1 00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:37,640 Speaker 1: Welcome back. You're listening to That's Garden with Scott Berlin. 2 00:00:37,720 --> 00:00:39,800 Speaker 1: I'm here with Paul calls Ar from the cincinne Zoo 3 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,600 Speaker 1: and Botanical Garden and with Kelly Norris Kelly on the line, 4 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 1: and Kelly, I gotta just start. I gotta start with 5 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:52,800 Speaker 1: some serious groveling, very serious groveling. I either forgot or 6 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:55,160 Speaker 1: did not know that you have a new book out. 7 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,000 Speaker 2: Well, you've been out here for a year. Came out 8 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:03,960 Speaker 2: last Yeah, just just last year, called Your Natural Gardens. 9 00:01:04,240 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, and uh in some of the questions I had 10 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 1: lined up be answered in that book. Uh. So I 11 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 1: ordered it right away. It's coming today. Unfortunately, so I 12 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: didn't get a look at it before we started talking. 13 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:19,120 Speaker 1: I don't how did I miss that, Kelly. I usually 14 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:22,200 Speaker 1: right on the pulse of everything in horticulture, and no 15 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:22,959 Speaker 1: one got by me. 16 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 2: Well, you know, a lot happened in the last year, 17 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 2: I guess, and so maybe maybe we were all tuned 18 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:32,400 Speaker 2: into something else. But uh, you know, it's the follow 19 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:35,440 Speaker 2: up to New Naturalism that came out a few years 20 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:39,120 Speaker 2: ago and carries on the conversation from you know the 21 00:01:39,880 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 2: uh that that book started really about how to design 22 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:45,679 Speaker 2: landscapes and gardens but a little more attuned to nature. 23 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 2: This book talks about how to garden those now. 24 00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: And that's the cool thing because there are a lot 25 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: of new naturalism books out there, you know, the Peed 26 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 1: out Off Designs and in Claudia West's book and and 27 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 1: different things, but I'm a to all of them address 28 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:05,560 Speaker 1: the plants and the designs and the philosophies behind it. 29 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 1: But what has been missing, in my opinion is the 30 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:10,440 Speaker 1: how to aspect. 31 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I agree, you know this, there's there's really 32 00:02:16,400 --> 00:02:17,960 Speaker 2: a case to be made for how to you know, 33 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:20,880 Speaker 2: think through the design and how you how you how 34 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:22,679 Speaker 2: you plant one of these things, and how you get 35 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:25,079 Speaker 2: it off the ground. But it really calls in to 36 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:28,920 Speaker 2: question a bigger conversation about how do you live with 37 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:32,080 Speaker 2: the landscape, how do you garden? And and why do 38 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:34,600 Speaker 2: you want to you know, proceed down this path of 39 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 2: making a landscape that's a little more attuned to nature. 40 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:40,359 Speaker 2: So it's uh, you know, it's an expansive conversation. There's 41 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 2: probably more to say about it, but there's two hundred 42 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:44,160 Speaker 2: eight pages there to get you started. 43 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll look forward to it arriving today. And finally, 44 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 1: getting a look at it. So for our listeners who 45 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:55,880 Speaker 1: don't know especially what naturalism is, can you go ahead 46 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:56,600 Speaker 1: and describe it? 47 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,400 Speaker 2: New naturalism is a you know, kind of umbrella term 48 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:04,680 Speaker 2: in a lot of ways that captures I think a 49 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:06,760 Speaker 2: lot of the topics that folks out there are thinking 50 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 2: and talking a lot about in their gardens today, which is, 51 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:15,360 Speaker 2: you know, making habitat and gardening for pollinators, and you know, 52 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:18,000 Speaker 2: and and you know, the bees, birds, the whole the 53 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 2: whole nine yards of how we think about our garden 54 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 2: as connected to something more than itself. Right, It's a 55 00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:27,160 Speaker 2: little sort of tile in the greater mosaic of the 56 00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:30,880 Speaker 2: natural world. And so you know, I chuckle saying all 57 00:03:30,880 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: this that, you know, the best way I can describe 58 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 2: new naturalism this morning, this might be shocking to some 59 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 2: of your listeners. I was awakened at three point fifty 60 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 2: seven am to the sound of two coyotes in my 61 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:47,240 Speaker 2: back garden seeing something you know, that's herban nature for 62 00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 2: you right there, folks. 63 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 1: I don't know. 64 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:49,840 Speaker 3: I was. 65 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 2: I was quite excited about it, but I was. I 66 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 2: was the solo vote in. 67 00:03:54,840 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 3: My house for that. 68 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:59,160 Speaker 2: I thought it was kind of cool. But at any rate, 69 00:03:59,200 --> 00:04:01,960 Speaker 2: The idea is, you know, a way for us to 70 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:04,160 Speaker 2: talk about, you know, how to how to garden a 71 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 2: little bit differently. This is about gardening for more than 72 00:04:07,160 --> 00:04:09,080 Speaker 2: just what looks pretty, and. 73 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: It's kind of interesting to me it It sort of 74 00:04:12,400 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 1: covers a range of gardening too. You can go from 75 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 1: the almost restoration type plantings, which I don't really call 76 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:23,279 Speaker 1: new naturalism, but a lot of people are doing it. 77 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:28,000 Speaker 1: You're throwing prairie mixes out and things like that, into 78 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 1: very highly designed, very natural looking, but extremely highly designed 79 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 1: you know plantings and landscapes absolutely. 80 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 2: And the other thing I'd add, you know that sort 81 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:41,600 Speaker 2: of inherent and what you just said is there's a 82 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:44,080 Speaker 2: lot of different scales that this can happen at, and 83 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:47,360 Speaker 2: even in one's own home garden. You know, you don't 84 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:51,200 Speaker 2: need acres in which to think about this. You could 85 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:54,760 Speaker 2: you could start with your foundation plantings and simply you know, 86 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:59,000 Speaker 2: increase their density, increase their complexity, adding you know, more 87 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 2: native species to or species native to your region. And 88 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 2: so you know, there's there's kind of ways in which 89 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:07,280 Speaker 2: one can start to take little, you know, baby steps 90 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 2: towards this or to you know, kind of bite off 91 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:12,280 Speaker 2: something that you can maybe experiment with and test a 92 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 2: little bit before you go, you know, hull hog like 93 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 2: maybe we have. 94 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 1: You know, we're a little bit of a. 95 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:19,480 Speaker 2: Different case in that sense, and you know we live 96 00:05:19,560 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 2: amongst a little more than a half acre of this 97 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 2: kind of stuff. 