Speaker 1: Quotes stereotypes that are just simply not true. And this
Speaker 1: is true in every occupation. Right, if you're a doctor,
Speaker 1: people think you're a B and C. If you're a lawyer,
Speaker 1: they think you're D, E and F, whatever the case
Speaker 1: may be. But what about you know, stereotypes about Christians
Speaker 1: or pastors and both positive and negative traits that you
Speaker 1: had come across in all your years with a church.
Speaker 2: Well, I went to a career day one day to
Speaker 2: me inviting me to come in and talk about being
Speaker 2: a pastor for a bunch of sixth graders, And I
Speaker 2: said to him, I said, all right, well, I'm gonna
Speaker 2: draw a picture. It's like cartoon a little bit. So
Speaker 2: I'm gonna draw a picture of a pastor. Tell me
Speaker 2: what they're like. And the hands started going up, and
Speaker 2: they said, what kind of eyes does he have? Angry eyes?
Speaker 2: I got angry eyes. I give this big pushy eyebrow.
Speaker 2: What does his mouth look like? Big mouth? He's yelling
Speaker 2: at people all the time. Really okay, So I drew
Speaker 2: a big mouth and as welles he got giant bible
Speaker 2: in his hand. All right, what's his other hand doing?
Speaker 2: He's pointing his finger and wagging at the people. I
Speaker 2: draw this caricature of what they thought of when they
Speaker 2: thought of a pastor. And then I turned to them
Speaker 2: and I said.
Speaker 3: Do I look like that?
Speaker 2: No, except once smart in the back. Yes. And I
Speaker 2: think I think that's the case for almost all of us,
Speaker 2: related to what we believe, what we do, our occupation,
Speaker 2: there's all these caricatures of that. I mean, every time
Speaker 2: I tell somebody eventually that I'm a pastor, or not
Speaker 2: just a pastor, I'm a person of faith, I'm a
Speaker 2: follower of Jesus, there's kind of this awkward silence, you know,
Speaker 2: and then they're like.
Speaker 4: Uh uh, my third cousin twice removed, read the Bible once,
Speaker 4: and like I get reduced, like the only thing I
Speaker 4: that my whole life is about this one little thing.
Speaker 4: And you know, we all love caricatures when you go
Speaker 4: to King's Island or you go to the fair.
Speaker 2: Or something, so they draws a caricature, but we don't
Speaker 2: like it of ourselves. And we often do that to
Speaker 2: others too, And a caricature artist will take one aspect
Speaker 2: exaggerated beyond the truth. I didn't realize that it's such
Speaker 2: a big forehead, my nose isn't that big. I think
Speaker 2: for a lot of people, they have caricatures of Christians.
Speaker 2: They've never met a real Christian and so all they
Speaker 2: know is what they've heard from a distance. Or maybe
Speaker 2: there certainly we've all been bad examples. I've been a
Speaker 2: bad example too, where you think, well, I think Christians
Speaker 2: are all brainless because I've heard that faith is the
Speaker 2: opposite of evidence, which of course we don't believe that,
Speaker 2: but they've heard that. Or all Christians are hypocrites, because
Speaker 2: there's plenty of us that are hypocrites, and even I'm
Speaker 2: a hypocrite. But part of hypocrisy is trying to own
Speaker 2: what you do wrong and say, man, I did live
Speaker 2: up to on standards. Again, I want to admit that,
Speaker 2: and I'm trying to do better, versus sitting on a
Speaker 2: soapbox and pretending that you're suddenly perfect, that you have
Speaker 2: the right to look down at other people. I think
Speaker 2: that's the other caricatures that Christians who are just judgmental.
Speaker 2: They're not graceful, they're merciful. There's an old Simpsons episode
Speaker 2: where Ned Flanders is on his way to church camp
Speaker 2: and the Homer turns them and says church camp is
Speaker 2: that where you Christians go to learn how to be
Speaker 2: more judgmental. So I think there are lots of caricatures
Speaker 2: and that ownership is on us and one not careature
Speaker 2: other people. But as Christians, I want to try and
Speaker 2: show that I'm not like the caricature. I'm distinct, I'm different,
Speaker 2: I'm winsome, I'm honest. I do own my own stuff.
Speaker 2: So that's kind of the ownership, and that's not just
Speaker 2: true of us as people of faith. I mean, if
Speaker 2: you're liberal, you're probably the caricature of conservatives. You're conservative,
Speaker 2: you're caricatural liberals. If you kind of grew up in
Speaker 2: the Union, you have a caricature of you at the
Speaker 2: company shop and the owners and the white collar workers
Speaker 2: are like rice versus. I think all of us need
Speaker 2: to be careful to not reduce people down to some
Speaker 2: sliver of who they are.
