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Speaker 1: Portions of the following program were prerecorded.

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Speaker 2: Kay Away and I heard radio station.

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Speaker 1: Guaranteed Human. I'm John Calvera. Welcome to the new Year.

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Speaker 1: I heard Jimmy talk about and you need to talk

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Speaker 1: about the confusion of the new year. I woke up

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Speaker 1: this morning. I was pretty certain it was it was Sunday,

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Speaker 1: and then yesterday I thought it was Friday. It's yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's just one of those one of those weeks. We'll

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Speaker 1: get through it, all right, So so, so much, so

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Speaker 1: much great stuff. The usual easy story at the beginning

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Speaker 1: of every year, and I always, I always despise this story.

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Speaker 1: You know, the story the first baby of the year.

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Speaker 1: Let's see here from the Denver Gazette, just moments after

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Speaker 1: the fireworks died down and this champagne stopped pouring. The

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Speaker 1: Denver Metro, by the way, when did that become a term.

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Speaker 1: It used to be Metro was an adjective, not a noun.

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Speaker 1: You know, this was the metropolitan area, this was the

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Speaker 1: metropolitan Museum. It was an adjective. And so the Denver Metro,

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Speaker 1: what the Denver Metro people, the Denver Metro skyline, the

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Speaker 1: Denver Metro weather. But now it's just the Denver Metro. God,

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Speaker 1: am I turning into an old guy? Or what? It's

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Speaker 1: just wonderful when you're old and cranky about stuff like this.

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Speaker 1: It's not the Denver Metro, Denver Metro. What it's like saying,

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Speaker 1: you know, the Denver Happy, What the Denver Metro, the hungry?

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Speaker 1: What the Denver hungry? What? People? Dogs? Cats?

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Speaker 3: Fish?

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Speaker 1: The Denver Metro welcomed its first baby of twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 1: Eliza was born at advent Health Castle Rock at twelve

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Speaker 1: twenty one am m, making her likely the first baby

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Speaker 1: born in the area of the year in the Denver

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Speaker 1: Metro area. Put in the word area speak English goodly,

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Speaker 1: me speak English good? All right, So congratulations to the

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Speaker 1: parents of this wonderful seven pound one ounce girl. Parents

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Speaker 1: to Anna and Felipe Maya. All right, congratulations. And I

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Speaker 1: know what that dad is thinking. That dad is thinking.

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Speaker 1: Damn it, woman, if you could have squeezed this out

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Speaker 1: just twenty one minutes earlier, we would have gotten a

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Speaker 1: tax deduction for the entire year. But no, you had

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Speaker 1: to be late, just like getting out of the house

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Speaker 1: every day. You had to be late by twenty one minutes.

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Speaker 1: And now we got to wait a whole year. We

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Speaker 1: celebrate the wrong thing. We celebrate the first baby of

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Speaker 1: the year always gets a news story. You you don't

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Speaker 1: want to have the first kid of the new year.

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Speaker 1: You want to proudly have the last kid of the

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Speaker 1: old year. You get an entire deduction, you might even

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Speaker 1: get earned income child tax credits. You get all sorts

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Speaker 1: of things, and you haven't really had to pay for

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Speaker 1: the kid yet. You see now this guy is rubbing

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Speaker 1: his head, going, yeah, yeah, honey, the news article. That's

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Speaker 1: that's real swell You know what would have been even

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Speaker 1: I'll use modern English swellier if we saved five grand

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Speaker 1: by you pushing that kid out twenty minutes earlier. No,

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Speaker 1: it's too late. You can't go back in time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm still divorced, by the way, Go figure that all right?

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Speaker 1: Three oh three seven one, three eighty five eighty five.

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Speaker 1: I just every year we have the same thing. We

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Speaker 1: celebrate the new pay and look, it's a beautiful old baby.

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Speaker 1: But I'm sure the one that was popped out just

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Speaker 1: a minute before midnight there's also a pretty little baby.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: That's that's why. When you're when you're planning your kid, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: when when do you want to have that kid want

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Speaker 1: to have it at the end of the year. And

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Speaker 1: this is why economists should not reproduce three h three

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Speaker 1: seven one three eight five eighty five seven one three

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Speaker 1: eighty five eighty five. You heard the incredible Mendabi statement.

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Speaker 1: It's so wonderful to have have a mayor saying that

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Speaker 1: we will replace rugged individualism with the warmth of collectivism. Wow,

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Speaker 1: the warmth of like, yeah, you know, the breadlines were

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Speaker 1: sure warm. When you're standing around those fifty gallon drums

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Speaker 1: with a fire inside as everyone's trying to warm their

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Speaker 1: hands over it, that's just the warmth of collectivism. So

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Speaker 1: let me dig into this with your help, please. You know,

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Speaker 1: Colorado has always been, at least in my mind growing

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Speaker 1: up here, the epitome of rugged individualism. That there was

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Speaker 1: nothing more more of a north star than that term

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Speaker 1: rugged individualism. The idea of individualism to socialists is somehow

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Speaker 1: insulting and I don't get it. I don't understand it

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Speaker 1: at all. And they seem to think that individualism is mean.

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Speaker 1: I have this discussion with a lot of progressives. I

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Speaker 1: know that you know that capitalism is mean. When I

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Speaker 1: look at individualism, what I see is tolerance. What I

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Speaker 1: see is cooperation, not coercion. You know, the warmth of

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Speaker 1: collect divism is a warmth by government force. We will

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Speaker 1: take it from you, we will give it to you.

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Speaker 1: We will tell you what you can do with your stuff,

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Speaker 1: and you will have something and you cannot do over here,

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Speaker 1: and we will plan. So the people in power plan. Now,

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Speaker 1: there there's always winners and losers in society when it

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Speaker 1: comes to power. You might argue, in America, the wealthy

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Speaker 1: have the power. Yeah, there's a lot of truth to that.

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Speaker 1: What's the choice. The other choice is the people in

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Speaker 1: government have the power. Go to any socialist, communist country

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Speaker 1: and you don't think that they have winners and losers.

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Speaker 1: There's a difference. If if you're close to Putin, you

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Speaker 1: probably live in a pretty nice house. If you're not,

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Speaker 1: you live in a hovel. During the height of the

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Speaker 1: Soviet Union, if you were a ranking member in the party,

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Speaker 1: that is, you are in the inner circle, You are

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Speaker 1: one of the planners. You ate better, you went to

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Speaker 1: better restaurants, you got much better healthcare, you went to

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Speaker 1: better hospitals. The stratification of society was solid, it was cemented,

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Speaker 1: it was calcified. The beautiful thing about a free society

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Speaker 1: is those levels of class if they exist, and they do,

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Speaker 1: I guess they're mobile. That THEO in the year can

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Speaker 1: become the guy that's rich the next year, the guy

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Speaker 1: that's rich one year goes broke the next year. The

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Speaker 1: social and economic mobility is the vibrance. But when I

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Speaker 1: hear these terms will replace rugged individual he said this,

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Speaker 1: he said this when he was sworn in. We'll replace

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Speaker 1: rugged individualism with the warmth of collectivism. Oh, doesn't that

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Speaker 1: sound sctacular? And people will fall for this because people

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Speaker 1: want the ends. They don't want the means. They want

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Speaker 1: the ends, and the ends are what he has give

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Speaker 1: to me instead of what he has. Man, I want

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Speaker 1: to replicate that and do one better. Three put three

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Speaker 1: seven to one, three eight, five eighty five. Do you

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Speaker 1: agree with the New New York mayor that rugged individualism

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Speaker 1: is something that needs to be replaced and warm collectivism.

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Speaker 1: By the way, I'm grateful that he put it in

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Speaker 1: these words. I'm grateful he laid it out. That's important.

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Speaker 1: I'm grateful that socialists will say what progressives and liberal

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Speaker 1: democrats feel but won't actually articulate good for this guy,

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Speaker 1: and now we can watch what happens now. It takes

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Speaker 1: it takes time for policies to grow. It takes time

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Speaker 1: for bad policies like rent control and price controls and

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Speaker 1: other things to really take hold. So listen carefully to

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Speaker 1: what I'm going to say here. In the short run,

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Speaker 1: collectivism always works in the short run. Government engineering always

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Speaker 1: works in the short run. Keynesianism, that is, debt spending,

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Speaker 1: making money out of nothing always works in the short run.

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Speaker 1: Very much like if you start running up your credit cards,

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Speaker 1: it works in the short run. You never have a

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Speaker 1: problem with that. If you start buying more than you

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Speaker 1: can afford, it always works for a short run, and

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Speaker 1: then sooner or later it explodes, and it's terrible and

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Speaker 1: it's hurtful. That's what collectivism is. It is not warmth.

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Speaker 1: It is a rejection of reality, but it sure feels

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Speaker 1: good for a while. Three or threety seven one three

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Speaker 1: eight five eighty five seven one three eighty five eighty five.

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Speaker 1: Tell me I'm wrong on this, and now that Colorado

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Speaker 1: is doing the same thing. Colorado was anonymous with rugged individualism,

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Speaker 1: guys who tamed the West, people who came out here

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Speaker 1: to write their own biography, people who came out here

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Speaker 1: to risk their wealth and their talent to build. There's

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Speaker 1: this other part that I think we don't give enough

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Speaker 1: credit for when it comes to this rugged individualism. Yep,

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Speaker 1: the left seems to think rugged individualism is mean and

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Speaker 1: being mean collectivism is nice being mean. You know that

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Speaker 1: the reason we have wokeness is not that we want

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Speaker 1: to coerce people. No, we just don't want people to

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Speaker 1: be mean. That's why we want to control the words

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Speaker 1: they use, and we just want them to be nice

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Speaker 1: to each own They're not be mean. No, do you understand?

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Speaker 1: Individualism is tolerance, individualism is diversity. Do you want to

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Speaker 1: have a consensual relationship with somebody? Do it? You want

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Speaker 1: to partner with somebody to start a business, to start

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Speaker 1: a family, you do it without having to go through hoops.

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Speaker 1: So what is? And I've been harping on this and

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Speaker 1: you've heard it before. I'll continue to harp on it

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Speaker 1: because I think it is hateful. So Mindabi wants a

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Speaker 1: thirty dollars an hour minimum wage in New York, Good

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Speaker 1: for him, go for it. But why don't progressives ever

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Speaker 1: acknowledge when you do that you are separating people who

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Speaker 1: want to have a relationship. Forget everything else. When you

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Speaker 1: have a minimum wage, you separate people who want to

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Speaker 1: work together. Leftists seem to think that the only thing

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Speaker 1: we care about is money. Some people take a job

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Speaker 1: because the hours are better for them. Maybe it's closer

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Speaker 1: and they don't have to commute, and that's worth a

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Speaker 1: lower wage. Maybe it's to learn a new learn a

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Speaker 1: new tactic, learn a new skill, learn a new talent.

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Speaker 1: Maybe they want to be part of a mission. I

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Speaker 1: want to work with that organization because I love what

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Speaker 1: they're doing. I want to be part of that, or

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Speaker 1: I want so there's all these things that that people

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Speaker 1: can say, I want to be an employee for the

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Speaker 1: left seems to think we're all these little automatons. Were

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Speaker 1: all the same, and we just are our little labor bots,

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Speaker 1: and the only thing we care about is is more money.

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Speaker 1: How repugnant is that? How how belittling is that?

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Speaker 3: Is that?

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Speaker 1: How they see our lives that were just these little

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Speaker 1: cogs and we're all the same. No, I am very different,

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Speaker 1: you're very different. We have different hopes, aspirations, dreams, fears,

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Speaker 1: all of it, and it's beautiful. But they want to

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Speaker 1: treat us all the same. So if somebody in New

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Speaker 1: York City wants to work for somebody else for twenty

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Speaker 1: nine dollars and ninety nine cents an hour, Mendabi will say, no,

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Speaker 1: you cannot have that relationship. And Madabi would never say, oh,

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Speaker 1: you two guys can't get married, or you two women

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Speaker 1: cannot have sexual relations because they believe in consensual relationships.

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Speaker 1: But only if you're naked. If it's part of if

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Speaker 1: it's part of money transferring money, well then you cannot

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Speaker 1: have that free relationship, including with renters. It is amazing

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Speaker 1: to see some of the words that the man has

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Speaker 1: used on on his on his speeches, as he has

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Speaker 1: called for rent control, because rent control works so very well.

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Speaker 1: The night that he won, the night that he won,

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Speaker 1: he he really went after it. Hmm. Together, we will

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Speaker 1: usher in a generation of change. We will embrace this

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Speaker 1: brave new course, brave new world. We can respond to

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Speaker 1: olive garb to authoritarianism with its fears, not the appeasement

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Speaker 1: it craves. Really, after all, if anyone can show a

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Speaker 1: nation betrayed by Donald Trump how to defeat him, the

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Speaker 1: city that gave rise to him can And if there

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Speaker 1: is any way to terrify a despot, it is by

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Speaker 1: dismantling the very conditions that allowed him to accumulate power.

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Speaker 1: So again, this whole idea, he's a despot, he's a despot,

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Speaker 1: and he's he's a despot. But I Mendami will force

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Speaker 1: people to raise rent, But you're a despot. I'm Mindabi

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Speaker 1: will force you to pay your employees more. But he's

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Speaker 1: the tyrant. Isn't that crazy? I am young, despite my

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Speaker 1: efforts to grow older. That's cute. I am Muslim, I

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Speaker 1: am a democratic socialist, and most daring of all, I

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Speaker 1: refuse to apologize for any of this. Wow, that's a

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Speaker 1: that's a nice thing. And then he goes on to

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Speaker 1: say how he's going to raise the minimum wage, how

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Speaker 1: he is going to how he is going to make

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Speaker 1: sure that landlords pay for this. How will this go?

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Speaker 1: At first, it will go well. I guarantee you it

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Speaker 1: will go well. Then what will happen? Do this for me?

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Speaker 1: Tell me how New York City and Colorado compare. Because

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Speaker 1: the same thing is happening, the exact same thing is happening.

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Speaker 1: You are seeing a state being transformed into New York City.

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Speaker 1: We used to love rugged individualism didn't we It was Colorado,

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Speaker 1: it was the West, and now we are moving towards

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Speaker 1: the warmth of collectivism. Give me your thoughts on this

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Speaker 1: one three h three seven one three eighty five eighty five.

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Speaker 1: I'm John Kelderic. Keep it right here, Aaron Kawa News,

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Speaker 1: Sports and Talk. Did you see the Nazi salute that

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Speaker 1: Mindabi and Donnie? Excuse me, Ma'm donnie. Did now keep

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Speaker 1: in mind when Elon Musk did this thing where he

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Speaker 1: he kind of grabbed his heart and then he lifted

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Speaker 1: his hand out to say, my heart goes out to you,

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Speaker 1: you know, from here, and then he put his hand out,

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Speaker 1: it was, of course a a Nazi salute. Every media

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Speaker 1: outlet reported on the Nazi salute. I knew guys who

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Speaker 1: are who are big anti Nazis, and they were, oh no, no,

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Speaker 1: he knew what he was doing. He knew what he

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Speaker 1: was doing. It was definitely a little sign for those

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Speaker 1: in the know. Yeah all right, yeah, I don't think so.

