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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Howard Jarvis Radio Show. I'm Susan Shelley

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Speaker 1: with the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association, the group that is

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Speaker 1: fighting for you in the legislature, in the courts, on

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Speaker 1: the ballot, and right here on KSFO and KABC. And

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Speaker 1: if you're ever not near a radio or you want

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Speaker 1: to text your friends, also on KSFO dot com and

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Speaker 1: KABC dot com. You can give us a call tonight

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Speaker 1: at one eight hundred two two two five two two

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Speaker 1: two eight hundred two two two five two two two.

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Speaker 1: And if you're not already a member of the Howard

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Speaker 1: Jarvis Taxpayers Association, why not come on along. Go to

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Speaker 1: HJTA dot org, click that button that says join and

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Speaker 1: be a member and strengthen your voice and the voice

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Speaker 1: of common sense in California, because we're fighting for the taxpayers,

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Speaker 1: the people who pay all the bills. Taxpayers are not

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Speaker 1: a special interest, They are the California that we all

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Speaker 1: are fighting for. Eight hundred in two two two five

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Speaker 1: to two two And I'm so pleased to be joined

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Speaker 1: tonight by h j t A President John Coupol Hi John.

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Speaker 2: Gosh from Megora. Happy St.

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Speaker 1: Patti's Day, Yeah, good luck to all of us.

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Speaker 2: Good question of the day is are you wearing green?

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Speaker 2: I've still got my green shirt on, so I'm compliant.

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Speaker 1: So nobody I'm I'm audio only, so I'm wearing green.

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Speaker 1: Prove me wrong.

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Speaker 2: It could be I bet you bar you look. You

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Speaker 2: look kind of irish, So.

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Speaker 1: Well, there you go. So we are in the middle

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Speaker 1: of a really exciting campaign to protect Prop thirteen because

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Speaker 1: the courts have been erasing your constitutional taxpayer protections and

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Speaker 1: we take exception to that at the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers

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Speaker 1: Association because frankly, we're the ones that put them in there,

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Speaker 1: so we we object to people taking them out with

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Speaker 1: asking the voters first, and some of some of the

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Speaker 1: questions that we have frequently are about what exactly is

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Speaker 1: this initiative? What does it do? And in order to

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Speaker 1: explain that, why don't we start with what is Prop

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Speaker 1: thirteen and why are its protections so important?

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Speaker 2: Well, first of all, Proposition thirteen came out of the

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Speaker 2: modern tax revolt movement in the nineteen seventies. Howard Jarvis,

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Speaker 2: for whom our organization is named, was very upset about

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Speaker 2: what he was seeing in southern California with people literally

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Speaker 2: being taxed out of their homes, and people were being

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Speaker 2: taxed out of their homes. And Howard Jarvis tried three

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Speaker 2: times to propose a constitutional amendment to rein in out

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Speaker 2: of control property taxes, and he lost several times. But

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Speaker 2: in June of nineteen seventy eight, that was when all

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Speaker 2: the stars came into alignment, or should I say, that's

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Speaker 2: when the tax bills went out and people understood what

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Speaker 2: their tax bills would be for the next year. And

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Speaker 2: that was really a tax revolt. And although every single

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Speaker 2: special interest, every labor group, most business groups, all the

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Speaker 2: education groups, all the editorial boards were against Proposition thirteen,

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Speaker 2: it was on the ballot and it passed by almost

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Speaker 2: a two thirds margin, sixty five percent. So what did

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Speaker 2: it do? It did two things. Number One, it took

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Speaker 2: an average property tax rate in the state of California

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Speaker 2: of two point six percent. That was the average property

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Speaker 2: tax rate that somebody paid prior to nineteen seventy eight.

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Speaker 2: That is the rate of tax applied every year to

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Speaker 2: the property that you held. And not only that, but

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Speaker 2: the taxable value, the value against against which that rate

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Speaker 2: was applied was going up every year. Property values are

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Speaker 2: going way way up. So homeowners were being hit with

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Speaker 2: a double whammy. They were being hit by high tax

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Speaker 2: rates and also escalating property values. Proposition thirteen came in

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Speaker 2: and said, look, instead of an average property tax rate

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Speaker 2: of two point six percent, we're going to cut the

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Speaker 2: tax rate down to one percent. And that's what the

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Speaker 2: tax rate is today. That aspect of Prop. Thirteen has

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Speaker 2: been with us for more than forty years. People like it.

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Speaker 2: They liked that one percent tax rate, but they also

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Speaker 2: like the other thing that Proposition thirteen did, which was

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Speaker 2: to limit the annual increases in taxable value. So instead

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Speaker 2: of your taxable value doubling in a couple of years

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Speaker 2: based on what the market value was, and because people,

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Speaker 2: you know, your home isn't an income producing asset, it's

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Speaker 2: what you live in, their increase in value was doubling

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Speaker 2: their property taxes. So we said, look, let's limit the

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Speaker 2: rate at which your taxable value can raise to two

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Speaker 2: percent a year. So what Prop thirteen did is it said, look,

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Speaker 2: we're going to value your property at what you've paid

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Speaker 2: for it, but going forward, your taxable value can only

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Speaker 2: go up two percent per year. So even if your

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Speaker 2: property values doubled in a single year, your property tax

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Speaker 2: bill could only go up two percent. And it has

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Speaker 2: been that aspect of Proposition thirteen that has given people

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Speaker 2: so much comfort, so much assurance against runaway property taxes.

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Speaker 2: Because people can now plan for the future. They will

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Speaker 2: know what their bill will be next year, They'll know

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Speaker 2: what it's going to be in ten years based on

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Speaker 2: that core tax right now, I hasten to add that

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Speaker 2: because of some loopholes, there are a lot of what

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Speaker 2: we call below the line items. You'll see various property fees,

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Speaker 2: reclamation fees, you'll see some bonds, bonded indebtedness is also

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Speaker 2: including your property tax bill. So what we suggest to people,

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Speaker 2: if you want to see how Proposition thirteen has helped you,

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Speaker 2: take out your property tax bill and compare it to

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Speaker 2: last year, and your core property tax bill should only

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Speaker 2: go up two percent a year. And there will probably

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Speaker 2: be some add ons. But we also have a very

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Speaker 2: helpful device for you to fully appreciate what Prop. Thirteen

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Speaker 2: means to you. And we have something I believe it's

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Speaker 2: called the Guessing Game Susan that's on our website.

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Speaker 1: It's a guessinggame dot org. You can go directly to

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Speaker 1: at at guessing game dot org.

