WEBVTT - What's next for ethics and the profession? 0:00:07.680 --> 0:00:11.910 Hello, my name is Gillian Bowen and this is Small Firm, 0:00:11.910 --> 0:00:12.960 Big Impact. 0:00:20.420 --> 0:00:24.829 The importance of trying to set a very robust and 0:00:24.829 --> 0:00:30.620 good culture and governance within the firms so as to 0:00:30.620 --> 0:00:36.080 avoid that unethical behaviours, get a space there and may 0:00:36.080 --> 0:00:39.590 flourish there because the right instruments and the right tools 0:00:39.590 --> 0:00:41.900 and the right culture is not in place. 0:00:46.159 --> 0:00:49.250 It's the podcast giving Chartered Accountants the up to date 0:00:49.250 --> 0:00:52.610 information they need to do their jobs. Each episode, I 0:00:52.610 --> 0:00:56.840 share resources, tools and expert advice provided by Chartered Accountants 0:00:56.840 --> 0:01:00.500 Australia and New Zealand and a range of people across 0:01:00.500 --> 0:01:03.830 our profession. So get following the pod in your favourite 0:01:03.830 --> 0:01:14.020 podcast app. Let's start a conversation. Today we have Gabriela 0:01:14.020 --> 0:01:17.770 Figueiredo Dias, the Chair of the International Ethics Standards Board 0:01:17.770 --> 0:01:20.590 for Accountants, or IESBA, as it's known. She's in the 0:01:20.590 --> 0:01:25.539 studio with me at CA ANZ's headquarters. The topic: why she's 0:01:25.540 --> 0:01:28.990 in Australia, IESBA's focus for the next few years and 0:01:28.990 --> 0:01:32.500 how it will impact you. Gabriela, welcome to Small Firm, 0:01:32.500 --> 0:01:33.400 Big Impact. 0:01:33.400 --> 0:01:36.039 Thank you very much, Gillian. It's a pleasure to be here. 0:01:36.040 --> 0:01:38.860 For a quick refresher for our listeners, I thought it 0:01:38.860 --> 0:01:41.380 would be good for you to explain what is IESBA 0:01:41.380 --> 0:01:44.830 and how IESBA and say, the Australian and New Zealand, 0:01:44.830 --> 0:01:46.810 because we have listeners in New Zealand as well, how 0:01:46.810 --> 0:01:50.020 the Australian and New Zealand ethics boards for accountants are 0:01:50.020 --> 0:01:53.050 all connected. How how does it all come together? 0:01:53.530 --> 0:01:57.640 Well, the IESBA is the International Ethics Standards Board for Accountants. 0:01:57.640 --> 0:02:01.780 It's a global board. It's a global ethics standard setter. 0:02:01.780 --> 0:02:04.330 And of course it connects and relates with all the 0:02:04.330 --> 0:02:10.269 local uh, standard setters and professional organizations. This is a 0:02:10.270 --> 0:02:14.260 standard setter which sets standards for accountants, even if more 0:02:14.260 --> 0:02:18.850 recently we have been exploring the possibility of extending the 0:02:18.850 --> 0:02:21.820 application of the standards to other professionals. But typically this 0:02:21.820 --> 0:02:26.170 has been a board developing standards for accountants. And so 0:02:26.169 --> 0:02:30.010 all these organizations in Australia, like in any other countries, 0:02:30.010 --> 0:02:34.120 are very close work, very close with IESBA, but in many, 0:02:34.150 --> 0:02:37.240 by many means, these kind of opportunities that we are 0:02:37.240 --> 0:02:40.750 having now, we have a national standard setters group with 0:02:40.750 --> 0:02:45.910 whom we meet very regularly. Uh, we also speak with a, 0:02:45.910 --> 0:02:50.170 with a, with a these organizations as necessary. They relate 0:02:50.169 --> 0:02:52.990 with us by responding to our public consultations. So there 0:02:52.990 --> 0:02:55.450 is a very close relationship. 0:02:55.450 --> 0:02:58.390 So what's the purpose of your visit now and the 0:02:58.389 --> 0:03:00.040 purpose of the visit to Australia? 