Speaker 1: Now back to murphin markets on the Sports Leader, streaming
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Speaker 2: Let's roll up our sleeves and get into it with
Speaker 2: Andy Bagley of the Athletic. He's sponsored by Marine Health,
Speaker 2: with top physicians, surgeons and clinicians right here in the
Speaker 2: North Bay. Marine Health puts you closer to your best health,
Speaker 2: world class care, closer than you think.
Speaker 3: Andy.
Speaker 2: I read your comprehensive recap of the trade deadline day
Speaker 2: in the Athletic outstanding as zolways. As we say good morning.
Speaker 2: Now as we wake up the next morning.
Speaker 1: You sleep on it.
Speaker 2: You wake up, the dust is settling. And somebody who
Speaker 2: was on vacation and didn't have Wi Fi just came
Speaker 2: back and said, Hey, Andy, what did the giants do
Speaker 2: on the trade deadline? What was their message? What's your
Speaker 2: answer to that? What was the overarching theme?
Speaker 3: Oh, you missed the whole trade dead And then we'll
Speaker 3: sit down. This is going to take a while. Yeah,
Speaker 3: you know what, I gotta say, It probably took me
Speaker 3: longer to hyperlink to all of our stories then it did.
Speaker 3: Actually write the piece summarizing everything because I mean, we
Speaker 3: were all over it. It was really amazing to see
Speaker 3: everybody in action. If you were behind the scenes and
Speaker 3: could like look at all the slack messages going back
Speaker 3: and forth and stuff. We had so many editors and
Speaker 3: so many writers, and we had so many things pre
Speaker 3: written that we're ready to go. And I mean every
Speaker 3: single trade had a story about the trade, a story
Speaker 3: about you know, trade grades, and then a lot of
Speaker 3: analysis and there was just so much on our site
Speaker 3: yesterday was really really amazing. So I just wanted to
Speaker 3: give a shout out to all of our editors and
Speaker 3: starting with Mark Coraig our MLB editor, and and and
Speaker 3: and obviously all the writers for really pitching in because
Speaker 3: it was a big, big day for for all of
Speaker 3: us in our business.
Speaker 2: And the theme was for the giants.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, right, the thing, Yeah, the actual content, the
Speaker 3: actual method, you know what I mean. I think the
Speaker 3: message was, you know, hey, look, we're not satisfied with
Speaker 3: the way things have gone. We know things have to change,
Speaker 3: and that means not only trading the impending free agents,
Speaker 3: but you know, taking advantage of guys whom might have
Speaker 3: a hot market to move them to get some pieces
Speaker 3: that might help to reset the team a little bit.
Speaker 3: But you know it's not a rebuild. And you might say, well,
Speaker 3: how do you trade six guys off your major league
Speaker 3: roster and add zero? I mean the Giants played a
Speaker 3: man down yesterday in Texas. I mean they took an
Speaker 3: all star second basement off the roster. They Zika, a
Speaker 3: former All star left fielder, off their roster, the only
Speaker 3: two guys in the bullpen to throw hard, two fifths
Speaker 3: of their starting rotation. And you think, well, this is
Speaker 3: a team that's having a fire sale. But it's not
Speaker 3: a fire sale if Logan Web is still standing in
Speaker 3: the room, Because if it had been a rebuild, then
Speaker 3: Logan Web would be traded, and quite honestly, he would
Speaker 3: have gotten more than what the Tigers got for Terrek
Speaker 3: Schouble because he comes with two additional years of club control,
Speaker 3: so he would have been the big difference maker traded
Speaker 3: at the trade deadline if the Giants had put him
Speaker 3: out there. They didn't. They would have taken absolute pennies
Speaker 3: on the dollar for anybody who could give them a
Speaker 3: shred of cost savings on a Damis chapman En Devs.
Speaker 3: They didn't do that, So this is not a team
Speaker 3: that's rebuilding. But they are a team that is definitely
Speaker 3: retooling in a big way with an eye toward getting younger,
Speaker 3: boosting that farm system, trying to create a wave of
Speaker 3: talent that can really come up and make a difference. Now,
Speaker 3: does that really really make it appreciably likely that they're
Speaker 3: going to be a really good team next year? Probably not.
Speaker 3: So maybe you could quibble with whether it's a rebual
Speaker 3: or not. But if you're looking for the Giants to
Speaker 3: use the tradeline to make themselves a ninety win team
Speaker 3: next season, it probably wasn't the trade deadline for you.
