WEBVTT - Mission-Ready Marriage | Tim & Ashley Ashcraft 0:00:01.040 --> 0:00:05.360 The struggles and triumphs of military marriages today. On building 0:00:05.360 --> 0:00:07.600 relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman. 0:00:08.280 --> 0:00:10.760 You do have to take a back seat. A lot 0:00:10.760 --> 0:00:13.760 of times as a military spouse, you're told where to 0:00:13.800 --> 0:00:16.799 go and when to go, and your heart has to 0:00:16.840 --> 0:00:21.520 be primed to follow, hopefully with loving service. 0:00:21.640 --> 0:00:24.520 That calling is a spouse. You're entering a mission field 0:00:24.520 --> 0:00:26.960 and as a service member, and I think that's an 0:00:26.960 --> 0:00:32.440 area that is ripe for believers and just a calling 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:36.000 out of what that could bring to marriages. Certainly in 0:00:36.000 --> 0:00:38.760 the military and many marriages that are second or third 0:00:38.760 --> 0:00:39.640 marriages as well. 0:00:44.280 --> 0:00:48.080 Welcome to building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman, author of 0:00:48.080 --> 0:00:52.280 the New York Times best seller The Five Love Languages. Today, 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:57.120 through multiple combat deployments, frequent sole parenting, post-traumatic stress, and 0:00:57.120 --> 0:01:00.940 12 moves, Ashley realized she needed a plan to survive 0:01:00.980 --> 0:01:03.300 her military marriage to her husband, Tim. 0:01:03.900 --> 0:01:07.580 And that plan is our featured resource today at Building Relationships. 0:01:08.580 --> 0:01:12.740 It's titled Mission Ready Marriage A Christian Guide to Discovering 0:01:12.740 --> 0:01:16.260 Hope and purpose as a military wife. Again, go to 0:01:16.300 --> 0:01:21.940 building relationships. And with Memorial Day coming up this Monday, 0:01:22.060 --> 0:01:24.259 I think this is the perfect time to talk about 0:01:24.260 --> 0:01:28.180 military marriages and some of the struggles they face. Gary, 0:01:28.220 --> 0:01:30.980 through the years, you've spoken into the lives of those 0:01:30.980 --> 0:01:34.060 who serve our country, and it's not just the person 0:01:34.060 --> 0:01:37.940 in uniform that serves. It's really the whole family, isn't it? 0:01:38.220 --> 0:01:41.620 Well, it is, Chris, no question about it, because every 0:01:41.620 --> 0:01:46.699 family member is impacted by military lifestyle, which is very 0:01:46.700 --> 0:01:51.100 different from the lifestyle that non-military people live. So. And 0:01:51.100 --> 0:01:54.020 as you know, I've been very, very interested and concerned 0:01:54.540 --> 0:01:57.140 with military couples. Wrote a special edition you remember of 0:01:57.140 --> 0:02:00.720 the five love languages for military couples trying to face 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:02.559 some of those things. So I am really excited about 0:02:02.560 --> 0:02:05.200 our conversation today and excited about this book. I think 0:02:05.200 --> 0:02:07.240 it's going to be very helpful to our listeners. 0:02:07.480 --> 0:02:10.639 I do too. Let's meet our guests first. Ashley Ashcraft 0:02:10.639 --> 0:02:15.680 is a nationally recognized educator, military wife, down syndrome advocate, 0:02:15.680 --> 0:02:19.600 and homeschool mom. She's also a contributing writer for Military 0:02:19.600 --> 0:02:24.359 Spouse magazine. Her husband, Tim Ashcraft, is a career Army 0:02:24.400 --> 0:02:28.679 aviation officer and recipient of the Distinguished Flying Cross for 0:02:28.680 --> 0:02:33.320 his actions in Afghanistan as an ah 64 Apache helicopter pilot. 0:02:33.360 --> 0:02:36.960 He holds two masters, one in aerospace engineering, one in 0:02:36.960 --> 0:02:40.799 military studies, served as an assistant professor in the Civil 0:02:40.800 --> 0:02:44.400 and Mechanical Engineering department at West Point. Tim and Ashley 0:02:44.400 --> 0:02:46.639 have been married for more than 15 years. They have 0:02:46.639 --> 0:02:50.280 four children and are featured. Resource is the book Mission 0:02:50.280 --> 0:02:54.040 Ready Marriage. You'll find out more at Building Relationships. 0:02:55.280 --> 0:02:58.460 Well, Ashley and Tim, Welcome to Building Relationships. 0:02:58.780 --> 0:03:02.419 Thank you, Doctor Chapman. It is a huge honor and 0:03:02.419 --> 0:03:04.780 blessing to be with you today. You have been a 0:03:04.900 --> 0:03:08.300 pivotal part of our marriage, because the five love languages 0:03:08.300 --> 0:03:12.220 is something that we hold very dear to our marriage 0:03:12.220 --> 0:03:15.980 and constantly remind ourselves of how to love the other. 0:03:15.980 --> 0:03:18.460 So thank you for your work and as you mentioned, 0:03:18.460 --> 0:03:22.420 your specific book for those who are married in the military. 0:03:23.100 --> 0:03:25.780 Well, I'm excited about your book that you're having you 0:03:25.780 --> 0:03:28.180 and Tim on the program today. You know, we like 0:03:28.180 --> 0:03:32.419 to hear love stories on this program. So, Ashley, start 0:03:32.460 --> 0:03:35.340 us off. How did you meet Tim and how did 0:03:35.340 --> 0:03:37.740 you know that he was the one for you? 0:03:38.340 --> 0:03:42.180 We met in our freshman English class in high school, 0:03:42.660 --> 0:03:46.500 and we became dear friends, and we tried to date 0:03:46.500 --> 0:03:50.100 a few times, but more than that, we were friends 0:03:50.100 --> 0:03:54.100 for about eight years and this was before the time 0:03:54.100 --> 0:03:57.930 of text messaging, so we constantly pass each other notes 0:03:57.930 --> 0:04:01.650 in between classes and we would always address them from 0:04:01.650 --> 0:04:07.250 famous characters. So two Prince Charming from Cinderella. And that's 0:04:07.250 --> 0:04:10.650 how our love story started out. And then it was 0:04:10.690 --> 0:04:15.010 our senior year in college, when I visited him up 0:04:15.010 --> 0:04:18.210 at West Point on a trip over Easter where I 0:04:18.210 --> 0:04:21.690 truly felt like I wanted to, that I knew I 0:04:21.690 --> 0:04:24.970 wanted to dedicate the rest of my life to loving 0:04:24.970 --> 0:04:27.049 this man and calling him my husband. 0:04:27.490 --> 0:04:30.930 Okay, Taylor, it's your turn. What was it like for you? 0:04:31.810 --> 0:04:35.810 I'll never forget when Ashley walked into Mrs. Hughes freshman 0:04:35.850 --> 0:04:39.450 English class. And I was assuming we were dating all 0:04:39.450 --> 0:04:44.370 those eight years, but. No, but we became very good friends. 0:04:44.370 --> 0:04:48.490 And even through long distance. Um, and that's what really 0:04:48.490 --> 0:04:51.130 cemented it. Of course, I fell more and more in 0:04:51.130 --> 0:04:53.010 love with her through the years. But what what was 0:04:53.150 --> 0:04:57.630 incredible to me was when she decided to move to 0:04:57.670 --> 0:04:59.670 a small town in Alabama while I was finishing up 0:04:59.670 --> 0:05:01.830 flight school, get a place of her own. And I 0:05:01.830 --> 0:05:04.349 hadn't even proposed yet. And I thought, wow, I better 0:05:04.390 --> 0:05:07.830 get serious because she's she's all in and I will 0:05:07.830 --> 0:05:10.630 never forget that commitment early on. 0:05:11.390 --> 0:05:14.349 All right. Well, you know, all of us have a 0:05:14.350 --> 0:05:17.750 story and it's amazing how God leads us together. Some 0:05:17.750 --> 0:05:21.229 early in life, as with the two of you. Well, actually, 0:05:21.230 --> 0:05:24.469 did you know what you were signing up for when 0:05:24.470 --> 0:05:26.350 you married a military man? 0:05:26.870 --> 0:05:31.110 I had absolutely no clue. Which seems to be the 0:05:31.110 --> 0:05:35.350 consensus in our community. I had two family members who 0:05:35.390 --> 0:05:37.869 had served in the military before I was born, but 0:05:37.870 --> 0:05:41.470 it wasn't something that was discussed or talked about as 0:05:41.470 --> 0:05:44.830 I grew up. So other than knowing we would move 0:05:44.870 --> 0:05:50.110 frequently and there would be deployments, I had no understanding 0:05:50.150 --> 0:05:53.930 of what this life would actually entail as a military spouse? 