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Speaker 1: This is Tony Pike's Friday Football Frenzy show, brought to

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Speaker 1: you in part five fellow Windows and door making life

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Speaker 1: writer pelenow Hey. Later Skyline Shilly Feeling Good. It's Skyline time,

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Speaker 1: Encore Technologies, visit OnCore dot Tech, Hubs, Oil Healing champions,

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Speaker 1: on and off the field, Game Day, men's health, Start

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Speaker 1: your best life today, and by the Creation Museum It's

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Speaker 1: more than a muda. Visit Creation Museum dot Org today

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Speaker 1: on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Cincinnati Bengals.

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Speaker 2: Hi, Hello, welcome in our number two of Tony pikes

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Speaker 2: Friday Football Frenzy Here on ESPN fifteen thirty. I Moss today,

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Speaker 2: more No Tone today, Tone back on Monday. He is

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Speaker 2: on Liberty Bowl duty for the Bearcats and the Navy

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Speaker 2: Midshipman later this afternoon in Memphis. But the show goes

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Speaker 2: on here. And we talked to our normal Friday guest,

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Speaker 2: our friend Charlie Goldsmith stopping by. Charlie, Happy New Year,

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Speaker 2: my friend, Thanks for joining us for another year. I

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Speaker 2: suppose Happy New.

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Speaker 3: Year often, and happy New Year to to Tony and

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Speaker 3: the listeners and everybody.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think there's a lot of interesting stuff

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Speaker 2: happening at pay Corpse Stadium. I thought, you're you wrote

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Speaker 2: about both Dalton Reisner and Joseph Osi, and I'm fascinated

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Speaker 2: by Dalton Reisner being so upfront about the idea of like, yes,

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Speaker 2: I want to come and be a Cincinnati I want

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Speaker 2: to come back, like be a Cincinnati Bengal. I want

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Speaker 2: to come back. It's very rare to hear a player

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Speaker 2: talk like that, isn't it.

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Speaker 3: That's exactly what I said to Dalton, Like that's got

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Speaker 3: to feel good to put this out there and to

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Speaker 3: be in a position or your play completely backs this up.

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Speaker 3: And it's funny too, Like I couldn't quite get this

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Speaker 3: across in my story. But when I initially ad asked

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Speaker 3: him about his interest in returning to Cincinnati, he spoke

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Speaker 3: about his love for the Bengals, how he wanted to

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Speaker 3: be back, how much he liked the coaching staff, and

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Speaker 3: then he kind of said.

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Speaker 2: Like the ball is in their court.

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Speaker 3: And so to follow up, I said, I guess you

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Speaker 3: know you're you're eligible to sign an extension right now.

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Speaker 3: You don't need to wait. The Rams just signed an

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Speaker 3: extension with one of their players yesterday. I said, Dalton,

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Speaker 3: have you got to talk yet? And he followed up

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Speaker 3: saying the ball is in their court. So he's put

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Speaker 3: his cards on the table. Now. The big question is

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Speaker 3: a team that only was willing to spend really for

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Speaker 3: Lucas Patrick in free agency last year, has Dalton played

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Speaker 3: his way out of what they would allocate for their

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Speaker 3: guard budget. Boy, that would be a sad reality, but

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Speaker 3: that's possible. And I guess that's the big question I

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Speaker 3: have going forward For a guy who certainly though made

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Speaker 3: a great impression, the team and the coaching staff would

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Speaker 3: love on paper to have him back.

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Speaker 2: Why wouldn't they re sign him other than the allocation

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Speaker 2: for that guard spot?

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Speaker 3: Well, why did they roll into twenty twenty five with

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Speaker 3: genostone that they're unchallenged unquestioned safety. Why didn't they sign

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Speaker 3: a pass rushing defensive tackle. You can see where I'm

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Speaker 3: going with it. So, what they're going to be going

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Speaker 3: to be able to do this offseason from an ownership

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Speaker 3: and a front office perspective compared to their inaction last

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Speaker 3: year in a way that you know we all saw

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Speaker 3: coming the massive holes and dangerous flog on the roster.

