1 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:11,719 Speaker 1: From WBZ News Radio in Boston. This is New England Weekend. 2 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: Each and every week right here, we come together, we 3 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,240 Speaker 1: talk about all the topics important to you and the 4 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:19,439 Speaker 1: place where you live. It is great to have you 5 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:21,680 Speaker 1: back with us this week. I'm Nicole Davis. 6 00:00:22,079 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 2: Well. 7 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:25,200 Speaker 1: The city of Salem this time of year, especially downtown 8 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 1: is completely packed. People come from all over the globe 9 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 1: to learn about and take in all things spooky for 10 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,320 Speaker 1: Halloween happenings and a major angle of this is a 11 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:37,239 Speaker 1: piece of American history that stands out for its cruelty 12 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:40,640 Speaker 1: and for what we learned. This is the Salem which Trials. 13 00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:42,800 Speaker 1: We're talking about the tragedy which played out in the 14 00:00:42,840 --> 00:00:46,320 Speaker 1: sixteen nineties. There is a memorial dedicated to the trials 15 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 1: in Salem, a which museum exhibits over at the Pbdessex. 16 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:52,920 Speaker 1: So much more, but not too far away in Denvers, 17 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 1: just over the line, that is where the hysteria actually 18 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:59,280 Speaker 1: began in what was then known as Salem Village. This 19 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 1: was a part of that was trying to break away 20 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:04,920 Speaker 1: and become independent. There was a lot of internal conflict, 21 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:08,720 Speaker 1: social and economics struggle, much more. This is quite the story. 22 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 1: Let's talk about it. Dan Gagnan is here. He is 23 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 1: a lifelong Danvers resident. He is a historian and author 24 00:01:14,600 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: of a book called a Salem Witch The Trial, Execution 25 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:21,200 Speaker 1: and Exoneration of Rebecca Nurse. Dan thanks so much for 26 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: being here, and I want to start by talking about 27 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 1: this split involving Salem village. How long had this been 28 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:28,319 Speaker 1: going on? 29 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,600 Speaker 2: Tough feelings on the village wanting to become independent had 30 00:01:32,920 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 2: been around for a while. They don't really come to 31 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:37,640 Speaker 2: a head before the witch hunt. The village had made 32 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 2: moves to separate really like thirty years prior, so it 33 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 2: wasn't a new event. It wasn't something that had really 34 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 2: bubbled up at that moment, and the village was fairly 35 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:52,480 Speaker 2: united in uniform and while wanting more independence. There had 36 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:57,279 Speaker 2: been some books written decades ago that claimed Salem Village 37 00:01:57,360 --> 00:01:59,680 Speaker 2: was split in two over the issue of whether or 38 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:02,280 Speaker 2: not to be come independent, But the facts and the 39 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 2: documents don't really bear out that sort of a conflict. 40 00:02:05,800 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 1: So you've got the two separate Salems, and things are 41 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:11,480 Speaker 1: like relatively copasetic at this point. But then we get 42 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: into the early sixteen nineties and tell us how the 43 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:17,959 Speaker 1: whole idea of witches came into the conversation here. 44 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:22,400 Speaker 2: Well, the Puritan view of witchcraft is very different from 45 00:02:22,480 --> 00:02:25,000 Speaker 2: our own, and of course even today in the twenty 46 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 2: first century, if you asked several different people what do 47 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,920 Speaker 2: you mean by a witch, you would get many different answers. 48 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 2: But to the Puritans, their one view of witchcraft was 49 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:40,320 Speaker 2: it was an ordinary person, human being who decided to 50 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:46,480 Speaker 2: not work for the Puritan church, but instead they signed 51 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 2: up to work for the devil himself. That they literally, 52 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,799 Speaker 2: the devil appeared in their house one day, handed them 53 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:59,360 Speaker 2: an employment contract. They signed it promising to do evil, wicked, 54 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:02,960 Speaker 2: bad things, and in return, the devil gave them special 55 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:04,200 Speaker 2: powers to do so. 56 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:08,079 Speaker 1: Where did the whole hysteria then start? When it came 57 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 1: to the whole he's a witch, and she's a witch, 58 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:11,160 Speaker 1: and so on and so forth. 