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Speaker 1: Good morning, Welcome to the Big Outdoors News Radio seven

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Speaker 1: hundred WLW Cincinnati, the home of the best Bengals coverage

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Speaker 1: and of course the Cincinnati Reds and basketball basketball basketball.

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Speaker 1: I'm not even a basketball fan. I don't even understand

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Speaker 1: the game, but there are a lot of people to do,

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Speaker 1: and we have a lot of it around this town,

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Speaker 1: which is great to carry people through.

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Speaker 2: At least the first quarter of the year.

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Speaker 1: So recently in the news in this neck of the

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Speaker 1: woods down here in Cincinnati, we had a die off

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Speaker 1: of the black vultures and Amelia at I forget the

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Speaker 1: name of the Catholic school, but nonetheless, it's just coincidentally.

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Speaker 1: It already scheduled this gentleman to be with me to

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Speaker 1: talk about the black vulture, which I guess it has

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Speaker 1: now an very expanded range. But nonetheless, it was just

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Speaker 1: something I wanted to get to because it's been affecting

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of issues with the livestock industry and

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Speaker 1: various other sundry other I guess groups are out there

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Speaker 1: that are out there and they're much more noticeable of

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Speaker 1: course on our roadways, cleaning up the deer we hit

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Speaker 1: and the possum we hit the raccoons, we hit the rabbits,

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Speaker 1: we hit and everything else. And you got to have

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Speaker 1: a breakfast club out there, quite frankly, to you know, clean.

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Speaker 2: Up the mass. So but I bring in Tommy Butler.

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Speaker 1: He is an assistant direct to a District Supervisor with

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Speaker 1: the USDA Wildlife Services here in the Southern District, Ohio. Tommy,

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the big outdoors. And how are you.

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Speaker 3: Well? How are you?

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Speaker 2: I'm doing fantastic.

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Speaker 1: So we met at the Farm Science Review, which is

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Speaker 1: big agricultural events sponsored by OSU up.

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Speaker 2: In the London, Ohio.

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Speaker 1: And and you were there with the USDA, and you

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Speaker 1: had a couple of brochures out on the table. One

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Speaker 1: that caught my eye was on the black vulture damage.

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Speaker 1: So if you could, and I think I had some

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Speaker 1: me on from University of Kentucky a couple of years

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Speaker 1: ago we talked about the black vulture. But they certainly

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Speaker 1: have become more apparent, or maybe it's because I've gotten

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Speaker 1: a different appreciation for our breakfast club out there. But nonetheless,

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Speaker 1: they were they were never I guess native to this area.

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Speaker 1: They they I guess had their range has expanded from

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Speaker 1: South America, and I guess the southern States into into

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Speaker 1: this part of Ohio.

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Speaker 4: Yes, sir, So you know, black vultures weren't necessarily super

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Speaker 4: concentrate here in state of.

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Speaker 3: Ohio for a long time.

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Speaker 4: They're there's been sightings of black vultures in Ohio for

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Speaker 4: one hundred years or so. Okay, in the last in

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Speaker 4: the last twenty years or so is when we started to,

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Speaker 4: you know, see that population really expand. And now here

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Speaker 4: in the state of Ohio you can find black vultures

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Speaker 4: basically in any county in the state. I'll say, you know,

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Speaker 4: Southwest Ohio certainly had probably has the most, but nobody's

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Speaker 4: out there, you know, counting them. We don't have an

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Speaker 4: exact number or anything like that. That's just kind of

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Speaker 4: observation on my part. But yeah, right, there's a ton

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Speaker 4: of black vultures in Ohio. Now.

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Speaker 1: So the turkey vulture, which was our prevalent vulture since

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Speaker 1: I mean since I can remember, and they apparently do

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Speaker 1: migrate south and when does that kind of start. But

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Speaker 1: you know, even this past summer or in the last

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Speaker 1: fifteen years, I've not seen the numbers of turkey vultures

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Speaker 1: that we used to. And it's like they were overtaken

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Speaker 1: by the by the black vulture.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't. So he reports that, you know, theory

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Speaker 4: that maybe black vultures are displacing turkey vultures, and I

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Speaker 4: don't see a whole lot of evidence of it. I

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Speaker 4: think what really happens is is black vultures are.

