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Speaker 1: Cincy Shirts. Cincy three sixty About Cincinnati from Cincinnati, sponsored

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Speaker 1: in part by Cincy Shirts. Cincy Shirts All Cincy, all Day.

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Speaker 1: This is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station.

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Speaker 2: No better place to get geared up for a white

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Speaker 2: Bengal night than at Cincy Shirts. Check them out each

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Speaker 2: of their retail locations. You can get a shirt custom

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Speaker 2: made on the spot at Cincy Shirts. Go check them

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Speaker 2: out ahead of tonight's game. If you need to get

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Speaker 2: something white, like our guy Moegger most still looking for

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Speaker 2: something white. He does this every single year. Figure it out.

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Speaker 2: You're a grown man. Another grown man is joining the show.

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Speaker 2: Now our guy John Sheeran, who talks Bengals with me

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Speaker 2: every single Thursday, and he joins us. Now I had

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Speaker 2: a Thursday night football, Johnny, got you got any white on?

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Speaker 2: You got any white Bengal gear for you? Just watch

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Speaker 2: the game? Or what are you going to the game?

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Speaker 2: What's going on?

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Speaker 3: John? Don't know? What's good?

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Speaker 4: Said? I appreciate you asking, Austin, because I am going

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Speaker 4: to the game. Let's go to the game with another

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Speaker 4: I'm going to the game with another girl. Man whose

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Speaker 4: name is my dad. And he also forgot to wear

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Speaker 4: white today. And I'm like, come on, Dad, like everyone

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Speaker 4: knows what this game is. So I'm actually in the

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Speaker 4: parking lot of Dick's Morning Goods about to get him

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Speaker 4: like a cheap white shirt so you can wear it tonight.

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Speaker 2: That's awesome and it sounds like something my dad would

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Speaker 2: do as well. So let's start with the matchups tonight

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Speaker 2: this game. When you think Bengals Steelers, when you think

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Speaker 2: about this game, what's the first matchup that comes to

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Speaker 2: mind in what will determine the outcome?

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Speaker 4: It's always the Pittsburgh defensive line, is it not. It's

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Speaker 4: been the staple of them for how many years?

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Speaker 3: Fifty? Yeah, something like that.

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Speaker 4: But they've always had good pass rushers, right, They've always

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Speaker 4: had good guys up front, and the Bengals offensive line

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Speaker 4: has always struggled against them no matter what the personnel is.

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Speaker 4: I remember, you know, in the last year's to the

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Speaker 4: Jonah Williams this year, like he got, you know, beating

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Speaker 4: like a ren and mule against Alex.

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Speaker 3: Higsmith and company.

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Speaker 4: Alex hig Smith is still there, and I think that's

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Speaker 4: a really good matchup for Pittsburgh against Ernanda Brown Junior,

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Speaker 4: who's not having a really good season, and I think

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Speaker 4: he's the type of pass rusher that can get under

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Speaker 4: your pads, you can win around the edge, and that's

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Speaker 4: always been the player archetype that is, you know, caused

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Speaker 4: Lean Brown, You're going to struggle. So when you're talking

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Speaker 4: about Steelers defense line that has not just Alex heismanth

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Speaker 4: obviously t J.

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Speaker 3: Watt and Cameron Hayward are the main guys there.

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Speaker 4: And Cameron Hayward, you know, baptized as a rookie guard

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Speaker 4: for the Bengals basically every single year, and now you

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Speaker 4: have two of them, and Dylan Fairchild and Jaalen Rivers

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Speaker 4: going up against them for the first time. That's just

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Speaker 4: the grown man in Cam Hayward, who's thirty six years

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Speaker 4: old and still is one of the very best players

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Speaker 4: in this position. So it's always been a mismatch for

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Speaker 4: the Bengals up front trying to block these guys. And

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Speaker 4: now that you have a quarterback and Joe Flacco who

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Speaker 4: should be more a little bit more comfortable in this

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Speaker 4: offense after being here for a week instead it was

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Speaker 4: a handful of days. But still I'm interested just like

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Speaker 4: I was last week, and how Flacco handles the pressure

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Speaker 4: and how the Bengals office line make sure that they mitigate,

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Speaker 4: you know, the obvious mismatches there to make sure the

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Speaker 4: ball gets out, make sure that the defensive lineman don't

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Speaker 4: ruin the game like they typically normally do in this matchup.