0:03:00.580 --> 0:03:04.600 Well, Gillian, outreach is fundamental for what we do. We 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:06.850 are a global standard setter again. So we need to 0:03:06.850 --> 0:03:10.390 understand what's happening in the jurisdictions, how stakeholders and the 0:03:10.389 --> 0:03:13.900 profession in particular feels about a lot of issues and 0:03:13.900 --> 0:03:19.179 and topics and our work. But very recently we have 0:03:19.180 --> 0:03:24.220 exposed a proposal for sustainability standards. We have published, uh, 0:03:24.460 --> 0:03:27.490 the new ethics standards for tax planning, and we are 0:03:27.490 --> 0:03:31.810 initiating a new work on firm culture and governance. And 0:03:31.810 --> 0:03:34.570 this made us feel that it was the right time 0:03:34.570 --> 0:03:38.080 to come to Australia. I'm going to other jurisdictions, but 0:03:38.080 --> 0:03:43.660 this one was a topical. Yeah. It was the right 0:03:43.690 --> 0:03:46.750 time to come here and speak with stakeholders. I'm speaking with, uh, 0:03:46.750 --> 0:03:52.720 the profession, professional organizations, uh, regulators, different regulators. Uh, so 0:03:52.720 --> 0:03:56.440 it's it's an incredible time here. A busy time, very 0:03:56.440 --> 0:04:00.040 busy time, very packed agenda. Exhausting, I must say, but, uh, 0:04:00.040 --> 0:04:01.990 but very fruitful so far. 0:04:01.990 --> 0:04:04.660 Yes, that's right. It's a really good opportunity, as you said, 0:04:04.660 --> 0:04:06.400 for people to be able to talk to you as 0:04:06.400 --> 0:04:09.730 well as you talking to them. So on that there's 0:04:09.730 --> 0:04:12.010 a lot to unpack there. And obviously the listeners of 0:04:12.010 --> 0:04:14.500 Small Firm, Big Impact will know we try to do 0:04:14.500 --> 0:04:15.940 as much as we can in 20 minutes or less. 0:04:15.940 --> 0:04:18.669 So we're having a good old crack here. What is 0:04:18.670 --> 0:04:22.240 your view on the application of ethics within the profession 0:04:22.240 --> 0:04:25.030 right now? And looking at it potentially as well, through 0:04:25.029 --> 0:04:26.710 a lens of Australia and New Zealand? 0:04:26.710 --> 0:04:30.040 Well, um, I think that there are improvement, improvements to 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:34.510 be made, but I'm positive about improvements being made. So I'm 0:04:34.690 --> 0:04:37.510 somewhere in between and we are somewhere in between being 0:04:37.510 --> 0:04:40.900 a little bit concerned about the need to the urgent 0:04:40.930 --> 0:04:44.320 need to uphold ethics in the profession, and a very 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:47.980 positive understanding of what's happening in terms of the awareness 0:04:47.980 --> 0:04:52.210 of the profession, of the importance of ethics. So, uh, 0:04:52.450 --> 0:04:57.280 discussions are being held, developments are being observed, and I 0:04:57.279 --> 0:05:00.790 think that we should be and we we can be 0:05:00.790 --> 0:05:03.460 positive and optimistic about the future. 0:05:03.460 --> 0:05:05.620 And that sounds to me as well, that you're aware 0:05:05.620 --> 0:05:08.380 of the work that professional bodies are doing in this space. 0:05:08.380 --> 0:05:10.930 And I'm thinking in particular through the lens of CA ANZ, 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:14.410 the actions and and the movements that CA ANZ has been 0:05:14.410 --> 0:05:17.589 doing to ensure that it's active in this conversation and 0:05:17.589 --> 0:05:20.049 is taking steps to ensure that its members are doing 0:05:20.050 --> 0:05:21.130 the right thing. 0:05:21.550 --> 0:05:26.350 Yeah. CA ANZ, like is, is actually very active in the 0:05:26.350 --> 0:05:29.440 conversations with, uh, with the IESBA. But this is a 0:05:29.440 --> 0:05:31.870 very particular moment, I would say, because we have, as 0:05:31.870 --> 0:05:34.599 you can imagine, a lot of organizations around the world 0:05:34.600 --> 0:05:40.029 connecting with us. And, um, what we could see yesterday and, 0:05:40.150 --> 0:05:43.900 and today as well, in the different moments where I 0:05:43.900 --> 0:05:47.830 had me and my colleagues had the opportunity to be 0:05:47.830 --> 0:05:52.720 with the CA ANZ and the representatives and members is a relevant, 0:05:52.870 --> 0:05:57.580 important interest in ethics, a very well understanding of what 0:05:57.580 --> 0:06:00.429 the IESBA is doing in this space, and awareness of 0:06:00.430 --> 0:06:04.450 the problems and of the opportunities for the profession. So 0:06:04.450 --> 0:06:06.370 I think