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Speaker 1: Do you want to be an American idiot?

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Speaker 2: He's got a Flowe show on seven hundred WLW that

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Speaker 2: we got some breaking news to share with you this

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Speaker 2: morning about crime in Cincinnati. Robert Shaw has now been

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Speaker 2: charged in the murder with that drive by shooting. He

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Speaker 2: killed a thirty four old man by the name of

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Speaker 2: Justin Johnson right after Thursday night football. This is on

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Speaker 2: Sycamore in front of the in Between Tavern. Happened about

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Speaker 2: two am, so people are still downtown celebrating the Big

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Speaker 2: Bengals when Shaw was wearing an ankle monitor at the time.

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Speaker 2: Does the story sound familiar?

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Speaker 3: Sure?

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Speaker 2: And the reason why I was under a house arrest

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Speaker 2: so to speak, was carried concealed weapon, illegal gun possession

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Speaker 2: and here he is being held on that, being about

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Speaker 2: to go and trial on that, and now he's out

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Speaker 2: there doing it again. So initially he was released on

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Speaker 2: a twenty thousand dollars bond with the electronic monitoring that

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Speaker 2: was back in June. Also, the suspect in the Fountain

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Speaker 2: Square shooting last week has turned himself in. Twenty four

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Speaker 2: year old Shaquille Ferguson said it's self defense because the

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Speaker 2: people that he shot at through the window of City

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Speaker 2: Chicken on Fountain Square were actually armed themselves and pointing

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Speaker 2: a gun at him. The only problem with that argument

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Speaker 2: from Clyde Bennett is that mister Ferguson was already on

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Speaker 2: probation in July for a violent crime, which means he's

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Speaker 2: under disability and shouldn't have had the gun that he

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Speaker 2: shot the window out and at the people to the

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Speaker 2: City Bird. So we're back to this question. Is our

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Speaker 2: probation and monitoring system completely broken and beyond repair? On

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Speaker 2: that is the honorable Betsy Sunderman, She's a judge in

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Speaker 2: Hamlin County, joining the show to discuss here on seven

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Speaker 2: hundred WLW.

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Speaker 4: How are you good morning, I'm great, how are you?

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Speaker 2: I'm doing final though you hear these stories, I'd love

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Speaker 2: to not be talking about violent crime in Cincinnati. But

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Speaker 2: you know, we have shoes dropping and now we know

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Speaker 2: the backgrounds of the individuals and jackets on Robert Shaw

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Speaker 2: and Shaquille Ferguson. You have two people yet again that

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Speaker 2: should not be armed by law, and yet there they are.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly, And if there's, if there are any issues

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Speaker 4: with probation monitoring right now, it is interesting for your

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Speaker 4: lists to know who is in charge of the probation officers.

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Speaker 4: It's the judges. The judges hire the probation officers and

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Speaker 4: make sure they're doing their jobs. So if we're having

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Speaker 4: issues with probation monitoring, I mean, I haven't heard this

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Speaker 4: issue before in the past. And it's interesting.

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Speaker 5: Now we have a.

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Speaker 4: Lot of Democrat judges who are in charge of the

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Speaker 4: probation department and that seems to be the big change,

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Speaker 4: and now we're not very happy with probation monitoring. So,

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Speaker 4: for example, about a month ago, the Democrat majority of

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Speaker 4: judges and Common Police Criminal Court decided to get rid

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Speaker 4: of some of these, well all of the probation substations.

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Speaker 4: So there used to be these substations in the most

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Speaker 4: violent neighborhood and people who are on probation could go

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Speaker 4: meet with those probation officers there, and the probation officers

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Speaker 4: could set up shop there and they could visit people

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Speaker 4: in their homes. But now the Democrat judges have gotten

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Speaker 4: rid of those and they said, well, it's more efficient

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Speaker 4: because now our probation officers can all be downtown. Well

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Speaker 4: that's true, maybe it's more efficient, as far as you know,

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Speaker 4: they don't have to drive places, but they're not able

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Speaker 4: to monitor people.

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Speaker 3: They're not in the community.

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Speaker 2: So now they got it a far further to monitor

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Speaker 2: the people instead of being in the neighborhood. It'd be

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Speaker 2: kind of like just having one big police station district

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Speaker 2: one as opposed to the multi different districts in and

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Speaker 2: around Cincinnati. For cops, you put them where the people

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Speaker 2: in the crimes.

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Speaker 4: Are exactly, and if they're visiting people in their homes,

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Speaker 4: then people are picking up more violations when the probation

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Speaker 4: officers are seeing things in their home. So of course

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Speaker 4: the stats are going to show a year from now

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Speaker 4: that there are fewer probation violations, but that's because the

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Speaker 4: monitor monitoring is going to be subpar, and as we

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Speaker 4: see the monitoring get worse and worse, we're going to

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Speaker 4: see people out there offending.

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Speaker 5: For example.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I really can't speak specifically to a case,

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Speaker 4: but if there's a case where someone, for example, is

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Speaker 4: on the ankle monitor but has privileges for something, sometimes

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Speaker 4: it's hard to monitor those privileges. So like let's say

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Speaker 4: I was on an ankle monitor and I had privileges

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Speaker 4: to go to work. Well, that's easy because I work

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Speaker 4: at one location and I work from the same time

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Speaker 4: I start and the same time I end every day.

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Speaker 4: But a lot of people don't have jobs like that.

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Speaker 4: A lot of people, you know, maybe they work construction,

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Speaker 4: or they work at a hospital, or they work odd hours.

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Speaker 4: And how do you monitor someone when they always say, well,

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Speaker 4: I was on my way to a construction job.

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Speaker 2: Or in the cases this is Betsy Sunderman ferguson the

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Speaker 2: Fountain Square shoot at Teddy Bird. This young man has

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Speaker 2: a two cases pending for aggravated assault, both with a

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Speaker 2: weapon specification. There he shot someone two days prior, allegedly

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Speaker 2: in Northside before he shot the window out in Fountain

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Speaker 2: Square and shout at the people there, And yet he

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Speaker 2: was on probation from the other one saying, hey, listen,

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Speaker 2: as long as you're out looking for a job, it's fine.

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Speaker 3: I don't know if that's a good idea.

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Speaker 2: You turn your application at City Bird and then turn

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Speaker 2: around and shoot their window out, albeit not to shoot

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Speaker 2: at the bird's window, shoot the people in the bird.

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Speaker 2: But still, I'm pretty sure, you know, if I'm doing

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Speaker 2: the hiring that kind of behaviors frowned upon.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I guess it depends what kind of job they're

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Speaker 4: trying to book, but it's unlikely that that would meet

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Speaker 4: the job description.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 4: But by having these rules that seem really tough, but

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Speaker 4: then not enforcing them properly, this is the way that

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Speaker 4: the politicians can say we're combating crime but really doing nothing.

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Speaker 4: For example, like the mayor and his juvenile curfew. Whenever

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Speaker 4: a juvenile either shoot someone or get shot, he says,

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Speaker 4: we're going to tighten up this curfew. But then if

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Speaker 4: you look at the actual rules of the juvenile curfew,

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Speaker 4: it says if a child is out, if someone under

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Speaker 4: eighteen is out and they say that they're on their

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Speaker 4: way to work or on their way home from work,

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Speaker 4: you can't make them go home, or you can't violate

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Speaker 4: them for the curfew. If they say that they are

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Speaker 4: exercising their First Amendment rights, which could be the freedom

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Speaker 4: of speech, assembly, they could freedom of the.

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Speaker 5: Press, to.

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Speaker 1: Church.

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Speaker 2: They're on their way to church, Betsy, when they shot

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Speaker 2: that person exactly.

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Speaker 4: And then even if the kid says, you know, I'm

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Speaker 4: not I have no exception that fits, then the police

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Speaker 4: all they can do is say, you know, we'd really

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Speaker 4: like you to go home. And if the kid says no,

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Speaker 4: Then they'd say, well, we'd really like you to go

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Speaker 4: to this, uh, this rec center, and if the kid

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Speaker 4: says no, they can't, they can't do anything. So it's

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Speaker 4: great that the mayor's on TV saying we're tightening up

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Speaker 4: this curfew. If if you're there and you're doing anything bad,

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Speaker 4: we're going to arrest. But it's just not playing out

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Speaker 4: like that, all right.

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Speaker 2: Betsy Sunderman, Judge Sunderman is here on the show, and

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Speaker 2: we're talking about probation and monitoring systems. Are they broken

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Speaker 2: beyond repair? Robert Shaw, that was the man who's now

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Speaker 2: been charged the drive by shooting. They killed thirty year

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Speaker 2: old Justin Johnson after Thursday night football right right near

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Speaker 2: the in between tavern on Thursday night Friday morning. He

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Speaker 2: was already out on a lot. He was wearing the

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Speaker 2: ankle monitor at the time he shot the individual in

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Speaker 2: the car. Justin Johnson form what I understand. People I

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Speaker 2: know knew this guy and said, yeah, he's a professional,

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Speaker 2: you know, seemed to be an upstanding guy. I don't

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Speaker 2: know why he and Robert Shaw got into a beef

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Speaker 2: and what was over. We don't know that, but the

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Speaker 2: background is not Justin Johnson is not a street criminal.

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Speaker 2: He's a professional, or was a professional before he was

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Speaker 2: murdered in the Shaquille Ferguson shooting a City Bird chicken.

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Speaker 2: He was armed again, had priors, who's out on probation

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Speaker 2: for a violent crime, and he shot the window out

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Speaker 2: and trying to shoot at the people inside City Bird.

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Speaker 2: His attorney, Clyd Bennett cle m self defense. We'll see

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Speaker 2: about that. I'm not quite sure how that works within

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Speaker 2: the law. If you're prohibited from having a weapon because

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Speaker 2: you're on probation and you shoot at someone, I'm not

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Speaker 2: quite sure that that is going to it's it's not

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Speaker 2: like ofsetting penalties in the NFL. And then you play

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Speaker 2: it over in that regard to Betsy sentiment though, And

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Speaker 2: I think it's interesting in pointing out, because we've talked

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Speaker 2: about the problem in its progressivism in Cincinnati.

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Speaker 3: That that's fueling this.

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Speaker 2: It's because we want to hands off no bail policy

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Speaker 2: and we want to be kindler and gentlemen people who

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Speaker 2: are suspected at crimes because their life is already difficult,

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Speaker 2: and well, it just gives the sociopaths out there more

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Speaker 2: license to do stuff like this. I will point out, however,

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Speaker 2: in both those cases in Sean Ferguson, those are both

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Speaker 2: conservative Republican judges that ordered them on monitoring, and that

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Speaker 2: would be Judge dink Locker and Judge Ruleman. Does that

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Speaker 2: change the math a little bit on.

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Speaker 4: This, Well, I'll tell you those are two of the

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Speaker 4: judges who give the biggest bombs. So without being able

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Speaker 4: to talk to I can't call them and ask them

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Speaker 4: about the case and then talk about it on the video,

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Speaker 4: right right, But I would trust that those judges would

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Speaker 4: set appropriate bonds. There's a trifecta that kind of effects

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Speaker 4: every time someone's upset about someone being on parole or

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Speaker 4: probation and being out there and committing crimes. There's a

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Speaker 4: trifecta that affects all this. There's the police, there's the

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Speaker 4: probation department, and the judges. So the police are controlled by,

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Speaker 4: of course the police chief, who is controlled by the

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Speaker 4: city manager, who is ultimately controlled by the mayor. So

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Speaker 4: the police department is controlled by the mayor. And then

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Speaker 4: we have probation, which I already told you is controlled

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Speaker 4: by the judges, the now liberal Democrat judges. And then

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Speaker 4: we have the judges themselves, which are now a majority

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Speaker 4: Democrat liberal judges, so that basically the two groups that

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Speaker 4: are controlling all this is the mayor, the city manager,

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Speaker 4: the city administration, and the liberal judges. So if we're

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Speaker 4: seeing a big change, those are the big changes. Of course,

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Speaker 4: we've had a Democrat mayor for probably fifty years, right,

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Speaker 4: but the way the mayor is affecting the police department

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Speaker 4: is different than ever before. And then all having a

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Speaker 4: majority liberal, progressive Democrat judges is new for us in

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Speaker 4: Hamilton County.

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Speaker 2: Look look look at it, and a lot of look at

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Speaker 2: how the mayor's office impacted the brawl, and that he

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Speaker 2: was demanding that the white guy be charged because he's

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Speaker 2: a white guy and we've got to balance things out racially. Apparently,

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Speaker 2: if yourest a personal caller, you got aggressed a white guy,

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Speaker 2: even though he was the victim. Clearly this whole thing,

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Speaker 2: and no one wanted to write that citation and unfortunately

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Speaker 2: made a captain down at the Central Business dictor to

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Speaker 2: it who wasn't even on the scene. To show you

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Speaker 2: how politically motivated those charges were. Just to appease the

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Speaker 2: vocal contingent of folks in the community who were screaming

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Speaker 2: about restorative justice, which is which is a farce. But

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Speaker 2: relative to Robert Shaw, I don't know. This may be

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Speaker 2: a tough question you can eat answer to you can.

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Speaker 2: I understand you have a canon of ethics you have

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Speaker 2: to abide by. You can't criticize other judges. But in

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Speaker 2: the shawcase, this is a drive by from Thursday night

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Speaker 2: football in from of the in Between that was under

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Speaker 2: Judge Dinkelocker. The guy Robert Shaw was on a twenty

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Speaker 2: thousand dollars bond with electronic monitoring and this was from

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Speaker 2: a case back in June. His jacket is this nineteen

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Speaker 2: ninety eight six months in prison for coke possession, two

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Speaker 2: thousand and three six months for concealed weapon, illegal guns,

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Speaker 2: receiving spilling Property RSP, and then twenty eleven and then

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Speaker 2: again in twenty fifteen he did prison time for a

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Speaker 2: llegal gun possession. He got twenty thousand dollars bond, an

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Speaker 2: electronic monitoring out and murdered someone while he was wearing

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Speaker 2: the ankle monitor. What would you prescribe what would you

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Speaker 2: prescribe as a punishment for Robert Shaw? If we're in

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Speaker 2: front of you, let's say, and he was already out

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Speaker 2: on bond for another shooting. How many more times do

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Speaker 2: you give someone a chance to get out on bond

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Speaker 2: even though they have priors involving a weapon, because it

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Speaker 2: tells me they're probably just going to do something with

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Speaker 2: a gun.

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Speaker 4: Again, Yeah, I mean.

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Speaker 5: What do you?

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Speaker 4: I mean, what do you do with someone who clearly

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Speaker 4: is never going to put down a gun?

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Speaker 6: Right?

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Speaker 4: I mean, this guy, it sounds like he's been in

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Speaker 4: prison quite a few times for having guns. He just

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Speaker 4: keeps he just keeps picking up a gun, right. I mean, again,

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Speaker 4: I can't speak to this exact case, but I do

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Speaker 4: trust judge take a locker and if he set that bond,

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Speaker 4: I mean, I don't know, I don't know. I can't

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Speaker 4: really speak to a specific case.

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Speaker 3: Well what were you? What would you done?

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Speaker 6: Now?

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Speaker 2: Again, you have the hindsight that this guy's going to

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Speaker 2: murder someone over apparently it's just a beef. It doesn't

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Speaker 2: look like they knew each other at this point. We'll

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Speaker 2: find out. But what And you can't look in the

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Speaker 2: crystal ball and say, well, he's going to go out

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Speaker 2: and murder someone. You don't know that because there are

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Speaker 2: probably countless people are in the situations that going down

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Speaker 2: and do it. But we're talking about stopping this from

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Speaker 2: happening in the first place. Should we just say, hey, listen,

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Speaker 2: you already had a gun. Speck you go right to

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Speaker 2: You're going to hold you and you're not going to

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Speaker 2: get out, and you're not going to be able to

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Speaker 2: walk around. And you decide to do something stupid with

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Speaker 2: a gun and you shouldn't have a gun. You're going

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Speaker 2: to sit in jail until your trial.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well, I mean I would want to look at

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Speaker 4: his pre trial services sheet. So every single person who's

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Speaker 4: arrested and put into the jail and has an arraignment

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Speaker 4: the next morning in front of a judge, a municipal

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Speaker 4: judge and pre trial services interviews the person and sees

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Speaker 4: if they're a flight risk, sees how much money they

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Speaker 4: could afford for a bond. They ask them a million

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Speaker 4: different questions about drugs and guns and family members and

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Speaker 4: community ties and do they have a job, that kind

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Speaker 4: of stuff. And the judge is able to look at

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Speaker 4: that sheet. The prosecutor is not able to look at

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Speaker 4: that sheet. I know that because I used to work

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Speaker 4: in that courtroom. One thing that we could do is

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Speaker 4: we could give everyone access to that information that might

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Speaker 4: be very helpful. I'm sure some of the new prosecutors

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Speaker 4: have different strategies than when I was a prosecutor there

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Speaker 4: because now they have a different boss.

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Speaker 5: So I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I mean, giving everyone maximum information and maybe giving the

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Speaker 4: media more information. I know the media doesn't see those

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Speaker 4: pre trial services sheets. I'm not saying those should be

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Speaker 4: turned over to the media, but usually that docket is

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Speaker 4: very rapid, and the media kind of leaves confused, like, well,

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Speaker 4: why did one person get a low bond and one

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Speaker 4: person get a high bond? Right, So maybe making some

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Speaker 4: of that more accessible.

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Speaker 2: Why isn't I shared with the prosecutor if anyone else.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know. It's a good question.

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Speaker 5: I don't know.

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Speaker 4: I should know that, but then it should be shared

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Speaker 4: with the defense attorney. If you can't share something just

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Speaker 4: with the prosecutor and not the defense attorney discovery, I

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Speaker 4: don't know. Maybe there's no time. I mean, it's a

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Speaker 4: very quick docket. I mean, it's probably not as quick

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Speaker 4: as it used to be because we not as many

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Speaker 4: people are arrested because there aren't that many people in

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Speaker 4: our jail anymore.

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Speaker 2: But well, I remember, was it long ago under Sheriff

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Speaker 2: Simon LEAs, and I know he's revered in this community.

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Speaker 2: I think there's something he did was way overreaching. I mean,

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Speaker 2: like you know, but he was tough on crime for sure.

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Speaker 2: And I remember having discussions about we need a bigger jail,

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Speaker 2: we need more jail space because we can't house all

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Speaker 2: the people. You don't hear that conversation anymore, and that was, like,

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Speaker 2: you know, fifteen years ago, twenty years ago, it's because

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Speaker 2: we're not holding people anymore.

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Speaker 4: Right, twenty years ago, sy Lease used to meet with

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Speaker 4: all the judges and say, listen, we are bursting at

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Speaker 4: the themes. I'm going to have to create some new

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Speaker 4: work details and things so we can let the least

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Speaker 4: violent people out earlier. And the judges would respond, you know,

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Speaker 4: do what you need to do. We're going to do

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Speaker 4: what we need to do. You know, we're not going

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Speaker 4: to change our sentences. But you know, if you don't

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Speaker 4: have room, you got to do what you need to do.

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Speaker 4: I can't imagine that conversation is happening now where the

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Speaker 4: sheriff is saying we don't.

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Speaker 5: Have any room. I never hear it, right, But even if.

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Speaker 4: We did try to arrest another two hundred people to

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Speaker 4: fill up the jail. We don't have sheriff's deputies, we

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Speaker 4: don't have enough corrections officers. Police officers have told me

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Speaker 4: when they arrest juveniles now and they bring them to

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Speaker 4: juvenile jail at twenty twenty, we call it twenty twenty.

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Speaker 4: Auburn Avenue that most often twenty twenty just says we're

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Speaker 4: not going to keep them. We just don't have enough employees.

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Speaker 5: We just can't keep them.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, I don't know. Is it a policy issue?

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Speaker 4: Is it a staffing issue. Is it people are vilifying

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Speaker 4: police correction officers and then no one wants to do it,

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Speaker 4: and then that's fulfilled the plan to be understaffed and

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Speaker 4: to not be able to lock people up.

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Speaker 5: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: If you look at the climate and CPD right now,

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Speaker 2: we've got a huge number of officers retiring, even at early ages,

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Speaker 2: because they can't stand all the politics and the bs

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Speaker 2: and what the mayor's office and how much control they

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Speaker 2: have and how their hands are tied in a lot

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Speaker 2: of cases. And they go to a suburban office or

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Speaker 2: trying to do a little recruiting, and I understand it's

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Speaker 2: difficult because people go well the money's good, but you

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Speaker 2: know what, on the job in Cincinnati, I'd rather stay

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Speaker 2: where I am. It's not attractive to them because the

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Speaker 2: climate created by the political ecosystem in Hamlin County, but

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Speaker 2: specifically in the city of Cincinnati. She is a judge,

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Speaker 2: Betsy Senderman, who's running for office this cycle. Will know

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Speaker 2: in a couple of weeks if she wins. But it's

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Speaker 2: it's a tough job. But we've got to reform this

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Speaker 2: system because ankle monitor the grant and there are probably

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Speaker 2: thousands and thousands of people out there that abide by

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Speaker 2: the terms of the deal they made with the judge

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Speaker 2: and are trying to do the right thing. But how

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Speaker 2: do we segregate the most violent people? And I'd say,

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Speaker 2: if you have a gun specification history of priors with

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Speaker 2: guns like this Robert schaugu I did, then I don't

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Speaker 2: understand why we're giving you house arrest essentially because chances

363
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Speaker 2: are you're going to break it. I think, if it's

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Speaker 2: a gun speck, we already have laws in the books.

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Speaker 2: Let's enforce federal law that if you're prohibited because of

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Speaker 2: a felony prior felony from owning a firearm possessing a firearm.

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Speaker 2: Then you go to jail right away and there is

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Speaker 2: no release, there is no ankle monitoring going on, because

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Speaker 2: you're a menace to society. Betsy Siderman, I always appreciate

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Speaker 2: the time and the insight. Thanks again.

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Speaker 5: You have a wonderful day, Judge Clown, I like it.

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Speaker 2: No, I'm not going back to school. You ain't gonna

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Speaker 2: get me there. Hell no, I'm not taking out more

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Speaker 2: student loans. I'm I'm on the wrong side of fifty

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Speaker 2: and I just finished paying mine off.

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Speaker 3: Bets Yah the.

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Speaker 5: Best, Take care, see you later.

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Speaker 3: All right.

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Speaker 2: We got a news update coming in momentarily and we'll

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Speaker 2: chop it up next about what you just shared here.

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Speaker 2: Surprise surprise, guys out on ankle monitors and house arrest

382
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Speaker 2: and they're out shooting people.

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Speaker 3: This is what this is. This is the government we

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Speaker 3: deserve because we elected them. Seven hundred w well them,

385
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Speaker 3: Scott flu Shows seven hundred w al them.

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Speaker 2: So I'm coming off of this foot surgery thing with

387
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Speaker 2: my ruptured perineal tendon that they had to sew back

388
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Speaker 2: to my foot. I've been barely walking around motion somewhere

389
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Speaker 2: on that because I'm stupid that's why, why why wohl't

390
00:19:02,080 --> 00:19:02,640
Speaker 2: you get that fixed?

391
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Speaker 1: Right? It?

392
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Speaker 3: Because I'm dumb. Pain is my business. I embraced pain

393
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Speaker 3: like a second cup of coffee. Just dumb is what

394
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Speaker 3: it is. So I got the boot out. I've got

395
00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:15,520
Speaker 3: the walking with that scooter. You put your knee on,

396
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Speaker 3: your roll around. It's got a little basket on the

397
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Speaker 3: front of it. Could put bourbon and snacks in there.

398
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Speaker 3: It's nice.

399
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Speaker 1: Uh.

400
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Speaker 2: And then the you know, the walking booth, the soft

401
00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:25,720
Speaker 2: cast and then crutches of course too, and so anything

402
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:27,480
Speaker 2: takes a lot longer to run down the hall the

403
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Speaker 2: second to grab something I've forgotten, Like, I just can't

404
00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,080
Speaker 2: walk there. I have to hobble there, tiny Tim on

405
00:19:32,119 --> 00:19:36,960
Speaker 2: his crutches. And uh, you know, of all the great

406
00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:41,520
Speaker 2: medical advances we've had, and we have medical advances coming

407
00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:43,760
Speaker 2: out day to day. I mean, it's incredible. I always

408
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:46,240
Speaker 2: make fun of the you know, the prescription ads on TV.