59 00:03:11,560 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 2: Right, So that starts out in Salem Village. The first 60 00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 2: two young girls who are so called afflicted, meaning thought 61 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:24,880 Speaker 2: to be harmed by witchcraft, were living in the minister's home, 62 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:29,000 Speaker 2: Reverend Samuel Parris's home. It was his daughter Betty his 63 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: adopted niece Abigail Williams, and the two of them started 64 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 2: to act really strangely look like they're having seizures, that 65 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 2: they were seeing ghostly shapes. And it's one of the 66 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 2: local doctors that says it's witchcraft. And after the doctor, 67 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 2: who was a trusted, respected member of the community says that, 68 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 2: then the hunt for who is doing this supposed witchcraft begins. 69 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: And just how extensive did this get? If I remember correctly, 70 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 1: at least twenty or thirty people were put on trial, 71 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:03,640 Speaker 1: if not more. 72 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:07,120 Speaker 2: Yes, So in total, if we take the witch hunt 73 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:12,880 Speaker 2: as lasting about eight months in sixteen ninety two, you 74 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 2: have almost two hundred people accused. You have nineteen hanged, 75 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:23,000 Speaker 2: one is pressed to death, and at least five die 76 00:04:23,360 --> 00:04:25,120 Speaker 2: in the really awful jails. 77 00:04:25,440 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 1: Oh my god. And you know, from what I've seen, 78 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 1: most of the residents who were executed were from Salem Village, right. 79 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 2: So those executed, we have a large proportion from Salem Village, 80 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:41,760 Speaker 2: and the accusations and those executed, it's spread to all 81 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 2: surrounding towns. There's many from andover. It goes as far 82 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 2: north as Maine, which was then still Massachusetts, as far 83 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:52,839 Speaker 2: south as Charlestown, and as far west as the area 84 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:53,680 Speaker 2: around bill Ricca. 85 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: It really seems to me like there's records of accusers 86 00:04:56,960 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 1: just calling out members of families that their families didn't lie, 87 00:05:00,240 --> 00:05:02,960 Speaker 1: or that people weren't getting along with or somebody just 88 00:05:03,000 --> 00:05:05,080 Speaker 1: seemed like they were acting a little off. I mean, 89 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:08,280 Speaker 1: it feels to me like this was at times really personal. 90 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 1: Do you agree with that? 91 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:15,720 Speaker 2: Yes, Yes, every accusation is unique, and some reveal right 92 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:20,800 Speaker 2: dark bad sordid histories between individuals. And then on the 93 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 2: other hand, you have some accusations that almost seem random 94 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:26,440 Speaker 2: that it's not even clear if those two people had 95 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 2: ever met before. It's just amazing how each case is 96 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 2: so varied. 97 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:36,560 Speaker 1: Well, there's clearly a lot of shame in the aftermath 98 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:41,800 Speaker 1: of all of this, and for obviously good reason. This 99 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:44,920 Speaker 1: was just a horrendous incident that happened. So then let's 100 00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:50,039 Speaker 1: talk about how Salem Village moved forward from this happening. 101 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:54,479 Speaker 1: How did this further contribute to the division of Salem 102 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: Town and Salem Village. 103 00:05:56,160 --> 00:05:59,880 Speaker 2: Well, the village is where most of the accusers lived. 104 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 2: It continued to be the epi center of the witch 105 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,599 Speaker 2: hunt even once they started the trials, which took place 106 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:10,039 Speaker 2: in downtown Salem, the city of Salem, because that's where 107 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 2: the court usually met just like today, and that's where 108 00:06:13,680 --> 00:06:18,200 Speaker 2: the county courthouse is. And with that after the whole 109 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 2: witch hunt ends. It ends because people did realize it 110 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:25,799 Speaker 2: was wrong, and they spoke out and got the government 111 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 2: to stop because they thought it was wrong. But these 112 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 2: people in Salem Village go back to their farms. You 113 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 2: might go back to your farm and the guy next 114 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:37,039 Speaker 2: door is the one who accused your mother or grandmother 115 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 2: of witchcraft. How do you ever try to go back 116 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:42,480 Speaker 2: to normal when a community had been so split. 