1 00:00:00,520 --> 00:00:02,160 Speaker 1: It's Night Side with Dan Ray. 2 00:00:02,800 --> 00:00:05,520 Speaker 2: I'm w BZY, Boston's new radio. 3 00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:09,200 Speaker 3: All right, welcome back everybody as we move into our 4 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,360 Speaker 3: third hour here on this very rainy Thursday night. And 5 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:15,120 Speaker 3: if you're out there driving around, thank you for joining us, 6 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:18,239 Speaker 3: thank you for listening, but please drive very carefully. 7 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 4: All right. 8 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:24,960 Speaker 3: This hour is a hour that we scheduled. We had 9 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 3: a brief conversation with our guest a couple of weeks ago. 10 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,200 Speaker 3: Let me introduce him to you. His name is Andrew Hale. 11 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:37,519 Speaker 3: He is a lawyer here in Massachusetts. He's a professor 12 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:42,080 Speaker 3: at Northeastern University School of Law, lives in the Boston 13 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:45,879 Speaker 3: area with his family, and has a couple of young girls. 14 00:00:46,040 --> 00:00:50,640 Speaker 3: And Andrew Hale, Welcome, Welcome back to Nightside. 15 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 4: How are you this evening. 16 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 1: I'm doing great, Dan, Thank you so much for having 17 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:55,360 Speaker 1: me back on. 18 00:00:55,840 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 3: For a while you worked in the Attorney General's office, 19 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 3: I think dealing with issues that you're interested in here, 20 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:08,040 Speaker 3: dealing with children's services, etc. And just to sort of 21 00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:12,400 Speaker 3: set the stage very quickly, you believe that the laws 22 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:16,440 Speaker 3: in Massachusetts that you would have been in charge of 23 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 3: involved in enforcing are actually pretty vague and arguably you know, arbitrary, vague, 24 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 3: and capricious. As we learned that phrase in law school 25 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 3: many years ago, that they basically handcuffed parents as to 26 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:40,119 Speaker 3: how they can raise their children, as to how much 27 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:44,679 Speaker 3: freedom the children should have. So let's start with that conversation. 28 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:47,800 Speaker 3: Tell us about your background. Let me just lay the 29 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 3: foundation of your background so people know that at one 30 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:54,120 Speaker 3: point you were in charge of having to enforce these laws. 31 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: Sure, Dan, thanks, So, like you said, I am a lawyer. 32 00:01:58,840 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 1: I'm not a law professor Northeastern. Prior to going into teaching, 33 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:06,960 Speaker 1: I worked for the mass Attorney General's Office under now 34 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 1: Governor more Healy. Part of my job there was defending 35 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 1: the Department of Children and Families or DCF, so I 36 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: was familiar and got familiar with the child welfare laws 37 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 1: that we have in Massachusetts. And then, of course I'm 38 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:23,079 Speaker 1: a dad. I have two girls there are nine and seven, 39 00:02:23,720 --> 00:02:26,119 Speaker 1: and I'm sort of in this phase of life now 40 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:28,080 Speaker 1: along with all of my peers, where we're sort of 41 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:32,240 Speaker 1: deciding about how much independence to give our kids as 42 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 1: they grow up. We live in Dorchester, we're sort of 43 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 1: navigating the city. And what I've realized is that the 44 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,600 Speaker 1: parental norms have really shifted since when I was a kid. 45 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:46,200 Speaker 1: I'm forty, and all of a sudden, it's become very 46 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,239 Speaker 1: difficult to do some basic things like letting my kid, 47 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,800 Speaker 1: for example, walk down the block, letting them run small errands, 48 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:57,920 Speaker 1: maybe playing outside by themselves. And that our laws governing 49 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:00,920 Speaker 1: child welfare actually make it more difficult for parents to 50 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 1: give children the independence that experts are increasingly saying that 51 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 1: they need. 52 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 3: Well, those laws were intended, I assume when they passed 53 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 3: the legislature to be protective of children number one, and 54 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 3: also to put the responsibility of keeping children safe on 55 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:27,160 Speaker 3: parents and making them understand that by having children, they 56 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:30,960 Speaker 3: have a responsibility to care and tend to their safety. 57 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,280 Speaker 3: But what you're saying is that now these laws, which 58 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:38,600 Speaker 3: probably you know as opposed to teaching to the top 59 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 3: of the class or teaching the center of the class, 60 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 3: you know, they're passing laws that really should apply to 61 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 3: absentee parents or parents who are not doing the proper 62 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 3: role of a parent. But those laws that are being 63 00:03:55,320 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 3: applied against people like you and others who might be 64 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:04,640 Speaker 3: trying to give their children based upon their own intelligence 65 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 3: and their own instincts for public safety. You want to 66 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 3: give them a little more freedom a little sooner, but 67 00:04:12,920 --> 00:04:16,480 Speaker 3: DCF might come down on you, ironically, even though at 68 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:19,320 Speaker 3: one point you were in the Attorney General's office. I 69 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:21,960 Speaker 3: think that's what you're saying. It's a little convoluted the 70 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 3: way I've described it. I'm sure you can simplify it. 71 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 4: Thanks Dan. 72 00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 1: I should say on the adset, I've never personally been 73 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:32,400 Speaker 1: the subject of any DCF enforcement. 74 00:04:32,400 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 4: Iand if I applied that, I apologize. 75 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 1: That's no problem. And I think to your point about 76 00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: the intent of law is all of this is well intentioned. 77 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:47,640 Speaker 1: There are really no villains here. Of course, the law 78 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:49,719 Speaker 1: is designed to protect children, which is something that we 79 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:53,680 Speaker 1: can all support. What I can say is just speaking anecdotally, 80 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 1: is this has happened to me now multiple times again. 81 00:04:56,760 --> 00:04:59,720 Speaker 1: We live in Dorchester. My girls are nine and seven there, 82 00:05:00,120 --> 00:05:02,160 Speaker 1: pretty mature for their age, and we're starting to get 83 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:03,839 Speaker 1: to the point where we want them to be able 84 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:06,400 Speaker 1: to say, go down the block to a friend's house, 85 00:05:06,520 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 1: or go down to the corner store and pick up 86 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 1: a gallon of milk, at least my eldest child. And 87 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:14,039 Speaker 1: I've been scolded multiple times by my neighbors who say Andrew, 88 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:16,480 Speaker 1: don't let them go out. They might get abducted. You 89 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:18,640 Speaker 1: don't know what happened. These are pretty girls, et cetera, 90 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,840 Speaker 1: et cetera. And what I realized is that in one 91 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:25,200 Speaker 1: exchange that I had with a neighbor, they said, look out, 92 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:28,840 Speaker 1: you see girls sort of walking around the neighborhood by themselves. 