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Speaker 2: And what you is. You can go to that, go

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Speaker 2: to our website, plug in what you think your property

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Speaker 2: is worth, and it will tell you how much you

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Speaker 2: have saved because of Proposition thirteen. And everybody who does

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Speaker 2: that is stunned at how much they're saving because of

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Speaker 2: Proposition thirteen. And again, if we didn't have Proposition thirteen,

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Speaker 2: the exodus out of California from all the individuals and

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Speaker 2: businesses would accelerate dramatically. Now there are so many of us,

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Speaker 2: Susan and myself included, that we're committed to stay in

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Speaker 2: California and fight for this beautiful state. But we have

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Speaker 2: seen just in the last week Susan again the CEO

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Speaker 2: of Starbucks who's moved out of Washington because of tax reasons.

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Speaker 2: But many of the high wealth individuals in California have

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Speaker 2: already moved out to Texas, or to Florida, or to Nevada.

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Speaker 2: And the people who are supporting tax increases are literally

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Speaker 2: cutting off the head of the golden goose and they

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Speaker 2: don't realize what this is going to do to tax

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Speaker 2: proceeds going forward. But again, the one aspect of tax

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Speaker 2: policy in the state of California that's been good for

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Speaker 2: tax fairers. It's Proposition thirteen because if we look at

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Speaker 2: income taxes, we have the highest income tax rate in

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Speaker 2: America at thirteen point three percent. We have the highest

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Speaker 2: state sales tax rate at seven and two in a quarter.

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Speaker 2: That's even before all the local add ons, and those

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Speaker 2: local add ons can push sales taxes above ten percent.

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Speaker 2: We have the highest gas tax in the nation, and

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Speaker 2: even with Prop thirteen, in terms of per capita property

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Speaker 2: tax collections, we rank eighteenth out of fifty states. So

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Speaker 2: don't believe these people who say that Prop. Thirteen has

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Speaker 2: starved California government. Even when it comes to property taxes,

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Speaker 2: we are above average. So that's what it does. But

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Speaker 2: for more than forty years, our organization has not rested

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Speaker 2: on its laurels. We exist to plug all the loopholes

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Speaker 2: that are punched in Prop thirteen by our adversaries who

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Speaker 2: want more of your money. And we have done that

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Speaker 2: repeatedly in the last more than four decades by sponsoring

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Speaker 2: and you folks out there have passed propositions like Proposition

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Speaker 2: to eighteen, the right to vote on taxes, Proposition twenty six,

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Speaker 2: which dealt with what is a property related fee, and

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Speaker 2: other fees and charges, and so we're right back at

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Speaker 2: it again, and this is where our new Local Taxpayer

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Speaker 2: Protection Act to protect Prop thirteen is on the ballot.

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Speaker 2: And the great news is, if you haven't heard already,

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Speaker 2: that we have turned in more than one point three

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Speaker 2: million signatures. So unless something very strange happens, and you

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Speaker 2: never know, this is California, Unless something very strange happens,

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Speaker 2: then our new initiatives should qualify for the November ballot.

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Speaker 2: And Susan, we can talk later about what that ballot

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Speaker 2: might look like, because there's some really interesting and confusing

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Speaker 2: things going on, which again is another reason why you

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Speaker 2: should join the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association, because as we

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Speaker 2: approach the election day in November, you're going to have

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Speaker 2: a lot of questions not just on our initiative, but

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Speaker 2: on all the initiatives out there, and there will be many.

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Speaker 2: There will be many. There is World War three going

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Speaker 2: on in the state of California right now in the

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Speaker 2: realm of initiatives and referendums. So if you're a taxpayer,

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Speaker 2: if you're a homeowner, if you consider yourself a citizen taxpayer,

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Speaker 2: and you want this straight scoop as to what's going

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Speaker 2: on in Sacramento, and what's going on with all these

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Speaker 2: ballot measures. Go to our website, give us a call,

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Speaker 2: join the organization because we are out there, and says

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Speaker 2: we're out there fighting for you.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely. And let me go back to something you said

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Speaker 1: about Prop. Thirteen. Sometimes people think it only applies to

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Speaker 1: people who own their homes when it passed in nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventy eight, and it doesn't help people today, But that's

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Speaker 1: not true. Proposition thirteen covers all property owners, no matter

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Speaker 1: when they purchase their home or other property. And because

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Speaker 1: Prop thirteen cut the tax rate from a statewide average

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Speaker 1: of over two percent down to one percent flat one percent,

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Speaker 1: even if you bought your house yesterday, Prop thirteen is

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Speaker 1: saving you money over what it would have been with

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Speaker 1: the old rules. And then the longer you keep your

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Speaker 1: property as inflation outpaces your tax bill because Prop. Thirteen

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Speaker 1: is holding your tax bill down, letting it go up

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Speaker 1: only two percent a year, the longer you hold your property,

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Speaker 1: the better it is. And it times out pretty well

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Speaker 1: if you're working when you buy your house and you

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Speaker 1: retire later, and then your property taxes won't tax you

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Speaker 1: out of your home.

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Speaker 2: I remember talking to one of our adversaries. He wasn't

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Speaker 2: a bad guy, he just won't work for one of

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Speaker 2: these ostensible business organizations that really wasn't pro taxpayer. We

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Speaker 2: had a few of those. We have some very good

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Speaker 2: pro taxpayer of business organizations. But I recall this individual

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Speaker 2: was not a fan of Proposition thirteen. And he point

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Speaker 2: Bland told me one day about ten years after Prop

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Speaker 2: thirteen passed, He said, you know, John, what are you

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Speaker 2: going to do? Because pretty soon all the people who

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Speaker 2: owned homes in nineteen seventy eight, they're going to move on,

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Speaker 2: they're going to die off, and you're not going to

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Speaker 2: have a constituency for Proposition thirteen. And I said, oh wait,

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Speaker 2: just a minute. Proposition thirteen is, Susan just said, protects

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Speaker 2: all property owners. And as it relates to that limitation

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Speaker 2: on annual increases in taxable value, you only have to

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Speaker 2: live in your house for two or three years or

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Speaker 2: four years before you begin to see the advantage of

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Speaker 2: that provision. You already get thee of that one percent

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Speaker 2: tax rate that helps everybody, but that provision that limits

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Speaker 2: the annual increases and taxable value, you just have to

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Speaker 2: live in your house for a couple of years before

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Speaker 2: you begin to understand that you do not want to

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Speaker 2: be taxed on the actual value of your house. You

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Speaker 2: want to be taxed on what you paid for it,

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Speaker 2: plus two percent a year. Susan, I can't think of

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Speaker 2: anything more tragic than having a young family who you know,

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Speaker 2: they stretch their budget. They've been in an apartment, and

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Speaker 2: they stretch their budget, and they bought as nice of

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Speaker 2: a home and as big as a home as they

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Speaker 2: could afford. Can you imagine the tragedy of them two

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Speaker 2: or three years out having to move back into an

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Speaker 2: apartment because they couldn't afford the tax bill. Proposition thirteen

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Speaker 2: prevents that from happening by limiting the annual increases and

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Speaker 2: taxable value. It provides certainty to that young family, It

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Speaker 2: provides certainty to senior citizens. It provides certainty to businesses.