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Speaker 1: But if you want to believe it, go for it

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Speaker 1: by all means. So then what happens when Ma'm Donnie

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Speaker 1: does the exact same thing yesterday He puts his hand

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Speaker 1: to his heart and he reaches his hand out flat

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Speaker 1: to those people who are he wants to wants to

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Speaker 1: say I love you too. Joey puts it out, well,

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Speaker 1: obviously it was a Nazi salute. Was there any coverage

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Speaker 1: of this, No, there was not. Was there any reporting,

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Speaker 1: any commentary, well, some observations on on social media. And

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Speaker 1: this is why we don't trust the media. This is

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Speaker 1: why we know that they play favorites. I don't think

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Speaker 1: they do it intentionally. I don't think they sit around

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Speaker 1: in some boardroom in a media conspiracy and go, hmm, well,

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Speaker 1: let's see. We know that Mendamie is a Nazi, but

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Speaker 1: we gotta keep it from the public. How do we

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Speaker 1: do that. We'll do it this way. Okay, great, we're there. No,

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Speaker 1: it's just that they don't see it from Mendami because

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Speaker 1: they're not looking for it. They see it with Elon

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Speaker 1: Musk because they're looking for it. The villainization of Elon

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Speaker 1: Musk is fascinating. Now. This was a guy who, up

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Speaker 1: until a couple of years ago, was the darling of

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Speaker 1: the progressive intellectual elite. He was it. I mean, the

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Speaker 1: guy made his money on corporate welfare, He made his

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Speaker 1: money on government regulations he gave us. He gave us

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Speaker 1: electric cars and made them so that people could buy them.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he made electric cars work so much so

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Speaker 1: that other manufacturers had to follow suit. If you don't know,

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Speaker 1: by the way, when I say it was cronyism, you

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Speaker 1: know that he gets huge, huge subsidies to build a factory,

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Speaker 1: and up until recently, you got huge subsidies to buy

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Speaker 1: his product. In Colorado, you still get a subsidy, a

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Speaker 1: subsidy for it. Fortunately we've cut it off thanks to

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Speaker 1: Trump on the federal level. But that's not where he

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Speaker 1: gets his money from cronyism. That's not the subsidy that

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Speaker 1: really makes the cash in. If you don't get it,

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Speaker 1: let me explain it real fast. Over the years, and

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Speaker 1: particularly during the Biden and Obama years, the federal regulations

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Speaker 1: required that a car company has to meet certain environmental

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Speaker 1: tailpipe emissions limits. Your whole fleet can only do this

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Speaker 1: much out of your tailpipe, and that's it. And every

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Speaker 1: car manufacturer gets x amount that they can do. Well,

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Speaker 1: if you're Ford and you're making F one fifties, you

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Speaker 1: run out of your credit pretty fast. You've got to

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Speaker 1: buy those credits from somebody. Else. So from whom do

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Speaker 1: you buy your tailpipe emissions credits from? Well, there is

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Speaker 1: one at that point, one and only one company that

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Speaker 1: has no tailpipes at all, and so they have all

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Speaker 1: these tailpipe emissions credit And so Tesla made its money. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: selling cars, sure, but that wasn't the high profit motive.

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Speaker 1: The high profit motive was by selling to their competitors

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Speaker 1: a bureaucratic certificate that their competitors needed to buy to

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Speaker 1: sell their cars. The reason why, the reason why in

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Speaker 1: F one fifty is so expensive has a lot to

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Speaker 1: do with they have to buy these credits in order

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Speaker 1: to sell them. It really is spectacular. So for a

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Speaker 1: long time Tesla was the darling and they're making money

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Speaker 1: hand over fist producing nothing. It's just that their product

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Speaker 1: doesn't have a tailpipe. You know, microwave oven doesn't have

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Speaker 1: a tailpipe either. They could have sold credits from them.

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Speaker 1: It was awful to see how Elon Musk turned into

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Speaker 1: a villain and how quickly he turned in the media's

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Speaker 1: eyes was wonderful. Case in point, his Nazi salute. His

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Speaker 1: Nazi salute, which I was told by people in the know,

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Speaker 1: was definitely a dog whistle signal to the racists of

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Speaker 1: the world that he is one of them. So when

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Speaker 1: their guy does it the exact same thing, the exact

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Speaker 1: same Nazi salute, it gets no media knowledge, it gets

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Speaker 1: no reporting, there's no outrage. And it's this double standard

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Speaker 1: which makes us so distrusting of the media. We can't

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Speaker 1: do it anymore. We know, we know that they are liars.

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Speaker 1: Now that's too strong. That's too strong. They don't see

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Speaker 1: their own biases and they do nothing to challenge it.

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Speaker 1: Over the weekend, it was interesting to see CBS Evening

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Speaker 1: News with what's his name, young guy with black hair,

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Speaker 1: because they all have to have hair. There are no

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Speaker 1: trusted bald men, you know, say that this is a

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Speaker 1: new era at CBS News that we are going to

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Speaker 1: Now we're now going to have a different, more trusting way.

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Speaker 1: We're going to listen to you. What does that mean.

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Speaker 1: It means that they know that that they know I'm

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Speaker 1: part of it. I'm trying to do two things I want.

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to pull up that quote ute and this

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Speaker 1: is why I'm a lousy talk show host. Hmm, Troy,

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Speaker 1: how do I pronounce his name? Doca pill? When he

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Speaker 1: says that that the news has put too much weight

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Speaker 1: on academics and elites. The press has missed the story.

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Speaker 1: That's pretty amazing. He starts Monday as the anchor of

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Speaker 1: CBS Evening News. Spoke out on New Year's Day about

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Speaker 1: where he thinks the press has gone wrong and vows

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Speaker 1: that the audience would come first ahead of advisors, politicians,

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Speaker 1: corporate interests, including CBS's own owners. People do not trust

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Speaker 1: us like they used to, he said in a video

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Speaker 1: posted on social media. Any stories, the press has missed

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Speaker 1: the story, and it's not just us, it's all of

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Speaker 1: legacy media because we've taken into account the perspective of advocates,

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Speaker 1: not the average American. Or we put too much weight

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Speaker 1: in the analysis of academics or elites and not enough

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Speaker 1: of you. Is it possible that CBS CBS wants to

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Speaker 1: wants to get into the Fox News action. Maybe they're

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Speaker 1: starting to realize we don't trust them, and why would

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Speaker 1: we trust them. The Mendabi Nazi salute is a perfect

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Speaker 1: example of the double standard, the current double standard that

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Speaker 1: we've all grown too used to. The media does not

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Speaker 1: understand they created. They created Trump, and Trump is a brutish,

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Speaker 1: insulting character that they hate. It's beautiful and we'll take

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Speaker 1: a break. When I come back, I'll play the clip

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Speaker 1: for you and you tell me what you think. Three

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Speaker 1: or three seven, one, three eight five eighty five seven one,

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Speaker 1: three eighty five eighty five. Do you see it? And

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Speaker 1: is it going to change in this year? I'm John

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Speaker 1: Kelderrek keep it here. You're on KOA News talk sport.

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Speaker 1: How is it that one guy can do a Nazi

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Speaker 1: salute and the other guy gets into trouble for it?

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Speaker 1: Hm hmm. I'm looking at a post on x where

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk is doing his Nazi salute and Mandabi is

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Speaker 1: doing his Nazi salute, and they're exactly this. Huh. All

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Speaker 1: these media outlets compared Elon's wave to a Nazi salute.

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Speaker 1: New York Times, BBCNPR, CNN, Axios, Washington Post, Freuters, MSNBC,

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Speaker 1: Al Jazeera USA Today, The Guardian, The Independent. None of

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Speaker 1: them have reported on Mendabi doing the exact same thing.

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Speaker 1: Doesn't it doesn't it make some some difference? Here?

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Speaker 2: We draw this city closer together.

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Speaker 3: We will replace the frigidity of rugged individualism with the

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Speaker 3: warmth of collectivism.

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Speaker 1: What this is, Colorado? I am telling you this is

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Speaker 1: the new Colorado. Colorado was a state of rugged individualism.

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Speaker 1: Colorado was a state where people came to risk. It

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Speaker 1: was a tolerant state. When Mandabi talks about being a

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Speaker 1: democratic socialist, it doesn't scare people. It should scare people.

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Speaker 1: It should scare you to death. Now I've told you

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Speaker 1: my reasoning why we're we're not upset by this, and

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Speaker 1: it's because of the blessings of capitalism that you and

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Speaker 1: I live the way kings in the past could never live.

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Speaker 1: That we have roofs and food and we live great lives.

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Speaker 1: We have a car, and we have a home, and

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Speaker 1: it's just incredible, and we take it all for granted.

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Speaker 1: If you are my age or younger, I'm sixty one.

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Speaker 1: If you are my age or younger, you have never

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Speaker 1: really felt an economic hard time. I'm not saying you

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Speaker 1: personally haven't gone through a hard time, by saying as

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Speaker 1: a collective, as a society, as a people man, we've

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Speaker 1: had it easy. Yeah. I remember the recession under Carter

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Speaker 1: and into Reagan. I remember the high unemployment, but that

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Speaker 1: wasn't my problem. It was the old man's problem. He

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Speaker 1: had to swim through it. I was in high school

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Speaker 1: checking out girls. I never had to worry about getting drafted.

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Speaker 1: We've never seen war on our shores. We've never been

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Speaker 1: in a world war. The wars that I've seen, it's

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Speaker 1: been volunteers who have gone, and God blessed them. We've

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Speaker 1: had it good. And so you can imagine that most

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Speaker 1: people in America go, well, then we could afford to

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Speaker 1: do this stuff because they don't remember the depression, they

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Speaker 1: don't remember war, they don't remember stagg inflation of the seventies,

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Speaker 1: they don't remember what happened when a dollar went out

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Speaker 1: of control. They will They're gonna be running right into it.

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Speaker 1: They will be running right into it. And it's a shame.

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Speaker 1: Why do we lose these messages? Why do we lose

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Speaker 1: these bits of history? Why are we forced to repeat them?

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Speaker 1: I have yet to have anyone call in and disagree

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Speaker 1: with me. There's got to be someone out there who does.

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Speaker 1: There's gotta some there's gotta be someone in the reach

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Speaker 1: of this fifty thousand blowtorch that goes, oh no, no. Collectivism.

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Speaker 1: Collectivism is warmth that we should replace rugged individualism with

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Speaker 1: the warmth of collectivism. All right, that's a double dog.

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Speaker 1: Dare to you three or three seven one three eight

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Speaker 1: five eighty five seven to one three eight five in

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Speaker 1: for Brownie. I'm John Calderic. Keep it right here. You're

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Speaker 1: on Kiowa News, Sports and.

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Speaker 2: Talk Kowa and HI hard radio station.

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Speaker 1: Guaranteed human good morning. So glad to spend some time

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Speaker 1: with you. I'm John Caldera. Hey, check out Independence Institute.

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00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:24,759
Speaker 1: Go to thinkfreedom dot org. Thinkfreedom dot org. Sign up

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00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:26,759
Speaker 1: for my newsletter. I won't charge you for it. It's

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00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 1: just a funny little thing I do. You'll get to

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00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,360
Speaker 1: see all the typos and bad jokes and keep you

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Speaker 1: up to date with what's going on in Colorado and

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Speaker 1: the world. That's Thinkfreedom dot o RG. I didn't even

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Speaker 1: know this until I went to an AP site. It

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Speaker 1: was Bernie Sanders who administered the oath of office to Zoron. Ma'mdami.

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Speaker 1: Bernie did it.

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Speaker 4: Well.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, Bernie and his great greatest grandfather,

426
00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:04,360
Speaker 1: Look you know that great picture of him with his

427
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 1: mittens on, with his arms crossed on a little folding chair.

428
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 1: He was basically wearing that outfit. And there he is

429
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:18,440
Speaker 1: given the oath of office against the oldigos, and I

430
00:35:18,520 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: get it. He's he's a socialist. But he's from Vermont.

431
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:36,919
Speaker 1: So in this speech that Mendabi does, he talks about, yes,

432
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,319
Speaker 1: we're all these different people, but more than that, we're

433
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 1: all New Yorkers. But he chooses, he chooses Bernie to

434
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:53,680
Speaker 1: swear him in. Isn't that odd? Isn't that odd? So

435
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:59,680
Speaker 1: I'm reading the Associated Press story about this, and I'm looking.

436
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: I'm looking. Ah, I'm looking. I'm looking. Uh huh uh huh.

437
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:14,600
Speaker 1: I don't see it. I see nothing in the AP

438
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: story about replacing rugged individualism with warm collectivism, which was

439
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 1: in his speech. So there's there is this social mayor

440
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 1: and and he's got he's the new mayor, doesn't have

441
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:43,600
Speaker 1: a Bible, he has a Quran. So this is the

442
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 1: first Muslim being mayor. That's right there in the beginning

443
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,440
Speaker 1: of the story. The picture is of Bernie Standers, the

444
00:36:51,520 --> 00:37:02,839
Speaker 1: socialist from Vermont and out of state. Hm hmm, isn't

445
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:04,800
Speaker 1: this a warm story? After work beeting part of the

446
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:08,840
Speaker 1: night in his new office, Man Donni then returned to

447
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:13,759
Speaker 1: City Hall in a taxi cab around midnight Thursday for

448
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:17,880
Speaker 1: a grander public inauguration, where Bernie Sanders, one of the

449
00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:27,799
Speaker 1: mayor's political heroes, administered the oath of our office. How wonderful.

450
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 1: Now let me go through this. I was elected as

451
00:37:34,200 --> 00:37:38,520
Speaker 1: a democratic socialist and I will govern as a democratic socialist.

452
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:44,359
Speaker 1: I love this that they have to put this adjective democratic,

453
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: But that somehow changes the socialism. Is it a warmer,

454
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,600
Speaker 1: happier face to being a communist when when you're a

455
00:37:56,640 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 1: democratic socialist, well a socialist, you want to rip power

456
00:38:05,239 --> 00:38:10,160
Speaker 1: away from individuals. You want to take away the role

457
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 1: of government from protecting our individual rights and instead infused

458
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:23,279
Speaker 1: into government the power to engineer society. The elitism, the

459
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 1: smugness it requires to be a socialist is outrageous. Yes,

460
00:38:30,600 --> 00:38:34,440
Speaker 1: those those darn individualists were mean, aren't we? We are

461
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 1: very mean? You mean people are mean. Wait a minute,

462
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:43,839
Speaker 1: We're not the ones telling other people how to live.

463
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:46,600
Speaker 1: We're not the ones telling other people what has to

464
00:38:46,640 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 1: happen with their property. We are the tolerant ones. We

465
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:55,400
Speaker 1: are the ones that say our job in government is

466
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:59,560
Speaker 1: to protect your freedom to make choices. Whereas a socialist,

467
00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,680
Speaker 1: whether he's a democratic socialist or tyrantical socialist, it doesn't matter.

468
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:10,400
Speaker 1: Socialism is all about taking away your choices. It is

469
00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:16,759
Speaker 1: saying we the ones who are smarter than you. We

470
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:20,839
Speaker 1: know what's right for you, and we will decisions for you.

471
00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:24,920
Speaker 1: We will tell you what kind of healthcare you should have.

472
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:28,160
Speaker 1: We will tell you how you should live. We should

473
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:32,520
Speaker 1: tell you where you should reside. We will create a

474
00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 1: public transit system where you will ride when we say,

475
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:39,239
Speaker 1: you should ride to the places we want you to go,

476
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:47,239
Speaker 1: because we know how you should live. Wow, some of

477
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:49,640
Speaker 1: the great things he said. In the richest country in

478
00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:51,839
Speaker 1: the history of the world, making sure that people can

479
00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 1: live in affordable housing is not radical. It is the

480
00:39:56,120 --> 00:40:00,319
Speaker 1: right and decent thing to do. Now what does that mean? Mean?

481
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 1: That means the failed experiment that he's too young to

482
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 1: recall of rent control. Hasn't he picked up a history

483
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:20,239
Speaker 1: book of his own city, the slums and the projects

484
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:28,120
Speaker 1: and the rent control and how it destroyed a city. Wow.

485
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:42,920
Speaker 1: So this thing of affordability again, it works. Will take

486
00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,480
Speaker 1: from the rich, will give to the poor. But then

487
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 1: when there's no more rich, what happens. The beautiful thing

488
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:57,920
Speaker 1: about socialists is they really believe that the work do,

489
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:03,200
Speaker 1: the money that they're stealing from people will always be there.

