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Speaker 1: Karsed Talk Station. It's Friday Eve. Bottom of the Hour.

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Speaker 1: Jay Ratlip, I heart media aviation expert, join us every week. Today,

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Speaker 1: I'm really excited to welcome to the frety five Cars

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Speaker 1: Morning Show. Formerly with Freedom Works and Blaze Media, he's

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Speaker 1: been with the Competitive Enterprise Institute for why his name

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Speaker 1: Destri Edwards. He's the media production and studio manager with

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Speaker 1: a Competitive Enterprise Institute. As a passion for film and politics,

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Speaker 1: he tries to use storytelling as a way to bridge

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Speaker 1: the gap between people and policy. And he is here

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Speaker 1: to talk about an award winning documentary. And the timing

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Speaker 1: couldn't be better. Man, dear mister President, the Letters of

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Speaker 1: Julius Sand And while I don't know who Julius sand is,

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Speaker 1: you're going to explain that, Destri Welcome to the fifty

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Speaker 1: five carssee Morning Show. I said, the timing is great

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Speaker 1: because I literally just got done watching Death by Lightning

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Speaker 1: on Netflix. I loved that. Welcome. It's good to have

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Speaker 1: you on.

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Speaker 2: Hey, great to talk with you. Now.

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Speaker 1: Did did Death by Lightning? For my listeners who don't know?

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Speaker 1: It was about the president James Garfield and how he

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Speaker 1: ended up being president and then getting assassinated. It could

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Speaker 1: come across as a work of fiction. The story was

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Speaker 1: a really cool one, but it really happened. Did that

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Speaker 1: series inspire Dear Mister President The Letters of Julius sand

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Speaker 1: Or was this project a concept you were working on

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Speaker 1: or had already completed before that one came out.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a good question. I mean, it's by the

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Speaker 2: timing of things that can look that way. But actually

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Speaker 2: I was probably two three months into pre production on

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Speaker 2: my documentary when Death by Lytton was announced, So there's

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Speaker 2: a pretty good chance they were in the works on

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Speaker 2: things behind the scenes before I was. As far as

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Speaker 2: official announcements, I was not aware of it when I started.

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Speaker 1: So I imagine your documentary or your film, Dear Mister President,

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Speaker 1: Letters of Julie Stan You're getting a lot of extra

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Speaker 1: love because people have to be intrigued by the twenty

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Speaker 1: first President Chester Arthur, who succeeded after the assassination of

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Speaker 1: President Garfield. He came across as a really, really corrupt

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Speaker 1: so and so Destri. Did they accurately and I will

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Speaker 1: move before we move over to your film, did they

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Speaker 1: accurately portray his level of corruption in Death by Lightning?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? So it's interesting how they did that. So it

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Speaker 2: is true that he was a corrupt person coming up

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Speaker 2: into the vice presidency and he was not a supportive

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Speaker 2: vice president. I will say Death by Lightning did overplay

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Speaker 2: some things. For instance, very light Spoil was high, very light,

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Speaker 2: but he never had any of Garfield's cabinet members kidnapped.

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Speaker 2: He also never spoke ill of Garfield to the press.

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Speaker 2: He also didn't try to resign at that point either.

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Speaker 2: So there's a lot of things that overplays, but the

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Speaker 2: general concept is true. He definitely was He definitely had

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Speaker 2: a corrupt past with the spoil system coming into all

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Speaker 2: of this.

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Speaker 1: And again Death by Lightning really revealed the New York

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Speaker 1: political machine for what it was, which was very very

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Speaker 1: powerful and Chester Arthur part of that, and one would

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Speaker 1: have expected him to sort of continue that level of corruption.

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Speaker 1: But as I believe you point out and dear mister President,

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Speaker 1: the Letter of Julie, it didn't turn out that way.

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Speaker 1: He actually turned out to be a bit of a reformer.

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Speaker 1: Playing into that Julia Sand who was Julius Sand and

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Speaker 1: how did she become so influential on how his presidency

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Speaker 1: turned out?

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Speaker 2: Yes, So drawing back to death by lightening again, as

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Speaker 2: you have seen in the final episode of Garfield's wife,

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Speaker 2: Lucretia speaks to Arthur in that episode and he gives

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Speaker 2: like a quick speech encouraging him to step up and

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Speaker 2: reform himself. So that never happened in real life. He

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Speaker 2: never had that kind of conversation with the Christia Garfield.

