S1: Coming to you from the Morning Star Mission sponsored studio.
S1: This is Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2: It's Carl and crew, and we're helping you take your
S2: next step with Jesus. You know, I love this topic
S2: this week, because if there's anything that is equivalent to
S2: physical core training, remember when that was in style?
S3: Uh, core training?
S2: Yeah.
S3: Um, I mean, not exactly like training.
S2: No core training. The stomach muscles, how everything flows from
S2: the core. There was about a decade ago, like all
S2: the all the clips, all the training videos I saw
S2: was like, you've got to get the core. And I
S2: do believe that, by the way. Yeah. Remember that super day?
S4: Absolutely. Yeah. Get your core. You gotta get the core.
S2: Core training. Core training. Got to get that core.
S4: Everything flows.
S2: From the.
S4: Core.
S3: I must have been doing something else.
S2: At the.
S4: Gym. You were. You were raising.
S2: Toddlers. You were raising toddlers. You had no time for
S2: core training.
S4: That makes sense. They were training you. Thank you. Yeah, exactly.
S2: No. Core training is a good principle. And it's. And
S2: it's important. And there's everything that you look at in life,
S2: there's people are trying to whittle down. What's the most
S2: important thing? If you look at a business, it's like,
S2: what's the most important thing? And when we're talking about
S2: the spiritual life, it's so easy to get on secondary
S2: issues and get hung up on them.
S3: Give me an example of a secondary issue.
S2: A secondary issue is I really believe this now. So
S2: hold on. So some of you are going to throw
S2: rocks at me and call me a heretic here. Um,
S2: I really think that the expression of spiritual gifts is
S2: secondary to cultivating in that core the engine room of
S2: our soul in the root system. Yeah. Your clear identity
S2: with who you are in Christ. Hear in his voice.
S2: Feeling secure in him. I think going out and using
S2: that spiritual gift without having some of those basic things
S2: in the core in our belly, I think, uh, I
S2: think it runs the risk of not using it, that
S2: spiritual gift. Absolutely. Or if we use it, we don't
S2: use it as powerfully as we could. So I think
S2: it's got some huge, um, I think there's some big
S2: divots that we can get stuck into there. And I
S2: see this in my own life, I don't as a pastor.
S2: I don't have to look around, look at other people.
S2: If I can tell you right now, the greatest days
S2: that I have are kicked off. When God has picked
S2: up the hood of my soul and gone tinkering around
S2: in there, and I've let him do it. That's the
S2: other thing. Am I going to let him work on
S2: the inside of me, and am I going to let
S2: him see what I need to see and talk to
S2: me about it? I mean, those are just it's just
S2: it's the hard work. But man, it's the good work.
S2: Because out of that, then I can come on here
S2: and I can go. All right. Few basics that I
S2: learned from the Lord this morning. I got nothing to prove. Whoo! Hallelujah!
S2: Because if you got. If you come on here and
S2: you got something to prove. How does that go, Ali?
S3: Uh, not. Well.
S2: I'm not. I've got nothing to gain. I've got nothing
S2: to lose. And when I. When I get those anchored
S2: in my brain. And those are Dempster isms all the way,
S2: by the way. Greg Dempster, who was on with you
S2: guys Monday. Uh, when when we really get that sorted
S2: out in the core of our being, my goodness, the
S2: outflow of that is just tremendous. It's the overflow of
S2: the heart that the mouth speaks. It all starts in here,
S2: doesn't it, guys?
S3: Starts in the core.
S2: It's right here. It just begins right here. Um, and
S2: and one of those key things is how in the
S2: world do we pray? Because it's it's the thing of prayer.
S2: It's this intimacy. It's this listening to God that is
S2: so rich. And boy, have we got a treat coming
S2: up here, don't we?
S3: Doctor Sam Storms he has quickly become one of our favorites.
S3: I mean, he every every time we talk to him,
S3: I learn a couple of new things. A couple, not
S3: just one.
S4: Yeah.
S2: And what's cool about him is that he's always learning stuff.
S4: Yes.
S2: That's what's really.
S4: Cool.
S3: And he goes deep into the word.
S2: Yeah. Yeah. It's beautiful. Hang on. Buckle up. Get up. What?
S4: Guys, swig of water.
S2: Get a swig of water, Sam. Big storm coming up.
S1: You can take him out of Alaska, but you can't
S1: take Alaska out of him. Carl is in the crew.
S1: It's Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2: All this week, we're talking about lifting the hood, looking
S2: deep within. It's the unseen things that matter most. Ali
S2: is much more biblio centric on this one, and that
S2: she's taking us right back to the roots and the
S2: fruits metaphor that we find in Scripture.