409
00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:50,560
Speaker 2: A bunch of fat, happy people dancing around at a

410
00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:54,040
Speaker 2: flea market somewhere outdoor festivals, singing about something or another.

411
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Speaker 2: I don't know what's making them so happy enough to sing,

412
00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:58,760
Speaker 2: whatever illness it is they have. I have no idea,

413
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:02,800
Speaker 2: but they seem rather happy. And whatever it is they're

414
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:04,639
Speaker 2: trying to sell you to ask your doctor about. You

415
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:06,280
Speaker 2: have no idea what it does, what it's for. But

416
00:20:06,640 --> 00:20:10,199
Speaker 2: damn it, I gotta write that down because the jingle's catchy,

417
00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:12,560
Speaker 2: and those people that are dancing look very happy. I

418
00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:14,560
Speaker 2: need me some happy joy juice, if you know what

419
00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,719
Speaker 2: I mean. So we have all these modern miracle all

420
00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:20,359
Speaker 2: these inventions. Now you're fat, We've got GLP one. Now

421
00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:23,200
Speaker 2: get an injection thirty five pounds. Like it's nothing, isn't it?

422
00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:23,480
Speaker 3: Great?

423
00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:29,439
Speaker 2: Technology solves everything? But there's one area that we have

424
00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:33,000
Speaker 2: not addressed. Where's one area that seems to be like this,

425
00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:35,600
Speaker 2: somebody can make billions of dollars. They came up with

426
00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:40,320
Speaker 2: an alternative to crutches. Crutches have been around forever the

427
00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:42,800
Speaker 2: Civil War veterans. You know you got you gotta a

428
00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:44,680
Speaker 2: scratch air in your leg and one of that doctor

429
00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:46,280
Speaker 2: comes in and cuts your leg off. As there's all

430
00:20:46,359 --> 00:20:48,000
Speaker 2: you don't want the gang green. That's really bad. We're

431
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:50,560
Speaker 2: gonna cut your leg off. Here, bite this bullet and

432
00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:54,360
Speaker 2: we're gonna cut your leg off with no anesthetic whatsoever. Okay, um,

433
00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:58,920
Speaker 2: it's still the same technology. It still something goes into

434
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:02,720
Speaker 2: your armpit helps you walk. Like all these years, you

435
00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:04,439
Speaker 2: think they would have come up with an alternative, a

436
00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:07,199
Speaker 2: better solution than crutches. And the crutch that I have,

437
00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,040
Speaker 2: it's aluminum. It's got a little rubbery thing at the

438
00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,040
Speaker 2: top and a grap certainly like the wooden ones they

439
00:21:12,040 --> 00:21:14,720
Speaker 2: had handed out back during the Civil War. But it's

440
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:17,920
Speaker 2: the same design. And I don't care how much foam

441
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,600
Speaker 2: you put under your armpit. It your armpits wearing a mire.

442
00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:23,879
Speaker 2: I've worn up by any of that armpit replacement at

443
00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:28,200
Speaker 2: this point, and it's only been five weeks. But there

444
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:32,400
Speaker 2: is something that really needs to be reimagined and rediscovered.

445
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,320
Speaker 2: And I know we have walkers now, and there's the

446
00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:37,880
Speaker 2: canes with the tripod with the tennis balls on it. Man,

447
00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:38,560
Speaker 2: it's still a cane.

448
00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:39,080
Speaker 3: I get it.

449
00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:40,919
Speaker 2: And I have you have one of those knee scooters

450
00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:43,399
Speaker 2: you rolled on ane scooter, but the knee scooter. I'm

451
00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:45,240
Speaker 2: driving myself now and I got to take my boot

452
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:47,320
Speaker 2: off getting the car, and it's getting the scooter out.

453
00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:50,679
Speaker 2: I barely get the crutches out let alone. A fifty

454
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:53,879
Speaker 2: pound scooter. It's nice, it's just not portable. It's just

455
00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:55,560
Speaker 2: not easy. There's got to be a better Somebody need

456
00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:57,280
Speaker 2: to be working on that. If you want to make

457
00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:00,200
Speaker 2: a lot of money. DME is a categor or a

458
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:04,840
Speaker 2: durable medical equipment because the up charge with the chargers

459
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,120
Speaker 2: things a small fortune. But the crutch has been around

460
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:10,760
Speaker 2: for hundreds of years. That's something that somebody needs to

461
00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,000
Speaker 2: look at and go, can we make a better version

462
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,840
Speaker 2: of Can we do something to make it easier unless

463
00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:18,119
Speaker 2: wear and tearing your armpits and your wrists than the

464
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:22,359
Speaker 2: good old crutch? Just some low hanging fruit there for

465
00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:27,120
Speaker 2: somebody who is aggressive and smart and an engineer type.

466
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,600
Speaker 2: You want to make some money, think about redoing the

467
00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:34,360
Speaker 2: crutch the crutch. I just had the honorable Betsy Sunderman

468
00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:36,960
Speaker 2: on the show on seven hundred WLW the latest on

469
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,200
Speaker 2: the downtown violence. And you know it wouldn't be a

470
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:41,120
Speaker 2: Monday if we didn't wake up and talk about more

471
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:46,760
Speaker 2: downtown violence. In the two cases in particular here Robert

472
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:48,960
Speaker 2: Shaw the one charge in the drive by shooting that

473
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:50,560
Speaker 2: killed a thirty four old man by the name of

474
00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:53,560
Speaker 2: Justin Johnson right after Thursday night football on Sycamore Street

475
00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:54,800
Speaker 2: by the way near the in between. I guess that

476
00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:59,600
Speaker 2: would be this guy was wearing an ankle monitor and

477
00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:02,439
Speaker 2: an ankle monitor out on twenty thousand dollars bond, by

478
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:05,040
Speaker 2: the way, because he was carrying concealed weapon and illegal

479
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:08,959
Speaker 2: gun possession. The shooting at Fountain Square involving twenty year

480
00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:11,760
Speaker 2: old Shaquille Ferguson, this is the thick guy who fired

481
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:15,000
Speaker 2: the shots into the window of Ceedybird Chicken now claims

482
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:17,080
Speaker 2: it was He's turned himself in by the way at

483
00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:19,879
Speaker 2: the behest to Clyde Bennett, his attorney, and Clyde Bennett

484
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:21,879
Speaker 2: is pulling the it was self defense. The people who

485
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 2: shot through the window of Ceedybird Chicken were actually armed

486
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:25,880
Speaker 2: and pointing a gun at him.

487
00:23:25,920 --> 00:23:26,240
Speaker 3: He said.

488
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,399
Speaker 2: The video hasn't be released because it's part of a

489
00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:30,359
Speaker 2: political cover up.

490
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:31,399
Speaker 3: They don't want you to hear this.

491
00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,880
Speaker 2: Now other things in Cincinnati, the way progressive politics are,

492
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:37,760
Speaker 2: is it the one that you wouldn't release that video?

493
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:39,879
Speaker 2: Why to make this guy look bad, to advance the

494
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:43,560
Speaker 2: narrative that violence is running rampant in downtown and Fountain Square.

495
00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:48,200
Speaker 2: Now you do the exact opposite. It doesn't make much sense.

496
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:49,479
Speaker 2: And not only that, I don't know how you can

497
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 2: get away with a self defense argument when in fact

498
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 2: your client is in possession of a gun he shouldn't

499
00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 2: had in the first place because he was on probation

500
00:23:58,640 --> 00:24:01,600
Speaker 2: in July for a violent crime. So I think the

501
00:24:01,600 --> 00:24:04,400
Speaker 2: bigger question, in addition to the fact that the two

502
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:06,800
Speaker 2: judges in the Shaw and the Ferguson case are both

503
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 2: Republicans and dinkele locker enrollment, is that the system itself

504
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:14,520
Speaker 2: is broken. It doesn't work because if you can say

505
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 2: I'm going to go find a job, I'm going to

506
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 2: do this, I'm going to report to my probation officer.

507
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 2: And we've seen countless people, countless people who marchai Black.

508
00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 2: For example, with the murder of Patrick Herringer, you know,

509
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:29,440
Speaker 2: shouldn't have been out and airy was community control, cut

510
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:31,920
Speaker 2: the ankle monitor off, we got a murder, and it's

511
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,520
Speaker 2: been a steady drum beat to that all summer. I

512
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 2: was doing a little bit more looking in research and

513
00:24:36,359 --> 00:24:38,399
Speaker 2: in some states they've actually addressed this issue. In some

514
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 2: states now in areas actually they're cracking down and saying,

515
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,040
Speaker 2: you know what, we got to get tougher when it

516
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:46,119
Speaker 2: comes to people who violate while wearing ankle monitor or

517
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 2: make it tougher for someone to qualify to wear the

518
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:51,320
Speaker 2: ankle monitor. If you look at the grand scheme, the

519
00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 2: number of people who are on quote unquote house arrest

520
00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:56,560
Speaker 2: in Hamlin County, it's in the tens of thousands. But

521
00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 2: in that regard that it's just a few of them

522
00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 2: who are violating and getting out and committing more crimes

523
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,879
Speaker 2: while they're allegedly on house arrest. So that's not lost

524
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,080
Speaker 2: on me, but there is. And these aren't exactly conservative

525
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:15,520
Speaker 2: hotbeds either. Washington, d C. New Mexico, Florida is one

526
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 2: of them. Florida implemented stricter criteria for pre trial detention.

527
00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:22,880
Speaker 2: I think the one that to me carries a lot

528
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:25,880
Speaker 2: of weight here and looking at what's going on in Florida,

529
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 2: for example, that it's a house build that I don't

530
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,440
Speaker 2: know it's past yet. But anyway, if you're in being

531
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:34,680
Speaker 2: held for a dangerous crime for first degree fela in

532
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,640
Speaker 2: his heart, which should be capital murder, life felonies, dangerous crimes,

533
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,600
Speaker 2: things like that, if you're arrested for a dangerous crime,

534
00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:44,360
Speaker 2: that's a capital felony, life felony of first degree felony.

535
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,119
Speaker 2: The state has to follow motion for pro prile detention,

536
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:50,159
Speaker 2: and so the court has to find what they call

537
00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 2: substantial probability that they committed the offense, and not only

538
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 2: he said, she said, but pretty clear evidence this person

539
00:25:56,840 --> 00:26:00,399
Speaker 2: is the right person. And if that's the case, you

540
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:04,120
Speaker 2: get no release whatsoever because of well, what we're talking

541
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 2: about here. You can't have non monetary release, which is

542
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:12,120
Speaker 2: the no Bell thing, but the discretion about electronic monitoring.

543
00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:14,000
Speaker 2: You have to have monetary bonds. You have to have

544
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 2: a lot of cash but down which most of them

545
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 2: can't afford. So it's a strict one. It mandates detention

546
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:23,439
Speaker 2: for serious crimes and eliminates the option of cash. No

547
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 2: cash bail eliminates that. I think that's a step in

548
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:29,680
Speaker 2: the right direction. I think that's something we need here

549
00:26:29,760 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 2: in Ohio and specifically Cincinnati. Address what we're talking about here.

550
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 2: I can't speak for Cleveland and Columbus and other cities.

551
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:39,640
Speaker 2: I can speak for Cincinnati. And the idea is that

552
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,280
Speaker 2: these people who are arrested and have long histories. Is

553
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:44,200
Speaker 2: the case of mister Shaw, which is the guy who

554
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:47,959
Speaker 2: murdered the person on Thursday night football. After Thursday night Football,

555
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,880
Speaker 2: the in between sitting in his car. Is this guy

556
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:54,600
Speaker 2: had a lot of priors, you know, six months for

557
00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 2: cocaine back in the nineties, in two thousand and three,

558
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 2: six months for a concealed weapon and illegal gun possession

559
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 2: because of the cocaine would prohibit him from having or

560
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 2: looking at or thinking about a gun at any time

561
00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 2: in his life. And then in twenty eleven and twenty

562
00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:09,800
Speaker 2: fifteen he did more time for a legal gun possession.

563
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,360
Speaker 2: You got the coke possession, You went to prison for that,

564
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 2: then he got out, and then within a few months

565
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:18,400
Speaker 2: of that, you had to conceal weapon on you, okay,

566
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 2: and then you did time for that, and he got out,

567
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:22,720
Speaker 2: and a few years went by, and then within four

568
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 2: year period you did it twice.

569
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 3: I don't know.

570
00:27:25,400 --> 00:27:28,320
Speaker 2: To me, if you had three priors where you had

571
00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:30,640
Speaker 2: a weapon under distability, why the hell are we giving

572
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:33,920
Speaker 2: anyone who is like that, even if it's a high

573
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:38,879
Speaker 2: bond electronic monitoring in the first place, It just to me,

574
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:40,719
Speaker 2: they seem extremely dangerous.

575
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 5: Now.

576
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 2: I understand right to a speedy trial, and I get that,

577
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,600
Speaker 2: but maybe making the bond about higher I don't know

578
00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 2: if that would have stopped anything, but probably not. Hell,

579
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:51,679
Speaker 2: it tells me a lot. When you are you have

580
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 2: the ankle monitor on you, you're not even cutting it off.

581
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:55,960
Speaker 2: You're out there shooting people while you got the ankle

582
00:27:56,000 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 2: monitor on. Not particularly bright. It's going to send you

583
00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:01,399
Speaker 2: back to prey, isn't but probably back to prison for

584
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 2: a few years ago, back out, and you know what,

585
00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,640
Speaker 2: you'll do it again. It's like Joe Peshian Casino, I'm

586
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 2: stupid that way. Prison is my business. Apparently business is good.

587
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 2: I guess other states like New Mexico and in Washington

588
00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 2: do things similar to this, not as extremist is in Florida,

589
00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 2: but you can make a case look at that, going

590
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,920
Speaker 2: why are we releasing these people who have have gun priors?

591
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:26,080
Speaker 2: And then you hear folks like my friend Anna Alby

592
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:28,040
Speaker 2: who was on last week talking about how we need

593
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 2: stricter gun la we need tougher gun laws.

594
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 3: No, we don't.

595
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:34,840
Speaker 2: If I'm sorry, If you got busted for distributing cocaine,

596
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:37,359
Speaker 2: possession with an intent to distribute, distributing cocaine, you go

597
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,520
Speaker 2: to prison for that, that's felling, which means a lot

598
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:42,680
Speaker 2: of things, but primarily the big one is you're not

599
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 2: allowed to have a gun in your possession. Okay, it

600
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,520
Speaker 2: ends right there. There's no I'm sorry, there's what tougher

601
00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:50,440
Speaker 2: gun law do you need?

602
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:50,760
Speaker 4: Then?

603
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:53,400
Speaker 2: The bad guys, if you're convicted of felony, you can't

604
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:55,240
Speaker 2: have a gun, And we have countless people as a

605
00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:56,880
Speaker 2: matter of fact, all the people just about it. I

606
00:28:56,880 --> 00:28:58,959
Speaker 2: think all of the people that we've talked about involving

607
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 2: these crimes that have given Fountain Square in particularly the

608
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,960
Speaker 2: Central Business District and Cincinnati black eye, all of them,

609
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 2: I don't think, without exception, have had prior felonies that

610
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 2: would prohibit them from possessing a firearm. That seems like

611
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:20,400
Speaker 2: a pretty tough law. Making more laws isn't going to

612
00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 2: stop that. We have a law that says, well, you're

613
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 2: on house arrest and you're out on bond, you can't

614
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:27,840
Speaker 2: do the things you're doing. And yet people with the

615
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:32,280
Speaker 2: monitor on are killing people. That's a pretty strict control.

616
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 2: I would think, I don't care what the court says.

617
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:36,720
Speaker 2: I don't care what I signed my life away, and

618
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:38,760
Speaker 2: I don't care that I struck a deal. I don't care.

619
00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,840
Speaker 2: All I care is about immediate gratification. And God only knows.

620
00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 2: Because we're starting to hear more and more come out

621
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:47,760
Speaker 2: about the thirty four year old man who is murdered

622
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:51,160
Speaker 2: on Thursday, well Friday morning, Thursday night, right after football

623
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 2: and Sycamore. And this guy, I guess is a professional

624
00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 2: in some capacity. It wasn't like he was another street thug,

625
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:00,640
Speaker 2: probably with what happened with Shaquille Ferguson City Bird, that

626
00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 2: he saw other street thugs out there, and they street

627
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 2: thugs kill each other. You want to kill each other,

628
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:06,640
Speaker 2: do it in an area where there's no one around, don't

629
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:10,479
Speaker 2: do it on Fountain Square. But in the case of

630
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,600
Speaker 2: mister Shaw, Robert Shaw, I don't know if it was

631
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,920
Speaker 2: a beef that spilled over from during the game or

632
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: maybe the in between or parking our argument of our

633
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 2: stupid stuff. But that's the problem with this is you

634
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:23,800
Speaker 2: get an argument with someone you don't know if their sociopaths,

635
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 2: they're gonna pull out and gun and kill you over

636
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 2: a parking spot or dispute or dirty look or something

637
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 2: that was misinterpreted or whatever it might be. You know,

638
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:35,600
Speaker 2: the whole I was disrespected. I get to disrespected daily.

639
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 2: That's called being an adults. Full of indiscretions and of

640
00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 2: course and things that just bring you down a few notches.

641
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 2: That happened to you every day. It's called humility. Settling

642
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 2: that with a firearm is part of the big problem.

643
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 2: But that's what happened with Robert Shaw anyway, So we'll

644
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 2: find out the details of that case. It comes a

645
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:53,640
Speaker 2: little bit more forward Scott's Loan show here on seven

646
00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:57,520
Speaker 2: hundred WLW been talking a lot about healthcare. Brad Winstrip,

647
00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:00,040
Speaker 2: of course, served in Congress. He is a physician. We

648
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:01,680
Speaker 2: got to talk to you about this. I've talked for

649
00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:04,960
Speaker 2: a while about how I disagree with the plan the

650
00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:08,200
Speaker 2: Democrats plan for healthcare is, well, we'll just take more

651
00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 2: hard earned taxpayer of dollars and subsidize the unaffordable healthcare

652
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:14,160
Speaker 2: and call it the Affordable Care Act. That's not really

653
00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:16,440
Speaker 2: a solution. That's a band aid. I think we can

654
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:18,920
Speaker 2: all commut that. And when you put in that context,

655
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 2: which is accurate, it's a band aid, Like, well, yeah,

656
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 2: I get that. I also get the fact that the

657
00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 2: people who not all, but most of them are going

658
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,960
Speaker 2: to get squeezed on this are folks who can't afford healthcare.

659
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:31,719
Speaker 2: So all of a sudden you look at it and go,

660
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 2: we're an open enrollment season, and now I may not

661
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,640
Speaker 2: wind up getting those subsidies. And how am I going

662
00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:40,560
Speaker 2: to afford healthcare? I've got a wife, I got a kid,

663
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:42,640
Speaker 2: I worked two three jobs, none of them off for healthcare.

664
00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 2: I got to buy it on the market. How am

665
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 2: I going to afford that? I can't afford that? And

666
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:49,920
Speaker 2: that's a real scare for people. That's the reality of it. Now,

667
00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 2: then you know the politics aside. We've got a broken system.

668
00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:56,360
Speaker 2: This is this makes it worse because we just continue

669
00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 2: to bankrupt America because we're as you know, every time

670
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 2: you said said I something, it doesn't make it cheaper

671
00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:06,200
Speaker 2: or affordable. It masks the costs and makes it more inaccessible.

672
00:32:06,200 --> 00:32:08,880
Speaker 2: It drives a deficit up and costs more. College should

673
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 2: be a great parallel to that. College should be relatively cheap.

674
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,240
Speaker 2: It's all of the incentives and carabouts and seticides and

675
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,160
Speaker 2: grants and money and funny and the federal governments involved.

676
00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:19,680
Speaker 2: We've got to make it more affordable. And the more

677
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 2: Democrats scream about college not being affordable and out of reach,

678
00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:23,960
Speaker 2: and we've got to do something about it.

679
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 3: We got to aleviate debt. Well, someone picks up the

680
00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 3: tab for that. Debt.

681
00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 2: Probably a lot of the people who can't afford healthcare

682
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,480
Speaker 2: go well, I have no choice. My taxes are there,

683
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:33,960
Speaker 2: and I have to pay taxes, and that's going to

684
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:37,360
Speaker 2: go to fund student debt relief. Student loans cost so

685
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 2: much money. College is too expensive because it's inflated by subsidy,

686
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,440
Speaker 2: just like healthcare and a lot of other things in America.

687
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 2: There's the core of the problem. Subsidy is what drives

688
00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 2: the cost up, makes it harder, makes compliance harder because

689
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 2: of government rules and agencies. And you've got to hire

690
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 2: as a physician a bunch of people behind the scenes

691
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 2: just to work with Medicare, Medicaid and the insurance company

692
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,480
Speaker 2: is another factor. It's a night for folks. How do

693
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 2: we fix that system? Well, I know what Democrats are doing.

694
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 2: What are Republicans offer? And I said for a long

695
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 2: time Democrats, I don't think it's a plan.

696
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:11,000
Speaker 3: I think it's a patch. But at least it's something.

697
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:14,960
Speaker 2: And it's the only issue when you pull Americans that

698
00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:18,360
Speaker 2: has a higher favorability than the Republicans do on that.

699
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 2: Everything else, Democrats are underwater. Mean think Republicans got problems.

700
00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 2: Democrats got some real problems. They don't have any answers,

701
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:26,960
Speaker 2: they have no standard. They're directionalists, they're twisted in the wind.

702
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,560
Speaker 2: They've got one thing, and it's healthcare, which is why

703
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 2: the government shut down. Could shut it down over a

704
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:34,360
Speaker 2: whole bunch of different things, but healthcare is one issue

705
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:38,200
Speaker 2: that most Americans, majority Americans, go, Yeah, Democrats got a

706
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,720
Speaker 2: better idea, which is really not a better, it's just

707
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:41,240
Speaker 2: an idea.

708
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:42,240
Speaker 3: It's a patch.

709
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 2: And then that regard, I don't see Republicans happen much,

710
00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 2: if anything. But what are Republicans have to offer? I've

711
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,040
Speaker 2: been saying that for a while. Brad Winsterp was listening.

712
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,240
Speaker 2: He said, you know what, we've got the plan here.

713
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 2: Let me share with you what the GOP thinks is

714
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:57,560
Speaker 2: the path forward. And I'll hear that coming up in

715
00:33:57,640 --> 00:33:59,480
Speaker 2: just a few minutes here in the show. On seven

716
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 2: hundred doublew on a beautiful Monday mornings, we get back

717
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:04,600
Speaker 2: at a heavy rain yesterday and wind, my god, the

718
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:06,680
Speaker 2: wind was crazy yesterday. It was like Wizard of Oz

719
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:10,319
Speaker 2: like the flags were completely bending in the breeze. We

720
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 2: got tons of rain, which we desperately needed, and now

721
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 2: we get a few days of drier air. But the

722
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 2: cold air has moved in. We have gone from summer

723
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:19,160
Speaker 2: to officially winter here in Cincinnati. When you got out

724
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:20,840
Speaker 2: in the morning and go, man, I can see my breath.

725
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:25,319
Speaker 2: And just the other day there was steam rising up

726
00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 2: from the rising rough from the pavement because of the heat.

727
00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, that's that sinsy. You don't like the weather,

728
00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:31,839
Speaker 2: Hang out a couple of days. It's going to change,

729
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 2: probably in a couple hours for that matter. So more

730
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:37,719
Speaker 2: of that cold part as we head towards fall, late fall,

731
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 2: and then winter. We'll be here before you know it.

732
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 2: So it's a Monday morning on a Scott's Loan show

733
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 2: on seven hundred w WELW at five, three, seven, four, nine, seven,

734
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 2: eight hundred the Big One talk back on the Art

735
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 2: radio app here till noon and then a Willie takes over.

736
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:52,120
Speaker 2: Not sure what he has yet today, but we got

737
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:53,880
Speaker 2: lots of stuff to cover. As I said, brad winstrips

738
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 2: on the way next, it's also a mental health Monday

739
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,080
Speaker 2: with Juliettas share at the bottom of the next hour.

740
00:34:57,320 --> 00:34:59,880
Speaker 2: Hang on for more slowly on seven hundred WLW.

741
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:03,440
Speaker 1: Do you want to be an American idiot? Flow me?