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Speaker 2: Now, I did think that Flacco looked a little bit

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Speaker 2: slow when he was trying to avoid the rush against

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Speaker 2: Green Bay, But I also thought that was okay, Like

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Speaker 2: that was good enough of a performance. There's something there.

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Speaker 2: What did you like about what you saw from Flacco

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Speaker 2: against the Packers?

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Speaker 4: I mean you needed to see what he did in

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Speaker 4: the second half, right, because the first half obviously wasn't

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Speaker 4: good enough. This team still hasn't scored the first half

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Speaker 4: touchdowns since Week two. Right, Joe Burrow was in there,

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Speaker 4: and you'd like to see him get into rhythm and

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Speaker 4: just just trust the playmakers on the outside. I think

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Speaker 4: the majority of his targets went went to Jamar Chase

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Speaker 4: and Tiggins, and with Mikaseeki out for the foreseeable future,

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Speaker 4: that should remain the case, especially with andre yosabauch not

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Speaker 4: necessarily having a good season on his own, but taking

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Speaker 4: advantage of one on one matchups when you get it

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Speaker 4: with Chase and Higgins on the boundary. If Flaco still

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Speaker 4: trusts his arm, he's still accurate enough to get the

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Speaker 4: ball where it needs to go, and he's been a

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Speaker 4: lot more efficient with getting the ball out under two

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Speaker 4: a half seconds. I believe Paul and her Junior have

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Speaker 4: pulled up some great stats in this Leaves article with

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Speaker 4: the Athletic about how much more efficient the offense is

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Speaker 4: with Flakka getting the ball out within the first tree

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Speaker 4: half seconds compared to Jake Browning. And that is going

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Speaker 4: to be the base of this offense because again, you

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Speaker 4: can't trust pass protection against matchups like this, so Flacco

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Speaker 4: needs to be sustained rhythm to identify, you know, where

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Speaker 4: the matchups are at his disposal, and just take advantage

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Speaker 4: of Jamar Chase and Chigins because they're going to be

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Speaker 4: advantages against most quarterbacks that they play, especially tonight, like

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Speaker 4: Darius Slay Junior and Joey Porter Junior and Jalen Ramsy.

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Speaker 4: They're all really good quarterbacks, but you still don't want

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Speaker 4: to take advantage of Jamar Chase when you have him,

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Speaker 4: and I think seeing that connection grow last week against

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Speaker 4: the Packers, that was a really promising.

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Speaker 2: Sign yeah, I agree with you one hundred percent. The

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Speaker 2: other thing, too, is being able to run the football.

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Speaker 2: They weren't great against the Packers. They haven't been great

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Speaker 2: all season. The Steelers sixteenth ranked run defense, allowing over

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Speaker 2: one hundred yards per game on the ground. Do you

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Speaker 2: feel like tonight is a chance for them to get

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Speaker 2: it going at all? Even though that Steeler defensive line

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Speaker 2: is good, Like you mentioned, it's.

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Speaker 4: Really tough to imagine at this point, they are on

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Speaker 4: track to maybe one of the worst rushing offenses in

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Speaker 4: the history of the league. And it's troubling to see

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Speaker 4: how Chase Brown can't get anything going in front of him,

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Speaker 4: and the fact that they can't utilize his athleticism and

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Speaker 4: his burst and everything like that. It still remains a

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Speaker 4: really porous scheme, and I think the stuff in the

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Speaker 4: games that the Steelers defensive line typically run it makes

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Speaker 4: things a little bit more complicated, like that, there are

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Speaker 4: high risk, high reward opportunities when defensive linemen kind of

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Speaker 4: slant in the rushes a little bit and trees up

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Speaker 4: some gaps. But if you don't have the confident bodies

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Speaker 4: up front to get them out of the way and

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Speaker 4: displace them, then it ends up disrupting you more more