S3: Psalm one. Like a tree.
S2: Yes. Love that. Those are my three favorite verses in
S2: all the Psalms I love it. Psalm one one through three.
S2: Check it out. Boom crew. But with us right now
S2: is a man who has done some deep diving on
S2: the whole issue of prayer. A lot of years of experience.
S2: I'm sure he's got some sacred scars to prove failings
S2: in this area. Doctor Sam Storms, what are you learning
S2: about prayer, my friend?
S5: My goodness, that's a big question that deserves a big answer. I,
S5: in writing this book, I've learned so much because I
S5: was determined to get into what Scripture says about prayer,
S5: not our own personal conceptions or what we've been taught
S5: by those who didn't know what they were talking about.
S5: But to really examine how did Jesus pray and why?
S5: How did the Apostle Paul pray and why? And James
S5: and others, as well as the Old Testament saints. And
S5: I think really, again, this is a book that, like
S5: so many of my books, where I'm doing it really
S5: for myself. Ultimately, I know that sounds selfish.
S2: No.
S5: It's good. But I realized I was not praying as
S5: I should. I wasn't praying consistently, passionately, expectantly, and I
S5: kind of preached to myself as I as I wrote
S5: each of these chapters in this book.
S3: Doctor Sam Storms, our guest right now founder and president
S3: of Enjoying God Ministries, serves on the Council of the
S3: Gospel Coalition, featuring a book today, Understanding Prayer Biblical Foundations,
S3: and Practical Guidance for Seeking God. You mentioned some of
S3: the ways that we've been mis taught on prayer that
S3: can potentially hinder us in this area. Uh, highlight a
S3: few that you think are important.
S5: Well, I think probably the most important one of all
S5: is that I find that people oftentimes because they have
S5: this big concept of God, which is good, that God
S5: is good, God is powerful. He's generous, compassionate, and merciful.
S5: That if I need something desperately, he'll give it to
S5: me whether or not I pray and ask for it.
S5: And I think that's a dangerous and arrogant assumption. We
S5: should never assume that God will grant us, apart from prayer,
S5: what he has promised us. He will give us only
S5: in response to prayer. It's this sense of entitlement that
S5: we have, and I've heard people say, ah, you know,
S5: prayer is hard. I don't have time. God's good. If
S5: he if I really need this, he'll he'll give it
S5: to me, even if I don't ask. And I just think,
S5: you know, James four you have not because you ask not.
S5: And all through the scriptures, you know, we read these
S5: places where we are told what is available to us
S5: from God if we will ask him. And I think
S5: that's the most dangerous thing that paralyzes people today, is
S5: they operate on this assumption. Well, that's God's business. That's
S5: that's just what God does. He's he's that good. So
S5: I'll devote myself to other things, knowing that he's going
S5: to provide me what I need anyway. And we go
S5: without so many blessings because we have failed to ask.
S5: And I think the Word of God just continually exhorts us, ask, seek, knock.
S5: You know, your heavenly Father is good and gracious, but
S5: he has chosen. This is the mystery. He has chosen
S5: to accomplish his purposes in us and in the church.
S5: In response to our passionate requests of him.
S2: You know, Sam, it's interesting because God's not punitive. And
S2: so somebody could listen to this go, okay, God's sure enough,
S2: we're getting confirmation here. God's God's playing his God card
S2: over me and waiting for me to open my mouth.
S2: He's not punitive. There's always a greater lesson in this.
S2: Why would God withhold blessings from the mute person that
S2: will not speak?
S5: Because he has designed his relationships with us so that
S5: prayer magnifies him. It magnifies his grace, his abundant supply
S5: of good things. It magnifies and awakens us to our
S5: weakness and our desperate need of him. So, you know,
S5: oftentimes we think that somehow prayer is coercing God or
S5: that we can bully him or compel him. And of course,
S5: that is just almost blasphemous to think of those terms.
S2: Sure.
S5: But God has chosen and honestly, you know, if you
S5: ask me the question, why did he orchestrate his universe
S5: and his relationship to his people in this way? I
S5: think that's about the only answer we can give, because
S5: in some mysterious manner, it brings the greatest honor and
S5: praise to him when he is seen as generous and
S5: abounding in good things. When his children come to him
S5: in humility and ask for it. Uh, let me give
S5: you just a quick example of this. We read in
S5: Isaiah 30, verse 18, therefore the Lord waits to be
S5: gracious to you, and therefore he exalts himself to show
S5: mercy to you. And then it says at the sound
S5: of your cry, as soon as he hears it, he
S5: answers you. And I read that, and I said, Lord,
S5: why are you waiting to be gracious to me? I
S5: don't I don't get it. It says he will surely
S5: be gracious to you when you cry to him in prayer,
S5: and as soon as he hears it, he answers you.