742
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:07,080
Speaker 2: On seven hundred WLW Welcome back. It's day nineteen of

743
00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:11,840
Speaker 2: the government checkdown. We've nineteen today and when Senators returned

744
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:13,880
Speaker 2: to Camp holl by the way today, we're all informed,

745
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,839
Speaker 2: including staffers last week, they're not going to get their

746
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:18,360
Speaker 2: October twentieth paychecks.

747
00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:20,319
Speaker 3: So no paychecks.

748
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:22,440
Speaker 2: Today, and I can be paid for the remainder of

749
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:26,600
Speaker 2: the shutdown on the I guess fixing this whole thing

750
00:35:26,680 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 2: in the deep seated political but most I think they're

751
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:31,839
Speaker 2: right in this thing.

752
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 3: That's frustrating.

753
00:35:33,120 --> 00:35:35,960
Speaker 2: Greg Landsman chimed it on this making hay and saying,

754
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 2: some nearly eighty percent of Americans Democrats, Republicans independence want

755
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 2: the Affordable Care Act tax credits extended. That's what this

756
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:44,879
Speaker 2: is all about. So you know DEM's want more the same,

757
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:47,160
Speaker 2: more subsidies. But I've a questioned for all, Okay, well,

758
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 2: we know what Democrats want and it's not sustainable.

759
00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:51,680
Speaker 3: What do Republicans want?

760
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 2: That's a really good question, and on that is former

761
00:35:54,320 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 2: US Representative brad Winstrip Welcome back.

762
00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:57,520
Speaker 3: How are you.

763
00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 7: I'm doing okay, I'm doing okay.

764
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:00,799
Speaker 3: I'd be with you.

765
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:02,880
Speaker 2: All right, it's Monday that it takes a while for

766
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:04,960
Speaker 2: the tongue to get going here. I have the thoughts.

767
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:07,719
Speaker 2: It's trying to articulate them on a Monday morning. But nonetheless,

768
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:12,080
Speaker 2: the GOP pushes a narrative I'm stamped about and right

769
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,640
Speaker 2: now it's about okay, illegal aliens and wow, this is

770
00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:17,080
Speaker 2: about fattening insurers, which is which is true? I mean,

771
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:19,200
Speaker 2: you know this is going to make insurers a lot

772
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 2: more rich. But the takeaway for most people, Brad as

773
00:36:21,719 --> 00:36:25,880
Speaker 2: simple as a practitioner, doctor yourself. Millions of Americans are

774
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:26,920
Speaker 2: going to have to pay a lot more for their

775
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:29,120
Speaker 2: healthcare if Congress doesn't act. You know, we're an open

776
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 2: enrollment right now. Annual healthcare costs in the US are

777
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:35,160
Speaker 2: about thirteen four hundred dollars per person on estimate. Working

778
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 2: people just simply can't afford that. And I get that

779
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 2: the idea of taking money from Pile A and moving

780
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 2: to Pile B, it doesn't make things affordable. It makes

781
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 2: it more expensive. It's just someone else's paying for it,

782
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 2: that's the problem. But that's something, and I think something

783
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 2: that working people can hang their hat on. What are

784
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:54,439
Speaker 2: the Republicans offer? I need, we need a plan?

785
00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:58,200
Speaker 7: Yeah, Well, I mean, first of all, you're asking a

786
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 7: lot of the taxpayers. It's not like this money's just

787
00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 7: out there and going, oh, here you go. And you're

788
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 7: right about the part where the insurance companies are the

789
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:07,719
Speaker 7: ones that are benefiting because with the Affordable Care Act,

790
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:09,799
Speaker 7: you have so many things that are mandated in the

791
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:14,600
Speaker 7: coverage and therefore it costs more and then they jack

792
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 7: up the price. But you know what actually was done

793
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:22,319
Speaker 7: is money that was taken from the savings supposedly from

794
00:37:22,440 --> 00:37:27,560
Speaker 7: reducing the cost of drugs under Medicare by negotiation quote unquote.

795
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 7: That savings was then gone to subsidies for the Affordable

796
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:33,400
Speaker 7: Care Act. None of this makes any sense. We have

797
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 7: a bigger problem when it comes to healthcare. And when

798
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 7: we talk about it in Washington and Washington you mentioned healthcare,

799
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,480
Speaker 7: and everybody immediately start to talk about Medicare, Medicaid, the

800
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 7: Affordable Care Act and Blue Cross, Blue Shield, etc. Etc.

801
00:37:46,800 --> 00:37:48,799
Speaker 7: But they really don't talk about health. Do you really

802
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 7: hear anybody talking about health or they just talking about

803
00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:55,520
Speaker 7: a plan? And you know, so what Republicans had done

804
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:58,320
Speaker 7: we put together what was called the Healthy Futures Task Force.

805
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:02,840
Speaker 7: Our doctors is put together program we called the Healthiest

806
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 7: Nation on the Planet and this is before make America

807
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 7: healthy again. And you know, to me, it's a national

808
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,239
Speaker 7: security issue for one thing, because we need to be

809
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,280
Speaker 7: a healthier nation if we're going to be a strong,

810
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:16,600
Speaker 7: strong nation. But you know, we don't put any value

811
00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 7: on the healthy human life. And this is what we

812
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:21,640
Speaker 7: are talking about, and this is what I think we

813
00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 7: need to do. We put the patient pers and you

814
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:27,400
Speaker 7: have to start young. You have to start educating people.

815
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:30,319
Speaker 7: Everyone knows there's an obesity problem in this country. Why

816
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:33,600
Speaker 7: is that? I mean a friend of mine who started

817
00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:35,959
Speaker 7: the soup, she goes into schools and she says, kids

818
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:38,279
Speaker 7: don't even know what a vegetable is. What about the

819
00:38:38,320 --> 00:38:41,239
Speaker 7: President's physical Fitness program? Where did that go since I

820
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 7: was a kid? It is important, and we can do

821
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:48,080
Speaker 7: that and accommodate those with disabilities. And look, I'm grateful

822
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 7: to live in a country that has safety nets for people.

823
00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 7: I think that is really important, such as Medicaid, Medicare.

824
00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:59,120
Speaker 7: There's safety nets for us overall. But we shouldn't be

825
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,400
Speaker 7: bragging about putting more people into what is the government

826
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:06,160
Speaker 7: program safety net. We should be bragging when fewer people

827
00:39:06,239 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 7: need it, because then they may have good insurance and

828
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 7: there's a lot of things that go along with that

829
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,839
Speaker 7: that we want. We want to reward prevention, we want

830
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:19,120
Speaker 7: to increase education. We want early diagnosis of things and

831
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,359
Speaker 7: so that people have access to physicians that can make

832
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,759
Speaker 7: an early diagnosis. We have a physician shortage and we

833
00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:29,680
Speaker 7: need to increase those that are graduating in medical school,

834
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:31,920
Speaker 7: and we need more Marcus Welbys by the way, And

835
00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:34,880
Speaker 7: you know, we've got a system in place today that

836
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:38,800
Speaker 7: it's becoming all hospital based and controlled under that way,

837
00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 7: rather than the guy who's just down the street that

838
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:44,200
Speaker 7: will take care of you and knows you. So these

839
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:47,040
Speaker 7: are the things that we're for. And you know, I

840
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:50,760
Speaker 7: like home care, I like telehealth. I don't want it abused.

841
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:54,160
Speaker 7: I want it to be good. Where's transparency in medicine?

842
00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:56,160
Speaker 7: You know, people are going into surgery. I have my

843
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 7: patients say, you just had surgery, right, you know how

844
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:01,720
Speaker 7: much is is going to cost? Well, the insurance company

845
00:40:01,719 --> 00:40:03,319
Speaker 7: often to say, well, we'll let you know after you

846
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:05,400
Speaker 7: have it. And it's like, well, this is what I'm

847
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 7: going to do. Why can't you tell the patient how

848
00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:09,920
Speaker 7: mu's going to it's going to cost them? These are

849
00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 7: problems that are that are out there, and people should

850
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:14,080
Speaker 7: be able to know what their costs are going to be,

851
00:40:14,600 --> 00:40:17,840
Speaker 7: make decisions, work with their doctor to make make decisions.

852
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:21,720
Speaker 7: And the other thing is we're driving towards innovations, chores

853
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 7: and better treatments keep people healthy. When people are healthy,

854
00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:28,200
Speaker 7: they can go to work. I mean, we have a

855
00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:32,200
Speaker 7: problem putting people into the military today because our youths

856
00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 7: are a problem.

857
00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:36,520
Speaker 3: Today. Seven out of.

858
00:40:36,560 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 2: Ten Americans today right now, all of us, seven out

859
00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 2: of ten of us bra At robs.

860
00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:44,400
Speaker 7: Right, this is the problem, and that's what you need

861
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 7: to address, not just the Affordable Care Act. So the

862
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 7: debate can go on, and this is what the shutdown

863
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:54,720
Speaker 7: is over, and you're talking about people losing their jobs,

864
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 7: et cetera, et cetera. You know, this continued resolution did

865
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,920
Speaker 7: not stop the subsidies. That's at a later date. So

866
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:05,719
Speaker 7: now you're doing all this shutting down the government. Well,

867
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,359
Speaker 7: what you're fighting for isn't even in play yet.

868
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:11,839
Speaker 2: It cost another trillion dollars to keep the government open

869
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:12,560
Speaker 2: seven more weeks.

870
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:14,720
Speaker 3: What are we getting for that? Over a trillion dollars?

871
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 2: That's again, it's that's always a question, right, it's taking

872
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:21,239
Speaker 2: you know, it's all you're doing is transferring. The problem

873
00:41:21,280 --> 00:41:25,560
Speaker 2: we know subsidy, for example, college is heavily subsidized. How's

874
00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:28,160
Speaker 2: college working on? Is college affordable? Answer is hell no.

875
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:31,759
Speaker 2: If you subsidize something, all you're doing is you're you're

876
00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 2: taking the cost and passing into other people. And I

877
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:35,239
Speaker 2: know that's how our healthcare system is set up. But

878
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,280
Speaker 2: with compliance, you mentioned burnout. For example, physicians are leaving

879
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:41,600
Speaker 2: not because they don't love practice and medicine helping people.

880
00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 2: It's because there's so much between them and the actual

881
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 2: practicing of medicine with compliance and bureaucracy, Medicare, Medicaid, insurance companies,

882
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:50,319
Speaker 2: they don't have time for it.

883
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:53,440
Speaker 7: Thank Scott. I know a guy in the rural areas.

884
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 7: He doesn't take insurance for primary care. They can pay

885
00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 7: him with ex state one too. When you're on insurance plans,

886
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 7: if if somebody gives you eggs, you might be in

887
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,640
Speaker 7: trouble for that because you're like you're taking a pride.

888
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:07,879
Speaker 2: I like direct primary care. I think that's I think

889
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 2: that's a great thing.

890
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:10,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I.

891
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:14,080
Speaker 7: Think there's ways of making that in medicaid. But that's

892
00:42:14,360 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 7: that's the topic for another day. But what's the return

893
00:42:18,760 --> 00:42:20,600
Speaker 7: on investments. I mean, that's what we need to be

894
00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:22,480
Speaker 7: looking at. And you you brought that, well, what is

895
00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:25,800
Speaker 7: that do Are we healthier because we subsidize the Affordable

896
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 7: Care Act? Now we're becoming a healthier nation? No, we're not.

897
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:31,680
Speaker 7: And so there's no return on investment with what they're

898
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:34,360
Speaker 7: what they're talking about there. And I look at something

899
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:36,640
Speaker 7: like we've got to cure for hepatitis, see what like

900
00:42:36,719 --> 00:42:39,360
Speaker 7: five ten years ago, and I remember in Washington, the

901
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:42,160
Speaker 7: immediate reaction is what is that going to cost? Well,

902
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 7: if it cost twenty five thousand dollars and you're avoiding

903
00:42:46,080 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 7: the two hundred and fifty thousand dollars liver transplant, there's

904
00:42:49,680 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 7: a good return on investment. The problem we have in

905
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 7: Washington is the Congressional Budget Office, which people live and

906
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 7: die by too often, doesn't know how to do that.

907
00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 7: They actually met with us in the scott and they said, well,

908
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 7: we don't know how to do that, and we actually

909
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:06,759
Speaker 7: got a bill in place that you can over ten

910
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 7: years look at things like that to see the return

911
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:13,480
Speaker 7: on investment, because guess what, people that get hepatitises are

912
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 7: no longer getting liver tramp right right, I mean you know,

913
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:19,520
Speaker 7: you can see the savings and see that. All right,

914
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:21,319
Speaker 7: let me know there are things we can do.

915
00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 2: Brad Winstrip US representative retired. He's a physician, as you know,

916
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:28,520
Speaker 2: and I'm great person. Talked about the government shutdown and

917
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:32,480
Speaker 2: it's over healthcare. Democrats want the Affordable Care TAXI critics

918
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:35,200
Speaker 2: extended for people. If you're talking tens of millions of

919
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:37,799
Speaker 2: people who rely on this thing. And I for a

920
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,520
Speaker 2: while now, I've been questioning, okay, so what's the GOP plan? Then,

921
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:42,320
Speaker 2: I you know, I want to pick the best plan.

922
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:44,719
Speaker 2: I think it's flawed. I think it's faulty. I think

923
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 2: subsidies make us pay more than we should. It's more bureaucracy,

924
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 2: it's more red tape. But it's something you can go, hey,

925
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:53,440
Speaker 2: we're going to subsidize your healthcare because you can't afford

926
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 2: it right now. And I've questioned, okay, what is the

927
00:43:56,080 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 2: GOP alternative? Give me a good alternative, and for a

928
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:02,640
Speaker 2: long time, and I hear what you're saying, Brad, but

929
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:04,560
Speaker 2: it's it's maha right.

930
00:44:04,560 --> 00:44:06,200
Speaker 3: It's prevention over treatment.

931
00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:09,759
Speaker 2: It's access to healthcare of telehealth and competition, and that's

932
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:12,319
Speaker 2: going to just workforce shortages and of course price transparency

933
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,439
Speaker 2: with President Trump in the first term got his hands

934
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:16,719
Speaker 2: around it. In the sample size, maybe too early to

935
00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:19,280
Speaker 2: tell because I think it just all the final components

936
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:20,640
Speaker 2: that wasn't to effect last year.

937
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:21,879
Speaker 3: But that's a good thing.

938
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 2: But when I look at that whole thing, you know,

939
00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:27,080
Speaker 2: to me, Brad, sorry, it doesn't seem like it's a

940
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 2: it's an answer. It's it's observations, it's platitudes. We know

941
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 2: what's wrong, but we can't fix it again. Democrats are

942
00:44:34,200 --> 00:44:37,319
Speaker 2: shifting money from wildpod to another with subsidies, right, and

943
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:41,560
Speaker 2: that's but it's not making us healthier. But you're talking about,

944
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:44,400
Speaker 2: all right, if we started this today, because habits are

945
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:47,319
Speaker 2: hard to break, as we know, that's that's great for

946
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:51,480
Speaker 2: that's great for a newborn, for a young kid. Hitting

947
00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:54,360
Speaker 2: this message with thirty forty fifty sixty year olds, I

948
00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:57,440
Speaker 2: think it's missing the plate simply because all right, well,

949
00:44:57,440 --> 00:44:59,799
Speaker 2: that's if we teach people to be healthier, that's great.

950
00:44:59,800 --> 00:45:02,719
Speaker 2: But I have cancer, now, I have als, Now I'm

951
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 2: in a wheelchair. Now, my mom has diabetes, my uncle

952
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:08,280
Speaker 2: has cancer. What can you do for me right now? Today?

953
00:45:08,360 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 2: This is long term and changing a mindset. That's great

954
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:13,359
Speaker 2: and we should be doing that, but that doesn't help

955
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 2: people today. That's the problem with this plan because it's

956
00:45:15,520 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 2: not aude.

957
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:22,319
Speaker 7: But nobody's talking about getting rid of taking care of

958
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:26,320
Speaker 7: people in generally in general. And instead of just having

959
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:29,319
Speaker 7: to break it fix it, we try to prevent it.

960
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,239
Speaker 7: And that's where the real cost savings is. That's where there,

961
00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:34,839
Speaker 7: that's where there's the return on investment. And you have

962
00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:37,160
Speaker 7: to start it sometimes, and that's why I say you

963
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:39,800
Speaker 7: start with the youth. You know, we have to educate

964
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 7: our children. You know, what about health class. I mean,

965
00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:46,560
Speaker 7: that's just that's just the start. And you know, when

966
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:49,880
Speaker 7: you talk about the Affordable Care Act in general, you

967
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,080
Speaker 7: know what they're what we're finding is there's people on

968
00:45:52,120 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 7: there that have other insurance and there and there are

969
00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:58,759
Speaker 7: illegals on there, and our taxpayers don't want to pay

970
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:02,520
Speaker 7: for that. They just why should they? You're paying for

971
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:05,120
Speaker 7: people that don't pay any taxes and pay into one

972
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:05,760
Speaker 7: hundred percent.

973
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:09,280
Speaker 2: But it doesn't address the issues people can't afford healthcare today.

974
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 2: And you know, you may look at hey, subsidies, I

975
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,239
Speaker 2: get it's driving everything up, but I need this now.

976
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:16,640
Speaker 2: I mean, we're in enrollment season or close to it,

977
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:19,080
Speaker 2: and people are afraid. They're you know, if your healthcare

978
00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:21,520
Speaker 2: costs quadruple, no one can afford that. If I had

979
00:46:21,520 --> 00:46:24,560
Speaker 2: to pay thirteen four hundred, which is the average, that's

980
00:46:24,560 --> 00:46:27,759
Speaker 2: not affordable for most Americans. So this addresses things in

981
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 2: the future and taking care of yourself now. If you

982
00:46:30,600 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 2: if you're an adult and you need health care, which

983
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:35,600
Speaker 2: we all do at this point, I don't thought I don't,

984
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:37,880
Speaker 2: and nothing's making it cheaper. We need to, and I

985
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:39,759
Speaker 2: think that's where Republicans is one of the few things

986
00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:41,440
Speaker 2: that Trump's losing the war on, right, And this is

987
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 2: why Democrats are falling on this hill, Brad is because

988
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:46,480
Speaker 2: healthcare is the only thing that they win on that

989
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:48,479
Speaker 2: they're on the right side of with the American people.

990
00:46:48,480 --> 00:46:50,920
Speaker 2: Everything else they're upside down losing the trumpet underwater on.

991
00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:53,120
Speaker 2: So they plant the swag and rally around it. I

992
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,880
Speaker 2: get the political nature of why they're doing this, but

993
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 2: it also is the fact that health care sucks in

994
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:01,839
Speaker 2: this country. I would love a Republicans are something a

995
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:05,040
Speaker 2: concrete plan to get it fixed, kind of like you know,

996
00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 2: Trump does something and hey, we're going to put them

997
00:47:07,239 --> 00:47:08,880
Speaker 2: under his he put a man on the moon in

998
00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 2: the week, right, if those are nineteen sixty nine, we

999
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 2: need a plan like that. We need a man in

1000
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:15,760
Speaker 2: the moon strategy to fix healthcare in the next few years.

1001
00:47:16,080 --> 00:47:18,160
Speaker 7: Okay, well, let's talk about that for a second. So

1002
00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 7: you have the Affordable Care Act, and it's like so

1003
00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:22,759
Speaker 7: many other plans, and I can tell you this first

1004
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:27,879
Speaker 7: stand from patient frustration. What do insurance companies do? They

1005
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:31,440
Speaker 7: delay your care and they deny your care. Why you

1006
00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:35,000
Speaker 7: talked about doctors leaving because we get tired of having

1007
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:38,439
Speaker 7: to get prior authorization. These are all things that need

1008
00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:41,640
Speaker 7: to change, and they can be changed now. They can

1009
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:45,080
Speaker 7: be changed now. Congress can do this, and we need

1010
00:47:45,120 --> 00:47:48,200
Speaker 7: to streamline. I have a bill called the Safe Step Act,

1011
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:51,239
Speaker 7: and that's been out there for twelve years and we

1012
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 7: can't get it through. What does it do. It just

1013
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:56,680
Speaker 7: allows the doctor to say, this is the medicine that

1014
00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:00,520
Speaker 7: my patient needs. It's not on your formulary. This is

1015
00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 7: what they need. And here's why. Instead of writing for

1016
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:07,800
Speaker 7: the prescription that you want your patient to have, waiting

1017
00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:10,919
Speaker 7: for the insurance company to approve it, telling them that's

1018
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:13,840
Speaker 7: telling you it's not approved. This is not good for help.

1019
00:48:14,320 --> 00:48:16,960
Speaker 7: These are all the things that are taking place and

1020
00:48:17,000 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 7: that has taken place within the Affordable Care Act and

1021
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:23,759
Speaker 7: everywhere else, and so to feed the monster doesn't make

1022
00:48:23,800 --> 00:48:26,720
Speaker 7: any sense. We need to change the monster as well.

1023
00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:29,680
Speaker 3: Why is the political power to do that? Though? I mean,

1024
00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 3: you mentioned something.

1025
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:32,759
Speaker 2: I love what you just proposed her, But why why

1026
00:48:32,800 --> 00:48:34,440
Speaker 2: is that bill languishing for twelve years?

1027
00:48:34,480 --> 00:48:36,000
Speaker 3: Brad? What what's holding that up?

1028
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:40,680
Speaker 7: Because because the insurance lobby is pretty strong, and they

1029
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:43,640
Speaker 7: get to some people and say, oh, you know, you

1030
00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:45,759
Speaker 7: can't do that, that's that's not good, it's going to

1031
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:47,759
Speaker 7: be a waste of money, and blah blah blah, and

1032
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:51,239
Speaker 7: then they blame doctors, doctors just they're getting kickbacks from

1033
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:54,200
Speaker 7: these companies and bloom, which isn't true. It's not true.

1034
00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 7: But this is the political narrative that's being held out there,

1035
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:02,760
Speaker 7: and this and who suffers. Patients are the ones that suffer.

1036
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:06,000
Speaker 7: If you think the insurance lobby isn't huge out there,

1037
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:09,399
Speaker 7: then just wonder why they're getting the subsidies to begin with.

1038
00:49:10,680 --> 00:49:14,400
Speaker 7: They're making a lot of money off this rather than competing,

1039
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:19,080
Speaker 7: and maybe they have a little less profit that now.

1040
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:22,359
Speaker 2: Falls in the area of campaign finance reform, but little action.

1041
00:49:22,600 --> 00:49:24,759
Speaker 2: That's a whole, that's a whole separate. Well, that's what's

1042
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:26,760
Speaker 2: true scrip of the system. I get that these represent

1043
00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 2: companies that have people that they hire and their shareholder value.

1044
00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:31,280
Speaker 2: All those things go in the that's kount of they

1045
00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 2: shouldn't have a voice. But when they hold senators and

1046
00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:37,880
Speaker 2: congressman hostage, that's a different story. And that's you know,

1047
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 2: the cost is driving up. They're making the money off

1048
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:41,800
Speaker 2: the middle and that's why there's no impetus to change

1049
00:49:41,840 --> 00:49:45,480
Speaker 2: things because both Republicans and Democrats are the ones that

1050
00:49:45,520 --> 00:49:48,840
Speaker 2: are are being enriched through campaign donations and everything else

1051
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:52,760
Speaker 2: with the people we're trying to uh decrease their reliance

1052
00:49:52,760 --> 00:49:54,839
Speaker 2: on that's driving the cost of healthcare up. And if

1053
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:56,839
Speaker 2: that's the case, is that it's never going to be solved,

1054
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:57,080
Speaker 2: is it?

1055
00:49:58,000 --> 00:49:59,719
Speaker 7: But you have no and you have to shift in

1056
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:03,759
Speaker 7: their until you can look, until you can determine and

1057
00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:06,920
Speaker 7: claim that we as a country want the return on

1058
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:10,320
Speaker 7: investment to be a healthier nation, and that means taking

1059
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:13,839
Speaker 7: care of things acutely, but it also means preventing and

1060
00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,760
Speaker 7: coming up with treatment cureservations. This is common sense stuff.

1061
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:21,680
Speaker 7: Just throwing more money at an insurance company doesn't make

1062
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:25,719
Speaker 7: any of those individuals on that plan healthier. That's a fact.

1063
00:50:25,880 --> 00:50:29,040
Speaker 7: And so if reducing the subsidies makes them have to

1064
00:50:29,080 --> 00:50:31,960
Speaker 7: be more competitive, I know it makes it more difficult.