93 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:30,760 Speaker 5: Somebody might call DCF. 94 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 1: And well, again, again, I'm a lawyer, I'm well versed 95 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:38,679 Speaker 1: in these laws. I'm sure I could have an adequate 96 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:40,919 Speaker 1: sort of defense to that. I think there is a 97 00:05:41,040 --> 00:05:44,080 Speaker 1: chilling effect that takes place when parents are concerned about 98 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: the possibility of DCF enforcement. And what that does is 99 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:50,920 Speaker 1: then parents are sort of more likely to just keep their. 100 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 5: Kids at home. 101 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,520 Speaker 1: And what happens when they're at home, kids are then 102 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:56,919 Speaker 1: on screens sort of for many hours a day, and 103 00:05:56,960 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 1: I think that is where we really run into some 104 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:00,000 Speaker 1: problems with our kids. 105 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 3: So what you're saying is these well intentioned laws, which 106 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:12,600 Speaker 3: again are probably not directed against people of your background, 107 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:19,400 Speaker 3: and in most parents, they're intended to be used, I 108 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 3: guess against parents who would be deleterious in their care 109 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:26,240 Speaker 3: for their children, would allow the children to be out 110 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 3: playing in the street at ten o'clock at night as 111 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 3: supposed to be, you know. I mean, we can all 112 00:06:31,520 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 3: come up with hypothetical situations where where DCF certainly has 113 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 3: an interest in getting involved. Although I must tell you, 114 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:42,120 Speaker 3: over the years, I've had plenty of people call me 115 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:45,800 Speaker 3: as a talk show host and and say to me 116 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:49,280 Speaker 3: that that DCF showed up at their door and. 117 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:50,360 Speaker 4: They were very aggressive. 118 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:54,120 Speaker 3: And so there were people out there who who are 119 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:57,919 Speaker 3: not happy with DCF and feel that they were I 120 00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 3: don't know, maybe identified by paper who called and ratted 121 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 3: them out, you know. So I mean, it's like anything else. 122 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:12,040 Speaker 3: When I get caught for driving too fast, my initial 123 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 3: reaction is going to be to the police officer. Look, 124 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 3: I know I was going sixty two in the fifty five, 125 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:19,200 Speaker 3: but that guy just blew by me going seventy five. 126 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 3: And I know what the CoP's gonna say. I don't care. 127 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:24,080 Speaker 3: I didn't see him doing seventy five. I saw you 128 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 3: doing sixty two. So lows of difficult things. When they replied, 129 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 3: I've spoken to you once before, and I can remember 130 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 3: as a kid, my dad would give me a quarter 131 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 3: go up to the growth to the variety store at 132 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 3: the street and get him a pack of camels unfiltered. 133 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:44,880 Speaker 3: It was no big til it was like, you know, 134 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:46,080 Speaker 3: a quarter of a mile. 135 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 4: From the house. 136 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 3: I was up, you know, on a maje street walk 137 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 3: walking there or whatever. I'd grab a pack of baseball 138 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:54,360 Speaker 3: cards on the way home, and I'd be looking at 139 00:07:54,400 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 3: it halfway look at the baseball cards. So, but I 140 00:07:57,920 --> 00:07:59,960 Speaker 3: also spent a lot of time out playing and would 141 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:01,880 Speaker 3: What you're saying is that their norm now is for 142 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 3: parents to become overly protective. Maybe they're seeing stuff in 143 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 3: the media about kids being kidnapped and they assumed that 144 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 3: that their child might be next. Maybe they want their 145 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:16,040 Speaker 3: kids in the house and doing this screen time. But 146 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:20,160 Speaker 3: you're saying that's not allowing the kid to mature and 147 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 3: grow up and assume some responsibility, which is a This 148 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 3: is a difficult subject. It's a difficult balance to strike. 149 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 4: Right. 150 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:33,840 Speaker 1: Absolutely, and I think you're right, and I want to 151 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:37,559 Speaker 1: say that, you know, every parent should do whatever they 152 00:08:37,600 --> 00:08:40,280 Speaker 1: feel most comfortable with around their kids. What I will 153 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 1: say is, you know, crime rates now are dramatically lower 154 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 1: than they were even in the eighties and nineties when 155 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 1: I was growing up as a kid Boston. Just for example, 156 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:52,960 Speaker 1: last year at twenty twenty four had only twenty four homicideses, 157 00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: the lowest since nineteen fifty seven. That's compared to one 158 00:08:56,840 --> 00:09:01,120 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty in nineteen ninety. For example, the homicide 159 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:04,719 Speaker 1: rate is dramatically lower, crime rate is dramatically lower than 160 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:07,560 Speaker 1: it was. And yet parents I think are much more 161 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: protective of their kids even despite that sort of landscape. 162 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:13,440 Speaker 1: So at the same time, the sort of risk of 163 00:09:13,480 --> 00:09:17,840 Speaker 1: abduction by a stranger is actually extremely rare. We're talking 164 00:09:17,920 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 1: the odds of one out of seven hundred and twenty thousand, 165 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:24,920 Speaker 1: so it's just really really rare that a stranger is 166 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 1: going to abduct your child. And then at the same 167 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 1: time what's not rare, though, is we're seeing increasingly kids 168 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:34,839 Speaker 1: getting addicted to screens, sort of being you know, seven, eight, nine, 169 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 1: ten hours a day on a screen, unable to really 170 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,880 Speaker 1: engage with other people, unable to kind of form those 171 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:43,719 Speaker 1: friendships that they need to to develop that resiliency and 172 00:09:43,800 --> 00:09:47,200 Speaker 1: independence that is going to make them responsible adults. And 173 00:09:47,240 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 1: so I think the solution to that is get the 174 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 1: kids outside, get them outdoors, get them playing with each other, 175 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:55,360 Speaker 1: get them resolving disputes amongst themselves. But that is I 176 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:58,559 Speaker 1: think a little bit hindered by our child eglect laws 177 00:09:58,760 --> 00:09:59,679 Speaker 1: so large. 178 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:03,079 Speaker 3: And we can talk all about the organization of sports. 179 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 3: I mean I remember I played, you know, hundreds of 180 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 3: pickup baseball games and then we did have Little League. 