S5: So it's that statement where he exalts himself to show
S5: mercy to us. And I don't know why God orchestrated
S5: it that way. He's infinitely wise. But I think if
S5: we really probe deeply, it's because our weakness, our need,
S5: our dependency on him, magnifies his abundant grace and supply
S5: for all things that are necessary to grow in godliness.
S5: And God says, if you want that, I'm waiting for
S5: you to cry out to me. Come to me and ask,
S5: and I will do it.
S3: Doctor Sam storms our guest right now. The question I
S3: know many people will have right now is. But I
S3: did ask for this, for this person to be healed
S3: for this area of my life. And I didn't get
S3: the answer. I asked and God said no. Or he
S3: said nothing at all. How do we reconcile the two
S3: realities that yes, we must ask for what we need
S3: for God? But there are times that when we do ask,
S3: we certainly feel like God didn't give it to me. God.
S3: God didn't provide here.
S5: Boy, that's that's a penetrating question that people are often
S5: upset by it and they're befuddled. And I think there
S5: are many answers to that. First of all, there are
S5: reasons why God chooses not to grant us what we want.
S5: I mean, can you imagine a father who grants his
S5: six year old son a shotgun on Christmas morning? He
S5: knows that the that the gift that the son desperately
S5: wants could do damage to him and others. God knows
S5: what is best for us. He knows the timing is
S5: best for us. Sometimes it's not so much that God
S5: says no, but God says wait. And sometimes, instead of
S5: the answer that we want, he says, I've got something
S5: even better for you. And in other instances, I just
S5: I have a default. I think most Christians do. Romans
S5: 828 God causes all things to work together for good
S5: to those that love him and are called according to
S5: his purpose. So I would say, all things being equal,
S5: if you do not receive the answer to the request
S5: that you made, it is because God has something even
S5: better for you. Even the issue of healing, if somebody
S5: we pray for remains in their sickness, God is using
S5: that to draw them into greater conformity to Christ, to
S5: give them an opportunity to depend on him in the
S5: midst of heartache and pain. So everything that God grants
S5: to us or withholds from us is designed to conform
S5: us to the image of Jesus. So I just say
S5: to people, first of all, don't stop asking. You know,
S5: ask God to refine your prayers. I mean, as an author,
S5: I know what it's like when I write something. And
S5: then my editor comes back, marking it all up in red,
S5: and then I have to go back and rewrite it
S5: and rephrase it. Sometimes our prayers are so insipid and
S5: so selfish that God waits and seems to say no,
S5: to give us an opportunity to go back and say, wait,
S5: wait just a minute. Did I really want God to
S5: do that or not? And then finally, I think we
S5: have to rest on the fact that God's wisdom is
S5: greater than ours. God knows what is best for me.
S5: I don't. I think I know what's best for me.
S5: God says no. I know what is best for you.
S5: And in this particular case, it's by asking you to wait,
S5: to continue to pray. And it might even be a no.
S5: I mean, like Paul's request that God remove the thorn
S5: in the flesh. Finally, God says, no, Paul, because I
S5: want my grace to be manifested through your weakness.
S2: You know, Sam, I've got a broken heart for a
S2: couple hundred folks that I've met in the last 5
S2: to 10 years who have wayward kids, and they've prayed
S2: and they've begged God, and they've done it earnestly. What's
S2: going on there? What's happening there? And what can you give,
S2: based on your study to a person that's just there? And,
S2: you know, so many of those folks to Sam.
S5: Sure. Yeah. That is a heartbreaking situation. That's that's not,
S5: you know, like a situation where you say, Lord, I
S5: would like a promotion at work and you don't get
S5: it right because you are so emotionally tied up with
S5: the welfare of your kids. You know, I often think
S5: of Saint Augustine. Often called Augustine, who lived a horribly
S5: immoral life into every kind of philosophy. And sexual immorality.
S5: And his mother, Monica, prayed every day for him. And
S5: she finally went to Ambrose, who was the bishop of
S5: the area where they lived. And she poured her heart out.
S5: And Ambrose's response was, it isn't possible for the child
S5: of those tears not to believe. And the point was,
S5: God sees your tears. He knows your heart. Cling to him.
S5: Continue to pour out your intercession for them. Pray that
S5: God would turn their life inside out, and that they
S5: would find in a moment of desperation, that the only
S5: place they can turn is to the Lord Jesus Christ.