Speaker 1: But you know, we do it all the time. I mean,
Speaker 1: you're one hundred percent right. I wish we didn't do it.
Speaker 1: There are a lot of things I wish I didn't do.
Speaker 1: I wish I don't do. I want to get into
Speaker 1: a couple of them specifically, though certainly there are a
Speaker 1: lot of people in every walk of life that are hypocritical.
Speaker 1: You know, a Christian, for a sample, fails to live
Speaker 1: up to the message of love and forgiveness, but they
Speaker 1: preach and they're quick to judge others. That's more of
Speaker 1: a case help me here, now, pastor. That's more of
Speaker 1: a case of someone who's probably not a Christian. I
Speaker 1: don't mean, I don't mean to throw a blanket over
Speaker 1: people who are not people of faith. I don't mean
Speaker 1: it that way. What I mean is is that if
Speaker 1: you think someone is a Christian and you see that
Speaker 1: they're failing to live up to that standard, I guess
Speaker 1: you could say, is that person really a Christian after all?
Speaker 2: Is that fair?
Speaker 3: Fair point?
Speaker 2: Well, I think there's one part of it. I also
Speaker 2: think that I don't know anyone who lives up during expectations,
Speaker 2: and that's religious or irreligious alike. So, but I do
Speaker 2: think if you don't see any fruit, if you don't
Speaker 2: see any indication of someone, I mean, the Bible can
Speaker 2: be reduced down to two statements. Jesus just brilliantly reduced
Speaker 2: all the complexity of the Bible to two things. You know,
Speaker 2: you're learning how to love God and you're learning how
Speaker 2: to love people. So if you don't see any evidence
Speaker 2: of someone learning how to love God or learn to
Speaker 2: love people, I would say they probably haven't first seen
Speaker 2: the message that God loves them and God loves people.
Speaker 2: So it begins with you before I try and act
Speaker 2: out on something. The motivation is, man, I saw somebody
Speaker 2: do this to me. When you realize that God the
Speaker 2: universe have and so compassionate to you, you're like, man,
Speaker 2: I didn't really deserve it, and he was so patient
Speaker 2: with me, and I want to try and be more
Speaker 2: patient and more compassionate with others and the other end. Again,
Speaker 2: we never live up to our own standards, so I
Speaker 2: think it's in our own imperfect way. We are trying
Speaker 2: to make progress, not perfection. And I think a person
Speaker 2: of real faith, the main characteristic you would see in
Speaker 2: them is humility, which is I'm humble. It doesn't mean
Speaker 2: I'll struggle there against the bride, but it means I'm
Speaker 2: humble enough to realize, man, I really don't have my
Speaker 2: act together, and God love me, and I'm open to feedback.
Speaker 2: I'm open to where I might be wrong, because the
Speaker 2: whole message of the Bible is that I did a
Speaker 2: lot of stuff wrong. So whatever my boss is mentioning,
Speaker 2: my wife is mentioning, my kids are mentioning, this might
Speaker 2: be one of those things. I think humility would be
Speaker 2: one of the main things you'd want to see. But
Speaker 2: certainly there are people who pretend to be one thing
Speaker 2: and they're not, or they think they're one thing that
Speaker 2: they're not. And I do think it's fair to say
Speaker 2: you can, you know, judge them by their fruit, or
Speaker 2: you can examine and look for fruit in their life.
Speaker 2: But I do think anytime you think there's some magic
Speaker 2: wand where there's perfect people, I mean, if there's a
Speaker 2: way to make imperfect people perfect on this earth, I
Speaker 2: mean we should bottle that and sell it. Pap would
Speaker 2: be drinking it and passing around to their kids and otherwise,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: The other one that that always bothers me and I
Speaker 1: do hear this from time to time, and I just
Speaker 1: scratch my head, I shake my head in disbelief is
Speaker 1: that oftentimes a Christian is perceived as being anti intellectual
Speaker 1: or anti science. Let's start with the science part. Some
Speaker 1: of the greatest scientists household names have been some of
Speaker 1: the best Christians out there, and their science in fact
Speaker 1: led them to being more Christian.
Speaker 2: With every science we have is developed by a Bible
Speaker 2: believing Christian. You think about Louis Pasture and the pastorization
Speaker 2: of milk, getting rid of the idea of a spontaneous generation.
Speaker 2: There was a common belief that you could just throw
Speaker 2: rags in a corner and poof, I would jump a mouse.