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Speaker 4: times than not. So it's always been tough to run

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Speaker 4: against the Steelers again that they cause a lot of

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Speaker 4: chaos up front, and I just there's not a lot

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Speaker 4: of confidence right now for me in the personnel upfront

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Speaker 4: for blocking to these guys. You like how hard somebowosip

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Speaker 4: around runs, and you like the fact that Chase Brown

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Speaker 4: he can't get a full head of scene when you

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Speaker 4: have a little bit of space, But there's just not

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Speaker 4: a lot of space to be found, and it's hard

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Speaker 4: for me to see any space being found at night.

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Speaker 2: How do you expect the offense to change, if at all,

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Speaker 2: with Mike Giseki being out.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think we saw how Tanner Hudson could fill

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Speaker 4: that role a little bit. He caught the touchdown last week,

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Speaker 4: but now he's in the concusion protocol. Right, So you

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Speaker 4: go from an offense that had five fight ins at

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Speaker 4: the disposed of down to three, and with Kaseki out,

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Speaker 4: that does mean that yose Vash is going to play more.

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Speaker 4: You could see more snaps for a guy like Mitchell Tinsley,

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Speaker 4: who's now wide receiver for Charlie Jones, is still dealing

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Speaker 4: with an injury, and Jermaine Burton he's in limbo obviously,

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Speaker 4: so you would expect to see, you know, more usage

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Speaker 4: deeper into the wide receiver group for the guys who

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Speaker 4: are active. I would like to see Noah Fan get

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Speaker 4: some more opportunity as well. It seems like in the

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Speaker 4: game three he's involved, He's always at at least four targets,

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Speaker 4: which I think is a little bit more than even

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Speaker 4: I expected for a guy who was signed so late

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Speaker 4: in the offseason. But you know, this is an interesting

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Speaker 4: night to see who Flacko trusts in those opportunities. Because

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Speaker 4: obviously Drew Sample and Cam Grandy, we know who they are.

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Speaker 4: They're just in there to block and catch and catch,

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Speaker 4: you know, short passes and try to run up to

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Speaker 4: the catch. But Noah Fan, I think needs to take

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Speaker 4: another step up, and I'm interested to see if Flacko

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Speaker 4: trust him.

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Speaker 3: Enough to do that.

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Speaker 2: Talking to John Sheeran covering the Bengals A is the

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Speaker 2: Sports Johnny wrote your Bengals report card, and you mentioned

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Speaker 2: DJ Turner as being a pleasant surprise, and especially the

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Speaker 2: way he's played over the last month and the way

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Speaker 2: he played against Green Bay. What have you seen from him?

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Speaker 2: That makes him or has led to a little bit

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Speaker 2: more consistent and an uptick in his level of play.

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Speaker 4: I think when you have an elite athlete like DJ Turner, right,

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Speaker 4: the number one thing for him at cornerback is to

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Speaker 4: control that athleticism and matching mirror the speed of the

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Speaker 4: guys that he's going up against, because that allows him

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Speaker 4: to stay in position to make plays in the ball.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 4: It's one thing to be fast enough to you know,

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Speaker 4: be able to stay with a guy on a vertical round, right,

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Speaker 4: but your change the direction, your balance, your ability to

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Speaker 4: stay in the hip hocket these guys and be physical.

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Speaker 4: I think Dj has shown pretty much all of those

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Speaker 4: qualifications and all those attributes, and now he's finding the

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Speaker 4: ball out better. Like you don't get five passes defense

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Speaker 4: in one game out of pure luck, right, Like quarterbacks

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Speaker 4: are obviously testing you. But I think DJ really showed

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Speaker 4: a lot last week and not only staying with guys

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Speaker 4: but then finding the ball making a play on the ball.