490
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:08,400
Speaker 1: They honestly believe that the wealthy of New York City,

491
00:41:10,280 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 1: don't have feet that work, that their legs cannot work,

492
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:18,000
Speaker 1: that they will stay in New York City and just

493
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:23,080
Speaker 1: be plundered. The same thing here in Colorado. Isn't it

494
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:30,160
Speaker 1: amazing that starting yesterday there were nine count them one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight,

495
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:36,840
Speaker 1: nine states that lowered their income tax rates in this

496
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:43,880
Speaker 1: race to draw productive people to their states. Here in Colorado,

497
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:46,160
Speaker 1: there's actually a group of people who want to put

498
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:52,560
Speaker 1: in a progressive income tax system because they don't remember

499
00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,160
Speaker 1: we already had that and got rid of it in

500
00:41:55,200 --> 00:41:58,400
Speaker 1: the eighties. Thanks it a lot to what Independence Institute

501
00:41:58,440 --> 00:42:03,799
Speaker 1: did back then to lead the charge, no, we want

502
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:08,719
Speaker 1: that back. New York and California have the worst of

503
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:12,360
Speaker 1: progressive income taxes out In California it's up to thirteen

504
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: percent for the most productive people. Well, you know what,

505
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:21,560
Speaker 1: the most productive people leave, and that's why people are

506
00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:25,560
Speaker 1: leaving California and they're leaving New York. They're moving to

507
00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:28,560
Speaker 1: places where they are valued and where they can keep

508
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:36,279
Speaker 1: their earnings. Hmm. It comes the usual comments from the

509
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:40,440
Speaker 1: new mayor. A moment like this comes rarely. Seldom do

510
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 1: we hold such an opportunity to transform and reinvent yeah,

511
00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 1: government control, reinvent it means opposite of freedom. You understand,

512
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:55,880
Speaker 1: you either have freedom or you have coercion. Socialism is

513
00:42:56,160 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 1: coercion anyway, keep going, rarer Still, it is the people

514
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 1: themselves who hands are on the levers of change. Oh

515
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:09,160
Speaker 1: and that's sweet, That is good. Bolshevik crap right there,

516
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:14,239
Speaker 1: Uh comrade, keep going, he continues. Yet we know that

517
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,600
Speaker 1: too often in our past, moments of great possibility have

518
00:43:18,719 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 1: been promptly surrendered to small imagination and smaller ambition. Quote hmm,

519
00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:34,359
Speaker 1: he has other things he has to do. In an

520
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:39,719
Speaker 1: opening remark to the crowd, US representative AOC praise New

521
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:48,319
Speaker 1: Yorkers for courage over fear. We have chosen prosperity for

522
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:55,320
Speaker 1: the many over the spoils for the few. Quick economics lesson.

523
00:43:58,160 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 1: Let's let's let's start with my favorite band, the Beatles,

524
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:06,200
Speaker 1: because I think they've been the most influential in pop history.

525
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:12,840
Speaker 1: You know what, they're all wealthy McCartney, especially super super wealthy.

526
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:19,839
Speaker 1: The guy's got money galore. But given what he has

527
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 1: given to the world, what he's given to me, the

528
00:44:23,120 --> 00:44:26,799
Speaker 1: money I have spent on his records and his concerts,

529
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:30,480
Speaker 1: I feel pretty good about a matter of fact, I'm

530
00:44:30,520 --> 00:44:35,319
Speaker 1: the one who wins in that exchange. My life is

531
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:41,040
Speaker 1: better for the Beatles and all their records. And if

532
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:47,600
Speaker 1: the cost is that they're rich, I don't care. I

533
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:53,560
Speaker 1: get the music. Oh let's go a little more down

534
00:44:53,600 --> 00:45:01,600
Speaker 1: to earth for you kids. You know, Steven Jobs, he

535
00:45:01,760 --> 00:45:06,640
Speaker 1: left billions, He built an empire. His family are billionaires.

536
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:10,960
Speaker 1: That's wrong. But what is it that he gave us

537
00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 1: in your pocket right now is a supercomputer connected to

538
00:45:18,160 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: the entire planet. That phone in your pocket can get

539
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:30,560
Speaker 1: you instant information, instant financial transfers. You can move money,

540
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:33,320
Speaker 1: you can order pizzas, you can talk to your grandma

541
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:39,760
Speaker 1: for free. You can have a video conversation with anyone

542
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,359
Speaker 1: you want. Now, keep in mind, you remember that scene

543
00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:45,440
Speaker 1: from two thousand and one to Space Obvious. See the

544
00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:48,799
Speaker 1: guy's up in the hotel that's orbiting Earth and he

545
00:45:48,880 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 1: calls back home on a video phone. He talks to

546
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,319
Speaker 1: his daughter, and that's the future. And then afterwards the

547
00:45:55,400 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 1: AT and T sign says you will be charged sixty

548
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 1: five dollars for this call. We're making those calls for free.

549
00:46:08,360 --> 00:46:10,799
Speaker 1: What is the price we have to pay is that

550
00:46:11,160 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 1: Steven Jobs becomes ridiculously wealthy. Who's the winner in all this.

551
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:20,239
Speaker 1: It's us.

552
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:29,880
Speaker 5: Elon Musk is a multi multi, multi, multi billionaire. But

553
00:46:29,920 --> 00:46:34,800
Speaker 5: do you realize in the farthest reaches, in some jungle

554
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:39,719
Speaker 5: in Africa, people put up a an antenna to Starlink

555
00:46:40,280 --> 00:46:43,640
Speaker 5: and they have instant access to the world. They can

556
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:46,799
Speaker 5: be educated, they can trade, they can do banking, they

557
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:52,680
Speaker 5: can do it all and there's a platform orbiting above

558
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:55,000
Speaker 5: them that makes it possible.

559
00:46:56,800 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 1: Yeah. You know what happens. The price of all of

560
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:04,440
Speaker 1: us living so well is that some of these people

561
00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:09,799
Speaker 1: become very, very wealthy. A lot of these people lose everything,

562
00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:18,000
Speaker 1: and they're hated for it. They're not beloved for it.

563
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,320
Speaker 1: They're not revered for it. They're hated for it. Listen

564
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 1: to Alexandria Cortes say, we have chosen prosperity for the

565
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,320
Speaker 1: many over the spoils for the few. What a false

566
00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:39,000
Speaker 1: dichotomy she sees this little zero sum world in You

567
00:47:39,040 --> 00:47:48,319
Speaker 1: know what, because of their success, you and I have prosperity. Yesterday,

568
00:47:49,120 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 1: I needed ink cartridges for my home printer. I tapped

569
00:47:55,480 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 1: a button on my computer. In a few hours later,

570
00:48:00,600 --> 00:48:05,040
Speaker 1: a guy from Amazon dropped it off to my door.

571
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:10,600
Speaker 1: There it was. I didn't have to go out. I

572
00:48:10,719 --> 00:48:16,960
Speaker 1: got what I needed delivered to me instantly. During COVID,

573
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:20,439
Speaker 1: people could order their food while they were under house

574
00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:24,200
Speaker 1: arrest and they lived. Now the price of that is

575
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:31,000
Speaker 1: Jeff Bezos is a billionaire. I don't care. I needed

576
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:36,880
Speaker 1: the ink cartridge because of the machinery he built. It

577
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:44,680
Speaker 1: popped up on my doorstep. Isn't that crazy? Shouldn't we

578
00:48:44,760 --> 00:48:50,160
Speaker 1: be celebrating them. I'm not saying we make them into gods,

579
00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:56,960
Speaker 1: but we understand that because they are wealthy. They're wealthy

580
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:01,160
Speaker 1: because they added value to the world. They've given us

581
00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:06,160
Speaker 1: things that we've never had before. Our quality of life,

582
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:09,399
Speaker 1: our cost of living has dropped, our quality has gone up.

583
00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 1: Would you like to go backward in time thirty years?

584
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:15,919
Speaker 1: Would you like to go backward in a world where

585
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:17,720
Speaker 1: you have to wait online to talk to a travel

586
00:49:17,719 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 1: agent to try to figure out when you might be

587
00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:23,840
Speaker 1: able to travel for what would you rather have? What

588
00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:28,759
Speaker 1: we have now? This world we live in is made

589
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:34,360
Speaker 1: possible because of freedom, because of liberty, and the cost

590
00:49:34,560 --> 00:49:39,200
Speaker 1: is if you find it offensive that when people give

591
00:49:39,560 --> 00:49:43,760
Speaker 1: something of value, take the risk build something of value,

592
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:49,240
Speaker 1: they get rewarded for it. That is the price of innovation.

593
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:54,239
Speaker 1: That is the price of this incredible life we have.

594
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:59,800
Speaker 1: So when when she says, you know, we live in

595
00:49:59,840 --> 00:50:04,840
Speaker 1: a world that needs to be changed. Were the richest

596
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:07,480
Speaker 1: in the world, there should be more than enough for

597
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:09,799
Speaker 1: all of us. Yeah, how did we get to be

598
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:14,920
Speaker 1: the richest in the world. Before you can steal somebody's

599
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:18,160
Speaker 1: stuff and give it to somebody else, that person has

600
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:22,040
Speaker 1: to earn that stuff, build that stuff. These people are

601
00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:26,239
Speaker 1: chopping down the tree of innovation. Why is it we

602
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:32,120
Speaker 1: have failed to teach our kids about this? All right,

603
00:50:32,160 --> 00:50:37,479
Speaker 1: let me break it down into the most ridiculous. There

604
00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:41,760
Speaker 1: is a sacrament that happens when you spend a dollar.

605
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:46,560
Speaker 1: It is a ceremony of great beauty and freedom. You

606
00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:49,000
Speaker 1: have a dollar, that guy has an ice cream cone.

607
00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:53,320
Speaker 1: You value the ice cream cone more than he values

608
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:56,360
Speaker 1: that dollar. You give him the dollar, he gives you

609
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:59,279
Speaker 1: the ice cream cone, and you look at each other

610
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:05,280
Speaker 1: and you both go, huh, I'm better off. Government wasn't involved.

611
00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:07,880
Speaker 1: There didn't need to be a planner involved. There didn't

612
00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:11,000
Speaker 1: need to be some smart guy and some fluorescent lit

613
00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:15,959
Speaker 1: basement and a bureaucratic headquarters deciding who has ice cream

614
00:51:15,960 --> 00:51:21,680
Speaker 1: and who doesn't. By that free trade, that's simple, free trade.

615
00:51:22,040 --> 00:51:27,080
Speaker 1: You both walk away better off. You value the ice cream,

616
00:51:27,160 --> 00:51:33,680
Speaker 1: he values the dollar. And look, economists call it utility.

617
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:40,239
Speaker 1: Utility has increased and it costs nothing. That's what they

618
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:44,319
Speaker 1: are giving away. That's what they are giving away. And

619
00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:48,120
Speaker 1: I fear that you and I don't make the moral

620
00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:53,080
Speaker 1: argument for the beauty of capitalism that you and I

621
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:55,439
Speaker 1: talk about. Well, no, this is good, and that's bad,

622
00:51:55,480 --> 00:52:01,160
Speaker 1: and it's good for the No, as human beings, we

623
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:04,160
Speaker 1: are sovereign to ourselves, and we have a right to

624
00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:09,480
Speaker 1: have relationships with whomever we want. And if we want

625
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 1: to buy this phone, we should be able to do so.

626
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:18,000
Speaker 1: It shouldn't be stolen from someone and given to you. Now,

627
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:21,400
Speaker 1: the reason I go off on this is, yeah, New

628
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:24,880
Speaker 1: York is going to suffer and Colorado could use this

629
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 1: as a learning experiment. But Colorado has been doing what

630
00:52:29,840 --> 00:52:33,560
Speaker 1: New York is going to do. We've taken away people's

631
00:52:33,640 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 1: property rights. We've said, yeah, you've got fuel under your ground,

632
00:52:37,520 --> 00:52:40,680
Speaker 1: but you cannot tap it. No you can't build what

633
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:44,400
Speaker 1: you want to build. No, you can't buy the gas

634
00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:47,799
Speaker 1: powered HVACT system. You're going to have to buy the

635
00:52:47,840 --> 00:52:51,600
Speaker 1: more expensive electric one, even though we don't have electricity

636
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:57,000
Speaker 1: for it. We are farther along the lines of democratic

637
00:52:57,080 --> 00:53:01,440
Speaker 1: socialism here in Colorado. The New York is three or

638
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:04,200
Speaker 1: three seven one, three eight five eighty five seven one

639
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:07,480
Speaker 1: three eighty five eighty five. Back after this, I'm John Calderic.

640
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:13,400
Speaker 1: Keep it here on KOA News Talk Sport are talking.

641
00:53:14,080 --> 00:53:18,360
Speaker 1: I'm John Caldera. Welcome, good morning. It's thirty four minutes

642
00:53:18,400 --> 00:53:21,200
Speaker 1: after you hear Chad Bauer talk about the story of

643
00:53:22,760 --> 00:53:29,280
Speaker 1: Trump's Trump's hearing loss, what to which Trump said, Eh, yeah,

644
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:33,200
Speaker 1: the guy's old. Of course he's got hearing loss. Front

645
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:38,440
Speaker 1: page Wall Street Journal as well was a story on

646
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:45,600
Speaker 1: Trump's declining health. Again the broken record that is my life.

647
00:53:46,440 --> 00:53:51,160
Speaker 1: The press that is jumping all over, jumping all over

648
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:56,879
Speaker 1: Trump for being old and falling asleep at a cabinet meeting,

649
00:53:56,960 --> 00:54:00,919
Speaker 1: which he says he didn't do. The ones who were

650
00:54:01,040 --> 00:54:10,920
Speaker 1: complicit and hiding Biden's mental frailties an auto pen to

651
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:15,719
Speaker 1: the point that after it was made public, well then

652
00:54:15,760 --> 00:54:20,680
Speaker 1: the media was like, oh, look, he's he's senile. Have

653
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:26,320
Speaker 1: you ever have you ever seen the media turn against

654
00:54:26,640 --> 00:54:31,880
Speaker 1: anyone so fast as the day after the debate between

655
00:54:31,880 --> 00:54:36,759
Speaker 1: Trump and Biden, where Biden just went off in his dementia,

656
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:41,759
Speaker 1: as if the media just saw it for the first time. No,

657
00:54:41,800 --> 00:54:44,440
Speaker 1: they got caught with their pants down, they got caught

658
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:48,120
Speaker 1: with their with their lie. They covered up for him,

659
00:54:48,280 --> 00:54:51,279
Speaker 1: they knew it. But Trump they go after. And by

660
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:53,120
Speaker 1: the way, I'm not saying it's wrong to go after

661
00:54:53,160 --> 00:54:56,480
Speaker 1: Trump if he's if his health is failing. What I'm

662
00:54:56,480 --> 00:54:59,200
Speaker 1: saying is this is why we despise the media, and

663
00:54:59,239 --> 00:55:03,520
Speaker 1: they're blind to it. I feel bad for them. I've

664
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:06,439
Speaker 1: got a lot of friends who are reporters and they're

665
00:55:06,520 --> 00:55:11,600
Speaker 1: they're left leaning, and I they don't they don't see

666
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:16,480
Speaker 1: they don't see their own biases. It is the most

667
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:22,560
Speaker 1: ridiculous thing. It's like talking to your drunk uncle. Unk

668
00:55:22,680 --> 00:55:26,120
Speaker 1: you you drink too much. You know you drink too much,

669
00:55:26,600 --> 00:55:28,640
Speaker 1: and finally when you push it to them, they get

670
00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:32,400
Speaker 1: angry at you. That's what the media does when you

671
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:37,080
Speaker 1: confront them about their bias. They don't see it. They

672
00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:39,279
Speaker 1: don't see it. They don't see it. You show it

673
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:42,719
Speaker 1: to them, and then they're angry at you. It's it's

674
00:55:42,719 --> 00:55:46,279
Speaker 1: the way it is did you say, Mark Clark, that's

675
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:48,640
Speaker 1: a better word. Let's go to the phones. Three oh

676
00:55:48,680 --> 00:55:52,480
Speaker 1: three seven one three eight five eighty five. Hey Clark, welcome.

677
00:55:52,719 --> 00:55:53,880
Speaker 1: You're with John Caldera.

678
00:55:54,800 --> 00:55:56,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, Johnna talk to you. Used to talk to you

679
00:55:56,760 --> 00:55:59,360
Speaker 3: a long time ago, but you're never on the radio anymore.

680
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:05,200
Speaker 3: So what can I say? I have a question. Yeah,

681
00:56:05,320 --> 00:56:10,759
Speaker 3: you consider inheritance capitalism. And what I mean by that

682
00:56:11,040 --> 00:56:13,600
Speaker 3: is I have no problem what you're saying about Jeff

683
00:56:13,600 --> 00:56:19,640
Speaker 3: Bezo or any of the other multi billionaires. But they're great,

684
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:23,080
Speaker 3: great great great grandchildren that aren't even needed, aren't even

685
00:56:23,080 --> 00:56:26,960
Speaker 3: close to being born yet will be born billionaires. Is

686
00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:28,719
Speaker 3: that capitalism?

