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Speaker 1: Welcome to a post show podcast, and if you were

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Speaker 1: listening to Thursday show, you heard me begin the conversation

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Speaker 1: with our guest on the Post show podcast, Josh Scherard,

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Speaker 1: director of Law Enforcement, Private security, former military police captain.

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Speaker 2: Again, as I did on the show, Josh.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for your service and more specifically too to

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Speaker 1: the conversation. You're also a part of Berna BYRNA dot

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Speaker 1: com recent editions in terms of sponsorships here on Twin

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Speaker 1: Cities News Talk and my show talk a little bit

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Speaker 1: about your relationship with Berna and how you got hooked

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Speaker 1: up with them.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, Burna started back in twenty nineteen, and

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Speaker 3: you know, the goal was to provide less legal options

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Speaker 3: that really that law enforcement has been using for decades

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Speaker 3: and really repackaging those that have proven to be extremely effective,

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Speaker 3: extremely safe, and put them in a package that civilians

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Speaker 3: could actually use. You know, you know, in the last decade,

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Speaker 3: we've seen the need for civilians to have force options

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Speaker 3: to defend themselves. A lot of scrutiny now on how

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Speaker 3: you're defending yourself in the level that you're defending yourself,

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Speaker 3: and so having that median option that's gonna give you

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Speaker 3: a better option in most scenarios was really the goal.

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Speaker 3: And in twenty nineteen they started and it took off,

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Speaker 3: and they really never they knew that they would they

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Speaker 3: would be offering a law enforcement at some point, but

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Speaker 3: they wanted to establish good business, you know, good manufacturing processes.

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Speaker 3: But they kept getting calls from law enforcement agencies all

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Speaker 3: of the countries saying, we need this, and so they

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Speaker 3: realized that they had to move faster than they thought. So,

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Speaker 3: you know, through some networking and in some common contacts,

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Speaker 3: I got contacted and was able to come on with

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Speaker 3: some people and start a law enforce division for BURNA.

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Speaker 3: Since then, in the last five plus years, and we've

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Speaker 3: onboarded over eight hundred agencies just here in the US

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Speaker 3: and internationally has been massive. We've onboarded entire countries, especially

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Speaker 3: in Latin America. I mean, we're talking tens of thousands

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Speaker 3: of officers in countries and governments all over the world

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Speaker 3: who understand, how you know, having those options and giving

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Speaker 3: their officers in their communities the ability to defend themselves

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Speaker 3: in an appropriate and reasonable manner. It's how important that is.

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Speaker 3: It may I'll tell you it's been a wild ride.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I was I was surprised talking I believe it

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Speaker 1: was Andrew who I was speaking with when we were

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Speaker 1: preparing for the sponsorship for Berna here on the show,

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Speaker 1: and Josh. I was surprised because I guess I had

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Speaker 1: the wrong mentality. I thought that your typical ardent Second

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Speaker 1: Amendment supporters, of which I am, I certainly didn't carry

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Speaker 1: this attitude.

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Speaker 2: But I was wondering. I was like, well, you know what,

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Speaker 2: if you have.

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Speaker 1: A concealed carry already, you know, what is your view

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Speaker 1: towards a less lethal option like a Berna. I thought

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Speaker 1: that there may have been a bit of a disconnect

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Speaker 1: or even some negativity towards that option for individuals that

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Speaker 1: were already, you know, caring to protect themselves and their

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Speaker 1: loved ones.

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Speaker 2: But I've quickly learned that that absolutely isn't the case.

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Speaker 1: I mean, even mentioning it briefly this morning on the

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Speaker 1: show prior to talking to you, I got a lot

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Speaker 1: of comments from listeners who are, you know, concealed carry

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Speaker 1: holders and they also have a burna and they're really

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Speaker 1: thankful to have these less lethal options. So I guess

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Speaker 1: that was bad on my part that I was carrying

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Speaker 1: around that assumption because it appears that I was wrong.

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Speaker 3: Well, I'll tell you I carried the same and when

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Speaker 3: I came on, I you know, I honestly I question. Look,

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Speaker 3: I understood the need for law enforcement, which is why

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Speaker 3: I originally came onto the company, and I had the

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Speaker 3: same question. I'm like, man, are civilians really going to understand?

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Speaker 3: Are they really going to want something, especially that, especially

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Speaker 3: your two A guys, especially your gun tots. And I

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Speaker 3: was wrong as well, and it seems that now, look

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Speaker 3: we have buy for care or we have you know,

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Speaker 3: kind of really been popular on both sides of the aisle,

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Speaker 3: but extremely popular on the two A guys. Look, I'm

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Speaker 3: a gun totor. Most of Berna employees are our gun totors,

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Speaker 3: and everybody's a big two A supporter. We are not

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Speaker 3: here to replace that. And that's that's one of the

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Speaker 3: biggest messages we had to get across. We're not here

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Speaker 3: to say you don't need a gun, you need this.

