1 00:00:01,639 --> 00:00:03,600 Speaker 1: Eight sixteens. Who do you have carcy De Talks Dation. 2 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: Tonight's the night not only you learn about FRAUDA Minnesota, 3 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:10,040 Speaker 1: but you also learn about all the changes that have 4 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: been ongoing lately in insofar as firearms and constitutional carry. 5 00:00:16,360 --> 00:00:19,640 Speaker 1: And my next guest, Bob Jewell, is going to be 6 00:00:19,680 --> 00:00:22,560 Speaker 1: explaining to you empower Youoamerica dot Org being at seven PM. 7 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:25,400 Speaker 1: A lot has changed since Ohio first enacted constitution or 8 00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 1: concealed carry in twenty on two thousand and has it 9 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:28,240 Speaker 1: been that long? 10 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 2: Anyway? 11 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: Bob Jewel knows everything there is no about the law. 12 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:35,560 Speaker 1: Bob a registered Arrange Master, Advanced Certified Handgun Instructor, a 13 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 1: graduate of the FBI Citizens Academy, graduate of the Law 14 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:42,600 Speaker 1: of Self Defense Instructor Program, annually participates in firearm training 15 00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: from top national instructors and has taught himself over six 16 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:49,880 Speaker 1: hundred hours of concealed carrying Advanced Concealed Carry classes. Also 17 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:53,239 Speaker 1: influential in writing the two Ohio self defense laws and 18 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:57,520 Speaker 1: authored numerous articles on tactical shooting self defense for national publications. 19 00:00:58,160 --> 00:01:00,720 Speaker 1: He also happened to be leader of his churches safety team. 20 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:03,120 Speaker 1: Something you might want a factor into the equation. Bob Jewel, 21 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Morning Show. It's great to have you 22 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 1: on today. 23 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 2: Hey, thanks, Brian, what an honor. 24 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 1: No, it's distinctly my honor. I'm a fan of firearms. 25 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 1: It's a hobby of mine. I liked plinking. I went 26 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 1: out to twenty two to three this week with a 27 00:01:16,040 --> 00:01:18,360 Speaker 1: friend and fired off about four hundred rounds and really 28 00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:20,399 Speaker 1: enjoyed myself. And I've been trying to hone my skills 29 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 1: now for a long time. Can never be too good, 30 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: but you need to stay on top of the law. 31 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:27,960 Speaker 1: And as you point out, the landscape has now changed. 32 00:01:28,120 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: Twenty nine states, how have constitutional carrying, Bob. That just 33 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 1: means the Second Amendment means what it says, you're allowed 34 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:36,679 Speaker 1: to carry and protect yourself, right. 35 00:01:37,880 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 2: Yeah. Amen. 36 00:01:39,560 --> 00:01:41,920 Speaker 3: It's interesting to look back at Ohio and just see 37 00:01:41,959 --> 00:01:45,480 Speaker 3: how our laws evolved in those what last twenty twenty 38 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 3: one years since we got the governor to sign it 39 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 3: in two thousand and four. 40 00:01:49,840 --> 00:01:51,680 Speaker 1: And you'd think that wouldn't have been a difficult thing 41 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 1: considering we do have a Second Amendment. Although it took 42 00:01:55,280 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: a lot of effort on the parts of many national 43 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:00,160 Speaker 1: gun organizations to come to this realization, I feel a 44 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 1: lot more comfortable. And I know so many people that 45 00:02:02,520 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 1: own firearms, and they are not They're the least inclined 46 00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 1: people to do anything bad with the fireman. In fact, 47 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:09,519 Speaker 1: they're the best trained folks out there. People who purchase 48 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 1: and acquire handguns for lawful purposes. You don't have to 49 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:13,920 Speaker 1: worry about those folks, do you, Bob. 50 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 2: Well, I'd like to think so. 51 00:02:17,400 --> 00:02:20,600 Speaker 3: But over the last years, I've seen some very law 52 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:24,120 Speaker 3: abiting people end up in some serious legal trouble because 53 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 3: of their lack of understanding of the law. 54 00:02:26,320 --> 00:02:27,200 Speaker 2: Associated with it. 55 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: There you go. 56 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 2: I always felt like, Yeah, I've always felt like, when I. 57 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:34,840 Speaker 3: Teach a class, it's just not important to teach shooting. 58 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:37,760 Speaker 3: It's important to teach what I call the rules in 59 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:41,320 Speaker 3: the engagement that go along with having that gun, and 60 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 3: the responsibility and the right that comes with the Second Amendment. 61 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:47,160 Speaker 3: So I think, you know, you can be pro Secondmendment, 62 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:49,240 Speaker 3: but you also need to understand the laws that go 63 00:02:49,280 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 3: along with it. 64 00:02:50,120 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's with much dismay anytime I read an 65 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:54,760 Speaker 1: article about someone who goes out the front door of 66 00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:57,520 Speaker 1: their home and starts squeezing off rounds at somebody who's 67 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:01,000 Speaker 1: on their property or trying to take their bicycle from them. Sorry, 68 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:03,880 Speaker 1: that does not allow for the use of deadly force. 