98 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:27,000 Speaker 1: Well, that was one of my questions to you, you know, 99 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:32,919 Speaker 1: is is most of what we've seen with new naturalism 100 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:37,680 Speaker 1: up until now have been pretty big projects, you know, 101 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 1: public gardens, botanic gardens, big parks, big college campuses, or 102 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:52,000 Speaker 1: industrial or corporate campuses. But it seems like only now 103 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 1: people are thinking like how we can bring it down 104 00:05:53,839 --> 00:05:57,040 Speaker 1: the scale and use it, you know, in anybody's backyard. 105 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:04,839 Speaker 2: Absolutely. I mean, you know, our our practice as you know, 106 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 2: Landscape Design Studio, you know, we work, we work across 107 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 2: all those scales, right, We do a lot of commercial 108 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:14,160 Speaker 2: and public, institutional scale stuff. We work with a lot 109 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 2: of home gardeners as well. In fact, increasingly we're working 110 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 2: with home gardeners who you know, want to do the 111 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:24,200 Speaker 2: work themselves. They don't know how to design it, they 112 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:25,760 Speaker 2: don't know where to get planned and how to put 113 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:27,480 Speaker 2: it together, but they they kind of want to get 114 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:30,000 Speaker 2: get involved and get their hands dirty with it. And 115 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:32,599 Speaker 2: so we we assume kind of a role of you 116 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:36,560 Speaker 2: know of kind of designer manager construction and then kind 117 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 2: of not really a coach, but you know, kind of 118 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 2: a steward of sorts that helps them kind of start 119 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:46,719 Speaker 2: to to frame how they want to live with it. 120 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:48,839 Speaker 2: And so we've we've got some great examples of some 121 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 2: of those kinds of projects up on our website Kellydynoris 122 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 2: dot com. But uh, you know that shows how in 123 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 2: a kind of suburban setting, you know, we're talking quarter 124 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:01,640 Speaker 2: acre lots or less, you know, you and do various 125 00:07:01,640 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 2: sorts of projects from again, maybe like a full front 126 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:07,760 Speaker 2: yard replaced men people who just want to get rid 127 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:09,479 Speaker 2: of the mower and get rid of the front yard 128 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:11,680 Speaker 2: to you know, something that might feel more like a 129 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 2: you know, a feature type of installation of bed or 130 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 2: something maybe had a difficult slope. 131 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 1: Friend, I'm thinking of one in particular that we saw 132 00:07:20,280 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: last year at the Perennial Plant Association conference that was 133 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 1: in Des Moines, where you are, and it was one 134 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 1: of your designs in a very normal suburban subdivision. And 135 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 1: these folks had made their entire yard except for a 136 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 1: small swath of turf, but the vast majority of their 137 00:07:40,480 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 1: yard into a big new naturalist garden, and I wondered, 138 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 1: you know, how are the neighbors responding to this, and 139 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 1: it was everybody said, they love it. 140 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, that garden, if folks are navigating the website 141 00:07:58,360 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 2: is labeled Agrahood Residence and that garden is just it's 142 00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 2: a wonderful garden. It's wonderful story. They're wonderful clients. They're 143 00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:09,880 Speaker 2: they're people who by their nature are generous and kind 144 00:08:09,920 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 2: of community builders. And what's interesting about that garden, as 145 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 2: you described, is you know it is it is the 146 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 2: standout in its neighborhood. I mean, there's really not anything 147 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:19,120 Speaker 2: else quite like it. 148 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,200 Speaker 1: Oh you see it from a mile away. 149 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:28,640 Speaker 2: And yet it's propagating these ideas in their own way 150 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:31,520 Speaker 2: across the community. Their neighbors across the street now have 151 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:35,240 Speaker 2: a smaller version in their front yard that they've you know, 152 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:38,560 Speaker 2: kind of taken on themselves. And so, uh, you know, 153 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:40,680 Speaker 2: even when we put that garden in, they kind of 154 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:43,960 Speaker 2: handwrote invitations to their neighbors and went and put them 155 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 2: people you know, this is new new development. 156 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, were all. 157 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 2: People who are coming together, you know them probably didn't 158 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 2: know each other and he's putting invitations in their mailbox 159 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:54,839 Speaker 2: that say come plant with us. And it was this, 160 00:08:55,080 --> 00:08:58,600 Speaker 2: it was this really beautiful affair and it's uh, it's 161 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:00,920 Speaker 2: it will be lovely to see how translates into the 162 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 2: neighborhood in the years to come. 163 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: Kelly, we're gonna go ahead and take a break. We'll 164 00:09:05,160 --> 00:09:08,040 Speaker 1: be back in five or six minutes and we'll continue 165 00:09:08,040 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 1: this conversation. You're listening to Let's Garden with Scott Berline. 166 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 1: We'll be back. 167 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:28,480 Speaker 4: Hey, Gary Salvan here. 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We're talking with Kelly Norris, horticultural superstar. And Kelly, 204 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 1: before we go back to new naturalism, let's expound on 205 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 1: the superstar status you cleaned up at the Philadelphia Flower 206 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:57,640 Speaker 1: Show this year and last year with awards. 207 00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:01,319 Speaker 2: Well, we did, we did all right. This year we 208 00:12:01,320 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 2: were pleased to be part of the American Landscape Showcase, 209 00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 2: which was a special feature this year at the Philadelphia 210 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:12,520 Speaker 2: Flower Show, honoring and reflecting on two hundred and fifty years. 211 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:16,120 Speaker 1: Is that incredible? Is that incredible? It was fun? Yeah? 212 00:12:16,160 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 1: I bet it was. I've been meaning to go to 213 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:20,400 Speaker 1: the Philadelphia Flower Show for a number of years now, 214 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:23,480 Speaker 1: it's been too long, and really looking for a way 215 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:24,280 Speaker 1: to get back there. 216 00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 2: It's a spectacular way to spend a couple of days. 217 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 6: If you want to make the big place you can. 218 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 6: Certainly world's largest indoor flower exhibition, the oldest in our country, 219 00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:40,079 Speaker 6: and it's a great way to spend a few days 220 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:42,240 Speaker 6: at the end of February, first of March. 