1 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:12,200 Speaker 1: Six, twenty seven hundred WLW Welcome into the RNL Carrier 2 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:15,360 Speaker 1: Sports Talk presented by Kelsey Chevroleham, Lance McAllister Man. I 3 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:17,600 Speaker 1: can't wait to talk with my next guest. He's an 4 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:20,240 Speaker 1: award winning columnist and author who's covered just about everything 5 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 1: there is to cover in the world of sports over 6 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:24,200 Speaker 1: the years. A while back, we talked with him about 7 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: a book he wrote, Red Brick Legacy, wonderful book about 8 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:30,800 Speaker 1: Miami's cradle of Coaches. I'll never forget his story about 9 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 1: calling Walter Alston at home one night. His new book 10 00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 1: is another must read, My Big Red Machine, The Tails, 11 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: Drama and Revelations of a fan term journalist covering Baseball's 12 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:45,440 Speaker 1: greatest team. What a treat to welcome in, Terrence Moore, Terrence. 13 00:00:45,120 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 2: How are you? I? 14 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 3: I'm doing quite well, LANs And there's always great to 15 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 3: talk to you. And even beyond the fact that you 16 00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:55,360 Speaker 3: and I have that self in Indiana connection. 17 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: No doubt, and we have a connection to loving the 18 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 1: Big Red Machine. And this book hits my spot and 19 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:04,440 Speaker 1: you live this kind of trace the timeline for listeners 20 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 1: of growing up with the Big Red Machine and the 21 00:01:06,840 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: path to covering the Big Red Machine. 22 00:01:10,000 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 3: I want to tell you something to last. I'm getting 23 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 3: chilled right now because you know, I'm somewhat biased obviously 24 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:18,759 Speaker 3: because I wrote the book. But whenever I think about 25 00:01:18,760 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 3: the Bigger Red Machine, whenever I think about this book, 26 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:23,640 Speaker 3: whenever I think about what I'm going to tell you, 27 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:28,120 Speaker 3: it's just it's almost an outer body experience. But the 28 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 3: answer question, you know, I grew up itself in Indiana. 29 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 3: My dad was an act supervisor. And I got to 30 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:38,040 Speaker 3: also say this, I'm a very spiritual person. I don't 31 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:41,199 Speaker 3: think there's anything that's by coincidence. So he gets transferred 32 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:44,960 Speaker 3: by dad to Cincinnati in nineteen sixty eight and the 33 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 3: fall sixty eight, and you know, twelve years old, and 34 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 3: from that point quickly became a die hard Rent fan, 35 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 3: and certainly the Bigger machine started coming into play that 36 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 3: next year of sixty nine, the first four year Johnny bench. 37 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:02,840 Speaker 3: But to make a Losstoy sword, we're gonna talk about 38 00:02:02,840 --> 00:02:06,280 Speaker 3: more details. I go from being that diehard Ritch fan 39 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:10,800 Speaker 3: going to crawsley Field River Front Stadium, devouring anything about 40 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:13,639 Speaker 3: in the rids, to going up the school up there 41 00:02:13,680 --> 00:02:16,720 Speaker 3: at the Great Miami, Ohio Miami University of OXVI Ohio, 42 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 3: thirty five miles away, and a week after graduating from Miami, 43 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 3: Ohio and May of nineteen seventy eight, started working full 44 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 3: time for the Siscid Inquirer. I mean, you can't make 45 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:30,320 Speaker 3: this stuff up. And one of my primary beats was 46 00:02:30,400 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 3: covering my childhood heroes. And I won't bury the leading last. 47 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 3: I'm not going to bear the lead. You know what 48 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:40,919 Speaker 3: to to saying you should never meet your heroes. I did, 49 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,520 Speaker 3: and unlike others, it was fantastic. 50 00:02:45,400 --> 00:02:45,880 Speaker 2: Tren Tai. 51 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:48,639 Speaker 1: I got chills when I read your account of it, 52 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:50,960 Speaker 1: and I want to say, this was May fourteen of 53 00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:53,959 Speaker 1: seventy six. You're a sophomore at Miami and you're in 54 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:55,800 Speaker 1: the Reds Club ass for the first time ever and 55 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:57,239 Speaker 1: you meet Pete Rose. 56 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 2: What was that moment? 