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Speaker 3: Here in Ohio year round.

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Speaker 4: So it seems like there's more of them because we

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Speaker 4: see them year round, where the turkey vulture in Ohio

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Speaker 4: is pretty pretty like clockwork with with their migration here.

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Speaker 4: So they usually migrate out of the state right around Halloween,

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Speaker 4: first week in November, depending on where you're at, and

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Speaker 4: they usually come back in you know, late February, early March,

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Speaker 4: so they're gone for several months and then we were

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Speaker 4: left with black vultures.

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Speaker 2: And so a pair.

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Speaker 1: But is was climate change the reason for their range

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Speaker 1: expansion or is there really no reason that anybody could

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Speaker 1: put a finger on.

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Speaker 4: There's there's a few theories, and there's kind of a

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Speaker 4: several theories on why they've expanded. Warmer winners could certainly,

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Speaker 4: you know, you could point that direction. They're a southern bird,

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Speaker 4: it's a little bit warmer, you know. You one would

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Speaker 4: think that would be helpful for them, but I think

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Speaker 4: more importantly would be habitat So they are a woodland

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Speaker 4: edge species. They do like the forest. They roost in trees,

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Speaker 4: so over time, you know, Ohio has become more forested

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Speaker 4: after you know, initial European settlement and then the fanning

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Speaker 4: of DDT. Yeah, the infect side was bad for birds,

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Speaker 4: and so you know, they can play on eggs now

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Speaker 4: and have successful nests. And of course they are protected

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Speaker 4: by the Migratory Bird Treaty Act, so they are afforded

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Speaker 4: some protection by the US Fish.

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Speaker 1: And Wildlife, but not in all instances. And we'll get

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Speaker 1: to that after the break. But I also want to

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Speaker 1: just bring in a little discussion about the die off

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Speaker 1: of Amelia, and we'll do that at the end, but

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Speaker 1: I want to want to talk about, actually, you know

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Speaker 1: what what kind of damage the black vultures do and

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Speaker 1: you know, I guess what communities it really affects. Chip

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Speaker 1: Hard The Big Outdoors News Radio seven hundred WLW Cincinnati

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Speaker 1: back in a moment.

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Speaker 2: Hey, we're back the.

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Speaker 1: Big Outdoors News Radio seven hundred l W Cincinnati, home

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Speaker 1: and the best Bengals coverage in the Cincinnati Reds And

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Speaker 1: with me this morning is Tommy Butler, Assistant District super

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Speaker 1: for the us DA under Wildlife Services. And so Tommy,

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Speaker 1: for those out there, we'll get to the Amelia die

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Speaker 1: off in a bit, but for those out there, what

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Speaker 1: kinds of problems uh that you know, do does the

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Speaker 1: black vulture create? Which I guess the turkey vulture was

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Speaker 1: never much of a problem in that in that same respect,

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Speaker 1: So and then that involves you guys with the USDA

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Speaker 1: under Wildlife Services. So so what what issues are they

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Speaker 1: you know, do they create for the various communities out there?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, here in Ohio we kind of split it into

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Speaker 4: two categories of black vulture damage. The first being property damage.

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Speaker 4: So black vultures when they congregate in these large roofs

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Speaker 4: and stuff, they can they can cause damage to things

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Speaker 4: like rubber roofs, vehicles, whether they're stripping on windows, whether

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Speaker 4: it be cars or houses.

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Speaker 3: Things like that.

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Speaker 4: Soft things they like picking it rubber and plastic and

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Speaker 4: that can cause roof damage and people can get you know,

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Speaker 4: pretty big damage bills for for black vulture damage.

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Speaker 3: So that's one.

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Speaker 4: Category and which I help people with often.

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Speaker 3: The other category is livestock.

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Speaker 4: So black vultures will kill young livestock basically while they're

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Speaker 4: being born or shortly thereafter. So it's a it's a

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Speaker 4: it can be a big hit to you know, local

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Speaker 4: farmers livestock industry when we're you know, while livestock's prices

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Speaker 4: are high right now, so it's a big loss to

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Speaker 4: lose like a calf for example.