221 00:12:43,160 --> 00:12:47,319 Speaker 1: Well, let's get back to plants and gardening. The different 222 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:53,400 Speaker 1: philosophies ranged with any designer about how native people want 223 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:57,000 Speaker 1: to go. Some are very happy to include natives and 224 00:12:57,120 --> 00:13:01,640 Speaker 1: exotics equally. Some you know, want to go almost entirely 225 00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 1: or entirely with native plants. But you can do it 226 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:09,200 Speaker 1: all and be within this realm of new naturalism. It's 227 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,560 Speaker 1: more about the look and the function than you know, 228 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: hardcore rules. I would think, well, you. 229 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:19,840 Speaker 2: Know, I I like what you're saying, because you know, 230 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 2: the reality is the places that we live and work 231 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:26,120 Speaker 2: in today are you know, kind of complex, right they have? 232 00:13:27,080 --> 00:13:29,320 Speaker 2: They have both sometimes whether we like it or not, 233 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:33,599 Speaker 2: and so uh we try not to, you know, to 234 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:35,560 Speaker 2: sort of ignore that reality a little bit. And I 235 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 2: also don't really feel like it's all that productive to 236 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:39,960 Speaker 2: sort of scold people about you know, yeah, you know 237 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:42,200 Speaker 2: you should get it of your pe andy when I 238 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,840 Speaker 2: think you should be planting something else and So I 239 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:46,560 Speaker 2: think that's one of the wonderful things about you know, 240 00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,600 Speaker 2: being a designer and kind of coming into circumstances where 241 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:52,360 Speaker 2: you know, somebody says, here, I want to I want 242 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:54,240 Speaker 2: you to do X, Y or Z. But by the way, 243 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:56,839 Speaker 2: I'm really attached to this peony outside my back urse. 244 00:13:56,880 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 2: I want you to find a place for that. Usually 245 00:13:59,080 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 2: I'm grinting my piece when I heard that, because I think, 246 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:02,960 Speaker 2: I don't want to think in panny. 247 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:04,880 Speaker 1: But it's gonna stick out like a sort of thumb. 248 00:14:07,480 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 3: It worked out. 249 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, you make it work. You make it where you 250 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,840 Speaker 1: got to make the client happy first and foremost. Uh, 251 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:19,080 Speaker 1: these plantings in it it all of them that I've seen, 252 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 1: whether it's out off in New York City or Chicago 253 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 1: or your work in Des Moines or other places. The 254 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:30,960 Speaker 1: attraction to wildlife, particularly with insects and pollinators is just 255 00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: absolutely Uh. It hits you in the chest when you 256 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:38,000 Speaker 1: approach these gardens. You notice it immediately, and it's it's 257 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:41,760 Speaker 1: such a fine part of the whole package. 258 00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 2: It adds, you know, an incredible dimension to the experience 259 00:14:47,480 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 2: of just living and being with the garden. And I 260 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 2: think you're right. I think it's one of the things 261 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 2: that when when folks experienced that for the first time, 262 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 2: you know, it does it does excite a certain interest 263 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,960 Speaker 2: that or awaken a certain interest maybe, uh, you know, 264 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 2: folks hadn't really thought about it considered before. I mean, 265 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 2: and so you know the way in which that happens 266 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 2: primarily is through a you know, a foundation of native plants. 267 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,200 Speaker 2: I mean, in our own practice, we've probably used seventy 268 00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:18,560 Speaker 2: five percent of our palettes, our plants native to the 269 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 2: region that we're working in. But you know that that's 270 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 2: a that's a sort of loose and flexible rule. Sometimes 271 00:15:24,400 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 2: it's one hundred percent, sometimes it might be a little 272 00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:27,680 Speaker 2: bit less. It just depends on where we're. 273 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 1: Where we're at, you're in a particularly good region for 274 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:34,320 Speaker 1: new naturalism, I think, not to rule out anywhere else, 275 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:37,560 Speaker 1: but you're out on the prairie in Des Moines, and 276 00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: that palette of plants alone is so fascinating and so 277 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:50,320 Speaker 1: under used in under under understood. How about that one. 278 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 1: I'm not articulate like you. 279 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,040 Speaker 2: Well, no, I think I think this palette of plants 280 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:58,680 Speaker 2: in the mid section of the country, you know, has 281 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 2: inspired a kind of global revolution about gardening. I mean, 282 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 2: you know, we're talking about a sensitivity to place. I mean, 283 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,280 Speaker 2: that's what animates us and our work is we want 284 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 2: to make you know, here look like here and not there. 285 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 2: I mean, we can have some creative license with that. 286 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 2: But I think your point is well taken, is that. 287 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, you look at you know, the 288 00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:21,680 Speaker 2: designers like Pete out Off and others, and it's clear 289 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 2: that an affection and an vicinity for plants that grow 290 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,200 Speaker 2: in this sort of broad mid section of the country 291 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 2: have certainly inspired a little romanticism and how we think 292 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:35,360 Speaker 2: about plantings today. 293 00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:38,720 Speaker 1: I think your point of about planning for place is 294 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:45,120 Speaker 1: so intriguing and again under understood, but you know, you 295 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:47,640 Speaker 1: think about it. I remember a long time ago, back 296 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 1: in the eighties, I went to Arizona. I went to Phoenix, 297 00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: which looked like you know New York, any eastern town, 298 00:16:55,080 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 1: every turf, all the same plants you would find, you know, 299 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: maple tree, these, you know, willows, whatever it would be. 300 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 1: And then I went to Tucson, which even at that 301 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:12,719 Speaker 1: time was very focused on their native plant palette, or 302 00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:18,640 Speaker 1: at least with drought tolerant you know, zeroscape type plants. 303 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:22,760 Speaker 1: And you know that it was an overwhelming sense of 304 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:26,959 Speaker 1: it was just interesting because man, you went to Tucson 305 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: in Arizona, you felt like you were in Arizona. And 306 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:32,160 Speaker 1: I feel like, if I go to Australia, I don't 307 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,200 Speaker 1: want to see American plants there. I want to see 308 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 1: what Australia looks like in their gardens. And if I 309 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:39,360 Speaker 1: go to Des Moines and go to one of your gardens, 310 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 1: I'm going to get a real sense of what it's 311 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:45,199 Speaker 1: like to live in Des Moines with your plant palette. 