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Speaker 2: But what the filmmakers did there is the actually drew

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Speaker 2: those words of the paraphrase from what Julius Sand had written.

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Speaker 2: So after Garfield was shot by Charles Gatteau, the country

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Speaker 2: was fearful about what was happening. Arthur was also fearful

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Speaker 2: because he had no intention of becoming president. He had

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Speaker 2: never wanted that. He felt fully unqualified to be the president.

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Speaker 2: And so a few weeks to Garfield being on his deathbed,

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Speaker 2: as everyone was fearing that he would pass away. As

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Speaker 2: of course, she eventually did. This woman Julius Sand, who

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Speaker 2: was just a normal constituent from New York City, she

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Speaker 2: started writing Arthur. She wrote Arthur and encouraged well. She

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Speaker 2: started out by telling him that, hey, people are bad

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Speaker 2: in grief, but do you realize it not so much

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Speaker 2: because he is dying, but because you were a successor.

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Speaker 2: And that's kind of I imagine a gut punch to

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Speaker 2: anybody reading that. But she went on also to encourage him,

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Speaker 2: telling him, Hey, I'm not asking to res up to

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Speaker 2: you to resign. I'm asking you to her reform and

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Speaker 2: be better, to be the president that this country needs

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Speaker 2: you to be. And she continued writing those letters. She

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Speaker 2: wrote twenty three letters to him over the next couple

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Speaker 2: of years, being a conscience to him, giving him admonishment

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Speaker 2: for things to do wrong or might be wrong, but

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Speaker 2: also give him encouragement that she believed he could rise

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Speaker 2: to the occasion.

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Speaker 1: Well, I find it fascinating, you know, my listeners and

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Speaker 1: I struggle regularly with you know, reaching out to our politician,

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Speaker 1: you know, to action. Call your congressman, call to action,

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Speaker 1: call your senator, send him an email, send him a letter.

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Speaker 1: No one believes that works. I'm just surprised that the

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Speaker 1: president of the United States. And granted the population was

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Speaker 1: much smaller, and I don't know how many people actually

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Speaker 1: wrote the president, but how is it that she was

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Speaker 1: able to get his attention and have such a profound

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Speaker 1: impact on him. Was it kind of a unique thing

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Speaker 1: for someone to reach out? What caused him to be

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Speaker 1: to gravitate and take what she had to say by

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Speaker 1: way of recommendation to heart.

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Speaker 2: That's a good question. So even in her first letter,

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Speaker 2: she assumes that he's received other letters like this, and

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Speaker 2: maybe he did. We don't have any record of any

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Speaker 2: other letters he at least nothing else that he kept.

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Speaker 2: He kept all of her letters, but nothing from anyone else.

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Speaker 2: And as I was doing this story and talked with

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Speaker 2: several historians who have broad knowledge of the presidency, I

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Speaker 2: was asking them, Hey, do you know any other story

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Speaker 2: like this where a president was influenced in this way

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Speaker 2: by a normal constituent, And no historian to talk to

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Speaker 2: had any other example of this level. Like the closest

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Speaker 2: thing make a point to was a Lincoln growing a beard,

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Speaker 2: which looks cool, But that's a choice. This is a

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Speaker 2: unique situation in history that we're looking at here, but

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Speaker 2: there's no reason has to be unique. We can. I

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Speaker 2: think that's part of the lesson here is that we

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Speaker 2: assume that we have no influence on our elected leaders

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Speaker 2: that we actually do.

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Speaker 1: Now, did she have some unique political insight? Was she

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Speaker 1: connected in any way, because apparently she had a sufficient

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Speaker 1: knowledge of the corruption in how he should reform himself

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Speaker 1: and move away from that corrupt New York political machine

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Speaker 1: that he was part of. I mean, what was she

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Speaker 1: unique in some regard in terms of her knowledge? I

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Speaker 1: guess I'm just wondering how she was able to push

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Speaker 1: his button.

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Speaker 2: I mean, her family was decently well off, but they

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Speaker 2: had no political connections whatsoever. She would she herself was

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Speaker 2: actually fairly sickly and didn't get out of the house

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Speaker 2: an exceptional amount of time, and when she did, it

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Speaker 2: really took the energy out of her. She read the newspapers,

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Speaker 2: but she wasn't informed in some kind of way beyond that,

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Speaker 2: like some kind of inside source, So she didn't know

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Speaker 2: more than an average person could have.

