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Speaker 1: Enter this nation.

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Speaker 2: Y keyword on our website, grant, that's grand. Enter it now.

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Speaker 2: Bengals Nation lives here.

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Speaker 3: ESPN fifteen thirty.

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Speaker 1: That's right, it's a three minutes after three o'clock. This

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Speaker 1: is ESPN fifteen thirty one.

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Speaker 4: ED.

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Speaker 2: Thank you so much for listening.

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Speaker 1: We are posting up inside at Oakley Greens, which is

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Speaker 1: an awesome place to watch college basketball, which you can

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Speaker 1: do tonight. You got UC versus Dayton, you got Kentucky

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Speaker 1: versus Louisville. You could watch those games here at Oakley Greens.

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Speaker 1: You can watch any college basketball game you wanted Oakley Greens.

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Speaker 1: They are fully decorated for the holiday season. They even

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Speaker 1: have some of the TVs right now. They got like

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Speaker 1: a fake fireplace, which just it doesn't really bring any heat,

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Speaker 1: but it just makes me feel warmer. We love the

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Speaker 1: folks at Oakley Greens. We are here every single Tuesday.

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Speaker 1: Great place to watch Bengals games. Bengals Steelers on Sunday,

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Speaker 1: FC Cincinnati a week from Sunday as the Orange and

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Speaker 1: Blue plays in the Eastern Conference semi finals. Awesome for

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Speaker 1: your holiday parties, Awesome for us every single Tuesday, especially

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Speaker 1: when Paul Danner juniors here as he is for the

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Speaker 1: three o'clock hour from the Athletic dot Com and the

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Speaker 1: Growler Podcast.

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Speaker 2: How are we doing? I'm doing great. You know, the

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Speaker 2: Oakley Greens has enough space that you could have a

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Speaker 2: separate cheering section tonight. Yes, for your your Dayton people

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Speaker 2: and your Cincinnati people. Keep them, keep them separated, you know,

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Speaker 2: much like we need between you guys here.

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Speaker 1: Cat fans and Dayton fans. We're not talking about a

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Speaker 1: bunch of ruffians.

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Speaker 2: Ok.

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Speaker 1: These are nice people who can live with somebody else

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Speaker 1: rooting against their team. There's no reason to keep everybody separate.

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Speaker 1: You talk about the two kindest, most understanding fan bases,

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Speaker 1: Cincinnati and Dayton.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Sure, And I just say that if you want

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Speaker 2: to sit in separate, there's plenty of space to do, yes,

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Speaker 2: so you don't have to worry about being like next

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Speaker 2: to the guy who's rooting a little too hard and

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Speaker 2: a little too in your face about a team. I'm

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Speaker 2: not saying it would be these two lovely fan bases

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Speaker 2: of no, of course not. But it does happen with

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Speaker 2: sports Kentucky and Louisville right now. Excepate I would need

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Speaker 2: separate buildings.

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Speaker 1: Well, you could put them all in here and and

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Speaker 1: and sort of just work your way among all the

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Speaker 1: use and Dayton fans tonight and you'll be good to go.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely plenty of plenty of good games.

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Speaker 1: It's awesome to have you. Not a lot going on

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Speaker 1: in the Monday after the bye week. I really thought

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Speaker 1: we'd get a nice call Monday. I think, you know

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Speaker 1: what coming out of.

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Speaker 2: The by it's it's what's gonna happen today? You know,

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Speaker 2: let's just let's just ease into the week, and then

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Speaker 2: no easing into the week this week. That's okay, though,

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Speaker 2: I'll take a distraction from the topics that we have

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Speaker 2: been hammering home. So at least for a few minutes,

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Speaker 2: it felt like we could be like, oh hey, a

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Speaker 2: nice thing. So that's kind of how I was for

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Speaker 2: a few minutes, and then immediately brought back down to earth, realizing, yeah,

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Speaker 2: it doesn't really.

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Speaker 1: I never would have thought that Joe Burrow announcing his

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Speaker 1: pseudo return and offering a timeline earlier than anybody expected,

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Speaker 1: would have listened a shoulder shrug. And yet that's where

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Speaker 1: a lot of us were yesterday. That's where I ended up.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think it's I mean, I think what

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Speaker 2: Joe is doing is again I sort of wrote about it.

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Speaker 2: It's like, hey, Joe's doing the hero stuff again, Like

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Speaker 2: this is unbelievable. He does this all the time, and

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Speaker 2: he always it's it's always unbelievable, and people understandably rally

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Speaker 2: around it, and it can it can pull a whole

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Speaker 2: organization along with him when he when he does these

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Speaker 2: types of things. The problem inevitably is though, Like to me,

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Speaker 2: my take on yesterday was that the Joe Burrow return

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Speaker 2: news was not the biggest news to come out of yesterday. No,

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Speaker 2: the biggest news to come out of yesterday was already

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Speaker 2: Trey Hendrickson is doubtful for this weekend. That's who they need.

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Speaker 1: That's the hero they need right now is number ninety one.

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Speaker 2: Yes, they they have the I'm not everybody wants to

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Speaker 2: take this the wrong way when I say this, they

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Speaker 2: already have. Over the last month since Joe Flacco arrived

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Speaker 2: at Cincinnati, the number one offense in football by Epapril play,

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Speaker 2: they've scored thirty eight. They scored eighty and two weeks

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Speaker 2: thirty three. Like the offense is just not the problem.

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Speaker 2: They need something otherwise, You're back in the same situation

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Speaker 2: when we were in last year, when Burrow was playing

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Speaker 2: right at at the level he was, So, yeah, it's cool, Yes,

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Speaker 2: I Burrows better than Flacco. I shouldn't have to say that,

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Speaker 2: but like you do, and it's fine, like, yeah, yes,

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Speaker 2: obviously that would be good. This is a good development.

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Speaker 2: But it doesn't change the point of the twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: five season is that this it doesn't matter if they

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Speaker 2: can't find somebody or some way to get a stop.

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Speaker 2: The only hope was that maybe Trey Hendrick saying can

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Speaker 2: get healthy and be the one to come back and

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Speaker 2: give you that stop that you need. And now he's

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Speaker 2: already viewed as doubt which they're not even not even

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Speaker 2: playing the fake game, you know, the game where we

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Speaker 2: do the like I don't know, we'll see you're gonna

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Speaker 2: get him through the week now Wednesday, Yeah, no, doubtful.

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Speaker 2: And so we're just all ready to that point in

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Speaker 2: a game where, let's be honest, they're gonna need them.

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Speaker 2: They're gonna get into the fourth quarter in Pittsburgh, it's

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Speaker 2: gonna be close or something like that, and you're gonna say, oh,

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Speaker 2: they just need third and eight, just need one guy.

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Speaker 2: To get back there, and nobody will the.