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Speaker 3: We're here to say need both. We're here to say

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Speaker 3: that you need to have options that you think are appropriate,

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Speaker 3: that are best for you to fit in your ecosystem

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Speaker 3: to defend yourself, whether that be a gun, whether it

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Speaker 3: be a or whether that be both, and so I

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Speaker 3: was I was wrong as well. And I think a

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Speaker 3: lot of that stems from the fact that those people

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Speaker 3: that have made the conscious decision to carry a gun

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Speaker 3: every day to say I'm going to do what it

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Speaker 3: takes to find myself and my family also understand the

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Speaker 3: ramifications of that. They understand that if I have to

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Speaker 3: take somebody's life, there's a lot that goes into that.

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Speaker 3: You know, One is just the emotional turmoil of you know,

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Speaker 3: taking somebody's life, but two, that's the liability that sets

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Speaker 3: themself up. The criminal liability, you know, if is it

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Speaker 3: an appropriate case? Am I going to be charged criminally?

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Speaker 3: Or the civil liability? Am I going to be sued afterward?

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Speaker 3: Can I lose everything if I take this person's life?

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Speaker 3: And you know, so they understand that that's really the

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Speaker 3: last option they want to do, and if they have

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Speaker 3: an intermediate option, if they have something to do instead

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Speaker 3: of that, that's still appropriate for that situation, they would

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Speaker 3: much rather rather have that. Look, you know that I

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Speaker 3: always throw these stats out because that's what means most

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Speaker 3: of the stats guy, I'm a numbers guy. Your chance

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Speaker 3: of having to use in the when we look at

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Speaker 3: the country. We look at to six year to year,

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Speaker 3: and we look at the just fileble, homicides, and self

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Speaker 3: defense every year. Your chance of having to use deadly

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Speaker 3: force to defend yourself in the US is about one

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Speaker 3: in eight hundred thousand per year, so almost, you know,

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Speaker 3: pretty close to one in a million. Sure is your

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Speaker 3: chance of having used deadly force to defend yourself. Your

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Speaker 3: chance of having to use some other kind of force

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Speaker 3: to defend yourself, your chance to being a victim of

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Speaker 3: violent crime is about one in two hundred and seventy five.

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Speaker 3: That is orders of magnitude more likely that you're going

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Speaker 3: to have to defend yourself using something other than deadly

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Speaker 3: force in a situation where deadly force is not going

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Speaker 3: to be considered reasonable. So my you know, my take

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Speaker 3: on that is, I look, I'm a I rather have

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Speaker 3: not need than I need to not have. Guy, I

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Speaker 3: get it. You could be that one in eight hundred thousand,

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Speaker 3: but your chance to be in that one to two

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Speaker 3: hundred and seventy four is so much greater. Why would

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Speaker 3: you not have an option that's so much more likely

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Speaker 3: to be used than not? And that's that's really what

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Speaker 3: it comes down to.

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Speaker 2: Let's spend the remaining a few minutes.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk a little bit about the product itself,

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Speaker 1: because the the BURNA is different than other less lethal options,

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Speaker 1: especially when it comes to the way in which the

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Speaker 1: CEO two canister operates.

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Speaker 2: Am I correcting that?

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Speaker 3: You absolutely are. So that's that's really what we've been

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Speaker 3: able to do as a company is really give civilians

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Speaker 3: the best option, the most convenient option, and the lowest

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Speaker 3: maintenance option and the most effective to really defend theirselves.

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Speaker 3: So all of our products, especially the handheld products, they

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Speaker 3: do resemble pistols. And the reason is is because everybody's

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Speaker 3: familiar with that. Most everyone, whether you're gunter or not,

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Speaker 3: you understand how they work. You know, you understand that

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Speaker 3: point in this direction. I understand how to pull a trigger.

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Speaker 3: That they're very, very easy to use. The bigger point

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Speaker 3: is they're always ready. That COO two, they are all

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Speaker 3: air powered. That CO two cartridge sits in the launcher unpierced,

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Speaker 3: and it will sit in there indefinitely a week, month,

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Speaker 3: six months a year. All you have to do to

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Speaker 3: make it work is pointed at the bad guy, pull

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Speaker 3: the trigger. That first short to pull pierces the cartridge

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Speaker 3: and fires that first round, and you're gonna get a

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Speaker 3: bunch of rounds after that. Look, in a critical incident,

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Speaker 3: you cannot rely on yourself to remember to do any

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Speaker 3: complex things, whether it's push a button or flip the

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Speaker 3: switch or all this other stuff that would require you know,

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Speaker 3: activation of a product or activation of a tool. We

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Speaker 3: took all of that out. It's literally point and pull.