117 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 1: I don't think you do. Frankly, I think that at 118 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: that point I would just want to leave. I'd want 119 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 1: to start it in somewhere else. 120 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:55,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll have some descendants of the accused who do 121 00:06:55,600 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 2: move out west. Back then out west was Framingham well 122 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:05,560 Speaker 2: compared to you know today, many do remain. Though many 123 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 2: do remain, they can't afford to move that the only 124 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:12,800 Speaker 2: thing they have of value is their farm, the land, 125 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:15,119 Speaker 2: and so a lot of people really are just stuck 126 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:19,800 Speaker 2: in that place. So seventeen fifty two is when Danvers 127 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 2: becomes its own independent community. And the name Danvers was 128 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:27,920 Speaker 2: not at all a choice of the local people. It 129 00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:31,520 Speaker 2: was assumed that they would be probably just keep the 130 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:35,600 Speaker 2: name Salem Village, and the legislature told them, nah, you 131 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 2: cannot have two places next to each other with basically 132 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 2: the same name. Of course, today we have places like 133 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 2: Andover and North Andover. But back then they were told no, 134 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 2: and someone in Boston picked the name. It was probably 135 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 2: the governor and the name was just assigned to them. 136 00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 2: It was thought it may have been a political favor, 137 00:07:55,760 --> 00:08:00,800 Speaker 2: the royal governor naming it after Danvers Osborne, who had 138 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:04,320 Speaker 2: been a Lieutenant Governor of New York and had been 139 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:10,680 Speaker 2: politically connected to his family. That's the best hypothesis. 140 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 1: Well, let's fast forward now to the current times and 141 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:15,800 Speaker 1: Salem even as we talk, you know, it is packed 142 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 1: with people. It is Halloween season, and of course with 143 00:08:19,320 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 1: all that heavy, heavy focus on the Witch trials, you've 144 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 1: got the Witch Museum and everything else. Danvers, though, is 145 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 1: pretty quiet. So why do you think that Danvers has 146 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 1: been essentially not left behind in the conversation? But it's 147 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:35,520 Speaker 1: not as much of a spotlight on Danvers. 148 00:08:36,080 --> 00:08:39,920 Speaker 2: So you are very right that the disparity is quite real, 149 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 2: especially this month October with all of the Salem tourism. 150 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 2: The reason for this disparity is in part because the 151 00:08:49,120 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 2: city of Salem had more of a commercial base in 152 00:08:52,920 --> 00:08:57,600 Speaker 2: the early nineteen hundreds it transitioned to more embracing tourism, 153 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:04,120 Speaker 2: whereas agricultural and then suburban residential later on, Danvers never 154 00:09:04,200 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 2: really had the business to boost tourism, the business infrastructure, 155 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 2: and the other part is for generations and generations. So 156 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:21,839 Speaker 2: many people in Danvers were still connected to someone from 157 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:27,120 Speaker 2: the witch trial days on whichever side, accusers or defendants. 158 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 2: But in the city of Salem you had such a 159 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 2: shift of new people moving into the city, factories opening 160 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 2: it attracting people from across New England to move there, 161 00:09:38,520 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 2: that in the early nineteen hundreds many of them had 162 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 2: less of a personal connection to the witch hunt, or 163 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:46,319 Speaker 2: perhaps no family connection. 164 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:48,680 Speaker 1: That makes sense, And the fact that you know the 165 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: name change. When you hear Salem witch trials, you don't 166 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 1: hear talking about Danvers witch trials, right, So I'm sure 167 00:09:54,640 --> 00:09:57,480 Speaker 1: that just in the public sye, it's a little bit 168 00:09:57,480 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 1: of a disconnect for that reason alone. 169 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 2: You're right, the name is the brand, and of course 170 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 2: Salem has its original name, and so that connection is there. 171 00:10:07,600 --> 00:10:11,040 Speaker 1: What's left behind in Denverse to remind people of these atrocities. 172 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 1: I mean you said that a lot of the accusers 173 00:10:15,360 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: stayed behind in Salem Village. Surely their homes and their 174 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:19,120 Speaker 1: farms are still there too. 175 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 2: Yes, we have several buildings that are connected to people 176 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:27,320 Speaker 2: involved in the witch hunt. First and foremost is the 177 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:30,559 Speaker 2: Rebecca Nurse Homestead in Danvers. It's the only home of 178 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 2: a victim of the witch hunt that's preserved and open 179 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 2: to the public. There are other homes that are just 180 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:42,280 Speaker 2: somebody's private home that were homes of victims or accusers. 