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Speaker 1: Pittsburgh game last year, the game, yeah, or or a

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Speaker 1: few weeks ago, you know, before the very end where

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Speaker 1: every game ever for the last two years, it feels

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Speaker 1: like when he's not out there, So yeah, to me,

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Speaker 1: it's great, and we can talk all about the borough contingencies,

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Speaker 1: but they don't really matter because even Burrow at his best,

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Speaker 1: as we learned last year, can't counter what's happening on

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Speaker 1: the other side of the football.

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Speaker 2: And that's sort of the sad thing. Like I Bengals

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Speaker 2: fans sent me the Lieutenant Dan on New Year's meme

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Speaker 2: that I feel like that's just how it feels. It's

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Speaker 2: like everyone should kind of be celebrating, but the one

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Speaker 2: that knows it's like, yeah, I know, but I'm still

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Speaker 2: sad because the reality is that this is your life

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Speaker 2: right now.

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Speaker 1: So we were doing the show yesterday, the Tony and

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Speaker 1: Mo Football Show, and I was driving to go do it,

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Speaker 1: and I thought like I should be stoked, like I

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Speaker 1: should feel like, all right, game on, just in the

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Speaker 1: nick of time, the season can be saved. And I

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Speaker 1: felt at two o'clock yesterday afternoon the same way that

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Speaker 1: I felt at nine o'clock yesterday morning, before I saw

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Speaker 1: that Joe Burrow was coming back in practice. Yeah, Joe

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Speaker 1: Burrow's return should not not move the meter the way

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Speaker 1: it did.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know, we shouldn't be talking about the

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Speaker 2: nineteen sixty six New York Giants or the nineteen twenty

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Speaker 2: one Takawanda Whatever's like. I mean, this is where this

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Speaker 2: is just the part of the issue. I mean, this

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Speaker 2: is part of everything right now, is there's a hopelessness

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Speaker 2: because you don't see answers that can really help you

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Speaker 2: right now. But yeah, I mean, it's exciting. It'd be

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Speaker 2: cool to see Burrow come back and be that guy again.

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Speaker 2: And I think that there's a juice that you can

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Speaker 2: get from that in a locker room. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 2: but I don't know that that goes, you know, all

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Speaker 2: that far when you have so much to overcome.

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Speaker 1: So I think for a lot of us, the discussion

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Speaker 1: has become about the value in Burrow playing if the

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Speaker 1: losing continues. So he's not gonna play on Sunday. I

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Speaker 1: certainly think they have more than a puncher's chance to

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Speaker 1: beat the Pittsburgh Steelers, but you know, they are underdogs

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Speaker 1: on the road. They've won one of their last seven,

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Speaker 1: so you certainly don't assume victory. It's completely plausible to

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Speaker 1: think that they will lose the next two games against

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Speaker 1: Pittsburgh and home for New England. At that point, they're

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Speaker 1: three to eight and maybe not mathematically out of it.

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Speaker 1: But what is already a long shot becomes even longer,

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Speaker 1: and then so for a lot of us, there's then

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Speaker 1: no value in Joe playing. You wrote this quote, even

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Speaker 1: if out of it, Even if they're out of it,

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Speaker 1: don't expect Burrow to stand down in his desire to

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Speaker 1: get back under center. So he's playing no matter what,

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Speaker 1: when when he's cleared, when he when he finally feels

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Speaker 1: right close to one hundred percent, at least, he's playing

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Speaker 1: no matter what.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so, I think his sense is when

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Speaker 2: I'm healthy, I'm the quarterback and I'm here to play.

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Speaker 2: I mean, this goes back to last year at four

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Speaker 2: and eight. We're gonna find out who is this you

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Speaker 2: know we're going to go forward with on this team,

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Speaker 2: and that all this stuff matters.

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Speaker 1: I can help answer that question for this year right now.

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Speaker 2: I know DJ Turner, yes, yes, but I yeah, I

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Speaker 2: feel like it goes back to that idea that this

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Speaker 2: is not to me, this is not gonna be Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you're impacted by wins and losses, somebody. This is gonna

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Speaker 2: be about what the doctor says, is there is there

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Speaker 2: a risk here of reinjury. You know, if you had

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Speaker 2: surgery and you're all the way back and cleared and

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Speaker 2: you're doing and there's not not really any risk of

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Speaker 2: re injury, then if he wants to then you should

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Speaker 2: play like I mean, this is I get like shelving him,

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Speaker 2: but if this is not about reinjury, he's a quarterback, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: like he wants to play football, he should play football.

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Speaker 2: There's there's value in it. Playing out the string or

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Speaker 2: not playing out the string. I mean, no one would

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Speaker 2: have thought at all they would have had a chance

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Speaker 2: to get back into it at four and eight last

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Speaker 2: year and they ripped off a bunch of wins and

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Speaker 2: did find a way. Like to me, I understand the

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Speaker 2: desire to be like it's over, man, like, just don't

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Speaker 2: go hurt yourself that right, Joe Burrow didn't get to

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Speaker 2: this point with that attitude. That's not who he is, right,

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Speaker 2: And it's not who he is as a person, as

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Speaker 2: a player and he's gonna want to play, and I

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Speaker 2: don't think anybody should tell him not to if he's

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Speaker 2: healthy and there's no extra chance of re injury associated

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Speaker 2: with this, and that's that's for the doctors to say

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Speaker 2: at that point in time.

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Speaker 1: Even if we get to a point where they are

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Speaker 1: mathematically eliminated.

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Speaker 2: I think so. I mean, again, if he's healthy, what's

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Speaker 2: holding him back? I mean other than than should you

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Speaker 2: shut him down every time we how many times we

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Speaker 2: watch this guy in the fourth quarter of a game

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Speaker 2: where they were down by thirty, Yeah, taking zero blitzes

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Speaker 2: in the face, didn't want to come out, not going

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Speaker 2: to come out in respect. That not who I am.

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Speaker 2: I need this team. This is my team met no

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Speaker 2: matter what out of it, in it, whatever, If he's healthy,

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Speaker 2: that's you know, that's what they want to be. It's

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Speaker 2: what they want this team to be. They want this

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Speaker 2: team to be people that don't quit, that are like, look,

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Speaker 2: we're in it. We're with as long as we can

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Speaker 2: go out there and play. And again the risk situation,

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Speaker 2: but as long as that's not an issue, then go

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Speaker 2: play football. And I think that everybody, as long as

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Speaker 2: the doctors are on board with that, would be on

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Speaker 2: board with that.

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Speaker 1: I understand.

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Speaker 2: I understand why fans like I don't want to see

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Speaker 2: him every no play when it doesn't matter. But that's

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Speaker 2: just that's not what's gonna help build this team back better.

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Speaker 2: I don't think.

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Speaker 1: To me, it's kind of like the preseason. It sounds

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Speaker 1: great on Tuesday afternoon, Hey, Joe should play in the preseason,

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Speaker 1: and then I watch those preseason games and it's like, uh, man,

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Speaker 1: just make this end. Please, for the love of God,

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Speaker 1: what are we doing. These games have no value. Get

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Speaker 1: him out there. Get him out of there.

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Speaker 2: Like it.

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Speaker 1: It sounds great, Joe's gonna play, and you admire it.