1065
00:50:32,000 --> 00:50:33,960
Speaker 7: We want it to be more affordable and that goes

1066
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:37,680
Speaker 7: to the transparency and accountability and all the things. And

1067
00:50:38,160 --> 00:50:40,319
Speaker 7: I think I sent you the information of what we're

1068
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 7: trying to do and trying to make a common sense.

1069
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:47,680
Speaker 7: This is putting patients first, and that's not what's happening.

1070
00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:51,840
Speaker 7: It's putting insurance companies first, not patience and their health.

1071
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 7: And that is the narrative has to change. If we

1072
00:50:56,520 --> 00:51:01,880
Speaker 7: should be asking providers in the providers, insurance providers and

1073
00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:04,359
Speaker 7: the Affordable Care Act, what have you done to make

1074
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:08,480
Speaker 7: America a healthier nation? What about your plan makes America

1075
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 7: healthier because they have coverage, it's it's delayed and denied.

1076
00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 7: We've got to do better, and just just feeding the

1077
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:18,640
Speaker 7: monster doesn't make sense to a lot of people, and

1078
00:51:18,680 --> 00:51:20,600
Speaker 7: it doesn't do the patience any It doesn't.

1079
00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:21,640
Speaker 3: Okay, but what do you say.

1080
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:23,359
Speaker 2: Somebody hears it goes that's all well and good, But

1081
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 2: I'm worried about tomorrow if these tax credits expire and

1082
00:51:28,160 --> 00:51:31,640
Speaker 2: that they just simply die. I can't afford healthcare for me,

1083
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:33,880
Speaker 2: my spouse and my two kids.

1084
00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:35,840
Speaker 7: What do you say to that, Yes, you, well, maybe

1085
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:38,360
Speaker 7: you can if you can get the plan that you choose,

1086
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:41,439
Speaker 7: if you can go out and shop for the chance

1087
00:51:41,480 --> 00:51:44,440
Speaker 7: that plan that you choose, it doesn't have things in

1088
00:51:44,520 --> 00:51:47,760
Speaker 7: mandates mandated in it. You know, for the little sisters

1089
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:50,920
Speaker 7: of the poor to have to get contraceptive covered, that

1090
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:52,080
Speaker 7: doesn't make any sense.

1091
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:52,440
Speaker 5: Stop.

1092
00:51:52,760 --> 00:51:57,439
Speaker 7: There's problems within that, proproblems get that, and and that's

1093
00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:00,800
Speaker 7: not a free choice for people. And you know that

1094
00:52:00,800 --> 00:52:03,799
Speaker 7: that creates a problem too. So you've you've got over

1095
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:07,920
Speaker 7: certain people a monopoly of what they have to buy,

1096
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:12,400
Speaker 7: and it isn't cost effective for most people. And so

1097
00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:15,480
Speaker 7: if they have to compete, it makes a whole whole

1098
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:18,799
Speaker 7: lot of difference. If they have compete compete, A lot

1099
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:21,640
Speaker 7: of people would say, you know what I can pay

1100
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:25,160
Speaker 7: for my day to day I just want catastrophic That's

1101
00:52:25,239 --> 00:52:27,000
Speaker 7: that's all. I want to have servers.

1102
00:52:26,719 --> 00:52:29,759
Speaker 3: Right right as well? It should well it should and

1103
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:31,719
Speaker 3: have enough on the side wall.

1104
00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:34,239
Speaker 2: We heard that analogy before about well if you had

1105
00:52:34,280 --> 00:52:36,080
Speaker 2: if your health insurance, for like your car insurance, Church

1106
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:38,880
Speaker 2: app and car insurance, when you need new wipers for example,

1107
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:41,200
Speaker 2: or gasod be covered under insurance, and that's not what

1108
00:52:41,239 --> 00:52:43,880
Speaker 2: it's there for. It's for catastrophic needs for Unfortunately, so

1109
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:46,319
Speaker 2: many people don't have the savings set aside to be

1110
00:52:46,320 --> 00:52:49,239
Speaker 2: able to afford anything above that, the healthcare system is

1111
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:51,920
Speaker 2: a mess and it doesn't sound like it's changing anytime

1112
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:54,799
Speaker 2: soon because of the deep pockets that really control things,

1113
00:52:54,800 --> 00:52:58,400
Speaker 2: and that'd be hospitals, insurance companies, big pharma, medical professional

1114
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:01,440
Speaker 2: groups and the like have stakeholders on this as well

1115
00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:04,400
Speaker 2: and have the leverage you have able to influence lawmakers,

1116
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:06,319
Speaker 2: which is why good ideas like that bill you had,

1117
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:09,080
Speaker 2: Brad just sit there and shrivel up and die because

1118
00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:12,400
Speaker 2: it's not in their best interest. Brad winstrop Us Representative

1119
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:14,719
Speaker 2: retired now in private practice. I don't know if we

1120
00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:17,400
Speaker 2: solved any any Maybe we answered some questions here, but

1121
00:53:17,480 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 2: I think we solved anything today.

1122
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:21,880
Speaker 7: Well, I will tell you this that there there's a

1123
00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:26,080
Speaker 7: group in DC that is talking about Brad. Can you

1124
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:29,040
Speaker 7: get involved if we can maybe put together a collaboration.

1125
00:53:29,280 --> 00:53:32,680
Speaker 7: It's not part of the government. Where you have pharma. There,

1126
00:53:33,280 --> 00:53:38,760
Speaker 7: you have hospitals. There, you have physician specialty represent table,

1127
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:42,399
Speaker 7: if you will, and a round table front of Sea Span,

1128
00:53:42,880 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 7: not sitting in front of Sea Span, going getting your

1129
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:49,120
Speaker 7: five minutes, and it's to satisfy your baby.

1130
00:53:49,200 --> 00:53:51,080
Speaker 2: It's all dog and pony. I get hey, Brad, I

1131
00:53:51,080 --> 00:53:52,600
Speaker 2: got to get going. I thank you for the time.

1132
00:53:52,640 --> 00:53:55,759
Speaker 7: Be well, always a pleasure. Thanks gott my friend.

1133
00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:56,000
Speaker 3: Thanks.

1134
00:53:56,040 --> 00:53:57,279
Speaker 2: So we're running late. We've got to get to a

1135
00:53:57,320 --> 00:53:59,120
Speaker 2: news update. Lots to chew on there or maybe not.

1136
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:02,440
Speaker 2: You go oktill the answering. I gotta pay my stuff today.

1137
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:05,000
Speaker 2: I feel you seven or WWI.

1138
00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:09,600
Speaker 6: Everyone needs help every now and then, and she's here

1139
00:54:09,600 --> 00:54:11,040
Speaker 6: to help us get our heads right.

1140
00:54:11,880 --> 00:54:15,319
Speaker 7: This is Mental Health Monday with mental health expert Julie Hattershire.

1141
00:54:15,600 --> 00:54:17,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, we do it on Monday because that is a

1142
00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:19,879
Speaker 2: struggle day for most people. Now, if you got your

1143
00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:23,359
Speaker 2: bleep together and every day is a holiday, every day

1144
00:54:23,400 --> 00:54:26,960
Speaker 2: is good and you're probably the envy of most modern brains.

1145
00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:29,839
Speaker 2: But that's not how it works. Julie Hattershare, I hope

1146
00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:31,400
Speaker 2: trust you had a good weekend.

1147
00:54:31,200 --> 00:54:34,240
Speaker 5: All right, Yeah, it was a really good weekend.

1148
00:54:34,239 --> 00:54:35,040
Speaker 8: How is your good?

1149
00:54:35,120 --> 00:54:35,400
Speaker 3: Fine?

1150
00:54:35,680 --> 00:54:38,600
Speaker 2: Just tobbling around, that's about it. I can't do stare

1151
00:54:38,640 --> 00:54:41,520
Speaker 2: at the window like a drooling fool. But maybe another

1152
00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:44,720
Speaker 2: couple of days so maybe I can crawl as opposed

1153
00:54:44,719 --> 00:54:46,759
Speaker 2: to sit there and not move at all. So hey,

1154
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:48,200
Speaker 2: you know what, And then there are people with real

1155
00:54:48,239 --> 00:54:49,879
Speaker 2: sickness in ls in the world, so I don't feel

1156
00:54:49,880 --> 00:54:52,920
Speaker 2: so bad. I'm good, We good, were good. There's a

1157
00:54:52,960 --> 00:54:55,839
Speaker 2: story ripped from today's headlines. And I know we'd often

1158
00:54:55,920 --> 00:54:58,840
Speaker 2: talk about political stuff, but this, I mean it's political,

1159
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:01,200
Speaker 2: but I think there's also so something else going on here.

1160
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:04,520
Speaker 2: So by now you've heard about the leaked telegram chat

1161
00:55:04,560 --> 00:55:08,400
Speaker 2: of twenty eight thousand plus matcheses between young Republicans. I

1162
00:55:08,400 --> 00:55:12,000
Speaker 2: think it was on a platform and a social platform,

1163
00:55:12,719 --> 00:55:16,000
Speaker 2: and there are comments about Hitler, praising Hitler, racial slurs,

1164
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:19,000
Speaker 2: gas chamber jokes, horrific, horrific things in there from a

1165
00:55:19,080 --> 00:55:21,480
Speaker 2: ledge of the future of the Republican Party. Bad look

1166
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:23,920
Speaker 2: for Republicans, because if you don't like Republicans or on

1167
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,520
Speaker 2: the other side, you say, well, that's about right for

1168
00:55:26,560 --> 00:55:29,799
Speaker 2: these guys. But I think there's somebody to be said

1169
00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:31,759
Speaker 2: about who's doing this and why I mean, this is

1170
00:55:31,840 --> 00:55:35,520
Speaker 2: extremely difficult to talk about, I know, but I think

1171
00:55:35,520 --> 00:55:37,000
Speaker 2: it also gets back the fact that a lot of

1172
00:55:37,000 --> 00:55:42,040
Speaker 2: people there's their online persona and then there's real life persona.

1173
00:55:42,080 --> 00:55:43,880
Speaker 2: I just wonder how many of these people believe what

1174
00:55:43,920 --> 00:55:45,880
Speaker 2: they said, and if they weren't just trying to get

1175
00:55:45,920 --> 00:55:47,719
Speaker 2: a rise and be an edge lord and get a

1176
00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:49,960
Speaker 2: rise from the people in that particular circle. I think

1177
00:55:49,960 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 2: it's an interesting sociological thing that's going on here.

1178
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:54,879
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree with you.

1179
00:55:55,000 --> 00:55:57,560
Speaker 9: So I read through some of this and did a

1180
00:55:57,600 --> 00:56:00,680
Speaker 9: little research, and of the eleven people on that chat,

1181
00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:04,799
Speaker 9: three of them were women, and eight of them were

1182
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:08,440
Speaker 9: between twenty four and thirty five. So when people say,

1183
00:56:08,719 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 9: you know, it's just kids being kids, I want to

1184
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:14,120
Speaker 9: point out that these are the young Republicans, but they're

1185
00:56:14,120 --> 00:56:19,279
Speaker 9: not teenagers. Many of them have jobs that are in

1186
00:56:19,400 --> 00:56:22,680
Speaker 9: lower levels of political office, and in fact, one is

1187
00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:25,839
Speaker 9: a state senator in Vermont and his wife, So these

1188
00:56:25,840 --> 00:56:30,279
Speaker 9: are not kids in the sense that they've been portrayed

1189
00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:33,719
Speaker 9: as kids. But yeah, it's really hard to know from

1190
00:56:33,760 --> 00:56:36,680
Speaker 9: reading through what I read through whether they actually believe

1191
00:56:36,800 --> 00:56:39,600
Speaker 9: this and meanness to the extent that they said it,

1192
00:56:40,200 --> 00:56:43,640
Speaker 9: or whether it's just sort of the common language of

1193
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:45,759
Speaker 9: their group, you.

1194
00:56:45,760 --> 00:56:46,239
Speaker 6: Know what I mean?

1195
00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:46,680
Speaker 3: Right, right?

1196
00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:46,880
Speaker 6: Right?

1197
00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:50,280
Speaker 2: And nebic, you know, young anything young professionals, for example,

1198
00:56:50,320 --> 00:56:53,120
Speaker 2: typically means people forty and under, But that is also

1199
00:56:53,160 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 2: a broad spectrum. Is that it does an eighteen year old?

1200
00:56:55,160 --> 00:56:56,600
Speaker 2: How much does an eighteen year old have in common

1201
00:56:56,600 --> 00:56:58,560
Speaker 2: with a forty year old? So it's not like it's

1202
00:56:58,560 --> 00:57:02,440
Speaker 2: a specific demographics as gen zers, But there's also millennials

1203
00:57:02,440 --> 00:57:05,160
Speaker 2: in there too, So young is basing any group under

1204
00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:07,160
Speaker 2: forty exactly?

1205
00:57:07,440 --> 00:57:07,720
Speaker 8: Yeah.

1206
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:10,760
Speaker 9: And so as I was reading through this and keeping

1207
00:57:10,800 --> 00:57:14,080
Speaker 9: in mind that you know, prefrontal cortexas don't develop until

1208
00:57:14,080 --> 00:57:16,760
Speaker 9: early twenties, and then maybe a year or two later

1209
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:19,680
Speaker 9: than that, we've still got some people in this that

1210
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:23,760
Speaker 9: may not have full comprehension of the potential consequences of

1211
00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:26,800
Speaker 9: what they're saying. But then as I'm continuing to read,

1212
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:28,840
Speaker 9: there are more than once it says, you know, if

1213
00:57:28,840 --> 00:57:33,000
Speaker 9: this gets leaved, we're in bad trouble. So some people

1214
00:57:33,080 --> 00:57:36,600
Speaker 9: in this definitely had some sense of what the potential

1215
00:57:36,600 --> 00:57:39,960
Speaker 9: consequences could be, but some of the stuff that they

1216
00:57:39,960 --> 00:57:43,480
Speaker 9: wrote was just shocking. And the question you asked me

1217
00:57:43,600 --> 00:57:45,760
Speaker 9: is how much of this do they actually believe versus

1218
00:57:45,800 --> 00:57:48,960
Speaker 9: how much of this is just you know, in group languaging.

1219
00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:51,000
Speaker 9: And I don't have an answer for you for that.

1220
00:57:51,400 --> 00:57:54,880
Speaker 9: It's really distressing to think about, right, But you.

1221
00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:58,200
Speaker 2: Wonder because it is younger people and again not teenagers

1222
00:57:58,200 --> 00:58:01,800
Speaker 2: here there's generally natures don't give a damn about politics.

1223
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:04,000
Speaker 2: They know they don't like stuff, but they don't know why.

1224
00:58:04,080 --> 00:58:06,000
Speaker 2: It's not till you get older you go, oh, okay.

1225
00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:06,800
Speaker 3: I get what's going on here.

1226
00:58:06,800 --> 00:58:11,040
Speaker 2: It's politics in the fact that this is online culture though, right,

1227
00:58:11,160 --> 00:58:14,080
Speaker 2: is that we are in these individual silos. Now, if

1228
00:58:14,120 --> 00:58:18,240
Speaker 2: I am a I don't know, a blind agnostic who's

1229
00:58:18,280 --> 00:58:22,680
Speaker 2: into a fifth century pottery, I can find a group

1230
00:58:22,720 --> 00:58:25,320
Speaker 2: online of like minded people. Before I'd be kind of

1231
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:27,840
Speaker 2: the freak and ostracized, But now I find my own

1232
00:58:27,880 --> 00:58:30,120
Speaker 2: group online. And that's the other side of it. But

1233
00:58:30,160 --> 00:58:33,400
Speaker 2: the downside is more tribalism. Is this one of those

1234
00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:36,400
Speaker 2: deals where everyone in this echo chamber espouses the same

1235
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:39,960
Speaker 2: political ideology, but it's just trying to basically roast or

1236
00:58:40,040 --> 00:58:42,760
Speaker 2: outrage other people. And the more you outrage, the more

1237
00:58:42,760 --> 00:58:46,360
Speaker 2: it looks like you are I guess more of a

1238
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:49,240
Speaker 2: believer in the cause, and it just becomes this self

1239
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:53,480
Speaker 2: fulfilling prophecy that's anchored by well, how outrageous can I

1240
00:58:53,520 --> 00:58:56,160
Speaker 2: be because I'm with Kindred Spirits. Isn't this all about

1241
00:58:56,160 --> 00:58:57,600
Speaker 2: tribalism and wanting to belong.

1242
00:58:57,400 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 3: To a group?

1243
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:00,600
Speaker 9: I think that's a big piece of it. Yeah, and

1244
00:59:00,800 --> 00:59:03,640
Speaker 9: trying to see just how far you can push the envelope. Okay,

1245
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:05,800
Speaker 9: so I make this joke, I say this word, I

1246
00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:09,120
Speaker 9: say this thing, and people are giving me thumbs up

1247
00:59:09,160 --> 00:59:11,840
Speaker 9: and piling on positively, or people are giving me thumbs

1248
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:15,000
Speaker 9: up and thumbs down and piling on negatively. So now

1249
00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:17,080
Speaker 9: I'm trying to test the boundaries and figure out are

1250
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:20,600
Speaker 9: their boundaries and what are they? And what we do

1251
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:23,280
Speaker 9: online is very different than what we would do in person.

1252
00:59:23,960 --> 00:59:28,760
Speaker 9: So you would say something terrible in person, and there.

1253
00:59:28,680 --> 00:59:31,080
Speaker 8: Might be people who would give you pushback.

1254
00:59:30,640 --> 00:59:33,560
Speaker 9: Or a disgusted look, or or there might be some

1255
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:37,120
Speaker 9: indication that that wasn't okay. But if you do that

1256
00:59:37,240 --> 00:59:40,600
Speaker 9: in the online world, sometimes all you get is dead air.

1257
00:59:40,880 --> 00:59:44,840
Speaker 9: So there's no negative. The dead air is the negative,

1258
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:47,200
Speaker 9: which is not the same as people saying hey, it's

1259
00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:50,840
Speaker 9: not okay to say or Conversely, you say something in

1260
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:51,360
Speaker 9: real life.

1261
00:59:51,200 --> 00:59:53,920
Speaker 8: When people are yeah, absolutely.

1262
00:59:53,360 --> 00:59:54,080
Speaker 4: Go more with that.

1263
00:59:55,120 --> 00:59:58,439
Speaker 9: So it's about finding out where you fit, I think

1264
00:59:58,600 --> 01:00:01,120
Speaker 9: to some extent, and testing the boundaries of just how

1265
01:00:01,200 --> 01:00:04,720
Speaker 9: far things can be pushed, where are the edges here,

1266
01:00:05,120 --> 01:00:08,320
Speaker 9: and how provocative can I be and still be part

1267
01:00:08,360 --> 01:00:08,800
Speaker 9: of the group.

1268
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 2: In the pre digital age, I will say that you

1269
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:13,080
Speaker 2: know you would you may be at a rally or

1270
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:15,400
Speaker 2: something like that and you have a sign or I mean,

1271
01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:18,800
Speaker 2: let's face you. Okay, let's say that there's the real life,

1272
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:21,840
Speaker 2: in real life version, this would be let's say a

1273
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:23,840
Speaker 2: Nazi rally or something. All right, okay, so I'm going

1274
01:00:23,880 --> 01:00:25,560
Speaker 2: to go up there and like what we saw over

1275
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:27,880
Speaker 2: and Evenil in the summer. Right, Look how many people

1276
01:00:27,920 --> 01:00:30,800
Speaker 2: showed up and yelled at them, threatened them, brought guns

1277
01:00:30,840 --> 01:00:32,640
Speaker 2: to the dance and want them the hell off of

1278
01:00:32,640 --> 01:00:33,240
Speaker 2: that overpass.

1279
01:00:33,320 --> 01:00:34,439
Speaker 3: Everyone did except them.

1280
01:00:34,840 --> 01:00:37,600
Speaker 2: You have now real time feedback from your comments and

1281
01:00:37,600 --> 01:00:38,040
Speaker 2: your beliefs.

1282
01:00:38,040 --> 01:00:38,960
Speaker 3: Do I really believe this?

1283
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:41,680
Speaker 2: Well, they did everything they could to sell this ideology

1284
01:00:41,680 --> 01:00:44,640
Speaker 2: that no one was buying. But online you don't have

1285
01:00:44,680 --> 01:00:46,880
Speaker 2: those repercussions. You're not going to get punched in the face.

1286
01:00:46,920 --> 01:00:49,360
Speaker 2: You're not going to get physically threatened. You might digitally,

1287
01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:51,600
Speaker 2: but it's the same as a compliment. It doesn't matter.

1288
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:54,680
Speaker 2: It's different when you're saying that someone's these things, they're

1289
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:57,080
Speaker 2: face And that's really what's changed about the digital age.

1290
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:00,320
Speaker 9: That's really what's changed about the digital age, which is

1291
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:02,960
Speaker 9: that now with the Internet, we can say things that

1292
01:01:03,040 --> 01:01:05,640
Speaker 9: we wouldn't say to someone in real life, and we

1293
01:01:05,720 --> 01:01:09,800
Speaker 9: can have very limited consequences to that. And if we

1294
01:01:09,880 --> 01:01:11,960
Speaker 9: happen to be in a group where that is the norm,

1295
01:01:12,280 --> 01:01:14,760
Speaker 9: then not only do we get limited consequences, but here

1296
01:01:14,760 --> 01:01:17,400
Speaker 9: are our people, and we're saying it to our people,

1297
01:01:17,400 --> 01:01:19,960
Speaker 9: whether it's positive or negative, whether it's left or right

1298
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:23,520
Speaker 9: or center, we're talking to our people, and we're getting

1299
01:01:23,600 --> 01:01:27,080
Speaker 9: more affirmation for that than we might otherwise in a

1300
01:01:27,080 --> 01:01:28,120
Speaker 9: more mixed group.

1301
01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:31,320
Speaker 8: And we don't have to affiliate with people online who

1302
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:32,640
Speaker 8: aren't like us.

1303
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:36,320
Speaker 9: As we would in the real world in a job

1304
01:01:36,600 --> 01:01:38,959
Speaker 9: or in a social situation where there are.

1305
01:01:38,840 --> 01:01:40,080
Speaker 8: People who aren't like us.

1306
01:01:40,240 --> 01:01:43,520
Speaker 9: Can be as as groupy as we want to be

1307
01:01:44,080 --> 01:01:46,160
Speaker 9: online because those are our folks.

1308
01:01:46,640 --> 01:01:49,040
Speaker 2: We've always had these kind of groups, Julie. But at

1309
01:01:49,080 --> 01:01:51,480
Speaker 2: the same time, I think they're more prevalent. It seems

1310
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:54,200
Speaker 2: like this's happening with impunity now. COVID had a lot

1311
01:01:54,240 --> 01:01:56,360
Speaker 2: to do this because of the lockdown, because we were

1312
01:01:56,520 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 2: all islands or by ourselves. We've still got stuff done,

1313
01:02:00,360 --> 01:02:02,760
Speaker 2: learned to live online a lot more and there's no

1314
01:02:02,840 --> 01:02:03,320
Speaker 2: going back.

1315
01:02:04,760 --> 01:02:08,640
Speaker 9: It really changed everything long term. I don't know about permanently,

1316
01:02:08,720 --> 01:02:10,080
Speaker 9: but certainly long term.

1317
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:10,880
Speaker 8: It changed everything.

1318
01:02:10,920 --> 01:02:13,480
Speaker 9: I mean, I'll tell you from my own profession there

1319
01:02:13,520 --> 01:02:16,200
Speaker 9: as therapist who went totally online during COVID, and we'll

1320
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:19,040
Speaker 9: never go back to seeing people in person. And so

1321
01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:21,040
Speaker 9: if you just look at you know how many people

1322
01:02:21,080 --> 01:02:25,000
Speaker 9: stopped working in person and are now only working online,

1323
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:28,240
Speaker 9: So you can't you don't have the same social interaction

1324
01:02:28,800 --> 01:02:32,360
Speaker 9: with people you're not choosing to interact with as you

1325
01:02:32,440 --> 01:02:34,480
Speaker 9: do if you go into an office every day, or

1326
01:02:34,520 --> 01:02:36,520
Speaker 9: you go into a factory every day.

1327
01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:39,000
Speaker 8: Or you go out into the world in a different

1328
01:02:39,000 --> 01:02:40,520
Speaker 8: way now than we did before.