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Speaker 3: Yep.

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Speaker 4: That's how we split it up in the in the

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Speaker 4: livestock and property. And we do have a unique situation

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Speaker 4: with the livestock program and that we can help people

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Speaker 4: give them you know what we call technical assistance, give

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Speaker 4: them advice on what they can do.

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Speaker 3: On the farm to help prevent the black.

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Speaker 4: Vultures, but also that can get elevated at the point

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Speaker 4: where we can help them get permits to lethally remove

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Speaker 4: some vultures.

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Speaker 2: Are you getting more call? Are the calls coming?

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Speaker 1: Say, the number of calls vary depending on where what

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Speaker 1: part of the state you might be in, or I guess,

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Speaker 1: in that case of livestock, depending on you know, what

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Speaker 1: counties are heavily born into livestock than crops.

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Speaker 4: In twenty twenty five, I think we've done you know,

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Speaker 4: livestock permits for people in over.

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Speaker 3: Half of ohioest counties real heavy.

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Speaker 4: I think the most permits we've had are not too

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Speaker 4: far from Cincinnati there in Highland County is kind of

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Speaker 4: ground zero for a lot of permits, and it's kind

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Speaker 4: of due to there's a lot of vultures in Highland

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Speaker 4: County and there's a lot of livestock in Highland County,

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Speaker 4: so when you put those two things together, it leads

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Speaker 4: to conflict. Adams County is another one, kind of down

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Speaker 4: the area that the kind of same boat as Highland

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Speaker 4: County move over to the eastern part of the state.

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Speaker 4: Jackson is another one, and then I think Guernsey County

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Speaker 4: would kind of be that top four, top five counties

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Speaker 4: here in the state.

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Speaker 3: But anywhere from the Ohio River clear up to.

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Speaker 4: Lake Erie, we've helped people get permits.

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Speaker 2: I guess.

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Speaker 1: I guess being more living, I live more rurally these

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Speaker 1: days than anything else, and I'm seeing more and more

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Speaker 1: And maybe that's because of obviously I'm out with the

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Speaker 1: lot where the livestock are contrary when I grew up

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Speaker 1: or even up to fifteen years ago, so maybe that's

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Speaker 1: why I'm noticing more. But nonetheless, the flock seemed to

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Speaker 1: be fairly large size in comparison to what the turkey

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Speaker 1: vultures used to be. I mean, these things flock in

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Speaker 1: huge numbers.

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Speaker 4: They do flock in larger numbers than turkey vultures do

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Speaker 4: a lot of times when people see turkey vultures, they

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Speaker 4: do flock, but you know, you might see something like

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Speaker 4: six or ten turkey ballltures where black vultures will congregate

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Speaker 4: up into the hundreds. And in fact, this time of

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Speaker 4: year is when we do see those big, you know,

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Speaker 4: congregations and flocks here in the wintertime. Often they're in

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Speaker 4: municipalities around the state, so kind of the county seat

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Speaker 4: that the town county seat tends to have a big

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Speaker 4: flock of them, And those are those when they get

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Speaker 4: together like that, and those big flocks, damage can happen.

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Speaker 1: Well, I would imagine the heat from a particular town,

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Speaker 1: like take Batavia for instance, or or hillsbro does the

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Speaker 1: does the heat off of town attract them? I just

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Speaker 1: kind of just looks like because they're on the buildings

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Speaker 1: and you know in cold weather, is that I'm just.

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Speaker 4: Nuts now, I don't know if that's a I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I think the things that I see of that are

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Speaker 4: roost attributes for for black vultures are kind of high points.

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Speaker 3: They like being on cell.

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Speaker 4: Phone towers, water towers, large buildings. Often we'll see them

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Speaker 4: in reachedon pine trees, like on top of the hill

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Speaker 4: for example. So you know there's a there's a patch

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Speaker 4: of pine trees in a town that's on you know,

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Speaker 4: on a high point. Often that's a good area to

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Speaker 4: find them. God.