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Speaker 1: And he's a football player, and he's a quarterback and

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Speaker 1: he's gonna play football, and he's gonna play quarterback, and

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Speaker 1: that's what you want, and it is what you want

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Speaker 1: until I'm watching him against the Arizona Cardinals in Week

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Speaker 1: seventeen in a game that means nothing, and I'm watching

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Speaker 1: dude's tee off on him so the Bengals can get

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Speaker 1: win number six or whatever it is.

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Speaker 2: I don't know, man, I understand. Yeah, I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I understand. But my point is, if if we're saying

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Speaker 2: that the toe doesn't.

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Speaker 1: It's not so much about the toe, it's about well,

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Speaker 1: the other way is me is.

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Speaker 2: Needs to move.

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Speaker 1: I understand, point to a place on his body to.

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Speaker 2: Send send a sacrificial Flacco out there the rest of

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Speaker 2: the year.

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Speaker 1: Joey having fun. Yeah, go out there and do what

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Speaker 1: you gotta do. I understand that. Said, I do believe

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Speaker 1: there is probably if you are on the side of

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Speaker 1: the fan base that says they have to change how

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Speaker 1: Joe Burrow plays because of the risk he is under

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Speaker 1: when he plays the way he does, the way the

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Speaker 1: offense is functioned with Joe Flacco as quarterback. I can

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Speaker 1: certainly understand someone saying, well, the best way to do

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Speaker 1: that is to have Joe Burrow play and play in

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Speaker 1: a somewhat newly restructured offense, regardless of how much meaning

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Speaker 1: the games actually have.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, I mean I think there's something to be

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Speaker 2: said for that. Joe not exactly interested in that storyline yesterday, No,

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Speaker 2: not at all.

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Speaker 1: You know, I mean I thought that to me was

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Speaker 1: that was my big takeaway from yesterday, Like.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't gonna go there. It wasn't really like

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Speaker 2: interested in that in that thought, which is fine. And

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Speaker 2: guy Yeah, I mean I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah, we're

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Speaker 2: here for it. But I mean it's yeah, I I

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Speaker 2: I understand what you're saying. I just I keep going.

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Speaker 2: I keep going back to, you know, organizationally, the same

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Speaker 2: thing we talked about around the trade deadline. M h.

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Speaker 2: They're not gonna wave the fly. They're not gonna want

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Speaker 2: it ever to look like there's a game where they're

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Speaker 2: out there and not doing everything they can to win

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Speaker 2: as an organization, as the way they just operate. And

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Speaker 2: I think that could involve Joe Burrow and you know,

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Speaker 2: if if it's like Joe's good to go, He's it's

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Speaker 2: all good, go go play, Go play football, and go

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Speaker 2: play the way that maybe it is using just playing

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Speaker 2: us the safer, get the ball out faster portion of it.

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Speaker 2: It's just understanding there's no need to go taking crazy

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Speaker 2: risks in this game, but go play. Yeah, maybe that

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Speaker 2: is part of it. Maybe that teaches them something, and

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Speaker 2: maybe that's connected to the Flacco stuff, Like I don't know,

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Speaker 2: that's probably minimal in my mind in terms of that.

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Speaker 2: I think you've got a lot of time to deal

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Speaker 2: with that. He knows how to play quarterback like that

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Speaker 2: is a conscious that is not something where he needs

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Speaker 2: to get reps at it. That's a conscious decision of

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna get the ball out, you know, a higher

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Speaker 2: percentage of the time and do less of the trying

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Speaker 2: to do crazy playmaking unless I have to. He knows

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Speaker 2: what that is. If he wants to do it, he

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Speaker 2: doesn't have to do anything. So I just I don't

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Speaker 2: think he needs I don't think that. I don't think

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Speaker 2: that's big of a part of the equation. All right,

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Speaker 2: So him back to not playing. You're backing on.

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Speaker 1: Find by me. Look, here's to shut down the season,

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Speaker 1: So why play anybody? Well, okay, if there are games

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Speaker 1: that mean absolutely nothing, to shut down everyone, shut down everybody, like,

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Speaker 1: I have no problem with that. If there is a

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Speaker 1: mathematic chance, as there was last year, go for it,

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Speaker 1: go for it as against the odds as it may be.

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Speaker 1: I have no problem. But if if you're playing out

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Speaker 1: the string and you decide we want to protect our

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Speaker 1: most important assets, I don't have any issue.

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Speaker 2: With that at all, So shut down Jamar and t too. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: those are the most important assets.

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Speaker 1: That everybody just says if the games mean and it

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Speaker 1: would be one thing if you're playing an opponent that's

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Speaker 1: playing for something and you could be a spoiler. That's something.

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Speaker 1: There's I get the integrity of the league sort of thing. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but if you're playing Arizona and Cleveland the last two

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Speaker 1: weeks and the games have zero bearing on the postseason,

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Speaker 1: I have no issue with anybody who says I would

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Speaker 1: rather protect my most prized assets and the pieces that

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Speaker 1: give me a chance to win next year, even if

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Speaker 1: it puts a more inferior product on the field in

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Speaker 1: the short term.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fine, And I think that's a one a

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Speaker 2: week eighteen conversation, right. I don't you know, I don't

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Speaker 2: know how much earlier you're gonna you're gonna get. I

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Speaker 2: do not expect saying why we're in it now. That's

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Speaker 2: because we're talking about the plan for Barack.

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Speaker 1: I do not expect them if they lose the next

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Speaker 1: two to tell Joe Burrow if he's cool, if he's

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Speaker 1: one hundred percent. I don't expect them to say, you

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Speaker 1: know what, we're three and eight, we're not gonna play

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Speaker 1: against Baltimore. That doesn't bother me at all. I would also, though,

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Speaker 1: have no issue with there's an X or a Y

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Speaker 1: or is it whatever they put next to the team

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Speaker 1: that's been eliminated and they're playing out the string, whether

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Speaker 1: it's Miami or Arizona Cleveland. And by the way, I

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Speaker 1: hope they beat the Pittsburgh Steelers and think they have

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Speaker 1: a chance and this becomes a moot conversation. But if

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Speaker 1: you if you play those last few games and they

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Speaker 1: have no bearing whatsoever on the postseason, I would absolutely

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Speaker 1: have no issue with the Bengals going These are our

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Speaker 1: most important assets. We are protecting them to the best

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Speaker 1: we can.

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Speaker 2: Remember the end of the season where Sam Hubbard was

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Speaker 2: hurt and he played. I go back to that. I

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Speaker 2: feel like they want that to be the core of

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Speaker 2: who they are, right Sam Hubbard battling through stuff. Nobody

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Speaker 2: for an absolute second would have thought twice about that

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Speaker 2: dude hanging it up and not playing in the final game.

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Speaker 2: That absolutely meant nothing. But I'm a captain of this team.