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Speaker 3: Their ability to rectify that. The story of the off season.

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Speaker 3: But those are questions for Duke and Katie and Troy

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Speaker 3: and the Browns.

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Speaker 2: I know that, you know, the season doesn't really have

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Speaker 2: anything clearly nothing to play for, But I do think

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Speaker 2: there's some interesting storylines going into this offseason that do

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Speaker 2: include this game against the Browns. What are you most

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Speaker 2: interested in when the game? As far as the game

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Speaker 2: is concerned, this Sunday against Cleveland absolutely.

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Speaker 3: One thing above all else. Are they playing to really

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Speaker 3: win this and if so, what does that mean? Or

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Speaker 3: you know, will they put Joe Flacko in in the

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Speaker 3: third quarter and you know, rotate some of the young

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Speaker 3: defensive backs through, Like do they do that or do

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Speaker 3: they fully invest in commit to this game? And kind

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Speaker 3: of what that would signify to me was kind of

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Speaker 3: a continuation of the theme of like if they play

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Speaker 3: Burrow the whole way and really run the offense, a

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Speaker 3: continuation of the theme of playing Burrow in the preseason,

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Speaker 3: of making decisions where you're not quote unquote scared or

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Speaker 3: intimidated by the danger in the theory that maybe Burrow

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Speaker 3: could you know, obviously, you know, once that to happen,

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Speaker 3: could get hurt like they have in the past, made

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Speaker 3: a lot of a lot of decisions operating under the

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Speaker 3: fact that, like, you can't live your life scared and

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Speaker 3: playing to really win this game on Sunday would be

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Speaker 3: another one of those that, to me would be an

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Speaker 3: example of you know yet, Burrow's gonna play in the

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Speaker 3: preseason next year. Burrow is not going to change the

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Speaker 3: style of play. They're going to just keep living life

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Speaker 3: and playing football kind of without some of that fear.

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Speaker 2: What did you make of the comments? I think it

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Speaker 2: was last week now I apologize. My days are all

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Speaker 2: running together of Al Golden in the way that he

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Speaker 2: talked about glowingly Geno Stone at the safety position.

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Speaker 3: Here's my hottest take of the offseason. We go. I

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Speaker 3: would it's not really I would love to have Geno

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Speaker 3: Stone back of the third safety, put him exactly in

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Speaker 3: the role that he had in Baltimore, have him be

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Speaker 3: a veteran in the room who helps behind the scenes

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Speaker 3: with some of the communication and some of the football

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Speaker 3: IQ and tendency's stuff. Having him who say what you

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Speaker 3: want about Geno, he can stand in center field and

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Speaker 3: be a post safety because he does have a nice

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Speaker 3: zone awareness, but in positions where he doesn't have to tackle.

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Speaker 3: Having a guy like that in the room lets you

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Speaker 3: really get it down hill thumper. I'm gonna be calling

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Speaker 3: it like a nick In and Worry type, a guy

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Speaker 3: who can be a box safety or a slow and

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Speaker 3: can blitz and can be versatile, and then give you

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Speaker 3: a really nice, dynamic young safety duo with him and

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Speaker 3: Jordan Battle whoever that magical safety ends up being with.

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Speaker 3: Then having Geno available as a backup, I'm gonna call

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Speaker 3: it like the Trent Brown of safety. I like Geno

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Speaker 3: in that role in twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 2: That's interesting. How much of a reality do you think

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Speaker 2: that would be.