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Speaker 4: That's Those are the impact plays that you don't always

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Speaker 4: see from this secondary, and you haven't really seen from

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Speaker 4: a cornerback in the secondary in a while. You saw

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Speaker 4: a little bit flashes with that of Cam Tailberg when

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Speaker 4: he was on his game, but obviously he hasn't been

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Speaker 4: on his game for quite some time, so it looks

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Speaker 4: like Turner is the guy that they would trust the

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Speaker 4: most going up against you know, whoever the opposing number

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Speaker 4: one receiver is this week. Is really interesting because DK

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Speaker 4: Metcalf is a you know, physical freak who definitely outsizes

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Speaker 4: DJ Turner that reguard, But they may have the most

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Speaker 4: trust in Turner to stay with him and try to

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Speaker 4: make plays in the ball because he's doing that better

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Speaker 4: than anyone in the secondary right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was gonna ask, like, would you imagine he

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Speaker 2: would he would follow DK Metcalf around. I know the

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Speaker 2: Bengals don't do that often, but if Calvin Austin is

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Speaker 2: out and that's their best weapon and maybe their best

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Speaker 2: performing corner, do you think they would do something like that.

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Speaker 3: I'm really interested to find out.

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Speaker 4: I think this is this would be such an opportunity

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Speaker 4: for Cam Tobert to earn back trust. I think back

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Speaker 4: to two years ago when he played DK Metcalf for

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Speaker 4: the Seahawks. That was one of his best games ever.

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Speaker 4: He really got into his head. He got the interception

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Speaker 4: and everything like that. Of course, you're gonna give up

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Speaker 4: a big plays to Metcalf because he's playing like one

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Speaker 4: of the best receivers in the NFL, and he's basically

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Speaker 4: like the entirety of that Pittsburgh passing game is running

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Speaker 4: through him right now, So you know they're going to

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Speaker 4: feature him and involve him. So I think it comes

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Speaker 4: down to just more than just one guy for the Bengals.

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Speaker 4: I don't think you want to have Dj Turner following

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Speaker 4: in around for six he plays the game. I think

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Speaker 4: this could be a situation where quarterbacks stay on their

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Speaker 4: sides and you just maybe try to brack it Metchalf

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Speaker 4: a little bit, gets some help from the safeties. But yeah,

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Speaker 4: if it's gonna be Dj Turner against Metcalf all night, like,

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Speaker 4: there's gonna be some goball opportunities and Metcalf is going

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Speaker 4: to try to use the size to win that matchup

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Speaker 4: for sure.

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Speaker 2: Logan Wilson was benched against the Packers in favor of

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Speaker 2: Barrett Carter. He handed it really well. I don't know

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Speaker 2: that it entirely makes sense. What do you make of

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Speaker 2: Logan Wilson's benching.

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Speaker 3: It's very interesting.

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Speaker 4: I think it would make more sense like he said,

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Speaker 4: if the rookies were playing significantly better than him, and

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Speaker 4: I just don't think there's anyone really in that position

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Speaker 4: group that is standing out above the rest. I think

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Speaker 4: identifying and drafting two linebackers in the first four rounds

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Speaker 4: it definitely means more now than maybe what it did,

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Speaker 4: you know, back when the draft was happening, and you

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Speaker 4: think that Breck Carter is just going to be this

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Speaker 4: long term replacement for Logan Wilson. It's not like Logan

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Speaker 4: Wilson is playing significantly great. Obviously he's he's playing less

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Speaker 4: for a reason. But I just don't I don't see

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Speaker 4: why this makes sense other than the fact that just

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Speaker 4: giving the young guys a lot more reps to prove

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Speaker 4: themselves unless there's things in practice that we're not seeing.

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Speaker 4: And there's a lot of flashes and a lot of

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Speaker 4: promise from Bark Carter, you know, between Monday and Saturday, right,

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Speaker 4: and they want to give him chance to prove that

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Speaker 4: on Sunday.

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Speaker 3: But at the same time, you're paying a lot for

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Speaker 3: Logan Wilson.

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Speaker 4: I don't think he's that much different of a player

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Speaker 4: than what you would have expected him to be. So

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Speaker 4: it just seems like a really aggressive move by this

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Speaker 4: coaching staff to really see what their return on investment

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Speaker 4: for these rookies are. And if it works out, it

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Speaker 4: works out great, then they have bear Carter for the

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Speaker 4: next handful of years and then they can slide with

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Speaker 4: what to do with Wilson. But if you're not seeing

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Speaker 4: it from Carter yet in terms of just a consistent player,

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Speaker 4: I'm not sure it makes entirely a lot of sense.