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Speaker 2: With my team's on the field, I'm out there with

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Speaker 2: my guys, right, That's what I am. I think that

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Speaker 2: there's value in that in terms of this is the

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Speaker 2: standard around here? Okay, we have enough problems we see

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Speaker 2: in this building with standards not being upheld sure, and

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Speaker 2: people not living up to certain levels of caring that

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Speaker 2: you want to see. And I feel like the same

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Speaker 2: way they held Joe Flacco with the ac join up

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Speaker 2: and said, this is it. This guy, No one would

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Speaker 2: fault him for not going out there and playing while

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Speaker 2: his arm's falling off. He's forty by week, come in,

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Speaker 2: but he plays right. I feel like we see this

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Speaker 2: and we see this being shown by them as far

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Speaker 2: as this is what we want to be, and who

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Speaker 2: else to show who you want to be other other

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Speaker 2: than Joe and Jamar and some of these guys. And

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Speaker 2: I understand the big picture, and there's nervousness. It's just

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Speaker 2: I think the value organizationally in holding people to this

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Speaker 2: standard and this is what we want to kind of

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Speaker 2: be and who we want to be known for. I

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Speaker 2: think there's I think there's value in that that can

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Speaker 2: inevitably be trumped by logic in certain situations. But I

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Speaker 2: just think there's gonna be an extremely in the other

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Speaker 2: direction when we start if we start talking about this down.

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Speaker 1: The stretch, but we're not. We're not because you don't

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Speaker 1: need to, because they're gonna be Pittsburgh.

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Speaker 2: It's they did just do it a few weeks ago.

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Speaker 2: So it's not like it's off the table. It's not

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Speaker 2: like they weren't one play away from having three wins

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Speaker 2: in a row and actually being in first place right now.

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Speaker 2: Like it's crazy when you think about it.

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Speaker 1: I said on this, and I know I gotta get

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Speaker 1: a break in midweek last week, somebody after the bye

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Speaker 1: is gonna rush to the front of the line to

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Speaker 1: be the first to change the narrative and talk about

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Speaker 1: how they're going to be Pittsburgh. At three twenty two today,

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Speaker 1: I am the first in line.

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Speaker 2: Well, let's go.

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Speaker 1: They're beating Pittsburgh on Sunday.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, for many reasons, yes, I mean, and we will

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Speaker 2: discuss them. I assume I was waiting. I didn't want

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Speaker 2: to step on your little seg going to.

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Speaker 1: Beat the Pittsburgh Steelers on Sunday.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it feels it feels very a season of plotists.

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Speaker 1: There will be another one and then by Monday afternoon.

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Speaker 2: Here we go, Here we go, how they beat the Patriots.

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Speaker 1: It is twenty three minutes after three o'clock. We're at

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Speaker 1: Oakley Greens. I'm drinking a coke right now.

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Speaker 2: I've yeah, I see that.

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Speaker 1: Just in case anybody thinks something sitting here all afternoon

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Speaker 1: pounding them back.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. It is a coke. It is a

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Speaker 2: straight Coca cola. Class making bold claims about this team

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Speaker 2: going on the road to beat Pittsburgh. You could have

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Speaker 2: been infused with something.

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Speaker 1: All right, we'll talk about how bold that like. Take

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Speaker 1: maybe coming up here and just a bit. Paul Danner Junior,

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00:20:01,840 --> 00:20:06,320
Speaker 1: Theathletic dot Com, The Growler Podcast on Twitter at Paul

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00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:08,840
Speaker 1: Danner Junior. He's here till four, We're here till six.

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00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:14,000
Speaker 1: Oakley Greens on ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station Cincinnati's

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00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:15,879
Speaker 1: ESPN fifteen thirty.

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Speaker 4: Traffic from the UC Health Traffic Center. You'll find more

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Speaker 4: options and clinical trials for pancreatic cancer care at the

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Speaker 4: UC Cancer Center. Get a second opinion, Fast call five

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Speaker 4: one three five eighty five UCCC On southbound seventy five

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Speaker 4: at seventh Street. It's an accident that's off onto the

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Speaker 4: right shoulder. Also an accident westbound on three Rivers Parkway

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Speaker 4: at dining Lane. Right now. Traffic is being directed around

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Speaker 4: that area and some slow traffic northbound seventy five. Mitchell

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00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:50,120
Speaker 4: the Paddock on that Ezelic with traffic.

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Speaker 3: This reason, Taylor versus Tumlin in the Steel City, the

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00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:57,480
Speaker 3: Bengals look to toss the Steelers into the recycling bin.

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Speaker 3: There's a lot I can say about Pittsburgh, but none

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Speaker 3: of it can be setting the radio. The Bengals slug

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00:21:04,080 --> 00:21:08,000
Speaker 3: it out with the Steelers someday. Coverage begins at nine am.

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00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,399
Speaker 3: Stream for free on the new and improved Igheart Radio

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00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:15,919
Speaker 3: app or ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the

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Speaker 3: Cincinnati Bengals.

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Speaker 1: Three thirty, ESPN fifteen thirty mo Igorant Oakley Greens. Paul

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Speaker 1: Beaner Junior is here from The Athletic and the Growler podcast.

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Speaker 1: This is going to be a very short segment. I

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Speaker 1: have a lot of things on my piece of paper

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Speaker 1: here that I want to talk about that seems hard

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Speaker 1: to do. I've written down some things you have written about,

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00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:36,760
Speaker 1: like I've quoted you and I just did one. I've

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Speaker 1: got a couple from your mail bag.

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Speaker 2: I see you wrote it, you wrote it down, Yeah, no,

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Speaker 2: no printer access.

435
00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:46,720
Speaker 1: And then actually today no, okay, I was I was

436
00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:51,560
Speaker 1: at uc between getting ready for a basketball game and

437
00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:53,000
Speaker 1: waiting for Scott Saderfield.

438
00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:55,560
Speaker 2: So old school, loose leaf and penn, oh school, loose

439
00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:57,280
Speaker 2: leaf and pen look at you go? All right, I

440
00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:57,960
Speaker 2: appreciate that.

441
00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,159
Speaker 1: So some of those larger topics we're going to to

442
00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:02,720
Speaker 1: get to in the second half hour. I've visit because

443
00:22:02,760 --> 00:22:05,560
Speaker 1: we'll have more time, and then I have a request

444
00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:07,879
Speaker 1: for what happens this weekend. But since we only have

445
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 1: a second here. When you were last with me, we

446
00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:12,679
Speaker 1: were closing it on the trade deadline, and you were

447
00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 1: a little antsy thinking maybe Trey Hendrickson is going to

448
00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:16,200
Speaker 1: be traded.

449
00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:16,719
Speaker 2: He was not.

450
00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,879
Speaker 1: So now the conversation advances, although it really doesn't because

451
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:26,040
Speaker 1: time with Trey is a flat circle. Should they franchise

452
00:22:26,080 --> 00:22:27,640
Speaker 1: tag them? Will they franchise tag them?

453
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 2: No? Okay, I think I think the experiment is probably

454
00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:34,440
Speaker 2: just gonna come to a merciful end. It's probably my guest.

455
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:37,400
Speaker 2: I mean, here, do we do this all the time.