181 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:14,959 Speaker 3: But I think there are sub communities where the kids 182 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:18,760 Speaker 3: will only play instructured games with parents there as coaches, 183 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,440 Speaker 3: and they never go out on their own and grab 184 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:24,200 Speaker 3: a bat and as we used to say, bucket up 185 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 3: and then you pick your friends and you form a team. 186 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 3: And a little different in terms of the crime, we 187 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:32,800 Speaker 3: hear about a lot of crime, and there's a lot 188 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 3: of crime as you know, within the criminal justice system, 189 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:41,480 Speaker 3: uh that that gets downgraded and there are continuouses without 190 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:45,559 Speaker 3: a finding and cases are broomed out. Homicide rates in 191 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,120 Speaker 3: Boston have jumped back up more than they were a 192 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 3: year ago. That that trend of going down has gone 193 00:10:51,040 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 3: the other way. And with high profile cases. You read 194 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 3: about some woman who's who's jogging in the middle of 195 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:02,240 Speaker 3: Iowa who is abducted in that eventually killed. Those become 196 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 3: high profile cases and people hear about them. So there 197 00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 3: are social and media you know, trends that maybe didn't 198 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:16,520 Speaker 3: exist you know when you were growing up, it was 199 00:11:17,240 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 3: a nightly newscast of thirty minutes and not the twenty 200 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,520 Speaker 3: four hours, seven days a week, drumbeat of local news 201 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 3: and profile, high profile cases. Let's do this, and let's 202 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 3: take a quick break. I want to invite callers to 203 00:11:32,000 --> 00:11:34,160 Speaker 3: join the conversation. I think what you say makes a 204 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 3: lot of sense. I also think that again, it very 205 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:42,040 Speaker 3: much depends upon you know where you live, what the 206 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:48,720 Speaker 3: circumstances are. Bad things can happen to kids in any community, 207 00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:50,480 Speaker 3: in any community, some. 208 00:11:50,520 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 4: Of the more rural communities. 209 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,520 Speaker 3: I remember reading the other day about a little girl 210 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:58,319 Speaker 3: who Holly Parine, and this is thirty five years ago. 211 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 3: I covered the stories of television television reporter. They still 212 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 3: haven't solved that crime. She literally walked down the street 213 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:08,000 Speaker 3: to visit a yard with puppies. So you have cases 214 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:11,320 Speaker 3: like that which I think sends a chill through through 215 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 3: an entire community, for that matter, entire state. We'll take 216 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 3: a break if you want to join this conversation. How 217 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:20,280 Speaker 3: do you strike the balance between what good parents want 218 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 3: to do for their children in introducing them to uh freedom, 219 00:12:26,640 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 3: introducing them to freedom with freedom comes responsibility. 220 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 4: How do you balance that off in a world. 221 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 3: Where there are high profile cases and there are and 222 00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:41,079 Speaker 3: there are concerns, and is it anyone else's business besides 223 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:46,240 Speaker 3: the DCF. Does the woman who I'm sure she spoke 224 00:12:46,360 --> 00:12:49,959 Speaker 3: with Andrew out of concern for Andrew's children, But. 225 00:12:51,559 --> 00:12:54,440 Speaker 4: Is that appropriate? Well, I'm sure she did, but is 226 00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 4: that appropriate? 227 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:00,680 Speaker 3: There's there's a there's a variety of topics here which 228 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,160 Speaker 3: we can take this conversation, and I hope people will 229 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 3: be expansive, uh and focus more broadly six one, seven, two, five, four, 230 00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:11,400 Speaker 3: ten thirty six one seven, nine, three, one ten thirty. 231 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 3: I have often been approached by my audience members to 232 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:18,760 Speaker 3: do something on DCF and upon how children are dealt with. 233 00:13:18,880 --> 00:13:21,240 Speaker 3: And there was a period of time, as I mentioned before, 234 00:13:21,280 --> 00:13:23,560 Speaker 3: and I know this is not what you're advocating, so 235 00:13:23,679 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 3: called free range parents, where kids were given an extraordinary 236 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:29,319 Speaker 3: amount of freedom. 237 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:29,839 Speaker 5: Uh. 238 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:34,079 Speaker 3: And the parents were fully supportive of that, and they 239 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:37,359 Speaker 3: believed in that it was their philosophy, their lifestyle. 240 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:38,360 Speaker 4: UH. 241 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:41,680 Speaker 3: And that became a little bit of H. Well, I 242 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:44,080 Speaker 3: think a pejorative term free range parenting. 243 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 4: We'll take a break. 244 00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 3: We have a couple of lines at six one, seven, 245 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 3: nine three one ten thirty. Let's get the conversation going 246 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 3: here on nights Side, My guess h Northeastern University Law 247 00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:58,439 Speaker 3: school professor Andrew Hale, who has also worked in the 248 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 3: Attorney General's Office. He's been on the other side of this, 249 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 3: representing Council of the Department of Children and Families. We'll 250 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:07,080 Speaker 3: be back on Nightside right after this. 251 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:12,760 Speaker 6: You're on Night Side with Dan Ray on the Boston's 252 00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:13,400 Speaker 6: News radio. 253 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 4: Andrew, let's get some phone calls. If you're all set, 254 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:19,400 Speaker 4: I'm all set. 255 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 5: Let's do it. 256 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:23,160 Speaker 4: All right, let's go. Let's start off with Jason in Boston. 257 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:27,600 Speaker 3: Jason, you first this hour with Northeastern University law professor 258 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 3: Andrew Hale. He has a two young daughters, seven and nine, 259 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 3: and he wants them to understand freedom and responsibility, and 260 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:40,360 Speaker 3: he feels that a lot of other parents probably need 261 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:44,320 Speaker 3: to give their children maybe a little bit more freedom 262 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 3: than they're giving them right now. 263 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 4: Go ahead, Jason, Yeah, Hi, how are you doing. 264 00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 6: First, I'm actually listening to your show first time. 265 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:55,320 Speaker 4: First time you're listening to my show. 266 00:14:56,400 --> 00:15:00,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I don't typically stay up super late. This 267 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 2: is at you know, one of the first times I 268 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 2: heard the article of the excuse me the subject, and I. 269 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 6: Was like, I have an opinion, So you know, well. 270 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:10,320 Speaker 3: You're I'm assuming since it's the first time, you're also 271 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,560 Speaker 3: making a first call to the show, and if that's true, 272 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,280 Speaker 3: we want to give you a round of a plus 273 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:18,720 Speaker 3: to the studio audience. You're all with Professor Andrew Hale, 274 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 3: Go right ahead, Jason. 275 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, so I will say so I actually do sort 276 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 2: of bleed in part of what Professor Andrew Hale is saying. 277 00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 6: I have three kids, and they arrange. 278 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 2: The age of like twelve to seven, and by the 279 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 2: time they're twelve and they're in Boston public schools. Boston 280 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:39,640 Speaker 2: and public schools are straight up just like, hey, your 281 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 2: kid can no longer take the yellow buts. They have 282 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 2: to find their own way to get up there. And 283 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:46,960 Speaker 2: I'm highly happy my older daughter's in Boston Latin school. 284 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 2: She's doing great, but realistically speaking, where we live, there's 285 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:52,280 Speaker 2: just no way we were going to get her to 286 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 2: her school long time, so she has to take public transportation. 