S5: And that's really we say, well, that's all we can do. Well,
S5: that's a whole lot. It really is.
S2: We've thrown you some curveballs here. Theologically, I want to
S2: hit another tough one. Does prayer change God's mind.
S5: No. Here's what God's mind does. God's mind orchestrates the
S5: world and our relationship with him in it by suspending
S5: his blessings on our asking for them. So things that
S5: God has decreed from eternity past, let's say, for example,
S5: the second coming of Jesus or his bodily resurrection. No
S5: amount of prayer is going to change God's determination to
S5: raise Jesus from the dead and enable His Son to
S5: return to consummate his kingdom. So certain things are immutable
S5: and unchangeable. But basically God says, for example, many times
S5: in the Old Testament you have. Let's just take Jonah
S5: for example. God said to Jonah, go and preach in
S5: 40 days. I'm going to judge them. Well, Jonah goes
S5: and he preaches, and lo and behold, they repent. And
S5: God says, I'm not going to judge them now. But
S5: God had arranged it where both Jonah's preaching and the
S5: repentance of the people were a part of his plan.
S5: They were in his mind in response to Jonah's obedience
S5: to preach to them. So we need to be careful.
S5: I don't want God to do things according to the
S5: dictates of my mind.
S2: Yes, or someone else's.
S5: Yeah, he's infinitely good and immeasurably wise and sovereign and loving.
S5: And I say, Lord, I don't want to change your
S5: mind about this or that. I want you to change
S5: my mind so that I'll ask in accordance with your
S5: character and your purposes.
S2: So the few instances in the Bible that at first
S2: blush it may appear a mind has been changed. Actually,
S2: just someone jumped in the gap with prayer to fulfill
S2: his ultimate sovereign will. Is that fair?
S5: Right. Yeah. His ultimate sovereign will. Is that after having
S5: said I'm going to do this or that, he ordained
S5: that someone like, for example, Moses intercedes for Israel and
S5: God says, okay, I won't judge them after all. So yes,
S5: the prayers that we pray that seem to change the
S5: course of direction in God's purpose was part of God's
S5: eternal purpose in the first place.
S2: That makes perfect sense.
S3: Doctor Sam storms our guest right now. Give a word
S3: on praying in Jesus name. There's a lot of discussion
S3: around that. You've written about that in your book. Talk
S3: about it.
S5: First of all, understand what it doesn't mean. It doesn't
S5: mean that if I tack on those precise words at
S5: the end of my prayer, that guarantees that I'll get
S5: what I ask for. It's not like we put a
S5: rabbit's foot on the end of our intercession and trust.
S5: It's going to, you know, bring about reality that we
S5: want to see happen. I think in the name, when
S5: he talks about praying in the name of Jesus, he's saying,
S5: pray with the understanding that the only reason why the
S5: God of this universe hears you is because His Son,
S5: Jesus Christ, lived a sinless life for you and died
S5: and rose again from the dead. It's based on the
S5: idea that access to the father is through the son.
S5: Praying in his name means praying in accordance with his character.
S5: We can't ask him for things that are a violation
S5: of his character. Praying in his name means praying in
S5: conformity with his revealed purposes. Praying in his name means
S5: that we acknowledge that we are helpless and hopeless without him.
S5: And it says we are dependent on who Jesus is
S5: and what he has done. So, for example, you don't
S5: have to actually say the words and we pray this
S5: in the name of Jesus, Amen. It's a heart attitude.
S5: It's an attitude that says, I'm asking this ultimately for
S5: the glory of Jesus Christ because of who he is
S5: and what he's done for me, acknowledging my complete dependence
S5: upon him. I always use the words because they're there
S5: in Scripture, but I've known people and I've often wondered,
S5: and I've asked them, why did you close your prayer
S5: without saying Jesus name? They said, well, I was praying
S5: in Jesus name for all the reasons I've just explained,
S5: but I didn't want people to think that somehow that's
S5: a magical incantation, that saying those words in itself is
S5: going to make a difference. It's what the words imply.
S5: It's the theology behind them that is so central.
S2: I want to wrap this where we begin, because I
S2: think one of the most compelling things I've ever heard
S2: on prayer you shared today, and it really flows out
S2: of James call to our life. And that is we
S2: don't have because we don't ask Sam, this is huge.
S2: You're telling me, in essence, there are some blessings left
S2: on the table. If we go to glory without opening
S2: our mouth, there's some things that God really desires to
S2: do with his children that he loves so much. If
S2: we would but bring them to the Lord in prayer.
S5: Absolutely. And I know that's hard for some people to swallow. Uh,
S5: you know, I believe very strongly in the sovereignty of God.