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Speaker 1: So what policies that Chester Arthur embraced and during his

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Speaker 1: period of reform moving away from his prior corruption. What

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Speaker 1: policies did he embrace that you can trace directly to

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Speaker 1: the recommendations of Julia.

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Speaker 2: Sand Yeah, So the biggest thing we can look at

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Speaker 2: is the Penelton Act that was referenced to the end

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Speaker 2: of death by lightning, which is kind of an interesting

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Speaker 2: arc for Arthur himself because that goes against his entire career.

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Speaker 2: At that point, he had been at the head of

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Speaker 2: the spoil system where people get government jobs not based

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Speaker 2: on their qualifications but based on political favors and who

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Speaker 2: they knew and who they had helped in the past,

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Speaker 2: regardless to whether or not they had qualification for their job.

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Speaker 2: And so the Penalan Act is what kind of started

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Speaker 2: the path away from that to make actual qualifications and

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Speaker 2: this wasn't about the political favors being paid out. I

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Speaker 2: don't know if he's necessarily so much throughout Julie Sand's

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Speaker 2: letters in Arthur's career that he did things specifically because

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Speaker 2: Julie Fan asked him to. More so, she was kind

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Speaker 2: of a conscience to him and was giving him support

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Speaker 2: to hey, this is what the people want, this is

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Speaker 2: what you are capable of doing. So there were things

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Speaker 2: like that tactic chief among them, as well as the

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Speaker 2: first Chinese Exclusion Act. The Second Chinese Exclusion Act is

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Speaker 2: a different matter that we discussed in the documentary, but

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Speaker 2: there are things like that as well as some different

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Speaker 2: corruption investigations where she would encourage him to, hey, make

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Speaker 2: sure your administration moves forward the right way on this.

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Speaker 1: I guess I'm kind of curious did he not have

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Speaker 1: advisors and other elected officials around him who might have

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Speaker 1: been offering similar suggestions that Julius sand was offering. And

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Speaker 1: I just find it so unusual that some lone voice

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Speaker 1: in the wilderness was able to impact him in such

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Speaker 1: a profound way that he wasn't surrounded by other people

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Speaker 1: who might have influenced them in the same way.

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Speaker 2: I think, particularly in the beginning when he was still

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Speaker 2: a vice president and Garfield was dying, Arthur's wife had

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Speaker 2: died just the year before. He didn't really have any

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Speaker 2: quote that he didn't really have any close family other

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Speaker 2: than that, and he had his children, but that's not

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Speaker 2: really that was a different scenario. And then his friends

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Speaker 2: were all the people in the political machine. So in

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Speaker 2: this moment where the machines understrup scrutiny, they weren't really

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Speaker 2: people he could go to for this kind of support.

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Speaker 2: So he was kind of isolated at the time of

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Speaker 2: garfield assassination, and he was at this point where he

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Speaker 2: really needed somebody to reach out to him and be

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Speaker 2: an encouragement to him and point him in the right direction.

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Speaker 2: And just what Julius Ann was able to be and

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Speaker 2: as an administration kind of took off all of Garfield's

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Speaker 2: appointees didn't trust him and end up all resigning. So

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Speaker 2: the entire cabinet, over the course of a couple of months,

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Speaker 2: leaves office with the exception of one person, and so

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Speaker 2: he has to rebuild the cabinet basically from scratch. And

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Speaker 2: so in that time he's kind of a loss for

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Speaker 2: advisors and they lost for allies, and so Julius Ann's

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Speaker 2: voice kind of stands out because of that.

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Speaker 1: That's just so intriguing. Now, how is this will reveal

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Speaker 1: my honest political ignorance with regard to Chester A or

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Speaker 1: Chester Arthur's presidency. How is he remembered at least in

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Speaker 1: terms of his presidency overall? Is he looked on with

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Speaker 1: favor or one of the more overlooked presidents? I mean,

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Speaker 1: how do you sort of I know it's a subjective measure,

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Speaker 1: but how do you rank in terms of his success

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Speaker 1: as president considering the level of corruption he was involved

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Speaker 1: with before he became president.