1329
01:02:40,280 --> 01:02:42,600
Speaker 9: COVID for sure, and I think it definitely made us

1330
01:02:42,640 --> 01:02:46,560
Speaker 9: more in group ye and less diverse in the people

1331
01:02:46,600 --> 01:02:49,240
Speaker 9: that we spend time with because we don't have to

1332
01:02:49,240 --> 01:02:50,600
Speaker 9: to the same degree that we used to.

1333
01:02:50,880 --> 01:02:52,360
Speaker 3: Right, Okay, that makes sense.

1334
01:02:52,360 --> 01:02:54,920
Speaker 2: She's Julie Hattershoes, she's a licensed mental health therapist from

1335
01:02:54,920 --> 01:02:57,320
Speaker 2: here in Cincinnati. On Scotsland show. It's Mental Health Monday,

1336
01:02:58,200 --> 01:03:00,520
Speaker 2: and I don't have mental healthy. This is in a

1337
01:03:00,560 --> 01:03:04,800
Speaker 2: sense that we have traded digital relationships or face to

1338
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:07,240
Speaker 2: face ones. And I think maybe that's the big takeaway

1339
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:09,360
Speaker 2: is that, and I'm sure you treat or see people

1340
01:03:09,360 --> 01:03:11,560
Speaker 2: and hear about from people who are in the same boat,

1341
01:03:11,640 --> 01:03:14,440
Speaker 2: is that if you get a steady diet of these

1342
01:03:14,480 --> 01:03:18,640
Speaker 2: echo chambers and that takes over your real life and reality,

1343
01:03:19,080 --> 01:03:20,960
Speaker 2: it's probably gonna lead you some meleal health issues.

1344
01:03:22,200 --> 01:03:25,800
Speaker 9: Well it does, and also it leads to some relationship challenges.

1345
01:03:25,840 --> 01:03:27,720
Speaker 9: So I'm not even going to say if you get

1346
01:03:27,720 --> 01:03:29,760
Speaker 9: a steady diet of these echo chambers, I'm just going

1347
01:03:29,840 --> 01:03:33,120
Speaker 9: to say people are losing the ability to interact with

1348
01:03:33,160 --> 01:03:36,440
Speaker 9: each other effectively face to face. The more time we

1349
01:03:36,520 --> 01:03:39,240
Speaker 9: spend online, the more time we don't have to make

1350
01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:41,880
Speaker 9: a phone call to a customer service rep to get

1351
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:44,320
Speaker 9: something done, or make a phone call to schedule an

1352
01:03:44,360 --> 01:03:47,240
Speaker 9: appointment for something, the more that we don't actually have

1353
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:49,640
Speaker 9: to go out into the world and interact with people

1354
01:03:49,680 --> 01:03:53,240
Speaker 9: on a consistent basis, we're losing some of our social skills,

1355
01:03:53,360 --> 01:03:57,320
Speaker 9: or at least they're changing and they're becoming more online

1356
01:03:57,320 --> 01:04:01,200
Speaker 9: social skills. And the problem is that then if you

1357
01:04:01,440 --> 01:04:03,800
Speaker 9: forget where you are and you say something in the

1358
01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:06,320
Speaker 9: real world that you would only drop in a chat online,

1359
01:04:06,480 --> 01:04:10,479
Speaker 9: suddenly you get some negative pushback for that. But we're

1360
01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:13,280
Speaker 9: losing the ability to interact and relate with each other

1361
01:04:13,360 --> 01:04:14,120
Speaker 9: face to face.

1362
01:04:14,640 --> 01:04:16,680
Speaker 8: And I see that in my practice a lot.

1363
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:19,520
Speaker 9: I see people who are so isolated and so lonely

1364
01:04:19,840 --> 01:04:22,120
Speaker 9: despite the fact that we're more connected and I use

1365
01:04:22,160 --> 01:04:25,800
Speaker 9: air quotes around that word than ever before. And the

1366
01:04:25,840 --> 01:04:29,800
Speaker 9: thing is that we're connected often to people who think

1367
01:04:29,880 --> 01:04:33,240
Speaker 9: like us, and not connected to people who don't.

1368
01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:33,640
Speaker 8: Think like us.

1369
01:04:33,680 --> 01:04:37,080
Speaker 9: So there's no real world fact checking or pushback for

1370
01:04:37,160 --> 01:04:38,280
Speaker 9: some of the things we say and do.

1371
01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:40,600
Speaker 2: That's interesting because so what you're saying is like people,

1372
01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:45,320
Speaker 2: for example, who I don't know, maybe they're you know,

1373
01:04:45,360 --> 01:04:46,840
Speaker 2: Trump seems to be the bit and it could be

1374
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:49,240
Speaker 2: anything that right now, it's Trump, Like I'm a big

1375
01:04:49,280 --> 01:04:51,919
Speaker 2: Trump fan, and I only associate with people online who

1376
01:04:52,000 --> 01:04:54,560
Speaker 2: are in the real world I know people who aren't,

1377
01:04:54,600 --> 01:04:56,600
Speaker 2: and then I don't associate even family members and we've

1378
01:04:56,600 --> 01:05:00,000
Speaker 2: seen relationships break off over who's president of the United States.

1379
01:05:00,000 --> 01:05:02,920
Speaker 2: I mean, it's it's so stupid and myopic that you're

1380
01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:05,520
Speaker 2: gonna you know, you're losing family members and friends for

1381
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:07,480
Speaker 2: a long long time over who got voted in the

1382
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:09,520
Speaker 2: office or who didn't win. It doesn't make any sense

1383
01:05:09,560 --> 01:05:12,560
Speaker 2: to me, but for those people it does. And that

1384
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:16,520
Speaker 2: to me is that detachment from online versus real life.

1385
01:05:17,560 --> 01:05:20,560
Speaker 9: Yes, and that detachment from a reality check that not

1386
01:05:20,720 --> 01:05:22,920
Speaker 9: everybody thinks and feels the way that you do, and

1387
01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:24,760
Speaker 9: that people who don't think and feel the way that

1388
01:05:24,800 --> 01:05:27,440
Speaker 9: you do can actually be good people and you might

1389
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:30,120
Speaker 9: actually have to work with them and interact with them,

1390
01:05:30,240 --> 01:05:32,640
Speaker 9: or be a family member or a friend to.

1391
01:05:32,600 --> 01:05:34,160
Speaker 8: Them, or go to school with them.

1392
01:05:34,680 --> 01:05:38,360
Speaker 9: And so we're losing the ability to hold opposing viewpoints

1393
01:05:38,400 --> 01:05:41,400
Speaker 9: as being equally valid as ours, and we're starting to

1394
01:05:41,480 --> 01:05:45,480
Speaker 9: dehumanize and other eyes people who think differently than we do.

1395
01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:48,000
Speaker 2: Well when we and yeah, I'm sorry, when we establish

1396
01:05:48,080 --> 01:05:50,000
Speaker 2: like you know, saft zones on college campuses where I

1397
01:05:50,000 --> 01:05:52,120
Speaker 2: can espouse my you know, actually my first amenment, right,

1398
01:05:52,120 --> 01:05:54,720
Speaker 2: but you can't challenge me that you know that that

1399
01:05:54,840 --> 01:05:57,720
Speaker 2: predates and that overshadows. In my opinion, we're talking about

1400
01:05:57,720 --> 01:05:59,240
Speaker 2: to hear digital, but it feeds in the whole same

1401
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:01,680
Speaker 2: thing is that we want to shelter our children who

1402
01:06:01,680 --> 01:06:05,480
Speaker 2: eventually become adults so much that they only have their

1403
01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:08,480
Speaker 2: views reinforced and never be challenged to think another way

1404
01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:10,640
Speaker 2: or see someone else's that that's dangerous.

1405
01:06:10,760 --> 01:06:11,680
Speaker 3: And it leads to this.

1406
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:16,320
Speaker 9: Doesn't It does leads. It definitely can lead to this.

1407
01:06:17,360 --> 01:06:19,680
Speaker 9: These witness tests for you in or are you out?

1408
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:23,680
Speaker 9: And these belief systems that if you disagree with me,

1409
01:06:23,880 --> 01:06:26,560
Speaker 9: if anyone disagrees with us.

1410
01:06:26,600 --> 01:06:28,520
Speaker 8: They are bad or wrong.

1411
01:06:28,680 --> 01:06:32,200
Speaker 9: We dehumanize, we otherize them. We don't have the ability to,

1412
01:06:32,320 --> 01:06:34,560
Speaker 9: as they say in politics, work across the aisle.

1413
01:06:34,880 --> 01:06:36,240
Speaker 8: We're losing the ability to.

1414
01:06:36,240 --> 01:06:37,919
Speaker 9: Say, you and I disagree on this, but we still

1415
01:06:37,960 --> 01:06:39,680
Speaker 9: have to work together to get this done.

1416
01:06:39,440 --> 01:06:40,640
Speaker 8: Whatever that happens to be.

1417
01:06:41,120 --> 01:06:44,080
Speaker 9: And we're becoming very tribal, to use your word from

1418
01:06:44,120 --> 01:06:47,919
Speaker 9: earlier in the segment, we're becoming very tribal. And that

1419
01:06:48,600 --> 01:06:52,120
Speaker 9: can be a strength, but it more often than not,

1420
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:54,720
Speaker 9: I think is a deficit because we're losing diversity of

1421
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:59,480
Speaker 9: thought and diversity of representation, and we're losing our abilities

1422
01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:01,520
Speaker 9: to deal with people who think and feel and operate

1423
01:07:01,560 --> 01:07:02,520
Speaker 9: differently in the world.

1424
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:02,720
Speaker 8: Than we do.

1425
01:07:03,000 --> 01:07:07,080
Speaker 2: Also the ability to negotiate, to realize we have differences

1426
01:07:07,120 --> 01:07:10,240
Speaker 2: in coming to common ground. I mean, I think it's

1427
01:07:10,360 --> 01:07:13,720
Speaker 2: not a coincidence that we same day we're talking about

1428
01:07:13,720 --> 01:07:15,600
Speaker 2: this business. I mean, look at the shootings on Found Square,

1429
01:07:15,640 --> 01:07:17,800
Speaker 2: look at the one we just had on Thursday after

1430
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:20,440
Speaker 2: the football game. People are willing to just Okay, I'm

1431
01:07:20,440 --> 01:07:22,920
Speaker 2: in an argument over something stupid, not even a street

1432
01:07:23,360 --> 01:07:25,400
Speaker 2: total strangers and pick up a gun and shoot them

1433
01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:29,320
Speaker 2: because what because they looked at you differently or you

1434
01:07:29,360 --> 01:07:32,320
Speaker 2: thought they said something, or a parking spot, whatever it is.

1435
01:07:33,120 --> 01:07:35,000
Speaker 2: Rather than just you know, argue you're getting a fight

1436
01:07:35,080 --> 01:07:36,880
Speaker 2: or discuss it, somebody's going to pick up a gun

1437
01:07:36,880 --> 01:07:39,280
Speaker 2: and shoot YOUO. This is cut from the same fabric.

1438
01:07:39,360 --> 01:07:42,560
Speaker 9: I think it's very similar. It's all part of the

1439
01:07:42,640 --> 01:07:51,000
Speaker 9: continuum of increasing uncivil discourse in our country, in our society.

1440
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:56,600
Speaker 9: It's increasingly becoming extremist, it's increasingly becoming.

1441
01:07:56,240 --> 01:07:59,360
Speaker 8: Violent word wise or action wise.

1442
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:06,440
Speaker 9: And it's increasingly becoming cooperative and cooperative and negotiated. And

1443
01:08:06,520 --> 01:08:08,800
Speaker 9: so yes, I think it's all part of the continuum

1444
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:13,040
Speaker 9: of uncivilizing our civilization.

1445
01:08:14,040 --> 01:08:14,800
Speaker 3: Julie hattersh here.

1446
01:08:14,800 --> 01:08:16,240
Speaker 2: I don't know if you see this in your practice,

1447
01:08:16,280 --> 01:08:18,920
Speaker 2: or maybe you've heard stories from colleagues and the like

1448
01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:21,400
Speaker 2: it are there people that are realizing, Hey, I've got

1449
01:08:21,400 --> 01:08:24,120
Speaker 2: a digital problem. I've got to get some help mentally

1450
01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:26,280
Speaker 2: and this or I guess it's a mental health therapist

1451
01:08:26,320 --> 01:08:29,519
Speaker 2: about this above all. Also that's changing my you know,

1452
01:08:29,680 --> 01:08:31,800
Speaker 2: changing my or or someone's forcing someone to go to

1453
01:08:31,880 --> 01:08:34,599
Speaker 2: therapy because they've isolated themselves. To the point is that

1454
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:36,920
Speaker 2: actually has that become a thing over the years in

1455
01:08:36,960 --> 01:08:39,400
Speaker 2: practices like, yes, yeah.

1456
01:08:39,200 --> 01:08:39,679
Speaker 8: It has.

1457
01:08:39,880 --> 01:08:41,759
Speaker 9: I have a lot of people, a lot of couples

1458
01:08:41,800 --> 01:08:44,720
Speaker 9: I see in fact that I suggest going on a

1459
01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:47,920
Speaker 9: digital diet or a digital detox because they're spending so

1460
01:08:48,040 --> 01:08:50,120
Speaker 9: much time with their face on the screen that they're

1461
01:08:50,120 --> 01:08:54,120
Speaker 9: not actually connecting with themselves in life and with other

1462
01:08:54,200 --> 01:08:58,400
Speaker 9: people in life, and it's creating problems in relationships, it's

1463
01:08:58,400 --> 01:09:03,120
Speaker 9: creating problems in mental health in individuals who get so

1464
01:09:03,200 --> 01:09:07,280
Speaker 9: sucked into the screen that they're not actually connecting with

1465
01:09:07,479 --> 01:09:11,240
Speaker 9: folks in their life and doing things outside, like actually

1466
01:09:11,320 --> 01:09:16,160
Speaker 9: outside the house, but outside of their screen. Becomes very

1467
01:09:16,240 --> 01:09:19,719
Speaker 9: isolating and it's meant to I mean, the stuff online

1468
01:09:19,760 --> 01:09:21,880
Speaker 9: is meant to keep you there. That's what they want.

1469
01:09:21,920 --> 01:09:23,479
Speaker 9: They want you to stay there. They don't want you

1470
01:09:23,520 --> 01:09:25,599
Speaker 9: to go out and you know, paddle connue or take

1471
01:09:25,640 --> 01:09:26,479
Speaker 9: a bike rider.

1472
01:09:26,400 --> 01:09:27,679
Speaker 8: Engage and have lunch with the friends.

1473
01:09:27,760 --> 01:09:29,800
Speaker 3: Engagement, that's what it's all about. And engaging.

1474
01:09:30,040 --> 01:09:31,800
Speaker 2: But then you get more of the diet of what

1475
01:09:31,880 --> 01:09:34,120
Speaker 2: you subscribe to and want to see, and so the

1476
01:09:34,160 --> 01:09:36,040
Speaker 2: algorithmnosis and feed you more of it to keep you

1477
01:09:36,080 --> 01:09:38,840
Speaker 2: on on longer. The problem is there's a definite mental

1478
01:09:38,880 --> 01:09:42,000
Speaker 2: health component to this. The more you spend, the more

1479
01:09:42,040 --> 01:09:43,840
Speaker 2: it hurts your mind. Now and the other thing too

1480
01:09:43,920 --> 01:09:45,920
Speaker 2: is you may not see it right is how many

1481
01:09:45,960 --> 01:09:47,640
Speaker 2: people have done that and go, well, that's not me.

1482
01:09:47,760 --> 01:09:50,439
Speaker 2: I just is what I like and not realizing that

1483
01:09:50,479 --> 01:09:51,679
Speaker 2: this we're talking about you.

1484
01:09:53,040 --> 01:09:54,519
Speaker 9: Exactly, and we are not.

1485
01:09:54,600 --> 01:09:56,240
Speaker 8: We humans are not designed to live.

1486
01:09:56,080 --> 01:09:59,280
Speaker 9: In isolation, and yet so many of us are isolated

1487
01:09:59,320 --> 01:10:02,439
Speaker 9: from the world, and our primary relationship is through a screen,

1488
01:10:02,840 --> 01:10:04,720
Speaker 9: and we are not. Our brains and our bodies are

1489
01:10:04,720 --> 01:10:05,960
Speaker 9: not designed to live in isolation.

1490
01:10:06,040 --> 01:10:07,120
Speaker 8: We're designed to live in.

1491
01:10:07,160 --> 01:10:10,639
Speaker 9: Community with other people, our friends, our families, our co workers,

1492
01:10:10,720 --> 01:10:16,280
Speaker 9: our neighbors, and this keeps us connected again in air quotes.

1493
01:10:16,000 --> 01:10:17,960
Speaker 8: But also it's so incredibly disconnected.

1494
01:10:18,280 --> 01:10:21,639
Speaker 9: It's not good for us mentally, emotionally, relationally, it's not.

1495
01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:22,479
Speaker 8: Good for us physically.

1496
01:10:23,320 --> 01:10:26,200
Speaker 9: There are so many things that it's like anything you know,

1497
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:26,799
Speaker 9: too much.

1498
01:10:26,640 --> 01:10:30,720
Speaker 8: Of anything is bad. And this is another example of that.

1499
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:33,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, as the young Republicans chats like, it's got so

1500
01:10:33,200 --> 01:10:35,920
Speaker 2: narrow and so so tribal that you know, if you

1501
01:10:35,920 --> 01:10:37,320
Speaker 2: step back and look at and go, what what the

1502
01:10:37,360 --> 01:10:37,760
Speaker 2: hell is?

1503
01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:38,920
Speaker 3: What what am I reading here?

1504
01:10:38,960 --> 01:10:42,519
Speaker 2: This is and not suspecting that someone at some point

1505
01:10:42,520 --> 01:10:45,439
Speaker 2: of all those people in that chat would and so

1506
01:10:45,640 --> 01:10:48,360
Speaker 2: either be exploited or I've heard it, maybe the blackmailed

1507
01:10:48,400 --> 01:10:50,679
Speaker 2: a little bit. But still, I mean it's it's they're

1508
01:10:50,720 --> 01:10:52,479
Speaker 2: your words, and somebody's going to get a hold of that.

1509
01:10:52,520 --> 01:10:55,719
Speaker 2: We'll definitely use it against you. But there's a bigger problem.

1510
01:10:55,720 --> 01:10:59,559
Speaker 2: It's the more connected we become as a world digitally, uh,

1511
01:10:59,840 --> 01:11:03,080
Speaker 2: the more lonely we become an individual relationships. I think

1512
01:11:03,120 --> 01:11:05,599
Speaker 2: that's the takeaway here. If that's you're someone to love,

1513
01:11:05,680 --> 01:11:07,920
Speaker 2: definitely need to talk somepon Like Julie hattersh here, she's

1514
01:11:07,960 --> 01:11:10,880
Speaker 2: at beconnected dot care. Hey, Juliet, be connected dot care

1515
01:11:10,880 --> 01:11:12,479
Speaker 2: if you want to reach out question for a future

1516
01:11:12,520 --> 01:11:15,040
Speaker 2: topic on mental health Monday. I always appreciate the insight

1517
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:18,480
Speaker 2: and the good stuff as always be well, take care youte.

1518
01:11:18,479 --> 01:11:20,280
Speaker 2: All right, getting you to a news update and when

1519
01:11:20,280 --> 01:11:23,519
Speaker 2: we return on seven hundred WLW. Last week, we had

1520
01:11:23,560 --> 01:11:28,560
Speaker 2: the governor's ban on what do we call it intoxicating

1521
01:11:28,600 --> 01:11:30,760
Speaker 2: hemp beverages and products because they may fall on the

1522
01:11:30,760 --> 01:11:33,960
Speaker 2: hands of kids, you know, using the children to enact

1523
01:11:34,040 --> 01:11:37,280
Speaker 2: prohibition as nothing new. Uh, but this part of a

1524
01:11:37,320 --> 01:11:39,840
Speaker 2: bigger problem is is just how slow the government is

1525
01:11:39,920 --> 01:11:46,160
Speaker 2: to legislate, control and regulate things that go into our body,

1526
01:11:46,200 --> 01:11:49,600
Speaker 2: whether it's those drinks or edibles I'm talking about, or

1527
01:11:50,240 --> 01:11:53,680
Speaker 2: something like a nicotine pouch which you put in your

1528
01:11:53,720 --> 01:11:55,840
Speaker 2: lip and you get nicotine. It's not smoke, it's not

1529
01:11:55,880 --> 01:11:59,479
Speaker 2: tobacco much much safer, but you're getting the nicotine delivery system.

1530
01:11:59,479 --> 01:12:04,599
Speaker 2: You're getting kotine without the harmful byproducts of tobacco. Well,

1531
01:12:04,920 --> 01:12:08,200
Speaker 2: much like what's happening in Ohio, it's happening nationwide. With

1532
01:12:08,479 --> 01:12:11,160
Speaker 2: Trump's FDA, he wants he wants to fast track some

1533
01:12:11,280 --> 01:12:16,599
Speaker 2: of these products these uh, nicotine pouches, and the problem

1534
01:12:16,720 --> 01:12:18,920
Speaker 2: is now the market is flooded with black market products

1535
01:12:18,960 --> 01:12:19,360
Speaker 2: as well.

1536
01:12:19,560 --> 01:12:20,679
Speaker 3: She writes about this.

1537
01:12:20,479 --> 01:12:23,639
Speaker 2: For a reason and why we need to fast trek

1538
01:12:23,880 --> 01:12:26,360
Speaker 2: regulation a lot quicker than the FDA has in the past,

1539
01:12:26,640 --> 01:12:28,559
Speaker 2: and Trump's trying to do it. Her name Sophia Hamilton.

1540
01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:30,360
Speaker 2: She joins the next next on the show to talk

1541
01:12:30,360 --> 01:12:32,519
Speaker 2: about that. Just ahead seven hundred WWT Cincinnatic.

1542
01:12:32,800 --> 01:12:36,559
Speaker 1: Don't want to be an American Scott Flone show.

1543
01:12:36,600 --> 01:12:38,439
Speaker 3: This is seven hundred w LW.

1544
01:12:38,479 --> 01:12:39,240
Speaker 1: Welcome to the show.

1545
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:45,000
Speaker 2: So Mike DeWine issued his Delta AD Intoxicating hamp emergency

1546
01:12:45,040 --> 01:12:47,519
Speaker 2: band that kicked in last week. But that's a emblematic

1547
01:12:47,600 --> 01:12:50,600
Speaker 2: a bigger problem. Uh, and it's the problem is a

1548
01:12:50,680 --> 01:12:52,800
Speaker 2: it's a slow to move government right that drives the

1549
01:12:52,800 --> 01:12:54,880
Speaker 2: black market. The reason why he had to do that

1550
01:12:55,000 --> 01:12:57,320
Speaker 2: band was because the legislator's been dragging their feet for

1551
01:12:57,360 --> 01:12:59,640
Speaker 2: a long time. They had a caravat for hemp and

1552
01:12:59,680 --> 01:13:01,200
Speaker 2: then that's I'm going to figure out a way to go, Hey,

1553
01:13:01,200 --> 01:13:02,960
Speaker 2: we could take some of the low level TCH and

1554
01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:05,760
Speaker 2: hemp and process it and as long as we derive

1555
01:13:05,800 --> 01:13:08,720
Speaker 2: the THHD, which is the psychoactive ingredient and weed the

1556
01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:12,320
Speaker 2: stuff that gets you high. We can make these products

1557
01:13:12,360 --> 01:13:15,599
Speaker 2: and then you know, for example, fifty West rolls out

1558
01:13:15,640 --> 01:13:16,320
Speaker 2: of beverage.

1559
01:13:16,320 --> 01:13:17,320
Speaker 3: Many companies are doing it.

1560
01:13:17,360 --> 01:13:21,439
Speaker 2: That's CBD infused, cannabis infused, and you get a decent buzz,

1561
01:13:21,520 --> 01:13:24,320
Speaker 2: kind of like alcohol without the alcohol side effects.

1562
01:13:24,360 --> 01:13:25,240
Speaker 3: Money people like it.

