WEBVTT - 12-17-25 Willie with Joe Deters and Mark Piepmeier 0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:03.680 By Billy Cunningham, the Great America and a studio with 0:00:03.760 --> 0:00:06.920 me now is Joe Eaters former how many County prosecutor 0:00:07.000 --> 0:00:09.400 also on the High Supreme Court now and Mark Petemar, 0:00:09.640 --> 0:00:12.039 who spent how many years prosecuting criminals? Are Mark? 0:00:12.080 --> 0:00:15.239 Did you spend forty four year for six months when 0:00:15.280 --> 0:00:16.680 I was activated for Desert storm? 0:00:16.760 --> 0:00:18.439 So you know it's where the bodies are buried? Forty 0:00:18.440 --> 0:00:19.880 four years? Bhi Joe. 0:00:19.880 --> 0:00:21.599 First of all, you want to make a statement, Well, 0:00:21.680 --> 0:00:24.000 I just want to make sure that your listeners know 0:00:24.120 --> 0:00:28.640 that I am on the Supreme Court and this has 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:31.280 got nothing to do with the Supreme Court. I voluntarily 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:34.000 recused myself from anything to do with. 0:00:35.440 --> 0:00:37.320 The Jones case, and. 0:00:38.920 --> 0:00:41.159 I felt compelled to write this letter bill that you 0:00:41.280 --> 0:00:43.400 have now and I think it's on your website too, 0:00:45.479 --> 0:00:50.880 laying out my concerns with MS. Pillage's press conference is 0:00:50.920 --> 0:00:55.200 clearing Elwood Jones of the murder of Roode Nathan, and 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:58.000 I appreciate the opportunity to come in here talk to 0:00:58.080 --> 0:01:00.520 you about it. I brought Mark with Ian. Mark was 0:01:00.560 --> 0:01:05.640 the trial attorney in this case. I don't know that 0:01:05.680 --> 0:01:08.440 many people know Mark's reputation and I wish he wasn't 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:11.760 here to listen to this, but it's stellar. He was 0:01:11.880 --> 0:01:15.399 the lead prosecutor in all the Lucasville Right cases. He 0:01:15.480 --> 0:01:21.280 was in that office forty years about maybe the best 0:01:21.600 --> 0:01:25.280 prosecutor in the state of Ohio. And Mark was the 0:01:25.319 --> 0:01:27.199 trial attorney. And I send to be here with us 0:01:27.240 --> 0:01:30.240 just in case you had questions about the facts of 0:01:30.280 --> 0:01:30.640 this thing. 0:01:30.800 --> 0:01:35.440 Mark Pete Meyer did Eldwood Jones murder wrote a Nathan. 0:01:35.280 --> 0:01:40.200 Yes, tell me why, well, a lot of evidence. In fact, 0:01:40.240 --> 0:01:42.520 I was speaking of Joe before. You know, we've tried 0:01:42.520 --> 0:01:45.679 some tough cases where you really rely on eyewitnesses only, 0:01:45.720 --> 0:01:48.120 and those are the kind of the tough cases. And 0:01:48.280 --> 0:01:51.360 people criticize this because it was only quote only, a 0:01:51.400 --> 0:01:57.640 circumstantial evidence case. And to me, circumstantial evidence is unrefuted facts, 0:01:57.760 --> 0:02:01.840 and these are the unrefuted facts. Elwood Jones was working 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.480 on the second floor of the Embassy Suites hotel in 0:02:04.520 --> 0:02:07.040 the afternoon of I think it was a Friday afternoon, 0:02:07.480 --> 0:02:10.080 setting up a banquet room when a couple arrived to 0:02:10.120 --> 0:02:12.400 go into the room next door to where he was working. 0:02:12.800 --> 0:02:16.240 That was Joe Kaplan and Elaine Shube. Elwood could have 0:02:16.280 --> 0:02:18.919 easily seen them go into that room, and our theory 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.160 as he did see them, knew that it was a 0:02:21.160 --> 0:02:24.680 couple staying in that room. Later that night, after Elwood 0:02:24.680 --> 0:02:28.240 got off of work, rode to Nathan, our victim showed up. 0:02:28.320 --> 0:02:31.480 Elwoodt did not realize now that there are three people 0:02:31.520 --> 0:02:35.320 in the room. The next morning, the couple that first 0:02:35.480 --> 0:02:38.280 arrived went down to breakfast and rote of Nathan is 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:40.600 in the room. She's going to take a shower, and 0:02:40.840 --> 0:02:43.680 Elwood is also working in the room right next door. 