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Speaker 2: Businesses are now able to predict, at least that provision

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Speaker 2: of costs, their business costs going forward. They may not

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Speaker 2: know what their inventory, their wholesale prices, what they might

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Speaker 2: be subject to all the regulations, but they're one thing

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Speaker 2: that they can predict, just like homeowners, is they can

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Speaker 2: predict what their property tax bills will be and that's

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Speaker 2: why Susan, you know, California is not as conservative as

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Speaker 2: it used to be. But we've seen the polling. If

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Speaker 2: Proposition thirteen were on the ballot today, it would pass

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Speaker 2: by about the same sixty percent margin that it did

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Speaker 2: back in nineteen seventy eight.

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Speaker 1: And a lot of people don't realize that the voters

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Speaker 1: twice turned down what's called a split roll property tax system,

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Speaker 1: where businesses could be taxed at a different rate than

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Speaker 1: residential property. They turned it down in nineteen seventy eight

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Speaker 1: because the legislature put a competing measure on the ballot

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Speaker 1: to try to take the steam out of Prop thirteen,

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Speaker 1: But the voters turn that down flat choose Prop thirteen,

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Speaker 1: which protects all property. And then it happened again in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty when a split roll was on the ballot,

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Speaker 1: and once again, a split roll is when business properties

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Speaker 1: are taxed at a different rate or under different rules

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Speaker 1: than residential property. But in California it's all taxed under

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Speaker 1: the same rules, and voters have said twice they don't

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Speaker 1: want to change that. So it's not a scam and

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Speaker 1: it's not a gimmick, and it's not a loophole. It's

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Speaker 1: what the voters put in the constitution.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know. And the notion that somehow Prop. Thirteen

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Speaker 2: created a loophole for businesses is simply not true. Because

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Speaker 2: California has had what we call a unified tax role,

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Speaker 2: which means that all property is treated the same since

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Speaker 2: the eighteen hundreds. Prop thirteen did not change that. So,

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Speaker 2: and there's something very equitable, something very fair about treating

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Speaker 2: all property, whether it is a homeowner, an apartment building,

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Speaker 2: industrial property, commercial property, small business, a large business. By

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Speaker 2: treating all property the same, everybody has the same stake

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Speaker 2: in preserving the system.

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Speaker 3: That we have.

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Speaker 2: That is why we have so many business allies, and

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Speaker 2: we have a lot of allies in the apartment business

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Speaker 2: as well, mostly small small apartment buildings owners, mom and

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Speaker 2: pop owners of small apartment buildings four units, eight units.

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Speaker 2: And people forget that. Howard Jarvis himself was the executive

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Speaker 2: director of the Apartment Association or Greater Los Angeles. So

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Speaker 2: our partnership with the mom and pop operators of apartment

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Speaker 2: buildings has been there for a long time. And those

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Speaker 2: folks do something that government doesn't do very well, which

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Speaker 2: is it provides affordable housing to people looking for it,

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Speaker 2: and people say, well, you guys, Howard Jarvis, you guys

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Speaker 2: are just looking up for homeowners. You don't care about tenants.

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Speaker 2: Here's the reality. When property owners save money, they can

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Speaker 2: pass those savings on to their tenants. But when landlords

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Speaker 2: get hit with a higher tax, a higher regulatory fee,

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Speaker 2: they're going to have to pass that along to tenants.

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Speaker 2: And finally, one of the reasons we like tenants is

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Speaker 2: because these are the people we would like to see

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Speaker 2: become homeowners one day. Because home ownership in California is

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Speaker 2: at one of the lowest rates in the nation. Very

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Speaker 2: few people can afford to buy a house because of

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Speaker 2: the costs. We'd like to change that. We'd like to

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Speaker 2: see all the people who are currently renting property, we'd

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Speaker 2: like to see them succeed and buy their own homes.

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Speaker 2: Right now, they can't. They can't because of California government policies.

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Speaker 2: And we're working to change those.

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Speaker 1: We sure are. And it's really important. Home ownership is

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Speaker 1: really important for building wealth, for building the future, for

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Speaker 1: leaving something to your kids. It's really important. And you know,

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Speaker 1: one of the other things that we should mention about

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Speaker 1: Prop thirteen and by the way, you're listening to the

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Speaker 1: Howard Jarvis Radio Show from the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association.

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Speaker 1: I'm Susan Shelley here with HJATA President John Coopaul. And

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Speaker 1: one of the things in Prop thirteen is a two

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Speaker 1: thirds vote to raise state taxes. Now people don't know this,

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Speaker 1: but in the eighteen seventy nine California Constitution, those Californians

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Speaker 1: put in a requirement that local bonds need a two

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Speaker 1: thirds vote to pass. Now, there was in twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 1: there was an effort to change that, which we were

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Speaker 1: able to defeat. They wanted to make it easier to

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Speaker 1: pass bonds and raise your property taxes, because local bonds

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Speaker 1: raise your property taxes. So the two thirds vote was

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Speaker 1: in the eighteen seventy nine constitution for bonds, and then

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Speaker 1: in Prop thirteen it was added for the state taxes,

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Speaker 1: so that the legislature had to have a two thirds

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Speaker 1: vote to raise your state taxes. And Howard Jarvis said,

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Speaker 1: and we have it on a recording that was very tough,

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Speaker 1: and we wanted it to be tough. Two thirds vote

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Speaker 1: to raise taxes, and at the local level, a two

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Speaker 1: thirds vote for local special taxes. So that ended up

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Speaker 1: defined as special meaning the money is earmarked for something,

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Speaker 1: and general taxes needed a simple majority, not a two

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Speaker 1: thirds vote. But then the courts got involved in twenty seventeen,

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Speaker 1: and what happened to our twos vote protection for local taxes.

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Speaker 2: Well, it was significantly weakened by this ambiguity in a

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Speaker 2: court case that suggested that the two thirds vote for

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Speaker 2: local special taxes would not apply if that tax was

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Speaker 2: placed on the ballot by a so called citizens committee.

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Speaker 2: Now by citizens committee or citizens effort, citizens initiative, that

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Speaker 2: usually means special tax, special interests. Because what we saw

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Speaker 2: in the City of Los Angeles is the special interests

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Speaker 2: proposing a tax increase, a special tax increase, a real

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Speaker 2: the state transfer tax, and they evaded the two thirds

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Speaker 2: vote by putting this forwarding this thing as a citizen's initiative.