S5: It's his power is immutable. And it sounds as if
S5: we're saying that God is frustrated and he's not, because
S5: if he really, in the depths of his heart, wants
S5: to give us something that he knows is best for us,
S5: he will so move upon us that we will in fact,
S5: ask him for it. I want people to really think
S5: about what James says. He's talking there about praying for
S5: the sick. And the illustration that he uses to encourage
S5: us is of all people. Elijah and I remember when
S5: I first read that, I said, wait a minute, James.
S5: You're telling me that I have the same access and
S5: the same power in my prayers as Elijah did when
S5: he prayed? And it didn't rain for three and a
S5: half years.
S2: And.
S5: He prayed again, and it rained. And yet James says, well,
S5: hold a minute, Sam. Elijah was of like nature with you,
S5: just as weak, just as frustrated, just as doubtful, just
S5: as sinful as you. And yet look at how God
S5: used his prayers. That's a remarkable fact, that of anybody
S5: that he would choose to encourage us to pray. He
S5: uses a man of such incredible character and great supernatural
S5: prowess as Elijah. He says, but he's just like you.
S5: So pray.
S2: That's powerhouse. Sam Storms everybody. You want to get a
S2: copy of something that's going to peel some spiritual paint
S2: off the veneer and get it right down on it
S2: with prayer. Ali, what do we have?
S3: Just text storm to 800 555 7898. This is going
S3: to take you to Doctor Sam Storm's website, where you
S3: can find a lot of resources. There's blogs, there's articles,
S3: there's sermons. The book is there as well. Just text
S3: storm to 800 555 7898.
S1: A basketball mom who's mastered the dad joke. Ali is
S1: in the crew. It's Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
S2: Well, coming off that interview with Sam, I got to
S2: tell you, man, this guy, he is one of our favorites.
S2: There's no question about it. And what I. What I
S2: love about Sam is that everything that he's talking about
S2: comes from a deep theological understanding, which is knowing God
S2: and how he works. Um, otherwise, you get all kind
S2: of urban myths out there about what's going on, man, with,
S2: with regard to prayer. And that site that you're going
S2: to go to is just loaded with unbelievable content and
S2: it's free. Uh, and then obviously a link to his
S2: brand new book on prayer. So check it out. Text
S2: storm to 805 55. Five. 78. 98. Given resources to
S2: help you take your next step with Jesus. Okay. Guess
S2: what it is. Let me check. Sure enough, it's Wednesday.
S2: It's bottom of the hour. It's one of your favorite
S2: stop in times here. It's like drive thru grub for
S2: the soul. Hang on.
S1: It's time making herself laugh no matter who joins her.
S1: It's time for Allie. Thinks it's funny.
S3: Drive, drive thru grub for the soul.
S4: Sure. It's a quick stop. Yeah.
S3: Quick snippet.
S4: Okay, I like it.
S2: Stop in here.
S4: Get a couple of jokes.
S3: It'll stop in little dad joke for you.
S6: I'd like to order two jokes, please.
S3: Oh, that was corny. Jonathan, I love it.
S6: Thank you.
S3: Way to go all in on that. What did the
S3: lunchbox say to the refrigerator? What did the lunchbox say
S3: to the refrigerator? No, don't hate me because I'm a
S3: little cooler. Come on, young Thunder.
S4: You asked.
S3: For two.
S4: Jokes.
S6: I did, I did ask for two jokes.
S4: Food related.
S7: So there you go.
S3: There you go. Next up, um, you know how you
S3: have to get your alerts to change your password here
S3: at Moody? Man, we get those. Those things come at you.
S4: Fast.
S6: And furious. Oh, yeah.
S3: Time to change your password.
S6: I changed it two days ago.
S3: And it's tough to keep track of all of them.
S3: Can we all agree?
S4: I agree, of course. Yes.
S3: Here's what you're not supposed to do. A little safety tip.
S3: You are not supposed to use the same password across
S3: many platforms. That makes you more vulnerable to security risks, right?
S3: So vary those passwords. Well, one Gen-xer did not listen
S3: to that advice. Why did the Gen-xer change all of
S3: his passwords to Kenny? Kenny family name, I don't know.
S3: Why do you think he changed all his passwords to Kenny?
S3: He wanted to have all Kenny Loggins.
S8: Not gotta cut loose, Footloose. Kick off your Sunday shoes.
S6: All right, let's go.
S4: I think the.
S2: Song saved.
S4: It. Yeah. It did.
S8: Exactly.
S6: I don't think you could do a joke without the song.
S4: I mean, yes, of.
