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Speaker 1: Hey, it's Brian Thomas. Pleased to welcome former mayor of

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Speaker 1: the City of Cincinnati and former member of the CINCINNTI

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Speaker 1: Southern Railway Board, who did advocate for the sale the

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Speaker 1: one point six billion dollars sale the railroad previously owned

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Speaker 1: by the city. That money put into an interest generating

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Speaker 1: fund to produce more money than we were getting annually

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Speaker 1: through the lease deal. And apparently that's worked out. We

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Speaker 1: had a good investment year last year. But Charlie Lucan,

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Speaker 1: you were interviewed by the Cincinnati Inquirer several days ago

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Speaker 1: and you expressed some disappointment that the railway money which

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Speaker 1: has apparently come in, but then only five percent of

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Speaker 1: what's come in has been spent. Your reaction to this

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Speaker 1: and what's your take on why it hasn't been spent.

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Speaker 2: Charlie, Well, first, two years ago, Brian, we promised the

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Speaker 2: voters that we were going to do this, and when

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Speaker 2: we did it, if we generated the money we expected,

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Speaker 2: which we have, and then some that we would get

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Speaker 2: to work on streets, bridges, playgrounds, et cetera. And so

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Speaker 2: it passed. The money's there. There's one point almost one

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Speaker 2: point nine billion now in that's fun. Two years later

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Speaker 2: and yeah, it's up. It's up two hundred and fifty

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Speaker 2: eight million dollars. So and that's after paying the city

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Speaker 2: there fifty seven million dollar allot meant last year. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: we promised. It's getting bottlenecked at the city inexcusable. And

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Speaker 2: I finally I'm not on the board anymore. I resigned

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Speaker 2: after we passed it. I still think it was a

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Speaker 2: good idea to pass it. I'd rather have the city

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Speaker 2: in the board's hands for this, for the benefit of

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Speaker 2: the taxpayers, than in the railroad's hands. But right now

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Speaker 2: we're not getting much done with it.

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Speaker 1: Well, that seems obvious. And as the reporting points out,

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Speaker 1: and you pointed out four point five million spent out

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Speaker 1: of the eighty five million in railway money that apparently

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Speaker 1: is available, that's the interest that was generated off of it.

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Speaker 1: But Molly Molly Lair, who was the city manager spokesperson, said, well,

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Speaker 1: fifty one million of the railroad money in this fiscal

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Speaker 1: year has been allocated toward road projects in various stages

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Speaker 1: of planning and developments, as well as a million more

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Speaker 1: railroad dollars allocated toward other infrastructure. It seems to me.

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Speaker 1: She's stronging a distinction between allocation and spending.

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Speaker 2: So that's right, that's Washington speak. Yes, all that is

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Speaker 2: you can allocate things all day, you can plan things

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Speaker 2: all day, but it doesn't get the It doesn't get

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Speaker 2: the shovels in the ground.

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Speaker 1: Right now, which leads me to a burning question. I

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Speaker 1: think I'm not the only one that has who selects

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Speaker 1: the projects. We were all told that this money could

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Speaker 1: only be spent on existing infrastructure. I mean, we're behind

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Speaker 1: four hundred or so road mile repairs. We all can

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Speaker 1: name a ton of projects. You alluded to a few

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Speaker 1: at your opening statements on the interview here of what

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Speaker 1: needs to be done, so we all know what infrastructure is.

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Speaker 1: But any of these projects have they been scrutinized? Do

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Speaker 1: we know what this the allocated money is going toward.

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Speaker 1: Has anyone done a review, thoughtful analysis whether it falls

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Speaker 1: in the category of existing infrastructure? Because we were all

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Speaker 1: expecting the Shenanigans to come out of the city Council

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Speaker 1: like they built a second leg of the street car,

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Speaker 1: which I would argue isn't existing. So where are we

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Speaker 1: on this?

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Speaker 2: And know what I would too, I would argue that

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Speaker 2: and we had that conversation. But there is a list.

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Speaker 2: It has been studied. This list theoretically, when we passed it,

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Speaker 2: we were toward I was told that all these projects

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Speaker 2: were quote shovel ready and I looked at them, and

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Speaker 2: they are all the things that you would think are

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Speaker 2: basic to a city. Playgrounds, bridges, streets, et cetera. I mean,

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Speaker 2: there's a list of five hundred million dollars plus and growing,

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Speaker 2: and unfortunately the money hasn't gotten there, so we have

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Speaker 2: not benefited as a city much at this point from

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Speaker 2: the passage of the railroad issue.

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Speaker 1: Well, can I ask you a direct question, does the

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Speaker 1: Cincinni Police department and stuff? We're down a couple of

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Speaker 1: hundred officers. The problem is obviously known, and at least

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Speaker 1: I've finally been acknowledged by AFTAB provol and some of

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Speaker 1: the other members accounts. We do have a crime problem,

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Speaker 1: but we can't get anybody to take the police positions.

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Speaker 1: Can the railroad money, because since I have to have

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Speaker 1: parvole is talking about increasing the income tax for the

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Speaker 1: purposes of public safety, can the railroad money be properly

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Speaker 1: allocated to help support the police department, made by raises

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Speaker 1: or something isn't it an existing infrastructure?

