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Speaker 1: Do you want to be an American? Plon me back

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Speaker 1: on seven hundred. W welw.

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Speaker 2: I don't have to tell you about care costs, and

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Speaker 2: justin like since two thousand, they the number there has tripled.

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Speaker 1: In most cases, we're tied.

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Speaker 2: I'm just talking about healthcare, but pharmaceuticals and everything, and

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Speaker 2: we know what's kind of driving that. Congress is allegedly

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Speaker 2: addressing it and trying to make things more affordable. I

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Speaker 2: don't know how that's going to work with the HSAS.

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Speaker 2: It's a big question. And we've talked to a lot

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Speaker 2: of people at the receiving end, patients like me and you,

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Speaker 2: healthcare providers, doctors, nurses, et cetera. Very well, very rarely

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Speaker 2: we get a chance to talk to somebody on the inside,

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Speaker 2: and we do today.

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Speaker 1: It's Beth Kaiser.

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Speaker 2: She's the West region president for Anthem, Blue Cross, Blue Shield,

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Speaker 2: joining the show. Good morning, How are you, Beth?

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Speaker 3: Good morning Scott. It's nice to be with you there

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Speaker 3: in Ohio.

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Speaker 2: When you think about the most hated institutions in America,

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Speaker 2: you know, even above maybe politicians and trial ors, certainly

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Speaker 2: the healthcare professionals like yourself come to mind. We saw

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Speaker 2: the assassination of healthcare CEO. And additionally, there are constant,

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Speaker 2: NonStop stories about people who pay their premiums and yet

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Speaker 2: they're denied coverage even when it's life saving. And you know,

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Speaker 2: someone in the media or online gets involved and you

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Speaker 2: guys reverse your policy and it's a black eye and

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Speaker 2: it feels like it's coming at you every single day.

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Speaker 2: How are you guys responding to and feeling this pressure?

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Speaker 3: Beth, I would say that all stakeholders are filling pressure

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Speaker 3: now too. Have you know, the affordability of health care

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Speaker 3: be an issue and so you know what we say

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Speaker 3: at Anthem is Anthem Blue Cross, Blue Shield, is that

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Speaker 3: unaffordable healthcare is inaccessible healthcare. So it's a critical time

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Speaker 3: for us.

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Speaker 2: What is the latest affordability to numbers that you guys

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Speaker 2: do internally show? And how do our auto pocket increases

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Speaker 2: in Ohio, Kentucky and Indiana compared to other states outside

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Speaker 2: the Midwest.

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Speaker 3: Gosh, and you know some people follow the rand study

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Speaker 3: from years ago, but certainly shows that there's plenty of

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Speaker 3: work for both of our states to do. But just

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Speaker 3: to give you some facts, the US healthcare spending grew

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Speaker 3: seven and a half percent in twenty twenty three, reaching

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Speaker 3: nearly four point nine trillion, and as you know, that's

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Speaker 3: continued to escalate. Prescription drugs spending alone increase more than

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Speaker 3: eleven percent last year. So these trends are putting significant

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Speaker 3: strains own individuals, employers, and government programs.

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Speaker 2: And we also, let's face this demographic demographic issue. As

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Speaker 2: baby boomers get older and older, they're going to use more,

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Speaker 2: need more care, and there are a few people at

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Speaker 2: the end to pay for that, and so it overwhelms

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Speaker 2: the system. And then you factor in people who need assistance,

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Speaker 2: and it it's even worse.

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Speaker 4: This is true.

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Speaker 3: So that's one of the reasons addressing people's health from

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Speaker 3: a holistic standpoint, looking at whole health is so important.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's part of the Republican plan. But I

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Speaker 2: don't dismiss that because we all have a stake in

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Speaker 2: our health. But I mean, let's face it, if the

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Speaker 2: healthcare plan is, hey, take better care of yourself and

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Speaker 2: your incentives to do so, that that's fine. But so

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Speaker 2: many people, and it seems seemingly there's a story every

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Speaker 2: day about someone who's you know, the drug cost for

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Speaker 2: something for their kid or a loved one is so

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Speaker 2: exorbitant they have to file for bankruptcy.

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Speaker 1: That shouldn't be happening, but it is.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And delaying and skipping care can affect people in

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Speaker 3: the healthcare system as well. So we have to keep

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Speaker 3: it affordable because if those health issues that individuals have

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Speaker 3: worsen are they become harder to treat, they certainly become

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Speaker 3: more expensive as well. And so that a lot of

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Speaker 3: people think, well, that only impacts the individual, but actually

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Speaker 3: it impacts more than the individual's health outcomes. It puts

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Speaker 3: a strain on the broader healthcare system and it drives

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Speaker 3: up costs for.

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Speaker 4: All of us.

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Speaker 2: How do you determine who gets care for some specific

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Speaker 2: disease lets, I don't know. It might be I mentioned

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Speaker 2: the horror stories, right that someone who's denied care clearly

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Speaker 2: they're sick. It becomes a news story, goes viral, and

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Speaker 2: then all of a sudden and maybe not you guys,

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Speaker 2: but another healthcare insurance make insured, maybe like yourself, and

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Speaker 2: others will go ay, okay, well we're going to take

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Speaker 2: care of this person because of public pressure in.

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Speaker 1: The outcome, right, how are those decisions made at the

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Speaker 1: granular level?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say many employers, individuals, families are determining

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Speaker 3: how do they access healthcare, how do they make it affordable?

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Speaker 3: And so we are addressing that by the first looking

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Speaker 3: to see the factors that are causing the increase health

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Speaker 3: care costs, and those factors include an aging population, people

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Speaker 3: with increased chronic conditions like you mentioned, Scott, escalating drug prices,

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Speaker 3: provider consolidation, fraud and abuse, as well as ongoing legislative changes.

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Speaker 3: And then we're working to address that with the stakeholders

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Speaker 3: that you mentioned as well.

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Speaker 2: She's Beth Kaiser, she's a president of Blue Cross Blue

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Speaker 2: Shields and and Blue Cross Blue Shield West Region president.

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Speaker 2: Talking about health care costs and the insurance end of

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Speaker 2: this thing. One of the other elements here is hospital consolidation.

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Speaker 2: We've seen that accelerate tremendously here in our region, Beth,

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Speaker 2: and how does that help with rates? And we also

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Speaker 2: worry about rural areas too. We're in Cincinnati, you're out

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Speaker 2: in Indye, but there's a lot of country between us

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Speaker 2: and you and across both of these states as well

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Speaker 2: as Kentucky where rural hospitals and clinics are closing it

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Speaker 2: record amounts.

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Speaker 3: How do we address that, yeah, and unfortunately, you know

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Speaker 3: a lot of people think just what you mentioned that

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Speaker 3: when healthcare providers going together, it may be lower costs,

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Speaker 3: but often it means that patients have fewer choices and

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Speaker 3: the prices actually go up. So what we're doing at

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Speaker 3: ANT and Blue Cross Blue Shield to address those challenges

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Speaker 3: is we're prioritizing strategies that protect affordability and enhance the

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Speaker 3: value for our members. And the way we're doing that

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Speaker 3: is we're creating benefits and contracts with our provider partners

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Speaker 3: that give people access to mini quality providers, and at

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Speaker 3: the same time, we're helping focus on the think using

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Speaker 3: AI and data to make sure that we're cutting waste

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Speaker 3: and avoiding unnecessary treatment, which also helps keep costs down.

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Speaker 3: But when I speak specifically to waste and fraud and waste,

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Speaker 3: there's things that now with AI as well as that

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Speaker 3: we're allowed through billing to look at for unusual charges

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Speaker 3: that may have occurred in the system, such as phantom

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Speaker 3: billing where they're built for a service that didn't occur,

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Speaker 3: double billing where they're bill twice, and then upcoding where

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Speaker 3: they're charged for a service at a higher rate than

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Speaker 3: what was provided.

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Speaker 2: One of the things you hear from government on this

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Speaker 2: Beth is waste frawed abuse, waste fraud abuse constantly. But

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Speaker 2: you know, I always contended that if you're a business

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Speaker 2: like you are, and you're in the business of providing healthcare,

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Speaker 2: but you have to be profitable, uh in you you

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Speaker 2: probably do a better job than anyone as far as

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Speaker 2: that and making sure that those people who are using

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Speaker 2: the care, or vendors particularly are getting what they deserve,

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Speaker 2: but not more or less.

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Speaker 4: We do.

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Speaker 3: It's important though, I mean, you know, we want to

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Speaker 3: make sure we're looking at individuals and members in their

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Speaker 3: whole health, so helping them remain healthy longer in life

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Speaker 3: and helping them have a tool and the support they need.

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Speaker 3: Where in the past we were much you know, we

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Speaker 3: were known, how plans were know more for you know,

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Speaker 3: just managing the quality, the costs and administration of billing.

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Speaker 3: We feel at Anton Blue Cross we shield that we

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Speaker 3: have a larger role to play.

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Speaker 2: Let's segue to pharmacy benefits. That's a big one. PDM's right.

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Speaker 2: Pharmacy benefit managers not quite sure what they do, but

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Speaker 2: they drive the cost up. That is the constant cry.

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Speaker 2: I guess that you probably hear. What percentage of premium

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Speaker 2: increases can you attribute to prescription drug costs and specifically,

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Speaker 2: how do.

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Speaker 1: You address that?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mentioned just a minute ago that the prescription

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Speaker 3: drug spending alone has increased more than eleven percent from

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Speaker 3: last year. But what specifically We've been focused on negotiating

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Speaker 3: lower costs around specialty pharmacy as well. That's an important

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Speaker 3: area for us, and our responsibility is to negotiate lower price.

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Speaker 2: You know that's the model, but seemingly prices continue to

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Speaker 2: spiral upward.

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Speaker 1: Where's that coming from?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I would just say that, I mean, we all

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Speaker 3: want we all want access to the best and to

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Speaker 3: the latest, and we want to make sure we give

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Speaker 3: our members access. So we feel like as we negotiate

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Speaker 3: for better drug costs, especially around the specialty costs, that

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Speaker 3: we can bring those costs down.

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Speaker 2: I've had this happen personal experience, family experience with this

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Speaker 2: to where there's times where insurance and we're Anthem Blue

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Speaker 2: Crossbow Shield where we work here at iHeart and have

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Speaker 2: very good coverage. I can't complain. Some people, obviously you

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Speaker 2: don't have that, maybe your experience varies, but pay a

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Speaker 2: fair amount of money for that. Absolutely. When it comes

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Speaker 2: to the pharmacy, though, I've noticed at times where we'll

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Speaker 2: go in and say, okay, here's your prescription. Well how

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Speaker 2: much do I pay out of pocket? And it's less?

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Speaker 2: Or if I use something like good orax with it,

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Speaker 2: which is like a discount. Why would that occur if

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Speaker 2: indeed we're negotiating the lowest prices? Why do Why are

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Speaker 2: some medicines cheaper if you get them out of pocket

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Speaker 2: or use a discount.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that it depends upon the individual. So

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Speaker 3: in your I mean, this is the reason it's so

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Speaker 3: important for us to be talking about affordability because without

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Speaker 3: I mean, the individual's portion of being engaged and involved

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Speaker 3: in their health and understanding what tools, what discounts, what

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Speaker 3: their benefit structure looks like, helps them to be a

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Speaker 3: more empowered member and to your point, be aware of

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Speaker 3: costly option.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: We're talking to Beth Guiser this morning on the Scots

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Speaker 2: Loan Show seven hundred wol she's a regional president for

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Speaker 2: Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield talking to Ensure about what

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Speaker 2: can be done about high costs and always, almost always

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Speaker 2: we blame the insurance companies, but there's a lot driving

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Speaker 2: that as well, and we're kind of getting into this

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Speaker 2: morning here on the show in a limited time that

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Speaker 2: we have. One of the other questions too, is surprise

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Speaker 2: medical billing. You know, Trump in his first term said hey,

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Speaker 2: we know we're going to disclose prices. You're going to

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Speaker 2: know what you're get coming in and still most of

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Speaker 2: those metrics have not been hit. That is a huge

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Speaker 2: complaint before federal legislation, and we've had a you know,

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Speaker 2: the President doing that and moving even more I think

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Speaker 2: in this term to do that. But we're sti getting

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Speaker 2: unexpected bills and costs despite the reforms. Why does that

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Speaker 2: remain problematic?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: I would just say, first, we fully support the No

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Speaker 3: Surprises Act because the intention was for it to protect

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Speaker 3: patients from receiving surprise to healthcare bills. But as you mentioned, Scott,

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Speaker 3: there have been some issues, some unintended consequences, some fraudulent

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Speaker 3: behavior that have unintentionally raised those costs. And so we're

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Speaker 3: committed at ANS and Blue Crossley Shield to fixing the

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Speaker 3: No Surprises Act, and in twenty twenty six we'll introduce

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Speaker 3: the policy with hospitalists or curb out of network specialists

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Speaker 3: billing through in network facilities and so this will aid

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Speaker 3: those specialists in wanting to join our networks, which will

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Speaker 3: lower patient costs and whole facilities accountable for repeated non

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Speaker 3: emergency use of out of network and so that will

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Speaker 3: drive down healthcare costs personally. So you can't do that,

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Speaker 3: Scott though, without thoughtful collaboration with our hospitals and our providers,

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Speaker 3: right right, that's the key path to our affordability.

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Speaker 2: Well, you have the collaboration, and I know there's price

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Speaker 2: transparency tools out there and they're required, but the data,

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Speaker 2: and maybe it's because it's new, few consumers use them effectively.

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Speaker 2: Are they confusing? And you know what's driving that? Are

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Speaker 2: more people adopting it or just simply they don't know.

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Speaker 3: We're seeing adoption, least specifically with our Sydney app. We're

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Speaker 3: seeing great adoption because because of the unaffordability, many members

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Speaker 3: are wanting to understand their benefit options.

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Speaker 2: I brought this up before and I would love your

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Speaker 2: unvarnished point of view on this this. You know, I

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Speaker 2: go to my do we go to our doctor. You

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Speaker 2: look in there, Okay, I've got a doctor. Maybe he

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Speaker 2: has a PA or a nurse or something like that.

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Speaker 2: And then you have five five people who just handle

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Speaker 2: coating and billing and insurance and medicare and medicaiding and

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Speaker 2: all that stuff, and as we know, it drives costs up.

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Speaker 2: I always use the parallel to you know, you bring

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Speaker 2: your dog into a vet and you know, canines felines

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Speaker 2: use some and sometimes the same medicine or overlapping menage,

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Speaker 2: and you look at that and go, Okay, that's pretty

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Speaker 2: affordable my dog, cat or whatever.

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Speaker 1: It comes to me.

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Speaker 2: There's paperwork, there's bills that come for the next six, seven,

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Speaker 2: eight months, and you forget what they're for, and it's

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Speaker 2: this whole mess. If we simply took the edict and

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Speaker 2: made it an edict for employers in America, Listen, you're

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Speaker 2: no longer in the business of providing health insurance. Can

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Speaker 2: offer health insurance you got buy in the free market.

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Speaker 2: Is that better for you guys? Is it better for

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Speaker 2: the patient?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I believe that the reason that we want

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Speaker 3: to make sure people remain covered is because if it

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Speaker 3: becomes unaffordable for individuals. In some cases, many people are

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Speaker 3: very reliant on their employer to help subsidize their healthcare calls.

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Speaker 3: And again, as I mentioned earlier, if unaffordable healthcare will

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Speaker 3: become inaccessible health care. So it's important that they get

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Speaker 3: the resources they need. And I think to your point

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Speaker 3: on data, and I mean, how we need to become

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Speaker 3: more efficient and effective with the way we work in healthcare.

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Speaker 3: That's a job for all of us. And we're doing

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Speaker 3: our part at Anton Blue Cross Blue Shield by adopting AI,

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Speaker 3: by adopting new data technologies, and providing coordination with our

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Speaker 3: provider partners so that we have access to the whole view,

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Speaker 3: to the whole health view of you, Scott, so that

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Speaker 3: we can see your health holistically and that we can

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Speaker 3: help aid in keeping you healthier longer.

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Speaker 6: Right.

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Speaker 2: But I guess the question is more about compliance and

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Speaker 2: things like you You still have to obviously address compliance issues,

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Speaker 2: but it seems there's a lot of things elements involved,

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Speaker 2: particularly the government in our healthcare. Why can't I just

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Speaker 2: buy a plan directly from you and like minded people

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Speaker 2: do that. I think we'd save enough money in the

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Speaker 2: long run to be able to take care of the

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Speaker 2: indigen and the people who really need it. Looking ahead

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Speaker 2: five years, what do you and it's just going to

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Speaker 2: continue to get worse. I mean, we're going to start

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Speaker 2: to see things level off or is it just simply

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Speaker 2: a matter of demographics that I started with, where you're

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Speaker 2: going to see baby boomers as they age out and

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Speaker 2: eventually pass, we have a younger generation coming in replacing

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Speaker 2: them as old folks, and so it goes. Is it

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Speaker 2: simply just a numbers game that way, or is it

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Speaker 2: going to level out in the next five or ten years.

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Speaker 3: Well, my optimistic to use Scott is that we're going

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Speaker 3: to work together the stakeholders. They appreciate how urgent this is.

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Speaker 3: Individuals understand that they certainly can access individual plans, but

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Speaker 3: many again are reliant on the benefits and the subsidies

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Speaker 3: that they have in place today. So we've got to

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Speaker 3: make sure. You know, it's a delicate issue, right, But

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Speaker 3: what I would say as a society, and what I'm

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Speaker 3: hoping that in the next few years that will come

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Speaker 3: together as stakeholders, is making the healthy choice, the easy choice,

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Speaker 3: and allowing individuals to have more control over their health

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Speaker 3: and their health care costs.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but that doesn't mean prices are going on.

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Speaker 2: That's the biggest concern, and you know, we're probably pretty

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Speaker 2: bad about that ourselves, and you know, you led with

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Speaker 2: and it's a good point. If we took better care

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Speaker 2: of ourselves eight better, you know, exercise and all that stuff,

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Speaker 2: then we need less health care. It makes it less

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Speaker 2: expensive for everyone. But we don't do that. But it's

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Speaker 2: not like we're alone. Other countries have the same problem.

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Speaker 2: And yet here in America our health care costs are

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Speaker 2: out of control. Administrative costs the US are substantially higher

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Speaker 2: in other countries. What percentage of premium dollars goes to

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Speaker 2: administration versus actual.

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Speaker 3: Care, you know, that would be dependent upon the situation.

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Speaker 3: But I'm not sure Scott, if you're aware that the

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Speaker 3: majority of employers are self insured. So and specifically in

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Speaker 3: the states. I'm in Indiana next to you, ninety percent

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Speaker 3: of our employers are self insured. So what that means

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Speaker 3: is they're paying directly for the cost of a procedure,

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Speaker 3: and that there's a small admin fee that goes on that.

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Speaker 3: And as you know, health plans are regulated and the

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Speaker 3: cost that we can charge for that is regulated by

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Speaker 3: our government.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that all factors into the cost as well,

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Speaker 2: because the regulation adds a little bit more overhead in that.

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Speaker 2: I guess that's the initial point. As it seems there's

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Speaker 2: a lot a lot of hands in the cookie there.

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Speaker 2: There's a lot of money to be had here, but

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Speaker 2: at the end, consumers suffer and some people are not

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Speaker 2: making the decision to go without healthcare, especially during these

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Speaker 2: times where we talk about the ACA and all that

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Speaker 2: being in jeopardy. Beth Kaizier, West Region President for Anthem

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Speaker 2: Blue cross Bow Shield out of Indianapolis, Thanks again for

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Speaker 2: the time, Beth, appreciate it.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much, Scott, and I would encourage individuals

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Speaker 3: that are interested in this topic to go to our website.

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Speaker 3: It's www dot Anthem dot com. Forward slash Affordability in Ohio.

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Speaker 3: Thank you Scott so much for the conversation.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Beth. And uh yeah, well Gutsia.

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Speaker 2: It takes a lot to come on a see out

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Speaker 2: of a healthcare company or at least a regional president. Anyways,

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Speaker 2: the case may be is understand it wasn't that many

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Speaker 2: years ago and you kind of didn't really have an

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Speaker 2: opinion about it. Now, if you look at the hate

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Speaker 2: index in America, that group is rising close to the

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Speaker 2: damn time. We had a lot of people we hate on

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Speaker 2: these days, but I can't think of a group, a

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Speaker 2: private group, maybe more so than healthcare CEOs for Sure

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Speaker 2: News is on the way in just minutes. A fine

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Speaker 2: recap coming up of last night's vestivity in order to

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Speaker 2: Kentucky Convention Center for Martographer Homeless Chisle Slow today because

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Speaker 2: we were partying until about ten o'clock last night.

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Speaker 1: Scott flown show seven hundred.

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Speaker 2: There we go slonely seven hundred wolw on this Wednesday morning.

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Speaker 2: Thank you were probably you've probably an here, I know what.

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Speaker 2: I'm thanking you for it because you're sleeping if you're

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Speaker 2: Marty Gruff for Homeless Kids, twenty twenty six last night

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Speaker 2: at the Northern Kentucky Convention Center. But congratulations though, and

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Speaker 2: thank you so much for your support on this, and

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Speaker 2: that includes people who couldn't make it who still donated

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Speaker 2: to the cause. And so we will sleep well tonight.

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Speaker 2: And maybe you're sleeping well on unknowing that we're going

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Speaker 2: to provide more than one hundred and fifty thousand meals

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Speaker 2: this year for children in need and also support Bethany

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Speaker 2: House Welcome House in Brighton Center. And last night we

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Speaker 2: raised in excessive two hundred and fifty thousand bottles, which

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Speaker 2: is an all time high, So it was fantastic We

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Speaker 2: had a blast last night on behalf of myself, the King.

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Speaker 2: Sheila Gray, my queen from Local twelve OO was great

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Speaker 2: hanging with she she for a while, John John with

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Speaker 2: Kiss one oh seven to one, and Sarah Alice from

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Speaker 2: the Kid Chris shown of course a snort report she

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Speaker 2: will not be here today, she's sleeping it off. And

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Speaker 2: the man himself, Tom Brenneman, those two m seeing and

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Speaker 2: we had an absolute fantastic time. The restaurants were amazing,

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Speaker 2: the food was great, the drinks were great, and of

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Speaker 2: course the most important thing raising money for all those charities.

