Speaker 1: This moment.
Speaker 2: I love it. Sean McMahon in the producer spot, Doctor
Speaker 2: west crafton with me again. You are back from Nashville.
Speaker 2: You've got a special guest who I've been dying to meet,
Speaker 2: and she's with us too. Channing is your daughter, and
Speaker 2: you're in the studio a nice family Thanksgiving thing that
Speaker 2: we have going on. I say, Hi, Channing. Oh I
Speaker 2: don't hear her, Mike, do you hear it? Yeah? There
Speaker 2: you go, there you go. Hi. Hello. So she looks
Speaker 2: like you, first of all, And we're going to talk
Speaker 2: to her in a minute because we have a lot
Speaker 2: of stuff to go over about family and the main
Speaker 2: thing I want to talk about because you know, this
Speaker 2: is a happy time for a lot of families, right
Speaker 2: There's as it's the Thanksgiving and we're going into Christmas,
Speaker 2: and for some families it's the best time of year.
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, I've always enjoyed this. I'm close
Speaker 2: with my family most of them, but a lot of
Speaker 2: times not so great for some families. And we're going
Speaker 2: to talk about families that are estranged. Oprah Winfrey just
Speaker 2: did a huge podcast on this called No Contact Families,
Speaker 2: and what that means basically is that they cut off
Speaker 2: all ties with either your parents' siblings, you know, grandparents too,
Speaker 2: that would be included. And there's it was overall it
Speaker 2: was a set because I knew you watched it too, right,
Speaker 2: doctor Uss. So it was a sad podcast, but there
Speaker 2: was something empowering about it too, And the premise of
Speaker 2: it is that basically roles of parents that you know,
Speaker 2: when we grew up on, you know, respect your mother
Speaker 2: and father. You know, you only have one mom that
Speaker 2: kind of things. Roles of parenting and just having that,
Speaker 2: you know, kind of authority because I'm your parents and
Speaker 2: I tell you what to do, is changed a little
Speaker 2: bit into more of a relationship. Can you speak a
Speaker 2: little bit about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's more of a consultant. It's more of a
Speaker 1: consultant type role. So when when parents become when children
Speaker 1: become the same age as their parents, parents are supposed
Speaker 1: to transition from a parental role to a role of
Speaker 1: a consultant where they're there just as a way to
Speaker 1: offer advice, offer feedback, but ultimately the autonomies with the kids,
Speaker 1: the adult children. But some parents can't do that.
Speaker 2: Why because they get into the role of controlling yes
Speaker 2: and helicoptering like a helicopter parent. You should do this,
Speaker 2: You've always been good at that. I think you should
Speaker 2: go to this college, or I think you should marry
Speaker 2: this person, right right. And then it becomes the kid.
Speaker 2: It gets stifled and suffocated and they don't really communicate,
Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden, your son or daughter
Speaker 2: don't want to talk to you because there's this to presentment.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's an emotional issue for the parents most often,
Speaker 1: And what I mean by that is that they can't
Speaker 1: let go. Their identity is so wrapped up in being
Speaker 1: a mom or being a dad that they literally don't
Speaker 1: have an identity apart from that, and so they need
Speaker 1: to be the one to say do this, don't do that.
Speaker 1: And I see it a lot, and I have to
Speaker 1: break that down with my clients, like what is this behavior,
Speaker 1: what's the function of his behavior for you? Well, I
Speaker 1: don't know who I am unless i'm a mom.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, they get wrapped up in those roles, and
Speaker 2: then oftentimes the kids they don't even know how to
Speaker 2: communicate because it's I'm your mother, You do what? Just
Speaker 2: do what I say.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I have some clients to come in and they're
Speaker 1: looking for me to tell them what to do. And
Speaker 1: I say, why are you wanting me, as the therapist
Speaker 1: to tell you what to do? And they'll say, because
Speaker 1: it's always been that way. An authority figure has always
Speaker 1: told me what to do. My mom and dad have
Speaker 1: always told me what to do, So I'm looking for
Speaker 1: you to do the same thing in therapy.
Speaker 2: You know. Oh my gosh, I don't know how much
Speaker 2: I'm going to divulge because literally, literally it just reminded
Speaker 2: me of my ex husband, uh huh, because his parents
Speaker 2: were very involved in his life. They had two kids.
Speaker 2: One went to San Francisco and like did his own thing,
Speaker 2: and they're like, oh, this one's younger. I'm never letting
Speaker 2: this one out of my sight. And that's kind of
Speaker 2: how they They did it, and they were lovely parents.
Speaker 2: They were wonderful parents and they still are. But they
Speaker 2: made the mistake. And even his mother said to me
Speaker 2: one time, I think I overmothered. Yeah, my son. And
Speaker 2: then we went to California and he went through this
Speaker 2: I can't talk to him stage for a little bit,
Speaker 2: and it was hard. It was very, very hard, and
Speaker 2: parents are blown away by that. This was the whole
Speaker 2: thing about the podcast of like you know, this mother
Speaker 2: talked about how they went to ty food and a
Speaker 2: movie and then the next day they she her daughter
Speaker 2: said she didn't want to talk to her anymore. And
Speaker 2: two years go by. How does that happen?
Speaker 1: It's a people finally wake up and realize they're tired
Speaker 1: of not being their own person. They're just tired of it.
Speaker 1: They they their identity has been so enmeshed. And that's
Speaker 1: the that's the key word there, or the term that
Speaker 1: we use, enmeshment. There is no healthy boundary between the two,
Speaker 1: so there's just it. It's like a uh, we call
Speaker 1: it an undifferentiated family ego mass. That's the clinical term,
Speaker 1: which is just like imagine like this big mass of
Speaker 1: just one big ego and it's just a family ego
Speaker 1: and there's no.