they are playing a very good role. 0:06:06.370 --> 0:06:07.390 Mhm, mhm mhm. 0:06:07.630 --> 0:06:13.510 The IESBA Strategy and Work Plan has recently been finalized, April, 0:06:13.510 --> 0:06:15.820 I believe it was. And that was after consultation. And 0:06:15.820 --> 0:06:18.130 I note for those listening along, CA ANZ fed into that 0:06:18.130 --> 0:06:20.589 so I'll put a link to our, um, involvement. It's 0:06:20.589 --> 0:06:22.989 an extensive document. We cannot talk about it in this 0:06:22.990 --> 0:06:26.710 short time. Is there something like maybe three, three takeaways 0:06:26.710 --> 0:06:28.900 or two takeaways, maybe even one takeaway, if that's all 0:06:28.900 --> 0:06:31.210 we have time for tha accountants in Australia and New 0:06:31.210 --> 0:06:32.560 Zealand should know about. 0:06:33.400 --> 0:06:37.450 Well, I won't call them probably takeaways but I would 0:06:37.450 --> 0:06:41.020 I would highlight two topics which are the two main 0:06:41.020 --> 0:06:45.190 strategic topics that we have identified for the next four years, 0:06:45.190 --> 0:06:48.070 for the years, but to do work on. And these 0:06:48.070 --> 0:06:51.460 topics are the firm's culture and governance and the possible 0:06:51.460 --> 0:06:55.360 extension or expansion of the applicability of the code to 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:58.870 non-professional accountants. These are the main strategic topics. Then within 0:06:58.870 --> 0:07:01.210 these topics we are going to develop work. So it's 0:07:01.210 --> 0:07:04.480 very early days. So I'm not able to say what, 0:07:04.480 --> 0:07:07.960 but what I think that the firms and the professional 0:07:07.960 --> 0:07:14.620 accountants should retain is one, the importance of trying to 0:07:14.620 --> 0:07:19.060 set a very robust and good culture and governance within 0:07:19.060 --> 0:07:25.450 the firms so as to avoid that unethical behaviors, get 0:07:25.450 --> 0:07:31.120 a space there and may flourish there um, because the 0:07:31.120 --> 0:07:34.000 right instruments and the right tools and the right culture 0:07:34.000 --> 0:07:36.220 is not in place. And the second, which is related 0:07:36.220 --> 0:07:40.270 to this one, is that accountants, professional accountants are subject 0:07:40.270 --> 0:07:43.780 to the code of ethics. The IESBA develops ethics standards 0:07:43.780 --> 0:07:48.040 for the professional accountants. But there are other professionals, other 0:07:48.040 --> 0:07:51.400 people doing the same services. So it's in the interest 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:54.580 of everybody, namely of the profession and of the users, 0:07:54.580 --> 0:07:57.430 of the information of the for the public interest that 0:07:57.430 --> 0:08:01.150 there is a common, consistent framework applying to all of 0:08:01.150 --> 0:08:05.230 them to avoid that some of them have are subject 0:08:05.230 --> 0:08:09.640 to a robust set of standards, ethics standards, and the 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:13.000 others can be doing the same thing without abiding by 0:08:13.000 --> 0:08:19.390 any ethics standards or more, uh, more fragile ethics approaches. 0:08:19.390 --> 0:08:22.750 So this is important not only from a level playing 0:08:22.750 --> 0:08:26.950 field perspective to put them all in, in the same, 0:08:26.950 --> 0:08:30.190 in the same situation, but mostly for the public interest, 0:08:30.190 --> 0:08:33.430 because it avoids investors and other users of the information 0:08:33.429 --> 0:08:37.450 to be protected against any kind of wrongdoing and etc. 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:40.030 irrespective of who is providing the information. 0:08:40.030 --> 0:08:43.720 How do you get to that point of a common, 0:08:43.720 --> 0:08:47.950 consistent framework? Is that what you will plot out or 0:08:47.950 --> 0:08:50.650 work towards as this framework goes on in the next 0:08:50.650 --> 0:08:51.460 few years? 