69 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:05,720 Speaker 1: Let's talk about that one, because people quite offer and 70 00:03:05,760 --> 00:03:07,000 Speaker 1: are confused, and I know you're going to go into 71 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,360 Speaker 1: detail about this tonight beginning at seven pm. But the 72 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 1: use of actual deadly force, I've been I've been through 73 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:14,280 Speaker 1: it so many times on the on the Morning show 74 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,360 Speaker 1: that I'm blow in the face. But let's review, Bob 75 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 1: Joel the appropriate use of deadly force. 76 00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:26,200 Speaker 3: Well, according to Ohio law and most laws across the country, 77 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,440 Speaker 3: you have to have a reasonable belief of an imminent 78 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:34,400 Speaker 3: fear of death or serious bodily harm. That's that's pretty 79 00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 3: solid across all fifty states. So that's going to be 80 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 3: the first thing. And there's a couple of keywords in there. 81 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 1: Reasonable I know, I know, that's a great law. A 82 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:47,480 Speaker 1: great word, which is what you know from your legal 83 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:49,360 Speaker 1: background is could go anywhere. 84 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 3: The other one, obviously, is the word imminent, meaning it's 85 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:54,920 Speaker 3: coming down right now, it's going to happen right now. 86 00:03:56,480 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 1: You know, And it's funny like an eminent threat from Iran. Yeah, sorry, you. 87 00:04:01,320 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 2: Go, no, No, I appreciate that the you know. 88 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 3: It's it's funny you as a citizen, web a split 89 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:11,120 Speaker 3: second to make that decision, I know, But once it 90 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 3: gets into the legal system, they'll take hours, days, months, 91 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 3: juries could take year, you know, months and days and 92 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 3: hours to revisit your decision that happened in a split second. 93 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that breakdown up. What would you what would 94 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: a reasonable person be thinking at that moment in time 95 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:29,479 Speaker 1: is the standard by which you will be judged. And 96 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:30,840 Speaker 1: I'm sure there are a lot of people that might 97 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:33,719 Speaker 1: want to twist that with twenty twenty hindsight. 98 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:36,680 Speaker 2: Right, and not to mention the video that will be available. 99 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 2: Good point, good point. 100 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:45,799 Speaker 1: Yeah, now go ahead, go ahead, No, you have the floor, Bob, 101 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 1: go ahead. 102 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 3: One of the things that was really interesting when I 103 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 3: was putting this together was to go back and look 104 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:54,239 Speaker 3: at the history of how we got concealed carry in Ohio. 105 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:57,120 Speaker 3: I don't think a lot of people know that nineteen 106 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 3: seventy four we actually got our first law pass It 107 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:03,960 Speaker 3: was a very weak law, but it was passed. And 108 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:06,960 Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety six a bill was passed through the 109 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 3: House and the Senate, but Governor Voinovitch said he wouldn't 110 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 3: sign it, so we could have had concealed carry as 111 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 3: early as nineteen ninety six, but it took on a 112 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 3: High Supreme Court ruling in twenty three that, ironically enough, 113 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:26,640 Speaker 3: was really predicated on a twenty nine year old pizza 114 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:30,599 Speaker 3: delivery driver getting pulled over by Hamilton County with a 115 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:36,440 Speaker 3: concealed handgun. Under the nineteen seventy four law, he had 116 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 3: a legitimate reason he'd been robbed before, he was law abiding, 117 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:42,120 Speaker 3: so according to that law he could have carried, but 118 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:45,840 Speaker 3: instead he was arrested. That case went to court eventually 119 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 3: became what was called Klein versus Lease Simon Lease that 120 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:52,440 Speaker 3: went through the House Supreme Court YEP, and the High 121 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 3: Supreme Court basically said to the legislature, you need to 122 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,000 Speaker 3: fix this nineteen seventy four law. 123 00:05:58,400 --> 00:05:59,839 Speaker 2: It's not clear. 124 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 3: And that's what brought us up to the two thousand 125 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 3: and four law that Bobbinger. 126 00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: Under that original law, did you have to fall into 127 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 1: like one of three specific categories to justify having a 128 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 1: concealed carry weapon? 129 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, you had to feel like there was a legitimate 130 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 3: threat that my understanding is this Piezza driver had been 131 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 3: robbed before. Okay, obviously you had to be law abiding 132 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 3: as well. But the problem is it just left too 133 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 3: much up to the police that the way that law 134 00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:30,240 Speaker 3: is written into the courts. 