181 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 2: In sixteen ninety two, we have an archaeological site where 182 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 2: Reverend Paris's home, the Salem Village Parsonage was And then 183 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 2: in March of nineteen ninety two, the three hundredth anniversary 184 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 2: of the first death in the witch hunt, which was 185 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,760 Speaker 2: one of the people who was passed away in jail, 186 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 2: this memorial to all the victims of the witch hunt 187 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 2: was dedicated in Danvers in what used to be the 188 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:10,359 Speaker 2: center of Salem Village, that neighborhood. 189 00:11:10,520 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: You are a lifelong Danvers resident, and clearly you know 190 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:17,160 Speaker 1: a lot about the history. You are a historian. This 191 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 1: is what you've dedicated your life's work to so far, 192 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: and we'll talk about your book, we'll talk about your 193 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 1: tours here in just a minute. Tell me what it 194 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:26,080 Speaker 1: feels like to be somebody who lives in Danvers and 195 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 1: has kind of uncovered a lot of this history that 196 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 1: a lot of people these days don't talk about. 197 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 2: What I find fascinating as having researched this event and 198 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:39,440 Speaker 2: giving tours of sites related to this event is there 199 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 2: are people who come out to see these original sites 200 00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:46,200 Speaker 2: related to the witch hunt who are very much the 201 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:51,600 Speaker 2: tourists who are history oriented. That they don't they might 202 00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 2: come in October, but not for Halloween, not in costume 203 00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,840 Speaker 2: or anything like that, but that they are tourists who 204 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:04,320 Speaker 2: are historical tourists. That's the group that would make it 205 00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 2: out from downtown Salem to Danvers. 206 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 1: These days, I feel like a lot of us talk 207 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:12,280 Speaker 1: more about uncomfortable history. Do you feel that that's the 208 00:12:12,280 --> 00:12:12,959 Speaker 1: case now. 209 00:12:13,240 --> 00:12:16,120 Speaker 2: Yes, Well, it is definitely an uncomfortable topic. It is 210 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:19,680 Speaker 2: a genuine tragedy that these people have lost their lives, 211 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 2: and locally it's something that people living in town know about. 212 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:27,719 Speaker 2: There's a high level of awareness and we have, for example, 213 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:31,320 Speaker 2: the third graders of all the elementary schools do a 214 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 2: local history day that involves includes a visit to the 215 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 2: Rebecca Nurse homestead. It's probably the only town in America 216 00:12:39,640 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 2: where all the elementary schoolers visit a grave of a 217 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:46,640 Speaker 2: condemned and executed alleged witch. 218 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: Speaking of Rebecca Nurse. By the way, you have written 219 00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,120 Speaker 1: a book, and this has been out for a couple 220 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 1: of years now. It's called a Salem Witch The Trial, 221 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: Execution and Exoneration of Rebecca Nurse. We've talked about Rebecca 222 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:01,120 Speaker 1: Nurse a couple of times so far in this interview, 223 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: but tell me why you decided to focus on her. 224 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:07,040 Speaker 2: Well, I knew I wanted to write a biography because 225 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:11,359 Speaker 2: at the time of writing, there was no standalone biography 226 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:13,880 Speaker 2: of any of the victims of the witch hunt. There 227 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 2: was no book that told one of the victim's whole 228 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:20,000 Speaker 2: life story. And that that was a need that I 229 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:23,800 Speaker 2: saw because it is a tragedy and once you see 230 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 2: it through one person's eyes, you really understand how it 231 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,119 Speaker 2: affected them. It affected their family, it affected the community. 