687
00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 1: Is it capitalism? It's freedom, it's your money and you

688
00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:37,360
Speaker 1: can give it to whomever you wish.

689
00:56:38,800 --> 00:56:42,640
Speaker 3: But what you said was, you know, capitalism is innovation.

690
00:56:43,400 --> 00:56:46,000
Speaker 3: It is now somebody that's not not born for maybe

691
00:56:46,040 --> 00:56:50,319
Speaker 3: two hundred years, what did they innovate to become a billionaire?

692
00:56:52,360 --> 00:56:56,840
Speaker 1: They might have not innovated anything. Why is it that

693
00:56:56,920 --> 00:56:59,640
Speaker 1: we're so lucky to be Americans because our parents were

694
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:04,160
Speaker 1: here as well. Let me put it this way. My

695
00:57:04,400 --> 00:57:08,520
Speaker 1: job at Independence Institute is to beg people from money.

696
00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:11,719
Speaker 1: That's a big part of what I do. I have

697
00:57:11,800 --> 00:57:15,279
Speaker 1: to go out and say, please donate to us. And

698
00:57:15,320 --> 00:57:17,680
Speaker 1: I've gotten to get a good sense of the different

699
00:57:17,720 --> 00:57:22,720
Speaker 1: generations of wealth, and largely I can tell you that

700
00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:27,520
Speaker 1: those people who create the wealth and those people who

701
00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:30,880
Speaker 1: then inherit the wealth are very different. And those who

702
00:57:30,920 --> 00:57:34,080
Speaker 1: inherit it don't hold onto it for as long as

703
00:57:34,120 --> 00:57:38,560
Speaker 1: you think. So it is still a system of freedom

704
00:57:38,640 --> 00:57:42,160
Speaker 1: that if I want to give my money to my kids,

705
00:57:42,600 --> 00:57:44,640
Speaker 1: that's my choice. It's my money. What they do with

706
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:47,800
Speaker 1: it then becomes theirs. Likewise, what was what was the

707
00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:50,280
Speaker 1: name of the old guy who gave his money to

708
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:58,040
Speaker 1: his hot wife the blonde? Oh? They jested, come on Handednicle,

709
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:01,560
Speaker 1: thank you and Nicole Smith. And I loved I loved

710
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:06,680
Speaker 1: this guy. Why because he he said to his kids,

711
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 1: it's daddy's money. Daddy can do what he wants. And

712
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:12,400
Speaker 1: I'm buying I'm I'm buying a bimbo instead of giving

713
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:15,880
Speaker 1: it to you. Good for him. Are you saying that

714
00:58:16,200 --> 00:58:18,560
Speaker 1: a wealthy guy should not be able to give his

715
00:58:18,600 --> 00:58:20,200
Speaker 1: money to whom he wishes.

716
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:26,440
Speaker 3: No, because she provided a excuse the quotes, but the

717
00:58:26,520 --> 00:58:29,520
Speaker 3: service for him that was directly what you were saying,

718
00:58:29,560 --> 00:58:32,160
Speaker 3: like the ice cream cone guy, you buy the ice cream,

719
00:58:32,200 --> 00:58:33,680
Speaker 3: you get a something there. But but but.

720
00:58:33,640 --> 00:58:35,360
Speaker 1: If it's my money, are you saying I should not

721
00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:37,440
Speaker 1: be able to give it to my child?

722
00:58:38,560 --> 00:58:40,840
Speaker 3: No, I think you should be able to give the

723
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:43,640
Speaker 3: bad bat majority of it to your child.

724
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:46,240
Speaker 1: Why not all of it? And if I wish my

725
00:58:46,360 --> 00:58:48,400
Speaker 1: money you can.

726
00:58:49,160 --> 00:58:51,200
Speaker 3: But and I'm not not a problem with that.

727
00:58:51,560 --> 00:58:53,480
Speaker 1: No, let me let me try this. This is a

728
00:58:53,600 --> 00:58:56,760
Speaker 1: this is a clarifying question. I'm not trying. I just

729
00:58:56,760 --> 00:58:59,880
Speaker 1: want to know where you sit. First. Are you do

730
00:58:59,880 --> 00:59:04,120
Speaker 1: you support death taxes so that when someone dies they

731
00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:06,800
Speaker 1: have to give that estate. A lot of it goes

732
00:59:06,840 --> 00:59:09,840
Speaker 1: to the to the state. I just want to know

733
00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:14,880
Speaker 1: where you are a proportion, So the answer is, yes,

734
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:22,280
Speaker 1: you support death taxes, a proportion subcovering you. You like

735
00:59:22,360 --> 00:59:23,160
Speaker 1: the estate tax.

736
00:59:24,400 --> 00:59:29,520
Speaker 3: No, I hope that gives my children, But I don't

737
00:59:29,520 --> 00:59:30,080
Speaker 3: think I should.

738
00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:34,400
Speaker 1: You're confusing me. I have a simple little mind. Help

739
00:59:34,440 --> 00:59:42,280
Speaker 1: me out. If rich guy dies, don't I'm not following you.

740
00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:46,640
Speaker 1: A rich guy dies, I believe one of his money

741
00:59:46,720 --> 00:59:49,640
Speaker 1: should go to wherever he wants his money to go

742
00:59:49,760 --> 00:59:54,640
Speaker 1: without the government getting a penny of it. How much

743
00:59:54,680 --> 00:59:56,439
Speaker 1: do you think the government should take.

744
00:59:58,080 --> 00:59:59,560
Speaker 3: It depends on how much money.

745
01:00:01,680 --> 01:00:04,200
Speaker 1: Billion dollars. He's got a billion dollars, how much would

746
01:00:04,200 --> 01:00:06,280
Speaker 1: the government take zero?

747
01:00:07,120 --> 01:00:09,760
Speaker 3: If he has a trillion dollars, he should not be

748
01:00:09,800 --> 01:00:11,160
Speaker 3: able to give a trillion dollars?

749
01:00:11,360 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 1: Why not?

750
01:00:13,880 --> 01:00:15,080
Speaker 4: Because you believe he should.

751
01:00:15,120 --> 01:00:18,920
Speaker 1: I believe he shouldn't. Yeah, And I'm asking why. The

752
01:00:18,920 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 1: reason I think he should is because it is his property,

753
01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:25,880
Speaker 1: and his property, he should be free to dispose of

754
01:00:25,920 --> 01:00:30,360
Speaker 1: his property how he wishes. Now, why do you believe

755
01:00:30,400 --> 01:00:33,080
Speaker 1: he should not have the power over his own property?

756
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:39,320
Speaker 3: Because his children, his great great great grandchildren, have not

757
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:43,240
Speaker 3: contributed to society and they will never need to contribute

758
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:48,240
Speaker 3: to society for what he has done. Man, I just

759
01:00:48,240 --> 01:00:51,200
Speaker 3: don't think that what we're seeing is this disparity where

760
01:00:51,240 --> 01:00:55,320
Speaker 3: the middle class is going away, and especially with AI developing,

761
01:00:55,760 --> 01:01:00,200
Speaker 3: I think you're going to see many, many, many more billionaires,

762
01:01:00,240 --> 01:01:03,560
Speaker 3: probably several trillionaires. And you know that.

763
01:01:04,000 --> 01:01:08,440
Speaker 1: So is it just a jealousy thing? No? So, because

764
01:01:08,680 --> 01:01:14,520
Speaker 1: it's all right. So if I'm a trillionaire and I

765
01:01:14,680 --> 01:01:17,720
Speaker 1: want to on my death, all right, just work with

766
01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:19,760
Speaker 1: me on this. It's a thought experiment. I'm a trillionaire.

767
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:23,640
Speaker 1: On my death, I want my money to be burned,

768
01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:27,080
Speaker 1: put into a pile and burned. Is that okay with you?

769
01:01:27,440 --> 01:01:27,800
Speaker 3: For you?

770
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:30,040
Speaker 1: Should I be taxed for that?

771
01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:33,240
Speaker 3: Absolutely?

772
01:01:34,080 --> 01:01:37,440
Speaker 1: I should be taxed before I burn my money. I

773
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:38,320
Speaker 1: should be taxed for it.

774
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:41,600
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I mean, if that's what you want to do,

775
01:01:41,640 --> 01:01:44,680
Speaker 3: if you're stupid enough to burn your money, then yeah.

776
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:47,520
Speaker 1: It's my money. So you're you're gonna You're gonna tax

777
01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:49,360
Speaker 1: me for doing what I want with my money.

778
01:01:50,520 --> 01:01:52,640
Speaker 3: I guess, do you want to burn your house down

779
01:01:52,640 --> 01:01:53,200
Speaker 3: when you die?

780
01:01:54,080 --> 01:01:55,920
Speaker 1: If I want to do, I have the right to,

781
01:01:56,080 --> 01:01:59,280
Speaker 1: is my question? Personally? The answer is no, I don't

782
01:01:59,320 --> 01:02:01,760
Speaker 1: want to do that, but I should be free to

783
01:02:01,880 --> 01:02:04,520
Speaker 1: do that. If I want you on my deathbed gamble

784
01:02:04,560 --> 01:02:06,640
Speaker 1: my money on roulette till it's all gone, I should

785
01:02:06,680 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: be able to do that. What gives? What gives? You're

786
01:02:10,920 --> 01:02:16,360
Speaker 1: confusing me here, help me understand. On one side, Saint John,

787
01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:18,360
Speaker 1: you're a trillionaire. You do what you want with your money.

788
01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:19,959
Speaker 1: On the other hand, you're saying no, if you don't

789
01:02:20,000 --> 01:02:22,480
Speaker 1: do what I like with your money, it should be taxed.

790
01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:29,720
Speaker 1: Explain how you have a right over my money.

791
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:33,360
Speaker 3: I'm trying to protect your great great great grandchildren from

792
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:36,160
Speaker 3: not working and not contributing to society.

793
01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:39,760
Speaker 1: Why would they want to know you've jumped. You've jumped.

794
01:02:40,160 --> 01:02:43,040
Speaker 1: Let's try it again. I want to burn my money.

795
01:02:43,200 --> 01:02:45,760
Speaker 1: You say I can't. I want to gamble my money away.

796
01:02:45,840 --> 01:02:46,680
Speaker 1: You see I can't.

797
01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:49,959
Speaker 3: I said, you can burn your money. You can burn

798
01:02:49,960 --> 01:02:50,880
Speaker 3: your money, all right.

799
01:02:50,880 --> 01:02:53,000
Speaker 1: So I can burn my money, but I cannot put

800
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:55,880
Speaker 1: it in a trust for people that I want to

801
01:02:55,920 --> 01:02:59,200
Speaker 1: give it to. But instead the collective should take my

802
01:02:59,360 --> 01:03:02,400
Speaker 1: money and give it to people not yet born in

803
01:03:02,440 --> 01:03:08,000
Speaker 1: the form of welfare. Why is it that your values

804
01:03:08,680 --> 01:03:12,760
Speaker 1: trump my values? That's that's where I talk about the

805
01:03:12,840 --> 01:03:20,760
Speaker 1: tolerance of capitalism versus versus collectivism. Collectivism is you will

806
01:03:20,800 --> 01:03:26,320
Speaker 1: swallow my values against your will, and capitalism is you

807
01:03:26,400 --> 01:03:30,360
Speaker 1: will tolerate somebody's values, whether you like them or not.

808
01:03:30,480 --> 01:03:33,320
Speaker 1: I'd like the latter a whole lot. Hey, great conversation.

809
01:03:33,360 --> 01:03:35,560
Speaker 1: I'm late for a break, was really fascinating. Thank you

810
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:37,920
Speaker 1: for doing that. Three oh three seven, one, three eight,

811
01:03:38,000 --> 01:03:41,200
Speaker 1: five eighty five. I'm John Caldera. Keep it here. You're

812
01:03:41,280 --> 01:03:45,840
Speaker 1: on KAA News, Talk and Sports. John Caldera, thanks for

813
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:49,160
Speaker 1: the call from Clark, who recently called up we have

814
01:03:49,240 --> 01:03:53,960
Speaker 1: this interesting back and forth of inheritance tax, and I

815
01:03:54,000 --> 01:04:00,480
Speaker 1: agree with him. People who are raised with money, well,

816
01:04:02,640 --> 01:04:06,240
Speaker 1: they're not always productive. They lose their money, they really do.

817
01:04:06,760 --> 01:04:10,280
Speaker 1: And it's one of one of the problems with becoming

818
01:04:10,320 --> 01:04:15,200
Speaker 1: wealthy is that your kids don't value or your grandkids

819
01:04:15,240 --> 01:04:18,880
Speaker 1: don't value the same things. They haven't had the same risk,

820
01:04:19,520 --> 01:04:23,840
Speaker 1: the same fire under them, and I don't want that

821
01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:28,160
Speaker 1: to happen to my children. So long ago, I made

822
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:32,400
Speaker 1: a decision, a very difficult decision, never to become wealthy.

823
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:34,920
Speaker 1: And I got to tell you, it's taken a lot

824
01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:39,960
Speaker 1: of discipline to stay as poor as I am. It

825
01:04:39,960 --> 01:04:43,560
Speaker 1: has been taken out the opportunities I've had to become

826
01:04:43,600 --> 01:04:47,680
Speaker 1: a millionaire. And I've said, nay, nay, I do not

827
01:04:47,840 --> 01:04:51,080
Speaker 1: want my children and their children to have life too

828
01:04:51,120 --> 01:04:54,840
Speaker 1: easy and to sponge off of this. They need those lessons.

829
01:04:55,600 --> 01:04:59,920
Speaker 1: I will instead invest my money in this which goes bankrupt,

830
01:05:02,640 --> 01:05:04,640
Speaker 1: cause I love my kids three or three seven, one,

831
01:05:04,720 --> 01:05:07,439
Speaker 1: three eight five eighty five seven one three eighty five

832
01:05:07,560 --> 01:05:10,680
Speaker 1: eighty five, And I get it. But there's this sense,

833
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:15,920
Speaker 1: there's this sense that that rich people, no matter how

834
01:05:15,920 --> 01:05:20,160
Speaker 1: they made their money, don't deserve it. Yeah, it's true

835
01:05:21,640 --> 01:05:25,600
Speaker 1: in a lot of ways they don't. But government's job

836
01:05:25,760 --> 01:05:30,280
Speaker 1: is to protect our life, our liberty, and our property.

837
01:05:30,960 --> 01:05:33,120
Speaker 1: Let's go to the phones and talk to Mark. Mark. Welcome.

838
01:05:33,200 --> 01:05:36,880
Speaker 1: You're with John Caldera a meal. Hold on.

839
01:05:39,040 --> 01:05:42,200
Speaker 6: Well, I'm a middle class guy, and everybody keeps talking

840
01:05:42,280 --> 01:05:47,680
Speaker 6: about these dang billionaires and nobody talks about them dang millionaires.

841
01:05:47,720 --> 01:05:49,120
Speaker 6: Who's got more than me too?

842
01:05:49,240 --> 01:05:56,680
Speaker 1: You know? Indeed, indeed, you know they.

843
01:05:56,680 --> 01:05:59,080
Speaker 6: Usually talk about it, but not anymore.

844
01:05:59,480 --> 01:06:02,400
Speaker 1: I used to talk talk about it, oh everybody.

845
01:06:02,600 --> 01:06:05,800
Speaker 6: Yeah, the media, those darn millionaires.

846
01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:08,080
Speaker 1: Those darn millionaires. Now it's gonna be billionaires, you know,

847
01:06:08,120 --> 01:06:08,800
Speaker 1: I think about it.

848
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:11,440
Speaker 6: Sure you read the PJ. Old book?

849
01:06:12,760 --> 01:06:15,480
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, Oh I miss PJ. PJ was a friend

850
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:18,800
Speaker 1: of mine and just really cool. Oh yeah, no, he was.

