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S1: The angels announced to the shepherds peace and goodwill toward men.

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S1: What did they actually mean, though? Where is this peace?

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S1: How should the Bible frame our understanding of true peace,

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S1: especially at Christmas when there's so little of it? That's

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S1: our focus coming up with that, we welcome you to

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S1: another edition of The Land and the book hosted by

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S1: the one and only Doctor Charlie Dyer, who happens to

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S1: be one of the most respected Middle East experts around.

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S1: I'm John Gager, and before we take a glance at

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S1: the major developments this week in the Middle East, this

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S1: thought you and I live in uncertain days, right? And

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S1: in times like these, many people ask the big question

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S1: Where is God? I mean, there are times when we,

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S1: as believers might start to wonder where God is and

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S1: what he's doing.

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S2: That's absolutely right, John. And that's why our friends at

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S2: Life in Messiah have recently published a book addressing that

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S2: very issue. It's titled Where Is God in fearful times.

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S2: Encouragement from Exodus. This book is a study on Israel's

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S2: ordeal in Egypt and what we can learn from this

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S2: to apply to our circumstances. The lessons learned by the

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S2: Jewish people in Egypt are extremely relevant today. God hears

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S2: your cry. He cares for you and he's working for

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S2: your good and his glory. Life in Messiah is now

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S2: making this book available for a limited time to the

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S2: land and the book listeners with a special deal. To

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S2: find out how you can get a copy of this

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S2: encouraging book for yourself, or as a gift to share

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S2: with others who are struggling, visit lifeline. Org and click

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S2: on the radio icon. That's life in Messiah.

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S1: Well, a whole lot has been happening over the past

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S1: week in the Middle East. We're going to try to

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S1: cover a number of stories beginning with this one. Last week,

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S1: two of the key headlines we covered focused on the

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S1: controversy surrounding Prime Minister Netanyahu's pardon request and the proposed

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S1: ultra-Orthodox draft law. What developments have there been on these

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S1: stories over the past week, if any? Charlie.

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S2: Well, Prime Minister Netanyahu released a video sharing his perspective

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S2: on the trial and why he chose to request a pardon.

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S2: It focuses on the political nature of the trial and

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S2: the difficulty of balancing his expected court appearances with the

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S2: time pressures of running the government. That video, which is

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S2: actually very well done and quite humorous, shows why he's

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S2: doing this. And President Trump's pressure on Israel to issue

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S2: a pardon also likely played a role in the timing,

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S2: though he doesn't mention that at one piece of good

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S2: news out of the government is that the coalition was

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S2: able to approve a 2026 state budget, which has now

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S2: been sent on to the Knesset for a preliminary vote.

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S2: But those are the kind of political issues that require

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S2: a lot of time and effort on the part of

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S2: the Prime Minister, which is why, again, he's asking for

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S2: this pardon. Netanyahu does believe his work on behalf of

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S2: the state is being hindered by the trial, including the

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S2: demand that he spend three days a week on the

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S2: stand giving testimony. At the same time, he's made it

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S2: clear he won't quit politics in exchange for a pardon,

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S2: since that would be a tacit admission of guilt. And

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S2: he doesn't believe he's guilty. Now, when it comes to

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S2: developments over the ultra-Orthodox draft law, the issue itself is

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S2: becoming a large headache and creating new fractures within Netanyahu's

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S2: own coalition. This past Sunday, on the National Day of

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S2: Appreciation for Wounded Soldiers, a soldier who lost two hands,

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S2: a leg and an eye in the war with Hamas

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S2: spoke to the Knesset, criticizing the proposed law. He said

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S2: that any ultra-Orthodox men not studying Torah full time in

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S2: a yeshiva should be required to join the army and contribute.

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S2: He was echoing the beliefs held by many across all

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S2: political persuasions, including some within Netanyahu's own party. These feelings

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S2: of anger toward the demands of the ultra-Orthodox make it

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S2: less likely that the proposal will pass, unless Netanyahu is

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S2: able to pull another political rabbit out of his hat.

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S2: This issue could bring down his coalition and lead to

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S2: new elections. Now elections do need to take place in October.

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S2: Netanyahu would just like to have those elections held on

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S2: his terms and his late in the year as possible.

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S1: Well, changing our focus to the situation in Gaza, what

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S1: are the most recent developments there and the ongoing ceasefire

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S1: arrangements between Israel and Hamas? I'm seeing all kinds of

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S1: things online.

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S2: Yeah, a consensus seems to be emerging on how to

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S2: move forward, though it's not necessarily a positive consensus or

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S2: at least not positive from Israel's perspective at the Doha Forum.

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S2: Officials from a number of Arab states seem to agree

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S2: that the Gaza deal needs to move to the next phase. However,

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S2: most are unwilling to commit their own people or finances

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S2: to help stabilize, rebuild and restore order to Gaza. Qatar's

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S2: president said his country is unwilling to, quote, write the

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S2: cheque to fund Gaza's reconstruction. He compared the situation to

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S2: the Ukraine, where Europe is talking about using Russian funds

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S2: to rebuild Ukraine. His point is that Israel ought to

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S2: pay for Gaza's reconstruction. but he's really making a flawed argument.

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S2: Russia invaded Ukraine, but it was Hamas, not Israel, that

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S2: started the war. Hamas invaded Israel and Hamas built its bunkers,

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S2: weapons storage areas, rocket launchers and bases around and underneath

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S2: civilian infrastructure. Russia deliberately attacked civilian targets. Israel was attacking

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S2: military targets that were deliberately hidden under hospitals, apartments, mosques

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S2: and schools. In addition, Hamas built up its military infrastructure

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S2: using money sent to it by Qatar. Qatar helped create

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S2: the monster, but now wants Israel to pay for the restoration.

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S2: Hamas leader Khaled Meshaal recently announced that Hamas will not

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S2: give up its weapons or its rule of the Gaza Strip,

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S2: nor will it permit external oversight. So Israel is being

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S2: pressured to move forward. But Hamas isn't willing to give

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S2: up its fight against Israel. And none of the other

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S2: Arab states are apparently willing to force Hamas to give

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S2: up its control. Now there's a major difference between peace

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S2: and appeasement. I hope the US doesn't try to pressure

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S2: Israel into giving up the gains it made on the

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S2: battlefield for the sake of appeasing other Arab countries.

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S1: I hope so too. This is the land in the

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S1: book from Moody Radio Hour host Charlie Dyer, noted Middle

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S1: East scholar. Iran's political and economic woes continue to mount

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S1: as the country struggles with sanctions and a severe water shortage.

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S1: What is the Iranian government doing to address these challenges?

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S2: Yeah, John, the struggles are very real and they're quite severe.

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S2: The renewed UN sanctions have forced Iran's currency to all

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S2: time lows with inflation running at 40%. Lake Urmia, which

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S2: was Iran's largest lake, has completely dried up, causing massive

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S2: salt storms, poisoning the nearby soil and leading to health

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S2: problems in the region. Dropping water levels also caused a

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S2: power station serving Tehran to go offline. Because the dam's

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S2: water level was too low to run the turbines. Tehran

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S2: had its first rain in months this past week, but

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S2: it was literally just a drop in a bucket in

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S2: terms of what the country needs now, in addition to

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S2: the water crisis. Governmental hypocrisy is also causing internal unrest

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S2: while morality police arrest women for not wearing hijabs. A

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S2: video surfaced showing the wedding of a key leader's daughter,

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S2: who was wearing a low cut gown and no hijab,

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S2: nor were any of the other women at the wedding.

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S2: The government is again responding to all the criticism by

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S2: cracking down on dissent. A human rights lawyer was found

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S2: dead while women continued to be arrested for not wearing hijabs.

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S2: Even as the Iranian people struggle, Israel exposed an Iranian

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S2: financial network set up in Turkey that's been sending hundreds

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S2: of millions of dollars to support Hamas and other terror groups.

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S2: And Iran is also continuing to move forward on developing

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S2: nuclear weapons. They see those weapons as a strategic answer

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S2: to Israel's military superiority, and as a way to ultimately

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S2: fulfill an Islamic prophecy of Israel's destruction in the last days.

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S2: Right now, Iran's leadership is desperate, and that makes them

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S2: even more dangerous.

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S1: After two years of relative drought, Israel has experienced significant

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S1: rainfall over the past ten days as opposed to Iran.

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S1: Does this mean the drought is now over?

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S2: Yeah. One series of storms, even one including a named storm.

