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Speaker 1: You found Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

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Speaker 2: All right, that's us fie minutes after three.

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Speaker 3: This is ESPN fifteen thirty Moegar, Thank you for listening.

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Speaker 3: Show previews available right now at Molegar on Twitter thanks

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Speaker 3: to share Facts Credit Union. I am thrilled that you

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Speaker 3: are here. Thanks to Chad Brendel for pinching yesterday. If

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Speaker 3: you had a free day weekend, hopefully you enjoyed it.

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Speaker 3: Weeks off to a good start. Paul Danner Junior from

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Speaker 3: The Athletic is here. Later on, we'll get to Elie

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Speaker 3: Dela Cruz and Tito Francona and the Reds offense, and

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Speaker 3: we'll talk to Miami and Kent State point shaving with

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Speaker 3: our guys Stewart W. Penrose from Manila Law Group, and

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Speaker 3: of course, thoughts on the college football Playoff National Championship

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Speaker 3: tilt last night won by the Indiana Hoosiers. If you're

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Speaker 3: an IU fan and IU grad, congratulations, it's the coolest

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Speaker 3: story in sports history. We'll get to all of that

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Speaker 3: a little bit later on, but Paul's here from the

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Speaker 3: Athletic and the Growler podcast.

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Speaker 2: How is it going? It's going great?

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Speaker 4: Do you know when I was in college, I did

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Speaker 4: a thesis on point shaving in college basketball.

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Speaker 2: Really.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: It was sparked because I thought that the leading scorer

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Speaker 4: for OU's basketball team was shaving points and I wanted

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Speaker 4: to try to expose it. Yeah, that was not the

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Speaker 4: case as far as I could tell, although I had

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Speaker 4: my theories. But I did learn a lot about the

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Speaker 4: history of point shaving and headache Smith and Kentucky from

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Speaker 4: back in the fifties. Of course, now you can fill

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Speaker 4: ten times as many books just in the last couple

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Speaker 4: of years compared to what there was then. But if

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Speaker 4: you want to know any more, I've got lots of background.

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Speaker 3: Here is the thesis available? Is it published? Is something

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Speaker 3: I can access? I mean, I hope did you mention

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Speaker 3: your Did you mention the OU player by name?

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Speaker 4: I would like not to say his name, but if

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Speaker 4: you look up the leading scorers from two thousand and

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Speaker 4: one to two thousand and three at Ohi University you

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Speaker 4: could probably figure out now.

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Speaker 3: So you could be my point shaving guy. I mean,

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Speaker 3: is that the beat you want?

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Speaker 2: At this point? I might take it understood, but yeah, no,

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Speaker 2: I'm here for whatever you need.

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Speaker 3: A little bit later on, I'm gonna I'm gonna tell

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Speaker 3: you the move. I wish the Bengals weren't a position

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Speaker 3: to make a little tease.

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Speaker 2: That is good. You're no, I'm not. But but in

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Speaker 2: that instance, maybe I peaked your interest. Yes, I am

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Speaker 2: interested in that.

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Speaker 3: Perhaps the audiences as well. There's a lot of stuff.

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Speaker 3: We got a lot to get to. Yeah, let's start

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Speaker 3: with the striking contrast, which is something we talked about

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Speaker 3: a little bit on your podcast this morning. So the

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Speaker 3: Buffalo Bills they got Josh Allen. Josh Allen's an MVP quarterback.

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Speaker 3: Josh Allen's an a lister, Josh Allen's a star. He

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Speaker 3: is one of the faces of the league. The Buffalo

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Speaker 3: Bills haven't won a Super Bowl with him, so they

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Speaker 3: said to the coach, thanks for everything, Deuces, see you.

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Speaker 3: The Baltimore Ravens have a two time MVP quarterback, Lamar Jackson,

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Speaker 3: bona fide star right this year. Maybe not himself, perhaps

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Speaker 3: more physically compromised than he was letting on. He did

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Speaker 3: miss games, but Lamar Jackson is a star. He was

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Speaker 3: paired with a coach who was quickly hired by the

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Speaker 3: New York Giants, a guy who might be in the

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Speaker 3: Hall of Fame one day, but the Baltimore Ravens said,

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Speaker 3: we can't wait anymore. See you, John Harball, Thanks, enjoy

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Speaker 3: New Jersey. The Cincinnati Bengals have a quarterback like that. Granted,

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Speaker 3: not been an MVP, but he has played in a

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Speaker 3: Super Bowl, but he's been an MVP finalist twice, two

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Speaker 3: time comeback Player of the Year, bona fide star, has

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Speaker 3: a claim to the title of best quarterback in the sport.

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Speaker 3: And the Cincinnati Bengals said, we're cool, Zach, You're good.

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Speaker 3: You two are together. That contrast, to me is striking absolutely.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's been interesting.

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Speaker 4: You have the AFC had this this thing going with

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Speaker 4: Mahomes and Reed and then Zach, Taylor and Burrow and

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Speaker 4: Harbaugh and Jackson and of course Allan and McDermott. I mean,

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Speaker 4: for the longest time these were that wasn't changing. And

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Speaker 4: I even right before at the end of this season,

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Speaker 4: we were talking about how interesting is when you look

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Speaker 4: at the coaches about how these quarterbacks have kept their

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Speaker 4: coaches connections going. Really, whatever's been going on there, there's

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Speaker 4: no doubt about it. What is happening now in the

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Speaker 4: upheaval in the league and the ten open jobs and

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Speaker 4: the high profile coaches that have left. Now with franchise quarterbacks,

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Speaker 4: it only does what everything seems to be doing. The

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Speaker 4: theme right now is okay, you want to be your

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Speaker 4: team continuity.

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Speaker 2: That's the thing. This is it.

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Speaker 4: That pressure could not be more on everything to happen

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Speaker 4: this year because you're just not going to get now.

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Speaker 4: Who knows, it's the Bengals, so whatever, it could go

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Speaker 4: on forever, but like it does, it does really feel

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Speaker 4: like this time like this is it. I mean, this

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Speaker 4: is your It's either you can do it or you're

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Speaker 4: going to be like the rest of these. And the

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Speaker 4: difference I will say when you analyze what's happening here

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Speaker 4: one coming off the year where you didn't have Burrow

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Speaker 4: for the whole time, so who knows what it looks like.

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Speaker 4: But that said, I think your job ends up being

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Speaker 4: so much about managing your quarterback relationship and managing up.

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Speaker 4: This job has since Marvin Lewis showed up day one,

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Speaker 4: been about managing up and helping everything get as much

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Speaker 4: done as you can and deal with all of that.

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Speaker 4: I think Zach Taylor has a good relationship obviously with

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Speaker 4: ownership to still be here at this point. Yeah, and

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Speaker 4: obviously with Joe Burrow to still be here at this point,

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Speaker 4: I think those are the two things that John Harbaugh

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Speaker 4: and Sean McDermott did not have and it cost them

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Speaker 4: now for whatever reason. How much should that matter? We

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Speaker 4: can all debate that, but if you're asking me the

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Speaker 4: difference in this particular moment, I think that got those

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Speaker 4: guys and at some point, yes, you have to win.

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Speaker 4: They were there, you know, longer than Zach's been here,

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Speaker 4: but it's understood at this point. I mean, you only

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Speaker 4: get so many shots when you have the franchise quarterback,

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Speaker 4: when you have him in full But yeah, that man

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Speaker 4: the pile. It just keeps everything that's happened, everything that

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Speaker 4: has happened in recent years, the conjecture from Joe, the

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Speaker 4: movement in the league, the A division that now will

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Speaker 4: have all new head coaches around you, the AFC and upheaval.

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Speaker 4: It's just Zach Taylor and Andy Reid are the only

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Speaker 4: guys that have really been around here. All of the

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Speaker 4: continuity that they're selling and bringing back, and the support statement.

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Speaker 4: Everything that has happened since the season has ended has pointed.

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Speaker 2: To extreme pressure cooker.

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Speaker 4: Of twenty twenty six season, and this is it, man,

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Speaker 4: because otherwise you're going to go the same way that

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Speaker 4: the rest of the league is going.

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Speaker 3: We will see ultimately what the result of the coaching

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Speaker 3: searches in the three AFC North cities are. But is

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Speaker 3: there a world because I think there is where the

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Speaker 3: Bengals are considered AFC North favorites before the season.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, because who I mean, Pittsburgh is not a

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Speaker 4: good job. No, Pittsburgh is a great job theoretically in

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Speaker 4: a you can keep this job for a long time.

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Speaker 3: But all of those coaches had almost immediate success. So

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Speaker 3: when I say, all, let's talk about Cower and Tomlin,

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Speaker 3: they they they lived off the instant success they had.

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Speaker 2: Yes, that's part of it.

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Speaker 4: And also when you take that job, I think you're

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Speaker 4: the reason that it was time there is it's hard

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Speaker 4: reset time in Pittsburgh. They got to figure out a

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Speaker 4: way to say the rosters old, the quarterback situation needs

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Speaker 4: to get a long term solution. If you're if you're

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Speaker 4: cutting ties, if the Tomlin move happens now that is

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Speaker 4: you know, let's reset the game. Okay, And so that's

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Speaker 4: not a great job. How is a new per new

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Speaker 4: coach gonna mesh with Lamar Jackson and both like, I

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Speaker 4: don't know, it's obviously not gonna be Cleveland that you're

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Speaker 4: gonna be so so yeah, I mean I don't to

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Speaker 4: this in this moment. They should be Yes, this should

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Speaker 4: be it is setting up for them to make their run.

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Speaker 2: I mean it's.

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Speaker 4: This is this is what you ask for and so yeah,

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Speaker 4: can you should they? Yes, they should be favorites to

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Speaker 4: win the AFC North from the get go, which does

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Speaker 4: what only adds more pressure. Again, like all of this,

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Speaker 4: all of this is, it's all this one pile. This

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Speaker 4: is what it all is. It's like, okay, twenty twenty

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Speaker 4: six or all bets are off with absolutely everything happening internally.

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Speaker 3: I was watching people fight on the internet, and I'm

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Speaker 3: as i've gotten older, I'm more of a watch people

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Speaker 3: fight than i am jump into the fray I enjoy sometimes,

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Speaker 3: not that often. But I was watching people fight about

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Speaker 3: Mike Tomlin, fighting over whether or not he would would

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Speaker 3: take the Bengals job if it comes open next year,

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Speaker 3: and the one person was making the argument that there's

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Speaker 3: no way that Mike Tomlin would want to work for

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Speaker 3: the Brown family, and I thought about that, and I said,

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Speaker 3: you know, these are two family run franchises, And when

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Speaker 3: I read stuff out of Pittsburgh, or when I listen

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Speaker 3: to shows like this out of Pittsburgh, it sounds like

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Speaker 3: the Bengals are being talked about, or I read some

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Speaker 3: of the same things I read about the Bengals that

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Speaker 3: outdated facilities and mom and pop franchise and stubborn and

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Speaker 3: obstinate and set in their ways and frugal to a fault.

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Speaker 3: This is not for me a conversation about Mike Tomlin.

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Speaker 3: But you talked about the Steelers job. I believe this.

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Speaker 3: Say what you want about the prestige of that franchise

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Speaker 3: and what the Steelers historically have accomplished. Those two franchises

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Speaker 3: have more in common at the ownership level than I

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Speaker 3: think people realize.

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Speaker 2: The biggest thing that differentiates the two of them is

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Speaker 2: the history. That's it.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, at this point, if you want to

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Speaker 4: look back in the last fifteen years, the last ten years,

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Speaker 4: in the recent history, the franchises have operated similarly. They've

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Speaker 4: had similar problems. Mike Tomlin is going through the same

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Speaker 4: thing now that Marvin Lewis went through.

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Speaker 2: I mean, this is.

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Speaker 4: Very, very similar paths. They have a similar ownership group

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Speaker 4: that is adjusting and trying to figure out how to

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Speaker 4: act and survive and sustain in an NFL world that

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Speaker 4: is changing what ownership looks like around them, for better

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Speaker 4: or for worse, right, And I just I think there's

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Speaker 4: adjustments in that. I think they there's there is a

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Speaker 4: lot more similarities. I think you're exactly right, but the

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Speaker 4: history and the respect that comes with what they have

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Speaker 4: been and and I think a way that they go

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Speaker 4: about certain things, but they do things that they this

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Speaker 4: is the Steeler way that I equivocally do not agree

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Speaker 4: with in terms of the money they spend to older players, right,

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Speaker 4: the heavy lean into like just defense all the time

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Speaker 4: and not realizing it's an offensive league, and in the

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Speaker 4: churning of the quarterback situation.

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Speaker 2: Like, there's a lot of stuff that they do that

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Speaker 2: they have.

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Speaker 4: Always done that I don't necessarily agree with the same

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Speaker 4: way they would be things that you would look at

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Speaker 4: the way the Bengals do it that the normal NFL

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Speaker 4: franchise is not going to agree with in that respect,

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Speaker 4: I think you're right, Like they operate in distinct kind

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Speaker 4: of unique ways, their own unique ways, but unique ways

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Speaker 4: to the bigger NFL landscape.

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Speaker 3: Watching people on the internet, if you do it in

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Speaker 3: small doses, can bring an amount of joy to you

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Speaker 3: that I think is rare when you when you when

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Speaker 3: you go online.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I think I like it most when you

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Speaker 4: do jump in that is kind of yes, because you

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Speaker 4: it's clearly reluctantly, but it's clear also that you have

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Speaker 4: a joke so good you just have to get it off. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: you know, you're like, I just I you know it's

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Speaker 4: not in your best interest. Like every time I see

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Speaker 4: you do it, I'm like, he knows he shouldn't do

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Speaker 4: this right now. Yes, but you're like, but the joke's

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Speaker 4: too good. Yeah, get passed on the joke. And that's

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Speaker 4: what I respect about you. When you got the good joke,

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Speaker 4: you're willing to get it off no matter what the

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Speaker 4: fallout could be.

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Speaker 3: We have finally found something you respect about me. So

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Speaker 3: Dan Pitcher is a valued member of the Cincinnati Bengals,

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Speaker 3: yet they may let him leave for the same job.

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Speaker 3: This doesn't make any sense. We'll talk about it when

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Speaker 3: we come back. Paul Danner Junior's here from The Athletic

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Speaker 3: and The Growler podcast. Follow him at Day Junior. The

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Speaker 3: latest edition of the Growler Podcast released just a short

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Speaker 3: while ago.

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Speaker 2: Seventeen minutes after three. Paul's here till four.

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Speaker 3: We are here till six on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati

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Speaker 3: Sports Station WCKY, Cincinnati and iHeartRadio station Garan teed Human

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Speaker 3: ESPN fifteen thirty. I heard radio twenty two minutes after

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Speaker 3: three o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty on Moeger. Thanks

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Speaker 3: for listening. Paul Dayner Junior is here from The Athletic

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Speaker 3: and the Growler Podcast. He has written about the list

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Speaker 3: of possible cat casualties, and we're going to get to

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Speaker 3: that here in a bit. Go read it at the

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Speaker 3: Athletic dot com. Let's spend some time on Dan Pitcher. Okay,

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Speaker 3: you're big on Dan Pitcher. Man, you think Dan Pitcher

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Speaker 3: should be interviewed by all these teams who need a

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Speaker 3: head coach was interviewed by one.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you're a big Dan Pitcher guy, right.

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Speaker 3: You are?

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Speaker 2: I feel I shall be I know we's going. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: The Bengals like Dan Pitcher. Yes, they value Dan Pitcher.

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Speaker 3: They think Dan Pitcher is key to their success. They

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Speaker 3: view him as an important part of the organization, So

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Speaker 3: why then would they let him leave for a lateral

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Speaker 3: move interviewing with the Buccaneers to be their offensive coordinator.

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Speaker 3: He's the offensive coordinator here. Now I know the answer is, well,

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Speaker 3: he wants to call plays? Cool, why not just let

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Speaker 3: him call plays here?

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Speaker 6: Then?

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Speaker 2: So I don't think it's that simple.

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Speaker 4: Oh, I don't think it's as simple to say he

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Speaker 4: wants to call plays, Okay. I mean, we've seen plenty

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Speaker 4: of coaches get hired that didn't call plays. I think,

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Speaker 4: and this is me. Dan has never said this to me,

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Speaker 4: but this is my observation on the way things are going.

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Speaker 4: I can only imagine a frustration with the last two

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Speaker 4: head coaching cycles. Sure for him, I think there has

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Speaker 4: always been a shroud of dis credit around coaches underneath

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Speaker 4: Joe Burrow or are in the orbit of Joe Burrow.

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Speaker 2: The Burrow's doing this right. Coaches don't get much credit.

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Speaker 4: I haven't gotten much credit for anything here, maybe rightfully,

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Speaker 4: so I don't know. I'm not really here to differentiate

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Speaker 4: that perception is reality.

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Speaker 3: Does Brian Callahan's lack of success in Tennessee don't help?

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Speaker 3: It certainly doesn't help, but it doesn't run under the

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Speaker 3: degree that I fear it.

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Speaker 4: Might maybe some, but I think I think there is

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Speaker 4: a degree Dan wants to be a head coach, as

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Speaker 4: anyone in his position would sure, and I think there

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Speaker 4: is some degree of maybe getting out from the shadow

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Speaker 4: of Joe Burrow into a different offense, into a different

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Speaker 4: atmosphere and showing off things there could be helpful to

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Speaker 4: your career. And Zach Taylor and this staff would say,

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Speaker 4: we don't want to stop you from seeing what your

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Speaker 4: you know, progress in your career can be look into, right,

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Speaker 4: especially with the acknowledgment that if he did, they they

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Speaker 4: have a easy one to one potentially available in Frank Callahan.

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Speaker 4: But that's my point is I don't think they want

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Speaker 4: to be restrictive of what Dan feels like is maybe

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Speaker 4: the best path for him to get to his career goal. Okay,

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Speaker 4: of telling you no, you're here now, you can't. I

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Speaker 4: don't want you going anywhere else. You're here, don't try

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Speaker 4: to find what's what you might think is best for you.

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Speaker 3: And by the way, there's I'm sure a lot of

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Speaker 3: organizations that would operate that way, perhaps this one in

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Speaker 3: the past.

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Speaker 4: One has in the past, I think in certain situations

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Speaker 4: in certain times if you feel like any one of

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Speaker 4: these things are true. You can't advance when you're in

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Speaker 4: Cincinnati because of everything. You can't advance because you don't

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Speaker 4: call plays. You can't advance because of the shadow of

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Speaker 4: Joe Burrow. You can't advance because you just can't stay

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Speaker 4: in that position for too many years, Like the league

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Speaker 4: turns over for a reason, you either get promoter or fired.

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Speaker 7: Right.

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Speaker 2: If you're in there too long, it becomes why are

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Speaker 2: you in there that long? Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Okay, So I think there is a not wanting to

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Speaker 4: let him feel like he doesn't have a chance to advance.

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Speaker 4: Go see what you can do, make see if that

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Speaker 4: is a better job for you, right, and then come

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Speaker 4: back and let's see what you think is the final

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Speaker 4: decision for you.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 4: I don't think they want to feel like he should

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Speaker 4: feel restricted being in this position. I think that's part

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Speaker 4: of it. So it's more than just I want to

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Speaker 4: call plays. Obviously that's gonna be a portion of this

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Speaker 4: because he doesn't, and that's you know, if we're gonna

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Speaker 4: call him the non play calling oh.

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Speaker 2: See, whatever.

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Speaker 4: But I think it's about career growth and the path

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Speaker 4: to what he wants most and not wanting to restrict

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Speaker 4: that in somebody that works for you is a big

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Speaker 4: part of this.

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Speaker 3: So Dan Pictuer if he leaves, obviously they could just

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Speaker 3: bring back Brian Callahan, which sounds great. But what if

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Speaker 3: Brian Callahan gets a job somewhere else and Dan Pittrick

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Speaker 3: gets a job somewhere else. Yeah, well that's then what's playing. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's a terrible scenario. They would figure that out.

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Speaker 4: There's a list, I mean, there's always you always have

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Speaker 4: a list that you compile in every off season and

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Speaker 4: some downtime pete network of people that you know they're

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Speaker 4: not I mean, yeah, the timing is tricky here, Yeah,

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Speaker 4: in terms of what there's but the timing is tricky

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Speaker 4: for everybody in the entire league right now with this

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Speaker 4: many jobs and this many staffs being put together and

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Speaker 4: disassembled and trying to get read like this is something

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Speaker 4: that we haven't seen in the league in a little

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Speaker 4: while where you're.

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Speaker 2: Gonna have this much movement.

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Speaker 4: So yeah, everybody's sitting in here trying to watch the

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Speaker 4: timing of things. I think Brian Callahan would like to

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Speaker 4: come back here as a number one landing spot. I

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Speaker 4: think he's interested in a lot of different things, but

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Speaker 4: this one certainly makes the most sense.

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Speaker 2: For Zach Taylor.

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Speaker 4: It certainly makes the most sense in a world where

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Speaker 4: they are so they're just they're so pot committed to

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Speaker 4: continuity at this point, like like to use poker terms

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Speaker 4: like this is it like they're in there's no getting

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Speaker 4: out of the continuity train.

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Speaker 6: Now.

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Speaker 2: That's what they're doing. That's their angle.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so you're not gonna like go away from that

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Speaker 4: in the offensive coordinator position, assuming you can, you can

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Speaker 4: make the timing work. That is, you know, the I

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Speaker 4: guess the tricky part of that. And if Brian gets

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Speaker 4: a better opportunity, which very well could happen, but you know,

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Speaker 4: they certainly hope that it doesn't. I think there's a

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Speaker 4: thought that this is the best opportunity for the Bengals

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Speaker 4: and for him if it came to that at all.

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Speaker 2: Sure, but is.

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Speaker 3: There any validity to the idea that, Okay, if you

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Speaker 3: want to escape Joe Burrow's very large shadow, for lack

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Speaker 3: of a better way of putting it, call the plays

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Speaker 3: next year bring out something in this quarterback, in this

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Speaker 3: offense that maybe we haven't been able to tap into

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Speaker 3: nearly as much. And the credit will come. No, he

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Speaker 3: did that? Yeah, what else?

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Speaker 2: What happened?

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Speaker 4: In twenty twenty four, Dan Pitcher came in, took over

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Speaker 4: Jamar Chase won a triple crown. They were doing things

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Speaker 4: they hadn't done before. They were they evolved in a

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Speaker 4: nice way, right, And what did he get?

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Speaker 3: No head coach interviewed It wasn't calling place. People love

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Speaker 3: to fixate on the call and place thing.

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Speaker 2: I mean, that's fine, is it? Something is?

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Speaker 4: I don't think that's the only I think that's how

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Speaker 4: everybody gets hired.

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Speaker 2: I mean, there's not like.

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Speaker 3: It's silly for us as fans to fixate on that.

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Speaker 3: I think so when it comes to any coach, you know,

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Speaker 3: because you've heard it with Eric b Enemy for instance, Right,

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Speaker 3: well he doesn't call plays right, and so like the

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Speaker 3: public perception is that works.

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Speaker 4: I think it's a piece of the pie. I do

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Speaker 4: not think it's anywhere near the most important part. I

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Speaker 4: think being able to lead, I think, understanding how to

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Speaker 4: connect with people. I think understanding how to properly build

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Speaker 4: a culture, what winning actually looks like like all of

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Speaker 4: that stuff. You know, it's sort of like I mean,

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Speaker 4: to me, it's kind of like when you rush the

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Speaker 4: baseball manager for the decisions they make with their bullpen.

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Speaker 2: And I don't mean that as a joking way, but

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Speaker 2: I want to see you know where.

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Speaker 4: It's like, so much of being a baseball manager is

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Speaker 4: just managing the personalities through one hundred and sixty two

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Speaker 4: games and getting people liking coming to work and all

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Speaker 4: that stuff, right, But what's most seen by fans and

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Speaker 4: complained about is stuff that happens in game decision making

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Speaker 4: that blows up in their face. Now, that is a

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Speaker 4: part of your job, but it is not the biggest

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Speaker 4: part of your job. And I think in the way

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Speaker 4: that they do it here, I it's not like he

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Speaker 4: has no say in the calling of plays and the

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Speaker 4: execution of all of that. But yeah, that's part, but

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Speaker 4: I understand that. Yeah, would you love if that was Also,

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Speaker 4: if you're an owner and you're looking at your head

416
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Speaker 4: coach candidates, you'd love to have every single one of

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Speaker 4: those thirty boxes checked. If one of them doesn't call plays.

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Speaker 4: You know, maybe the box is bigger for some than others,

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Speaker 4: but it's one of many.

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Speaker 2: Boxes you would love. Everybody would love their resume to

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Speaker 2: have every box check.

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Speaker 4: They don't all Okay, maybe that's one that he feels

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Speaker 4: like he needs. Maybe the shadow of Joe Burrow is

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Speaker 4: what he feels like he needs. Maybe he just wants

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Speaker 4: to know what's out there, right. Maybe he just won't

426
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Speaker 4: to see if he can make a little more money.

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Speaker 4: Maybe he likes the sun, Okay, Like I don't know,

428
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Speaker 4: there's lots of reasons. Maybe he too is sick of losing.

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Speaker 4: Maybe there's lots of reasons why you would consider looking

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Speaker 4: into your other options elsewhere. And I think it's fine

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Speaker 4: that they would sit there and say, go look into

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Speaker 4: what you can get.

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Speaker 3: And I yeah, on a human level idea, I greatly

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Speaker 3: appreciate that, especially in a year where there's a lot

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Speaker 3: of a lot of pressure on this staff to win.

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Speaker 3: I can appreciate them saying, look, if what's best for

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Speaker 3: you is taking a lateral move, so to speak, because

438
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:52,480
Speaker 3: you think that's best for you, we're not going to

439
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:54,520
Speaker 3: get in your way. Like, I think that's cool as hell.