851
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:23,520
Speaker 1: He was spectacular. I miss him. Good, good, greak i'd

852
01:06:23,560 --> 01:06:26,760
Speaker 1: have a drink with, and just smart and funny and

853
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:27,920
Speaker 1: a great communicator.

854
01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:32,640
Speaker 6: I got a riddle for you, all right, what's the

855
01:06:32,720 --> 01:06:39,080
Speaker 6: difference between a progressed a socialist and the communist?

856
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:43,200
Speaker 1: I give up. What's the difference between a progressive.

857
01:06:42,760 --> 01:06:48,080
Speaker 6: Socialist and salmon's finger about an inch apart about that much.

858
01:06:48,600 --> 01:06:52,840
Speaker 1: Yep, have yourself a great morning, thanks Mark three o

859
01:06:52,960 --> 01:06:55,960
Speaker 1: three seven one three eight five eighty five seven one

860
01:06:56,000 --> 01:07:02,880
Speaker 1: three eighty five eighty five. The idea that other people

861
01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:08,080
Speaker 1: have access to what you have, that they have a

862
01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:11,760
Speaker 1: right to just come and take it. How about this

863
01:07:11,960 --> 01:07:18,520
Speaker 1: for a simple concept. If it is illegal for an

864
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:24,680
Speaker 1: individual to do something, shouldn't it also be illegal for

865
01:07:24,760 --> 01:07:29,520
Speaker 1: the government to do the very same thing. If the

866
01:07:29,600 --> 01:07:35,360
Speaker 1: government can come in and just take your money, shouldn't

867
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:39,480
Speaker 1: we go wait, wait a second, just because just because

868
01:07:40,920 --> 01:07:44,840
Speaker 1: a blob of people come and take somebody's property, does

869
01:07:44,840 --> 01:07:49,320
Speaker 1: that make it right? And the answer is no. I

870
01:07:49,360 --> 01:07:53,560
Speaker 1: think any money that is taken from you above what

871
01:07:53,680 --> 01:07:59,520
Speaker 1: is needed for the mere core functions of government is theft.

872
01:08:00,200 --> 01:08:02,160
Speaker 1: Let me try it this way, then we'll go to

873
01:08:02,200 --> 01:08:06,840
Speaker 1: a break. If one hundred percent of your labor, one

874
01:08:06,920 --> 01:08:09,960
Speaker 1: hundred percent of all the work you do goes to

875
01:08:10,000 --> 01:08:15,720
Speaker 1: somebody else, what do we call that? We call it slavery.

876
01:08:15,920 --> 01:08:20,160
Speaker 1: You work and the product of that work goes to

877
01:08:20,200 --> 01:08:28,720
Speaker 1: somebody else, that's slavery. So if the government takes half

878
01:08:29,280 --> 01:08:36,400
Speaker 1: of everything you produce, is that half slavery, What exactly

879
01:08:36,520 --> 01:08:39,519
Speaker 1: is it? Give me an answer? Three or three seven

880
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:42,360
Speaker 1: one three eighty five eighty five. I'm John Caldera. It's

881
01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:45,559
Speaker 1: the first Friday of a new year. Help me out

882
01:08:45,560 --> 01:08:48,479
Speaker 1: with these big questions. Three h three seven to one

883
01:08:48,520 --> 01:08:52,040
Speaker 1: three eight five eighty five. You're in KOA News Talk.

884
01:08:51,920 --> 01:08:56,640
Speaker 2: Sports, KOWA and HI heard radio stations.

885
01:08:58,280 --> 01:09:03,040
Speaker 1: Guaranteed human John Caldera in for mister Brown, who is

886
01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:07,320
Speaker 1: out of town. Actually, I think he's probably drying out someplace.

887
01:09:07,400 --> 01:09:13,840
Speaker 1: I always like to say he's he's in recovery right now. Yeah,

888
01:09:13,880 --> 01:09:16,800
Speaker 1: I like that better. All right, let's do a couple

889
01:09:16,840 --> 01:09:19,360
Speaker 1: of things. One of the things that we've done at

890
01:09:19,360 --> 01:09:22,960
Speaker 1: Independence Institute again check us out at thinkfreedom dot org,

891
01:09:23,080 --> 01:09:28,960
Speaker 1: is we've brought together a bizarre coalition of left and

892
01:09:29,040 --> 01:09:35,360
Speaker 1: right groups in Colorado who are concerned about transparency, that is,

893
01:09:35,840 --> 01:09:42,120
Speaker 1: the government hiding what they are doing, and so sitting

894
01:09:42,160 --> 01:09:47,120
Speaker 1: down with a bunch of organizations that usually we disagree with,

895
01:09:48,040 --> 01:09:52,639
Speaker 1: organizations like the League of Women Voters and Colorado Public

896
01:09:52,720 --> 01:09:57,360
Speaker 1: Radio and the Press Association and the Broadcasters Association and

897
01:09:57,400 --> 01:10:01,559
Speaker 1: the Times Recorder, which is a progressive news organ and

898
01:10:01,600 --> 01:10:05,800
Speaker 1: all these other groups that we usually fight with and

899
01:10:05,840 --> 01:10:10,080
Speaker 1: we all got together because we're all angry left, right

900
01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:13,320
Speaker 1: and middle that we can't find out what's going on

901
01:10:13,960 --> 01:10:18,160
Speaker 1: inside government. And really it came to a head a

902
01:10:18,280 --> 01:10:23,240
Speaker 1: year or so ago when the Colorado legislature voted to

903
01:10:23,760 --> 01:10:28,599
Speaker 1: exempt itself from the open meetings law. So in Colorado,

904
01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 1: we've got this law that if our officials are doing

905
01:10:32,240 --> 01:10:37,240
Speaker 1: the people's business, you know, horse trading, discussing what they

906
01:10:37,280 --> 01:10:41,519
Speaker 1: should do on policy, that we need to be allowed

907
01:10:41,560 --> 01:10:44,960
Speaker 1: to see it. We should be able to sit down

908
01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:49,240
Speaker 1: and watch it. They pass the law saying yeah, yeah,

909
01:10:49,280 --> 01:10:51,720
Speaker 1: that's good for all the other governments in Colorado, all

910
01:10:51,720 --> 01:10:56,600
Speaker 1: the other five thousand governments, but not us because or

911
01:10:56,640 --> 01:11:00,960
Speaker 1: the legislature, don't you know. And as soon as they

912
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:06,200
Speaker 1: passed it, the governor sadly signed it into law. I

913
01:11:06,240 --> 01:11:09,439
Speaker 1: was really disappointed in police on that and for many things.

914
01:11:09,439 --> 01:11:11,280
Speaker 1: And by the way, he's done some good things and

915
01:11:11,520 --> 01:11:13,360
Speaker 1: a lot of bad things. This was a bad thing.

916
01:11:14,640 --> 01:11:17,240
Speaker 1: And within a few weeks there was a special session

917
01:11:17,400 --> 01:11:22,479
Speaker 1: and lo and behold, the Democrats went into their executive session.

918
01:11:22,520 --> 01:11:26,840
Speaker 1: They went into a private caucus, kicked out the reporters,

919
01:11:27,320 --> 01:11:31,000
Speaker 1: made their deals, did their horse trading, and since they

920
01:11:31,040 --> 01:11:35,080
Speaker 1: have a near super majority, walked out, laid it down

921
01:11:35,320 --> 01:11:38,240
Speaker 1: and voted for it. We never got to see what

922
01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:42,639
Speaker 1: they considered or how they got to that that level.

923
01:11:44,760 --> 01:11:47,559
Speaker 1: And so all of a sudden, I find myself in

924
01:11:47,640 --> 01:11:51,840
Speaker 1: a group with all these other people that I would

925
01:11:51,920 --> 01:11:54,559
Speaker 1: disagree with on just about every policy in the world,

926
01:11:54,880 --> 01:11:58,439
Speaker 1: but we're all saying we should know what's going on.

927
01:12:00,000 --> 01:12:07,120
Speaker 1: Dolado has open records laws and open meetings laws. The

928
01:12:07,240 --> 01:12:09,880
Speaker 1: idea is that it's our government and we should see

929
01:12:09,880 --> 01:12:12,320
Speaker 1: what they're doing. And if you want to see what's

930
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:17,679
Speaker 1: going on in Colorado and inside your government, whether it's

931
01:12:17,760 --> 01:12:21,120
Speaker 1: your legislature, whether it's your school district or your park

932
01:12:21,160 --> 01:12:23,840
Speaker 1: and rex department, you've got a right to know. You've

933
01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:27,320
Speaker 1: got a right to see what they're doing. You can

934
01:12:27,360 --> 01:12:30,240
Speaker 1: even request to see certain documents and they have to

935
01:12:30,240 --> 01:12:34,960
Speaker 1: give it to you. But we have so many different

936
01:12:34,960 --> 01:12:37,920
Speaker 1: governments and they all treat you differently, and they want

937
01:12:37,920 --> 01:12:41,960
Speaker 1: to charge you different amounts for that, which makes no

938
01:12:42,520 --> 01:12:49,400
Speaker 1: sense given that everything now is digital. Everything has been

939
01:12:49,439 --> 01:12:53,160
Speaker 1: done on an email, and so to go back and say, yeah,

940
01:12:53,160 --> 01:12:55,680
Speaker 1: show me all the emails between this person and that

941
01:12:55,720 --> 01:13:02,160
Speaker 1: person on the subject of this nothing. It's right there

942
01:13:02,479 --> 01:13:08,479
Speaker 1: in digital form. I remember once we did a study

943
01:13:08,840 --> 01:13:13,559
Speaker 1: on the different colleges in Colorado. We needed some sort

944
01:13:13,560 --> 01:13:16,880
Speaker 1: of public information, so we sent out a CORA request

945
01:13:16,880 --> 01:13:21,000
Speaker 1: that's a Colorado Open Records request to all the colleges

946
01:13:21,040 --> 01:13:25,479
Speaker 1: and universities. Some of them got back to us right away.

947
01:13:26,240 --> 01:13:29,439
Speaker 1: See U Boulder, drag their feet and try to charge

948
01:13:29,479 --> 01:13:32,479
Speaker 1: us a lot. CSU down in Pueblo refused to give

949
01:13:32,560 --> 01:13:35,519
Speaker 1: us that information at all and said if you want

950
01:13:35,560 --> 01:13:37,719
Speaker 1: to see it, you can come down here and look

951
01:13:37,760 --> 01:13:40,920
Speaker 1: at it, but we're not sending it to you. I

952
01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:43,560
Speaker 1: think it was like payroll information or something, you know

953
01:13:43,640 --> 01:13:49,920
Speaker 1: what people are getting paid. It was Western State University

954
01:13:49,960 --> 01:13:56,960
Speaker 1: out in Grand Junction sent us a cd ROM with

955
01:13:57,080 --> 01:14:00,519
Speaker 1: all the information on it for free, and then a

956
01:14:00,520 --> 01:14:03,840
Speaker 1: couple days later called us up and asked, hey, do

957
01:14:03,880 --> 01:14:06,760
Speaker 1: you need any more information? Did that cover it? So

958
01:14:06,880 --> 01:14:09,959
Speaker 1: we had the gambit of the same level of government

959
01:14:10,200 --> 01:14:13,840
Speaker 1: treating us all sorts of ways, one charging money, the

960
01:14:13,920 --> 01:14:17,800
Speaker 1: other one saying no way, know how, and one saying,

961
01:14:18,040 --> 01:14:22,960
Speaker 1: oh yeah, no problem here it is. That's how crazy

962
01:14:23,040 --> 01:14:28,840
Speaker 1: Colorado's open records are. And how about this one? So

963
01:14:28,880 --> 01:14:34,519
Speaker 1: this group got together and we decided, you know what,

964
01:14:35,439 --> 01:14:37,960
Speaker 1: at least people should be able to see what goes

965
01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:40,000
Speaker 1: on in the capitol. I mean, after all, we live

966
01:14:40,040 --> 01:14:44,600
Speaker 1: in a world of zoom meetings. You can stream and

967
01:14:44,680 --> 01:14:50,720
Speaker 1: FaceTime anything you want. But Colorado. Get this, Colorado was

968
01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:55,280
Speaker 1: the only state in the Union that did not live

969
01:14:55,520 --> 01:15:00,720
Speaker 1: stream video it's committee hearings. So you got all these

970
01:15:00,760 --> 01:15:04,760
Speaker 1: committee hearings going on, and get this, Each one of

971
01:15:04,760 --> 01:15:11,160
Speaker 1: those committee rooms has video cameras in it and large

972
01:15:11,200 --> 01:15:16,640
Speaker 1: TVs for zoom meetings. But they never wanted to just

973
01:15:16,840 --> 01:15:19,280
Speaker 1: flip the switch so you and I could watch what

974
01:15:19,439 --> 01:15:23,439
Speaker 1: goes on in the Capitol in all these meeting rooms.

975
01:15:24,160 --> 01:15:26,960
Speaker 1: If we wanted to the only state here we are

976
01:15:26,960 --> 01:15:31,880
Speaker 1: in this technologically advanced, high tech state of Colorado, and

977
01:15:31,960 --> 01:15:37,400
Speaker 1: if you wanted to testify at a committee hearing, you

978
01:15:37,439 --> 01:15:41,320
Speaker 1: could do so. Buy zoom. So get this. If you

979
01:15:41,400 --> 01:15:44,960
Speaker 1: were zooming in to be to give public testimony on

980
01:15:45,000 --> 01:15:47,840
Speaker 1: a bill, well then you could see what was going on.

981
01:15:49,120 --> 01:15:51,680
Speaker 1: But if you weren't, then you could not see what

982
01:15:51,760 --> 01:15:58,120
Speaker 1: was going on. How goofy was that? So we put

983
01:15:58,160 --> 01:16:02,759
Speaker 1: some pressure on the leadership in the House and Senate,

984
01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:07,600
Speaker 1: and it said this is nuts, and we're and we

985
01:16:07,760 --> 01:16:10,000
Speaker 1: made a stink about it, and so lo and behold.

986
01:16:10,200 --> 01:16:13,880
Speaker 1: Last year they did a pilot, a pilot program, and

987
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:16,680
Speaker 1: what did they do. They flipped the switches on so

988
01:16:16,760 --> 01:16:21,080
Speaker 1: people could see some of the committee rooms. Well, now,

989
01:16:21,800 --> 01:16:24,720
Speaker 1: a victory to transparency and a victory to us and

990
01:16:24,760 --> 01:16:29,520
Speaker 1: all of our partners left, right and center. The Legislative

991
01:16:29,520 --> 01:16:36,479
Speaker 1: Committee has has said, okay, you can watch. You can

992
01:16:36,600 --> 01:16:42,479
Speaker 1: watch all the hearings permanently. So the by a vote

993
01:16:42,520 --> 01:16:46,840
Speaker 1: of five to one, they voted to let you finally

994
01:16:46,880 --> 01:16:52,360
Speaker 1: see what's going on in your government. But still they

995
01:16:52,520 --> 01:16:57,720
Speaker 1: haven't changed the open meetings law. They still can go

996
01:16:57,800 --> 01:17:01,320
Speaker 1: into a back room, decide what they're going to do

997
01:17:01,439 --> 01:17:05,400
Speaker 1: to you, then come out and do it. That's how

998
01:17:05,600 --> 01:17:12,880
Speaker 1: arrogant this one party monolith running our state is. It

999
01:17:13,040 --> 01:17:16,080
Speaker 1: needs to change. Three o three seven to one, three eight,

1000
01:17:16,160 --> 01:17:18,559
Speaker 1: five eighty five. So a little bit of good news

1001
01:17:18,600 --> 01:17:21,080
Speaker 1: and a lot more fight to go. Go to thinkfreedom

1002
01:17:21,080 --> 01:17:23,120
Speaker 1: dot org to learn more about that. In the meantime,

1003
01:17:23,640 --> 01:17:26,560
Speaker 1: keep it right here. You're on KOA News Talk Sports.