S3: Course it takes the song. Otherwise, some people are going,
S3: Who's Kenny?
S6: I was going to say.
S7: Hold on.
S4: You bailed out.
S6: What?
S2: Oh, yeah. You got to get. You got to wait
S2: for the good part.
S4: Yeah. We can't bail out. We missed it. Yeah. Oh, no.
S4: Sykora said no, it was the chorus.
S6: That was the chorus.
S2: Oh, that was it.
S6: That was.
S4: It. Yes. This is a little bit more.
S6: You want more?
S4: Oh, yeah. A little bit. Give me a little more
S4: Kenny Loggins. Everybody right here.
S8: Passing you by? I'm trying to tell you it will
S8: if you don't even try. You can fly if you'd
S8: only cut loose.
S2: That'll get you up. Get you going. Welcome aboard.
S3: Kickoff Sunday.
S7: We need to record Jonathan doing the no. You know.
S6: Take me the.
S7: Kevin.
S6: Bacon.
S7: The footloose.
S3: Oh. The dance.
S7: Yeah. The kick.
S4: Oh, the the kick. You know, the head nod. Yeah.
S7: Oh, yeah.
S3: Super decent here. Doing it like.
S7: She's.
S3: Doing the little thing with her head. Text jokes to
S3: 800 555, 78, 98. If you want those jokes, song
S3: not included, you got to provide your own music. Text
S3: jokes to 805, five.
S7: Five.
S3: 78, 98. You know, you got to have those product
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S3: when you get it.
S7: Very true.
S4: Absolutely.
S7: Okay.
S3: Jokes to 800 555 7898.
S1: She's a choreographer extraordinaire, and everything is Greek to her.
S1: Super die is in the crew. It's Carl and crew
S1: on Moody Radio.
S3: Well, sometimes it's a drawer in your house that has
S3: all the stuff that you don't have anywhere else for anyone.
S3: Have a drawer like that. I used to call it
S3: the junk drawer. It was just a collection of everything.
S3: But sometimes that junk drawer spills out to the counter
S3: and to the table, and then it can take over
S3: a room, and all of a sudden, the clutter in
S3: our lives can become more than just something we can
S3: shut and pretend we don't see. Kathy Lipp. We're talking
S3: clutter coming up.
S1: He's a sports fanatic with a stat for anything you
S1: can think of. Young Thunder is in the crew. It's
S1: curling crew on Moody Radio.
S2: Well, it's usually one thing, isn't it, Ali?
S3: It's usually that one thing that when you start to
S3: think about, why am I stuck? Why am I not
S3: living the life that I want to live? Usually there's
S3: one big thing that comes to mind first that's holding
S3: you back, right?
S2: Yeah, but. But the beauty of it is, if we can.
S2: And I've seen this so many times. You want some
S2: hope today? Boom crew. If you can get victory over
S2: that one thing. I kid you not, it is a
S2: domino effect. It's a flywheel effect. It's one victory gives
S2: birth to another. And we got someone who has seen
S2: a victory birthed in her life. Kathy, how are you
S2: doing this morning?
S9: Oh, I'm just amazing. Thanks so much for having me on.
S9: Carl and Ali.
S2: So clutter was eating your lunch and maybe everyone in
S2: the home.
S9: Oh, absolutely. Eating my lunch, taking my lunch money, doing
S9: all the things. Absolutely. My dad was a hoarder, and
S9: I've never been a hoarder, but I have definitely been
S9: in that space where, like, you just can't make the
S9: next decision because there's so much stuff in your house.
S9: And so I that was my one. Well, I've had
S9: many things, but that was one of my one thing.
S4: But it's a big one.
S2: Wasn't.
S4: It?
S9: It's a huge thing. And, you know, it's so interesting
S9: because if you look at the New Testament, Jesus talks
S9: about money and possessions more than anything else. This is
S9: no surprise that this was going to be a problem
S9: for many of us in our lives, and I was
S9: one of them.
S3: Kathy Lipp, our guest right now, she's an author, speaker, blogger.
S3: She hosts a podcast called The Clutter Free Academy. Now
S3: let's talk about this. Remember a couple years ago here
S3: on our morning show, we started talking about this issue.
S3: And very quickly, Karl, I'm sure you remember this. The
S3: number of responses that we got from people who said
S3: clutter or hoarding or stuff. It was overwhelming the amount
S3: of people for whom this was such a big issue,
S3: and so many of them had so much shame associated
S3: with it. The feeling of, I don't want people to
S3: come into my house. I'm not able to fully be
S3: active in ministry the way I'd like to. The effects
S3: of clutter, even if it doesn't get to the. The
S3: term hoarding it keeps us from living our best life.