312 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:49,119 Speaker 2: Well, and I love that that anecdote because you know, 313 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 2: even just one hundred and twenty years ago in this country, 314 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:56,920 Speaker 2: we were having a very similar conversation about what was 315 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,879 Speaker 2: it called wild gardens at the time and native plants. 316 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 2: There was a real sort of romantic affection with identifying with, 317 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:07,760 Speaker 2: you know, the idea of what an American garden, an 318 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,000 Speaker 2: American landscape should look like. It was happening in architecture 319 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:12,919 Speaker 2: as well too. I mean, you look at, you know, 320 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 2: some of the great architectural highlights of the early twentieth century, 321 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:18,560 Speaker 2: and we had, you know, we had affordable houses that 322 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:22,040 Speaker 2: you know, people in residential neighborhoods could buy that expressed 323 00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 2: a character of the place that identified you know, the 324 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 2: prairie style with Francroyd Wright for instance, and you and others, 325 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:32,000 Speaker 2: and that that had a kind of way of saying, 326 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:35,119 Speaker 2: this is where here is versus wherever there is. And 327 00:18:35,520 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 2: we've we've kind of lost something about that. I mean, 328 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,880 Speaker 2: there's maybe maybe that's the Internet, maybe that's the fast place. 329 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:41,120 Speaker 7: Of the world. 330 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 2: You know, we don't have time to unpack all that today. 331 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 2: But there's a placelessness about our culture today that you know, 332 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:49,600 Speaker 2: we can just call up our phone and suddenly be, 333 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 2: you know, kind of anywhere. And I think there's a 334 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:54,600 Speaker 2: yearning out there maybe for some people to say, you know, 335 00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 2: I mean, maybe it's pride. Maybe we want to have 336 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 2: a little pride of our place. Maybe it's maybe it's 337 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 2: just uniqueness. The US is a big country. Is you 338 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,520 Speaker 2: know of ten, eleven, twelve hard in the zones? I mean, 339 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:08,080 Speaker 2: there's twenty some eco regions. Then how you cut them 340 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:10,199 Speaker 2: up more if you want to get finance feel about it. 341 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:13,720 Speaker 2: There's a lot to pack into this this country, and 342 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 2: a lot to celebrate and explore. And like you say, 343 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 2: when you go to Arizona, you want to see what 344 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:20,840 Speaker 2: Arizona looks like not some version of the of the 345 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 2: transported into a you know, in the place where it 346 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:24,680 Speaker 2: doesn't belong. 347 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, Williamsburg. You know, you don't want to see Williamsburg 348 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:32,359 Speaker 1: in Arizona. It just doesn't work. It doesn't work that well, 349 00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:38,320 Speaker 1: you know in the in horticultural circles, in the elite circles, 350 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:41,439 Speaker 1: when we just have a mini here, Kelly. But and 351 00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:44,399 Speaker 1: then we'll come back and we'll talk more. But it 352 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: seems like this is really catching on, not just in 353 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:51,600 Speaker 1: the with the people in in horticulture, but beyond. 354 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:55,800 Speaker 2: I think we're at the consp of a moment and 355 00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 2: it's very exciting. 356 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, it definitely is. Well, you're going to come back 357 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:04,520 Speaker 1: with us for the next segment, is that right, Kelly? Perfect? 358 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 1: Perfect perfect. We are talking with Kelly Norris, author, designer, 359 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:15,159 Speaker 1: and a whole lot more from Des Moines, Iowa. We 360 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:16,919 Speaker 1: will be back with him in just a minute. You 361 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,159 Speaker 1: are listening to Let's Garden with Scott Berlin. I'm here 362 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 1: with Paul Callazar eight eighty two fifty five. Will be 363 00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:24,320 Speaker 1: right back. 364 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,879 Speaker 5: Looking for an et DIY project that will totally transform 365 00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:55,960 Speaker 5: your kitchen or bath. Well, check out the Spreadstone Mineral 366 00:20:56,040 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 5: Select Countertop Refinishing Kit from Dice Coatings. 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You are listening to Let's Garden with Scott Berline. 384 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:40,480 Speaker 1: I just want to bring up a couple upcoming shows. 385 00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:44,879 Speaker 1: Next week we will have designer and gravel garden expert 386 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:49,680 Speaker 1: Jeff Epping on board and Irvin ATNX Gardener Extraordinaire from 387 00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:54,280 Speaker 1: Newfields in in Indianapolis. And then Mother's Day Saturday, we'll 388 00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 1: have Alan Armataghn and Cure back from the zoo. We 389 00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:01,040 Speaker 1: will talk herbaceous plants. Will take your calls on anything 390 00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:06,119 Speaker 1: annuals and perennials and not to be discriminatory. On May sixteenth, 391 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,040 Speaker 1: we'll go deep on woody plants with a bunch of 392 00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:13,000 Speaker 1: tree geeks, Christone Ron Roethis. John Butcher again will be 393 00:23:13,720 --> 00:23:16,840 Speaker 1: more than happy to take your woody plant questions. But 394 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,040 Speaker 1: right now I'm here with Paul Callers R from cincinn 395 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:24,480 Speaker 1: Botanical Garden and Zoo and Kelly Norris. And Kelly, Paul 396 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:25,560 Speaker 1: had a good question for you. 397 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:28,919 Speaker 9: Yeah, Kelly, excuse me. I was wondering whether or not 398 00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 9: you think or what your thoughts are on how sense 399 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:37,399 Speaker 9: of place has been made difficult by the adaptability of 400 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 9: plants that we have in our palates. 401 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: We like to choose plants. 402 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:44,800 Speaker 9: That are adapted to lots of situations, and you know, 403 00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:49,400 Speaker 9: has that made it more difficult to maintain a sense 404 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 9: of place because we can use things anywhere? 