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Speaker 2: That those cases were directly contrary to previous cases in

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Speaker 2: California law. For forty years, for at least thirty five years,

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Speaker 2: the law has been that any special tax at the

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Speaker 2: local level would require a two thirds vote of the

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Speaker 2: local electorate, no matter where it came from. Well, the

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Speaker 2: courts muddied the water, and unfortunately Susan. We had a

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Speaker 2: negative ruling last week the last case. The last case

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Speaker 2: dealing with whether or not the two thirds vote would

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Speaker 2: apply to special taxes. The courts rejected our arguments, but

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Speaker 2: that is why we have qualified this initiative. So what

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Speaker 2: we cannot get through litigation, we will take that issue

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Speaker 2: directly to the people of State of California, and if

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Speaker 2: polling is any is at all accurate, that our initiatives

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Speaker 2: should pass with flying colors. Now, it's going to be

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Speaker 2: a tough fight because the people who want your money

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Speaker 2: are going to put up one heck of a battle.

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Speaker 2: But people like Prop thirteen, they like the two thirds vote.

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Speaker 2: People State of California, you look at any pole and

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Speaker 2: they honestly believe, and for good reason, that we are

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Speaker 2: over taxed. So we're seeing this a lot, and we

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Speaker 2: can talk about this in the next segment season. But

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Speaker 2: the number of initiatives that are currently in circulation or

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Speaker 2: have qualified for the ballot dealing with taxes is going

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Speaker 2: to make people's head spin them Again. I think if

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Speaker 2: you're listening to this and you have questions, you're gonna

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Speaker 2: have questions. You can rely on the Harvard Drivers Taxpayers

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Speaker 2: Association for impartial information on proposed measures. Let me correct

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Speaker 2: that we're not entirely impartial. We are actually partial in

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Speaker 2: favor of taxpayers. So if you're somebody out there who thinks, gee,

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Speaker 2: I think higher taxes is a good thing, we're not

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Speaker 2: impartial because we exist to represent the citizen taxpayer in

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Speaker 2: the state of California.

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Speaker 1: Well, the citizen taxpayer of the state of California has

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Speaker 1: been beaten up pretty badly, so they we really need

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Speaker 1: to be on this. One of the things that the

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Speaker 1: courts did is erased the ban on transfer taxes. Now,

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Speaker 1: transfer tax is like a sales tax on real estate,

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Speaker 1: and Prop thirteen prohibited transfer taxes because Prop. Thirteen was

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Speaker 1: an authentic tax reduction, not a deferral to be taken

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Speaker 1: back when you sold your property. So transfer taxes were

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Speaker 1: completely banned. But then the courts got involved and they said, well,

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Speaker 1: maybe here, maybe there. And then we wound up with

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Speaker 1: this other loophole with the Citizens' Initiative tax increase, And

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Speaker 1: now we had this measure ULA Pass, which is the

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Speaker 1: Manch Tax in Los Angeles, a huge transfer tax on

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Speaker 1: real estate above five million dollars, which affects apartment buildings

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Speaker 1: and it affects new developments of apartment buildings as well

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Speaker 1: as all commercial real estate on top of mansions. It's

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Speaker 1: not all mansions. So this is something that we think

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Speaker 1: we have to fix. So our initiative restores what's already

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Speaker 1: in the plain language of Prop. Thirteen, which is a

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Speaker 1: ban on transfer taxes. And there's another kind of tax

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Speaker 1: that's banned also, the advalrem And you can explain that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, an advolrum simply means that's Latin for to the value,

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Speaker 2: and your base property tax rate is that one percent.

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Speaker 2: The one percent base property tax is the advalorum tax. Now,

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Speaker 2: the advalorum tax can be increased by by a bond

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Speaker 2: with a vote, but that vote needs a two thirds vote,

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Speaker 2: except for school bonds. Local school bonds, they snuck through

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Speaker 2: another exception fifty five percent, which is why most of

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Speaker 2: those pass. But the two thirds vote for all intents

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Speaker 2: and purposes at the local level is at least for

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Speaker 2: bond's remains intact. But the citizens' initiatives are causing havoc

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Speaker 2: in the state of California and in local governments, and

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Speaker 2: the negative impact that this has had in Los Angeles

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Speaker 2: is well documented.

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Speaker 1: Well, we are certainly going to be telling every voter

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Speaker 1: about what's on the ballot, and in November, when this

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Speaker 1: is on the ballot, you're going to hear a lot

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Speaker 1: about it. We have to take a break. This is

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Speaker 1: the Howard Jarvis Radio Show. We're at eight hundred two

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Speaker 1: two two five two two two. Eight hundred two two

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Speaker 1: two five two two two. We will be right back

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Speaker 1: after this. Welcome back to the Howard Jarvis Radio Show.

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Speaker 1: I'm Susan Shelley with the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association here

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Speaker 1: with HJTA President John Coopaul, and we're talking Prop thirteen

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Speaker 1: Prop to eighteen. We're talking about all the things in

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Speaker 1: the constitution that protect you from higher taxes and what

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Speaker 1: we're doing to protect those provisions from being attacked by

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Speaker 1: the courts and everybody else who seems to want to

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Speaker 1: get into your wallet. We're at eight hundred two two

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Speaker 1: two five two two two. Let's talk to David in

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Speaker 1: Butte County. Hi, David, Hi, how.

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Speaker 4: Are you good?

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Speaker 1: Thanks for calling.

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Speaker 5: I was wondering if HJATA endorses the results California ballot initiative.

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Speaker 5: They are collecting signatures and I got the initiative form

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Speaker 5: to sign from them in the.

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Speaker 1: Mail Results California. I'm not familiar with that. What does

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Speaker 1: it do?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, so it's called Results California, and it's California's for

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Speaker 5: a more Transparent and effective government. And it says that

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Speaker 5: it says results audits of programs funded by the new

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Speaker 5: state special taxes, prohibits new state taxes that are excluded

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Speaker 5: from existing voter approved state spending Limit initiative constitutional amendment.

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Speaker 1: Okay, we do know what that is. We've been calling

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Speaker 1: that the Transparency Initiative. The results threw us off.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we call that the Transparency Initiative. We are not

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Speaker 2: the sponsors of that. This came to our attention. We

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Speaker 2: started getting a lot of calls, like from folks like you,

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Speaker 2: have you guys seen this? A lot of people thought

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Speaker 2: it was from us. It's not, but we have not

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Speaker 2: done a full analysis of it. But what we see

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Speaker 2: we like. We think there's a lot of good things

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Speaker 2: in this and we can we can get into this.

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Speaker 2: First of all, we're all in favor of transparency. And

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Speaker 2: also that reference for the state spending limit also known

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Speaker 2: as the gang spending limit, that's kind of a sleeper issue.