440
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,960
Speaker 4: I mean, Dave Canalis, Liam Kuhn too. The last two

441
00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:06,120
Speaker 4: successful coordinators in Tampa became head coaches after one year.

442
00:22:06,240 --> 00:22:08,879
Speaker 4: Dan might have been able to get that job before

443
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,879
Speaker 4: and instead right, and so maybe there's a regret in

444
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:16,719
Speaker 4: there with Tampa or other places. Let's let's see. I mean,

445
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:19,439
Speaker 4: let's see how that all plays out. I'm just saying,

446
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:23,880
Speaker 4: like I understand looking at that gig if you want

447
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:27,560
Speaker 4: to be a head coach and saying that could be

448
00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:30,040
Speaker 4: a nice step there. For me, that's not lateral.

449
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:32,120
Speaker 3: So what you do is you let him go coach

450
00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,919
Speaker 3: the Bucks and then when the Bengals go eight to

451
00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:40,360
Speaker 3: nine next year, Dan Pitcher come back. I mean, you're

452
00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:44,320
Speaker 3: do you not think that ultimate continuity moved? I mean

453
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:45,640
Speaker 3: that would certainly be.

454
00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:46,200
Speaker 2: On the table.

455
00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:50,040
Speaker 3: I mean, who knows, right, I just I don't necessarily

456
00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,240
Speaker 3: believe the Bengals are going eight to nine next year.

457
00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:54,679
Speaker 2: Before anybody gets mad at me, well, but I mean

458
00:22:54,720 --> 00:23:00,520
Speaker 2: it's on the table. Sure is there a number that's not? Yeah,

459
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,440
Speaker 2: they're not. It's like this year like a high number. Maybe.

460
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,800
Speaker 3: So they went six and eleven. That's as bad as

461
00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:09,919
Speaker 3: it's ever gonna get. They're never gonna lose clip that

462
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:14,560
Speaker 3: Taran clip it. They will never do. This year was awful.

463
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 3: This is as crappy, as miserable, as unfunny Bengals season

464
00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 3: as has happened in my life. They still stumble their

465
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,000
Speaker 3: way to six wins. They will never with joke in

466
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:28,160
Speaker 3: the Joe Burrow era. This is my bold hot take.

467
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:30,920
Speaker 3: If you want to go, they'll never win fewer than six.

468
00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 4: As long as he's healthy all year. You're accounting for

469
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:36,400
Speaker 4: Joe Burrow not missing more than a month.

470
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:40,400
Speaker 3: Okay, if he doesn't play a game, you know it's

471
00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 3: preseason injury. And if Joe Burrow plays half the games,

472
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 3: they will still win five. I'm sorry, they will win

473
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:49,879
Speaker 3: more than five. Yeah, it's not a very high bar

474
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 3: to clear.

475
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:53,800
Speaker 4: No, I don't see many worlds where if Joe Burrow

476
00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:57,920
Speaker 4: plays during a season that they go under five hundred

477
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,720
Speaker 4: or less in games where he's the starter and finishes.

478
00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:03,960
Speaker 2: Like, I'm with you on that. I just you know,

479
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:04,600
Speaker 2: I don't know.

480
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:07,680
Speaker 3: So there are numbers, in my opinion that are off

481
00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:10,679
Speaker 3: the table, the ones below six.

482
00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:18,119
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't take those off. No, I mean because

483
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:22,240
Speaker 4: I we don't know that Joe will be healthy. Like,

484
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:24,000
Speaker 4: but I know what you're saying. Three of us six

485
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,320
Speaker 4: years he and the inability to handle his injury. I

486
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 4: get injuries when they have happened. That's it is twenty

487
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,440
Speaker 4: six away from four o'clock. So you have your list

488
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:36,280
Speaker 4: of guys the Bengals could move on from, and I'm

489
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:38,000
Speaker 4: okay if they don't move on from any of them,

490
00:24:38,119 --> 00:24:40,399
Speaker 4: but there's one that I wish they were in a

491
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,199
Speaker 4: position to. We'll talk about him when we come back

492
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 4: to sports headlines as well. Paul Danner Junior is with

493
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 4: us till four o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati

494
00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:52,680
Speaker 4: Sports Station. No one covers the Bengals like ESPN fifteen

495
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:54,439
Speaker 4: thirty Cincinnati Sports.

496
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 3: Sports Headlines are a service of Kelsey Chevrolet, Home of

497
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:02,320
Speaker 3: lifetime powertrain protection and guarantee credit approval from their family

498
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:06,959
Speaker 3: to yours for life, kelseyshev dot Com. Tonight, the nationally

499
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:11,560
Speaker 3: ranked and undefeated Miami RedHawks hit the road to battle

500
00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:14,480
Speaker 3: Kent State. The Golden Flashes have one loss in MAC

501
00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 3: play this year. They lost by two to Central Michigan.

502
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 3: Travis Steel's team, looking for a season opening twentieth consecutive victory.

503
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:25,879
Speaker 3: Tip off is at seven o'clock tonight. What else do

504
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,800
Speaker 3: we have? We have a college basketball in the area.

505
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:33,480
Speaker 3: The Indiana Hoosiers visit third graded Michigan, and Ohio State

506
00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:37,239
Speaker 3: will host Minnesota hockey this evening. The Columbus Bluejackets, who

507
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:40,840
Speaker 3: have won four consecutive games, skate against the Ottawa Senators.

508
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 2: If the Jackets lose, the rules.

509
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 3: Say they have to fire the head coach, because they

510
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:46,120
Speaker 3: fire head coaches.

511
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:46,480
Speaker 2: Like every other week.

512
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,600
Speaker 3: Paul Tanner Junior from The Athletic and the Growler podcast

513
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 3: is here. I wish we could have podcast the last

514
00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:52,880
Speaker 3: conversation we were having off air.

515
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,000
Speaker 2: No, that's okay, we probably don't need to do that.

516
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 2: By the way, I can tell you how long Miami's

517
00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 2: unbeaten streak is gonna last.

518
00:25:58,800 --> 00:26:03,920
Speaker 4: Okay, they're gonna have a heartbroken on Valentine's heartbroken on

519
00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 4: Valentine's Day, goes into Oxford.

520
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:10,919
Speaker 2: Probably not. They're actually not very good this year. No,

521
00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 2: we've got more point shaving.

522
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:16,160
Speaker 4: It's possible they might need to bring back the leading

523
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 4: scorer from two thousand and one.

524
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 2: Three.

525
00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:25,560
Speaker 3: You you did the list of possible cap casualties, possible

526
00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 3: cap cuts, and on those list of players, there was

527
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:32,320
Speaker 3: no one that I was like dying to move on from.

528
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 3: There were players that if they moved on from, I

529
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 3: would find replaceable.

530
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 2: TJ.

531
00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 3: Slayton's one of them, right, I view him if he's

532
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,680
Speaker 3: on the team next year okay, and if they said

533
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 3: we're done, okay Oron Burks. If the Bengals said we

534
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:48,840
Speaker 3: can find somebody better than Oron Burks, I'd go cool.

535
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,400
Speaker 3: And if he was on the team next season, that's

536
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 3: fine too. The one that's interesting to me is Orlando Brown.

537
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:58,800
Speaker 3: And this is why I wish the Bengals had a

538
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 3: better defense, because I would love to look at him

539
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,439
Speaker 3: and go, you know what, we're gonna get out in

540
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 3: front of a drop off, And because he wasn't awesome

541
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 3: this past year, but at the end of the season,

542
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,959
Speaker 3: he said, Okay, given all the other stuff they have

543
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:16,000
Speaker 3: to fix, let's just leave well Enough alone at left

544
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 3: tackle and hopefully we get through the season with the

545
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:23,320
Speaker 3: same offensive line, bring back Dalton Reisner, Hopefully Orlando Brown

546
00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 3: plays at the same level he did in twenty five

547
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:27,800
Speaker 3: and twenty six, and you live with it and then

548
00:27:27,840 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 3: you move on. I wish they could get out in

549
00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 3: front of that, but they they're not equipped to because

550
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 3: of all the other issues they have to fix. That

551
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,159
Speaker 3: to me is one of the part. What's one of

552
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 3: the dominoes when you have a defense that's that bad

553
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,439
Speaker 3: that you can't look at Orlando Brown and say you

554
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,800
Speaker 3: know what, we're going to prioritize left tackle, Maybe do

555
00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:49,439
Speaker 3: it a year early, move on from them, sign a

556
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,920
Speaker 3: suitable replacement, and use your first round draft choice on

557
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:54,880
Speaker 3: that position. You can't do that because of how bad

558
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:58,240
Speaker 3: they are on defense. Yeah, that's the challenge.

559
00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:00,600
Speaker 4: And I've been you know, going through a very very

560
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 4: close to the mock off season sheet.

561
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:04,119
Speaker 2: Well it's, oh, it's very close.

562
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:07,000
Speaker 4: But that's as I've gone through it and been like

563
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 4: doing my versions of it. That's the one I come

564
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,600
Speaker 4: back to a lot of like, you just can't add on.

565
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 2: You can't.

566
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,920
Speaker 4: You gotta know that you would be able to get better,

567
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:20,160
Speaker 4: and then you also could be taking the chance of

568
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:22,560
Speaker 4: playing a draft pick over there.

569
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,119
Speaker 2: Like, there's just a lot of variables.

570
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,480
Speaker 4: Whereas it's it's fourteen million dollars against the cap is

571
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:31,359
Speaker 4: a big number, but he's also you know, when you

572
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 4: talk about tackle money, it's not that big.

573
00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:34,240
Speaker 3: No.

574
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,399
Speaker 4: I mean he's he's he's not paid average annual value

575
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 4: in the top twenty anymore. I mean it's and that's

576
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 4: probably a fine level that he plays at. Like I think,

577
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 4: I think it's fine. They do need to be getting

578
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:49,000
Speaker 4: out in front of it. In thinking about the future

579
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 4: and and my take on this has been offensive tackle

580
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:54,480
Speaker 4: should be on the table in round one. I'm not

581
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 4: saying you would do it, but it certainly should be

582
00:28:57,520 --> 00:28:59,240
Speaker 4: on the table. There's very few that should be off

583
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 4: the table at that time point. But somewhere in your

584
00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 4: first three picks, you need to come away with a

585
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 4: tackle that could potentially be your tackle of the future.

586
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,800
Speaker 4: I know that's scary because the ghost of Cedric a

587
00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 4: wayhe and Jake Fisher, but like, but you have to

588
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 4: do that, Like you just have to do that.

589
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 2: But he's got to be able to play if needed

590
00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 2: this year. Yeah, well that's the point. It's hering.

591
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,120
Speaker 4: Look, anybody you pick in the first three rounds should

592
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 4: be able to be a backup and be able to

593
00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 4: play if called upon. That's what a first, second, or

594
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 4: third round pick needs to be. Now you're gonna be

595
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 4: with tackle. Sure, there's chances that you take in that,

596
00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 4: but I mean, if they're worth that pick, they should

597
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,480
Speaker 4: be able to take on that responsibility of being O

598
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 4: T three okay and so, and potentially be more than

599
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,760
Speaker 4: that going forward. There's I mean, there's plenty of tackles

600
00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:46,080
Speaker 4: that that play and have played on good teams and

601
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 4: had success. So I I that to me is what

602
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 4: the approach has to be. And that's not even speaking

603
00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 4: about Orlando's level of play at all. If you have

604
00:29:57,480 --> 00:29:59,760
Speaker 4: any tackle entering the last year of his contract, you

605
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,360
Speaker 4: I don't know what's going on next year. That position

606
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:04,959
Speaker 4: is too hard to flip on the fly to all

607
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:06,880
Speaker 4: of a sudden be able to just be like next year,

608
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:09,600
Speaker 4: say oh, what are we going to do here? No,

609
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:13,480
Speaker 4: they have to be preemptive about that regardless. So to me,

610
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 4: that's on the table. Yes, I agree. You would love

611
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 4: to be in a position where if that was your

612
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,440
Speaker 4: only issue and you had extra money, you could go

613
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 4: get a different guy or get younger or Yeah, there's

614
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:28,520
Speaker 4: not a ton out there, but like it's there's not

615
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 4: a lot of offensive line man that teams are that

616
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 4: are really good. That team's are just letting me out

617
00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 4: there on the open market. So it's scarce anyway, but

618
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 4: there are names that you could find an answer there.

619
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 3: I just feel like with him, and I hope this

620
00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 3: isn't the case. And by the way, he's not even

621
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 3: thirty yet. He gets talked about like he's, you know,

622
00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 3: thirty four years old. I think he turns thirty during

623
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:50,520
Speaker 3: camp next year, so.

624
00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:53,120
Speaker 4: And keeping him around could be an option, But I

625
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:55,760
Speaker 4: think you'd want to see him play.

626
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 2: Better this year than he did last year. And and

627
00:30:57,680 --> 00:30:59,680
Speaker 2: so my fear is.

628
00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 3: I could see a scenario where next season Orlando Brown

629
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:08,920
Speaker 3: plays poorly, just the way it's trending. Sure, and when

630
00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:10,680
Speaker 3: he does, you go, man, I wish they could have

631
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 3: avoided this, but they can't.

632
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:14,480
Speaker 2: Like they can't.

633
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,640
Speaker 3: I don't want whatever's behind door number two at left tackle,

634
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:20,280
Speaker 3: but I wish the team was good enough to go,

635
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:24,440
Speaker 3: you know what, everything else is pretty set, Let's definitively

636
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 3: use the tenth overall pick on a left tackle, or

637
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:31,240
Speaker 3: let's find a suitable replacement and free agency to pair

638
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:35,280
Speaker 3: with the tenth overall pick. And they just, to me

639
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:37,680
Speaker 3: can't do that because of all the other stuff they've

640
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 3: got to fix. And so what you're hoping for is

641
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:41,640
Speaker 3: that Orlando Brown plays at the level that he did

642
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 3: this year, And hopefully that happens, and if so.

643
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:46,200
Speaker 2: I think we'll be okay with it.

644
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:48,200
Speaker 3: But I could see a world where he doesn't, and

645
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:51,040
Speaker 3: you go, man, now it's a liability.

646
00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 8: Yeah.

647
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,000
Speaker 4: Well, and I think one of the more interesting free

648
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:57,840
Speaker 4: agency things to look at, is what is their aggression.

649
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:01,000
Speaker 2: Level at their third tackle position. Is it?

650
00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 4: Is it a replacement because they need a swing tackle,

651
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 4: so it's some you know, bargain two three million dollar

652
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 4: guy whatever journeyman. Or is it a little bit more

653
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 4: of an aggressive push into a higher salary range for

654
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 4: somebody who could be there in case things don't go

655
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 4: well with with Orlando Brown and and try to take

656
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 4: the feeling pigeonholed to get an offensive tackle.

657
00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:27,600
Speaker 2: In the first three rounds or first or second round

658
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 2: or whatever, and.

659
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:30,880
Speaker 4: Play curious to see how that plays out if they

660
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 4: if they view that as something that they should prioritize.

661
00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:38,040
Speaker 4: My gut says that they they won't, but it's certainly possible.

662
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:42,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

663
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 3: I just as I was going down the list, I

664
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,800
Speaker 3: was wrestling with do I really want Orlando Brown on

665
00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:50,360
Speaker 3: the team next year? And I arrived at I do that,

666
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 3: I do do again. I just wish the team was

667
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 3: better that I can kind of afford to go. You

668
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:57,239
Speaker 3: know what, Let's let's get out in front of this now,

669
00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 3: because I think ideally, if your organization is humming on

670
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 3: all cylinders, that's what you do. You move on from

671
00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 3: players before they have that sudden drop off, and I

672
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,480
Speaker 3: fear by mid November we're gonna go, Holy hell, this

673
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 3: is what the sudden drop off looks like. Maybe that

674
00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 3: doesn't happen. Maybe he has a great year in him

675
00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,440
Speaker 3: and that would be unsurprising as well. But when you

676
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 3: look at the offense, it's Reisner, it's maybe a third

677
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,960
Speaker 3: wide receiver, and it's something at left tackle. I wish

678
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:26,800
Speaker 3: you could make that a bigger priority, but you can't,

679
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 3: cause the defense you may have heard.

680
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 2: Not very good.

681
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's no doubt, but I mean if you're talking

682
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:35,400
Speaker 4: about using pick ten or forty one on a tackle

683
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 4: and you get to November and it's not very good,

684
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:39,959
Speaker 4: that's the point where you make a change there anyway,

685
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:41,120
Speaker 4: with a top pick.

686
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:48,320
Speaker 2: When you see a tweet from Joe Burrow, do you

687
00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:50,000
Speaker 2: assume he's been hacked? Yes?

688
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,800
Speaker 3: First thought you assume. You try to figure out if

689
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 3: it's really him. Uh, well, where does your mind go

690
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,719
Speaker 3: when you see that Joe Burrow has decided to jump in? Like?

691
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 3: I enjoy Twitter, I really do. I use it to

692
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 3: amuse myself and to promote myself. I enjoy Twitter. I

693
00:34:07,920 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 3: don't necessarily know that I understand after that app has

694
00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 3: been around for seventeen years. Why somebody would suddenly decide,

695
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:15,839
Speaker 3: you know what I'm gonna do? Today is the day

696
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 3: I'm gonna jump in. And so I am. I am

697
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:23,719
Speaker 3: fascinated by the mindset here is this. You know, Joe

698
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 3: Burrow only has something to lose on Twitter. There's nothing

699
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:29,320
Speaker 3: for him to gain. It's Joe Burrow, right, trying to

700
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 3: gain the favor of the officials.

701
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:31,600
Speaker 2: That I guess.

702
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 3: So, so when I'm looking at the timeline and I

703
00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,799
Speaker 3: see a tweet from Joe Burrow, there are very few

704
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 3: times there's an audible reaction for me based on a

705
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,680
Speaker 3: tweet that and it wasn't what he tweeted about. It

706
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 3: was like, holy hell, he remember his password?

707
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:48,040
Speaker 4: Yes, which is maybe the most impressive part. And yeah

708
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:51,080
Speaker 4: that photographic that's true. Yes, I remember all that stuff.

709
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 3: No, do you think he's a two way authentication guy?

710
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 8: Yeah?

711
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 3: I think I kind of cares about security. Okay, if

712
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:03,239
Speaker 3: I was Joe Burrow I when it happened four way authentication,

713
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,520
Speaker 3: I think probably more. Yeah, No, I think so. I

714
00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 3: think here's the thing. I mean, I looked down and

715
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 3: I did the first hacked. Sure, right, gotta be And

716
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:14,640
Speaker 3: then it's like, okay, maybe.

717
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 2: Not what's going on? Then I was just staring. I

718
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 2: was kind of squinting.

719
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:20,719
Speaker 4: I have a we have a rule, like, let's let's

720
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:22,719
Speaker 4: try not to have the phones out at the dinner table,

721
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 4: and normally I don't, but like, if I get a

722
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:26,360
Speaker 4: bunch of buzz, I'm like, I'll just go to do

723
00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:28,440
Speaker 4: a quick peek. And then I did the I was

724
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,960
Speaker 4: literally just leaning down, staring, to the point of my

725
00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:33,279
Speaker 4: wife being like, what's wrong?

726
00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:36,800
Speaker 2: What are you staring at? I think, Joe Burrow tweeted.

727
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:41,920
Speaker 4: I'm not totally sure why or how, but yes, uh,

728
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:44,840
Speaker 4: that was that was fairly stunny.

729
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:46,919
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm gonna go. I'm gonna go with trying

730
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 2: to get on the officials nice side. I like it.

731
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:53,760
Speaker 3: What do you believe is more newsworthy a Joe Burrow

732
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:55,440
Speaker 3: tweet or a Nick Lachet tweet?

733
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:59,680
Speaker 2: Don't do this? This has been your thing, don't dude,

734
00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 2: and your thing? Do you think? Joe Burrow tweet? Yes?

735
00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:07,759
Speaker 4: I mean, come on, are you I know what you're

736
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:09,920
Speaker 4: trying to do here? Do you just agree you're trying

737
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:12,640
Speaker 4: to elicit reaction and you're gonna clip me on this camera?

738
00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:12,879
Speaker 6: Right?

739
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 3: Here and it's gonna get You've already done that for

740
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 3: your own podcast.

741
00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:18,080
Speaker 2: Yes, I don't want to do it anymore. I just

742
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 2: don't want to do it anymore. Would you get in trouble? No,

743
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 2: don't get you. No, No, I didn't get in trouble.

744
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:24,839
Speaker 2: I just don't. I don't want to. I don't want

745
00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 2: leche Hive after me.

746
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:29,640
Speaker 3: Okay, is there apparent in twenty twenty.

747
00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:33,000
Speaker 2: Six, I'm clear this was not about Nick. Shouldn't make

748
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 2: it abundantly clear.

749
00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:37,160
Speaker 4: It's about people making Nick Lache's tweets news.

750
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 3: Yes, not news. Joe Burrow anything he does or says

751
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 3: his news fair. There is a lache Hive, like there's

752
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 3: a I get it if.

753
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:49,640
Speaker 2: You tweet I love blind people.

754
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:52,359
Speaker 3: Okay, I don't even know what that is there are

755
00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 3: I don't Is that Is that a show that he's on?

756
00:36:55,600 --> 00:36:57,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the show that he's on.

757
00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,320
Speaker 3: So you went viral for and what you're viral Okay?

758
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 3: What your take was basically is just because Nick Lache

759
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,560
Speaker 3: tweets about the Bengals doesn't mean it's news. And there

760
00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:12,400
Speaker 3: are outlets who treated that like news, and your commentary

761
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 3: was about those outlets.

762
00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, yeah, let's be better. Let's be better as

763
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 2: a news outlet. It's clooney or nobody. Fine, so, but

764
00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 2: that was your point.

765
00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 3: What I what I am skeptical of is the suggestion

766
00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:29,040
Speaker 3: that there are people so passionate about Nick Lache.

767
00:37:29,080 --> 00:37:31,919
Speaker 2: Nothing against Nick, who is a very nice man.

768
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:35,759
Speaker 3: Uh has had a very good career, good for him,

769
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:37,879
Speaker 3: lives a charm life, good for him.

770
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:40,600
Speaker 4: But there are people so attached to him that they

771
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:43,440
Speaker 4: came after you. I mean, as much as anybody comes

772
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:45,239
Speaker 4: after anybody on Twitter, it's hard to tell. I was

773
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,360
Speaker 4: being come after a lot at that point. Yeah, so

774
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 4: it kind of blended in I think in the woodwork.

775
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:52,440
Speaker 4: But yeah, no, yeah, there was some of there's some

776
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 4: of that. But I mean, it's okay, okay, it's okay,

777
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:57,399
Speaker 4: it's it's fine. Everybody has their things. And then maybe

778
00:37:57,400 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 4: they didn't agree with my thoughts.

779
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,919
Speaker 3: Oh, I'm sure there are foo, namely at the publications

780
00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 3: you were referencing that didn't agree with you. To get

781
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:05,000
Speaker 3: some pushback from.

782
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,160
Speaker 4: Them, No, they can't feel media few, they can't feel

783
00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:08,719
Speaker 4: good about it.

784
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:12,920
Speaker 2: Oh, come on, I was hoping for a media feud.

785
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't I don't want one. No, I do.

786
00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:16,560
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't want to be in it.

787
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:20,240
Speaker 3: But as again as an observer of chaos an absurdity, Yes,

788
00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 3: a good media feud would be awesome.

789
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:28,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, we have something. No, that's who wants to do that?

790
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 2: All right? Well, has the lache or what do they

791
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:34,960
Speaker 2: call themselves? I don't. I don't know that.

792
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:37,520
Speaker 4: There were just some people that were that that showed

793
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 4: up and just felt like I didn't need this right now?

794
00:38:40,280 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 2: That's all? Okay, I get I understand that. I don't

795
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:46,200
Speaker 2: know they have names that they were willing to share.

796
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:49,759
Speaker 3: Probably is I just don't know, all right, But I said,

797
00:38:49,920 --> 00:38:51,880
Speaker 3: I think there's something about this that you're not telling me.

798
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:54,120
Speaker 2: I don't think there is Nick's brother come after you

799
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 2: in town, isn't he. It's just when.

800
00:38:56,760 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 4: People show up and you're mentioned and be like, you

801
00:38:58,960 --> 00:39:01,799
Speaker 4: know at the defense of Nicolche, that's all.

802
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 2: But did they understand you weren't coming after Nikola? People?

803
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,320
Speaker 4: Never There's been a lot of misunderstanding I feel like happening,

804
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:11,200
Speaker 4: that's all, And I can't.

805
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:13,239
Speaker 2: I can't do anything about that.

806
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:17,399
Speaker 4: What other people have misunderstood things that have been said,

807
00:39:17,560 --> 00:39:18,040
Speaker 4: I can't.

808
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 2: I'm just letting you know what happened, you asked, I

809
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 2: knew this is gonna happen. I'm enjoying you see him uncomfortable.

810
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:26,080
Speaker 2: I am uncomfortable. It makes me.

811
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 3: You can go to one of your breaks, Paul Dan.

812
00:39:29,680 --> 00:39:32,279
Speaker 3: You could read his work at the Athletic dot com.

813
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:34,719
Speaker 3: When does the mock The mock Off Season's out of Thursday?

814
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 2: Soon? Yeah?

815
00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:40,080
Speaker 4: Hopefully, hopefully, breadsheet, it's currently just going through the last

816
00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:43,600
Speaker 4: edits in the different levels of I've done this spreadsheet.

817
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:47,080
Speaker 4: I don't know that you're gonna love it this year. Really,

818
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:50,000
Speaker 4: some years you feel tortured very yes, and I think

819
00:39:50,040 --> 00:39:53,560
Speaker 4: this might be closer to that this year than really. Yeah,

820
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 4: I was surprised because you want to do like I want.