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S2: Storm Byron doesn't necessarily signal the end of a drought,

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S2: but the rainfall from these multi-day storms has been welcome. Well,

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S2: except for some significant flooding in low lying areas. Storm

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S2: Byron was preceded by the storm that I experienced when

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S2: I was in Israel. Our group encountered rain as we

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S2: drove south from the Sea of Galilee toward the Dead Sea,

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S2: and there was concern for a while that the road

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S2: along the Dead Sea might get closed because of the

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S2: rain falling up in the hill country, but thankfully that

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S2: didn't happen. The latest storm system began in the South

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S2: last weekend, with rain and flooding closing roads near a

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S2: lot by Sunday. Yotvata, north of Eilat had received get

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S2: this John 175% of its normal rainfall for the entire

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S2: year in one day, with most of that coming just

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S2: in one day. By mid-week, the rain had expanded further north,

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S2: with some locations, especially along the coast and in the lowlands,

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S2: receiving as much as 4 to 8in of rain. John,

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S2: I remember when we were at Megiddo, that one time

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S2: with a group, when a storm like that hit and

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S2: flooded us out. Well, that's what they've been having with

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S2: this series of storms that's been producing that kind of

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S2: rain in spots throughout Israel. It also brought snow to

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S2: the top of Mount Hermon and other places, experienced thunderstorms

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S2: and hail. Now, the long range prediction is for another

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S2: series of storms in early January, and more rain is

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S2: definitely needed, though if they hope to fill the Sea

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S2: of Galilee by the end of the winter rainy season.

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S1: Warning Bible maps could be harmful to world harmony. That's

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S1: the conclusion of a professor from the University of Cambridge

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S1: who argues that including maps was simultaneously one of publishing's

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S1: greatest failures and triumphs. So was putting maps in our

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S1: Bibles helpful or hurtful?

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S2: Yeah, the bottom line those maps in your Bible are helpful.

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S2: Don't rip them out. Uh, what this professor's problem is, uh,

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S2: is actually two. First, he says they displaced, in his words,

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S2: contemporary Israel-Palestine with the Holy Land of Christian imagination. And second,

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S2: he says, adding maps was one of the agents that

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S2: created the modern world of nation states. Well, now, let

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S2: me pick up that second argument first. That ignores the

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S2: Bible itself. The Bible provides specific boundaries for nations, including

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S2: the nation of Israel, numbers 34 and Ezekiel 47. Uh,

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S2: we know there's specific geographical boundaries for the tribes. It

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S2: wasn't just Israel. Uh, judges mentions the Arnon River as

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S2: a boundary for ancient Moab. They might have drawn maps,

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S2: but the writers clearly understood tribal national boundaries, so that's

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S2: not a good argument. Also, the Bible maps he's complaining

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S2: about incorporated biblical names and boundaries, names and places found

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S2: in the Hebrew scriptures. They didn't Christianize things. I believe

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S2: these maps are incredibly helpful for us, and I'm not

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S2: sure why he's making such statements.

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S1: All right, I'll keep looking at those maps. Charlie, I

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S1: need him. Coming up, a conversation about peace on earth.

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S1: Your personal peace as you go through the holidays. Next

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S1: on the land and the book. The angels announced to

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S1: the shepherds peace and goodwill toward men. What do they

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S1: actually mean? Where is this peace? And how should the

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S1: Bible frame our understanding of true peace? After all, peace

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S1: is much more than just a Christmas thing. Let's talk

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S1: about it next. Hey, welcome to the land and the

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S1: book segment two I'm John Gieger. Glad you're with us today.

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S1: Let's pause for just a moment and think about a

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S1: creative strategy for sharing Jesus with a Jewish friend. Sharing

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S1: a New Testament with your Jewish friend. Good idea, bad idea.

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S1: Beth Taplin is on the administrative staff at Olive tree

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S1: congregation in suburban Chicago. You've got a story along these lines,

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S1: I do.

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S3: I was invited to a friends holiday gathering, and there

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S3: was going to be a Jewish man there and his girlfriend.

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S3: And so I took some New Covenant or New Testament

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S3: books and wrapped them in Hanukkah paper and gave them

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S3: to my friends and presented them as the potentially the

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S3: most valuable gift you will ever receive. Really? And left

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S3: it at that. A year later, I was invited back

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S3: to the same family's party, and this man who I

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S3: gave the New Testament to came up to me and said, wow,

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S3: I gave this book to someone I worked with and

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S3: it changed his life. And I said, oh, that's great,

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S3: but do you want another one? And he said, no,

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S3: I don't. But it really did change his life. He

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S3: started going to church. He started reading it all the time.

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S3: He started sharing with me. It was really amazing what

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S3: the Lord did through that one little book.

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S1: Okay, not to the friend that you'd intended it for,

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S1: but to his friend, right?

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S3: Yeah. You never know.

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S1: That's right. You never know who God has in mind. Thanks, Beth. Beth.

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S1: Tavalon here on the land and the book. Doctor Jeremiah

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S1: Johnston is a New Testament scholar, professor, apologist who speaks

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S1: at university campuses, churches and conferences. His passion is equipping

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S1: Christians to give intellectually informed accounts of what they believe.

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S1: Doctor Johnston serves as the founder and president of Christian

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S1: Thinkers Society, a resident institute of Houston Baptist University, where

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S1: he also serves as Associate Professor of Early Christianity. Christian

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S1: Thinkers Society produces live events, media productions, conferences, and publications,

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S1: all geared to help teach pastors and Christians to become

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S1: thinkers and then thinkers to become Christians. Hey, thanks for

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S1: connecting with us today, Doctor Johnston.

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S4: Great to be with you, John. Excited for our conversation

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S4: on the Shalom of God.

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S1: Well, and this all very much at front and center

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S1: in this, uh, Bible, the Peace of God Bible that

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S1: you have helped to create. We're excited for that. We'll

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S1: talk more about it. But my question is, have we

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S1: in some ways oversimplified piece. I mean, there's piece at

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S1: the workplace, piece in the political spectrum piece between husbands

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S1: and wives, piece on the battlefield, not to mention personal piece.

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S1: Or are we really talking about essentially the same commodity?

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S4: We really are talking about the same commodity because piece

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S4: is found in the person of piece. And as you

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S4: said in the monologue of Jesus, that great Isaiah prophecy

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S4: that saw him as the wonderful counselor, the mighty God,

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S4: but make no mistake, the Prince of Peace. And it's

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S4: interesting in a society that is seeking peace in all

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S4: the areas that you just mentioned, we've never had more anxiety.

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S4: And so four years ago, I had the opportunity to

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S4: set out as the general editor of the Peace of

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S4: God Bible and to trace every occurrence of the word peace,

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S4: the word shalom in Scripture from Genesis to Revelation. And John,

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S4: if you can believe it, it is, I think, the

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S4: most important word in the Bible, after the name of Jesus.

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S4: It appears over 600 times in Scripture, and yet it's

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S4: an elusive topic. And so in some simplistic ways, we

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S4: can hear about it everywhere. And yet it seems so

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S4: elusive to the common believer, the mom or dad today

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S4: who's listening and just wanting to know, how can I

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S4: know this peace in my family? How can I know

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S4: this peace in my parenting? How can my child know

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S4: this peace who's struggling? And so studying those 600 occurrences

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S4: in the Bible gave me a path to peace that

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S4: leads to freedom. And I hope everyone has that.

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S1: Well, when the angel of Luke two announced to the

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S1: shepherds peace and goodwill toward men, what kind of peace

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S1: was he really talking about?

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S4: He was talking about this beautiful word, shalom. And so

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S4: many people think it's just a greeting. If you go

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S4: to the land of Israel. And I love your show,

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S4: The Land of the Bible, if you go to the

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S4: land of the Bible in Israel, you'll hear this word

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S4: shalom used as a greeting. And it certainly is. But

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S4: it's so much more than that. This is the first

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S4: word that Jesus proclaimed in his resurrection body Shalom. It

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S4: means more than just an absence of conflict or a truce.

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S4: And yet that's where so many believers are today. It

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S4: actually means that we can flourish in our faith. It

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S4: means to be made whole, to lack nothing, to be

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S4: made complete. And this word in and of itself personifies

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S4: the entire message of the gospel, because we have peace

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S4: with God first and foremost. Romans five one through our

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S4: Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, through what his finished work

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S4: on the cross, through his resurrection, that's the gospel. We

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S4: have peace with God through faith in Christ, and yet

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S4: then we have the opportunity. And this is where I

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S4: think my Bible will help people, help people go from yes,

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S4: I have peace with God. I have shalom with God.