0:08:51.460 --> 0:08:55.240 Well, we will explore how much we can do and 0:08:55.240 --> 0:08:57.640 we should do in that respect. I'm not saying that 0:08:57.640 --> 0:09:01.170 this is going to change dramatically over the next 2 0:09:01.170 --> 0:09:04.150 or 3 years. This is the start of a journey 0:09:04.150 --> 0:09:07.990 where we will explore together with our stakeholders, stakeholders and 0:09:07.990 --> 0:09:11.170 namely with the profession, which we have already been doing, 0:09:11.170 --> 0:09:13.510 how much this is necessary and what we can do 0:09:13.510 --> 0:09:18.070 in that respect. Anyway, I see that there is a 0:09:18.070 --> 0:09:24.850 considerable relevant space where this may happen again for the 0:09:24.850 --> 0:09:27.460 public interest, but also in the interest of the profession. 0:09:27.490 --> 0:09:28.180 Mhm, mhm. 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:32.080 You've used the word 'agility'. I'm not sure if you've 0:09:32.080 --> 0:09:34.750 read the foreword recently of the, of the document, but 0:09:34.750 --> 0:09:36.460 the word that you put in there or the word 0:09:36.460 --> 0:09:38.620 that you say is your word for the next four 0:09:38.620 --> 0:09:41.950 years is agility. Why is that? 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:49.330 I think it's, uh, well, agility because the world is changing. 0:09:49.330 --> 0:09:53.380 The IESBA is not an island. We don't work in the vacuum. 0:09:53.380 --> 0:09:57.370 We observe the developments around us, the changes, the the 0:09:57.370 --> 0:10:03.850 the opportunities, the the threats, the risks. And we respond actively, 0:10:03.850 --> 0:10:07.420 proactively or reactively to these changes. Now the world is 0:10:07.420 --> 0:10:10.900 changing very quickly. Things are happening that we could never, 0:10:10.900 --> 0:10:14.079 never imagine. A few years ago we had Covid, we 0:10:14.080 --> 0:10:17.680 had the Ukraine war. Now we have the Middle East 0:10:17.679 --> 0:10:19.150 war and all these things 0:10:19.150 --> 0:10:19.780 inflation... 0:10:19.780 --> 0:10:25.600 inflation, geographic geopolitical tensions, uh, a lot of things, climate change, 0:10:25.780 --> 0:10:28.630 which is not one of the minor risks, that one's 0:10:28.630 --> 0:10:32.140 not going changes. So what we can do upon a 0:10:32.140 --> 0:10:36.220 very extensive consultation to our stakeholders and our own reflection, 0:10:36.220 --> 0:10:38.380 is to set a strategy and work plan for the 0:10:38.380 --> 0:10:41.920 next four years, which is what we can where we 0:10:41.920 --> 0:10:45.760 are now understand, uh, to be the areas where we 0:10:45.760 --> 0:10:48.430 can be more relevant. But we are very well aware 0:10:48.429 --> 0:10:51.699 that this may change very quickly. There may be developments 0:10:51.700 --> 0:10:55.480 that we are not expecting, which may, uh, um, force 0:10:55.480 --> 0:11:00.340 us to reprioritize our initiatives or even to put them, 0:11:00.340 --> 0:11:03.430 some of them on hold and replace them by initiatives 0:11:03.429 --> 0:11:06.070 and areas of work that we have not, uh, uh, 0:11:06.070 --> 0:11:09.220 we had not foreseen. So our stakeholders should be ready 0:11:09.220 --> 0:11:13.420 to accept that, because traditionally it's not the way IESBA 0:11:13.420 --> 0:11:17.170 was working, but we have to change as the world changes. 0:11:17.170 --> 0:11:19.030 So that's why the agility. 0:11:19.030 --> 0:11:19.599 I think that's a. 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:21.760 Good takeaway from anything that we do that we want. 0:11:21.790 --> 0:11:24.220 We don't want to keep doing something just because we 0:11:24.220 --> 0:11:26.260 said we would if it no longer makes sense because 0:11:26.260 --> 0:11:29.290 you've got improved information, I think that's an important takeaway 0:11:29.290 --> 0:11:31.479 for me, no matter what you're doing. Look, two questions 0:11:31.480 --> 0:11:33.340 to go because I'm conscious we're almost out of time 0:11:33.340 --> 0:11:36.910 and I'm trying to keep it short, snappy and happy. Um, 0:11:37.270 --> 0:11:39.579 I think it's important because of the listeners that we've 0:11:39.580 --> 0:11:42.609 got to talk about the work that you've been doing 0:11:42.610 --> 0:11:44.980 on tax planning and related services. You mentioned it at 0:11:44.980 --> 0:11:48.010 the start, but what is it that you're doing in 0:11:48.010 --> 0:11:50.620 that space, and how is that relevant to people who 0:11:50.620 --> 0:11:53.410 might work in smaller or medium sized firms rather than 0:11:53.410 --> 0:11:54.459 in the big firms? 