Speaker 2: There's roles to play, right, and so if anyone steps
Speaker 2: out of the role, then ruckus happens to the family.
Speaker 2: That's there's there's like somebody steps out of line and
Speaker 2: now we're all suffering.
Speaker 1: That's exactly right, Yeah, okay, yeah, And usually whoever steps
Speaker 1: out along becomes a scapegoat. Yeah, in the family, they're
Speaker 1: the problem child, they're the black sheep. That's right, right,
Speaker 1: But they are the strongest. But I tell my clients,
Speaker 1: but you are actually the strongest one because you've been
Speaker 1: able to stand up against that dysfunctional pattern. It is
Speaker 1: a dysfunctional pattern. Yeah, it really is. Five three seven,
Speaker 1: four hundred, the big run, the big one.
Speaker 2: Have you had to cut ties with family members in
Speaker 2: order to have a more peaceful life or more control
Speaker 2: over your life. There are things that we are all
Speaker 2: destined to do here in this life. And when you
Speaker 2: have somebody that means well, as parents means well, does
Speaker 2: everything for their kid, has good intentions, wants to like
Speaker 2: save them from being hurt or you know, but they
Speaker 2: don't understand that you're stifling this kid. They don't understand
Speaker 2: what they want to do with their lives because they've
Speaker 2: been told by their parents, you should do this, you
Speaker 2: should do that. And that is a very uncomfortable place
Speaker 2: to be. And I think now that you have so
Speaker 2: much therapy online in your therapist and you people go
Speaker 2: to counseling now and understand that hey, there's a little
Speaker 2: manipulation there, or there's a little bit of you know,
Speaker 2: judgment on you, or there's a big control issue with
Speaker 2: somebody in your close proximity. Then they start to see
Speaker 2: it and realize, hey, this hasn't been a relationship, it's
Speaker 2: been a dictatorship kind of a thing. And so is
Speaker 2: there ever a time doctor wes that that these people
Speaker 2: that don't want to connect with their family members other
Speaker 2: than abuse, because I think physical and mental abuse, you
Speaker 2: should get some space and get away from that person
Speaker 2: who's doing that to you. But like, is there a
Speaker 2: way that they can communicate before you cut ties? Because
Speaker 2: when you stop connecting, it's hard to reconnect after that.
Speaker 2: You go two years without texting your mom and dad
Speaker 2: or calling them or anything like that, that's hard to
Speaker 2: come back from. So is there a way to kind
Speaker 2: of stop that from happening before it gets to the sure?
Speaker 1: Well, it can people. The way I assess it, when
Speaker 1: a family comes in my office, I'm noticing who's speaking
Speaker 1: and who's not speaking, And then I'm noticing are they
Speaker 1: using I language I think, I feel I'm going to
Speaker 1: do this? Or is one person looking at the other
Speaker 1: person and saying, I don't know, what do you think?
Speaker 1: Or is someone talking over the other person. You can
Speaker 1: start to see the patterns of the family. So the
Speaker 1: way that yes, we can stop this if a therapist
Speaker 1: or somebody helps the family members start to feel strong
Speaker 1: enough to say this is what I think and I feel,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to do this. We can still be
Speaker 1: in relationship with each other, right, And we can disagree.
Speaker 2: Right, and you can step out of the roles for
Speaker 2: a minute and just see this individual person for who
Speaker 2: they are. That's right, right, five three seven four ninety
Speaker 2: seven thousand. We do want this show to be interactive.
Speaker 2: This is something that I want to hear from the listeners.
Speaker 2: I want to hear from you. I want you to
Speaker 2: add either your story or your point of view. Is
Speaker 2: it is it? Are the roles really changing? Is it
Speaker 2: the mom should be respected no matter what? Or is
Speaker 2: it moved more towards a relationship where you have this
Speaker 2: open dialogue and both people understand that it takes two
Speaker 2: people to have a relationship, not one. Right. It's it's
Speaker 2: no matter how well intended you are, if you're not
Speaker 2: letting somebody be who they are, then that's a problem.
Speaker 2: Let's hear from you Channing for a second. Because I
Speaker 2: was talking to doctor Wesh your dad, and I was
Speaker 2: saying how affable and easy it is to talk to
Speaker 2: You're fourteen years old, How did you? How did you
Speaker 2: get to be so open and friendly and and talkative
Speaker 2: and that type of person at fourteen.
Speaker 3: I think I've always been like that from like a
Speaker 3: very young age. I've just always been a very like
Speaker 3: talkative person. I would always just like make small talk
Speaker 3: with like people who I like, didn't know. But I
Speaker 3: also think I've been through so much therapy that I
Speaker 3: think it's helped me. Like it's helped me know myself
Speaker 3: better than like anybody else, Like it's helped me understand
Speaker 3: my feelings more. And because I think as we grow up,
Speaker 3: as like we all mature and grow up, we have
Speaker 3: like big, bigger feelings. Like whenever you were like younger,
Speaker 3: like if you were sad, it would just be sadness.
Speaker 3: But like now it's like if you're sad, it's like, oh,
Speaker 3: it's like staying so then it's like turns into like
Speaker 3: a deeper feeling.
Speaker 2: So I think, interesting, Yeah, I think that's how Wait
Speaker 2: until you start paying bills and going out with Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's that's when the story gets a little bit crazier too.
Speaker 2: By definitely, once you start paying bills and once you
Speaker 2: start your first heartbreak from your boyfriend right or or
Speaker 2: you know those types of things or friends too. Channing
Speaker 2: like you have friend breakups too, and you're kind of
Speaker 2: going through that right now. I am, Okay, So how
Speaker 2: are you handling that at fourteen years old?