Speaker 2: And he came out with the it's not really a law,
Speaker 2: but biogenesis is called which life comes from life. You
Speaker 2: can't get life from non life. You think about the
Speaker 2: father of astronomy, Johann Kepler, and again this guy was
Speaker 2: a Bible believing Chrision Isaac Newton, who was an absolute genius.
Speaker 2: And you can actually google this. You can look he wrote.
Speaker 2: He invented calculus as we know it. He invented everything
Speaker 2: we know about gravitational poll at the time, and he
Speaker 2: wrote as much about the Bible as he did about
Speaker 2: gravitational pool in algebra. So these are really brilliant people.
Speaker 2: And I think that caricature that kind of check your
Speaker 2: brain to door if you're a Christian comes from an
Speaker 2: inaccurate but well traveled phrase about faith. People will say, well,
Speaker 2: faith is the opposite of evidence. And every time I
Speaker 2: hear that on TV, and I hear it all the time,
Speaker 2: I want to throw some up at the TV. Faith
Speaker 2: is not the oposite the absence of evidence. That's called ignorance.
Speaker 2: Faith is putting your confidence in the evidence. You can
Speaker 2: have as much faith as you want in sin ice
Speaker 2: and you're still going to fall through. But you can
Speaker 2: have just a little bit of faith in thick eyes
Speaker 2: and you can walk on it. That's why Jesus says,
Speaker 2: it's not the size of your faith, it's what you
Speaker 2: put your faith in. I think of it this way.
Speaker 2: Just to science, for example, what makes more sense a
Speaker 2: rational god create a rational universe that can be studied rationally.
Speaker 2: That makes a lot of sense. Or an irrational process
Speaker 2: create a rational world that can be studied rationally. Even
Speaker 2: the idea of rationality is built on the foundation that
Speaker 2: there was a mind that created the universe, and that
Speaker 2: that mind was rational and want us to discover about
Speaker 2: him and about his universe, and all of that flows
Speaker 2: out of the very idea of a Christian worldview.
Speaker 1: The last one I want to get to before we
Speaker 1: let you go is the idea the stereotype out there
Speaker 1: yet those of faith are pushy. You know, they're very
Speaker 1: aggressive and trying to convert others. And you told a
Speaker 1: story the other day involving bread crumbs.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, if you think about how most people get
Speaker 2: influence to do anything. Number one, they don't know anyone
Speaker 2: who believes what you believe, and they don't like anyone
Speaker 2: who believes that you believe. And so the first step
Speaker 2: is recognizing, like any good communicator, where's my audience at
Speaker 2: they have no conscious awareness of me or my message.
Speaker 2: So the first step is honestly, in anything that you
Speaker 2: don't know much about, having a positive attitude toward that person,
Speaker 2: and so that person doesn't come across pushy. They're just
Speaker 2: going to drop a bread crumb. And they mentioned they
Speaker 2: went to church this weekend when you said stuff. And
Speaker 2: if you show interest, you know, they may keep talking.
Speaker 2: If you don't show interests, they're smart enough to shut up.
Speaker 2: And I think a lot of us, you know, it
Speaker 2: doesn't matter what it is, whether it's the stereotypical Amway
Speaker 2: salesman when you're a kid, or the multi marketing person
Speaker 2: you're like, listen, can't you read the room? Here? People?
Speaker 2: The cluephones ring and I'm not interested, But However, at
Speaker 2: some point, maybe if you're our good neighbor, the way
Speaker 2: you're living your life, the way you love your spouse,
Speaker 2: the way you parents your kids, people just notice and
Speaker 2: they'll start to have a positive attitude towards you as
Speaker 2: a messenger of that message. And then I get curious,
Speaker 2: and again you're dropping breadcrumbs about You're just talking about
Speaker 2: your life, right, my life. You know what happened this weekend? Well,
Speaker 2: I have a life, and I had to fight. But
Speaker 2: I realized later I need to go back and apologize. Really,
Speaker 2: I don't know people who typically talk about the fact
Speaker 2: they fight with their wife, and you admitted that, you apologize,
Speaker 2: I really struggle with pride, And suddenly they're a little interested,
Speaker 2: and it's like, tell me more about that, and you're
Speaker 2: looking for that that tell me more about that moment.
Speaker 2: And so part of not being pushy with any subject
Speaker 2: is honestly living your life authentically, being a genuine article
Speaker 2: of owning your own stuff. So you show that I'm
Speaker 2: not like the hypocrites in the sense that I own it.
Speaker 2: When I'm a hypogrite, you know, I try and be
Speaker 2: gracious toward other people, just towards myself and others, And
Speaker 2: I think that's what people are looking for, the genuine article.