0:11:54.460 --> 0:11:58.059 Well, I think that this work will be relevant to everybody. 0:11:58.059 --> 0:11:58.599 Love that... 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:02.020 ...to be to be frank, these are very recently issued 0:12:02.020 --> 0:12:06.579 published ethics standards, ethics standards for tax planning. They were 0:12:06.580 --> 0:12:09.280 published last month after the approval of the PIOB, the 0:12:09.280 --> 0:12:13.120 public interest (oversight board), not the approval, the certification of the PIOB. 0:12:13.120 --> 0:12:17.980 And we are exactly now rolling out, making professional accountants 0:12:17.980 --> 0:12:21.250 aware of the existence of these standards and making them 0:12:21.250 --> 0:12:24.429 understand how they work. The idea of these standards is 0:12:24.429 --> 0:12:28.480 to provide all professional accountants ... I mean, professional accountants 0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:32.290 in business or professional accountants in public practice, with a 0:12:32.290 --> 0:12:36.040 very robust framework for to help them navigate the ethical 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:40.059 dilemmas that they may face when providing tax planning services. 0:12:40.059 --> 0:12:43.360 It's not about what's forbidden, because what's forbidden is forbidden. 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:47.920 It's it's illegal so that's not our space. What's absolutely 0:12:47.920 --> 0:12:50.890 and clearly legal and acceptable. It's not our space. Our 0:12:50.890 --> 0:12:53.590 space is the space in between what we call the 0:12:53.590 --> 0:12:58.150 gray area that is very relevant in this space and which, um, 0:12:58.300 --> 0:13:03.370 speaks to these problems or these moments where the tax 0:13:03.370 --> 0:13:07.420 planning provider knows that something can be legal or can 0:13:07.510 --> 0:13:13.120 be considered illegal. But beyond the legality, the pure legality 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:19.059 of the of the situation, there are ethical considerations to be, uh, taken, uh, 0:13:19.240 --> 0:13:23.350 to be to be to be well, to be considered. Mm. Uh, 0:13:23.350 --> 0:13:27.370 if I may. So, uh, and this is exactly what 0:13:27.370 --> 0:13:30.429 we are trying to help professional accountants do and to 0:13:30.429 --> 0:13:33.550 protect them, to protect the public interest, of course, to 0:13:33.550 --> 0:13:37.870 protect their clients and to protect themselves against the consequences 0:13:37.870 --> 0:13:42.010 of any actions, any situations where they provide they provide 0:13:42.010 --> 0:13:46.150 tax services, tax planning services. And this can be considered 0:13:46.150 --> 0:13:50.020 not only illegal, but more than that unethical and create 0:13:50.020 --> 0:13:58.360 severe reputational issues, financial, uh, consequences against the provider and 0:13:58.360 --> 0:14:03.700 the profession more generally. So it's really a framework which 0:14:03.700 --> 0:14:07.060 is conceived for the public interest. That's what we work for, 0:14:07.059 --> 0:14:11.500 but that we, uh, suppose, imagine and and believe that 0:14:11.500 --> 0:14:15.640 will help immensely professional accountants in the, in the in 0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:18.910 providing tax services. Now the question is should they apply 0:14:18.910 --> 0:14:22.270 to others as well, not only to tax planning to 0:14:22.270 --> 0:14:27.160 professional accountants providing tax planning services. Yeah, we encourage that 0:14:27.160 --> 0:14:32.140 the application and adoption by others consultants, lawyers uh, namely 0:14:32.140 --> 0:14:36.340 which are doing exactly the same thing, but to whom 0:14:36.340 --> 0:14:41.440 these standards don't apply directly. In an ideal world, all 0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:45.310 of them would be abiding by the same ethical standard 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:50.290 and taking the same considerations into their work when providing 0:14:50.320 --> 0:14:51.370 tax planning services. 