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Speaker 1: This is Doctor Wendy Walsh and you're listening to KF

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Speaker 1: I Am six forty the Doctor Wendy Waalsh Show on

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Speaker 1: demand on the iHeartRadio app. Oh my gosh, I watched

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Speaker 1: this movie. Thank goodness. The director sent me a screener

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Speaker 1: that literally is everything I've been saying for years and

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Speaker 1: over supply of men in China. I keep talking about

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Speaker 1: the oversupply of successful women here in America. Violet, welcome

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Speaker 1: to the show. Tell me how to pronounce your last

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Speaker 1: name correctly.

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Speaker 2: Phung at emg song fong.

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Speaker 1: Violet, Oh my goodness, this documentary is so interesting. So

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Speaker 1: it's called The Dating Game correct, Yes, yeah, And the

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Speaker 1: Dating Game looks at the social problem of an oversupply

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Speaker 1: of men in China because of the years of the

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Speaker 1: one child law. And I got to tell you a

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Speaker 1: couple of things that I liked about it. One, it's

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Speaker 1: really interesting, like a fun dating show because you meet

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Speaker 1: a Chinese dating coach who's cleaning up these guys and

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Speaker 1: giving them all these techniques. So it's sort of fun

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Speaker 1: and entertaining, but to get into some of the social

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Speaker 1: stuff and some real emotion. So, Violet, how did you

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Speaker 1: come up with the idea for doing the dating game.

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Speaker 2: Well, so I've been making films about China for many

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Speaker 2: years and I'm born raising China. My last film was

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Speaker 2: actually about a film about women in China, and there's

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Speaker 2: a story about modern generation of women and how they

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Speaker 2: are trying to revive and ancient language created and shared

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Speaker 2: only among women, using that language to cope with the

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Speaker 2: revived patriarchal society in China. And after making that film,

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Speaker 2: understanding how extremely goin to divide it our country has become,

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Speaker 2: and also globally, I felt like it's my responsibility to

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Speaker 2: cross the aisle and really try to understand men's perspectives.

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Speaker 2: And without doing so, I don't think that I will

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Speaker 2: be able to challenge myself to really understand where the

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Speaker 2: gap of gender di vitually exist. So that was kind

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Speaker 2: of why that I was. I knew that I had

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Speaker 2: to make a film about Chinese men, and you hit

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Speaker 2: a letter.

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Speaker 1: You really caught the experience. I think there will be

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Speaker 1: many young men in America who resonate with these men

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Speaker 1: because you really captured their emotional experience of loss, the

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Speaker 1: guys who are losing out. Now in the movie, you

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Speaker 1: say there are thirty million more extra basically Chinese men

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Speaker 1: than women, and the ones who are losing out tend

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Speaker 1: to be the ones who are in the less affluent areas,

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Speaker 1: in the rural villages. And in the movie, the social experiment,

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Speaker 1: of course is to bring them into the city, clean

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Speaker 1: them up, get them in fashion, and teach them how

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Speaker 1: to use those dating apps, et cetera. But you know,

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Speaker 1: while that's an interesting watch for viewers, there's a very

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Speaker 1: sad truth.

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Speaker 2: Behind this, right yeah. And it's not really only because

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Speaker 2: of the one child policy that most of the people

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Speaker 2: in the western countries know about, but these surplus men

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Speaker 2: also grew up in a time when China was experiencing

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Speaker 2: a rap economic boom, and that's also in the same

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Speaker 2: timeline as the urbanization of China that was happening. So

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Speaker 2: most of their parents answered the calling and then moved

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Speaker 2: to the city to provide better financial support for the family.

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Speaker 2: As a result, and also couple with another policy, which

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Speaker 2: is the residency policy, which prevented their children to move

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Speaker 2: wisdom to the city to got educated in the city.

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Speaker 2: So that's why most of their children are left behind

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Speaker 2: in the rural areas as a result, that not only

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Speaker 2: these young men grew up without any interaction to growth

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Speaker 2: because most of the people who the kids who were

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Speaker 2: born was boys versus growth. But also they grew up

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Speaker 2: without role models of relationships. They also grew up without love. Well,

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Speaker 2: it's that typical tragic.

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Speaker 1: It's two layers of that. So you mentioned their parents

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Speaker 1: having to leave them because they had to search for

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Speaker 1: jobs in the city. They were not able to take

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Speaker 1: their kids with them. There's an interview with a mom

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Speaker 1: there who feels very sad that she left her son

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Speaker 1: when he was five.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you know, I see that.

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Speaker 1: So I wrote my dissertation on attachment theory, and I

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Speaker 1: see that as attachment trauma. So it's twofold. It's one

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Speaker 1: the crisis of breaking the maternal bond and secondly, the

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Speaker 1: lack of modeling of love. Right now, many of them

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Speaker 1: were raised by grandparents, might have been a single grandparent

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Speaker 1: or a married grandparent. Did any of those grandparents do

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Speaker 1: you think could they model a healthy relationship or Well?