Speaker 3: But you know, if you really just want to see
Speaker 3: the organization be in a healthier place, then I think
Speaker 3: that they accomplished that in a lot of ways.
Speaker 4: Bags This is now back to back seasons that we've
Speaker 4: seen the Giants be sellers at the trade deadline. Last
Speaker 4: year they moved three names. This year they've moved six.
Speaker 4: MURF and I were discussing it earlier this morning. You
Speaker 4: might know better than both of us. Is this the
Speaker 4: biggest sell off at the trade deadline in Giant's history?
Speaker 3: I mean, I guess it depends on what you call
Speaker 3: biggest I mean, have they traded bigger players at the deadline? Gosh,
Speaker 3: I can't really think of I can't really think of
Speaker 3: guys that they've traded that have been just huge blockbusters.
Speaker 3: I mean, really, the biggest trade that they've made mid
Speaker 3: seasoned in a long long time was the rock Hield
Speaker 3: Devers deal And I don't know if you want to
Speaker 3: call that a trade headline trade or not since it
Speaker 3: happened in June, but yeah, I don't know. I guess
Speaker 3: you could probably say it was the biggest sell off,
Speaker 3: probably the biggest sell off in the twenty whatever years
Speaker 3: I've covered the team, But again, I don't think that
Speaker 3: necessarily equits to fire sell.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I can't remember volume wise, I can't never
Speaker 2: remember this many players being traded from the Giants. This
Speaker 2: to me is number one. But that said, we got
Speaker 2: to talk about the big one. So of all of them,
Speaker 2: I would argue probably the two most attractive ones for
Speaker 2: the industry would be either the Ramon Marquez from the
Speaker 2: Phillies going for Luisa Rise. But the one I want
Speaker 2: to ask you about first is the Marcello Meyer one.
Speaker 2: Red Sox fans were in their feelings about that they
Speaker 2: had complex feelings about and he was supposed to be
Speaker 2: the darling of the future. You know, whether do you
Speaker 2: want to compare him to Luciano or Marco Luciano or
Speaker 2: whoever the Giants had through the years that fans were
Speaker 2: in love with. But he had not performed in his
Speaker 2: brief stints as a Red Sox, and he was also
Speaker 2: injury prone. But there's this potential. You look at Casey
Speaker 2: Schmid and Elliott Ramos's guys who took a couple of
Speaker 2: years to get going. So your take on the Marcelo
Speaker 2: Meyer trade, trading away Eric Miller from Marcello Meyer, how
Speaker 2: do you evaluate that one?
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I think I would evaluate it pretty
Speaker 3: similarly to the way that Keith Law evaluated it on
Speaker 3: our site, which is you understand why the Red Sox
Speaker 3: did it. I mean, they feel like they have other
Speaker 3: players coming. Meyer's a guy who has had a lot
Speaker 3: of injuries, and you know, he was their opening day
Speaker 3: second basement, but they felt like they didn't have really
Speaker 3: a place to play him going forward and they needed
Speaker 3: a lefty reliever now. And this is a guy who's
Speaker 3: got some control and isn't just a rental. We also
Speaker 3: know what Eric Miller's warts are because we've seen him
Speaker 3: pitch and he's got six walks per nine innings. You know,
Speaker 3: he's always going to be a high walk guy. He
Speaker 3: has a history of getting hurt, so you know, he
Speaker 3: stayed healthy this year, but last year he didn't, and
Speaker 3: then he was available to the Giants from the Phillies
Speaker 3: because he had that injury history. So you could be selling,
Speaker 3: you know, relatively peak value on him if you know
Speaker 3: he can't stay healthy from this point forward. And of
Speaker 3: course you wish him the best and you hope he
Speaker 3: has success and health, but he's still a reliever, and
Speaker 3: a reliever can only make so much impact. And this
Speaker 3: is a guy who's an everyday position player who was
Speaker 3: one of the top twenty prospects in the game basically
Speaker 3: a year ago. So he's still twenty three. Kind of cool.
Speaker 3: He went to the same high school as Casey Schmid,
Speaker 3: so you know, shout out to La Vista. Maybe there's
Speaker 3: gonna be some Giants fans there now. But you know,
Speaker 3: he's a guy who, if he does get back on track,
Speaker 3: he's you know, a four or five war player. He's
Speaker 3: a difference maker, and just for a ten percent chance
Speaker 3: of getting that kind of player, It was worth the
Speaker 3: Giants doing this deal.
