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S1: He's just back from a trip to Israel. But he

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S1: wasn't touring. He was learning, observing, and a lot of

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S1: what he saw was, quite frankly, shocking. How profound is

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S1: the impact of the Hamas war on Israel? What's next

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S1: for the nation that Hamas and others want to destroy completely?

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S1: Coming up, an update from Israel, plus all the top

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S1: stories of the Middle East. Welcome to the land and

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S1: the book. It's the one hour broadcast that takes you

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S1: to the Holy Land and back without a passport or

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S1: plane ticket. Our tour guide is Doctor Charlie Dyer, who,

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S1: by the way, has led more than 100 actual trips

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S1: to Israel. And I'm John Gager. Well, Israel, of course,

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S1: has been in the news a lot over the past year.

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S1: And as we know, the Bible is jam packed with

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S1: end times prophecies about epic world events, the regathering of

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S1: the Jewish people to their ancient homeland, and and then ultimately,

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S1: Jesus soon returned. It is crucial for us as believers

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S1: to have a proper understanding of Bible prophecy. So our

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S1: view of the future is shaped by Scripture, not just

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S1: headlines from today.

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S2: That's right. And with this in mind, our friends at

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S2: Life in Messiah have published a book titled God, Israel

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S2: and Bible Prophecy, and they're offering it to listeners of

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S2: the land in the book for a limited time. This

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S2: informative book is focused on providing readers with a deeper

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S2: understanding and greater appreciation of what God has in store

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S2: for Israel and the nations by digging into what the

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S2: scriptures say about these issues. Now, if you're interested in

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S2: learning more about what God has in store, visit Life

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S2: in Messiah. Org and click on the Moody Radio button

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S2: there to find out how you can receive your copy

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S2: of God, Israel and Bible Prophecy. That's life in messiah.org.

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S1: And now let's take a look at current events from

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S1: the Middle East. Israel's war with Hamas is no longer

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S1: headline news, but the war is still continuing. Charlie, what

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S1: exactly has been happening?

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S2: Well, the level of intensity in that war has dropped,

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S2: but Israel is continuing to put pressure on Hamas by

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S2: attacking remaining pockets of resistance. On Monday, a barrage of

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S2: 20 rockets was launched from Gaza against southern Israel. They

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S2: landed in open areas near the border but did no damage.

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S2: But it was a reminder that the war isn't over.

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S2: Israel continues to target Hamas and Islamic Jihad targets. They

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S2: want to keep pressure on Hamas to help secure a

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S2: hostage deal, but they're also continuing to search for and

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S2: destroy tunnels leading from Egypt to Gaza. Those are the

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S2: supply lines that were used to arm Hamas, and Israel

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S2: wants to cut off their ability to resupply. The number

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S2: of tunnels was far more extensive than initially thought. Some

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S2: believe that operation could actually take many more months to complete.

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S2: The next phase of the war also involves creating some

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S2: kind of a government alternative to Hamas. Israel is trying

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S2: to place Palestinians not affiliated with Hamas over some administrative functions. Meanwhile,

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S2: the US is trying to recruit other Arab countries to

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S2: participate in a post-war Gaza security force. Secretary of State

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S2: Blinken has said Egypt and the United Arab Emirates are

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S2: on board to serve as part of that force. However,

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S2: both conditioned their participation on plans to establish a pathway

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S2: to a future Palestinian state, and the UAE is also

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S2: demanding that the US be involved in the security force

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S2: in some way. There's one other item of note on

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S2: what's been happening in Gaza. A few months ago, the

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S2: UN and the International Court of Justice were accusing Israel

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S2: of genocide by creating a catastrophic food shortage in Gaza.

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S2: At the time, they claimed a full blown famine would

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S2: break out between March and July. Well, a new report

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S2: was released saying those previous assumptions were wrong. This new

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S2: UN linked report found no mortality data to prove famine

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S2: is present. The previous projection was based on wrong assumptions

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S2: on the amount of food entering the territory, instead of

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S2: decreasing the supply increased. Those earlier claims made the headlines,

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S2: but the new factual data debunking those claims has barely

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S2: been acknowledged. It's a good reminder that one of the

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S2: first casualties in war is the truth. Hamas has been

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S2: caught numerous times announcing so-called Israeli atrocities that turned out

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S2: to be false, but the reports were uncritically picked up

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S2: and broadcast by mainstream media. The level of coverage on

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S2: the war in Gaza is continuing to drop as the

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S2: press shifts its focus to other areas, but the war

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S2: still continuing, and Israel is still doing everything it can

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S2: to defeat Hamas, bring back the remaining hostages, and doing

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S2: so while harming as few civilians as possible. And that

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S2: is worth noting. Charlie, what.

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S1: About time frame here? Any thoughts on this? We're talking

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S1: about more tunnels to destroy, obviously hostage negotiations still going on.

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S1: What are what's the latest thinking on a time frame

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S1: for an end or some sort of a a stalled resolution.

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S2: Well, the one number that was thrown about was it

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S2: would take at least six months to a fully get

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S2: rid of all the tunnels that are leading in from

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S2: Egypt to Gaza. But the reality is they don't know

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S2: what they don't know. So that's just the best guess.

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S2: And it may be wildly optimistic or pessimistic.

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S1: Well, the conflict with Hamas may be sliding into the background,

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S1: but Israel's threatened conflict with Hezbollah and Iran seemed to

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S1: be taking its place. Is a peaceful resolution even possible,

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S1: or is war just simply inevitable at some point?

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S2: Well, war is definitely a possibility, though I wouldn't say

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S2: it's inevitable, though the headlines make it seem like that

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S2: in a speech, though, Israeli National Unity Party head Benny

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S2: Gantz said the Israeli Defense Force can destroy Hezbollah's military

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S2: capabilities in a matter of days. The former defense minister

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S2: did admit that Israel would pay a price in any war,

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S2: but the price paid by Lebanon and Hezbollah would be

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S2: far greater. For its part, Iran warned of obliterating Israel

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S2: if Israel attacks Hezbollah. It threatened to act against Israel

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S2: with full force and to include the full involvement of, quote,

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S2: all resistance fronts alluding to their allies in Iraq, Yemen

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S2: and Syria. Israel's foreign minister responded with his own threat,

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S2: saying A regime that threatens destruction deserves to be destroyed.

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S2: Israel's defense minister said Israel isn't looking for war but

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S2: is ready for it. He also said he hopes a

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S2: diplomatic solution could be reached. Now, the key to any

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S2: settlement is the implementation of UN Security Resolution 1701, which

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S2: created a demilitarized zone between the border and the Litani

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S2: River in Lebanon. This requires Hezbollah to remove its fighters

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S2: away from Israel's border to the north of that river.

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S2: This would allow the 60 to 80,000 Israeli citizens, who

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S2: have been displaced since October to return to their homes,

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S2: and it would allow Lebanese civilians who fled their homes

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S2: to return as well. A peaceful resolution is possible, but

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S2: the final decision rests with Hezbollah. One thing's for certain,

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S2: though Israel won't allow Hezbollah fighters to remain on their

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S2: border indefinitely. And a cut off time, if you will,

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S2: might be sometime in July or August.

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S1: Charlie, if you're Lebanon, you know you can't be thrilled

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S1: about what's happening either. What is the leverage that continues

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S1: to keep them from simply being reasonable?

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S2: Well, sadly for them, it's the fact that Hezbollah is

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S2: better armed than even the Lebanese army. No matter what

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S2: they say, they really don't have much of a voice

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S2: over Hezbollah because it is so well armed from Iran.

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S1: Story number three an archaeologist claims to have discovered evidence

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S1: of a Syrian army camps in Israel dating back to

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S1: the time of King Hezekiah. Where are these camps? How

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S1: reliable is the evidence and how would this discovery connect

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S1: to claims in the Bible?

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S2: You know, it's amazing. There are so many passages in

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S2: Second Kings 18 to 20, Isaiah 36 to 39, Second

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S2: Chronicles 32, and Isaiah ten. Micah one, along with others,

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S2: describe the invasion of Judah during the time of Hezekiah

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S2: by King Sennacherib of Assyria. Archaeological evidence from the ancient

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S2: city of Lachish matches that description, and so does a

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S2: relief on display in the British Museum that was originally

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S2: from the palace in Nineveh that depicts the Assyrian army

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S2: camp during its siege of Lachish. Now the camp in

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S2: that relief is oval shaped, and it's protected by a

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S2: wall with guard towers at regular intervals. So they have

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S2: some idea of what that camp would have looked like.

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S2: Using that relief, along with early photos from Israel and

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S2: some modern mapping techniques. Stephen Compton claims to have discovered

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S2: the location of the Assyrian army camps, both at Lachish

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S2: and just to the north of Jerusalem. If those proposed

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S2: sites are indeed Assyrian camps, it would be additional support

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S2: for the biblical accounts describing those attacks. However, I can't

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S2: get too excited about this announcement, at least not yet.