Speaker 3: I'm just I'm It's definitely hard, Don't get me wrong,
Speaker 3: especially when I've been friends with this girl since I
Speaker 3: was so young. I mean, me and her have made
Speaker 3: so many good and countless memories. But I think looking
Speaker 3: at it from the bigger picture and like asking myself, like,
Speaker 3: is this friendship doing me any good? And you know,
Speaker 3: I'm trying. I'm just kind of taking it one day
Speaker 3: at a time. I'm like, I'm not being mean to her,
Speaker 3: I'm not holding a grudge. I'm just kind of like
Speaker 3: being there and just kind of letting everything be because
Speaker 3: I think I've, like with friendship breaks up breakups, I
Speaker 3: have like the tendency to like want to solve it
Speaker 3: like right then and there. Yeah, So I think I'm
Speaker 3: just trying my best to just let things be.
Speaker 2: I think that's a really really good approach to that.
Speaker 2: Let people be who they are, let them do what
Speaker 2: they need to do, and if you're meant to be friends.
Speaker 2: Just like any relationship, you'll come back together. Now, I
Speaker 2: notice that you and your dad have a pretty good
Speaker 2: relationship right off the bat. I can tell that you
Speaker 2: guys communicate with each other. What is it that he
Speaker 2: does right as a parent.
Speaker 3: He's just my dad and my mom included. They're just
Speaker 3: both there for me, Like they're there, like they're they're
Speaker 3: not like trying to like control me, because I know
Speaker 3: y'all talked a lot about like parents like controlling and
Speaker 3: stuff like that.
Speaker 2: They don't do that.
Speaker 3: They very much just like are there for me, and
Speaker 3: they're just they just want me to be happy. So
Speaker 3: it's like whatever that is, they're gonna support me the
Speaker 3: best of their ability and just I think that really
Speaker 3: helps because it leaves a lottery room for just me.
Speaker 2: To for just me to be myself. Is it nice
Speaker 2: to hear your daughter say that is?
Speaker 1: Absolutely yeah. I think that my strategy all along with
Speaker 1: her has not to be an authoritarian parent where I'm
Speaker 1: like laying down the law. It's more of giving her
Speaker 1: boundaries and saying you can choose within these boundaries what's
Speaker 1: best what you feel like is best for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah. For instance, we were we went and got a
Speaker 2: smoothie before on air, and we were talking about her
Speaker 2: cheerleading and she doesn't know whether she wants to continue, right,
Speaker 2: And you said, well, I think it's very stressful and
Speaker 2: I don't think you should do it, but it's your decision, correct,
Speaker 2: So you give your advice and she knows that it's
Speaker 2: up to her and you're going to support her either way. Sure,
Speaker 2: I mean really, that's what else? What else do you
Speaker 2: want from a parent in terms of like guidance, right,
Speaker 2: You want them to be honest with you and tell
Speaker 2: you your you know how how they feel. Sometimes people
Speaker 2: will say, you know you're doing cheerleading because you've already
Speaker 2: done it four years and if you have one more year,
Speaker 2: then you're going to have this amount of you know
Speaker 2: this and this and this, or you've got you know
Speaker 2: and and it's and it's pressure. Like I bought you
Speaker 2: this trumpet you said you wanted to play, you don't
Speaker 2: like it, you're not turning back now, you're doing it, right,
Speaker 2: So that's also like, you know, that's.
Speaker 1: An authoritarian parents, and we don't want and the lase
Speaker 1: fair would be the opposite extreme, where you just don't
Speaker 1: have any boundaries for your kids, right, yeah, whatever, they
Speaker 1: whereas I'm trying to be right in the middle. I'm
Speaker 1: trying to get a you know, it's in between lase
Speaker 1: fear parenting and authoritarian parenting.
Speaker 2: So well, and it's a fine, it's fine. I am
Speaker 2: not a parent. I don't have any kids, and it's
Speaker 2: it's it's an interesting thing because all my sisters have
Speaker 2: kids and we have a really big family. In fact,
Speaker 2: brother and a sister of mine I don't contact. I
Speaker 2: have no contact with them. And it happened over my
Speaker 2: mother's estate when she died. So it was a money issue,
Speaker 2: which is absolutely dreadful to ruin a relationship over. But
Speaker 2: I have you know, there's four of us, the sisters
Speaker 2: that we're all very close and go on sister's trip with.
Speaker 2: So I understand that there are needs to not have
Speaker 2: any contact with people that are no longer interested in
Speaker 2: your in my well being, and it's just you know,
Speaker 2: there's no good positive communication. So yeah, there's a time
Speaker 2: to let go of those relationships. Is there is that
Speaker 2: a healthy boundary to say, up, I just can't speak
Speaker 2: to this person, whether they're family or not. You hear
Speaker 2: me talk about the four horsemen all the time.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 1: That can apply for not just romantic relationships, that's for
Speaker 1: family really, that's just for any relationship. So when you're
Speaker 1: getting into an element of contempt and that you're better
Speaker 1: than some yes, that is appropriate time to cut off
Speaker 1: because you're going to do more damage to the relationship
Speaker 1: if you're just critical and defensive and you're stone walling
Speaker 1: each other and you're holding each other in contempt, you
Speaker 1: think you're looking down upon each other. Yeah, it's just
Speaker 1: not healthy. It's not healthy at all. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of and that can lead to a lot of your
Speaker 1: own anxiety and stress and mental disorders, and.
Speaker 2: So it's almost for the health of yourself and for
Speaker 2: both people. Yeah, for both people, it's time to take
Speaker 2: some space. We're going to talk about how to reconcile
Speaker 2: some of these things and some of the problems that
Speaker 2: you know, we face as a society in especially during
Speaker 2: the holidays, where it's supposed to be all family and
Speaker 2: all friends and everybody's going to be cheery, and sometimes
Speaker 2: it's not like that for some people. We'll be back
Speaker 2: in just a few minutes. Donna d with Doctor West
Speaker 2: Saturday Night. It's seven hundred WLW, Cincinnati.