Speaker 4: Bags. The trade that stood out to me was Elliott
Speaker 4: Rama's being shipped out to the New York Yankees. What
Speaker 4: were your thoughts on the Giants treating away that controllable
Speaker 4: contract and overall the return package they got for Ramos.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was It was a tough deal to trade Ramos,
Speaker 3: but you just kind of had a feeling they would
Speaker 3: because there were so many teams that needed a right
Speaker 3: handed hitting outfielder. And I think the Giants looked at
Speaker 3: a couple of things. One, you know, Ramos does have
Speaker 3: some limitations defensively. He's worked hard to get better this year,
Speaker 3: but we know it was a disaster last year, and
Speaker 3: they don't have a DH spot for the foreseeable future,
Speaker 3: certainly for the rest of this decade. If Devers and
Speaker 3: Eldridge are on the roster, so and you have other
Speaker 3: players coming up, You've got, you know, Victor Barracotto. They
Speaker 3: really like what they've seen from him, and I don't
Speaker 3: know if he's going to be an everyday big leaguer,
Speaker 3: but you know, you could maybe kind of close your
Speaker 3: eyes halfway and envision him doing what Ramos is doing.
Speaker 3: You know, they've got Dakota Jordan, they've got Bo Davidson,
Speaker 3: they've got Parks Harbor, they've got other players coming up,
Speaker 3: and so they felt like maybe they could cover that
Speaker 3: loss of Ramos and try to balance out the system
Speaker 3: because we know it's position player heavy, So if they
Speaker 3: were going to trade Ramos, it was only going to
Speaker 3: be if they got, you know, a really good pitcher
Speaker 3: back and l Lane from the from the from the
Speaker 3: Yankee system is an interesting guy. Six foot seven. He's
Speaker 3: from the Bronx, but he was actually an international signee
Speaker 3: from the Dominican Republic. And you know, he's a guy
Speaker 3: who wasn't protected from the Rule five draft a year ago.
Speaker 3: He wasn't major league ready obviously, so nobody took him.
Speaker 3: But that's where he's gotten to as a prospect. I mean,
Speaker 3: he wasn't making progress in the in the in the
Speaker 3: Yankee system, and and all of a sudden boom, now
Speaker 3: he's throwing ninety seven ninety eight with some really good secondaries.
Speaker 3: So the Giants have a guy that they that they
Speaker 3: can develop and hope can turn into something. And they
Speaker 3: just need as many of those guys as they can
Speaker 3: I think he was the number five ranked Yankees prospect.
Speaker 3: So and then of course kayden Ken is a guy
Speaker 3: that the Giants, you know, as Buster Posey told us yesterday,
Speaker 3: they wanted to they wanted to take with their fort
Speaker 3: round pick last year, and the Yankee scooped him up
Speaker 3: thirteen picks ahead of where they were going to go.
Speaker 3: So is that one a little bit of a you know,
Speaker 3: kind of a narrative, you know, play a little bit
Speaker 3: of a popular deal to get Kent's kid in in
Speaker 3: the fold? And you know, Tents had joked that he
Speaker 3: can't be all the way in as a Giant because
Speaker 3: you know, he still has to be a little bit
Speaker 3: of a Yankee fan. Well, now that's out of the way,
Speaker 3: and we know that they have Peyton bonds in the system.
Speaker 3: So the whole thing of Tenton bonds, you know, is
Speaker 3: there some of it that might be a little beyond
Speaker 3: you know, the nuts and bolts baseball? Yeah, you know,
Speaker 3: they say no, but I got to believe maybe there's
Speaker 3: a little bit of a lure there. So yeah, it's
Speaker 3: a fun thing to dream on. Fun stuff.
Speaker 1: Andy Bagley.
Speaker 2: By the way, we had Jeff Ken on last week
Speaker 2: and he had great audio. I know you'll probably talk
Speaker 2: to him, but he goes, he goes. He was talking
Speaker 2: about Cayden. He's man, Yeah, I told him he's two forty.
Speaker 2: I'm going to kill him. So he said he's got
Speaker 2: wants him to hit for a high average and move
Speaker 2: the ball around. He had a really good breakdown of him.