1563
01:13:25,280 --> 01:13:27,040
Speaker 2: Well, kids were getting a hold of this in the

1564
01:13:27,080 --> 01:13:30,720
Speaker 2: smokeable and edible form in some Roague carryout stores and

1565
01:13:30,760 --> 01:13:32,960
Speaker 2: around the state, which of course happens when you have

1566
01:13:33,000 --> 01:13:36,080
Speaker 2: a black market that's created by government overregulation and the

1567
01:13:36,120 --> 01:13:38,400
Speaker 2: government's low to move, and the end result is now

1568
01:13:38,439 --> 01:13:40,880
Speaker 2: adults can't have nice things either. No one wants kids

1569
01:13:40,880 --> 01:13:44,240
Speaker 2: getting high at the same time as an adult. I've

1570
01:13:44,280 --> 01:13:47,120
Speaker 2: kind of earned that right. So this fits into something

1571
01:13:47,120 --> 01:13:49,400
Speaker 2: else that's going under the Trump FDA. They're fast tracking

1572
01:13:49,439 --> 01:13:53,000
Speaker 2: reviews of tobacco. Companies are in the nicotine pouch game

1573
01:13:53,040 --> 01:13:55,559
Speaker 2: now because we are people are smoking tobacco, as you know,

1574
01:13:55,680 --> 01:13:56,800
Speaker 2: so they're going to go, hey, we got to make

1575
01:13:56,800 --> 01:13:59,720
Speaker 2: our money. We'll do nicotine pouches, things like zin and

1576
01:13:59,760 --> 01:14:01,640
Speaker 2: other stuff like that. That's all well and good, but

1577
01:14:02,320 --> 01:14:04,800
Speaker 2: the problem is it's much like Ohio's doing with the

1578
01:14:04,800 --> 01:14:08,360
Speaker 2: CBD stuff is that the slow moving government, the plot

1579
01:14:08,479 --> 01:14:11,639
Speaker 2: and government, the legislature simply can't get on the way

1580
01:14:11,640 --> 01:14:15,519
Speaker 2: and create rules that make access available to other companies.

1581
01:14:15,880 --> 01:14:18,120
Speaker 2: And then the end result is you have some black

1582
01:14:18,160 --> 01:14:21,719
Speaker 2: market folks getting their products into well convenience stores, for example,

1583
01:14:21,840 --> 01:14:24,320
Speaker 2: just like we do in Ohio when it comes to CBD.

1584
01:14:24,760 --> 01:14:27,879
Speaker 2: Kind of a long setup there. I apologize. She's Sophia Hamilton.

1585
01:14:27,960 --> 01:14:30,200
Speaker 2: She writes in Reason magazine about this. Also she's a

1586
01:14:30,200 --> 01:14:32,640
Speaker 2: fellow with Young Voices. Good morning, how are you.

1587
01:14:33,960 --> 01:14:36,760
Speaker 6: I'm doing great, Thank you so much for having.

1588
01:14:36,479 --> 01:14:37,200
Speaker 4: Me this morning.

1589
01:14:38,120 --> 01:14:42,839
Speaker 6: I'm excited to chat a little bit about this scary

1590
01:14:42,960 --> 01:14:48,360
Speaker 6: market changes that we're seeing with not only nickedine couches,

1591
01:14:48,400 --> 01:14:51,759
Speaker 6: but like as you were saying, with cannabis as well.

1592
01:14:52,040 --> 01:14:53,720
Speaker 2: It's two sides of the same coin, right, I mean,

1593
01:14:53,720 --> 01:14:56,960
Speaker 2: that was the world's longest setup. I apologize, But it

1594
01:14:57,000 --> 01:15:01,000
Speaker 2: all comes together because it's the problem is a slow moving,

1595
01:15:01,040 --> 01:15:04,439
Speaker 2: plotting government and we live in an on demand society.

1596
01:15:04,439 --> 01:15:06,880
Speaker 2: People sample something and they see something, they read something,

1597
01:15:06,880 --> 01:15:07,600
Speaker 2: they eat, they drink O.

1598
01:15:07,640 --> 01:15:07,840
Speaker 1: Wow.

1599
01:15:07,880 --> 01:15:08,519
Speaker 3: I like this a lot.

1600
01:15:08,560 --> 01:15:10,320
Speaker 2: Where can I get it? Well, all of a sudden,

1601
01:15:10,360 --> 01:15:14,200
Speaker 2: you have an exploding consumer market for that, and we

1602
01:15:14,280 --> 01:15:17,160
Speaker 2: get it. Whether it's a CBD infused to THC CBD

1603
01:15:17,200 --> 01:15:21,800
Speaker 2: infused drink or whether it's a nicotine pouch, somebody's gonna

1604
01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:25,160
Speaker 2: rush in legal, arly illegal to fill that void. What's

1605
01:15:25,160 --> 01:15:27,559
Speaker 2: happening relative to nicotine. We know what's going on with

1606
01:15:28,000 --> 01:15:31,040
Speaker 2: THCHC here in Ohio, but what about the nicotine patch game?

1607
01:15:32,520 --> 01:15:38,280
Speaker 6: Yeah, so nicotine policy is changing all across the country.

1608
01:15:38,320 --> 01:15:41,559
Speaker 6: We have some states that are incredibly strict and how

1609
01:15:41,600 --> 01:15:44,920
Speaker 6: to have a lot of bands where they limit ages

1610
01:15:45,080 --> 01:15:49,719
Speaker 6: percentages of nicotine flavors. And then you have a different

1611
01:15:49,760 --> 01:15:55,080
Speaker 6: regulatory regene at the spiral level where they are very

1612
01:15:55,120 --> 01:16:00,320
Speaker 6: slow to improve quality products that have been on the

1613
01:16:00,400 --> 01:16:03,320
Speaker 6: international market for decades and that we know are safe,

1614
01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:08,839
Speaker 6: and so consumers are trying new products like nicotine pouches.

1615
01:16:09,040 --> 01:16:13,000
Speaker 6: They've been on the US market for at least a decade,

1616
01:16:13,120 --> 01:16:16,400
Speaker 6: but they haven't had full SDA approoval and that's a

1617
01:16:16,439 --> 01:16:19,799
Speaker 6: whole it's a whole process to get the official stamp

1618
01:16:19,840 --> 01:16:24,200
Speaker 6: of approval from the SBA. So American consumers have been

1619
01:16:24,200 --> 01:16:27,519
Speaker 6: able to try these products and realize, oh yeah, I

1620
01:16:27,680 --> 01:16:31,160
Speaker 6: really like the nicotine pouches. They're a lot smoother than base,

1621
01:16:31,280 --> 01:16:35,800
Speaker 6: there's less downside, all of these, all of these great things,

1622
01:16:36,360 --> 01:16:40,160
Speaker 6: the FDA hasn't moved as fast as consumers have. They've

1623
01:16:40,320 --> 01:16:43,760
Speaker 6: they've moved out of snail's pace, and so consumers have

1624
01:16:43,880 --> 01:16:47,520
Speaker 6: dried this product, decided that they liked it, and it's

1625
01:16:47,560 --> 01:16:49,800
Speaker 6: hard to get what they want because of all of

1626
01:16:49,800 --> 01:16:54,920
Speaker 6: the state restrictions on flavors. So who's come infilled that

1627
01:16:55,040 --> 01:17:01,280
Speaker 6: demand where the state's safe block access the market? And

1628
01:17:01,320 --> 01:17:05,280
Speaker 6: so we're seeing a bunch of counterfeits explode onto the

1629
01:17:05,360 --> 01:17:09,160
Speaker 6: scene where they look exactly like the old products that

1630
01:17:09,240 --> 01:17:12,200
Speaker 6: people know, but there's new flavors and that's exactly what

1631
01:17:12,240 --> 01:17:15,600
Speaker 6: consumers want. But they don't know that they're getting a

1632
01:17:15,720 --> 01:17:17,200
Speaker 6: sketchy product.

1633
01:17:16,920 --> 01:17:19,840
Speaker 2: Right because they haven't the process. Well, there's a fine

1634
01:17:19,880 --> 01:17:21,479
Speaker 2: line of balance there. And I get whether it's what

1635
01:17:21,520 --> 01:17:23,639
Speaker 2: Mike DeWine's doing here in Ohio, it's the exact same

1636
01:17:23,760 --> 01:17:28,360
Speaker 2: argument we're doing with the THHD and the intoxicating hemp

1637
01:17:28,400 --> 01:17:30,960
Speaker 2: as we call it, and what's going on with nicotine

1638
01:17:32,040 --> 01:17:37,120
Speaker 2: edibles and the pouches, and that is government will tell you, well,

1639
01:17:37,160 --> 01:17:38,680
Speaker 2: hold on, we need to research you and to make

1640
01:17:38,680 --> 01:17:40,880
Speaker 2: sure this stuff is safe to be consumed by people.

1641
01:17:41,400 --> 01:17:43,280
Speaker 2: You don't know that if you go to your comedience store,

1642
01:17:43,320 --> 01:17:46,040
Speaker 2: you don't know if a product has been tested or not.

1643
01:17:46,240 --> 01:17:47,840
Speaker 3: And that's that's part of the problem.

1644
01:17:47,600 --> 01:17:52,160
Speaker 6: Right exactly. Well, I think most consumers go into a

1645
01:17:52,240 --> 01:17:55,280
Speaker 6: store and they see something on the shelf and they go, oh, yeah,

1646
01:17:55,400 --> 01:17:58,920
Speaker 6: this is this is perfectly safe they're getting it's getting

1647
01:17:58,920 --> 01:18:02,479
Speaker 6: told to me, and there's there's there's there might be

1648
01:18:02,560 --> 01:18:05,400
Speaker 6: some risks, like they know when they buy cigarettes or

1649
01:18:05,439 --> 01:18:07,599
Speaker 6: when they buy a vase, when they buy any sort

1650
01:18:07,640 --> 01:18:10,719
Speaker 6: of products, that there's a downside, but they aren't going

1651
01:18:10,760 --> 01:18:12,920
Speaker 6: in there thinking that it could be a counterfeit. And

1652
01:18:12,960 --> 01:18:16,479
Speaker 6: I think that's where it's really scary and dangerous, is

1653
01:18:16,479 --> 01:18:19,080
Speaker 6: that they think that they're buying a real product, and

1654
01:18:19,120 --> 01:18:21,439
Speaker 6: with the nicotine pouches, they it's a.

1655
01:18:21,400 --> 01:18:22,360
Speaker 4: Harm reduction tool.

1656
01:18:22,400 --> 01:18:25,240
Speaker 6: They think that they're buying something that's safer for them,

1657
01:18:25,960 --> 01:18:30,759
Speaker 6: and really it's it's a counterfeit and and it's it's not.

1658
01:18:30,640 --> 01:18:31,439
Speaker 4: Meeting the needs.

1659
01:18:31,520 --> 01:18:34,760
Speaker 6: And the reason the reason why we have all of

1660
01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:38,559
Speaker 6: these restrictions on the nicotine pouches is what they always

1661
01:18:38,560 --> 01:18:41,960
Speaker 6: say is for the safety of children. The children aren't

1662
01:18:42,000 --> 01:18:45,760
Speaker 6: getting these products. But we we've all been teenagers. We

1663
01:18:45,880 --> 01:18:48,160
Speaker 6: know how, we know how teams are. They're going to

1664
01:18:48,240 --> 01:18:50,680
Speaker 6: get their hands on what they want to And now

1665
01:18:50,720 --> 01:18:53,600
Speaker 6: the market is even more dangerous because the market is

1666
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:58,719
Speaker 6: fulled with counterfeits because we restricted it for the safety

1667
01:18:58,800 --> 01:19:00,960
Speaker 6: of these teams. But now all the teams are getting

1668
01:19:00,960 --> 01:19:02,920
Speaker 6: what they're getting the counterfeit.

1669
01:19:02,560 --> 01:19:06,040
Speaker 2: Product, right, right, So what would happen basically politically speaking,

1670
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:08,600
Speaker 2: is a lot of progressives, for example, and some conservatives

1671
01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:10,640
Speaker 2: what we'll talk about, well, this is why we need

1672
01:19:10,680 --> 01:19:12,599
Speaker 2: a strong FDA, and this is you know, you're you're

1673
01:19:12,640 --> 01:19:14,559
Speaker 2: just gonna fast track all this stuff and put all

1674
01:19:14,560 --> 01:19:17,280
Speaker 2: these more poisons on the market. And they're getting on

1675
01:19:17,320 --> 01:19:20,320
Speaker 2: the market anyway, to ignore the what the black market

1676
01:19:20,400 --> 01:19:24,840
Speaker 2: is created, whether it's THC drinks or edibles or in

1677
01:19:24,840 --> 01:19:28,559
Speaker 2: this case, nicotine pouches and pretty much everything else. They've

1678
01:19:28,840 --> 01:19:31,080
Speaker 2: they've got to meet consumer demand head on. And you

1679
01:19:31,120 --> 01:19:33,360
Speaker 2: don't do that by Okay, in five years, we're gonna

1680
01:19:33,360 --> 01:19:34,960
Speaker 2: have research and we'll find out whether or not we're

1681
01:19:35,000 --> 01:19:37,240
Speaker 2: all lot of this stuff and that's gonna get polluted

1682
01:19:37,240 --> 01:19:40,200
Speaker 2: down by lobby groups and everything else. Or just simply

1683
01:19:41,120 --> 01:19:44,559
Speaker 2: you know, if you're if you're anti edible or vape

1684
01:19:44,680 --> 01:19:48,800
Speaker 2: or nicotine, you're you're gonna shoot this thing down. Whatever

1685
01:19:48,800 --> 01:19:51,799
Speaker 2: the corporate policy is, so to speak, the party policy.

1686
01:19:51,920 --> 01:19:54,400
Speaker 2: So this stuff has to be faster. We got to

1687
01:19:54,400 --> 01:19:56,360
Speaker 2: do a better job of saying, Okay, well it's not

1688
01:19:56,439 --> 01:19:58,400
Speaker 2: the best thing you can put in your body, but

1689
01:19:59,280 --> 01:20:02,479
Speaker 2: at least there's not mercury or serious harmful chemicals in it.

1690
01:20:02,520 --> 01:20:04,680
Speaker 2: We need to test this stuff and screen it much

1691
01:20:04,760 --> 01:20:08,839
Speaker 2: much faster. But that's the reality here. Can we actually change.

1692
01:20:08,640 --> 01:20:14,040
Speaker 6: That, though we definitely can. These products have been available

1693
01:20:14,360 --> 01:20:19,639
Speaker 6: in the europe market for chuckies. We know that they're safe.

1694
01:20:19,760 --> 01:20:21,720
Speaker 6: We don't need to go in through a whole new

1695
01:20:21,760 --> 01:20:24,880
Speaker 6: approval process. We can look at these markets that we

1696
01:20:24,960 --> 01:20:27,920
Speaker 6: know and trust and say, okay, here's the research that

1697
01:20:27,960 --> 01:20:31,200
Speaker 6: they've produced. It's good to be on the US market.

1698
01:20:31,800 --> 01:20:35,920
Speaker 6: Let's fast track it and approve it. Instead, they're doing

1699
01:20:35,960 --> 01:20:38,679
Speaker 6: the same thing where they did with spates, where they

1700
01:20:39,160 --> 01:20:41,360
Speaker 6: blocked good things from getting on the market that we

1701
01:20:41,439 --> 01:20:45,559
Speaker 6: knew we're safe and that we knew consumers wanted, and

1702
01:20:46,040 --> 01:20:50,640
Speaker 6: instead of approving things, they went and attacked the counterfeits

1703
01:20:50,680 --> 01:20:53,440
Speaker 6: which needs to happen. You need to get the counterfeits

1704
01:20:53,439 --> 01:20:56,680
Speaker 6: off the market, but they're ignoring why those counterfeits are

1705
01:20:56,720 --> 01:21:00,559
Speaker 6: on the market, and that's to fill the design of

1706
01:21:00,600 --> 01:21:04,519
Speaker 6: the consumers. And so we're seeing the same issue with

1707
01:21:04,760 --> 01:21:08,200
Speaker 6: nicotine couches where they're attacking the counterfeits, but they're not

1708
01:21:08,280 --> 01:21:13,120
Speaker 6: addressing why the counterfeits popped up first. And so they

1709
01:21:13,200 --> 01:21:16,120
Speaker 6: really do need to address the approval process to get

1710
01:21:16,160 --> 01:21:20,599
Speaker 6: good quality products on the market that adult consumers want,

1711
01:21:20,680 --> 01:21:26,000
Speaker 6: and that includes flavors, that includes choice in nicotine percentages.

1712
01:21:26,560 --> 01:21:31,720
Speaker 6: And you can't just put this desire to have prohibition,

1713
01:21:32,040 --> 01:21:40,200
Speaker 6: especially among teenagers, to harming adult consumers because everyone will

1714
01:21:40,240 --> 01:21:42,599
Speaker 6: be worse off if you take away that change.

1715
01:21:42,640 --> 01:21:44,720
Speaker 3: And that was Governor Mike Dewines cry here is this

1716
01:21:44,760 --> 01:21:45,800
Speaker 3: is about the children. The child.

1717
01:21:45,800 --> 01:21:48,679
Speaker 2: We got to save the children because children, I get. Okay, Well,

1718
01:21:48,920 --> 01:21:51,160
Speaker 2: well what about the retail around of the Sophia Hamilton.

1719
01:21:53,080 --> 01:21:55,439
Speaker 2: You know, if I'm a retail what's the retailer's perspective

1720
01:21:55,439 --> 01:21:57,080
Speaker 2: on this or some instiga. I don't care what's in it,

1721
01:21:57,120 --> 01:21:58,760
Speaker 2: even if it's poison. I'll sell it to him because

1722
01:21:58,760 --> 01:22:00,680
Speaker 2: I need to make money at my carry out. It's

1723
01:22:00,680 --> 01:22:03,160
Speaker 2: certainly not all retailers. I don't see the big box

1724
01:22:03,160 --> 01:22:05,599
Speaker 2: stores or you know, the Krogers of the world, for example,

1725
01:22:06,320 --> 01:22:08,799
Speaker 2: shelving this stuff. But you know, at the same time,

1726
01:22:09,520 --> 01:22:12,760
Speaker 2: the little guy at the corner, what's the process for them?

1727
01:22:12,800 --> 01:22:14,439
Speaker 2: They're trying to keep their head above water to I

1728
01:22:14,479 --> 01:22:16,160
Speaker 2: get it, but I don't think i'd want to make

1729
01:22:16,200 --> 01:22:18,840
Speaker 2: my money, you know, selling the kids. Some people are

1730
01:22:18,840 --> 01:22:21,240
Speaker 2: going to do that. It seems like it's an enforcement issue.

1731
01:22:22,439 --> 01:22:27,559
Speaker 6: Yeah, there are enforcement issues, but they're smart. They're going

1732
01:22:27,640 --> 01:22:31,320
Speaker 6: to find someone who's above the legal age to buy

1733
01:22:31,320 --> 01:22:34,400
Speaker 6: the product for them or have a fake idea. There's

1734
01:22:34,439 --> 01:22:38,160
Speaker 6: definitely ways. It's really not that complicated for them to

1735
01:22:38,200 --> 01:22:41,280
Speaker 6: find ways to get these products in a reliable manner.

1736
01:22:42,040 --> 01:22:46,120
Speaker 6: And I think it's fairs not want teenagers to be

1737
01:22:46,240 --> 01:22:50,000
Speaker 6: using these products, especially if they've never used other nicotine products.

1738
01:22:50,200 --> 01:22:53,519
Speaker 6: You don't want to get them addicted. But they're going

1739
01:22:53,600 --> 01:22:55,320
Speaker 6: to do what they want to do. At the end

1740
01:22:55,360 --> 01:22:58,120
Speaker 6: of the day, they're going to drink even though drinking

1741
01:22:58,160 --> 01:23:01,280
Speaker 6: age is at twenty one. The aids to consume nickedine

1742
01:23:01,280 --> 01:23:04,559
Speaker 6: and tobacco is also at twenty one, And we were

1743
01:23:04,640 --> 01:23:08,040
Speaker 6: all in college at one point. But I just this,

1744
01:23:08,040 --> 01:23:13,679
Speaker 6: this desire to go through prohibition policies and we've seen

1745
01:23:13,720 --> 01:23:17,760
Speaker 6: them fail time and time again with so many different substances,

1746
01:23:18,520 --> 01:23:21,880
Speaker 6: is the silliest thing in my mind. We've seen it fail.

1747
01:23:21,920 --> 01:23:24,200
Speaker 6: Why are we trying to do it again? Because it's

1748
01:23:24,280 --> 01:23:28,920
Speaker 6: hurting retailers, like you said, it's hurting consumers, it's hurting

1749
01:23:29,000 --> 01:23:33,200
Speaker 6: the companies, and it's hurting the local economies because you

1750
01:23:33,280 --> 01:23:37,639
Speaker 6: get so much money from taxes on these products, right,

1751
01:23:37,840 --> 01:23:40,120
Speaker 6: and so you're trying to prohibit it and you're putting

1752
01:23:40,120 --> 01:23:42,600
Speaker 6: it into the black market where you're the state is

1753
01:23:42,640 --> 01:23:46,920
Speaker 6: no longer able to get the excise taxes from these products.

1754
01:23:47,080 --> 01:23:50,960
Speaker 6: So it's really just the loose situation all around.

1755
01:23:50,800 --> 01:23:51,320
Speaker 3: No question.

1756
01:23:51,479 --> 01:23:53,920
Speaker 2: And you know the fact of the matter is the

1757
01:23:53,960 --> 01:23:56,560
Speaker 2: government can never keep up with demand. They need to

1758
01:23:56,600 --> 01:23:59,200
Speaker 2: move a lot faster, be a lot leaner. That makes

1759
01:23:59,280 --> 01:24:02,600
Speaker 2: capitalism work better. Certainly, we don't want poisons going to

1760
01:24:02,680 --> 01:24:04,120
Speaker 2: convenience stores or our bodies.

1761
01:24:04,160 --> 01:24:06,080
Speaker 3: We assume that a lot of stuff is tested.

1762
01:24:06,439 --> 01:24:09,040
Speaker 2: But the way the models set up the big tobacco

1763
01:24:09,160 --> 01:24:11,600
Speaker 2: companies that have all sorts of research and development and

1764
01:24:11,680 --> 01:24:14,559
Speaker 2: backing and money coming or talking billions and publicly traded

1765
01:24:14,600 --> 01:24:19,920
Speaker 2: companies they can afford to play the regulation game, like Zen,

1766
01:24:20,000 --> 01:24:23,479
Speaker 2: for example, simply because they have the what about the

1767
01:24:23,520 --> 01:24:25,519
Speaker 2: mom and pop the entrepreneurs. And the same is true

1768
01:24:25,560 --> 01:24:28,120
Speaker 2: when it comes to THHD infused drinks. You know, I mean,

1769
01:24:28,479 --> 01:24:31,280
Speaker 2: you know, Anheuser Busch may be able to put a

1770
01:24:31,320 --> 01:24:34,320
Speaker 2: product out that rivals at but something like fifty West

1771
01:24:34,320 --> 01:24:37,519
Speaker 2: here in Cincinnati, when they roll a THC infused product,

1772
01:24:37,560 --> 01:24:39,760
Speaker 2: they don't have the backing, the wherewith all the R

1773
01:24:39,760 --> 01:24:42,360
Speaker 2: and D to be able to afford all the regulatory

1774
01:24:42,400 --> 01:24:45,240
Speaker 2: red tape to get the government seal of approval. That

1775
01:24:45,400 --> 01:24:49,720
Speaker 2: just stemy small and mid sized businesses, doesn't it exactly?

1776
01:24:50,360 --> 01:24:56,960
Speaker 6: Going through the approval process takes good years and countless

1777
01:24:57,160 --> 01:25:02,240
Speaker 6: countless dollars. Zen just speaking, the first company to be

1778
01:25:02,320 --> 01:25:05,960
Speaker 6: approved to market to adulop consumers in the US their

1779
01:25:06,040 --> 01:25:10,719
Speaker 6: nicotine pouches in January of this year. The first company,

1780
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:16,200
Speaker 6: They're a giant company international, and that took in years

1781
01:25:16,200 --> 01:25:18,880
Speaker 6: and years to get that first stamp of approval. That's

1782
01:25:18,920 --> 01:25:24,160
Speaker 6: not even the end process. Most companies cannot wait that long,

1783
01:25:24,960 --> 01:25:28,320
Speaker 6: and so it's it's an incredibly difficult process to go through.