1004
01:17:26,960 --> 01:17:28,720
Speaker 1: So glad to spend a little time with you. Give

1005
01:17:28,720 --> 01:17:32,800
Speaker 1: me a call. Three oh three seven to one, three

1006
01:17:32,920 --> 01:17:38,160
Speaker 1: eight five eighty five more than this from the Washington Examiner,

1007
01:17:38,200 --> 01:17:42,760
Speaker 1: more than one point five million recipients of the Supplemental

1008
01:17:42,840 --> 01:17:47,599
Speaker 1: Nutrition Assistance Program. We used to call this food stamps.

1009
01:17:47,800 --> 01:17:53,920
Speaker 1: I miss food stamps. Food stamps, Yeah, they were, They

1010
01:17:53,920 --> 01:17:58,280
Speaker 1: were literal stamps. They were coupons. They had a denomination

1011
01:17:58,400 --> 01:18:00,519
Speaker 1: on it, and you can bring them inside and stuff

1012
01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:05,160
Speaker 1: with it. Then along came debit cards, and it was like,

1013
01:18:05,320 --> 01:18:07,320
Speaker 1: this is a lot easier to do. You can just

1014
01:18:07,360 --> 01:18:12,519
Speaker 1: fill them up automatically, and it's less stigmatizing for those

1015
01:18:12,680 --> 01:18:15,559
Speaker 1: who use it. So now we have something called SNAP

1016
01:18:16,040 --> 01:18:21,559
Speaker 1: Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program. Work at anything. Just stayed away

1017
01:18:21,560 --> 01:18:23,400
Speaker 1: your words. I can't have to to learn. Are these

1018
01:18:23,439 --> 01:18:27,960
Speaker 1: new words? Anyway? More than one point four million recipients

1019
01:18:28,000 --> 01:18:32,799
Speaker 1: a SNAP across five states will be banned from using

1020
01:18:33,160 --> 01:18:45,960
Speaker 1: federal food assistance for candy or soda purchases starting now. Indiana, Iowa, Nebraska, Utah,

1021
01:18:46,040 --> 01:18:49,760
Speaker 1: West Virginia are the first group of eighteen states to

1022
01:18:49,920 --> 01:18:53,920
Speaker 1: set food restriction waivers at the start of the new year.

1023
01:18:53,960 --> 01:18:59,040
Speaker 1: According to the Department of Agriculture, the waivers targets different

1024
01:18:59,160 --> 01:19:05,280
Speaker 1: junk food in each state. All right, I have some

1025
01:19:05,600 --> 01:19:08,200
Speaker 1: mixed feelings about this, so work with me on it.

1026
01:19:10,080 --> 01:19:13,439
Speaker 1: Indiana will soon restrict the purchase of soft drinks and candy,

1027
01:19:14,040 --> 01:19:16,360
Speaker 1: So if we're gonna give you money, you gotta use

1028
01:19:16,400 --> 01:19:19,360
Speaker 1: it for good food. Part of me thinks this is

1029
01:19:19,600 --> 01:19:28,440
Speaker 1: silly because money is fungible. It's fungible. That's the problem

1030
01:19:28,479 --> 01:19:31,840
Speaker 1: with money is that you can use it for this,

1031
01:19:31,920 --> 01:19:33,880
Speaker 1: and if someone says you can't use it for that,

1032
01:19:34,520 --> 01:19:37,360
Speaker 1: well then you can use other money for it. It

1033
01:19:37,479 --> 01:19:42,639
Speaker 1: all goes into the same basket. So let me throw

1034
01:19:42,680 --> 01:19:47,519
Speaker 1: out this argument. Tell me if it makes any any

1035
01:19:47,560 --> 01:19:52,280
Speaker 1: sort of sense to you. The beautiful thing about food

1036
01:19:52,280 --> 01:19:59,360
Speaker 1: stamps is the same thing about educational fouchers. When we

1037
01:19:59,439 --> 01:20:03,040
Speaker 1: say here is a voucher to go to a private

1038
01:20:03,160 --> 01:20:07,599
Speaker 1: or public school of your choice, what are we doing.

1039
01:20:08,439 --> 01:20:12,200
Speaker 1: We're saying you, the parents, go make a decision for

1040
01:20:12,280 --> 01:20:15,599
Speaker 1: your kids. You know what's best for your kids, and

1041
01:20:15,640 --> 01:20:18,960
Speaker 1: you might get it wrong because the usual response to

1042
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:24,720
Speaker 1: educational choices, well, what if they choose something awful? What

1043
01:20:24,800 --> 01:20:30,160
Speaker 1: if they choose the Hitler school instead of the Gandhi school,

1044
01:20:32,400 --> 01:20:35,800
Speaker 1: to which I end up saying, yeah, that is a

1045
01:20:35,880 --> 01:20:42,559
Speaker 1: distinct possibility. Maybe with real school choice, parents will choose

1046
01:20:42,760 --> 01:20:48,920
Speaker 1: a school that most people will find repugnant or at

1047
01:20:48,960 --> 01:20:55,040
Speaker 1: the very least not within norms. But isn't that the

1048
01:20:55,080 --> 01:20:59,160
Speaker 1: idea of educational choice. Isn't that the idea of tolerance.

1049
01:21:00,080 --> 01:21:05,000
Speaker 1: Isn't that thing? Here, here's the money, go to the

1050
01:21:05,040 --> 01:21:09,360
Speaker 1: school of your choice, even if people don't think it's

1051
01:21:09,400 --> 01:21:13,479
Speaker 1: the right choice for your kid. As the parent, you

1052
01:21:13,840 --> 01:21:18,439
Speaker 1: get to make that decision. I've always thought that's the

1053
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:24,280
Speaker 1: way educational choice should be. But what happens if you

1054
01:21:24,360 --> 01:21:26,599
Speaker 1: choose something wrong. That's one of the reasons I've always

1055
01:21:26,680 --> 01:21:30,880
Speaker 1: liked the concept of food stamps. Food stamps never came

1056
01:21:30,920 --> 01:21:33,320
Speaker 1: out of the Welfare department. Food stamps came out of

1057
01:21:33,360 --> 01:21:36,640
Speaker 1: the Department of Agriculture. They had excess food. They were

1058
01:21:36,720 --> 01:21:39,160
Speaker 1: hungry people, and so they didn't want to get into

1059
01:21:39,160 --> 01:21:42,479
Speaker 1: the idea of distributing this food, and they said, here,

1060
01:21:42,840 --> 01:21:45,880
Speaker 1: for poor people, here's money. Go buy the food you want,

1061
01:21:46,360 --> 01:21:50,640
Speaker 1: which means you want to buy art instead of squash.

1062
01:21:50,840 --> 01:21:57,320
Speaker 1: I guess that's your thought. I don't like the idea

1063
01:21:57,360 --> 01:22:00,640
Speaker 1: of saying you cannot put your snap money into or

1064
01:22:00,640 --> 01:22:03,679
Speaker 1: whatever else. Yes it's a bad decision, Yes you shouldn't

1065
01:22:03,680 --> 01:22:11,040
Speaker 1: do it, But we should be promoting responsibility, and responsibility

1066
01:22:11,120 --> 01:22:16,439
Speaker 1: means the freedom to use your money the way you want.

1067
01:22:17,000 --> 01:22:19,320
Speaker 1: And if we're going to give you money, whose money

1068
01:22:19,360 --> 01:22:23,120
Speaker 1: is it? Then help me with this one. Should Colorado

1069
01:22:23,479 --> 01:22:27,200
Speaker 1: fall suit? Should we fall into line and say, if

1070
01:22:27,240 --> 01:22:30,040
Speaker 1: you get foodstamps, if you get stamp, scuse me stap,

1071
01:22:30,800 --> 01:22:35,320
Speaker 1: no soda, no candy bars, just meat, vegetables and potatoes

1072
01:22:35,360 --> 01:22:38,559
Speaker 1: for you. Three or three seven, one, three, eight five

1073
01:22:38,560 --> 01:22:41,320
Speaker 1: eighty five seven one, three eighty five eighty five. I'm

1074
01:22:41,400 --> 01:22:43,840
Speaker 1: John kelderk keep it right here. You're on Kawa News

1075
01:22:43,880 --> 01:22:49,080
Speaker 1: Talk sport in for Michael Brown. Hey, I was part

1076
01:22:49,120 --> 01:22:53,280
Speaker 1: of a little how to put a community service? Was

1077
01:22:53,360 --> 01:22:57,200
Speaker 1: that the way you would say it? So, so the

1078
01:22:57,560 --> 01:23:01,280
Speaker 1: minority leader in the House, rosebul Gleasy calls me up

1079
01:23:01,320 --> 01:23:04,320
Speaker 1: and she says, will you be on this committee for me?

1080
01:23:04,560 --> 01:23:08,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, no, I don't want it. Please for me. No,

1081
01:23:08,760 --> 01:23:14,200
Speaker 1: it's a it's a committee to decide what legislators should

1082
01:23:14,240 --> 01:23:19,919
Speaker 1: get paid in the future and what the state officials

1083
01:23:19,960 --> 01:23:25,280
Speaker 1: should be paid, governors, treasurer, et cetera. No, I don't

1084
01:23:25,320 --> 01:23:29,240
Speaker 1: want to do that. And then she said, John, I

1085
01:23:29,360 --> 01:23:32,439
Speaker 1: really need you to be on this. Do it for me,

1086
01:23:33,479 --> 01:23:37,519
Speaker 1: and I love Rose Polici's great lady, and so I say,

1087
01:23:38,200 --> 01:23:42,439
Speaker 1: for you, I will do it. And then like a

1088
01:23:42,479 --> 01:23:46,600
Speaker 1: month later she resigns and I'm still on this ridiculous committee.

1089
01:23:46,760 --> 01:23:49,200
Speaker 1: I go on this committee and I find what my

1090
01:23:49,400 --> 01:23:52,640
Speaker 1: friend and colleague Joshua Sharf is on the same committee

1091
01:23:52,960 --> 01:23:59,720
Speaker 1: to recommend pay raises for legislators. And as it turns out,

1092
01:24:00,080 --> 01:24:03,799
Speaker 1: he and I were, how to put it, the voice

1093
01:24:03,920 --> 01:24:08,080
Speaker 1: of the loyal opposition compared to everyone else. So I

1094
01:24:08,080 --> 01:24:11,080
Speaker 1: thought I'd bring josh on to to talk about the experience.

1095
01:24:11,120 --> 01:24:13,120
Speaker 1: It was kind of an interesting thing. Josh thanks for

1096
01:24:13,160 --> 01:24:15,599
Speaker 1: doing this, actually being on the radio. And how did

1097
01:24:15,600 --> 01:24:18,200
Speaker 1: you get conned into being on that committee?

1098
01:24:19,240 --> 01:24:21,400
Speaker 4: Pretty much suid the same means, although not Rose. It

1099
01:24:21,439 --> 01:24:24,160
Speaker 4: was over in the over on the Senate side, and

1100
01:24:24,240 --> 01:24:27,400
Speaker 4: so yeah, it was pretty much over on the Senate side.

1101
01:24:27,400 --> 01:24:28,880
Speaker 4: And then had to had to say and a matter

1102
01:24:28,880 --> 01:24:31,120
Speaker 4: of fact, I was shocked that you were. It was

1103
01:24:31,160 --> 01:24:33,880
Speaker 4: almost enough to get me to resign that I was

1104
01:24:33,920 --> 01:24:34,280
Speaker 4: on it.

1105
01:24:35,760 --> 01:24:36,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, when I.

1106
01:24:36,240 --> 01:24:40,120
Speaker 1: Thought that you were on it obviously, all right, So

1107
01:24:40,400 --> 01:24:45,879
Speaker 1: from from from the outside in, you know, legislators get paid.

1108
01:24:46,320 --> 01:24:49,160
Speaker 1: That's a good thing. Our governor and our a g

1109
01:24:49,720 --> 01:24:54,559
Speaker 1: and our treasurer. Uh. They all get paid. That's that's

1110
01:24:54,720 --> 01:24:58,840
Speaker 1: that's good too, I suppose. But the question is what

1111
01:24:58,920 --> 01:25:05,439
Speaker 1: should they get paid? And my sense is not very much,

1112
01:25:05,840 --> 01:25:09,880
Speaker 1: because it is a one hundred and twenty day job

1113
01:25:10,560 --> 01:25:14,759
Speaker 1: that people take out of their lives, and I worry

1114
01:25:15,080 --> 01:25:18,120
Speaker 1: that if they get paid too much, they worry more

1115
01:25:18,200 --> 01:25:22,439
Speaker 1: about their job as a legislator than their job in

1116
01:25:22,479 --> 01:25:28,000
Speaker 1: real life. And once you become a full time legislator

1117
01:25:28,160 --> 01:25:34,240
Speaker 1: or congressman, your view of the world just warps. What

1118
01:25:34,320 --> 01:25:37,120
Speaker 1: was your feeling on this going in as the guys

1119
01:25:37,120 --> 01:25:40,840
Speaker 1: who needed to make a recommendation on what politicians should

1120
01:25:40,880 --> 01:25:42,719
Speaker 1: be paid? Where did you come from?

1121
01:25:42,920 --> 01:25:43,120
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1122
01:25:43,160 --> 01:25:47,200
Speaker 4: So there, Yeah, So there had been an independent commission

1123
01:25:47,280 --> 01:25:49,200
Speaker 4: back in the eighties to deal with this, with the

1124
01:25:49,280 --> 01:25:52,160
Speaker 4: similar to deal with this problem as well of how

1125
01:25:52,240 --> 01:25:54,800
Speaker 4: do we pay legislators? And so my reaction was to

1126
01:25:54,840 --> 01:25:58,559
Speaker 4: go back and see how they dealt with it and see,

1127
01:25:58,760 --> 01:26:01,320
Speaker 4: you know, if there could be any analogies between the

1128
01:26:01,360 --> 01:26:03,800
Speaker 4: way they approached it the way we approached it. One

1129
01:26:03,840 --> 01:26:05,439
Speaker 4: of the things that they did was they looked at

1130
01:26:05,439 --> 01:26:08,439
Speaker 4: what they considered to be comparable states. Now I took

1131
01:26:08,760 --> 01:26:11,040
Speaker 4: a different approach than they did to what I considered

1132
01:26:11,080 --> 01:26:14,320
Speaker 4: to be comparable. And ultimately the committee sort of sort

1133
01:26:14,320 --> 01:26:17,439
Speaker 4: of went along with with what my suggestion was, which

1134
01:26:17,479 --> 01:26:22,040
Speaker 4: is that we take fifteen states whose length of legislative

1135
01:26:22,080 --> 01:26:25,600
Speaker 4: session is similar to Colorado, so maybe we have a

1136
01:26:25,600 --> 01:26:28,240
Speaker 4: four month session, so maybe it goes up to a

1137
01:26:28,280 --> 01:26:30,200
Speaker 4: five month session and as far down as a three

1138
01:26:30,200 --> 01:26:32,320
Speaker 4: month session, and that sort of keeps it in the ballpark.

1139
01:26:32,760 --> 01:26:35,360
Speaker 4: It keeps it as a part time job, a part

1140
01:26:35,360 --> 01:26:40,320
Speaker 4: time legislative legislative responsibility, as opposed to say California, where

1141
01:26:40,360 --> 01:26:44,200
Speaker 4: they're in session all the time, or Texas where they

1142
01:26:44,240 --> 01:26:46,679
Speaker 4: meet for I don't know, something like ninety days every

1143
01:26:46,680 --> 01:26:47,240
Speaker 4: other year.

1144
01:26:47,320 --> 01:26:50,160
Speaker 1: Which is which, which is which is beautiful the way

1145
01:26:50,160 --> 01:26:50,880
Speaker 1: it should be.

1146
01:26:51,200 --> 01:26:54,680
Speaker 4: It is, but it's not comparable to what we do.

1147
01:26:54,720 --> 01:26:59,080
Speaker 4: And unfortunately, the Commission didn't have the ability to really

1148
01:26:59,120 --> 01:27:04,360
Speaker 4: recommend that we go to something something, something magnificent like that.