Speaker 1: I love it.
Speaker 2: It's a snowy you guys came in from Nashville, so snow.
Speaker 2: You got a nice little Thanksgiving present. There you go.
Speaker 2: We should get some snow all day tomorrow. I think,
Speaker 2: oh my goodness, I had to check my weather. I
Speaker 2: did just listen to it though. By the way, Donna
Speaker 2: d with doctor Wes licensed marriage family Therapist, Thanks for
Speaker 2: coming in. I love doing the show with you. And
Speaker 2: we're been talking about you know, it's a beauty full
Speaker 2: time Thanksgiving, we're coming into Christmas, we're at the end
Speaker 2: of the year, New Year's and things like that, and
Speaker 2: there's a lot of people that are estranged in their families.
Speaker 2: Right now. We're talking about how the roles have changed
Speaker 2: from respecting your parents and having them. You know, you're
Speaker 2: the mom, you're the dad. You do what I say
Speaker 2: to the kids.
Speaker 4: I'm the mom.
Speaker 2: I'm the dad. You do what I say too. Let's
Speaker 2: have a relationship because that's we're the roles are shifting.
Speaker 2: It's not just mom and dad. You tell me what
Speaker 2: to do and I'll do it. It's I have a
Speaker 2: life and I want to have control of it. I
Speaker 2: respect you, I'm always gonna respect you, but have a
Speaker 2: little bit of a distance. Don't control everything. Now, you
Speaker 2: counsel a lot of couples, but you also do families
Speaker 2: as well.
Speaker 1: That's right.
Speaker 2: And we were talking about earlier how you can notice
Speaker 2: the roles within the family while you're counseling them and
Speaker 2: those that interrupt, those that don't speak very much and
Speaker 2: at the floor, so you can tell what types of
Speaker 2: family dynamics they are just by coming in the room. Now,
Speaker 2: how do you handle some of these things that you
Speaker 2: find within communication flaws maybe would say, or different types
Speaker 2: of patterns you see within the family.
Speaker 1: Well, first thing I do is I call it out.
Speaker 1: I just name.
Speaker 2: It, like what, so somebody is interrupting I keep interrupting you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'll just say, hey, I'm noticing let me
Speaker 1: interject for a minute. I'm going to interrupt you for
Speaker 1: a minute, right, And I say, I'm noticing that that's
Speaker 1: a pattern for you that you tend to interrupt or
Speaker 1: you speak for someone else. And I'm wondering what's happening
Speaker 1: for you, what's going on in your body, what's happening
Speaker 1: in your feelings in your are you are you feeling anxious?
Speaker 1: Are you feeling that your heart rate is increasing, is
Speaker 1: your body temperature, are you feeling like flushed in your face?
Speaker 1: What's happening for you that causes you to feel the
Speaker 1: need to interject? And then what's your goal in doing that?
Speaker 2: What do you think interrupting means? Because I know a
Speaker 2: lot myself included my interrupt go fake here. But I
Speaker 2: I'm also a good listener too, so I don't have
Speaker 2: an agenda to interrupt. Sometimes I just have something that
Speaker 2: I think is absolutely amazing. I want to say and
Speaker 2: say it. What is? What is it though that some
Speaker 2: somebody constantly interrupts.
Speaker 1: There's a couple of different I do think that there's
Speaker 1: there's different types of interruptions. There is the one that's
Speaker 1: just the person has is excited to get it, get
Speaker 1: in their message. They're they're so excited and passionate about
Speaker 1: the dialogue that they just they don't have the ability
Speaker 1: to in that moment, their brain just kind of just
Speaker 1: takes over.
Speaker 2: And that's not that's not the person you were talking about.
Speaker 2: That's what is the person that you're talking about in
Speaker 2: your office that keeps.
Speaker 1: Saying that person, that person feels the need to control
Speaker 1: uh huh, and that come from fear. Yeah, in my
Speaker 1: opinion it comes from and in my clinical assessment of
Speaker 1: the family, it's whenever someone starts, whenever the family starts
Speaker 1: to get a little bit too autonomous. People are starting
Speaker 1: to speak their mind a little bit more. The person
Speaker 1: who's in charge of the family starts to get a
Speaker 1: little afraid.
Speaker 2: Okay, right, they're not listening to me anymore. I have
Speaker 2: no more authority. They're going to go do what they
Speaker 2: want and nobody's going to care what I think anymore.
Speaker 2: That's right, right, So what happens to the to the
Speaker 2: mom or the dad that doesn't say anything or much,
Speaker 2: the one that keeps quiet, what is that they about?
Speaker 1: They end up developing bitterness and resentment. They end up well,
Speaker 1: they also have fear. They're afraid of the repercussions, usually
Speaker 1: of the criticism, the contemptuous. Usually the person who's in
Speaker 1: charge has there are family rules. There are definitely family rules,
Speaker 1: and they learned that if I, if I challenge, then
Speaker 1: I'm going to have this repercussion coming back on me,
Speaker 1: and I don't want that repercussion, whatever that might be.
Speaker 1: So it is power and control and the family rules
Speaker 1: are here ad here too until a therapist comes like
Speaker 1: me comes up, and my job is to start to
Speaker 1: learn the family rules. It's like a family game that
Speaker 1: these families play, and I'll start learning charge schoos in charge.
Speaker 1: And then how do you send messages back to each other?
Speaker 1: And what are the even the messages of silence? Silence
Speaker 1: is a messenger too. When people are silent, they're speaking,
Speaker 1: they're sending a message.