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S4: I'm a child of God. I'm redeemed. I'm forgiven. But

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S4: then the Bible says we can cultivate the peace of

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S4: God richly in our heart. John, that's Colossians 315. Yes.

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S4: And in that little step from peace with God to

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S4: the peace of God, that's where many believers needed the

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S4: immediate next steps of, okay, I see that it is

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S4: God's will for me to live in Shalom. I see

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S4: that it is God's will for me to flourish in

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S4: my life, even in the face of adversity. But what

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S4: are the immediate next steps? How do I actually do that?

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S4: And that's what I investigated for four years, and it

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S4: was life changing.

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S1: Doctor Jeremiah Johnston is a New Testament scholar, professor, and apologist.

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S1: He serves as the founder and president of Christian Thinkers

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S1: Society at Houston Baptist University. Well, one more question about

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S1: the the shepherds there in that Luke two account, do

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S1: you think those shepherds actually anticipated, having heard from that angel,

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S1: that they were personally going to experience this peace that

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S1: was promised them?

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S4: I think they had to of I mean, what an

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S4: incredible prophecy to experience in the angels. And I've been

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S4: in those shepherds fields in the land of the Bible

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S4: in Bethlehem. And I think it was more than they

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S4: could have ever imagined. And because this peace had been

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S4: prophesied for years, the entire historicity of the Old Testament

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S4: looked to the coming of this Prince of Peace, this

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S4: one who would embody shalom. And that's why we can't

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S4: have shalom without having Jesus. And just like those shepherds,

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S4: we need to seek him not only in the advent season,

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S4: but every season of our lives, seeking him the person

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S4: of peace. I spell peace j-e-s-u-s because it is always

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S4: found in the person of peace. Not in our religion,

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S4: not in religious practices. I mean, I think of Luke 19,

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S4: John 41 and 42 when Jesus looks at the religious

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S4: leaders of his day and he says, if you even

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S4: you would see the things that bring you peace, and

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S4: yet they're hidden from your eyes. And so let's make

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S4: sure that even in our all our religion, we never

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S4: miss the person of peace. And that's Jesus our Savior.

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S1: Okay, so you have said that you went back and

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S1: looked at the many hundreds of references to Shalom, all

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S1: of them in this Peace of God Bible research project.

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S1: Let me ask you, what was the karate chop moment

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S1: for you when you said, wow, I never saw this before?

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S4: Well, there were two of them. One was pieces of discipline.

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S4: It's not a spiritual gift. It's not a talent that

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S4: only godly people have. You know, my wife and I

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S4: are the busy parents of five children. We have nine

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S4: year old triplets, so we've not slept in nine years.

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S4: As you can imagine, like peace is something we want

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S4: to have is, you know, shout out to all the

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S4: families out there and, you know, so peace was very

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S4: elusive to us. And yet how do we live in that?

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S4: And I found that the peace of God is a discipline.

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S4: It's not a talent. It's not a spiritual gift, but

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S4: it is a discipline that every one of us, as

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S4: believers in Christ, can and should cultivate. The second moment

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S4: for me was a judges six moment. Gideon had so

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S4: many problems in his life. John and the angel of

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S4: the Lord appeared to him, and he said, I'm with you.

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S4: And he tells Gideon four times that he's with him.

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S4: You know, Moses only had to hear it once, and

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S4: he led the children out of Egypt. Joshua only had

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S4: to hear it once, and the sun stood still. Gideon

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S4: had so many problems in his life, and I'm sure

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S4: that people can identify with that. You might need to

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S4: hear the voice of the Lord four times today. Say

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S4: I'm with you. And Gideon built an altar in judges

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S4: six and he called it Yahweh Shalom. It's the first

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S4: time in Scripture chronologically where our God is called, literally

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S4: the God of peace or the God of Shalom. And

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S4: the really cool thing is, he prayed a prayer. That's

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S4: only four words that I would encourage everyone in the audience,

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S4: and everyone is listening to pray. Gideon prayed this prayer

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S4: in judges chapter six. My God is peace. That's what

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S4: he what he prayed at the altar of the Lord.

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S4: And you know, you can pray that today over your kids.

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S4: You can pray that if you're going into a difficult

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S4: situation or a season, my God is peace. And here's

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S4: the interesting thing that I realized, and this was the

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S4: karate chop moment. Gideon still had to stand up John

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S4: and go fight the Midianites. He had to go win

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S4: his battle.

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S1: Right?

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S4: So we're not talking about a peace that, like, hides

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S4: us from the adversities of life. We're talking about a

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S4: peace that enjoins us, that inspires us, that leads us

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S4: directly through the battles that we have. And it was

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S4: at that point where I was working on the notes

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S4: for the Peace of God Bible that I just had

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S4: to push back from the desk and get on my knees.

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S4: And I had to pray that prayer. My God is peace.

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S4: And yes, Lord, like Gideon, I may need to hear

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S4: you say it again and again and. But you know

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S4: what I believe. You can lead me today to fight

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S4: my battles and be victorious in the peace of God.

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S4: It's a whole different thing. If you approach your battles

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S4: today in the peace of God versus not having the

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S4: shalom of God. And so that's why I'm praying that

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S4: people have that same karate chop experience in their life.

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S4: I love that term.

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S1: The Peace of God Bible is what we're looking at

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S1: today on the land and the book. I'm John Yeager,

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S1: joined by our guest, Doctor Jeremiah Johnston. All right. You've

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S1: said peace is a discipline, not a talent, not a gift.

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S1: And we've heard that lovely prayer. My God is peace.

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S1: But I have to ask because everybody wants to know, now,

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S1: what do we do? How do we cultivate the discipline

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S1: of peace?

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S4: We cultivate the discipline of peace by doing exactly what

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S4: the Apostle Paul did. He had to come up with

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S4: a personal peace plan. And that's really the payoff of

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S4: going through the peace of God. Bible Paul goes from

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S4: second Corinthians chapter two, verse 13, where he's in the

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S4: city of Troas, and he has, quote, no peace of mind.

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S4: So we can all identify with that. He had no

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S4: peace of mind. So he left that city, even though

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S4: God had opened up an incredible door of ministry to him.

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S4: Seven years later, Paul writes the greatest anti-anxiety passage in

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S4: all the Bible in Philippians four seven and eight, and

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S4: Philippians four eight is just 32. English words one verb.

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S4: By focusing, by thinking, that's the verb. By thinking about

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S4: things that are true, pure, praiseworthy, of good report. If

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S4: there's anything worthy of praise, if there's anything worthy of love, think.

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S4: Dwell on these things and the peace of God will

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S4: be with you. Paul developed a peace plan in that

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S4: chapter of things he had to take out of his mind,

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S4: and things he had to fill his mind with. And John,

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S4: I think he had to do it continually. And so

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S4: what's cool about the Peace of God Bible is it

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S4: shows that hope comes when I have a plan. If

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S4: you're a busy mom, listening to this, peace comes when

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S4: you have a plan. And Paul had to have a plan,

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S4: and he was an apostle who saw the resurrected Christ.

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S4: He still had to put a plan in his life.

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S4: And so for those that are listening today, you know,

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S4: you might have a life insurance plan. You might have

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S4: a social plan. Golly, we have so many calendars on

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S4: our phones and on our social guidebooks and. And why

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S4: don't we plan for the peace of God like we

442
00:22:40,540 --> 00:22:42,980
S4: plan for other things in our life that are not

443
00:22:42,980 --> 00:22:46,260
S4: as important? And so my Bible, the Peace of God Bible,

444
00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:50,060
S4: will help you put together a personal peace plan for you,

445
00:22:50,060 --> 00:22:52,859
S4: for your marriage, for your parenting, for your family. That

446
00:22:52,859 --> 00:22:56,900
S4: was the largest exegetical payoff for me, John, as I saw, okay,

447
00:22:56,940 --> 00:22:59,419
S4: I am a planner, so we know that it doesn't

448
00:22:59,420 --> 00:23:02,700
S4: happen overnight, but we can ease into through this discipline

449
00:23:02,740 --> 00:23:06,380
S4: of peace. I understand theologically my peace is found in Jesus.

450
00:23:06,380 --> 00:23:10,700
S4: I understand practically that it can happen through discipline and biblically,

451
00:23:10,700 --> 00:23:12,580
S4: it is God's will for me to live in his peace.