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Speaker 3: I mean, you saw what Al said. They know how

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Speaker 3: Genostone played this season, but they like Geno. He's never

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Speaker 3: been a guy who behind the scenes you were hearing

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Speaker 3: negative things about in terms of how he handled this

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Speaker 3: or how he approached this or how he changed during

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Speaker 3: the No it was like a positive behind the scenes

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Speaker 3: season for Geno's stone, and he can put him out

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Speaker 3: there and sposible. He doesn't have to tackle. That's fine

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Speaker 3: by me. I think the Bengals would be fine with that,

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Speaker 3: and I think Geno likes being here as well. And also,

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Speaker 3: it's not like he's about to have all these teams

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Speaker 3: ask whom to be their starting free safety.

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Speaker 2: That's a good point with all that in mind. We

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Speaker 2: never really saw and I know Dejon Anthony was hurt

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Speaker 2: and Tyson Anderson never really saw much of him, never

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Speaker 2: really saw much of PJ. Jewles. Is that just indicative

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Speaker 2: of there's really no faith in those guys behind Gino

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Speaker 2: and Jordan as well, and that could potentially bolster the depth.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I just see those guys as special teamers. Frankly,

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Speaker 3: as how I see those guys what they were viewed

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Speaker 3: as now and how have you them going forward?

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Speaker 2: How much growth do you think the team has seen

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Speaker 2: in Barrett Carter and Demetrius Knight Junior, especially over the

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Speaker 2: last eight or ten weeks.

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Speaker 3: I talked to Mike Hodges, the linebackers coach, on Wednesday,

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Speaker 3: and very fascinating conversation. Like the way he looked at

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Speaker 3: it was and we've all seen the mistackled me clo

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Speaker 3: if it plays aloud, and you don't need me to

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Speaker 3: tell you about that, But talking to Mike gave me

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Speaker 3: some perspective, like I don't know that anyone was in

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Speaker 3: a tougher spot than these rookie linebackers were this season,

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Speaker 3: and I don't know that anyone handled adversity quite as

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Speaker 3: well as these rookie linebackers over the course of the season.

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Speaker 3: Because of that, and yes a few, I feel very

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Speaker 3: good that they're an a role for both of them

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty six. Now here's kind of how I

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Speaker 3: see the plan going. Sign I bet your linebacker, I'm

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Speaker 3: gonna call him the Alex Kappa of linebackers seven to

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Speaker 3: twelve million dollars in free agency. Then you sign what

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Speaker 3: I'm going to call the Cam Sample of linebackers. Give

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Speaker 3: me a guy who can do something Demetrius struggled with

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Speaker 3: this year, which is when you need to set the

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Speaker 3: edge on the line of scrimmage in five man fronts,

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Speaker 3: and also can take on fullbacks because you kind of

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Speaker 3: see some more of those teams now one on one

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Speaker 3: against the run. Give me someone kind of a Cam

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Speaker 3: Sample level player who can do that. But then you know,

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Speaker 3: have some some packages where Barrett and Demetrius each have

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Speaker 3: an opportunity, have some some runway, especially too for if

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Speaker 3: woman them pops. Yeah, you know, either one of them

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Speaker 3: could be a full time starter in twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 3: I'm not giving up on each of them. I want

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Speaker 3: to make sure they each still have that runway. And

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Speaker 3: I think that's how the Bengals view it too.

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Speaker 2: We talk a lot about, like, you know, all these

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Speaker 2: different things that need to be done on defense, whether

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Speaker 2: it's a safety or those linebackers like you mentioned in

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Speaker 2: the edge rushers, and not to get too deep into

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Speaker 2: the like off season bag of questions, but just on

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Speaker 2: the surface, looking ahead, how doable do you think it

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Speaker 2: is in one off season to fix these holes.

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Speaker 3: It's funny because I've said since twenty twenty three, all

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Speaker 3: they need to do is have an off season that

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Speaker 3: was as good as what they did enter in twenty

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Speaker 3: twenty one, and they'll be Backcestiva Bowl. And of course

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Speaker 3: that's just much easier said than done. But there's one

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Speaker 3: more point I want to get across to. Here's how

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Speaker 3: I'm going to view this from a defensive perspective, especially

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Speaker 3: the quickest pass, the most realistic past, and the past

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Speaker 3: that I think honest that that they're gonna end up taking.