57 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 3: Like? Well, and let's backtrack, okay, sixty eight. I bought 58 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:08,120 Speaker 3: these posters, two posters from an old place called I 59 00:03:08,160 --> 00:03:10,919 Speaker 3: think it's called field House, those sporting goods in Cincinnati, 60 00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:14,400 Speaker 3: and one was the Pete Rolls one of was the 61 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:16,640 Speaker 3: other one was Hank Aaron and I started these posts 62 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:19,280 Speaker 3: to this day and that perfect condition. But anyway, I 63 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 3: was a die hard Ped Rolls fan. My all time 64 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:26,079 Speaker 3: favorite player. So in May of May fourteenth, nineteen seventy six, 65 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,919 Speaker 3: on a Friday, sophomore Miami, as you pointed out, and 66 00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:32,920 Speaker 3: Joe Nuxhall got me into the clubhouse, and that's another 67 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 3: story that's. 68 00:03:33,440 --> 00:03:33,840 Speaker 2: In the book. 69 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 3: And I'm just overwhelmed because these are my heroes. I'm 70 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 3: saying Tony Friz, I'm saying Johnny Mess, I'm saying Joe Morgan. 71 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 3: But I don't see my guy, Pete Rose. So it's 72 00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 3: about time for me to leave. At least in my mind. 73 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 3: I probably couldn't stay Downre a little bit longer if 74 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 3: I was getting kind of nervous. I'm twenty years old, 75 00:03:51,880 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 3: you know, I shouldn't be here. So I'm trying to 76 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:58,800 Speaker 3: leave and Pete Rose, who does not know me from Adam, 77 00:03:59,160 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 3: walks straight toward me and six out of his hand 78 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 3: with a smile, and he says, my name is Pete Rose. 79 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:09,680 Speaker 3: What's your name? I'm like any more? And he says, 80 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:12,400 Speaker 3: do you work for the cists that inquirer? I said no. 81 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 3: He said, okay, well you work for the Mquire someday, 82 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:18,479 Speaker 3: and I'm like, is he serious? A year after that, 83 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 3: a year after that, I'm an intern at the cists 84 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 3: that Inquirer. This is summer nineteen seventy seven. I'm in 85 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:27,040 Speaker 3: the Red club House and you can't make this stuff up. 86 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:29,480 Speaker 3: Pete Rose seized me. Come up to me. He says, 87 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:32,280 Speaker 3: I'm going, Terry. You work for the Empire. Yet I said, 88 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:35,080 Speaker 3: I'm just an intern, and he said I'm just an intern. 89 00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 3: He says, you worked there full time. Next year after that. 90 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 3: This is unbelievable because May of seventy eight, two years 91 00:04:42,320 --> 00:04:45,040 Speaker 3: after I first met him. And now I'm going to 92 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 3: be proactive. You know, my first week at assist that Inquirer, 93 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 3: I go up to the sports editor, Jim Montgomery. Pete 94 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:53,240 Speaker 3: Rose had just come up with this soft ring called 95 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:55,720 Speaker 3: Pete and as you remember, it was god awful. Let 96 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 3: us another shirt. So after the sports editor, I think 97 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,560 Speaker 3: I story beyond Petere rows in the soft DrAk. He said, sure, 98 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:04,640 Speaker 3: So I go with river Front Stadium. You know what 99 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 3: was heading. So go to river Front Stadium, kop House. 100 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 3: Peter sitting at his locker, phineas back. He looks up 101 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 3: at me without missing a beat. Lass he says, I'm gone, Cherry, 102 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:17,279 Speaker 3: and said, you work for the Inquirer. Right, I'm like, gosh, 103 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:19,880 Speaker 3: I I know this, and I said yes. He said, well, 104 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:21,560 Speaker 3: you're here to talk to me about my soft drink. 105 00:05:21,680 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 3: I'm like yes. And now it went from there for 106 00:05:25,600 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 3: the next decades after that, he's here's my guy. 107 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:29,360 Speaker 2: You pick up. 108 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:32,520 Speaker 1: You picked up so many nuggets for this book along 109 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 1: the way that I'm just fascinated by. To the late 110 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:38,919 Speaker 1: in life, Bob Housem really let you in with background 111 00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:40,919 Speaker 1: on the on the end of the Big Red Machine. 