452
00:23:12,580 --> 00:23:15,020
S4: So now what are those immediate next steps? And so

453
00:23:15,260 --> 00:23:17,780
S4: I even made my own peace plan, John, where things

454
00:23:17,780 --> 00:23:20,740
S4: that I wanted to avoid that were stealing the peace,

455
00:23:20,740 --> 00:23:23,460
S4: because we all know that anything that costs our families,

456
00:23:23,500 --> 00:23:26,420
S4: our peace is too expensive. And so there are things

457
00:23:26,420 --> 00:23:28,780
S4: we had to eliminate from our family. And then there

458
00:23:28,780 --> 00:23:31,410
S4: were things we had to fill backfill into our family

459
00:23:31,410 --> 00:23:34,370
S4: for the greater win of God's shalom. And so that's

460
00:23:34,369 --> 00:23:37,010
S4: the beauty of this. That's the payoff. That's the peace

461
00:23:37,010 --> 00:23:38,330
S4: plan of how we get there.

462
00:23:38,369 --> 00:23:40,889
S1: Well, talking about payoffs, I have to ask you now. Right.

463
00:23:40,930 --> 00:23:43,170
S1: Let's say we get your wife on the phone magically

464
00:23:43,170 --> 00:23:46,130
S1: right now, and, uh, I tell her, you know, your

465
00:23:46,130 --> 00:23:48,850
S1: husband Jeremiah here says he, as a result of his

466
00:23:48,850 --> 00:23:51,490
S1: research on this book and this Bible has created his

467
00:23:51,490 --> 00:23:54,609
S1: own personal peace plan. What kind of a difference do

468
00:23:54,609 --> 00:23:57,530
S1: you sense in him? What's she going to say to me?

469
00:23:58,170 --> 00:24:00,370
S4: Well, I'm really glad you asked that. Um, I don't

470
00:24:00,369 --> 00:24:02,290
S4: know how she would have. Well, I do know four

471
00:24:02,290 --> 00:24:05,250
S4: years ago she would have said, um, Jeremiah is the

472
00:24:05,250 --> 00:24:10,490
S4: king of chaos in our home. Um, because, you know,

473
00:24:10,530 --> 00:24:12,490
S4: that's just how I rolled. But what I mean by

474
00:24:12,490 --> 00:24:16,090
S4: that is I was not intentional about how my as

475
00:24:16,090 --> 00:24:19,450
S4: a spiritual leader, how my commitments would impact my parenting

476
00:24:19,450 --> 00:24:23,210
S4: and my children as a busy father, etcetera. And there

477
00:24:23,210 --> 00:24:25,090
S4: were certain points there was a point in the Bible

478
00:24:25,090 --> 00:24:28,050
S4: to where I asked people to ask themselves, you know,

479
00:24:28,050 --> 00:24:30,080
S4: are you an agent of conflict or are you an

480
00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,960
S4: agent of peace in your home? And I can tell

481
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,399
S4: you what Audrey would say. She would say, my wife.

482
00:24:35,440 --> 00:24:38,440
S4: Four years ago, there was a defining moment where Jeremiah

483
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,200
S4: began to ask himself this question of mine. Agent of

484
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:43,679
S4: conflict or an agent of shalom and peace in my family.

485
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,880
S4: And we've seen changes ever since then, and it's changed

486
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:48,719
S4: our whole family. The peace of God is on our

487
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:51,239
S4: home now. That doesn't mean I'm not talking about a

488
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:53,240
S4: problem free, worry free life, but I'm.

489
00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:53,760
S1: Talking about.

490
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:59,080
S4: Approaching all of our catastrophes and adversities in life, in

491
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,600
S4: the peace of God. And we've seen the blessing of

492
00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:03,359
S4: God on our home in the last four years. And

493
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:06,360
S4: we've seen the Lord with us in defining, really challenging moments.

494
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:08,280
S4: Some of our most challenging moments have been in the

495
00:25:08,280 --> 00:25:10,920
S4: last four years, but doing it in the shalom of

496
00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:12,160
S4: God was the X factor.

497
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:13,840
S1: Well, there is so much more to this Peace of

498
00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:18,280
S1: God Bible, including 365 devotionals based on a key verse

499
00:25:18,280 --> 00:25:23,040
S1: or passage. There are 365 what you call peace notes.

500
00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:27,200
S1: Just a lot of great content, all geared, all focused on,

501
00:25:27,310 --> 00:25:31,949
S1: as you say, are establishing our own personal peace plan. And, Jeremiah,

502
00:25:31,990 --> 00:25:33,710
S1: you know, I got to confess, a lot of times

503
00:25:33,710 --> 00:25:36,070
S1: when we get books, I'm happy to share them with others.

504
00:25:36,109 --> 00:25:38,350
S1: This one ain't going nowhere. This Peace of God Bible

505
00:25:38,390 --> 00:25:41,390
S1: I have because I need I need more of it.

506
00:25:41,390 --> 00:25:43,590
S1: And I thank you for your time and for what

507
00:25:43,590 --> 00:25:44,550
S1: you've invested here.

508
00:25:45,350 --> 00:25:47,669
S4: Shalom to you, John. Thank you so much for having me.

509
00:25:47,710 --> 00:25:49,590
S1: Hey, a link to that Peace of God Bible is

510
00:25:49,590 --> 00:25:53,430
S1: at our website. The land and the book Gerald Peterman

511
00:25:53,430 --> 00:26:09,510
S1: next on the land and the book. From Moody Radio.

512
00:26:09,510 --> 00:26:12,710
S1: It's the land and the book. And you and Doctor

513
00:26:12,710 --> 00:26:16,590
S1: Gerald Peterman. And between you, perhaps a question. Well, that's

514
00:26:16,590 --> 00:26:18,550
S1: what this next segment is all about. We're going to

515
00:26:18,550 --> 00:26:21,230
S1: get to that question, that question about the Bible. Maybe

516
00:26:21,230 --> 00:26:23,950
S1: it's prophecy, maybe it's the Middle East, whatever it might be.

517
00:26:24,190 --> 00:26:26,780
S1: That's what this segment is all about. And I'm John

518
00:26:26,780 --> 00:26:29,980
S1: Yeager saying welcome to it. Also saying hello to our

519
00:26:29,980 --> 00:26:33,980
S1: co-host Doctor Gerald Peterman always handles this segment so beautifully.

520
00:26:33,980 --> 00:26:36,540
S1: His Bible is open. I see plenty of notes in

521
00:26:36,540 --> 00:26:39,540
S1: the margins. Uh, how important are your notes to you

522
00:26:39,580 --> 00:26:41,780
S1: on a on a regular basis as you're teaching the

523
00:26:41,780 --> 00:26:43,500
S1: Bible in a classroom at Moody?

524
00:26:43,700 --> 00:26:47,340
S5: Uh, really important because I've collected these notes over the

525
00:26:47,340 --> 00:26:51,100
S5: course of, say, 35 years of putting them in my margins.

526
00:26:51,100 --> 00:26:53,460
S5: And so many times the notes in the margin of

527
00:26:53,460 --> 00:26:57,140
S5: my Bible become my lecture notes. Okay. Don't tell anybody.

528
00:26:57,180 --> 00:26:59,699
S1: I'll keep it a secret. Your secret is safe with me.

529
00:26:59,700 --> 00:27:01,659
S1: We're going to get to some questions centered around the

530
00:27:01,660 --> 00:27:04,780
S1: book of Romans. But first, no question that we all

531
00:27:04,780 --> 00:27:08,179
S1: face fearful times from time to time. The question is,

532
00:27:08,180 --> 00:27:10,540
S1: what do we do with those fears? Wes Tabor of

533
00:27:10,540 --> 00:27:13,260
S1: Life in Messiah has written the book Where Is God

534
00:27:13,500 --> 00:27:17,460
S1: in Fearful Times, a biblical Account of the Exodus journey,

535
00:27:17,500 --> 00:27:19,820
S1: piece by piece. Wes, how do you think our lives

536
00:27:19,820 --> 00:27:22,500
S1: would be different if we today had a stronger grip

537
00:27:22,500 --> 00:27:25,970
S1: on this question? Where is God in fearful times. That's

538
00:27:25,970 --> 00:27:26,890
S1: a great question.

539
00:27:27,290 --> 00:27:30,730
S6: God is sovereign. God designs what we go through. We

540
00:27:30,770 --> 00:27:34,090
S6: decide how we will go through it. Our circumstances are

541
00:27:34,130 --> 00:27:37,330
S6: ordained of the Lord. They're there to humble us, to

542
00:27:37,369 --> 00:27:39,250
S6: test us, to prove what's in our hearts.