821
00:39:57,160 --> 00:39:59,440
Speaker 4: I wanted to do more, so my overhaul is not

822
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 4: as possible. I don't know, maybe it is. Maybe maybe

823
00:40:02,440 --> 00:40:06,880
Speaker 4: you will come away feeling differently. I my prediction I'm

824
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:09,279
Speaker 4: handicapping this is that you'll come away and say that

825
00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:10,040
Speaker 4: was frustrating.

826
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:13,520
Speaker 3: Okay, that's my prediction. We're going to a couple times.

827
00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:15,880
Speaker 3: Here's my request. I don't know how this works on

828
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 3: the internet, but what for those who don't know the

829
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 3: mock Off seasons A spreadsheet where you basically build the roster,

830
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:24,840
Speaker 3: cut players, add free agents, draft.

831
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:26,640
Speaker 2: You know you you tweak.

832
00:40:26,440 --> 00:40:31,360
Speaker 3: The roster when the Geno stone drop down when I

833
00:40:31,400 --> 00:40:35,040
Speaker 3: click on it and I click cut, could could that?

834
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:37,160
Speaker 3: Could a sound be incorporated?

835
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:40,200
Speaker 4: Could it be like when you send a congratulations text

836
00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:41,399
Speaker 4: and like balloons and.

837
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,440
Speaker 3: Fireworks go off? Yeah, you know that's not a cut.

838
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,160
Speaker 3: That sound that you get when you send, well, it's

839
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:49,120
Speaker 3: not a cut. I guess not sign it would not

840
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:49,719
Speaker 3: bringing them back.

841
00:40:49,800 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 4: I might have to create a whole separate drop down.

842
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:56,080
Speaker 4: That's just you have decided not to re sign Genostone.

843
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 2: When you send an email.

844
00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:00,120
Speaker 3: At least for me, if I send an email on

845
00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:03,640
Speaker 3: my phone US an outlook, it sends a sound effect. Yeah,

846
00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:06,360
Speaker 3: sometimes I will have to send an email that I

847
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:08,240
Speaker 3: get a great amount of pleasure out of sending.

848
00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 2: I love that sound.

849
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:13,240
Speaker 3: Yes, I want I love that sound, and I want

850
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:15,680
Speaker 3: that to be on the spreadsheet. When I decide to

851
00:41:15,719 --> 00:41:17,640
Speaker 3: not bring back Genostone.

852
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,719
Speaker 4: Maybe I can call it. Maybe I can give it

853
00:41:19,760 --> 00:41:23,160
Speaker 4: like a name like the mow Egger non re signing,

854
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:27,120
Speaker 4: like you sponsored not re signing, Yes, genostone. Sure, the

855
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,040
Speaker 4: Moegger decision to not re sign genostone is what I'll

856
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:32,440
Speaker 4: put it there in the dropdown ass So that's okay

857
00:41:32,440 --> 00:41:32,759
Speaker 4: with that.

858
00:41:32,800 --> 00:41:37,600
Speaker 3: Absolutely, that's later this week, all right. Paul Dannerginuita's worked

859
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 3: the Athletic dot Com. I thought it was outstanding.

860
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:41,960
Speaker 2: I loved it.

861
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 3: We got a lot of good stuff. Dan picture play calling,

862
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:48,440
Speaker 3: Orlando Brown and Nicholas Schay. We can't beat it perfect

863
00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:49,440
Speaker 3: just way I drew it up.

864
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 2: Hopefully this is the last run for the Nicholas coms.

865
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:56,080
Speaker 3: It will be I promise The Growler podcast available where

866
00:41:56,080 --> 00:42:00,440
Speaker 3: you get your podcasts, including YouTube and follow Paul or

867
00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 3: It is four minutes away from four o'clock. This is

868
00:42:04,239 --> 00:42:06,439
Speaker 3: esp AT fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

869
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:08,400
Speaker 1: We'll be on fifteen thirty.

870
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:13,800
Speaker 3: That's us four minutes afterfore. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Moeger.

871
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:14,760
Speaker 2: Thank you for listening.

872
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:19,720
Speaker 3: Hopefully it's your Tuesday's going as well as ours. Awesome

873
00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:24,000
Speaker 3: stuff from Paul Dayner Junior. As always, if you missed

874
00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:26,080
Speaker 3: any of it. The podcasts, that's what we do on

875
00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 3: the iHeartRadio app. Podcasts of this show are a service

876
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:32,600
Speaker 3: of Long Neck Sports Grail More on the Bengals a

877
00:42:32,640 --> 00:42:35,280
Speaker 3: little bit later on we'll talk about the big college

878
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:38,800
Speaker 3: basketball point shaving scandal with our friends Stuart W. Penrose

879
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:42,200
Speaker 3: from the Manilo LG Groups from college basketball a little

880
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 3: bit later on as well.

881
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:45,280
Speaker 2: That has nothing to do with point shaving.

882
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 3: I have not on this show had a chance to

883
00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:51,319
Speaker 3: talk about UC's victory over Iowa State on Saturday. We'll

884
00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 3: do that a little bit later on. Some Red Stuff,

885
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 3: including Tito Francona. Delance on Friday talked about the fact

886
00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 3: that the Reds aren't gonna lead the league in unscored

887
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 3: and he's right about that, and that's probably okay. But

888
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:07,520
Speaker 3: I'll tell you what the butt is a little bit

889
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 3: later on. Last night's college football Playoff National Championship game

890
00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:16,960
Speaker 3: was terrific. Congratulations to the Indiana Hoosiers. Many have said

891
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:20,040
Speaker 3: it's the greatest sports story ever. I have a hard

892
00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:23,600
Speaker 3: time countering that. In my lifetime, it's the greatest college

893
00:43:23,600 --> 00:43:28,279
Speaker 3: bass or college football story ever, I am. I think

894
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:31,399
Speaker 3: it's fun as hell when a sport that is at

895
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:37,680
Speaker 3: times not that inclusive has somebody crash it from outside Indiana,

896
00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:43,719
Speaker 3: the quintessential college football outsider losing his program. Ever, and

897
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:46,920
Speaker 3: to me, what is so awesome about this season is

898
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:52,560
Speaker 3: obviously with the Hoosiers. There's a Cinderella element to it, right.

899
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:55,960
Speaker 3: It feels like many have compared it to the miracle

900
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,840
Speaker 3: on ice. Many have compared it to like George Mason

901
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 3: going to the NCAA turn in Final four h Leicester City.

902
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:05,120
Speaker 3: I don't really follow Premier League soccer. Many have made

903
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:08,200
Speaker 3: that comparison to me, and it's rags to riches. But

904
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:13,879
Speaker 3: what I love most about it is Indiana dominated. They

905
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:16,799
Speaker 3: went sixteen to zero in two seasons. They have outscored

906
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:20,320
Speaker 3: opponents six hundred and sixty six to one eighty seven.

907
00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 3: They won the Big Ten in the process. Don't get

908
00:44:25,520 --> 00:44:27,879
Speaker 3: mad at me for saying this, Ohio State fans. They

909
00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:34,720
Speaker 3: beat the reigning national champion. They then went and destroyed

910
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:40,000
Speaker 3: the bluest of blue bloods, Alabama. They then hammered Oregon,

911
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:42,800
Speaker 3: a mainstay at the top of the polls in college

912
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:43,759
Speaker 3: football for.

913
00:44:43,800 --> 00:44:47,680
Speaker 2: Quite a while. They beat five playoff teams.

914
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:51,360
Speaker 3: None of those games against playoff teams took place in Bloomington.

915
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:54,719
Speaker 3: And then last night they won just a great football game,

916
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:58,040
Speaker 3: and it was the latest reminder. Look, college football has

917
00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 3: all sorts of issues. College basketball has all sorts of

918
00:45:02,680 --> 00:45:08,200
Speaker 3: issues college sports. There are many facets of college sports

919
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:11,759
Speaker 3: that feel like they're at a crossroads, and the discontent

920
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:15,239
Speaker 3: that many feel when it comes to their relationship with

921
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:19,440
Speaker 3: their favorite college sports team should not be ignored. Although

922
00:45:19,480 --> 00:45:21,520
Speaker 3: I don't necessarily know who's going to be able to

923
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:26,560
Speaker 3: address it. But the games are sometimes so good. That

924
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 3: game last night was so good. Give Miami a lot

925
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:35,480
Speaker 3: of credit with dudes like Reuben bain Alekai Tony, like

926
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 3: guys who just kept coming every time it felt like

927
00:45:40,080 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 3: Indiana was about to deliver a knockout blow. The Hurricanes responded,

928
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 3: that was a great football game, that was a great

929
00:45:47,480 --> 00:45:51,080
Speaker 3: sporting event, and it ends look had Miami won on

930
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,000
Speaker 3: some level, that would have been cool as well. I'm

931
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:55,720
Speaker 3: old enough to remember when Miami was the biggest brand

932
00:45:55,760 --> 00:46:00,920
Speaker 3: in college football. I'm probably in the minority, hear. I

933
00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:03,480
Speaker 3: actually think it's kind of fun watching dudes like Michael

934
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:06,640
Speaker 3: Irvin and ray Lewis on the Miami sideline. But I

935
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:09,399
Speaker 3: was rooting for Indiana, and so if you're an IU fan,

936
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:12,600
Speaker 3: if you went to IU, congratulations, it is an awesome story.

937
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 3: Now I think many are trying to pull lessons from

938
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:18,840
Speaker 3: the Indiana story and there's I guess.

939
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:20,839
Speaker 2: For me, it's this right.

940
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 3: You hear this When colleges have openings, sometimes for a

941
00:46:27,840 --> 00:46:31,600
Speaker 3: men's basketball coach, sometimes for a football coach, sometimes for

942
00:46:31,680 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 3: another part of the athletic department. Sometimes we talk a

943
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:39,400
Speaker 3: little bit too much about having a type. So the

944
00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:41,600
Speaker 3: University of Cincinnati had an opening at the end of

945
00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:45,279
Speaker 3: the twenty twenty two season. I've seen people suggest that

946
00:46:45,400 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 3: Kurt Signetti was interviewed by UC. I don't know that

947
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:51,200
Speaker 3: to be a fact, but whether or not it was,

948
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:53,760
Speaker 3: you see, had a type and what they were looking

949
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 3: for was somebody who had been a Power five conference

950
00:46:56,520 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 3: head coach. And it feels like, and John Hunningham talked

951
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,400
Speaker 3: about this at the time, that was a huge factor

952
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:08,360
Speaker 3: in deciding to hire Scott Sadderfield. Now, time, I guess

953
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:11,120
Speaker 3: ultimately will tell if that turns out to be the

954
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:15,160
Speaker 3: right hire. Scott Sadderfield is obviously not that popular with

955
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:18,360
Speaker 3: UC fans. I think, you know, this year's season for

956
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:21,640
Speaker 3: me was underwhelming because they started seven to one. They

957
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 3: had a lot of dudes come back, They went and

958
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:27,560
Speaker 3: hit the portal and brought some good players in and

959
00:47:27,600 --> 00:47:30,399
Speaker 3: so for all of that to end with a seven

960
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 3: win season and five straight losses at the end is

961
00:47:33,040 --> 00:47:36,799
Speaker 3: very underwhelming. But that's neither here nor there. They had

962
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 3: there was a type they prioritized, Power five coaching experience,

963
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:44,680
Speaker 3: and I think, I think this is what we do right.

964
00:47:44,719 --> 00:47:47,399
Speaker 3: And so to me, if there's one thing from the

965
00:47:47,640 --> 00:47:52,880
Speaker 3: Indiana story that could be applied elsewhere, it's when you

966
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:58,400
Speaker 3: have a head coach, cast a wide net, do an exhaustive,

967
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:04,520
Speaker 3: extensive search, don't be guided by there being a type

968
00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 3: that you're looking for, don't use Well, they they need

969
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:14,520
Speaker 3: power five experience. Kurt Signetti had no Power five head

970
00:48:14,560 --> 00:48:18,279
Speaker 3: coaching experience. Well, they've they've got to be from this

971
00:48:18,440 --> 00:48:21,960
Speaker 3: part of the country. Not to say that that can't help. Uh,

972
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 3: Kurt Signetti is not from Indiana. Well, they've they've got

973
00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:30,920
Speaker 3: to be. They've got to be young. Kurt Signetti at

974
00:48:31,000 --> 00:48:34,560
Speaker 3: least in coaching years, not exactly young. Well, we need

975
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 3: a big name that can energize people. We need a

976
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 3: big name that can stir up the fan base. Let's

977
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 3: be honest, Prior to about midway through last season, did

978
00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:52,720
Speaker 3: anybody know who Kurt Signetti was? Chances are the answer

979
00:48:52,760 --> 00:48:56,520
Speaker 3: is no. And so we do this like make it

980
00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:59,440
Speaker 3: about any school. I remember when I you had a

981
00:48:59,480 --> 00:49:03,440
Speaker 3: head coaching vacancy. I don't remember when they hired Kurt Signetti.

982
00:49:03,880 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 3: I don't remember the Google Meet press conference. Frankly, neither

983
00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:10,600
Speaker 3: do most. It was Oh yeah, Indiana hired the guy

984
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:13,200
Speaker 3: from James Madison. Looks like he had a pretty good

985
00:49:13,239 --> 00:49:16,440
Speaker 3: record there. Good luck at IU. That feels like a

986
00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:18,920
Speaker 3: place where coaches go to die. Now, there are lots

987
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 3: of other things that have happened since the way they've

988
00:49:21,680 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 3: navigated the portal, the quality of players brought in, nil

989
00:49:26,719 --> 00:49:30,880
Speaker 3: money helping out the program, the ease of player movement

990
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:34,040
Speaker 3: in college football. All of those things factors great coaching.

991
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:39,520
Speaker 3: Obviously grabbing players from Miami's backyard, including a quarterback for

992
00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:42,760
Speaker 3: Nanda Mendoza that the Hurricanes didn't want. But I guess

993
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:45,319
Speaker 3: for me, like Kurt Signetti, didn't check any of the

994
00:49:45,320 --> 00:49:49,719
Speaker 3: boxes that at times, and I'm sure schools do this,

995
00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:53,560
Speaker 3: but we as fans do this too, And like as

996
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 3: a UC fan, I've done this show through four different

997
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:01,880
Speaker 3: head coaching searches. Was on the air from Kelly to Jones,

998
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:04,080
Speaker 3: was on the air from Jones to Tubberville. Was on

999
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:07,839
Speaker 3: the air from Tubberville to Fickle and then Fickle to Saderfield.

1000
00:50:07,880 --> 00:50:11,799
Speaker 3: That's like five. And we do it as fans. There's

1001
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:15,759
Speaker 3: always like certain like prerequisites. Want somebody who's been a

1002
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:20,200
Speaker 3: head coach before. Uh, want somebody who's been a Power

1003
00:50:20,239 --> 00:50:23,840
Speaker 3: five head coach, Well, do they have ties to the city.

1004
00:50:24,920 --> 00:50:29,200
Speaker 3: They've got to be an offensive guy or a defensive guy.

1005
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,560
Speaker 3: Not that Kurt Signetti didn't check certain boxes for the

1006
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:35,719
Speaker 3: person that hired him, but it felt to me like,

1007
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:39,759
Speaker 3: and we're saying this now after the fact, that they

1008
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 3: simply prioritized the right person, the right fit, the person

1009
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 3: who wowed them at the interview, and were willing to

1010
00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:51,200
Speaker 3: look beyond what he wasn't. I think we as fans,

1011
00:50:51,239 --> 00:50:53,400
Speaker 3: and I'm sure there's a lot of administrators in college

1012
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 3: sports who don't do that, looking to check certain boxes. Well,

1013
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:02,400
Speaker 3: they've got to be an offensive guy, or need to

1014
00:51:02,400 --> 00:51:05,920
Speaker 3: have somebody who has ties to the area. Need to

1015
00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:09,640
Speaker 3: have somebody who went to this school. Need to be

1016
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 3: somebody who has been on a on a Power five

1017
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:17,399
Speaker 3: or Power four staff. Need somebody with power fork head

1018
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:22,360
Speaker 3: coaching experience. And we do this a lot when it

1019
00:51:22,400 --> 00:51:26,360
Speaker 3: comes to coaching vacancies or general manager vacant season. My

1020
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 3: one wish is always cast a wide net. Cast a

1021
00:51:30,719 --> 00:51:35,880
Speaker 3: wide net. Next coaching opening here, whether it's the Bengals,

1022
00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:38,320
Speaker 3: the Reds, u Se Xavier, whatever it is, cast a

1023
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:41,600
Speaker 3: wide net. Like I think Richard Patino is gonna work

1024
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:45,719
Speaker 3: at Xavier. Xavier went outside the family for the first

1025
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:47,000
Speaker 3: time in like two decades.

1026
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:48,239
Speaker 2: Now.

1027
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:50,160
Speaker 3: It's not like they had to turn over a rock

1028
00:51:50,200 --> 00:51:53,560
Speaker 3: to find Richard Patino, who's coaching a good program in

1029
00:51:53,600 --> 00:51:56,560
Speaker 3: New Mexico. The name doesn't hurt. He had coached in

1030
00:51:56,600 --> 00:51:59,239
Speaker 3: the Big Ten before. But they cast a wide net,

1031
00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:04,120
Speaker 3: cast a wide net. This comes up when when when

1032
00:52:04,120 --> 00:52:07,520
Speaker 3: there's a Reds managerial vacancy. Now, when Terry Francone is available,

1033
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:11,319
Speaker 3: maybe you put the net away, but you know, beyond that,

1034
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:13,880
Speaker 3: we do this all the time, and it felt like

1035
00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:17,319
Speaker 3: Indiana cast a pretty wide net. Now, if you kind

1036
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:20,000
Speaker 3: of have an idea in your back pocket who some

1037
00:52:20,040 --> 00:52:21,640
Speaker 3: of the people you want to interview are going to be,

1038
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:23,520
Speaker 3: It's it's not like you had to look that far.

1039
00:52:23,719 --> 00:52:26,879
Speaker 3: James Madison's not some an I nai a program. Hell,

1040
00:52:26,960 --> 00:52:30,600
Speaker 3: that program played participated in the College Football Playoff this year,

1041
00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:33,319
Speaker 3: But I guarantee you. There are people who followed the

1042
00:52:33,360 --> 00:52:36,319
Speaker 3: IU program who are like, who, wait a minute, that's

1043
00:52:36,360 --> 00:52:39,520
Speaker 3: the best we can do. James Madison, Wait a minute.

1044
00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:42,920
Speaker 3: That hiring a guy in his sixties. That dude's not

1045
00:52:42,960 --> 00:52:47,520
Speaker 3: from here. There's no P five head coaching experience, he

1046
00:52:47,560 --> 00:52:52,080
Speaker 3: doesn't have big ten roots. Instead, just hire the best dude.

1047
00:52:53,640 --> 00:52:57,040
Speaker 3: Hire the best dude who's also the best fit. And

1048
00:52:57,200 --> 00:52:59,239
Speaker 3: IYU did that and is rewarded for it. It's not

1049
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:02,719
Speaker 3: always gonna work, but that's what I you did. That's

1050
00:53:02,760 --> 00:53:05,040
Speaker 3: what it seems like they did. Hire the right person,

1051
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:09,800
Speaker 3: cast a wide net, do an exhaustive search, and forget

1052
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:15,160
Speaker 3: the preconceived ideas of what the head coach has to be.

1053
00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:17,880
Speaker 3: Don't hire a type, hire a coach. I think we

1054
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:21,120
Speaker 3: do that sometimes you're looking for a type. NFL teams

1055
00:53:21,160 --> 00:53:24,160
Speaker 3: have done this, you know. Zach Taylor was hired during

1056
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:29,560
Speaker 3: the wave of young, offensive minded coach and Zach Taylor,

1057
00:53:31,160 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 3: it's not like he's been a total flop. Say what

1058
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:33,799
Speaker 3: you want about him.

1059
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:34,680
Speaker 2: He did.

1060
00:53:35,080 --> 00:53:38,120
Speaker 3: He did stand on these sidelines for the Bengals in

1061
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 3: a Super Bowl. But I remember at the time going like,

1062
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:44,520
Speaker 3: are we hiring the best leader? Are we hiring the

1063
00:53:44,520 --> 00:53:46,560
Speaker 3: best fit or are we hiring a type? Because all

1064
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 3: I heard was about a type, young, offensive oriented coach,

1065
00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:55,960
Speaker 3: and with Zach there's been successes and failures. I cannot

1066
00:53:56,000 --> 00:54:00,560
Speaker 3: stand hiring a type. I think you pigeonhole your self.

1067
00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:05,279
Speaker 3: I think you you're operating in times with one arm

1068
00:54:05,320 --> 00:54:06,240
Speaker 3: tied behind your back.

1069
00:54:06,640 --> 00:54:08,120
Speaker 2: I don't think Indiana hired a type.

1070
00:54:08,160 --> 00:54:08,359
Speaker 6: Now.

1071
00:54:08,400 --> 00:54:10,279
Speaker 3: You know what everybody else is gonna do now is

1072
00:54:10,600 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 3: try to find their version of Kurt Signetti. And I'm

1073
00:54:14,280 --> 00:54:15,600
Speaker 3: not sure that person's out there.

1074
00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:17,320
Speaker 2: We'll see.

1075
00:54:17,719 --> 00:54:20,719
Speaker 3: But anyway, congratulations to the Indiana Hoosiers. By the way,

1076
00:54:20,800 --> 00:54:26,359
Speaker 3: my colleague Lance McAllister has a question. I saw it

1077
00:54:26,400 --> 00:54:32,239
Speaker 3: on his Facebook and it was, you know which was

1078
00:54:32,520 --> 00:54:36,959
Speaker 3: more impressive the seventy six undefeated Indiana Hoosiers basketball team,

1079
00:54:37,080 --> 00:54:40,160
Speaker 3: the last college basketball team on the men's side to

1080
00:54:40,760 --> 00:54:43,400
Speaker 3: go through an entire season undefeated, or what the IU

1081
00:54:43,440 --> 00:54:45,640
Speaker 3: Hoosiers football team did.

1082
00:54:46,120 --> 00:54:51,000
Speaker 2: And for me the answer is football. Now. Both are awesome,

1083
00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:52,040
Speaker 2: Both are historic.

1084
00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:55,319
Speaker 3: Indiana LA's claimed to both, but in this era, with

1085
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:59,760
Speaker 3: roster instability, with their being real parody in this sport

1086
00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:03,800
Speaker 3: is to a degree unprecedented that I'm not sure existed

1087
00:55:03,800 --> 00:55:07,480
Speaker 3: in men's college basketball in the mid nineteen seventies, NFL

1088
00:55:07,600 --> 00:55:12,040
Speaker 3: levels of scouting and analytics available to everybody.

1089
00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:14,440
Speaker 2: Like to me, it's it's football.

1090
00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:19,840
Speaker 3: Nothing against Indiana Hoosiers nineteen seventy six undefeated team with

1091
00:55:19,920 --> 00:55:22,120
Speaker 3: six dudes who played in the NBA and Bob Knight.

1092
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:24,879
Speaker 3: But if you're making it one versus the other, which

1093
00:55:24,960 --> 00:55:28,759
Speaker 3: we don't have to do, I'll take what Kurtzignetti's team

1094
00:55:28,760 --> 00:55:33,000
Speaker 3: accomplished ahead of Bob Knight. Seventeen minutes after five o'clock,

1095
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:36,600
Speaker 3: Elie Dela Cruz was offered by the Reds, according to

1096
00:55:36,719 --> 00:55:38,960
Speaker 3: Nick Krawl, a contract that would have made him the

1097
00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:44,760
Speaker 3: highest paid Reds player of all time. Understand what I

1098
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:48,399
Speaker 3: just said there? Understand what I didn't just say there.

1099
00:55:48,719 --> 00:55:56,680
Speaker 3: I'll explain next WCKY Cincinnati and iHeartRadio Station Guaranteed Human

1100
00:55:57,239 --> 00:56:03,640
Speaker 3: ESPN fifteen thirty Hard twenty three after four o'clock. This

1101
00:56:04,280 --> 00:56:06,960
Speaker 3: is ESPN fifteen thirty Moeger, Thanks so much for listening.

1102
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:09,160
Speaker 3: I gotta throw two pole questions out there. One will

1103
00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:13,160
Speaker 3: be about the Reds over under, because that's that's a

1104
00:56:13,200 --> 00:56:16,759
Speaker 3: novel idea on Twitter at moegor phone calls in a

1105
00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,319
Speaker 3: bit lines are open. Five point three, seven, four, nine,

1106
00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:22,919
Speaker 3: fifteen thirty Reds Fest happened this weekend, and the big

1107
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:26,120
Speaker 3: story that came out of it was Nick Crawl. According

1108
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,320
Speaker 3: to a report authored by Sea Trent Rosecrans of the Athletic,

1109
00:56:30,160 --> 00:56:32,960
Speaker 3: Ellie Dela Cruz was offered a contract that would have

1110
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:37,240
Speaker 3: made him the highest paid Reds player ever, the highest

1111
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:44,360
Speaker 3: paid player in franchise history. That's key, verbage, highest paid

1112
00:56:44,400 --> 00:56:50,920
Speaker 3: player in franchise history. Note that I didn't say highest

1113
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:53,160
Speaker 3: paid player in major league history.

1114
00:56:54,480 --> 00:56:55,280
Speaker 2: There's a difference.

1115
00:56:57,640 --> 00:57:02,719
Speaker 3: If you were Ellie Dela Cruz, you could sign right

1116
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:05,840
Speaker 3: now to be the highest paid player in Red's history,

1117
00:57:06,360 --> 00:57:12,719
Speaker 3: or perhaps, if you perform at a high level, be

1118
00:57:12,800 --> 00:57:17,560
Speaker 3: the highest paid player in baseball history. Now remove your

1119
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:20,120
Speaker 3: fandom for a second, take your Reds hat off.

1120
00:57:20,480 --> 00:57:22,800
Speaker 2: I get it. Ironically, I'm wearing a Red hat.

