1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 1: Football in the NATI brought to you by bell Terra 2 00:00:04,480 --> 00:00:09,760 Speaker 1: Casino and Belterra Park on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official 3 00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:12,639 Speaker 1: home of the Cincinnati Bengals. 4 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:17,280 Speaker 2: Twenty three for four. This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Molegger 5 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 2: Robert Wine Trump right say weekly Bengals column for Cincinnati 6 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 2: Magazine dot com and he joins us every single Thursday. Robert, 7 00:00:25,200 --> 00:00:28,000 Speaker 2: It's awesome to have you. Now it's your turn to 8 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 2: go ahead and publicly psychoanalyze Joe Burrow the Flora's yours. 9 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 3: I usually get paid about three fifty an hour for that, 10 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:38,640 Speaker 3: so hopefully if the check will be coming directly from jail, 11 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 3: and that this is a PR firm he is, I 12 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 3: have to say, I mean, this is the spin operation 13 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:45,519 Speaker 3: he is going on. 14 00:00:45,720 --> 00:00:46,959 Speaker 4: Is amazing in that. 15 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 3: He'd got the whole world feeling sorry for him coming 16 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:51,600 Speaker 3: up a game where he was the one. 17 00:00:51,440 --> 00:00:52,840 Speaker 4: Who basically lost the game. 18 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,800 Speaker 3: I mean, the understandable to me if this was a 19 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 3: scenario where it was, you know, the Jets of the 20 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 3: Bears game when Joe Flacco played in the defense snatched 21 00:01:01,760 --> 00:01:06,000 Speaker 3: the defeat from the jaws of victory. But here's a 22 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:07,800 Speaker 3: game where you know, I don't want to put all. 23 00:01:07,680 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 4: The blame on Burrow. 24 00:01:09,120 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 3: You know, clearly the defense struggled to stop Josh Allen, 25 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:14,120 Speaker 3: but a lot of defenses struggled to stop Josh Allen. 26 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 3: It was always going to be a shootout. And you know, 27 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:19,960 Speaker 3: Burrow blinked a couple. It was a little bit of 28 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,039 Speaker 3: bad luck and a great play by the Bill's defensive back, 29 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 3: Christian Benford. But still, and now he comes out and 30 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 3: he feels a little sorry for himself, and all of 31 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:29,319 Speaker 3: a sudden, everybody's like, how. 32 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:32,080 Speaker 4: Dare the Bengals even employ this guy? We're right back 33 00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 4: to before the draft. It's unbelievable to me. 34 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:39,560 Speaker 2: So the game on Sunday, though, encapsulated everything I dislike 35 00:01:39,600 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 2: about the Bengals right now. So Joe made a mistake, right, 36 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,320 Speaker 2: that's a pick six that you can't throw. You certainly 37 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 2: can't throw it in that situation in the fourth quarter. 38 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 2: But he's on a team that requires him to be perfect, 39 00:01:51,000 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 2: and on Sunday he was human, and if Joe is 40 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:54,520 Speaker 2: only human, they can't win. 41 00:01:56,560 --> 00:01:59,279 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, besides you, who of us really is human? 42 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 3: You know, I mean, it's a slippery slope. And of 43 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 3: course you're right, that's been a problem. 44 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 4: You know, Burrow is a. 45 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:13,360 Speaker 3: Great quarterback, but even great quarterbacks make mistakes, and you know, 46 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:15,400 Speaker 3: you see it around the league. A lot of guys 47 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 3: we assume are superhuman, suddenly they don't play one hundred 48 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:22,520 Speaker 3: percent perfect in the game and their team looks very 49 00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 3: mortal around them in Kansas City and Baltimore. 50 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 4: We see it all over the place, and yeah, it's tough. 51 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:31,520 Speaker 3: It's something that we were promised was a one off 52 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 3: from last year and would never happen again, and here 53 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:37,919 Speaker 3: it is happening again. That's the real issue, I think 54 00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 3: for all of us in that you know you're willing 55 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:43,720 Speaker 3: to bite down really hard and choke it down after 56 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 3: last year and think, okay, well it happens, but you 57 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 3: know we're going to change things up in twenty twenty five, 58 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 3: and then we all seldom not really do anything and 59 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 3: promise it was going to be different, and it. 60 00:02:55,320 --> 00:02:57,079 Speaker 4: Hasn't been any different. In a lot of ways, it's 61 00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 4: been worse. 