0:05:54.410 --> 0:05:57.729 Yeah, most of us have no idea our little idea 0:05:57.970 --> 0:05:59.690 of what marriage is going to be like, even if 0:05:59.690 --> 0:06:00.850 we're not in the military. 0:06:01.370 --> 0:06:02.170 Amen. 0:06:03.570 --> 0:06:06.890 Well, Tim, uh, did you have any idea of the 0:06:06.890 --> 0:06:10.210 adjustments in all that Ashley and later your family would 0:06:10.210 --> 0:06:10.930 have to make? 0:06:11.490 --> 0:06:15.969 No idea. I really think there's a beautiful illustration in 0:06:15.970 --> 0:06:19.530 Ashley's book about a spouse's oath of office. You know, 0:06:19.529 --> 0:06:22.570 in the military, you take an oath of office and 0:06:22.610 --> 0:06:27.370 any public service. And she has this beautiful illustration of 0:06:27.370 --> 0:06:31.490 how there should be almost at the altar or when 0:06:31.490 --> 0:06:34.770 you join up a spouse's oath of office, because they 0:06:34.770 --> 0:06:39.770 really take on not just your oath, but the whole 0:06:39.770 --> 0:06:42.690 family and providing for the family. So I, I had 0:06:42.690 --> 0:06:46.409 no idea hardly what I was getting into and let 0:06:46.410 --> 0:06:47.730 alone Ashley. 0:06:48.650 --> 0:06:51.830 Yeah. Ashley. What are some of the challenges, just in 0:06:51.830 --> 0:06:55.710 a general sense, that military families face, that the general 0:06:55.710 --> 0:06:57.470 public doesn't understand? 0:06:58.270 --> 0:07:00.590 I think one of the most important things for the 0:07:00.589 --> 0:07:05.070 community to understand is that the military has the highest 0:07:05.070 --> 0:07:08.670 divorce rate of any profession on the planet, so we 0:07:08.670 --> 0:07:14.550 are in desperate need of support in our marriages. Also, 25% 0:07:14.550 --> 0:07:18.870 of military families struggle with food insecurity, and this is 0:07:18.870 --> 0:07:23.270 because of the low wages that they earn early on, 0:07:23.270 --> 0:07:30.110 but also because of financial guidance that is really lacking 0:07:30.110 --> 0:07:35.270 in the military community. And lastly, the military spouse unemployment 0:07:35.270 --> 0:07:39.270 rate is five times the national average. So because we 0:07:39.270 --> 0:07:45.230 move so frequently, it's challenging to transfer our licenses and 0:07:45.230 --> 0:07:50.290 repeat tests and find jobs that fit our niche everywhere 0:07:50.290 --> 0:07:53.850 that we go. So if there's not an unemployment rate, 0:07:53.850 --> 0:07:56.490 then oftentimes we are underemployed as well. 0:07:57.330 --> 0:07:59.570 I think you're right on those things, and I think 0:07:59.570 --> 0:08:04.610 very few civilians understand some of those things and perhaps 0:08:04.610 --> 0:08:06.970 would not even have thought about those things. 0:08:07.690 --> 0:08:10.210 Tim, as as a person in the military, it must 0:08:10.210 --> 0:08:13.970 break your heart to see marriages around you doing what 0:08:13.970 --> 0:08:17.530 they're doing and those who are in the service. 0:08:18.250 --> 0:08:22.530 It really does. And it is a mission field for believers. 0:08:22.930 --> 0:08:26.850 You cry out for those that are believers and struggling, 0:08:26.970 --> 0:08:30.650 but those that don't even have a faith. I so 0:08:30.690 --> 0:08:34.050 admire the the Chaplain Corps and the work they do, 0:08:34.490 --> 0:08:38.370 but not just their work as a mission field. Ashley 0:08:38.770 --> 0:08:41.250 talks in her book how that calling is a spouse. 0:08:41.250 --> 0:08:44.890 You're entering a mission field and as a service member. Um, 0:08:44.890 --> 0:08:48.470 and I think that's an area that is ripe for 0:08:48.910 --> 0:08:53.390 believers and for just a calling out of what that 0:08:53.390 --> 0:08:57.070 could bring to marriages, certainly in the military and many 0:08:57.070 --> 0:08:59.470 marriages that are second or third marriages as well. 0:09:00.190 --> 0:09:03.030 Well, Tim, if you were talking to a young man 0:09:03.030 --> 0:09:05.790 or a group of young men or women for that matter, 0:09:05.790 --> 0:09:09.710 about joining the military, what would you say to them 0:09:09.830 --> 0:09:14.150 in their consideration of the process of going into the military? 0:09:14.870 --> 0:09:17.950 I would say that there is a jersey for you, 0:09:17.950 --> 0:09:20.949 and I'm I'm stealing that from my boss, who gave 0:09:20.990 --> 0:09:24.150 a beautiful speech on if you want to be a veterinarian, 0:09:24.150 --> 0:09:29.150 an artist, an astronaut, a pilot, a tanker, there is 0:09:29.190 --> 0:09:32.030 a jersey for you. And a lot of people just 0:09:32.030 --> 0:09:35.030 don't know the careers that they can take on. There's 0:09:35.350 --> 0:09:39.710 incredible stories of people who have enlisted, who come from 0:09:40.030 --> 0:09:43.030 the most humble beginnings, and go on to be general 0:09:43.030 --> 0:09:49.210 officers or to serve distinguished careers twice over in the military, 0:09:49.210 --> 0:09:53.170 and I would encourage them to really look into what 0:09:53.170 --> 0:09:55.929 they want to be as a as a professional, as 0:09:55.929 --> 0:09:59.530 a person, and how the military can complement that. And 0:09:59.890 --> 0:10:01.770 when you couple those together, you have some of the 0:10:01.770 --> 0:10:07.090 most incredible experiences you couldn't even ever imagine, while also 0:10:07.330 --> 0:10:10.330 having a sense of service and and a calling to 0:10:10.650 --> 0:10:12.010 something beyond yourself. 0:10:12.530 --> 0:10:16.650 Yeah, I think the plus side of military life is 0:10:16.650 --> 0:10:21.530 often not emphasized among civilians, but there are a lot 0:10:21.570 --> 0:10:26.490 of positive things there. I'm just thinking about children, for example, 0:10:26.530 --> 0:10:30.450 and what exposure they have to various places, living various 0:10:30.450 --> 0:10:33.130 places and all of that sort of thing. Yeah, so 0:10:33.130 --> 0:10:35.890 I would certainly encourage young, young men who have any 0:10:35.890 --> 0:10:38.449 interest at all, or young women for that matter, if 0:10:38.450 --> 0:10:44.440 that's their interest to seriously consider military service. So actually, Ashley, 0:10:44.440 --> 0:10:48.480 you mentioned some of the difficulties military families go through. 0:10:49.040 --> 0:10:51.880 What was the most difficult for you and how did 0:10:51.880 --> 0:10:52.800 you cope with it? 0:10:54.080 --> 0:10:57.880 By far the most difficult thing that we've been through 0:10:57.920 --> 0:11:02.480 was Tim's first deployment. And true to military life, we 0:11:02.679 --> 0:11:06.400 missed our first wedding anniversary together. He deployed the month 0:11:06.400 --> 0:11:11.360 prior and two months into his deployment. I got a 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:14.520 phone call from him. And I knew something was wrong 0:11:14.520 --> 0:11:18.520 right away and learned that earlier that morning he had 0:11:18.520 --> 0:11:23.240 been shot down. And it was the night of power. 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:26.600 And extremists believed that on the night of power, if 0:11:26.600 --> 0:11:29.439 they kill the enemy, then they will be rewarded by 0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:33.040 Allah a thousand fold. And so, just as him and 0:11:33.040 --> 0:11:38.240 his co-pilot were landing, they noticed that there were about 0:11:38.240 --> 0:11:43.860 50 insurgents dressed in stolen US military uniforms breaching the wire. 0:11:44.460 --> 0:11:47.820 And so they lifted back up but weren't able to 0:11:47.860 --> 0:11:51.740 get to a high enough level for safety. And their 0:11:51.940 --> 0:11:55.900 helicopter took 15 rounds. And by the grace of God, 0:11:55.940 --> 0:12:01.700 they survived. But you don't come home from a deployment 0:12:01.700 --> 0:12:07.340 like that without trauma. Well, trauma changes the brain, and 0:12:07.340 --> 0:12:11.980 neither of us were equipped for what reintegration would look 0:12:11.980 --> 0:12:14.660 like after he came home from that deployment. I think 0:12:14.660 --> 0:12:19.300 there is a romanticized idea of what that's going to 0:12:19.300 --> 0:12:24.580 look like. But he lost close friends over there and 0:12:24.580 --> 0:12:31.300 he experienced traumatic events. And shortly after he returned home, 0:12:31.300 --> 0:12:36.420 within just weeks, we moved to a new town. That 0:12:36.420 --> 0:12:39.980 was a huge challenge in our marriage, figuring out how 0:12:40.100 --> 0:12:43.920 to love and serve each other well in the midst 0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:46.440 of trying to process everything that had just happened in 0:12:46.440 --> 0:12:49.040 the last year and being ill equipped to do so. 