S1: Paul says, I owe a debt to Jesus that I
S1: pay to you. How do you pay your debt to Jesus?
S1: Tell somebody else about him. Because the gospel is just
S1: one beggar telling another beggar where to find bread.
S2: This is treasure truth with pastor and author James Ford Jr,
S2: senior pastor of Christ Bible Church in Chicago. I'm Steve Hiller.
S2: Glad you're with us as we continue a message winning
S2: the lost, no matter the cost. And pastor, really a
S2: great challenge and reminder for us today that we, if
S2: we have been saved by Christ, owe this debt of gratitude.
S2: And what a great way that we get to pay
S2: that debt by sharing that good news with others.
S1: Well, you know, we are those who understand what life
S1: is really all about.
S2: What do you mean by that?
S1: The bottom line life is about our relationship with Jesus Christ. Now,
S1: a lot of people don't believe that, don't live that,
S1: don't believe the Bible, but the essence of life. The
S1: Bible says in him we live and move and have
S1: our being. It goes on to say, apart from him,
S1: we can do nothing. So many people are existing, but
S1: they're not living because life comes through Jesus Christ. Two.
S1: Two Greek words are translated life bios, from which we
S1: get the word biology, which speaks of physical life. But
S1: Zoe is spiritual life. And Zoe. This life, Zoe is
S1: in Christ. And so if I want to live eternally
S1: with him, then I need to know him.
S2: Yeah, well. And that's, you know what we get to
S2: be able to do here on this radio program to
S2: talk all about him, to encourage others to talk about him.
S2: And for the person who says, I know that I
S2: should be telling others about him. But I just get
S2: so overwhelmed. What if I say the wrong thing? What
S2: if they ask me a question I don't know how
S2: to answer? How do you encourage that person?
S1: Well, I would tell them, uh, one of the most
S1: profound answers you can give, uh, when it's a subject
S1: or a question asked that you don't know, here it is.
S1: Three words I don't know. So I'm not called to
S1: tell people about what I don't know. I when he
S1: called to tell people about what I do know and
S1: who I do know. So the woman at the well,
S1: she accepted Jesus Christ and became a believer. She goes
S1: into the village and tells all the men, come see
S1: a man who told me everything I've ever done, and
S1: they all went to see her. Now here's my point.
S1: Let me ask you some questions. Okay? Uh, after she
S1: got saved, did she attend Moody Bible Institute?
S2: She did.
S1: Not. Uh, did she take a class at your church
S1: on evangelism?
S2: She did not.
S1: Know. She just merely went out and told what happened
S1: to her. Yeah. That's witnessing.
S2: Well, and that's a great reminder for all of us
S2: that when we are challenged, we can answer, I don't know.
S2: It's simply sharing our story. Right? I don't know what
S2: he's going to do for you, but this is what
S2: Christ has done for me, right?
S1: Remember, one of the mottos Moody had in the past
S1: was to know him and to make him known. Yeah.
S2: That's it. Well, and that's what, uh, we hope to
S2: do here on this radio broadcast and hopefully encourage you
S2: as you share the good news of the gospel with
S2: those around you. So let's open our Bibles to Romans
S2: chapter one as we continue a message winning the lost.
S2: No matter the cost, here is Pastor Ford.
S1: Success in witnessing is not leading a person to Christ.
S1: Success in witnessing is witnessing about Christ. Here's what he
S1: said one plants, one waters. God gives the increase. Here's
S1: what he said. Jesus himself said, the sower and the
S1: reaper get the same reward. Who's the sower? The one
S1: that planted the seed. The one that put the seed
S1: in the heart. Soil. Who's the reaper? The one that
S1: prayed with him. The one that actually was there when
S1: they actually came to Christ? You mean both of them? Yes.
S1: Because you can't have one without another. You can't have
S1: a reaper if you ain't had a sower. Yeah. Amen.
S1: And you can't have a sower without a reaper, because
S1: then everything's going to go rotten. And so he says,
S1: because of converts. Now, I want you to notice something here.