287 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 6: And we've had points. 288 00:15:57,520 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 2: Where we've been nervous and scared, but over all we've 289 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 2: been able to give her a little bit of communication 290 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 2: ability with her cell phone, which is not a smartphone, 291 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:08,040 Speaker 2: just a regular flip phone. All it does is text 292 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:11,400 Speaker 2: to make phone calls. And she has been very responsible. 293 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:13,360 Speaker 2: She's been waking up on time and doing all the 294 00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:15,840 Speaker 2: things she used to do. She's been able to periodically 295 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,760 Speaker 2: help us by picking up her younger brother and sister. 296 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 2: And it's been a really big Godsden be able to 297 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:24,680 Speaker 2: trust her with this freedom. And we didn't just like 298 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:27,880 Speaker 2: go hey, school starting boom, hear the phone by. We 299 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 2: started practicing with her over the summer and getting her 300 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:33,680 Speaker 2: ready for the idea that she was going to need 301 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 2: that independence and that drive to be able to do 302 00:16:35,680 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 2: it herself. 303 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, let's let's get Andrew's response to that. What is 304 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:42,680 Speaker 4: she is? She a seventh grader with the Boston Line School. 305 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:44,760 Speaker 6: She's a seventh grader. 306 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 4: Yes, we called that it. We used to call that 307 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 4: a sixty. I graduated from that school. 308 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:50,480 Speaker 5: Yeah, last six Yeah. 309 00:16:50,720 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 6: I don't understand what that means. 310 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 4: But a countdown. 311 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:56,440 Speaker 3: If you're a sixty, that's six years until you graduate 312 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 3: in the seventh grade year sixty, So you got to 313 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:01,360 Speaker 3: get a six year is and she'll be graduating as 314 00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 3: a senior. It'll go by before you know it. Andrew, 315 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 3: what what Jason had to say? 316 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 1: Sure, First of all, I just I think Jason maybe 317 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:12,159 Speaker 1: he should get you know, a hat or a sweatshirt, 318 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:15,080 Speaker 1: maybe some swag Dan Ray swag for being a first 319 00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 1: time caller. 320 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:21,680 Speaker 3: I think that's awesome, swagged first time call Andrew would 321 00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:24,320 Speaker 3: be in the poorhouse. But anyway, we'll see what we 322 00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 3: can do here. 323 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 1: Go ahead, go ahead, all right, no worries. I'll talk 324 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 1: to the producer afterwards. 325 00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:30,800 Speaker 5: But no, I got thank you. 326 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:33,080 Speaker 3: I'm going to give something Jason for his daughter for 327 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:36,160 Speaker 3: his daughter, and uh when we finish up. But you've 328 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:39,080 Speaker 3: convinced me go ahead, and you're a good litigator. 329 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:43,360 Speaker 1: Oh that's great. I can close this deal for sure. No, 330 00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:46,679 Speaker 1: I thanks, thanks Jason for those great thoughts. You know, 331 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: I think we're in a similar situation. It sounds like 332 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: Jason's kids a little older than ours, But I mean, 333 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:53,879 Speaker 1: my girls are in Boston public schools too, And I 334 00:17:53,920 --> 00:17:57,399 Speaker 1: think what Jason's highlighting is what we're not saying. And 335 00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,359 Speaker 1: maybe and then maybe this was what you were referring 336 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:03,399 Speaker 1: to around the free range parenting. But what we're not 337 00:18:03,440 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 1: saying is just open the door, let the kid run 338 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 1: around you know, I think we're saying this. Actually, this 339 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 1: approach to parenting actually does take a sort of much 340 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:16,919 Speaker 1: more engaged, sustain thoughtful conversation with your kid. It's asking 341 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:20,160 Speaker 1: them what are you comfortable with? And then you know, okay, 342 00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 1: so let's let's talk to the scenarios. Let's say you're 343 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:24,800 Speaker 1: walking to school and let's say you get approached by 344 00:18:24,800 --> 00:18:26,360 Speaker 1: a stranger. Well, how are you going to handle that? 345 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 1: What are you going to be your strategies? And so 346 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: I think for me, it's it's really helping us as 347 00:18:31,119 --> 00:18:34,000 Speaker 1: parents to equip our kids and making sure that they're comfortable, 348 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 1: they have a contingency plan, it's not just turning them loose. 349 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 1: So I think Jason's right on with that. 350 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you, Yeah, because I mean, on the other 351 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:47,800 Speaker 2: end of that spectrum, So, one day a week, my 352 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:51,359 Speaker 2: nine year old walks home from her school bus from 353 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 2: the school bus stop to our house and on average 354 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:57,919 Speaker 2: it's been fine, but one day she did have an 355 00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:01,639 Speaker 2: issue that was really scary in alarm to us. And 356 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:05,000 Speaker 2: I mean the answer was either a like sort of 357 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:06,399 Speaker 2: in a way like almost lock her up on a 358 00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:08,919 Speaker 2: tower and be like you can't come out anymore, or 359 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 2: we had to find other options to make sure that 360 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 2: she felt secure and confident enough, and also. 361 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 6: Knew that like this is going to be a thing, 362 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:17,159 Speaker 6: and you have. 363 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:20,680 Speaker 2: Different tools and your toolbox that you're able to help 364 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:24,480 Speaker 2: resolve issues like that with. So you know, for me, 365 00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,480 Speaker 2: it's more important because eventually all these kids are gonna 366 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:29,199 Speaker 2: get out of the house, hopefully, and when they do, 367 00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:31,760 Speaker 2: they're going to be independent and on their own, and 368 00:19:31,800 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 2: they need to know how to do these things. I 369 00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:35,880 Speaker 2: don't want them to be eighteen and not know how 370 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 2: to interact with people or how to keep themselves safe. 371 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 4: Absolutely. 372 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:45,239 Speaker 3: What the circumstance with your daughter, it wasn't hopefully it 373 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:50,320 Speaker 3: wasn't a potentially criminal III. 374 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:53,840 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I'll tell you basically, she got off 375 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:56,600 Speaker 2: the bus stop at the age of ten, and she's ten, 376 00:19:57,040 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 2: and a man came up to her and gave her 377 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:01,680 Speaker 2: a bunch of compliment and then proceeded to follow her. 378 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 2: And she was really scared and rattled and ran home, 379 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:09,320 Speaker 2: you know, and we talked her about it, and then 380 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:13,080 Speaker 2: proceedingly the next rex time when she had to do it, 381 00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:15,200 Speaker 2: I picked her up from the bus stop and proceeded 382 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:18,080 Speaker 2: to show her all the different places that she can 383 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 2: go to, whether it's a school, whether it was a store, 384 00:20:22,119 --> 00:20:24,520 Speaker 2: whether it was friends of people who lived in the 385 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:28,080 Speaker 2: area who were like, we are here for you, because 386 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:30,639 Speaker 2: I wanted to, Like, again, it's not going to go 387 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:33,439 Speaker 2: anywhere when she's eighteen. You I think you had something earlier. 