1121
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:26,000
Speaker 3: I would rather be the highest paid player in major

1122
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:33,280
Speaker 3: League Baseball history. Enough said, Now he's got to play

1123
00:57:33,400 --> 00:57:37,760
Speaker 3: like it and like more than his contract or where

1124
00:57:37,840 --> 00:57:41,760
Speaker 3: he's gonna play in twenty thirty. One of these central

1125
00:57:41,840 --> 00:57:45,320
Speaker 3: storylines for this team is is Elie Dellacruz a better

1126
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:48,880
Speaker 3: baseball player this year than he was last year. Health

1127
00:57:49,680 --> 00:57:51,440
Speaker 3: may have something to do with that. I'm sure it

1128
00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:56,520
Speaker 3: will durability, but he's gonna have to be better. Can't

1129
00:57:56,600 --> 00:57:59,880
Speaker 3: lead the planet in errors Like here we are. The

1130
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:01,520
Speaker 3: dude has been a part of the of a big

1131
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:06,600
Speaker 3: league team for nearly three whole seasons, nearly three whole seasons,

1132
00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:13,200
Speaker 3: and we're still having discussions about where he fits best defensively,

1133
00:58:13,320 --> 00:58:18,960
Speaker 3: like you will find smart people, credible people who will

1134
00:58:18,960 --> 00:58:22,880
Speaker 3: say he's best suited to play center field. That doesn't

1135
00:58:22,880 --> 00:58:25,720
Speaker 3: go away if you continue to be a mushroom trip

1136
00:58:25,720 --> 00:58:28,840
Speaker 3: when the ball is hit you at shortstop. So that's

1137
00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:32,120
Speaker 3: got a change. The level of offensive production has to

1138
00:58:32,120 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 3: get better again. If you want to say, well, late

1139
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,960
Speaker 3: last season, chalk it up to the quad issue, okay,

1140
00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:44,760
Speaker 3: but still, if you want to be maybe Baseball's first

1141
00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:49,200
Speaker 3: billion dollar player, your seasons moving forward have to look better.

1142
00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 2: Also.

1143
00:58:49,760 --> 00:58:53,120
Speaker 3: The Reds this year is currently constructed built just like

1144
00:58:53,200 --> 00:58:56,720
Speaker 3: last year. At the beginning of the season, last year's

1145
00:58:56,760 --> 00:59:00,120
Speaker 3: Reds team was built around two guys, Matt McLain the

1146
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:03,040
Speaker 3: two spot, Ellie Dela Cruz in the middle of the order,

1147
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:07,680
Speaker 3: hitting third. This team was built around those two guys.

1148
00:59:07,720 --> 00:59:10,680
Speaker 3: Now Matt McClain had a terrible season. The Reds two

1149
00:59:10,760 --> 00:59:14,040
Speaker 3: hole production was awful. We're all hoping for a big

1150
00:59:14,080 --> 00:59:17,240
Speaker 3: bounce back season for Matt McLain. But last year's team

1151
00:59:17,280 --> 00:59:21,320
Speaker 3: was also built around Ellie deler Cruz being superhuman. He

1152
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:27,400
Speaker 3: had his moments, he was not superhuman. So I'm a

1153
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:30,960
Speaker 3: little bit more short focused. I guess if we're focused

1154
00:59:31,000 --> 00:59:33,640
Speaker 3: on the short term, we'll put it that way, like,

1155
00:59:34,520 --> 00:59:36,280
Speaker 3: is Ellie going to be better this season? Is he

1156
00:59:36,320 --> 00:59:38,520
Speaker 3: going to stay healthy this year? How are they going

1157
00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:41,720
Speaker 3: to manage his playing time if he is sore, if

1158
00:59:41,800 --> 00:59:43,760
Speaker 3: he is dealing with an injury. Are they just gonna

1159
00:59:43,800 --> 00:59:45,480
Speaker 3: let him go out there and play every single day

1160
00:59:45,520 --> 00:59:48,560
Speaker 3: no matter what. Will they use him as a DH occasionally?

1161
00:59:49,120 --> 00:59:51,800
Speaker 3: Will they give him an off day occasionally? Will they

1162
00:59:51,840 --> 00:59:57,000
Speaker 3: tell him no? Those things are all to me higher

1163
00:59:57,040 --> 01:00:00,720
Speaker 3: on the list than where's he going to be playing thirty?

1164
01:00:02,320 --> 01:00:06,160
Speaker 3: But as long as the verbiage is highest paid player

1165
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:10,760
Speaker 3: in Red's history and not highest paid player in baseball history,

1166
01:00:11,600 --> 01:00:15,880
Speaker 3: non starter, and that potential is still out there, it

1167
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:18,520
Speaker 3: might not be the one that might not be the

1168
01:00:18,560 --> 01:00:23,120
Speaker 3: ultimate outcome. But when Wan Soto signed his deal with

1169
01:00:23,160 --> 01:00:27,640
Speaker 3: the Mets and folks wondered who's going to be Baseball's

1170
01:00:27,680 --> 01:00:30,440
Speaker 3: first billion dollar player. One of the names that popped

1171
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:33,400
Speaker 3: up was Elie Dela Cruz. Now, there can be multiple

1172
01:00:33,440 --> 01:00:35,800
Speaker 3: billion dollar players, and by the way, that the labor

1173
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:39,440
Speaker 3: situation in the future of baseball's economics could play a

1174
01:00:39,480 --> 01:00:44,480
Speaker 3: part in how this works. But to me, the eyeopener

1175
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:46,919
Speaker 3: would have been, Hey, the Red's offered Elie Dela Cruz

1176
01:00:46,960 --> 01:00:48,920
Speaker 3: a chance to be the highest paid player in baseball.

1177
01:00:50,120 --> 01:00:50,640
Speaker 2: They didn't.

1178
01:00:51,920 --> 01:00:55,000
Speaker 3: Or the real eye opener would have been, they've offered

1179
01:00:55,040 --> 01:00:57,120
Speaker 3: Elie Dela Cruz a chance to be the highest paid

1180
01:00:57,160 --> 01:01:00,560
Speaker 3: player in baseball history, or they've offered a chance to

1181
01:01:00,560 --> 01:01:04,720
Speaker 3: be Baseball's first billion dollar player. In the absence of

1182
01:01:04,760 --> 01:01:09,240
Speaker 3: that highest paid player in Red's history, wouldn't do anything

1183
01:01:09,320 --> 01:01:13,320
Speaker 3: for me or you if we were Ellie Dela Cruz.

1184
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:17,120
Speaker 3: I said this a second ago. The Reds have to

1185
01:01:17,160 --> 01:01:20,120
Speaker 3: say no to Ellie Dela Cruz. I think this is encouraging.

1186
01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:23,960
Speaker 3: So Ellie's not going to play in the World Baseball Classic,

1187
01:01:24,040 --> 01:01:26,280
Speaker 3: And like, there is a big part of me that

1188
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:28,720
Speaker 3: wishes he would, because I think that's an awesome event

1189
01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:31,000
Speaker 3: and it would be more awesome if he was a

1190
01:01:31,040 --> 01:01:34,880
Speaker 3: part of it, but they steered him away from it,

1191
01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:37,960
Speaker 3: because you have that right when you're coming off an injury,

1192
01:01:38,440 --> 01:01:40,440
Speaker 3: to tell the guy you're not going to play in

1193
01:01:40,440 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 3: the World Baseball Classic. I'm sure Ellie is disappointed. I

1194
01:01:46,600 --> 01:01:48,400
Speaker 3: don't think this has to be the sort of thing

1195
01:01:48,440 --> 01:01:52,800
Speaker 3: that leads to a contentious relationship. But the Reds have

1196
01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:55,640
Speaker 3: to do what's best for the Reds and if they

1197
01:01:55,720 --> 01:01:58,720
Speaker 3: have the ability to tell Ellie not, actually, we're not

1198
01:01:58,760 --> 01:02:01,080
Speaker 3: going to have you play in that because it's best

1199
01:02:01,120 --> 01:02:05,440
Speaker 3: for us if you don't awesome. Last year, they wouldn't

1200
01:02:05,440 --> 01:02:07,760
Speaker 3: tell Ellie Delacruz. No, remember the whole thing we did

1201
01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:11,200
Speaker 3: all year long. Hey, Ellie's really struggling at the plate,

1202
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:13,240
Speaker 3: Well he's hurt, or they should give him a day off.

1203
01:02:13,320 --> 01:02:15,560
Speaker 3: Well they can't. Why not because he wants to play

1204
01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:18,280
Speaker 3: every day. Well he's not playing very well. Well, because

1205
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:19,959
Speaker 3: he's hurt, Well they should give him a day off.

1206
01:02:20,200 --> 01:02:24,320
Speaker 3: Well they can't. Why because Ellie wants to play every day. Okay, Well,

1207
01:02:24,320 --> 01:02:26,400
Speaker 3: but he's not playing very well. But while he's hurt,

1208
01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:28,479
Speaker 3: Well they should give him a day off. Well they can't.

1209
01:02:28,520 --> 01:02:31,560
Speaker 3: I mean, all year long round then around then a round,

1210
01:02:31,640 --> 01:02:34,280
Speaker 3: and it was like, tell the dude no, awesome, that

1211
01:02:34,320 --> 01:02:36,040
Speaker 3: you want to play every day. Awesome, that you want

1212
01:02:36,040 --> 01:02:38,240
Speaker 3: to play in the field every day, but you're not

1213
01:02:38,320 --> 01:02:40,560
Speaker 3: helping the team. If you're not one hundred percent, you're

1214
01:02:40,600 --> 01:02:42,720
Speaker 3: not helping the team, if you're not seventy five percent,

1215
01:02:43,320 --> 01:02:49,480
Speaker 3: Tell the guy no. This would suggest that perhaps they're

1216
01:02:49,520 --> 01:02:53,080
Speaker 3: a little bit more willing to tell him no. That

1217
01:02:54,680 --> 01:02:59,400
Speaker 3: is a good thing. So are our segments with Stuart W.

1218
01:02:59,600 --> 01:03:02,400
Speaker 3: Penro from Manila Lawgroup. He joins us talk about college

1219
01:03:02,400 --> 01:03:04,000
Speaker 3: basketball's point shaving scandal.

1220
01:03:04,080 --> 01:03:10,880
Speaker 8: Next Cincinnati's sports station ESPN fifteen to thirty.

1221
01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:14,480
Speaker 3: Twenty five from five o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty Moegger.

1222
01:03:14,560 --> 01:03:18,000
Speaker 3: We'll do sports headlines, of which there aren't many here in.

1223
01:03:18,520 --> 01:03:18,960
Speaker 2: Just a bit.

1224
01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:22,920
Speaker 3: On Tuesdays, we talk about the sports and the law

1225
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:27,240
Speaker 3: with our friend Stewart W. Penrose from Manilo Lawgroup. You

1226
01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:30,920
Speaker 3: can learn more at Manilolawgroup dot com. Last week we

1227
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:33,160
Speaker 3: spent a little bit of time on this the big

1228
01:03:33,240 --> 01:03:37,600
Speaker 3: college basketball point shaving scandal, which has enveloped a lot

1229
01:03:37,600 --> 01:03:41,440
Speaker 3: of programs at the low major and mid major level.

1230
01:03:42,480 --> 01:03:46,440
Speaker 3: It's pretty widespread the evidence seems to be pretty damning

1231
01:03:46,480 --> 01:03:49,400
Speaker 3: for everybody involved, and so I wanted to ask questions

1232
01:03:49,440 --> 01:03:52,360
Speaker 3: of our legal expert. Stewart is with us. It's good

1233
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:53,200
Speaker 3: to have you as always, sir.

1234
01:03:53,240 --> 01:03:55,479
Speaker 2: How are you doing great?

1235
01:03:55,520 --> 01:03:55,640
Speaker 8: Moll?

1236
01:03:55,760 --> 01:03:59,440
Speaker 2: Thanks for having me ie hands here. Yeah, we do,

1237
01:03:59,560 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 2: we do.

1238
01:04:00,080 --> 01:04:03,760
Speaker 3: And so whenever I see federal indictment, and I'm painting

1239
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:05,760
Speaker 3: with a very broad brush here, but whenever I see

1240
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:10,480
Speaker 3: federal indictment, I think, uh, oh, ironclad case one that's

1241
01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:14,080
Speaker 3: hard to get out of. Is that assumption a fair

1242
01:04:14,120 --> 01:04:16,160
Speaker 3: one that if I see federal indictment, you know what,

1243
01:04:16,200 --> 01:04:19,200
Speaker 3: the Feds don't lose, So the people who have been

1244
01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:20,320
Speaker 3: indicted here are screwed.

1245
01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:21,240
Speaker 2: Is that a fair assumption?

1246
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:27,560
Speaker 6: It's it's not a dishonest assumption. The Seds don't bring

1247
01:04:27,640 --> 01:04:31,560
Speaker 6: weak cases, but no case is an automatic lock. I

1248
01:04:31,560 --> 01:04:35,440
Speaker 6: mean mode generally speaking, when when when federal prosecutors final

1249
01:04:35,520 --> 01:04:39,320
Speaker 6: final charges for uh, you know, wire fraud is typically

1250
01:04:39,360 --> 01:04:42,920
Speaker 6: after months and sometimes years of investigations. You know, by

1251
01:04:42,960 --> 01:04:45,480
Speaker 6: the time these the rest happen, they typically have one

1252
01:04:45,560 --> 01:04:50,680
Speaker 6: or more cooperating witnesses, wire tasks, text messages, uh, there

1253
01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:53,520
Speaker 6: could be betting records, bank transfers. So I mean their

1254
01:04:53,560 --> 01:04:56,720
Speaker 6: their batting average is extremely high, and they're not going

1255
01:04:56,800 --> 01:04:58,640
Speaker 6: to go in blindly, and it's with a lot of

1256
01:04:58,680 --> 01:05:03,840
Speaker 6: investigation and usually a lot of concrete evidence before they

1257
01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:04,880
Speaker 6: bring down these charges.

1258
01:05:05,040 --> 01:05:08,479
Speaker 3: Can cases like this even be prosecuted at the state

1259
01:05:08,480 --> 01:05:09,200
Speaker 3: and local level.

1260
01:05:10,640 --> 01:05:17,120
Speaker 6: State ten states prosecute sports fiber bribery, gaming related fraud, conspiracy.

1261
01:05:17,760 --> 01:05:20,600
Speaker 6: But the set step in when when bets cross state lines,

1262
01:05:21,280 --> 01:05:24,560
Speaker 6: online sportsbooks are involved, I mean mode typically speaking, if

1263
01:05:24,600 --> 01:05:29,080
Speaker 6: there are phones, text messages, apps, banking systems, those tend

1264
01:05:29,080 --> 01:05:31,400
Speaker 6: to cross state lines. And you know, once you cross

1265
01:05:31,440 --> 01:05:35,120
Speaker 6: state lines, it becomes a federal issue, and for prosecution,

1266
01:05:35,520 --> 01:05:40,200
Speaker 6: you know, federal course preferred. There's broader jurisdiction. The penalties

1267
01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:43,320
Speaker 6: are much harsher as well too, and they have more

1268
01:05:43,360 --> 01:05:45,760
Speaker 6: resources and more investigative tools.

1269
01:05:46,080 --> 01:05:50,160
Speaker 3: Uh, walk me through the specific charges involved here and

1270
01:05:51,080 --> 01:05:54,400
Speaker 3: what the people involved are potentially looking at in terms

1271
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:55,000
Speaker 3: of punishment.

1272
01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:59,520
Speaker 6: Sure, well, first and foremost, I mean the court charge

1273
01:05:59,560 --> 01:06:02,000
Speaker 6: here is why fraud. And you know you might be asking,

1274
01:06:02,080 --> 01:06:03,960
Speaker 6: you know, I hear the term all the time. You

1275
01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:07,600
Speaker 6: know what's wire fraud? You know essentially it's three elements.

1276
01:06:07,640 --> 01:06:09,720
Speaker 6: You know, there's got to be a scheme to defraud,

1277
01:06:10,640 --> 01:06:14,080
Speaker 6: intend to decize and the use of interstate wires, whether

1278
01:06:14,120 --> 01:06:19,480
Speaker 6: those be you know, phone calls, texts, apps, internet. Basically,

1279
01:06:19,560 --> 01:06:22,480
Speaker 6: if you use the phone, text or betting app to

1280
01:06:22,680 --> 01:06:25,880
Speaker 6: you know, to rig outcomes or manipulating betting betting lines,

1281
01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:28,920
Speaker 6: that's wire fraud and that's and those are the accusations here.

1282
01:06:29,400 --> 01:06:32,880
Speaker 6: You know, there are the charges conspiracy, money laundering, bribery,

1283
01:06:33,240 --> 01:06:36,000
Speaker 6: illegal gambling, but you know, the wire fraud is the

1284
01:06:36,040 --> 01:06:37,240
Speaker 6: is the main crups of it here.

1285
01:06:37,640 --> 01:06:39,920
Speaker 3: So you have a lot of folks involved here, you

1286
01:06:39,960 --> 01:06:44,040
Speaker 3: have a lot of current and former men's college basketball players.

1287
01:06:44,160 --> 01:06:46,800
Speaker 3: What happens if the people name decide to cooperate with

1288
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:48,040
Speaker 3: the prosecution.

1289
01:06:49,200 --> 01:06:53,040
Speaker 6: Well, the I'm sure most of the athletes will a

1290
01:06:53,040 --> 01:06:54,760
Speaker 6: lot of times in these sex the cases MO when

1291
01:06:54,760 --> 01:06:56,480
Speaker 6: there's big schemes, it's kind of a rate to the

1292
01:06:56,480 --> 01:07:00,280
Speaker 6: prosecutor's office. Let's be honest here, the player are the

1293
01:07:00,680 --> 01:07:03,000
Speaker 6: ponds in the system. They're the small you know, they're

1294
01:07:03,000 --> 01:07:05,000
Speaker 6: the small people at the bottom of the totem poll.

1295
01:07:05,320 --> 01:07:08,400
Speaker 6: It is certainly in their best interest to cooperate and

1296
01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:12,560
Speaker 6: give information. Uh, if you cooperate, there can be reduced charges,

1297
01:07:13,280 --> 01:07:17,960
Speaker 6: drop charges, there could be significant reductions in your sentence,

1298
01:07:18,640 --> 01:07:21,080
Speaker 6: sometimes no jail time at all, particularly for these you know,

1299
01:07:21,120 --> 01:07:24,040
Speaker 6: for these players, they're low level pawns, you know the government,

1300
01:07:24,320 --> 01:07:25,960
Speaker 6: you know, well, they they're going to get everybody. They

1301
01:07:25,960 --> 01:07:27,800
Speaker 6: want to get the people at the top, you know,

1302
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:29,960
Speaker 6: first and foremost, those are the big fish at the

1303
01:07:30,040 --> 01:07:32,880
Speaker 6: end of the day. So uh, certainly folks are going

1304
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,680
Speaker 6: to want to cooperate and testify, and the sooner they

1305
01:07:35,760 --> 01:07:39,080
Speaker 6: do and the more information they provide, the lighter that

1306
01:07:39,320 --> 01:07:40,360
Speaker 6: things are going to go for them.

1307
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:43,760
Speaker 3: This is maybe a dumb question, will not be the

1308
01:07:43,800 --> 01:07:46,080
Speaker 3: first one or a last one that I've asked, but

1309
01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 3: you you know, you can you can find evidence that

1310
01:07:49,120 --> 01:07:52,200
Speaker 3: a that a college basketball player agreed to shave points

1311
01:07:52,280 --> 01:07:54,880
Speaker 3: right if they're texting, you know, that sort of thing.

1312
01:07:55,360 --> 01:07:57,880
Speaker 3: But can you actually prove that a player went through

1313
01:07:57,920 --> 01:07:59,720
Speaker 3: Can you, in a court of law prove that a

1314
01:07:59,760 --> 01:08:01,960
Speaker 3: player wasn't trying his best to help his team win.

1315
01:08:03,920 --> 01:08:05,880
Speaker 6: Well, they're going to use messages that the players have

1316
01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:08,360
Speaker 6: sent to you know that the folks that they were

1317
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:10,600
Speaker 6: working with, and you know, my understanding from some of

1318
01:08:10,600 --> 01:08:12,640
Speaker 6: the articles and some of the news that broke out

1319
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:15,440
Speaker 6: is you know that they talked to the conspirators and

1320
01:08:15,440 --> 01:08:17,479
Speaker 6: the folks that were paying them. Hey, I tried doing this,

1321
01:08:17,600 --> 01:08:20,080
Speaker 6: I tried doing that, And certainly their words can be

1322
01:08:20,160 --> 01:08:24,679
Speaker 6: used against them. And I'm sure that there are ways,

1323
01:08:25,240 --> 01:08:27,639
Speaker 6: you know, to to try and improve that in court.

1324
01:08:27,680 --> 01:08:30,080
Speaker 6: I'm sure that there are ways by you know, looking

1325
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,160
Speaker 6: at film and doing things besides just the messages. But

1326
01:08:33,520 --> 01:08:36,120
Speaker 6: when you have messages and you have texts and emails

1327
01:08:36,120 --> 01:08:38,479
Speaker 6: that are pretty damning, you know, it's not it's not

1328
01:08:38,520 --> 01:08:39,120
Speaker 6: good for the player.

1329
01:08:39,320 --> 01:08:44,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, So the basketball players themselves, if convicted, what sort

1330
01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,240
Speaker 3: of punishment, what kind of time are they maybe looking at?

1331
01:08:48,000 --> 01:08:50,720
Speaker 6: Technically speaking? Why or fraud carries up the twenty years

1332
01:08:50,760 --> 01:08:53,559
Speaker 6: in prison? I mean that said now, I mean no

1333
01:08:53,760 --> 01:08:55,880
Speaker 6: judge is going to look to throw a you know,

1334
01:08:56,360 --> 01:09:00,320
Speaker 6: a pawn in this system, a college athlete in prison

1335
01:09:00,360 --> 01:09:02,800
Speaker 6: for twenty years over this could prison time be on

1336
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:05,880
Speaker 6: the table, yes it can, but more than likely, you know,

1337
01:09:05,920 --> 01:09:08,360
Speaker 6: these young kids, these you know, young athletes are going

1338
01:09:08,439 --> 01:09:11,680
Speaker 6: to work with the prosecution, work with the investigators with

1339
01:09:11,720 --> 01:09:14,679
Speaker 6: the aid of their attorney, to give information and cut

1340
01:09:14,760 --> 01:09:17,960
Speaker 6: deals that you know very well could keep them out

1341
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:18,360
Speaker 6: of prison.

1342
01:09:18,560 --> 01:09:20,960
Speaker 3: So you obviously have a lot of folks who are

1343
01:09:21,160 --> 01:09:25,040
Speaker 3: are worried that this, with the proliferation of legal gambling,

1344
01:09:25,080 --> 01:09:27,840
Speaker 3: that this is going to become kind of a common

1345
01:09:27,920 --> 01:09:30,400
Speaker 3: thing that we have to deal with these stories all

1346
01:09:30,439 --> 01:09:34,760
Speaker 3: the time. So, could a judge, for instance, decide, you

1347
01:09:34,760 --> 01:09:37,479
Speaker 3: know what, because I don't want there to be more

1348
01:09:37,520 --> 01:09:40,080
Speaker 3: cases like this, I'm going to make an example of

1349
01:09:40,120 --> 01:09:44,160
Speaker 3: the athletes involved here and have found guilty, punish them,

1350
01:09:44,600 --> 01:09:47,599
Speaker 3: for lack of a better term, excessively in an effort

1351
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:49,000
Speaker 3: to make an example out of them.

1352
01:09:50,479 --> 01:09:53,439
Speaker 6: You could you could always have a judge go road.

1353
01:09:53,880 --> 01:09:58,519
Speaker 6: That said, there still are sent unseen guidelines. Most of

1354
01:09:58,560 --> 01:10:02,280
Speaker 6: these players probably have little to know criminal records whatsoever.

1355
01:10:03,080 --> 01:10:05,760
Speaker 6: There are still guidelines that you have. Whereas if you

1356
01:10:05,800 --> 01:10:07,679
Speaker 6: have somebody in front of you with a long criminal

1357
01:10:07,720 --> 01:10:11,960
Speaker 6: record that you know has more contact with the cord

1358
01:10:12,040 --> 01:10:14,679
Speaker 6: and you know it's higher risk, you know that person

1359
01:10:14,720 --> 01:10:18,559
Speaker 6: is likely to receive a longer sentence, It's probably unlikely

1360
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:21,000
Speaker 6: a judge goes rogue on a young college athlete here.

1361
01:10:21,160 --> 01:10:22,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, makes sense. Stuart W.

1362
01:10:22,760 --> 01:10:26,920
Speaker 3: Penrose, Attorney, Manila Lawgroup dot Com. I have a feeling

1363
01:10:26,920 --> 01:10:29,559
Speaker 3: there's going to be more cases like this and so

1364
01:10:29,600 --> 01:10:31,479
Speaker 3: it's going to be good to have you. As we

1365
01:10:31,560 --> 01:10:33,240
Speaker 3: say in the legal profession, as you say in the

1366
01:10:33,320 --> 01:10:36,679
Speaker 3: legal profession on retainer. Awesome stuff. As always, Man, thanks

1367
01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:41,280
Speaker 3: so much, Thank you, Bo. That's our guy, Stuart W. Penrose.

1368
01:10:41,320 --> 01:10:44,000
Speaker 3: You can learn more about the Manila Lawgroup at Manila

1369
01:10:44,040 --> 01:10:48,519
Speaker 3: Lawgroup dot com. It's eighteen away from five o'clock. Sports

1370
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:52,799
Speaker 3: headlines involved basically this there's a couple of college basketball

1371
01:10:52,840 --> 01:10:53,799
Speaker 3: games in the area.

1372
01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:54,200
Speaker 2: Tonight.