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Speaker 2: I will say that, and also thanks to my friends

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Speaker 2: Melissa Reed and everyone in DV eight one of the

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Speaker 2: best cover bands in Cincinnati. Melissa one of the greatest

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Speaker 2: vocalists too, I think at Cincinnati as well. So great

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Speaker 2: to see those guys and hang with those guys for

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Speaker 2: a little bit briefly. And you know, two hundred and

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Speaker 2: fifty thousand dollars, that's a lot of cash to raise

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Speaker 2: in one night. The Joe Burrow Foundation, Jeff Ruby Foundation,

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Speaker 2: of course, Mercedes Benz of Fort Mitchell and Don Pepperell

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Speaker 2: over there doing a great job and supporting the mission

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Speaker 2: as well raising just a ton of money. Obviously, I

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Speaker 2: was watching briefly we had Local twelve was on. I

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Speaker 2: caught on the corner and my eye the video from

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Speaker 2: last night. And I have to apologize to the folks

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Speaker 2: at the Northern Kentucky Convention Center who have the task

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Speaker 2: of having to clean up because it started, as I

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Speaker 2: think it was started as a senior prank and now

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Speaker 2: it was just completely out of control. Years ago, when

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Speaker 2: Mike McConnell was the the aforementioned the artist formerly known

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Speaker 2: as Mike McConnell was the king of Marty Gras and

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Speaker 2: then I took over for him. His bodies had come

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Speaker 2: and throw bread. Closterman Baker's always there and they have,

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Speaker 2: you know, bread like a bread stand, and so his

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Speaker 2: body started throwing bread at him and judge because we're

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Speaker 2: in this big rolling platform way up above and we're

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Speaker 2: throwing beads out to the crowd the Marti Gras Court,

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00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:37,880
Speaker 2: and it was good natured fun, and we started talking

403
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Speaker 2: about this on the show and every year now more

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Speaker 2: and more people engage in throwing rolls at and.

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Speaker 1: So there's this video on twelve.

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Speaker 2: It's me and Sheila up there and three Bengal cheer

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Speaker 2: a couple Bengal cheerleaders and John John and we are

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Speaker 2: getting it. Just if you didn't know what it was,

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Speaker 2: You're like, what, why are they ducking? What is going on?

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Speaker 2: I think they having fun, but they look like they're

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Speaker 2: under attack. And we are underttack by rolls from Closterman

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Speaker 2: and people are just like firing rolls at us left

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Speaker 2: and right, and we're trying to throw them back to

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Speaker 2: the crowd and throw beads and it's complete to bauchery

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Speaker 2: and mayhem. But now we have these pockets of I

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Speaker 2: don't know in cells that are rising up in the crowd.

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Speaker 2: For the bread is not just where the stand is.

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Speaker 2: Now people are taking the bread and going to other

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Speaker 2: parts of the convention center to the throw bread. So

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Speaker 2: there'll be these pockets of you know, popping up of

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Speaker 2: people throwing bread at us in the middle of the room.

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Speaker 2: And it's funny as hell. Some guy, I think I

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Speaker 2: got a hogy. I think I got like one of

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Speaker 2: those sub I don't know where it came from. And

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Speaker 2: now people are bringing their own bread. Apparently this was

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Speaker 2: left over from a Super Bowl party. You know those

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00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:47,880
Speaker 2: giant subs that feed fifty like it was coming at

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00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:49,760
Speaker 2: us and it looked like the sun was getting blocked

429
00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:51,720
Speaker 2: out at this point, like what is happening right now?

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Speaker 2: So just part of the fun and mayhem of Marty Grausse.

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Speaker 2: So thanks again two hundred and fifty K and we're

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Speaker 2: gonna feed a lot of kids with that, So thanks

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Speaker 2: so much for joining us. Always glad to be part

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Speaker 2: of that wonderful event with the Northern Kentucky Restaurant Association.

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Speaker 2: Everyone down there, Gordy Sneyder, Pat Kenala, everybody, all right,

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00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:11,399
Speaker 2: moving on, moving on. Saw the big headline today that

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Speaker 2: apparently we're this close to striking a deal with Iran

438
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:17,879
Speaker 2: because we're talking in Geneva with Progress to try and

439
00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:21,479
Speaker 2: go tell their nuclear energy and Iran and they may

440
00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:21,880
Speaker 2: be back.

441
00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:23,800
Speaker 1: I don't know. It's the Middle East.

442
00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:26,480
Speaker 2: So you hear this and you go okay, So in

443
00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,720
Speaker 2: two weeks they'll wind up doing something. They'll blow it up.

444
00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:32,200
Speaker 2: It's like, you know, Israel and God say, okay, we've

445
00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:34,439
Speaker 2: got peace, do we really? Because you know the stuff's

446
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:36,040
Speaker 2: still going to continue to happen. It's just I look

447
00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:39,240
Speaker 2: at it going okay, it's wishual thinking, but the reality

448
00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,600
Speaker 2: is there'll be some sort of aggrievance, some sort of

449
00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,240
Speaker 2: microaggression that they perceive on the part of the United

450
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:47,280
Speaker 2: States or vice versa, and we'll be back at it again.

451
00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:49,080
Speaker 2: But had a little little brief piece and some hope.

452
00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:50,919
Speaker 2: We need some hope these days, so we will take it.

453
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,479
Speaker 2: We will take it. There's a guy named Michael Sullivan

454
00:21:54,560 --> 00:21:58,399
Speaker 2: arrested outside the Capitol eighteen years old. Parked a suv

455
00:21:58,480 --> 00:21:59,840
Speaker 2: near the western of the Capitol exit of the b

456
00:22:00,280 --> 00:22:02,320
Speaker 2: a shotgun and insteaded running toward the Capitol. He's we're

457
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:05,160
Speaker 2: in a tactical vest and gloves, kevlar, helmet, gas mask

458
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:08,200
Speaker 2: inside the suv, everything with an attempt to try and

459
00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:09,480
Speaker 2: I don't know what he's going to do is try

460
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:12,399
Speaker 2: and take out people inside the capital. Of course, the

461
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:13,919
Speaker 2: good news is and may I don't know if the

462
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 2: good news or not news, but it would have been

463
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,720
Speaker 2: more effective if Congress are actually working, Like, if you're

464
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:20,679
Speaker 2: going to do that, you may want to, I don't know,

465
00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 2: go online and do some research and find out if

466
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,040
Speaker 2: they're actually they're not saying I was wishing they would

467
00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:27,760
Speaker 2: by any stretch. But you know, if you're going to

468
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,280
Speaker 2: go to prison for the rest of your life. I

469
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:32,920
Speaker 2: guess you know, at least there's some sort of perceived threat.

470
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:35,840
Speaker 2: But it's like, yeah, they're not working. They in addition

471
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:38,520
Speaker 2: to the recess, they also are they shut down government.

472
00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:41,840
Speaker 2: So what actually has happened over there? It's like, wait

473
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:43,879
Speaker 2: a minute, I did that. I'm going to prison forever.

474
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 2: And man, they weren't even that. Oh man, man, the

475
00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 2: times in which we live. I have you heard this story?

476
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:55,000
Speaker 2: So if you had kids or have kids that are

477
00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,160
Speaker 2: in school, you know about a company called Life Touch Photography.

478
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:01,639
Speaker 2: And so every every beginning every school year in the fall,

479
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:04,200
Speaker 2: your kids, you know, you get the you go shopping.

480
00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:07,040
Speaker 2: You're back to closed school. And then the best outfit

481
00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,600
Speaker 2: from your back to closed shopping experience, of course, will

482
00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 2: be the one that your mom will tell you not

483
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:13,960
Speaker 2: to get dirty because you've got school pictures. You can

484
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:16,200
Speaker 2: wear this, but you need to say this is for school.

485
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 2: When you have your school pictures, you gotta look nice

486
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,240
Speaker 2: for your school pictures. And you know, they give you

487
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:23,399
Speaker 2: the comb, you comb your hair, you look all nice,

488
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:25,600
Speaker 2: and of course they capture that moment it look like

489
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:27,919
Speaker 2: you just got maced or something like that. It's the

490
00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,520
Speaker 2: stupid expressions on your face when you're a kid. But nonetheless,

491
00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:32,879
Speaker 2: the life Touch photography is a big deal. It's a

492
00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:37,240
Speaker 2: big money maker for everyone. So the Kentucky Educational Development

493
00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:41,879
Speaker 2: Corporation is suspending their partnership with life Touch due to

494
00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 2: concerns over a tie to Jeffrey Epstein. So this is

495
00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:48,639
Speaker 2: from the let me get the straight department. Okay, the

496
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:53,320
Speaker 2: CEO has a documented business relationship with Epstein, and it

497
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:55,920
Speaker 2: was in charge of Apollo when it bought Shutterfly, who

498
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:59,480
Speaker 2: owns Life Touch now in twenty nineteen. Life Touch says, well,

499
00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:02,400
Speaker 2: no exact if there have ever had any contact with Epstein,

500
00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:06,119
Speaker 2: and Apollo did not acquire shutter Fly until after Jeffrey

501
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 2: Epstein died.

502
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 1: So so you.

503
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,880
Speaker 2: Had this guy who was tied to the previous company,

504
00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:16,520
Speaker 2: which was then bought out, and then that was sold

505
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,640
Speaker 2: package up and sold the Shutterfly. So we're like, we're

506
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:25,160
Speaker 2: two we're two child molesters away from this evening tying

507
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:29,440
Speaker 2: to the current company, and yet Kentucky's going, well, we

508
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 2: got to question our business and largely probably because of

509
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 2: backlash from parents. You know, you want to think that

510
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,639
Speaker 2: we're getting a little better allowing our kids to be

511
00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,199
Speaker 2: a little bit more feral and you know, kind of

512
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 2: plot their own direction to some degree.

513
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 1: You know, you give them controls.

514
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:46,760
Speaker 2: I'm not suggesting the five year old should be, you know,

515
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 2: out there doing whatever he wants. You know, you give

516
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 2: him a give a limit, the list of selections, like, hey,

517
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:52,920
Speaker 2: I want to wear this, I want our Halloween cost

518
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,600
Speaker 2: him to school. Well you really can't, Well I can.

519
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:56,760
Speaker 2: I Well here's why, but I'll give you three outfits

520
00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:58,040
Speaker 2: you can pick from. You pick, and it makes you

521
00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 2: feel like they have some control, right, And the older

522
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:03,600
Speaker 2: you get, the more autonomy they should.

523
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:04,760
Speaker 1: And then they want to serve.

524
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,120
Speaker 2: But now it's like you think, at this point, now

525
00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:09,119
Speaker 2: we start going back the other way, but we're not.

526
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 2: It's like, okay, did the current did this guy have

527
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,679
Speaker 2: any tie? Did Leon Black have does he have any

528
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:19,960
Speaker 2: bearing on what they're doing today? And the answer, of

529
00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:21,720
Speaker 2: course is now. Now if you think it's like blood

530
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:23,919
Speaker 2: money or something like that, even that I'd questioned, going, well,

531
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:27,200
Speaker 2: wait a minute, the company was sold and was sold again,

532
00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:31,040
Speaker 2: and so you are at least two transactions removed from

533
00:25:31,080 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 2: this guy have anything to do with it, and it

534
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:35,639
Speaker 2: was the CEO anyway, and you know, you go through CEO,

535
00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 2: it's a change. They change, and if you did something wrong,

536
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 2: you certainly deserve to be fired and go to prison

537
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,359
Speaker 2: and something as serious as this for sure, But I

538
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:45,160
Speaker 2: don't know what you're protecting your kid from.

539
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:47,080
Speaker 1: It's it's life touch.

540
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:48,600
Speaker 2: I could see if what was going on now a

541
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:52,560
Speaker 2: different story, but not just part of the overprotective society

542
00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:54,240
Speaker 2: in which we live. It's kind of like a few

543
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:57,239
Speaker 2: weeks ago we had that it escapes me where it was,

544
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:00,000
Speaker 2: but locally where you had because of all the snow

545
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 2: and ice, the roof collapse in the on a school

546
00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 2: gym and an elementary school gym, which is served your

547
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 2: costs for concern. So they shut the school down for

548
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:08,560
Speaker 2: a couple of weeks and uh, it was just a

549
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:10,040
Speaker 2: gym roof, And like the rest of us, they had

550
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 2: structural engineers go in and inspectors from the state and

551
00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,840
Speaker 2: everything else going to look at the place and inspecting, like, Okay,

552
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,239
Speaker 2: we're good, we're gonna open it back up. And they

553
00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:18,919
Speaker 2: had an open house and parents are showing up and saying, well,

554
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 2: I'm not sending my kid to school because it's not safe.

555
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:23,520
Speaker 2: It's like, well, we're not sending them to you know,

556
00:26:23,600 --> 00:26:25,960
Speaker 2: like back in the day, your mom and dad did that, going, wait,

557
00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:28,119
Speaker 2: what happened? Yeah, the roof collapse in the gym? Oh okay,

558
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:29,120
Speaker 2: well we got to see what's good?

559
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:30,639
Speaker 1: All right? Can I go back to school?

560
00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:33,040
Speaker 2: Well yeah, you just can't have gym, but you should

561
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,280
Speaker 2: go and learn stuff and also get the hell out

562
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:35,479
Speaker 2: of here.

563
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:36,439
Speaker 1: You're driving me crazy.

564
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:39,359
Speaker 2: I think it was just maybe a little I don't

565
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:41,040
Speaker 2: want to be the guy going, oh, it's so better

566
00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:42,439
Speaker 2: back in the day, but something like that to me

567
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:44,040
Speaker 2: is like, all right, well, you've had all these people

568
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:45,800
Speaker 2: and there's a huge liability issue and they're not going

569
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:49,080
Speaker 2: to let not only teachers and the staff and but kids,

570
00:26:49,160 --> 00:26:52,240
Speaker 2: especially if if it's unsafe. And yet even though you've

571
00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 2: had certified engineers structural engineers coming to go yeah, it's okay,

572
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 2: it's just the gym.

573
00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 1: We got to rebuild it. Okay.

574
00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 2: Well, the rest of school's fine, right, yep, Now we're good.

575
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,320
Speaker 2: There's no more snow on the roof, and we inspected

576
00:27:02,320 --> 00:27:06,159
Speaker 2: everything looks good. Okay, good enough. Yeah, but there's a

577
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:07,520
Speaker 2: chance that no, there's no chance.

578
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:08,920
Speaker 1: I mean, you guess you.

579
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:10,680
Speaker 2: Could have a media rite or a piece of ice

580
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 2: off an airplane and fall through the roof. I suppose,

581
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:17,159
Speaker 2: but you know, really we've inspected it and anything about that.

582
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:18,720
Speaker 2: It's like, I'm not sending my kid to school anyway.

583
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,040
Speaker 2: Well you had inspectors there. You may send your kid

584
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 2: to a school before that was never inspected. So there's

585
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:27,119
Speaker 2: probably the safest roof of any building in the state

586
00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 2: at this point. Considering how many people are inspecting the roof, Well,

587
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:33,640
Speaker 2: what if they're wrong, Well, they're probably not. I would

588
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 2: err on the side of having that inspection. And maybe

589
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:37,119
Speaker 2: you have a kid go to a different school and

590
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:39,040
Speaker 2: you're like, well you go to school, Well they'd inspect

591
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:39,440
Speaker 2: our roof.

592
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,879
Speaker 1: That could fall down too. I don't know. I don't know.

593
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,760
Speaker 1: But the shutterfly thing is that is absolutely fascinating to me.

594
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:50,399
Speaker 2: This is pretty good. I know, if you saw this

595
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 2: or not. He was on a podcast and President Obama

596
00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:55,760
Speaker 2: was to I know it was like like a little

597
00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 2: Q and a thing like a speed round thing, and

598
00:27:57,600 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 2: he's answering questions about whether or not aliens were real,

599
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:02,239
Speaker 2: and he I don't know if it's a slip up

600
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 2: or not, but you know, he said that, oh, they're real,

601
00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 2: and then he had to come back and walk it

602
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 2: back and said, I I was joking, wanted to you know,

603
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 2: I want to know the whereabouts of like if there's

604
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 2: an underground bunker with aliens and they're keeping this from

605
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,000
Speaker 2: the president because I didn't know anything about it. And

606
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:17,679
Speaker 2: it was kind of funny too, and you know, it

607
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 2: just feels that speculation about aliens and Area fifty one

608
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,399
Speaker 2: and conspiracy theories. And he said, yeah, they're real, but

609
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:24,879
Speaker 2: we don't have them here. We don't have them an

610
00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 2: Area fifty one. And he had to kind of walk

611
00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 2: those comments back a little bit, which just fuels a

612
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:30,880
Speaker 2: conspiracy theorist even more.

613
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 1: It's kind of funny. I was, hey, I don't I

614
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:33,320
Speaker 1: always thought of that.

615
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:36,960
Speaker 2: I really think that there's some sort of extraterrestrial life

616
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 2: out there. We just assume they're smarter than us, because

617
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:40,920
Speaker 2: that makes her a good story because they could come

618
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:42,840
Speaker 2: control us, because the other way around, it's like, well,

619
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 2: you know, there there's life forms out there, but they're

620
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:53,200
Speaker 2: pretty dumb, right, pretty pretty stupid. It's like our dumbest

621
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 2: criminals are still smarter than the extraterrestrial life out there.

622
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:59,000
Speaker 2: Oh okay. It was one of those guys yeah, all right,

623
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 2: we're good. Like, you know, maybe they don't even have

624
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:06,520
Speaker 2: opposable thumbs. Yeah, I haven't even invented a crew ton

625
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 2: or anything good like that. Yeah, spreadable cheese, like, yeah,

626
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:11,480
Speaker 2: we're good. It's the eating dirt.

627
00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:12,040
Speaker 1: Okay.

628
00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 2: Maybe there's I don't know if it's intelligent life, but

629
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 2: developed life out there sure probably probably, But daddy that

630
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 2: you know, there's a superior being out there and it's

631
00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 2: not us, Like, I don't know about that. But I

632
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,560
Speaker 2: was reading this, it's interesting what we know about Area

633
00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,240
Speaker 2: fifty one now. And I was reading a following a

634
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 2: book about that, and it's interesting because the first uf

635
00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 2: of the saucer, right back in the fifties, if it's

636
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:38,160
Speaker 2: all in the flying saucers, flying saucers were UFOs, and

637
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 2: now they're called UFAs or UFDs.

638
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 1: I don't know.

639
00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 2: They changed the name every few years. And so the

640
00:29:43,440 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 2: very first one they found it had crashed and there

641
00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 2: was evidence, Oh my god, this thing crashed, and you know,

642
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,200
Speaker 2: the FEDS came in and sealed the area off, and

643
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,560
Speaker 2: it fueled all this conspiracy later on, as it turned out,

644
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 2: according to the story, is that obviously the scientists there

645
00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 2: took it apart in the desert and wanted to see

646
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,920
Speaker 2: what the hell it was because there was no visible

647
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 2: signs of a way to propel the vehicle, you know,

648
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 2: no exhaust is the equipment. And so anyway, they took

649
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 2: this thing apart and they found on parts inside it

650
00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:18,880
Speaker 2: things written in the cyrillic alphabet, and the cyrillic alphabet,

651
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:22,479
Speaker 2: of course is Russian. Now think about it, when this

652
00:30:22,520 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 2: happens nineteen fifties, we're coming out of World War Two.

653
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 2: We instantly went from World War to the Cold War.

654
00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:34,720
Speaker 2: We're battling the Russians, Russians Vus, atomic superpowers, duck and cover.

655
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 2: Everyone's paranoid thinking the bomb's going to go off, and

656
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 2: now the Russians are flying saucers, which we looked at

657
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 2: and want how the hell they're doing this, and they're

658
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,960
Speaker 2: doing it on our airspace, and so huge national security concern.

659
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 2: Now you can't come out and say that. And the

660
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 2: speculation was of course by someone said, well, they're like

661
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,680
Speaker 2: little alien men, or they're alien. Maybe it's an alien,

662
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 2: it's something from outer space. And because of the time,

663
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,600
Speaker 2: you know, that was a whole thing that you know,

664
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:06,200
Speaker 2: we're going with fifties, you know, it's a war of

665
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 2: the Cold War. But also, you know, we're involved in

666
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 2: the space race. They're launching spot nicking things, and so

667
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:14,200
Speaker 2: all that ties together. It's like, well, maybe it's an

668
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:19,080
Speaker 2: alien life form. And so the government said, you know what,

669
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 2: that mistruth, that narrative is good for us because that

670
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:26,560
Speaker 2: gives us cover for what we're doing out there in

671
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:31,200
Speaker 2: our space program. And so you saw things develop like

672
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 2: the U two spyplane was actually which we flew over

673
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:37,800
Speaker 2: the Soviet un over to Russia, was developed out in

674
00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 2: the desert, and that's where they tested these things, and

675
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,840
Speaker 2: they'd get reports of these mysterious objects flying really high

676
00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,880
Speaker 2: and glowing lights, and the B two stealth bomber, same thing.

677
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:46,960
Speaker 1: That's where they tested this thing.

678
00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:51,120
Speaker 2: And people get reports of well, mysterious objects that were

679
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 2: defying gravity plant and largely it was these experimental aircraft

680
00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:55,800
Speaker 2: that they were working on, some of them man some

681
00:31:55,920 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 2: of them unmanned, and they just let people run with it,

682
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:01,400
Speaker 2: going okay, well we had a sighting, Yeah it's probably

683
00:32:01,400 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 2: an alien because we did not want to expose the

684
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:08,440
Speaker 2: truth of our space program. Pretty cool, I think, and

685
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:10,600
Speaker 2: it you know, you think about it fits together and

686
00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:14,760
Speaker 2: It's also part of Ockham's razor. Rockham's razor basically is like,

687
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:20,719
Speaker 2: generally the easiest story is the true story rather than

688
00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 2: going aliens and everything. I was like, yeah, we're trying

689
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 2: to protect our national interests and develop these things because

690
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:27,640
Speaker 2: we're in a race with the with the Russians. Still

691
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 2: don't know what's inside that flying sauc where I was flying,

692
00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:32,440
Speaker 2: but it might and I've been fueled or powered. Maybe

693
00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 2: it was launch from an airplane or something. Who knows.

694
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:39,600
Speaker 2: But to today, you know, we think there's aliens out there. Yeah,

695
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 2: and I think there's intelligent life out there. I just

696
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:43,360
Speaker 2: don't know if they're smarter than we are. At this point,

697
00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,240
Speaker 2: we've been trying to communicate with them forever based on

698
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:48,480
Speaker 2: this premise that they're out there, and we've got radio

699
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,960
Speaker 2: telescopes and everything else, still try sending signals and picking

700
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:55,640
Speaker 2: signals up and from distant galaxies and it's all fascinating stuff.

701
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:57,160
Speaker 1: And boy, it's kind of funny.

702
00:32:57,200 --> 00:32:59,440
Speaker 2: It's like, man, this thing was was sort of like

703
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:01,960
Speaker 2: a I don't know, kind of like we let this

704
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:04,200
Speaker 2: mistruth go and let people believe it, and now it's

705
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 2: this whole inn we actually now the sam government's actually

706
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 2: spending what million, tens of millions of dollars on a radio,

707
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 2: telescopes and everything else, not necessarily all to you know,

708
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:16,480
Speaker 2: make contact with alien life forms. But it's all based

709
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 2: on that premise. That's kind of it's got a funny

710
00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,280
Speaker 2: use of money. Like we're not gonna we're not gonna

711
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:22,680
Speaker 2: blow up the bed here. We got a pretty big

712
00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:25,240
Speaker 2: it gotten so big now you're just like, we can't

713
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 2: really give them the truth because they're gonna be really

714
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:29,760
Speaker 2: mad at us now because we spend all this money

715
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 2: with anti alien technology.

716
00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:33,800
Speaker 1: For God's sake, that's how the world works.