135 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:33,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, and who's to say when you might run into 136 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:36,720 Speaker 1: a threat where you are reasonably anticipating grievous bodily harm 137 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,000 Speaker 1: or death. You never know when that moment in time 138 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:41,960 Speaker 1: is gonna come. I personally experience that. I'm not gonna 139 00:06:41,960 --> 00:06:43,280 Speaker 1: go through the story again, but I had to pull 140 00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 1: out my concealed carry firearm because I thought a guy 141 00:06:45,440 --> 00:06:47,839 Speaker 1: was gonna literally kill me because he had been trying 142 00:06:47,880 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 1: to kill me as we drove up I seventy one, 143 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:52,240 Speaker 1: and I've talked to law enforcement about that. I had 144 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:54,840 Speaker 1: absolutely every right to pull that firearm out to protect 145 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 1: myself because, Man, I thought that guy was gonna go 146 00:06:56,920 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 1: rogue on me at that moment in time. Did I 147 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:00,600 Speaker 1: think that was gonna happen? Had I ever needed a 148 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: firearm before that moment in time? No, but be prepared. 149 00:07:03,720 --> 00:07:05,880 Speaker 1: That's why you need to carry one. Now, what is 150 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 1: one of the bigger changes in the law that you're 151 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 1: going to be talking about tonight. That's a newer development 152 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,200 Speaker 1: that even my friends out there that are experienced with 153 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 1: firearms and maybe firearms law might not know about, Bob, Right. 154 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:18,480 Speaker 3: Well, you mentioned one. In twenty twenty two we went 155 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:23,520 Speaker 3: to permitless carry. But I think Brian, a real significant 156 00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:27,520 Speaker 3: one was in twenty eighteen, we shifted the burden of 157 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 3: proof from the defendant in a self defense case over 158 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 3: to the prosecutor, and Ohio was the last state to 159 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:35,200 Speaker 3: do that. 160 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 2: So if you had used your. 161 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:39,960 Speaker 3: Handgun in Ohio up to that point, you'd have the 162 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 3: burden of proof in the courtroom that your self defense 163 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 3: was justified, and that law was changed in twenty twenty 164 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 3: eighteen to shift that over to the prosecutors. Now you 165 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:56,440 Speaker 3: can imagine prosecutors didn't like that shit, but that's pretty significant. 166 00:07:56,720 --> 00:07:59,280 Speaker 3: I would hope that that nobody ever has to find 167 00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 3: themselves in work justifying their use of self defense. But 168 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:05,400 Speaker 3: if you are I want to prosecute, to have that 169 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 3: burden a proof. 170 00:08:07,120 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 1: As not the defendant as well, they should you're basically 171 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 1: accusing you of a crime. The burden always rests with 172 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 1: the prosecutor's office on that, and I find it shocking 173 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 1: to believe that they didn't always have that obligation. Bob 174 00:08:19,000 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: jul oh. 175 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:22,160 Speaker 3: And we were by by far the last state to 176 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 3: do that. 177 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:25,200 Speaker 1: Well, I'll take progress whenever I can get it, even 178 00:08:25,200 --> 00:08:26,840 Speaker 1: if it's really slow. Bob, And I want to thank 179 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 1: you on behalf of all my second Amendment, appreciating of 180 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:31,520 Speaker 1: friends out there and listening audience for all the work 181 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 1: that you have done over the years to achieve this 182 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:35,360 Speaker 1: great status we have in Ohio. And real quick, I 183 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 1: know you're going to teach about self defense insurance coverage 184 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 1: and whether that's needed. You talk about laws involving traveling 185 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: with a handgun, information associated with concealed carrying, places of worship, 186 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:49,920 Speaker 1: the whole gamut tonight, seven pm and power Youoamerica dot Org. Bob, 187 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:53,480 Speaker 1: really quickly before we part company, constitutional carry, this whole 188 00:08:53,520 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 1: concept of nationwide reciprocity. Do you see that going through 189 00:08:57,520 --> 00:08:58,320 Speaker 1: on a federal level. 190 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 2: It's a good thought, Brian, but it's it's. 191 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: A long way away, a long way away, and I 192 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 1: got a list. 193 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 2: Don't going back. 194 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: We have a second Amendment, you know, should it be 195 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:15,680 Speaker 1: this difficult, Bob? I mean seriously, right, Bob, Good luck 196 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 1: tonight with the seminar. I will strongly encourage anyone who 197 00:09:19,160 --> 00:09:22,680 Speaker 1: is maybe even interested in purchasing a firearm for the 198 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:26,680 Speaker 1: first time the great foundation for firearm ownership, and of 199 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:29,560 Speaker 1: course everyone who owns one is going to help get 200 00:09:29,559 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 1: a lot of benefit from Bob Jewel's seminar tonight and 201 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:33,520 Speaker 1: power you America dot org. Log in from home or 202 00:09:33,520 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 1: show up at three hundred Great Oaks Drive and experience 203 00:09:36,160 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 1: it live in person. Bob again, thank you for your 204 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:39,840 Speaker 1: time this morning, and thanks for what you continue to 205 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 1: do in the name of the Second Amendment. Thank you, Brian, 206 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:45,760 Speaker 1: thank you eight twenty six. Right now, it's that time 207 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 1: I heard media