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:45.760 That day, it's a banquet room with the door open, 0:02:46.480 --> 0:02:49.800 and Elwood is a thief. He's a career thief. And 0:02:49.919 --> 0:02:53.079 our belief is is that he saw an opportunity, went 0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:56.200 in the room because he thought it was open and confronts. 0:02:56.400 --> 0:03:00.120 Wrote to Nathan. Rode to Nathan is savagely beaten. He 0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:03.120 died of blunt force trauma. There was very little blood 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:06.280 at the scene because it was just beaten to death. 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:10.040 About a half hour later, the couple comes back from breakfast, 0:03:10.080 --> 0:03:13.040 open the door and they find Roda Nathan laying on 0:03:13.080 --> 0:03:15.160 the floor. All she had on her was a bath towe. 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:17.840 They think, oh my god, she must have had a 0:03:17.840 --> 0:03:21.000 heart attack. And they call paramatics and they come and 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:23.320 they're treating her, trying to revive her from what they 0:03:23.320 --> 0:03:26.880 believed was a heart attack. Two other things were noticed 0:03:26.880 --> 0:03:29.600 by the couple at the time. There was a distinctive 0:03:29.639 --> 0:03:34.079 handweight made necklace that Roda always wore around her neck 0:03:34.120 --> 0:03:38.120 and it was missing. Also, Elaine Schub noticed there were 0:03:38.200 --> 0:03:40.520 hundreds of dollars of cash that she had in her 0:03:40.560 --> 0:03:44.240 purse that was taken. One other thing is this is 0:03:44.280 --> 0:03:46.680 a you know, thirty years ago or so, and back 0:03:46.720 --> 0:03:49.200 then they didn't have the electronic key cards. You needed 0:03:49.200 --> 0:03:51.480 a key to get in the door, and the door 0:03:51.560 --> 0:03:54.960 latsed automatically, but Joe Kaplan was sure when he left 0:03:55.000 --> 0:03:57.440 the room, he did what most people do, checked to 0:03:57.520 --> 0:04:00.200 made sure it was securely locked, because they didn't one 0:04:00.240 --> 0:04:04.360 it opened with Rooda in. They're taking a shower. When 0:04:04.440 --> 0:04:06.800 Rhoda gets to the hospital, she dies. They take her 0:04:06.800 --> 0:04:09.520 to the coroner's office and lo and behold, they find 0:04:09.520 --> 0:04:12.520 that she died from blunt for's trauma. A couple other 0:04:12.600 --> 0:04:15.200 things about her body. There was a couple of distinctive 0:04:15.240 --> 0:04:18.520 bruises that were developed on her body. One was very 0:04:18.560 --> 0:04:22.640 consistent with a walkie talkie, which some of the workers 0:04:22.640 --> 0:04:25.719 in the hotel were issued. Elwood Jones was one of those. 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:28.760 There was also a door chain a latch, which is 0:04:28.839 --> 0:04:31.000 kind of an unusual mark to have on a body. 0:04:31.320 --> 0:04:33.919 She also had that on her body, and it told 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:37.239 us that whoever did this three things we know for sure. 0:04:37.720 --> 0:04:40.440 The person had to have a master key. The person 0:04:40.480 --> 0:04:42.960 also had to have a walkie talkie, and the person 0:04:43.000 --> 0:04:46.039 also had to have one of these door latches. We 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:50.080 also know that the person that did this took Rhoda's necklace. 0:04:50.920 --> 0:04:54.120 When Elwood Jones arrived at work that morning, everybody noticed 0:04:54.160 --> 0:04:57.159 he was fine. A couple hours later, people noticed that 0:04:57.200 --> 0:05:00.320 his left hand was bandaged, and people said, Elwood, what 0:05:00.400 --> 0:05:02.800 happened to your hand? And one person he said, oh, 0:05:02.839 --> 0:05:04.520 I was taking some trash out and I fell and 0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:06.960 I cut it. And somebody else asked him he says, well, 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:09.120 when I was up on the second floor taking down 0:05:09.160 --> 0:05:12.000 that banquet room, a piece of the floor and fell 0:05:12.040 --> 0:05:13.160 on my hand and he cut it. 0:05:13.400 --> 0:05:15.120 So some inconsistent things. 