388 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:35,639 Speaker 2: You said someone walked in a parking lot and disappeared. Like, 389 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 2: that's not going anywhere, whether she's ten or whether she's eighteen. 390 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:40,880 Speaker 2: So I need to get her. 391 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 4: I talked. 392 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,119 Speaker 3: I was about seven years old, and she was in 393 00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:48,280 Speaker 3: western Massachusetts. It's a very well known case about thirty 394 00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:51,480 Speaker 3: five years ago. Her name was Holly Parena, and she 395 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 3: walked down the street with her parents' permission to go 396 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:59,120 Speaker 3: visit a house a few houses away where a dog 397 00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:02,560 Speaker 3: had just had some puppies. And it was one of 398 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 3: those moments in time where someone I'm sure this wasn't planned. 399 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:09,879 Speaker 3: I'm sure it was just a crime of opportunity. Someone 400 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 3: must have seen her and scooped her up and she 401 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,360 Speaker 3: was never found. To this day, we hear those stories, 402 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,439 Speaker 3: and unfortunately those stories do actually occur. 403 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:22,240 Speaker 4: Not every story a happy ending. 404 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:26,640 Speaker 2: Yes, and those are definitely scary. But also unless I'm 405 00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 2: going to tell her to never leave the house again. 406 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:30,160 Speaker 6: This is life, and. 407 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:34,719 Speaker 3: You're right on the shape you were agreeing with. 408 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 4: Professor Hale. Hey, I'll tell you what. 409 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:39,160 Speaker 3: Leave your name and number, and I'm going to send 410 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 3: you a night side coffee munk. You can either give 411 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:44,520 Speaker 3: it to your daughter and she can drive the teachers 412 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:45,920 Speaker 3: crazy at Boston Land School. 413 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:50,320 Speaker 4: She drinks coffee. Maybe she shouldn't coffee, or you can 414 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:50,679 Speaker 4: get it. 415 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:55,119 Speaker 3: So leave your information with Shane, maybe an address in 416 00:21:55,119 --> 00:21:57,359 Speaker 3: a daytime phone number. We'll get you a nightside coffee 417 00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 3: mug and you can think Professor Hale for that. He 418 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:03,320 Speaker 3: obviously has put me in a situation where I have 419 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:04,120 Speaker 3: to do something. 420 00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:09,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll bat you in the corner there, Dan, didn't 421 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 1: I you did a great job. 422 00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 4: You did a great job. 423 00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,359 Speaker 1: Okay, and enjoy the coffee. 424 00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:18,000 Speaker 3: Jason, your decision whether it goes to your daughter or 425 00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,679 Speaker 3: you keeping it for yourself, that's your decision. I'm going 426 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:23,160 Speaker 3: to make it difficult for you. We'll take a break here. 427 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:27,239 Speaker 3: We have a newscast coming up. Professor Andrew Hale of 428 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:31,399 Speaker 3: Northeastern University Law School is with us. He has a 429 00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:35,200 Speaker 3: background in this legal background in this area, having worked 430 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:39,199 Speaker 3: in the Massachusetts Attorney General's Office as a legal counsel 431 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:44,639 Speaker 3: for you know, Children's Family and Children's Services. We will 432 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 3: continue our conversation if you would love to jump in 433 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,280 Speaker 3: and explain to us how you're handling it as your child, 434 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 3: your children or child reaches certain points in their life 435 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,520 Speaker 3: and how you give them freedom at the same time 436 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:02,880 Speaker 3: and still upon with Dan a sense and understanding that hey, 437 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:06,879 Speaker 3: not everybody out there on the street is a good person. 438 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,920 Speaker 3: That's a sad message, but I think it's a message 439 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:11,960 Speaker 3: that has to be conveyed. At least I convaded to 440 00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 3: my kids. I have a son and a daughter. They're 441 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 3: now in their thirties, so they're on their own at 442 00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 3: this point. But I'll tell you I was. I've had 443 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:21,760 Speaker 3: the same worries all of you as parents have had. 444 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:23,919 Speaker 3: So whether your a parent or grandparents, give us a 445 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 3: call six one, seven, two, five, four to ten thirty 446 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:28,679 Speaker 3: or six months, seven nine, three, one ten thirty. Going 447 00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,639 Speaker 3: to be talking with Christopher in the Great State of Ohio. 448 00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:33,399 Speaker 3: Coming up next back on Nightside. 449 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 5: You're on Night Side with Dan Ray. 450 00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 6: I'm w b Z Boston's News Radio. 451 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:43,680 Speaker 4: All right, welcome back. Every when we are talking about. 452 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 3: Raising children reasonably and rationally and getting them out to 453 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:53,240 Speaker 3: play and spend time with other kids, irrespective of well 454 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:57,440 Speaker 3: you bringing children up in the city maybe more difficult 455 00:23:57,480 --> 00:23:59,760 Speaker 3: than the city I don't know, or Dorchester, where my guests, 456 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 3: Professor Andrew Hale of Northeastern University resides with his wife 457 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:11,679 Speaker 3: and their two daughters. Andrew Professor Hale, for many years 458 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:16,400 Speaker 3: represented the Massachusetts Apartment of Children and Families, which oftentimes 459 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:21,080 Speaker 3: they're called also the DCF, but oftentimes has been criticized 460 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:24,159 Speaker 3: for being too aggressive. The question is hot, where do 461 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:27,400 Speaker 3: you hit that balance? Let me go next to Christopher 462 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:30,040 Speaker 3: in Ohio. Hey, Christopher, welcome to Nightside. 463 00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,000 Speaker 1: How are you well? 464 00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 7: Yeah, I'm good, just Christopher. 465 00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,639 Speaker 4: Yeah, Christopher? How old are you? You sound like you 466 00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 4: might be young. 467 00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:42,040 Speaker 7: Yeah, I'm thirteen and I live in Ohio. 468 00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:46,320 Speaker 4: Really do you listen to Night's Side or just happened 469 00:24:46,359 --> 00:24:47,200 Speaker 4: to find us tonight? 470 00:24:49,119 --> 00:24:49,359 Speaker 8: Yeah? 471 00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,159 Speaker 7: This is my first time, first time calling. 472 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:55,359 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, we'll give you a round of applause you 473 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:57,120 Speaker 3: for my Disney's studio audience. 474 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 1: I here now, Dan oh I know. 475 00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:07,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, Chris, Christopher, you're thirteen years old? How much do 476 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:10,919 Speaker 3: your how much freedom do your parents give you to 477 00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:12,679 Speaker 3: move around your neighborhood. 