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Speaker 2: The thing is that these grandparents, first of all, they

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Speaker 2: are much older. And also you have to remember that

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Speaker 2: it's usually the case that one that of grandparents are watching,

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Speaker 2: you know, like a lot of kids or cousins, you know,

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Speaker 2: so it's very hard for them to really provide enough

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Speaker 2: emotional support for all these kids. It's like it's probably

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Speaker 2: struggling enough for them to provide food for them, you know,

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Speaker 2: for example. So yeah, that's that's actually what most of

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Speaker 2: these kids were dealing with.

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Speaker 1: And going back to the one child world, which how

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Speaker 1: many years was that in effect?

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Speaker 2: So it started around nineteen seventy seven, seventy eight, so

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Speaker 2: he ended twenty sixteen.

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Speaker 1: Wow, that's a huge period of time. And I remember

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Speaker 1: this sad moment in the movie when the boy talks

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Speaker 1: about when he was little, they you know, here they

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Speaker 1: are yearning for girls to talk to them, yearning to

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Speaker 1: meet girls, and he's reminiscing in a sad, sad way

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Speaker 1: about female fetuses, female babies he saw abandoned and stranded.

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Speaker 1: It is shocking to think that here was this trauma

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Speaker 1: that they were witnessing as children as well.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that for this generation of men,

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Speaker 2: they also because they see it with their own eyes,

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Speaker 2: and also they understood that or their mom's generation, their grandparents'

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Speaker 2: generation as women were treated onequally in a lot of ways.

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Speaker 2: So they actually do understand why women especially the younger

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Speaker 2: generation is going through explosion of face of rebellion and

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Speaker 2: so and then they are the consequence of that too.

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Speaker 2: And then they on one side they understand why this happened.

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Speaker 2: On the other side, they're the victims of that as well.

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Speaker 2: So there's many layers to these traumas that's causing for

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Speaker 2: these men, which is quite real. And I, you know,

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Speaker 2: were Reais in China. I knew all these numbers, and

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Speaker 2: I know all the facts, but it was truly until

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Speaker 2: when I was spending time with then them in such

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Speaker 2: an intense, intense way that I truly understand their psychological trauma.

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Speaker 1: The thing that got me the most was how, you know,

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Speaker 1: relatively good looking all these guys were, and they felt

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Speaker 1: so ugly. They felt they had such low self esteem.

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Speaker 1: They seem to have the lowest self worth, and you know,

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Speaker 1: it reminded me. We have to go to a break,

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Speaker 1: but when we come back, I want to talk more

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Speaker 1: about this. What dating apps have created in this country

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Speaker 1: is women flock to a very small percentage of men

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Speaker 1: presented to them on the apps because they think they

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Speaker 1: can access these high status men, and then this other

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Speaker 1: chunk of men aren't getting any matches at all, and

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Speaker 1: it has nothing to do with the one child policy.

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Speaker 1: It just has to do with the algorithms of the

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Speaker 1: dating apps. You're listening to doctor Wendy Walsh on demand

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Speaker 1: from KFI AM six forty my guest, Violet Fun, film

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Speaker 1: director of the new documentary called The Dating Game, which

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Speaker 1: you will be able to stream online in the new year.

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Speaker 1: For now, you can see an expert an excerpt called

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Speaker 1: Only the Lonely a short version, and that's where I

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Speaker 1: discovered it first at the New York Times. So if

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Speaker 1: you just google the words New York Times and Only

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Speaker 1: the Lonely, you'll be able to see it.

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Speaker 2: Violet.

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Speaker 1: The movie talks about this surplus of single men in

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Speaker 1: China because partly because of the one child law, but

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Speaker 1: also the fact that they're having trouble finding mates because

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Speaker 1: of the attachment trauma they had as kids when their

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Speaker 1: parents left to the city and become urbanized. Now, the

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Speaker 1: research that I've read in the area of evolutionary psychology

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Speaker 1: is that when any society or culture has a surplus

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Speaker 1: of single men who cannot find mates, that can raise

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Speaker 1: crime rates?

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Speaker 2: Can it? Yeah? Absolutely so. I think that one thing

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Speaker 2: that we started to notice in China, is that the

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Speaker 2: last few years in particularly that you're seeing a lot

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Speaker 2: of phases of violence that like random happen of, like

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Speaker 2: people attacking like otters in big numbers on the street

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Speaker 2: in a mass. And over the past couple of years,

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Speaker 2: you see that a lot of these people who committed

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Speaker 2: those violence crimes are single, unmarried men. So that's one

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Speaker 2: thing that we've already started to see kind of the

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Speaker 2: anger and the dissatisfaction of these men, not only because

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Speaker 2: they cannot find love, but I think it's also because

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Speaker 2: we're experiencing economic downturn as well. So a lot of

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Speaker 2: these men are unemployed and they truly don't see hope

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Speaker 2: in their life.