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Speaker 1: Well, you know here I thought they were keeping an

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Speaker 1: eye on all the politicians in the communities. You know,

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Speaker 1: just just the thought. That's my thought, Tommy, not yours,

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Speaker 1: I know. Anyway, Sit tight, We got more to come.

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Speaker 1: The Big Outdoors News Radio seven hundred WLW, Cincinnati back

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Speaker 1: in the Mommy.

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Speaker 2: The iHeartRadio app seven hundred WLW.

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Speaker 1: Hey, we're back the Big Outdoors News Radio, seven hundred WLW, Cincinnati, Chippark.

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Speaker 1: My guest is Tommy Butler, and he is with the

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Speaker 1: us DA under their Wildlife Services Division here in southwest Ohio.

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Speaker 1: Been talking to black vulture and so Tommy, uh, just

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Speaker 1: to recap your responsibility is is what as far as

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Speaker 1: you're out there, you're working with the people that have

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Speaker 1: issues with this particular bird.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, big picture with USDA Wildlife Services here in

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Speaker 4: Ohio is our our you know, mission or goal is

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Speaker 4: is to help you know, we provide federal leadership in

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Speaker 4: human wildlife conflict resolution. So we're out there just trying

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Speaker 4: to help people are having conflict with wildlife. As far

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Speaker 4: as black vultures go. You know, we're doing just that

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Speaker 4: in southern Ohio and the rest of the state. You know,

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Speaker 4: when conflict arises, one of the things we do is

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Speaker 4: is we provide advice on you know, how to how

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Speaker 4: to help resolve these problems, how to lessen damage is

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Speaker 4: kind of.

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Speaker 3: How we're driven.

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Speaker 4: So that goes you know to like I said with

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Speaker 4: the livestock stuff, is helping farmers you know, make decisions

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Speaker 4: on farming practices that can help produce that. For example,

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Speaker 4: parcass management's very important with with black vultures. You know,

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Speaker 4: on the farm, things die and what they do, they

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Speaker 4: need to be disposed up properly so we don't make

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Speaker 4: the farm attractive to our scavenger black vultures.

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Speaker 3: Husbandry issues too.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just gonna say that that could be. That

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Speaker 2: could be tough.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, it can be tough. It's it's it can be

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Speaker 4: difficult to man. It's but it's important. You know, you

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Speaker 4: kind of you can branch that out to you know,

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Speaker 4: having carcasses on the farm there can be attractive to

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Speaker 4: other predators like coyotes things like that. So it's an

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Speaker 4: important aspect of of of of what they do on

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Speaker 4: the farm. The other thing is husbandry stuff with you know,

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Speaker 4: the way they cave so a lot and I'm kind

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Speaker 4: of you know, heavy on the cattle here because a

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Speaker 4: lot of.

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Speaker 3: This stuff there is cattle driven.

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Speaker 4: But uh, you know, heifer cabin for the first time

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Speaker 4: that you know, they don't know what they're doing. It's

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Speaker 4: their first time doing it.

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Speaker 3: It can take a long time.

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Speaker 4: They can have a calf and kind of walk away

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Speaker 4: and when that happens, predators key in on that and

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Speaker 4: black valters do as well. So you know, keeping those

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Speaker 4: those first time you know us or or heifer's that

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Speaker 4: are you know, layman or cabin the first time. Putting

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Speaker 4: those things in the barn is a really good way

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Speaker 4: to kind of head off your vaulture damage.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, and so people can just go to you

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Speaker 1: uh just just uh, I guess doing uh internet search

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Speaker 1: for us d A Wildlife Services for a particular area

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Speaker 1: and up you guys will come right, Yeah, you can.

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Speaker 4: You can do Google search US. If you call one

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Speaker 4: eight six six for U. S. D A W S.

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Speaker 4: That phone number will route you to to our state

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Speaker 4: office and then we can get you get you in

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Speaker 4: touch with the right person depending on the subject matter

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Speaker 4: you're dealing with. All Right, that number work, go ahead,

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Speaker 4: that number of work throughout the country, the whole country.

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Speaker 3: That number will get you where you need to go

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Speaker 3: for the state you're in.

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Speaker 1: Fantastic, Okay, now we gotta we'll switch gears a little bit.