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S2: No actual excavations have been done at either site, so

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S2: he's basing his identification on Arabic names along with maps

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S2: and photos. But in the area where Lachish is located, well,

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S2: there are a lot of hills that would fit this description,

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S2: and it's not clear from the relief in the British

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S2: Museum that the Assyrians even put their camp on a hill. Now,

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S2: I believe the Assyrian camps are near Lachish, as shown

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S2: in that relief in the British Museum, and that they

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S2: were on the north side of Jerusalem, because Isaiah ten

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S2: says that. But, uh, the problem is right now we

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S2: don't know where they are. Someday his proposed locations might

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S2: be validated through excavations, but for right now, all we

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S2: can say is his proposed locations are in the right

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S2: general area, and that the Assyrians did indeed camp there

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S2: based on what the Bible says.

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S1: Well, six months ago, you reported on an Israeli medtech

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S1: company's innovative headset that could reduce delirium in ICU patients,

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S1: and an interim report now suggests the system is having

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S1: a positive impact on severely injured soldiers. So tell us

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S1: about this latest update from Icontrol control medical technology.

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S2: Yeah, this is a great story. You know, they originally

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S2: developed this headset as an alternative to communicate with people

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S2: who have ALS. But they saw an opportunity to try

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S2: and use it with those in ICU who are under

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S2: sedation and on a ventilator. And their hope was it

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S2: could help reduce or eliminate delirium and post-traumatic stress disorder.

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S2: The headset has an infrared camera that follows the eye,

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S2: a bone conduction earphone, and it's connected to the cloud

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S2: via Wi-Fi. Sedated patients are in a state of artificial sleep,

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S2: but the brain still works to fill in gaps, which

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S2: is what leads to nightmares, PTSD, and delirium. So playing

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S2: familiar sounds in this headset, like favorite music or hearing

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S2: verbal messages from the family, is what they were hoping

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S2: would fill in the gaps. And indeed, that's what is happening.

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S2: One seriously wounded patient awoke after six months in intensive

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S2: care and asked the nurse to listen to his favorite music,

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S2: which they had been playing. The innovative use of this

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S2: system is really having a positive impact on those in ICU.

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S1: And that's a look at current events from the Middle

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S1: East with our host, doctor Charlie Dyer. Coming up, a

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S1: conversation where we're going to head inside Israel with a

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S1: guy who's just back, fresh insights, perspectives you need to hear.

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S1: That's all ahead on today's edition of The Land and

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S1: the book. When it comes to the war with Hamas,

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S1: facts have ceased to matter in America. A generation that

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S1: claims to measure everything with science has thrown science out

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S1: the window. What's left is narrative, and that narrative is viciously,

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S1: sometimes violently, opposed to Israel. What's really going on? Troy

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S1: Miller of the National Religious Broadcasters was just in Israel.

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S1: He joins us today with fresh insights in just a

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S1: moment here on the land and the book. Welcome. I'm

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S1: John Gager, and before we join Troy, let's think about

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S1: ways that we can model Christ for our Jewish friends

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S1: and neighbors. Helping you help your Jewish friend find Yeshua

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S1: in the Old Testament. That's our challenge. As we sit

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S1: down with Michael Riedel, general editor of the Moody Handbook

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S1: of Messianic Prophecy. Where would you take us?

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S3: I would say, you know, so often people say Jesus

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S3: was some sort of victim. No, this was a choice

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S3: that the Hebrew prophets said he would make to suffer

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S3: for us. It says in Isaiah 50 when it talks

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S3: about the suffering servant, it's a first person kind of statement,

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S3: a poem written in the first person. He says. I

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S3: gave my back to those who beat me and my

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S3: cheeks to those who tore out my beard. I did

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S3: not hide my face from scorn and spitting. Isaiah 50,

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S3: verse six. What he is saying is, I willingly suffered.

224
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S3: I did not go to the cross as a victim.

225
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S3: It was my choice. That's what the Lord Jesus taught.

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S3: No man takes my life, but I lay it down willingly.

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S3: He gave himself for us because it was his choice.

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S3: He was not a victim of oppression. He was one

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S3: who chose. He could have called those angels to deliver him,

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S3: but he chose to die for us.

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S1: Our thanks to Michael Radiogenic, professor of Jewish studies here

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S1: at the Moody Bible Institute, joining us on the land

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S1: and the book. Troy Miller is president and CEO of

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S1: the National Religious Broadcasters. He's enjoyed a distinguished and varied career,

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S1: including 15 years with the US Navy. He worked for

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S1: Personal Computer Gateway Incorporated for ten years, was involved in

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S1: leading several business start ups, including Gateway's expansion into Europe

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S1: and Asia. Troy has also served as the executive vice

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S1: president and chief operating officer for James Kennedy Ministries. And

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S1: as I mentioned earlier, he recently returned from a trip

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S1: to Israel, which is the focus of today's conversation. Hey,

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S1: welcome to the land and the book, Troy.

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S4: Thanks, John. I'm glad to be with you.

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S1: So what was the nature of your visit to Israel?

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S4: So we took a group of Christian communicators, uh, people

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S4: that were in Christian media over for what we called

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00:13:45,750 --> 00:13:48,990
S4: a solidarity and fact finding tour. We were able to

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S4: meet with a number of officials and a number of

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S4: organizations while we were there, to really get a good

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S4: perspective of what's going on in Israel today with the

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S4: war on Hamas, and also what's going on in the

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S4: northern border with Hezbollah. So that was kind of the

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S4: whole gist of our mission. But we also met with

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S4: a number of religious leaders so that we could show

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S4: the solidarity that Christians have for Israel and for our

256
00:14:13,130 --> 00:14:15,349
S4: brothers and sisters there. As you know, there's a lot

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S4: of opposition going on in the U.S. right now. And

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S4: so that was an important message we wanted to bring.

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S1: Well, you did a lot of walking, a lot of touring.

260
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S1: Tell me about an experience you had that felt like

261
00:14:25,490 --> 00:14:28,010
S1: a kick in the stomach. What comes to mind?

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S4: Yeah, I think the two biggest kicks in the stomach

263
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S4: that we had one. We visited the Nova music Festival

264
00:14:34,910 --> 00:14:39,050
S4: grounds and were able to talk to a few survivors.

265
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S4: And when you really understand what happened on that music grounds,

266
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S4: that festival there, it really is just heart wrenching for

267
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S4: you to understand that these young kids woke up that morning,

268
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S4: they were listening to music. They were getting ready to

269
00:14:54,710 --> 00:14:57,370
S4: kind of head home for the day. And then they

270
00:14:57,370 --> 00:15:01,870
S4: heard the sirens. But the sirens quickly turned into gunfire.

271
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S4: And just the horrific events there, and the number of

272
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S4: young adults that lost their lives, that had promising lives.

273
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S4: It's just a heartache. Just gut wrenching, as you said.

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S1: National Religious Broadcasters President and CEO Troy Miller is just

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S1: back from a trip to Israel, and we appreciate his

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S1: updates today on the land. And the book. Sounds like

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S1: traveling to Israel right now in particular, is a whole

278
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S1: lot different than talking about Israel, particularly the way the

279
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S1: mainstream media has covered the current war. What are your thoughts?

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S4: Oh, absolutely. The mainstream media, somehow I don't I'm not

281
00:15:37,890 --> 00:15:42,510
S4: sure how has turned Israel into, you know, the enemy here,

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S4: as if Israel was the perpetrator on October 7th and

283
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S4: has forgotten that that it was Hamas who launched this

284
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S4: horrific attack on these very peaceful and for the most part,

285
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S4: very liberal communities that were down in the South. A

286
00:15:59,900 --> 00:16:03,560
S4: lot of these communities were working very hard on the

287
00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:08,240
S4: behalf of Palestinians and Palestinian citizens, trying to employ them,

288
00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,900
S4: educate them, help them get medical coverage. Just a number

289
00:16:11,900 --> 00:16:15,050
S4: of things there. And those are messages that the mainstream

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S4: media is just not talking about. And also the fact,

291
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S4: you know, just as, uh, not too long after we

292
00:16:20,660 --> 00:16:24,440
S4: got back, Israel, you know, rescued four hostages. Two of

293
00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:30,260
S4: those hostages were being held by Palestinian civilians. They weren't

294
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S4: being held by, you know, the Hamas militants, the terrorists,

295
00:16:33,310 --> 00:16:36,010
S4: they were being held by civilians. And this is just

296
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S4: a message that mainstream media is not reporting. And they're

297
00:16:39,580 --> 00:16:42,040
S4: also not reporting, John, on what's going on on the

298
00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:45,910
S4: northern border. Until recently, Hezbollah on the northern border has

299
00:16:45,910 --> 00:16:50,050
S4: launched well over a thousand rocket attacks into Israel. And

300
00:16:50,050 --> 00:16:53,050
S4: so there's a lot going on in Israel that we

301
00:16:53,050 --> 00:16:54,490
S4: want people to be aware of.