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Speaker 2: No, what the what the railroad money can be used

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Speaker 2: for is to alleviate some of the stress stress on

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Speaker 2: the safety budget by let's say, remodeling District two or

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Speaker 2: buying new police cars, or buying new computers or new

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Speaker 2: weaponry or whatever it might be. That is existing infrastructure.

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Speaker 2: But in terms of paying salaries, this was all put

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Speaker 2: in a guard rail by my old friend Bill Sitz

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Speaker 2: in Ohio in the Ohio legislature before this whole thing passed.

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Speaker 2: So it's pretty strict and you can't pay salaries out

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Speaker 2: of it, which I have to think is a is

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Speaker 2: a good thing because Lord knows what they would spend

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Speaker 2: it on if you could.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Irish contracts or something on this.

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Speaker 2: Brian, Brian, I want to emphasize this is this is

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Speaker 2: not brain surgery. This is pretty basic running a city stuff.

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Speaker 2: And when you ask why there's no money getting out there,

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Speaker 2: and the answer is because it takes a while to

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Speaker 2: contract or because we we are uh doing compliance. That's unacceptable.

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Speaker 2: That is just that is just government jargon. That means nothing.

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Speaker 2: It means we can't do it, and you have to

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Speaker 2: at some point question the basic competence of the people

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Speaker 2: that are that are in charge and and supposed to

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Speaker 2: be able to do this well.

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Speaker 1: Greasing the skids, get the money out into the world

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Speaker 1: where it's going to do the most good. If they've

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Speaker 1: identified that as a problem, sounds to me like that

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Speaker 1: an easy thing to fix in front of them.

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Speaker 2: That's right, it's fairly easy, And I would this probably

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Speaker 2: will never happen, but I would recommend that they get

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Speaker 2: somebody from business or a few people and they create

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Speaker 2: some kind of an extra outside city hall group that's

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Speaker 2: going to take this list and it's going to work

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Speaker 2: this list through with the money that's already there, and

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Speaker 2: I think we might make some progress because I just

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Speaker 2: think it's this is one of those things where it's

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Speaker 2: sitting on this guy's desk for a while and this

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Speaker 2: woman's desk for a while, and it never goes anywhere.

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Speaker 1: We need the outside sector and their knowledge and experience

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Speaker 1: to fix the problems with the city government because the

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Speaker 1: city government doesn't know how to get the money out

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Speaker 1: into the world where it needs to where it can

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Speaker 1: help us. That's interesting, Charlie Lukean, really.

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Speaker 2: No, that's what I think. I mean. You know, I

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Speaker 2: created the three CDC if that was created primarily because

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Speaker 2: the city did not know how to do economic development.

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Speaker 2: So now it's given to people outside to do what

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Speaker 2: was the business of the city. And I know that

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Speaker 2: sounds like, well, why do we have the government at all?

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Speaker 2: But I think that's the answer here.

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Speaker 1: Well, it's also it forces us to go into another

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Speaker 1: discussion and we don't need to engage in a lengthy

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Speaker 1: ones sir, about the work that non government organizations do.

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Speaker 1: They get the money because they're allegedly in a better

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Speaker 1: position to fix the need that they're being given money

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Speaker 1: to fix, and yet we find out quite often that

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Speaker 1: money is used for political purposes, is not properly spent,

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Speaker 1: or there is no oversight to see that those NGOs

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Speaker 1: are doing what they promised to do with the taxpayer

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Speaker 1: money allocation.

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Speaker 2: Right, I mean, I get that, but I you know,

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Speaker 2: going back to the three CDC example, you get if

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Speaker 2: you get the right folks who are for the right reasons,

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Speaker 2: and I think they're out there. I think I think

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Speaker 2: you can make a big difference. But we're just going

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Speaker 2: in circles. And as I say, I campaigned for this,

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Speaker 2: you probably recall it. You will recall there where a

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Speaker 2: lot of people are against it, and I get that,

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Speaker 2: but those of us that campaigned for it are starting

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Speaker 2: to look pretty bad.

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Speaker 1: Well, and you do have a reputation to protect, and

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Speaker 1: it's a solid reputation, Charlie Lucan. You've done well by

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Speaker 1: the city and I know you have all the right motivations,

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Speaker 1: but this does look bad. The optics are terrible. Where

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Speaker 1: is the money, asked Charlie Lucan. He said he'd bring

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Speaker 1: it to us. It's there, and it's turned out to

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Speaker 1: be better than we originally thought. The problem seems to

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Speaker 1: be with the ones that are responsible for it, and

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Speaker 1: I guess it takes really the right folks to choose

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Speaker 1: the right outside folks to make sure the work gets done.

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Speaker 1: Maybe that leads us to where our problem is my

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Speaker 1: subjective opinion, Charlie Lucan, keep up the great work and

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Speaker 1: keep speaking out loud about this. I know that we

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Speaker 1: will all bene fit ultimately once they get this money

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Speaker 1: out into the world, and I know that was your

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Speaker 1: goal and talking to the Inquiry about it, and it's

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Speaker 1: been a pleasure to have you speak with my listeners

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Speaker 1: of me today. It's really it's really great.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on Brian