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:53.360 Yeah. Tim. Tim. What was that like for you? Just 0:12:53.360 --> 0:12:56.400 just a few words from when you went through that 0:12:56.400 --> 0:12:57.760 traumatic experience. 0:12:58.679 --> 0:13:02.520 The scenario that Ashley described, it was one an incredible 0:13:02.520 --> 0:13:06.079 affirmation of my faith. I had never felt that peace 0:13:06.080 --> 0:13:10.240 that surpasses all understanding more than I did in that 0:13:10.240 --> 0:13:14.360 moment when we were fairly convinced that was it would 0:13:14.440 --> 0:13:18.240 be going down in hostile territory. And I just felt 0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:22.479 God's presence and by his grace. And but coming home, 0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:26.760 despite the reintegration training that is given for the service 0:13:26.800 --> 0:13:29.439 member and the spouse and the family, there was an 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:32.760 aspect of pride for me, and maybe arrogance too, of 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:35.439 oh no, I could go through that and I wouldn't 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:38.480 bring any of that home. But it really took Ashley 0:13:38.480 --> 0:13:41.699 sitting me down and saying, no, you. You're different and 0:13:41.700 --> 0:13:44.900 I love you and I just need you to acknowledge that. 0:13:44.900 --> 0:13:49.980 So it was almost the that denial initially that had 0:13:49.980 --> 0:13:54.220 to be gracefully presented by my, my wife, um, to 0:13:54.260 --> 0:13:56.620 overcome that pride and start working through it. 0:13:57.260 --> 0:13:59.140 I don't think those of us who have never been 0:13:59.140 --> 0:14:02.900 through that type of experience can imagine that. But the 0:14:02.900 --> 0:14:07.460 positive thing for Christians, which you've shared, is the presence 0:14:07.460 --> 0:14:11.620 of God in the midst of that of that trauma. Wow. Well, Tim, 0:14:11.620 --> 0:14:14.140 it must have also been difficult for you to have 0:14:14.140 --> 0:14:18.459 to deploy again and again and leave your family, or 0:14:18.820 --> 0:14:21.620 be the reason why they had to move again. Uh, 0:14:21.620 --> 0:14:23.060 what was that like for you? 0:14:23.780 --> 0:14:27.979 You know, I think it was a challenge I didn't 0:14:28.020 --> 0:14:31.740 think about when signing up for the military. And I 0:14:31.740 --> 0:14:34.460 don't know that at 17 years old, I had the 0:14:34.460 --> 0:14:40.680 capacity to comprehend One. Starting a family in the military, 0:14:40.680 --> 0:14:47.680 two having my wife move while deployed, and three raising 0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:51.840 kids in that environment as well. So I not necessarily 0:14:51.840 --> 0:14:56.040 expect a young teenager to think through that, but I 0:14:56.040 --> 0:15:00.600 would encourage anyone at any stage to get involved in 0:15:00.640 --> 0:15:03.080 their church, to get involved in a in a small group, 0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:08.240 in their community, because we lean so heavily on those 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:12.680 around us and really lifted us up. And despite Ashley's strength, 0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:16.640 really held up our our marriage and figurative and literal 0:15:16.640 --> 0:15:17.440 way as well. 0:15:18.400 --> 0:15:21.520 You know, I remember once being at Fort Bragg, uh, 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:27.480 and I was speaking to the spouses and in Afghanistan, 0:15:27.480 --> 0:15:30.400 they had a hookup where the spouses could actually hear 0:15:30.440 --> 0:15:35.120 me at the same time. And then afterwards, later, another 0:15:35.120 --> 0:15:38.100 time I was there. Carolyn and I were there when 0:15:38.620 --> 0:15:43.700 the the troops were coming back and we watched, you know, 0:15:43.740 --> 0:15:46.300 these spouses greeting them for the first time after they 0:15:46.300 --> 0:15:48.860 came back and all and and it brought tears to 0:15:48.860 --> 0:15:51.340 our eyes just just realizing, you know, what? What they 0:15:51.380 --> 0:15:56.100 had gone through. Actually talk to young women who are 0:15:56.260 --> 0:16:00.020 in love and they think things will work out fine, 0:16:00.020 --> 0:16:03.180 and they're going to marry a military spouse, and they 0:16:03.180 --> 0:16:05.780 don't see that as a big deal. What would you 0:16:05.780 --> 0:16:09.900 say to them to perhaps help them prepare for this? 0:16:11.020 --> 0:16:15.020 I would say first that I understand you're so in love, 0:16:15.020 --> 0:16:18.060 and it's hard to see beyond that. But I think 0:16:18.060 --> 0:16:22.220 it's essential to prepare your heart for the mission work 0:16:22.220 --> 0:16:27.140 that you're about to do. So the Lord determines our boundaries. 0:16:27.140 --> 0:16:31.100 It says in acts 1726. And another one of the 0:16:31.380 --> 0:16:34.420 positives about the military is that you get to travel 0:16:34.420 --> 0:16:36.640 all around the country or the world, and God is 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:39.840 sending you out to do this mission work. But we 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:42.960 can't take that lightly, and we really have to prepare 0:16:42.960 --> 0:16:48.320 our hearts in prayer to not fall into a trap 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:52.360 of bitterness and resentment, but to see this as the 0:16:52.360 --> 0:16:55.200 Lord's work and to ask for his guidance. And I 0:16:55.200 --> 0:16:59.240 think it would be imperative for a young woman to 0:17:00.120 --> 0:17:03.200 ask for a mentor. Maybe that's somebody in her church 0:17:03.200 --> 0:17:10.120 or at her fiance's local installation, but find someone who 0:17:10.119 --> 0:17:14.080 has walked this path before you and that loves Jesus 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:17.960 more than anything, and have her hold your hand through 0:17:17.960 --> 0:17:20.840 this and help prepare you. Because I think, as Tim 0:17:20.840 --> 0:17:24.480 has alluded to, community has been essential for us, and 0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:28.560 having those other Christ like brothers and sisters come alongside 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:31.080 us is really important to this process. 0:17:31.440 --> 0:17:34.260 Yeah, I really like the emphasis you have in the 0:17:34.260 --> 0:17:37.660 book of this being a mission. You know, as Christians, 0:17:37.660 --> 0:17:41.820 we're on mission. And I'm thinking in terms of missionaries 0:17:41.820 --> 0:17:44.859 that we send out to other countries and churches, you know, 0:17:44.900 --> 0:17:48.220 will adopt missionaries. They will have people praying for them 0:17:48.220 --> 0:17:51.300 all the time. And really, it would be great if 0:17:51.300 --> 0:17:53.859 we could have that kind of program for any military 0:17:53.859 --> 0:17:57.380 couple that's in a Christian church, that they would have 0:17:57.380 --> 0:18:00.179 couples at home praying for them. You know, like we 0:18:00.180 --> 0:18:03.340 pray for our missionaries. So I really I really like 0:18:03.380 --> 0:18:06.140 that emphasis. And but of course, you're emphasizing also not 0:18:06.140 --> 0:18:10.220 only people at home praying for you, but also involve 0:18:10.220 --> 0:18:14.300 yourself in chapels and churches wherever you go so that 0:18:14.300 --> 0:18:17.900 you're you're walking this journey with other individuals. 0:18:18.420 --> 0:18:21.540 Absolutely. And I, I appreciate you mentioning that. And I 0:18:21.540 --> 0:18:25.220 think if there are any church leaders that are listening 0:18:25.260 --> 0:18:28.300 to this, that I would highly encourage them to pray 0:18:28.300 --> 0:18:32.889 about seeing their those in their congregation that are in 0:18:32.890 --> 0:18:35.409 the military as their missionaries and looking at how they 0:18:35.410 --> 0:18:39.170 could support them through prayer or even financially as as 0:18:39.170 --> 0:18:40.010 you mentioned. 