S1: Because what are we trying to do? We're trying to
S1: let people know about our God who can do what
S1: our God can do. He said, what are you talking about?
S1: Let me show you something. Let me show you something.
S1: I just shared this with the Wednesday crowd. Here's what
S1: Paul says I was hindered. Uh, now, what hindered him?
S1: The work of God hindered him. Now. Now, here's what
S1: we got to realize. This. This thing is powerful to me.
S1: I said, first Thessalonians 218 is is is demonic delay.
S1: But acts 16 six through eight is divine delay. God
S1: stopped him from going. Question. Why? Since he wants to
S1: go there and witness. Are you having him? Wait. My
S1: might I postulate a possibility. Say postulate. I remember when
S1: I got converted, some things changed right away. Some things
S1: didn't change, right? Some things changed. The first thing I did,
S1: anybody remember? Flushed my drugs down the toilet? I used
S1: to have Pepsi-Cola pusher, you know. Remember when Pepsi-Cola bottles?
S1: You could get two cent for them? I was two
S1: cent nickel and dime pusher. And first thing I did
S1: was flush all my drugs down the toilet. That word
S1: got around, man. Ford done lost his mind. He ain't
S1: got religion. And he didn't flush drugs down the toilet.
S1: And then the other thing I was doing, I was
S1: gaming on welfare. Now, let me tell you what that means.
S1: That means I had a job, a good job, but
S1: I had my wife go to welfare office and say
S1: that I had left her and the children, so we
S1: was able to get food stamps just way before we
S1: was able to get food stamps and she got a
S1: medical card. So here I was. I had a good job.
S1: I was working in a factory making top money, and
S1: then she was getting welfare and food stamps and I
S1: was selling drugs. Big bank, big bank, big bank. But
S1: then it backfired because when I got saved, the first
S1: thing I did was I went to the welfare office
S1: because the guilt was on me. And I said, for
S1: two and a half, almost three years, we've been cheating you.
S1: I know I could go to jail, but my guy
S1: who led me to Christ said, one of the first
S1: things I must do is make restitution. So this guy
S1: had me. That's why my marriage is such a wreck.
S1: I had to go tell my wife, every woman that
S1: I ever mess with. You know, I had to go
S1: and confess to everybody what I had stolen and and
S1: make restitution. And I'm going back, you know? Yeah, yeah.
S1: You know, when you're just missing it at your crib
S1: and you thought so, and so did it. I told
S1: you he did it. I know he's like that. I
S1: did it, you know, that kind of stuff. Yeah. Here's
S1: your money back, man. Here's this back. You know, all
S1: that went through all that. But I didn't want to
S1: do that one. He said, well, then you don't want
S1: to be fully obedient to Jesus. I said, okay, so
S1: I go and I'm sitting up there, I'm sweating bullets, man. And, uh,
S1: you know, the the supervisor comes out and she says, sir,
S1: this has never happened. I don't even know what to do.
S1: Here's what I'm going to tell you. We're going to
S1: just erase this from our records in this office. Just
S1: don't do it again. I said, Praise God. Praise God.
S1: God is a deliverer, baby. Because I thought I was
S1: going to jail, man. And and so here's what happened.
S1: Here's the end of the story. So because of that now,
S1: whenever my job started laying off and I was one
S1: of the ones that got laid off and, um, uh,
S1: I went to unemployment and they said, well, you can
S1: only get $158 a week because you're you're a single person.
S1: I said, I'm married. Well, not according to our records.
S1: Your wife and children are on welfare. I said no, no, see,
S1: I was gaming on them. Well, that ain't we ain't
S1: got nothing to do with that. This is what you get.
S1: So now it's like, I don't, man, I don't have
S1: a job. I can't take care of my family. So then,
S1: you know, I got an undesirable discharge from the military.
S1: And so, I mean, this thing is all stacked against me.
S1: So they said city of Pittsburgh has 50 job openings,
S1: and there were over 2000 applicants. I said, I can't go.