Speaker 2: You can of course find those at cambr dot com. Hey.
Speaker 2: A couple other things to get to is it was
Speaker 2: interesting that Buster went out of his way. None of
Speaker 2: you asked him, and he just said, I would like
Speaker 2: to flag and highlight Ramon Marquez of the Philadelphia Phillies.
Speaker 2: I thought it was interesting that he said that, and
Speaker 2: was that the one on the Arise trade that the
Speaker 2: industry sort of gave the Giants a golf clap on Huh.
Speaker 3: Well, look, I think that they were determined. However, the
Speaker 3: chips fell, and whoever was interested in the various players
Speaker 3: they wanted to feel like they came out of this
Speaker 3: trade deadline with one really really highly ranked pitching prospects
Speaker 3: wherever it came from, and Marquez was one of those
Speaker 3: guys on their list that they thought might be available
Speaker 3: but weren't sure. And for the Phillies. He was the
Speaker 3: one guy that they thought, Okay, a lot of teams
Speaker 3: are asking on him, He's probably going to be the
Speaker 3: one big chip that we use to get, you know,
Speaker 3: an offensive player who can really help our situation. And
Speaker 3: the Giants were the team that had the match, so
Speaker 3: I think they feel fortunate that, you know, they did
Speaker 3: find this match, they got the picture that they wanted
Speaker 3: because this is a guy, you know, he's still I
Speaker 3: think he's just twenty, and really a neat story. Are
Speaker 3: Charlotte Barnes who interned with the Chronicle actually recently and
Speaker 3: now she's covering the Phillies for us along with Matt
Speaker 3: gel who does they built do a tremendous job. They
Speaker 3: they saw this coming. It was so obvious that he
Speaker 3: was going to be traded that they wrote a feature
Speaker 3: a couple of days ago on him just to tell
Speaker 3: his backstory. And he was signed for you know, ten
Speaker 3: thousand dollars when they found him at you know, a
Speaker 3: tryout in in Merit of Mexico. So yeah, a really
Speaker 3: neat story, and he obviously turned himself very very quickly
Speaker 3: into somebody who opened eyes and became really their second
Speaker 3: best pitching prospect in their system, and you know, you
Speaker 3: get a guy with a really really plus change up.
Speaker 3: He can make, you know, lower minor league hitters look
Speaker 3: really silly. And that's exactly what's happening bags.
Speaker 4: Going back from the Patrick Bailey trade to the draft
Speaker 4: a couple of weeks ago to yesterday's trade deadline, how
Speaker 4: much better is the Giants overall farm system than it
Speaker 4: was to start the season.
Speaker 3: Oh. I think you also layer in performance. You know,
Speaker 3: whether it's Dakota Jordan or Gavin Keelan, the way the
Speaker 3: two kids josu Ar and Luis Gonzalez and Hernandez are
Speaker 3: starting out in the Complex League and now at San Jose,
Speaker 3: the way just the teams have played in one I
Speaker 3: know it's not exactly the number one metric you look at,
Speaker 3: but you know the fact that the teams are playing well,
Speaker 3: they're playing good baseball, they're complementing each other, well, those
Speaker 3: are habits that the Giants want to ingrain and it's happening.
Speaker 3: I think all those things are positives. And you know,
Speaker 3: it's been a really really bleak year and I think
Speaker 3: the only thing that kind of you know, maybe is
Speaker 3: the jewel in the crown is is there has been
Speaker 3: a lot of progress in the farm system, and this
Speaker 3: trade deadline, you know, only puts a little more air
Speaker 3: in the balloons. So where they're going to rank at
Speaker 3: the end of the year. And to be clear, you know,
Speaker 3: prospect rankings, farm system rankings, they don't matter. They're only concepts, right,
Speaker 3: I mean, there are any flags that fly forever based
Speaker 3: on where your system ranks, but it is a good
Speaker 3: barometer of just the health where you are. And I
Speaker 3: think that the Giants are very, very easily going to
Speaker 3: be a top ten system and some people think need
Speaker 3: to even top five from the year Summer four.