405 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 2: You know? The certainly there are a preponderance of plants 406 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 2: in the horticultural trade, the kinds of things folks can 407 00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:05,000 Speaker 2: go find the garden centers that you know, you can 408 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 2: find it hundreds of garden centers around the country. But 409 00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:10,960 Speaker 2: the interesting thing is, too, is that our sense of place, 410 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:13,840 Speaker 2: though is is very much achieved in the same way. 411 00:24:13,880 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 2: I mean, the ecological world runs on generalists, right, I mean, 412 00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:19,359 Speaker 2: there are you know, if they take a plant like 413 00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:23,480 Speaker 2: little bluespin, for instance, native to the whole lower forty 414 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 2: eight dates, practically, you know, it's a plant that says 415 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:29,840 Speaker 2: as much about Pennsylvania as it does about Iowa. And 416 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:31,760 Speaker 2: so I think I think some of that becomes in 417 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:34,320 Speaker 2: how you how you start to put together a palette 418 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,600 Speaker 2: of plants, how you kind of relate them. Maybe in 419 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 2: a more eastern position. You know, a plant like little 420 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 2: blue stem might be quite rare and only found in 421 00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,280 Speaker 2: certain places, you know, maybe that are dry enough to 422 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 2: support its life. Out here on the prairie, it can 423 00:24:49,800 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 2: be quite common and actually quite extensive in a kind 424 00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 2: of prairie or meadows type setting. And so so I 425 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:57,680 Speaker 2: think some of it does come down to the fact that, yeah, 426 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 2: the horticulture industry gives us a it gives gardeners a 427 00:25:00,600 --> 00:25:03,639 Speaker 2: palette of choices. But even within that palette of choices, 428 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:05,760 Speaker 2: I think there are plants that that sort of have 429 00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:08,720 Speaker 2: versatility as it can you know, it can work in 430 00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:10,800 Speaker 2: a lot of different gardens, in a lot of different places. 431 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:15,640 Speaker 1: Kelly, how do you, as a designer personally, how do 432 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:22,159 Speaker 1: you incorporate design into your naturalist gardens? Naturalism gardens? You know, 433 00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: how do you what are the keys the eye candy 434 00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 1: that tells a visitor that this is a garden not 435 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:30,919 Speaker 1: just a wild space. 436 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 2: We think a lot about patterns. We you know, we're 437 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,479 Speaker 2: not as you know a lot of gardeners that they 438 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:42,200 Speaker 2: might think about combinations and you know, twos and threes 439 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:45,199 Speaker 2: and fives and these kinds of you know, pairings of sorts. 440 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:47,879 Speaker 2: We maybe do that, I guess in one sense, but 441 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:50,160 Speaker 2: we think about it at a at a scale, even 442 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,600 Speaker 2: if we're working in a fairly small landscape. So we 443 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 2: we do that because you know, patterns are a kind 444 00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:58,399 Speaker 2: of a language visually that you know, people are accustomed to. 445 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 2: I mean, we we wear patterns as some of those 446 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:03,000 Speaker 2: most of us maybe, I mean we see we can 447 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 2: pick up patterns and you know, rhythm and sends to 448 00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:08,560 Speaker 2: people's sensibility about music and all this sorts of stuff. 449 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,199 Speaker 2: And so we think about those ways in which we 450 00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:13,640 Speaker 2: can take one or a few plant species in any 451 00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:17,120 Speaker 2: given season and turn up the volume on them and 452 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:20,120 Speaker 2: you know, use their their color, their texture, their form, 453 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 2: whatever their visual properties are to kind of stand out 454 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:27,080 Speaker 2: from the rest of it. And so, you know, often 455 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:29,639 Speaker 2: the research shows actually if you do that, you know, 456 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:32,560 Speaker 2: with just one, three, five species in a season, you 457 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,920 Speaker 2: could have fifty other species in the garden that might 458 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:38,399 Speaker 2: be in a more secondary role. They may not be 459 00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,439 Speaker 2: the stars of the show at that moment, and it 460 00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:43,080 Speaker 2: can lead people to start to understand the landscape a 461 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:45,239 Speaker 2: little bit more than if you just you know, kind 462 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:47,120 Speaker 2: of drop them out in the middle of a kind 463 00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:49,360 Speaker 2: of chaotic mess of all sorts of things. And so, 464 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:51,640 Speaker 2: you know, we try to think about ways in which 465 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:54,480 Speaker 2: we can set some plants up to be the stars 466 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,679 Speaker 2: of the show throughout the season and then you know, 467 00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 2: create permission for maybe a lot of other associate cast members. 468 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,720 Speaker 2: If we're talking about easy theater analogy. 469 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,720 Speaker 1: I noticed looking at your gardens last summer that texture 470 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 1: is a huge part of your designs. 471 00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:17,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know, I'm not a colorist the first 472 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:19,680 Speaker 2: and foremost. It's funny. One of the words we wanted 473 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:21,640 Speaker 2: the Philly Flower Show this year is for best use 474 00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:24,200 Speaker 2: of color, and I just I have to laugh because 475 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,360 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, color, you know, it certainly happens 476 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 2: in our world. I mean, it's not that we don't 477 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,720 Speaker 2: think about it, but it's not the first. It's it's 478 00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:32,800 Speaker 2: maybe the last thing we think about. You know, We're 479 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:36,400 Speaker 2: more interested in uh, you know, in form and shape 480 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,320 Speaker 2: and and and just you know, kind of textural differences 481 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:43,879 Speaker 2: between things, contrast between you know, something finer versus something coarse, 482 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,400 Speaker 2: for instance, and so you know, those are the features 483 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:48,199 Speaker 2: that we have to live with. And you know, in 484 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,760 Speaker 2: the gardens for longer, colors fleeting, So you know, those 485 00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:54,800 Speaker 2: are I think those are fairly traditional design principles, but 486 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:59,639 Speaker 2: that applied to a more dense and diverse kind of 487 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:04,400 Speaker 2: plan team have exceeding amounts of power for helping them, 488 00:28:04,640 --> 00:28:07,800 Speaker 2: you know, be kind of legible and understandable for people. 489 00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:12,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, and going back to color, you know, it's not 490 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 1: that naturalistic plants uh don't have color. Some have zinger 491 00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 1: power color, but most are more subtle and more often 492 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 1: than not in these designs, it comes down to foliage color, 493 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:30,639 Speaker 1: very subtle differences, but used correctly, can be very powerful. 494 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:36,000 Speaker 3: Yeah absolutely, I mean we just you know, just yesterday 495 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 3: I was in our nursery, you know, going through some things, 496 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 3: organizing some plants, and I was, you know, we have 497 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 3: again back to a little blue sim We have several 498 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 3: different forms of little blue stem in the nursery for 499 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 3: projects this year. 500 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:49,400 Speaker 2: One is kind of silver, one's kind of green, another 501 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,040 Speaker 2: one's kind of blue. I mean, just one one species, 502 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:54,760 Speaker 2: one very common native plant throughout the whole US. And 503 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,880 Speaker 2: you know there's three just immediate kind of color and 504 00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:01,720 Speaker 2: textural differences between just three different varieties of them, you know, 505 00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 2: all together, it's kind of a you know, it's almost 506 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,600 Speaker 2: like a tonal blend. I mean, you know, they all 507 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:09,760 Speaker 2: kind of look like they belong together, but they very 508 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 2: subtly between each other. It can be really compelling effect. 