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Speaker 2: If they if this initiative passes. My understanding is that

434
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,959
Speaker 2: it would prevent any more modifications of the state spending

435
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:02,919
Speaker 2: limit and we would make it harder for the state

436
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 2: to overspend. And now I'm not one hundred percent sure

437
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 2: about that, but that is my initial read of it.

438
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 2: This is one of five initiatives that have been brought

439
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 2: to us by a group of quite frankly, very wealthy

440
00:27:18,600 --> 00:27:24,080
Speaker 2: interests who are tired of how bad California has gotten.

441
00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,920
Speaker 2: Like so many of us, but these are individuals and

442
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 2: interests who are extremely wealthy, coming mostly from the high

443
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 2: tech industry, and who are tired of being the punching

444
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:42,480
Speaker 2: bag for far left special interests. So my first observation

445
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:44,919
Speaker 2: you may or may not agree with this is that

446
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:47,520
Speaker 2: I'm glad that some of these people are finally fighting

447
00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:50,720
Speaker 2: back because we've been fighting back against these tax and

448
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 2: spenders for a long time and we need all the

449
00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:56,920
Speaker 2: allies we can get, and this is one of those

450
00:27:56,960 --> 00:28:02,159
Speaker 2: five initiatives that they are pushing to to bring some

451
00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:06,479
Speaker 2: sanity and actually to push back against these mostly public

452
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 2: sector labor organizations that are looking forever higher taxes. So

453
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,920
Speaker 2: it looks good to us. My initial reaction right now is, yeah,

454
00:28:15,960 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 2: this is something we'll get you to support and people

455
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:22,600
Speaker 2: should vote for. But we will we will give official

456
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:29,680
Speaker 2: recommendations sometime in the near future. Our usual practice is

457
00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 2: that we wait until an initiative actually qualifies for the

458
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:37,240
Speaker 2: ballot before we take an official position. But we can

459
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:39,400
Speaker 2: certainly give you our opinion as to whether or not

460
00:28:39,440 --> 00:28:42,320
Speaker 2: they're on the right track. And it seems to us

461
00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 2: that the people who are pushing for greater transparency and

462
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 2: an accountability over special taxes, that's a very very good thing.

463
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 2: So anyway, that's a roundabout way of saying what we

464
00:28:56,960 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 2: see so far we really like.

465
00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: Thank you for calling. We appreciate it. Yes, auditing all

466
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:05,840
Speaker 1: those special taxes can't be a bad thing, because certainly

467
00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: people vote for taxes. It's supposed to go to whatever

468
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 1: the fire department or the schools or some other worthy thing,

469
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 1: and it's on the ballot to do that. And then

470
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 1: the problem doesn't seem to get better. And where did

471
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 1: the money go?

472
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,719
Speaker 2: Where did the money go? And just to give an

473
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 2: example of why this is so important, people forget that

474
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 2: during the COVID crisis, the fraud in the Employment Development

475
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 2: Department was thirty billion dollars, not thirty million dollars thirty

476
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:43,800
Speaker 2: billion dollars worth of fraud, and so many people were saying,

477
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 2: do you have any idea where this money's going? And

478
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 2: nobody did, and it was just like it was so frustrating.

479
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 2: We really could have used somebody who views their job

480
00:29:56,520 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 2: in the public sector as a responsibility that comes with

481
00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 2: a whole lot of fiduciary stewardship, and nobody was doing it.

482
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 2: And we see that today. We see money being spent

483
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 2: hand over fist, nobody knows where it's going. And California

484
00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 2: has one of the worst records when it comes to waste, fraud,

485
00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:21,600
Speaker 2: and abuse, and so these kinds of initiatives are really

486
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:22,440
Speaker 2: sorely needed.

487
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: You know, in Los Angeles we have these homelessness taxes

488
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:30,000
Speaker 1: one after another, and they all have oversight bodies, and

489
00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 1: then there are oversight bodies from the county Board of

490
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 1: Supervisors and from the city and oversight on top of

491
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 1: oversight and leadership tables and executive committees and blue riven commissions,

492
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:43,800
Speaker 1: and still the money is just wasted.

493
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, wasn't there a federal judge was it Carter who

494
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 2: just said, you know, basically, you people have no idea

495
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 2: where this money is going and he was really angry.

496
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:57,000
Speaker 2: He was appointed as like a special master or something.

497
00:30:58,200 --> 00:30:59,360
Speaker 2: I can't recall exactly what.

498
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 1: It's a lawsuit filed by some downtown business interests and

499
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:08,000
Speaker 1: residents that was settled. They were suing the city in

500
00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:11,080
Speaker 1: the county to provide housing for people because there wasn't

501
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:13,440
Speaker 1: any and nothing was being done with the money, so

502
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 1: they sued and then the lawsuit was settled. Judge David

503
00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:20,000
Speaker 1: Carter was assigned to the lawsuit because he'd done some

504
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:24,400
Speaker 1: work in this area in Orange County. And after they settled,

505
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:27,240
Speaker 1: apparently the City of Los Angeles was in breach of

506
00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:30,880
Speaker 1: the settlement. They didn't meet the numbers, the benchmarks that

507
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,000
Speaker 1: they had promised to meet. But that's all in contention,

508
00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:35,760
Speaker 1: and now the judge is threatening to hold the city

509
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 1: in contempt of court, and the city has hired outside council,

510
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:42,560
Speaker 1: which is costing millions of dollars, and once again, the

511
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: money's not going to the people it was supposed to help.

512
00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 1: So it's very frustrating as a taxpayer. It's very frustrating.

513
00:31:49,840 --> 00:31:52,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, that seems to be the story of California.

514
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 2: The money's not going to where people think it's going.

515
00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:58,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, especially in the homeless. In the homelessness area, there's

516
00:31:58,560 --> 00:32:02,200
Speaker 1: just a tremendous amount. The sales tax increase that passed

517
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: in November twenty twenty four in La County is bringing

518
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:08,719
Speaker 1: in one billion dollars a year. So it's coming in.

519
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: Where is it going? That is the question. Let's take

520
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,200
Speaker 1: a call from Tim in San Francisco.

521
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 4: Hi, Tim, Yeah, Hi, Susan.

522
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:21,880
Speaker 3: I've called you guys before about the high speed rail.

523
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:25,360
Speaker 3: I'm not going to beat that dead horse tonight. I

524
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 3: know you guys don't endorse candidates for anything, but Steve Hilton,

525
00:32:30,200 --> 00:32:33,480
Speaker 3: who I'm leaning towards voting for, has suggested in some

526
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:35,600
Speaker 3: of his campaign material he's going to do away with

527
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:39,240
Speaker 3: the California State income text. I don't know how he's

528
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 3: going to make up for that loss revenue. Is it

529
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 3: because he's going to fire it out all the waste

530
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:48,120
Speaker 3: and fraud like that thirty billion for the Employment Development

531
00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 3: Department a few years ago? Is that how he's going

532
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 3: to do it? Or do you have any opinion? I'll

533
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,160
Speaker 3: take my answer on the air if you don't mind.