478 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 8: Well's I ask calling about? 479 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:19,399 Speaker 7: I was going to ask how should I go about 480 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,560 Speaker 7: asking my parents for more freedom? 481 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,280 Speaker 3: Wow, that's a pretty good question. Well, we got the 482 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:29,480 Speaker 3: expert here for you, Professor Hale. This is a potential 483 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:31,560 Speaker 3: law school student at some point. 484 00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:34,240 Speaker 4: Here, Professor Hale. 485 00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 1: Can we enroll thirteen year old in Northeast. 486 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:42,000 Speaker 4: Little advanced courses early early admission? 487 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 3: I think would be perfect here, Go ahead, Professor Hale. 488 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,880 Speaker 3: Christopher is looking for a way to get a little 489 00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:52,399 Speaker 3: more freedom. 490 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:52,840 Speaker 4: Go ahead. 491 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:59,320 Speaker 1: Well, Christopher, first of all, I applaud you for thinking 492 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: about these issu use, especially for being up at ten 493 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,440 Speaker 1: forty one pm and calling into. 494 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:05,199 Speaker 6: This radio station. 495 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: I think, Christopher, you should sit your parents down, and 496 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:13,600 Speaker 1: you should. You should go over a plan and discuss 497 00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 1: and maybe do some negotiation with them and say, hey, 498 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,080 Speaker 1: look up thirteen, here are some things that I'd like 499 00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:21,120 Speaker 1: to be able to do. Are there certain reasons why 500 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:23,280 Speaker 1: I can or can't do that? And you know, I think, 501 00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:25,720 Speaker 1: see what they say. I think the communication between the 502 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 1: parent and the child, in particular, when the parents lay 503 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:31,360 Speaker 1: down a rule, it's really you want to make sure 504 00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: that that rule is well reasoned and and and have 505 00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:36,479 Speaker 1: them talked that through with you. So I applaud you 506 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:38,440 Speaker 1: for calling him Christopher. 507 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 4: How many siblings do you have? 508 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:41,639 Speaker 3: If I can ask you, are you the oldest in 509 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 3: your family or do you have older brothers or sisters? 510 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:45,520 Speaker 1: No? 511 00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:47,639 Speaker 8: I have three other siblings. 512 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 7: I have a younger brother and two older well, one 513 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 7: other older brother and one older sister. 514 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 3: Okay, well here's the strategy that you might use. Do 515 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:06,359 Speaker 3: you feel that they have a little more freedom than you? 516 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:10,200 Speaker 3: I mean, they probably should because they're older, but uh 517 00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:13,400 Speaker 3: are you? Can you talk to them and say, hey, 518 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,680 Speaker 3: what are you allowed to do? And maybe convince your 519 00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 3: parents that that you know, what are you specifically looking for? 520 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:23,879 Speaker 3: Do you want to spend more time, you know, playing 521 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 3: sports somewhere? What? 522 00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 4: What's what would this? What would this entail to you? 523 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 4: What do you need? 524 00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:30,920 Speaker 3: Do you want to be able to ride your bike 525 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,359 Speaker 3: to the mall or something? I know we're about to Ohio. 526 00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:35,320 Speaker 3: Do you live If I could ask what, what community? 527 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,840 Speaker 7: I live in Twinsburg, like northeast Ohio. 528 00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:45,159 Speaker 3: Northeast, so you're kind of over by Cleveland in that 529 00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:48,280 Speaker 3: neck of the woods, kind of in Cleveland and Pittsburgh. Okay, 530 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:53,840 Speaker 3: so yeah, yeah, what is the freedom that you're looking for? 531 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,440 Speaker 3: Are your buddies and your your pals able to have 532 00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:58,359 Speaker 3: more freedom than you? 533 00:27:58,480 --> 00:27:58,680 Speaker 4: What? 534 00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:01,880 Speaker 3: What's how do you make your case? Professor Hale made 535 00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,960 Speaker 3: the point you want to sit with your parents, but 536 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 3: are they Are they good communicators? 537 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:09,840 Speaker 4: You sound like a really smart guy. 538 00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:17,920 Speaker 3: So yeah, uh, what do you have in terms of 539 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 3: negotiation with your parents? 540 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 4: Do you do you have a goal? 541 00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 3: Is there something that you want to do that they're 542 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,720 Speaker 3: saying Christopher, You're not ready to do that yet. 543 00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:31,280 Speaker 7: Yeah, like get a phone so I can like text 544 00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:32,160 Speaker 7: with my friends. 545 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:35,919 Speaker 4: Okay, okay, so now we're down to a phone. Let 546 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,440 Speaker 4: me ask Professor Hale. Phones here, this is this a 547 00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:40,160 Speaker 4: tough one. 548 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,120 Speaker 5: Let's let's talk about Christopher. 549 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 1: There has been listening to the rest of my diatribe 550 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:49,640 Speaker 1: about childhood independence. I was with you, Christopher on you 551 00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 1: ride your bike around the neighborhood and you go play football, 552 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:54,840 Speaker 1: whatever you want to do. But if it means having 553 00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 1: a saw a flip phone, I think it's fine. It's 554 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:02,160 Speaker 1: the smartphone that I think and really develop these addictive tendencies. 555 00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:05,520 Speaker 1: And there's this great book by Jonathan Haate called a 556 00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:10,440 Speaker 1: social psychologist from NYU. It's called the Anxious generation, and 557 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: it's all about kind of this rise in mental illness 558 00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:17,600 Speaker 1: that we've seen, particularly on teenagers, particularly my teenage girls. 559 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 1: That happens beginning in the mid sort of twenty tens 560 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,000 Speaker 1: with the rise of smartphones. 561 00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:23,160 Speaker 5: And social media. 562 00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:26,880 Speaker 1: And so I think, unfortunately, I'm probably not with you, 563 00:29:26,960 --> 00:29:30,920 Speaker 1: Christopher on the smartphone negotiation. But a flip phone, I 564 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: think that's probably fine. 565 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:33,960 Speaker 4: Yeah. You know. 566 00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 3: The thing about a flip phone, Christopher, and I you 567 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:39,320 Speaker 3: may be disappointed in what I'm going to say is 568 00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 3: it allows you to communicate with your parents. It allows 569 00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 3: them to keep track of you. 570 00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:44,560 Speaker 4: Know where you are. 571 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:46,160 Speaker 3: If you're going to go to the mall or something, 572 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 3: I go to the movies or go bowling or whatever 573 00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:49,080 Speaker 3: you're going. 574 00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 4: To do, they know where you are. The cell phones. 