0:05:15.839 --> 0:05:20.159 Immediately, when Blue Ass started investigating, they realized one very 0:05:20.160 --> 0:05:23.279 important thing. Whoever did this had to be in the 0:05:23.320 --> 0:05:25.920 hotel that morning and had to have a master key, 0:05:26.240 --> 0:05:29.400 and that limited the suspect pool from hundreds of people 0:05:29.400 --> 0:05:32.200 in the hotel to about four people. You know what 0:05:32.240 --> 0:05:34.080 I'm saying this, I feel like I've given an opening 0:05:34.120 --> 0:05:36.720 statement again. But these are the facts, and this is 0:05:36.760 --> 0:05:40.720 what we presented to the jury. About four or five 0:05:40.800 --> 0:05:44.720 days later, Elwood's hand got very infected and he's thinking, 0:05:45.080 --> 0:05:47.640 I'd better do something about this, and he goes to 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:51.039 some clinic and there's a doctor, John McDonough, who taught 0:05:51.240 --> 0:05:53.360 at UC Med School, and he was one of the 0:05:53.400 --> 0:05:56.719 best hand surgeons in the country. And one day a 0:05:56.800 --> 0:05:59.200 month he would volunteer to go to this clinic and 0:05:59.240 --> 0:06:02.680 treat people basically for free. It's almost like God said, 0:06:03.000 --> 0:06:05.800 I want you there that day because I want someone 0:06:05.839 --> 0:06:08.359 to see what Elwood has. And Elwood comes in and 0:06:08.400 --> 0:06:11.440 his left hand has severely sworn. It's Elwood, what what 0:06:11.560 --> 0:06:13.240 happened to your hand? And he gives them a couple 0:06:13.279 --> 0:06:16.839 other stories. And the doctor knows that anytime you've got 0:06:16.839 --> 0:06:19.560 a cut in one of your knuckles, chances are you 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:22.800 pop somebody in the mouth. He also knows that inside 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:27.760 the human gum line there's a bacteria Aikinella crodins I 0:06:27.800 --> 0:06:29.880 don't know science very well. Hell, I want to Roger 0:06:29.920 --> 0:06:33.039 Bacon I Joe couldn't get in, but he had to 0:06:33.120 --> 0:06:37.680 settle for saying it's just sad, you know, but we 0:06:37.720 --> 0:06:40.760 have standards like you. Anyway, he knew that if I 0:06:40.880 --> 0:06:44.839 don't treat this hand for Konella crones or tests for it, 0:06:45.040 --> 0:06:47.640 he's going to lose his hand. So even though Elwood 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:49.880 said I cut it on something, he tested for this 0:06:50.000 --> 0:06:53.000 bacteria that's in the gum line. Lo and behold, it's 0:06:53.040 --> 0:06:56.520 Akonela crodins. In fact, he was so sure of this 0:06:57.120 --> 0:07:00.200 he took a picture of Elwood's hand to teach to 0:07:00.200 --> 0:07:03.120 his medical students and said, if anybody ever comes in 0:07:03.320 --> 0:07:06.600 with a hand swollen like this, you've got to test 0:07:06.640 --> 0:07:09.200 for that bacteria because if you don't, they're probably gonna 0:07:09.200 --> 0:07:12.520 lose their hands. So when this came out, everybody started 0:07:12.560 --> 0:07:16.000 focusing on Elwood. Blue Ash police got a search warrant 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:18.320 for his car, for his home, for his trunk of 0:07:18.360 --> 0:07:21.560 his car. A couple things they found. Number one, they 0:07:21.600 --> 0:07:25.400 found Milwaukee talkie that actually Joe and I went to Washington, 0:07:25.520 --> 0:07:27.720 d C. And had the FBI lab look at it, 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:30.640 and they were able to match it again it's Alwaukee talkie. 