112 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 1: And even Sperky told you about the sense he had 113 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:45,119 Speaker 1: for the end of the Big Red Machine. 114 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 2: After nineteen seventy six. 115 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:49,720 Speaker 3: He did, he did, And I'm sat with Bob Housem 116 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:51,880 Speaker 3: and this is the past example of how this book 117 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:53,480 Speaker 3: was meant to be. And I'll give you this short 118 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 3: version of this. The long version, of course, is in 119 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 3: the book. But Bob Housem and last you probably know 120 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:01,279 Speaker 3: going up as a Dihard Big Red Machine fan. He 121 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:04,040 Speaker 3: was the architect of that machine. But he said nothing. 122 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:06,840 Speaker 3: I mean, he gave nothing of interest to the prey. 123 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 3: He was a like a banker, you know, he was 124 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 3: a poker face and what have you. So it's near 125 00:06:11,040 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 3: the end of his life and I was spelling him 126 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,279 Speaker 3: for another matter that had nothing to do with baseball, 127 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 3: and I tracked him down and you know, no one 128 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 3: had heard from him in years. At this point, He's 129 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:24,159 Speaker 3: like eighty seven or eighty eight. And at the end 130 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:26,600 Speaker 3: of what I put him for, he was very gracious. 131 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:29,040 Speaker 3: I just told him about me being this Darhart big 132 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 3: Red Machine fan, and he kind of remembered me at 133 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:34,359 Speaker 3: the inquire and he just spilled his guts for the 134 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 3: next hour. I was like, oh my god, I kept 135 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,040 Speaker 3: just tell me this stuff from the real story about 136 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 3: Tony Perez, about how he said that was the worst 137 00:06:43,120 --> 00:06:45,640 Speaker 3: decision in his life to let twenty Prayers go after 138 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:48,039 Speaker 3: the nineteen seventy sixth season, and how it just ruined 139 00:06:48,080 --> 00:06:51,240 Speaker 3: them for winning more World Series. The real reason behind 140 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:55,159 Speaker 3: why Pete Rose ended up going from Cincinnati as free agent, 141 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:58,599 Speaker 3: at least why they allowed him to go from Cincinnati 142 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 3: to you know, to the Philadelphia Phillies. That went on 143 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:05,839 Speaker 3: and on and on, and then you listened Sparky, Sparky, 144 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 3: and again, I should say this part for some reason, 145 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:11,480 Speaker 3: and I've buen like this all through my life. People 146 00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 3: have always had a tendency to open up to me 147 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 3: all my life, you know, as a sports genalist, and 148 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:21,160 Speaker 3: Sparky was one of those individuals. And I saw him 149 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 3: with Sparky one day, and this was when he was 150 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 3: with the manager of the Detroit Tigers, and Dick Wagner 151 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:29,240 Speaker 3: had just gotten fired from people who made not know 152 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 3: Dig Wagner became a jailal manager after Bob Howisen and 153 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:36,120 Speaker 3: basically ruined the franchise. But that's a whole other story. 154 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 3: So Dig Wader gets fired in eighty four, Bob Howison 155 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 3: takes over, and so now everybody's asking what would have 156 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:45,120 Speaker 3: happened if the Big Red Machine had been kept together 157 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 3: Pete Rose and King Griffy and Tonys. I talked to 158 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:52,000 Speaker 3: all these guys and they all said what everybody thought, 159 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 3: that they would win like two or three more World 160 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:56,760 Speaker 3: Series besides the back to back once the seventy five 161 00:07:56,800 --> 00:08:00,240 Speaker 3: and seventy six. So I brought the Sparky and I'm thinking, Okay, well, 162 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 3: he's gonna be more the same, and he for me. 163 00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 3: I said, Sparky, how many more World Series would you 164 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 3: guys hasn't won had you not traded twenty Press after 165 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:12,400 Speaker 3: the seventy sixth season and started to break up du 166 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:14,360 Speaker 3: Old Gang, He