0:18:40.369 --> 0:18:44.649 Yeah. Tim, would it be fair to say you felt 0:18:44.650 --> 0:18:47.970 called to the military? Now, you went in very young, 0:18:47.970 --> 0:18:50.770 but did you have a sense that God was calling 0:18:50.770 --> 0:18:51.930 you into the military? 0:18:52.650 --> 0:18:56.409 So I had a romantic idea about the military. My 0:18:56.490 --> 0:19:00.530 my grandfather was in World War two and commissioned into 0:19:00.530 --> 0:19:03.530 the horse cavalry of all things. And then they mechanized 0:19:03.530 --> 0:19:05.930 things and served in the war and came back. And 0:19:05.970 --> 0:19:07.770 it was a great example to me, but I hadn't 0:19:07.770 --> 0:19:10.770 really seriously considered it until I was looking at where 0:19:10.810 --> 0:19:14.210 to go to school. So West Point to me, after 0:19:14.250 --> 0:19:18.210 looking at all the academies, you get an Ivy League education. 0:19:18.210 --> 0:19:21.450 You you can play army, you can go into the 0:19:21.490 --> 0:19:25.810 you commission into the army. After that had first engineering 0:19:25.810 --> 0:19:28.130 school in America. It was just all of the things 0:19:28.130 --> 0:19:32.350 that that I was attracted to, but I didn't understand 0:19:32.350 --> 0:19:37.910 the long, longer term commitment beyond your initial obligation. And 0:19:38.310 --> 0:19:40.389 we were juniors in high school when nine over 11 happened. 0:19:40.390 --> 0:19:42.869 So there was very much a sense of wanting to 0:19:42.910 --> 0:19:48.670 serve and re-energizing the entire base in America of patriotism 0:19:48.710 --> 0:19:50.910 and and really felt called to that. But even while 0:19:50.910 --> 0:19:52.750 I was in school there, we thought the war would 0:19:52.750 --> 0:19:56.030 be quickly over, much like the first Gulf War. So 0:19:56.230 --> 0:19:58.109 I think it was a little bit of both. I 0:19:58.150 --> 0:20:02.750 think that while I was in school, I really was. 0:20:03.230 --> 0:20:07.190 It affirmed my reason for going and wanting to go 0:20:07.230 --> 0:20:10.390 into the Army and out of the gate. I think 0:20:10.390 --> 0:20:12.470 I was just a little too young to to understand 0:20:12.470 --> 0:20:14.150 the long term commitment. 0:20:14.550 --> 0:20:19.109 Yeah. Ashley, you think it's important that wives of military 0:20:19.109 --> 0:20:23.630 I'm talking about Christians now, uh, have that same sense of, 0:20:23.830 --> 0:20:27.190 you know, being called with with that military person to 0:20:27.230 --> 0:20:28.510 this particular mission. 0:20:29.070 --> 0:20:35.330 I think definitely taking this commitment to God and asking 0:20:35.330 --> 0:20:37.889 him to prepare their hearts and to lead them and 0:20:37.930 --> 0:20:40.970 to guide them. You know, I don't think it's an 0:20:40.970 --> 0:20:45.010 accident when a military, when a woman falls in love 0:20:45.010 --> 0:20:49.170 with a military man and that as you're speaking specifically 0:20:49.170 --> 0:20:53.170 to Christians, I would just ask that or suggest that 0:20:53.170 --> 0:20:56.730 she really pray about this and and search the scriptures 0:20:56.770 --> 0:21:02.730 and see if she feels like she can support her 0:21:02.730 --> 0:21:06.570 husband's service, because you do have to take a back seat. 0:21:06.609 --> 0:21:09.610 A lot of times as a military spouse and you 0:21:09.609 --> 0:21:12.010 don't often get a lot of choice, you're told where 0:21:12.050 --> 0:21:15.250 to go and when to go, and your heart has 0:21:15.250 --> 0:21:21.570 to be primed to to follow. Um, hopefully with loving service. 0:21:22.410 --> 0:21:25.730 Now, we hear a lot today, not only in the military, 0:21:25.770 --> 0:21:31.350 even outside the military of loneliness. But I think being 0:21:31.350 --> 0:21:36.470 in the military and for a spouse and often when 0:21:36.470 --> 0:21:39.150 the when the husband or the other wife, only either 0:21:39.150 --> 0:21:42.110 one is deployed and the other is left at home, 0:21:42.470 --> 0:21:45.110 there has to be a sense of loneliness associated with 0:21:45.109 --> 0:21:47.149 all of this. Speak to that in terms of your 0:21:47.190 --> 0:21:48.270 own experience. 0:21:49.270 --> 0:21:53.190 I think that's one of the biggest hindrances that our 0:21:53.390 --> 0:21:58.350 military spouse community faces is loneliness. And coupled with that 0:21:58.350 --> 0:22:02.990 anxiety and depression and we're we move so often and 0:22:03.430 --> 0:22:05.950 depending on your personality style, it can be really hard 0:22:05.950 --> 0:22:08.590 to get out there and meet new people. It's not 0:22:08.590 --> 0:22:10.350 likely that people are just going to show up at 0:22:10.350 --> 0:22:13.510 your door and invite them into our lives, but that's 0:22:13.510 --> 0:22:16.910 one thing that I have learned is to be that person. 0:22:16.910 --> 0:22:20.109 Even when we've moved after 12 times, it gets a 0:22:20.109 --> 0:22:24.790 little bit exhausting to start relationships again, but you never 0:22:24.790 --> 0:22:26.850 know how long you're going to be there and the 0:22:26.850 --> 0:22:29.490 friends and neighbors around you essentially need to become your 0:22:29.490 --> 0:22:32.689 community for you to thrive. And so we've really learned 0:22:32.690 --> 0:22:35.649 to just show up at all the doors around us 0:22:35.650 --> 0:22:40.490 and jump into the churches and jump into serving and 0:22:40.530 --> 0:22:43.490 find out ways that we can connect on our installations 0:22:43.490 --> 0:22:47.850 has really been an imperative process. And the one thing 0:22:48.170 --> 0:22:51.130 where I believe that God can use loneliness that we 0:22:51.130 --> 0:22:54.890 experience happened for us. An example, when we were at 0:22:54.890 --> 0:22:58.090 Fort Rucker, Alabama, and we went for a short course 0:22:58.090 --> 0:23:00.970 so we weren't there long enough for me to teach, 0:23:00.970 --> 0:23:04.530 which was my profession at the time. And so I 0:23:04.530 --> 0:23:06.930 had to stay home and just felt very lonely. Not 0:23:06.970 --> 0:23:10.850 having friends, not having community, not having family. Our church 0:23:10.850 --> 0:23:12.889 at that time had challenged us to read the Bible 0:23:12.890 --> 0:23:17.689 in 90 days, and without my having any work, I 0:23:17.690 --> 0:23:20.650 was able to accept that challenge. And so I spent 0:23:20.650 --> 0:23:23.690 those 90 days for the first time reading through the 0:23:23.690 --> 0:23:26.910 entire Bible. I didn't always understand what I was reading, 0:23:26.910 --> 0:23:29.710 but with the Holy Spirit's guidance, I was able to 0:23:29.910 --> 0:23:32.990 get through that. And I think God really used that 0:23:32.990 --> 0:23:35.910 time to draw me intimately close to him. And that's 0:23:35.910 --> 0:23:39.109 really where my relationship with him caught fire. And so 0:23:39.109 --> 0:23:43.590 I think there is a benefit to the quiet spaces 0:23:43.590 --> 0:23:46.950 that are sometimes created for us as we move. But 0:23:46.950 --> 0:23:49.550 along with that, I was also involved with our church, 0:23:49.550 --> 0:23:51.909 so it's important to have that community as well. 0:23:52.350 --> 0:23:57.990 Yeah, I think utilizing that time when you are alone 0:23:57.990 --> 0:24:01.310 more than at other times can be very, very profitable. 0:24:06.070 --> 0:24:09.790 This is the building relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman podcast. 0:24:10.030 --> 0:24:13.070 For more simple ways to strengthen your relationships, go to 0:24:13.109 --> 0:24:17.030 five Love Languages. Com our featured resource today is the 0:24:17.030 --> 0:24:21.430 book by Ashley Ashcraft titled Mission Ready Marriage A Christian 0:24:21.430 --> 0:24:24.930 Guide to Discovering Hope and purpose as a military wife. 0:24:25.210 --> 0:24:28.169 Find out more at Five Love languages.com. 0:24:29.890 --> 0:24:32.650 I just want to say a word about Lieutenant Colonel 0:24:32.690 --> 0:24:36.689 Ashcraft because I. I texted my brother, who is a 0:24:36.690 --> 0:24:38.890 West Point grad, and said, hey, I got another West 0:24:38.890 --> 0:24:41.930 Point grad coming on, and he sent me. You guys 0:24:41.970 --> 0:24:44.970 at West Point know each other everything. He knows your 0:24:44.970 --> 0:24:50.050 shoe size. He knows everything that you've done. And also, 0:24:50.090 --> 0:24:53.690 I was interested when you were when you graduated high 0:24:53.690 --> 0:24:58.370 school in Arizona, you were had honors, southern Arizona honors. 