534
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:56,360
Speaker 1: Okay, thank you.

535
00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 2: First of all, the Howard Drivers Taxers Association does not

536
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:05,000
Speaker 2: endorse candidates. That is true, but the Howard Jarvis Taxpayer's

537
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:09,440
Speaker 2: Pack Political ex Committee we do, and people can go

538
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:14,400
Speaker 2: to our website and see the candidates we've endorsed. Now

539
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:21,640
Speaker 2: we endorse for state legislative races. We endorse for statewide office.

540
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:27,680
Speaker 2: We endorse for Board of Equalization because that's a tax agency.

541
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 2: There are five districts for the BOE, and we do endorse.

542
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:37,760
Speaker 2: At the local level. We endorse in county assessor races.

543
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 2: And you may think why assessors not boards of supervisors

544
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:45,840
Speaker 2: Number one, there are so many people running for boards

545
00:33:45,840 --> 00:33:49,200
Speaker 2: and supervisors we can't do our due diligence. But when

546
00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:52,600
Speaker 2: it comes to county assessors, they're the people responsible for

547
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 2: implementing Prop. Thirteen. So we take a really close look

548
00:33:56,080 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 2: at who's running for county assessor. Will endorse in those races.

549
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 2: As it relates to the governorship, yes, we will endorse

550
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 2: in that race. The Pack will endorse in that race.

551
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:15,400
Speaker 2: There are eight kind of candidates running, six of which

552
00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:21,319
Speaker 2: are non starters, people either completely corrupt or completely incompetent.

553
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,120
Speaker 2: I'm not going to get into those there are and

554
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 2: by the way, I hasten to add hord Jars Taxpayer's

555
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 2: Political Action Committee. We're nonpartisan, and in fact, there's one

556
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 2: race that I won't get into right now, where we may,

557
00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 2: in fact endorse a Democrat. Doesn't happen very often because

558
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:43,839
Speaker 2: Republicans tend to be more fiscally conservative. But we've looked

559
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:46,880
Speaker 2: at the governor's race and we have Steve Hilton and

560
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:52,240
Speaker 2: Chad Bianco, both we think are very good individuals. Chad Bianco,

561
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,800
Speaker 2: of course, is a former sheriff. He is a sheriff,

562
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 2: very strong on public safety. We get that. I've had

563
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 2: several meetings with Steve Hilton and this individual. He's extremely bright,

564
00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:08,880
Speaker 2: and he seems to know the policy issues very well.

565
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:13,640
Speaker 2: I would say that some of his statements that are

566
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 2: the things he can and cannot do. He'll get rid

567
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:21,040
Speaker 2: of the income tax. Let's be realistic. The governor cannot

568
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 2: get rid of the state income tax. That would take

569
00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:30,040
Speaker 2: a state legislative state legislative act. What I have suggested

570
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:34,560
Speaker 2: is that if he does, if he does win the governorship,

571
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 2: the governorship does have a lot of power behind it.

572
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,680
Speaker 2: Now if we have what I call a wave election.

573
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 2: A wave election is where you get a lot of

574
00:35:44,560 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 2: fiscal conservatives replacing the high spending progressives. Then that would

575
00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:55,360
Speaker 2: give him even more leverage. But it is possible. It

576
00:35:55,480 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 2: is possible that the next election cycle everybody thrown out

577
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 2: of office and we get all fishful conservatives. But you

578
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:06,959
Speaker 2: know what, I stopped believing in the Easter Buddy long

579
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:11,919
Speaker 2: time ago. I think we have to work very aggressively

580
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 2: to get good candidates in. And this is why people

581
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 2: need to look very carefully at their candidates city council,

582
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:25,320
Speaker 2: boards of supervisors, assessors, district attorneys, state assemblymen, state senators.

583
00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:28,640
Speaker 2: You have to know who these people are. Don't believe

584
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:32,880
Speaker 2: their promises, look at what they've actually done. I am

585
00:36:33,440 --> 00:36:37,080
Speaker 2: reasonably impressed with Steve Hilton that I think he would

586
00:36:37,120 --> 00:36:39,680
Speaker 2: make a very good governor, and we will make a

587
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 2: formal announcement very very soon. But I'm impressed with a

588
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:50,880
Speaker 2: number one. He's extremely energetic, he knows the issues, and

589
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:54,799
Speaker 2: he also has a degree of optimism about what California

590
00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:57,560
Speaker 2: could be. And this is one of the things that

591
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 2: I think is very important because it's easy being a

592
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 2: taxpayer in the state of California to be very depressed

593
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 2: and pessimistic. If we have somebody comes in who's very optimistic,

594
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:11,959
Speaker 2: like a Ronald Reagan who always looked at the bright side,

595
00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:15,200
Speaker 2: and we said, we can do this, we can bring

596
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,360
Speaker 2: in we can reign in government. If we get somebody

597
00:37:18,400 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 2: who's smart and optimistic and can who can articulate the issues,

598
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:27,759
Speaker 2: then that's somebody who's I think worth a very very

599
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 2: serious look. And like I say, we're going to be

600
00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:33,600
Speaker 2: making an announcement very soon, probably in the next couple

601
00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:37,080
Speaker 2: of days. But again we're very impressed with Steve Hilton.

602
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:40,920
Speaker 1: Well, thank you very much for the call. We appreciate it.

603
00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,440
Speaker 1: You know, there's going to be a number of things

604
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,480
Speaker 1: on the ballot this fall. We have several tax increases

605
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:50,600
Speaker 1: on the ballot in June that's bad enough. You might

606
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:54,319
Speaker 1: see transit taxes, you might see in Los Angeles City

607
00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:57,160
Speaker 1: will have a hotel tax increase, and they want to

608
00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:00,600
Speaker 1: try to tax illegal cannabis businesses, and they want to

609
00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 1: they want to bring Airbnb type platforms under the hotel tax.

610
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 1: I believe I think that's the third one. And then

611
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 1: this fall we might have this billionaire's tax. Now what

612
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 1: is that and why should everyone be concerned about it?

613
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:17,960
Speaker 2: Well, they can call it a billionaire's tax, but what

614
00:38:18,000 --> 00:38:21,319
Speaker 2: it is, it is a wealth tax. Number one, it

615
00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:26,120
Speaker 2: is very constitutionally suspect, but set that aside, set the

616
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:31,280
Speaker 2: legality aside for the moment. It would be an attempt

617
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:36,440
Speaker 2: not to just tax the income of high wealth individuals,

618
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:40,359
Speaker 2: but to actually tax their assets a wealth tax, and

619
00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:46,560
Speaker 2: that would involve number one, determining what someone's wealth is. Well,

620
00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:50,319
Speaker 2: even for people who aren't billionaires. You may own a

621
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:53,439
Speaker 2: few stocks, you may own a house, and you may

622
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 2: not know what the actual value of your house is.