S1: I might as well not go, Ray said. You don't
S1: believe God, that God can overcome your past? I said, well, yeah,
S1: he did. He said, what did he do with the
S1: welfare thing? He said, go down there and apply for
S1: the job. So I went down and applied for the job,
S1: I got it. Now let me let me tell you
S1: what happened before. The guy used to sell drugs for Clyde.
S1: I don't know if you remember Clyde, but anyway, Clyde, uh,
S1: I was talking to him before I got this job. Uh,
S1: I was talking to him, and he said, yeah, you broke.
S1: Now you did, you know. Come on, you might as
S1: well come on back, you know, and get your drugs
S1: from me, man. You know? No, no, no, I ain't
S1: into that. Jesus, you know, blah blah blah. I'm telling you.
S1: He said. Yeah, I heard about that. He said, but
S1: if you're Jesus so powerful, how come you don't have
S1: a job? Man, that hurt me, man, I went home,
S1: I got down on my knees. I said, did you
S1: hear what he said? That's that's the way I did it.
S1: I was I was newly saved. You know, I wasn't
S1: all that prim and proper. Oh, God, that dwelleth thou I, I,
S1: I come from the streets, so I that's the way
S1: I talk to him, you know, and I, truth be known,
S1: I still talk to him that way. I say I
S1: don't like it. I'm going to tell you I don't
S1: like it because you told me to come boldly to
S1: the throne of grace. Alright? I don't like what's going on.
S1: I gotta deal with it. But Lord, you're gonna have
S1: to do something. And so I told. I said, you
S1: hear what he said about you? He talking about if
S1: you're so great, how come I don't have a job now? Lord,
S1: this thing is deeper than just. I need to pay
S1: the rent. Because I've been telling all these people how
S1: good you are. You got to get me a job.
S1: So then Ray told me, going down there and applied,
S1: I applied, I got the job. The first person I
S1: told after my wife was Clyde. I went down the alley.
S1: I knocked on his door. And Clyde, guess what, man
S1: you was talking about last week? About your God. So great.
S1: How come you don't have a job? I got a job.
S1: And not just any job. I got a job I
S1: shouldn't even have because the city wasn't even supposed to
S1: hire me. But my God is so powerful that he
S1: overruled the rules. Because my God is the God who
S1: makes the rules. And I said, and then I took
S1: him down Romans Road. Now that's why I come to
S1: tell you once again, you know that the wages of
S1: sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life.
S1: All have sinned come short and I'm telling them. Witness
S1: to him. And he says, man, get out of my face.
S1: I said, you can pray a prayer of faith, man.
S1: Just ask Jesus Christ to come into your heart. Man no,
S1: I don't want to hear. He slammed the door in
S1: my face. Fast forward the video a couple years ago,
S1: probably about eight now, I was asked to go up
S1: to Grand Rapids and preach to some brethren up there
S1: about about about 3 or 400 of them. And I'm preaching.
S1: I preach Friday night, then I preach two messages on
S1: Saturday morning. Saturday afternoon I finished the message. A guy
S1: come running to me and he said to me, he said,
S1: he said, man, I've been waiting years, almost 20 years
S1: to talk to you. I said, what? He said, you
S1: don't know who I am. I said, no, he said,
S1: I'm Clyde's brother, Clyde. Clyde who? You know what, Clyde
S1: I'm talking about. I said, man, come on. Are you serious?
S1: He said, yeah. And I've been asking people, when are
S1: you coming back home? And every time you come home,
S1: the preacher of home church, I miss you. But now
S1: I live in Detroit. I gotta tell you, I've been
S1: wanting to tell you this story for over 20 years.
S1: What story? He said the day that you witnessed to
S1: my brother Clyde, I was in the living room. You
S1: were on the porch. And when you told him. Romans 623,
S1: Romans 523, Romans ten nine and ten and asked him
S1: to pray. I did, I got saved. Now get this,
S1: I said, man, man, praise the Lord. He said, no, no, no, no.