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Speaker 2: That's a great question. So this is probably changing now

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Speaker 2: because of Death by Lightning and him being a major

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Speaker 2: character in that. But before the show, at least he

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Speaker 2: has been consistently ranked as the least known US president

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Speaker 2: of history. Thank you.

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Speaker 1: That just made you feel better. He made me feel better.

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Speaker 2: But as far as people actually look at the achievements,

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Speaker 2: I mean the biggest thing being the Penalton Act, which

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Speaker 2: I would say, you know, they're presidents who have made

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Speaker 2: some negative choices on civil service reforms since him, But

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Speaker 2: I think it's pretty easy for all sides to be

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Speaker 2: able to look at Arthur's reforms say yeah, that was

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Speaker 2: a good direction he was taking this. So I think

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Speaker 2: that civil service reform, when you look at his record,

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Speaker 2: as the major key cornerstone of what he was able

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Speaker 2: to accomplish. And despite all the evidence, like if you

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Speaker 2: look at this, you know, if you're looking for someone

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Speaker 2: to vote for in a primary or general election, looked

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Speaker 2: at this person's past, all the question they've been involved in.

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Speaker 2: Plus not a good vice president either. He's not the

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Speaker 2: person you would say, yes, this is going to be

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Speaker 2: a good president. He's the guy at the back, right.

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Speaker 2: But he actually did end up being a good president.

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Speaker 2: And even people like Mark Twain were saying, and Mark

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Speaker 2: Twain not someone who was eager to just give, you know,

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Speaker 2: praise to politicians, acknowledge that hey, like, it would be

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Speaker 2: hard to do better than Arthur's presidency.

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Speaker 1: How about that? Well, I've learned a lot and I

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Speaker 1: know it's going to it's a great companion piece for

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Speaker 1: those who've seen Death by Lightning or haven't seen it.

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Speaker 1: I'll encourage him to watch it. I just thought it

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Speaker 1: was a great story to tell. But also you get

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Speaker 1: a little insight into who Chester A. Arthur was, and

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Speaker 1: that'll segue perfectly into Destri Edwards film. Dear mister President,

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Speaker 1: the Letters of Julius Sand Should my listeners be inspired

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Speaker 1: by Julius Sand in the sense that yes, it's worth

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Speaker 1: it to take the time to write that letter and

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Speaker 1: offer your suggestions.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, And I would say obviously things are different today

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Speaker 2: than they were in the eighteen eighties, so the methodology

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Speaker 2: might be different. It might not be a letter of

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Speaker 2: maybe it is, but I would say the big takeaway

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Speaker 2: there is people do have a voice. You are able

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Speaker 2: to impact your your political representatives around you, whether that's

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Speaker 2: the president, whether that's your senator, whether that's your mayor.

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Speaker 2: But be involved, be an encouragement. Don't just be there

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Speaker 2: to slam them like you can be honest, but you

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Speaker 2: know if you're you're going to listen to you If

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Speaker 2: you're going to encourage in the right direction, not just

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Speaker 2: beat up on them. As far as exactly. Yes, And

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Speaker 2: for people who are interested in seeing the film, it's

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Speaker 2: available now on YouTube, So all you have to do

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Speaker 2: is just look up, dear mister Presidents, The Letters of

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Speaker 2: Julia Sand or look up the organization Competitive Enterprise Institute,

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Speaker 2: and you know you will find it there for free

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Speaker 2: on YouTube.

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Speaker 1: Competitive Enterpresidents. Who is CEI dot org? YouTube is a

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Speaker 1: place to find the movie, Dear mister President The Letters

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Speaker 1: of Julius saying, I'm gonna watch it today because again

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Speaker 1: fascinated by Death by Lightning, Destri Edwards filmmaker. I really

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Speaker 1: enjoyed talking with you today and thanks for filling in

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Speaker 1: the blanks on the obvious questions we all had after

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Speaker 1: watching Death Black Lightning. This is perfect timing.

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Speaker 2: Man really is well. Thank you so much being great

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Speaker 2: to talk with you.

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Speaker 1: It's been a real pleasure having you on the show, sir.

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Speaker 1: Get on YouTube. Check it out, dear mister President, The

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Speaker 1: Letters of Julius sand take care of Destriy. It's been

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Speaker 1: a pleasure stick around. I heard media aviation expert Jay

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Speaker 1: right lift coming up. It's eight twenty right now fifty

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Speaker 1: five KRCD talk station fifty five krc