0:24:58.369 --> 0:25:02.970 In football, you were a recipient of several awards. You 0:25:02.970 --> 0:25:06.050 excelled in fine arts. So not only can you get 0:25:06.050 --> 0:25:08.730 in a helicopter and go fly it over there, you 0:25:08.730 --> 0:25:12.090 can sing a song and dance across the stage. And 0:25:12.210 --> 0:25:15.290 now I understand why I actually was drawn to you, Tim. 0:25:16.930 --> 0:25:19.410 He was definitely the All-American. 0:25:19.650 --> 0:25:22.359 I'm sure my unit will have fun with that, sir, But. 0:25:23.440 --> 0:25:23.840 I. 0:25:24.000 --> 0:25:27.560 Will say there, there is. I'm so grateful for the 0:25:27.600 --> 0:25:31.399 upbringing that I had. And serving on a worship arts 0:25:31.400 --> 0:25:35.040 team in a chapel in Afghanistan was one of the 0:25:35.040 --> 0:25:38.600 most special experiences I'll have. And doing an Easter sunrise 0:25:38.600 --> 0:25:42.480 service in a in a country that is so beautiful, 0:25:42.640 --> 0:25:45.199 yet has been war torn for so many years. It 0:25:45.200 --> 0:25:49.320 was something else. And the bond that we have with those, 0:25:49.359 --> 0:25:51.640 those folks will never be broken. 0:25:51.840 --> 0:25:55.440 Yeah. Keyboard and drums. Gary. So we can ask Tim 0:25:55.440 --> 0:25:58.359 to do just about anything. But you know what he is? 0:25:58.359 --> 0:26:02.200 He is a cheerleader for Ashley's book because he really 0:26:02.200 --> 0:26:06.280 believes in this. And, uh, one other question, and then 0:26:06.320 --> 0:26:07.960 I'll get it back. Give it back to you, Gary. 0:26:07.960 --> 0:26:11.760 And that is the Distinguished Flying Cross. Not everybody gets that, 0:26:11.920 --> 0:26:16.240 nor the Bronze Star. So when I see this picture 0:26:16.240 --> 0:26:20.660 of you with all of these medals there, what goes 0:26:20.660 --> 0:26:24.940 through your mind, Tim? When when you get to where 0:26:25.100 --> 0:26:27.139 these things that have been given to you. 0:26:27.580 --> 0:26:31.500 Well thank you. It's very humbling. It is humbling to 0:26:31.540 --> 0:26:36.420 think about those who served before and will continue to. 0:26:36.820 --> 0:26:40.179 And I will say there's an immense sense of pride 0:26:40.180 --> 0:26:43.420 in each of those awards and ribbons. Every, every one 0:26:43.420 --> 0:26:46.220 of them has a story, but something that in the 0:26:46.220 --> 0:26:50.340 military edition that Doctor Chapman talks about, there's an illustration 0:26:50.340 --> 0:26:53.020 of a couple where the husband says, I would give 0:26:53.020 --> 0:26:58.139 it all away because his marriage was falling apart. And 0:26:58.140 --> 0:27:00.939 I would say that none of that would ever have 0:27:00.940 --> 0:27:05.619 been possible without Ashley's support. And in that scenario that 0:27:05.619 --> 0:27:09.379 that earned us the crew, the Distinguished Flying Cross. Ashley 0:27:09.380 --> 0:27:13.580 wanted to know every detail and wanted to support me through, 0:27:14.140 --> 0:27:18.920 you know, healing process and and everything else experienced through deployment. Redeployment. 0:27:18.920 --> 0:27:20.600 And I would say I would. I would give it 0:27:20.600 --> 0:27:25.440 all away if I had to. Thankfully, as as Doctor 0:27:25.440 --> 0:27:27.440 Chapman alludes to in his book, you can have a 0:27:27.440 --> 0:27:32.320 successful marriage and career as well, and through faith, I 0:27:32.320 --> 0:27:36.320 believe is key. As an illustration, those metals are held 0:27:36.320 --> 0:27:38.919 on in the back by a little pin. You know, 0:27:38.960 --> 0:27:43.480 if there's anything that's held me through a military career, 0:27:43.520 --> 0:27:48.400 it's it's Ashley. Um, and her, her rock solid faith 0:27:48.400 --> 0:27:52.120 and foundation for our family. And, um, so that's a, 0:27:52.200 --> 0:27:54.840 I guess, a bit of a metaphor, but that's what 0:27:54.840 --> 0:27:55.440 I think of. 0:27:56.119 --> 0:27:57.880 I think we ought to have a little song and 0:27:57.880 --> 0:28:00.280 celebration for you, Ashley. Right now. Okay. 0:28:01.840 --> 0:28:04.439 Hit it. Tim. One. 0:28:04.480 --> 0:28:05.160 Two. Three. 0:28:07.880 --> 0:28:11.080 All right, well, let's change the subject a bit here. Ashley. Uh, 0:28:11.080 --> 0:28:14.040 you polled a lot of military wives, and you saw 0:28:14.080 --> 0:28:17.439 a need in an area that you really hadn't planned 0:28:17.580 --> 0:28:19.860 to address in this book. Talk about that. 0:28:20.740 --> 0:28:23.419 Yes, I was very surprised. I had outlined all the 0:28:23.420 --> 0:28:26.580 chapters in my book and thought I had every subject 0:28:26.580 --> 0:28:29.060 in there that needed to be addressed. But over and over, 0:28:29.060 --> 0:28:32.580 as I talked to military spouses, one of the primary 0:28:32.580 --> 0:28:37.220 concerns was their family of origin and their extended families 0:28:37.260 --> 0:28:42.820 not understanding the depths of the sacrifice and really placing 0:28:42.820 --> 0:28:47.780 a lot of blame and shame on our families. For example, 0:28:47.780 --> 0:28:51.540 it's not easy for us to travel home for Christmas. 0:28:51.580 --> 0:28:53.940 One of the reasons, of course, is financial. You know, 0:28:53.980 --> 0:28:56.459 for my family to get across the country for Christmas 0:28:56.660 --> 0:28:58.780 last year, if we would have gone, it would have 0:28:58.780 --> 0:29:04.020 cost us $5,000. And that's very challenging. And but they 0:29:04.020 --> 0:29:08.020 also don't understand often that some of our husbands are 0:29:08.020 --> 0:29:11.380 on a deployment call where they have to be ready 0:29:11.380 --> 0:29:15.140 to go in two hours, and so we can't plan 0:29:15.140 --> 0:29:19.360 trips to go home. Often when our husbands are unable 0:29:19.360 --> 0:29:24.160 to travel. Just understanding too that sometimes, most of the 0:29:24.160 --> 0:29:27.200 time our vacations are home to our family of origin 0:29:27.200 --> 0:29:30.160 and our extended families. But sometimes we need that time 0:29:30.160 --> 0:29:35.240 to our immediate family ourselves, to create new memories and 0:29:35.240 --> 0:29:39.760 to recoup. Because even if our spouse isn't deployed or 0:29:39.800 --> 0:29:42.880 out training in the field, which feels like most of 0:29:42.880 --> 0:29:47.000 the time their hours are really insane. And so we 0:29:47.040 --> 0:29:49.800 hardly have any time together as a family. And so 0:29:49.800 --> 0:29:52.480 it's also important for us to just have that time 0:29:52.480 --> 0:29:56.880 with our immediate family and for our extended families to 0:29:56.920 --> 0:29:59.840 understand that that's not anything against them. We just need 0:29:59.840 --> 0:30:04.640 to cultivate our family bond as well. And so there's 0:30:04.640 --> 0:30:07.640 a whole list of ways that we can help communicate 0:30:07.640 --> 0:30:12.880 with our families back home, to help them understand ways 0:30:12.880 --> 0:30:15.980 that they can support us. And as Tim has mentioned, 0:30:16.020 --> 0:30:18.980 our families have. We've been very blessed to our families 0:30:18.980 --> 0:30:21.740 have showed up every time that we have moved. They 0:30:21.780 --> 0:30:24.060 have helped watch our kids, helped load the truck, have 0:30:24.100 --> 0:30:28.380 helped pack the dishes. They welcome us home and create 0:30:28.860 --> 0:30:32.660 beautiful environments for us to be home and create fun memories. 0:30:32.660 --> 0:30:37.740 And and they really do understand that when we can't 0:30:37.740 --> 0:30:39.140 come home, it's not personal. 0:30:39.660 --> 0:30:43.180 Yeah. Yeah. You're alluded to this, but talk about the 0:30:43.180 --> 0:30:47.420 financial struggles of military couples. Why do so many have 0:30:47.420 --> 0:30:50.980 difficulty in this area and what can be done to help? 0:30:51.940 --> 0:30:53.060 I think we could say. 0:30:53.100 --> 0:30:58.340 That generally across the board, people are struggling, not in education. 