Speaker 2: You know that means because I to be honest, the
Speaker 2: silent treatment is the worst kind of pain.
Speaker 1: Oh it is.
Speaker 2: I absolutely hate this. You can yell at me. I
Speaker 2: would prefer you yell at me, then give me the
Speaker 2: silent treatment. It's like you're turning your back on me.
Speaker 2: There's nothing I can do if my partner does not engage.
Speaker 2: And so what is the silent treatment about. That's power,
Speaker 2: that's control. It is of course it's stone walling, exactly, stonewalling.
Speaker 2: Just ignore the other person. And and what a what
Speaker 2: a horrible thing to do to somebody?
Speaker 1: Is it?
Speaker 2: Because somebody is always interrupting? Is that why?
Speaker 1: I mean?
Speaker 2: Is that why people say forget it? You don't care
Speaker 2: what I have to say anyway? So I'm not going to.
Speaker 1: Say, well, that's actually called fawning. So there's fight, Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's flight, Yeah, there's freeze, and there's fawning. Those are
Speaker 1: the responses that typically people take, and falling.
Speaker 2: Fawning kind of sounds like a nice thing.
Speaker 1: It's all it's like, okay, fine, you know whatever it's
Speaker 1: I'm going to give up. I'm going to stop arguing.
Speaker 1: I'm going to stop you. You have it your way, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you have it your way.
Speaker 2: Well I don't. I think that's apathy and I don't
Speaker 2: think that's good for any real No, of course not no,
Speaker 2: but no, that's that's a that's a terrible thing. Five
Speaker 2: one three for a hundred, the big one. How have
Speaker 2: the holidays been for you so far? Has it been
Speaker 2: a fun festive thing? Have you have you never had
Speaker 2: an issue with your family? Or is it hard for
Speaker 2: you right now? We want to hear from you. Five
Speaker 2: one three sevenber nine, seven thousand. So there are some
Speaker 2: ways to reconcile with family members that you've not had
Speaker 2: contact with for a few a few years or a
Speaker 2: few months, or even a few days. Sometimes people really
Speaker 2: need space, and when they do, you should give it
Speaker 2: to them. But doctor West, when a does it become
Speaker 2: a problem, like when when? When is the space that
Speaker 2: they need getting too long, right, Like all right, clearly
Speaker 2: they just want to be away from me, right, they
Speaker 2: don't want to speak to me at all, or you know,
Speaker 2: three days is three Three days is a long time too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, three days is a long time. Typically, Like I
Speaker 1: tell couples to take breaks from each other, but I
Speaker 1: try and have them do a repair attempt within the
Speaker 1: same day. Yeah, right, I don't want them to go
Speaker 1: into the next day, right, So I would encourage families
Speaker 1: to do the same thing that take take that break.
Speaker 1: If you know, at their dinner table, if all hades
Speaker 1: is breaking loose, then just everybody go and chill out
Speaker 1: for a little bit. Thirty minutes is what you really
Speaker 1: need to help your brain to kind of calm down
Speaker 1: and then come back together and say, okay, let's talk
Speaker 1: about let's go around the room, and and everybody you're listening,
Speaker 1: not to agree to or to disagree, you're listening, just
Speaker 1: to listen. And everyone says, this is what I feel
Speaker 1: in this moment. It's not about I think, it's what
Speaker 1: I feel, right, focus on feelings and then everything.
Speaker 2: About acknowledging that somebody has these feelings.
Speaker 1: That's what Yeah, exactly right, That's the next step is
Speaker 1: that the people will then acknowledge that what I hear
Speaker 1: you saying is that you are feeling hurt in this,
Speaker 1: in this dialogue that we just had.
Speaker 2: Okay, so acknowledging listen, you need space. So there's clearly
Speaker 2: some kind of break in our communication. So I get that,
Speaker 2: but I want us to come together. So I'm gonna
Speaker 2: I just want you to say whatever it is you
Speaker 2: want to say, and I'm going to listen. I'm gonna listen,
Speaker 2: and then I'm going to echo back what I heard
Speaker 2: you say. And then I'm going to say what I
Speaker 2: know about you meant that makes sense to me. That's validation, right.
Speaker 2: That doesn't mean I agree with you. It just means
Speaker 2: what I know about you and our relationship, I can
Speaker 2: see how you would feel that way. Okay, So how important?
Speaker 2: And I think it's pretty important, Which is the question.
Speaker 2: I want you to validate me on this west self reflection, right,
Speaker 2: And and I want to talk to Channing in a
Speaker 2: moment about this, because she and I talked about this
Speaker 2: early on. And Dick, I'll get to you in a minute.
Speaker 2: Self reflection is important whether you're in or not in
Speaker 2: a conflict. Right, always observing what how you are with
Speaker 2: yourself and other people? Yes, would you call that a
Speaker 2: top three thing?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 1: Absolutely, a top three Yeah. I'm teaching all of my
Speaker 1: clients to be really self aware of what they're thinking,
Speaker 1: what they're feeling at all times. That's really a daily occurrence.
Speaker 1: Like in the morning, what am I feeling?
Speaker 2: I'm frustrated? I woke up on the wrong side of
Speaker 2: the bed, so like, I really need to pay attention
Speaker 2: to how I'm treating people today because I can already
Speaker 2: feel a little frustration. Let's go to Dick and Dayton. Dick,
Speaker 2: how you doing? Nice to speak to you?
Speaker 5: Happy holidays? Yeah, I would just tell it you're good.