456
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:39,120
Speaker 2: Right now, we're gonna be back and they're like, oh, well,

457
00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 2: you know they're tagging trade and this is just not

458
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:45,679
Speaker 2: something I see them executing, you know, And that's just

459
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:49,679
Speaker 2: this just feels like it just goes It goes the

460
00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:52,840
Speaker 2: way of Trey goes off or get the cop pick.

461
00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 1: I'm not ready for it.

462
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:55,600
Speaker 2: To end. You want more?

463
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,320
Speaker 1: I want I'm not ready for it to end.

464
00:22:58,480 --> 00:22:59,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I am.

465
00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:04,280
Speaker 1: But are the Bengals I don't know.

466
00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,199
Speaker 2: I mean, they still don't have any answers, right, but

467
00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:09,639
Speaker 2: they also have so many problems. It's the same flat

468
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:13,600
Speaker 2: circle conversation. They still have so many problems. So what

469
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:15,280
Speaker 2: are you gonna do? I mean, are you really gonna

470
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,239
Speaker 2: pour the amount of money that it would take to

471
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:20,159
Speaker 2: keep him for his older seasons when you need, like,

472
00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,480
Speaker 2: you need to use that money on four competent starters,

473
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:28,040
Speaker 2: right they Trey is at this point, he's almost luxury item.

474
00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:32,480
Speaker 2: You need competent starters, somebody that will keep your defense

475
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:37,359
Speaker 2: from being historically bad and compared to the Dayton triangles. Okay,

476
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:41,360
Speaker 2: this is what you are searching for, and so if

477
00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:45,199
Speaker 2: you need competent levels starters, you need that money to

478
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:47,879
Speaker 2: go acquire competent level starters. That's where I feel like

479
00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:51,000
Speaker 2: it sits. There's also a lot of decisions between now

480
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 2: and then to get figured out, but it feels like

481
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:54,359
Speaker 2: the end.

482
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:56,680
Speaker 1: Trey Hendrickson for a while now has been a part

483
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:58,879
Speaker 1: of my daily routine where I wake up in the

484
00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 1: morning and as I'm brushing my teeth. I go, Okay,

485
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:02,680
Speaker 1: what are we going to say today about Trey Hendrickson.

486
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:04,480
Speaker 1: I'm not ready for that. I can't just pull that

487
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,200
Speaker 1: band aid off. That's not something you just quit cold Turkey.

488
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 1: You can still do that with whatever he does. If

489
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:11,639
Speaker 1: he goes somewhere else, I'm sure he'll still be saying

490
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:12,720
Speaker 1: and doing things over there.

491
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:15,600
Speaker 2: I don't care. Then, Yeah, that's less interesting. I understand.

492
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:17,640
Speaker 2: I'm saying you could. You can always think about him.

493
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 1: I want to talk about a sentence I did not

494
00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:23,000
Speaker 1: think I would read earlier this year. When we come

495
00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:25,399
Speaker 1: back to Oakley Greens.

496
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 2: Well done.

497
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:29,080
Speaker 1: After sports headlines on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station

498
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,280
Speaker 1: where Passion mes play.

499
00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:37,080
Speaker 2: Welcome to the Ultimate Sports Showdown Tony Pike, Sincy three

500
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:41,600
Speaker 2: sixty today at twelve noon on ESPN fifteen.

501
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:45,119
Speaker 1: Thirty Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

502
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:49,880
Speaker 4: Traffic from the UC Health Traffic Center. You'll find more

503
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:53,320
Speaker 4: options and clinical trials for pancreatic cancer care at the

504
00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:56,800
Speaker 4: UC Cancer Center. Get a second opinion Fast call five

505
00:24:56,840 --> 00:25:01,160
Speaker 4: one three five eighty five U SECC on southbound seventy

506
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 4: five at seventh Street. It's an accident that's off onto

507
00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:08,600
Speaker 4: the right shoulder. Also an accident westbound on three Rivers

508
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 4: Parkway at dining Lane right now traffic is being directed

509
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:16,280
Speaker 4: around that area and some slow traffic northbound seventy five

510
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 4: Mitchell the Paddock. I'm at ezelic with traffic this report.

511
00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:24,000
Speaker 1: Kelsey chevro Light home of lifetime powertrain protection and guarantee

512
00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,959
Speaker 1: credit approval from their family to yours for life, Kelsey

513
00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:29,920
Speaker 1: chev dot Any Bengels.

514
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 2: News Tonight, thank your not really nothing nothing A major note.

515
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,879
Speaker 1: College basketball tonight, you see host dayon both teams two

516
00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:40,359
Speaker 1: and oh tip off at seven at fifth third on

517
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:44,960
Speaker 1: seven hundred WLW Tonight at the Young Center, Louisville hosts UK.

518
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: That game tips off at eight. You can listen to

519
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,560
Speaker 1: it on ESPN fifteen thirty with pregame coverage beginning at

520
00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,880
Speaker 1: six pm. Also this evening, Ohio State takes on app

521
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,360
Speaker 1: State and Wright State hooks up with Toledo. The Columbus

522
00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,920
Speaker 1: Blue Jackets skate on the road tonight against the Seattle

523
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:02,600
Speaker 1: Paul Danner Junior's here from the Athletic.

524
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,600
Speaker 2: You did something that made me nervous. You just quickly,

525
00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 2: at the last second, pulled up the story and did

526
00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,080
Speaker 2: a finding replace for a keyword, to go find something

527
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 2: specifically in there, and now I'm nervous.

528
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 1: There's no reason to be nervous.

529
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, what's it about?

530
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,280
Speaker 1: So you did a mailbag? Yeah, I would like to

531
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:24,000
Speaker 1: see the correspondence that you don't reply to? Could we do?

532
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:25,520
Speaker 2: There were? No, there were a lot.

533
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,760
Speaker 1: Actually, could we do like a segment where I respond

534
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 1: to the letters or the emails? You don't?

535
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 2: Boy, do I have some Do I have some comments

536
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 2: for you? You should? You should? Actually that actually would

537
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:40,639
Speaker 2: have been a better mail bag is just the emails

538
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,720
Speaker 2: and the and the questions that I got. Yes, they

539
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:46,320
Speaker 2: weren't questions like I got a lot that were just

540
00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:49,960
Speaker 2: like one thousand word diatribes with lots of expletives and

541
00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:52,840
Speaker 2: all caps, and I'm like, I don't know like what

542
00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:55,480
Speaker 2: you're asking of me here, but the answer is probably

543
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:56,399
Speaker 2: not what you want it to be.

544
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:01,119
Speaker 1: You you were asked a question about the offensive line. Yeah,

545
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 1: and the reason I highlighted it is I didn't write

546
00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:05,720
Speaker 1: down the exact passage.

547
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 2: No, that's good of you.

548
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,680
Speaker 1: So, but I knew you mentioned one of the offensive lineman.

549
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:12,360
Speaker 1: So I did a quick search for Carris.

550
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 2: Yeah.

551
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 1: I could have done Rivers, I could have done Mims.