S1: He said, all through, all through grammar school, all through
S1: high school I lived for the Lord. The Lord. When
S1: I got ready to graduate, he said, I'm calling you
S1: to preach for me. So don't go to a secular school.
S1: I got a full ride. Don't go to secular school,
S1: go to a Christian college. So I went to a
S1: Christian college. I'm just graduating now, the Bible College of Detroit,
S1: getting ready to go to seminary. I'm going to be
S1: a pastor. And I said, I've got to tell him
S1: how God used him, and he didn't even know it.
S2: What a story, isn't it? You're listening to Treasure Truth
S2: with Pastor Ford. A message called Winning the Lost. No
S2: matter the cost. And we're going to get back to
S2: this teaching in just a moment. And maybe you have
S2: a story of how God has used you to bring
S2: someone to a saving faith. We'd be encouraged to read that.
S2: You can give us your feedback about the program, share
S2: your stories, or even ask a question of Pastor Ford.
S2: Just come to our website, npr.org. Click on the contact link,
S2: fill out that form, and we'll make sure that Pastor
S2: Ford sees that. And who knows? If you ask a question,
S2: we may answer that in a future broadcast. Again, come
S2: to Treasure Truth Radio org and click on the contact
S2: link back to the message. Here is Pastor Ford.
S1: Paul said, hey, I was hindered and God says it's
S1: a divine interruption. So you've been praying five years, ten years,
S1: 15 years. Now you're ready to give up. Don't you
S1: dare give up. You keep on sharing because you don't
S1: know the domino effect of what's happening. As you share
S1: with a person what God is going to do, and
S1: he says converts. Now, let me just let me just
S1: drop this on you. Uh, because, you know, when you
S1: win converts, you get a crown. This this amazes me
S1: about Jesus. He doing all the work in me, and
S1: he giving me all the reward. Now, how many crowns
S1: can you get? I know you know this. Okay, let me.
S1: Let me walk through these crowns real quick. You know
S1: I'm already. There's the incorruptible crown. First Corinthians 925 through 27.
S1: That's for people who master the flesh. Who walk in
S1: the spirit more than they walk in the flesh. Then
S1: the second crown you can get is called the crown
S1: of glory. That's the shepherd's crown. It's given to all
S1: pastors who faithfully shepherd God's flock. And you say, well,
S1: then that's not for us. Yes, it is, because when
S1: you come in and God has gifted you and brought
S1: you to this place, and you say, I espouse the vision,
S1: I'm getting involved in the plan and purpose of God,
S1: then you get that crown because you work with me
S1: to fulfill God's vision and purpose for this local assembly. Alright. Why?
S1: Because if you give a prophet a cup of water
S1: in the name of the Lord, you receive a prophet's reward.
S1: Then the crown of life. James 112 is also revelation
S1: two seven and it's given to those who faithfully endure temptation.
S1: And it's a martyr's crown for all of those who
S1: lose their life for the cause of Christ. Like the
S1: over 2 million people, uh, every six months that's given
S1: their life for Christ. Then there's the crown of righteousness.
S1: Second Timothy four eight. It's given to those who live
S1: right and who love the rapture of the church. Then
S1: this one, the one that I'm talking about, converts that
S1: everybody who drops a seed, everybody who witnesses is somebody.
S1: God says you've got a crown of rejoicing. What is that?
S1: It's given to those who win. Souls who witness for
S1: the Lord. It's a crown that you can get. Amen.
S1: Notice secondly, with me. Notice. secondly with me. Here's the
S1: second stick of dynamite that Paul was going to throw
S1: into our laps. He says because of verse, verse 13,
S1: notice because of compulsion, verse 14, notice he says, I
S1: am debtor both to the Greeks and the barbarians, both
S1: to the wise and the unwise. Wait a minute. The
S1: word debtor means you have an obligation. Now get this.
S1: Who's this obligation to or to whom is this obligation? Christ.