543
00:27:39,290 --> 00:27:41,050
S1: You've done such a beautiful job in this book of

544
00:27:41,050 --> 00:27:44,730
S1: bringing these scriptures alive, bits and pieces of passages that

545
00:27:44,730 --> 00:27:47,490
S1: come alive even as you discuss things like the Fear

546
00:27:47,490 --> 00:27:50,730
S1: Factor and Misery Index. It's all in the book. Where

547
00:27:50,730 --> 00:27:53,650
S1: is God in fearful times? How do you get a copy?

548
00:27:53,690 --> 00:27:55,650
S1: We've got one for you with your name on it.

549
00:27:55,690 --> 00:27:58,889
S1: If you'll visit us at Life in Messiah. Click on

550
00:27:58,890 --> 00:28:02,970
S1: the radio button there. Life in Messiah. The book is

551
00:28:02,970 --> 00:28:07,170
S1: where is God in fearful times? I have just finished

552
00:28:07,170 --> 00:28:09,850
S1: Doctor Peterman. A personal study in the book of Romans

553
00:28:09,850 --> 00:28:12,130
S1: took me pretty much one whole year to do it.

554
00:28:12,170 --> 00:28:12,610
S5: Cool.

555
00:28:12,770 --> 00:28:15,090
S1: And boy, have I loved the journey.

556
00:28:15,130 --> 00:28:15,730
S5: Oh, yeah.

557
00:28:15,810 --> 00:28:17,969
S1: And now to find out. You teach this book. And

558
00:28:18,010 --> 00:28:20,530
S1: so we've got some questions centered on the book of Romans.

559
00:28:20,530 --> 00:28:24,510
S1: We're going to dig right in, starting with Romans eight.

560
00:28:24,550 --> 00:28:28,150
S1: It says suffering makes us heirs with Christ. At least

561
00:28:28,150 --> 00:28:30,750
S1: that's a cursory view. What about suffering? That could be

562
00:28:30,750 --> 00:28:33,389
S1: confusing for some people, I think, when they take a

563
00:28:33,390 --> 00:28:34,590
S1: look at first glance.

564
00:28:34,590 --> 00:28:40,190
S5: Yes, indeed. I really, really appreciate this question. Suffering. As Christians,

565
00:28:40,310 --> 00:28:43,390
S5: we will suffer. But wait, what will the suffering be?

566
00:28:43,590 --> 00:28:47,190
S5: It might only be somebody mocking us for believing in Jesus,

567
00:28:47,350 --> 00:28:50,709
S5: or it might be somebody killing us. And everything in

568
00:28:50,710 --> 00:28:54,710
S5: between can be suffering for Christ. The verse we have

569
00:28:54,710 --> 00:28:57,910
S5: in mind here is Romans 817. Let me back up

570
00:28:57,910 --> 00:29:02,750
S5: a minute. Romans 815. We have been adopted as God's children.

571
00:29:02,750 --> 00:29:06,910
S5: Romans 816 God has given us His Holy Spirit to

572
00:29:06,950 --> 00:29:10,590
S5: let us know we're children. Then there's verse 17 if

573
00:29:10,630 --> 00:29:13,630
S5: we're children, we are heirs, heirs of God and fellow

574
00:29:13,630 --> 00:29:17,150
S5: heirs with Christ, because this is what an heir is.

575
00:29:17,150 --> 00:29:20,150
S5: It's the child in the family, right? Oh, and now

576
00:29:20,150 --> 00:29:24,260
S5: here's the hard part. Heirs with Christ. If indeed we

577
00:29:24,300 --> 00:29:27,380
S5: suffer with him, that we may be glorified with him.

578
00:29:27,540 --> 00:29:31,540
S5: What kind of an if is this? Yeah. Let me

579
00:29:31,540 --> 00:29:35,580
S5: give you a couple of English examples of if if

580
00:29:35,660 --> 00:29:38,219
S5: I get on a ladder, I start to feel nervous.

581
00:29:38,420 --> 00:29:41,900
S5: I'm serious. That's true. Okay. 1 or 2 steps. If

582
00:29:41,900 --> 00:29:43,580
S5: I get on a ladder, I start to feel nervous.

583
00:29:43,580 --> 00:29:48,820
S5: Cause and effect the cause. Get on the ladder. The effect. Nervous? Okay, good.

584
00:29:49,060 --> 00:29:52,380
S5: Let me give you another example. If there's lightning, then

585
00:29:52,380 --> 00:29:56,860
S5: there's clouds. Wait wait wait. Lightning doesn't cause clouds to exist, right? Ah,

586
00:29:56,980 --> 00:30:02,380
S5: but lightning almost certainly is evidence that there are clouds. Okay. Oh,

587
00:30:02,500 --> 00:30:04,540
S5: this is a different kind of. If then.

588
00:30:04,580 --> 00:30:05,140
S1: Okay.

589
00:30:05,180 --> 00:30:08,340
S5: Yeah. Okay. We are heirs with Christ if we suffer

590
00:30:08,340 --> 00:30:13,580
S5: with him. Let me paraphrase that suffering with Christ shows

591
00:30:13,580 --> 00:30:17,140
S5: that we are heirs with him because we really know him,

592
00:30:17,620 --> 00:30:19,700
S5: and we really want to live for him, and we

593
00:30:19,700 --> 00:30:23,050
S5: really want to obey him. We really, really want to

594
00:30:23,090 --> 00:30:26,570
S5: love others in his name. But many times, because we're

595
00:30:26,570 --> 00:30:30,890
S5: living for Christ, others will mock us. Yeah. So the

596
00:30:30,890 --> 00:30:35,810
S5: suffering we encounter demonstrates that we're his heirs and children.

597
00:30:35,850 --> 00:30:38,130
S1: Well, that's an important distinction. Thank you for those very

598
00:30:38,130 --> 00:30:41,810
S1: practical examples. Let's go to Romans 14. It seems like

599
00:30:41,810 --> 00:30:45,090
S1: there we find a controversy between the strong and the weak.

600
00:30:45,570 --> 00:30:48,570
S1: Explain this controversy in plain language, please.

601
00:30:48,970 --> 00:30:53,530
S5: Yes, this is sometimes very difficult. Romans 14 Paul talks

602
00:30:53,530 --> 00:30:57,890
S5: about some key issues. He talks about one person who

603
00:30:57,930 --> 00:31:01,130
S5: eats all kinds of food and another person who eats

604
00:31:01,130 --> 00:31:05,890
S5: only vegetables. He talks about one person for whom certain

605
00:31:05,890 --> 00:31:09,130
S5: days are quite special, and he talks about another person

606
00:31:09,130 --> 00:31:12,210
S5: for whom no day is particularly special. They're all good,

607
00:31:12,210 --> 00:31:15,890
S5: if you will. Now, how could this question come up

608
00:31:16,330 --> 00:31:20,200
S5: in a congregation in the first century? Almost certainly it

609
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:24,880
S5: comes up not because there's some Zeus follower who's wanting

610
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,920
S5: to celebrate Zeus's birthday. No, it comes up because there

611
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:33,560
S5: are Jewish people and Gentile people in the congregation. And

612
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:36,320
S5: the Jewish people for years and years and years have

613
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:40,520
S5: restricted their diet. They've eaten kosher because the law required it.

614
00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:45,360
S5: And they've gone to three festivals in Jerusalem per year,

615
00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:47,840
S5: because the law required it, and other festivals which they

616
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:52,800
S5: kept in their hometown. So that's food and special days.

617
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,120
S5: So for Paul, the weak person is the person who

618
00:31:56,120 --> 00:32:00,680
S5: thinks I still must obey the law, but the strong

619
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:03,520
S5: person is the person who knows, no, I don't have to.

620
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:05,640
S5: And you can see where the weak and the strong

621
00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:09,000
S5: are going to have conflict. So what should happen? Well,

622
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:12,040
S5: on the one hand, the weak person hopefully can grow

623
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:15,600
S5: in faith, grow in understanding, and on the other hand,

624
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:19,990
S5: Paul says the strong should be sympathetic and help and

625
00:32:19,990 --> 00:32:21,110
S5: love the weak.

626
00:32:21,510 --> 00:32:23,790
S1: This is the land and the book from Moody Radio.

627
00:32:23,830 --> 00:32:26,630
S1: A special look at the Book of Romans. Maybe you've

628
00:32:26,630 --> 00:32:29,110
S1: been studying the Book of Romans or another book and?