552
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:15,800
Speaker 2: I just did Carris.

553
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,480
Speaker 1: But you were asked a question about, hey, the offensive line,

554
00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 1: is it like really getting better? And you acknowledged something

555
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: that I would not have thought was a possibility a

556
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 1: month ago. You wrote being able to confidently say Orlando Brown, Junior,

557
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 1: Dylan Fairchild, Ted Carris, Jalen Rivers and a Marius Mims

558
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:34,199
Speaker 1: are the twenty twenty six opening day starters. Would be

559
00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 1: particularly advantageous if everyone could continue this momentum that feels

560
00:27:39,520 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: like something that's on the table. And I would have

561
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:42,760
Speaker 1: laughed at you six weeks ago.

562
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:49,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's like, okay, you might have some stability here.

563
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 2: It's now I think Rivers, I don't know. Man, Like

564
00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,360
Speaker 2: we'll see sure. Yeah, Like he's not all the way there,

565
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:00,680
Speaker 2: he's still out, but they've been good enough to make

566
00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 2: this offense do what it's done. Flacco is in the

567
00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 2: top five in terms of sack percentage in on the

568
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 2: good top five. They're protecting him. He's yeah, he's getting

569
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:14,040
Speaker 2: the ball out fast, but they're running the ball. They're

570
00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:18,000
Speaker 2: most efficient running games and football. They're doing all these

571
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,240
Speaker 2: things with those guys in there, you can say, oh, well,

572
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:22,879
Speaker 2: you know, Flacco has gone run. You can say all

573
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 2: these other things, but like they've done it. And so

574
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:27,399
Speaker 2: if we're gonna sit here and we're gonna rip the

575
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:30,920
Speaker 2: offensive line when they're not doing those things, let's give

576
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 2: them credit here because these things that have changed with

577
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 2: this offense, a lot of it has come back to

578
00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:40,440
Speaker 2: things that the offensive line had to change and do better.

579
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 2: And that has been a large part of Jalen Rivers

580
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 2: and Dylan Fairchild and rising when he's been in and others.

581
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 2: But like them finding some development, some cohesion and getting

582
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 2: things done a lot more consistently. So I think there's

583
00:28:57,000 --> 00:28:58,840
Speaker 2: you know, there seems to be real hope there. I mean,

584
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,480
Speaker 2: we talked to Dan Pitcher last week and I sort

585
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:06,560
Speaker 2: of was asking about this and he's like, I just

586
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 2: I don't want it to sound at all like it

587
00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 2: seems like we've arrived, because we have not. He's like,

588
00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 2: but you know, there really are. There's just a lot

589
00:29:15,080 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 2: of positive things that you can build on. There's plenty

590
00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:19,920
Speaker 2: that they're working on, but there's a lot of positive

591
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:22,240
Speaker 2: things that you're seeing now and they're just starting to

592
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 2: see some of the gains after that incredibly rocky start.

593
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:28,600
Speaker 1: Well, and the key for me second year player and

594
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 1: two rookies. Yeah, that we're at least acknowledging. I think

595
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,440
Speaker 1: it's fair to wonder, like how long in the tooth

596
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: is Orlando Brown and Ted Carris. Those are legitimate concerns.

597
00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:40,520
Speaker 1: You can't have enough offensive line and I'm sure we'll

598
00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,280
Speaker 1: be talking about O line depth this offseason no matter what.

599
00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:46,760
Speaker 1: But right there is what we had talked about prior

600
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:49,440
Speaker 1: to the twenty twenty four draft. If you're gonna build

601
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 1: a good offensive line and have it be sustainable, it's

602
00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 1: gonna have to come via the draft. And there are

603
00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:58,239
Speaker 1: some decent early returns. Yeah. I don't want to get

604
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:01,000
Speaker 1: ahead of myself either. Yeah, but when I read that

605
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 1: part of your mail bag and I'm like, you know

606
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 1: what that's not, I didn't. I didn't WinCE when you

607
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 1: wrote that.

608
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,640
Speaker 2: So this has this has been my theory where I've

609
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:12,880
Speaker 2: It's kind of where I've sort of started on offense

610
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 2: and with that conversation with the offensive line, when I've

611
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 2: been asked a lot about how big is this defensive rebuild?

612
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 2: Like it's obviously massive, I mean, but what are we

613
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:27,200
Speaker 2: talking how many years? And my point is name me

614
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:30,600
Speaker 2: who's not back on offense next year. Your whole offense

615
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 2: is set. Yeah, So when your whole offense is set,

616
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:37,080
Speaker 2: you can use every pick, every dollar in free agency,

617
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:41,120
Speaker 2: everything that you have at your disposal you can throw

618
00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 2: at this defense. And that could be a lot of things,

619
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 2: and so you can you can change it all over

620
00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:50,000
Speaker 2: fairly quickly. You can throw a top ten pick in

621
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 2: there and a serviceable levels. That's why you don't play

622
00:30:54,480 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 2: Joe there, you go tank tank for RVL rees. I mean,

623
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 2: I don't yeah, I don't know, like I'm I'm just

624
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:07,400
Speaker 2: saying the state of the offense in terms of everything

625
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 2: being very set for a while now, I mean all

626
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 2: your positions and whatever you you know, you're you're always

627
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 2: thinking next for the offensive line. But I mean, for

628
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 2: the most part, you can use the vast majority of

629
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 2: your resources in next offseason where you are top ten

630
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:27,960
Speaker 2: in cap space, you're gonna have some picks. You can

631
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 2: keep throwing those at the defense and hope that you

632
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:34,040
Speaker 2: find some that stick. I just when you don't have

633
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 2: to worry about really anything on offense right now, it

634
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 2: does open up some doors for you to make quick

635
00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 2: work of a flip over.

636
00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:43,600
Speaker 1: So you went where I was gonna go to next

637
00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 1: because you referred to quote a multi year down to

638
00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 1: the studs. Gut job. Yeah, when it comes to the defense, yeah,

639
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:52,600
Speaker 1: And the way I'm thinking, the way that gets accelerated

640
00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:54,840
Speaker 1: is if I don't have to devote as much, well,

641
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:56,560
Speaker 1: you know, with them, it's an issue of time, because

642
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,000
Speaker 1: we saw that with Chason Higgins. Devoted all the time

643
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,720
Speaker 1: to those dudes and then couldn't sign anybody in free agency.

644
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 1: But if you want to hasten what looks like a

645
00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:10,960
Speaker 1: very very very substantial rebuild on defense, the easiest way

646
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 1: to do that is to be set on the other

647
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 1: side of the ball. Yeah, and if that offensive line

648
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:16,960
Speaker 1: continues its current trajectory, that might.