0:14:51.670 --> 0:14:54.790 I like that um, line you explained there. I think 0:14:54.790 --> 0:14:57.130 it sums up your work really well, the area or 0:14:57.130 --> 0:15:00.310 the space in between. And that is where people get 0:15:00.310 --> 0:15:02.980 into trouble and need and need the guidance. So then 0:15:02.980 --> 0:15:05.170 you've touched on it a little. My final question before 0:15:05.170 --> 0:15:08.860 we wrap up then is, um, what do you think 0:15:08.860 --> 0:15:12.760 the impact will be on accountants, um, in their day 0:15:12.760 --> 0:15:15.729 to day with this work that you're doing in this space? 0:15:15.730 --> 0:15:17.950 I think it's going to be a very positive impact. 0:15:17.950 --> 0:15:22.450 There are some, some situations where, uh, professional accountants may 0:15:22.450 --> 0:15:25.120 think that this is an additional burden or additional things 0:15:25.120 --> 0:15:28.090 that they have to do. This is really about bringing, 0:15:28.090 --> 0:15:33.400 putting in a very objective and clear way how a process, 0:15:33.400 --> 0:15:37.060 a certain approach to the work that they should take 0:15:37.060 --> 0:15:39.010 to avoid problems, to put it in a very simple 0:15:39.010 --> 0:15:43.090 way to avoid significant problems for the public interest and 0:15:43.090 --> 0:15:47.110 for themselves, that may arise of a inadvertently most of 0:15:47.110 --> 0:15:51.550 the times of uh, conducts behaviors in providing, uh, tax 0:15:51.550 --> 0:15:59.020 planning services, which may result from a purely automatic, uh, um, 0:15:59.230 --> 0:16:03.160 legal approach to the, to the law. 0:16:03.220 --> 0:16:04.060 Um, now 0:16:04.060 --> 0:16:06.760 I've asked all the questions. Is there anything that you 0:16:06.760 --> 0:16:09.760 would like to say about anything that you haven't had 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:11.020 the opportunity to say yet before we go? 0:16:11.930 --> 0:16:15.110 Well, I think that, uh, my message is always, uh, 0:16:15.110 --> 0:16:17.600 the same. I think that what I'd like to say 0:16:17.600 --> 0:16:21.110 is that I'd like to see, uh, the profession, um, 0:16:21.260 --> 0:16:26.570 upholding ethics and, uh, more and more taking ethics into 0:16:26.570 --> 0:16:29.690 the centre of everything they do and realize that this 0:16:29.690 --> 0:16:33.380 is really a systemic risk and a great opportunity for 0:16:33.380 --> 0:16:37.160 them to make a difference. So I want the, the, 0:16:37.160 --> 0:16:42.890 the profession to become, uh, ethical champions, not only compliance. 0:16:42.890 --> 0:16:43.460 I love that. 0:16:43.460 --> 0:16:45.710 Look. We've tried to pack a lot into a short time. 0:16:45.710 --> 0:16:47.390 This is all we have time for. I'll put a 0:16:47.390 --> 0:16:50.360 link to the IESBA Strategy and Work Plan into the 0:16:50.360 --> 0:16:53.450 podcast episode, show notes, as well as a link to 0:16:53.450 --> 0:16:57.619 the CA ANZ submission for anyone wanting to read any more information. 0:16:57.620 --> 0:16:59.930 And our team, of course, will continue to communicate with 0:16:59.930 --> 0:17:02.990 you about how this work impacts you through the usual 0:17:02.990 --> 0:17:06.200 ways obviously newsletters, webinars, events, etc. so if you aren't 0:17:06.200 --> 0:17:09.680 receiving the information you need, please check your communication preferences 0:17:09.680 --> 0:17:11.959 in MyCA. There'll be a link to that in the 0:17:11.960 --> 0:17:14.060 show notes as well. If you want to get in 0:17:14.060 --> 0:17:20.510 touch with the podcast, email us podcast@charteredaccountantsanz.com and follow the pod. 0:17:20.510 --> 0:17:24.440 Let's start a conversation. Thank you Gabriela Figueiredo Dias for 0:17:24.440 --> 0:17:27.200 being my guest on Small Firm, Big Impact. 0:17:27.200 --> 0:17:28.250 Thank you. 0:17:28.250 --> 0:17:29.300 Bye bye.