S3: Did you feel that?
S9: Oh, Ali. I was the person who. If you wanted
S9: to come over for coffee, we were drinking that on
S9: the front porch because there was no way you were
S9: coming into my house. And here's the thing. Like the
S9: people who struggle with clutter are the kindest, most generous
S9: people I have ever met in my entire life. But
S9: you're absolutely right. There's a barrier. And we're struggling against
S9: marketing messages that say, if you want to live life,
S9: you need this thing and that thing and all these things,
S9: but then also your house should look like you possess
S9: none of those things. And it is a battle.
S4: It is a battle and hide it all. Yeah.
S9: Exactly. And I don't know about you guys. I do
S9: not have that much storage in my house. And so
S9: I had to really reconcile, not just with the getting
S9: rid of stuff, but keeping stuff from coming in in
S9: the first place. And it's a battle.
S2: I got to ask you something here.
S9: You mentioned.
S2: Something. Why is it that the sweetest, kindest. I mean,
S2: most gentle people on the planet have sometimes the biggest
S2: problems with clutter? Is there something going on there? What's
S2: going on?
S9: I think one, we are people pleasers. We want to
S9: make sure that everybody is taken care of. We want
S9: to do all the things. And so and also I'm
S9: just going to say it's going to sound weird, but
S9: I think it's very hard for us to say no.
S9: And that is including with marketing messages. It's including saying
S9: no to our kids. It's including saying no to our
S9: parents who say, you want my 24 settings of China, right?
S9: And we have a hard time saying no, even in
S9: our own best interest. And it's something that we have
S9: to work at and something we have to get better at.
S3: So, Kathy, what did it look like? One for you
S3: to first make the recognition that, okay, this is something
S3: that is a problem for me and I need to
S3: start working toward victory, because it's easy for this to
S3: be a low level, kind of low underlying thing for
S3: decades and never be addressed. But you must have reached
S3: a point where you went, enough is enough. I got
S3: to do something about this.
S9: I think it was several things happening at the same time.
S9: I think it was one the recognition of I am
S9: limiting my life because I'm not inviting people over to
S9: my house, to the amount of time I spent stuck
S9: not being able to get rid of things, not being
S9: able to make decisions and feeling overwhelmed all the time,
S9: and not wanting to pass that on to my kids.
S9: And then also recognizing the amount of money that was
S9: going into not just buying this stuff, but organizing it,
S9: the containers, the all the stuff and all of those
S9: things took me off of God's purpose. And so, you know,
S9: to not being able to have a friend over for
S9: a cup of coffee, to not be able to give
S9: money to the organization. I wanted to all of that
S9: hit at the same time, and I knew I had
S9: to make a difference in my life.
S2: Kathy Lipp is our guest right now, and we're going
S2: to have a keyword for you and some resources that
S2: are going to help you because we give hope, help
S2: and healing around here. Kathy. There has to be a
S2: time when you look at yourself and go, okay, this
S2: clutter thing, I'm missing the mark. I'm going to call
S2: it what it is. It's sin. I'm missing the mark.
S2: That's tough because we've got to get through that threshold
S2: of going. This is not just clutter. This is something
S2: going on inside of me. And what is that thing
S2: inside of you? You've you've hinted at it, but for
S2: you specifically, what was it?
S9: It was fear, guilt and shame. Fear. I'm not going
S9: to have enough guilt. I've spent so much money on it.
S9: I need to keep it for the rest of my life.
S9: And shame. Somebody else gave this to me. And if
S9: I give it away, it means that that person is
S9: no longer important to me. And when I recognize that,
S9: and I admitted it to somebody else out loud because
S9: I think this it is the most shame inducing thing,
S9: you know. I've also struggled with my weight my whole life.
S9: I've lost £100 in my life, but I would say
S9: that this felt more shameful than that. And so, to
S9: finally come to the realization, I need to talk about
S9: this with somebody, whether that's a counselor or a trusted friend,
S9: and say, I need to get, you know, this fear,
S9: guilt and shame is eating me up, and I want
S9: to live a different life. And you can. You absolutely can.
S9: I've seen it happen hundreds, if not thousands of times.
S9: The recovery from this.
S3: So, Kathy, what does the recovery from something like this
S3: look like? Because, you know, you see, like the Pinterest
S3: worthy homes where everything's white, all the cabinets are white,
S3: all the furniture is white, no pets or children in sight.
S3: But what is what are you aiming for when you
S3: say clutter free academy or clutter free home? And this
S3: is now your thing. What's the goal?