0:07:30.680 --> 0:07:33.680 There were more than one in that hotel, but it 0:07:33.840 --> 0:07:37.520 matched all the rivets and everything matched exactly. The mark 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:42.120 on road in Nathan's check chest. Also in his toolbox 0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:45.480 there was one of these door latches and that also 0:07:45.720 --> 0:07:50.520 matched the toolmark. The impression of that door lock on 0:07:51.200 --> 0:07:54.040 her chest, which is again that's a lot more unusual 0:07:54.080 --> 0:07:57.840 than Milwaukee talkie. But the absolute thing that clinched it 0:07:57.920 --> 0:08:02.360 all was that pendant of Rooda Nathan. There were a 0:08:02.400 --> 0:08:05.280 picture of taking of Roda Nathan wearing that, and it 0:08:05.440 --> 0:08:09.360 matched exactly that pendant found in the trunk of Elwood 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:12.320 Jones's car. I think that's a pretty darn good case. 0:08:12.800 --> 0:08:16.920 Rhoda is almost reaching back from the grave saying the 0:08:16.960 --> 0:08:20.640 evidence of my killing is in possession of the murderer, 0:08:20.880 --> 0:08:23.080 and that man was Edward Jones. And Rotea had that 0:08:23.200 --> 0:08:24.160 virus in her mouth. 0:08:24.760 --> 0:08:28.280 That was so that's how the infection occurred. 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.240 Joe. When I read and you looked at the news 0:08:31.240 --> 0:08:35.080 conference of our new prosecutor, Connie Pillage, she uses words 0:08:35.120 --> 0:08:38.520 like cheat it in quotes that you and Mark cheated. 0:08:39.120 --> 0:08:44.959 She also used terms that you withheld evidence well, in 0:08:44.960 --> 0:08:48.360 other words, she's accusing you two of making sure that 0:08:48.440 --> 0:08:51.640 an innocent man is convicted and the guilty guy gets 0:08:51.679 --> 0:08:54.880 all free. Whoever, this mystery man is with OJ Simpson 0:08:54.880 --> 0:08:57.120 in a sand trap. So how do you respond to 0:08:57.160 --> 0:09:01.040 this allegation of Connie Pillach, who never tried a criminal 0:09:01.080 --> 0:09:03.440 case in her life, that you cheated. 0:09:04.440 --> 0:09:09.800 I'm, frankly, I'm dumbfounded by the allegation. She's further stated 0:09:09.880 --> 0:09:16.200 she's cleared him because of modern medical scientific evidence. I 0:09:16.240 --> 0:09:18.760 don't know what she's talking about. If she is talking 0:09:18.760 --> 0:09:24.040 about hepatitis B. The defense's own witness, in his request 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:26.640 for a new trial, said there was about a thirty 0:09:26.679 --> 0:09:30.240 three percent chance of him getting that by punching her 0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:30.880 in the mouth. 0:09:31.400 --> 0:09:32.000 So it's not. 0:09:33.440 --> 0:09:35.000 How can you exclude. 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:38.320 Somebody when there's a seventy or sixty seven percent chance 0:09:38.679 --> 0:09:45.160 that that could still be true. But the allegation, Look, 0:09:45.880 --> 0:09:48.079 I said this in the letter. I hope the people 0:09:48.080 --> 0:09:49.600 that are listening to this could have a chance to 0:09:49.679 --> 0:09:50.320 read the letter. 0:09:50.360 --> 0:09:51.080 It's not that long. 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:54.920 It's on our website, it's on your website. 0:09:55.240 --> 0:09:56.480 It's just so offensive. 0:09:57.880 --> 0:10:01.760 If she wants to let this guy go, maybe she says, oh, 0:10:01.800 --> 0:10:05.120 you know what, thirty years is enough, the litigation is enough. 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:08.960 In mercy for whatever reason decides to let him go. 0:10:09.040 --> 0:10:11.840 I got no problem with that. She's the prosecutor. She 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:14.800 can do whatever she wants. What I take umbrage to 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:21.720 is accusing the prosecutor's office of what I mean, seriously, 0:10:22.480 --> 0:10:25.800 she's accusing people of a crime here hiding evidence. I mean, 0:10:25.840 --> 0:10:30.199 that is outrageous to make that allegation. There's no proof 0:10:30.240 --> 0:10:34.360 of it. And even that, Look, we had the trial, 0:10:35.440 --> 0:10:40.400 it went through all the judges in state court, affirmed, affirmed, affirmed, 0:10:40.880 --> 0:10:43.080 Then they go to federal court. And when they went 0:10:43.120 --> 0:10:45.960 to federal court, they asked for all these documents from 0:10:46.280 --> 0:10:50.720 Blush police. We're basically questionnaires given to everybody stay at 0:10:50.760 --> 0:10:55.640 the hotel. The vast majority was we didn't see anything. 