302
00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:57,150
S1: Troy, the question is why? What's the payoff? What's the

303
00:16:57,150 --> 00:17:01,470
S1: pressure point that is creating this kind of false reporting?

304
00:17:01,740 --> 00:17:05,160
S4: Well, I think it just falls in line with the

305
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:09,180
S4: problem we have here in the U.S., the indoctrination on

306
00:17:09,180 --> 00:17:12,690
S4: critical race theory and intersectionality and some of these things

307
00:17:12,690 --> 00:17:15,929
S4: that have been taught in these colleges and universities. And

308
00:17:15,930 --> 00:17:20,420
S4: now they see Israel, you know, portrayed Israel as the aggressor,

309
00:17:20,420 --> 00:17:23,930
S4: as the evil in this, as the colonial power. And

310
00:17:23,930 --> 00:17:26,720
S4: people don't realize that, you know, the land that God

311
00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:29,420
S4: gave Israel way back, all the way back that he

312
00:17:29,420 --> 00:17:33,980
S4: promised Abraham. Jews have been in that land continuously. There

313
00:17:33,980 --> 00:17:36,650
S4: has never been a time where the Jewish people have

314
00:17:36,650 --> 00:17:39,530
S4: not been in the land. There's been a remnant. Of course,

315
00:17:39,530 --> 00:17:42,380
S4: we know there's a dispersion, but the Jewish people were

316
00:17:42,380 --> 00:17:47,060
S4: there long before 1948, before Israel was declared a state.

317
00:17:47,060 --> 00:17:50,480
S4: And I think that it just fits into this socialist

318
00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:53,630
S4: Marxist indoctrination that they're doing, and they don't know how

319
00:17:53,630 --> 00:17:56,300
S4: to back away from it now. We met with some

320
00:17:56,300 --> 00:18:00,470
S4: protesters and people who, like those who deny the Holocaust,

321
00:18:00,500 --> 00:18:04,490
S4: were even denying that October 7th even happened in Israel,

322
00:18:04,490 --> 00:18:07,250
S4: and that it's just the narrative there is really, really

323
00:18:07,250 --> 00:18:08,510
S4: hard to understand.

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S1: Well, if you joined us midstream, this is the Land

325
00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,600
S1: and the book from Moody Radio, I'm John Gager, joined

326
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S1: by Troy Miller, who is president of the National Religious

327
00:18:17,270 --> 00:18:20,960
S1: Broadcasters here in the US. Troy polling has shown a

328
00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:26,090
S1: precipitous drop in support for Israel among young evangelicals impacted

329
00:18:26,090 --> 00:18:29,389
S1: by both social media and their peers over the images

330
00:18:29,390 --> 00:18:32,129
S1: coming from Gaza. So how do you suggest we counteract

331
00:18:32,130 --> 00:18:33,000
S1: all of this?

332
00:18:33,030 --> 00:18:37,230
S4: It's a topic that pastors and leaders, elders and churches

333
00:18:37,230 --> 00:18:40,350
S4: need to talk about and Christian media is talking about.

334
00:18:40,350 --> 00:18:42,870
S4: And I'm so glad that you're covering this topic today.

335
00:18:42,869 --> 00:18:46,200
S4: And we really need to get Christian influencers on these

336
00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:50,790
S4: social media platforms, particularly TikTok, where the young adults, young

337
00:18:50,790 --> 00:18:55,670
S4: evangelicals really get their information from and communicate the truth

338
00:18:55,670 --> 00:18:58,580
S4: about what's really going on in Israel and what's really

339
00:18:58,580 --> 00:19:03,170
S4: behind these attacks, and the fact that Hamas really simply

340
00:19:03,170 --> 00:19:06,260
S4: wants the elimination of the Jewish people in the Middle East.

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00:19:06,290 --> 00:19:09,950
S1: Well, one bright spot in this discussion. You've observed that

342
00:19:09,950 --> 00:19:14,389
S1: when American students who have a strong faith based background,

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00:19:14,390 --> 00:19:17,300
S1: when they're presented with the full picture, they're more inclined

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00:19:17,330 --> 00:19:20,740
S1: to be supportive of Israel than their secular counterparts. Give

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00:19:20,740 --> 00:19:22,389
S1: us a story or example here.

346
00:19:22,570 --> 00:19:23,320
S5: Yes.

347
00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:27,399
S4: So my daughter actually went out to the University of

348
00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:31,090
S4: California with Concerned Women of America to march on behalf

349
00:19:31,090 --> 00:19:33,760
S4: of Israel, and they were able to meet some of

350
00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,850
S4: the protesters, and particularly some of the protesters who were

351
00:19:36,850 --> 00:19:40,450
S4: Christians out there and have these dialogues, have a conversation

352
00:19:40,450 --> 00:19:44,320
S4: and talk about, okay, here's what happened October 7th. Here's

353
00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:48,100
S4: what Israel's facing. Did you know that Israel has given

354
00:19:48,100 --> 00:19:52,870
S4: the Palestinian people complete autonomy to run their cities and

355
00:19:52,869 --> 00:19:56,320
S4: to run their areas? And as she had those conversations,

356
00:19:56,320 --> 00:20:00,730
S4: she found out that very quickly the evangelical students said, oh,

357
00:20:00,730 --> 00:20:03,340
S4: we didn't know any of that. The Christians that were

358
00:20:03,340 --> 00:20:06,190
S4: there marching on behalf of Palestine. So we didn't really

359
00:20:06,190 --> 00:20:08,700
S4: realize any of that. And she said several of them

360
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S4: just walked away from the protest.

361
00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:13,140
S1: Mm. That's great. Hey, let's talk a bit more about

362
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S1: the anti-Semitic wave that's rolling over college campuses. You've written

363
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:21,659
S1: the actions of an extremist minority on college campuses across

364
00:20:21,660 --> 00:20:24,960
S1: the United States have created a backlash that is bringing

365
00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:30,720
S1: Christians and Jews together against the woke driven, anti-Israel ideology

366
00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:33,810
S1: permeating the mainstream media. Give us an example of this

367
00:20:33,810 --> 00:20:34,890
S1: coming together.

368
00:20:35,070 --> 00:20:35,580
S5: Yeah.

369
00:20:35,580 --> 00:20:38,550
S4: So again, look at my daughter. You know, she's 23

370
00:20:38,550 --> 00:20:42,810
S4: years old. She flies out to California to go and

371
00:20:42,810 --> 00:20:46,620
S4: rally on behalf of the Jewish and Israeli students at

372
00:20:46,619 --> 00:20:49,770
S4: the University of Southern California. And we also saw this

373
00:20:49,770 --> 00:20:54,030
S4: down at many of the southern universities, University of Mississippi,

374
00:20:54,030 --> 00:20:56,500
S4: where there was a march down there by a number

375
00:20:56,500 --> 00:21:01,600
S4: of anti-Israeli march, a pro-Palestinian march and a group from

376
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:05,080
S4: one of the Christian student bodies was a group that

377
00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:07,540
S4: helped surround some of the monuments so that they could

378
00:21:07,540 --> 00:21:10,720
S4: not be defaced. And these are groups that are groups

379
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:15,220
S4: across this country that have volunteered to escort Jewish students

380
00:21:15,220 --> 00:21:19,360
S4: to their classes. And these are predominantly Christian groups. These

381
00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:23,380
S4: are predominantly young Christian adults who come alongside their Jewish

382
00:21:23,380 --> 00:21:27,340
S4: brothers and sisters on the campuses to show that solidarity

383
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S4: and protect them. And that is really, as you said,

384
00:21:30,130 --> 00:21:33,340
S4: that's a really hopeful thing that we're actually seeing Christians

385
00:21:33,340 --> 00:21:37,389
S4: stand up today and protect our Jewish brothers and sisters.

386
00:21:37,390 --> 00:21:41,260
S1: What's happening now in Israel and how it's being portrayed

387
00:21:41,260 --> 00:21:44,310
S1: here in America. That's our focus on the land and

388
00:21:44,310 --> 00:21:47,370
S1: the book as we dialogue today with Troy Miller, president

389
00:21:47,369 --> 00:21:51,389
S1: of the National Religious Broadcasters, just back from Israel, it

390
00:21:51,390 --> 00:21:54,060
S1: feels very much like Israel has just plain lost the

391
00:21:54,060 --> 00:21:57,300
S1: media war. At least, you know, in the mainstream media.

392
00:21:57,300 --> 00:22:00,480
S1: How can we take seriously though, the claim of genocide

393
00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:04,830
S1: against Israel when the Hamas charter talks specifically about the

394
00:22:04,830 --> 00:22:08,209
S1: destruction of Israel? Why does this get no mention, no

395
00:22:08,210 --> 00:22:10,639
S1: traction in the media? And what can believers do to

396
00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:11,510
S1: change that?