1373
01:10:54,280 --> 01:10:56,560
Speaker 3: Miami is on the road against ken State, the RedHawks

1374
01:10:56,960 --> 01:11:00,519
Speaker 3: looking for a twentieth consecutive victory after there over time

1375
01:11:00,600 --> 01:11:05,439
Speaker 3: win thrilling overtime win over Buffalo on Saturday. That game

1376
01:11:05,479 --> 01:11:10,320
Speaker 3: will tip off in Kent, Ohio, at seven o'clock tonight. Meanwhile,

1377
01:11:10,360 --> 01:11:13,080
Speaker 3: college basketball in the area, Ohio State takes on Minnesota.

1378
01:11:13,600 --> 01:11:17,160
Speaker 3: Indiana's on the road against Michigan Hockey tonight. The Blue

1379
01:11:17,200 --> 01:11:20,600
Speaker 3: Jackets look for a fifth consecutive victory, skating with and

1380
01:11:20,680 --> 01:11:27,960
Speaker 3: against Ottawa. There you go, seventeen away from five o'clock five, one, three, seven, four, nine.

1381
01:11:28,040 --> 01:11:31,000
Speaker 3: Fifteen thirty is our phone number. We will grab a

1382
01:11:31,040 --> 01:11:33,439
Speaker 3: couple of phone calls when we come back on ESPN

1383
01:11:33,479 --> 01:11:34,080
Speaker 3: fifteen thirty.

1384
01:11:34,120 --> 01:11:35,160
Speaker 2: Cincinnati sports station.

1385
01:11:35,880 --> 01:11:39,759
Speaker 3: It is twelve from five o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen

1386
01:11:39,840 --> 01:11:43,200
Speaker 3: thirty Moeger. Thanks for listening today. You'll hear Terry Francona

1387
01:11:44,560 --> 01:11:47,320
Speaker 3: state the obvious coming up after the top of hour

1388
01:11:47,360 --> 01:11:54,040
Speaker 3: at five o'clock plus. Tonight, Twitter's angriest night Baseball Hall

1389
01:11:54,080 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 3: of Fame class in twenty twenty six is going to

1390
01:11:56,360 --> 01:12:00,479
Speaker 3: be announced, and I've got the one, two, three, three, four,

1391
01:12:00,800 --> 01:12:05,320
Speaker 3: five five five, Yes, five players who should be let

1392
01:12:05,400 --> 01:12:08,479
Speaker 3: in this year. I bet you can't wait for that.

1393
01:12:08,520 --> 01:12:11,680
Speaker 3: Coming up in the five o'clock hour. Right now, though,

1394
01:12:11,760 --> 01:12:15,439
Speaker 3: we'll talk to other folks, starting with Ron and Milford. Ron,

1395
01:12:15,439 --> 01:12:17,599
Speaker 3: You're on ESPN fifteen thirty. Roun, Good afternoon.

1396
01:12:17,600 --> 01:12:18,040
Speaker 2: How are you.

1397
01:12:19,479 --> 01:12:21,000
Speaker 7: I am well, Mo, how are you doing?

1398
01:12:21,080 --> 01:12:22,599
Speaker 2: I'm doing awesome. Thanks for asking.

1399
01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:26,880
Speaker 7: I can't wait to hear the lift. I'll be holding

1400
01:12:27,000 --> 01:12:28,559
Speaker 7: strong to listen to that later.

1401
01:12:28,680 --> 01:12:31,599
Speaker 3: It's gonna be incredible question for you five thirty five.

1402
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:32,960
Speaker 2: By the way, I know you can't wait.

1403
01:12:34,280 --> 01:12:35,040
Speaker 7: I can't wait.

1404
01:12:35,160 --> 01:12:35,960
Speaker 8: I got a question.

1405
01:12:36,120 --> 01:12:40,160
Speaker 7: If I missed this, I apologize, But what were your

1406
01:12:40,160 --> 01:12:43,240
Speaker 7: thoughts on the officiating this weekend? I thought the officials

1407
01:12:43,240 --> 01:12:44,520
Speaker 7: did a good job overall.

1408
01:12:44,920 --> 01:12:48,719
Speaker 3: Are you talking about the ball downfield of Brandon Cooks

1409
01:12:48,720 --> 01:12:51,439
Speaker 3: that was ruled an interception in the Buffalo Denver game.

1410
01:12:52,760 --> 01:12:55,400
Speaker 7: Well, just yeah, just overall in that game, I thought,

1411
01:12:55,560 --> 01:12:58,920
Speaker 7: you know, they because I feel like each team caught

1412
01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:01,600
Speaker 7: a break. I mean, Cooks got held earlier in the

1413
01:13:01,680 --> 01:13:04,679
Speaker 7: end zone, but then the Bills could have the Bills

1414
01:13:04,720 --> 01:13:06,720
Speaker 7: could have been called for a safety, which would have

1415
01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:09,680
Speaker 7: ended the game when they had that holding in the

1416
01:13:09,760 --> 01:13:10,280
Speaker 7: end zone.

1417
01:13:10,680 --> 01:13:10,840
Speaker 8: Yea.

1418
01:13:11,040 --> 01:13:14,360
Speaker 7: And just in general, I thought that, you know, they

1419
01:13:14,479 --> 01:13:17,719
Speaker 7: kind of gave each team a little bit each way,

1420
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:21,080
Speaker 7: So I thought in general, And on the interference calls,

1421
01:13:21,160 --> 01:13:24,000
Speaker 7: I thought that those were interference and I do think that.

1422
01:13:24,400 --> 01:13:26,679
Speaker 7: I mean on the catch there, like you said, I mean,

1423
01:13:27,040 --> 01:13:32,799
Speaker 7: it either had to be a interception or a catch.

1424
01:13:32,840 --> 01:13:35,400
Speaker 7: There was no fumble because someone had to have the

1425
01:13:35,439 --> 01:13:36,960
Speaker 7: ball and the ball never hit the ground.

1426
01:13:38,560 --> 01:13:40,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I mean, to me, that was simple.

1427
01:13:40,800 --> 01:13:42,880
Speaker 3: And I think a lot of people had issue with

1428
01:13:42,920 --> 01:13:47,280
Speaker 3: the fact that the call wasn't that it felt like

1429
01:13:47,360 --> 01:13:50,760
Speaker 3: they reviewed it hastily, right, that they conferred, reviewed it

1430
01:13:50,800 --> 01:13:55,120
Speaker 3: hastily and moved on. But to me, the verbiage that

1431
01:13:55,160 --> 01:13:57,240
Speaker 3: has been used here makes all the sense in the world.

1432
01:13:57,280 --> 01:13:59,760
Speaker 3: We talk all the time about completing the process of

1433
01:13:59,800 --> 01:14:03,479
Speaker 3: making a catch. The wide receiver didn't complete the process

1434
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:06,080
Speaker 3: of making the catch, and the ball end up in

1435
01:14:06,120 --> 01:14:09,240
Speaker 3: the hands of another guy, So that's an interception. Like

1436
01:14:09,280 --> 01:14:12,719
Speaker 3: that's to me, that's not that controversial. We can debate

1437
01:14:13,360 --> 01:14:16,320
Speaker 3: what constitutes completing the process of making a catch.

1438
01:14:16,400 --> 01:14:17,519
Speaker 2: We do that all the time.

1439
01:14:18,160 --> 01:14:20,719
Speaker 3: But I think under what we have come to commonly

1440
01:14:20,880 --> 01:14:25,880
Speaker 3: understand as completing the process of making the catch, Brandon

1441
01:14:25,920 --> 01:14:29,639
Speaker 3: Cooks didn't do that, and so then the ball either

1442
01:14:30,080 --> 01:14:33,200
Speaker 3: hits the ground, which it did not, or it ends

1443
01:14:33,240 --> 01:14:35,200
Speaker 3: up in the hands of another player, which it did,

1444
01:14:35,280 --> 01:14:39,120
Speaker 3: and if it does, then the ball goes to the

1445
01:14:39,120 --> 01:14:42,120
Speaker 3: other team. So I thought the officials got that correct.

1446
01:14:42,800 --> 01:14:46,080
Speaker 3: I also thought the folks looking for offensive pass interference

1447
01:14:46,120 --> 01:14:49,400
Speaker 3: on the the Cole Comet touchdown, the miraculous play that

1448
01:14:49,920 --> 01:14:51,439
Speaker 3: forced overtime.

1449
01:14:51,800 --> 01:14:55,040
Speaker 7: Just hand fighting though.

1450
01:14:54,920 --> 01:14:58,439
Speaker 3: Yeah, just because two players are hand fighting and the

1451
01:14:58,479 --> 01:15:01,960
Speaker 3: other player releases does make it a push off all.

1452
01:15:01,960 --> 01:15:04,559
Speaker 7: Cole Comet deer.

1453
01:15:04,800 --> 01:15:09,080
Speaker 3: All cole Comett did was release himself from the player. Yeah,

1454
01:15:09,160 --> 01:15:12,240
Speaker 3: there's there's pushing off. He didn't push off, like if

1455
01:15:12,240 --> 01:15:16,639
Speaker 3: there's some physical contact and the player one of the players.

1456
01:15:16,720 --> 01:15:20,280
Speaker 3: In this case, the offensive player decides to separate from

1457
01:15:20,360 --> 01:15:21,320
Speaker 3: the defender.

1458
01:15:21,720 --> 01:15:22,800
Speaker 2: That's not a push off.

1459
01:15:23,040 --> 01:15:26,160
Speaker 3: I have no idea what folks who wanted to push

1460
01:15:26,200 --> 01:15:28,400
Speaker 3: off there were looking at, because what I saw were

1461
01:15:28,439 --> 01:15:32,280
Speaker 3: two players fighting for position and the other players simply released,

1462
01:15:32,479 --> 01:15:35,200
Speaker 3: which is one legal. It turned out to be somewhat

1463
01:15:35,200 --> 01:15:37,640
Speaker 3: of a moot point because the Bears chose to not

1464
01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:39,000
Speaker 3: go for two, which was stupid.

1465
01:15:39,360 --> 01:15:40,160
Speaker 2: They chose to.

1466
01:15:40,280 --> 01:15:43,200
Speaker 3: Uh not possess the ball to start overtime, which was

1467
01:15:43,240 --> 01:15:43,920
Speaker 3: also stupid.

1468
01:15:45,320 --> 01:15:47,200
Speaker 7: I was gonna ask you about that, though they should

1469
01:15:47,200 --> 01:15:47,840
Speaker 7: have went for two.

1470
01:15:48,400 --> 01:15:51,439
Speaker 3: You're two yards away from the winning points against a

1471
01:15:51,560 --> 01:15:56,160
Speaker 3: defense that shell shocked. Now maybe the Rams call time out.

1472
01:15:56,280 --> 01:15:59,800
Speaker 3: You're two yards away from the winning points. There is

1473
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:03,400
Speaker 3: a very good chance in overtime you will never be

1474
01:16:03,560 --> 01:16:07,240
Speaker 3: two yards away from the winning points.

1475
01:16:08,439 --> 01:16:09,120
Speaker 2: You to me.

1476
01:16:09,400 --> 01:16:11,839
Speaker 3: I know they were at home, and maybe the argument

1477
01:16:11,960 --> 01:16:14,360
Speaker 3: in favor of playing for overtime is different if you're

1478
01:16:14,360 --> 01:16:17,840
Speaker 3: on the road. I am winning the game with my

1479
01:16:18,040 --> 01:16:21,040
Speaker 3: offense on the field two yards away from the winning

1480
01:16:21,080 --> 01:16:24,960
Speaker 3: points ten times out of ten, and then I agree,

1481
01:16:25,160 --> 01:16:28,400
Speaker 3: you start overtime by kicking the ball away. And I

1482
01:16:28,400 --> 01:16:31,920
Speaker 3: don't understand that either I want the ball first, I

1483
01:16:31,920 --> 01:16:33,840
Speaker 3: want to put the pressure on the other team to

1484
01:16:33,880 --> 01:16:37,160
Speaker 3: either score, or if they do, I get the ball

1485
01:16:37,200 --> 01:16:38,679
Speaker 3: back in All I need is a field goal.

1486
01:16:40,080 --> 01:16:40,680
Speaker 8: Exactly.

1487
01:16:41,120 --> 01:16:43,479
Speaker 7: No one of the things that you were just talking

1488
01:16:43,520 --> 01:16:47,200
Speaker 7: to the legal experts there. I honestly, and I hate

1489
01:16:47,200 --> 01:16:50,479
Speaker 7: to be a conspiracy theorist, but you know, if there's

1490
01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:53,439
Speaker 7: one sport that there's a lot of judgment calls that

1491
01:16:53,479 --> 01:16:56,479
Speaker 7: can be made, it seems like the NFL, and I

1492
01:16:56,640 --> 01:16:59,600
Speaker 7: just wonder how many of these officials are gambling on

1493
01:16:59,640 --> 01:17:03,320
Speaker 7: the game to affect the outcomes, because, let's face it,

1494
01:17:03,320 --> 01:17:07,759
Speaker 7: they have the most opportunity to affect the outcome of games,

1495
01:17:07,760 --> 01:17:09,040
Speaker 7: are the officials?

1496
01:17:10,320 --> 01:17:13,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't agree with that. I mean, do they

1497
01:17:13,680 --> 01:17:15,360
Speaker 3: have an opportunity to affect games?

1498
01:17:15,439 --> 01:17:16,040
Speaker 2: Sure they do.

1499
01:17:16,680 --> 01:17:18,960
Speaker 3: I don't watch these games through the lens of thinking

1500
01:17:19,000 --> 01:17:20,200
Speaker 3: the officials are on the take.

1501
01:17:21,200 --> 01:17:24,800
Speaker 2: Like I cannot imagine.

1502
01:17:24,240 --> 01:17:27,160
Speaker 3: In this day and age that an official would be

1503
01:17:27,200 --> 01:17:31,360
Speaker 3: willing to risk prison time for the sake of helping

1504
01:17:31,400 --> 01:17:36,160
Speaker 3: somebody win a bet. I just we're talking about in

1505
01:17:36,240 --> 01:17:40,280
Speaker 3: many cases, folks who have been officiating games for years, who,

1506
01:17:40,280 --> 01:17:44,240
Speaker 3: by the way, have forged other careers, who have families.

1507
01:17:44,880 --> 01:17:48,519
Speaker 3: Why would an NFL official be willing to risk all

1508
01:17:48,560 --> 01:17:51,880
Speaker 3: of that to go to jail if they're caught.

1509
01:17:52,160 --> 01:17:54,840
Speaker 7: Well, I think it's because some of them, as you said,

1510
01:17:54,840 --> 01:17:57,959
Speaker 7: they have these second careers and they're not all at Hockeyly,

1511
01:17:58,040 --> 01:18:01,479
Speaker 7: they're not all attorneys. I mean I don't know.

1512
01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:02,800
Speaker 6: Yeah, I.

1513
01:18:04,320 --> 01:18:10,559
Speaker 3: Mean no, I just officiating inconsistencies and judgment mistakes have

1514
01:18:10,680 --> 01:18:15,120
Speaker 3: been going on since we decided to have officials officiate

1515
01:18:15,160 --> 01:18:17,800
Speaker 3: sporting events.

1516
01:18:19,760 --> 01:18:22,080
Speaker 7: Well, we get the full time officials finally in the

1517
01:18:22,200 --> 01:18:24,320
Speaker 7: NFL or no, So here's my question.

1518
01:18:25,840 --> 01:18:28,320
Speaker 3: If I'm an official and they say you're going to

1519
01:18:28,360 --> 01:18:31,000
Speaker 3: be a full time employee of the NFL, I have questions.

1520
01:18:31,640 --> 01:18:32,320
Speaker 2: What's the pay?

1521
01:18:33,240 --> 01:18:35,599
Speaker 3: If I have another job that's lucrative and I have

1522
01:18:35,640 --> 01:18:37,400
Speaker 3: to give that up, are you going to account for

1523
01:18:37,439 --> 01:18:38,360
Speaker 3: that money that I'm out?

1524
01:18:38,600 --> 01:18:38,920
Speaker 2: Also?

1525
01:18:39,000 --> 01:18:42,120
Speaker 3: What's the job security? If I miss one call? Am

1526
01:18:42,160 --> 01:18:45,559
Speaker 3: I out of a job? Like we hear this all

1527
01:18:45,600 --> 01:18:47,360
Speaker 3: the time. We'll make them full time employees.

1528
01:18:47,400 --> 01:18:47,679
Speaker 7: Cool?

1529
01:18:48,240 --> 01:18:50,519
Speaker 3: So if I let me ask you this, If I

1530
01:18:50,520 --> 01:18:53,160
Speaker 3: if I miss one call in one game, am I fired?

1531
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:54,840
Speaker 2: What's the job security?

1532
01:18:55,439 --> 01:18:55,519
Speaker 5: Like?

1533
01:18:55,600 --> 01:18:59,000
Speaker 3: What are the benefits? What's the salary? Sounds great? Make

1534
01:18:59,040 --> 01:19:01,479
Speaker 3: them full time employe. P If I was one of

1535
01:19:01,479 --> 01:19:04,680
Speaker 3: these officials, I would ask a lot of questions, and

1536
01:19:04,720 --> 01:19:07,800
Speaker 3: I would be skeptical about whether or not I make

1537
01:19:08,080 --> 01:19:11,280
Speaker 3: a mistake on a fifty to fifty call and now

1538
01:19:11,320 --> 01:19:14,160
Speaker 3: I'm out of a job. So yeah, man, it sounds awesome.

1539
01:19:14,200 --> 01:19:16,519
Speaker 3: Make them full time employees. How many of them would

1540
01:19:16,560 --> 01:19:18,840
Speaker 3: really want to be full time employees? How many of

1541
01:19:18,880 --> 01:19:21,000
Speaker 3: them would be willing to give up what their primary

1542
01:19:21,080 --> 01:19:24,400
Speaker 3: vocation is to be full time NFL employees with maybe

1543
01:19:24,439 --> 01:19:25,720
Speaker 3: not so much job security?

1544
01:19:27,200 --> 01:19:29,240
Speaker 8: Well, no, the NFL makes enough money.

1545
01:19:29,240 --> 01:19:31,400
Speaker 7: You'd think they'd be able to pay the officials well

1546
01:19:31,520 --> 01:19:33,800
Speaker 7: enough to make them full time employees. Let's face it,

1547
01:19:33,840 --> 01:19:37,639
Speaker 7: the money is hand over hand in the NFL more

1548
01:19:37,680 --> 01:19:39,040
Speaker 7: than any of the other sports.

1549
01:19:39,160 --> 01:19:41,760
Speaker 2: Right, what's my job security?

1550
01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:46,720
Speaker 7: Well, if Angel Hernandez has got a job in BASEBALLMB,

1551
01:19:46,760 --> 01:19:49,840
Speaker 7: sure if these guys in the NFL could keep their jobs.

1552
01:19:49,520 --> 01:19:52,080
Speaker 3: Too, well, Angel Hernandez for years had the backing of

1553
01:19:52,120 --> 01:19:55,160
Speaker 3: an umpire's union. Are the officials going to have the

1554
01:19:55,240 --> 01:19:57,840
Speaker 3: same union protection they have now? Remember they went on

1555
01:19:57,880 --> 01:19:59,080
Speaker 3: strike in twenty twelve.

1556
01:20:00,360 --> 01:20:02,559
Speaker 8: I know, and mo I heard on I didn't know this.

1557
01:20:02,640 --> 01:20:04,000
Speaker 8: I heard on NFL.

1558
01:20:03,760 --> 01:20:05,599
Speaker 7: Live that I guess the contracts up again?

1559
01:20:05,840 --> 01:20:06,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is so.

1560
01:20:07,320 --> 01:20:10,040
Speaker 3: And that's why I think there's this added discussion about

1561
01:20:10,080 --> 01:20:11,880
Speaker 3: the officials being full time employees.

1562
01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:13,799
Speaker 2: Knowing how fans are.

1563
01:20:14,520 --> 01:20:17,400
Speaker 3: And and and I'm this way, but but knowing how

1564
01:20:17,400 --> 01:20:20,960
Speaker 3: we are where we we scrutinize every single call that's made.

1565
01:20:21,600 --> 01:20:24,640
Speaker 3: So a first year official makes two bad calls? Is

1566
01:20:24,640 --> 01:20:27,160
Speaker 3: he out of a gig? I mean, that's what I

1567
01:20:27,160 --> 01:20:28,240
Speaker 3: would want to know. You want to make me a

1568
01:20:28,240 --> 01:20:29,040
Speaker 3: full time official?

1569
01:20:29,080 --> 01:20:29,280
Speaker 6: Cool?

1570
01:20:29,320 --> 01:20:31,720
Speaker 3: How much leeway am I allowed? Am I allowed to

1571
01:20:31,720 --> 01:20:34,160
Speaker 3: make any bad calls? You know what's what's going to

1572
01:20:34,200 --> 01:20:37,800
Speaker 3: happen if I don't grade perfectly? I think we we

1573
01:20:37,880 --> 01:20:41,799
Speaker 3: are continuing to search for perfect officiating, and in my lifetime,

1574
01:20:41,800 --> 01:20:44,559
Speaker 3: we haven't gotten it. Replay was supposed to fix it,

1575
01:20:44,840 --> 01:20:47,400
Speaker 3: and then added replay was supposed to fix it, and

1576
01:20:47,439 --> 01:20:51,560
Speaker 3: then adding uh, replay Assist was supposed to fix officiating,

1577
01:20:51,920 --> 01:20:54,880
Speaker 3: and now the latest, the latest fix is going to

1578
01:20:54,880 --> 01:20:58,000
Speaker 3: be full time officials. Like we're in search of something

1579
01:20:58,040 --> 01:21:01,400
Speaker 3: that's never going to exist. We're in search of perfection, Ron,

1580
01:21:01,479 --> 01:21:04,479
Speaker 3: thank you so much. We're in search of perfection, which

1581
01:21:04,520 --> 01:21:07,080
Speaker 3: is why and this is never gonna happen. I am

1582
01:21:07,120 --> 01:21:10,519
Speaker 3: the ultimate human element guy. If I was in charge

1583
01:21:10,520 --> 01:21:13,719
Speaker 3: of sports, which I should be, replay would go away entirely.

1584
01:21:14,520 --> 01:21:18,360
Speaker 3: Games played by human beings and coach by human beings

1585
01:21:18,560 --> 01:21:21,720
Speaker 3: should be officiated by human beings and we live with

1586
01:21:21,760 --> 01:21:24,439
Speaker 3: the results. But I think you would have a lot

1587
01:21:24,479 --> 01:21:26,960
Speaker 3: of pushback among NFL officials when it comes to being

1588
01:21:26,960 --> 01:21:27,960
Speaker 3: full time employees.

1589
01:21:29,120 --> 01:21:30,280
Speaker 2: What's my job security?

1590
01:21:30,400 --> 01:21:34,360
Speaker 3: Like? Nobody has that answer. Tito Francona says the obvious.

1591
01:21:34,400 --> 01:21:37,320
Speaker 3: I'll say what he didn't say next on ESPN fifteen thirty.

1592
01:21:37,439 --> 01:21:40,240
Speaker 1: You've done Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen years ago.

1593
01:21:40,400 --> 01:21:43,719
Speaker 3: Four after five, ESPN fifteen thirty, Malager, thanks for listening

1594
01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:51,360
Speaker 3: and hopefully your Tuesday is going swimmingly. Swimmingly, I said,

1595
01:21:55,360 --> 01:21:57,360
Speaker 3: we're gonna talk more about Dan Pitcher a little bit

1596
01:21:57,439 --> 01:22:00,360
Speaker 3: later on, and we're gonna play a little game of

1597
01:22:00,439 --> 01:22:04,600
Speaker 3: Elie Delacruz Make Belief. One of the best shows of

1598
01:22:04,640 --> 01:22:09,560
Speaker 3: the year is when Lance McAllister does sports talk from Redsfest.

1599
01:22:10,200 --> 01:22:12,760
Speaker 3: It's terrific and anything you might have missed from that

1600
01:22:12,800 --> 01:22:15,800
Speaker 3: you can go find on the iHeartRadio app. He had

1601
01:22:15,840 --> 01:22:19,439
Speaker 3: a conversation with Tito Francona. So this Reds offseason has

1602
01:22:19,479 --> 01:22:23,240
Speaker 3: been defined by two things. One I think is really good.

1603
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:27,320
Speaker 3: I think the Reds bullpen is better, not at all insignificant.

1604
01:22:27,479 --> 01:22:30,880
Speaker 3: Do not downplay that. You could be frustrated with what

1605
01:22:31,080 --> 01:22:34,760
Speaker 3: hasn't happened with the offense, and you can be skeptical

1606
01:22:34,800 --> 01:22:35,800
Speaker 3: that this is going to work.

1607
01:22:36,720 --> 01:22:38,559
Speaker 2: Those are very legitimate things.

1608
01:22:39,439 --> 01:22:43,759
Speaker 3: I do think they have been pretty aggressive in finding

1609
01:22:44,040 --> 01:22:49,120
Speaker 3: established big league relievers to fill certain roles. I have

1610
01:22:49,240 --> 01:22:52,120
Speaker 3: sat in this room, in front of this microphone before

1611
01:22:53,000 --> 01:22:58,960
Speaker 3: and hammered the Reds for not prioritizing getting legitimate relievers

1612
01:23:00,160 --> 01:23:01,320
Speaker 3: to fill important roles.

1613
01:23:01,360 --> 01:23:03,880
Speaker 2: I think they've done that this offseason. That's good.

1614
01:23:04,920 --> 01:23:08,120
Speaker 3: The other way this offseason has been defined is by

1615
01:23:08,200 --> 01:23:13,160
Speaker 3: the fruitless search for a bat. And it's January twentieth.

1616
01:23:13,240 --> 01:23:16,960
Speaker 3: Spring training starts in three weeks. Maybe they'll still get one.