649
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,320
Speaker 2: Be the case. I mean, it's like everything though, it

650
00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 2: all comes back to the young players getting better. Is

651
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,480
Speaker 2: how many years there are on this defensive rebuild, and

652
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 2: that would include the guards. If Jalen Rivers falls off

653
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 2: the second half of this season and you're like, oh,

654
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 2: we still got an issue there that we got to

655
00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:35,960
Speaker 2: figure out, or you know, you start to be like, well,

656
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 2: we've got to find a tackle of the future in

657
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:40,240
Speaker 2: case we're not in Orlando Brown. Unless you start to

658
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 2: worry more about that or and the same way that

659
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 2: Shamar Stewart and Demitrius Knight and Barrett Carter if they

660
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:50,040
Speaker 2: just don't show any progress over the second half of

661
00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:54,600
Speaker 2: this season. Yeah, it extends the length of how far

662
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,719
Speaker 2: this rebuild must go. You want more, you know, if

663
00:32:57,720 --> 00:32:59,640
Speaker 2: we're going down to the studs, I'd like for there

664
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,280
Speaker 2: to be more than one stud Yeah, you know, like

665
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:04,600
Speaker 2: I need more than one thing to build on. If

666
00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:06,640
Speaker 2: I could, if you could get a couple more guys

667
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 2: that you feel like over the second half of this season,

668
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,800
Speaker 2: you're like, can build around that that that I put

669
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:16,959
Speaker 2: that with with Turner and one other thing and okay,

670
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 2: now filling all the rest, then it doesn't feel as

671
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:24,200
Speaker 2: far off. I don't think that. I mean, you know,

672
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 2: a lot things happen quick in the NFL, but like

673
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 2: the idea of them rebuilding and being some sort of

674
00:33:29,920 --> 00:33:33,560
Speaker 2: top ten unit next year feels crazy. But you can

675
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 2: I think that I'll take I'll take top thirty. How

676
00:33:36,600 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 2: about how about only comparing it to teams that are

677
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 2: bad this year and not from the sixties. If we

678
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:45,600
Speaker 2: can get to that, I think the way you can

679
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:47,880
Speaker 2: turn things over in the NFL, I mean the heck

680
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 2: much less we talk about in college football, like the

681
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 2: way you can turn it over fast. If you make

682
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 2: the right moves, you can get to a mid level.

683
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:57,680
Speaker 2: You can you can put serviceable pieces in there if

684
00:33:57,720 --> 00:33:59,280
Speaker 2: you can find a few things to build around. If

685
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 2: you can't, then you know you're you're gonna keep doing

686
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:06,320
Speaker 2: this searching for young players and living with growing pain,

687
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 2: stuff that they've kind of been doing this year.

688
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:14,360
Speaker 1: One thing they could do, and you reference this, is

689
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:16,399
Speaker 1: go ahead and get a jump start on getting DJ

690
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:17,840
Speaker 1: Turner locked in long term.

691
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:22,440
Speaker 2: I think it's an interesting uh test. Yeah, two, are

692
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 2: you doing the same thing? We're gonna keep doing the

693
00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 2: same thing that gots you in this spot? Are you

694
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:30,759
Speaker 2: gonna wait or are you going to say, Hey, here's

695
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 2: a chance for a philosophy switch, Tom. Let's start building

696
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:38,919
Speaker 2: around something right. Here's this guy who earned it and

697
00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:41,879
Speaker 2: is doing it the right way and played himself into

698
00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 2: one of the best cornerbacks uh in the game this year.

699
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:49,279
Speaker 2: Let's build around him. Let's pay him extension eligible now

700
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 2: for the first time, Let's pay him. Let's get ahead

701
00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 2: of the market, and let's let's let's show that we're

702
00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 2: trying something new. Or or you're or you're gonna say

703
00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:02,960
Speaker 2: I want to see another year of health and the

704
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:05,759
Speaker 2: same level of play. Go do it again? Right? And

705
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:08,400
Speaker 2: then and then you're talking about Okay, you're, you're, but

706
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,480
Speaker 2: at some point then he's is he gonna hit free agency?

707
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 2: Are you gonna what do you can do this? Although?

708
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:17,359
Speaker 2: Are you gonna go back? We're gonna franchise tag DJ Turner? Uh?

709
00:35:17,400 --> 00:35:19,480
Speaker 2: Is he gonna request a trade? And then and then

710
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:21,359
Speaker 2: you have then you can talk about DJ Turner. He'll

711
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 2: be the next to the line, right, Yeah, we had

712
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:26,919
Speaker 2: we had Jesse Bates. Of course we have had Trey

713
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:30,520
Speaker 2: Hendrickson Higgins, and maybe DJ Turner will be next for

714
00:35:30,600 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 2: you and you can wake up thinking about him every

715
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 2: day and what he's got going on.

716
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:38,799
Speaker 1: I want to wake up and read your gamer and

717
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,040
Speaker 1: I know you don't at the Athletic don't write you know,

718
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 1: traditional gamers or watch the walkout. Yeah, and after the

719
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,880
Speaker 1: Bengals have beaten the Pittsburgh Steelers, I want to either

720
00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:53,719
Speaker 1: read or hear or both references to how as was

721
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: predicted on this show.

722
00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:59,359
Speaker 2: Mo had it first, Mo had it first. You were

723
00:35:59,360 --> 00:36:01,799
Speaker 2: the first one in the Yes, not afraid to say it.

724
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,360
Speaker 1: The offense is cooking. They're coming off a bye. The

725
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 1: Steelers are not intimidating. No, Mike Tomlin's getting mad at

726
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 1: reporters for asking legit questions about his quarterbacks. Quarterbacks like

727
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:13,920
Speaker 1: one hundred years old. They've beaten them already recently. They

728
00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:15,200
Speaker 1: should go to Pittsburgh and win.

729
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:21,280
Speaker 2: Yes, I think this is one hundred percent a game

730
00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:24,040
Speaker 2: that you should expect this team to win. I mean

731
00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:27,239
Speaker 2: they are when you have the offense playing. One thing

732
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,520
Speaker 2: that that teams run into when they play the Steelers

733
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:32,960
Speaker 2: is if you're just not familiar with the style of

734
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 2: game you have to play against them. It's different like teams.

735
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 2: Teams get wrapped up in that. I think that happened

736
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:39,640
Speaker 2: to the Colts. Yeah, I think that happened to the

737
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:40,399
Speaker 2: Colts a little bit.

738
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,719
Speaker 1: But I don't think they played that style here. I

739
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:44,960
Speaker 1: don't think they've played it against the Bengals.

740
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 2: Don't the Chargers. The Bengals don't play into it. I

741
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:49,439
Speaker 2: think the Chargers knew what they were doing with it, right,

742
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:53,640
Speaker 2: and you know what are they I mean, who's the

743
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:56,880
Speaker 2: corner opposite Porter right now? Is going to be Pierce

744
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 2: and they're moving Jalen Ramsey to safety, right, they are searching, okay,

745
00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 2: and if you know, I think the one thing you

746
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:08,800
Speaker 2: could say is okay, all right, young defense.

747
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:11,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, you just saw this a few weeks ago.