S1: Get this. Paul says, I owe a debt to Jesus
S1: that I pay to you. How do you pay your
S1: debt to Jesus? Tell somebody else about him. Because the
S1: gospel is just one beggar telling another beggar where to
S1: find bread. Yeah. Here's here's what the Bible said. He
S1: who gives to the poor lends to the Lord. Isn't
S1: that a powerful principle? That's why I don't ever hesitate.
S1: I don't hesitate, sister. Hit me up last night. Me
S1: and my children, I said, okay, boom, boom. I gave
S1: it to her. Why? Because I know I can't outgive God.
S1: I gave it to her. I lent it to the Lord.
S1: And I don't know about you. I'm biblical. Sometimes I
S1: remind them, I remember I lent that money. I gave
S1: it to her. But you told me you was going
S1: to pay it back. Hey, man, I don't know what
S1: y'all doing. Throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Say,
S1: what's he doing now? Get this. It's a financial debt
S1: to all men. The word obligation is a financial term.
S1: He says I have a debt to all men. See,
S1: the Greeks called everybody barbarians. Why didn't he say Jews?
S1: He said Greeks and barbarians. Because he's speaking to those
S1: who are sophists, say sophists. There are people who who
S1: were erudite. They were people who like to pontificate, who
S1: really were into the the. Okay, let me see if
S1: I can get you to understand. They were bougie. Okay.
S1: Now you understand. Yeah. Or they were. No. That's a
S1: ghetto person who who's trying to be bougie. Yeah. And
S1: so and so they always look down on other people.
S1: And every time I hear it, you people, it's a
S1: derogatory term. I say you people, who is you people.
S1: I mean, you know, you know, you people. Have you
S1: ever noticed? We're proud of things of which we have
S1: no control. We're proud of race. We're proud of face.
S1: We're proud of grace, and we're proud of place. And
S1: we had nothing to do with any of them. Do
S1: you think that most of of us in here would
S1: look like we look, if we could have picked our
S1: own face? Hey, man. No, we got used to it.
S1: Should I tell everybody I'm a good looking black man?
S1: I don't care what anybody say. Shoot. God, don't make
S1: no junk. But I am somebody. That's it. You know
S1: I already got a woman. Ah. That's right. So she
S1: think I look good? I don't care what everybody else say. Shoot,
S1: I ain't, ain't nobody else. Give me no money. And
S1: so he says listen, it's kind of like it's kind
S1: of like, uh, there was a Angelo brother and the
S1: Chinese brother. They were friends. And so the Chinese brother said,
S1: come to a funeral with me. So they went to
S1: the funeral, and the Chinese brother went up and took
S1: a bowl of rice and put it by the picture.
S1: So he comes back and American Brother says to him,
S1: what is that all about? He said, well, when somebody dies,
S1: we take the rice and we put it up there
S1: because some people believe, I don't believe it, but it's
S1: just a custom. Some people believe that they'll eat the rice.
S1: He said, well, when are they going to eat the rice?
S1: He said, well, when the people who you give flowers
S1: start smelling them. Make sense to me. And so what's
S1: going on here? He's saying listen, listen, listen, listen. Do
S1: you have an obligation? Do you feel obligated? Let me
S1: let me tell you. Let me tell you. Let me
S1: tell you. Uh, Pastor Hickman, pastor Hickman is a friend
S1: of mine. But you know what? You know what that
S1: hanging out with that brother has done with me. Not
S1: only educating me about what he talked to you about,
S1: because we talk about that kind of stuff all the time.
S1: But I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what happened.
S1: I tell you what happened. He takes me to Maggiano's.
S1: Have you ever been to Maggiano's? I ain't never been
S1: to Gino's. You've been in Chicago all this time. You've
S1: never been. I ain't never been to Maggiano, man, you know?
S1: Come on, Imma take you. So we go. We go
S1: to Marciano's. And so a lady walks up to us.
S1: She's pushing a cart. She's a bag lady. She says, uh,
S1: excuse me, gentlemen, I don't do drugs. And never have
S1: I lost my family, my home, because I was a homemaker.
S1: My husband worked in a fortune 500 company. He got
S1: hooked on drugs. We lost everything. My children are gone.