1617
01:23:17,000 --> 01:23:19,519
Speaker 3: To this point, they have not. Apologies to Dane Meyers

1618
01:23:19,560 --> 01:23:25,440
Speaker 3: and JJ Bleday, and so there's a fair amount of frustration,

1619
01:23:25,840 --> 01:23:30,320
Speaker 3: legitimate and understandable frustration. I share it that the Reds

1620
01:23:30,320 --> 01:23:33,559
Speaker 3: offense is going to look a lot like last year's offense.

1621
01:23:33,680 --> 01:23:34,519
Speaker 2: Now, maybe it won't.

1622
01:23:34,560 --> 01:23:37,559
Speaker 3: Maybe Salz Stewart hits thirty home runs, and maybe Ella

1623
01:23:37,640 --> 01:23:40,400
Speaker 3: Dela Cruz is productive and healthy, and maybe Matt McClain

1624
01:23:40,520 --> 01:23:44,599
Speaker 3: is better, and maybe JJ Bleday ends up being better

1625
01:23:44,640 --> 01:23:46,400
Speaker 3: than most of us think he can be.

1626
01:23:46,520 --> 01:23:47,639
Speaker 2: And maybe Key.

1627
01:23:47,479 --> 01:23:50,559
Speaker 3: Brian Hayes is not an offensive zero, even though he

1628
01:23:50,640 --> 01:23:52,320
Speaker 3: has been one for his entire career.

1629
01:23:52,400 --> 01:23:53,920
Speaker 2: A lot of maybe he's a lot of what ifs.

1630
01:23:54,840 --> 01:23:57,720
Speaker 3: But what they haven't done is add a guy who

1631
01:23:57,800 --> 01:24:00,840
Speaker 3: has a legitimate bat that may you feel like the

1632
01:24:01,439 --> 01:24:07,360
Speaker 3: offensive dynamic has changed. Here is Tito with Lance on

1633
01:24:07,479 --> 01:24:12,160
Speaker 3: Friday stating, when it comes to the Reds offense, what

1634
01:24:12,240 --> 01:24:15,160
Speaker 3: I think most of us would agree is the obvious.

1635
01:24:17,160 --> 01:24:20,040
Speaker 5: So when we were going through good times last year,

1636
01:24:20,200 --> 01:24:24,840
Speaker 5: our bullpen was rested, yep and deep, and when we struggled,

1637
01:24:25,040 --> 01:24:28,400
Speaker 5: we're relying on guys like Santion Pugne way too much.

1638
01:24:28,960 --> 01:24:31,759
Speaker 5: Now we've got some depth, We added some left handers.

1639
01:24:32,720 --> 01:24:35,400
Speaker 5: And it's not just when you're winning, but you know,

1640
01:24:35,439 --> 01:24:38,680
Speaker 5: when you're down by two in the sixth guys give

1641
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:40,559
Speaker 5: you a chance to come back and win some of

1642
01:24:40,560 --> 01:24:44,000
Speaker 5: those games and also not bury the guys at the

1643
01:24:44,080 --> 01:24:45,920
Speaker 5: end of the game. But you make a good point

1644
01:24:46,000 --> 01:24:48,599
Speaker 5: because there's different styles. We have a couple of different left,

1645
01:24:48,640 --> 01:24:51,479
Speaker 5: these different looks. The writing's not like Pierce Johnson coming

1646
01:24:51,479 --> 01:24:54,360
Speaker 5: in with a breaking ball. Again, We're not going to

1647
01:24:54,439 --> 01:24:56,680
Speaker 5: leave the league in runs, is my guess. That's just

1648
01:24:56,720 --> 01:25:00,400
Speaker 5: being honest. But I would rather try to play with

1649
01:25:00,479 --> 01:25:04,479
Speaker 5: a really good pitching staff and team that catches the ball.

1650
01:25:04,720 --> 01:25:07,200
Speaker 5: Then when you score, it's meaningful. Trying to win ten

1651
01:25:07,240 --> 01:25:09,879
Speaker 5: to nine is really hard. You got to do it sometimes,

1652
01:25:09,920 --> 01:25:10,960
Speaker 5: but it's a hard way to play.

1653
01:25:11,479 --> 01:25:13,400
Speaker 3: I would like to win ten nothing. I'd like to

1654
01:25:13,439 --> 01:25:16,600
Speaker 3: win ten to two. Like it doesn't have to be

1655
01:25:16,640 --> 01:25:19,000
Speaker 3: an either or a thing. It's not well, you either

1656
01:25:19,000 --> 01:25:21,400
Speaker 3: win three to two or ten to nine, Like, why

1657
01:25:21,439 --> 01:25:24,320
Speaker 3: not win ten to five? You talk about something that

1658
01:25:24,360 --> 01:25:28,320
Speaker 3: could ease the strain on a bullpen, consistently having large leads.

1659
01:25:28,640 --> 01:25:31,599
Speaker 3: Talk about something that can help your starting staff giving

1660
01:25:31,640 --> 01:25:33,559
Speaker 3: them a lot of runs and a lot of cushion,

1661
01:25:34,040 --> 01:25:36,439
Speaker 3: so you don't have to start thinking about high leverage

1662
01:25:36,479 --> 01:25:39,040
Speaker 3: outs in the middle innings because every game is close.

1663
01:25:39,920 --> 01:25:44,040
Speaker 3: It doesn't have to be either or. There's a lot

1664
01:25:44,080 --> 01:25:46,360
Speaker 3: that Terry Francona just said there that I agree with,

1665
01:25:46,439 --> 01:25:48,720
Speaker 3: and again how he feels about the bullpen. I think

1666
01:25:48,840 --> 01:25:52,160
Speaker 3: is justified because I believe that can be a strength

1667
01:25:52,200 --> 01:25:54,920
Speaker 3: of this team. I think you would agree. But it

1668
01:25:55,479 --> 01:25:58,360
Speaker 3: doesn't have to be an either or proposition. It's not

1669
01:25:58,640 --> 01:26:01,200
Speaker 3: either win games two to one, ten to nine. How

1670
01:26:01,200 --> 01:26:04,160
Speaker 3: about win more games nine to three? How About win

1671
01:26:04,240 --> 01:26:08,840
Speaker 3: more games eight to four. How About instead of skating

1672
01:26:08,880 --> 01:26:12,360
Speaker 3: into the postseason you go into the postseason with ease.

1673
01:26:13,200 --> 01:26:16,280
Speaker 3: How About instead of skating by and winning every game

1674
01:26:16,320 --> 01:26:19,240
Speaker 3: by a run or two, you win more games with ease.

1675
01:26:19,640 --> 01:26:23,439
Speaker 3: That'll make everybody's job easier. It'll make it easier to

1676
01:26:23,520 --> 01:26:27,240
Speaker 3: win close games if you have more blowouts. And I'm

1677
01:26:27,280 --> 01:26:30,760
Speaker 3: not talking about winning games twelve zip. You know, ten

1678
01:26:30,800 --> 01:26:33,720
Speaker 3: to two is maybe extreme, but I don't know why

1679
01:26:33,760 --> 01:26:37,200
Speaker 3: it has to be either or. How about this, try

1680
01:26:37,200 --> 01:26:40,680
Speaker 3: to win more games seven to one. If you win

1681
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:44,360
Speaker 3: more games seven to one, it'll put a lot less

1682
01:26:44,360 --> 01:26:47,720
Speaker 3: strain on everybody. That was my first reaction to that

1683
01:26:47,800 --> 01:26:50,960
Speaker 3: sound when I heard it on Friday. The other is this,

1684
01:26:52,320 --> 01:26:55,200
Speaker 3: he took a guess, and I think we would agree

1685
01:26:55,840 --> 01:26:58,559
Speaker 3: they're probably not going to lead the league in run score.

1686
01:26:59,320 --> 01:27:05,240
Speaker 3: Fair assumption, a reasonable assumption, an assumption that I think

1687
01:27:05,280 --> 01:27:07,559
Speaker 3: most of us have nodded along with.

1688
01:27:08,760 --> 01:27:10,719
Speaker 2: And you know what, that's okay.

1689
01:27:10,840 --> 01:27:12,600
Speaker 3: You can still win a lot of games by not

1690
01:27:12,760 --> 01:27:16,639
Speaker 3: leading the league in run scored. It puts a premium

1691
01:27:16,680 --> 01:27:19,479
Speaker 3: on your starting pitching. Red should have really good starting pitching.

1692
01:27:20,080 --> 01:27:22,040
Speaker 3: Puts a premium on the bullpen. I think the Reds

1693
01:27:22,040 --> 01:27:24,800
Speaker 3: are gonna have a pretty decent bullpen this year. Puts

1694
01:27:24,800 --> 01:27:28,280
Speaker 3: a premium on defense, puts a premium on doing the

1695
01:27:28,320 --> 01:27:32,160
Speaker 3: little things, not giving away outs, not giving up bases,

1696
01:27:32,880 --> 01:27:37,439
Speaker 3: make taking advantage of the outs you have offensively, playing

1697
01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:40,880
Speaker 3: small ball, not giving away outs on the base pass.

1698
01:27:41,160 --> 01:27:45,559
Speaker 3: There's no one way to win. The problem, though, isn't

1699
01:27:45,800 --> 01:27:51,080
Speaker 3: what Tito said. The problem isn't Terry Francona informing the

1700
01:27:51,120 --> 01:27:54,280
Speaker 3: rest of us what chances are we already know, hey,

1701
01:27:54,800 --> 01:27:57,880
Speaker 3: we're not going to score that many runs. We're not

1702
01:27:57,920 --> 01:28:00,880
Speaker 3: going to lead the league in run scored. I think

1703
01:28:00,920 --> 01:28:06,000
Speaker 3: the problem is Tito Francona's bosses seem okay with that.

1704
01:28:08,600 --> 01:28:10,840
Speaker 3: It's one thing for the manager to go and you know,

1705
01:28:10,960 --> 01:28:14,120
Speaker 3: this was part of his messaging this weekend was, you know,

1706
01:28:14,240 --> 01:28:16,760
Speaker 3: my job is to manage the guys that I have,

1707
01:28:17,439 --> 01:28:19,000
Speaker 3: and I'm happy with the guys we have, and I

1708
01:28:19,000 --> 01:28:21,439
Speaker 3: don't have to talk myself into it. I'm paraphrasing them here,

1709
01:28:21,479 --> 01:28:25,240
Speaker 3: but it's one thing for the manager to say, you

1710
01:28:25,280 --> 01:28:27,320
Speaker 3: know what, we're probably not going to lead the league

1711
01:28:27,360 --> 01:28:31,280
Speaker 3: in runs. It's something else entirely for the front office

1712
01:28:31,320 --> 01:28:33,320
Speaker 3: to act in a way that makes you and I

1713
01:28:33,360 --> 01:28:39,000
Speaker 3: believe that they're okay with that. Hasn't that been the

1714
01:28:39,120 --> 01:28:42,439
Speaker 3: overriding message of the offseason, at least when it comes

1715
01:28:42,479 --> 01:28:46,640
Speaker 3: to the offense. Yes, there was the dalliance or the flirtation,

1716
01:28:46,920 --> 01:28:48,439
Speaker 3: or the pursuit, if you want to call it that

1717
01:28:49,560 --> 01:28:51,520
Speaker 3: of Kyle Schwarber.

1718
01:28:51,880 --> 01:28:55,000
Speaker 2: It didn't work out. Since then, what's there?

1719
01:28:55,080 --> 01:28:58,200
Speaker 3: Been handful of reports that they're going to trade for

1720
01:28:58,240 --> 01:29:03,000
Speaker 3: ktel Marte did happen? A handful of reports that they're

1721
01:29:03,040 --> 01:29:09,720
Speaker 3: pursuing Luis Robert frankly glad that hasn't happened. Folks want

1722
01:29:09,720 --> 01:29:12,240
Speaker 3: to see a u Haaneo Suarezbak sign me up for that.

1723
01:29:12,439 --> 01:29:14,400
Speaker 3: Don't know where he'd play, but I'd be okay with that.

1724
01:29:14,760 --> 01:29:19,280
Speaker 3: But nothing concrete. The offseason is nearly four months old.

1725
01:29:19,479 --> 01:29:22,720
Speaker 3: Nothing has been done to take last year's offense and

1726
01:29:22,920 --> 01:29:26,519
Speaker 3: with an outside bat, make it better. No protection for

1727
01:29:26,560 --> 01:29:30,400
Speaker 3: the middle of the order, nobody who changes the dynamic

1728
01:29:30,439 --> 01:29:33,840
Speaker 3: of the offense, Nobody who's really good at getting on base,

1729
01:29:34,320 --> 01:29:38,400
Speaker 3: no speedster, nobody, a couple of spare parts, dudes like

1730
01:29:38,479 --> 01:29:41,120
Speaker 3: jaj Bleday who feel a lot like a bunch of

1731
01:29:41,160 --> 01:29:43,679
Speaker 3: guys we've seen play time and play in the outfield

1732
01:29:43,720 --> 01:29:50,519
Speaker 3: for the Reds for years. Tito Francona's observation is probably accurate.

1733
01:29:51,120 --> 01:29:53,040
Speaker 3: The Reds are not going to lead the league and

1734
01:29:53,120 --> 01:29:59,559
Speaker 3: run scored. My observation is it feels like Tito's bosses

1735
01:30:00,160 --> 01:30:03,080
Speaker 3: are kind of okay with that. I don't know how

1736
01:30:03,120 --> 01:30:07,120
Speaker 3: that's acceptable. Like Tito's got a job. I'll manage the

1737
01:30:07,120 --> 01:30:09,439
Speaker 3: guys I got. I gotta make do with what I got,

1738
01:30:09,720 --> 01:30:12,599
Speaker 3: being paid a lot of money, Hall of Fame, bona fides.

1739
01:30:12,960 --> 01:30:14,680
Speaker 3: You brought me in to make do with whatever you

1740
01:30:14,720 --> 01:30:18,439
Speaker 3: give me. And so if I've got to use our

1741
01:30:18,479 --> 01:30:21,599
Speaker 3: starting staff and a better bullpen to win more three

1742
01:30:21,640 --> 01:30:24,680
Speaker 3: to two games, that's my job. It's my job to

1743
01:30:24,720 --> 01:30:27,439
Speaker 3: find out ways, figure out ways to win when we're

1744
01:30:27,520 --> 01:30:29,880
Speaker 3: probably not gonna lead the league and run scored. We

1745
01:30:29,960 --> 01:30:32,840
Speaker 3: don't have an uber potent lineup. We're not gonna hit

1746
01:30:32,880 --> 01:30:34,760
Speaker 3: a ton of home runs, and I don't have a

1747
01:30:34,760 --> 01:30:36,479
Speaker 3: lot of guys who are great at getting on base,

1748
01:30:36,920 --> 01:30:40,800
Speaker 3: probably not gonna steal a ton of bags. It's one

1749
01:30:40,840 --> 01:30:46,080
Speaker 3: thing for the manager to acknowledge that it's something else entirely, though,

1750
01:30:46,120 --> 01:30:48,840
Speaker 3: for that acknowledgment to come toward the end of an

1751
01:30:48,880 --> 01:30:55,920
Speaker 3: offseason where management has seemed okay with that. They they

1752
01:30:55,960 --> 01:31:00,240
Speaker 3: seem okay with their being this massive deficiency. But the

1753
01:31:00,280 --> 01:31:03,280
Speaker 3: manager is telling you were not going to be good offensively,

1754
01:31:04,800 --> 01:31:07,400
Speaker 3: and yet in the front office they're kind of nodding along,

1755
01:31:07,479 --> 01:31:12,960
Speaker 3: going hey, yeah, sorry, man, good good, good luck is good,

1756
01:31:13,080 --> 01:31:16,439
Speaker 3: do what you gotta do. They hopefully were healthier, and

1757
01:31:16,479 --> 01:31:19,080
Speaker 3: some dudes who weren't very good last year better, good luck, Tito.

1758
01:31:21,240 --> 01:31:24,400
Speaker 3: I don't know how that's okay. Quite frankly, I do

1759
01:31:24,520 --> 01:31:28,200
Speaker 3: not know how that's okay. So yeah, man, I think

1760
01:31:28,240 --> 01:31:30,599
Speaker 3: the job that Nick ral has done with the bullpen

1761
01:31:30,880 --> 01:31:34,920
Speaker 3: pretty good. Like I think they will go into spring training.

1762
01:31:35,880 --> 01:31:38,040
Speaker 3: I think with most of us having a pretty good

1763
01:31:38,040 --> 01:31:41,000
Speaker 3: idea of who should do what. Performance will have something

1764
01:31:41,000 --> 01:31:43,599
Speaker 3: to do with that. Injuries will have something to do

1765
01:31:43,640 --> 01:31:47,280
Speaker 3: with that, The overall performance of the starting staff might

1766
01:31:47,320 --> 01:31:50,360
Speaker 3: have something to do with that. So that's good. This

1767
01:31:50,400 --> 01:31:54,479
Speaker 3: isn't just gratuitously beat on the Reds like they have

1768
01:31:54,640 --> 01:31:58,320
Speaker 3: fixed part of their team, but they've done nothing to

1769
01:31:58,400 --> 01:32:03,240
Speaker 3: this other part. And so now you're left with the

1770
01:32:03,240 --> 01:32:08,479
Speaker 3: framing of, hey, it's hard to win games ten to nine, Yeah,

1771
01:32:08,840 --> 01:32:11,760
Speaker 3: try to win more games nine to three, try to

1772
01:32:11,800 --> 01:32:14,880
Speaker 3: win more games five to one, try to win more

1773
01:32:14,920 --> 01:32:18,880
Speaker 3: games seven zip. Yeah, you gotta win your share of

1774
01:32:18,880 --> 01:32:21,759
Speaker 3: close games. You gotta win your share of low scoring games. Awesome,

1775
01:32:23,240 --> 01:32:25,479
Speaker 3: That will be easier to do if you won more

1776
01:32:25,560 --> 01:32:27,720
Speaker 3: lopsided games. You have a better chance of winning more

1777
01:32:27,760 --> 01:32:30,800
Speaker 3: lopsided games with a better offense. It feels like the

1778
01:32:30,800 --> 01:32:33,439
Speaker 3: front office is okay with an offense that the manager

1779
01:32:33,560 --> 01:32:40,000
Speaker 3: is admitting is not great. Can you imagine Zach Taylor saying,

1780
01:32:40,080 --> 01:32:44,320
Speaker 3: you know, let's be honest, we're probably not gonna have

1781
01:32:44,400 --> 01:32:48,679
Speaker 3: a very good defense, but you know, gotta figure it out.

1782
01:32:49,120 --> 01:32:52,560
Speaker 3: We might have to win games forty two to thirty five. Like, no,

1783
01:32:52,680 --> 01:32:56,280
Speaker 3: you would go fix that part of your team. The

1784
01:32:56,320 --> 01:32:58,960
Speaker 3: manager is telling you what the front office didn't do.

1785
01:33:01,360 --> 01:33:03,479
Speaker 3: That's how I took it. On Friday night, I heard that,

1786
01:33:03,560 --> 01:33:08,360
Speaker 3: and I'm like, yeah, Tito, you're right, Go tell Nick,

1787
01:33:08,720 --> 01:33:13,160
Speaker 3: Go tell Bob, go, tell Phil, go tell Brad. Yeah, man,

1788
01:33:13,960 --> 01:33:16,920
Speaker 3: we're probably not gonna lead the league in runs. If

1789
01:33:17,000 --> 01:33:19,439
Speaker 3: you could say that in January. By the way, there's

1790
01:33:19,479 --> 01:33:22,120
Speaker 3: still time. The season doesn't start for more than two months.

1791
01:33:23,080 --> 01:33:25,800
Speaker 3: Your manager is telling you what you're gonna suck at.

1792
01:33:26,439 --> 01:33:29,040
Speaker 3: So how about this choose to not suck at it.

1793
01:33:31,920 --> 01:33:39,759
Speaker 3: Quarter after five, We're probably not gonna lead the league

1794
01:33:39,760 --> 01:33:44,080
Speaker 3: in runs. Yeah, you're right, Tito, You're exactly right. So

1795
01:33:44,280 --> 01:33:47,479
Speaker 3: maybe somebody should do something about that. This idea that

1796
01:33:47,520 --> 01:33:50,560
Speaker 3: it's got to be one or the other is absurd.

1797
01:33:53,960 --> 01:33:56,519
Speaker 2: You're allowed to win games by more than one run.

1798
01:33:56,720 --> 01:33:58,959
Speaker 2: You're allowed to have a team with a good bullpen

1799
01:33:59,080 --> 01:34:02,599
Speaker 2: and a better off By the way, if the Reds

1800
01:34:02,840 --> 01:34:06,719
Speaker 2: got Kyle Schwarber, you know what, they probably were still

1801
01:34:06,800 --> 01:34:09,320
Speaker 2: not gonna lead the league in runs, but they were

1802
01:34:09,320 --> 01:34:12,400
Speaker 2: probably gonna have an offense that was at least a

1803
01:34:12,520 --> 01:34:15,479
Speaker 2: tick better, a little bit more difficult to prep for,

1804
01:34:16,160 --> 01:34:18,559
Speaker 2: a little bit more difficult to navigate if you're a pitcher,

1805
01:34:19,920 --> 01:34:20,879
Speaker 2: a little bit more.

1806
01:34:20,680 --> 01:34:23,200
Speaker 3: Difficult to navigate late in the game with a bullpen.

1807
01:34:25,840 --> 01:34:28,479
Speaker 3: We're probably not gonna lead the league in runs because

1808
01:34:28,640 --> 01:34:30,920
Speaker 3: you know, but I I'd rather win games three, two

1809
01:34:31,000 --> 01:34:34,120
Speaker 3: to ten to nine. I just want to win, man,

1810
01:34:34,200 --> 01:34:37,240
Speaker 3: but I believe you have more of a chance of

1811
01:34:37,280 --> 01:34:39,880
Speaker 3: winning three to two games if the night before three

1812
01:34:39,880 --> 01:34:42,800
Speaker 3: to two win or a three to two game. You

1813
01:34:42,840 --> 01:34:44,880
Speaker 3: want a game seven zip or do you want a

1814
01:34:44,920 --> 01:34:51,840
Speaker 3: game seven to five? Seventeen minutes after five o'clock, I

1815
01:34:51,880 --> 01:34:56,200
Speaker 3: want you to pretend that Elie dela Cruz did not

1816
01:34:56,280 --> 01:34:58,040
Speaker 3: play for the Reds last year. We'll get to that

1817
01:34:58,080 --> 01:34:59,920
Speaker 3: coming up here in just a bit in the Hall

1818
01:35:00,080 --> 01:35:03,559
Speaker 3: Fame ballot and a question about Dan Pitcher on ESPN

1819
01:35:03,560 --> 01:35:07,320
Speaker 3: fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station twenty one after five. This

1820
01:35:07,479 --> 01:35:13,240
Speaker 3: is ESPN fifteen thirty. Moeger, thank you for listening. One

1821
01:35:13,280 --> 01:35:15,800
Speaker 3: other thing here on the the Ellie dey la Cruz thing,

1822
01:35:16,840 --> 01:35:21,920
Speaker 3: just to help you emotionally, which is what I'm here

1823
01:35:21,960 --> 01:35:25,720
Speaker 3: to do. We could do one of two things. We

1824
01:35:25,760 --> 01:35:28,680
Speaker 3: could just operate under an assumption, and if we do

1825
01:35:28,840 --> 01:35:32,320
Speaker 3: this now, it'll make things, I think a lot easier.

1826
01:35:33,920 --> 01:35:36,800
Speaker 3: And just operate under the assumption Ellie de la Cruz

1827
01:35:36,840 --> 01:35:40,720
Speaker 3: will probably play for another team at the end of

1828
01:35:40,720 --> 01:35:45,320
Speaker 3: his current contract or at the end of his team control,

1829
01:35:46,000 --> 01:35:49,360
Speaker 3: and that's the assumption. I've been operating under for a while,

1830
01:35:49,400 --> 01:35:52,519
Speaker 3: and that doesn't bother me. If he earns free agency,

1831
01:35:52,560 --> 01:35:55,280
Speaker 3: he's earned the right to pick the team that he

1832
01:35:55,280 --> 01:35:58,759
Speaker 3: wants to play for, assuming that team would want him.

1833
01:35:58,840 --> 01:36:02,600
Speaker 2: And that's how it works.

1834
01:36:03,479 --> 01:36:05,760
Speaker 3: And I just think if you reconcile yourself with that,

1835
01:36:05,960 --> 01:36:10,120
Speaker 3: it will make the departure whenever it comes, a lot

1836
01:36:10,160 --> 01:36:14,120
Speaker 3: easier to swallow. Or we could do this and I

1837
01:36:14,160 --> 01:36:18,679
Speaker 3: did this on Twitter over the weekend. If you're caught

1838
01:36:18,760 --> 01:36:22,479
Speaker 3: up in worrying about Ellie post twenty twenty nine, which

1839
01:36:23,800 --> 01:36:26,760
Speaker 3: to me just seems silly, like the Reds haven't won

1840
01:36:26,800 --> 01:36:31,240
Speaker 3: a postseason series in thirty years, and I'm going to

1841
01:36:31,320 --> 01:36:34,519
Speaker 3: waste energy and time on twenty thirty. Like I don't

1842
01:36:34,560 --> 01:36:38,599
Speaker 3: care win now. I want to win while they have them.

1843
01:36:39,160 --> 01:36:42,040
Speaker 3: That's been my thing the entire time. I don't know

1844
01:36:42,040 --> 01:36:44,920
Speaker 3: where Ellie Dela Cruz is going to play baseball next decade.

1845
01:36:45,400 --> 01:36:48,280
Speaker 3: I know where he's going to play baseball now, so why.

1846
01:36:48,200 --> 01:36:49,120
Speaker 2: Not win with him?

1847
01:36:49,320 --> 01:36:51,920
Speaker 3: And by the way, if if you want to impress

1848
01:36:52,000 --> 01:36:54,040
Speaker 3: upon him, why it's best for him to sign here.