748
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 2: You know what they're gonna do. Let's let's go through

749
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:16,879
Speaker 2: this again. Let's try this a second time. It could

750
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,440
Speaker 2: be a good test for this defense in regards of

751
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:22,719
Speaker 2: can you start learning from your mistakes? Here's literally the

752
00:37:22,760 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 2: same mistakes and the same people you just did this

753
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,000
Speaker 2: against the week before. Can can you just find a

754
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 2: way to clean those up a little bit? You're gonna

755
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:32,919
Speaker 2: see the same players and the same plays, the same

756
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 2: stuff here. Can you be a little bit better? Whereas

757
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:39,680
Speaker 2: I don't I have thoughts that maybe that could happen.

758
00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:41,600
Speaker 2: I don't have many thoughts that the Steelers are all

759
00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:43,480
Speaker 2: of a sudden just gonna like shut down this offense.

760
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 2: I just think the offense is in too good of

761
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 2: a place right now, and the matchup is, you know,

762
00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:52,200
Speaker 2: too nice for what the Bengals want to do. And

763
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 2: how quickly Flacco is getting the ball out.

764
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:57,279
Speaker 1: You you can reference it even if I'm not right.

765
00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:00,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, go ahead. No, most said first they were gonna win,

766
00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 2: and then they lost by twenty eight, right, and then

767
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:04,879
Speaker 2: we can use it to talk about you.

768
00:38:04,960 --> 00:38:07,840
Speaker 1: But fine by me. It's okay. But somebody was gonna

769
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:11,520
Speaker 1: be for there will be others by Friday. Everybody is

770
00:38:11,520 --> 00:38:13,480
Speaker 1: gonna have the Bengals win. In fact, it's then I

771
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 1: may do it a heel turn to go. Actually, nah,

772
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 1: they're not gonna beat the Steelers. Somebody was gonna be first.

773
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,720
Speaker 1: What is it about the Steelers that makes that crazy?

774
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:23,440
Speaker 2: Though? Is the only thing? I mean to me, that's it.

775
00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:25,960
Speaker 2: It's it's you had their game against the Colts, which

776
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:29,960
Speaker 2: just seemed like a weird thing. Otherwise, I mean, look

777
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 2: at the team that the Steelers have been, even.

778
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: Even when they have won games earlier in the season,

779
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:38,200
Speaker 1: they were not imposing that indye, win is a very

780
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,000
Speaker 1: good wine. The Colts, I think, are really good. But

781
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:43,520
Speaker 1: there's the brand and there's what you've come to expect.

782
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 1: And look, the Bengals have all sorts of defensive issues,

783
00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:47,360
Speaker 1: and so they may give up forty two points to

784
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,000
Speaker 1: know what he would be surprised. I don't think there's

785
00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 1: anything scary about the Pittsburgh Steelers.

786
00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:55,719
Speaker 2: Certainly not a few. I mean, when you just experienced

787
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:58,359
Speaker 2: this a few weeks ago, and they're you know, their

788
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 2: their offense is not scary. Their offense is whatever Dk

789
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:03,840
Speaker 2: Metcalf is gonna be able to get for them in

790
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 2: very little else Sometimes they run the ball and defensively

791
00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:11,920
Speaker 2: they're kind of a mess, and and they're either turnovers

792
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,520
Speaker 2: or bust. They either get turnovers and find a way

793
00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:16,839
Speaker 2: to win or they don't when they lose. That's been

794
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:19,279
Speaker 2: the case pretty much across the board. That's how they

795
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,280
Speaker 2: beat Indianapolis. I mean Daniel Jones with all those turnovers

796
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 2: in that game, and so the one that's the one

797
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:26,960
Speaker 2: thing Flacco has been good at. That's what they've They've

798
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:29,480
Speaker 2: found a way to protect the ball, manage the game,

799
00:39:29,560 --> 00:39:31,880
Speaker 2: get the ball out quick, don't let t J. Watt

800
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:35,920
Speaker 2: and Keanu Benton and Cam Hayward and all those guys

801
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 2: tear you up. And you know, the the recipe is there.

802
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:43,880
Speaker 2: They just at some point mo in the fourth quarter

803
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:46,400
Speaker 2: are gonna need to go out there and get a stop.

804
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:51,320
Speaker 2: And that's probably where nol God has been working on.

805
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 2: What got misconstrued was you thought they were just saving

806
00:39:57,640 --> 00:40:00,319
Speaker 2: all the stuff and hiding everything in the preseason. What

807
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:02,200
Speaker 2: he actually meant was through the first half too, and

808
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,960
Speaker 2: then after the bye week, just unleash on the league.

809
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:08,440
Speaker 1: Can I tell you what I think the most annoying

810
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:11,320
Speaker 1: thing about the Steelers is right now? It's their special

811
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:13,800
Speaker 1: teams coach. Oh yeah, that guy.

812
00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:15,800
Speaker 2: Chewing the gummy.

813
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 1: He gets more TV time than any special teams coach

814
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:22,720
Speaker 1: in the league. Chris Collins weren't done talk about special

815
00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:25,040
Speaker 1: teams coaches. I'm watching the game. You would think the

816
00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 1: guy like invented kicking. He's been there a long time.

817
00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:31,880
Speaker 1: I'm sure he's a nice guy. There's no other team

818
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,359
Speaker 1: where you see the special teams coach as much as

819
00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:35,760
Speaker 1: you do when you watch.

820
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:38,320
Speaker 2: The Steelers, unless you have one of these like big

821
00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:40,960
Speaker 2: special teams coaches that likes to run the field with

822
00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 2: his team. Yeah, jump in the air and do all

823
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:46,360
Speaker 2: kinds of crazy stuff. Sometimes you get that guy, that

824
00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:46,960
Speaker 2: crazy guy.

825
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 1: But this guy back in the day, the Cowboys had

826
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,600
Speaker 1: a special teams coach because he had like Jesus hair,

827
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:53,759
Speaker 1: so you kind of noticed him. Other than that, you

828
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:56,520
Speaker 1: don't notice special teams coaches until the Steelers play. They

829
00:40:56,520 --> 00:40:59,120
Speaker 1: don't stop showing that guy, Like, bro, you're a special

830
00:40:59,120 --> 00:40:59,760
Speaker 1: teams coach.

831
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:02,799
Speaker 2: Let's put an over undrawn number of cutaways for our

832
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 2: guy on Sunday nine and a half, count them up

833
00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:09,200
Speaker 2: nine and a half? Think I think under Night under nine.

834
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 1: Well, the Bengals win by more points than cutaways to

835
00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:13,760
Speaker 1: the special teams code.

836
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 2: Oh wow, you heard it here first.

837
00:41:16,120 --> 00:41:19,280
Speaker 1: Thank you as always Reed Paul's work The Athletic dot Com.

838
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:21,600
Speaker 1: Listen to the podcast or watch the podcast The Growlar

839
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 1: Podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Pat noon and joins

840
00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,960
Speaker 1: us Next word Oakley Queen's This is ZESPN fifteen.

841
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:34,479
Speaker 4: Thirty, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from the UC Health

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845
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:49,520
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846
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:52,320
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847
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848
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849
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850
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