Speaker 2: So how can I be the genuine article? How do
Speaker 2: I investigate? You might say, no, I don't believe those
Speaker 2: Christian people because I got a bad caricature. I would
Speaker 2: just encourage you to investigate and get to know one
Speaker 2: that's not that way and say what makes them distinct?
Speaker 2: And is there something there? Is? All of us as
Speaker 2: human beings, we have questions about the big things in life.
Speaker 2: Who am I? What happens when I die? What's the
Speaker 2: problem with life? What's the solution with life? And that's
Speaker 2: why christian too, and breadcrumbs. You're dropping the benefits. You're
Speaker 2: just always talking with the benefits to your life, which
Speaker 2: is you know, I just lost my grandmother. This is
Speaker 2: not your story of hypthetically. You just lost my grandmother
Speaker 2: last week, and man, I'm so glad I get to
Speaker 2: see her again. That might be a bread crumb, but
Speaker 2: it's also true part of when you deal with death.
Speaker 2: There's a real hope you can rub into your grief
Speaker 2: that Christianity offers. It's very unique. It comes across in humility,
Speaker 2: it comes across and apologizing. It's just you're talking about
Speaker 2: your regular life. But you are dropping breadcrumbs and see
Speaker 2: if people are interested.
Speaker 3: Well, this is teddy you.
Speaker 2: People don't carry what you know until they know that
Speaker 2: you care. So be a person who cares absolutely.
Speaker 1: And that's great advice, even for those that have not
Speaker 1: reached a point in their life where they're a spiritual person,
Speaker 1: but certainly fighting and avoiding and at least being open
Speaker 1: minded to stereotypes. Chad, have a great rest of your day.
Speaker 1: We'll look forward to catching up with you again next week.
Speaker 2: Sir, good time, Thanks so much.
Speaker 1: All righty Chad Hooven kind enough to join us each
Speaker 1: and every Wednesday at this time for plane Glass, stained Glass, Well,
Speaker 1: joining us about every ten minutes on a regular basis,
Speaker 1: our good buddy, Chuck Ingram Chuck.
Speaker 3: What's the very latest on the roadway? Latest is a
Speaker 3: new accident. It's westbound two seventy five before you get
Speaker 3: to the new Richmond exit. Traffics now backing up to
Speaker 3: five mile, and the eastbound two seventy five was running
Speaker 3: slow from Kelwogg to that new construction layout near the
Speaker 3: new Richmond ramp. This from the UC Health Tramfhing Center.
Speaker 3: You see health weaightfall Center are off for a surgical
Speaker 3: and medico Obcitycaren expertise called five one three nine three
Speaker 3: nine two two sixty three. That's nine three nine twenty
Speaker 3: two sixty three southbound seventy five. Better pass the wreck
Speaker 3: at Cincinnati Dayton. What's left now is over on the
Speaker 3: right shoulder. Also improving southbound seventy one pasts the accident
Speaker 3: in your fields. Irdle break lights start in near two
Speaker 3: seventy five and continue down to Red Bank on southbound
Speaker 3: seventy one. Chuck Ingram News Radio seven hundred walw y WCPO.
Speaker 1: Nine first tenty four cast presented by our buddy Jennifer
Speaker 1: catch Market. Is chili out there? I mean chili. We're
Speaker 1: still in the low twenties. The sun will breakthrough a
Speaker 1: little bit today, We'll see some sunshine up to thirty four.
Speaker 1: Then tonight good chance of another half inch to an
Speaker 1: inch of snow, especially for those north of the Ohio River.
Speaker 1: Low is twenty eight Tomorrow suns in cloud again high
Speaker 1: up to thirty Tomorrow night we're all the way down
Speaker 1: to fifteen degrees, and then on Friday gonna stay cold,
Speaker 1: sun clouds but only up to thirty seven degrees and
Speaker 1: our lows at night over the weekend into the mid twenties.
Speaker 1: Want to thank Danny Gleese and our producer for all
Speaker 1: his outstanding work as usual, and we close every single
Speaker 1: program by inviting you to consider, just considerate. I'm going
Speaker 1: to pick up my daughter's shelter pet right now. She
Speaker 1: worked at a animal shelter in Fort Worth, Texas when
Speaker 1: she was going to college and brought Journey Girl all
Speaker 1: the way home. And boy do we love her. And
Speaker 1: I think you'll find that if you go get a
Speaker 1: shelter pet, you will fall in love as well. Eight
Speaker 1: fifty six seven Undrewlwis Report. It's sponsored by Land of
Speaker 1: Illusion Christmas Glow