397
00:22:11,540 --> 00:22:15,020
S4: Look, the mainstream media has a message that they want

398
00:22:15,020 --> 00:22:17,510
S4: to send out. And I think we're seeing this today,

399
00:22:17,510 --> 00:22:21,830
S4: as we've seen a lot of these anti-Israel pro-Palestinian marches

400
00:22:21,830 --> 00:22:26,780
S4: really morph into anti-American marches. And even in some cases,

401
00:22:26,780 --> 00:22:29,899
S4: some of these marches have called, you know, for violence

402
00:22:29,900 --> 00:22:31,760
S4: on Christians. And I think one of the things that

403
00:22:31,790 --> 00:22:35,149
S4: Christian media can do is Christian media needs to keep

404
00:22:35,150 --> 00:22:39,080
S4: reminding people of the truth, and especially us as Christians,

405
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,260
S4: we understand, we look in our Bible, we can read

406
00:22:42,260 --> 00:22:45,350
S4: from Exodus, we can read the promises that were made

407
00:22:45,350 --> 00:22:49,909
S4: to Abraham in Genesis. We can read Joshua's conquest. And

408
00:22:49,910 --> 00:22:52,370
S4: we understand that the land that God, this is the

409
00:22:52,369 --> 00:22:55,430
S4: creator of the universe. He carved out this one place

410
00:22:55,430 --> 00:22:57,699
S4: of all the earth. God took this land and carved

411
00:22:57,700 --> 00:23:00,159
S4: it out for his people. And so one of the

412
00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:03,730
S4: initiatives that we've launched also is an initiative called Keep

413
00:23:03,730 --> 00:23:06,550
S4: God's Land, which is we change the rhetoric and we

414
00:23:06,550 --> 00:23:08,800
S4: don't talk about things like the West Bank. There is

415
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:10,780
S4: no such thing as a West Bank. That's a made

416
00:23:10,780 --> 00:23:14,169
S4: up term. This land is Judea and Samaria. This is

417
00:23:14,170 --> 00:23:17,140
S4: the land that Christ walked himself in. And this was

418
00:23:17,140 --> 00:23:19,570
S4: the land that was given to the Jewish people. And

419
00:23:19,570 --> 00:23:21,690
S4: so we need to keep that narrative going. You know,

420
00:23:21,690 --> 00:23:24,060
S4: so many young people can't even name when they chant

421
00:23:24,060 --> 00:23:26,010
S4: from the river to the sea. They can't even name

422
00:23:26,010 --> 00:23:28,680
S4: the river. They don't even understand what's going on there.

423
00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:31,680
S4: And as you said, we don't talk enough about Hamas,

424
00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:34,470
S4: who recently just got on. The Hamas leader who's in

425
00:23:34,470 --> 00:23:37,950
S4: Qatar recently just got on the the mainstream media, got

426
00:23:37,980 --> 00:23:42,330
S4: on Al Jazeera and called for the elimination of all

427
00:23:42,330 --> 00:23:46,040
S4: homosexuals across the Middle East, and talked about how there's

428
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:50,090
S4: no repentance for that. And that's the difference between Christianity

429
00:23:50,090 --> 00:23:54,680
S4: and radical Islam. We understand that God forgives, there is repentance.

430
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,350
S4: There is a way back to Christ, has paid the

431
00:23:57,350 --> 00:24:01,070
S4: penalty for our sins, and we need to talk more

432
00:24:01,070 --> 00:24:03,320
S4: about that. As a church, we need to talk about

433
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:05,930
S4: this is God's land, and we need to talk about

434
00:24:05,930 --> 00:24:09,820
S4: really the difference that's going on here between Islam, Judaism

435
00:24:09,820 --> 00:24:10,990
S4: and Christianity.

436
00:24:11,020 --> 00:24:14,050
S1: Troy, I read a Pew Research report, This is fresh,

437
00:24:14,050 --> 00:24:17,650
S1: in which people were asked about speech that supports Israel's

438
00:24:17,650 --> 00:24:21,369
S1: right to exist, among other questions. Should that type of

439
00:24:21,369 --> 00:24:24,940
S1: speech be allowed, meaning Israel's right to exist? Should that

440
00:24:24,940 --> 00:24:30,129
S1: be allowed? Get this 7% of Americans said no and 21%

441
00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:34,630
S1: were unsure. Why are we not more outraged by this

442
00:24:34,630 --> 00:24:38,260
S1: apparent desire to shut down even speech about these things?

443
00:24:38,859 --> 00:24:40,420
S5: Yeah, well, look.

444
00:24:40,420 --> 00:24:43,990
S4: We should be completely outraged that we can't talk about

445
00:24:43,990 --> 00:24:47,109
S4: something as simple as the right for the Israeli state

446
00:24:47,109 --> 00:24:50,170
S4: to exist, a right that was given to them in 1948,

447
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,140
S4: a right that has been there, as we said, from

448
00:24:53,140 --> 00:24:56,490
S4: God from the beginning. And this is very indicative of

449
00:24:56,490 --> 00:24:59,880
S4: what's going on in society today. We see the weaponization

450
00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:03,479
S4: of the mainstream media. Mainstream media today is not media.

451
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:08,970
S4: They're a propaganda generation, factories generating factories that are out there.

452
00:25:08,970 --> 00:25:12,300
S4: And we see this weaponization of the government. And I

453
00:25:12,300 --> 00:25:14,940
S4: think people I really would hope that people would have

454
00:25:14,940 --> 00:25:18,930
S4: a bigger backlash to this after the whole Covid pandemic mess,

455
00:25:18,930 --> 00:25:21,109
S4: where we found out that so much of what they

456
00:25:21,109 --> 00:25:26,810
S4: called misinformation really turned out to be real information. And today,

457
00:25:26,810 --> 00:25:29,060
S4: I don't know why we don't, but we need our

458
00:25:29,060 --> 00:25:32,570
S4: pastors need to talk about the value of our First

459
00:25:32,570 --> 00:25:35,330
S4: Amendment rights, our God given rights. The values that the

460
00:25:35,330 --> 00:25:39,680
S4: Founding Fathers understood were rights given to us not by

461
00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:42,230
S4: the government, but given to us by our creator.

462
00:25:42,260 --> 00:25:46,240
S1: National Religious broadcasters. Broadcasters President and CEO Troy Miller has

463
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,700
S1: joined us today on the land and the book. We're

464
00:25:48,700 --> 00:25:51,790
S1: up next. Charlie Dyer takes a look at your questions.

465
00:25:51,790 --> 00:25:54,730
S1: I'm looking forward to what's puzzling you on the land

466
00:25:54,730 --> 00:26:08,290
S1: and the book. Hope your day is going well. This

467
00:26:08,290 --> 00:26:10,750
S1: is the land and the book from Moody Radio with

468
00:26:10,750 --> 00:26:13,810
S1: our host, Charlie Dyer. I'm John Gager, and this is

469
00:26:13,810 --> 00:26:16,750
S1: segment three, Bible Questions and Answers. We have a great

470
00:26:16,750 --> 00:26:20,290
S1: time because it's not us doing the scripting, the asking,

471
00:26:20,290 --> 00:26:22,900
S1: it's you. The questions are all yours. They're all real.

472
00:26:22,900 --> 00:26:25,270
S1: They come to us via email at The Land and

473
00:26:25,270 --> 00:26:29,590
S1: the book@moody.edu. You know, Charlie Israel has been in the

474
00:26:29,590 --> 00:26:32,260
S1: news a lot over the past year and as we know,

475
00:26:32,260 --> 00:26:35,639
S1: the Bible is jam packed with end times prophecies about

476
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:38,790
S1: epic world events, the regathering of the Jewish people to

477
00:26:38,790 --> 00:26:42,720
S1: their ancient homeland, and Jesus return. It's crucial for us, though,

478
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,260
S1: as believers, to have a proper understanding of Bible prophecy.

479
00:26:46,260 --> 00:26:48,810
S1: So our view of the future is shaped by Scripture, right?

480
00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:49,950
S1: Not today's headlines.

481
00:26:49,980 --> 00:26:52,800
S2: That's exactly right. And with this in mind, our friends

482
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:56,010
S2: at Life and Messiah have published a book titled God,

483
00:26:56,010 --> 00:26:59,450
S2: Israel and Bible Prophecy, and they're offering it to listeners

484
00:26:59,450 --> 00:27:01,490
S2: of the land in the book for a limited time.

485
00:27:01,490 --> 00:27:04,820
S2: This informative book is focused on providing readers with a

486
00:27:04,820 --> 00:27:08,690
S2: deeper understanding and greater appreciation of what God has in

487
00:27:08,690 --> 00:27:11,600
S2: store for Israel and the nations by digging into what

488
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:14,450
S2: the scriptures say about these issues. Now, if you're interested

489
00:27:14,450 --> 00:27:17,240
S2: in learning more about what God has in store, visit

490
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:20,270
S2: Life in Messiah. Org and click on the Moody Radio

491
00:27:20,270 --> 00:27:22,930
S2: button to find out how you can receive your copy

492
00:27:22,930 --> 00:27:28,390
S2: of God, Israel and Bible Prophecy. That's life in Messiah org.