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Speaker 2: Ian Rappaport reported this morning it's a long shot for

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Speaker 2: Trey Hendrickson to be able to play short week with

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Speaker 2: the hip injury. If he doesn't, how can the Bengals

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Speaker 2: dial up some pressures against Aaron Rodgers. What would be

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Speaker 2: the plan for Al Golden?

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Speaker 4: Do you think, Well, he said that Schmartiwver is going

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Speaker 4: to play a ton, and I think the more that

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Speaker 4: you move him around and the more that you get

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Speaker 4: him maybe almost in the two point stands to just

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Speaker 4: use as much speed and explosion that you can. I

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Speaker 4: think that's the best way to compensate for not having

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Speaker 4: your true difference maker out there. I think Golden saying

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Speaker 4: that about Stewart was kind of foreshadowing how he felt

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Speaker 4: about Trey in this game, and whether or not he

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Speaker 4: plays or not, he may not be able to play

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Speaker 4: the whole game even if he is active. Right, So

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Speaker 4: Miles Murphy's probably going to start. Schmart Stewart's probably gonna

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Speaker 4: be that third edge. He's gonna be not only lying

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Speaker 4: up on the edge, but he's also gonna be inside.

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Speaker 4: They're gonna use him on all three downs because he's

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Speaker 4: really good and really chaotic against the run.

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Speaker 3: So it's gonna be tough.

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Speaker 4: You definitely need to do things differently because you just

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Speaker 4: can't expect the pass ruses that you have to win

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Speaker 4: every single one on one matchup when really only Trey

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Speaker 4: Hendrickson could do that consistently.

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Speaker 2: How good are the Steelers really like? Are they legit

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Speaker 2: contender in the AFC? Are they a product of their schedule?

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Speaker 2: How do you view the Steelers?

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Speaker 4: I think the Steelers have some different faces every single year,

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Speaker 4: but they always are pretty much the same team. And

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Speaker 4: sometimes they start the season really slow and then they

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Speaker 4: entered the playoff race in November December and they make

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Speaker 4: it into nine and eight. Sometimes they started in this

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Speaker 4: in this case four and one and then they fall

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Speaker 4: back down to nine eight, But they always end up

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Speaker 4: around nine to eight, ten and seven, are always in

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Speaker 4: the conversation, always physical, They don't make a lot of

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Speaker 4: critical mistakes, and they typically have an offense that's just

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Speaker 4: barely good enough to complement their defense. And I think

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Speaker 4: that's pretty much been the case this year. I think

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Speaker 4: Aaron Rodgers is about the quarterback that the Jets should

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Speaker 4: have expected at you know, thirty nine to forty years

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Speaker 4: old at this point, and obviously he was a tremendous

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Speaker 4: disaster for the Jets, but he clearly still has just

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Speaker 4: enough to be a competent quarterback and run a competent offense.

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Speaker 4: But you know that passing offense again is entirely run

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Speaker 4: through DK Metcalf. They're really desperate for maybe a guy

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Speaker 4: like George Pickens if they had him. They don't have

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Speaker 4: a ton of great success with running the football right now,

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Speaker 4: and that's a little bit different compared to years past.

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Speaker 3: But I think they're just a solid team. They're obviously not.

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Speaker 4: I think gonna be finished with more than like ten

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Speaker 4: or eleven wins necessarily, but definitely serious enough to make

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Speaker 4: the playoffs and definitely win this game for sure.

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Speaker 2: Let's say that the Steelers do win the game. Do

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Speaker 2: you anticipate any dominoes falling for the Bengals afterwards, like

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Speaker 2: a coach losing his job or a Trey Hendrickson potentially

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Speaker 2: getting traded. What domino's do you anticipate to fall if

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Speaker 2: the Bengals can't win tonight?

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Speaker 4: You know, the Bengals are never the sellers, right, They're

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Speaker 4: never the ones that want to just liquidate assets for

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Speaker 4: the sake of liquidation, for the sake of a last season.