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Speaker 3: I think this is going to be the off season

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Speaker 3: of the defensive line. I think they're going to be

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Speaker 3: more aggressive on the defensive line than any other spot.

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Speaker 3: Every time I talk to people in that building, they

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Speaker 3: talk about when we prepare for an opponent. As a player,

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Speaker 3: the first thing you look at is the fronts on

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Speaker 3: an opposing team. The things we're most worried about is

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Speaker 3: their front, is their pass rush. Talking about the challenges

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Speaker 3: and headaches it creates when there's balance and guys who

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Speaker 3: can you know, win from different spots that you know

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Speaker 3: you can't just plug one hole. You have to account

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Speaker 3: for multiple guys across the defensive line. For all of

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Speaker 3: those reasons, there is a lot of beliefs in that

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Speaker 3: building that the easiest kind of have to rebuilding this

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Speaker 3: defense is by being hyper aggressive on the defensive line,

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Speaker 3: And my kind of agreement that they should take that

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Speaker 3: path is why I'm more willing to live with a

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Speaker 3: young safety with Geno Stone still in the room and

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Speaker 3: just one starting better linebacker, because don't want to make

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Speaker 3: sure I'm keeping a lot of that powder dry for

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Speaker 3: the defensive line.

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Speaker 2: Well, one of those guys you wrote about as well

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Speaker 2: was was Joseph's What was your takeaway there? Do you

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Speaker 2: feel like you know there's maybe as much mutual interest

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Speaker 2: in Joseph Osai returning and also, do you think you

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Speaker 2: know that his injury history would play a role in

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Speaker 2: his price?

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Speaker 3: His injury history spooks me, and I know it's something

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Speaker 3: that's that's clearly come up in the building. I mean,

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Speaker 3: just look at even heading into this year, he wasn't

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Speaker 3: a guy they were willing to commit multiple years to. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: both side, and I don't have the numbers. I've shared

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Speaker 3: them on this show. His production really took off when

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Speaker 3: Henderson was hurt because that gave him, for the first

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Speaker 3: time in his life, the chance to rush against the

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Speaker 3: left tackle on third downs. And he says, I'm way

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Speaker 3: better on that side because the other side, my wrist

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Speaker 3: is still bothering me. This risk injury he suffered as

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Speaker 3: a rookie, and that's something that he still lives with,

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Speaker 3: something that he still battles through, and something that still

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Speaker 3: impacts him as a player. So that combined with the

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Speaker 3: fact that he's got a couple other games over the

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Speaker 3: course of his career. But really the long term nature

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Speaker 3: of that risk injury for defensive lineman makes me a

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Speaker 3: little more nervous about Osad. But that's not taking anything

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Speaker 3: away from the fact that I think he's gonna do

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Speaker 3: pretty well. Somewhere maybe in Cincinnati on the Free age.

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Speaker 2: Of market talking to Charlie Goldsmith. You can check him

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Speaker 2: out Charlie's chalkboard on Substack. Also Fox nineteen as well.

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Speaker 2: How how much do you think I know the Steelers?

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Speaker 2: Miles Garrett said last week that it felt like the

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Speaker 2: Steelers were more worried about him than winning the game.

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Speaker 2: Do you feel like the Bengals are more worried about

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Speaker 2: Miles Garrett than winning the game on Sunday? And should

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Speaker 2: they be?

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Speaker 3: Here's how I view it. It would be like saying

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Speaker 3: a defense is more worried about stopping Joe Burrow and

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Speaker 3: Jamar Chase than beating the Bengals. Like you beat the

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Speaker 3: Bengals by stopping Joe Burrow and Lamar Chase.

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Speaker 2: True, you beat because of.

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Speaker 3: How much Males Garrett is worth, even from like a

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Speaker 3: points per game perspective, even though technically he doesn't score.