575 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 3: Can can be really distracting, and a lot of adults, 576 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 3: not just thirteen year old guys like you, but adults, 577 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 3: they get lost in the cell phones and there's a 578 00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 3: lot of there's a lot of stuff on the cell 579 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 3: phones which is really junk. To be honest with you, okay, 580 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:21,080 Speaker 3: And I would not want my son at the age 581 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,960 Speaker 3: of thirteen with what they call a smartphone. And I 582 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:27,320 Speaker 3: know that's probably not what you want to hear us say, 583 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 3: but I think we're both telling you what we really believe. 584 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:33,160 Speaker 3: How are you doing in school? You must be doing 585 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 3: pretty well in school. You're really well spoken. Yeah, so 586 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 3: you're doing well in school. 587 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:42,480 Speaker 4: Right. 588 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:46,800 Speaker 3: You said, how many of you? How many of your friends, 589 00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 3: your buddies have cell phones are so called smartphones. 590 00:30:56,000 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 7: I'd say about like half of my friends, maybe a 591 00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:01,479 Speaker 7: little more than that. 592 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,440 Speaker 4: Okay, do some of your friends have flip phones? 593 00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:10,920 Speaker 7: Yeah, one of my friends has a flip phone. 594 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 3: And what a flip phone means is that if you 595 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 3: are out some night and then and you need to 596 00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:18,160 Speaker 3: ride home and call your parents, they can call you. 597 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:20,280 Speaker 4: So there's a there's a value to a flip phone, 598 00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:22,320 Speaker 4: real value. 599 00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:24,280 Speaker 5: But this there's a. 600 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 4: There's a lot of just stuff that that I don't know. 601 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know how to put this to you. 602 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 3: Let me put it to you as best I can. 603 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:38,160 Speaker 3: There's a lot of stuff on smartphones that is just junk. 604 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,160 Speaker 3: I mean, it's it's that it has no value. Uh, 605 00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 3: it's not educational, it's not informative, it's it's really just 606 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 3: stupid stuff. And I think, uh, most parents who love 607 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:52,240 Speaker 3: their kids are going to say, look, I don't want 608 00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:55,800 Speaker 3: you looking and dealing with stupid stuff and wasting your time. 609 00:31:56,240 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 3: That's that That's that's my thought on it. 610 00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:02,880 Speaker 4: Do you did you just find us tonight on the 611 00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 4: radio out there? Will you flipping the radio around tonight? 612 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:08,520 Speaker 8: Yeah? 613 00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: Okay, totally random, totally random. 614 00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 4: I like that. 615 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 3: Okay, Well, look, do me a favor. I'll tell you 616 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 3: what I'm going to do for you. Your first time called, 617 00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 3: we gave you a round of applause. 618 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:21,600 Speaker 4: Uh. 619 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:23,480 Speaker 3: I'm going to send you a night Side T shirt? 620 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:25,960 Speaker 3: What sized Nightside T shirt? Would would you wear it? 621 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:28,239 Speaker 1: You know? Uh? 622 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:28,800 Speaker 8: Small? 623 00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:34,160 Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, fair enough. Okay, we'll get that in the 624 00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:37,280 Speaker 3: mail to you. Leave your name and address uh with 625 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,480 Speaker 3: with my producer and we'll get that out in the 626 00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:39,960 Speaker 3: mail to you. 627 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:42,080 Speaker 4: This was a great call, Christopher. 628 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 1: I hope you. 629 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 4: I hope you continue to listen to night Side. 630 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:48,520 Speaker 3: We do a lot of stuff on this show, uh 631 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:53,240 Speaker 3: that I think someone with your intelligence uh will appreciate 632 00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 3: because because you you kept right with our car, you 633 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 3: kept you you you did really well talking to a 634 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,040 Speaker 3: broken down talk show host and a young law professor. 635 00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:08,840 Speaker 4: So you're writing the game home, Chris. 636 00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:11,640 Speaker 3: Thank you, Christopher. Your parents should be very proud of you. 637 00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 3: I tell my kids the most important words in the 638 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:14,840 Speaker 3: world are please and thank you. 639 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:17,240 Speaker 4: And we will get you that T shirt. 640 00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:20,000 Speaker 3: I promise you, uh uh, and I want you to 641 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:24,520 Speaker 3: wear it proudly in Ohio. Thanks Christopher. Don't hang up, 642 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 3: don't hang up. Okay, You're welcome. You're welcome. 643 00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:28,120 Speaker 5: Thanks Christopher. 644 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:30,840 Speaker 4: I'll tell you that's a that's a great folk call. 645 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:32,680 Speaker 4: That's one I'm going to remember for a while. 646 00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:37,160 Speaker 1: You get thirteen year olds calling on radio dance. 647 00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:41,520 Speaker 3: No No in the country, guys, think Christopher, and make 648 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 3: sure you get everything right on him. And you can 649 00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:46,400 Speaker 3: include that as well. We will take a break. We 650 00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 3: got two more callers we're going to get to. I 651 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:52,640 Speaker 3: promise this is great stuff. I mean the thing about 652 00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:55,800 Speaker 3: we do have a really strong signal. I'm not surprised 653 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:59,640 Speaker 3: by the phone call from Ohio. I am surprised by 654 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:02,480 Speaker 3: the full of intelligence for a thirteen year old. It 655 00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:05,600 Speaker 3: takes some guts to dial in and then talk to 656 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,320 Speaker 3: two adults like you and me. I mean, I'm serious. 657 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:13,880 Speaker 3: Good for him, he'll he's going to be a successful 658 00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 3: young man. I'll tell you there should be some schools 659 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:21,520 Speaker 3: thinking about him. That's for sure. I'm overwhelmed and impressed 660 00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,919 Speaker 3: with that young guy. We'll take a break. We will 661 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:28,680 Speaker 3: be back with my guest, Professor Andrew Hale of Northeastern University, 662 00:34:28,719 --> 00:34:33,560 Speaker 3: talking about balancing freedom for children and the responsibility of 663 00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 3: parents obviously to be protective, but not overwhelmingly protective of children, 664 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:41,799 Speaker 3: giving them some freedom and let them learn. 665 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:44,560 Speaker 4: We'll be back on night's side right after this break. 666 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:47,839 Speaker 5: Side with Dan Ray. 667 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:52,239 Speaker 6: I'm telling Boston's News Radio, let's keep rolling. 668 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 4: Gonna go to Anika and Nick. 669 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:57,359 Speaker 3: We normally don't take two people together, but Anaka and Nick, 670 00:34:57,440 --> 00:34:58,720 Speaker 3: we'll give it a shot. 671 00:34:58,920 --> 00:35:02,000 Speaker 4: You are both on with Professor Andrew Hale. 672 00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:04,839 Speaker 3: He's a professor at Northeast University Law School, and we're 673 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:10,200 Speaker 3: talking about parents children. How do they incorporate freedom and 674 00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:13,799 Speaker 3: responsibility in children so that the children are safe and 675 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:15,879 Speaker 3: yet they have the ability to kind of get out 676 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:17,000 Speaker 3: and experience the world. 