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Speaker 3: Point at the bad guy pulled the trigger. That's all

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Speaker 3: you have to do. So in a critical incident, there's

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Speaker 3: nothing else to remember, and that's what makes it so effective.

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Speaker 3: We're also giving you so much more distance than anything else.

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Speaker 3: I mean, you're it's effective at over sixty feet, well

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Speaker 3: over sixty feet. So now you don't have to let

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Speaker 3: you know when you're when you're using a keychaine pepper spray,

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Speaker 3: you're having to let that person get within ten feet,

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Speaker 3: which is incredibly dangerous. Now you don't have to wait.

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Speaker 3: You can start engaging much much farther out, which gives

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Speaker 3: you that time to escape. So we really increase your

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Speaker 3: ability and your capability to defend yourself your family against threats,

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Speaker 3: get it out of there, escape and not killingbody.

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Speaker 1: And then you have the difference between your kinetic rounds

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Speaker 1: and then your your chemical rounds. You've got what like

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Speaker 1: two hundred miles an hour, like you're being shot with

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Speaker 1: a marble. But then if you're using the chemical rounds too,

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Speaker 1: it's a circumstance in the way that it was described

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Speaker 1: to me where wherein the kinetic round you're gonna want

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Speaker 1: to hit.

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Speaker 2: Your target obviously, but with.

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Speaker 1: The chemical round, you can actually end up firing to

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Speaker 1: something nearby where the assailants is and it's still gonna

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Speaker 1: end up having a major impact on them.

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Speaker 3: Correct. Absolutely. The kinetic rounds are just hard, solid polymer balls,

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Speaker 3: and you're gonna get pay a lot of pain compliance

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Speaker 3: out of those rounds. But yeah, the chemical ledger rounds one,

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Speaker 3: if you hit them directly, you're still going to get

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Speaker 3: that same pain compliance. I'm telling you, it hurts. It's

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Speaker 3: going to leave a mark, a big mark, and it's

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Speaker 3: going to get some compliance. But they do. You get

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Speaker 3: about a three to five foot cloud of that powderized

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Speaker 3: chemical agent and depending on the round you're using, has

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Speaker 3: the same ingredientss but pepper spray and then tear gasing

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Speaker 3: military big tear gas. So it does incredibly effect very

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Speaker 3: very quickly. But like you said, we get a lot

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Speaker 3: of people that use it in what we call an

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Speaker 3: indirect manner, where you can shoot the ground in front

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Speaker 3: of them, shoot the wall next to them, you don't

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Speaker 3: even have to see them, and you can shoot around

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Speaker 3: them and use that chemical agent to make that area

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Speaker 3: very very uncomfortable. And depending on the situation you're in,

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Speaker 3: maybe the level of force, the level of forcing uses

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Speaker 3: doesn't require you to hit them directly. Maybe it's just

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Speaker 3: you know, hey, I'm gonna make it very uncomfortable for

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Speaker 3: them to be there. But it also makes it so

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Speaker 3: that even a miss is a hit. You know, Look,

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Speaker 3: I get it. You know, hit rates and critical incidents

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Speaker 3: aren't great. But even if you miss, you hit the

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Speaker 3: wall next to them, the ground in front of them,

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Speaker 3: you're still going to get value out of that, you know,

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Speaker 3: out of that that that action. So it really is

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Speaker 3: gives you so many options to deal with so many

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Speaker 3: different situations.

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Speaker 1: The website is b y r NA dot com. That's

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Speaker 1: a Burner dot com and eight hundred thousand units sold,

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Speaker 1: zero deaths. Yep, I'm correct on that right. Zero death Yeah,

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Speaker 1: pretty incredible. Josh Girarden, again, thank you so much. For

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Speaker 1: the your time this morning. I know we were having

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Speaker 1: some technical difficulties, but I'm glad that we sorted everything

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Speaker 1: out and then it was great to meet you and

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Speaker 1: again to talk to you a little bit about These

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Speaker 1: products are absolutely fantastic and I'm so I'm so pleased

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Speaker 1: to have Berna on board here with Twin Cities News Talk,

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Speaker 1: and I hope everybody has the opportunity to go in

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Speaker 1: and check these out for themselves, or as we heard

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Speaker 1: from many listeners this morning, they already have one and

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Speaker 1: they're planning on buying another, so that's good news as well.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for the time this morning.

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Speaker 3: Josh, Yeah, thanks for letting me join