717
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 2: I suppose we've got news on the way in just

718
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 2: about six minutes here on the Big One, seven hundred

719
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:42,000
Speaker 2: W LW. Bill, this is interesting. Bill Henson is his

720
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 2: name is from Manhattan. Institude's there think tank. But it

721
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 2: did come up with a new way to measure return

722
00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 2: on investment for public education and the astomic part about

723
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:53,480
Speaker 2: this whole thing. And they're based on New York and

724
00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 2: so I think, you know, you hear that and you go, oh,

725
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 2: it's New York.

726
00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 1: I don't really care. I live in Ohio, living Kentucky,

727
00:33:58,040 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: live in the Danna. Yeah.

728
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:02,240
Speaker 2: But the truth the formula still works. It developed something

729
00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 2: called EROI, and that is a new return on investment

730
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 2: educational return on investment, because you figure in is how

731
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,120
Speaker 2: much the average student costs, the averageer people spending is,

732
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 2: and then how many students you have in the district,

733
00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:16,360
Speaker 2: and then how many kids graduate or go on to

734
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:19,520
Speaker 2: college or go on And so is it fair to

735
00:34:19,560 --> 00:34:22,439
Speaker 2: include in the per people spending the number of kids

736
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:24,719
Speaker 2: who don't graduate? And the answer be well, yeah, you

737
00:34:24,719 --> 00:34:26,839
Speaker 2: need to do that. It's not just so how much

738
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 2: does that average diploma cost a taxpayer? And well it

739
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:33,400
Speaker 2: certainly fuel for people to go, hey we got to

740
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:36,200
Speaker 2: you know, go do more private schools or homeschooling. Okay, fine,

741
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:38,439
Speaker 2: But at the same time I look at it going, yeah,

742
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 2: is this really an efficient use of money?

743
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 1: Can we do better? And I think we can and

744
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:43,560
Speaker 1: have to do with AI.

745
00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,680
Speaker 2: We'll get into that right after a news update on

746
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,600
Speaker 2: the Scott's Loan Show seven hundred WLW.

747
00:34:48,680 --> 00:34:50,840
Speaker 5: Do you want to be an American idiot?

748
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 2: Let's go Scott's Loan Show, seven hundred WLW. You know

749
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 2: how much we spend on the military, and often I

750
00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:00,640
Speaker 2: always spend seven eight times more than the next twenty

751
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 2: nations gone by whatever it is. And we do spend

752
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:04,319
Speaker 2: a lot on the military, and how much is enough?

753
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 2: That number pals in comparison to the amount of money

754
00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:11,000
Speaker 2: we spend in this country on K through twelve education.

755
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:14,239
Speaker 2: We spend more on K through twelve education than we

756
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 2: do national efense. That is an astounding high number, and

757
00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:19,880
Speaker 2: the results of that spend are eye opening, especially in

758
00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 2: light of a new way to look at how much

759
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:23,800
Speaker 2: bang we get for the buck.

760
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:25,080
Speaker 1: It is about ROA.

761
00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:26,759
Speaker 2: Don't let anyone tell you any difference like well, these

762
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:28,520
Speaker 2: are about kids in their future and it's more than

763
00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:31,680
Speaker 2: just you know, getting a job and being productive citizens.

764
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 2: It's part of it. All feels good, it's all the fields.

765
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,319
Speaker 2: But we want to know what the ROI is are

766
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:38,720
Speaker 2: what's the return of our investment?

767
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 1: Here?

768
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:42,520
Speaker 2: Are we getting the maximum we can for our dollar?

769
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,000
Speaker 2: And that's not only fair to ask as taxpayers, but

770
00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 2: more so as parents and grandparents. And the new metrics

771
00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 2: that we're using are downright infuriating. William Henson is here.

772
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,920
Speaker 2: Bill is with Manhattan Institute and primarily talks about, you know,

773
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 2: what's going on in New York public school system. But

774
00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:59,399
Speaker 2: I think it's a good illustration because this is true

775
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:00,239
Speaker 2: everywhere else else.

776
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:01,799
Speaker 1: Bill, Welcome to the show. How are you.

777
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:05,480
Speaker 4: I'm well, Scott, thank you, thanks for having me.

778
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:08,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, So this ree you. You did this

779
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 2: with new and it's not New Day. But it's called

780
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:14,640
Speaker 2: e ROI Educational turn on Investment. So it's a way

781
00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:19,360
Speaker 2: to calculate per pupil spending versus academic outcomes. We're talking

782
00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 2: graduation rates, college completion to says what that ROI is,

783
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,359
Speaker 2: what the bang for the buck is, what it's educational values?

784
00:36:25,400 --> 00:36:26,279
Speaker 1: How do you formulate that?

785
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:32,000
Speaker 4: So it's relatively straightforward, and getting the lot of the

786
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,040
Speaker 4: information was a bit more of a challenge. Yeah, but

787
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 4: most school districts, whether they be in Cincinnati, Kentucky, or

788
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 4: New York, California, et cetera, you can get access to

789
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:50,280
Speaker 4: how much those school districts spend per student. Okay, although

790
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,760
Speaker 4: even there it's a little bit complicated because they'll publish

791
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 4: their direct operating costs not necessarily and I don't want

792
00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,160
Speaker 4: to get too much in the leads here, but you

793
00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:04,160
Speaker 4: know they're indirect cost capital expenditures, pensions and the like,

794
00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:08,080
Speaker 4: and then you have enrollment and it's pretty simple. Okay,

795
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:10,560
Speaker 4: what's you know, what's the total spending divided by the

796
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:12,400
Speaker 4: number of kids in the system that gives are your

797
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 4: per pupil spending. What that doesn't do, though, is tell you, well,

798
00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:22,040
Speaker 4: what am I getting, like you, like you said in

799
00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:24,399
Speaker 4: the introduction, what am I getting for that money? Whether

800
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:28,440
Speaker 4: it be as a parent, student, taxpayer, et cetera.

801
00:37:28,760 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's a fair question.

802
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,279
Speaker 2: And I looked at the numbers for Cincinnati a larger

803
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:36,840
Speaker 2: school listening area bill, Cincinnati Public and so the cost

804
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 2: to educate a kid, and it's right now, it's about

805
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 2: our pupil's per pupils about nineteen thousand dollars A little

806
00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:45,640
Speaker 2: some studies say more, a little more, a little low,

807
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:49,240
Speaker 2: but we'll say nineteen grand over thirteen years, okay, through twelve.

808
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:52,240
Speaker 2: That's almost too. That's almost a quarter million dollars a kid. Now,

809
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 2: the other element there is what about kids who don't graduate?

810
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:59,359
Speaker 2: And I think that's something that this this formula bakes in.

811
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:02,640
Speaker 2: It is like, okay, great, but are they're they're graduating?

812
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:05,399
Speaker 2: But what about the roughly fourteen fifty percent kids who

813
00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 2: don't That should be factored in the equation as well.

814
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:14,239
Speaker 4: So if you so, you know, just staying with you know, Cincinnati,

815
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:19,560
Speaker 4: and they round numbers twenty, you know, quarter million dollars

816
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,960
Speaker 4: to educate one student over the course of his or

817
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:25,920
Speaker 4: her primary and secondary.

818
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:27,400
Speaker 6: Years.

819
00:38:28,080 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 4: But if only ten percent or twenty percent or thirty

820
00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:40,719
Speaker 4: percent of those kids ultimately graduate from college, ont's just

821
00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 4: assume from the moment that's the ultimate objective. That could

822
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:44,800
Speaker 4: be a whole another conversation whether that's.

823
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:46,480
Speaker 6: The right path for everybody, sure, but.

824
00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:49,840
Speaker 4: Assuming that's you know, that's your goal, that's your objective,

825
00:38:50,280 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 4: and you say, okay, well, if it's twenty percent of

826
00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:05,320
Speaker 4: ultimately graduate from college, that's one fifth. So my cost,

827
00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 4: Cincinnati's cost in this hypothetical example is actually five times

828
00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 4: a quarter of a million or what would that be?

829
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:18,840
Speaker 4: A million and a quarter a million, two hundred and

830
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:23,240
Speaker 4: fifty thousand to graduate one young person ultimately from college.

831
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,960
Speaker 4: And that's what you got to ask the question, am

832
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:27,719
Speaker 4: I getting the bank for the buck? As you said,

833
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:28,879
Speaker 4: am I, am I.

834
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:32,839
Speaker 2: That is a you know, in New York City's seven

835
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:35,040
Speaker 2: hundred thousand dollars today's dollars, and of course you know

836
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 2: you don't. It's hard to factor inflation and matriculation moving

837
00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:41,880
Speaker 2: from district to district. But it's and it's a rough number,

838
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:44,200
Speaker 2: but I think it's important too. It's like, if we're

839
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:46,880
Speaker 2: failing to educate these kids. I don't think that's solely

840
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,200
Speaker 2: back on the school system, quite honestly. I think there

841
00:39:49,200 --> 00:39:52,919
Speaker 2: are multipleitude, multitude of factors as why an urban area.

842
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 2: I mean, for example, I know you taught a very

843
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 2: prestigious private school, which is the best of the best,

844
00:39:57,680 --> 00:39:59,760
Speaker 2: and of course you're going to have higher graduation attendance

845
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:01,000
Speaker 2: because you know, parents.

846
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:01,520
Speaker 1: Are paying a lot of them.

847
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:04,960
Speaker 4: I think, like you said, is procedure, but in a

848
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:09,400
Speaker 4: different way, right, it exclusively serves low income kids. If you,

849
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:13,080
Speaker 4: if your family, God bless them, makes above a certain

850
00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 4: amount of money and you can afford another private school,

851
00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:20,680
Speaker 4: we will. How should I say, invite you to take me?

852
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:23,080
Speaker 6: Yeah?

853
00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:25,239
Speaker 2: No, I I understand that nuance, And that's true a

854
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:27,560
Speaker 2: lot of areas as well. You're crystal ray and could

855
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:32,200
Speaker 2: not right right, Yeah, But public schools also have you,

856
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 2: they have to take they have to take spec special

857
00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 2: education students of life too, So there's I think there's

858
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 2: some nuances there. There's you know, the absent tee chronic

859
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,640
Speaker 2: apps and tee rates, kids who are under house underfed.

860
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:45,360
Speaker 2: You know that's that's certainly those are certainly mitigating factors

861
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 2: for this whole thing. But you know, I was, I

862
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:50,719
Speaker 2: was speculating about this the other day in that you know,

863
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 2: the whole educational system itself, we miss so many kids.

864
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:56,160
Speaker 2: I was one of those kids because I'm more of

865
00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:58,680
Speaker 2: a tactile learner. You know, you put a you put

866
00:40:58,760 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 2: numbers in front of me, and I'm confused. Used, But

867
00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:02,799
Speaker 2: you put a tape measure in front of me or something,

868
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:04,759
Speaker 2: I can say, Okay, what's the point of this and

869
00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:06,920
Speaker 2: apply more of an applied learner in that regard. And

870
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,240
Speaker 2: so many kids are and we I think we're starting

871
00:41:09,239 --> 00:41:11,160
Speaker 2: to learn more about admiss it. But my point is,

872
00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 2: you know, today you hear about kids being disengaged in

873
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:17,120
Speaker 2: school and not paying attention to kids. Maybe we're not

874
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 2: teaching to their level and maybe, you know, with the

875
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:22,960
Speaker 2: distractions of phones and social media in AI, now it

876
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 2: seems like, I don't know, do we even need THEE

877
00:41:25,719 --> 00:41:27,799
Speaker 2: or should the public school model change? In a sense,

878
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:30,560
Speaker 2: it's like, why aren't we teaching kids on their level?

879
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:33,720
Speaker 2: AI can learn how to teach to each individual student,

880
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 2: They'll learn more, will retain better, they'll be better students,

881
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,240
Speaker 2: and ultimately be more productive and successful in life. Maybe

882
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:41,360
Speaker 2: the way to do this is using AI as the

883
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:44,400
Speaker 2: teacher as opposed to a well, actual human teacher.

884
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:51,799
Speaker 4: Well, and there are some school models that are pursuing

885
00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:57,959
Speaker 4: that where it's it might be too strong to say

886
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:02,320
Speaker 4: AI driven, but certainly AI I supported, And then you

887
00:42:02,360 --> 00:42:07,799
Speaker 4: and m they'll dedicate or ear mark maybe two three

888
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:12,759
Speaker 4: hours of the education of the school day to sort

889
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 4: of traditional curriculum, et cetera, utilizing AI to be hopefully

890
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 4: that much more efficient, that much more effective, et cetera,

891
00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:27,120
Speaker 4: and then allocating the rest of the normal school day

892
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:35,319
Speaker 4: to other programs, services, et cetera. That would be in

893
00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:40,759
Speaker 4: a perfect world of address. You know, kids, the way

894
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 4: you describe yourself as a different kind of learner or

895
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:47,600
Speaker 4: a different interests, et cetera. So I think there's a tremendous,

896
00:42:47,640 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 4: tremendous opportunity there. And I think, you know, over the

897
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:56,719
Speaker 4: course of the next several years, and it probably won't

898
00:42:56,760 --> 00:42:59,040
Speaker 4: even be that long, you're you're going to see more

899
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:04,360
Speaker 4: of those type of sort of models and initiatives you

900
00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 4: know pop up.

901
00:43:05,760 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's a way to explore us.

902
00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 2: Now, of course, this is a total threat to the

903
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:13,480
Speaker 2: ecosystem of public education, in particular that well wait a minute, now,

904
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:16,400
Speaker 2: if we use AI, we need future teach we need

905
00:43:16,480 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 2: less teachers. That is a threat to unions. We certainly

906
00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:21,640
Speaker 2: need to help a lot less administrators, which is a

907
00:43:21,680 --> 00:43:24,320
Speaker 2: threat to the bureaucratic class. It's also a threat to

908
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 2: the brick and mortar of the schools that we continue

909
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,239
Speaker 2: to fund the buildings themselves. Because if this is all

910
00:43:30,280 --> 00:43:32,600
Speaker 2: a digital enterprise and you can teach kids on their

911
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:35,440
Speaker 2: own level, to their own means using AI, all of

912
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:37,920
Speaker 2: that stuff is now in jeopardy. That's a threat to

913
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 2: that's a threat to the American way of life in itself.

914
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:46,359
Speaker 4: Bill, Yeah, And I think you can even extend that

915
00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 4: line of thinking beyond just the implications of AI, but

916
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:58,399
Speaker 4: to anything that represents a different model, a different way

917
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 4: of doing things from the traditional public school model, where

918
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:10,600
Speaker 4: you know where where the unions and entrench bureaucracy are

919
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:15,920
Speaker 4: nervous at best, if not to downright resistant to any

920
00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:19,160
Speaker 4: kind of of change. And that's what we see here

921
00:44:19,400 --> 00:44:22,080
Speaker 4: in New York. And you know the purpose of my

922
00:44:22,120 --> 00:44:24,360
Speaker 4: study was sort of twofold, and we touched on. The

923
00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:29,239
Speaker 4: first bar was to provide families, taxpayer, policymakers, et cetera,

924
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 4: with the tool so it could really see, all right,

925
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:35,000
Speaker 4: what am I getting for this huge investment, you know,

926
00:44:35,680 --> 00:44:40,120
Speaker 4: over a trillion or about a trillion dollars nationally. And

927
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:44,080
Speaker 4: then secondly is to then use that tool to evaluate

928
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:49,520
Speaker 4: a few different educational alternatives. And you know, I use

929
00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 4: New York because that's where I am. In New York

930
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:53,600
Speaker 4: is sort of the tip of the spear in the

931
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:58,800
Speaker 4: sense that they are the most expensive public school system

932
00:44:58,920 --> 00:45:04,759
Speaker 4: in the country. And you see that, well, these there

933
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:06,799
Speaker 4: is one, you know, there is this alternative out there

934
00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 4: called this Christal Ray model. Educates low income kids and

935
00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:12,719
Speaker 4: ninety nine percent kids of color, most of them come

936
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:17,479
Speaker 4: from uh, you know, single parent households, et cetera, et cetera.

937
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 4: And yet for every one student out of the New

938
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:27,400
Speaker 4: York City public school system that ultimately graduates from college

939
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 4: for the same amount of money, Christo Ray model graduated

940
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:37,120
Speaker 4: or produced nine kids from college.

941
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:39,920
Speaker 1: What's what drives that? What do you think drives that?

942
00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:45,880
Speaker 4: Oh, there's a there's a you know, a host of factors.

943
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:50,399
Speaker 4: Scott I'll say the ones I you know what, folks

944
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 4: who work and teach in in In this case, it's

945
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:56,960
Speaker 4: a Catholic school model lowled You know, approximately half if

946
00:45:57,000 --> 00:46:00,439
Speaker 4: not more of the kids are non Catholic. They don't

947
00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:05,600
Speaker 4: get paid as much as public school teachers. So that's

948
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 4: not necessarily a good thing in some ways, especially if

949
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 4: you're that particular teacher or staff member, But in other ways,

950
00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:17,680
Speaker 4: it sends a pretty powerful message to the leadership of

951
00:46:17,680 --> 00:46:24,400
Speaker 4: the school, the board, etc. That those staff members, those teachers,

952
00:46:24,520 --> 00:46:27,919
Speaker 4: they really want to be there, they want to teach,

953
00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:32,280
Speaker 4: They're willing to make that sacrifice so that they can

954
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:38,000
Speaker 4: help these young people ultimately realize their full potential. And

955
00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:41,839
Speaker 4: that whether it comes through overtly or more subtly, that

956
00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:47,040
Speaker 4: sends a very very powerful message to the students themselves,

957
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:50,879
Speaker 4: to their families, to the rest of the community, and

958
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:59,400
Speaker 4: that once you get young people motivated and believing in themselves,

959
00:47:01,719 --> 00:47:05,040
Speaker 4: that goes a long long way to them being able

960
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 4: to actually grow and achieve and accomplish.

961
00:47:09,080 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 5: What they want.

962
00:47:09,920 --> 00:47:12,000
Speaker 4: So culture is a big part of it, you know,

963
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:13,879
Speaker 4: just just one part of it.

964
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:15,040
Speaker 1: Well, it also isn't it.

965
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:17,760
Speaker 2: Also the kids are coming there because their parents, regardless

966
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:22,080
Speaker 2: of income or socioeconomic level, bill they want their kids

967
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 2: to succeed in school, and so they have a vestigations

968
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:26,279
Speaker 2: to making sure the kids shows up. They go to

969
00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 2: the parent teacher beings. I mean, it probably takes a

970
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 2: very alert and education oriented parent because that's who's going

971
00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 2: to go to a school like this, Whereas you may

972
00:47:38,120 --> 00:47:41,040
Speaker 2: have kids that come from troubled homes and parents that

973
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:42,680
Speaker 2: simply don't see the value in education.

974
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:43,800
Speaker 1: I think that's a distinction.

975
00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:46,520
Speaker 2: But you know, to your point, yeah, And the other

976
00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:48,040
Speaker 2: point too is you know, this is about college, and

977
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:51,000
Speaker 2: I does it factor in those who are going to

978
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:53,320
Speaker 2: the skilled trades or military service or just going directly

979
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:53,840
Speaker 2: the workforce.

980
00:47:55,160 --> 00:48:00,319
Speaker 4: Well, the Crystal Ray model, which is national over forty

981
00:48:00,360 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 4: Chrystal Ray schools around the country, including in Cincinnati to

982
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:11,279
Speaker 4: others in Ohio, has been a since its beginning, which

983
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:14,759
Speaker 4: was in the mid to late nineties. First Chicago has

984
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:25,040
Speaker 4: been a college, college access, college success driven model. Now

985
00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:28,240
Speaker 4: as we go forward in the world, that's changing pretty

986
00:48:28,320 --> 00:48:30,840
Speaker 4: darn rapidly for some of the reasons we've touched on

987
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:37,440
Speaker 4: here and others. Does that evolve over time possibly, but

988
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:42,680
Speaker 4: also remember it's a it's a large network, but it's

989
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:44,680
Speaker 4: still a niche player. There's maybe, you know, in the

990
00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:48,280
Speaker 4: grand scheme of things, you know, thirteen thousand students probably

991
00:48:48,400 --> 00:48:51,840
Speaker 4: double maybe by now more than double that, thirty thousand alumni,

992
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:54,840
Speaker 4: et cetera. So when you look at it relative to

993
00:48:55,760 --> 00:49:01,400
Speaker 4: all you know, high school population and the country, it's

994
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:07,759
Speaker 4: it's still a small player. But again, you know, so

995
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:11,200
Speaker 4: its model is is is a is a college driven one.

996
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:14,280
Speaker 4: And I think, you know, going back to its founding

997
00:49:14,440 --> 00:49:17,560
Speaker 4: and and and in the decades since you know, the

998
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:24,720
Speaker 4: ethos has meant, hey, there's these young people by virtue

999
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:28,720
Speaker 4: of their economic circumstances and others should not be denied

1000
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 4: the same the same opportunity as they're more affluent peers have.

1001
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, and unfortunately we have this hierarchy of the system

1002
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:38,799
Speaker 2: in place, and anything that's been in trench for a while,

1003
00:49:38,840 --> 00:49:41,439
Speaker 2: they're going to protect their own And of course you're

1004
00:49:41,480 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 2: looking at this model and say, wow, we should replicate

1005
00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:46,239
Speaker 2: this is a threat to their to their existence the

1006
00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:48,880
Speaker 2: way they've always done things, and saving to the cries

1007
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 2: you don't care about education and you want to destroy

1008
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 2: public schools, that's not it. It's if you look at

1009
00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 2: it as a tax payer, you want and none all

1010
00:49:55,200 --> 00:49:57,600
Speaker 2: that for our future. We need young people to be

1011
00:49:57,920 --> 00:50:01,479
Speaker 2: successful and well led you because it's in our best

1012
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:03,440
Speaker 2: interests as we get older too it our kids need

1013
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:05,200
Speaker 2: to because they're the ones that are going to be

1014
00:50:05,239 --> 00:50:09,279
Speaker 2: funding our lifestyles in the future. It's Bill Henson, he's

1015
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:12,600
Speaker 2: at Manhattan Institute joining the show this morning about how

1016
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:15,120
Speaker 2: we calculate the metrics or what success looks like in

1017
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:17,800
Speaker 2: public schools and when we spend more on public education,

1018
00:50:18,239 --> 00:50:21,880
Speaker 2: then we do self to our defense system for example,

1019
00:50:21,880 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 2: and you see the results our defense gets us versus

1020
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:26,520
Speaker 2: what education does or like is this money well spent

1021
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:28,680
Speaker 2: and we should be kicking the tires on what that

1022
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:29,640
Speaker 2: ROI looks like.

1023
00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 1: Bill, all the best, Thanks for jumping on this.

1024
00:50:31,160 --> 00:50:35,200
Speaker 4: Morning, my pleasure, Scott, thanks so much for having.

1025
00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:35,520
Speaker 1: Me take care.

1026
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, at some point it breaks right as we look

1027
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,160
Speaker 2: at AI and go, well, if kids aren't engaged in

1028
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:43,640
Speaker 2: their phone more than in the classroom, because that's the model,

1029
00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:46,480
Speaker 2: that's the formula, it's the algorithm. Or right now in

1030
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:50,960
Speaker 2: Washington they're fighting with well Facebook and other social media platforms,

1031
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:54,839
Speaker 2: TikTok and everything else about kids being engaged all the time.