1849
01:36:54,880 --> 01:36:57,920
Speaker 3: Chances are winning and like winning more than eighty three

1850
01:36:57,960 --> 01:37:01,760
Speaker 3: games would go maybe not a very long way, but

1851
01:37:01,800 --> 01:37:04,400
Speaker 3: would go at least a little bit of the way.

1852
01:37:06,120 --> 01:37:09,080
Speaker 3: So do this, like, let's let's pretend Elie Dela Cruz

1853
01:37:09,160 --> 01:37:14,080
Speaker 3: played for the Chicago Cubs last year, or the Seattle

1854
01:37:14,120 --> 01:37:17,600
Speaker 3: Mariners of the Los Angeles Angels, or the Miami Marlins

1855
01:37:17,680 --> 01:37:22,599
Speaker 3: or the New York Yanke played for anybody else besides

1856
01:37:22,680 --> 01:37:26,479
Speaker 3: the Reds. Let's let's pretend that.

1857
01:37:26,560 --> 01:37:27,240
Speaker 2: Let's pick that.

1858
01:37:27,360 --> 01:37:29,519
Speaker 3: Let's for our for the sake of our example, let's

1859
01:37:29,520 --> 01:37:32,200
Speaker 3: say Texas Rangers. Ellie Dela Cruz played for the Texas

1860
01:37:32,320 --> 01:37:38,160
Speaker 3: Rangers last year and this offseason signed a four year

1861
01:37:38,200 --> 01:37:40,920
Speaker 3: deal to play for the Reds. Regardless of what the

1862
01:37:40,960 --> 01:37:45,000
Speaker 3: money would be, You'd be pretty damn happy, wouldn't you.

1863
01:37:45,280 --> 01:37:48,960
Speaker 3: I would be We'd be doing cartwheels. We would be

1864
01:37:49,080 --> 01:37:52,640
Speaker 3: acting the way Tony Pike and I will act late tomorrow.

1865
01:37:53,000 --> 01:37:58,160
Speaker 3: If you see shocks the world and beats Arizona, would

1866
01:37:58,240 --> 01:38:00,560
Speaker 3: anybody say, well.

1867
01:38:00,200 --> 01:38:02,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, but where's he going to be in twenty thirty? No,

1868
01:38:02,520 --> 01:38:03,240
Speaker 2: the answer is no.

1869
01:38:03,560 --> 01:38:08,800
Speaker 3: They if they signed Ellie Dela Cruz to a four

1870
01:38:08,880 --> 01:38:12,800
Speaker 3: year contract new free agent Ellie Dela Cruz, would anybody

1871
01:38:12,880 --> 01:38:17,400
Speaker 3: be worried about twenty thirty of course not. It's not

1872
01:38:17,479 --> 01:38:20,440
Speaker 3: apples to apples because he's in his thirties. But had

1873
01:38:20,439 --> 01:38:24,439
Speaker 3: the Kyle Schwarber thing gotten done, like, would anybody be

1874
01:38:24,520 --> 01:38:26,160
Speaker 3: worried about where he was going to go at the

1875
01:38:26,280 --> 01:38:28,960
Speaker 3: end of those five years? No, Now there's a little

1876
01:38:29,000 --> 01:38:32,840
Speaker 3: bit of a difference between four and five. I guess

1877
01:38:33,040 --> 01:38:39,400
Speaker 3: my focus in my energy is kind of trained on

1878
01:38:40,840 --> 01:38:42,920
Speaker 3: how is this team going to take advantage of having

1879
01:38:42,960 --> 01:38:44,800
Speaker 3: a guy like that and having one hundred green and

1880
01:38:44,840 --> 01:38:48,160
Speaker 3: having a really good starting staff and having players that

1881
01:38:48,200 --> 01:38:52,920
Speaker 3: have come through their system. If between now in twenty

1882
01:38:53,000 --> 01:38:56,080
Speaker 3: twenty nine, the best they do is eighty three wins

1883
01:38:56,120 --> 01:38:57,960
Speaker 3: and a quick exit from the postseason.

1884
01:38:58,520 --> 01:39:00,200
Speaker 2: I gotta be honest with you.

1885
01:39:00,040 --> 01:39:02,600
Speaker 3: Really care who is playing shortstop or centerfield for the

1886
01:39:02,600 --> 01:39:05,800
Speaker 3: Reds in twenty thirty when while you have the guy, now,

1887
01:39:06,479 --> 01:39:10,000
Speaker 3: build the best possible team around the guy, protect him

1888
01:39:10,040 --> 01:39:12,599
Speaker 3: better than they did last year, get more guys on

1889
01:39:12,720 --> 01:39:15,760
Speaker 3: base in front of him, and if he's hurt, tell

1890
01:39:15,800 --> 01:39:22,519
Speaker 3: him that he can't play. Thank you, let's see here, Mike,

1891
01:39:22,560 --> 01:39:25,040
Speaker 3: go ahead, thanks for hanging on. You're on ESPN fifteen thirty.

1892
01:39:25,040 --> 01:39:26,160
Speaker 3: Good afternoon, Mike, How are you?

1893
01:39:27,560 --> 01:39:28,120
Speaker 6: Thank you well?

1894
01:39:28,200 --> 01:39:31,439
Speaker 8: I appreciate it. Well, I got so much stuff.

1895
01:39:31,479 --> 01:39:32,040
Speaker 6: I have to.

1896
01:39:32,000 --> 01:39:34,880
Speaker 8: Prioritize it because you won't give me enough ton which

1897
01:39:34,920 --> 01:39:40,639
Speaker 8: I understand. Uh, first of all, you know what I love.

1898
01:39:41,479 --> 01:39:43,800
Speaker 8: I always forget the guy's name that you're with on

1899
01:39:44,040 --> 01:39:50,639
Speaker 8: to to put you know, the Bengals guy. Yes, and

1900
01:39:50,680 --> 01:39:53,200
Speaker 8: it's only because I've hit so much damn Chimo, my

1901
01:39:53,320 --> 01:39:56,840
Speaker 8: damn brank my memory. That no offense to you, Paul.

1902
01:39:56,880 --> 01:39:57,639
Speaker 8: You're wonderful.

1903
01:39:57,760 --> 01:40:00,400
Speaker 3: Well, Mike, here's here's here's the I don't want to

1904
01:40:00,439 --> 01:40:02,280
Speaker 3: say the good news, but I'll counter that with this.

1905
01:40:02,520 --> 01:40:04,960
Speaker 3: My memory stinks and I've never had chemo, so at

1906
01:40:05,040 --> 01:40:06,080
Speaker 3: least you have an excuse.

1907
01:40:08,520 --> 01:40:10,000
Speaker 8: Well, he made me feel a little better.

1908
01:40:10,040 --> 01:40:10,479
Speaker 6: Thank you, bo.

1909
01:40:11,160 --> 01:40:15,120
Speaker 8: But your talk about the picture was so funny, and

1910
01:40:15,160 --> 01:40:18,519
Speaker 8: you were talking about reasons why he might live and

1911
01:40:18,600 --> 01:40:21,360
Speaker 8: Paul was saying could be this, could be that, could

1912
01:40:21,400 --> 01:40:26,080
Speaker 8: be sunshine, and that just cracked me up. Yeah, wasn't

1913
01:40:26,080 --> 01:40:26,599
Speaker 8: that funny?

1914
01:40:26,680 --> 01:40:30,280
Speaker 2: It was funny. Paul's the best Paul. The hour with

1915
01:40:30,320 --> 01:40:31,920
Speaker 2: Paul is my.

1916
01:40:32,040 --> 01:40:35,960
Speaker 3: Favorite of the week because we talked about things that

1917
01:40:36,000 --> 01:40:38,800
Speaker 3: matter to a lot of us, but we have fun

1918
01:40:38,840 --> 01:40:41,040
Speaker 3: with it no matter what. And that was the case

1919
01:40:41,080 --> 01:40:43,040
Speaker 3: today and is the case every single week.

1920
01:40:44,160 --> 01:40:45,920
Speaker 8: Yeah, he's a wonderful guest.

1921
01:40:46,120 --> 01:40:49,040
Speaker 3: You can't have fun talking about sports. What can you

1922
01:40:49,120 --> 01:40:49,840
Speaker 3: have fun doing?

1923
01:40:51,200 --> 01:40:54,800
Speaker 8: Exactly because in the scheme of things, it's down the

1924
01:40:54,880 --> 01:40:55,960
Speaker 8: scale on importance.

1925
01:40:56,200 --> 01:40:56,639
Speaker 2: Correct.

1926
01:40:57,680 --> 01:41:02,599
Speaker 8: Really, but when he said sunshine, I thought, even though

1927
01:41:02,640 --> 01:41:05,320
Speaker 8: I can't really be out and join it, but seventy

1928
01:41:05,320 --> 01:41:08,559
Speaker 8: three degrees here in southern California with twenty one percent humidity,

1929
01:41:09,080 --> 01:41:12,120
Speaker 8: the blue Pacific Ocean, the twelve thousand foot mountains. Okay,

1930
01:41:12,120 --> 01:41:19,320
Speaker 8: I'll stop. I were you were talking about coaches? I

1931
01:41:19,360 --> 01:41:25,160
Speaker 8: thought earlier today and I was thinking about the bit

1932
01:41:25,280 --> 01:41:31,320
Speaker 8: my Bearcats, and I thought about Tommy the a hole Tverville,

1933
01:41:31,320 --> 01:41:36,320
Speaker 8: who's a rotten human being ruin through when he cut

1934
01:41:36,400 --> 01:41:39,800
Speaker 8: back the military. He held up military paid a couple

1935
01:41:39,880 --> 01:41:42,960
Speaker 8: of years ago for some bull crunch. And then we

1936
01:41:43,000 --> 01:41:45,559
Speaker 8: had Butch Jones. Haha, he was trying to get out

1937
01:41:45,560 --> 01:41:45,800
Speaker 8: of here.

1938
01:41:45,920 --> 01:41:48,160
Speaker 2: No, we had but before, we had Butch before Tommy.

1939
01:41:49,080 --> 01:41:54,559
Speaker 8: Okay, then Satderfield, really Satderfield. Really we got lucky. We

1940
01:41:54,600 --> 01:41:59,240
Speaker 8: got lucky with Luke, not lucky with Luke. But uh,

1941
01:42:01,320 --> 01:42:04,719
Speaker 8: you know, Kelly leaves at midnight. Luke leaves at midnight.

1942
01:42:06,000 --> 01:42:07,920
Speaker 8: What are we going to do on these football coaches

1943
01:42:07,920 --> 01:42:08,439
Speaker 8: that you've seen?

1944
01:42:08,479 --> 01:42:10,439
Speaker 3: Well, but this is what they do. I don't think

1945
01:42:10,479 --> 01:42:13,479
Speaker 3: that's exclusive to you. See, I mean you watch what

1946
01:42:13,560 --> 01:42:16,360
Speaker 3: Lane Kevin did, right, But I don't.

1947
01:42:16,200 --> 01:42:19,320
Speaker 8: Care about other school I'm talking about you see, we can't.

1948
01:42:19,400 --> 01:42:22,760
Speaker 8: You know. You know why bring this up is because Indiana.

1949
01:42:22,840 --> 01:42:24,840
Speaker 8: I don't know how they got Signetti. I don't know

1950
01:42:24,920 --> 01:42:27,679
Speaker 8: the details, but my God want.

1951
01:42:27,439 --> 01:42:31,600
Speaker 2: To find yes. Fine, yeah, no, I mean cast a

1952
01:42:31,600 --> 01:42:32,280
Speaker 2: wide net.

1953
01:42:32,360 --> 01:42:35,840
Speaker 3: Now, you know you're I think you're referring to beyond

1954
01:42:35,880 --> 01:42:40,040
Speaker 3: Tommy Tumberville coaches. You know, we'll see what happens with

1955
01:42:40,080 --> 01:42:43,800
Speaker 3: Scott's Haderfield. But coaches who have left, I don't I

1956
01:42:43,840 --> 01:42:47,800
Speaker 3: don't believe college football fans should worry about the departure

1957
01:42:48,000 --> 01:42:49,439
Speaker 3: or worried about worry about.

1958
01:42:49,280 --> 01:42:49,960
Speaker 2: The coach leaving.

1959
01:42:50,840 --> 01:42:53,439
Speaker 3: I think you simply hope that they do as good

1960
01:42:53,439 --> 01:42:55,679
Speaker 3: of a job as they possibly can while they're in place.

1961
01:42:56,800 --> 01:43:00,640
Speaker 3: And so that's why Brian Kelly, to this day I

1962
01:43:00,680 --> 01:43:02,639
Speaker 3: think more about what he did while he was here

1963
01:43:02,680 --> 01:43:05,880
Speaker 3: than his departure. And same for Luke Fickle and even

1964
01:43:05,920 --> 01:43:08,160
Speaker 3: to a different degree, Butch John. Now I was not

1965
01:43:08,200 --> 01:43:11,519
Speaker 3: a huge Butch Jones fan. But Butch did in his

1966
01:43:11,600 --> 01:43:13,640
Speaker 3: three years. He had two seasons where they shared a

1967
01:43:13,640 --> 01:43:16,880
Speaker 3: Biggiest championship. It's not like his teams were awful. Now,

1968
01:43:17,240 --> 01:43:19,880
Speaker 3: I didn't like a lot about how Butch handled things

1969
01:43:19,920 --> 01:43:22,200
Speaker 3: off the field. I didn't think he was necessarily a

1970
01:43:22,240 --> 01:43:25,640
Speaker 3: great game coach. I thought he had a lot of

1971
01:43:25,680 --> 01:43:28,880
Speaker 3: misplaced priorities. I didn't think he was as transparent as

1972
01:43:28,920 --> 01:43:31,040
Speaker 3: maybe he could have been when he was looking to leave.

1973
01:43:31,720 --> 01:43:33,880
Speaker 2: But you know, he did win here.

1974
01:43:34,000 --> 01:43:37,800
Speaker 3: He did a you know, on the field win loss perspective,

1975
01:43:38,160 --> 01:43:40,320
Speaker 3: did a good job. And at the end of the day,

1976
01:43:40,400 --> 01:43:43,000
Speaker 3: that's all I care about. And I look at these

1977
01:43:43,040 --> 01:43:46,280
Speaker 3: guys and I understand they're gonna leave for somewhere else,

1978
01:43:46,360 --> 01:43:51,040
Speaker 3: and that's okay. Do you make the program as good

1979
01:43:51,080 --> 01:43:53,479
Speaker 3: as it can be while you're here. And with a

1980
01:43:53,600 --> 01:43:56,639
Speaker 3: number of those coaches they've had, the answers have been yes.

1981
01:43:57,800 --> 01:44:02,599
Speaker 8: Okay. I got two other topics will really quick. One

1982
01:44:02,720 --> 01:44:06,080
Speaker 8: was the NFL playoffs this weekend. I got two questions

1983
01:44:06,080 --> 01:44:07,519
Speaker 8: and then I got to get to the Reds with

1984
01:44:07,600 --> 01:44:12,960
Speaker 8: my ultimate questions. Oh okay, well you think Stidham can

1985
01:44:13,040 --> 01:44:15,080
Speaker 8: do the job? Remember to win that game.

1986
01:44:16,240 --> 01:44:20,000
Speaker 3: I'm very skeptical because I think Denver's defense has fallen

1987
01:44:20,000 --> 01:44:25,880
Speaker 3: off and the Patriots have feasted on compromised opponents and

1988
01:44:26,320 --> 01:44:28,519
Speaker 3: opponents who haven't been at their best at the sport's

1989
01:44:28,600 --> 01:44:29,559
Speaker 3: most important position.

1990
01:44:31,000 --> 01:44:33,519
Speaker 8: And New Anglo I didn't realize Newlinglo has spent more

1991
01:44:33,520 --> 01:44:36,080
Speaker 8: than anybody on free agency. They spent three hundred and

1992
01:44:36,120 --> 01:44:38,960
Speaker 8: fifty dollars on free agency last year.

1993
01:44:39,160 --> 01:44:44,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, and like they've had a historically easy schedule. That's

1994
01:44:44,120 --> 01:44:47,000
Speaker 3: not their fault. They caught a break because CJ. Stroud

1995
01:44:47,160 --> 01:44:52,000
Speaker 3: was frankly non competitive at his position. The Chargers from

1996
01:44:52,240 --> 01:44:56,720
Speaker 3: an offensive line perspective, were severely compromised. But they had

1997
01:44:56,720 --> 01:44:59,400
Speaker 3: the best record in the NFL this year against the spread.

1998
01:45:00,080 --> 01:45:03,040
Speaker 3: So they're covering big numbers sixteen to five and one.

1999
01:45:03,880 --> 01:45:06,800
Speaker 3: It's less than a touchdown this week. I think they

2000
01:45:06,880 --> 01:45:08,720
Speaker 3: cover it. I'll take the Pats.

2001
01:45:09,240 --> 01:45:12,599
Speaker 8: I got you, okay with the Reds Now we're talking

2002
01:45:12,640 --> 01:45:15,120
Speaker 8: about these on and I'm the biggest proponent of the

2003
01:45:15,320 --> 01:45:18,360
Speaker 8: of increasing the offense like you. But when I got

2004
01:45:18,439 --> 01:45:22,000
Speaker 8: when I got into the numbers for runs per game,

2005
01:45:22,640 --> 01:45:25,479
Speaker 8: the Reds weren't bad. They were fourteenths with four point

2006
01:45:25,560 --> 01:45:26,920
Speaker 8: four to two runs per game.

2007
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:27,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, middle of the pass.

2008
01:45:28,840 --> 01:45:30,080
Speaker 8: Only three teams.

2009
01:45:29,760 --> 01:45:33,880
Speaker 9: Were over five, the Dogs, the Dodgers, the Yankees, in

2010
01:45:33,920 --> 01:45:38,880
Speaker 9: the Blue Jays, And of course Tony said, well, it's

2011
01:45:38,920 --> 01:45:41,760
Speaker 9: you know, they scored twenty seven runs in that one game,

2012
01:45:41,800 --> 01:45:44,040
Speaker 9: maybe fifteen here, and that's still not going to skew

2013
01:45:44,200 --> 01:45:46,840
Speaker 9: dramatically one hundred and sixty two games.

2014
01:45:47,120 --> 01:45:49,680
Speaker 3: But I think that's what's frustrating about this offseason. They

2015
01:45:49,720 --> 01:45:53,200
Speaker 3: didn't need an overhaul. They needed like one guy, and

2016
01:45:53,240 --> 01:45:56,200
Speaker 3: they haven't gotten that one guy. Like nobody went into

2017
01:45:56,200 --> 01:45:59,000
Speaker 3: this offseason saying you need like four new position players.

2018
01:45:59,040 --> 01:46:00,679
Speaker 2: You need to reconstruc lineup.

2019
01:46:00,720 --> 01:46:02,600
Speaker 3: You needed to add something to it, and if you

2020
01:46:02,720 --> 01:46:07,559
Speaker 3: did that, average offense could maybe be slightly above average,

2021
01:46:07,800 --> 01:46:11,200
Speaker 3: and that could be the difference between winning eighty three

2022
01:46:11,280 --> 01:46:14,160
Speaker 3: games and maybe winning eighty seven or eighty eight.

2023
01:46:15,320 --> 01:46:15,559
Speaker 6: Yeah.

2024
01:46:16,080 --> 01:46:18,560
Speaker 8: Yeah, I know you're right. It's just such a quandary

2025
01:46:18,600 --> 01:46:21,240
Speaker 8: that we're all frustrated. One last thing, I'll give you

2026
01:46:21,320 --> 01:46:23,560
Speaker 8: the nine. I'll lay to nine with Arizona.

2027
01:46:24,479 --> 01:46:27,719
Speaker 2: Uh is that what the number is? I haven't seen. Yeah, nine,

2028
01:46:27,800 --> 01:46:31,719
Speaker 2: it's only nine. Now, it's ten, it's only ten.

2029
01:46:33,080 --> 01:46:37,479
Speaker 8: Yep, check it. I'm telling you the truth.

2030
01:46:37,680 --> 01:46:39,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I will. No, I believe that.

2031
01:46:39,400 --> 01:46:41,680
Speaker 3: I would have thought it would have been closer to

2032
01:46:41,880 --> 01:46:43,479
Speaker 3: twelve and a half to thirteen and a half.

2033
01:46:44,880 --> 01:46:48,479
Speaker 8: Lloyd is Tommy Lloyd is going to spank West Miller.

2034
01:46:48,520 --> 01:46:51,040
Speaker 8: I'm putting to bed. That's gonna be the way it goes.

2035
01:46:51,120 --> 01:46:54,080
Speaker 8: I hate to say it, but that team is ten deep.

2036
01:46:54,280 --> 01:46:57,200
Speaker 8: You don't even miss the replacements. And they're fifth in

2037
01:46:57,280 --> 01:47:01,600
Speaker 8: off They're fifth in offensive rebounding and seventh in defensive

2038
01:47:01,640 --> 01:47:03,000
Speaker 8: rebound that'sheard of.

2039
01:47:03,160 --> 01:47:04,000
Speaker 2: They're ridiculous.

2040
01:47:04,360 --> 01:47:09,080
Speaker 3: I mean that statement has more to do with Arizona

2041
01:47:09,479 --> 01:47:12,120
Speaker 3: than it does Cincinnati, quite frankly. And to say which

2042
01:47:12,160 --> 01:47:16,240
Speaker 3: one about UC's deficiencies, we know what they are, the

2043
01:47:17,160 --> 01:47:20,080
Speaker 3: Arizona Wildcats when they have been at their best this year.

2044
01:47:20,680 --> 01:47:23,719
Speaker 3: I've watched them against UCLA, I've watched them against Yukon.

2045
01:47:24,120 --> 01:47:26,639
Speaker 3: The most impressed I've been by any team at college

2046
01:47:26,680 --> 01:47:29,760
Speaker 3: basketball this year was when they beat Alabama in Birmingham,

2047
01:47:30,120 --> 01:47:32,759
Speaker 3: scored ninety six on them. They took a good Auburn

2048
01:47:32,840 --> 01:47:35,679
Speaker 3: tea behind the woodshed. They haven't lost in Big Twelve play.

2049
01:47:36,720 --> 01:47:39,559
Speaker 3: I watched them against Utah when they scored ninety seven.

2050
01:47:39,640 --> 01:47:41,840
Speaker 3: Won that game by nineteen, and it wasn't that close.

2051
01:47:41,960 --> 01:47:48,520
Speaker 3: Like they are a load. They the task the Bearcats

2052
01:47:48,520 --> 01:47:53,080
Speaker 3: have in front of them. It's difficulty cannot be understated.

2053
01:47:53,120 --> 01:47:56,320
Speaker 3: I'm surprised, and I'm trying to pull it up right now.

2054
01:47:56,360 --> 01:48:01,200
Speaker 3: My computer is not cooperating. Nine seams.

2055
01:48:01,240 --> 01:48:04,760
Speaker 8: Long Tony said. The one reason that you see could

2056
01:48:04,760 --> 01:48:07,439
Speaker 8: win the game is because Arizona is not a grete

2057
01:48:07,479 --> 01:48:08,519
Speaker 8: three point shooting team.

2058
01:48:08,680 --> 01:48:11,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, here's the thing, Mike.

2059
01:48:11,040 --> 01:48:16,040
Speaker 3: I'm I'm I got my fan dual app open right now, okay.

2060
01:48:15,760 --> 01:48:22,479
Speaker 2: And I'm looking at lines four tomorrow. Look, I see

2061
01:48:22,479 --> 01:48:26,560
Speaker 2: fifteen an hour ago, I see I see fifteen and

2062
01:48:26,640 --> 01:48:27,040
Speaker 2: a half.

2063
01:48:27,920 --> 01:48:29,200
Speaker 8: Holy what?

2064
01:48:31,960 --> 01:48:33,760
Speaker 3: There was no way it was only There was no

2065
01:48:33,800 --> 01:48:34,880
Speaker 3: way it was only nine.

2066
01:48:35,560 --> 01:48:35,840
Speaker 2: Dude.

2067
01:48:35,840 --> 01:48:38,000
Speaker 8: I googled it and said it was nine on some

2068
01:48:38,080 --> 01:48:40,240
Speaker 8: wines and ten on the other. But you know that

2069
01:48:40,280 --> 01:48:41,240
Speaker 8: doesn't mean that probably.

2070
01:48:41,960 --> 01:48:44,600
Speaker 3: I'm literally, I'm literally looking at it right now. I

2071
01:48:45,240 --> 01:48:47,559
Speaker 3: see Cincinnati is getting fifteen and a half points.

2072
01:48:48,280 --> 01:48:50,720
Speaker 8: Well that's why you were so shocked. Well yeah, that's

2073
01:48:50,760 --> 01:48:52,840
Speaker 8: on my do stuff like this. You always make me

2074
01:48:52,920 --> 01:48:55,719
Speaker 8: look like a damn pool. I hate that, but anyway,

2075
01:48:56,720 --> 01:48:59,439
Speaker 8: I appreciate you straightened me out. I know you got

2076
01:48:59,479 --> 01:48:59,600
Speaker 8: to go.

2077
01:49:00,160 --> 01:49:01,960
Speaker 2: That's that's that's that's what I do.

2078
01:49:02,080 --> 01:49:08,120
Speaker 3: I I was, I was, I was. I was shocked

2079
01:49:08,120 --> 01:49:11,000
Speaker 3: when you said it was only ten. That didn't make

2080
01:49:11,000 --> 01:49:16,200
Speaker 3: any sense to me. And now there's I don't know

2081
01:49:16,200 --> 01:49:18,880
Speaker 3: that I'm nuts about taking those points, but you know,

2082
01:49:19,040 --> 01:49:21,519
Speaker 3: fifteen and a half, I'm more comfortable with the night, Mike,

2083
01:49:21,560 --> 01:49:22,120
Speaker 3: I gotta run.