677 00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 4: An Nick, go right ahead. 678 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:20,040 Speaker 2: Hi. 679 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:24,880 Speaker 8: Unfortunately we're not parents, but we are former students of 680 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,160 Speaker 8: Professor Hale, so we figured we'd just give a call 681 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:29,879 Speaker 8: in to say hello and say great job. 682 00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:33,520 Speaker 9: And also just to add in Valadi that he was 683 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,480 Speaker 9: a great choice for the show. He knows so much 684 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:38,480 Speaker 9: and we've learned so much from him. 685 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,080 Speaker 5: So hi, both. 686 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,200 Speaker 3: I see that you have a Connecticut number. Are you 687 00:35:43,200 --> 00:35:44,440 Speaker 3: guys down in Connecticut. 688 00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 9: We're in Boston, so we're currently in our last year 689 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:51,160 Speaker 9: at Northeastern. We had Professor Hale a couple of years. 690 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:54,360 Speaker 8: Ago, but I'm from Connecticut. I'm a two or three number. 691 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:58,840 Speaker 8: We met in Professor Hill's class and we're in a 692 00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:04,239 Speaker 8: relationship now. It's all going well. So he's for us, and. 693 00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: I don't know how these guys got through the lines. 694 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:14,160 Speaker 1: You really got to screen them a little better, you know. Well, 695 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:16,400 Speaker 1: I goodness. 696 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:19,640 Speaker 9: I hope we gave you a good laugh tonight. 697 00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 8: Yes, we just wanted to say hi and say that 698 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:22,879 Speaker 8: you're doing a great job. 699 00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:23,720 Speaker 1: We love your article. 700 00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:28,439 Speaker 3: So so you you read the article and uh yeah, 701 00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,880 Speaker 3: and you understand what he's saying. When I first talked 702 00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,400 Speaker 3: with him, I don't know, a week or so ago, 703 00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 3: I was talking about it was a concept of free 704 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:42,520 Speaker 3: range parenting, which was the rage three or four years ago, 705 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 3: and uh uh, and Professor Hale was quick to disabuse 706 00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,520 Speaker 3: me of the notion that this was anything close to 707 00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:52,719 Speaker 3: free range parenting, and there were some parents who's whose 708 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:58,160 Speaker 3: kids were really quite a distance away. Is he as 709 00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:00,560 Speaker 3: good a teacher in class as he is as a 710 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:01,400 Speaker 3: talk show host? 711 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 8: I think he's probably equally as good a professor as 712 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:07,600 Speaker 8: he is talk show host. 713 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:13,680 Speaker 1: As he is dad. 714 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:18,160 Speaker 8: Sorry, yeah, that's bad. That's my bad. Be a great 715 00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:19,839 Speaker 8: host also, I'm sure I. 716 00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,839 Speaker 4: Know, but hey, don't let my management. No, I could 717 00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:22,600 Speaker 4: be out of a job. 718 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:29,799 Speaker 8: He's got a job in Northeastern. Don't worry. Don't worry. So, yeah, 719 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,000 Speaker 8: he's he's equally good as a professor, talk show guest, 720 00:37:33,040 --> 00:37:37,320 Speaker 8: and a dad. His kids have a great, great respect 721 00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:39,880 Speaker 8: and great affection. 722 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:42,160 Speaker 4: For him, both of you and Nick. 723 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:44,840 Speaker 3: You're in your third year at Northeastern, about to graduate, 724 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:46,400 Speaker 3: I assume next May or June. 725 00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:47,439 Speaker 1: Yeah. 726 00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:50,440 Speaker 8: Yeah, we just supplied to graduate, so it's it's imminent. 727 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:51,320 Speaker 4: Okay. 728 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:54,640 Speaker 3: One piece of advice, and that is, before you take 729 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:56,920 Speaker 3: the bar, make sure you take the bar review course. 730 00:37:57,280 --> 00:37:59,200 Speaker 4: You'll learn more in the bar review on it. 731 00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:02,800 Speaker 8: We're on it. We're on it. And many of Professor 732 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:07,680 Speaker 8: Hill's uh former students have passed recently, so it's not 733 00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 8: the testament to his work, then we're happy to praise it. 734 00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:12,920 Speaker 4: Well, that's great, that's great. Well, thank you very much 735 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:13,560 Speaker 4: for calling in. 736 00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:18,439 Speaker 3: We had an interesting, uh combination of guests of callers tonight. 737 00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:20,600 Speaker 4: That is for sure. And again, Nick, thanks very much. 738 00:38:20,640 --> 00:38:23,239 Speaker 3: I hope you continue to listen to Nights Night and 739 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,399 Speaker 3: call in, whether he's the guest or not. Okay, thank 740 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:25,919 Speaker 3: you so much. 741 00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:30,800 Speaker 9: Thanks tonight. 742 00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:36,160 Speaker 1: Dan, did they get shirts too or I figured. 743 00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:37,399 Speaker 4: Thirteen year old. 744 00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:40,520 Speaker 3: No, I at this point they'll be firing me for 745 00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:43,320 Speaker 3: giving away too much, too much merch. 746 00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:45,839 Speaker 5: You're never going to invite me back. 747 00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:48,359 Speaker 4: No, no, no at all. Thank you very much. 748 00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:52,439 Speaker 3: I enjoyed the conversation immensely so tonight and I, uh, 749 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:55,680 Speaker 3: and I learned a lot. And I think you you 750 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:59,000 Speaker 3: take a very reasonable position. And uh, I'm sure you're 751 00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:03,200 Speaker 3: a great law school professor. Witnessed the testimony of a 752 00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:05,960 Speaker 3: couple of students here. That's that's wonderful. Look keep in 753 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:07,719 Speaker 3: touch with on IT. I hope you continue to listen. 754 00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:09,799 Speaker 3: If there's any other subjects that come up, keep us, 755 00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:13,040 Speaker 3: keep us posted, always looking to add people to the 756 00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:14,600 Speaker 3: roster of our returning guests. 757 00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:16,040 Speaker 4: Thank you so much for your time tonight. 758 00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:18,560 Speaker 5: Thank you Dan, thanks for having me on. 759 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,440 Speaker 3: You're more than welcome. And again I highly recommend people 760 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:25,200 Speaker 3: can find the article it was in which mag It 761 00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:28,279 Speaker 3: was was in Prospective Man, Boston Globe. It was in 762 00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:29,040 Speaker 3: the Boston Globe. 763 00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:30,719 Speaker 5: Yeah, the Boston Globe. 764 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:34,279 Speaker 3: Yep, kids need more independence. If only Massachusetts law would 765 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:37,160 Speaker 3: allow it easy to find in the Globe. Thanks again, 766 00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:40,760 Speaker 3: Professor Andrew Hale of Northeastern University. 767 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,200 Speaker 5: Law School, Thanks man, take care. 768 00:39:43,320 --> 00:39:45,600 Speaker 3: You're welcome, you too. Okay, we get back. We're going 769 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,920 Speaker 3: to open up a fourth and final hour tonight. Stay 770 00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,359 Speaker 3: with us here on Nightside back right after the eleven 771 00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:52,040 Speaker 3: o'clock news