1149
01:27:05,920 --> 01:27:09,600
Speaker 4: So I thought that was the place to start. And

1150
01:27:09,640 --> 01:27:12,519
Speaker 4: then it turns out that there are some states like

1151
01:27:12,680 --> 01:27:16,160
Speaker 4: Alaska and Hawaii which even though they're part time sessions,

1152
01:27:16,160 --> 01:27:19,080
Speaker 4: they treat it like a full time job, so for instance,

1153
01:27:19,080 --> 01:27:21,880
Speaker 4: in terms of pay, So for instance, they pay their

1154
01:27:22,000 --> 01:27:28,040
Speaker 4: legislators well above the median salary for the state, even

1155
01:27:28,120 --> 01:27:32,120
Speaker 4: though the salary, even though it's a part time a

1156
01:27:32,160 --> 01:27:34,960
Speaker 4: part time session. And then there are other states. There

1157
01:27:34,960 --> 01:27:40,360
Speaker 4: are four other states which essentially treat it as the

1158
01:27:40,439 --> 01:27:44,880
Speaker 4: salary as a compensation maybe for some potential lost income

1159
01:27:44,960 --> 01:27:47,720
Speaker 4: and some expenses and so forth. So they'll pay like

1160
01:27:47,760 --> 01:27:50,040
Speaker 4: two thousand a year or four thousand, maybe ten thousand

1161
01:27:50,040 --> 01:27:53,679
Speaker 4: a year, And so those are different approaches as well.

1162
01:27:54,120 --> 01:27:56,919
Speaker 4: And then the other states sort of give some salary

1163
01:27:56,960 --> 01:28:00,920
Speaker 4: that is commensurate with a part time, part time position.

1164
01:28:01,520 --> 01:28:04,080
Speaker 4: And I was kind of hoping that we would we

1165
01:28:04,080 --> 01:28:06,040
Speaker 4: would sit there somewhere in the middle, which is what

1166
01:28:06,080 --> 01:28:09,040
Speaker 4: we have. We would see that we had we were

1167
01:28:09,080 --> 01:28:12,479
Speaker 4: paying more on a per day basis and than these

1168
01:28:12,479 --> 01:28:15,280
Speaker 4: other states were and maybe not do anything with it.

1169
01:28:16,160 --> 01:28:17,599
Speaker 1: But what what do they get paid?

1170
01:28:17,600 --> 01:28:17,760
Speaker 4: Now?

1171
01:28:17,800 --> 01:28:21,639
Speaker 1: What does a state legislator get paid in Colorado? Gosh,

1172
01:28:21,680 --> 01:28:22,559
Speaker 1: I think it's something.

1173
01:28:22,360 --> 01:28:23,519
Speaker 4: I want to I want I don't.

1174
01:28:23,640 --> 01:28:25,759
Speaker 1: I don't know, something like I want.

1175
01:28:25,520 --> 01:28:29,599
Speaker 4: To say something like forty forty some thousand. I want

1176
01:28:29,640 --> 01:28:31,679
Speaker 4: to say it's around forty five thousand a year, plus

1177
01:28:31,760 --> 01:28:32,599
Speaker 4: or minus a little bit.

1178
01:28:33,120 --> 01:28:35,080
Speaker 1: And when you think about that they get. They get

1179
01:28:35,120 --> 01:28:38,640
Speaker 1: paid that forty forty five thousand. I forget exactly what

1180
01:28:38,640 --> 01:28:41,000
Speaker 1: it is too. And they also get a per diem

1181
01:28:41,439 --> 01:28:43,599
Speaker 1: which means, you know, money to get to and from.

1182
01:28:43,680 --> 01:28:47,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, they get a per diem of and that varies

1183
01:28:47,920 --> 01:28:51,439
Speaker 4: by the way. Denver area legislators get a smaller predium

1184
01:28:51,479 --> 01:28:53,400
Speaker 4: because of course they can drive home every night. They

1185
01:28:53,400 --> 01:28:55,760
Speaker 4: don't have to pay for a hotel room. The ones

1186
01:28:55,760 --> 01:28:59,920
Speaker 4: who are from say Durango or farther south, you know,

1187
01:29:00,439 --> 01:29:03,320
Speaker 4: or even develop or where they really would have to

1188
01:29:03,320 --> 01:29:06,240
Speaker 4: stay overnight, they get a They get a larger pretty

1189
01:29:06,400 --> 01:29:08,200
Speaker 4: because they have to they have to deal with lodging.

1190
01:29:08,600 --> 01:29:13,040
Speaker 4: And they also get some compensation for out of session

1191
01:29:13,160 --> 01:29:14,320
Speaker 4: days as.

1192
01:29:14,200 --> 01:29:16,679
Speaker 1: Well, when they have to come in for a Kennedy here.

1193
01:29:16,760 --> 01:29:20,439
Speaker 4: Or something, yeah, something any any day where they're doing

1194
01:29:20,520 --> 01:29:23,000
Speaker 4: where they're doing legislative work. And they also get a

1195
01:29:23,080 --> 01:29:23,920
Speaker 4: mileage expense.

1196
01:29:24,400 --> 01:29:28,240
Speaker 1: But they also get to participate. They get to participate

1197
01:29:28,280 --> 01:29:32,080
Speaker 1: in para, which means if you do eight years in

1198
01:29:32,120 --> 01:29:35,320
Speaker 1: the House and eight years in the Senate, uh, and

1199
01:29:35,400 --> 01:29:39,559
Speaker 1: then you get a government job anywhere for three more years,

1200
01:29:40,400 --> 01:29:44,559
Speaker 1: your retirement is based on your last couple of years.

1201
01:29:45,080 --> 01:29:49,200
Speaker 1: So you can get you can get a retirement that

1202
01:29:49,400 --> 01:29:53,600
Speaker 1: is so much more than you ever made in office.

1203
01:29:53,760 --> 01:29:55,920
Speaker 1: So there's there's a lot of ways to work the

1204
01:29:55,960 --> 01:29:58,080
Speaker 1: system to do pretty darn well if you're if you're

1205
01:29:58,120 --> 01:29:59,439
Speaker 1: a politician.

1206
01:30:00,200 --> 01:30:02,479
Speaker 4: Yeah, there is that potential as well, although I'm not

1207
01:30:02,520 --> 01:30:05,639
Speaker 4: sure how many are able to are able to swing

1208
01:30:05,800 --> 01:30:09,120
Speaker 4: that particular arrangement, but yeah, that's that's certainly a possibility.

1209
01:30:09,400 --> 01:30:13,360
Speaker 4: And if someone ends up as a essentially a career politician,

1210
01:30:13,920 --> 01:30:18,080
Speaker 4: then that's something that I mean, we saw that that

1211
01:30:18,240 --> 01:30:24,040
Speaker 4: was in part how Governor Ritter was him compensated by

1212
01:30:24,479 --> 01:30:28,960
Speaker 4: Governor Hickenlooper for you know, for after after he left

1213
01:30:29,000 --> 01:30:31,320
Speaker 4: and he land a nice little.

1214
01:30:31,520 --> 01:30:36,040
Speaker 1: He landed an immense job up at CSU. Yeah, getting

1215
01:30:36,080 --> 01:30:40,120
Speaker 1: a three hundred thousand dollars year job and right, and

1216
01:30:40,120 --> 01:30:41,519
Speaker 1: then was able to retire on that.

1217
01:30:43,280 --> 01:30:45,760
Speaker 4: Yeah, So you know, that's that's that's an option. Is

1218
01:30:45,880 --> 01:30:49,320
Speaker 4: that ends up happening as well sometimes. So this is

1219
01:30:49,400 --> 01:30:54,040
Speaker 4: not it's not like they get forty seven year, forty

1220
01:30:54,040 --> 01:30:58,120
Speaker 4: five thousand a year and then that's it. They get

1221
01:30:58,120 --> 01:31:01,240
Speaker 4: forty five thousand a year plus compensate for expenses that

1222
01:31:01,280 --> 01:31:03,920
Speaker 4: they might incur. So this is not this is not

1223
01:31:04,479 --> 01:31:07,000
Speaker 4: I certainly didn't walk into this thinking that they were

1224
01:31:07,040 --> 01:31:10,080
Speaker 4: being you know, that they were being low balled or

1225
01:31:10,160 --> 01:31:13,120
Speaker 4: unfairly treated by the taxpayers.

1226
01:31:14,479 --> 01:31:18,639
Speaker 1: You had an interesting thought during it, which was, wait

1227
01:31:18,680 --> 01:31:24,280
Speaker 1: a second, politicians are pretty disconnected from the damage or

1228
01:31:24,479 --> 01:31:28,599
Speaker 1: good that they do to the economy. Maybe we should

1229
01:31:28,960 --> 01:31:33,240
Speaker 1: we should tie it somehow to to how Colorado is doing.

1230
01:31:34,479 --> 01:31:40,920
Speaker 1: That idea was was roundly, roundly rejected. I thought it

1231
01:31:41,360 --> 01:31:44,599
Speaker 1: had some merit, which is, you know, what you do

1232
01:31:44,920 --> 01:31:50,880
Speaker 1: in office either helps or hurts Colorado's economy, and you

1233
01:31:50,920 --> 01:31:54,519
Speaker 1: should be we should tie it to performance somehow. How

1234
01:31:54,520 --> 01:31:59,920
Speaker 1: do you tie performance? How do you tie performance at

1235
01:32:00,840 --> 01:32:01,680
Speaker 1: for a politician?

1236
01:32:03,320 --> 01:32:05,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's that's a difficult question. And I don't think

1237
01:32:05,680 --> 01:32:08,240
Speaker 4: I really ever got around to working out the details.

1238
01:32:08,600 --> 01:32:11,519
Speaker 4: But what I what did bother me? And unfortunately this

1239
01:32:11,680 --> 01:32:15,839
Speaker 4: is something that the Commission did not have direct control

1240
01:32:15,880 --> 01:32:19,120
Speaker 4: over the law that created the commission, the law that

1241
01:32:19,160 --> 01:32:24,040
Speaker 4: created this quadrennial commission. So it will meet again, different composition,

1242
01:32:24,160 --> 01:32:27,000
Speaker 4: different members. Presumably hopefully it's you.

1243
01:32:26,960 --> 01:32:29,439
Speaker 1: And me again, because I'm not doing it again.

1244
01:32:30,479 --> 01:32:32,439
Speaker 4: No good Lord, but the h.

1245
01:32:34,760 --> 01:32:35,400
Speaker 1: But but.

1246
01:32:37,240 --> 01:32:43,320
Speaker 4: It'll it didn't the law that created a commission already

1247
01:32:43,880 --> 01:32:48,240
Speaker 4: adjusts on an annual basis for Denver's cost of living.

1248
01:32:48,280 --> 01:32:52,040
Speaker 4: For Denver's cost of living, already adjust the salaries and

1249
01:32:52,040 --> 01:32:54,880
Speaker 4: and for for that. Now it doesn't adjust their for

1250
01:32:55,040 --> 01:32:57,519
Speaker 4: deems for that, but it does adjust the salary by

1251
01:32:57,560 --> 01:32:57,920
Speaker 4: the way.

1252
01:32:57,800 --> 01:33:01,200
Speaker 1: I think is wrong because law of Colorado and the

1253
01:33:01,200 --> 01:33:05,599
Speaker 1: Denver area's inflation, which is higher than most any other state,

1254
01:33:06,120 --> 01:33:09,000
Speaker 1: any other area, is because of the bad policies in

1255
01:33:09,040 --> 01:33:11,920
Speaker 1: Colorado makes prices go up, and then they get an

1256
01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:15,200
Speaker 1: automatic pay raise based on their own mouthfeasons.

1257
01:33:16,560 --> 01:33:18,559
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, my feeling was that they shouldn't be

1258
01:33:18,640 --> 01:33:22,440
Speaker 4: exactly that they shouldn't be indemnified against the bad consequences

1259
01:33:22,439 --> 01:33:25,120
Speaker 4: of their own decisions. That the Commission didn't seem to

1260
01:33:25,160 --> 01:33:27,080
Speaker 4: agree with that. My feeling was that if you're going

1261
01:33:27,160 --> 01:33:30,360
Speaker 4: to do this, first of all, don't tie it to

1262
01:33:31,200 --> 01:33:34,439
Speaker 4: Denver cost of living. If you're going to tie it

1263
01:33:34,439 --> 01:33:36,040
Speaker 4: to a cost of living, okay, fine, you want to

1264
01:33:36,040 --> 01:33:39,040
Speaker 4: tie it to things that are beyond their control. So

1265
01:33:39,080 --> 01:33:42,200
Speaker 4: if you absolutely have to do that, then tie it

1266
01:33:42,240 --> 01:33:45,599
Speaker 4: to the national inflation rate, which really is a function

1267
01:33:45,640 --> 01:33:47,919
Speaker 4: of how much extra money that the FED is printing,

1268
01:33:48,160 --> 01:33:51,560
Speaker 4: which is something they don't control. But when you have legislators,

1269
01:33:51,600 --> 01:33:56,759
Speaker 4: I mean, and here's an example, an any credible candidate

1270
01:33:56,840 --> 01:34:01,360
Speaker 4: for governor, including Bennett, at this point, is running ads

1271
01:34:01,439 --> 01:34:05,800
Speaker 4: talking about affordability. Well, if you're going to run on affordability,

1272
01:34:06,280 --> 01:34:09,240
Speaker 4: that's going to imply that your job has something to

1273
01:34:09,320 --> 01:34:13,240
Speaker 4: do with making Colorado more or less affordable. If the

1274
01:34:13,320 --> 01:34:15,720
Speaker 4: job has something to do with making Colorda more or

1275
01:34:15,800 --> 01:34:19,640
Speaker 4: less affordable, you shouldn't be insulated from your failure to

1276
01:34:19,680 --> 01:34:24,120
Speaker 4: make it more affordable for everybody else. But unfortunately that

1277
01:34:25,560 --> 01:34:27,400
Speaker 4: didn't come through. Now, one thing that we did do,

1278
01:34:27,520 --> 01:34:29,080
Speaker 4: the increase in salary.

1279
01:34:28,720 --> 01:34:30,960
Speaker 1: That we voted, I think we voted.

1280
01:34:30,720 --> 01:34:34,200
Speaker 4: It up to another fifty something. It turns out that

1281
01:34:34,200 --> 01:34:40,120
Speaker 4: that's really not beyond a reasonable expectation of inflation that

1282
01:34:40,160 --> 01:34:42,679
Speaker 4: would have been adjusted for that anyway. So I really

1283
01:34:42,760 --> 01:34:45,320
Speaker 4: didn't give it that much more. In terms of the legislators,

1284
01:34:45,560 --> 01:34:47,360
Speaker 4: and in terms of one of the one of the

1285
01:34:47,360 --> 01:34:50,680
Speaker 4: elected offices, which is Lieutenant governor, the salary that we

1286
01:34:50,800 --> 01:34:56,280
Speaker 4: voted for that came in less than what we would

1287
01:34:56,280 --> 01:34:59,120
Speaker 4: expect inflation to be. So that position that actually turned

1288
01:34:59,120 --> 01:35:01,400
Speaker 4: out we may have although I don't know anyone on

1289
01:35:01,439 --> 01:35:04,040
Speaker 4: the commission other than you and me realized that at

1290
01:35:04,080 --> 01:35:06,160
Speaker 4: the time, But that turned out to be less than

1291
01:35:06,320 --> 01:35:09,599
Speaker 4: than a than a three percent, say, inflation rate between

1292
01:35:09,600 --> 01:35:12,960
Speaker 4: now and then. So I think we obviously I voted

1293
01:35:12,960 --> 01:35:18,240
Speaker 4: against all the pain increases, as did you, but it Uh.

1294
01:35:18,520 --> 01:35:23,080
Speaker 4: But I think founding home, uh, some of some of

1295
01:35:23,080 --> 01:35:25,160
Speaker 4: what we did, some of the approach that we took,

1296
01:35:25,520 --> 01:35:28,280
Speaker 4: had to at least had the benefit of limiting the damage.

1297
01:35:28,000 --> 01:35:30,400
Speaker 1: That it was done right. And and by the way,

1298
01:35:31,720 --> 01:35:34,280
Speaker 1: you and I did not have the power to do

1299
01:35:34,320 --> 01:35:37,000
Speaker 1: anything other than recommend and this commission that was put

1300
01:35:37,040 --> 01:35:43,519
Speaker 1: together by by law that we were volunteered for. Uh,

1301
01:35:43,920 --> 01:35:49,080
Speaker 1: actually further term volunteered, we were volunteerld to be on

1302
01:35:50,680 --> 01:35:54,360
Speaker 1: was Uh. The legislature can do whatever they want. They

1303
01:35:54,400 --> 01:35:56,920
Speaker 1: can take the recommendations, they can do something completely.