1784
01:25:28,320 --> 01:25:33,120
Speaker 6: It's also very very confusing and long, and the sea

1785
01:25:33,400 --> 01:25:37,479
Speaker 6: is has a huge backlog or records long backlog, and

1786
01:25:37,680 --> 01:25:42,080
Speaker 6: most companies just cannot survive that weight to get the approval,

1787
01:25:42,479 --> 01:25:45,880
Speaker 6: and that's where you're seeing good competition get pushed out

1788
01:25:45,880 --> 01:25:48,320
Speaker 6: of the way, while we have the door wide open

1789
01:25:48,800 --> 01:25:51,760
Speaker 6: for counterfeits where we don't know what's what's even in

1790
01:25:51,840 --> 01:25:54,960
Speaker 6: them because there's no there's no approval process, there's no

1791
01:25:55,080 --> 01:25:56,000
Speaker 6: regulation there.

1792
01:25:56,200 --> 01:25:59,799
Speaker 2: I know what no one's saying. Nicotine is you certainly

1793
01:26:00,120 --> 01:26:02,280
Speaker 2: you can get sick. You can overdose on nicotine for

1794
01:26:02,320 --> 01:26:04,240
Speaker 2: that matter too, But you know, it seems to me

1795
01:26:04,360 --> 01:26:07,679
Speaker 2: a better alternative than traditional tobacco would be VP products,

1796
01:26:07,720 --> 01:26:10,519
Speaker 2: but especially nicotine pouches that you put between your lip

1797
01:26:10,560 --> 01:26:13,800
Speaker 2: and gum. It's not a can, it's not a carcinogen

1798
01:26:13,840 --> 01:26:16,920
Speaker 2: in the way that the traditional snuffs and dip and

1799
01:26:17,000 --> 01:26:19,920
Speaker 2: smoking is. And so you know, if you're worried about

1800
01:26:19,960 --> 01:26:22,479
Speaker 2: the future generations and lung cancer and cancer as well,

1801
01:26:22,680 --> 01:26:24,480
Speaker 2: this seems like to be a good alternative.

1802
01:26:24,520 --> 01:26:25,320
Speaker 3: It's not perfect.

1803
01:26:25,479 --> 01:26:28,240
Speaker 2: I'm not saying it doesn't have harmful effects, but it's

1804
01:26:28,280 --> 01:26:30,200
Speaker 2: certainly a lot less than what the alternative is or

1805
01:26:30,200 --> 01:26:31,480
Speaker 2: the traditional methods.

1806
01:26:31,120 --> 01:26:36,080
Speaker 6: Are exactly it's a harm reduction tool because it is

1807
01:26:36,240 --> 01:26:39,559
Speaker 6: more safe than the other products that are out there.

1808
01:26:39,600 --> 01:26:43,360
Speaker 6: So if you're going to be consuming nicotine, this is

1809
01:26:43,520 --> 01:26:47,640
Speaker 6: the safest way that you can do it. And there's

1810
01:26:47,680 --> 01:26:52,559
Speaker 6: still downsides. You can have some irritation, stomach upside, but

1811
01:26:52,680 --> 01:26:56,040
Speaker 6: you know, I'm sitting here drinking of coffee and there's

1812
01:26:56,320 --> 01:27:00,360
Speaker 6: similar downside to coffee as well with nicotine. So it's

1813
01:27:00,600 --> 01:27:04,040
Speaker 6: really the safest way that you can consume the product.

1814
01:27:04,160 --> 01:27:07,480
Speaker 6: And it's it's funny to see all of the restrictions

1815
01:27:07,680 --> 01:27:09,720
Speaker 6: when you can easily go and buy a pack of

1816
01:27:09,800 --> 01:27:13,519
Speaker 6: cigarette still, and so all of these, all of these

1817
01:27:13,560 --> 01:27:17,439
Speaker 6: barriers that we're putting up to a less harmful product

1818
01:27:17,479 --> 01:27:22,200
Speaker 6: and placing more taxes on it. It's it just does

1819
01:27:22,280 --> 01:27:24,840
Speaker 6: not make sense if the end goal is to have

1820
01:27:24,880 --> 01:27:28,639
Speaker 6: people consuming in a safer way. It really does seem

1821
01:27:28,680 --> 01:27:33,960
Speaker 6: like the end goal is prohibition and abstinence from any subject.

1822
01:27:34,000 --> 01:27:36,040
Speaker 2: Well, I think the other leg of the stool here

1823
01:27:36,040 --> 01:27:38,360
Speaker 2: between you know, companies and the government, of the fact

1824
01:27:38,400 --> 01:27:42,800
Speaker 2: of the the big business that is the health prevention people,

1825
01:27:42,920 --> 01:27:45,559
Speaker 2: the health the health people right. The Long Association Heard

1826
01:27:45,560 --> 01:27:50,000
Speaker 2: Association where Association amou BE is when the vaping trend

1827
01:27:50,040 --> 01:27:53,040
Speaker 2: started to take years and years ago. What surprised me

1828
01:27:53,120 --> 01:27:55,360
Speaker 2: is some of the same people that said, oh my god,

1829
01:27:55,400 --> 01:27:57,720
Speaker 2: we've got to sue tobacco companies out of existence, and

1830
01:27:57,720 --> 01:28:00,880
Speaker 2: they're they're killing people. They are being seemed a good

1831
01:28:00,920 --> 01:28:03,280
Speaker 2: way to wean yourself off of traditional tobacco. And yet

1832
01:28:03,320 --> 01:28:06,080
Speaker 2: they fought just as hard as they did against traditional tobacco,

1833
01:28:06,439 --> 01:28:08,320
Speaker 2: is it against vape? And some of them are fighting

1834
01:28:08,320 --> 01:28:11,400
Speaker 2: against nicotine pouches and I'm like, that's a much safer

1835
01:28:11,439 --> 01:28:13,880
Speaker 2: alternative to what you get. So if you, you know,

1836
01:28:13,960 --> 01:28:15,600
Speaker 2: if you stamp out the problem, not that you know,

1837
01:28:15,680 --> 01:28:17,320
Speaker 2: we I don't know what the smoking levels, but they're

1838
01:28:17,320 --> 01:28:20,080
Speaker 2: nowhere near where they used to be. Now your organization

1839
01:28:20,160 --> 01:28:21,559
Speaker 2: cees too. Is this so we have to find the

1840
01:28:21,560 --> 01:28:23,040
Speaker 2: next boogeyman in order to keep.

1841
01:28:22,920 --> 01:28:27,840
Speaker 6: Our funding exactly exactly And what they will never say

1842
01:28:28,520 --> 01:28:32,240
Speaker 6: is that they'll never point to the tobacco studies that

1843
01:28:32,320 --> 01:28:35,040
Speaker 6: are done at the national level that show our use

1844
01:28:35,120 --> 01:28:39,400
Speaker 6: in adult smoking rates are at a historic level. They

1845
01:28:39,439 --> 01:28:42,599
Speaker 6: will never point that out. And why is that? Because

1846
01:28:42,680 --> 01:28:47,040
Speaker 6: of new products like nicotine pouches, And they just want

1847
01:28:47,080 --> 01:28:49,599
Speaker 6: to demonize this because they think it's from the same

1848
01:28:50,080 --> 01:28:55,120
Speaker 6: old big tobacco of two decades before. And know these

1849
01:28:55,439 --> 01:28:59,000
Speaker 6: these are companies that want to have safer alternatives for

1850
01:29:00,120 --> 01:29:04,120
Speaker 6: their for their client base because they know what their

1851
01:29:04,160 --> 01:29:08,479
Speaker 6: consumers want. And I'll go when I testify on these

1852
01:29:08,520 --> 01:29:12,160
Speaker 6: issues to state legislators, the people that are arguing against

1853
01:29:13,560 --> 01:29:18,640
Speaker 6: against access to these good products are not based in reality.

1854
01:29:18,680 --> 01:29:22,759
Speaker 6: They really are, I think, just trying to keep their jobs,

1855
01:29:22,920 --> 01:29:25,360
Speaker 6: arguing against big tobacco.

1856
01:29:24,960 --> 01:29:25,920
Speaker 3: And their mind right.

1857
01:29:26,280 --> 01:29:29,760
Speaker 6: And they will argue that nicotine is as harmful and

1858
01:29:29,800 --> 01:29:35,960
Speaker 6: as substances like heroin, And I hear that line so

1859
01:29:36,120 --> 01:29:38,920
Speaker 6: many times and it's the funniest thing to me. But

1860
01:29:39,040 --> 01:29:41,759
Speaker 6: it's sad because they think it's rooted in reality.

1861
01:29:41,800 --> 01:29:43,719
Speaker 8: It's any bits.

1862
01:29:43,080 --> 01:29:44,720
Speaker 2: Laugh at the What we got to do is to

1863
01:29:44,760 --> 01:29:47,080
Speaker 2: save the children because children are being corrupted in their

1864
01:29:47,080 --> 01:29:49,400
Speaker 2: bank And do agree, you knowuse children should not be

1865
01:29:49,400 --> 01:29:52,760
Speaker 2: buying intoxicating hemp products your carry out, But that is

1866
01:29:52,800 --> 01:29:54,920
Speaker 2: not a reason to shut the entire industry down because

1867
01:29:54,960 --> 01:29:58,120
Speaker 2: somebody adults enjoy it. Uh, you know, whether it's THG

1868
01:29:58,240 --> 01:30:02,600
Speaker 2: drinks or nicotine pouches or vaping, it's the same predictable

1869
01:30:02,720 --> 01:30:05,599
Speaker 2: argument from the pearl clutters about, you know, protecting the show.

1870
01:30:05,600 --> 01:30:07,760
Speaker 2: We've got to shut that on protected children, damn it.

1871
01:30:07,800 --> 01:30:09,960
Speaker 2: With the adult market wants, we've got to do this

1872
01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:12,639
Speaker 2: to save the children, which they're doing at the behest

1873
01:30:12,720 --> 01:30:16,479
Speaker 2: of well, the big health organizations as we mentioned, as

1874
01:30:16,520 --> 01:30:20,320
Speaker 2: well as the big tobacco companies that are getting decreasing

1875
01:30:20,400 --> 01:30:23,400
Speaker 2: revenue from tobacco here in the States, and so they

1876
01:30:23,400 --> 01:30:26,599
Speaker 2: supplant that income and keep their shareholders happy with something else.

1877
01:30:26,640 --> 01:30:29,400
Speaker 2: With us Nicotine pouches are vape that shouldn't price out

1878
01:30:29,400 --> 01:30:31,240
Speaker 2: the little guy though, and that's what's happening here, whether

1879
01:30:31,280 --> 01:30:34,880
Speaker 2: it's fifty West or you know somebody who's selling vape

1880
01:30:34,960 --> 01:30:39,240
Speaker 2: juice to a local supplier. Anyway, Sophia Hamilton writing about

1881
01:30:39,280 --> 01:30:42,000
Speaker 2: this in Reason She's with a Young Voices and thanks again,

1882
01:30:42,040 --> 01:30:42,880
Speaker 2: soph We appreciate it.

1883
01:30:43,680 --> 01:30:45,679
Speaker 6: Thank you so much for having me on Scott.

1884
01:30:45,720 --> 01:30:46,519
Speaker 4: I appreciate it.

1885
01:30:46,560 --> 01:30:49,840
Speaker 2: Be well, good stuff there, and that's the libertary inside

1886
01:30:49,880 --> 01:30:52,080
Speaker 2: of me coming out. And I'm not saying you open

1887
01:30:52,120 --> 01:30:54,240
Speaker 2: it all up and it's a free There has to

1888
01:30:54,280 --> 01:30:57,320
Speaker 2: be reasonable amounts of testing to make sure the product's

1889
01:30:57,360 --> 01:30:59,599
Speaker 2: safe as safe as it could be, but it shouldn't

1890
01:30:59,600 --> 01:31:01,800
Speaker 2: take decad and it shouldn't be only available to the

1891
01:31:01,840 --> 01:31:04,720
Speaker 2: big pocketed companies. You can afford that Scott's Loan show

1892
01:31:04,760 --> 01:31:07,200
Speaker 2: with News on the way, and when we're returning, what

1893
01:31:07,240 --> 01:31:12,600
Speaker 2: the no King's protests refused to accept the protesters and

1894
01:31:12,640 --> 01:31:14,920
Speaker 2: I get what you're complaining about when I sort of do.

1895
01:31:15,000 --> 01:31:17,000
Speaker 2: It's a bunch of people complaining about different things, and

1896
01:31:17,040 --> 01:31:19,760
Speaker 2: that's not one unified protest that just comes out as

1897
01:31:19,760 --> 01:31:21,679
Speaker 2: we hate Trump. We'll get into that next seven hundred

1898
01:31:21,800 --> 01:31:26,360
Speaker 2: WLW Scott Clone show, seven hundred weather. That lou Hes

1899
01:31:26,520 --> 01:31:31,200
Speaker 2: is fascinating, absolutely fascinating. That ladder leaning up against the

1900
01:31:31,200 --> 01:31:33,479
Speaker 2: building already, no one saw that coming. You saw a

1901
01:31:33,560 --> 01:31:36,000
Speaker 2: ladder there, I went. It's kind of security issue and

1902
01:31:36,120 --> 01:31:38,240
Speaker 2: somebody breaks in. When the what's seven to ten minutes

1903
01:31:38,720 --> 01:31:41,759
Speaker 2: took off with a portion of the French Crown jewels

1904
01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:45,920
Speaker 2: and Napoleon jewels, that's pretty Uh, it's actually pretty Pink Panther.

1905
01:31:47,240 --> 01:31:49,040
Speaker 2: I'm not talking about the Steve Martin one. I'm talking

1906
01:31:49,040 --> 01:31:52,680
Speaker 2: about the Oldsco. If you're old enough, remember uh was

1907
01:31:52,720 --> 01:31:54,880
Speaker 2: that Peter Sellers in the Pink Panther movies?

1908
01:31:55,280 --> 01:31:57,400
Speaker 3: The minute that story broke. Well, you have France, we

1909
01:31:57,439 --> 01:32:00,439
Speaker 3: have a jewelized Where is inspector gluso?

1910
01:32:02,080 --> 01:32:05,200
Speaker 2: That's nothing med dig all right, go look it up, kids,

1911
01:32:05,240 --> 01:32:08,280
Speaker 2: go look it up. Home stretcher will he takes over

1912
01:32:08,360 --> 01:32:11,840
Speaker 2: at twelve o'clock. And this weekend we had the No

1913
01:32:12,080 --> 01:32:15,519
Speaker 2: Kings rally. I did, actually I did the Little King's

1914
01:32:15,600 --> 01:32:18,160
Speaker 2: rally myself. I was rallying for some Little Kings because

1915
01:32:18,720 --> 01:32:22,759
Speaker 2: start on Friday afternoon and don't until Saturday night. Anyway,

1916
01:32:22,960 --> 01:32:25,519
Speaker 2: looked like pretty decent turnouts this weekend if you're into

1917
01:32:25,560 --> 01:32:29,000
Speaker 2: protests and estimated I think they said seven million nationally,

1918
01:32:29,040 --> 01:32:31,479
Speaker 2: big group of people at small riverfront Park and elsewhere.

1919
01:32:32,360 --> 01:32:35,120
Speaker 2: And uh, I know our Republicans old brand. This is

1920
01:32:35,160 --> 01:32:40,519
Speaker 2: a hate America rally. I mean, come on, you know

1921
01:32:40,600 --> 01:32:42,920
Speaker 2: some people may hate America in that group, sure, but

1922
01:32:43,280 --> 01:32:45,120
Speaker 2: I mean one could say it's a hate America rally.

1923
01:32:45,120 --> 01:32:47,160
Speaker 2: You could say the same thing about Jay six, you know,

1924
01:32:47,240 --> 01:32:51,680
Speaker 2: trying to unsuccessfully subvert the Constitution. Because the MyPillow guy

1925
01:32:51,720 --> 01:32:54,560
Speaker 2: said so that just seems like hack politics and a

1926
01:32:54,600 --> 01:32:57,519
Speaker 2: hacked defense. I don't you know, I thought the No

1927
01:32:57,680 --> 01:33:01,400
Speaker 2: Kings rally was stupid for different reasons because typically in

1928
01:33:01,439 --> 01:33:03,760
Speaker 2: these things it's just the it's it's a bunch of

1929
01:33:03,800 --> 01:33:10,160
Speaker 2: aggrieved progressives with different causes and different you know, anger

1930
01:33:10,200 --> 01:33:15,439
Speaker 2: points and talking points and assorted beefs under the common

1931
01:33:15,520 --> 01:33:17,000
Speaker 2: threat of we hate Trump.

1932
01:33:16,760 --> 01:33:18,160
Speaker 3: And it's just more of the same.

1933
01:33:19,479 --> 01:33:21,800
Speaker 2: Participant groups include you had the a c LU there,

1934
01:33:21,840 --> 01:33:24,479
Speaker 2: you had teachers unions, you had the Human Rights Campaign,

1935
01:33:24,560 --> 01:33:27,760
Speaker 2: you had Indivisible and move on. I'm not quite you're indivisible,

1936
01:33:27,800 --> 01:33:29,960
Speaker 2: but move on, we know goes back to the move

1937
01:33:30,000 --> 01:33:34,519
Speaker 2: on from the war. Nonetheless, it's a bunch of people

1938
01:33:34,560 --> 01:33:37,920
Speaker 2: with various indifferent interests, but the same hate for Trump,

1939
01:33:37,960 --> 01:33:40,080
Speaker 2: I guess. And that doesn't to me. It's like, okay, well,

1940
01:33:40,200 --> 01:33:42,400
Speaker 2: what else is new? What else do you have? It's

1941
01:33:42,439 --> 01:33:45,080
Speaker 2: not like one central thing. It's just well, you know

1942
01:33:45,080 --> 01:33:47,080
Speaker 2: what it is alone. It's fascism, That's what it is.

1943
01:33:47,120 --> 01:33:48,680
Speaker 2: It's it's fair. I mean, just look at the young

1944
01:33:48,720 --> 01:33:53,040
Speaker 2: Republican chats for example. It's fascism. It's you know, Trump's

1945
01:33:53,040 --> 01:33:54,960
Speaker 2: a lot of things, and some of it I like,

1946
01:33:55,000 --> 01:33:58,040
Speaker 2: some of it I don't like, but the whole tired

1947
01:33:58,080 --> 01:34:02,679
Speaker 2: fascism trope. I mean, every time there's a Republican it's fascist.

1948
01:34:02,840 --> 01:34:05,880
Speaker 2: Reagan was a fascist when I was younger, and then

1949
01:34:05,920 --> 01:34:07,240
Speaker 2: every Republican.

1950
01:34:06,840 --> 01:34:07,879
Speaker 3: Between is a fascist.

1951
01:34:07,880 --> 01:34:12,559
Speaker 2: It's Fascism is closer ideologically to communism, you know. So

1952
01:34:12,600 --> 01:34:15,960
Speaker 2: you have Marxist socialism, you have capitalism, liberal capitalism, that's

1953
01:34:15,960 --> 01:34:18,040
Speaker 2: a blend to that. So and then all you're doing

1954
01:34:18,080 --> 01:34:20,120
Speaker 2: is to you're taking public and private sectors and putting

1955
01:34:20,200 --> 01:34:23,320
Speaker 2: under a central government and central ideology. So privately, yeah,

1956
01:34:23,320 --> 01:34:26,040
Speaker 2: you can have private industry, but the ultimate authority is

1957
01:34:26,080 --> 01:34:28,280
Speaker 2: the state, and so you've got a lot of censorship.

1958
01:34:28,320 --> 01:34:30,839
Speaker 3: And I just I don't.

1959
01:34:30,680 --> 01:34:33,479
Speaker 2: See how someone who has a track record of being

1960
01:34:33,720 --> 01:34:39,599
Speaker 2: anti authoritarian and a capitalist is a fascist.

1961
01:34:39,720 --> 01:34:42,240
Speaker 3: That's again, Donald Ruby, Calma j you want.

1962
01:34:42,280 --> 01:34:46,519
Speaker 2: But fascist is such a it's such a character, that's incorrect,

1963
01:34:46,880 --> 01:34:50,000
Speaker 2: you know, Fascists witnes to point judges and jurists who

1964
01:34:50,360 --> 01:34:52,320
Speaker 2: want to minimize the authority of the federal government. It's

1965
01:34:52,400 --> 01:34:58,719
Speaker 2: exact opposite. The real problem, though, are the executive orders.

1966
01:34:59,800 --> 01:35:02,200
Speaker 2: Now we've had a decreased, believe it or not, of

1967
01:35:02,200 --> 01:35:04,080
Speaker 2: all things in the number of execut doors issue. If

1968
01:35:04,080 --> 01:35:06,559
Speaker 2: you look at presidencies over the last twenty years, and

1969
01:35:07,000 --> 01:35:10,120
Speaker 2: recent presidents have seemingly man they're just doing everything by

1970
01:35:10,120 --> 01:35:13,280
Speaker 2: executive order, which is sure like for the front part

1971
01:35:13,320 --> 01:35:16,000
Speaker 2: of the front loadings increased thematically, like Trump signed I

1972
01:35:16,000 --> 01:35:17,840
Speaker 2: think one hundred and forty three executive orders in the

1973
01:35:17,840 --> 01:35:21,599
Speaker 2: first hundred days, Franklin Roosevelt saying ninety nine. But by

1974
01:35:21,600 --> 01:35:23,920
Speaker 2: the way, Franklin Roosevelt is the goat when it comes

1975
01:35:23,920 --> 01:35:27,840
Speaker 2: to executive orders. He wrote over thirty seven hundred of

1976
01:35:27,880 --> 01:35:30,280
Speaker 2: them during his years as president. Of course, that spanned

1977
01:35:30,280 --> 01:35:32,439
Speaker 2: an ungodly amount of time. He was in office for

1978
01:35:32,479 --> 01:35:37,000
Speaker 2: like now forty five years, and you most you're going

1979
01:35:37,040 --> 01:35:39,880
Speaker 2: to get now is two two terms, so that with

1980
01:35:39,920 --> 01:35:42,760
Speaker 2: a grand assault. However, I think part of the issue

1981
01:35:42,800 --> 01:35:46,160
Speaker 2: here is the numbers have declined, but they become more political,

1982
01:35:46,200 --> 01:35:49,120
Speaker 2: and they're front loaded, and it's all part and partial descent,

1983
01:35:49,240 --> 01:35:52,559
Speaker 2: you know, to the politics. To discuss most of us,

1984
01:35:52,560 --> 01:35:54,120
Speaker 2: it'd be the partisan warfare. To just make a lot

1985
01:35:54,160 --> 01:35:59,360
Speaker 2: of sense, you can talk about well, for example, Obama himself,

1986
01:35:59,439 --> 01:36:03,559
Speaker 2: DHAKA is a Obama edict, so was a Clean Power Plan,

1987
01:36:04,120 --> 01:36:06,640
Speaker 2: but also the Affordable Care Act. A lot of that

1988
01:36:06,680 --> 01:36:09,599
Speaker 2: got done because well, let's face it, the executive order,

1989
01:36:09,800 --> 01:36:11,920
Speaker 2: and then Biden picked right back up on this other thing.

1990
01:36:11,920 --> 01:36:12,200
Speaker 3: Gotcha.

1991
01:36:12,240 --> 01:36:15,400
Speaker 2: Oh my god, he's subverting congresses. He's a titan, and

1992
01:36:15,439 --> 01:36:18,320
Speaker 2: he's a fascist because he's a king, because he just

1993
01:36:18,360 --> 01:36:19,599
Speaker 2: writes these executive orders.

1994
01:36:19,640 --> 01:36:23,040
Speaker 3: Hold up just a second. They're skipping now.

1995
01:36:24,120 --> 01:36:25,720
Speaker 2: You got to point that dirty under the stick at

1996
01:36:25,760 --> 01:36:28,679
Speaker 2: yourself somewhat here because your boy Biden, in his first

1997
01:36:28,680 --> 01:36:32,320
Speaker 2: mom signed I think twenty executive order. It was like,

1998
01:36:32,920 --> 01:36:34,720
Speaker 2: somewhere are on twenty in the first two days, I think,

1999
01:36:34,800 --> 01:36:37,479
Speaker 2: first forty eight hours, and he went nuts with the pen.

2000
01:36:38,560 --> 01:36:40,960
Speaker 2: And one of the things he was into was DEI.