Speaker 5: To talk to you, I would just telling you're on
Speaker 5: my dad's side. That live order Ohio and uh, I
Speaker 5: look forward to every year. When I was young, the
Speaker 5: family and the cousins developed a relationship and music like
Speaker 5: the uh ah it with Italian music, and I learned
Speaker 5: river Boat and uh all of us. I think you know,
Speaker 5: I played in two or three group, but I find
Speaker 5: relationships like at your church or like you go to
Speaker 5: social groups like music and uh just things like that,
Speaker 5: you know, like singles clubs and stuff, and uh I
Speaker 5: always was. Uh I still play my music and you know,
Speaker 5: I get around and stuff. But I think that's something
Speaker 5: that you get from your family, know what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so my my family was musical as well, and
Speaker 2: my mom used to play world music and she's from Canada,
Speaker 2: so she would play all kinds of fun and you know, yeah,
Speaker 2: people I've never heard. I've always, you know, for the
Speaker 2: last probably thirty years, played guitar and there's all my
Speaker 2: exsh time.
Speaker 5: Actually I started a mandolin, but I can play you now.
Speaker 2: Too, uh huh. But it is its too, you know,
Speaker 2: it's a different dick. Thank you so much for Colin.
Speaker 2: I appreciate it. Happy holidays. Nice to hear from you too,
Speaker 2: Thank you here, welcome by bye. So it is a
Speaker 2: different dynamic to when you connect with another like some
Speaker 2: sort of a side project or some sort of you know,
Speaker 2: like music brings the family together. That's that's also you know,
Speaker 2: everyone lay the Partridgs family who didn't want to be
Speaker 2: the Partridge family growing up? Do you even know who
Speaker 2: the Partridge family is? Channing? No, Well, let's get to
Speaker 2: Channing here real quick, because we talked about this in
Speaker 2: self reflection you're fourteen years old. Your doctor, I understand
Speaker 2: your doctor Wes's daughter, and you have had a therapy
Speaker 2: in your whole life, and he's a counselor and things
Speaker 2: like that. What do you do to to look at
Speaker 2: yourself and reflect on how you're feeling, how you're doing.
Speaker 3: I'm trying to think. I always like to ground myself.
Speaker 3: I feel like grounding myself, like I would like That's
Speaker 3: one like the coping strategies that I've learned is like
Speaker 3: placing my feet on the ground, or sometimes if like
Speaker 3: I'm having really big feelings, then I'll just like I'll
Speaker 3: lay on the ground, like I'll literally lay flat on
Speaker 3: my back and I will like do like five things
Speaker 3: I can see, like stuff like that, And it kind
Speaker 3: of helps ground myself with my emotions because like I
Speaker 3: oftentimes have big emotions, like if I'm feeling mad, I
Speaker 3: just need to ground myself and breathe.
Speaker 2: So I often do that a lot. Do you feel like,
Speaker 2: because you're in such a different generation, do you feel
Speaker 2: like the cell phone and social media and your computers
Speaker 2: are they a burden or a blessing?
Speaker 3: They're honestly, I feel like they're both. Yeah, but I
Speaker 3: feel like they can also be a burden because I
Speaker 3: tell my parents all the time, I'm like, guys, I
Speaker 3: think I was supposed to be born in the two thousands,
Speaker 3: because like, I like my cell phone. I love my
Speaker 3: cell phone. I spend way too much time on it. Yeah,
Speaker 3: but I feel like it takes me away from like
Speaker 3: the world. Like I feel like once I get on
Speaker 3: my phone and I just start doom scrolling, I just
Speaker 3: feel like it just takes me.
Speaker 2: And it can be an hour or longer before you
Speaker 2: even feel like, oh my gosh, i'ven't taken a deep breath.
Speaker 2: I don't know what time it is, I haven't talked
Speaker 2: to any friends or family, or you know, I haven't
Speaker 2: been outside right back in the day. And even doctor
Speaker 2: West is younger than me. We we never I didn't
Speaker 2: even have a cell phone until I was twenty two,
Speaker 2: twenty four, and certainly there was no social media, thank heavens.
Speaker 2: When I was growing up, we spend all of our
Speaker 2: time outside. We did, you know, we had you know,
Speaker 2: seven kids, so they would go go go get them
Speaker 2: and we'll play, you know, breakout up at the top
Speaker 2: of the hill. You know, So I miss that for
Speaker 2: your generation. I really wish you guys had more of
Speaker 2: outdoor time, more social time with friends, and you know
Speaker 2: what I mean, Like that's such a big deal. And
Speaker 2: even parents, myself included, are on their phones. So even
Speaker 2: when you get off your phone, probably a parent is
Speaker 2: on their phone. And it's like we communicate fifteen twenty
Speaker 2: minutes in a day, And how the heck does that positive? Right?
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like I was having a meal with my mom
Speaker 3: and my sister the other day and I finally got
Speaker 3: off my phone.
Speaker 2: I looked up in there on their phone, just exactly, like,
Speaker 2: let's everybody. I even make it a point like when
Speaker 2: we're all having dinner, like everybody put their cellphones away,
Speaker 2: because that's the least we can do, have one hour
Speaker 2: together and look each other in the eyes.
Speaker 1: How important is that, doctor West. It's very important. It's
Speaker 1: absolutely important. It's the digital divide. It's it's actually a
Speaker 1: it's actually like a third party in the relationship. It's
Speaker 1: like you're having a it's like an a fair right,
Speaker 1: it really is. It's like you have developed this relationship
Speaker 1: with your phone.
Speaker 2: No. I totally understand because some times when I go
Speaker 2: long periods and I'm out of town and I and
Speaker 2: I you know, I've been at events and I even't
Speaker 2: had my phone. I like to be alone with my
Speaker 2: phone and catch up on all the things that I missed.
Speaker 2: It's like Christmas morning. It's terrible.
Speaker 1: It's guaranteed validation though, I mean, you can get validated
Speaker 1: on that phone.