said, we would have never won another 167 00:08:14,360 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 3: World Series. We will never want anything. And I thought 168 00:08:16,960 --> 00:08:19,400 Speaker 3: he was I thought I was kidding, and he said 169 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:22,840 Speaker 3: that that team had gone as far as it could go. 170 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 3: He said, we were absolutely bored. He says, figure to 171 00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 3: my figuring myself. He said, I was more interested. This 172 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 3: is Sparky talking. I was more interested in football than 173 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 3: I was and trying to win another World championship. And 174 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:37,200 Speaker 3: he went further than that in the book, as you'll see. 175 00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:39,200 Speaker 3: But it's little things like that. 176 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:41,360 Speaker 1: I'm going to try to squeeze in two quick ones 177 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 1: before I run out of time. And I laughed when 178 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: you got tips along the way, including one from a 179 00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 1: groundskeeper at Riverfront in nineteen seventy eight who said, hey, 180 00:08:49,960 --> 00:08:51,840 Speaker 1: you should do a story on King Griffy. 181 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:55,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I'll give you a short birdion on this 182 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 3: for time constraints. But when he told me that, I said, 183 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 3: I'm many stories before King Griffrey. I thot, I saw 184 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:05,319 Speaker 3: abou King Griffrey Senior. So no, no, the sun and 185 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,080 Speaker 3: I said, and I said, I mean it was the sun. 186 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:10,200 Speaker 3: It is like eight years old. He said, oh yeah, 187 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 3: but he's this great not hole League player. And we 188 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:14,439 Speaker 3: know the rest of the story. I ended up doing 189 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:16,120 Speaker 3: the story. I did the first story ever about King 190 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 3: Griffrey Junior and the rest is history. 191 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:20,319 Speaker 2: Oh fantastic. 192 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 1: Oh, there are so many stories that just just made 193 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 1: me smile and think about that team. I know you've 194 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 1: got a book signing coming up around the area. Toe 195 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:30,960 Speaker 1: listeners how they can get the book, how they can 196 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:32,720 Speaker 1: show up at a book signing as well. 197 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 3: Well the book signing I'm having, because I'll have one 198 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 3: in Birmingham, Alabama tomorrow, that one at the universaidor Dame 199 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 3: believe it or not, they happen me for book signing. 200 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:44,200 Speaker 3: But the one in that area that's coming up is 201 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 3: on October the twenty ninth, and that's at the Lane 202 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 3: Library in Hamilton, Ohio. And that's going to be at 203 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 3: let me find out at the time. That's going to 204 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 3: be at from six to seven. But in the meantime, 205 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 3: and I'm telling you last I've been blessed. The pre 206 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 3: sales have been incredible. You can get a book signed 207 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:08,600 Speaker 3: by me, Great Christmas President. I'm just saying at my 208 00:10:09,080 --> 00:10:13,200 Speaker 3: big redmachine dot com and I will personally autograph for you. 209 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 3: And one fust thing I got to say this, Tom 210 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:20,840 Speaker 3: mcfoy Hall of Fame baseball writer and covers Big Red Machine. 211 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:23,439 Speaker 3: He was saying this stuff in this book that he 212 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 3: didn't know about. Marty Brindleman, who did the foward to 213 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 3: the book. Marty Bridman said the same thing. He says, 214 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:32,079 Speaker 3: seventy percent of the stuff that Bob Hogle told me 215 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 3: has never been said before, and he goes on and on. 216 00:10:35,800 --> 00:10:38,319 Speaker 1: It is a wonderful read. It is so cool to 217 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 1: catch up with you again. Congratulations on this book and 218 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:42,600 Speaker 1: best of luck with it. I hope we can talk 219 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:43,440 Speaker 1: again down the road. 220 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:46,320 Speaker 3: Thank you. And I know he's talking to about critical 221 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:49,000 Speaker 3: coaches guys afterwards, and tell them I said, hello, I. 222 00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:50,320 Speaker 2: Will do that. Thanks Terrence.