493
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,419
S1: All right. Thank you. Charlie. Let's dig into our first question.

494
00:27:31,420 --> 00:27:34,659
S1: This one from Sue she says, is time one of

495
00:27:34,660 --> 00:27:37,929
S1: God's attributes or did he create time? And if he

496
00:27:37,930 --> 00:27:41,169
S1: created time, when did he do so? Is God just

497
00:27:41,170 --> 00:27:44,260
S1: present in this moment or does he simultaneously exist in

498
00:27:44,260 --> 00:27:48,850
S1: the past, present, and future? How does God see the future? Yeah, I.

499
00:27:48,850 --> 00:27:51,250
S2: Don't see time as being an attribute of God. A

500
00:27:51,250 --> 00:27:53,710
S2: time seems to be a function of the created order.

501
00:27:53,710 --> 00:27:56,109
S2: It's a property of creation, kind of like the second

502
00:27:56,109 --> 00:27:58,869
S2: law of thermodynamics or the speed of light. You know,

503
00:27:58,869 --> 00:28:02,560
S2: passages like Psalm 90 put God outside the created order.

504
00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:04,870
S2: It says there before the mountains were born, or you

505
00:28:04,869 --> 00:28:08,830
S2: brought forth the whole earth from everlasting to everlasting, your God.

506
00:28:09,010 --> 00:28:12,070
S2: That Psalm also describes, I think, in poetic fashion, how

507
00:28:12,070 --> 00:28:15,040
S2: God's view of time is so vastly different than ours.

508
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:17,980
S2: It says A thousand years in your sight are like

509
00:28:17,980 --> 00:28:19,990
S2: a day that's just gone by, or like a watch

510
00:28:19,990 --> 00:28:23,410
S2: in the night. Now, in terms of God's relationship to time,

511
00:28:23,410 --> 00:28:26,710
S2: I like what God himself said in Isaiah 46. He says,

512
00:28:26,710 --> 00:28:29,260
S2: remember the former things those of long ago I'm God,

513
00:28:29,260 --> 00:28:32,020
S2: there is no other. I'm God, there's none like me.

514
00:28:32,020 --> 00:28:35,479
S2: I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times.

515
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:38,300
S2: What is still to come. So trying to determine how

516
00:28:38,330 --> 00:28:40,430
S2: time relates to God, at least to me, seems to

517
00:28:40,430 --> 00:28:44,780
S2: be irrelevant since time itself, past, present, future exists within

518
00:28:44,780 --> 00:28:49,070
S2: the plan he designed before time, as we even understand it, began.

519
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:51,830
S2: One last passage though it's from the New Testament. First

520
00:28:51,830 --> 00:28:55,610
S2: Timothy one nine. There Paul describes God's gracious plan of

521
00:28:55,610 --> 00:28:58,180
S2: salvation through his son. He says it was given in

522
00:28:58,180 --> 00:29:02,290
S2: Christ Jesus before the beginning of time. Literally. It says

523
00:29:02,290 --> 00:29:06,520
S2: before time eternal. We might say before the eons of time.

524
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,370
S2: But the key here is that this was before those

525
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,310
S2: eons of time even began. God was there, and he

526
00:29:12,310 --> 00:29:15,160
S2: had a plan prior to the foundation of time itself.

527
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:19,150
S1: Interesting. Robin takes us to Romans 826, which says, the

528
00:29:19,150 --> 00:29:23,760
S1: Holy Spirit intercedes for us. But verse 34 says, Jesus

529
00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:26,220
S1: Christ intercedes for us. Now how are these two roles

530
00:29:26,220 --> 00:29:27,900
S1: similar and or different?

531
00:29:27,930 --> 00:29:30,330
S2: Well, I see them as complementary, you know, in verses

532
00:29:30,330 --> 00:29:33,840
S2: 22 to 28. In that section, Paul uses three forms

533
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:36,540
S2: of a word for groan or groaning. In verse 22,

534
00:29:36,540 --> 00:29:40,320
S2: the whole creation groans together. In verse 23, we groan

535
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,860
S2: within ourselves, and then in verse 26, the spirit intercedes

536
00:29:43,860 --> 00:29:47,400
S2: for us, he says with groanings that words can't express.

537
00:29:47,580 --> 00:29:49,560
S2: His point here is that the world around us is

538
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:52,950
S2: full of struggles. We experience struggles as well. And he

539
00:29:52,950 --> 00:29:55,770
S2: says in verse 26, the spirit comes to our aid

540
00:29:55,770 --> 00:29:58,830
S2: by taking all the prayer concerns we struggle over and

541
00:29:58,830 --> 00:30:01,410
S2: bringing them to God the Father with an intensity with

542
00:30:01,410 --> 00:30:04,709
S2: groanings that we can't even begin to imagine. And he

543
00:30:04,710 --> 00:30:07,440
S2: does it in accordance with God's will. So as a result,

544
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:09,920
S2: we have confidence God will work all things together for

545
00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:11,990
S2: the good of those who love him. Because of the

546
00:30:11,990 --> 00:30:14,510
S2: role of the spirit in praying for us and taking

547
00:30:14,510 --> 00:30:17,750
S2: our feeble prayers and translating them into those powerful and

548
00:30:17,750 --> 00:30:21,110
S2: passionate words that align with God's will. Now the second part,

549
00:30:21,110 --> 00:30:24,920
S2: verses 31 to 35. The focus isn't on prayer, but

550
00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:27,350
S2: it's on the issue of our acceptance by God. And

551
00:30:27,350 --> 00:30:29,690
S2: he says, no charge can be made against us that

552
00:30:29,690 --> 00:30:34,300
S2: can stand because God has predestined, called, justified and glorified us.

553
00:30:34,300 --> 00:30:36,430
S2: And we know that because God gave His Son to

554
00:30:36,430 --> 00:30:39,130
S2: pay the penalty for our sin. So Paul's arguing from

555
00:30:39,130 --> 00:30:41,440
S2: the greater to the lesser. If if God already has

556
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:43,750
S2: given us his son, won't he also meet all our

557
00:30:43,750 --> 00:30:46,150
S2: other needs by his grace? And then he says, how

558
00:30:46,150 --> 00:30:49,090
S2: can charges be made against us since God justifies us?

559
00:30:49,090 --> 00:30:51,700
S2: Christ died for us, was raised from the dead, and

560
00:30:51,700 --> 00:30:54,640
S2: intercedes for us. And now in those verses, the intercession

561
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:58,320
S2: isn't focused on answering prayer, but on answering any objections

562
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:00,750
S2: someone might raise about our salvation.

563
00:31:00,750 --> 00:31:03,600
S1: Questions and answers. With Charlie and John here on the

564
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:07,170
S1: land and the book. Charlie's answering those questions. I get

565
00:31:07,170 --> 00:31:09,780
S1: to ask your questions, and that's kind of fun. Here's

566
00:31:09,780 --> 00:31:12,330
S1: one from Joe, she says, considering the great importance that

567
00:31:12,330 --> 00:31:16,620
S1: the tabernacle and temple sacrifices had for the Jewish people,

568
00:31:16,620 --> 00:31:18,990
S1: how did they transition out of all that? A ritual

569
00:31:18,990 --> 00:31:21,180
S1: that was so incredibly significant?

570
00:31:21,210 --> 00:31:24,840
S2: Well, from a human perspective, the sacrifices and temple system

571
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:27,540
S2: ceased because the temple was destroyed by the Romans in

572
00:31:27,540 --> 00:31:32,160
S2: AD 70. In Deuteronomy 12, God gave specific requirements on

573
00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:34,890
S2: where they were to offer their sacrifices. He says, you

574
00:31:34,890 --> 00:31:36,870
S2: can't just choose any place. You've got to go to

575
00:31:36,870 --> 00:31:39,600
S2: the one which your Lord, your God will choose. So

576
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,330
S2: initially the tabernacle was set up at Shiloh. That's the

577
00:31:42,330 --> 00:31:45,350
S2: place chosen by God. But then it became Jerusalem when

578
00:31:45,350 --> 00:31:48,740
S2: Solomon's Temple was built. There are Jewish individuals today who

579
00:31:48,740 --> 00:31:51,710
S2: believe they need to rebuild the temple now, since they're

580
00:31:51,710 --> 00:31:54,260
S2: back in the land. But until a new temple is built,

581
00:31:54,260 --> 00:31:58,550
S2: they're prohibited from offering sacrifices and performing those other rituals.

582
00:31:58,700 --> 00:32:02,780
S1: From Brian this question some Christians believe that nations should

583
00:32:02,780 --> 00:32:06,260
S1: be non-resistant and never enter a war. Others think we

584
00:32:06,260 --> 00:32:09,290
S1: shouldn't start one but have a right to defend ourselves

585
00:32:09,290 --> 00:32:13,370
S1: and or other nations. Still, others might feel Christians shouldn't fight,

586
00:32:13,370 --> 00:32:16,460
S1: but it's all right for non-Christians to fight. What can

587
00:32:16,460 --> 00:32:18,080
S1: we conclude from Scripture?