1304
01:35:56,600 --> 01:36:01,360
Speaker 7: Different they yes, and no, these recommendations that we make

1305
01:36:01,520 --> 01:36:06,400
Speaker 7: do become law, do become law unless the legislative legislature

1306
01:36:06,439 --> 01:36:07,600
Speaker 7: votes differently.

1307
01:36:07,760 --> 01:36:10,160
Speaker 4: So they would actually have to and and and the

1308
01:36:10,240 --> 01:36:12,880
Speaker 4: whole point of creating the commission in the first place

1309
01:36:13,520 --> 01:36:18,960
Speaker 4: was to provide some level of insulation forward the legislature

1310
01:36:19,040 --> 01:36:22,680
Speaker 4: from having to vote for its own pay increases. And

1311
01:36:22,760 --> 01:36:25,280
Speaker 4: that that was what prompted the commission back in the eighties.

1312
01:36:25,320 --> 01:36:27,920
Speaker 4: And if you look at the introduction to to the

1313
01:36:28,000 --> 01:36:30,599
Speaker 4: to the to the report that was written back then,

1314
01:36:31,120 --> 01:36:33,519
Speaker 4: it says one of the hardest things for legislator to

1315
01:36:33,560 --> 01:36:36,439
Speaker 4: do in good conscience is to vote itself, you know,

1316
01:36:37,000 --> 01:36:39,280
Speaker 4: it's to vote for himself to have a pay increase.

1317
01:36:39,800 --> 01:36:42,160
Speaker 1: And so that's why they love to put it on

1318
01:36:42,200 --> 01:36:46,200
Speaker 1: an automatic you know, cost of living increase. Then they

1319
01:36:46,240 --> 01:36:49,640
Speaker 1: don't have to be the ones worried about it. It

1320
01:36:49,800 --> 01:36:52,479
Speaker 1: just bumps up automatically. Even in Federal Congress has done that.

1321
01:36:52,560 --> 01:36:54,960
Speaker 1: I think it's really chicken poop to do it that way.

1322
01:36:56,400 --> 01:36:59,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, I no, I agree, and I think that. But regardless,

1323
01:37:00,040 --> 01:37:03,280
Speaker 4: one of the points that we made repeatedly was to

1324
01:37:03,280 --> 01:37:05,960
Speaker 4: to what effect, It's unknown, but one of the one

1325
01:37:05,960 --> 01:37:07,800
Speaker 4: of the points that we made repeatedly is that we

1326
01:37:07,840 --> 01:37:11,600
Speaker 4: don't need to become cover for the legislators to to

1327
01:37:12,000 --> 01:37:14,759
Speaker 4: you know, to not do anything and give them something

1328
01:37:14,760 --> 01:37:16,640
Speaker 4: they want. We don't have an obligation to do that.

1329
01:37:16,680 --> 01:37:19,000
Speaker 4: We don't have an obligation to to make, you know,

1330
01:37:19,080 --> 01:37:22,759
Speaker 4: to make their lives easier by voting them a pay increase.

1331
01:37:22,840 --> 01:37:28,240
Speaker 4: That they are unwilling to accept responsibility for and and ultimately, uh,

1332
01:37:28,560 --> 01:37:32,120
Speaker 4: that's that's what ends up happening here, is that the

1333
01:37:32,160 --> 01:37:35,719
Speaker 4: recommendations that we make in the report that was filed

1334
01:37:36,280 --> 01:37:41,240
Speaker 4: become law unless the legislature votes differently, so they would

1335
01:37:41,280 --> 01:37:43,439
Speaker 4: have to actually somewhere have to actually introduce the bill.

1336
01:37:43,560 --> 01:37:47,360
Speaker 1: So let's let's let's step back by the way. Yeah,

1337
01:37:47,560 --> 01:37:50,719
Speaker 1: Joshua Sharf works with me at Independence Institute, does incredible

1338
01:37:50,760 --> 01:37:54,240
Speaker 1: economic work, works on PAARA and social security type issues,

1339
01:37:54,280 --> 01:37:57,000
Speaker 1: and just thrilled to have them. And so we ended

1340
01:37:57,080 --> 01:37:59,639
Speaker 1: up from two different routes being put on the same

1341
01:38:00,080 --> 01:38:05,679
Speaker 1: uh pay Advisory Commission. If you could, if you could

1342
01:38:05,720 --> 01:38:09,559
Speaker 1: do this from scratch, that's a thought experiment, and you

1343
01:38:09,720 --> 01:38:12,720
Speaker 1: wanted to one. You know, you want good people to

1344
01:38:12,720 --> 01:38:16,720
Speaker 1: be able to run for office. But also you don't

1345
01:38:16,760 --> 01:38:18,920
Speaker 1: want to make it a career. You don't want to

1346
01:38:18,920 --> 01:38:21,120
Speaker 1: do a California does. You don't want to make it

1347
01:38:21,160 --> 01:38:24,400
Speaker 1: so that they're so insulated the the idea of public services.

1348
01:38:24,800 --> 01:38:27,840
Speaker 1: You take some time off of what you do to

1349
01:38:27,880 --> 01:38:31,320
Speaker 1: give back to your community. Uh. And you're a legislator

1350
01:38:31,360 --> 01:38:33,280
Speaker 1: or you're a city councilman, or you're on the rt

1351
01:38:33,400 --> 01:38:35,600
Speaker 1: D board or something like that, and then you go

1352
01:38:35,720 --> 01:38:39,760
Speaker 1: back to your real life. How would you if you

1353
01:38:39,760 --> 01:38:43,000
Speaker 1: could wave the wand Joshua, how would you do it?

1354
01:38:43,120 --> 01:38:45,240
Speaker 1: What do you think would be an appropriate way to

1355
01:38:45,600 --> 01:38:48,160
Speaker 1: pay politicians?

1356
01:38:48,880 --> 01:38:52,240
Speaker 4: And that's uh, that's actually a tougher question than than

1357
01:38:52,600 --> 01:38:54,080
Speaker 4: than than than it appears.

1358
01:38:54,400 --> 01:38:56,519
Speaker 1: Well, first of all, they get a bonus if they

1359
01:38:56,560 --> 01:38:59,200
Speaker 1: get sterilized and can't have children. I would do that.

1360
01:39:00,760 --> 01:39:07,000
Speaker 4: Well that well, there's well that would that might that

1361
01:39:07,080 --> 01:39:08,400
Speaker 4: might save some other things.

1362
01:39:08,439 --> 01:39:09,639
Speaker 1: But I think the.

1363
01:39:11,200 --> 01:39:13,559
Speaker 4: I think you start with the idea that that a

1364
01:39:13,560 --> 01:39:19,240
Speaker 4: per diem is reasonable. Expenses associated with the position are

1365
01:39:19,280 --> 01:39:20,160
Speaker 4: reasonable enough.

1366
01:39:20,760 --> 01:39:21,320
Speaker 3: I think a.

1367
01:39:22,080 --> 01:39:28,200
Speaker 4: Small ish salary that is maybe a little bit above

1368
01:39:28,280 --> 01:39:31,200
Speaker 4: the median for the state, but on a per d

1369
01:39:31,360 --> 01:39:34,519
Speaker 4: but on a daily basis, So you wouldn't say, well,

1370
01:39:34,520 --> 01:39:37,160
Speaker 4: the median salad in Colorado is and again I don't

1371
01:39:37,240 --> 01:39:39,080
Speaker 4: I don't remember the number. But let's say it's sixty

1372
01:39:39,120 --> 01:39:41,400
Speaker 4: thousand dollars a year, So you don't start with that.

1373
01:39:41,840 --> 01:39:43,760
Speaker 4: Say it's sixty thousand dollars a year divided by how

1374
01:39:43,800 --> 01:39:46,360
Speaker 4: many days you work, and then multiply that by how

1375
01:39:46,400 --> 01:39:48,719
Speaker 4: many days you work. As the legislature and say, okay, fine,

1376
01:39:48,760 --> 01:39:51,479
Speaker 4: that's a you know, it's an average to slightly above

1377
01:39:51,520 --> 01:39:54,960
Speaker 4: average job on a daily basis. This is how much.

1378
01:39:55,400 --> 01:39:57,840
Speaker 4: This is how much you would get compensated. For people

1379
01:39:57,840 --> 01:40:00,439
Speaker 4: who are wealthy, who are stepping away from a bit business,

1380
01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:03,800
Speaker 4: this is their decision to take on public service that

1381
01:40:03,840 --> 01:40:06,880
Speaker 4: they think is important. For people who are less wealthy,

1382
01:40:06,960 --> 01:40:09,640
Speaker 4: who are doing this again out of a sense of

1383
01:40:09,640 --> 01:40:13,599
Speaker 4: obligation or a desire to serve that that makes it

1384
01:40:13,680 --> 01:40:18,200
Speaker 4: possible for them to do that without sacrificing, you know,

1385
01:40:18,360 --> 01:40:22,160
Speaker 4: without sacrificing an income that they really need in order

1386
01:40:22,200 --> 01:40:24,240
Speaker 4: to make ends meet. And I think I would sort

1387
01:40:24,240 --> 01:40:25,599
Speaker 4: of start from find.

1388
01:40:25,439 --> 01:40:27,479
Speaker 1: You it wasn't that long ago around me. I just

1389
01:40:29,880 --> 01:40:33,080
Speaker 1: it wasn't that long ago when the wage to be

1390
01:40:33,120 --> 01:40:36,680
Speaker 1: a state legislator was seventeen grand. I mean that that

1391
01:40:36,760 --> 01:40:39,960
Speaker 1: wasn't you know, decades ago. It was you know, fifteen

1392
01:40:40,040 --> 01:40:42,640
Speaker 1: years ago, I think, and then it got bumped up

1393
01:40:42,680 --> 01:40:47,080
Speaker 1: to thirty five and now it's up to you know. No,

1394
01:40:47,200 --> 01:40:48,880
Speaker 1: I don't think they don't tell me I'm wrong in

1395
01:40:48,880 --> 01:40:50,960
Speaker 1: front of my audience. You don't make me look bad.

1396
01:40:53,840 --> 01:41:03,439
Speaker 4: I doesn't think need to do that. No, it was a.

1397
01:41:03,840 --> 01:41:04,679
Speaker 7: I'm pretty sure.

1398
01:41:06,360 --> 01:41:08,840
Speaker 4: When I ran into when I ran where I ran

1399
01:41:08,880 --> 01:41:12,040
Speaker 4: in two thousand and eight, and then in two thy ten,

1400
01:41:12,080 --> 01:41:14,120
Speaker 4: I'm pretty sure it was a thirty thousand dollars salary

1401
01:41:14,160 --> 01:41:14,679
Speaker 4: at that point.

1402
01:41:14,800 --> 01:41:20,280
Speaker 1: So but again, but I remember right in the early

1403
01:41:20,320 --> 01:41:23,000
Speaker 1: two thousands though, I'm pretty sure it was fifteen seventeen

1404
01:41:23,160 --> 01:41:27,200
Speaker 1: five was the was it? And when I remember when

1405
01:41:27,240 --> 01:41:31,360
Speaker 1: Bill Owens became governor, I think governor was eighty six

1406
01:41:31,520 --> 01:41:33,800
Speaker 1: thousand dollars a year or something like that. I'm trying

1407
01:41:33,840 --> 01:41:39,679
Speaker 1: to remember, all right, So putting it, putting it, putting

1408
01:41:39,680 --> 01:41:43,760
Speaker 1: it in a picture? How about this? And this was

1409
01:41:43,760 --> 01:41:47,120
Speaker 1: the point that I tried to make. I look at,

1410
01:41:47,280 --> 01:41:51,479
Speaker 1: is somebody getting paid enough if the position is being filled,

1411
01:41:52,120 --> 01:41:54,280
Speaker 1: you know, if if there are enough people running for

1412
01:41:54,360 --> 01:41:59,000
Speaker 1: the position and we pay nothing, it tells me that

1413
01:41:59,080 --> 01:42:02,559
Speaker 1: the market is well, there's a market. People want to

1414
01:42:02,560 --> 01:42:04,479
Speaker 1: do this. We don't need to pay them anything. And

1415
01:42:04,760 --> 01:42:08,200
Speaker 1: so the evil capitalist in me goes, you know, let's

1416
01:42:08,240 --> 01:42:10,760
Speaker 1: find out. It's the same argument I hear about, well,

1417
01:42:10,960 --> 01:42:15,040
Speaker 1: teachers are so underpaid, they're always underpaid. Then why is

1418
01:42:15,080 --> 01:42:18,640
Speaker 1: it they're still working? Why is it we still have teachers?

1419
01:42:18,960 --> 01:42:21,639
Speaker 1: It must mean that in a market sense. People want

1420
01:42:21,680 --> 01:42:22,439
Speaker 1: to fill that role.

1421
01:42:25,160 --> 01:42:26,680
Speaker 4: I'd be willing to pay them more if they have

1422
01:42:26,800 --> 01:42:31,479
Speaker 4: less powers. You're running, you're running for the I'm not

1423
01:42:31,520 --> 01:42:34,840
Speaker 4: talking about teachers, not about the say the governor or

1424
01:42:34,800 --> 01:42:39,000
Speaker 4: the attean or the attorney general. Well, you know, people

1425
01:42:39,040 --> 01:42:41,840
Speaker 4: are running. We don't pay them much, but they're not

1426
01:42:41,880 --> 01:42:44,000
Speaker 4: really running for the salary any way. They're running in

1427
01:42:44,080 --> 01:42:46,320
Speaker 4: order to be able to do good, or they're running

1428
01:42:46,360 --> 01:42:48,680
Speaker 4: to be able to affect change in the way that

1429
01:42:48,720 --> 01:42:51,519
Speaker 4: government runs, or or or they'll be able to enact

1430
01:42:51,560 --> 01:42:54,040
Speaker 4: policies like it's really about the power of the office.

1431
01:42:54,080 --> 01:42:57,599
Speaker 4: It's really not about the salary. And that's fair. I'd

1432
01:42:57,640 --> 01:42:59,639
Speaker 4: be willing to make that trade. And they well, they're

1433
01:42:59,680 --> 01:43:01,799
Speaker 4: running for the running for the power of the office,

1434
01:43:01,840 --> 01:43:03,400
Speaker 4: so we don't really need to pay them that much.

1435
01:43:03,800 --> 01:43:05,760
Speaker 4: And if they want to get paid more, I'll be

1436
01:43:05,800 --> 01:43:08,440
Speaker 4: happy to reduce the power of the office.

1437
01:43:09,880 --> 01:43:11,960
Speaker 1: All right, And so let's leave it at this. I'm

1438
01:43:12,040 --> 01:43:16,080
Speaker 1: latey to say goodbye, but I would like to make

1439
01:43:16,240 --> 01:43:19,479
Speaker 1: the legislative session go down from one hundred and twenty

1440
01:43:19,560 --> 01:43:22,519
Speaker 1: days to ninety days or something like that, and pay

1441
01:43:22,560 --> 01:43:24,479
Speaker 1: them the same amount of money they get paid more

1442
01:43:24,520 --> 01:43:27,240
Speaker 1: for the hours they work. But the Commission said, no,

1443
01:43:27,280 --> 01:43:29,719
Speaker 1: we don't have the power to do that. Joshua Sharff

1444
01:43:29,720 --> 01:43:32,400
Speaker 1: with Independence Institute, thanks for the look inside the machinery.

1445
01:43:32,439 --> 01:43:35,800
Speaker 1: I gotta run. I'm John Caldera. Check out Independence and

1446
01:43:35,840 --> 01:43:38,760
Speaker 1: so you go to thinkfreedom dot org. That's thinkfreedom dot

1447
01:43:38,840 --> 01:43:41,320
Speaker 1: org and keep it right here. You're on KOA News

1448
01:43:41,360 --> 01:43:42,320
Speaker 1: Talk Sports,