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:56.400 Okay. 0:10:56.559 --> 0:10:59.800 That's the thousands of pages of evidence that was hidden, 0:11:00.280 --> 0:11:04.640 and then police runs to the hotel. The Federal Court 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:09.040 of Appeals, the judge of at the trial level said 0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:13.680 that the material was in fact immaterial and it would 0:11:13.760 --> 0:11:16.760 not have affected the outcome of this trial. Then it 0:11:16.840 --> 0:11:19.280 went all the way to the six Circuit Court of Appeals, 0:11:19.280 --> 0:11:23.200 Federal Court Appeals on the same issues exact same issues, 0:11:23.760 --> 0:11:29.880 and they unanimously affirmed that too. So this has been 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:33.800 litigated before, and to claim now that we've hid evidence 0:11:34.720 --> 0:11:39.439 or that you can exclude this guy is total bull crap. 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:39.960 Okay. 0:11:40.040 --> 0:11:43.319 Also, she said the modern scientific when she said that, I, 0:11:43.480 --> 0:11:44.960 you know, I think about DNA. 0:11:45.160 --> 0:11:45.840 That's what I thought. 0:11:47.160 --> 0:11:49.400 There's no DNA. She was talking about a hepatitis B 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:52.520 that one third of the time is communicated two thirds 0:11:52.559 --> 0:11:55.920 of time not Also, Mark Petemyer, you were in charge 0:11:55.960 --> 0:12:00.360 of providing to the defense in this case all available evidence. 0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:03.280 You've been accused of playing a game of Lucy Hyde 0:12:03.320 --> 0:12:06.240 the football, and that you had these thousands and thousands 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:10.720 of pages of inculpatory or exculpatory evidence that you refuse. 0:12:10.840 --> 0:12:12.679 You knew what was in there, and you didn't want 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:14.920 to give it to the defense because it proved that 0:12:14.960 --> 0:12:18.280 Elwood was innocent. That's the allegation of Connie Pillage. You're 0:12:18.320 --> 0:12:20.640 the guy in charge of giving the papers. What do 0:12:20.640 --> 0:12:22.800 you say about that one? That's just not true. 0:12:22.840 --> 0:12:25.560 And Bill, you've tried a lot of cases too, including 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:28.760 murder cases, and the rules of discovery back then is 0:12:28.840 --> 0:12:32.240 the basically everything you had you gave to the defense. 0:12:32.360 --> 0:12:35.520 One thing they were not entitled to were witnesses statements. 0:12:35.600 --> 0:12:38.200 Now since then the law has been changed. But as 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:41.000 you know, if I called Joe Deaders as a witness 0:12:41.000 --> 0:12:44.760 and he's made a prior statement before you cross examine him, 0:12:45.000 --> 0:12:47.800 you can ask the judge to review his prior statement, 0:12:48.000 --> 0:12:50.120 and the judge will do that, and if there's anything 0:12:50.120 --> 0:12:52.959 in there inconsistent here, say hey here, Bill, you can 0:12:53.000 --> 0:12:55.360 cross examined leaders on this because he said some things 0:12:55.400 --> 0:12:58.040 different that happened during the trial a couple times. 0:12:58.240 --> 0:13:01.040 That's the only thing that was not given. But again 0:13:01.080 --> 0:13:03.640 they had access to it during the trial. All this 0:13:03.720 --> 0:13:06.400 other stuff, these questionnaires at Blue ass sent out that 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:09.920 meant nothing. As far as I know, we never got 0:13:09.960 --> 0:13:13.840 and we certainly never got afterwards. We never subpoenaed the 0:13:13.880 --> 0:13:16.240 records of all the crimes that ever took place in 0:13:16.240 --> 0:13:19.520 that hotel. I remember they had some prostitution ring if 0:13:19.559 --> 0:13:22.920 you going on back there years ago, that a lot 0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:25.240 of people were prosecuted for that, they had some undercover 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:26.000 cops in there. 