588
00:32:18,170 --> 00:32:19,970
S2: Yeah, and this is one where I've got to watch

589
00:32:19,970 --> 00:32:22,730
S2: very carefully, because to fit everything in, I could go

590
00:32:22,730 --> 00:32:24,560
S2: a mile a minute speaking. So I want to try

591
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:27,080
S2: and speak slowly, but we're going to cover a lot

592
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:30,560
S2: of ground because good and godly people do disagree. So

593
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:32,630
S2: I'm going to offend some listeners and what I'm going

594
00:32:32,630 --> 00:32:34,770
S2: to say. and it's my opinion. And here's what I

595
00:32:34,770 --> 00:32:37,020
S2: believe the Bible teaches. So if you don't like it

596
00:32:37,020 --> 00:32:39,780
S2: I'm sorry, but God does prohibit murder. We can all

597
00:32:39,780 --> 00:32:42,780
S2: agree on that. That's the intentional taking of an innocent life.

598
00:32:42,780 --> 00:32:46,470
S2: That's the sixth commandment thou shalt not kill. But second,

599
00:32:46,470 --> 00:32:49,380
S2: I don't believe that command is intended to be absolute

600
00:32:49,380 --> 00:32:53,670
S2: without exception. In this sense, in Genesis nine six, God

601
00:32:53,670 --> 00:32:57,480
S2: established capital punishment for deliberate murder. Whoever sheds the blood

602
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,240
S2: of man by man shall his blood be shed. For

603
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,460
S2: in the image of God, God has made him. A

604
00:33:02,460 --> 00:33:05,010
S2: human life is to be held sacred, and the penalty

605
00:33:05,010 --> 00:33:08,520
S2: for deliberately taking a human life for committing murder is

606
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:10,530
S2: the forfeiture of the life of the one who commits

607
00:33:10,530 --> 00:33:13,110
S2: that murder. Now that principle is repeated in both the

608
00:33:13,110 --> 00:33:17,400
S2: Old and New Testaments. In Leviticus 2417, God said, if

609
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:19,890
S2: anyone takes the life of a human being, he must

610
00:33:19,890 --> 00:33:23,150
S2: be put to death. And in Romans 13, verses three

611
00:33:23,150 --> 00:33:25,490
S2: and four, Paul said, you know, rulers don't hold terror

612
00:33:25,490 --> 00:33:27,560
S2: for those who do, right? But if you do wrong,

613
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:29,900
S2: you do because he's God's servant to do you good

614
00:33:29,900 --> 00:33:32,000
S2: if you do right. But he's an agent of wrath

615
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:34,820
S2: to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. You know, God did

616
00:33:34,820 --> 00:33:38,870
S2: establish capital punishment to judge those who commit murder. I

617
00:33:38,870 --> 00:33:41,870
S2: go beyond that. Third. I believe God provides human government

618
00:33:41,870 --> 00:33:44,780
S2: to help hold evil in check. And a legitimate role

619
00:33:44,780 --> 00:33:47,500
S2: of government is to provide safety for its citizens. And

620
00:33:47,500 --> 00:33:50,620
S2: sometimes that includes going to war. A God sent Israel

621
00:33:50,620 --> 00:33:54,490
S2: to war on multiple occasions. Now how does that impact believers?

622
00:33:54,490 --> 00:33:56,500
S2: Here's the bottom line. I think this is where it

623
00:33:56,500 --> 00:33:59,590
S2: becomes a matter of personal conviction. Can a believer join

624
00:33:59,590 --> 00:34:02,290
S2: the military and fight for his country? I believe that's

625
00:34:02,290 --> 00:34:06,610
S2: possible if the individual understands the differences between not seeking vengeance,

626
00:34:06,610 --> 00:34:10,230
S2: but seeking to promote justice and national protection. Uh, the

627
00:34:10,230 --> 00:34:12,930
S2: same thing is true for someone serving as a police officer,

628
00:34:12,930 --> 00:34:15,450
S2: in the sense that they're given authority by the state

629
00:34:15,450 --> 00:34:18,540
S2: to maintain order and help bring lawbreakers to justice. And

630
00:34:18,540 --> 00:34:20,790
S2: at times, that includes the power to take the life

631
00:34:20,790 --> 00:34:23,609
S2: of someone threatening others. Does a Christian have a right

632
00:34:23,610 --> 00:34:26,700
S2: to defend himself or herself or others if attacked? Well,

633
00:34:26,700 --> 00:34:29,130
S2: Psalm 82 says, we're to defend the cause of the

634
00:34:29,130 --> 00:34:32,130
S2: weak and fatherless, maintain the rights of the poor and oppressed,

635
00:34:32,130 --> 00:34:34,919
S2: rescue the weak and needy, deliver them from the hand

636
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,500
S2: of the wicked. And that suggests to me we can

637
00:34:37,500 --> 00:34:41,190
S2: step in to defend those being attacked. But how about us?

638
00:34:41,190 --> 00:34:43,950
S2: How does this impact us if we're the one being attacked?

639
00:34:43,950 --> 00:34:46,590
S2: And the answer depends on how we take passages like

640
00:34:46,590 --> 00:34:49,530
S2: Jesus's words in Matthew five. You've heard it was said,

641
00:34:49,530 --> 00:34:51,299
S2: an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.

642
00:34:51,300 --> 00:34:53,819
S2: But I say, do not resist an evil person. If

643
00:34:53,820 --> 00:34:56,310
S2: someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him

644
00:34:56,310 --> 00:34:58,969
S2: the other also. So as you can see, there isn't

645
00:34:58,969 --> 00:35:01,460
S2: one simple answer, but what I would encourage you to

646
00:35:01,460 --> 00:35:04,070
S2: do is study all those different passages and ask the

647
00:35:04,070 --> 00:35:05,839
S2: Lord to give you wisdom to know how he wants

648
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:08,899
S2: you to respond in a way that best honors him. Huh?

649
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:12,800
S1: What a complex question and a great answer. Thank you. Charlie.

650
00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,009
S1: Stan says that my men's Bible study last week, somebody

651
00:35:16,010 --> 00:35:18,320
S1: mentioned that Jesus will be the only one in heaven

652
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:21,350
S1: with scars on his eternal body as a result of

653
00:35:21,350 --> 00:35:25,150
S1: the crucifixion. They support this view with revelation five verse six,

654
00:35:25,150 --> 00:35:28,570
S1: where Jesus is represented as a lamb looking as if

655
00:35:28,570 --> 00:35:31,960
S1: it had been slain. Also, Jesus had nail and spear

656
00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:35,380
S1: marks when he appeared to Thomas after the resurrection. I'm

657
00:35:35,380 --> 00:35:37,899
S1: not sure I agree with this position. What are your thoughts?

658
00:35:37,900 --> 00:35:40,060
S2: Well, I see two separate questions here, so let me

659
00:35:40,060 --> 00:35:42,820
S2: answer each one first. Does Jesus bear the marks of

660
00:35:42,820 --> 00:35:45,930
S2: his crucifixion in his resurrection body? And the Bible says

661
00:35:45,930 --> 00:35:49,860
S2: he does. In fact, you you referenced Jesus's post-resurrection encounter

662
00:35:49,860 --> 00:35:53,010
S2: with Thomas. That's in John chapter 20, where he mentions

663
00:35:53,010 --> 00:35:55,110
S2: the imprint of the nails in Jesus's hands and the

664
00:35:55,110 --> 00:35:57,660
S2: wound in his side. So I do see that. Now.

665
00:35:57,660 --> 00:35:59,940
S2: The second question, though, is whether Jesus will be the

666
00:35:59,940 --> 00:36:04,050
S2: only one with identifiable marks on the resurrection body. And

667
00:36:04,050 --> 00:36:06,600
S2: as far as I can see, we're simply not told

668
00:36:06,719 --> 00:36:09,420
S2: we must be identifiable in some way in our new bodies,

669
00:36:09,420 --> 00:36:13,200
S2: but we're not told what those identifiable characteristics might be.

670
00:36:13,260 --> 00:36:14,910
S2: This is a case, I think, where we need to rest.

671
00:36:14,910 --> 00:36:17,880
S2: In Paul's words in first Corinthians 15, you know, he

672
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:20,160
S2: talked about some are wondering, how will the dead be raised,

673
00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:22,109
S2: what kind of body will they have? And he says,

674
00:36:22,110 --> 00:36:25,500
S2: the body that's sown is perishable, it's raised imperishable. It's

675
00:36:25,500 --> 00:36:28,410
S2: sown in dishonor, raised in glory, sown in weakness, raised

676
00:36:28,410 --> 00:36:31,650
S2: in power, sown a natural body, raised a spiritual body.