62 00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:00,360 Speaker 3: And so that's what makes it really difficult, say as 63 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 3: a Bengals fan, to watch that and to know that 64 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 3: you know, you understand Burrows, you know the weight of 65 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:09,640 Speaker 3: I've always called him at list and yet it seems 66 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:11,240 Speaker 3: like the weight of the world on. 67 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:13,919 Speaker 4: His shoulders is actually he's feeling these days because it's 68 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:14,880 Speaker 4: just so. 69 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:18,520 Speaker 3: Much on him to be that all pro level quarterback 70 00:03:18,600 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 3: every single down, every single week, and it's just not happening, 71 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 3: and it won't happen for anybody. And you know he's 72 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 3: feeling it, no question about it. 73 00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 2: He needs help. He needs a better defense. Bengals need 74 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 2: better defensive players. But they they do have pieces. The 75 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:36,960 Speaker 2: obvious one is DJ Turner. Who else on that side 76 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 2: of the ball is worth keeping or building around. 77 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:44,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, when you stay building around, I think the players 78 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 3: they are going to build around aren't even on the roster, right, 79 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:49,760 Speaker 3: I mean, that's that's where you take it. I think 80 00:03:50,040 --> 00:03:54,480 Speaker 3: you mentioned Turner. He's obviously having an excellent season. You're 81 00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:56,920 Speaker 3: not giving up on players like Miles Murphy. He's showing 82 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 3: a flash. I hope that he and Schamar Stewart can 83 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:04,720 Speaker 3: develop together and form a decent at least edge Russian combination. Uh. 84 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 4: You know, other guys have. 85 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,560 Speaker 3: Shown moments, Dack, Phil Chris Jenkins. They're not guys you 86 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 3: just automatically flush. I mean, you know in the NFL, 87 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:17,119 Speaker 3: guys you sink or swim at different levels. Some guys 88 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:19,360 Speaker 3: burst out right away and then they you know, kind 89 00:04:19,360 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 3: of fall off. Some guys take a while to develop 90 00:04:21,800 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 3: and then they really show who they are and they're 91 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:25,840 Speaker 3: they're fourth even fifth seasons, or they need a new 92 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:29,120 Speaker 3: team sometimes, and you know, you know, that's that's the 93 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:30,760 Speaker 3: nature of the league, and you're seeing that a little 94 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:33,800 Speaker 3: bit in Cincinnati. We hope these guys will finally get 95 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 3: it together. I mean, Al Golden was brought in specifically 96 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:40,800 Speaker 3: to make guys who were young and underachieving under Lunarumo 97 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 3: take that step forward, and then, you know, except for Turner, 98 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:46,479 Speaker 3: you're not really seeing that. So I don't know that 99 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 3: anybody besides him is what you would call a building 100 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 3: block on that side of the ball. And they're going 101 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:53,720 Speaker 3: to bring in a ton of personnel, but you can't 102 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:56,839 Speaker 3: replace everybody else besides DJ. So you're going to have 103 00:04:56,839 --> 00:04:59,160 Speaker 3: to hope that some of these other guys continue to develop. 104 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 3: And you know, crussing your fingers hasn't worked that well 105 00:05:02,360 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 3: so far, but I don't know if we have any 106 00:05:03,880 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 3: other option. 107 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 2: Robert Wintraub read his weekly Bengals column at Cincinnati Magazine 108 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:13,919 Speaker 2: dot com. You're an analytics guy. Do analytics love DJ 109 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 2: Turner as much as as much as I do when 110 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:21,160 Speaker 2: I just apply the eye test, Well. 111 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 3: Analytics aren't human, mo, so no, I hope they can't 112 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:27,920 Speaker 3: love like you can as an emotional, breathing human being. 113 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 3: But yet the numbers do back up the eye test, 114 00:05:30,760 --> 00:05:34,920 Speaker 3: no question. You know, the Bengals are right at near 115 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:37,920 Speaker 3: the top and enemy number one guarding by DVOA. 116 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 4: They don't throw at DJ Turner hardly at all. 117 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:45,680 Speaker 3: He's received, by percentage, the second fewest passes thrown in 118 00:05:45,760 --> 00:05:49,479 Speaker 3: his direction at any corner out there. And when you 119 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 3: know the opposing quarterback has such a buffet of options 120 00:05:52,839 --> 00:05:54,239 Speaker 3: to throw elsewhere. 