S9: The goal is to walk into a space and feel
S9: like you belong there, to feel like, you know. Yeah,
S9: I don't want to live in somebody else's perfect house.
S9: And by the way, I'm always going to have clutter
S9: because I live a big life. I, you know, mail
S9: comes in, groceries come in. I'm working on a craft project. Like,
S9: there's always going to be some clutter. But clutter is life.
S9: It's the it's the excess that. That's where it starts
S9: to weigh us down. And so I want to have
S9: a home where if you walk in, you know that
S9: there is life going on there, but you also don't
S9: feel overwhelmed by that life.
S2: So is this a bite at a time rather than
S2: this whole big old elephant? One room, one closet, one drawer.
S2: What is it?
S9: Yeah. The most depressing sentence in the English language is
S9: I'm going to declutter my house today, I mean.
S7: Oh, gross. I know, thank you.
S9: But if I say I'm going to do 15 minutes
S9: on this junk drawer or I'm going to do 15 minutes,
S9: just like pulling my living room back together and people think, oh, Cathy,
S9: you have not seen my house. 15 minutes isn't going
S9: to do it. 15 minutes is more powerful than you think.
S9: So set a timer. Do 15 minutes. Don't you know?
S9: Don't be distracted. That email will wait. That social media
S9: post will wait. Just do it for 15 minutes. And
S9: you know what? Even if the first 15 minutes doesn't
S9: make a difference, by the third 15 minutes, you're going
S9: to be seeing a real difference and you're going to
S9: start to love your space more.
S2: I got a crazy question. I was driving past a
S2: big old storage unit yesterday. I mean, a behemoth, and
S2: I've heard the stories on this that a lot of
S2: people have these things. In fact, I love to ask
S2: questions to people all the time. So I was in
S2: a storage unit place one time. I said, what's the
S2: most storage unit someone has here? You know, she said, five.
S2: And I said, they must. They must have a business. No,
S2: she says, it's just household goods. And this person was
S2: so bold with her. The manager of the storage place
S2: that they were filled with shame. Someone listening? Not someone.
S2: Thousands have a storage unit in that sucker haunts them.
S2: They're paying 149.99 a month for.
S4: This stupid.
S2: Thing. And how do you. How do you ever get there?
S9: Yeah. So once you know that you are not alone,
S9: there are more storage units than there are McDonald's.
S7: Wow.
S9: So, yeah, if that gives you an idea about that.
S2: You don't mean individual units. You mean places.
S9: I mean places, uh, storefronts.
S2: Goodness.
S9: Yeah. You know, I live incredibly rurally. You know, there
S9: is not a McDonald's for an hour and a half
S9: from where I live. But I can think of seven
S9: storage unit places. So you are not alone. This is.
S9: This is the money cycle that we live in the
S9: United States. We spend the money and then we spend
S9: money to store the money. And so I would say,
S9: if you can have it, a goal, if you have
S9: five storage units, get it down to four. You can
S9: do that, I promise you. And here's the thing. If
S9: you are not using it, think about the time, the money,
S9: the energy that that is draining from you to store
S9: those things. And I like to think about it this way.
S9: When I donate something that is getting into the hands
S9: of somebody who will actually use it. People are not.
S9: I mean, yes, there are some people who are going to,
S9: you know, the goodwill or other organizations and buying things
S9: they don't need. But when I was a single mom,
S9: that's how I furnished my home. That's how I clothed
S9: my kids. People were giving their things that they were
S9: no longer using. And it helped create a life for
S9: this single mom. And so I want you to think about,
S9: could you be putting that into use for somebody? Because
S9: the sad thing about storage units is people are storing
S9: things and those things are becoming obsolete, or they're becoming
S9: eaten by moths. We we know about this biblically.
S4: It's biblical, it's biblical.
S9: And so get that into the hands of somebody who
S9: can use it. Maybe God gave you that extra money
S9: to buy that thing so that it could get into
S9: the hands of somebody who actually needs it.
S3: Cathy Lippe, she has the Clutter Free Academy podcast, also
S3: has books. Her website has some really great tools. I
S3: just was looking Cathy at your 50 like quick micro sorting.
S3: I gave me so many ideas that I want to
S3: try when I get home.
S7: I love it Ali. Thank you.
S4: Ali's going to do her 15 minutes in the drawer thing.
S3: Got my day planned out and it's not decluttering my
S3: whole house. Maybe I'll do one drawer today.
S4: That's it.
S3: Text clutter will set you up. Text clutter to 800
S3: 555 7898. If you want more from Cathy Lipp, our
S3: guest this morning, text clutter to 800 555 7898.