677
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:34,549
S2: Beyond his general description, we really don't know exactly what

678
00:36:34,550 --> 00:36:36,680
S2: our new bodies are going to be like, but whatever

679
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:38,540
S2: they are, I think they're going to be pretty amazing

680
00:36:38,540 --> 00:36:40,010
S2: and I think we'll be pleased with them.

681
00:36:40,010 --> 00:36:42,290
S1: And that's an amazing set of questions that have come

682
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,870
S1: our way. Yours. Welcome. Any time when you email us

683
00:36:44,870 --> 00:36:49,970
S1: at The Land and the book@moody.edu. Hey, Charlie Dyer's devotional

684
00:36:49,969 --> 00:37:05,320
S1: is next. It's going to be great right here. Welcome

685
00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:08,140
S1: back to the land and the book. I'm John Gager asking,

686
00:37:08,140 --> 00:37:11,200
S1: don't you love a great coincidence? I've got one for you.

687
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:13,899
S1: This morning in my Bible study time, I was reading

688
00:37:13,900 --> 00:37:16,930
S1: through Proverbs eight, and now I find out. Charlie, you're

689
00:37:16,930 --> 00:37:19,150
S1: about to take us to Proverbs 14. Is that.

690
00:37:19,150 --> 00:37:20,410
S2: Correct? That's right.

691
00:37:20,410 --> 00:37:24,060
S1: John, and we've titled this devotional What is Versus What

692
00:37:24,060 --> 00:37:26,550
S1: Should Be? That's an interesting title. We'll get to the

693
00:37:26,550 --> 00:37:29,760
S1: content after this quick Holy Land experience moment. Let's give

694
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:30,480
S1: it a listen.

695
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:37,140
S6: My name is Nita Tin and I was on the

696
00:37:37,140 --> 00:37:41,610
S6: Moody tour and it was such a wonderful experience. If

697
00:37:41,610 --> 00:37:44,759
S6: you want to get closer to the Lord, what better

698
00:37:44,760 --> 00:37:48,259
S6: place than to come to where he walked? And as

699
00:37:48,260 --> 00:37:52,670
S6: I think of the song I walked today where Jesus walked,

700
00:37:52,670 --> 00:37:56,330
S6: that became so real. And just reading the Bible is

701
00:37:56,330 --> 00:37:59,719
S6: going to make it so different. Just because you've been

702
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:04,910
S6: there in the land where Jesus was and, uh, especially

703
00:38:04,910 --> 00:38:09,920
S6: for me, was, um, where Jesus was in the Garden

704
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:14,150
S6: of Gethsemane and where he cried, not my will, but

705
00:38:14,150 --> 00:38:17,150
S6: thine be done. And that was so special to me

706
00:38:17,150 --> 00:38:20,060
S6: because of what he has done for me and how

707
00:38:20,060 --> 00:38:21,200
S6: he has saved me.

708
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:25,730
S1: Boy, it just no end to the different reactions to

709
00:38:25,730 --> 00:38:28,610
S1: what people encounter as they travel to Israel. Thank you

710
00:38:28,610 --> 00:38:31,460
S1: for sharing that. Well, I'm looking forward to this discussion.

711
00:38:31,460 --> 00:38:34,360
S1: Charlie Solomon in the book of Proverbs. That's a great

712
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:35,290
S1: place to be.

713
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:36,820
S2: It is. And that's where we're going to spend the

714
00:38:36,820 --> 00:38:40,960
S2: month of July. Now, one of my all time favorite musicals, John,

715
00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:43,600
S2: is Fiddler on the roof. The story itself is full

716
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:46,750
S2: of pathos, and the songs evoke the emotions experienced by

717
00:38:46,750 --> 00:38:50,050
S2: the different characters. You know? For example, in the movie version,

718
00:38:50,050 --> 00:38:53,020
S2: Tevye is in the barn feeding his animals. When he turned,

719
00:38:53,020 --> 00:38:55,839
S2: he looks to heaven and says in a tired prayer, Lord,

720
00:38:55,840 --> 00:38:58,660
S2: you made many, many poor people. I realize, of course,

721
00:38:58,660 --> 00:39:01,450
S2: it's no shame to be poor. And then he adds

722
00:39:01,450 --> 00:39:04,900
S2: as something of an afterthought. But it's no great honor either.

723
00:39:04,900 --> 00:39:07,660
S2: So what would have been so terrible if I had

724
00:39:07,660 --> 00:39:10,330
S2: a small fortune? And then he launches into if I

725
00:39:10,330 --> 00:39:13,600
S2: were a rich man. Now, most listening today can resonate

726
00:39:13,600 --> 00:39:16,480
S2: with Tevye's words, at least emotionally. I think we've all

727
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:18,219
S2: felt at times how nice it would be to have

728
00:39:18,219 --> 00:39:21,280
S2: just a small fortune. You're not enough to rival Bill

729
00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:24,290
S2: Gates or Warren Buffett, but just enough to buy that

730
00:39:24,290 --> 00:39:27,469
S2: car or house we've always wanted, or to not get

731
00:39:27,469 --> 00:39:29,360
S2: stressed out at the end of each month when the

732
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:33,589
S2: different bills arrive or or, well, you can finish the sentence.

733
00:39:33,590 --> 00:39:36,140
S2: Part of the problem is that we tend to compare

734
00:39:36,140 --> 00:39:38,719
S2: ourselves with those who are more well off, not against

735
00:39:38,719 --> 00:39:41,750
S2: those who are less fortunate. We seem to be attracted

736
00:39:41,750 --> 00:39:44,629
S2: to the lifestyles of the rich because it helps fuel

737
00:39:44,630 --> 00:39:49,109
S2: our desire to become more wealthy ourselves. And yet, compared globally,

738
00:39:49,110 --> 00:39:54,450
S2: most Americans are already exceptionally blessed. In a 2024 poverty

739
00:39:54,450 --> 00:39:58,620
S2: ranking by country in the United States, less than 2.2%

740
00:39:58,620 --> 00:40:01,890
S2: of the population live on less than $10 a day.

741
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:05,670
S2: In Canada, it's even lower. Less than 1.2% of the

742
00:40:05,670 --> 00:40:09,180
S2: population live on less than $10 a day. Now compare

743
00:40:09,180 --> 00:40:12,680
S2: that to the 4.4 billion people in the rest of

744
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:15,799
S2: the world who live on less than $10 a day,

745
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:19,100
S2: or the nearly 700 million who live on less than

746
00:40:19,100 --> 00:40:22,550
S2: $2 per day. To help put our thinking in perspective,

747
00:40:22,550 --> 00:40:25,819
S2: let's pay a visit to Wise King Solomon and focus

748
00:40:25,820 --> 00:40:30,350
S2: on what is versus what should be, but follow along closely,

749
00:40:30,350 --> 00:40:33,290
S2: because the point of the story might not be what

750
00:40:33,290 --> 00:40:38,190
S2: you think. In Proverbs 1420, Solomon presents a sad reality

751
00:40:38,190 --> 00:40:41,940
S2: of life. The poor are shunned even by their neighbors,

752
00:40:41,940 --> 00:40:45,810
S2: but the rich have many friends. A stark reality in

753
00:40:45,810 --> 00:40:49,200
S2: life is that people like to hobnob with the haves

754
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:53,730
S2: while trying to avoid the have nots. In Proverbs 19 seven,

755
00:40:53,730 --> 00:40:57,450
S2: Solomon paints an even grimmer picture. A poor man is

756
00:40:57,450 --> 00:41:00,319
S2: shunned by all his relatives. How much more do his

757
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,739
S2: friends avoid him? Though he pursues them with pleading, they

758
00:41:03,739 --> 00:41:07,910
S2: are nowhere to be found. The Hebrew literally says, all

759
00:41:07,910 --> 00:41:10,760
S2: the brothers of the poor man hate him, and his

760
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:14,420
S2: friends abandon him. And it's not just that this unfortunate

761
00:41:14,420 --> 00:41:18,470
S2: relative had slipped their mind. They actively seek to avoid him.

762
00:41:18,469 --> 00:41:22,100
S2: Solomon continues. Though he pursues them with pleading, they are

763
00:41:22,100 --> 00:41:26,510
S2: nowhere to be found. As Solomon so wisely observed in life,

764
00:41:26,510 --> 00:41:29,629
S2: people often try to avoid the poor, even when those

765
00:41:29,630 --> 00:41:33,500
S2: who are poor are relatives. Perhaps they're embarrassed, perhaps they're

766
00:41:33,500 --> 00:41:36,770
S2: greedy or selfish. The reasons can vary, but the end

767
00:41:36,770 --> 00:41:39,680
S2: result is that most prefer not to think about, be

768
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:43,550
S2: associated with, or extend help to the poor. Now I

769
00:41:43,550 --> 00:41:46,569
S2: do need to add two crucial points. First, Solomon is

770
00:41:46,570 --> 00:41:49,690
S2: not preaching an ancient form of socialism, as we'll see

771
00:41:49,690 --> 00:41:52,810
S2: next week. Solomon also has much to say about someone

772
00:41:52,810 --> 00:41:56,650
S2: whose poverty is the result of laziness or idleness. Such

773
00:41:56,650 --> 00:42:00,759
S2: behavior wasn't to be rewarded. Solomon's words match those written

774
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:04,510
S2: almost 900 years later by the Apostle Paul in Second

775
00:42:04,510 --> 00:42:08,410
S2: Thessalonians three. Keep away from every brother who is idle.