1032
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:57,640
Speaker 2: It's become addictive. How do we take that formula, how

1033
00:50:57,640 --> 00:51:01,680
Speaker 2: do we take that algorithm and just simply using AI

1034
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:04,799
Speaker 2: making an educational model the way to teach kids to

1035
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,640
Speaker 2: make them addicted to learning. It seems like a great opportunity,

1036
00:51:07,640 --> 00:51:10,799
Speaker 2: but it threatens the hierarchy I was just talking about,

1037
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 2: and no one wants that, from the administrative class, to

1038
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:16,080
Speaker 2: the teachers, unions, to hell, the people who take care

1039
00:51:16,080 --> 00:51:19,080
Speaker 2: of the buildings, the brick and mortars. Scott's Loan Show

1040
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:21,120
Speaker 2: with news on the way in five minutes. Here Julie

1041
00:51:21,120 --> 00:51:29,799
Speaker 2: on the job, next seven hundred WLW program.

1042
00:51:26,719 --> 00:51:32,120
Speaker 1: Helping you put the big P in profession. Here's our career,

1043
00:51:32,239 --> 00:51:33,880
Speaker 1: Sir Julie Balki.

1044
00:51:33,960 --> 00:51:35,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm thinking we ought to bring that back, that

1045
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:38,200
Speaker 2: work whistle at the end of the day, and now

1046
00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:40,719
Speaker 2: were that that that horn that the shift is over.

1047
00:51:41,320 --> 00:51:42,480
Speaker 2: Of course you're not going to be going off all

1048
00:51:42,520 --> 00:51:44,839
Speaker 2: the time because everyone leaves at different times. But bring

1049
00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:46,640
Speaker 2: that up with that work whistle back, Julie, how are you?

1050
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:51,440
Speaker 7: I'm good, but I think why stop with the whistle

1051
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,160
Speaker 7: at the end of the day. Let's do a bell

1052
00:51:53,239 --> 00:51:58,000
Speaker 7: for lunch and morning and let's just keep.

1053
00:51:57,920 --> 00:51:58,680
Speaker 4: Selling all day.

1054
00:51:58,719 --> 00:52:00,759
Speaker 2: You're going to do the uh that like I don't

1055
00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:01,920
Speaker 2: know if they still do it or not, but like

1056
00:52:02,040 --> 00:52:04,480
Speaker 2: Japanese factory workers back in the day where they do

1057
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:08,720
Speaker 2: their calisthetics, the aerobics before before the work they started,

1058
00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:12,160
Speaker 2: nev's out there.

1059
00:52:15,080 --> 00:52:19,480
Speaker 7: The Japanese manufaction principles, like all that stuff. In the morning.

1060
00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:21,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you get up and instead of having coffee

1061
00:52:21,800 --> 00:52:26,120
Speaker 2: out there working out. So here's the question for you listening,

1062
00:52:26,280 --> 00:52:29,400
Speaker 2: is do you prefer money or do you prefer time?

1063
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:35,120
Speaker 2: Uninterrupted time off correlates with higher job satisfaction, better relationships

1064
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:39,320
Speaker 2: with your coworkers, and you're more engaged. Therefore, lower turnout

1065
00:52:39,640 --> 00:52:41,400
Speaker 2: time beats money.

1066
00:52:41,400 --> 00:52:45,279
Speaker 7: Does that surprise you, Julie, Well, I think we're gonna

1067
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:47,480
Speaker 7: put a caveat there. First of all, I'm not sure

1068
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:52,799
Speaker 7: why this surprises anyone. Everything that this study said, well da,

1069
00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:57,520
Speaker 7: I mean, so, I think what's what's tricky here is

1070
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:02,840
Speaker 7: this is a either or It really depends on your situation.

1071
00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:07,799
Speaker 7: So let's say that salary is not a concern for you,

1072
00:53:07,920 --> 00:53:10,400
Speaker 7: and yes, there are plenty of people who aren't working.

1073
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:13,239
Speaker 7: The salary is not the most important part of the job,

1074
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:16,880
Speaker 7: or they're not the primary red winner, or they've got

1075
00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 7: good savings and other things are more important for people

1076
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 7: like that. Yes, they would prefer to have more time

1077
00:53:23,640 --> 00:53:28,000
Speaker 7: off than they would a bonus in many cases because

1078
00:53:28,680 --> 00:53:32,960
Speaker 7: it gives them chances to do things that they want

1079
00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 7: to do outside of work. And so I think that

1080
00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:39,000
Speaker 7: the lesson here is, and I've said it over and

1081
00:53:39,040 --> 00:53:42,000
Speaker 7: over and over again, is one size does not fit all.

1082
00:53:42,920 --> 00:53:48,360
Speaker 7: And until you understand what motivates your folks, and you

1083
00:53:48,440 --> 00:53:52,400
Speaker 7: have those conversations and you show and you really start

1084
00:53:52,440 --> 00:53:55,479
Speaker 7: getting down to what can we offer that maybe does

1085
00:53:56,760 --> 00:54:01,480
Speaker 7: resemble a little bit of cafeteria style benefits they used

1086
00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:04,319
Speaker 7: to have, where you know, you get certain number of

1087
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:07,720
Speaker 7: credits or instead of this, uh, you know, thousand dollars

1088
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:10,680
Speaker 7: bonus or whatever, we're going to offer you two days

1089
00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:17,400
Speaker 7: off instead and give people that choice. Instead of saying

1090
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,240
Speaker 7: everybody gets X number of days off where everybody gets

1091
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 7: this bonus. You've got to offer what people value. And

1092
00:54:24,320 --> 00:54:27,640
Speaker 7: just because you, as a leader might value money and

1093
00:54:27,719 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 7: believe your people value money, their studies and studies upon

1094
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:35,680
Speaker 7: studies that go back decades to show that leaders believe

1095
00:54:36,120 --> 00:54:40,040
Speaker 7: that people value salary more than they do. But that's

1096
00:54:40,080 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 7: not to say they don't want to be paid fairly,

1097
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:47,600
Speaker 7: but it's the other things, recognition that I have a

1098
00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 7: personal life, there's other things I enjoy doing, that I

1099
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:54,759
Speaker 7: do have interest outside of work that matter to me,

1100
00:54:55,120 --> 00:54:59,120
Speaker 7: and that you're not going to go you're not going

1101
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:01,319
Speaker 7: to bother me and I'm on vacation. I was talking

1102
00:55:01,320 --> 00:55:04,400
Speaker 7: to somebody the other day, yep, who worked for, you know,

1103
00:55:04,680 --> 00:55:08,520
Speaker 7: a big organization, and he said, this guy called one

1104
00:55:08,600 --> 00:55:12,400
Speaker 7: of our staff members on she was at a wedding

1105
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:14,359
Speaker 7: out of state, and they asked her to come back

1106
00:55:14,360 --> 00:55:16,799
Speaker 7: because he needed her. And it wasn't even anything that

1107
00:55:16,960 --> 00:55:19,839
Speaker 7: important that it was just this person who was used

1108
00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:22,840
Speaker 7: to saying when I jump you out to say how high?

1109
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:27,359
Speaker 7: And that's an extreme example, but some variation of that

1110
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:28,320
Speaker 7: is not uncommon.

1111
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:31,799
Speaker 2: It's interesting that the way they did this study, So

1112
00:55:31,840 --> 00:55:35,120
Speaker 2: the study that they did, Julie Bokie, if I'm paid

1113
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:38,120
Speaker 2: vacation times make employees feel more quote unquote human than

1114
00:55:38,200 --> 00:55:39,520
Speaker 2: cash bonuses.

1115
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:41,120
Speaker 1: And the key.

1116
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:43,640
Speaker 2: Drivers just the time away. It's like a psychological boundary

1117
00:55:43,760 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 2: work in personal life. So they measured this out and

1118
00:55:46,520 --> 00:55:48,360
Speaker 2: there's like it's a very small gap and it's a

1119
00:55:48,440 --> 00:55:49,280
Speaker 2: seven point scale.

1120
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:50,000
Speaker 1: It's kind of weird.

1121
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:53,520
Speaker 2: But they said, every single text from a boss during

1122
00:55:53,560 --> 00:55:57,719
Speaker 2: your vacation drops that feeling human score so much it

1123
00:55:57,760 --> 00:55:59,799
Speaker 2: nearly wipes out the benefit of taking that vacation the

1124
00:55:59,800 --> 00:56:02,080
Speaker 2: first it's just by getting a few texts over the

1125
00:56:02,080 --> 00:56:02,920
Speaker 2: course of your vacation.

1126
00:56:03,480 --> 00:56:06,759
Speaker 7: Oh, absolutely, it triggers for this.

1127
00:56:06,960 --> 00:56:07,800
Speaker 4: What am I gonna thing?

1128
00:56:08,640 --> 00:56:11,000
Speaker 7: I've got to get got trying to relax. I've got

1129
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:13,279
Speaker 7: to put my head back into work. And if you

1130
00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:16,359
Speaker 7: own a company or you're the CEO and you want

1131
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:19,200
Speaker 7: choose to live your life like that, great, but don't

1132
00:56:19,239 --> 00:56:23,400
Speaker 7: assume that everybody else that everybody else is going to

1133
00:56:23,440 --> 00:56:25,640
Speaker 7: do that as well. So if you're really trying to relax,

1134
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:29,040
Speaker 7: and part of this comes from as a leader, establishing

1135
00:56:29,040 --> 00:56:34,160
Speaker 7: a culture that doesn't contact people on you know, on

1136
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:37,920
Speaker 7: their vacation, that doesn't you know, that says we're going

1137
00:56:38,000 --> 00:56:40,080
Speaker 7: to have somebody else take care of this, because every

1138
00:56:40,080 --> 00:56:42,479
Speaker 7: time you get dragged back to what's going on at work,

1139
00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:48,239
Speaker 7: the messenger sending is I don't care about you other

1140
00:56:48,360 --> 00:56:50,319
Speaker 7: than what you can do for me, So do this

1141
00:56:50,360 --> 00:56:50,960
Speaker 7: for me, please.

1142
00:56:52,640 --> 00:56:54,719
Speaker 2: How do you work with someone or for someone who

1143
00:56:54,880 --> 00:56:57,239
Speaker 2: values work more than time, because there are so many

1144
00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:59,759
Speaker 2: people in the world that their entire existence are entire

1145
00:56:59,800 --> 00:57:01,680
Speaker 2: life is about what they do for a living, and

1146
00:57:01,719 --> 00:57:03,680
Speaker 2: their whole cost for getting up in the morning is

1147
00:57:03,719 --> 00:57:06,279
Speaker 2: to do that. Now, you know, there's also people going, well,

1148
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:08,319
Speaker 2: it's I loved I like my job, I like what

1149
00:57:08,360 --> 00:57:09,719
Speaker 2: I do, I like the money, but it's not my

1150
00:57:09,760 --> 00:57:12,239
Speaker 2: whole life. I work so I can have other things

1151
00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:14,000
Speaker 2: in my life. I don't work just for the pure

1152
00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:17,760
Speaker 2: joy of working. And that's and that kind of attitude

1153
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:19,840
Speaker 2: is around that is that like the person who puts

1154
00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:22,880
Speaker 2: work above everything else in society, And it's starting to change.

1155
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 2: But that person is is more revered and more dedicated

1156
00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 2: than someone who doesn't that. Fortunately, I think that model

1157
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:31,120
Speaker 2: is starting to change, isn't it, And has been changing

1158
00:57:31,120 --> 00:57:32,680
Speaker 2: for a while for sure.

1159
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:35,600
Speaker 7: For sure, I had a client who was in my

1160
00:57:35,800 --> 00:57:39,360
Speaker 7: age range, and he interviewed with a CEO, and the

1161
00:57:39,400 --> 00:57:41,440
Speaker 7: CEO was asking a couple of questions for his family,

1162
00:57:41,640 --> 00:57:44,760
Speaker 7: and then the CEO said, I'm never just I'm met.

1163
00:57:44,960 --> 00:57:46,400
Speaker 7: This is the only time I'm going to ask you

1164
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:49,280
Speaker 7: about your family. I expect you to put work first

1165
00:57:49,360 --> 00:57:52,840
Speaker 7: in family seconds, and he took himself out of contention

1166
00:57:53,000 --> 00:57:55,560
Speaker 7: for the job. That moment, Wow, I said, that is

1167
00:57:55,600 --> 00:57:56,440
Speaker 7: not going to work for me.

1168
00:57:57,000 --> 00:57:57,360
Speaker 5: And so.

1169
00:57:58,920 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 7: When you weren't interviewing for a job, it's very fair

1170
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:04,680
Speaker 7: to say, Now, tell me about what it's.

1171
00:58:04,560 --> 00:58:06,000
Speaker 4: Like to work here, Tell me about the culture.

1172
00:58:06,120 --> 00:58:08,439
Speaker 7: Talk to as many people as you can who work

1173
00:58:08,520 --> 00:58:11,760
Speaker 7: there and understand is this the type of place that

1174
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:15,400
Speaker 7: expects you to be on call twenty four to seven,

1175
00:58:17,320 --> 00:58:20,440
Speaker 7: or or is a place that really values your off time?

1176
00:58:21,000 --> 00:58:26,320
Speaker 7: And I know people Flany that went on vacation purposely

1177
00:58:26,720 --> 00:58:29,120
Speaker 7: to places where they had no self service. Now this

1178
00:58:29,200 --> 00:58:31,680
Speaker 7: was years ago before self service was anywhere, like a

1179
00:58:31,760 --> 00:58:36,840
Speaker 7: crucis only so that they could not be contacted by

1180
00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:40,640
Speaker 7: the company. That is crazy. So I think part of

1181
00:58:40,640 --> 00:58:43,640
Speaker 7: this is setting expectations. You say something like I'm going

1182
00:58:43,680 --> 00:58:46,560
Speaker 7: to be off enjoying my family for a week. I

1183
00:58:46,560 --> 00:58:50,440
Speaker 7: will have very limited access. If there is I will

1184
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 7: check my email twice a week. If there's something urgent,

1185
00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:58,480
Speaker 7: please contact this person. But we kind of do it

1186
00:58:58,520 --> 00:59:02,760
Speaker 7: to ourselves. I'm not available, they will decide they don't

1187
00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:05,800
Speaker 7: need me, and then I'll be first on the layoff list.

1188
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:07,560
Speaker 7: And you can't walking that fine line.

1189
00:59:08,080 --> 00:59:09,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense. I think there's another element to

1190
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:11,680
Speaker 2: this whole thing too. By the way, it's Julie Balki

1191
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:14,240
Speaker 2: our career, Sirpa, it's Julie on the job every Wednesday

1192
00:59:14,240 --> 00:59:16,440
Speaker 2: morning on the Scott Slan show her seven hundred wylw

1193
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:19,439
Speaker 2: that a new study fund that paid vacation time makes

1194
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:23,000
Speaker 2: employees feel more human than cash bonuses and makes them

1195
00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:25,720
Speaker 2: seen as individuals' lives beyond work. And it's that paro.

1196
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:28,960
Speaker 2: It's all changing now, right, So people prefer time over money.

1197
00:59:29,160 --> 00:59:31,400
Speaker 2: I think there's another If you look at this almost

1198
00:59:31,480 --> 00:59:34,440
Speaker 2: like a graph, you have the time side on you know,

1199
00:59:34,560 --> 00:59:37,160
Speaker 2: the one access is time, the other access is money.

1200
00:59:37,600 --> 00:59:39,760
Speaker 1: But I will ask I'd offer a third.

1201
00:59:39,560 --> 00:59:43,240
Speaker 2: One in there, and that would be age because that

1202
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:46,320
Speaker 2: age line would intersect where you know when your first start.

1203
00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:48,120
Speaker 2: Now you have any money, you're working, You maybe have

1204
00:59:48,120 --> 00:59:50,160
Speaker 2: a degree or you get your training, whatever it might be,

1205
00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:51,720
Speaker 2: and you're ready to take on the world, and you're

1206
00:59:51,720 --> 00:59:53,440
Speaker 2: ready to work ob scene hours and put your nose

1207
00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:55,480
Speaker 2: to the grindstone because you really don't have anything else

1208
00:59:55,480 --> 00:59:57,200
Speaker 2: going on in your life. Maybe you're dating, you're not

1209
00:59:57,240 --> 01:00:01,080
Speaker 2: a serious relationship, but as you age and and everyone's different,

1210
01:00:01,080 --> 01:00:03,840
Speaker 2: but typically you age, you start to value relationships. Maybe

1211
01:00:03,840 --> 01:00:05,680
Speaker 2: you meet that special someone who will to start a family,

1212
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:07,640
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, that age line starts interacting

1213
01:00:07,680 --> 01:00:10,440
Speaker 2: where time is more important than money. And it's different

1214
01:00:10,440 --> 01:00:12,880
Speaker 2: for everyone, but I think that's a third factor here.

1215
01:00:14,680 --> 01:00:19,880
Speaker 7: Absolutely, your values and priorities change as you age. There

1216
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:23,160
Speaker 7: are certainly young people now it's flipped on a pad

1217
01:00:23,200 --> 01:00:26,920
Speaker 7: a little bit, that are not that focused on working career,

1218
01:00:27,040 --> 01:00:30,560
Speaker 7: and that's really frustrating to older generations because we're used

1219
01:00:30,600 --> 01:00:34,400
Speaker 7: to the model you just laid out. Be super focused early,

1220
01:00:34,840 --> 01:00:37,680
Speaker 7: kind of kill a little bit later on, and they're saying,

1221
01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:39,880
Speaker 7: maybe I want to chill now, maybe I want to

1222
01:00:39,960 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 7: chill forever, or maybe I'll get serious about my career

1223
01:00:42,640 --> 01:00:45,240
Speaker 7: in another few years. And so we have to recognize

1224
01:00:45,760 --> 01:00:50,200
Speaker 7: that each person brings a different, different life experience. And

1225
01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:55,040
Speaker 7: I'm not saying you don't expect great performance from your people.

1226
01:00:55,400 --> 01:00:58,360
Speaker 7: You absolutely do, and if they're not performing, that's a

1227
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:01,560
Speaker 7: whole other conversation. So don't take this to mean that

1228
01:01:01,640 --> 01:01:03,880
Speaker 7: I think everybody ought to be able to lobby other

1229
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:07,480
Speaker 7: away through the day, But you do have to recognize

1230
01:01:07,880 --> 01:01:11,600
Speaker 7: that each individual that it is never going back to

1231
01:01:11,640 --> 01:01:15,240
Speaker 7: the way it was yep, And that each individuals in

1232
01:01:15,320 --> 01:01:18,720
Speaker 7: your company has a life you know nothing about and

1233
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:20,960
Speaker 7: you don't have to understand it, and you don't have

1234
01:01:21,080 --> 01:01:23,480
Speaker 7: to get into it, okay, and you don't have to agree,

1235
01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:27,000
Speaker 7: you just have to recognize it.

1236
01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:30,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, what about the rto component return? We live in

1237
01:01:30,560 --> 01:01:32,240
Speaker 2: a moment Return office is a thing now, but we

1238
01:01:32,280 --> 01:01:34,560
Speaker 2: live in a moment where remote and hybrid work have

1239
01:01:34,640 --> 01:01:37,920
Speaker 2: blurred that line between work and personal life. Does that

1240
01:01:38,000 --> 01:01:40,280
Speaker 2: context may vacation time more or less valuable?

1241
01:01:42,120 --> 01:01:45,880
Speaker 7: Well, it depends if you so. I know some young,

1242
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:50,120
Speaker 7: younger people who have work for companies that are very,

1243
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:53,959
Speaker 7: very open and flexible with just get your work done,

1244
01:01:54,040 --> 01:01:58,240
Speaker 7: big national companies, get your work done and you're fine,

1245
01:01:58,320 --> 01:02:00,760
Speaker 7: We don't you know, take as much time as you need,

1246
01:02:00,800 --> 01:02:06,920
Speaker 7: but get your work done. And they are so loyal

1247
01:02:07,200 --> 01:02:12,480
Speaker 7: to those organizations and they are so appreciative of the

1248
01:02:12,560 --> 01:02:15,040
Speaker 7: fact that nobody's bringing down their neck that I know

1249
01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:21,000
Speaker 7: for sure they work harder because of that, and they

1250
01:02:21,040 --> 01:02:25,400
Speaker 7: don't necessarily need as much one hundred percent away from

1251
01:02:25,440 --> 01:02:29,200
Speaker 7: work vacation time because they haven't had to have their

1252
01:02:29,240 --> 01:02:31,560
Speaker 7: nose to the grindstone twenty four to seven to get

1253
01:02:31,600 --> 01:02:34,600
Speaker 7: those two weeks up. So it's finding that right mix

1254
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:37,640
Speaker 7: for you and organizations that have that type of a

1255
01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:42,240
Speaker 7: framework and realize that they've hired adults. Until I've hired

1256
01:02:42,280 --> 01:02:43,920
Speaker 7: you as an adult, I expect to get your work

1257
01:02:43,960 --> 01:02:46,200
Speaker 7: done and most time until you show me you can't.

1258
01:02:46,720 --> 01:02:49,520
Speaker 7: And then those individual cases where they show you can't,

1259
01:02:49,560 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 7: You've got to take care of those because if you don't,

1260
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:54,480
Speaker 7: you're going to lose the You're going to lose the

1261
01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:57,080
Speaker 7: engagement and the loyalty of the other people who are

1262
01:02:57,080 --> 01:02:58,000
Speaker 7: playing by the rules.

1263
01:02:58,280 --> 01:03:00,360
Speaker 2: Another element of those studies that they may sure, do

1264
01:03:00,400 --> 01:03:04,080
Speaker 2: you know, does it? Does a research hold across different

1265
01:03:04,080 --> 01:03:06,200
Speaker 2: income levels on it? For example, if you make a

1266
01:03:06,280 --> 01:03:09,840
Speaker 2: five thousand dollars bonus versus an extra week off, that

1267
01:03:09,960 --> 01:03:12,320
Speaker 2: might feel different if you're making you know, thirty five

1268
01:03:12,360 --> 01:03:14,720
Speaker 2: grand a year, but if you're making don't one hundred

1269
01:03:14,720 --> 01:03:17,000
Speaker 2: and fifty two hundred k year, that five thousand dollars

1270
01:03:17,080 --> 01:03:20,000
Speaker 2: is like, yeah, you know, I'll do the vacation instead.

1271
01:03:21,000 --> 01:03:24,040
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And also, I mean there are people

1272
01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:25,680
Speaker 7: who are doing three and four jobs and if you

1273
01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:28,200
Speaker 7: gave them, I mean, I've seen this. If you gave

1274
01:03:28,240 --> 01:03:32,680
Speaker 7: them a two hundred dollars bonus. That's potentially their electric bill.