0:13:26.160 --> 0:13:28.440 Those are the kind of records they also subpoened. So 0:13:28.920 --> 0:13:32.160 the vast, vast majority of this stuff we never had. 0:13:32.559 --> 0:13:35.400 But the federal judge got all this all this stuff 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:39.760 that they said proved he was innocent and that we withheld. Again, 0:13:39.880 --> 0:13:42.160 we didn't even have it. The judges looked at it 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:46.320 and says, there's nothing here. This is absolutely nothing that 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:48.880 exculpates Elwood Jones. 0:13:48.880 --> 0:13:51.080 And that's why it's already been ruled on. That's why 0:13:51.120 --> 0:13:56.000 when a common police judge basically overruled the federal judge 0:13:56.120 --> 0:13:58.640 and the Federal six Circuit Court of Appeals, it's like, 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:02.360 what's going on. Judge Cross never been on the bench before. 0:14:03.080 --> 0:14:05.400 She's a brand new judge from the Public Defender's Office, 0:14:05.760 --> 0:14:07.640 and she held a four day hearing on emotion for 0:14:07.679 --> 0:14:10.920 a new trial, essentially the appetitis B issue and not 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:14.240 giving over the document she used to explain, what's the motivation? 0:14:14.440 --> 0:14:15.840 Joe Dieters, what's the motivation? 0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:18.679 I have no idea why you would do this. 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:22.760 I mean, she's parroting the talking points of the defense attorneys, 0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:26.200 which is a good thing sometimes, well for you maybe, 0:14:26.240 --> 0:14:29.440 But she's supposed to be representing the state of Ohio. 0:14:29.800 --> 0:14:33.000 And you know, and I know this is kind of 0:14:33.000 --> 0:14:37.080 personal in nature, but I was the prosecutor and I 0:14:37.200 --> 0:14:42.280 litigated this case for twenty five years, and she clearly 0:14:42.320 --> 0:14:43.680 talked to the defense attorneys. 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:45.480 She was in a press commerce. 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:47.880 She said, oh why send them a screenshot of my 0:14:48.640 --> 0:14:52.360 emotion to dismiss the whole case, you know, almost gleefully. 0:14:53.360 --> 0:14:56.680 And she never called me one time. 0:14:57.760 --> 0:14:58.360 I've met her. 0:14:58.440 --> 0:15:01.560 One time, I said, if you need thing, feel free 0:15:01.640 --> 0:15:05.520 to call me. Be happy to talk to you about 0:15:05.520 --> 0:15:09.080 the office. But so she talks to the I don't 0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:11.520 know who she talked to besides these defense attorneys that 0:15:11.560 --> 0:15:14.720 she said she talked to. But anyone who thinks that 0:15:15.160 --> 0:15:20.640 Ellwood's been excluded, Uh, I'm trying to be judicious about this. 0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:28.320 It's either dead wrong or they're lying. You know, they 0:15:28.360 --> 0:15:31.880 just don't understand what this What exclusion means, it's gonna turn. 0:15:31.960 --> 0:15:34.920 It means he can't possibly be the guy. That's what 0:15:34.960 --> 0:15:35.840 Connie Pillage said. 0:15:35.880 --> 0:15:39.040 This cannot be the guy Mark Petemer based upon the 0:15:39.120 --> 0:15:41.760 layout of the case. This can and in fact, there's 0:15:41.760 --> 0:15:44.120 somebody out there who committed this other than El would 0:15:44.320 --> 0:15:46.600 now talk about his record many you didn't talk about it. 0:15:46.600 --> 0:15:49.560 He was in his early forties when he committed these crimes. 0:15:50.040 --> 0:15:52.800 And you know, I watched the Curtis Fuller interview at 0:15:52.840 --> 0:15:55.720 Channel five and almost seem like a he was a 0:15:55.720 --> 0:15:58.400 boy scout leader. When we come back, I want you 0:15:58.440 --> 0:16:01.040 to talk about the previous record Eldwood Jones. Well, this 0:16:01.240 --> 0:16:04.360 misbehavior is consistent, which includes, by the way, assault on 0:16:04.400 --> 0:16:07.000 a police officer. We'll talk about that on the other side. 0:16:07.080 --> 0:16:10.040 And by the way, the letter is on our Twitter account. 