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Speaker 3: If you can tell me the Bengals are going to

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Speaker 3: they got Miles air from the game, I would sign

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Speaker 3: up for that ten times at attendant old cough and

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Speaker 3: live with whatever other you know ham strung you know

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Speaker 3: ham stringing this the uh that ripple effect that creates

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Speaker 3: I think what it really was last week was an

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Speaker 3: Aaron Rodgers problem and a Steelers passing game problem more

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Speaker 3: than oh, they had some game plan because they're worried

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Speaker 3: about Garrett. So I'm not a believer in that, in

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Speaker 3: that ideology, and I think that that whole conversation really

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Speaker 3: is to blame just the talent level on the Steelers

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Speaker 3: offense more than anything kind of about how they approach

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Speaker 3: the games.

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Speaker 2: Who do you think wins that game Sunday night between

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Speaker 2: Pittsburgh and Baltimore.

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Speaker 3: I hate this Steelers team. Man. They're the one of

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Speaker 3: my least favorite, like quote unquote good teams, and like

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Speaker 3: I still don't quite know what they're good at. They've

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Speaker 3: got a strong front, but TJ. Watson hurt. I think

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Speaker 3: that secondary is extremely gettible. Their linebackers are extremely gettible. Obviously,

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Speaker 3: the DK Metcalf suspension has been massive, taking away any

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Speaker 3: juice their offense has so now. Of course the raven

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Speaker 3: aren't that good either, but I just think the Steelers

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Speaker 3: are a team that probably is, especially what I saw

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Speaker 3: last week, playing some of it's horse football right now,

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Speaker 3: and it's set up to continue playing it's worse football.

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Speaker 2: On Sunday, and I feel like both of those teams

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Speaker 2: are kind of I don't know if saying at a

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Speaker 2: crossroads is the right word, but they're just in some

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Speaker 2: difficult times when it comes to their roster and maybe

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Speaker 2: some uncertainty about their future. And I feel like the

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Speaker 2: Bengals and Browns, honestly from a roster standpoint. From a

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Speaker 2: financial standpoint, the Browns not as much as the Bengals

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Speaker 2: with the money, are in pretty good spots to be

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Speaker 2: good sooner rather than later. Where I feel like there's

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Speaker 2: turnover for Pittsburgh and Baltimore. How do you see like

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Speaker 2: the North going into the offseason outside of just Cincinnati point.

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Speaker 3: With the Bengals, we always talk about losing Jesse Bates

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Speaker 3: and he's the one that got away, like Baltimore may

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Speaker 3: never recover in the same way from losing Mike McDonald,

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Speaker 3: Like losing their defensive coordinator who then went to Seattle

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Speaker 3: was a franchise identity altering loss that they have no

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Speaker 3: avenue to replace, and that sign that's how I view it.

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Speaker 3: I mean, look what he's doing in Seattle. Mike McDonald's

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Speaker 3: is that seam. He is that system, and I think

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Speaker 3: it's the best defensive system in the NFL. And Baltimore,

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Speaker 3: I don't think we'll ever be able to recreate that

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Speaker 3: magic they had on defense which shut down Joe Burrow.

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Speaker 3: Just look at the Sam Hubbers pumble in the Juckle game.

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Speaker 3: I've never seen the offense book as it's duck as

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Speaker 3: it was that night. So that's Baltimore I talked about Pittsburgh.

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Speaker 3: Actually didn't even realize until this week just how bad

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Speaker 3: of a mess Cleveland is. I love their rookie class,

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Speaker 3: but like you know, Travon Williams is their third down

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Speaker 3: back right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and they.

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Speaker 3: Need a whole new offensive line. So like a Bengals

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Speaker 3: win the North in twenty twenty sixth take is probably

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Speaker 3: good value right now.

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Speaker 2: Well, switch gears quickly for a minute or two about

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Speaker 2: the Reds. I feel like it's been all quiet over

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Speaker 2: there for the most part. But Nick Krawl did say

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Speaker 2: that that they have a little bit more money to bed.