1275
01:03:32,720 --> 01:03:36,520
Speaker 7: I mean that's a big deal. So yes, the proportion

1276
01:03:37,080 --> 01:03:40,440
Speaker 7: of what the proportion combined with what the person's individual

1277
01:03:40,480 --> 01:03:43,480
Speaker 7: situation is is, is what And that's why I think

1278
01:03:43,480 --> 01:03:47,480
Speaker 7: you've got to create a You have to get out

1279
01:03:47,480 --> 01:03:50,160
Speaker 7: of the mentality that one size fits all. Get a

1280
01:03:50,200 --> 01:03:53,360
Speaker 7: benefit of your compon benefits person, Bring in a consultant

1281
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:56,600
Speaker 7: of compon benefits consultant. Make sure your attorneys in the

1282
01:03:56,640 --> 01:04:01,240
Speaker 7: loop so you're applying things consistently, but start to recognize

1283
01:04:01,480 --> 01:04:06,800
Speaker 7: and offer benefits that allow people to to to be

1284
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:09,520
Speaker 7: recognized as a person who's not like this the person

1285
01:04:09,600 --> 01:04:10,520
Speaker 7: sitting in the next view.

1286
01:04:10,720 --> 01:04:12,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, Julie Balki.

1287
01:04:12,200 --> 01:04:14,840
Speaker 2: If a company offers you more vacation but you're afraid

1288
01:04:14,840 --> 01:04:16,600
Speaker 2: to take it because of that mantra from the loss

1289
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:19,680
Speaker 2: is you know, because a work or culture of fear

1290
01:04:19,880 --> 01:04:22,560
Speaker 2: is seeing being less committed, does it does it benefit

1291
01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:25,960
Speaker 2: evaporate entirely? I mean, so many Americans have vacation days

1292
01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:28,840
Speaker 2: on the table. I don't know why, but they do.

1293
01:04:28,920 --> 01:04:30,280
Speaker 2: And that's probably part of it.

1294
01:04:32,080 --> 01:04:35,240
Speaker 7: Absolutely, So it's the culture set. So you might work

1295
01:04:35,280 --> 01:04:39,400
Speaker 7: for a company where the very top leadership is saying, absolutely,

1296
01:04:39,480 --> 01:04:40,880
Speaker 7: take all your time. You want you to take all

1297
01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:45,600
Speaker 7: your time. But you might work for a director. You

1298
01:04:45,680 --> 01:04:49,240
Speaker 7: might be direct reporting to somebody who rolls his eyes,

1299
01:04:49,800 --> 01:04:52,320
Speaker 7: rolls his or her eyes at that statement and says, yeah,

1300
01:04:53,000 --> 01:04:55,200
Speaker 7: kind of do as you know, do as I do,

1301
01:04:55,360 --> 01:04:58,080
Speaker 7: not as they're telling you to do, and really actively

1302
01:04:58,120 --> 01:05:00,479
Speaker 7: discourages it. And so yeah, I mean, and that can

1303
01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:03,280
Speaker 7: we say. I've said over and over again, all the

1304
01:05:03,280 --> 01:05:07,800
Speaker 7: research indicates the number one people reason people leave organizations

1305
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:11,760
Speaker 7: is poor leadership. And that's an example of poor leadership.

1306
01:05:13,800 --> 01:05:16,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense, But I don't think you're going

1307
01:05:16,600 --> 01:05:18,800
Speaker 2: to change that, you know, as long as they manage

1308
01:05:18,840 --> 01:05:20,640
Speaker 2: your boss or owners there, I don't think you're going

1309
01:05:20,680 --> 01:05:22,360
Speaker 2: to change that mindset. And you may see, you know,

1310
01:05:22,400 --> 01:05:24,520
Speaker 2: some some changes there as well. And I think you

1311
01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:28,880
Speaker 2: know what the boss test experiment, you know, one text

1312
01:05:28,960 --> 01:05:30,960
Speaker 2: drops the human feelings score by more than a full

1313
01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:33,280
Speaker 2: point in the seven point scale, and so, you know,

1314
01:05:33,360 --> 01:05:35,400
Speaker 2: I guess that tells us a lot more about what

1315
01:05:35,560 --> 01:05:38,480
Speaker 2: most workplaces actually, how they operate as approached to how

1316
01:05:38,520 --> 01:05:42,360
Speaker 2: realistically they're disconnected from the time off model here that

1317
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:44,960
Speaker 2: you know, there's plenty of people listening who work in

1318
01:05:45,080 --> 01:05:47,440
Speaker 2: environments like this, and you think at some point the

1319
01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:48,200
Speaker 2: message you get through.

1320
01:05:48,240 --> 01:05:52,160
Speaker 7: It never does though, No, no it doesn't. I mean

1321
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:54,600
Speaker 7: I can't even tell you the number of conversations I

1322
01:05:54,640 --> 01:06:00,400
Speaker 7: have with people that they work for someone who nine

1323
01:06:00,440 --> 01:06:04,720
Speaker 7: out of ten people could quit and say, you know,

1324
01:06:04,960 --> 01:06:08,120
Speaker 7: the leadership care is horrible, or nine not ten people

1325
01:06:08,120 --> 01:06:10,919
Speaker 7: could quit, and that leader would say, people just don't

1326
01:06:10,920 --> 01:06:14,400
Speaker 7: want to work anymore. That that lack of saying, wait

1327
01:06:14,480 --> 01:06:17,960
Speaker 7: a minute, maybe I'm doing something wrong. It is like

1328
01:06:18,160 --> 01:06:22,640
Speaker 7: this denial that leaders have over why people leave organizations.

1329
01:06:22,680 --> 01:06:26,800
Speaker 7: It's like they must twist themselves into some incredibly incredible

1330
01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:30,960
Speaker 7: prexels to believe that if you have really high turnover

1331
01:06:31,360 --> 01:06:33,160
Speaker 7: it's because people don't want to work anymore.

1332
01:06:33,240 --> 01:06:34,040
Speaker 4: It's ridiculous.

1333
01:06:34,280 --> 01:06:36,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess all that fair is that it's not

1334
01:06:36,600 --> 01:06:38,040
Speaker 2: just the workplace, it's human nature.

1335
01:06:38,120 --> 01:06:38,160
Speaker 5: Is.

1336
01:06:38,280 --> 01:06:40,800
Speaker 2: For example, you know, if you're divorced, if you get

1337
01:06:40,800 --> 01:06:44,280
Speaker 2: a divorce, well it's it's probably them. Second divorce is

1338
01:06:44,280 --> 01:06:46,439
Speaker 2: like well, and by the third one it's like, well,

1339
01:06:46,480 --> 01:06:47,680
Speaker 2: clearly it's not them, it's you.

1340
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:51,160
Speaker 1: Right, I just keep picking bad people, do you know

1341
01:06:51,320 --> 01:06:52,360
Speaker 1: it's probably you.

1342
01:06:53,560 --> 01:06:57,400
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, but that that lack of even awareness that

1343
01:06:57,520 --> 01:07:00,640
Speaker 7: even says we don't want to believe that should I

1344
01:07:00,760 --> 01:07:04,440
Speaker 7: be doing something different, it's going to be leading differently.

1345
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:08,320
Speaker 7: It is crazy to me and I stories all the

1346
01:07:08,360 --> 01:07:13,080
Speaker 7: time leaders write in Cincinnati who don't like the most

1347
01:07:13,160 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 7: clueless because they don't want to admit they thought they

1348
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:19,000
Speaker 7: have the mentality that I'm in charge, so I'm the

1349
01:07:19,040 --> 01:07:23,160
Speaker 7: smartest and so nobody can question me. Well, especially if

1350
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:25,120
Speaker 7: you have a younger workforce, they are not going to

1351
01:07:25,160 --> 01:07:28,440
Speaker 7: stick around and stuck it up. They're just not And

1352
01:07:28,480 --> 01:07:30,880
Speaker 7: so that that is part of why we're getting as

1353
01:07:30,920 --> 01:07:33,440
Speaker 7: younger generation doesn't want to work. Maybe they don't want

1354
01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 7: to work for you, Maybe they don't want to work

1355
01:07:36,280 --> 01:07:38,520
Speaker 7: in the way you want that to work. Maybe you

1356
01:07:38,600 --> 01:07:40,960
Speaker 7: need to take a look inside and see how you're

1357
01:07:41,040 --> 01:07:44,280
Speaker 7: leading and see, you know, see if your behavior matches,

1358
01:07:44,560 --> 01:07:47,800
Speaker 7: you know, matches what you're putting out there. And there's

1359
01:07:47,880 --> 01:07:50,760
Speaker 7: just this human nature that's like it can't possibly be me.

1360
01:07:51,240 --> 01:07:53,920
Speaker 2: Do you think that employers will trust this data? I mean,

1361
01:07:53,920 --> 01:07:56,120
Speaker 2: we have studies like this all the time, and I

1362
01:07:56,360 --> 01:07:57,760
Speaker 2: don't just fall on deafirs.

1363
01:07:59,400 --> 01:08:00,440
Speaker 4: No, I know.

1364
01:08:01,960 --> 01:08:04,560
Speaker 7: It's just it's just it's you know, after you've been

1365
01:08:04,600 --> 01:08:08,040
Speaker 7: around for us, Wow, there are so many. But you

1366
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:09,920
Speaker 7: just look at the number of books that are written

1367
01:08:09,920 --> 01:08:12,120
Speaker 7: on how to be a good leader and the fact

1368
01:08:12,160 --> 01:08:17,519
Speaker 7: that the needle hasn't moved, you know, forever on why

1369
01:08:17,560 --> 01:08:20,599
Speaker 7: people leave organizations, But their number one complaint is about

1370
01:08:20,640 --> 01:08:23,559
Speaker 7: their culture. The person who has the most influence over

1371
01:08:23,600 --> 01:08:29,960
Speaker 7: their lives. Nobody wants, nobody wants to believe it's that,

1372
01:08:30,120 --> 01:08:31,920
Speaker 7: and they can read book after book after book, but

1373
01:08:31,960 --> 01:08:35,960
Speaker 7: it requires that introspection and that well wait a minute,

1374
01:08:36,040 --> 01:08:38,800
Speaker 7: you know, am I really open to receiving feedback from

1375
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:42,759
Speaker 7: people who have experienced me as a leader and really

1376
01:08:42,840 --> 01:08:46,120
Speaker 7: open and open myself up and not be defensive, no doubt,

1377
01:08:47,439 --> 01:08:51,000
Speaker 7: and think about what I can do differently because of

1378
01:08:51,200 --> 01:08:53,720
Speaker 7: training and training and books and everything out there.

1379
01:08:53,760 --> 01:08:56,240
Speaker 2: It addresses the problem. And that's the biggest problem. There

1380
01:08:56,280 --> 01:08:58,599
Speaker 2: are bad bosses. You know, there's not many there's books

1381
01:08:58,600 --> 01:09:00,559
Speaker 2: on how to be a better boss or And it's

1382
01:09:00,640 --> 01:09:02,120
Speaker 2: kind of like, why aren't there there are plenty of

1383
01:09:02,160 --> 01:09:04,280
Speaker 2: weight loss books, Julia, Why aren't our books out there

1384
01:09:04,280 --> 01:09:05,080
Speaker 2: on how to gain weight?

1385
01:09:07,680 --> 01:09:08,760
Speaker 7: Right?

1386
01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:13,000
Speaker 2: Julie Bouki, Right, Julie Bouki career shir up here on

1387
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:15,280
Speaker 2: the Scotsland Show Julie on the Job every Wednesday morning.

1388
01:09:15,320 --> 01:09:18,680
Speaker 2: It's again the website her and her team. She got

1389
01:09:18,720 --> 01:09:20,160
Speaker 2: a whole team, by the way, it's b a Uk

1390
01:09:20,360 --> 01:09:23,040
Speaker 2: Debaki Group, dot Com, career Coach consult, et cetera. Thanks again,

1391
01:09:23,040 --> 01:09:25,600
Speaker 2: we'll talk next week. Have a good one, all all right,

1392
01:09:25,640 --> 01:09:26,120
Speaker 2: appreciate it.

1393
01:09:26,160 --> 01:09:26,320
Speaker 6: Han.

1394
01:09:26,400 --> 01:09:28,160
Speaker 2: Let me get a news update in when a return

1395
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:30,880
Speaker 2: boots on the ground here. Alex Schaeffer is his name,

1396
01:09:30,960 --> 01:09:33,639
Speaker 2: and he's a resident Adams County and you know it's

1397
01:09:33,680 --> 01:09:36,360
Speaker 2: the normal guy who now has become well to a

1398
01:09:36,439 --> 01:09:39,479
Speaker 2: lesser great activist. There's a local battle over data centers

1399
01:09:39,560 --> 01:09:42,080
Speaker 2: waging across not just Ohio, but Kentucky, Indiana, all over

1400
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:43,840
Speaker 2: and where to put these things? We need them, we're

1401
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:45,400
Speaker 2: using them, but we got it. We don't want them

1402
01:09:45,439 --> 01:09:48,000
Speaker 2: in our backyard. He has literally boots on the ground

1403
01:09:48,000 --> 01:09:50,200
Speaker 2: and fighting. And what's going on in Adams County. There's

1404
01:09:50,200 --> 01:09:52,600
Speaker 2: no the meeting tonight and what does that look like?

1405
01:09:52,640 --> 01:09:54,680
Speaker 2: Because now you're going as Adams County. But you know

1406
01:09:54,840 --> 01:09:57,320
Speaker 2: this is an issue we're all gonna face sooner rather

1407
01:09:57,320 --> 01:09:59,559
Speaker 2: than later. Where to put the data centers. He's next

1408
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:01,120
Speaker 2: on the show one hundred W regisins.

1409
01:10:01,160 --> 01:10:06,519
Speaker 8: Now it's got flowed on seven one hundred w welw

1410
01:10:06,760 --> 01:10:08,280
Speaker 8: so this week, and you're probably gonna spend a lot

1411
01:10:08,320 --> 01:10:10,400
Speaker 8: more time in front of devices than you do during

1412
01:10:10,439 --> 01:10:12,920
Speaker 8: the week, right just because you're not working hopefully and

1413
01:10:12,960 --> 01:10:13,479
Speaker 8: you yourself.

1414
01:10:13,479 --> 01:10:16,439
Speaker 2: On average, you have around twenty one devices which are

1415
01:10:16,479 --> 01:10:19,400
Speaker 2: online in various places throughout the day, all of them

1416
01:10:19,479 --> 01:10:21,640
Speaker 2: using data pretty much all the time. And with the

1417
01:10:21,680 --> 01:10:24,559
Speaker 2: AI boom comes the need for more data centers. Thus

1418
01:10:24,600 --> 01:10:27,000
Speaker 2: the debate. So here in the Tri State, the debate

1419
01:10:27,000 --> 01:10:29,360
Speaker 2: over regulations being fought tooth and nail. And if you

1420
01:10:29,360 --> 01:10:33,000
Speaker 2: don't think this affects you, it's probably coming to your area,

1421
01:10:33,120 --> 01:10:34,439
Speaker 2: no matter if you live in the city or in

1422
01:10:34,439 --> 01:10:37,439
Speaker 2: the outlining area especial rural areas Ohio. Right now we're

1423
01:10:37,479 --> 01:10:40,040
Speaker 2: fifth nationally for data center development. We want to be

1424
01:10:40,120 --> 01:10:44,240
Speaker 2: number one. The state SENESUS is an economic machine force

1425
01:10:44,320 --> 01:10:47,120
Speaker 2: to get us on the technology well at the top

1426
01:10:47,120 --> 01:10:49,760
Speaker 2: of the technology map. I guess City of Cincinnati's you

1427
01:10:49,880 --> 01:10:52,120
Speaker 2: may or may not know, it's getting very proactive. They

1428
01:10:52,200 --> 01:10:55,080
Speaker 2: just put a temporary moratorium on data centers in the

1429
01:10:55,080 --> 01:10:57,960
Speaker 2: city while they do a zoning study Adams County. There

1430
01:10:58,000 --> 01:11:00,880
Speaker 2: was another meeting over well, well, we really don't know.

1431
01:11:01,280 --> 01:11:05,280
Speaker 2: This is probably the most interesting battle over data centers

1432
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:08,439
Speaker 2: is that adding the controversy over these plants comes a

1433
01:11:08,479 --> 01:11:11,559
Speaker 2: plan here in Adams County that's completely secret because Economic

1434
01:11:11,600 --> 01:11:15,400
Speaker 2: Development director signed a non disclosure dree agreement, and nobody

1435
01:11:15,479 --> 01:11:18,160
Speaker 2: really knows what it's going to be, where it's going

1436
01:11:18,240 --> 01:11:20,160
Speaker 2: to go, and what it's going to do.

1437
01:11:20,240 --> 01:11:22,360
Speaker 1: Other than that, everything's great. Alex Schaefer's here.

1438
01:11:22,400 --> 01:11:25,280
Speaker 2: Alex is a resident and he's proactive in the process

1439
01:11:25,280 --> 01:11:27,240
Speaker 2: of finding out if this is right for his community,

1440
01:11:27,640 --> 01:11:29,719
Speaker 2: and he's out in Adams County and the Monroe Township

1441
01:11:29,720 --> 01:11:31,880
Speaker 2: and joins the show this morning. Basically, the bottom line

1442
01:11:31,960 --> 01:11:33,960
Speaker 2: is you're not going to do a more toim like

1443
01:11:34,080 --> 01:11:37,040
Speaker 2: City Cincinnati has, but you're going to make sure there's

1444
01:11:37,040 --> 01:11:40,240
Speaker 2: some strict zoning regulations in place. So it's it's progressing,

1445
01:11:40,240 --> 01:11:40,919
Speaker 2: it's moving.

1446
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:43,880
Speaker 9: Forward, it's progressing, it's moving forward. There's a lot of

1447
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:47,000
Speaker 9: community input. The role of the trustees now within the

1448
01:11:47,000 --> 01:11:50,280
Speaker 9: township is they are going to work with outside legal

1449
01:11:50,320 --> 01:11:51,200
Speaker 9: counsel to put.

1450
01:11:51,080 --> 01:11:52,759
Speaker 6: In the framework for zoning.

1451
01:11:54,240 --> 01:11:57,120
Speaker 9: You know, within these industrial areas within the township because

1452
01:11:57,160 --> 01:12:00,120
Speaker 9: everybody was on the same page where we have to

1453
01:12:00,120 --> 01:12:02,720
Speaker 9: get more information, We have to have more facts, and

1454
01:12:02,760 --> 01:12:07,000
Speaker 9: more importantly, we have to know even who these people

1455
01:12:07,040 --> 01:12:08,800
Speaker 9: are that are wanting to come in and what they're

1456
01:12:08,800 --> 01:12:09,400
Speaker 9: wanting to do.

1457
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:12,599
Speaker 2: Yeah, so what raised the red flags for you about

1458
01:12:12,640 --> 01:12:15,799
Speaker 2: these projects and what motive motivated you to get involved.

1459
01:12:16,320 --> 01:12:19,840
Speaker 9: You know, these sites at Stewart and Killing Station, Killing

1460
01:12:19,960 --> 01:12:23,639
Speaker 9: is in and Roe Township have been empty for roughly

1461
01:12:23,680 --> 01:12:25,920
Speaker 9: eight years since the power plant shut down, and a

1462
01:12:25,920 --> 01:12:27,639
Speaker 9: lot of that has to do with the site cleanup.

1463
01:12:28,000 --> 01:12:32,280
Speaker 9: And those were the economic drivers of our county, and

1464
01:12:32,360 --> 01:12:36,599
Speaker 9: Adams County is such a prideful, beautiful countryside, but those

1465
01:12:36,760 --> 01:12:42,040
Speaker 9: were the economic drivers that really our community was built around.

1466
01:12:42,120 --> 01:12:46,800
Speaker 9: So it is these are general generational issues that we

1467
01:12:46,920 --> 01:12:49,000
Speaker 9: have in our county and we want to make sure

1468
01:12:49,040 --> 01:12:52,120
Speaker 9: that we're doing the right things. So not only us,

1469
01:12:52,160 --> 01:12:55,160
Speaker 9: but our children and our grandchildren are proud to continue

1470
01:12:55,200 --> 01:12:56,639
Speaker 9: to live and remain in Adams County.

1471
01:12:56,680 --> 01:12:59,000
Speaker 2: So this isn't completely going Hey, we don't want a

1472
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:00,760
Speaker 2: data center, we don't want to of this stuff, stay

1473
01:13:00,760 --> 01:13:01,679
Speaker 2: the hell out of our town.

1474
01:13:03,080 --> 01:13:06,120
Speaker 9: No, I would say everyone is of the mindset where

1475
01:13:06,920 --> 01:13:10,080
Speaker 9: as I would akin these NDAs to that mister Worley

1476
01:13:10,120 --> 01:13:13,840
Speaker 9: signed is you're essentially agreen to get married before you've

1477
01:13:13,880 --> 01:13:16,080
Speaker 9: even seen who you're going on a date with. So

1478
01:13:16,960 --> 01:13:19,120
Speaker 9: you know, we need to have more facts. We need

1479
01:13:19,120 --> 01:13:22,080
Speaker 9: to know exactly who these companies are. Are they are

1480
01:13:22,120 --> 01:13:25,479
Speaker 9: they you know, companies based in the US. Are they

1481
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:29,519
Speaker 9: foreign based companies? And you know what exactly the plans

1482
01:13:29,560 --> 01:13:32,479
Speaker 9: are because there's so many different variables that come into play.

1483
01:13:33,560 --> 01:13:37,000
Speaker 2: And I think that's a critical point because in this

1484
01:13:37,040 --> 01:13:39,360
Speaker 2: particular case, and we'll get into the NDA battle in

1485
01:13:39,439 --> 01:13:41,240
Speaker 2: just a second. And Paul Warley, I believe is the

1486
01:13:41,240 --> 01:13:44,880
Speaker 2: Economic Development director for Adams County. He signed an NDA

1487
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:46,840
Speaker 2: with a company, But you guys have no idea on

1488
01:13:47,320 --> 01:13:49,559
Speaker 2: you know, the size and scope of the project, the

1489
01:13:49,640 --> 01:13:51,680
Speaker 2: exact location. I mean, you could kind of figure that

1490
01:13:51,760 --> 01:13:55,040
Speaker 2: out maybe with EPA records, but if you don't know

1491
01:13:55,080 --> 01:13:56,679
Speaker 2: the company, you don't know even if it's a data

1492
01:13:56,680 --> 01:13:59,479
Speaker 2: center or the type of services they offer before this

1493
01:13:59,520 --> 01:13:59,920
Speaker 2: thing goes.

1494
01:14:01,200 --> 01:14:05,560
Speaker 9: So the projects that are being proposed in Spring Township

1495
01:14:05,600 --> 01:14:09,320
Speaker 9: are a little bit further along, specifically at Stewart Seite,

1496
01:14:09,320 --> 01:14:12,400
Speaker 9: and there's also Buck Canyon site, which is across the

1497
01:14:12,520 --> 01:14:16,720
Speaker 9: road to inn Row, is very much earlier on in

1498
01:14:16,760 --> 01:14:22,120
Speaker 9: the process, which is very fortunate. And so that's precisely it.