629
00:32:29,310 --> 00:32:31,350
S1: And you've bumped into a question. Why not send it

630
00:32:31,350 --> 00:32:33,750
S1: to us with a quick email to the land and

631
00:32:33,750 --> 00:32:38,790
S1: the book at the land and the book at Moody,

632
00:32:40,390 --> 00:32:42,910
S1: to Romans 12, where Paul seems to be giving a

633
00:32:42,910 --> 00:32:45,470
S1: list of spiritual gifts. Let me ask, is that an

634
00:32:45,470 --> 00:32:48,870
S1: exhaustive list? Do I have to find my gift on

635
00:32:48,950 --> 00:32:49,710
S1: that list?

636
00:32:50,230 --> 00:32:53,510
S5: I really appreciate this question because I think praying before

637
00:32:53,510 --> 00:32:57,350
S5: God and pondering and taking some notes and asking other people,

638
00:32:57,350 --> 00:32:59,110
S5: what's my gift? What's my gift? I think that's a

639
00:32:59,110 --> 00:33:01,390
S5: I think that's a good idea. Let me back up

640
00:33:01,390 --> 00:33:04,910
S5: just a minute. There is a list of spiritual gifts

641
00:33:04,910 --> 00:33:07,950
S5: in Romans 12, and I think it's quite helpful. There's

642
00:33:07,950 --> 00:33:11,070
S5: also a list in First Corinthians 12. As a matter

643
00:33:11,070 --> 00:33:14,270
S5: of fact, there are two lists in first Corinthians 12,

644
00:33:14,270 --> 00:33:16,510
S5: and the two lists are not exactly the same, although

645
00:33:16,510 --> 00:33:21,180
S5: they overlap. Oh, and wait, there's another list in Ephesians four.

646
00:33:21,580 --> 00:33:23,900
S5: He gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some to

647
00:33:23,940 --> 00:33:26,700
S5: be pastors and teachers. Right? Oh, but wait, we shouldn't

648
00:33:26,700 --> 00:33:30,860
S5: leave out first Peter four as each has received a gift.

649
00:33:30,900 --> 00:33:36,540
S5: Use it to show God's multifaceted grace to be stewards

650
00:33:36,980 --> 00:33:41,300
S5: of grace. So we've got four places in Scripture where

651
00:33:41,300 --> 00:33:43,300
S5: we can find a gift list, and all the lists

652
00:33:43,300 --> 00:33:46,620
S5: are different, although they do overlap. So here's the conclusion

653
00:33:46,620 --> 00:33:51,580
S5: I draw. That is, every gift list is meant to

654
00:33:51,620 --> 00:33:55,820
S5: illustrate the ways that God might work through us by

655
00:33:55,820 --> 00:33:59,740
S5: His Spirit to help other people, right? But no list

656
00:33:59,740 --> 00:34:04,540
S5: is exhaustive. So maybe you have the gift of music.

657
00:34:04,540 --> 00:34:07,820
S5: I obviously do not, right? But if you have the

658
00:34:07,860 --> 00:34:11,140
S5: gift of music, I would say this is Holy Spirit given.

659
00:34:11,140 --> 00:34:13,219
S5: Use it to bless God's people. And there might be

660
00:34:13,219 --> 00:34:16,210
S5: two or 3 or 4 other possibilities. So to the

661
00:34:16,210 --> 00:34:19,450
S5: listener I would say yes, this list is very helpful,

662
00:34:19,450 --> 00:34:22,689
S5: but don't feel constrained that you must pick one from

663
00:34:22,690 --> 00:34:23,210
S5: the list.

664
00:34:24,170 --> 00:34:28,370
S1: Romans 13 says we must obey civil authorities. But what

665
00:34:28,370 --> 00:34:32,610
S1: if the authority itself is evil? Certainly plenty of examples

666
00:34:32,610 --> 00:34:36,410
S1: of that in world governments, even state and local municipalities,

667
00:34:36,410 --> 00:34:37,489
S1: all kinds of evil.

668
00:34:37,530 --> 00:34:41,129
S5: Yes, indeed. I'm going to say this is a very,

669
00:34:41,130 --> 00:34:44,489
S5: very practical question. But first, I'm going to get a

670
00:34:44,489 --> 00:34:49,009
S5: little persnickety about my answer to this question. Romans 13

671
00:34:49,050 --> 00:34:54,330
S5: does not say obey governing authorities. It says be in submission.

672
00:34:54,730 --> 00:34:58,770
S5: What does Paul say in Ephesians five? Wives, submit to

673
00:34:58,770 --> 00:35:01,450
S5: your husbands. What does he say in Ephesians six? Children,

674
00:35:01,450 --> 00:35:07,009
S5: obey your parents. There's a difference between submission and obedience.

675
00:35:07,010 --> 00:35:11,010
S5: When we are submitted to a governing authority, we recognize

676
00:35:11,570 --> 00:35:15,550
S5: it has authority. We recognize its position. We show honor

677
00:35:15,550 --> 00:35:19,109
S5: and respect. But do we always obey? No, we don't

678
00:35:19,110 --> 00:35:21,790
S5: always obey. Rosa Parks did not go to the back

679
00:35:21,790 --> 00:35:26,270
S5: of the bus. Remember those Hebrew midwives who did not

680
00:35:26,270 --> 00:35:29,710
S5: obey Pharaoh and kill the babies? Remember that Peter and

681
00:35:29,710 --> 00:35:33,390
S5: John in Acts four were told, stop preaching in the

682
00:35:33,390 --> 00:35:35,629
S5: name of Jesus. What did they do? They said, we

683
00:35:35,630 --> 00:35:39,630
S5: must obey God rather than man. So I think we

684
00:35:39,630 --> 00:35:44,069
S5: can be submissive and by the guidance and wisdom of

685
00:35:44,070 --> 00:35:46,989
S5: the Holy Spirit, decide exactly what that mean for us

686
00:35:46,989 --> 00:35:50,589
S5: in a particular instance. Recognize the authority. But maybe the

687
00:35:50,590 --> 00:35:52,430
S5: answer is not obey.

688
00:35:53,030 --> 00:35:55,430
S1: Yet I think I see a growing number of Christians

689
00:35:55,469 --> 00:35:59,710
S1: sort of grasping that verse and sort of as an

690
00:35:59,710 --> 00:36:02,910
S1: add on to the snarkiness and sassiness that we see

691
00:36:02,950 --> 00:36:05,549
S1: rising up saying, you see, there you go. You know,

692
00:36:05,590 --> 00:36:07,590
S1: I don't have to obey. You know, I don't you know,

693
00:36:07,590 --> 00:36:10,310
S1: I don't think that law is Christian. And so I

694
00:36:10,350 --> 00:36:12,550
S1: just think there is that risk to your thoughts.

695
00:36:12,590 --> 00:36:15,060
S5: Oh, absolutely. There is that risk. And that is an

696
00:36:15,060 --> 00:36:21,020
S5: attitude problem. Submission is often a proper attitude all through Scripture.

697
00:36:21,060 --> 00:36:25,020
S5: Governing authorities have been abusive and God's people have, if

698
00:36:25,020 --> 00:36:28,860
S5: you will, rebelled or not, been submissive, not been obedient,

699
00:36:28,860 --> 00:36:32,420
S5: I should say. But we don't. We're not snarky in that.

700
00:36:32,460 --> 00:36:34,819
S5: We mean we are loving God in that, and we're

701
00:36:34,820 --> 00:36:35,620
S5: humble in that.

702
00:36:35,620 --> 00:36:38,259
S1: The same Bible that brings us these stories of Peter

703
00:36:38,780 --> 00:36:41,219
S1: and Paul, you know, and so on, not obeying the

704
00:36:41,219 --> 00:36:44,379
S1: local authorities to not preach also says, pray for those

705
00:36:44,380 --> 00:36:47,859
S1: in authority over you. Indeed. Lots to think about. And

706
00:36:47,860 --> 00:36:50,060
S1: there's more to come on today's edition of The Land

707
00:36:50,060 --> 00:36:53,060
S1: and the book Charlie Dyer's Devotional, for example. It's next

708
00:36:53,060 --> 00:37:09,180
S1: right here. Stick around, won't you? Thanks for your company today.

709
00:37:09,180 --> 00:37:11,660
S1: Sure appreciate your hanging out with us at the land

710
00:37:11,690 --> 00:37:14,410
S1: and the book. I'm John Gager. Our host, Charlie Dyer.