623
00:38:57,320 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 2: I mean, we could, you can kind of figure out

624
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 2: what it might be. But if you are taxing the

625
00:39:02,120 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 2: value of your house, or the value of your stock

626
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 2: stock portfolio, or the value of the painting you may

627
00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:16,440
Speaker 2: have on your wall, you know, not everybody can afford

628
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 2: a ten million dollar painting from Hunter Biden. You know,

629
00:39:20,960 --> 00:39:25,880
Speaker 2: so okay, not ten million. But we know that was

630
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:29,359
Speaker 2: that was a scam. But the reality is trying to

631
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:33,800
Speaker 2: determine an individual's wealth at a particular point in time

632
00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 2: is very difficult. And by the way, California's tax agencies

633
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 2: have made it clear when they look at this, they said, hey,

634
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,759
Speaker 2: time out, folks, we have no way to implement this.

635
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:51,200
Speaker 2: The tax agencies in the state of California do not

636
00:39:51,320 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 2: have the expertise or the manpower to tax wealth. They

637
00:39:55,080 --> 00:40:01,480
Speaker 2: can tax income, they can tax sales. We have assessors

638
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:05,800
Speaker 2: and tax collectors who can tax property, but no agency

639
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 2: is set up to tax wealth. This experiment has been

640
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:12,399
Speaker 2: tried in Europe and it has failed virtually every time

641
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 2: it's been tried. They're talking about it in other states too.

642
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 2: They're talking about it. And of course Senator Bernie Sanders

643
00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:23,719
Speaker 2: from Vermont would love a wealth tax. You know, he says,

644
00:40:23,760 --> 00:40:26,920
Speaker 2: because those rich people, you know, we got to tax

645
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:29,440
Speaker 2: that wealth, irrespective of the fact that the guy owns

646
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:33,480
Speaker 2: three expensive homes himself. But set that aside for the moment.

647
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:39,400
Speaker 2: Taxing wealth tax is an idea that's not ready for

648
00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:45,799
Speaker 2: prime time. And the public sector labor organizations SEIU is

649
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 2: out there trying to get signatures right now. I'm not

650
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 2: sure they're going to make it. Everybody is under the wire.

651
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 2: And just a little bit of initiative news here. The

652
00:40:56,239 --> 00:41:01,480
Speaker 2: fact that our initiative, the protect Law Taxpayers Initiatives to

653
00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,480
Speaker 2: save for Reposition thirteen. The fact that we got our

654
00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 2: signatures in earlier, I think is helpful to us because

655
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:12,880
Speaker 2: and detrimental to other initiatives that are just now turning

656
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:16,560
Speaker 2: their signatures in because the way the registrars, the county

657
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 2: registrars count the votes, count the signatures, and they do

658
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:26,279
Speaker 2: them in the order in which they receive the petitions,

659
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:29,720
Speaker 2: and the petitions are collected in each county and they're

660
00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:33,759
Speaker 2: sent to the individual registrar of each county. And so

661
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 2: I think some of these other initiatives that are out there,

662
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 2: and there are several, I think some of them may

663
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:42,440
Speaker 2: have a really difficult time qualifying in time for the

664
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:46,240
Speaker 2: November ballot. But we'll see, we'll see. Maybe they'll maybe

665
00:41:46,239 --> 00:41:47,720
Speaker 2: they'll count in under the wire.

666
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:50,200
Speaker 1: Well they might, I think if they get it in

667
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:53,360
Speaker 1: by April seventeenth, according to what the Secretary of State's

668
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:56,239
Speaker 1: calendar said, that would be in time to get on

669
00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:58,960
Speaker 1: the November ballot this year. But if they don't make

670
00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 1: the November ballot this year, an initiative that qualifies, we'll

671
00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 1: roll over to the November twenty twenty eight ballot. So

672
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:08,960
Speaker 1: just because they don't make it in time for this

673
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:12,200
Speaker 1: year doesn't mean it's doesn't mean the threat is over.

674
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 1: And of course the threat is that they could change

675
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 1: the numbers, and that it's not billionaires, then it's anybody

676
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:21,120
Speaker 1: who has a retirement account. Pretty soon, so it's everybody,

677
00:42:21,120 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 1: because that's where the money is. The money's in the middle.

678
00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:26,440
Speaker 1: This is the Howard Jarvis Radio Show. I'm Susan Shelley.

679
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 1: You're with HJATA President John Coopaul. We are at eight

680
00:42:29,520 --> 00:42:32,399
Speaker 1: hundred two two two five two two two. Let's talk

681
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:35,200
Speaker 1: to Joseph in Los Angeles. Hi, Joseph, thanks for calling.

682
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:39,920
Speaker 4: Hi, Thank you. So. So would that billionaire tax push

683
00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:41,920
Speaker 4: Nancy Pelosi out of the state? That might not be

684
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:42,440
Speaker 4: a bad thing.

685
00:42:43,239 --> 00:42:46,840
Speaker 2: It already has it already has She's moved a Florida,

686
00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:51,800
Speaker 2: you know, you know, after voting and supporting every tax

687
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 2: increase in the state of California and being a taxi

688
00:42:55,080 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 2: sped liberal. Where does she move? She moves to the

689
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:02,560
Speaker 2: state run by Ronda Santis, who's the biggest fiscal conservative

690
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 2: in the United States of America. These people better, I

691
00:43:07,760 --> 00:43:09,480
Speaker 2: better shut up because I'm going to say some things

692
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:14,920
Speaker 2: I'm going to regret. But the hypocrisy, the hypocrisy of

693
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:19,360
Speaker 2: these ultra lefty billionaires. Now, the people, a lot of

694
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:21,800
Speaker 2: the people moving out are not lefty. You know, a

695
00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:24,799
Speaker 2: lot of the people. Some of our friends they've left too.

696
00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 2: But it's really ironic when you have very very progressive

697
00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:32,560
Speaker 2: people move out of state because of the taxes in California,

698
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 2: all the taxes that they voted for and that they

699
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:36,239
Speaker 2: push for.

700
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:42,960
Speaker 4: I heard that there's a possibility Carl Demils has been

701
00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 4: talking about of a real estate transfer fee of sixty

702
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:50,400
Speaker 4: thousand to sixty thousand dollars on any property in California

703
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:52,600
Speaker 4: being sold. Have you heard about you.

704
00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 1: Know, I think that's awesome.