1499
01:14:22,320 --> 01:14:25,280
Speaker 9: You know, we have to have more information on this

1500
01:14:25,400 --> 01:14:28,479
Speaker 9: because there I mean, it's just it's a black hole

1501
01:14:28,600 --> 01:14:29,880
Speaker 9: right now for the county, Okay.

1502
01:14:29,880 --> 01:14:33,240
Speaker 2: So the Economic Development director signs this non disclosure agreement

1503
01:14:33,240 --> 01:14:36,280
Speaker 2: with a couple companies and says, we've got to do

1504
01:14:36,400 --> 01:14:39,000
Speaker 2: this and they'll be transparency if the project gets to

1505
01:14:39,000 --> 01:14:40,880
Speaker 2: a point. So, you know, how do you respond to

1506
01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:43,400
Speaker 2: residents like yourself being asked away for details until the

1507
01:14:43,400 --> 01:14:45,559
Speaker 2: deals are nearly finalized. At what point is it too

1508
01:14:45,680 --> 01:14:47,080
Speaker 2: late for meaningful public input?

1509
01:14:49,600 --> 01:14:51,479
Speaker 9: I think that starts at the time that you actually

1510
01:14:51,520 --> 01:14:55,560
Speaker 9: signed the nbas. You know, Paul Whorley executed two nbas,

1511
01:14:55,640 --> 01:14:58,439
Speaker 9: one in January of twenty twenty four, the other one

1512
01:14:58,479 --> 01:15:01,920
Speaker 9: was in November of this year, and based on my

1513
01:15:02,120 --> 01:15:05,439
Speaker 9: tracing them, it's my opinion that they are linked to

1514
01:15:05,439 --> 01:15:10,519
Speaker 9: Amazon because the framework around the NBA's is the same

1515
01:15:10,560 --> 01:15:12,519
Speaker 9: as what's going on in Mount Warb right now in

1516
01:15:12,560 --> 01:15:15,880
Speaker 9: Brown County. And you know, to that point, and I

1517
01:15:15,920 --> 01:15:19,200
Speaker 9: had raised this issue and discussions with some of the

1518
01:15:19,200 --> 01:15:23,280
Speaker 9: Commissioners on Monday. Is Paul Whorley serves at the pleasure

1519
01:15:23,640 --> 01:15:27,240
Speaker 9: of the Board of Commissioners in Adams County. So how

1520
01:15:27,320 --> 01:15:30,920
Speaker 9: is the Board of Commissioners able to oversee Paul discharging

1521
01:15:30,960 --> 01:15:33,880
Speaker 9: his job duties for the board and thus in the

1522
01:15:33,880 --> 01:15:37,160
Speaker 9: best interests of the county if they cannot even monitor

1523
01:15:37,840 --> 01:15:38,960
Speaker 9: what he is working on?

1524
01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:42,040
Speaker 6: Who is who he is working with on these sites?

1525
01:15:42,280 --> 01:15:45,680
Speaker 2: Sure, but from the company standpoint, be it Amazon or

1526
01:15:45,760 --> 01:15:47,599
Speaker 2: whatever it might be, we don't know at this point.

1527
01:15:48,160 --> 01:15:49,439
Speaker 2: He's kind of like the kind of what so on

1528
01:15:49,520 --> 01:15:51,679
Speaker 2: these deals, you get a guy like him, an economic

1529
01:15:51,680 --> 01:15:55,280
Speaker 2: development guy, signs a non disclosure agreement with whoever's building

1530
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:58,320
Speaker 2: this thing, which is kind of standard practice because you know,

1531
01:15:58,360 --> 01:15:59,960
Speaker 2: they want to keep the secret for as long as

1532
01:16:00,040 --> 01:16:03,360
Speaker 2: pus from the competition because there's a lot of proprietary

1533
01:16:03,360 --> 01:16:05,720
Speaker 2: technical information of all. But the people who don't sign

1534
01:16:05,760 --> 01:16:08,120
Speaker 2: it would be the the elected lawmakers, right, that would

1535
01:16:08,160 --> 01:16:10,240
Speaker 2: be the county commissioners of Adams County. And so at

1536
01:16:10,280 --> 01:16:13,720
Speaker 2: some point there's going to have to be a disclosure

1537
01:16:14,120 --> 01:16:17,080
Speaker 2: so that you can you can vote on this. So

1538
01:16:17,120 --> 01:16:18,479
Speaker 2: based on that, is this anything?

1539
01:16:18,680 --> 01:16:18,920
Speaker 6: Is this?

1540
01:16:19,240 --> 01:16:22,320
Speaker 2: Is this different than how it's done elsewhere, not that

1541
01:16:22,360 --> 01:16:23,679
Speaker 2: it makes it right, but you know what I'm saying

1542
01:16:23,800 --> 01:16:25,960
Speaker 2: is like, if this is standard practice, I get why

1543
01:16:26,000 --> 01:16:28,160
Speaker 2: Amazon or whoever is trying to protect their interests here

1544
01:16:28,200 --> 01:16:30,280
Speaker 2: because you know, you don't want all this information out

1545
01:16:30,280 --> 01:16:32,360
Speaker 2: there until you get a deal kind of put together.

1546
01:16:33,640 --> 01:16:36,360
Speaker 9: The debate on whether NDA's is standard practice or not

1547
01:16:37,640 --> 01:16:40,280
Speaker 9: really dependent on who you ask. I can tell you

1548
01:16:40,320 --> 01:16:42,880
Speaker 9: in certain areas and Columbus, which Columbus has over one

1549
01:16:42,960 --> 01:16:46,720
Speaker 9: hundred data centers right now, is not the most standard practice.

1550
01:16:46,840 --> 01:16:50,880
Speaker 9: And to your point about competition, that is actually what

1551
01:16:51,040 --> 01:16:55,400
Speaker 9: NDAs specifically inhibit. My degree is in economics from Ohio

1552
01:16:55,439 --> 01:16:58,960
Speaker 9: State University, and when you put an NDA in place,

1553
01:16:59,560 --> 01:17:04,240
Speaker 9: that prohibits you from even looking at other alternatives as

1554
01:17:04,280 --> 01:17:07,840
Speaker 9: to those sites and those developments, thus reducing competition. What

1555
01:17:07,960 --> 01:17:11,000
Speaker 9: happens when you reduce competition, you harm the consumer. Who's

1556
01:17:11,040 --> 01:17:13,040
Speaker 9: the consumer here the residents of Adams County.

1557
01:17:13,680 --> 01:17:15,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I get the argument, and you, you guys,

1558
01:17:16,040 --> 01:17:17,920
Speaker 2: you definitely should have a hand in the process here.

1559
01:17:17,960 --> 01:17:19,479
Speaker 2: We don't want government just going out and no, we

1560
01:17:19,520 --> 01:17:21,800
Speaker 2: know what's best, and that's it doesn't work that way.

1561
01:17:22,640 --> 01:17:25,679
Speaker 2: County officials there will switch to the jobs saying they said, well,

1562
01:17:25,720 --> 01:17:28,040
Speaker 2: seven hundred seven hundred jobs lost with the power plant

1563
01:17:28,040 --> 01:17:30,439
Speaker 2: closures there in Adams County. Another five and a half

1564
01:17:30,479 --> 01:17:33,680
Speaker 2: million from school funding gets pulled out because as they said, look,

1565
01:17:33,680 --> 01:17:36,000
Speaker 2: I've going hey, listen, this is going to help support

1566
01:17:36,040 --> 01:17:39,479
Speaker 2: the tax space here. But as I understand it, data

1567
01:17:39,479 --> 01:17:42,680
Speaker 2: centers are obviously exempt from property taxes because it's commercial.

1568
01:17:43,360 --> 01:17:44,799
Speaker 2: What about the job creation element?

1569
01:17:46,120 --> 01:17:49,600
Speaker 9: So job creation, the studies have shown that you have

1570
01:17:49,720 --> 01:17:53,920
Speaker 9: to have roughly twenty million dollars of capital input costs

1571
01:17:54,040 --> 01:17:56,519
Speaker 9: to create one full time job. So if you have

1572
01:17:56,640 --> 01:18:00,479
Speaker 9: a billion dollar data center development, you are on going

1573
01:18:00,520 --> 01:18:03,639
Speaker 9: to create roughly fifty jobs, Whereas if you look at

1574
01:18:03,680 --> 01:18:09,360
Speaker 9: other industrial usages for that site that actually provide you know,

1575
01:18:09,560 --> 01:18:13,280
Speaker 9: not only additional jobs and infrastructure and increase land value

1576
01:18:13,280 --> 01:18:18,640
Speaker 9: for the community. You are actually specifically targeting a broader workforce,

1577
01:18:18,720 --> 01:18:20,800
Speaker 9: the technical skill set of the workforce that we have

1578
01:18:20,880 --> 01:18:24,320
Speaker 9: in Adams County. And it's also then benefiting the community

1579
01:18:24,960 --> 01:18:27,160
Speaker 9: for people to work there and also the school districts

1580
01:18:27,200 --> 01:18:30,400
Speaker 9: in terms of the generation of those taxes from the payroll.

1581
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:33,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, what about the element of what about the

1582
01:18:33,520 --> 01:18:35,360
Speaker 2: this is you know, the trail. I love the trades,

1583
01:18:35,400 --> 01:18:37,839
Speaker 2: but there'll be like over a thousand, around a thousand

1584
01:18:37,840 --> 01:18:40,479
Speaker 2: construction jobs for up to five years, and some of

1585
01:18:40,520 --> 01:18:42,360
Speaker 2: those would have to be in place for maintenance because

1586
01:18:42,360 --> 01:18:44,200
Speaker 2: a minute you finished this huge project going to take

1587
01:18:44,240 --> 01:18:47,200
Speaker 2: you know, three years, you're going to start having to

1588
01:18:47,240 --> 01:18:49,719
Speaker 2: refit some areas that were done three years ago because

1589
01:18:49,720 --> 01:18:52,640
Speaker 2: it's technology to change as rapidly. So some of the

1590
01:18:52,760 --> 01:18:55,280
Speaker 2: estimates say, you know, maybe one hundred million plus in

1591
01:18:55,320 --> 01:18:59,479
Speaker 2: local wages, one thousand, two thousand workers, eighty percent of

1592
01:18:59,479 --> 01:19:01,840
Speaker 2: those will be and radius of where you live.

1593
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:04,799
Speaker 1: Those jobs are nothing to some of your nose.

1594
01:19:04,680 --> 01:19:07,240
Speaker 6: App there are nothing good. Some of your knows that.

1595
01:19:07,320 --> 01:19:09,679
Speaker 9: But I think you have to look at the actual

1596
01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:11,840
Speaker 9: data in terms of the payroll. And I've talked about

1597
01:19:11,840 --> 01:19:14,360
Speaker 9: this with David Gifford, the county auditor, who's a good

1598
01:19:14,400 --> 01:19:17,160
Speaker 9: friend of mine. And you know, when people try and

1599
01:19:17,160 --> 01:19:20,360
Speaker 9: say these auxiliary jobs that are created in the permanency

1600
01:19:20,439 --> 01:19:23,519
Speaker 9: of them, the numbers simply do not support that in

1601
01:19:23,560 --> 01:19:25,960
Speaker 9: the payroll records, and the auditor has that, and I

1602
01:19:25,960 --> 01:19:28,840
Speaker 9: think you also overall with these data centers in the

1603
01:19:28,920 --> 01:19:31,160
Speaker 9: job creation, you have to look at what's happening in

1604
01:19:31,200 --> 01:19:34,879
Speaker 9: the Greater Columbus area with Intel, where essentially Mike Dwine

1605
01:19:34,920 --> 01:19:37,680
Speaker 9: sold the farm to Intel and we had and the

1606
01:19:37,680 --> 01:19:39,680
Speaker 9: plants were supposed to open last year, and they were

1607
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:43,280
Speaker 9: all these financial incentives and benchmarks that were supposed to

1608
01:19:43,280 --> 01:19:43,960
Speaker 9: be met by them.

1609
01:19:44,000 --> 01:19:44,400
Speaker 6: They have not.

1610
01:19:45,000 --> 01:19:48,559
Speaker 9: Mike had the option to enforce those agreements last year

1611
01:19:48,600 --> 01:19:49,760
Speaker 9: and he basically.

1612
01:19:49,320 --> 01:19:50,439
Speaker 6: Said, no, it's okay.

1613
01:19:51,320 --> 01:19:53,479
Speaker 9: You know, you can do whatever you want here in Ohio.

1614
01:19:53,800 --> 01:19:58,080
Speaker 9: So what would make the situation any different in Appalasha areas.

1615
01:19:57,720 --> 01:19:59,720
Speaker 6: And the Yeah.

1616
01:19:59,760 --> 01:20:01,160
Speaker 2: But the same time you look at it and go,

1617
01:20:01,560 --> 01:20:04,320
Speaker 2: are there industries that are are knocking at the door

1618
01:20:04,360 --> 01:20:06,720
Speaker 2: and trying to get their way into Adams County right now?

1619
01:20:07,200 --> 01:20:10,160
Speaker 2: You know you mentioned Columbus, Cincinnati, the big cities. A

1620
01:20:10,240 --> 01:20:12,320
Speaker 2: lot of companies want to do business in those areas.

1621
01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:14,880
Speaker 2: It makes a lot of sense for reasons we don't.

1622
01:20:15,080 --> 01:20:18,160
Speaker 2: The obvious reasons would be infrastructures already in place. But

1623
01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:21,920
Speaker 2: you know, Adams County I lost jobs, power plants. Is

1624
01:20:21,920 --> 01:20:23,840
Speaker 2: it kind of like you're turning your nose up with

1625
01:20:23,880 --> 01:20:26,080
Speaker 2: a good thing or you're trying to basically avoid a

1626
01:20:26,120 --> 01:20:28,040
Speaker 2: slam dunk. Care I mean, I think people see this

1627
01:20:28,080 --> 01:20:29,840
Speaker 2: and go, well, it's Adams County. It's not like and

1628
01:20:29,880 --> 01:20:32,040
Speaker 2: it's not being I'm not being derogatory. It's just like

1629
01:20:32,320 --> 01:20:34,160
Speaker 2: there are in companies that are looking to knock the

1630
01:20:34,160 --> 01:20:35,799
Speaker 2: door down to Adams County at this point.

1631
01:20:35,600 --> 01:20:36,160
Speaker 6: Are there.

1632
01:20:37,960 --> 01:20:40,680
Speaker 9: No, I would disagree with that. The sites have been

1633
01:20:40,720 --> 01:20:43,479
Speaker 9: looked at for a multiple for a multitude of different

1634
01:20:43,560 --> 01:20:45,599
Speaker 9: sectors over the years. And again, I think it's important

1635
01:20:45,600 --> 01:20:48,599
Speaker 9: for people to remember that once the power plants closed,

1636
01:20:48,600 --> 01:20:51,720
Speaker 9: it's not like you can just open up, you know,

1637
01:20:51,840 --> 01:20:54,800
Speaker 9: a new enterprise there the next day. There's so much

1638
01:20:54,880 --> 01:20:58,000
Speaker 9: environmental cleanup the head to be done with King Fisher Partners.

1639
01:20:57,640 --> 01:20:58,120
Speaker 6: To come in.

1640
01:20:58,120 --> 01:21:01,479
Speaker 1: There's a brownfield, yeah exactly precisely, yes.

1641
01:21:01,640 --> 01:21:04,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and but okay, so there's some infrastructure there,

1642
01:21:04,640 --> 01:21:06,960
Speaker 2: but people are well, well, I'd rather build something, you know.

1643
01:21:07,040 --> 01:21:09,360
Speaker 2: At the same time, you know, these data centers take

1644
01:21:09,400 --> 01:21:11,120
Speaker 2: a lot of power. So you know, put two and

1645
01:21:11,120 --> 01:21:13,360
Speaker 2: two together, it's pretty obvious that you want to be

1646
01:21:13,439 --> 01:21:14,960
Speaker 2: near water, which you have, and you want to be

1647
01:21:15,040 --> 01:21:17,320
Speaker 2: near you know, megawats of electricity.

1648
01:21:17,320 --> 01:21:18,880
Speaker 1: They're easily accessible.

1649
01:21:19,800 --> 01:21:22,360
Speaker 9: Correct, and we do have the power grid there in place,

1650
01:21:23,200 --> 01:21:25,360
Speaker 9: and you know, this is something that a big Ramaswami

1651
01:21:25,360 --> 01:21:27,960
Speaker 9: has discussed about the strain on the power grid right now,

1652
01:21:28,000 --> 01:21:30,960
Speaker 9: and there's currently a House bill in place, House Built

1653
01:21:31,000 --> 01:21:35,160
Speaker 9: six forty six sitting in the House Rules Committee in

1654
01:21:35,240 --> 01:21:39,000
Speaker 9: terms of actually setting a thirteam member commissioned to study

1655
01:21:39,040 --> 01:21:41,720
Speaker 9: these data centers because of the boom of them in Ohio,

1656
01:21:41,760 --> 01:21:46,439
Speaker 9: because of the strain on our electrical grid. So I

1657
01:21:47,120 --> 01:21:49,360
Speaker 9: kind of akin it to people as this is, how

1658
01:21:49,400 --> 01:21:53,400
Speaker 9: are we going to continue as a society to supply

1659
01:21:53,479 --> 01:21:57,120
Speaker 9: the power and energy to these data centers because they

1660
01:21:57,160 --> 01:22:00,560
Speaker 9: are not they are they are an energy input, They're

1661
01:22:00,600 --> 01:22:05,080
Speaker 9: not an energy export if we do not have facilities

1662
01:22:05,120 --> 01:22:07,519
Speaker 9: in place to actually generate that power for them.

1663
01:22:07,640 --> 01:22:09,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've talked about this a lot of my show

1664
01:22:09,360 --> 01:22:11,080
Speaker 2: Well in the Future, and I you know, you're in

1665
01:22:11,120 --> 01:22:12,920
Speaker 2: the tech sector as well, So it's not like you

1666
01:22:12,960 --> 01:22:14,760
Speaker 2: know your lott of your scream at the old man,

1667
01:22:14,800 --> 01:22:17,320
Speaker 2: scream at the clouds and saying damn computers.

1668
01:22:16,880 --> 01:22:19,000
Speaker 1: Go away, right, I mean you lean we all leaned

1669
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:19,280
Speaker 1: into it.

1670
01:22:19,280 --> 01:22:21,719
Speaker 2: We're all and it's it's such a paradox, right, Alex,

1671
01:22:21,800 --> 01:22:24,520
Speaker 2: because we're all guilty of this. We all have devices.

1672
01:22:24,560 --> 01:22:26,840
Speaker 2: I mean, we're talking you know, digitally. Right now I'm

1673
01:22:26,880 --> 01:22:29,640
Speaker 2: recording you digitally, it's going into a cloud. And so

1674
01:22:29,880 --> 01:22:32,640
Speaker 2: we're guilty of this ourselves right now. We have no

1675
01:22:32,800 --> 01:22:35,320
Speaker 2: choice but to figure out a way we can all live.

1676
01:22:35,200 --> 01:22:40,800
Speaker 6: With us absolutely. And you know, my company uses you know.

1677
01:22:40,880 --> 01:22:44,160
Speaker 9: Cloud servers, and you know, we have to have them

1678
01:22:44,200 --> 01:22:46,320
Speaker 9: as society, and we have to have them also in

1679
01:22:46,400 --> 01:22:50,680
Speaker 9: terms of national intelligence and also being independent from you know,

1680
01:22:51,040 --> 01:22:53,960
Speaker 9: foreign control. And I think we all saw what happened

1681
01:22:53,960 --> 01:22:57,360
Speaker 9: with COVID when manufacturing shut down and the rest of

1682
01:22:57,400 --> 01:22:59,160
Speaker 9: the world look that, you know, Oh my god, look

1683
01:22:59,160 --> 01:23:02,240
Speaker 9: how the pendent we are on China. So you know,

1684
01:23:02,320 --> 01:23:05,880
Speaker 9: that is definitely, you know, a great point. And that's

1685
01:23:05,920 --> 01:23:08,680
Speaker 9: the thing I think everyone's standpoint is we are not

1686
01:23:08,800 --> 01:23:12,040
Speaker 9: saying no to data centers overall, but in terms of

1687
01:23:12,360 --> 01:23:16,480
Speaker 9: specifically the locations and the phases in which you possibly

1688
01:23:16,920 --> 01:23:19,519
Speaker 9: would put those in and where you would put those

1689
01:23:19,560 --> 01:23:22,160
Speaker 9: in at is what the biggest concern is with not

1690
01:23:22,240 --> 01:23:24,320
Speaker 9: having any information from these companies?

1691
01:23:24,600 --> 01:23:27,480
Speaker 2: The number one, the biggest outside of transparency the politics

1692
01:23:27,479 --> 01:23:30,240
Speaker 2: of it, which generally they tend to settle down at

1693
01:23:30,240 --> 01:23:32,920
Speaker 2: some point. What's the biggest concern for residents? Would you

1694
01:23:32,920 --> 01:23:35,160
Speaker 2: say there Alex Schaeffer and Adams County over this.

1695
01:23:36,600 --> 01:23:39,760
Speaker 9: I would say specifically where they're proposing it is, you know,

1696
01:23:40,120 --> 01:23:44,639
Speaker 9: the landscape in you know, the southern part of Adams County,

1697
01:23:45,479 --> 01:23:48,320
Speaker 9: the hills and the river and everything is what makes

1698
01:23:48,360 --> 01:23:49,600
Speaker 9: Adams County beautiful.

1699
01:23:49,800 --> 01:23:51,479
Speaker 6: And also, you know.

1700
01:23:52,560 --> 01:23:54,680
Speaker 9: You know, the side effects that you have from the

1701
01:23:54,760 --> 01:23:57,719
Speaker 9: data center's long term is something that again we don't

1702
01:23:57,720 --> 01:24:00,000
Speaker 9: know about. So if the state is at the process

1703
01:24:00,080 --> 01:24:02,960
Speaker 9: sets to where they're looking at creating a thirteen member

1704
01:24:03,000 --> 01:24:07,679
Speaker 9: committee to study those effects, then us as Adams County

1705
01:24:07,720 --> 01:24:09,599
Speaker 9: should sit here and look at it and say, Okay,

1706
01:24:09,680 --> 01:24:11,720
Speaker 9: if this is a broader issue at the state and

1707
01:24:11,800 --> 01:24:15,519
Speaker 9: obviously the national level, you know, we don't have the

1708
01:24:15,560 --> 01:24:19,720
Speaker 9: ability as a small community to fight this later on

1709
01:24:19,800 --> 01:24:21,200
Speaker 9: down the road. So we don't want to make the

1710
01:24:21,240 --> 01:24:23,720
Speaker 9: wrong decision now that we look back ten years and

1711
01:24:23,760 --> 01:24:25,439
Speaker 9: we're like, what did we do right?

1712
01:24:25,479 --> 01:24:27,600
Speaker 2: It's hard because you know, you're at the tip of

1713
01:24:27,600 --> 01:24:29,400
Speaker 2: the spirit at this point. There are not many other

1714
01:24:29,439 --> 01:24:31,360
Speaker 2: peers you could look at that have been doing this

1715
01:24:31,400 --> 01:24:33,040
Speaker 2: for you twenty years and see what the long term

1716
01:24:33,080 --> 01:24:35,080
Speaker 2: effects are. You've got to make a decision. It's going

1717
01:24:35,080 --> 01:24:37,680
Speaker 2: to impact the next hundred exactly.