0:16:10.280 --> 0:16:12.800 Let's continue with more. Bill Cunningham with Mark Pete Meyer 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:22.920 and Joe Eaters on news Radio seven hundred WLWN. Let's 0:16:22.920 --> 0:16:25.360 continue now we have in the studio Joe Meeters and 0:16:25.400 --> 0:16:28.040 also Mark Pete Meyer left it kind of hanging because 0:16:28.080 --> 0:16:31.400 many times this is such a vicious beating. Some of 0:16:31.480 --> 0:16:33.520 wrote his teeth was found in her stomach. 0:16:33.560 --> 0:16:35.840 Correct, there was one on the floor of the hotel 0:16:35.920 --> 0:16:37.440 room and one was found in her stomach. 0:16:37.520 --> 0:16:41.120 Yes, Now, what was the previous criminal record of Elwood Jones. 0:16:42.200 --> 0:16:44.680 You know, it's interesting because when they did the podcast, 0:16:44.760 --> 0:16:47.640 the inquiry reported to the original podcast, she says, well, well, 0:16:47.640 --> 0:16:49.920 wouldn't no, you're not a saint, or he goes, oh no, no, 0:16:49.960 --> 0:16:52.440 I gotta admit I'm a thief. I'm a thief, and 0:16:52.600 --> 0:16:55.000 it was all they laughed about that, like it's okay. 0:16:55.680 --> 0:16:57.920 But he was more than a thief. He was arrested 0:16:58.000 --> 0:17:01.320 five or six times for assault, you know, beating someone, 0:17:01.840 --> 0:17:04.800 once for domestic violence, which would have been beating his wife, 0:17:05.200 --> 0:17:08.040 once for assault on a police officer. But he was 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:12.000 also arrested four times, four different times for aggravated burglar, 0:17:12.080 --> 0:17:16.560 which is breaking into someone's residence to steal something. After 0:17:16.600 --> 0:17:18.959 I guess the first couple. He actually was convicted on 0:17:18.960 --> 0:17:22.480 one of those and went to prison, apparently convinced the 0:17:22.480 --> 0:17:25.120 par board that hey, I've been scared straight, I learned 0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:27.280 my lesson. You're not going to see me again. They 0:17:27.320 --> 0:17:29.600 cut him loose early, and with a short amount of 0:17:29.680 --> 0:17:32.639 time he was arrested and convicted of another burglary and 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:36.400 went down to prison. So Elwood Jones was a career criminal, 0:17:36.440 --> 0:17:39.439 and what better place for a guy like him to 0:17:39.520 --> 0:17:42.160 work at a nice hotel with a master key. 0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:44.520 It's like a kid in a candy store. One of 0:17:44.600 --> 0:17:47.359 the other allegations of County pillage was that there was 0:17:47.359 --> 0:17:51.480 someone else who would confessed to the murder of Elwood Jones. 0:17:51.760 --> 0:17:53.800 Can you ferret out the facts in that matter? 0:17:54.240 --> 0:17:57.760 Yes, this was first came to light, I think from 0:17:57.800 --> 0:18:00.919 one of his attorneys twenty years after the murder happened, 0:18:00.920 --> 0:18:03.960 but they had a lady who said back around that 0:18:04.240 --> 0:18:06.600 shortly after this happened, she was locked up in the 0:18:06.800 --> 0:18:09.639 justice center and her cell mate was a lady I 0:18:09.680 --> 0:18:11.800 think her name was Linda Reid. And they get to 0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:14.960 be talking, kicking a little bit, and Linda Reid tells 0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:17.119 this lady, I have to tell you something. You know 0:18:17.200 --> 0:18:20.800 that person that's been arrested on that embassy suite's case. Yes, yes, 0:18:21.000 --> 0:18:23.720 well my husband the one is really did it, and 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:27.119 the Blue Ash Police framed that guy for it, but 0:18:27.200 --> 0:18:29.240 my husband is really the one. 0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:31.600 That is important stuff right now, Yeah, this is big. 0:18:31.640 --> 0:18:34.480 Well somebody confessed to it. So you're Mark Petmer's your 0:18:34.480 --> 0:18:36.560 ears looked like a rabbit. Well this is you know, 0:18:36.600 --> 0:18:38.920 it is twenty years later, but still, who is this guy? 0:18:38.920 --> 0:18:41.199 I mean, I never remember number one. He didn't work 0:18:41.280 --> 0:18:44.040 for Blue ass Police. Number two, there's no association with 0:18:44.160 --> 0:18:47.600 him in the hotel. And then we find out at 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:49.960 the time this lady is locked up and she's telling 0:18:49.960 --> 0:18:53.119 her cellmate this. She's going through a divorce with her husband. 