509 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 1: It really can. And you mentioned pattern being so important before, 510 00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:20,400 Speaker 1: but you know, another element of design I think is 511 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:22,720 Speaker 1: overlooked is a repetition. 512 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 2: Yeah absolutely, I mean we you know, we love a 513 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:29,880 Speaker 2: good beat that just keeps on going, right, I mean, 514 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 2: and that that right, something that I think is especially 515 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 2: powerful when you start to increase the complexity. It's like 516 00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:39,000 Speaker 2: if you can keep a couple elements just sort of steady, 517 00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 2: you know, steady as they go, either throughout the season 518 00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 2: or even even in a particular moment, it can do 519 00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:47,479 Speaker 2: a lot to kind of convey the idea of what 520 00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 2: you're trying to achieve. 521 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,840 Speaker 1: There, absolutely so, Kelly, You've got what was it two 522 00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:58,040 Speaker 1: current books on new naturalism, the one called the New Naturalism, 523 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:02,560 Speaker 1: I think, and then new one called Your Natural uh, 524 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 1: your Natural Garden uh, And that we talked a bit 525 00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:08,239 Speaker 1: about a little bit earlier. But that's more about like 526 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: how to how to weed a naturalistic garden, which isn't 527 00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:17,320 Speaker 1: necessarily as simple as as a more formal garden. 528 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 2: For sure, there are a couple of essays on you know, 529 00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,400 Speaker 2: what is a weed and how to weed? Because that's 530 00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:26,960 Speaker 2: that certainly is a different frame. 531 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,760 Speaker 3: Of mind that one one takes. 532 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 2: I when I was ethigrated to my botanical garden than 533 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,000 Speaker 2: a former life, uh, I used to try and cajole 534 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 2: volunteers into learning the names of weeds. There was, you know, 535 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:42,760 Speaker 2: an informal rule, as we've kept it on in our 536 00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:44,680 Speaker 2: life here is if you can't name it you can't 537 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 2: pull it. I guess now you don't have an excuse, 538 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,640 Speaker 2: because there's all these good apps now on your phone 539 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:51,040 Speaker 2: that I'll. 540 00:30:50,920 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 3: Tell you what it is. 541 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,560 Speaker 1: I I need to learn from that. I I've ignored 542 00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:58,520 Speaker 1: the names of weeds for far too long, I you know. 543 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 1: And but it is true. You every every year, every spring. 544 00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 1: Here I'm out there with the string trimmor and I'm like, oh, 545 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:14,160 Speaker 1: the great question, is that a plant? Where's that a weed? Kelly? Well? Absolutely, well, 546 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:16,920 Speaker 1: what are you working on right now? Okay, so you 547 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,080 Speaker 1: had the New Naturalism or your Natural Garden came out 548 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 1: a year ago, or have you got a book in 549 00:31:21,800 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 1: the works at all? 550 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:26,040 Speaker 2: No, no books in the works. We're we're knee deep 551 00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:30,640 Speaker 2: in uh and good projects. We've got plantings between Colorado 552 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 2: and Connecticut and all points in between right now. 553 00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, that'll keep you busy. Yeah, pleasure doing your Are 554 00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: you still doing your New Naturalism Academy online? These are 555 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: classes people can sign up for. 556 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:44,160 Speaker 2: That's that's right. One of the things that we think 557 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:46,680 Speaker 2: is so important is, uh, you know, we're we're out 558 00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:50,480 Speaker 2: there every day and in places learning about how these 559 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:53,360 Speaker 2: ideas are faring and and you know, maybe coming up 560 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:55,440 Speaker 2: with new ones, and we feel obligated to share that, 561 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:58,680 Speaker 2: and so we produce UH two times a year UH 562 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,920 Speaker 2: program all the New Naturalism Academy. It's kind of like 563 00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:07,600 Speaker 2: a college semester level course in design and horticulture and 564 00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:12,880 Speaker 2: ecology crammed into a virtual setting over twelve or so weeks. 565 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 2: And it's a lot of fun. We have a lot 566 00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 2: of fun producing it, and folks can learn more about 567 00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 2: that on our website too. 568 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 1: What else can you learn about from from your website 569 00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 1: or other ways they can reach out or get a 570 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:26,120 Speaker 1: hold of you or learn more about you. 571 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:30,800 Speaker 2: Absolutely, it's all there. You can contact us through the website. 572 00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:36,880 Speaker 2: That's Kellydnorris dot com. The project's page is probably the 573 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:40,120 Speaker 2: most popular section of the website by clicks. It's the 574 00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:44,400 Speaker 2: kind of a ever evolving or an expanding portfolio of 575 00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:47,040 Speaker 2: our projects is a good, you know, good reference if 576 00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:48,840 Speaker 2: you're out there trying to come up with ideas for 577 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 2: how to think about some of these things in your 578 00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:54,080 Speaker 2: own garden, you can certainly see how we've we've put 579 00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 2: some of these concepts we've been talking about to work. 580 00:32:57,800 --> 00:32:59,720 Speaker 1: I've got to thank you before we go, I've got 581 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:03,800 Speaker 1: to say thank you again, and we haven't talked that recently, 582 00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 1: but I got to thank you again for taking the 583 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:12,960 Speaker 1: time the day before the Perennial Plant Conference to give 584 00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:14,880 Speaker 1: me a personal tour of your garden. It was one 585 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:20,960 Speaker 1: hundred and ten degrees, I swear at least, and you 586 00:33:21,000 --> 00:33:24,960 Speaker 1: and David were out there slaving in this awful heat 587 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:29,200 Speaker 1: trying to get everything looking great for the tour, and 588 00:33:29,360 --> 00:33:32,000 Speaker 1: yet you generously gave me some time to look around, 589 00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:36,000 Speaker 1: and I greatly appreciate that and your time here this morning. 590 00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,800 Speaker 1: We really learned a lot, and I hope our listeners 591 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 1: enjoyed it. Thanks for being here. 592 00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 2: Oh my pleasure. It's always a pleasure. 