1718
01:24:38,160 --> 01:24:41,000
Speaker 9: And you know that's that's honestly the problem in society

1719
01:24:41,040 --> 01:24:44,160
Speaker 9: with a lot of things, whether that's technology or medicine,

1720
01:24:44,280 --> 01:24:48,400
Speaker 9: and you know, we have to continue to evolve and adapt.

1721
01:24:48,640 --> 01:24:51,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, there are unforeseen consequences that no one can predict.

1722
01:24:51,640 --> 01:24:54,120
Speaker 2: And usually that's the case, we didn't we didn't think

1723
01:24:54,120 --> 01:24:55,960
Speaker 2: of that, or we didn't see that coming. Because while

1724
01:24:56,280 --> 01:24:58,800
Speaker 2: the world is always changing, for sure, So what are

1725
01:24:58,800 --> 01:24:59,599
Speaker 2: the next steps here?

1726
01:25:01,000 --> 01:25:04,680
Speaker 9: So from area township right now they're in the process

1727
01:25:05,000 --> 01:25:08,440
Speaker 9: of obtaining outside legal counsels, start trapped in the framework

1728
01:25:09,280 --> 01:25:12,560
Speaker 9: for what they want to put in for zoning. Specifically,

1729
01:25:12,560 --> 01:25:17,160
Speaker 9: their Sprig Township has a meeting I believe it is

1730
01:25:17,160 --> 01:25:21,559
Speaker 9: February twenty third, and there there is going to be

1731
01:25:21,600 --> 01:25:24,720
Speaker 9: some more information hopefully that will come out about at

1732
01:25:24,760 --> 01:25:28,480
Speaker 9: that standpoint. And so overall for the county, the commissioners

1733
01:25:28,560 --> 01:25:33,040
Speaker 9: have promised to have more public input and a more

1734
01:25:33,120 --> 01:25:36,880
Speaker 9: dedicated special meeting to this. But again I think it's

1735
01:25:36,960 --> 01:25:40,000
Speaker 9: very important to point out, you know, in terms of

1736
01:25:40,040 --> 01:25:44,960
Speaker 9: these developments, the Board of Commissioners has the option to

1737
01:25:45,120 --> 01:25:50,519
Speaker 9: direct mister Warley to recuse himself from these NDAs, and

1738
01:25:50,640 --> 01:25:53,720
Speaker 9: that prevents these companies moving forward with the speed that

1739
01:25:53,760 --> 01:25:57,160
Speaker 9: they would like and garner that public input and have

1740
01:25:57,280 --> 01:26:00,800
Speaker 9: these representatives come in and talk to the community, talk

1741
01:26:00,880 --> 01:26:03,360
Speaker 9: to us about what their plans are and how they

1742
01:26:03,400 --> 01:26:07,360
Speaker 9: want to integrate themselves into our county in a way

1743
01:26:07,400 --> 01:26:09,840
Speaker 9: that we're proud of, just like General Electric has done

1744
01:26:09,840 --> 01:26:11,559
Speaker 9: with their jet engine testing facility in.

1745
01:26:11,560 --> 01:26:14,479
Speaker 2: People makes sense, You think Cincinnata has it right putting

1746
01:26:14,479 --> 01:26:15,680
Speaker 2: the moratry monusor.

1747
01:26:15,360 --> 01:26:17,040
Speaker 6: Did I do?

1748
01:26:17,240 --> 01:26:20,559
Speaker 9: And several other townships and Columbus have done that. Jerone Township,

1749
01:26:20,760 --> 01:26:23,120
Speaker 9: Washington Township, and the city of Dublin have done that,

1750
01:26:23,280 --> 01:26:25,599
Speaker 9: and they have data centers kind of around the perimeter

1751
01:26:26,120 --> 01:26:28,760
Speaker 9: of the City of Dublin. And because you know right

1752
01:26:28,800 --> 01:26:32,479
Speaker 9: now it's an arms race for data centers, it truly is,

1753
01:26:32,560 --> 01:26:37,400
Speaker 9: and that stems from, I believe, you know, a technological.

1754
01:26:36,760 --> 01:26:39,680
Speaker 6: Arms race with China. So again, in order for.

1755
01:26:39,720 --> 01:26:43,240
Speaker 9: Us to properly look at this for our future and

1756
01:26:43,280 --> 01:26:45,479
Speaker 9: look at the side effects of it, and look at

1757
01:26:45,960 --> 01:26:50,080
Speaker 9: where we want to see these things in the landscape

1758
01:26:50,360 --> 01:26:54,120
Speaker 9: of our communities, we have to put the pause button

1759
01:26:54,160 --> 01:26:58,920
Speaker 9: in place, get more information, get more facts, and truly

1760
01:26:58,960 --> 01:27:02,479
Speaker 9: be able to make and more educated and informed decision.

1761
01:27:02,920 --> 01:27:06,400
Speaker 2: Alex Schaeffer is a residence in Adams County and it's

1762
01:27:06,400 --> 01:27:08,840
Speaker 2: certainly one of the more interesting cases because of NDAs

1763
01:27:08,920 --> 01:27:11,760
Speaker 2: and land and not knowing what really is going to

1764
01:27:11,840 --> 01:27:14,040
Speaker 2: go and who even owns a data center for that point.

1765
01:27:14,080 --> 01:27:15,760
Speaker 2: But it's a great example to look at for the

1766
01:27:15,800 --> 01:27:19,400
Speaker 2: rest of us because Alex is a resident, is getting involved.

1767
01:27:19,400 --> 01:27:21,840
Speaker 2: He's being proactive in the process of finding out if

1768
01:27:21,880 --> 01:27:24,759
Speaker 2: it's right for his community and where he lives and breathes,

1769
01:27:24,760 --> 01:27:27,280
Speaker 2: he eats and works. And that's a battle. It's you

1770
01:27:27,320 --> 01:27:29,080
Speaker 2: hear and that's going well, that's Adams County, but guess

1771
01:27:29,080 --> 01:27:31,479
Speaker 2: what it's happening in Cincy. It's going to happen in

1772
01:27:32,439 --> 01:27:34,160
Speaker 2: not only the city, but it's going to happen in

1773
01:27:34,400 --> 01:27:38,120
Speaker 2: maybe suburban areas, but particularly rural areas, Butler County, Mount Orb,

1774
01:27:38,680 --> 01:27:41,080
Speaker 2: the list goes on and on and on. So it's

1775
01:27:41,080 --> 01:27:42,519
Speaker 2: a battle we're all going to have to face, or

1776
01:27:42,520 --> 01:27:43,920
Speaker 2: an issue we're gonna have to face, I guess, and

1777
01:27:43,920 --> 01:27:45,920
Speaker 2: figure out how to to what the best practice is.

1778
01:27:46,439 --> 01:27:48,839
Speaker 2: It's not going away. We're gonna have to put them somewhere.

1779
01:27:49,439 --> 01:27:51,400
Speaker 2: How do we coexist, I guess is a question it's

1780
01:27:51,400 --> 01:27:53,639
Speaker 2: a great case, Alex. We'll talk again in the future,

1781
01:27:53,640 --> 01:27:54,000
Speaker 2: I'm sure.

1782
01:27:54,040 --> 01:27:54,200
Speaker 6: Man.

1783
01:27:54,200 --> 01:27:57,040
Speaker 1: Thanks for coming on and shedding some light on this issue.

1784
01:27:57,920 --> 01:28:01,320
Speaker 9: Absolutely, and Scott, you know on behalf of the people

1785
01:28:01,320 --> 01:28:04,519
Speaker 9: of Adams County. Thank you for having me on to

1786
01:28:04,680 --> 01:28:08,599
Speaker 9: allow us to raise our voice on your platform into

1787
01:28:08,640 --> 01:28:11,280
Speaker 9: the greater Tri State area. We are truly and greatly

1788
01:28:11,320 --> 01:28:12,080
Speaker 9: appreciative of all.

1789
01:28:12,160 --> 01:28:15,200
Speaker 2: I appreciate you, brother, and again we'll talk soon. Thanks again,

1790
01:28:15,920 --> 01:28:18,040
Speaker 2: Thanks Scott. All right, there we go, Alex Schaeffer on

1791
01:28:18,080 --> 01:28:20,639
Speaker 2: the show. Yeah you hear that, you go. It doesn't really,

1792
01:28:20,720 --> 01:28:23,160
Speaker 2: it doesn't concern it, does it concerned? We're the ones

1793
01:28:23,200 --> 01:28:26,200
Speaker 2: doing it right. We use all this stuff as far

1794
01:28:26,200 --> 01:28:28,519
Speaker 2: as information goes in data. We're using it right now.

1795
01:28:28,680 --> 01:28:30,439
Speaker 2: You're using it right and we're all using it. We

1796
01:28:30,479 --> 01:28:33,400
Speaker 2: have no choice. This is it's what it is. It's

1797
01:28:33,439 --> 01:28:36,120
Speaker 2: the future too. So can we lean and make money

1798
01:28:36,160 --> 01:28:39,559
Speaker 2: and make Ohio a more vibrant and improve our economy

1799
01:28:39,560 --> 01:28:43,240
Speaker 2: because of Intel, because of aws et cetera, et cetera. Well,

1800
01:28:43,280 --> 01:28:46,000
Speaker 2: we also have to live where these plants are too.

1801
01:28:46,080 --> 01:28:48,719
Speaker 2: So watching these guys, I think it's a great test

1802
01:28:48,720 --> 01:28:50,360
Speaker 2: case for all of us. If you will anyway, we'll

1803
01:28:50,400 --> 01:28:52,880
Speaker 2: continue to follow that. Scott's Loan show continues seven hundred

1804
01:28:52,960 --> 01:28:55,639
Speaker 2: wl slonely seven hundred w Aldo.

1805
01:28:55,640 --> 01:28:56,599
Speaker 1: It'll be sharing the day off.

1806
01:28:56,960 --> 01:28:59,640
Speaker 2: She is resting after her work is MC along with

1807
01:28:59,680 --> 01:29:02,880
Speaker 2: Tom was off today. Marty grap for Homeless Kids twenty

1808
01:29:02,920 --> 01:29:05,320
Speaker 2: twenty six raised a quarter million dollars to feed kids

1809
01:29:05,360 --> 01:29:07,439
Speaker 2: in Cincinnati, So thank you, as King of Marti grat

1810
01:29:07,479 --> 01:29:10,640
Speaker 2: thank you for that. Speaking of kids, the weather is

1811
01:29:10,640 --> 01:29:13,040
Speaker 2: starting to get warmer and more kids will be participating

1812
01:29:13,040 --> 01:29:16,400
Speaker 2: in sports, and we know when it comes to concussions

1813
01:29:16,920 --> 01:29:20,880
Speaker 2: that kids are particularly susceptible to this. Football comes to

1814
01:29:20,920 --> 01:29:23,120
Speaker 2: my first and foremost. But now with the advent of

1815
01:29:23,160 --> 01:29:26,719
Speaker 2: flag football and girls participating at record levels, we're starting

1816
01:29:26,760 --> 01:29:29,360
Speaker 2: to see more and more kids present in emergency departments

1817
01:29:29,640 --> 01:29:33,760
Speaker 2: with concussions. And seven out of ten ed visits for

1818
01:29:33,840 --> 01:29:37,360
Speaker 2: sports and recreation related injuries are concussions for kids seventeen

1819
01:29:37,360 --> 01:29:39,760
Speaker 2: and under. It's incredible. Joining the show this morning once

1820
01:29:39,760 --> 01:29:44,599
Speaker 2: again is Bruce Parkman. He's an expert in preventing TBIs. Bruce,

1821
01:29:44,640 --> 01:29:45,559
Speaker 2: welcome back, how are you?

1822
01:29:47,160 --> 01:29:48,880
Speaker 5: Thank you very much, sir, appreciate you having me on

1823
01:29:48,880 --> 01:29:49,160
Speaker 5: the show.

1824
01:29:49,240 --> 01:29:52,680
Speaker 2: Doing fine today, Yeah, it's an important issue when you

1825
01:29:52,720 --> 01:29:55,679
Speaker 2: are exposed to early concussive trauma and we're talking about

1826
01:29:55,680 --> 01:29:58,559
Speaker 2: maybe multiple one, two or three or more, and maybe

1827
01:29:58,560 --> 01:30:01,840
Speaker 2: you don't know that your kid is suffering from a concussion.

1828
01:30:02,600 --> 01:30:04,559
Speaker 2: There's a hidden risk there. What are we seeing in

1829
01:30:04,560 --> 01:30:08,400
Speaker 2: relation to that? And then later on mental illness? Are

1830
01:30:08,400 --> 01:30:09,800
Speaker 2: we talking about CTE in.

1831
01:30:09,720 --> 01:30:14,000
Speaker 5: Particular talking about was called RhI repeated head impacts and

1832
01:30:14,040 --> 01:30:17,320
Speaker 5: those are the little blows, the subconcussom blows that kids

1833
01:30:17,360 --> 01:30:19,599
Speaker 5: take when their head hits the wrestling mat, or they

1834
01:30:19,600 --> 01:30:23,000
Speaker 5: get tackled in football, or they head the soccer ball.

1835
01:30:23,479 --> 01:30:26,720
Speaker 5: And these little impacts are now known over time to

1836
01:30:26,800 --> 01:30:29,240
Speaker 5: be the cause of CTE, which is of course you

1837
01:30:29,280 --> 01:30:32,080
Speaker 5: don't know about that to you die. But there are

1838
01:30:32,120 --> 01:30:36,200
Speaker 5: also the cause of damage to the brain that over time,

1839
01:30:36,520 --> 01:30:41,240
Speaker 5: through the inflammation and continued prolonged exposure to the subcust

1840
01:30:41,280 --> 01:30:44,280
Speaker 5: of is hits, leads to mental illness from the damage

1841
01:30:44,320 --> 01:30:44,800
Speaker 5: to the brain.

1842
01:30:45,680 --> 01:30:48,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, in some cases we know it may be one

1843
01:30:49,080 --> 01:30:51,880
Speaker 2: or two decent I mean really really good ones graded

1844
01:30:51,960 --> 01:30:54,799
Speaker 2: higher graded concussions that may causes but you're talking about

1845
01:30:54,840 --> 01:30:59,479
Speaker 2: now just the jarring of the brain, not necessarily concussion.

1846
01:30:59,000 --> 01:31:02,760
Speaker 5: Right, absolutely, sir. Every one of those hits changes the

1847
01:31:02,760 --> 01:31:06,040
Speaker 5: brain at the microcellular level. And the issue is because

1848
01:31:06,080 --> 01:31:09,040
Speaker 5: they don't provide any concussive symptoms like the child is

1849
01:31:09,080 --> 01:31:11,559
Speaker 5: not busy or the planning of a headache, we assume

1850
01:31:11,600 --> 01:31:14,080
Speaker 5: that it's safe. But what we now know from science

1851
01:31:14,080 --> 01:31:18,280
Speaker 5: and research and how I lost my son from mental illness,

1852
01:31:18,520 --> 01:31:21,280
Speaker 5: and that was validated by research and a study that

1853
01:31:21,320 --> 01:31:24,400
Speaker 5: we funded at Boston University with the NFL players as well,

1854
01:31:24,960 --> 01:31:28,719
Speaker 5: is that there is extreme structural damage that occurs over years,

1855
01:31:28,720 --> 01:31:31,280
Speaker 5: and that damage has been associated and known to be

1856
01:31:31,320 --> 01:31:33,759
Speaker 5: correlated with mental illness for over four decades.

1857
01:31:34,479 --> 01:31:36,559
Speaker 2: What type of mental illnesses are we talking about? How

1858
01:31:36,560 --> 01:31:37,400
Speaker 2: does it present later?

1859
01:31:38,479 --> 01:31:40,920
Speaker 5: So most of the mental illnesses that we could actually

1860
01:31:41,680 --> 01:31:45,160
Speaker 5: runs the gamut from psychological, cognitive, and behavior disorders. So

1861
01:31:45,200 --> 01:31:48,720
Speaker 5: we're talking about aggression, rage, and pulsivity. But it could

1862
01:31:48,720 --> 01:31:52,280
Speaker 5: be light noise sensitivity, it could be apathy, it could

1863
01:31:52,320 --> 01:31:56,120
Speaker 5: be just a lack of care. And the problem is

1864
01:31:56,160 --> 01:31:59,519
Speaker 5: that we have is that as a society, we assume

1865
01:31:59,600 --> 01:32:02,000
Speaker 5: that our kids are growing up or you know, they're

1866
01:32:02,400 --> 01:32:04,559
Speaker 5: just not you know, they're not taking part in the

1867
01:32:04,600 --> 01:32:07,439
Speaker 5: activity that used to love so well. But we are

1868
01:32:07,439 --> 01:32:10,120
Speaker 5: now finding out that all these mental illnesses. We have

1869
01:32:10,200 --> 01:32:13,040
Speaker 5: kids that are incarcerated right now only because they started

1870
01:32:13,040 --> 01:32:16,759
Speaker 5: playing sports so young that their brain is damage and rage, aggression,

1871
01:32:16,840 --> 01:32:20,240
Speaker 5: and pulsivity. I'll emanate from the prefrontal cortex damage, which

1872
01:32:20,280 --> 01:32:22,800
Speaker 5: is right behind the forehead and assumes the majority of

1873
01:32:22,800 --> 01:32:26,920
Speaker 5: the trauma that these kids are are are are being

1874
01:32:26,960 --> 01:32:28,439
Speaker 5: exposed to in contact sports.

1875
01:32:28,520 --> 01:32:30,759
Speaker 2: You know, I'm sure there's some folks listening and maybe

1876
01:32:30,800 --> 01:32:33,519
Speaker 2: being dismissive about this, going, oh, come on, okay, so

1877
01:32:33,560 --> 01:32:35,200
Speaker 2: you get you know, bump your head a little bit.

1878
01:32:35,280 --> 01:32:37,880
Speaker 2: You know, you made your body, We've developed as human beings,

1879
01:32:37,880 --> 01:32:40,439
Speaker 2: We've evolved, or maybe God made imperfect people, depending on

1880
01:32:40,439 --> 01:32:42,080
Speaker 2: how you look. And then you're telling me just the

1881
01:32:42,200 --> 01:32:44,720
Speaker 2: notion of living your life and drying your brain is

1882
01:32:44,760 --> 01:32:46,599
Speaker 2: going to cause someone to be a serial killer by

1883
01:32:46,640 --> 01:32:49,760
Speaker 2: the time they're sixteen or seventeen. You know, I get

1884
01:32:49,760 --> 01:32:52,559
Speaker 2: the extremism, and that maybe that argument that you would pushback,

1885
01:32:52,560 --> 01:32:55,360
Speaker 2: you would get from that, but we know scientifically that

1886
01:32:56,120 --> 01:33:02,160
Speaker 2: concussive repetition is causing problems, you know, the more severe ites.

1887
01:33:02,240 --> 01:33:04,960
Speaker 2: Certainly early on when it said when's a full blown concussion. Yeah,

1888
01:33:05,000 --> 01:33:06,920
Speaker 2: you can see it, but later on in life. I

1889
01:33:06,920 --> 01:33:09,320
Speaker 2: think there is something there that the constant jarring and

1890
01:33:09,720 --> 01:33:14,000
Speaker 2: the NonStop assault on your brain causes some of these

1891
01:33:14,040 --> 01:33:15,960
Speaker 2: things later in life. I mean, it seems to me

1892
01:33:16,000 --> 01:33:17,680
Speaker 2: to be a pretty clear connection. And I'm just a

1893
01:33:17,760 --> 01:33:18,240
Speaker 2: lay person.

1894
01:33:19,160 --> 01:33:21,840
Speaker 5: Oh no, sure, you're absolutely correct. And unfortunately, we were

1895
01:33:21,880 --> 01:33:24,479
Speaker 5: contacted by a family yesterday who just lost their son.

1896
01:33:24,800 --> 01:33:28,559
Speaker 5: He jumped off a bridge and his only contact sport

1897
01:33:28,760 --> 01:33:30,720
Speaker 5: was he liked to head the soccer ball, and he

1898
01:33:30,760 --> 01:33:34,120
Speaker 5: started heading the soccer ball kind of obsessively around the

1899
01:33:34,120 --> 01:33:37,320
Speaker 5: age of six or seven, and they watched their son degrade.

1900
01:33:37,320 --> 01:33:39,840
Speaker 5: And because they had no knowledge that it was the

1901
01:33:39,920 --> 01:33:42,880
Speaker 5: heading that was causing the mental illness, this kid had

1902
01:33:42,920 --> 01:33:46,439
Speaker 5: been to multiple psychiatric counselors, been all through treatment, been

1903
01:33:46,760 --> 01:33:49,200
Speaker 5: on every kind of drug because everybody thought he had

1904
01:33:49,200 --> 01:33:52,880
Speaker 5: a brain problem. It was never associated with contact sports.

1905
01:33:53,400 --> 01:33:56,160
Speaker 5: The issue of subconcussive trauma is not taught in any

1906
01:33:56,240 --> 01:34:00,600
Speaker 5: medical nursing or psychiatric institution of learning in the America.

1907
01:34:00,720 --> 01:34:02,880
Speaker 5: So if parents have no recourse they had, they cannot

1908
01:34:02,880 --> 01:34:05,800
Speaker 5: make informed decisions. When my son came to me and said, hey, Dad,

1909
01:34:05,800 --> 01:34:08,439
Speaker 5: I want to play football and he's already a heavy wrestler.

1910
01:34:08,560 --> 01:34:10,679
Speaker 5: I said, okay, who dies in this thing, let's man

1911
01:34:10,760 --> 01:34:13,880
Speaker 5: up right, and so but I ended up allowing my

1912
01:34:13,960 --> 01:34:16,880
Speaker 5: son to be exposed to more trauma, which you know,

1913
01:34:17,040 --> 01:34:20,439
Speaker 5: after you know, being his brain was validated and studied

1914
01:34:20,800 --> 01:34:23,519
Speaker 5: shown to be the cause of the trauma through his brain,

1915
01:34:23,960 --> 01:34:28,640
Speaker 5: that was then you know, causing his schizophrenia and depression

1916
01:34:28,920 --> 01:34:31,679
Speaker 5: and causing him to take his life. This happens around

1917
01:34:31,720 --> 01:34:34,880
Speaker 5: the country and we are absolutely uninformed about this as

1918
01:34:34,920 --> 01:34:38,040
Speaker 5: a society. And just by mitigating stuff. If we took

1919
01:34:38,080 --> 01:34:40,879
Speaker 5: contact drills out of high school football, we could eliminate

1920
01:34:40,920 --> 01:34:43,760
Speaker 5: sixty to eighty percent of the subcust of trauma. If

1921
01:34:43,800 --> 01:34:47,479
Speaker 5: we stopped exposing kids heads till fourteen, when the prefuntal

1922
01:34:47,520 --> 01:34:51,599
Speaker 5: portex starts to develop, we could make a massive debt

1923
01:34:51,960 --> 01:34:55,240
Speaker 5: and the amount of mental illnesses that are resulting from this.