Speaker 2: Let's go Andy just a bit on this year's team,
Speaker 2: and you wrote a pretty really solid piece on Sunday
Speaker 2: just calling out the Giants handling of their pitching this year,
Speaker 2: from Tony Vitello to Frank Anderson to justin message to
Speaker 2: Christian Wonders Marks. I even highlighted a few of Andy's
Speaker 2: key phrases strategic shortcomings, misuse of resources, odd usage decisions,
Speaker 2: have not looked to exploit matchups. Those are just a
Speaker 2: few phrases that you used you felt the need to
Speaker 2: write out that you just called it out. Andy, I'll
Speaker 2: give you credit, You called him out, you backed it
Speaker 2: up with a lot of evidence of any number of
Speaker 2: odd bad decisions they've used in handling their pitching this year.
Speaker 2: I don't know if you got any feedback or how
Speaker 2: you feel about, you know, when you wrote the piece
Speaker 2: and what you would say the Giants fans about, you know,
Speaker 2: how they fix that? Is it about cleanon house? Does
Speaker 2: this pitching coach staff not last the rest of the year,
Speaker 2: Does Tony v have to get a lot better fast?
Speaker 2: What's the what's the takeaway from it?
Speaker 3: I think I think everything has to be on the
Speaker 3: tables because you know, they've just they've just really been
Speaker 3: inefficient with how they've used their pitching this year. And
Speaker 3: now you know, they're about to wade into two months
Speaker 3: with you know, really a shred of a rotation and
Speaker 3: they're going to have to really mix it up. And
Speaker 3: I think they're recognizing that, and you're going to start
Speaker 3: seeing that Blade said, well, starting tonight they are looking
Speaker 3: at using an opener for Adrian Hauser, which they should
Speaker 3: have been doing earlier this year. But you know, I
Speaker 3: think for me, it's just the little things at UH
Speaker 3: and you start wondering, are they do they really you
Speaker 3: know what's going on here, what's happening in the think tank,
Speaker 3: because you know, there's there's no reason Keaton Winn should
Speaker 3: be pitching the ninth inning of a sixteen to three
Speaker 3: game when he pitched the night before, especially when you
Speaker 3: don't have a day off the next day, and when
Speaker 3: and he's already been on the il for in playing
Speaker 3: Belbo because you used them three times in a row
Speaker 3: earlier this year. Which might have been the worst decision
Speaker 3: that you know, that group has made all year was
Speaker 3: taking out Logan Web, putting in you know, a gas
Speaker 3: heat and win and letting his elbow blow up while
Speaker 3: you lose a game. So yeah, you know what, It's just,
Speaker 3: I think we were so conditioned to see the Giant's
Speaker 3: mind for every little advantage and and really do a
Speaker 3: lot of pitching chaos to the point where you know,
Speaker 3: it kind of ticked off fans under far hansiety and
Speaker 3: and uh and gave Kapler and and they weren't They
Speaker 3: were so unconventional. You wanted to know who the starting
Speaker 3: pitcher was going to be the next day. And I
Speaker 3: think the Giants have over corrected themselves, just straight into
Speaker 3: a ditch. I mean, that's I think that's the phrase
Speaker 3: I used, and they got it. They got to examine
Speaker 3: that and whether that means changing personnel, whether that means
Speaker 3: changing the way that they do things, you know, you know,
Speaker 3: and however far up that goes. I mean, they have
Speaker 3: to pay attention to this because you know, we know
Speaker 3: the I think the way I phrased it was the
Speaker 3: who is a big question and who's going to be
Speaker 3: in the rotation the rest of the way, Who's going
Speaker 3: to be in the rotation next year? You know, who's
Speaker 3: who's going to be the candidates in camp next year.
Speaker 3: But that if the how doesn't change, then you're only
Speaker 3: going to get so much better.
Speaker 2: I think you said it perfectly and I think you're
Speaker 2: one hundred percent right on everything. So they're going to
Speaker 2: take a hard look at that at the end of
Speaker 2: the season and maybe make some changes. So all right, Andy,
Speaker 2: a lot covered and a lot more. Will do it
Speaker 2: again next week and keep reading in the Athletic. Thank you,
Speaker 2: thanks bgs.
Speaker 3: Yeah, thanks guys, take care.
Speaker 2: Of Yeah, Andy, Baggley Man so much covered there. Listen,
Speaker 2: we can get back to it. We got cooler content
Speaker 2: than a little check in on the football. Mike Sander
Speaker 2: did his quarterback tiers, and then of course more reaction
Speaker 2: to the trade deadline and Tim Flannery at nine thirty.
Speaker 2: So great Tuesday on the Sports Leader