593 00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:45,440 Speaker 3: Thanks so much. 594 00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,240 Speaker 1: Well, good talking to you. You're listening to Let's Garden 595 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:50,440 Speaker 1: with Scott Berlin. I'm here with Paul callis Art. We'll 596 00:33:50,440 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 1: be back with Gary Sullivan in just a couple of minutes. 597 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:08,480 Speaker 10: Are you time of spending a lot of time watering 598 00:34:08,520 --> 00:34:11,920 Speaker 10: your plants? Then try mixing soil moist water absorbing crystals 599 00:34:12,080 --> 00:34:14,200 Speaker 10: and the soil as your plant. They can reduce your 600 00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:17,440 Speaker 10: watering frequency as much as fifty percent. Iron Wilson here, 601 00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:20,120 Speaker 10: soil moist granules hold over two hundred times they're weighting 602 00:34:20,200 --> 00:34:22,160 Speaker 10: water and release it back to the plant as. 603 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 1: It needs it. 604 00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:25,759 Speaker 10: Soil Moist is ideal for patio planters hanging baskets that 605 00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:28,520 Speaker 10: dry out quickly. They're safe and friendly. Soil Moist can 606 00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:31,040 Speaker 10: be used indoors and out for all your planting needs 607 00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:34,920 Speaker 10: Vegetable gardens as well. The Secret of professional growers. Soil 608 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,080 Speaker 10: Moist available at leading garden centers. 609 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:37,319 Speaker 1: Well. 610 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,719 Speaker 4: Ants are known for being hardworking and industrious, which is 611 00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:42,960 Speaker 4: bad news for you when they end up in your house. 612 00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:45,120 Speaker 4: Hey Gary Selvin here, When you need to get rid 613 00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,759 Speaker 4: of ants fast, you need rescue ant baits. Rescue ant 614 00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:52,040 Speaker 4: bits are prebated, chold resistant and ready to use right 615 00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:55,520 Speaker 4: out of the box, no sticky liquids, no mess. Rescue 616 00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 4: ant baits are made in USA by the makers of 617 00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:01,880 Speaker 4: the popular rescue Flying Yellow Jacket traps. Learn more at 618 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 4: rescue dot com. 619 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:17,680 Speaker 8: That's r E s c Ue dot com. 620 00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,200 Speaker 1: Welcome back, you're listening to That's Garden with Scott Berlin. 621 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:23,440 Speaker 1: I'm here with Paul Calls are from the Cinsan Potanical 622 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 1: Gardener Zoo and now I am also with mister Gary 623 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:31,840 Speaker 1: Sullivan himself. Gary. Welcome, good morning, how you doing doing fine, 624 00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:35,360 Speaker 1: doing fine, good, good Gary. I'm getting some comments that 625 00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 1: I don't take enough calls, and I've got to I've 626 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:41,200 Speaker 1: got to address that. First of all, the calls haven't 627 00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:41,920 Speaker 1: been coming in. 628 00:35:42,840 --> 00:35:43,919 Speaker 7: Well, let's start one. 629 00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:47,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's because I haven't left a lot 630 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:50,719 Speaker 1: of room for calls. And I'll admit that having a 631 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:52,960 Speaker 1: lot of guests on has been a crutch to get 632 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 1: me through these first eight or nine weeks of doing 633 00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,279 Speaker 1: this show. It's been good information and things. But I'm 634 00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 1: getting a little more comfortable, probably just enough comfort to get, 635 00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:07,480 Speaker 1: you know, in trouble. But we'll be opening up some 636 00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:09,560 Speaker 1: space for more callers coming up, and we have a 637 00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:13,480 Speaker 1: couple shows May ninth and sixteenth especially that will be 638 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 1: great opportunities to call in about perennials, annuals, and shrubs 639 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:18,880 Speaker 1: and trees. 640 00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:20,000 Speaker 7: Sure. 641 00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 1: Sure, you've been at this a long time. You you 642 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:23,600 Speaker 1: could do this in your sleep. 643 00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,840 Speaker 7: I yeah, Well, my background's a little different than yours. 644 00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:33,719 Speaker 7: I worked retail hardware stores for twenty five years and 645 00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:40,160 Speaker 7: probably at about year twenty started doing the radio show. Yeah, 646 00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:43,319 Speaker 7: And in fact, I when I started, I kind of 647 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:45,960 Speaker 7: got the advice opposite of what you were getting. I 648 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:49,240 Speaker 7: was like, you have too much fun from the general 649 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,759 Speaker 7: manager at that point, you have too much fun doing 650 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:57,320 Speaker 7: that show. You need to be more stressed out, more 651 00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:02,080 Speaker 7: information driven and lecture driven. I go, well, listen, I'm 652 00:37:02,120 --> 00:37:05,920 Speaker 7: not I'm not a master plumber. I'm not a certified electrician. 653 00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:09,959 Speaker 7: I'm a hardware store junkie. I know how to put 654 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 7: things together and what do you use. People want to 655 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,320 Speaker 7: know what do you use, how to do it, and 656 00:37:14,360 --> 00:37:16,640 Speaker 7: where to get it, and that's who I am. Because well, 657 00:37:16,680 --> 00:37:18,880 Speaker 7: like you got to try to be this other And 658 00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:21,680 Speaker 7: I go like, that's not going to happen. I mean, 659 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:23,960 Speaker 7: it's not going to happen. Right, You do what you're 660 00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:27,799 Speaker 7: comfortable with doing. And I've always enjoyed helping people with 661 00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:32,120 Speaker 7: specific problems. So I just came on and I just 662 00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:34,920 Speaker 7: start giving out that phone number. And I always envisioned 663 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,920 Speaker 7: the radio show as you know, the old guy behind 664 00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:41,960 Speaker 7: the counter at the hardware store given answers. It seems 665 00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:45,080 Speaker 7: to have worked, and yeah, that was the vision I had. Yeah, 666 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:47,319 Speaker 7: you know, you got to do what you're comfortable with 667 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:51,680 Speaker 7: and it's all knowledge based and you know you're you're 668 00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:54,400 Speaker 7: trying to help people with their landscaping I tried to 669 00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:55,959 Speaker 7: help people with their house, and. 670 00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:01,160 Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm not always comfortable with myself, but 671 00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:05,600 Speaker 1: I've never are never comfortable trying to be someone else, So. 672 00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:10,040 Speaker 7: Well, that's that's true. I still I remember the conversation 673 00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:13,520 Speaker 7: with the GM vividly. I had three kids under six 674 00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:16,160 Speaker 7: years of age, and my wife's going like, now you're 675 00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:19,120 Speaker 7: going to work weekends and yeah, yeah, you know it 676 00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:22,880 Speaker 7: shouldn't be bet at all. And you know he was 677 00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:26,920 Speaker 7: really telling me to, as crazy as it sound, not 678 00:38:27,000 --> 00:38:27,880 Speaker 7: have as much fun. 679 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:29,880 Speaker 1: Yeah that sounds odd. 680 00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 7: You know, we just all have houses. We all want 681 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:36,400 Speaker 7: to protect that investment. We all want to find the 682 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,760 Speaker 7: easy way to do it. We all wanted to go fast, 683 00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:43,080 Speaker 7: and it doesn't always work that way, but you know, 684 00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:44,920 Speaker 7: you try the best to get him there. And then 685 00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:51,759 Speaker 7: thirteen weeks later he thanked me for changing. So I 686 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:53,759 Speaker 7: don't know, they must have got more sales into the 687 00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:55,560 Speaker 7: show because I didn't change at all. 688 00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:57,960 Speaker 1: But I'm glad you took my advice. You sound great. 