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Speaker 4: I think the fact that they traded for a quarterback

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Speaker 4: not even two weeks ago, it means that they still

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Speaker 4: feel like they can do something with the season. I'm

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Speaker 4: not sure if two and five and this AFC climate

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Speaker 4: is going to make them immediately feel that. I think

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Speaker 4: the only reason we're talking about is because A this

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Speaker 4: is a divisional game against the divisional leader, and b

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Speaker 4: because it's going to be a long week of rest

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Speaker 4: after the Thursday night game, so that's naturally a time

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Speaker 4: could make changes. But I don't think you're going to

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Speaker 4: see a coach firing after this game. I think it's

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Speaker 4: still a little bit too early in the season for that.

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Speaker 4: And the one thing I am curious though, is that

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Speaker 4: if Logan Wilson is truly just ten snaps a game guy.

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Speaker 4: How much injuriest could you get for him on the

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Speaker 4: trade deadline, because at the end of the day, you're

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Speaker 4: paying a lot of money for guy who's not playing

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Speaker 4: a lot. So that could be an interesting domino based

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Speaker 4: on how the next two weeks ago. But I don't

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Speaker 4: think anything significant is gonna happen from this game, specifically.

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Speaker 2: On the flip side of that, if they do win

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Speaker 2: and obviously perform the way they are expected to, at

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Speaker 2: least against the Jets and maybe the Bears, could you

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Speaker 2: see them dipping their toe into the trade waters again.

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Speaker 2: Could you see them be a little bit more aggressive

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Speaker 2: if they feel like there's a chance to get you know,

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Speaker 2: back in it in this conference with Burrow coming back

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Speaker 2: later on.

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Speaker 4: It has to be the right deal, right, It has

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Speaker 4: to be potentially like a player for player trade or

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Speaker 4: another pick swap, like they've already sacrificed a.

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Speaker 3: Little bit of draft capital.

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Speaker 4: A little bit draft capital for them is a lot

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Speaker 4: of draft capital for them, So that's always relative, and

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Speaker 4: it may depend on any other injuries that they may suffer.

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Speaker 4: I think they expect to get healthier as the weeks

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Speaker 4: go on. Obviously, the Gaseki injury kind of ruins that

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Speaker 4: a little bit, but I think they have what they

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Speaker 4: feel like is quality death at that position room, and

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Speaker 4: once Tanner Hudson comes back, that's someone that they trust.

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Speaker 3: So I'm not really foreseeing them being buyers. Again.

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Speaker 4: I think Flato is probably the biggest splash that you're

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Speaker 4: gonna get because they did feel the pressure in the

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Speaker 4: urgency to do something other than Jake Browning.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, the next handful of weeks are going to

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Speaker 3: be very interesting.

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Speaker 2: His name's John Scheron covering the Bengals for eight to

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Speaker 2: Z Sports and also the Orange and Black Insider podcast. John,

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Speaker 2: thank you so much, man, really appreciate it.

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Speaker 3: Thanks guys.

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Speaker 2: That is John Shearon from eight to z Sports. Good stuff,

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Speaker 2: good stuff there. He about to go get some white

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Speaker 2: Bengal gear going to the game tonight. You can do

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Speaker 2: that too at Cincy Shirts, Cinti Shirts app and obviously

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Speaker 2: their stores as well. Get your custom shirt made. You're

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Speaker 2: a oh gonna get Flacco shirt ahead of tonight's game.

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Speaker 2: Get that in white for the white Bengal night. All right,

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Speaker 2: we'll take a break, we'll come back talkbacks. Yes, talkbacks.

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Speaker 2: I asked for your predictions about what's going to happen

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Speaker 2: tonight at pay Course Stadium. I can't wait to see

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Speaker 2: what all of you are predicting on talkbacks. That's next.

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Speaker 2: This is Sincy three to sixty hour two, brought to

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Speaker 2: you by Cincy Shirts on the home of the Bengals, Cincinnatis, ESPN,

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Speaker 2: fifteen thirty Now