0:18:53.200 --> 0:18:55.920 So I'm thinking, well, that's kind of red flag number one. 0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.040 But I don't say, you know what, I'm gonna go 0:18:58.040 --> 0:19:00.600 over and pull the domestic relations court case and see, 0:19:00.600 --> 0:19:03.000 maybe this guy is a violent guy and he's constantly 0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:05.320 beating the crap out of her, and maybe it's something 0:19:05.400 --> 0:19:07.760 like that. When I pull the file, I see it's 0:19:08.600 --> 0:19:12.800 Ken Peller, guardian for Ken Peller's a local attorney, guardian 0:19:12.800 --> 0:19:16.960 for Linda Red versus mister Reed. And I'm thinking, why 0:19:17.000 --> 0:19:19.199 does she have a guardian? I mean, why is she 0:19:19.280 --> 0:19:21.720 not participating in the divorce. So I look further and 0:19:21.760 --> 0:19:26.119 actually contacted Ken Peller. He says she was incompetent. She 0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:29.840 was mentally incompetent to participate. That's the hook upon which 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:31.760 Connie Pillage hanged part of this. Well. 0:19:31.800 --> 0:19:34.679 First of one, it's double hearsay because the guy that 0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:37.800 really did it is dead. His wife is really dead, 0:19:37.920 --> 0:19:40.960 So the person that did it telling his wife is 0:19:41.000 --> 0:19:43.480 hearsay it, and his wife telling this other lady is 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:47.800 double hearsay. So number one, it's legally admissible, inadmissible. But 0:19:48.680 --> 0:19:51.560 this lady that said it was found crazy by the 0:19:51.640 --> 0:19:53.880 court so much that she couldn't even participate in. 0:19:53.800 --> 0:19:57.040 Her own divorce. No way in the world that is evidence. 0:19:57.160 --> 0:20:00.879 But that is the third prong Again, Number one is 0:20:00.960 --> 0:20:03.800 the evidence that we withheld that the court said no. 0:20:04.280 --> 0:20:07.199 Number two is the hepatitis, which only a third of 0:20:07.240 --> 0:20:09.480 the people. In fact, the study that I referred to 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:12.240 us people that use needles of other people, and you're 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:13.600 very likely probably. 0:20:13.320 --> 0:20:15.679 To get it there, but a third of those people 0:20:15.760 --> 0:20:17.240 get it. Only a third. 0:20:17.320 --> 0:20:20.080 So anyway, those are the three prongs based on that 0:20:20.440 --> 0:20:21.160 he's cleared. 0:20:21.200 --> 0:20:26.200 He's yeah, someone else confessed, Joe talk about hepatitis b 0:20:26.400 --> 0:20:29.040 because you told me off there. There was some reference 0:20:29.080 --> 0:20:33.000 in the optops optops the well, the defense. 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:36.400 Initially said, we hid the fact that she had hepatitis. 0:20:36.440 --> 0:20:36.919 Did you do that? 0:20:37.840 --> 0:20:39.959 Well, it was in the autopsy report that they got. 0:20:40.080 --> 0:20:42.000 It was in black and white. Yes, it was inlaps, 0:20:42.040 --> 0:20:43.879 he said. And I don't have to tell them what 0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:46.800 defense to pursue. They can do whatever they want. You know, 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:51.399 it's not my job. But they received information she had hepatitis. 0:20:52.040 --> 0:20:54.000 You know the reason I wanted to come her bills. 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:56.320 I was so offended by that press conference. 0:20:56.359 --> 0:20:56.960 I mean, it was. 0:20:59.119 --> 0:21:06.840