689 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:00,480 Speaker 7: Yeah, that's kind of the way those two me win. 690 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:03,680 Speaker 7: And I don't think I've had a meeting since forty 691 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:04,239 Speaker 7: years ago. 692 00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:09,040 Speaker 1: I am learning that, you know, the feedback is few 693 00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:11,799 Speaker 1: and far between, and probably no news is good news. 694 00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:13,880 Speaker 7: Yeah right, yeah right. 695 00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:16,080 Speaker 1: What have you got coming up on your show today? 696 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 7: Well, you know, this is a time of year. I 697 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,880 Speaker 7: always call it like our super Bowl for home improvement 698 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:25,520 Speaker 7: in the spring. Everybody in gardening too. You know, everybody's 699 00:39:26,080 --> 00:39:28,160 Speaker 7: got the itch and they want to get things going 700 00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:30,400 Speaker 7: and get it done. So we do a lot this 701 00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:35,520 Speaker 7: time of year on painting cleaning, and we'll cover that today. 702 00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:38,680 Speaker 7: In fact, we have Bruce Yako on from Jall's Cleaning 703 00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:44,399 Speaker 7: or Jall's Cleaning Products, which is really cool. It's a 704 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:47,000 Speaker 7: bottle that you fill up with water and put a 705 00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:47,719 Speaker 7: cartridge in it. 706 00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:48,800 Speaker 1: Huh. 707 00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:53,040 Speaker 7: It's all pH balanced products and that bottle can be 708 00:39:53,080 --> 00:39:57,160 Speaker 7: reused up to thirty times. So from landfill issues with 709 00:39:57,280 --> 00:40:01,120 Speaker 7: plastics and stuff like that, he was ahead of the curve. 710 00:40:01,239 --> 00:40:04,839 Speaker 7: He's been a sponsors show probably for twelve years. He's 711 00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:09,080 Speaker 7: been doing this for years and it's literally a worldwide company. 712 00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:13,480 Speaker 7: He makes the cleaning products for submarines, that's how safe 713 00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:17,480 Speaker 7: they are in the Pentagon hospitals. So anyway, he's going 714 00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:18,960 Speaker 7: to join us for a half hour. We're going to 715 00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 7: talk about all the different type of cleaning products, and 716 00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:26,560 Speaker 7: we'll do just the normal patching concrete and ceiling decks 717 00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:30,239 Speaker 7: and painting bedrooms, the stuff that everybody's going to the 718 00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:32,560 Speaker 7: hardware store right now to get supplies with. That's what 719 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:33,560 Speaker 7: we'll be talking about. 720 00:40:33,600 --> 00:40:35,400 Speaker 1: And you'll probably get a lot of callers. 721 00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:37,759 Speaker 7: We'll get a lot of collars, and I'll give it. See, 722 00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:40,680 Speaker 7: I get to think I don't really have anybody tell me, 723 00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:45,400 Speaker 7: but I think it's a fault. I give the number constantly, Yeah, constantly. 724 00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:47,959 Speaker 7: It's like, I guess people get irritated at that. Maybe 725 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,120 Speaker 7: they do, maybe they don't. Nobody's ever said it, but 726 00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:56,080 Speaker 7: they call and invitation you know, exactly, yeah, exactly. Now, 727 00:40:56,160 --> 00:40:58,719 Speaker 7: you're doing great. Just keep it up, keep informing us 728 00:40:58,760 --> 00:40:59,560 Speaker 7: what we need to do. 729 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:02,240 Speaker 4: They just always tell me, Gary that you're very patient 730 00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:02,720 Speaker 4: with people. 731 00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:05,880 Speaker 7: I am, Yes, I wonder if my wife feels that way. 732 00:41:06,680 --> 00:41:09,600 Speaker 7: I can't tell you that one I have to ask, No, 733 00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:10,759 Speaker 7: never mind, I won't ask. 734 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:14,240 Speaker 1: There's how you behave with people and how you behave 735 00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:20,960 Speaker 1: with your family, two different things too. Yeah that I 736 00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:23,839 Speaker 1: think all of us are a little guilty of being 737 00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:26,279 Speaker 1: a little different. With that new stranger that we just 738 00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:28,960 Speaker 1: met and how we are with people. We could take 739 00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,560 Speaker 1: for granted a little bag. It's not that we should. 740 00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:37,160 Speaker 7: Exactly, so we'll be busy helping folks around the house. 741 00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:38,080 Speaker 7: Looking forward to it. 742 00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:40,440 Speaker 1: That sounds good. Now, these cleaning products, they can be 743 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:42,240 Speaker 1: used indoors outdoors. 744 00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,640 Speaker 7: Indoors outdoors. I mean they got it for granting. In fact, 745 00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:48,359 Speaker 7: I just choose one on the gas grill, the Weber grill, 746 00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:51,279 Speaker 7: and man, they got a kitchen de grease or it 747 00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:55,000 Speaker 7: is outstanding, it really is. And Danny uses their glass 748 00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:58,440 Speaker 7: cleaner and it's I've used it also, it's like no streaks. 749 00:41:58,280 --> 00:41:59,280 Speaker 7: It it's good stuff. 750 00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:01,839 Speaker 1: I will listen to your show and look into that 751 00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:05,399 Speaker 1: product because all of this is stuff I could use. 752 00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:08,000 Speaker 1: I mean our windows. We have eleven huge windows on 753 00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:10,480 Speaker 1: the first floor alone, right, you know it's such a 754 00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:12,600 Speaker 1: project to clean those and you get done, you feel 755 00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:15,160 Speaker 1: so good about yourself, and then the light comes in 756 00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:16,479 Speaker 1: at a certain angle and you're like. 757 00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:21,279 Speaker 7: Oh, well, you know they put you know, beautle in 758 00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:25,480 Speaker 7: glass cleaners. They put alcohol and glass cleaners, and a 759 00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:28,120 Speaker 7: lot of that stuff is kind of what causes the streaks. 760 00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:32,360 Speaker 7: I mean, good microfiber tile and a pH neutral glass cleaner. 761 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,480 Speaker 7: With none of that gunk in there, you won't have streaks. 762 00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 1: Well, well, I'll be back with you at roughly nine 763 00:42:38,920 --> 00:42:42,040 Speaker 1: point fifteen. Yes, sir, I want to thank Paul kulas 764 00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:46,000 Speaker 1: Are for being here today, really appreciate that. And then 765 00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:50,000 Speaker 1: we have thanks to Matt Bazel from Churchill Downs from 766 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:53,080 Speaker 1: talking with for talking with us. That was great. Kelly 767 00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:56,560 Speaker 1: Norris of course was amazing. Danny you were amazing again 768 00:42:56,640 --> 00:43:00,600 Speaker 1: as always, So thank you and all our listeners for listening. 769 00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:03,479 Speaker 1: And uh, we'll see you next week. I've got Jeff 770 00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 1: Epping and Irvin atn coming. It'll be a lot of fun. 771 00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:10,800 Speaker 1: Tune us in. Stay tuned for Gary Sullivan fifty five krs.