S1: Husband's gone. House is gone, I lost everything. Could you
S1: help me out? He pulls out five, $100 bills. Don't
S1: y'all mess with that man. And gifts, he says. I
S1: know why God told me to take this out because
S1: I wasn't going to take it out because I don't
S1: do cash. But God told me when I was at
S1: the bank, you're going to give to somebody and you'll
S1: know who it is when I tell you. And he
S1: gave her $500 bills. She said, oh, I can stay
S1: at the Y for a couple months. Oh, thank you,
S1: thank you, thank you. I looked at him, I said,
S1: I don't do drugs. But but but you know what?
S1: Here's what, here's what happened. Here's what I saw Elder Betts,
S1: over time of just hanging with him and just it's
S1: like I'm way more generous than I ever was just
S1: by hanging out with that man. Now, let me tell
S1: you why. Because now, when somebody bless me, like somebody
S1: blessed us and said, okay, I'm going to let you
S1: go downtown and I'm going to let you go on
S1: my dime. We stayed in a $600 a night room
S1: for $95 a night. I mean, come on now. Don't
S1: hate celebrate. God will let you participate. Now guess what? We're. That's.
S1: Guess what we do now. Here's what we do. Every
S1: time somebody does something like that for us, we look
S1: for somebody to bless. We say, who is it that
S1: have an anniversary coming up and they may just have
S1: a meal, may not be, you know, okay, let's, let's
S1: send them to, let's send them to a couple days
S1: or send them to a meal or do and that's
S1: what we do. We look for somebody to bless why
S1: we feel so obligated. Because we now don't you feel
S1: obligated if God saved you from crack? Don't you want
S1: a crack head to get saved? If God saved you
S1: from being a whore or a whoremonger, why don't you
S1: want somebody else to stop horn and quit being a
S1: horn monger, a drinker, or a drugger a beater abuser?
S1: If God did it for you, he could do it.
S1: Don't you feel obligated to let somebody know who's going
S1: through what you went through? That God is a healer.
S1: That God is a deliverer. That God can set you free.
S1: That he can write your name in the Lamb's Book
S1: of Life. We ought to feel obligated.
S2: You know, you don't have to have a dramatic story
S2: of conversion. Maybe your story is about how God brought
S2: you through depression or discouragement. Maybe it's how he saved
S2: your marriage. No matter who you are, there's someone out
S2: there going through a similar experience and you know you
S2: can help. You're listening to Treasure Truth with Pastor Ford.
S2: You can find us online at Treasure Truth radio.org. You know, pastor,
S2: as someone tunes in and listens to Moody Radio, not
S2: only are they going to hear this Bible teaching program,
S2: but just a wide array or variety of programming that
S2: can really be used to encourage and help them grow
S2: in their walk with Christ?
S1: Oh, yes. And you're going to hear things that are
S1: going to build you up in your most precious faith
S1: in Jesus Christ. Uh, you know, it's amazing to me.
S1: I say it all the time. But, you know, sometimes
S1: what we do is we buy things we don't need
S1: with money. We don't have to amass bills we can't
S1: pay to please people we don't like and don't care anyway.
S1: We are going to be held accountable for our stewardship.
S1: Isn't it amazing that we can send it ahead by
S1: giving to Moody Radio?
S2: Yeah, absolutely.
S1: Because that's an investment that draws a dividend that has
S1: eternal consequences. And I mean, when you invest in Moody Radio,
S1: you are actually investing in the only two things that
S1: last forever the word of God and the souls of
S1: men and women.
S2: Well, you can make an investment right now by coming
S2: to our website. It is Treasure Truth radio.org. Click on
S2: the donate button. We need both the ongoing monthly gifts
S2: and the one time gifts. Again, that's at Treasure Truth Radio.
S2: Thanks for giving and for listening. And thanks also to
S2: our producer, Amy Rios. For Pastor Ford, I'm Steve Hiller.
S2: Treasure truth is a production of Moody Radio, a ministry
S2: of Moody Bible Institute.