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Speaker 1: It can be a dangerous mixture high testosterone, not a

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Speaker 1: fully developed prefrontal cortex, anger and frustration about not finding

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Speaker 1: a mate. I noticed you touched on. The other thing

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Speaker 1: that societies and cultures have done around the world with

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Speaker 1: their surplus of young angrymen is the military has really expanded.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk about that a bit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's you know, for these men, imagine that

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Speaker 2: they their job opportunities becoming dramatically limited, and there's so

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Speaker 2: much pressure for them just to survive from day to day.

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Speaker 2: So one of the options for them obviously is, you know,

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Speaker 2: join the military, although the bar for joining the military

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Speaker 2: internet is becoming higher and higher that they're actually demanding

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Speaker 2: more educated people to join the military. But for these people,

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Speaker 2: join the military is one of the options that they

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Speaker 2: can change their social status. And that's also interesting because

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Speaker 2: a lot of the Chinese women actually likes men who

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Speaker 2: from the military too, so that not only will potentially

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Speaker 2: solve there's a survival issue, but also that it makes

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Speaker 2: them more felt.

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Speaker 1: It will help them find me. There's actually research to

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Speaker 1: support that. There's a famous study that in the UK

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Speaker 1: where they just looked at dating app profiles and looked

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Speaker 1: if if a man had had any military experience, he

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Speaker 1: was more likely to get a swipe right, even if

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Speaker 1: he was an accountant in the back office and never

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Speaker 1: saw a war zone. It's one way that you know,

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Speaker 1: historically men have competed against other men for female mates

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Speaker 1: is display of prowess and strength and fighting right in

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Speaker 1: the movie. Also the dating game, there were both informal

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Speaker 1: marketplaces as well as government run speed dating if you will,

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Speaker 1: and sometimes with parents just showing up trying to find

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Speaker 1: a mate. Can you explain that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so, because, as you can see, one thing is

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Speaker 2: because of the gender and balance that we're having, but

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Speaker 2: also it's because the rise of feminism movement in China

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Speaker 2: and also in general, I think that's happening everywhere in

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Speaker 2: the world. Is a younger generation, just like the less

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Speaker 2: and less find out marriage of healings. So the birth

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Speaker 2: rate in China has vummitted over the past several years

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Speaker 2: and to a degree that you know, it really affected

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Speaker 2: the real estate market and everything, but it's also affected

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Speaker 2: economy in a great way, and in the forthcoming that

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Speaker 2: we're only predicting that it's also going to be continued

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Speaker 2: to be affected by the birth rate. Job So the

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Speaker 2: government i think is very concerned about that. So as

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Speaker 2: a result, they are hosting nationwide matchmaking events to encourage

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Speaker 2: people to get married. Not that they're really saying it

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Speaker 2: that getting married is a must have experience for every

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Speaker 2: human being, and it's also kind of your young generation's

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Speaker 2: responsibility because getting married is a way to fulfill a

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Speaker 2: harmonious society of China. So they really want to encourage

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Speaker 2: people to get married and have kids.

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Speaker 1: And and the scene in the movie where there's sort

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Speaker 1: of a government run speed dating going on and they

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Speaker 1: match up a firefighter, a young man with a woman

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Speaker 1: and he very awkwardly hands her roses, she awkwardly. They're

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Speaker 1: telling them now touch, hold hands, now, hug And it

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Speaker 1: was heartbreaking to see these two young people who literally

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Speaker 1: didn't know what to do with each other.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean absolutely. And you also see their you know,

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Speaker 2: the government's side that they're a desperation of wanting these

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Speaker 2: people just go home and get married in and make baby. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: They literally said that I hope you can go get

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Speaker 1: married now. This is tell her you love her, Tell

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Speaker 1: you love her. Were just like they've never seen each

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Speaker 1: other before. This is wild.

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Speaker 2: Well.

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Speaker 1: I highly recommend this film to everybody. I can't wait

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Speaker 1: to see it streaming in the new year. For now,

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Speaker 1: if you want to see an excerpt, there's a wonderful

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Speaker 1: short version of it on the New York Times called

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Speaker 1: Only the Lonely. The long form, which we will see soon,

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Speaker 1: is called The Dating Game. Director Violet fun Violet, thanks

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Speaker 1: so much for being here on KFI.

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Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.

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Speaker 1: And that brings the Doctor Wendy Wall Show to a close.

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Speaker 1: It's always my pleasure to be with you every Sunday

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Speaker 1: from seven to nine pm. You can also follow me

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Speaker 1: on my social media which is at doctor Wendy Walsh.

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Speaker 1: You've been listening to Doctor Wendy Walsh. You can always

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Speaker 1: hear us live on KFI Am six forty from seven

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Speaker 1: to nine pm on Sunday and anytime on demand on

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Speaker 1: the iHeartRadio app