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Speaker 2: Talk about Amelia and the die off at uh.

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Speaker 1: It was a Catholic school I think a week ago

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Speaker 1: thereabouts of what like seventy black vultures, which being a

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Speaker 1: flock bird. Where what is the current status on that

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Speaker 1: as as you know it to be.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, as far as I know, I think the Division

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Speaker 4: of Wildlife kind of took the lead on sampling those.

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Speaker 4: I think the samples were taken and I think they're

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Speaker 4: sent up to the Higher Department of Agriculture up in

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Speaker 4: Reynoldsburg and they were tested for hypatha Avian influenza. Uh.

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Speaker 4: It turned out to be a non negative is what

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Speaker 4: they call it. So then that that then those samples

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Speaker 4: then get forwarded to uh NVSL, which is kind of

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Speaker 4: a feed USDA apist our our lab that just tests

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Speaker 4: samples like this. So I think we haven't heard back

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Speaker 4: if it's been confirmed by NVSL, but it.

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Speaker 3: Presumed it was high path avian influenza.

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Speaker 1: We had a die off in a couple of lakes

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Speaker 1: that like East Fork Lake and Caesar's Creek earlier. I

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Speaker 1: guess reports from fishermen and so forth to I guess it.

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Speaker 1: Apparently something went through the population.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Avian influenza is out in the environment.

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Speaker 3: Wild birds carry it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and then of course sometimes it turns high path

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Speaker 4: and people are not people, but it spreads through wild

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Speaker 4: population affects them and there can be die offs.

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Speaker 3: We see it.

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Speaker 4: We see it when this high path a eye flares up,

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Speaker 4: kind of this time of year.

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Speaker 1: Well, Tommy Butler, reappreciate your time this morning, and we'll

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Speaker 1: hopefully get a follow up and not too distant future

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Speaker 1: on everything.

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Speaker 2: Vulture appreciate it. Good talking to you, all right, thanks

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Speaker 2: for that.

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Speaker 1: We got to hit a break the Big Outdoors News

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Speaker 1: Radio seven hundred WLW Cincinnati back in the morning and

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Speaker 1: Gary Jeff of course we'll be up at the bottom

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Speaker 1: of the hour and him and the cast of characters

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Speaker 1: and every other Nitwick we can take care of everything

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Speaker 1: throughout the day along with all the sports. Gerbils just

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Speaker 1: going crazy around here, and it's it's kind of fun

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Speaker 1: to watch. It is their time of year, you know,

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Speaker 1: and their kind of sour pusses, you know. But then

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Speaker 1: there's good reason. Okay, I'll leave it at that. Here

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Speaker 1: we are with the numbers for everybody that's got to

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Speaker 1: know how much how many week killed? So Ohio hunters

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Speaker 1: took twenty three and forty nine an opening day. The

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Speaker 1: season total for the week of gunn was at eighty

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Speaker 1: seven thousand, one hundred and ninety one total. Harveston, Ohio

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Speaker 1: is currently as of earlier in the week, one hundred

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Speaker 1: and eighty eight thousand, two hundred and ninety one.

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Speaker 2: White Tails.

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Speaker 1: Kentucky, you guys did pretty good one hundred and thirty

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Speaker 1: thousand and nine hundred as of earlier this week.

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Speaker 2: And in Indiana, you.

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Speaker 1: Guys over here, you Hoosiers, are at one hundred and

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Speaker 1: nineteen thousand, nine hundred and twenty two.

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Speaker 2: So in some total we're almost.

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Speaker 1: Nearer a half million deer taken, and that's a lot

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Speaker 1: of innocent, gonna be a lot of sausage, a lot

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Speaker 1: of jerky, and maybe some good old Pennsylvania bologney. So

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Speaker 1: with that, everybody be safe out there, and uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: fill that freezer with whatever it is. Duck rabbit, I

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Speaker 1: don't care, Chip Hart, the Big Outdoors News Radio, seven

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Speaker 1: hundred WLW, Cincinnati.

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Speaker 2: Be safe in the woods, safe on the water, and

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Speaker 2: safe in that trees.