711
00:37:14,410 --> 00:37:16,850
S1: And Charlie. You know, when we go to Israel and

712
00:37:16,850 --> 00:37:19,770
S1: we still see flocks of sheep being watched? I don't

713
00:37:19,770 --> 00:37:22,930
S1: see a whole lot of evidences of watchtowers as a

714
00:37:22,930 --> 00:37:25,770
S1: part of that whole scenario. But apparently they were, at

715
00:37:25,810 --> 00:37:27,330
S1: least in ancient times.

716
00:37:27,850 --> 00:37:29,569
S2: They were, and they are still there if you know

717
00:37:29,570 --> 00:37:31,330
S2: where to look for them. But not nearly as many

718
00:37:31,330 --> 00:37:32,850
S2: as there must have been in the past.

719
00:37:32,890 --> 00:37:34,730
S1: All right. Clearly I don't know where to look for them.

720
00:37:34,730 --> 00:37:37,410
S1: There's a lot I need to learn. And maybe Charlie,

721
00:37:37,410 --> 00:37:39,250
S1: you'll help me along in your devotional. We'll get to

722
00:37:39,290 --> 00:37:41,850
S1: that after this Holy Land experience.

723
00:37:45,969 --> 00:37:50,969
S7: I'm Heather, and one of the many things that I've

724
00:37:50,969 --> 00:37:55,330
S7: been struck by is Charlie has not wasted one inch

725
00:37:55,330 --> 00:37:59,970
S7: of real estate in this entire country. We have learned

726
00:38:00,330 --> 00:38:06,490
S7: so much about the history of Israel, the people of Israel.

727
00:38:06,530 --> 00:38:11,160
S7: He has taken the content of Scripture, put it into

728
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,960
S7: the context of the cultures. He's helped us understand the

729
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:21,640
S7: cultures and has brought us into the modern day problems.

730
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:26,440
S7: And I think what it's done for me is it's

731
00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:30,719
S7: changed me dramatically, but it has also given me a

732
00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:35,160
S7: resolve to be the kind of believer I need to

733
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:37,680
S7: be for Israel.

734
00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:42,520
S1: Well, Charlie, I'm intrigued with this idea of the watchtower

735
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:45,279
S1: of the flock. We'll let you have at your devotional today,

736
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:47,000
S1: based in Micah chapter four.

737
00:38:47,440 --> 00:38:50,680
S2: Thanks, John. Yeah, Christmas is approaching and it's time to

738
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:53,120
S2: get out the decorations. Now, if you happen to have

739
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:56,200
S2: a manger set with Mary, Joseph, Jesus and the shepherds.

740
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,279
S2: Do you place the figurines in a creche or do

741
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:01,879
S2: yours go in a stable? And where do you place

742
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:04,680
S2: the wise men? Or do you prefer to call them magi?

743
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:08,560
S2: Different people use different names, but we understand what they mean.

744
00:39:09,150 --> 00:39:11,989
S2: Sometimes the Bible uses different words that mean almost the

745
00:39:11,989 --> 00:39:15,950
S2: same thing. For example, you've probably heard the word mitzvah before.

746
00:39:16,270 --> 00:39:19,910
S2: The word means watchtower or lookout, and several places in

747
00:39:19,910 --> 00:39:22,710
S2: the Old Testament were given that name. But do you

748
00:39:22,710 --> 00:39:26,110
S2: ever remember reading or hearing the word migdal? It's also

749
00:39:26,110 --> 00:39:30,110
S2: a Hebrew word that means tower, fortress or watchtower. And

750
00:39:30,110 --> 00:39:32,990
S2: several places in the Bible were given that name as well.

751
00:39:33,469 --> 00:39:36,390
S2: So should I call my tower a mitzvah or a migdal?

752
00:39:36,670 --> 00:39:39,630
S2: I guess it depends on which name you prefer. But

753
00:39:39,670 --> 00:39:42,270
S2: whatever your personal preference, today we're going to look at

754
00:39:42,270 --> 00:39:45,230
S2: a place called Migdal. But if you think that by

755
00:39:45,230 --> 00:39:48,710
S2: limiting our study to that one name, we'll avoid confusion. Well,

756
00:39:48,750 --> 00:39:51,390
S2: have I got news for you. There are times when

757
00:39:51,430 --> 00:39:54,910
S2: even a single name can cause a misunderstanding. But before

758
00:39:54,910 --> 00:39:57,910
S2: I totally confuse you, follow me out into this field.

759
00:39:58,270 --> 00:40:01,750
S2: We're standing near the monastery of Mar Elias, halfway between

760
00:40:01,750 --> 00:40:05,110
S2: Jerusalem and Bethlehem. Just behind us is the modern road

761
00:40:05,110 --> 00:40:08,580
S2: connecting the two towns. It straddles the spiny ridge that

762
00:40:08,620 --> 00:40:11,540
S2: runs through the center of the country. The modern road

763
00:40:11,540 --> 00:40:14,779
S2: follows the same path taken by travelers from as far

764
00:40:14,780 --> 00:40:18,140
S2: back as Abraham. Off in the distance in front of us,

765
00:40:18,140 --> 00:40:20,860
S2: you can actually see the land changing from the green

766
00:40:20,860 --> 00:40:24,100
S2: of the hill country to the brown of the Judean wilderness.

767
00:40:24,380 --> 00:40:27,219
S2: That wilderness is the place of the shepherds and sheep.

768
00:40:27,540 --> 00:40:30,219
S2: Somewhere out there in front of us is the spot

769
00:40:30,260 --> 00:40:34,340
S2: where shepherds were keeping their flocks by night 2000 years ago.

770
00:40:34,580 --> 00:40:37,020
S2: But why did we stop here? Well, to answer that,

771
00:40:37,020 --> 00:40:40,140
S2: we need to visit Migdal in two passages of Scripture.

772
00:40:40,420 --> 00:40:44,220
S2: The first passage is Genesis 35. After his sons killed

773
00:40:44,219 --> 00:40:47,700
S2: the men of Shechem, Jacob headed south. He went first

774
00:40:47,700 --> 00:40:49,779
S2: to Bethel, to the very spot where he had made

775
00:40:49,780 --> 00:40:52,140
S2: a vow to God when he left the land so

776
00:40:52,140 --> 00:40:56,460
S2: many years before. Jacob then continued his journey south, eventually

777
00:40:56,460 --> 00:40:59,500
S2: reaching the home of his father Isaac in Hebron. And

778
00:40:59,500 --> 00:41:02,980
S2: the road behind us is the pathway that connected those towns.

779
00:41:03,260 --> 00:41:06,460
S2: Now think about that journey Jacob was trying to distance

780
00:41:06,610 --> 00:41:09,489
S2: himself from the events in Shechem. After all, he didn't

781
00:41:09,489 --> 00:41:12,050
S2: know if others from that area might come after him,

782
00:41:12,050 --> 00:41:15,130
S2: looking to avenge those who'd been killed. He even said

783
00:41:15,130 --> 00:41:17,810
S2: as much to his sons. You have brought trouble on

784
00:41:17,810 --> 00:41:21,009
S2: me by making me odious among the inhabitants of the land.

785
00:41:21,050 --> 00:41:23,609
S2: They will gather together against me and attack me, and

786
00:41:23,610 --> 00:41:27,130
S2: I shall be destroyed. He's on the run, but he

787
00:41:27,130 --> 00:41:30,170
S2: has a large flock of animals which would slow him down.

788
00:41:30,650 --> 00:41:33,090
S2: Would he travel on the main road which his enemies

789
00:41:33,090 --> 00:41:36,050
S2: might use? Or would he try to avoid detection by

790
00:41:36,050 --> 00:41:38,210
S2: staying a little to the east on the edge of

791
00:41:38,210 --> 00:41:41,850
S2: the wilderness? There's less likelihood of being spotted out there,

792
00:41:41,850 --> 00:41:44,690
S2: and his flocks could feed on the tufts of grass

793
00:41:44,690 --> 00:41:47,730
S2: growing on the hillsides. And to add even more stress

794
00:41:47,730 --> 00:41:52,009
S2: to an already anxious situation, Rachel, his favorite wife, went

795
00:41:52,010 --> 00:41:55,330
S2: into labor. She gave birth to a son, Benjamin, but

796
00:41:55,330 --> 00:41:58,330
S2: she died during the birth. The Bible says this sad

797
00:41:58,330 --> 00:42:01,009
S2: event took place on the way to a fraught that

798
00:42:01,010 --> 00:42:04,730
S2: is Bethlehem. Off to our right is Bethlehem. And somewhere

799
00:42:04,730 --> 00:42:08,080
S2: near where we're standing before reaching that town is where

800
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:13,320
S2: Rachel died after burying his beloved Rachel. Jacob continued his journey.