Speaker 2: It's like, how are we We can we can watch movies,
Speaker 2: we can order food, we can order any services or
Speaker 2: product that we want online. We can social media, we
Speaker 2: can text, we can email, we can call. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's everything inch of gratification, but it's also exhausting and
Speaker 2: mind bending control with the addiction of the cell phones.
Speaker 1: I saw on the news yesterday it was at least
Speaker 1: fifty percent of the population of adults reports being lonely.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but yet we're so connected, right.
Speaker 2: But it's it's electronics. So it's not where we're three
Speaker 2: looking at each other in the studio and we see
Speaker 2: each other's eyes and I can see channing nodding when
Speaker 2: she's agreeing with me. There's a there's a real connection.
Speaker 2: I mean, we don't we all know this, but there's
Speaker 2: a real connection when you're out in the world and
Speaker 2: you put your cell phones down. We got to take
Speaker 2: a quick break. When we come back, we're gonna lighten
Speaker 2: it up a little bit and talk about holiday parties
Speaker 2: and what is the worst bad behavior you've ever seen
Speaker 2: at a holiday party? Ours is coming up on Wednesday.
Speaker 2: Everybody has holiday parties coming up, so we're gonna get
Speaker 2: into that. And even Sterling, I think, is gonna call
Speaker 2: in for this one because we were both together at
Speaker 2: the holiday party last year. Donnade along with doctor Wes
Speaker 2: and Channing Saturday Night, seven hundred WLW, Cincinnati. Wooh, it's
Speaker 2: a cold one twenty It's thirty five but feels like
Speaker 2: twenty five. There's a winter weather advisory. In effact we
Speaker 2: were it was snowing when we came in, so it's
Speaker 2: that's kind of nice. And it is the time of
Speaker 2: year to have snow. If we're gonna have snow, it's
Speaker 2: be around Thanksgiving and Christmas. Don and d Saturday Night,
Speaker 2: seven hundred WLW alongside doctor West, who I always love
Speaker 2: when you're in the studio with me and you drive
Speaker 2: a long way, not that far. I mean, I don't
Speaker 2: want to be ridiculous about it. You come out of Nashville,
Speaker 2: that's right, I do. What was the temperature in Nashville
Speaker 2: when you left.
Speaker 1: What was it, Channing, do you remember.
Speaker 2: Seventy sixty seventy I'm on it, guys. It was pretty
Speaker 2: it was.
Speaker 1: It was not what is here, I can tell you
Speaker 1: that much.
Speaker 2: We've got Channing. It's okay, we got it. It was
Speaker 2: warmer than it is here in Cincinnati. So but again,
Speaker 2: you know, this is the time where we have holiday
Speaker 2: parties and Thanksgiving and Christmas and love them or hate them.
Speaker 2: I mean, I was just telling you, doctor Wes. I
Speaker 2: had a Tuesday event last week, a Wednesday, a Thursday,
Speaker 2: obviously in Thanksgiving, and I had my girlfriends over Friday.
Speaker 2: So four nights in a row. That that's why I
Speaker 2: have no makeup on in the studio and I look
Speaker 2: absolutely hidious.
Speaker 1: But no negative self talk.
Speaker 2: I know, I know, but only if it's only if
Speaker 2: it's in humor, and it is. So We've got our
Speaker 2: Christmas party, our holiday party on Wednesday this week, and
Speaker 2: I have another one on Friday and Saturday. My co host.
Speaker 2: In the weekends. We were supposed to be on three
Speaker 2: to six, but you see football kind of canceled us.
Speaker 2: Sterling is on with me right now.
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, yeah, So we should have been on Bearcats
Speaker 6: could have waited.
Speaker 4: And not lost, but and then they had lightning to lay.
Speaker 6: And now it's snowing, and Doc West in the future
Speaker 6: of the world channing. There's rain, probably in Nashville, but
Speaker 6: you get to experience some snow.
Speaker 2: That's right, That's exactly right. Hey, at least all the
Speaker 2: other Cincinnati teams have won. I know you watched the
Speaker 2: Big Game Thursday night with Joe Burrow. How amazing was that?
Speaker 4: Sterling couldn't ask for much more?
Speaker 6: I mean, he came back unbelievable, settled in. Yeah, it's ridiculous.
Speaker 6: I'm trying not to interrupt. I'm afraid that I'm an
Speaker 6: interrupt or. I was listening and I'm thinking, is this
Speaker 6: all directed at me? Is this like an intervention? Do
Speaker 6: I have a problem beyond what I already know to
Speaker 6: be a problem. No, this isn't solve deprecation. I'm just
Speaker 6: trying to be better.
Speaker 2: No, Sterling. What happened was, I was talking to Tom
Speaker 2: Brenneman one the other day and I said, you know,
Speaker 2: he said, I think you and Sterling sounds so great,
Speaker 2: but you got to listen more instead of interrupting him.
Speaker 2: He's only and I said, but Sterling goes on forever.
Speaker 2: I got to interrupt him.
Speaker 6: I really, you know why, because I'm an only child,
Speaker 6: and usually it's the voices in my head and I'm
Speaker 6: but I try to listen. I know enough to know
Speaker 6: that I need to listen more because I don't know enough.
Speaker 2: We all have to listen more. That's the whole point
Speaker 2: of this show, by the way. Uh So, speaking of
Speaker 2: so we're gonna lighten it up a tiny little bit.
Speaker 2: And what's the worst thing you can do at a holiday,
Speaker 2: work party or otherwise any kind of bad behavior? And
Speaker 2: I'm going to give you the number one answer, Sterling,
Speaker 2: of what is the absolute worst thing that you can do?
Speaker 2: And you've never done it? I have, but not really bad.