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Speaker 2: I was a little bit surprised by that after they

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Speaker 2: made a couple of moves. Do you expect anything else

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Speaker 2: to happen between now and spring training?

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Speaker 3: I mean, just look at Nick Carl's track record. Publicly,

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Speaker 3: I keep track of this stuff when he sat said

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Speaker 3: they have more room to work with, and he says,

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Speaker 3: we're trying to get another thing done. I bet, I

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Speaker 3: bet ninety five percent of the time they get another

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Speaker 3: thing done. Now, I think the best case would literally

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Speaker 3: be Austin Hayes. I don't see a better option out

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Speaker 3: there than Hayes, and I don't have my trade target

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Speaker 3: list memorized right now, but a couple other guys kind

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Speaker 3: of on that level who maybe you could swing a

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Speaker 3: deal for. But I was ready to kind of say

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Speaker 3: right this off season, fields done. But those comments from

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Speaker 3: Nick make me feel like there's one other kind of

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Speaker 3: mid range Hayes level they'd work on. Probably first base

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Speaker 3: slash left field is where that player would would be

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty six. So I'm keeping my eyes and

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Speaker 3: ears open for that move for sure.

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Speaker 2: What do you think about the future of TJ.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, fantastic quest. Let's talk about this for like ten

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Speaker 3: minutes next week, Because assassinating the Red's weakest position in

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Speaker 3: their farm system, it's tied for center field and catcher.

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Speaker 3: Both are terrible. So what's the future the Reds in

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Speaker 3: center field? It's either Noelvie Martek and moves to center

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Speaker 3: full time one day or they and center field is

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Speaker 3: one of the hardest positions to find around the league.

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Speaker 3: So it's or you know, you're in you know the

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Speaker 3: annual you know, let's call it the Cal Farmers center

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Speaker 3: fielders every year once the Freedo era is over. So

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Speaker 3: for those reasons, it kind of needs. Freedele underrated season

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Speaker 3: getting out. I think it was like fifteenth in baseball

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Speaker 3: and obp last year, still a useful player. He has

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Speaker 3: lost some of that dynamic year. Just look at the

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Speaker 3: sprint speed in the defense range. The numbers show that,

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Speaker 3: but Friedel is still one of the better center fielders

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Speaker 3: in the league. So it's not like the red field

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Speaker 3: that they need to address it. And I think most importantly,

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Speaker 3: let me say Nick Crawl confirmed Freedle is their guy

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Speaker 3: with the capitol g in center in twenty twenty.

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Speaker 2: Six, How excited are you to get to Goodyear.

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Speaker 3: I booked my travel two days ago, so you know

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Speaker 3: that's the residents and all that kind of stuff, the

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Speaker 3: car that's all set to go. I love turn training.

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Speaker 2: I'm fired up, awesome, can't wait for that And appreciate

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Speaker 2: yous making some time for me today and I have

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Speaker 2: written it down center field TJ. Friedel for next week.

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Speaker 2: We'll spend ten minutes on it. Sounds good to me, Dear.

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Speaker 2: That's Charlie Goldsmith. He's the best. Charlie's chalkboard on substack.

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Speaker 2: You can also find him alongside Joe Daniman on Fox

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Speaker 2: nineteen and elsewhere along that website and that TV station.

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Speaker 2: You know how it gets, You know how it is.

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Speaker 2: You know Charlie by now, all right? You also know

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Speaker 2: that coming up next just talkbacks. I'm hoping for some

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Speaker 2: Cincinnati sports resolutions, and Lord knows what we're gonna get.

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Speaker 2: On the Friday after New Year's Day and New Year's

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Speaker 2: Eve here on Cincy three sixty, or as it's known today,

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Speaker 2: Tony Pike's Friday Football Frenzy on the Home of the Bengals,

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Speaker 2: ESPN fifteen thirty