801
00:42:13,600 --> 00:42:17,400
S2: His next campsite in verse 21 was the Tower of Edar.

802
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:21,319
S2: Other versions have Migdol or the tower of the flock.

803
00:42:21,600 --> 00:42:24,319
S2: They all mean the same thing. A watchtower for the

804
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:28,160
S2: flock somewhere near Bethlehem. We don't know exactly where, but

805
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:30,839
S2: somewhere out in the wilderness in front of us, is

806
00:42:30,840 --> 00:42:34,440
S2: the place where Jacob stopped before continuing on to the

807
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:37,600
S2: home of his father. Now to view the second passage.

808
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,480
S2: Move forward in time with me over a thousand years

809
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,440
S2: to the days of the prophet Micah. We're still at

810
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:46,520
S2: the same spot. There's Bethlehem, but now that town is

811
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:49,880
S2: much more important because King David has been born there.

812
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:53,080
S2: He's long gone, but his descendants are still raining on

813
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:56,720
S2: the throne he established in Jerusalem. And we're all familiar

814
00:42:56,719 --> 00:42:59,880
S2: with Micah's famous prophecy about the birth of the Messiah

815
00:42:59,880 --> 00:43:02,359
S2: in Micah five two. But I want to look at

816
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:06,100
S2: a lesser known prophecy given by Micah one chapter earlier

817
00:43:06,540 --> 00:43:09,859
S2: in Micah four and five, the prophet distinguishes between the

818
00:43:09,860 --> 00:43:13,540
S2: coming judgment on Judah and Jerusalem and God's ultimate blessing

819
00:43:13,540 --> 00:43:16,299
S2: for the nation. Micah announced that a day will come

820
00:43:16,300 --> 00:43:19,140
S2: when God will bring the exiles back to the land.

821
00:43:19,380 --> 00:43:22,259
S2: And in the middle of this promise, Micah writes, and

822
00:43:22,260 --> 00:43:25,899
S2: as for you. Tower of the flock, Migdal Eder, hill

823
00:43:25,900 --> 00:43:28,180
S2: of the daughter of Zion. To you it will come.

824
00:43:28,180 --> 00:43:30,580
S2: Even the former dominion will come. The kingdom of the

825
00:43:30,580 --> 00:43:34,180
S2: daughter of Jerusalem. And for the second time in the Bible,

826
00:43:34,180 --> 00:43:37,219
S2: we hear about Migdal Peter, the tower of the flock.

827
00:43:37,540 --> 00:43:40,859
S2: The first occurrence looked toward Bethlehem and focused on a

828
00:43:40,860 --> 00:43:45,219
S2: literal watchtower in the wilderness, where shepherds watched over their flocks.

829
00:43:45,540 --> 00:43:49,779
S2: This second occurrence points toward Jerusalem, where the ultimate shepherd

830
00:43:49,780 --> 00:43:53,700
S2: promises to gather and protect his flock. The first passage

831
00:43:53,700 --> 00:43:56,300
S2: looked toward the city, where Micah later said the Messiah

832
00:43:56,300 --> 00:43:59,620
S2: would be born, but the second passage looks toward the city,

833
00:43:59,620 --> 00:44:03,210
S2: where Micah says the Messiah will someday reign. And Micah

834
00:44:03,210 --> 00:44:07,690
S2: calls both cities Bethlehem and Jerusalem. The city of David.

835
00:44:08,170 --> 00:44:10,969
S2: But what does Migdal Eder, the tower of the flock,

836
00:44:10,969 --> 00:44:14,170
S2: have to do with us this Christmas? It's no accident

837
00:44:14,170 --> 00:44:17,370
S2: that the birth of Christ was announced to shepherds keeping

838
00:44:17,370 --> 00:44:21,129
S2: watch over their flock near Bethlehem. After all, Migdal Eder

839
00:44:21,130 --> 00:44:24,490
S2: was the watchtower of the flock. The Bible only uses

840
00:44:24,489 --> 00:44:28,170
S2: Migdal Eder in connection with two cities. One is Bethlehem,

841
00:44:28,210 --> 00:44:31,370
S2: the city of Jesus's birth, where God announced the news

842
00:44:31,370 --> 00:44:34,690
S2: to shepherds. The other city is Jerusalem, and it's the

843
00:44:34,690 --> 00:44:38,170
S2: city where the good Shepherd also became the ultimate Passover

844
00:44:38,170 --> 00:44:41,290
S2: lamb who died to pay for our sins. As you

845
00:44:41,290 --> 00:44:43,609
S2: get ready to celebrate the birth of Jesus in less

846
00:44:43,610 --> 00:44:47,890
S2: than two weeks, pause to read Genesis 35 and Micah

847
00:44:47,890 --> 00:44:51,410
S2: four and then think about Migdal Eder, the watchtower of

848
00:44:51,410 --> 00:44:55,689
S2: the flock. It was an actual place somewhere near Bethlehem,

849
00:44:55,730 --> 00:44:58,850
S2: a place where Jacob pitched his tent, and where shepherds

850
00:44:58,850 --> 00:45:02,960
S2: were still watching over their flocks nearly 2000 years later,

851
00:45:03,239 --> 00:45:05,879
S2: but it also describes the city where the Messiah will

852
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:09,239
S2: someday return a second time to shepherd the flock of

853
00:45:09,239 --> 00:45:14,239
S2: his people. Migdal Eder. One name associated with two cities

854
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,520
S2: and focused on the two advents of the Messiah.

855
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:21,120
S1: Charlie, you know, this idea of Jesus being the shepherd

856
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:24,960
S1: again of his flock is is just incredibly appealing. You know,

857
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:28,520
S1: we we do lack good leaders. We do lack those

858
00:45:28,520 --> 00:45:31,440
S1: who keep us safe. And Jesus is all of that, right?

859
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:34,160
S2: Oh, absolutely. In fact, I love you know, I'm a

860
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:37,080
S2: lover of the prophets, Jeremiah and Ezekiel. And both of

861
00:45:37,080 --> 00:45:39,920
S2: them picture the ultimate shepherd. Both of them talk about

862
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:43,320
S2: the kings as shepherds. And unfortunately, in their day, the

863
00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:46,080
S2: the shepherds. The kings were not good shepherds. That's why

864
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:48,520
S2: Israel was destroyed. But they keep pointing back to the

865
00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:51,080
S2: ultimate shepherd who is coming. Uh, the one who's going

866
00:45:51,080 --> 00:45:53,160
S2: to take care of the flock and watch out for him,

867
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,719
S2: feed them and nourish them. And of course, that's the

868
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:57,600
S2: picture of Jesus as the Messiah.

869
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:00,080
S1: That's Jesus in the role yet to come. But he

870
00:46:00,190 --> 00:46:02,830
S1: did arrive on this earth at Christmas. As Charlie has

871
00:46:02,830 --> 00:46:05,629
S1: beautifully pointed out, as the good Shepherd, the one who

872
00:46:05,630 --> 00:46:07,589
S1: laid down his life for the sheep. And the only

873
00:46:07,590 --> 00:46:11,070
S1: question is, have you received his forgiveness? Have you made

874
00:46:11,070 --> 00:46:12,950
S1: him in charge of your life? Or is it still

875
00:46:12,950 --> 00:46:16,069
S1: you running the show? You can know Jesus personally. You

876
00:46:16,070 --> 00:46:18,590
S1: can make him the leader or savior of your life,

877
00:46:18,590 --> 00:46:20,629
S1: and a friend is happy to pray with you and

878
00:46:20,630 --> 00:46:23,630
S1: answer your questions as you call eight, eight eight need

879
00:46:23,630 --> 00:46:27,910
S1: him eight need him. You can have that conversation right now.

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S1: We always encourage you to visit our website, The Land

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00:46:30,750 --> 00:46:35,589
S1: and the book for information about our guests, past programs,

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00:46:35,590 --> 00:46:39,070
S1: future programs, and more, as well as books that Charlie's written.

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00:46:39,070 --> 00:46:44,190
S1: That's the land and the book. I'm John Yeager saying,

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00:46:44,190 --> 00:46:47,030
S1: thank you for listening. Be sure and encourage this station.

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00:46:47,030 --> 00:46:49,870
S1: Thank them for caring the broadcast we call the Land

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00:46:49,870 --> 00:46:53,270
S1: and the book, a production of Moody Radio, a ministry

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S1: of Moody Bible Institute.