1924
01:34:55,479 --> 01:34:58,480
Speaker 5: Even in the military right now, we trained so realistically

1925
01:34:58,720 --> 01:34:59,960
Speaker 5: we are having special operation.

1926
01:35:00,040 --> 01:35:01,280
Speaker 6: This guy him a former Green.

1927
01:35:01,120 --> 01:35:05,679
Speaker 5: Berasard major demonstrating mental health just because they train around

1928
01:35:05,760 --> 01:35:08,880
Speaker 5: too many explosions like they're going the war. So it's

1929
01:35:08,920 --> 01:35:12,000
Speaker 5: like you're you're comment about, we're always always in sports.

1930
01:35:12,120 --> 01:35:14,639
Speaker 5: Kids are playing sports. You can play football year round.

1931
01:35:14,680 --> 01:35:18,400
Speaker 5: Now we are harming our children just through obsession with

1932
01:35:18,520 --> 01:35:20,880
Speaker 5: these sports and their passion for these sports of the

1933
01:35:20,960 --> 01:35:21,679
Speaker 5: sports as well.

1934
01:35:22,040 --> 01:35:23,679
Speaker 2: And I think there's something there, by the way, thanks

1935
01:35:23,680 --> 01:35:27,360
Speaker 2: for your service. I know a sergeant major that I've

1936
01:35:27,360 --> 01:35:29,680
Speaker 2: heard that before too, is that we have soldiers and

1937
01:35:29,720 --> 01:35:34,080
Speaker 2: sailors that are around concussion, concussive devices, right, explosive devices,

1938
01:35:34,200 --> 01:35:36,879
Speaker 2: artillery and the like, and it's NonStop.

1939
01:35:36,880 --> 01:35:37,559
Speaker 1: It's a barrage.

1940
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:39,800
Speaker 2: And what happens is that jars your brain much like

1941
01:35:39,840 --> 01:35:42,759
Speaker 2: getting hit because you feel it, you know, it literally

1942
01:35:42,760 --> 01:35:47,479
Speaker 2: makes you move, takes your breath away. That repetition is

1943
01:35:47,640 --> 01:35:49,760
Speaker 2: never accounted for when we're talking about things like this.

1944
01:35:49,840 --> 01:35:51,840
Speaker 2: And so we have a we have people who served

1945
01:35:51,880 --> 01:35:53,600
Speaker 2: in a military that that are turning on and we

1946
01:35:53,600 --> 01:35:55,800
Speaker 2: think it's because of their service and the connection to

1947
01:35:56,120 --> 01:35:59,280
Speaker 2: higher suicide rates and the mental illness that soldiers and

1948
01:35:59,280 --> 01:36:02,240
Speaker 2: sailors have, and it may be in ef fact, maybe

1949
01:36:02,280 --> 01:36:03,599
Speaker 2: part of this says to do with their training.

1950
01:36:04,680 --> 01:36:06,720
Speaker 5: I am at a conference right now today to look

1951
01:36:06,720 --> 01:36:11,240
Speaker 5: at blast exposure and its effect on military services brains.

1952
01:36:11,600 --> 01:36:14,840
Speaker 5: And we are now pushing hard and there is recognition

1953
01:36:14,920 --> 01:36:18,400
Speaker 5: in the military that a lot of the mental illnesses

1954
01:36:18,439 --> 01:36:22,559
Speaker 5: and suicidality that has that has occurred over the past

1955
01:36:22,880 --> 01:36:26,320
Speaker 5: could be associated yet was never attributed to their mental

1956
01:36:26,520 --> 01:36:30,200
Speaker 5: to their military service. Again, a huge oversight in the

1957
01:36:30,200 --> 01:36:33,400
Speaker 5: way we have looked at things that we assume to

1958
01:36:33,479 --> 01:36:36,640
Speaker 5: be innocent because they don't affect us like you could be.

1959
01:36:36,760 --> 01:36:39,479
Speaker 5: I've been around thousands of explosions, right and you can

1960
01:36:39,640 --> 01:36:41,720
Speaker 5: or you know, I've been tackled on rugby fields. I

1961
01:36:41,760 --> 01:36:44,360
Speaker 5: played semi professional rugby. You get up, you make the

1962
01:36:44,400 --> 01:36:47,439
Speaker 5: next hit, you assume you're okay. We as society have

1963
01:36:47,560 --> 01:36:51,080
Speaker 5: to understand the risk and dangers of these continuous forms

1964
01:36:51,080 --> 01:36:53,680
Speaker 5: of exposure. What is doing to our brains, both that

1965
01:36:53,800 --> 01:36:56,479
Speaker 5: for kids and veterans and professional athletes.

1966
01:36:57,520 --> 01:36:59,000
Speaker 1: I guess the other part of the problem here too.

1967
01:36:59,040 --> 01:37:02,240
Speaker 2: By the way, on the show's Bruce Parkman and Bruce's

1968
01:37:02,720 --> 01:37:06,880
Speaker 2: former Green Beret, a Sergeant major, lost his son to

1969
01:37:07,080 --> 01:37:10,519
Speaker 2: what they believe is exposure to concussive and subconcussive trauma

1970
01:37:11,040 --> 01:37:14,599
Speaker 2: and from youth sports, from wrestling and from football, and

1971
01:37:15,240 --> 01:37:19,360
Speaker 2: ultimately took his own life at seventeen after battling mental

1972
01:37:19,400 --> 01:37:23,120
Speaker 2: illness and what we've seen in athletes, particularly professional athletes,

1973
01:37:23,360 --> 01:37:27,120
Speaker 2: is with each in every transgression, each and every head injury,

1974
01:37:27,320 --> 01:37:30,160
Speaker 2: it gets easier to become concussed. And now you develop

1975
01:37:30,200 --> 01:37:33,320
Speaker 2: a pattern what effects not only your senses, but it

1976
01:37:33,360 --> 01:37:36,200
Speaker 2: affects who you are, your personality, which makes you much

1977
01:37:36,280 --> 01:37:39,000
Speaker 2: much more dangerous. And so we're starting to learn the

1978
01:37:39,000 --> 01:37:41,479
Speaker 2: effects much more of not just one or two a

1979
01:37:41,520 --> 01:37:46,040
Speaker 2: couple head traumas, but over the years repetitive head injuries,

1980
01:37:46,080 --> 01:37:48,679
Speaker 2: and especially the ones in a sport like soccer, which

1981
01:37:48,680 --> 01:37:50,519
Speaker 2: we love here in Cincinnati with a you know, we've

1982
01:37:50,520 --> 01:37:52,879
Speaker 2: got a major league soccer team, we've got a pipeline

1983
01:37:52,920 --> 01:37:54,840
Speaker 2: for kids to play, and no one's suggesting we should

1984
01:37:54,840 --> 01:37:58,280
Speaker 2: stop that, but you know, the repetitive micro traumas that

1985
01:37:58,400 --> 01:37:58,840
Speaker 2: kids have.

1986
01:37:59,760 --> 01:38:01,280
Speaker 1: We're starting to see some data.

1987
01:38:01,000 --> 01:38:05,040
Speaker 5: On this now, yes, sir, I mean when ct was

1988
01:38:05,080 --> 01:38:08,000
Speaker 5: found by doctor Omalu in two thousand and nine, it

1989
01:38:08,120 --> 01:38:10,679
Speaker 5: was found in fifty and sixty year old men. Well,

1990
01:38:10,760 --> 01:38:13,000
Speaker 5: now we're finding it in twenty and thirty year olds.

1991
01:38:13,000 --> 01:38:14,800
Speaker 5: As a matter of fact, quick story, I funded a

1992
01:38:14,800 --> 01:38:18,519
Speaker 5: study at Boston University because I challenged them on the

1993
01:38:18,520 --> 01:38:21,080
Speaker 5: evaluation of my son's brain for CTE. He did not

1994
01:38:21,160 --> 01:38:24,160
Speaker 5: have CTE, and I asked him, did you find structural damage?

1995
01:38:24,200 --> 01:38:25,439
Speaker 5: And then they asked me why, and they said, well, I

1996
01:38:25,439 --> 01:38:27,880
Speaker 5: wrote a book for parents, I read over one hundred

1997
01:38:27,920 --> 01:38:31,519
Speaker 5: couple hundred research papers, and you know, long story short,

1998
01:38:31,600 --> 01:38:34,680
Speaker 5: I am convinced that the structural damage is what's contributing

1999
01:38:34,720 --> 01:38:36,760
Speaker 5: to these mental illnesses. They went back and looked at

2000
01:38:36,800 --> 01:38:41,080
Speaker 5: every brain under thirty at the Unit Bank, NFL players,

2001
01:38:41,120 --> 01:38:45,800
Speaker 5: college players, and to children, the seventeen year olds that

2002
01:38:45,800 --> 01:38:48,040
Speaker 5: are up there like my son. What they found out

2003
01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:50,599
Speaker 5: was that one hundred percent of the brains had structural damage,

2004
01:38:50,680 --> 01:38:53,280
Speaker 5: one hundred percent of those brains had psychological disorders, and

2005
01:38:53,360 --> 01:38:56,200
Speaker 5: eighty percent of the diabuce suicide and overdose, even though

2006
01:38:56,240 --> 01:38:59,120
Speaker 5: only forty percent had CTE. So you're right, it is

2007
01:38:59,120 --> 01:39:02,760
Speaker 5: the continuous exposure that is the big problem here. Now,

2008
01:39:03,000 --> 01:39:07,000
Speaker 5: if our kids played, say you wait until fourteen, we

2009
01:39:07,120 --> 01:39:09,679
Speaker 5: recommend eighteen. You're an adult, you want to hurt yourself, smoke,

2010
01:39:09,760 --> 01:39:12,200
Speaker 5: do whatever you can make your decision. We'll never get

2011
01:39:12,320 --> 01:39:13,880
Speaker 5: contact sports out of high school.

2012
01:39:13,880 --> 01:39:14,320
Speaker 4: We know this.

2013
01:39:14,439 --> 01:39:17,360
Speaker 5: Or our compromise is if you wait till fourteen before

2014
01:39:17,400 --> 01:39:21,800
Speaker 5: you start, you play green safe sports, flag football, baseball, basketball, right,

2015
01:39:22,200 --> 01:39:26,120
Speaker 5: you can't avoid the occasional concussion. But then you start

2016
01:39:26,160 --> 01:39:28,800
Speaker 5: at fourteen and you just pick one sport and then

2017
01:39:28,840 --> 01:39:31,200
Speaker 5: you rest for the rest of the year. Play tiddley winks,

2018
01:39:31,360 --> 01:39:34,040
Speaker 5: play not play green sake sports. Study, you know, play

2019
01:39:34,040 --> 01:39:37,360
Speaker 5: your video games, go study, get ready for college. Right,

2020
01:39:37,600 --> 01:39:39,840
Speaker 5: you know, then you're ahead of the game, and you're

2021
01:39:39,920 --> 01:39:42,880
Speaker 5: probably going to be absolutely fine. Now, we do have

2022
01:39:43,000 --> 01:39:46,200
Speaker 5: kids that are with my son that started contact sports

2023
01:39:46,240 --> 01:39:48,680
Speaker 5: at fourteen, so there is a risk there, But they

2024
01:39:48,800 --> 01:39:51,599
Speaker 5: might have played excessively, they might have played way too much.

2025
01:39:51,960 --> 01:39:54,559
Speaker 5: But we know that if we wait till fourteen and

2026
01:39:54,640 --> 01:39:58,200
Speaker 5: we can just start taking the concussiveness out of our

2027
01:39:58,280 --> 01:40:01,520
Speaker 5: child's life, we give them a better chance. Personally, nowadays,

2028
01:40:01,560 --> 01:40:04,960
Speaker 5: I would say baseball, track and field, basketball, volleyball, all

2029
01:40:05,040 --> 01:40:08,160
Speaker 5: day long. Stay away from these things only because it's

2030
01:40:08,160 --> 01:40:11,040
Speaker 5: our children. Nobody wants to be in my shoes. But

2031
01:40:11,080 --> 01:40:12,960
Speaker 5: then when you're an adult, the same thing. You know,

2032
01:40:13,000 --> 01:40:16,519
Speaker 5: it's it's we these football players. I have NFL friends

2033
01:40:16,600 --> 01:40:19,080
Speaker 5: right now and they are all a mess man and

2034
01:40:19,120 --> 01:40:21,360
Speaker 5: they all do not let their kids play these sports.

2035
01:40:21,520 --> 01:40:24,799
Speaker 5: And if those folks are saying my kids ain't playing sports,

2036
01:40:24,840 --> 01:40:28,200
Speaker 5: and I absolutely support what your foundation's saying. They've lived it,

2037
01:40:28,200 --> 01:40:30,920
Speaker 5: they've walked the life, They've made money. They can't enjoy

2038
01:40:30,960 --> 01:40:33,680
Speaker 5: their life. They can't enjoy their money. They're having a

2039
01:40:33,720 --> 01:40:36,479
Speaker 5: horrible time with us in They tell me flat out

2040
01:40:36,760 --> 01:40:39,880
Speaker 5: that there is there is a huge problem with this

2041
01:40:39,960 --> 01:40:43,000
Speaker 5: in the NFL, with the with the retired players, and

2042
01:40:43,040 --> 01:40:43,599
Speaker 5: it's a shame.

2043
01:40:43,680 --> 01:40:43,840
Speaker 4: Man.

2044
01:40:43,880 --> 01:40:46,439
Speaker 5: They gave me my Sundays. I love my Sundays and

2045
01:40:46,520 --> 01:40:50,040
Speaker 5: my doritos. But it's not that you know, there's NHL players,

2046
01:40:50,120 --> 01:40:53,600
Speaker 5: rugby players, soccer players. Right now, a soccer player, a

2047
01:40:53,640 --> 01:40:55,679
Speaker 5: soccer ball hits ahead at one hundred and thirty miles

2048
01:40:55,720 --> 01:40:58,720
Speaker 5: an hour up to that's a massive joke, and we

2049
01:40:58,760 --> 01:41:00,320
Speaker 5: see them heading the balls all the time. I'm saying,

2050
01:41:00,360 --> 01:41:02,160
Speaker 5: it's just just some topics there, man.

2051
01:41:02,200 --> 01:41:04,200
Speaker 1: No, I youree hundred percent right.

2052
01:41:04,240 --> 01:41:06,639
Speaker 2: But I think in Bruce, I don't want to say

2053
01:41:06,640 --> 01:41:08,360
Speaker 2: this because of what you've been through with your son

2054
01:41:08,880 --> 01:41:11,400
Speaker 2: taking his own life and serving our country and seeing

2055
01:41:11,400 --> 01:41:14,280
Speaker 2: all the stuff firsthand. When it comes to repetitive concussive trauma,

2056
01:41:14,320 --> 01:41:19,920
Speaker 2: subconcussive subconcussive trauma is starting contact sports at fourteen, I

2057
01:41:19,960 --> 01:41:21,240
Speaker 2: don't know if there's ever going to happen. I don't

2058
01:41:21,240 --> 01:41:23,599
Speaker 2: think Grimmy'll put the toothpaste back in the two because

2059
01:41:23,640 --> 01:41:26,360
Speaker 2: of well, it starts with competitive dads and moms and

2060
01:41:26,400 --> 01:41:28,640
Speaker 2: they want their kid to be successful and get the scholarship,

2061
01:41:28,680 --> 01:41:30,640
Speaker 2: be a star, and the kid loves the sport and

2062
01:41:30,680 --> 01:41:33,240
Speaker 2: loves to play. My nephew grew up playing hockey. You

2063
01:41:33,240 --> 01:41:35,320
Speaker 2: couldn't get a stick out of his hand. He's at

2064
01:41:35,520 --> 01:41:38,920
Speaker 2: Miami University now. But I just don't see because there's

2065
01:41:38,960 --> 01:41:42,479
Speaker 2: so much money involved in you sports and contact you sports.

2066
01:41:42,760 --> 01:41:44,040
Speaker 2: I don't see that ever changing.

2067
01:41:45,360 --> 01:41:48,400
Speaker 5: I don't think it. I think it will change as

2068
01:41:48,520 --> 01:41:52,200
Speaker 5: the as the effects become more known and parents are

2069
01:41:52,240 --> 01:41:54,200
Speaker 5: more and well, right now you have parents that are

2070
01:41:54,200 --> 01:41:56,400
Speaker 5: non informed, saying yeah, put a hockey stick, put a

2071
01:41:56,400 --> 01:41:58,560
Speaker 5: helmet in the kid's head, lit him play hockey, and

2072
01:41:58,720 --> 01:42:01,719
Speaker 5: start checking at eleven I think is eleven to twelve

2073
01:42:01,800 --> 01:42:04,520
Speaker 5: is the age they start checking. Well, remember that prefrontal

2074
01:42:04,560 --> 01:42:07,639
Speaker 5: cortext that the CEO of the brain doesn't start developing

2075
01:42:07,760 --> 01:42:11,800
Speaker 5: till fourteen. That's why scientifically we asked that parents wait

2076
01:42:11,880 --> 01:42:15,960
Speaker 5: till then, because without a functioning prefuntal cortex, you have

2077
01:42:16,200 --> 01:42:20,400
Speaker 5: a dysfunctional adult guarantee. So you know, if you want

2078
01:42:20,439 --> 01:42:22,400
Speaker 5: to take that risk and you think that Jimmy's going

2079
01:42:22,479 --> 01:42:24,000
Speaker 5: to be playing in the NHL and being on a

2080
01:42:24,000 --> 01:42:26,720
Speaker 5: weedy box, all right, go for it, Okay, but you're

2081
01:42:26,720 --> 01:42:30,240
Speaker 5: harming your children. And that's why we're pushing for formed consent.

2082
01:42:30,600 --> 01:42:32,680
Speaker 5: So if you know you're doing it, that's on you.

2083
01:42:33,000 --> 01:42:35,639
Speaker 5: But you as a parent, if you had the option

2084
01:42:35,920 --> 01:42:39,679
Speaker 5: of playing hockey or playing soccer without hitting the ball,

2085
01:42:39,880 --> 01:42:42,720
Speaker 5: or baseball or a sport that you knew in your

2086
01:42:42,720 --> 01:42:46,080
Speaker 5: heart of hearts was not going to jeopardize the future

2087
01:42:46,080 --> 01:42:48,760
Speaker 5: of your child, that what sport would you pick that?

2088
01:42:49,600 --> 01:42:51,720
Speaker 5: And that's what we're saying now, we're pushing for in

2089
01:42:51,840 --> 01:42:53,559
Speaker 5: formed consents. You know, that's all. You know.

2090
01:42:53,680 --> 01:42:55,840
Speaker 6: It's not a fan, but you're right.

2091
01:42:56,240 --> 01:42:57,800
Speaker 2: And I think personally, I think the thing is this,

2092
01:42:57,880 --> 01:43:00,400
Speaker 2: it's kind of like social media so to up in

2093
01:43:00,400 --> 01:43:02,600
Speaker 2: the last twenty or fifteen years, and we didn't know

2094
01:43:02,640 --> 01:43:04,720
Speaker 2: anything of it. Now we're starting to see because we're

2095
01:43:04,720 --> 01:43:07,000
Speaker 2: starting to see results of this and why it's bad.

2096
01:43:07,040 --> 01:43:09,080
Speaker 2: And now we're starting to take phones away from kids

2097
01:43:09,080 --> 01:43:11,400
Speaker 2: in classrooms, which I think is great. We you know,

2098
01:43:11,640 --> 01:43:14,080
Speaker 2: anything new is going to have upside and downside. And

2099
01:43:14,240 --> 01:43:16,320
Speaker 2: it's only been what since two thousand and nine we've

2100
01:43:16,360 --> 01:43:19,160
Speaker 2: learned about CTE and really started taking seriously and starting

2101
01:43:19,160 --> 01:43:21,880
Speaker 2: to understand the brain. And I think in a generation

2102
01:43:22,200 --> 01:43:23,640
Speaker 2: of what you're talking about is going to come to

2103
01:43:23,640 --> 01:43:25,680
Speaker 2: fruition because my parents are going to go, hey, if

2104
01:43:25,680 --> 01:43:28,680
Speaker 2: the data is in, it's inconclusive, it's unconclusive. I mean

2105
01:43:28,680 --> 01:43:31,880
Speaker 2: it's conclusive rather than unconclusive, and I'm not gonna let

2106
01:43:31,880 --> 01:43:33,320
Speaker 2: my son or daughter to play this. And I think

2107
01:43:33,360 --> 01:43:35,479
Speaker 2: it's start to see youth sports change because of the

2108
01:43:35,520 --> 01:43:39,640
Speaker 2: work you're doing, Bruce Parkman, Youth contact sports, understanding the

2109
01:43:39,680 --> 01:43:42,720
Speaker 2: hidden risks of mental illness from early exposure to concussive trauma.

2110
01:43:42,800 --> 01:43:44,960
Speaker 2: If your kid plays sports, you got to check this out.

2111
01:43:46,000 --> 01:43:48,680
Speaker 2: And again, thanks again for the time, Bruce, all the.

2112
01:43:48,600 --> 01:43:51,680
Speaker 5: Best, Hey, thank you so much. You remember sure that

2113
01:43:51,720 --> 01:43:53,920
Speaker 5: we did. The book I wrote is free for any

2114
01:43:53,960 --> 01:43:57,040
Speaker 5: parent that wants to Just contact the Mac Parkman Foundation

2115
01:43:57,120 --> 01:43:59,240
Speaker 5: and will send them a digital copy and they can

2116
01:43:59,280 --> 01:44:00,360
Speaker 5: make the decision.

2117
01:44:00,040 --> 01:44:02,439
Speaker 2: For their child that they exactly one and I'll get

2118
01:44:02,439 --> 01:44:05,360
Speaker 2: The website is MP fact dot com.

2119
01:44:05,479 --> 01:44:09,160
Speaker 1: MP fact dot com. Bruce, thanks again, man all right,

2120
01:44:09,200 --> 01:44:09,880
Speaker 1: Thanks a lot, Blash.

2121
01:44:09,920 --> 01:44:11,639
Speaker 5: You take care. I'll come back anytime.

2122
01:44:11,760 --> 01:44:12,200
Speaker 6: Talk care.

2123
01:44:12,680 --> 01:44:15,479
Speaker 2: Keep it at sports related, Thanks Bruce, Sarah day off

2124
01:44:15,520 --> 01:44:18,439
Speaker 2: today with Marti Groo. Happened last night, so we're chasing

2125
01:44:18,520 --> 01:44:20,720
Speaker 2: recovery mode as it is. Tom Runneman so I think

2126
01:44:20,800 --> 01:44:23,000
Speaker 2: John John for that matter, I am here. I'm toughing

2127
01:44:23,040 --> 01:44:25,720
Speaker 2: it out Willie on the way AFTERNOWS on the home

2128
01:44:25,720 --> 01:44:27,240
Speaker 2: of those red seven hundred www.

2129
01:44:27,400 --> 01:44:28,000
Speaker 1: Cincinnati