776
00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:11,160
S2: If a man will not work, he shall not eat.

777
00:42:11,190 --> 00:42:16,740
S2: Neither Solomon nor Paul condone supporting someone's Slothfulness the poverty

778
00:42:16,739 --> 00:42:21,180
S2: being pictured by Solomon isn't the result of laziness or inactivity. Rather,

779
00:42:21,180 --> 00:42:25,080
S2: circumstances can arise that lead to poverty. Ruth and Naomi

780
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:27,780
S2: were in poverty because of a famine followed by the

781
00:42:27,780 --> 00:42:31,080
S2: deaths of their husbands. Job lost his wealth to a

782
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:36,320
S2: satanic attack. Illness. Fire. Flood. economic calamity, war and a

783
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:39,920
S2: host of other causes can lead to poverty. I believe

784
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:43,310
S2: Solomon's focus in Proverbs 14 is on those who find

785
00:42:43,310 --> 00:42:47,239
S2: themselves in poverty, not caused by their own foolish actions.

786
00:42:47,239 --> 00:42:50,420
S2: And that leads to the crucial point in Proverbs. I've

787
00:42:50,420 --> 00:42:54,259
S2: quoted part of two proverbs that describe what is, and

788
00:42:54,260 --> 00:42:56,960
S2: by that I mean Solomon is picturing what is often

789
00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:00,080
S2: true in life. People do tend to ignore or not

790
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:02,780
S2: think about those who are in poverty. But now let's

791
00:43:02,780 --> 00:43:04,730
S2: go back to see the other side of the coin,

792
00:43:04,730 --> 00:43:09,560
S2: the what should be that? Solomon also stresses in 1420.

793
00:43:09,590 --> 00:43:12,830
S2: Solomon said the poor are shunned even by their neighbors,

794
00:43:12,830 --> 00:43:15,470
S2: while the rich have many friends. But then look at

795
00:43:15,469 --> 00:43:18,200
S2: what he says in the very next verse. He who

796
00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:22,100
S2: despises his neighbor sins. But blessed is he who is

797
00:43:22,100 --> 00:43:25,419
S2: kind to the needy. Having pictured what might be considered

798
00:43:25,420 --> 00:43:28,870
S2: normal by the world, Solomon quickly adds that it is

799
00:43:28,870 --> 00:43:33,129
S2: not normal from God's perspective. I'm reminded of Jesus's parable

800
00:43:33,130 --> 00:43:36,400
S2: of the Good Samaritan, given in response to someone trying

801
00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:39,550
S2: to justify himself by saying, well, who is my neighbor?

802
00:43:39,550 --> 00:43:42,219
S2: If the second greatest command is to love your neighbor

803
00:43:42,219 --> 00:43:46,060
S2: as yourself, then despising and refusing to help one's truly

804
00:43:46,060 --> 00:43:49,500
S2: needy neighbor is indeed a sin. And the one who

805
00:43:49,500 --> 00:43:54,180
S2: does reach out to help receives God's blessing. In Proverbs 19,

806
00:43:54,180 --> 00:43:57,960
S2: Solomon does something very similar, having described how even brothers

807
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:01,170
S2: and friends will abandon and shun the poor. Solomon then

808
00:44:01,170 --> 00:44:04,050
S2: goes on in verse 17 to say, he who is

809
00:44:04,050 --> 00:44:07,350
S2: kind to the poor lends to the Lord, and he

810
00:44:07,350 --> 00:44:09,630
S2: that is the Lord will reward him for what he

811
00:44:09,630 --> 00:44:12,560
S2: has done. People didn't want to lend to the poor

812
00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:15,410
S2: because it was almost certain they would never get repaid.

813
00:44:15,410 --> 00:44:18,739
S2: But Solomon turns the equation on its head in helping

814
00:44:18,739 --> 00:44:21,830
S2: the poor. You're not lending to them, but to the Lord.

815
00:44:21,830 --> 00:44:25,190
S2: And God always pays back those who lend to him.

816
00:44:25,190 --> 00:44:27,170
S2: It might be in this life, or it might be

817
00:44:27,170 --> 00:44:29,870
S2: in the life to come. But picturing a gift to

818
00:44:29,870 --> 00:44:32,990
S2: the poor as a loan to God puts an entirely

819
00:44:32,989 --> 00:44:36,890
S2: different spin on the action. So what's the practical application

820
00:44:36,890 --> 00:44:41,030
S2: of Solomon's wise words for us today? First, he didn't

821
00:44:41,030 --> 00:44:44,240
S2: write to guilt us into giving to every panhandler holding

822
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:47,000
S2: up a sign at a stoplight. I like the signs

823
00:44:47,000 --> 00:44:49,550
S2: posted in a number of cities that say it is

824
00:44:49,550 --> 00:44:53,000
S2: okay to say no to panhandlers. Give instead to agencies

825
00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:56,239
S2: that help those in need. Your local rescue mission can

826
00:44:56,239 --> 00:44:59,410
S2: provide physical and spiritual help that will do far more

827
00:44:59,410 --> 00:45:03,550
S2: good with your contribution. A second be wise. Do you

828
00:45:03,550 --> 00:45:06,670
S2: personally know the circumstances that caused a family member or

829
00:45:06,670 --> 00:45:09,790
S2: neighbor to be in financial need? Was it caused by

830
00:45:09,790 --> 00:45:13,150
S2: a genuine calamity or is it the result of poor

831
00:45:13,150 --> 00:45:16,810
S2: or even sinful life choices? You don't want to subsidize

832
00:45:16,810 --> 00:45:19,660
S2: or encourage such a lifestyle, but you do want to

833
00:45:19,660 --> 00:45:23,380
S2: help someone with a genuine need. Finally, be as generous

834
00:45:23,380 --> 00:45:26,259
S2: and helpful as you can be without harming yourself or

835
00:45:26,260 --> 00:45:29,319
S2: your family. If you're on a fixed budget, give what

836
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:32,589
S2: you can without going into poverty yourself. You can give

837
00:45:32,590 --> 00:45:35,319
S2: directly to an individual, but you can also give to

838
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:39,040
S2: your church's assistance fund if it has one. Churches often

839
00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:41,440
S2: have such a fund to minister to those in the

840
00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:45,400
S2: congregation and community with physical needs, or give instead to

841
00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:49,190
S2: a ministry that focuses on providing physical and spiritual support

842
00:45:49,190 --> 00:45:52,820
S2: in times of need. Samaritan's purse and The Salvation Army

843
00:45:52,820 --> 00:45:55,790
S2: are two groups that come immediately to mind. It's a

844
00:45:55,790 --> 00:45:58,130
S2: reality of life that people tend to look up to

845
00:45:58,130 --> 00:46:01,520
S2: those with wealth and power, and to ignore those in poverty.

846
00:46:01,550 --> 00:46:05,420
S2: God wants us to demonstrate generosity and grace to those

847
00:46:05,420 --> 00:46:08,989
S2: with legitimate needs. That requires wisdom on our part. But

848
00:46:08,989 --> 00:46:11,480
S2: in reaching out to share with those in genuine need,

849
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:14,360
S2: just remember that God views it as a loan you're

850
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:18,410
S2: making to him, and he promises to someday reward your generosity.

851
00:46:18,410 --> 00:46:21,529
S2: And that's part of Solomon's instruction for how to live

852
00:46:21,530 --> 00:46:22,910
S2: life wisely.

853
00:46:22,910 --> 00:46:26,540
S1: I love that nudge toward generosity. Thank you Charlie, if

854
00:46:26,540 --> 00:46:28,790
S1: you want to hear today's program again, any of it

855
00:46:28,790 --> 00:46:31,460
S1: or all of it, you can do that at our website,

856
00:46:31,460 --> 00:46:36,170
S1: the land and the book.org information Information there about our guest,

857
00:46:36,170 --> 00:46:40,130
S1: past programs, future programs, and more. The land and the book.

858
00:46:40,430 --> 00:46:43,550
S1: Org that'll do it for today's edition of the broadcast

859
00:46:43,550 --> 00:46:46,400
S1: for our host, Charlie Dyer. Our producer, Dan Anderson, I'm

860
00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:48,620
S1: John Geiger, thanking you for your company. Nice to have

861
00:46:48,620 --> 00:46:51,530
S1: you along the land. And the book is a production

862
00:46:51,530 --> 00:46:55,040
S1: of Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.