0:30:58.340 --> 0:31:01.940 That unfortunately is being passed down in families or in school. 0:31:02.340 --> 0:31:06.540 And but in the military specifically, it's a huge challenge. 0:31:06.580 --> 0:31:09.820 And if you look at the statistics, it's near 8,090% 0:31:09.820 --> 0:31:14.160 of us are in debt and at a very high number. 0:31:14.360 --> 0:31:18.240 And so thankfully, one of the things that our family 0:31:18.240 --> 0:31:22.320 has been blessed by is Financial Peace University by Dave Ramsey. 0:31:22.520 --> 0:31:27.600 And they actually offer their Financial Peace University course for 0:31:27.600 --> 0:31:31.400 free for active duty members. And so that's Tim and 0:31:31.400 --> 0:31:33.480 I did that when we were engaged, and we followed 0:31:33.520 --> 0:31:36.000 their program our entire marriage. And it has been a 0:31:36.000 --> 0:31:37.480 huge blessing to our family. 0:31:38.040 --> 0:31:41.400 Yeah. Yeah. I hope that many military couples who don't 0:31:41.400 --> 0:31:44.280 know about that will search that out, because that's certainly 0:31:44.280 --> 0:31:48.480 good training. Well, let's talk about military kids. What have 0:31:48.480 --> 0:31:51.200 you learned about helping kids? Going through a lot of 0:31:51.200 --> 0:31:52.800 transitions in life? 0:31:53.520 --> 0:31:56.600 Our kids, when we moved to this house, had lived 0:31:56.600 --> 0:31:58.760 in as many houses as they were old. So our 0:31:58.760 --> 0:32:01.000 eight year old had just moved into her eighth house. 0:32:01.000 --> 0:32:02.840 Our six year old moved into his sixth house, and 0:32:02.840 --> 0:32:04.600 our four year old at that time had moved into 0:32:04.600 --> 0:32:09.160 her fourth house. And so transition is all they know. 0:32:09.200 --> 0:32:14.110 Saying goodbye to their friends, meeting new friends, leaving their homes, 0:32:14.110 --> 0:32:18.550 finding new homes. And it's just been a challenge. So 0:32:18.550 --> 0:32:20.230 one of our kids I talk about in the book 0:32:20.230 --> 0:32:23.190 has been diagnosed with a transition disorder, and that is 0:32:23.190 --> 0:32:26.550 common in our community. Um, a lot of it comes 0:32:26.550 --> 0:32:30.550 with anxiety and depression, but we also try and create 0:32:30.550 --> 0:32:33.350 a lot of fun with it too. When we move, 0:32:33.390 --> 0:32:37.270 we try and find fun places along the route. When 0:32:37.510 --> 0:32:40.510 dad is deployed or in training, the little ones that 0:32:40.510 --> 0:32:42.950 still think it's fun to sleep in bed with mom. 0:32:42.950 --> 0:32:45.070 They can hop in bed and sleep with me, or 0:32:45.310 --> 0:32:48.190 we make silly dinners like waffles and pancakes that I 0:32:48.190 --> 0:32:51.350 wouldn't make for dinner when Tim is home. And so 0:32:51.830 --> 0:32:56.990 we've tried to create fun experiences amidst the challenges. But also, 0:32:57.030 --> 0:32:59.870 I think the most imperative part for our military kids 0:32:59.870 --> 0:33:02.550 is to know that they too, are on mission, that 0:33:02.550 --> 0:33:06.510 they are never too young to love others, to serve others, 0:33:06.510 --> 0:33:10.650 to share the gospel message. And that can be very 0:33:10.650 --> 0:33:13.090 practical things we try and get our kids involved in. 0:33:13.130 --> 0:33:16.610 For example, if we have a neighbour who is deployed, 0:33:16.650 --> 0:33:19.250 then our kids can help bring the trash up, or 0:33:19.530 --> 0:33:22.690 they can help us babysit their kids so that the 0:33:22.690 --> 0:33:25.290 mom can get a break. Or when we have new 0:33:25.290 --> 0:33:29.090 neighbors move in, we can invite them over for s'mores 0:33:29.130 --> 0:33:31.810 in the backyard, or bring some flowers. And just real 0:33:31.810 --> 0:33:34.930 practical ways to teach our kids that the Lord has 0:33:34.930 --> 0:33:39.530 placed them at each military installation on purpose, um, for 0:33:39.530 --> 0:33:40.770 them to serve and love. 0:33:41.490 --> 0:33:44.010 I think that whole theme of service, which is at 0:33:44.010 --> 0:33:47.290 the heart of what the Christian lifestyle is all about, 0:33:47.730 --> 0:33:53.530 if if non-military couples can teach their children to thank 0:33:53.530 --> 0:33:57.610 military couples, you know, and for what they're doing. I 0:33:57.610 --> 0:34:00.890 was just walking through an airport some time ago and 0:34:00.890 --> 0:34:04.490 there were about five, I think 5 or 6 military 0:34:04.490 --> 0:34:08.130 people there dressed in military garb. And this family was 0:34:08.130 --> 0:34:10.950 walking by. And this young boy, I'm guessing he was 0:34:10.950 --> 0:34:14.790 six years old. He looked up to these military people 0:34:14.790 --> 0:34:20.670 and he said, thank you for protecting us. And I thought, man, 0:34:20.790 --> 0:34:23.950 those parents are doing a great job at that age 0:34:23.950 --> 0:34:26.550 that he has that concept. You know, that they're there 0:34:26.550 --> 0:34:29.750 serving us. So yeah. So whether you're in the military 0:34:29.750 --> 0:34:32.390 or out of military, if you're a Christian, service is 0:34:32.430 --> 0:34:36.589 a theme of our lifestyle. Now, Tim and Ashley, with 0:34:36.590 --> 0:34:41.750 your fourth child, you got some surprising news. Tell us 0:34:41.750 --> 0:34:42.549 what happened. 0:34:43.270 --> 0:34:46.190 When we had our fourth baby, Tim wanted to have 0:34:46.230 --> 0:34:49.350 a gender reveal party because those weren't popular when we 0:34:49.350 --> 0:34:51.589 had our first three kids. So he wanted to shoot 0:34:51.590 --> 0:34:54.109 off some confetti and find out what the gender of 0:34:54.110 --> 0:34:58.270 our baby was. And at our OB that we were at, 0:34:58.310 --> 0:35:00.510 they said the way they did that was through blood work. 0:35:00.830 --> 0:35:03.750 And so when I received a phone call from my 0:35:03.790 --> 0:35:07.649 OB office, I simply anticipated them saying that I would 0:35:07.650 --> 0:35:10.009 be picking up a card at the front office, that 0:35:10.010 --> 0:35:14.250 it was available with the gender. But the lady informed 0:35:14.250 --> 0:35:16.850 me that, in fact, my blood work showed that there 0:35:16.850 --> 0:35:19.610 was a nine out of ten chance that our baby 0:35:19.610 --> 0:35:23.930 would have down syndrome, and unfortunately, there was no support 0:35:23.930 --> 0:35:28.450 offered on that phone call. And I was completely ignorant 0:35:28.450 --> 0:35:32.530 about down syndrome. So I was an absolute wreck with 0:35:32.530 --> 0:35:35.569 that news. Uh, called Tim right away at work. He 0:35:35.570 --> 0:35:39.810 rushed home to comfort me and explained to me the 0:35:39.810 --> 0:35:41.609 truth that I knew in my heart, but that my 0:35:41.610 --> 0:35:44.330 head just couldn't wrap itself around, was that the Lord 0:35:44.330 --> 0:35:46.890 would be blessing us with this child, and he would 0:35:46.890 --> 0:35:51.690 use this baby for for his kingdom purposes. And while 0:35:51.690 --> 0:35:53.730 I was in the middle of writing this book, she 0:35:53.730 --> 0:35:57.450 was born nine weeks early with two holes in her heart, 0:35:57.730 --> 0:36:02.250 weighing just £2 and 12oz. And we lived in the 0:36:02.250 --> 0:36:05.950 Ronald McDonald House for three months while she was in 0:36:05.950 --> 0:36:10.350 the hospital. It was a complete surprise to us. Um, 0:36:10.350 --> 0:36:13.230 nothing we would have planned for, but it has been 0:36:13.469 --> 0:36:16.470 the biggest blessing in our life and brought the most 0:36:16.469 --> 0:36:20.509 joy to our family. Amidst the challenges, um, God knows 0:36:20.510 --> 0:36:22.710 what he's doing for our families. You know, when he 0:36:22.750 --> 0:36:23.989 sends these surprises. 