121 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:55,719 Speaker 4: Why would you throw a DJ Turner? 122 00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 3: Right? I mean, they're giving up ten passes in nearly 123 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 3: ninety five yards of game to tight end. 124 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 4: Just it's in human numbers. 125 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:07,480 Speaker 3: Turner is having the excellent season. We have a DVOA 126 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 3: for cornerbacks set which you can find at FtM. 127 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 4: Fantasy, and he's in the top five. So it's really 128 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 4: kind of remarkable that he's having this, you know. 129 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:20,719 Speaker 3: Excellent, close to all pro level season on an island essentially, 130 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:23,839 Speaker 3: and you know it's the old Deion Sanders thing, he's 131 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 3: doing his job and taking away the number one target 132 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 3: for enemy quarterbacks, and yet nobody else can step up 133 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:33,599 Speaker 3: and stop them. And it's just it's really they've let 134 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 3: him down almost as much as they've let down Joe Burrow. 135 00:06:37,279 --> 00:06:40,040 Speaker 3: I don't know if J's given any press conferences with 136 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 3: the way of the world on his shoulders, but maybe 137 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 3: he should because he's playing extremely well and nobody else 138 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:45,559 Speaker 3: is around him. 139 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 2: Give me thirty seconds on whether or not the Ravens 140 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 2: this week opponent, are done done. 141 00:06:52,640 --> 00:06:56,599 Speaker 3: No, I don't think they're done. They obviously are underachieving 142 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:57,919 Speaker 3: this year in a lot of the same way as 143 00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:00,520 Speaker 3: the Bengals are mostly tied to their quarter help. 144 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 4: As we know. 145 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 3: You know, they're sixteenth in DVOA, but the teams are 146 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 3: lumped around the Patriots and the Chargers and the Buccaneers, 147 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,560 Speaker 3: teams that we don't consider done. They're playing at basically 148 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:14,680 Speaker 3: that level. Lamark can break out at any time. I 149 00:07:14,680 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 3: don't think they'll turn the ball over five times again, 150 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 3: and you know, they don't look good, and there's not 151 00:07:20,080 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 3: a lot of reasons for optimism in Baltimore necessarily, but 152 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:26,120 Speaker 3: I wouldn't taint them as done, they can easily, you know, 153 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:27,760 Speaker 3: make a run and win the division, and that would 154 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:30,200 Speaker 3: be the first time any AFC North team has won 155 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 3: the division three times in a row since the inception 156 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 3: of the of the AFC North. So we definitely don't 157 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 3: want that better Pittsburgh. 158 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 4: Really even in that scenario than. 159 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,840 Speaker 3: The Dravens winning a three straight times doing something on precedent, 160 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:42,800 Speaker 3: and we can't live with that. 161 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:48,840 Speaker 2: I agree with that wholeheartedly, no psycho analysis needed. I 162 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 2: appreciate it as always. Man, I will talk to you 163 00:07:50,760 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 2: in a few weeks. Thank you so much. 164 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 3: Yes, have a great holiday season, everybody, Thanks so much. 165 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 2: That's our guy. Robert win traub Reid is Bengals column 166 00:07:58,880 --> 00:08:03,080 Speaker 2: right now, Cincinnati Magazine dot com. It's twenty nine away 167 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 2: from five o'clock. I'm mullweger uh. 168 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:07,240 Speaker 3: We have room. 169 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:07,960 Speaker 2: Well, we're not. 170 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:09,200 Speaker 4: We have a segment. 171 00:08:09,240 --> 00:08:12,080 Speaker 2: We have a guest free segment, so to speak. Before 172 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 2: Dan Klaskin's coming up at four forty five on ESPN 173 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:17,640 Speaker 2: fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station. 174 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 1: You've been listening to Football in the NATI on ESPN 175 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 1: fifteen thirty, the official home of the Cincinnati Bengals. Cincinnati's 176 00:08:30,840 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 1: ESPN fifteen thirty traffic. 177 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:37,480 Speaker 5: From the UC Health Traffic Center. 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