232 00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:35,560 Speaker 2: And I picked Rebecca Nurse because when she's accused, she 233 00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:39,839 Speaker 2: seemed at the time and now even historians agree, really 234 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,200 Speaker 2: one of the least likely people to have wound up 235 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 2: being accused of witchcraft. There are others who you know 236 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 2: that they had disputes, you know that they had feuds, 237 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:52,640 Speaker 2: and they wind up being accused. With Nurse, she has 238 00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 2: such a respectable background through the Puritan eyes, she is 239 00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:59,960 Speaker 2: an upstanding member of the community that I thought picked 240 00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 2: King the least likely person to be accused would actually 241 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:07,319 Speaker 2: reveal more about how the overall event unfolded. 242 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 1: Well, I'm going to leave that to people to read 243 00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 1: the book, because it's really a powerful story about Rebecca 244 00:14:12,559 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: and how she was able to rise in society and 245 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 1: then had this tragic, tragic downfall and end. But if 246 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: people want to get out toward Salem and Danvers or 247 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:24,320 Speaker 1: Salem Village, whatever you want to call it these days, 248 00:14:24,520 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: if people on a head to your neck of the 249 00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:29,320 Speaker 1: woods and take in some of this history. You lead 250 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:32,160 Speaker 1: walking tours, So tell us a bit about those and 251 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:34,920 Speaker 1: where you make your way around with these tours. 252 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 2: Yes, So for four years now I've been leading walking tours. 253 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 2: It was the first and the only historical walking tour 254 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:47,320 Speaker 2: of the Salem Village sites in Danvers. We hold them 255 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:50,800 Speaker 2: on Saturday mornings, typically just in the fall, which is 256 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:54,200 Speaker 2: when most people are are coming out, and it includes 257 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:59,320 Speaker 2: the foundation, the archaeological site of where Reverend Paris's house was. 258 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:03,120 Speaker 2: We talk outside some buildings in the historic district, including 259 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,040 Speaker 2: one that had been the tavern in Salem Village. We 260 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:08,760 Speaker 2: go to the memorial to the victims of the witch hunt, 261 00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:11,960 Speaker 2: and we talk in front of and about the first 262 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 2: Church of Danvers, the Congregational Church, which is the same 263 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:19,400 Speaker 2: congregation that was the Salem Village church back in sixteen 264 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 2: ninety two. 265 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:22,960 Speaker 1: Wow. And obviously for people who might be listening from 266 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:26,320 Speaker 1: outside of the area, Salem and Danvers are not that 267 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:28,680 Speaker 1: far apart. It does not take long to get between 268 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: the two. So if you're staying in Salem, super quick 269 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 1: ride up in uber or like public transit. It's not 270 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 1: that far to go. 271 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:38,000 Speaker 2: That is very true. Yep, No, it could be about 272 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 2: fifteen minutes driving it is. It's really close by. And 273 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:44,400 Speaker 2: many people I find stop and take the walking tour 274 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 2: on a Saturday morning on their way into Salem for 275 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 2: the day. 276 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: Tell us where people can find out more about signing 277 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:53,240 Speaker 1: up for the tour, about your book, about the history 278 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:55,800 Speaker 1: work that you've done, because this is no small fee 279 00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:57,680 Speaker 1: this is a lot of stuff to pull together. Tell 280 00:15:57,760 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 1: us where we can find out more. 281 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 2: You can find out more. We're at Daniel gagninhistory dot com. 282 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 2: The walking tour is booked through the Salem Historical Tours website. Okay, 283 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:12,440 Speaker 2: and I also always recommend people check out the nonprofit 284 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 2: Rebecca Nurse Homestead Museum in Danvers too. 285 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: All Right, Daniel Gagnan, this is great information, stories that 286 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:21,520 Speaker 1: many of us may not have known. So thank you 287 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:25,560 Speaker 1: for the education and enjoy your time in Salem Village 288 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:27,360 Speaker 1: for the rest of the spooky season. 289 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 2: Thank you very much, nice talking with you. 290 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 1: Have a safe and healthy weekend. Please join me again 291 00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:35,360 Speaker 1: next week for another edition of the show. I'm Nicole 292 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: Davis from WBZ News Radio on iHeartRadio.