705
00:43:55,320 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think that is an overstatement of what

706
00:44:00,239 --> 00:44:04,880
Speaker 2: has happened in La, because La, the ULA tax is

707
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:12,759
Speaker 2: a very high five percent on very wealthy, very expensive

708
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:16,640
Speaker 2: real estate. In fact, there was one downtown property, a

709
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 2: high rise that I believe the real estate transfer tax

710
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:24,400
Speaker 2: liability was as high as thirty million dollars. That was

711
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:27,640
Speaker 2: just the tax liability. But I don't see anything out

712
00:44:27,680 --> 00:44:31,120
Speaker 2: there right now where anybody's pushing a real estate transfer

713
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 2: tax of sixty thousand dollars. I just I don't think

714
00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 2: that's realistic.

715
00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:38,400
Speaker 1: Then our initiative would ban that anyway.

716
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,040
Speaker 2: Our initiaive would ban that anyway. Our initiative, So another

717
00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 2: reason to support our initiative.

718
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:47,680
Speaker 1: Absolutely thank you for the call. We appreciate it well.

719
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:51,440
Speaker 1: We are working so hard this year, and when we

720
00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:53,680
Speaker 1: get our endorsements up on the website, you'll be able

721
00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 1: to find them at HJTA dot org. We're still working

722
00:44:56,520 --> 00:44:58,319
Speaker 1: on all of that. We have a new issue of

723
00:44:58,360 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 1: Taxing Times in the works that's going to mail at

724
00:45:00,640 --> 00:45:02,959
Speaker 1: the beginning of May. If you join the Howard Jarvis

725
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:06,440
Speaker 1: Taxpayers Association right now, you'll get all of this in

726
00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:09,200
Speaker 1: the mail and it will be so convenient. You have

727
00:45:09,280 --> 00:45:12,000
Speaker 1: this tear out with all the endorsements on it. You

728
00:45:12,000 --> 00:45:13,719
Speaker 1: can take it to the poles with you, or you

729
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:15,839
Speaker 1: can wait till your ballot comes in the mail. And

730
00:45:15,880 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 1: by the way, your ballot comes in the mail, not

731
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:21,800
Speaker 1: June second on election day, it comes in the mail

732
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:25,240
Speaker 1: roughly May fourth, so election day is a month earlier.

733
00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:29,120
Speaker 1: Then everybody always thinks of it, and that makes life

734
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:32,440
Speaker 1: difficult because you have to get all of your information together.

735
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 1: And that's why we're helpful to you. So join the

736
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:39,600
Speaker 1: Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association HJTA dot org. It's only fifteen

737
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 1: dollars a year, and you strengthen your voice in this state,

738
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:46,640
Speaker 1: and nobody's voice is more important than yours is. So

739
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 1: we look forward to welcoming you as a member. And John.

740
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 1: What else is HJTA working on. We have our Public

741
00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:58,319
Speaker 1: Integrity Project, which is looking out for deceiving mail from

742
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 1: counties and cities and government entities.

743
00:46:01,320 --> 00:46:04,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've dealt with this issue quite a bit. It's

744
00:46:04,560 --> 00:46:09,480
Speaker 2: one thing to see political advertising from our advertising from

745
00:46:09,520 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 2: our adversaries paid for by their money. But it's another

746
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:17,800
Speaker 2: thing when we see anti taxpayer literature coming from government

747
00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:23,200
Speaker 2: paid for by taxpayers. This is taxpayer dollars being used

748
00:46:23,239 --> 00:46:27,680
Speaker 2: to advocate political positions contrary to the inference of taxpayers.

749
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:31,359
Speaker 2: The law in California is pretty clear that the use

750
00:46:31,400 --> 00:46:38,400
Speaker 2: of taxpayer dollars for electioneering, for political advocacy is against

751
00:46:38,440 --> 00:46:42,040
Speaker 2: the law. It's a violation of this state statute and

752
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:46,000
Speaker 2: it's also a violation the First Amendment of both California

753
00:46:46,040 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 2: Constitution and the Federal Constitution, because no person should be

754
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:54,280
Speaker 2: compelled to finance an election issue with which they disagree.

755
00:46:54,520 --> 00:46:58,319
Speaker 2: So what local governments do They push the envelope. They

756
00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 2: use weasel words, they don't see vote yes on a

757
00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:06,279
Speaker 2: tax increasing to those say please consider this issue for

758
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:10,840
Speaker 2: public safety. Because here's if this passes. How this is

759
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:13,879
Speaker 2: how the money will will be spent. And we're not

760
00:47:13,920 --> 00:47:16,759
Speaker 2: saying vote yes, We're just saying that the world will

761
00:47:16,800 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 2: come to an end if it doesn't pass. I mean,

762
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 2: it's not you know, it.

763
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:27,000
Speaker 1: Sounds funny, that's pretty much true. Everybody's going to die

764
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:29,440
Speaker 1: in the street and there won't be anybody to save you.

765
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:35,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, kittens and puppies will die and all this stuff. Yeah,

766
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:39,480
Speaker 2: it's pretty insidious. Remember that the Howard Drivers Taxpair's Association

767
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:43,640
Speaker 2: won a lawsuit against the County of Los Angeles and

768
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:47,640
Speaker 2: worked with the Fair Political Practices Commission to impose a

769
00:47:47,719 --> 00:47:51,480
Speaker 2: fine of one point three million dollars against the County

770
00:47:51,480 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 2: of Los Angeles for using taxpayer dollars in favor of

771
00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:59,520
Speaker 2: a homelessness tax, another homelessness tax, And we caught them

772
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 2: at it, and we won that case and won a

773
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:07,239
Speaker 2: pretty good attorney's fees award. But these people push the

774
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 2: envelope and sometimes they don't care that they're violating the

775
00:48:10,160 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 2: law because they figure if they just get the tax passed,

776
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,279
Speaker 2: who cares that they violated the law a little bit?

777
00:48:17,239 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 2: Because we got the money, the money's going to come in.

778
00:48:19,760 --> 00:48:25,480
Speaker 2: So it's very unethical, very illegal, and we have a

779
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:30,040
Speaker 2: public integrity project that rides shotgun over this, and this

780
00:48:30,080 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 2: is one more thing you should be watching for the

781
00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:33,920
Speaker 2: Howard Jarvis Taxpayers.

782
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 1: Association that's going to do it for us this week.

783
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being with us. I'm Susan

784
00:48:38,600 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: Shelley with the Howard Jarvis Taxpayers Association for John Coopol,

785
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:44,640
Speaker 1: president of HJTA. Thanks for being with us and we'll

786
00:48:44,640 --> 00:48:45,439
Speaker 1: see you next week.

787
00:48:46,040 --> 00:48:47,400
Speaker 2: Take care of everyone,