2084
01:49:22,160 --> 01:49:22,760
Speaker 2: Thanks so much.

2085
01:49:23,520 --> 01:49:25,120
Speaker 8: Give me the Greek aegor. Thank you.

2086
01:49:25,160 --> 01:49:29,320
Speaker 3: There you go. We'll well, we'll get into the Bearcats

2087
01:49:29,360 --> 01:49:33,640
Speaker 3: and what happened on Saturday and the five guys that

2088
01:49:34,120 --> 01:49:37,840
Speaker 3: baseball writers with ballads should have checked in the class

2089
01:49:37,840 --> 01:49:42,360
Speaker 3: of twenty twenty six. Coming up on ESPN fifteen thirty.

2090
01:49:42,400 --> 01:49:46,639
Speaker 3: It is twenty away from six o'clock. Excuse me, this

2091
01:49:46,680 --> 01:49:55,000
Speaker 3: is ESPN fifteen thirty. Thank you for listening. College hoops tonight,

2092
01:49:55,040 --> 01:49:58,040
Speaker 3: Miami is at ken State. The RedHawks take the floor

2093
01:49:58,040 --> 01:50:00,320
Speaker 3: with a number next to their name for the first

2094
01:50:00,320 --> 01:50:03,400
Speaker 3: time since Wally Zerbiak was playing in nineteen ninety nine.

2095
01:50:03,439 --> 01:50:07,799
Speaker 3: They won an absolutely epic game with the Ian Elmer

2096
01:50:08,240 --> 01:50:11,280
Speaker 3: buzzer beater to force overtime and then the Peter soooter

2097
01:50:11,360 --> 01:50:14,760
Speaker 3: shot that won it with less than a second, a

2098
01:50:14,760 --> 01:50:19,280
Speaker 3: go at Mallett Hall, Mullett Hall, not Millet Hall, and

2099
01:50:19,560 --> 01:50:22,920
Speaker 3: the RedHawks survive, they get ranked tonight. They' you're taking

2100
01:50:22,960 --> 01:50:26,559
Speaker 3: on a tough Kent State team the Saturday game you

2101
01:50:26,640 --> 01:50:28,719
Speaker 3: see beat Aowa State. I know Mike before was talking

2102
01:50:28,720 --> 01:50:32,160
Speaker 3: about Arizona, which, by the way, really quick. God love

2103
01:50:32,240 --> 01:50:35,439
Speaker 3: my guy, Tony. I don't know where this thing came

2104
01:50:35,479 --> 01:50:39,000
Speaker 3: from where. Arizona is not a good three point shooting team.

2105
01:50:39,439 --> 01:50:42,040
Speaker 3: They're maybe not awesome. They're forty fifth in the country.

2106
01:50:43,520 --> 01:50:50,120
Speaker 3: For comparison's sake, Cincinnati is three hundred and fifteenth. Arizona

2107
01:50:50,240 --> 01:50:52,639
Speaker 3: is middle of the pack in the Big Twelve, seventh

2108
01:50:52,640 --> 01:50:55,599
Speaker 3: in the Big Twelve. They shoot thirty seven percent from three.

2109
01:50:56,000 --> 01:50:58,320
Speaker 3: Cincinnati is dead last in the Big twelve and thirty

2110
01:50:58,320 --> 01:51:02,040
Speaker 3: one percent. Bearkat's defended well all season long. They're gonna

2111
01:51:02,040 --> 01:51:04,679
Speaker 3: have to defend at an extraordinarily high level tomorrow night

2112
01:51:05,120 --> 01:51:07,960
Speaker 3: just to make it close. And they're probably gonna have

2113
01:51:07,960 --> 01:51:09,439
Speaker 3: to be better from behind the ark than they have

2114
01:51:09,479 --> 01:51:12,719
Speaker 3: been all season long. But Arizona might not be awesome

2115
01:51:12,960 --> 01:51:18,960
Speaker 3: shooting the three. And you know they've they've taken They've

2116
01:51:19,000 --> 01:51:23,439
Speaker 3: taken decidedly less than everybody just three hundred and seven

2117
01:51:23,520 --> 01:51:26,720
Speaker 3: per so they don't take a lot, but they make

2118
01:51:26,760 --> 01:51:29,799
Speaker 3: a decent percentage. So maybe that's where Tony was coming from.

2119
01:51:29,840 --> 01:51:34,640
Speaker 3: I don't know. Quickly on Saturday. Let's be honest, this

2120
01:51:34,720 --> 01:51:38,040
Speaker 3: you see, you see football, you see basketball. Season hasn't

2121
01:51:38,080 --> 01:51:41,160
Speaker 3: been that much fun. They're ten and eight, even with

2122
01:51:41,200 --> 01:51:44,479
Speaker 3: the win over Iowa State. There's been more talk of

2123
01:51:44,640 --> 01:51:47,360
Speaker 3: what's gonna happen at the end of the season than

2124
01:51:47,400 --> 01:51:50,040
Speaker 3: what's happening on the floor during this season, and that's

2125
01:51:50,120 --> 01:51:53,880
Speaker 3: just the way it goes. The fan unrest, the fan

2126
01:51:53,960 --> 01:51:57,880
Speaker 3: disaffection is probably not going away just because they've won

2127
01:51:57,920 --> 01:52:01,799
Speaker 3: consecutive games, including over the second ranked team in the country.

2128
01:52:03,920 --> 01:52:07,640
Speaker 3: All of that said, I do think it is significance,

2129
01:52:09,040 --> 01:52:12,160
Speaker 3: not so much that they continue to play hard, because

2130
01:52:12,200 --> 01:52:16,280
Speaker 3: I think that should be baked in, But there's a

2131
01:52:16,360 --> 01:52:19,759
Speaker 3: lot of noise, and the noise has been about stuff

2132
01:52:19,840 --> 01:52:24,679
Speaker 3: like fans wearing bags and buyouts and are they gonna

2133
01:52:24,680 --> 01:52:26,920
Speaker 3: move on from West during the season, and again, a

2134
01:52:26,960 --> 01:52:29,160
Speaker 3: lot of this stuff comes with the territory. When the

2135
01:52:29,200 --> 01:52:33,040
Speaker 3: season isn't going well and a coach is in its

2136
01:52:33,160 --> 01:52:36,200
Speaker 3: current capacity for his fifth year, that hasn't made the

2137
01:52:36,240 --> 01:52:36,920
Speaker 3: tournament yet.

2138
01:52:37,160 --> 01:52:39,080
Speaker 2: All the noise just comes with.

2139
01:52:39,080 --> 01:52:41,880
Speaker 3: The territory when you are in the position that Wes

2140
01:52:41,960 --> 01:52:43,920
Speaker 3: Miller is in, and when you're in the position that

2141
01:52:43,960 --> 01:52:48,240
Speaker 3: you see basketball is in. I do think with all

2142
01:52:48,320 --> 01:52:52,280
Speaker 3: the noise swirling, at least for me, maybe for you,

2143
01:52:52,360 --> 01:52:55,840
Speaker 3: but I think it has been fair to wonder if

2144
01:52:55,840 --> 01:53:00,439
Speaker 3: the team's focus will waiver, and maybe to a degree,

2145
01:53:00,479 --> 01:53:05,760
Speaker 3: will the effort waiver. I think it is significant that

2146
01:53:05,920 --> 01:53:09,880
Speaker 3: neither of those things have happened. Might not make you

2147
01:53:09,920 --> 01:53:13,120
Speaker 3: feel better about the season, might not make you feel

2148
01:53:13,280 --> 01:53:16,439
Speaker 3: all that good about the coach, might not make you

2149
01:53:16,600 --> 01:53:18,800
Speaker 3: want to believe that Wes should be the coach next year,

2150
01:53:19,400 --> 01:53:22,439
Speaker 3: might not make you believe they have a remote chance

2151
01:53:22,479 --> 01:53:27,160
Speaker 3: of even coming close to winning the game tomorrow. But

2152
01:53:28,040 --> 01:53:30,600
Speaker 3: for all the criticism that Wes has gotten and to

2153
01:53:30,720 --> 01:53:35,599
Speaker 3: a degree has deserved, for the way the team has played,

2154
01:53:36,000 --> 01:53:38,320
Speaker 3: for his coaching, and then for some of the postgame

2155
01:53:38,360 --> 01:53:42,559
Speaker 3: comments that we've talked about a lot, I think that

2156
01:53:42,640 --> 01:53:45,280
Speaker 3: the next step where you know, okay, how much worse

2157
01:53:45,320 --> 01:53:45,880
Speaker 3: can it get?

2158
01:53:46,200 --> 01:53:47,120
Speaker 2: The answer was.

2159
01:53:48,560 --> 01:53:52,040
Speaker 3: The team looks checked out, or you see some guys

2160
01:53:52,120 --> 01:53:54,479
Speaker 3: who look like they're starting to think about where they're

2161
01:53:54,479 --> 01:53:57,360
Speaker 3: going to be playing next year, or the focus is

2162
01:53:57,560 --> 01:54:02,560
Speaker 3: just off. I don't think the focus was off against UCF.

2163
01:54:02,600 --> 01:54:06,000
Speaker 3: They did not win that game. The focus was not

2164
01:54:06,160 --> 01:54:09,040
Speaker 3: off against Colorado, and the focus was not off against

2165
01:54:09,120 --> 01:54:13,040
Speaker 3: Iowa State. And so I had had had the focus

2166
01:54:13,080 --> 01:54:15,320
Speaker 3: been off, or had the effort not been there, you

2167
01:54:15,360 --> 01:54:18,200
Speaker 3: and I both know I may have participated in it.

2168
01:54:19,000 --> 01:54:24,400
Speaker 3: Folks would have come at Wes Miller with ferocity and

2169
01:54:24,520 --> 01:54:27,920
Speaker 3: he would have had it coming. If you're going to

2170
01:54:27,960 --> 01:54:31,720
Speaker 3: be poised to do that, when the opposite happens, then

2171
01:54:31,760 --> 01:54:35,040
Speaker 3: he got to give credit. Doesn't have to mean that

2172
01:54:35,120 --> 01:54:36,800
Speaker 3: you love the season, doesn't have to mean that you

2173
01:54:36,880 --> 01:54:38,600
Speaker 3: love the coach, doesn't have to mean that you feel

2174
01:54:38,640 --> 01:54:41,160
Speaker 3: any better about where this season may go.

2175
01:54:41,880 --> 01:54:42,920
Speaker 2: Look, they're ten and eight.

2176
01:54:43,000 --> 01:54:47,320
Speaker 3: Man Like, if you're if you saw that game on

2177
01:54:47,360 --> 01:54:49,840
Speaker 3: Saturday and thought like, all right, let's do some NCAA

2178
01:54:49,920 --> 01:54:55,640
Speaker 3: tournament math, good luck, because they're they're probably gonna have

2179
01:54:56,960 --> 01:54:59,640
Speaker 3: only four more games they could afford to lose. It's

2180
01:54:59,680 --> 01:55:02,520
Speaker 3: gonna be really hard to overcome the Q four loss,

2181
01:55:02,640 --> 01:55:04,480
Speaker 3: even with that win over Iowa State.

2182
01:55:05,680 --> 01:55:06,720
Speaker 2: So look at it.

2183
01:55:06,640 --> 01:55:10,440
Speaker 3: On a more micro level, with all the stuff swirling.

2184
01:55:11,240 --> 01:55:14,120
Speaker 3: This team has still looked pretty much locked in, and

2185
01:55:14,240 --> 01:55:17,160
Speaker 3: they I thought, on Sunday or Saturday, they looked like

2186
01:55:17,200 --> 01:55:19,320
Speaker 3: a team where it made sense what everybody's role was

2187
01:55:19,360 --> 01:55:21,920
Speaker 3: gonna be. They shortened the rotation a little bit. The

2188
01:55:22,360 --> 01:55:25,520
Speaker 3: playmaking guards played like playmaking guards. The guys they needed

2189
01:55:25,520 --> 01:55:27,200
Speaker 3: to give them some good minutes off the bench gave

2190
01:55:27,280 --> 01:55:29,480
Speaker 3: him good minutes off the bench. The dudes who are

2191
01:55:29,520 --> 01:55:32,120
Speaker 3: supposed to be defensive stoppers like Buck Harris, played like

2192
01:55:32,160 --> 01:55:36,480
Speaker 3: defensive stoppers. The bigs played like quality big twelve bigs

2193
01:55:36,520 --> 01:55:39,880
Speaker 3: like the pieces on Saturday fit. The biggest and I

2194
01:55:39,880 --> 01:55:43,680
Speaker 3: think most fair criticism of UC basketball for the last

2195
01:55:43,720 --> 01:55:46,600
Speaker 3: couple of years has been, man, the pieces don't fit.

2196
01:55:47,640 --> 01:55:50,920
Speaker 3: I felt like on Saturday against Iowa State, the pieces

2197
01:55:50,960 --> 01:55:54,880
Speaker 3: fit and the focus was there. Those things may not

2198
01:55:55,120 --> 01:55:57,840
Speaker 3: matter to you if you have advanced the conversation to

2199
01:55:57,920 --> 01:56:00,280
Speaker 3: what's gonna happen at the end of this year. But

2200
01:56:00,280 --> 01:56:02,960
Speaker 3: if you are still hoping to see the Bearcats compete,

2201
01:56:03,200 --> 01:56:05,440
Speaker 3: if you're still holding out hope that they can still

2202
01:56:05,440 --> 01:56:10,200
Speaker 3: make something of this season, those things are really significant.

2203
01:56:11,720 --> 01:56:15,160
Speaker 3: Fourteen away from six o'clock. This is one of my

2204
01:56:15,240 --> 01:56:18,520
Speaker 3: favorite nights of the year. It's one of my favorite

2205
01:56:18,560 --> 01:56:22,000
Speaker 3: nights of the year because I love Hall of Fame discussions,

2206
01:56:22,720 --> 01:56:25,240
Speaker 3: and let's be honest, we all love football, we all

2207
01:56:25,240 --> 01:56:28,080
Speaker 3: love basketball, maybe other sports, the Baseball Hall of Fame

2208
01:56:28,120 --> 01:56:30,640
Speaker 3: matters more than the others. It is the one that

2209
01:56:30,800 --> 01:56:33,120
Speaker 3: is most widely discussed. It is maybe the one that

2210
01:56:33,200 --> 01:56:37,960
Speaker 3: is most based on statistics. It is exclusive, but I

2211
01:56:37,960 --> 01:56:42,000
Speaker 3: think the process makes more sense than football. The Basketball

2212
01:56:42,040 --> 01:56:44,920
Speaker 3: Hall of Fame quite frankly, doesn't feel like it's that exclusive.

2213
01:56:45,920 --> 01:56:48,480
Speaker 3: The Baseball Hall of Fame discussions we have are the

2214
01:56:48,520 --> 01:56:51,720
Speaker 3: best ones. Unfortunately, I think what happens in the ballot's

2215
01:56:51,720 --> 01:56:53,440
Speaker 3: going to come out a little bit after six o'clock

2216
01:56:53,840 --> 01:56:56,400
Speaker 3: is as soon as the class is announced, we start

2217
01:56:56,440 --> 01:56:58,919
Speaker 3: to talk about who didn't make it instead of focusing

2218
01:56:58,920 --> 01:56:59,600
Speaker 3: on who did.

2219
01:57:00,120 --> 01:57:02,080
Speaker 2: And then when we talked about who didn't.

2220
01:57:01,800 --> 01:57:07,600
Speaker 3: Make it, there's anger, and then it's less fun. I

2221
01:57:07,720 --> 01:57:10,960
Speaker 3: love pretending I have a vote. I do this with

2222
01:57:11,000 --> 01:57:14,280
Speaker 3: the other sports too, but in baseball, I think it's

2223
01:57:14,360 --> 01:57:18,240
Speaker 3: just a little bit more fun. So here it is

2224
01:57:18,280 --> 01:57:20,520
Speaker 3: the annual list of players I would vote for if

2225
01:57:20,520 --> 01:57:24,760
Speaker 3: I had a vote. Carlos Beltran has been on the

2226
01:57:24,800 --> 01:57:27,200
Speaker 3: outside looking in so far because of the twenty seventeen

2227
01:57:27,280 --> 01:57:30,120
Speaker 3: Houston Astro sign stealing scandal, and I think the price

2228
01:57:30,160 --> 01:57:32,960
Speaker 3: he is paid he deserved to pay. He should not

2229
01:57:33,080 --> 01:57:36,919
Speaker 3: be excluded from Cooperstown. His body of work pre twenty sixteen,

2230
01:57:37,080 --> 01:57:40,640
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, pre twenty seventeen was exceptional.

2231
01:57:41,120 --> 01:57:42,960
Speaker 2: Every seventy war.

2232
01:57:42,880 --> 01:57:46,400
Speaker 3: Center fielder in baseball history is in the Hall of Fame.

2233
01:57:46,880 --> 01:57:50,120
Speaker 3: Carlos Beltran is a seventy War Hall of Famer. Put

2234
01:57:50,200 --> 01:57:53,440
Speaker 3: him in Cooperstown. I believe he'll get in. Andrew Jones

2235
01:57:53,480 --> 01:57:56,240
Speaker 3: did have a really short peak, but what a peak

2236
01:57:56,280 --> 01:57:59,680
Speaker 3: it was. Here are the center fielders with the most

2237
01:57:59,760 --> 01:58:02,360
Speaker 3: year where they had a Gold Glove and hit thirty

2238
01:58:02,440 --> 01:58:06,839
Speaker 3: or more home runs. Willie Mays eight, Barry Bonds seven,

2239
01:58:07,520 --> 01:58:11,800
Speaker 3: Andrew Jones seven. I said centerfielders, I meant outfielders. That's

2240
01:58:11,880 --> 01:58:15,720
Speaker 3: exclusive company. Willy Mays is obviously in the Hall of Fame.

2241
01:58:16,000 --> 01:58:19,800
Speaker 3: Barry Bond should be, so should Andrew Jones. If Andrew

2242
01:58:19,880 --> 01:58:22,640
Speaker 3: Jones is a Hall of Famer on this ballot, Tory

2243
01:58:22,720 --> 01:58:26,440
Speaker 3: Hunter should be as well. A better offensive player, a

2244
01:58:26,560 --> 01:58:29,920
Speaker 3: much longer peak was still an all start thirty seven

2245
01:58:30,240 --> 01:58:32,360
Speaker 3: and frankly one of the most fun players to play,

2246
01:58:32,760 --> 01:58:38,840
Speaker 3: to watch play for an entire generation, Chase Hutley, there

2247
01:58:38,840 --> 01:58:44,440
Speaker 3: are only four second basemen who have an average five

2248
01:58:44,520 --> 01:58:47,080
Speaker 3: point four war per one sixty two.

2249
01:58:47,680 --> 01:58:48,560
Speaker 2: Let me do that again.

2250
01:58:49,080 --> 01:58:53,000
Speaker 3: There are only four second basemen who had an average

2251
01:58:53,000 --> 01:58:56,480
Speaker 3: of five point four war per one sixty two. All

2252
01:58:56,520 --> 01:58:59,120
Speaker 3: of them are Hall of Famers. Chase Hutley has that

2253
01:58:59,480 --> 01:59:03,360
Speaker 3: he should be the fifth. Jimmy Rollins I feel strongly about.

2254
01:59:03,400 --> 01:59:07,720
Speaker 3: Jimmy Rollins was an MVP World Series champion, four Gold Gloves.

2255
01:59:08,200 --> 01:59:09,840
Speaker 2: No other shortstop can say that.

2256
01:59:10,160 --> 01:59:12,920
Speaker 3: Only shortstop in history with more than twenty four hundred hits,

2257
01:59:12,920 --> 01:59:15,920
Speaker 3: two hundred homers, four hundred steals, and eight hundred extra

2258
01:59:15,960 --> 01:59:20,280
Speaker 3: base hits, longest hitting streak by a shortstop since eighteen

2259
01:59:20,400 --> 01:59:24,640
Speaker 3: ninety four, extraordinarily durable one hundred and fifty games or

2260
01:59:24,680 --> 01:59:27,200
Speaker 3: more in ten plus seasons. Only two short stops in

2261
01:59:27,320 --> 01:59:30,000
Speaker 3: history had more seasons of one hundred and fifty plus.

2262
01:59:31,000 --> 01:59:34,600
Speaker 3: Jeter and Ripken both are in Cooperstown. Jimmy Rollins should

2263
01:59:34,640 --> 01:59:38,000
Speaker 3: be in Cooperstown. One of my favorite pitchers to watch ever,

2264
01:59:38,120 --> 01:59:42,200
Speaker 3: Felix Hernandez wouldn't put him in love. Cole Hamils Cole

2265
01:59:42,240 --> 01:59:44,920
Speaker 3: Hamills once pitched a great postseason game against the Reds

2266
01:59:44,960 --> 01:59:45,600
Speaker 3: of GABP.

2267
01:59:46,160 --> 01:59:47,040
Speaker 2: Wouldn't put him in.

2268
01:59:47,600 --> 01:59:51,000
Speaker 3: Edwin and Carnassion had an awesome career former Red.

2269
01:59:51,240 --> 01:59:55,120
Speaker 2: Wouldn't put him in. Wouldn't put in a Rod, wouldn't

2270
01:59:55,120 --> 01:59:56,240
Speaker 2: put in many Ramires.

2271
01:59:56,800 --> 01:59:59,400
Speaker 3: I'd put in Bonds and Clemens. Neither guys are on

2272
01:59:59,440 --> 02:00:03,120
Speaker 3: the list. A Rod and Manny actually tested positive. I

2273
02:00:03,120 --> 02:00:06,000
Speaker 3: think it's fair to draw the line there, So there

2274
02:00:06,040 --> 02:00:08,480
Speaker 3: you go. That's it should be in. It's ten away

2275
02:00:08,480 --> 02:00:11,960
Speaker 3: from five o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

2276
02:00:12,560 --> 02:00:17,920
Speaker 1: Get the latest Bengals off season news on ESPN fifteen thirty,

2277
02:00:18,480 --> 02:00:20,360
Speaker 1: the official home of the Bengals.

2278
02:00:20,840 --> 02:00:23,840
Speaker 3: Anything you may have missed on this show you could

2279
02:00:23,960 --> 02:00:30,080
Speaker 3: always get for absolutely free on the iHeartRadio app, including

2280
02:00:30,120 --> 02:00:34,480
Speaker 3: our conversation with Paul Danner. Junior podcasts of this show

2281
02:00:34,560 --> 02:00:39,440
Speaker 3: are a service of Long Neck Sports Grill. If you're

2282
02:00:39,480 --> 02:00:42,120
Speaker 3: thinking ahead of the weekend, and who among us isn't

2283
02:00:42,600 --> 02:00:45,959
Speaker 3: you got the AFC and NFC title games on Sunday,

2284
02:00:46,560 --> 02:00:49,240
Speaker 3: You've got a full college basketball slate. You've got a

2285
02:00:49,280 --> 02:00:52,680
Speaker 3: loaded college basketball night Tomorrow night locally, you can watch

2286
02:00:52,680 --> 02:00:55,240
Speaker 3: all the action and so much more at Longneck Sports Grill,

2287
02:00:55,320 --> 02:00:58,680
Speaker 3: beer selection is top notch. If you haven't had long

2288
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Speaker 3: Nex wings, what are you waiting for? And the menu

2289
02:01:01,600 --> 02:01:04,360
Speaker 3: is terrific. Long next three locations. You got Wilder, you

2290
02:01:04,400 --> 02:01:06,800
Speaker 3: got Hebred, you got rich Wood. Each one of them

2291
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Speaker 3: very easy to get to. Each one of them is

2292
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Speaker 3: perfect for you and your buddies, maybe you and just

2293
02:01:12,640 --> 02:01:15,440
Speaker 3: by yourself. Long Nex Sports Girl, go and check them

2294
02:01:15,480 --> 02:01:18,520
Speaker 3: out and get anything you might have missed on the

2295
02:01:19,000 --> 02:01:21,360
Speaker 3: iHeart Radio app.

2296
02:01:22,160 --> 02:01:25,960
Speaker 2: The music means the show is over tomorrow. What have

2297
02:01:25,960 --> 02:01:26,360
Speaker 2: we got?

2298
02:01:26,920 --> 02:01:30,200
Speaker 3: Our guy Rick Boring on Xavier and NKU basketball. We

2299
02:01:30,240 --> 02:01:35,360
Speaker 3: are looking forward to that and in a month Xavier

2300
02:01:35,400 --> 02:01:40,400
Speaker 3: hasn't played in like forever. Like legitimately, every Biggies team

2301
02:01:40,440 --> 02:01:44,480
Speaker 3: gets a bye and whenever it happens. Xavier obviously had

2302
02:01:44,480 --> 02:01:49,120
Speaker 3: their bye this week and then they get set to

2303
02:01:49,120 --> 02:01:52,839
Speaker 3: play their next game. It's like Xavier is an omaha

2304
02:01:52,920 --> 02:01:55,040
Speaker 3: for a game against Creighton tomorrow. We will look ahead

2305
02:01:55,080 --> 02:01:57,160
Speaker 3: to that and so much more with our guy Rick

2306
02:01:57,200 --> 02:02:02,960
Speaker 3: bor and looking forward to it. Show is over. Gotta go.

2307
02:02:03,600 --> 02:02:11,280
Speaker 3: Follow on Twitter at moegar, Instagram at moegar, and whatever

2308
02:02:11,440 --> 02:02:14,280
Speaker 3: other social media platforms are out there chances are you'll

2309
02:02:14,280 --> 02:02:17,840
Speaker 3: find me with a page that's dormant. Have a great night,

2310
02:02:17,880 --> 02:02:20,400
Speaker 3: Thank you for listening. Thanks to Taran Plant for producing.

2311
02:02:20,440 --> 02:02:22,960
Speaker 3: This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station.