0:36:24.790 --> 0:36:26.190 How old is she now? 0:36:26.750 --> 0:36:28.550 She is 21 months now. 0:36:29.310 --> 0:36:35.069 Oh, Tim, what was your, uh, thoughts and feelings and 0:36:35.070 --> 0:36:36.590 emotions during that time? 0:36:37.430 --> 0:36:39.990 You know, I think as we talked about earlier, God's 0:36:39.989 --> 0:36:44.390 presence is always there and shows up when you need 0:36:44.390 --> 0:36:47.589 it most. And I was in the busiest job I've 0:36:47.590 --> 0:36:50.950 ever had when Ashley texted me and said, I need 0:36:50.950 --> 0:36:53.109 you to call me right away. And that was always 0:36:53.150 --> 0:36:55.430 you can tell right when you need to stop what 0:36:55.430 --> 0:36:58.350 you're doing, regardless of how important you think it is. 0:36:58.950 --> 0:37:01.549 And I called her and she was, um, I guess 0:37:01.590 --> 0:37:05.610 hysterical in the sense of the word I was concerned 0:37:05.610 --> 0:37:09.330 that she had lost the baby, and when she told 0:37:09.330 --> 0:37:12.930 me it was a diagnosis for down syndrome. It was 0:37:12.930 --> 0:37:17.650 almost a sense of relief because what came out was, 0:37:17.650 --> 0:37:21.730 it'll be okay. And I don't know that I, without 0:37:21.730 --> 0:37:26.410 God's presence, would have been able to say that otherwise. Um, 0:37:27.410 --> 0:37:32.130 the weight of carrying a child and going through delivery, 0:37:32.410 --> 0:37:37.450 I believe, is so much more on the mother. But when, 0:37:38.050 --> 0:37:41.130 as the husband and the father, the other kids, you 0:37:41.130 --> 0:37:46.370 realize that your wife is in such a vulnerable state 0:37:46.370 --> 0:37:51.850 with a child with special needs, it really awakens you. 0:37:52.090 --> 0:37:53.850 And I will say that it was God's way of 0:37:53.850 --> 0:38:00.049 really shaking me and reprioritizing what's important. So God had 0:38:00.090 --> 0:38:02.489 a at a different way of using that towards me, 0:38:02.550 --> 0:38:06.149 But I will emphasize what Ashley said, that it has 0:38:06.190 --> 0:38:10.870 been a blessing that we could never have imagined, despite 0:38:11.070 --> 0:38:12.030 its challenges. 0:38:12.430 --> 0:38:16.469 Yeah, I think any parent who's listening who has a 0:38:16.469 --> 0:38:20.350 special needs child, can certainly identify with everything that both 0:38:20.350 --> 0:38:24.590 of you are saying. Ashley, in every chapter in your book, 0:38:24.910 --> 0:38:30.670 you end with a section called Modeling Jesus. Why do 0:38:30.670 --> 0:38:34.589 you think that's an essential ingredient for a successful marriage? 0:38:34.989 --> 0:38:36.790 And how have you seen that play out in your 0:38:36.790 --> 0:38:37.589 own marriage? 0:38:39.230 --> 0:38:43.989 I think it is the most essential thing for us 0:38:43.989 --> 0:38:47.310 to do is to model Jesus in our marriages. And 0:38:47.350 --> 0:38:49.629 far beyond that, you know, in our communities and our 0:38:49.630 --> 0:38:53.989 parenting everything. But where that I really learned that lesson 0:38:54.830 --> 0:38:57.790 came when we were stationed in Fort Leavenworth, Kansas. And 0:38:57.790 --> 0:39:01.490 it had been a decade of me just feeling bitterness 0:39:01.489 --> 0:39:05.250 and resentful for all the sacrifices that I had had 0:39:05.250 --> 0:39:07.650 to make at a as a military spouse. And I 0:39:07.690 --> 0:39:10.890 just reached a point where I was tired of myself 0:39:10.890 --> 0:39:14.009 and I didn't want to feel that way anymore. And 0:39:14.130 --> 0:39:18.690 so I decided lent was approaching, and I decided to 0:39:18.730 --> 0:39:22.770 fast from being a bitter wife for 40 days. And 0:39:22.770 --> 0:39:27.969 in that place I decided to create 40 challenges. So 0:39:27.969 --> 0:39:32.290 for 40 days I loved him extravagantly and selflessly, even 0:39:32.290 --> 0:39:36.370 if I didn't feel like it. Um, just to really 0:39:36.370 --> 0:39:40.370 try and model Jesus. And we both agree that those 0:39:40.370 --> 0:39:43.330 40 days were the best 40 days that we've had 0:39:43.370 --> 0:39:46.529 in 15 years of marriage, and Tim didn't want it 0:39:46.530 --> 0:39:48.930 to end when it was over. So he in turn 0:39:48.930 --> 0:39:53.050 created a 40 day challenge for me. And that's where 0:39:53.090 --> 0:39:57.609 I think we both really learned practically kind of boots 0:39:57.610 --> 0:40:00.040 on the ground. What does it look like to model 0:40:00.040 --> 0:40:02.600 Jesus in your marriage? And then we saw the benefits 0:40:02.600 --> 0:40:03.200 of that. 0:40:04.520 --> 0:40:08.160 Yeah. If a husband and a wife can both have 0:40:08.160 --> 0:40:11.560 the attitude of Christ, who said I didn't come to 0:40:11.640 --> 0:40:15.640 be served? I came to serve. Are they going to 0:40:15.640 --> 0:40:18.319 be on a road to a healthy marriage, whether you're 0:40:18.320 --> 0:40:22.879 in the military or out of the military? Absolutely. Well, 0:40:22.880 --> 0:40:26.480 talk to the couple going through some very real and 0:40:26.480 --> 0:40:31.920 difficult times in their military marriage. Uh, what advice would 0:40:31.960 --> 0:40:34.200 either of you, uh, give to them? 0:40:34.960 --> 0:40:38.120 I would first say, I see you. You know, we've 0:40:38.120 --> 0:40:42.800 been through multiple deployments. We have lost all of our 0:40:42.800 --> 0:40:49.320 belongings in a housing situation. We have lost babies and 0:40:50.040 --> 0:40:56.480 trying to create a marriage and sustain a marriage. Cultivate 0:40:56.520 --> 0:41:00.060 a marriage amidst that is very challenging, and I would 0:41:00.060 --> 0:41:05.740 say that you can't do it alone. So if both parties, um, 0:41:05.780 --> 0:41:11.500 will just invest into Christ, into the church, I think 0:41:11.500 --> 0:41:14.900 that that's really imperative to help you through that. For us, 0:41:14.900 --> 0:41:19.020 counseling has been a significant part of our healing journey 0:41:19.340 --> 0:41:23.779 and finding a biblically and clinically informed therapist to help 0:41:23.780 --> 0:41:28.020 you process everything and continue to grow together. And I 0:41:28.020 --> 0:41:32.180 also think being around other brothers and sisters in Christ 0:41:32.180 --> 0:41:35.820 as a couple together is really important. Um, having people 0:41:35.820 --> 0:41:38.980 over for your from church together or being a part 0:41:38.980 --> 0:41:41.779 of a Bible study together so you can see what 0:41:41.780 --> 0:41:45.020 it looks like when other men and women who love 0:41:45.020 --> 0:41:47.300 Jesus are trying to love their spouses. 0:41:47.780 --> 0:41:50.060 Yeah. Jim, would you add anything to that? 0:41:50.380 --> 0:41:54.620 I would, I, I would say that in the hardest 0:41:54.620 --> 0:41:58.319 of times, one of your chapters really was striking for 0:41:58.320 --> 0:42:01.680 me in Five Love Languages, and I think it Ashley's 0:42:01.680 --> 0:42:04.200 book is almost a book on that chapter, and it's 0:42:04.200 --> 0:42:09.640 love is a choice and modeling Jesus. Jesus chose to 0:42:09.680 --> 0:42:13.920 love people that did not love him back. And Ashley's 0:42:13.920 --> 0:42:20.239 book takes that concept into practical application for couples that 0:42:20.239 --> 0:42:23.319 are in a really hard place where the easy choice 0:42:23.360 --> 0:42:27.520 is to give up, and the cadet prayer says choose 0:42:27.520 --> 0:42:30.600 the harder right over, the easier wrong, I think. Which 0:42:30.600 --> 0:42:35.279 segues into another theme of loving the unlovely. Ashley has 0:42:35.280 --> 0:42:38.919 had to love the unlovely more times than I can remember, 0:42:38.920 --> 0:42:42.000 and fortunately for me, I. Ashley's lovely, so I've never 0:42:42.000 --> 0:42:47.480 had to reciprocate. And I mean that sincerely. But through 0:42:47.480 --> 0:42:50.640 this military life and just through marriage, any couple going 0:42:50.640 --> 0:42:55.980 through a battlefield, right. Choosing to love the unlovely and 0:42:56.300 --> 0:42:59.739 making that choice to love with grace and mercy like 0:42:59.739 --> 0:43:00.500 Jesus did. 0:43:00.980 --> 0:43:05.460 Yeah, well, actually, writing was always a dream of yours. 