2001
01:36:41,320 --> 01:36:44,280
Speaker 2: So this whole anti woke feeld that came about is

2002
01:36:44,280 --> 01:36:49,519
Speaker 2: because of he writing single handedly executive orders leading to

2003
01:36:49,920 --> 01:36:53,480
Speaker 2: the DEI policies that have been refuted now by Republicans

2004
01:36:53,520 --> 01:36:57,760
Speaker 2: who are in charge. It's like, okay, well, you're celebrating

2005
01:36:57,800 --> 01:37:01,880
Speaker 2: the fact that Biden expanded DEI training in that the

2006
01:37:02,280 --> 01:37:05,600
Speaker 2: you know, uh, there's equitable treatment in the government workforce

2007
01:37:05,640 --> 01:37:08,559
Speaker 2: when it comes to people, and uh, there's advanced pay

2008
01:37:08,680 --> 01:37:10,920
Speaker 2: to address racial and gender pay gaps and all this

2009
01:37:11,000 --> 01:37:13,640
Speaker 2: other noise and nonsense. Then about half the country more

2010
01:37:13,720 --> 01:37:17,360
Speaker 2: disagree with like the gender pay gap. Well, you know

2011
01:37:17,439 --> 01:37:19,759
Speaker 2: gender Okay, why do women make less than men. Well,

2012
01:37:20,160 --> 01:37:23,880
Speaker 2: women take time out to have kids, or they leave

2013
01:37:23,920 --> 01:37:25,920
Speaker 2: the workforce for a while and then raise kids and

2014
01:37:25,960 --> 01:37:26,439
Speaker 2: come back.

2015
01:37:26,280 --> 01:37:28,960
Speaker 3: To the workforce later, like my wife did. Should you

2016
01:37:29,000 --> 01:37:30,080
Speaker 3: just pick up where you left off?

2017
01:37:30,080 --> 01:37:32,200
Speaker 2: And they're like, well, just because of age, now you

2018
01:37:32,240 --> 01:37:34,320
Speaker 2: get x amount of how you get paid the same

2019
01:37:34,360 --> 01:37:36,479
Speaker 2: as a person who's been in that position a lot

2020
01:37:36,479 --> 01:37:38,000
Speaker 2: longer than you have to. No, of course that doesn't

2021
01:37:38,000 --> 01:37:40,000
Speaker 2: make any sense. I mean, if that were the case,

2022
01:37:40,280 --> 01:37:43,799
Speaker 2: no one would ever hire a guy. Everyone in the workforce.

2023
01:37:43,840 --> 01:37:45,719
Speaker 2: If you're a woman, you're willing to work for less.

2024
01:37:45,800 --> 01:37:48,240
Speaker 2: You know, seventy seventy cents on seventy seven cents on

2025
01:37:48,280 --> 01:37:52,760
Speaker 2: the dollar. Companies above us want profit right, and if

2026
01:37:52,760 --> 01:37:54,200
Speaker 2: you look at the bottom lines, so well, why we're

2027
01:37:54,240 --> 01:37:54,880
Speaker 2: hiring guys.

2028
01:37:55,320 --> 01:37:57,040
Speaker 3: We just hired a bunch of women. They're willing to

2029
01:37:57,040 --> 01:37:57,639
Speaker 3: work for less.

2030
01:37:58,000 --> 01:38:00,000
Speaker 2: It's the same reason we outsourced jobs of different country

2031
01:38:00,240 --> 01:38:02,479
Speaker 2: is because of the wage scale. It's just the stupidest

2032
01:38:02,520 --> 01:38:06,479
Speaker 2: argument ever. But that's something he signed into law by

2033
01:38:06,560 --> 01:38:11,040
Speaker 2: executive order or Climate action for that matter. You know,

2034
01:38:11,080 --> 01:38:13,680
Speaker 2: cancel the first thing he did, cancel the Keystone XL pipeline. Well,

2035
01:38:13,720 --> 01:38:16,040
Speaker 2: how's that looking when we know we're getting our fuel

2036
01:38:16,040 --> 01:38:18,519
Speaker 2: from our enemies. How's that looking? Gas press up here?

2037
01:38:18,560 --> 01:38:20,320
Speaker 2: Four or five dollars? Again, not a good idea. It's

2038
01:38:20,320 --> 01:38:22,400
Speaker 2: not a good look, Joe. You know, you can wish

2039
01:38:22,479 --> 01:38:26,040
Speaker 2: that we're all in a new energy economy where everything's

2040
01:38:26,040 --> 01:38:28,599
Speaker 2: a windmill or a battery or whether the sun or whatever,

2041
01:38:28,720 --> 01:38:30,240
Speaker 2: but we're not anywhere close to doing that right now.

2042
01:38:30,280 --> 01:38:32,080
Speaker 2: We still live a good one hundred plus years of

2043
01:38:32,840 --> 01:38:35,439
Speaker 2: relying on petroleum. Just the way things are set up

2044
01:38:35,520 --> 01:38:37,400
Speaker 2: doesn't mean you can't do better and work towards it.

2045
01:38:37,400 --> 01:38:40,200
Speaker 2: But again with the subsidy that winds up costing a

2046
01:38:40,200 --> 01:38:43,479
Speaker 2: lot more, and again with the pushing the agenda rather

2047
01:38:43,520 --> 01:38:46,959
Speaker 2: than reality. But the same people are out there protesting

2048
01:38:47,000 --> 01:38:50,519
Speaker 2: in the No King's rally, we're celebrating Joe Biden and

2049
01:38:50,560 --> 01:38:53,559
Speaker 2: Oba Barack Obama for Affordable Care Act, which is again

2050
01:38:53,640 --> 01:38:58,479
Speaker 2: more subsidy. But climate and DEI and all these things.

2051
01:38:58,920 --> 01:38:59,479
Speaker 3: Where were you?

2052
01:38:59,520 --> 01:39:02,920
Speaker 2: Why were you protesting the fascism in the king then

2053
01:39:03,000 --> 01:39:05,599
Speaker 2: when the king on your side, your king, was doing

2054
01:39:05,640 --> 01:39:09,840
Speaker 2: all this stuff. So I look at this and I

2055
01:39:09,880 --> 01:39:12,200
Speaker 2: just kind of smile and laugh because I realized the

2056
01:39:12,240 --> 01:39:16,360
Speaker 2: nonsensical nature of partisan politics and the culture wars feed

2057
01:39:16,360 --> 01:39:20,880
Speaker 2: into this whole narrative. You Ca'm sorry, it seems disingenuous

2058
01:39:20,920 --> 01:39:23,640
Speaker 2: to me for you to be protesting and burning an

2059
01:39:23,640 --> 01:39:26,439
Speaker 2: effigy the president, and I certainly am not the biggest

2060
01:39:26,479 --> 01:39:29,160
Speaker 2: Trump fan of this radio station. Some stuff I look

2061
01:39:29,160 --> 01:39:31,000
Speaker 2: at you go pretty good. Other stuff I look at

2062
01:39:31,040 --> 01:39:33,160
Speaker 2: you go, I don't get it. The tariff, I don't

2063
01:39:33,200 --> 01:39:35,599
Speaker 2: get it. Some of the stuff he says, I get it,

2064
01:39:35,960 --> 01:39:37,720
Speaker 2: But I'm calling it like I see it. And if

2065
01:39:37,760 --> 01:39:39,840
Speaker 2: you're gonna be out there upset that this guy is

2066
01:39:39,880 --> 01:39:42,759
Speaker 2: a dictator in your opinion, and a fascist and whatever

2067
01:39:42,800 --> 01:39:47,720
Speaker 2: other ist it is wrongly labeled, I'll add then I

2068
01:39:47,720 --> 01:39:50,760
Speaker 2: would suggest, Okay, where were you when your guy was

2069
01:39:50,760 --> 01:39:52,960
Speaker 2: doing this just a few years ago. Nowhere to be found,

2070
01:39:53,520 --> 01:39:56,000
Speaker 2: because it supported things that you believe in your core,

2071
01:39:56,640 --> 01:39:58,360
Speaker 2: and that indeed is the problem. That's why we need

2072
01:39:58,400 --> 01:39:59,800
Speaker 2: a rule of law and things to applot all of

2073
01:39:59,880 --> 01:40:02,479
Speaker 2: us the same way. I suppose it's like turning a

2074
01:40:02,479 --> 01:40:04,800
Speaker 2: blind eye towards our it's our guy, so he can

2075
01:40:04,880 --> 01:40:07,280
Speaker 2: cheat the system and do the same things. Now we're

2076
01:40:07,280 --> 01:40:09,280
Speaker 2: accusing the other side of you, much like what's going

2077
01:40:09,320 --> 01:40:13,360
Speaker 2: on with the Young Republicans tech scandal. There are a

2078
01:40:13,400 --> 01:40:16,360
Speaker 2: lot of outrage Democrats and enters our outrage Republicans too.

2079
01:40:17,880 --> 01:40:20,320
Speaker 2: But you know, let's not forget. We also just went

2080
01:40:20,320 --> 01:40:23,920
Speaker 2: through this period where we had we had lawmakers with

2081
01:40:23,960 --> 01:40:28,320
Speaker 2: some avowed anti semitism publicly being anti Semitic, and there

2082
01:40:28,400 --> 01:40:31,479
Speaker 2: wasn't any fallout from that from from your party or

2083
01:40:31,600 --> 01:40:35,280
Speaker 2: Charlie Kirk's assassination or anything along those lines. It's just,

2084
01:40:35,360 --> 01:40:38,000
Speaker 2: you know, you'll taller if you're drinking the political kool aid.

2085
01:40:38,000 --> 01:40:41,040
Speaker 2: You will tolerate your side's beliefs and then of course

2086
01:40:41,080 --> 01:40:45,760
Speaker 2: absolutely obliterate the other side when they're guilty of something

2087
01:40:45,760 --> 01:40:48,599
Speaker 2: that didn't defend you previously. It's just while the rest

2088
01:40:48,640 --> 01:40:49,920
Speaker 2: of us in the middle just throw our hands up

2089
01:40:49,960 --> 01:40:51,800
Speaker 2: and go, this is stupid. Where are we getting with

2090
01:40:51,840 --> 01:40:56,280
Speaker 2: all this? We're getting nowhere. And whether it's Trump or Biden,

2091
01:40:56,360 --> 01:40:59,519
Speaker 2: they both, you know, they using executive orders aggressively when

2092
01:40:59,680 --> 01:41:03,320
Speaker 2: there's gridlock. They got to focus on the core issues

2093
01:41:03,320 --> 01:41:08,000
Speaker 2: to their constituency. And you're going to get court challenges

2094
01:41:08,000 --> 01:41:09,920
Speaker 2: and there's gonna be some reversals in there as well.

2095
01:41:09,960 --> 01:41:11,560
Speaker 2: And now it seems like court spends a lot of

2096
01:41:11,600 --> 01:41:14,479
Speaker 2: time reversing the executive orders, and then this is why

2097
01:41:14,520 --> 01:41:15,880
Speaker 2: the President gets up and says, this is why we

2098
01:41:15,960 --> 01:41:16,679
Speaker 2: got to change things.

2099
01:41:16,680 --> 01:41:17,920
Speaker 3: Otherwise nothing can get done.

2100
01:41:18,160 --> 01:41:20,400
Speaker 2: And we've got this incredible gridlock in our country that

2101
01:41:20,479 --> 01:41:22,080
Speaker 2: I don't have to tell you have a government shutdown.

2102
01:41:22,120 --> 01:41:24,960
Speaker 2: That shutdown over well, an issue that's not going away

2103
01:41:24,960 --> 01:41:28,080
Speaker 2: anytime soon. As I pointed out, we're shutting the government

2104
01:41:28,120 --> 01:41:30,479
Speaker 2: down over the core issue is healthcare. And the reason

2105
01:41:30,520 --> 01:41:32,559
Speaker 2: why we're doing that is because it's the one single

2106
01:41:32,600 --> 01:41:35,840
Speaker 2: issue that Democrats have on their side. Everything else they

2107
01:41:35,880 --> 01:41:37,920
Speaker 2: lose to Trump and the GOP on when it comes

2108
01:41:37,920 --> 01:41:38,839
Speaker 2: to public opinion.

2109
01:41:39,000 --> 01:41:39,840
Speaker 3: They've got one thing.

2110
01:41:40,000 --> 01:41:42,080
Speaker 2: Well, I think it's the equal pay thing, you know,

2111
01:41:42,160 --> 01:41:44,920
Speaker 2: workplace that that doesn't really that's not getting a lot

2112
01:41:44,920 --> 01:41:47,639
Speaker 2: of traction because look at how well women are doing

2113
01:41:47,640 --> 01:41:52,280
Speaker 2: from college on upward. You're excelling. Good for you, that's good. Unfortunately,

2114
01:41:52,280 --> 01:41:53,519
Speaker 2: I think it comes at the expense of a lot

2115
01:41:53,560 --> 01:41:56,600
Speaker 2: of young men. And at the same time, one of

2116
01:41:56,640 --> 01:41:58,639
Speaker 2: the other issues that they have is healthcare. They win

2117
01:41:58,720 --> 01:42:01,960
Speaker 2: on healthcare that they have a plan, No, they've got

2118
01:42:01,960 --> 01:42:05,599
Speaker 2: a band aid, they've got relief. A subsidy doesn't fix

2119
01:42:05,640 --> 01:42:08,960
Speaker 2: the problem that healthcare is too damn expensive. But at

2120
01:42:09,000 --> 01:42:11,320
Speaker 2: least it's something to go, Hey, we're giving you temporary

2121
01:42:11,320 --> 01:42:14,200
Speaker 2: relief to help you pay your healthcare bills. I talk

2122
01:42:14,240 --> 01:42:16,479
Speaker 2: to Republicans about this, and it's well, we need to

2123
01:42:16,479 --> 01:42:20,720
Speaker 2: get America healthy again. Okay, great, that's great. Well we

2124
01:42:20,760 --> 01:42:23,040
Speaker 2: also need to we have more accountability, and we need

2125
01:42:23,040 --> 01:42:25,240
Speaker 2: more competition. Okay, awesome, we need to do that. You're right,

2126
01:42:25,720 --> 01:42:28,479
Speaker 2: how does that pay my bill that's due tomorrow? And

2127
01:42:28,520 --> 01:42:30,840
Speaker 2: I think that's what most Americans look at, right, Okay,

2128
01:42:30,920 --> 01:42:34,519
Speaker 2: I get that the Affordable Care Act is broken and

2129
01:42:34,560 --> 01:42:37,000
Speaker 2: it's just a band aid fix. We're just taking money

2130
01:42:37,000 --> 01:42:39,559
Speaker 2: we don't have and spending it on this temporarily so

2131
01:42:39,680 --> 01:42:41,080
Speaker 2: you can get to the next page. It's like a

2132
01:42:41,080 --> 01:42:43,519
Speaker 2: paycheck loan for healthcare. It's what it is. It's gonna

2133
01:42:43,520 --> 01:42:44,800
Speaker 2: get It's not gonna solve the problem. It's going to

2134
01:42:44,840 --> 01:42:45,719
Speaker 2: get you to the next payday.

2135
01:42:45,840 --> 01:42:46,200
Speaker 3: Okay.

2136
01:42:46,560 --> 01:42:48,920
Speaker 2: But that's something that I think working people, a lot

2137
01:42:48,960 --> 01:42:51,640
Speaker 2: of Americans look at. Go, I don't like it. It

2138
01:42:51,680 --> 01:42:55,360
Speaker 2: cost us more money until we fix the problem. Fine,

2139
01:42:57,160 --> 01:43:00,120
Speaker 2: but we're not fixing the problem. And if Republicans have

2140
01:43:00,120 --> 01:43:02,200
Speaker 2: an alternative to healthcare. Sure would love to hear something

2141
01:43:02,280 --> 01:43:04,800
Speaker 2: rather than going, we got to make America healthy again. Great,

2142
01:43:04,840 --> 01:43:08,519
Speaker 2: we'll teach kids to eat carrots, we will tea which,

2143
01:43:08,560 --> 01:43:10,320
Speaker 2: by the way, I think Michelle Obama tried to do

2144
01:43:10,360 --> 01:43:11,840
Speaker 2: that and then she got left out of the building

2145
01:43:11,920 --> 01:43:13,200
Speaker 2: on republic.

2146
01:43:13,840 --> 01:43:17,840
Speaker 3: We're gonna make kids eat carrots again. Politics is such

2147
01:43:17,840 --> 01:43:20,400
Speaker 3: a joke. So I look at the whole thing and go,

2148
01:43:20,439 --> 01:43:22,800
Speaker 3: all right, well, what's the alternative. Well, we're gonna teach

2149
01:43:22,840 --> 01:43:24,960
Speaker 3: people how to take how to have a stake in

2150
01:43:24,960 --> 01:43:26,400
Speaker 3: their own health and so they do know need too much,

2151
01:43:26,439 --> 01:43:28,400
Speaker 3: and they do the right thing and they exercise.

2152
01:43:28,400 --> 01:43:30,479
Speaker 2: Awesome, That's that's one good. But what about the forty

2153
01:43:30,520 --> 01:43:35,000
Speaker 2: or fifty year old now that can't afford the subsidized healthcare,

2154
01:43:35,240 --> 01:43:39,040
Speaker 2: the healthcare without a subsidy. Those are great solutions and

2155
01:43:39,040 --> 01:43:41,600
Speaker 2: maybe ways to prevent future generations from me dependent on

2156
01:43:41,600 --> 01:43:43,599
Speaker 2: health care. But it doesn't fix the here and now,

2157
01:43:44,360 --> 01:43:47,320
Speaker 2: even temporarily. So I don't think that's much of a plan.

2158
01:43:47,360 --> 01:43:49,680
Speaker 2: It's a platitude, It's what it is. Why not just

2159
01:43:49,680 --> 01:43:51,840
Speaker 2: come out, let's say we're gonna blow the healthcare system up.

2160
01:43:51,880 --> 01:43:54,280
Speaker 2: The problem, of course, is it's going to be the

2161
01:43:54,280 --> 01:43:56,880
Speaker 2: lobby groups. It's going to be the healthcare insurance lobby,

2162
01:43:56,880 --> 01:44:00,160
Speaker 2: the doctor's lobby, the pharmaceutical lobby, lobby, lobby lobby that

2163
01:44:00,160 --> 01:44:01,960
Speaker 2: gets in the year of lawmakers, both on the left

2164
01:44:02,000 --> 01:44:03,719
Speaker 2: and right, and make sure that we have this crappy

2165
01:44:03,760 --> 01:44:07,880
Speaker 2: system because whether it's you know, single pair, double pair,

2166
01:44:08,000 --> 01:44:10,840
Speaker 2: triple pair, whatever, they're fat and happy, and so let's

2167
01:44:10,840 --> 01:44:13,000
Speaker 2: not rock the apple cart. The other thing I think, too,

2168
01:44:13,160 --> 01:44:16,000
Speaker 2: is that we don't fix the system simply because if

2169
01:44:16,000 --> 01:44:21,280
Speaker 2: there's any fallout whatsoever, the party that's responsible for enacting

2170
01:44:21,320 --> 01:44:23,439
Speaker 2: the changes, even though they may wholly be better than

2171
01:44:23,439 --> 01:44:26,080
Speaker 2: what we have right now, they're going to wind up

2172
01:44:26,120 --> 01:44:28,400
Speaker 2: paying in an election if somebody gets sick or somebody

2173
01:44:28,400 --> 01:44:29,920
Speaker 2: gets left out, or what about that. And you don't

2174
01:44:29,960 --> 01:44:32,200
Speaker 2: have carve outs either, So what's the point of having

2175
01:44:32,200 --> 01:44:35,240
Speaker 2: a politician. Whole goal of politics and politicians are what

2176
01:44:35,720 --> 01:44:39,040
Speaker 2: is it? Get carve out subsidy and relief for your voters,

2177
01:44:39,120 --> 01:44:42,680
Speaker 2: not the other guy, but your voters. And so I

2178
01:44:42,760 --> 01:44:45,080
Speaker 2: just don't see a system or healthcare changes anytime soon.

2179
01:44:45,120 --> 01:44:48,040
Speaker 2: The simple solution would be to go you're no longer

2180
01:44:48,040 --> 01:44:51,439
Speaker 2: allowed to provide healthcare in your workplace, I take an

2181
01:44:51,479 --> 01:44:54,320
Speaker 2: executive order, take some big stones too, and it's pretty

2182
01:44:54,320 --> 01:44:56,400
Speaker 2: ballsy to go all right, you're not in the business

2183
01:44:56,400 --> 01:44:58,639
Speaker 2: of supplying healthcare, go find it on the free market,

2184
01:44:59,200 --> 01:45:02,439
Speaker 2: and that would incre competition, it reduced costs, transparency, other

2185
01:45:02,560 --> 01:45:05,160
Speaker 2: government nonsense of go away. And then the people who

2186
01:45:05,240 --> 01:45:07,599
Speaker 2: really fell between the cracks, which is a lot of people,

2187
01:45:07,600 --> 01:45:10,519
Speaker 2: by the way, we could afford to pay health care

2188
01:45:10,560 --> 01:45:14,320
Speaker 2: for them and I and still have money left over

2189
01:45:14,360 --> 01:45:17,360
Speaker 2: to put towards the deficit. It's an easy solution. But

2190
01:45:17,400 --> 01:45:20,920
Speaker 2: the problem is lobbyist, it's Congress, it's politics that are ingrained,

2191
01:45:21,280 --> 01:45:22,760
Speaker 2: and this is why we'll have more of the same.

2192
01:45:22,800 --> 01:45:25,400
Speaker 2: And for most of us, it's just frustrating, a frustrating

2193
01:45:25,439 --> 01:45:29,200
Speaker 2: exercise in a sense that you know, we can see

2194
01:45:29,360 --> 01:45:31,120
Speaker 2: a way to make a change here, and that is

2195
01:45:31,240 --> 01:45:33,880
Speaker 2: make more of a libertarian kind of argument and going

2196
01:45:34,000 --> 01:45:36,599
Speaker 2: you buy your health insurance on the free market, as

2197
01:45:36,640 --> 01:45:41,120
Speaker 2: you do your current insurance, your renter's insurance, your life insurance, whatever, insurance,

2198
01:45:41,240 --> 01:45:43,960
Speaker 2: insurance for your dog. It's all on the market. It's transparent,

2199
01:45:44,000 --> 01:45:45,880
Speaker 2: it's easy, you pay for it out of your own pocket.

2200
01:45:46,040 --> 01:45:49,120
Speaker 2: Used to be that way, and then we attach it

2201
01:45:49,200 --> 01:45:51,600
Speaker 2: to employment, and that's a whole nother thing, especially the

2202
01:45:51,640 --> 01:45:53,800
Speaker 2: gig economy, because now people want to do their own

2203
01:45:53,840 --> 01:45:55,760
Speaker 2: thing and not have to do a nine to five,

2204
01:45:55,840 --> 01:45:58,559
Speaker 2: which is a huge boon for our economy. On top

2205
01:45:58,600 --> 01:46:01,320
Speaker 2: of this as well, save money and grower economy. Sounds

2206
01:46:01,320 --> 01:46:03,760
Speaker 2: like a plan, but this is where we stand right now.

2207
01:46:03,800 --> 01:46:07,000
Speaker 2: So the No Kings, Little King's protest, whatever it is, again,

2208
01:46:07,360 --> 01:46:09,160
Speaker 2: it's just more of the same, more noise, a bunch

2209
01:46:09,200 --> 01:46:12,000
Speaker 2: of a grieved people with the only commonality between them

2210
01:46:12,360 --> 01:46:14,160
Speaker 2: is a fact they don't like Donald Trump because he's

2211
01:46:14,200 --> 01:46:17,040
Speaker 2: a fascist, although he's really not. And when our guide

2212
01:46:17,080 --> 01:46:19,240
Speaker 2: did the same thing with executive orders, we just turned

2213
01:46:19,240 --> 01:46:22,800
Speaker 2: a blind eye, which is the hypocrisy of politics. This

2214
01:46:22,920 --> 01:46:24,960
Speaker 2: is a perfect leading for Bill Conningham coming up at

2215
01:46:25,000 --> 01:46:26,920
Speaker 2: twelve oh six right after news here on the home

2216
01:46:26,920 --> 01:46:29,920
Speaker 2: of the best Bengals coverage, seven hundred WW Cincinnati