0:43:05.500 --> 0:43:08.580 And I assume that with your children and all the 0:43:08.580 --> 0:43:11.380 kind of things we've been talking about that you've gone through, 0:43:12.300 --> 0:43:14.299 you must have had to put that idea on the 0:43:14.300 --> 0:43:17.700 shelf for a while. Uh, talk to those people who 0:43:17.700 --> 0:43:20.020 maybe have a dream. It may not be writing, but 0:43:20.020 --> 0:43:22.420 they have a dream, but they can't see a way 0:43:22.420 --> 0:43:25.500 to achieve it. What would you say to them? 0:43:26.460 --> 0:43:29.660 I love how God puts dreams in our hearts. Even 0:43:29.660 --> 0:43:32.140 from childhood, I'd always wanted to write ever since I 0:43:32.140 --> 0:43:35.379 was a little girl, and I think just being in 0:43:35.380 --> 0:43:38.500 constant prayer with God about that dream and asking him 0:43:38.500 --> 0:43:42.380 to open and close the doors to make that dream happen, 0:43:42.380 --> 0:43:47.500 if that's his will. Also, there's been seasons where I definitely, 0:43:47.540 --> 0:43:50.460 you know, with three kids under five, earlier on in 0:43:50.460 --> 0:43:52.620 our marriage, there was no way I could write a book. 0:43:52.620 --> 0:43:55.880 But there were simple ways I could cultivate the craft 0:43:55.880 --> 0:43:58.920 by writing a blog while the kids were napping, or 0:43:59.160 --> 0:44:02.520 taking a course online while they were sleeping at night. 0:44:02.880 --> 0:44:06.840 Just little things that that you can, um, continue to 0:44:07.160 --> 0:44:10.120 learn in whatever that dream is that you're trying to achieve. 0:44:10.400 --> 0:44:13.920 And then I would also say to connect with others 0:44:13.920 --> 0:44:18.279 in the area that are pursuing that same dream that 0:44:18.280 --> 0:44:20.799 you want to achieve, whether that's, you know, if you 0:44:20.800 --> 0:44:23.919 really want to excel as a homeschool mom, connecting with 0:44:23.920 --> 0:44:28.320 other moms who love Jesus that are homeschooling and, um, 0:44:28.320 --> 0:44:30.799 just whatever that craft is, I would say just, yeah, 0:44:30.840 --> 0:44:33.800 be in prayer, cultivate it in the moments when you can, 0:44:34.000 --> 0:44:36.239 and then just leave it up to God for him 0:44:36.239 --> 0:44:40.000 to create the opportunities, um, if that's his will for you. 0:44:40.920 --> 0:44:42.799 Well, lastly, as we come toward the end of our 0:44:42.800 --> 0:44:48.120 time together today, we haven't talked a lot about PTSD. Uh, 0:44:48.120 --> 0:44:51.440 can you address the stress on a family and the 0:44:51.440 --> 0:44:53.780 returning soldier. Who's going through that? 0:44:54.500 --> 0:44:58.620 Yeah, absolutely. And I'd love to hear Tim's perspective on this, too. 0:44:58.660 --> 0:45:02.899 But PTSD is something that we are so intimately familiar 0:45:02.900 --> 0:45:06.140 with in our community. One of my best friends lost 0:45:06.140 --> 0:45:10.420 her husband to suicide because of PTSD, and it's something 0:45:10.420 --> 0:45:16.340 that we need to keep at the forefront of our conversations. Um, 0:45:16.340 --> 0:45:19.300 we need to know the signs and symptoms of PTSD, 0:45:19.340 --> 0:45:21.860 and it doesn't just happen on deployments. It can happen 0:45:21.860 --> 0:45:24.859 in trainings. It can happen in daily operations in our 0:45:24.860 --> 0:45:28.660 military community as well. So the book has a full 0:45:28.660 --> 0:45:31.380 list of things that you need to be aware of 0:45:31.420 --> 0:45:35.540 as a military spouse. Um, and also just to we 0:45:35.540 --> 0:45:38.739 need to be keeping the dialogue open with our husbands, um, 0:45:38.739 --> 0:45:43.580 checking in on them. Uh, sometimes they won't share with us. So, um, 0:45:44.020 --> 0:45:47.940 being in prayer also that God would lead them to 0:45:47.980 --> 0:45:51.759 open up and to share with whether that's their chaplain 0:45:51.760 --> 0:45:56.840 or somebody in their chain of command or ourselves. But, um, 0:45:56.880 --> 0:46:00.399 this is something that is definitely a challenge in our community. 0:46:00.960 --> 0:46:02.880 Yeah. Tim, what would you say to that? 0:46:04.080 --> 0:46:08.200 I would point back to something we discussed earlier of 0:46:08.239 --> 0:46:13.719 of really leaning into as a spouse, leaning into your spouse, 0:46:13.880 --> 0:46:18.920 of asking questions. And, and I understand, you know, sometimes 0:46:18.920 --> 0:46:22.520 we can't talk about the scenario or we don't want to. 0:46:22.920 --> 0:46:26.080 But for me, it has been especially healing to be 0:46:26.120 --> 0:46:31.520 able to be completely transparent with Ashley on whatever it 0:46:31.520 --> 0:46:34.520 is I've been through. You know, we can't have those 0:46:34.520 --> 0:46:37.240 same level of conversations with our kids, but our kids 0:46:37.239 --> 0:46:40.719 also know why I don't particularly care for a house 0:46:40.719 --> 0:46:44.799 full of balloons during a party. And, uh, they get it. 0:46:44.800 --> 0:46:48.720 They understand that. And that's been a nice way. Ashley's, uh. 0:46:48.910 --> 0:46:52.870 gently been able to to love me and and support 0:46:52.870 --> 0:46:56.750 me as an anecdote. But there is an abundance of 0:46:56.750 --> 0:47:00.549 resources out there. I think we're at a transition to 0:47:00.590 --> 0:47:04.350 where it's was stigmatized, and it has it is not 0:47:04.350 --> 0:47:09.230 as stigmatized. And and I would take advantage of every resource, um, 0:47:09.230 --> 0:47:12.470 both the service member, the spouse. And again, it doesn't 0:47:12.469 --> 0:47:15.830 have to be a military service member or family going 0:47:15.830 --> 0:47:19.990 through PTSD. And to what Ashley said earlier, you know, 0:47:20.030 --> 0:47:24.589 biblically based counseling is is key and essential. It may 0:47:24.590 --> 0:47:27.629 not be perfect and it may not solve everything you're 0:47:27.630 --> 0:47:30.830 going through, but it it gets things out there in 0:47:30.830 --> 0:47:34.230 a in a neutral playing field and really helps you 0:47:34.230 --> 0:47:37.630 start to unpack it and understand it a bit better. 0:47:37.989 --> 0:47:42.069 And again, just that choice to love that's that's part 0:47:42.070 --> 0:47:43.310 of it is doing the hard work. 0:47:43.590 --> 0:47:46.270 Yeah. Well, Tim and Ashley, I want to thank you 0:47:46.270 --> 0:47:49.370 for being with us today on the program and Ashley 0:47:49.370 --> 0:47:51.730 for writing this book. And I just want to say 0:47:51.730 --> 0:47:54.810 to our listeners, this is not just a book to 0:47:54.850 --> 0:47:59.130 be read by military wives or military couples. I wish 0:47:59.969 --> 0:48:03.810 civilian couples could read this book, because it will give 0:48:03.810 --> 0:48:08.410 you a picture of a lifestyle that you're not familiar with, 0:48:08.610 --> 0:48:10.930 and it will also help you be more effective in 0:48:10.930 --> 0:48:14.130 praying for and encouraging military couples that you may know. 0:48:14.489 --> 0:48:17.090 So thanks again for being with us and looking forward 0:48:17.090 --> 0:48:18.850 to how God is going to use this book to 0:48:18.890 --> 0:48:19.650 help others. 0:48:20.050 --> 0:48:22.290 Thank you so much for this opportunity. It's been an 0:48:22.290 --> 0:48:23.170 absolute pleasure. 0:48:24.010 --> 0:48:26.850 Thank you, Doctor Chapman. If I could just say it 0:48:26.850 --> 0:48:30.529 is surreal for us to be talking with someone who 0:48:30.530 --> 0:48:34.690 has changed the lexicon in our society. When we talk about, hey, 0:48:34.690 --> 0:48:37.649 you're not talking my love language, whether it's at home 0:48:37.650 --> 0:48:40.650 or work, it is just an absolute honor. 0:48:41.250 --> 0:48:42.130 Well thank you. 0:48:42.690 --> 0:48:46.310 The title of that book is Mission Ready Marriage A 0:48:46.310 --> 0:48:49.910 Christian Guide to Discovering Hope and purpose as a military wife. 0:48:49.910 --> 0:48:53.029 But I agree with Gary. Everybody get a copy. Read it. 0:48:53.270 --> 0:48:56.350 It's by Ashley Ashcraft. She and her husband, Tim have 0:48:56.350 --> 0:48:58.989 been our guests today. You can find out more at 0:48:58.989 --> 0:49:03.430 Building Relationships, Building Relationships. 0:49:05.110 --> 0:49:08.430 And next week we open the lines for your questions 0:49:08.430 --> 0:49:09.430 and comments. 0:49:09.750 --> 0:49:11.549 Well that's right. And you can leave a message for 0:49:11.550 --> 0:49:16.950 Doctor Chapman now at 1866424. Gary again call with any 0:49:16.950 --> 0:49:24.950 relationship question. You have 1-866-424-4279. Our thanks to Janice backing 0:49:24.950 --> 0:49:27.870 and Steve Wick for their work behind the scenes. Building 0:49:27.870 --> 0:49:31.029 relationships with Doctor Gary Chapman is a production of Moody 0:49:31.030 --> 0:49:35.190 Radio in association with Moody Publishers, a ministry of Moody 0:49:35.190 --> 0:49:37.390 Bible Institute. Thanks for listening.