Speaker 2: The worst thing you can do is get too tipsy,
Speaker 2: drinking too much eggnog and anything else like that, getting
Speaker 2: to hit the bottle hitting the bottle, right, I mean,
Speaker 2: and you know we have open bar. You know at
Speaker 2: our most holiday parties are going to have some festive
Speaker 2: drinks on the menu. Right, But what have you seen
Speaker 2: that you would consider bad behavior? And just know we're
Speaker 2: all getting together on Wednesday.
Speaker 6: Well, I think you hit it right off the bat.
Speaker 6: I mean, you got to know your limits and you know,
Speaker 6: open bar or otherwise. One if it's work related, keep
Speaker 6: it together because it's not really fun time, as much
Speaker 6: as it may be social, and you're not there to
Speaker 6: make an assy yourself. Pardon my expression, Channing, I apologized.
Speaker 6: I am wholesome and naive to the ways of the world,
Speaker 6: no matter how bad my language. But I think that's
Speaker 6: probably the worst. I've never seen much when it comes
Speaker 6: to business party kind of scenarios. But when I worked
Speaker 6: at Hara Arena as a teenager growing up, I had
Speaker 6: a chance a couple of times to get extra work
Speaker 6: because they used to have a convention center facility and
Speaker 6: they would do banquets and parties, holiday season, graduations, wedding stuff.
Speaker 6: All that stuff was huge business for them. And a
Speaker 6: couple of times holiday season one I saw someone get
Speaker 6: so messed up. They like trashed a couple of Christmas trees.
Speaker 4: That were so oh yeah, they were a mess. It
Speaker 4: was entertaining.
Speaker 6: I didn't have to clean it up, and it wasn't
Speaker 6: my tree, bulbs and all the decorations, but was that
Speaker 6: was ugly And that was I think a little over indulgence, you.
Speaker 2: Know, Okay, have you ever witnessed And I don't know
Speaker 2: that I've ever seen it, but I you know how
Speaker 2: we always talk about sterling. We see all these fights
Speaker 2: on x and Instagram and stuff like that. Have you
Speaker 2: ever seen a fight at a holiday party, like like
Speaker 2: friends getting into a fistfight or something like that, because
Speaker 2: that would be pretty bad.
Speaker 6: It's not at a holiday party, but at a wedding reception.
Speaker 6: I saw that once and it was a couple of guys.
Speaker 6: I think you'd had maybe too much of the brown
Speaker 6: liquor and got stupid.
Speaker 2: But I think that's worse. If there's anything worse than
Speaker 2: getting into a fight at a holiday party, please tell
Speaker 2: me what that is. Even if somebody's gotten a little
Speaker 2: too tipsy and they've been drinking too much in their
Speaker 2: slurners and that kind of stuff, and it's not a
Speaker 2: good look, but they're not bothering anybody. Putting your hands
Speaker 2: on people is probably the worst thing you can do.
Speaker 6: I don't know what let up do it. I only
Speaker 6: got to see a little of the interaction and they
Speaker 6: were pulled out of it. But at a holiday party
Speaker 6: get together, sometimes people their inhibitions clearly are lower after
Speaker 6: a little bit of say lubrication or intoxication of one
Speaker 6: type or another.
Speaker 4: And I've seen.
Speaker 6: People that have a couple of times not work as
Speaker 6: far as I know, or you know, end up in
Speaker 6: a situation like in a coat room or something like
Speaker 6: that where there might have been some type of romantic
Speaker 6: kind of vibe going on in the season under the missiletoe,
Speaker 6: what have you, but not making too much of a
Speaker 6: nuisance of themselves. I mean, people will get excited and
Speaker 6: happy and romantic and stuff sometimes, but yeah, I've seen
Speaker 6: some vomiting. I've seen some trees knocked down.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 6: The big thing I think is just, I mean, handle
Speaker 6: yourself an act that it's like New Year's it's amateur nights,
Speaker 6: So you've got to act like you've been there before.
Speaker 2: Right by the way, flirting with someone who's taken is
Speaker 2: on the list, sterling. So you kind of hit the
Speaker 2: nail on the head with you know, somebody that's uh,
Speaker 2: you know, going into a coat room or or just
Speaker 2: grabbing the missile toe and putting it over somebody's head.
Speaker 4: Have you ever had that grabbing something else?
Speaker 2: You thought I was going to say that, doctor West,
Speaker 2: what what is the what is the getting too drunk
Speaker 2: thing or you know, getting into it. What what what
Speaker 2: would cause somebody who's a rational person to just do
Speaker 2: something like that at a holiday party?
Speaker 1: Well, I think the obvious answer there would be just
Speaker 1: they just want to have fun, They want to kick back,
Speaker 1: they want to lower their inhibitions and and experience themselves
Speaker 1: differently with the coworkers. But obviously that doesn't go well.
Speaker 2: Okay, so they're buttoned up at work all the time.
Speaker 2: But this is a radio station, so like we we
Speaker 2: you know, kind of have fun with each other all
Speaker 2: the time. Anyway, Sterling, I was just talking about this
Speaker 2: just as a side note to Sterling and I have
Speaker 2: been that we're closing up on three years over three
Speaker 2: years together, and we've not been that long. It has
Speaker 2: been that long because our Instagram is done twenty twenty three,
Speaker 2: so we're getting to.
Speaker 6: Feel that long or longer. See that's my word is
Speaker 6: that like deep down you're like, uh, this is really
Speaker 6: feeling like a long time, like you in something in
Speaker 6: a bad situation. It goes fast because you're having a
Speaker 6: good time. Yeah most of our shows do, yes, but
Speaker 6: it's going bad. You feel like time is stopped and
Speaker 6: that I don't want to be the guy causing that
Speaker 6: you're not.
Speaker 2: I would yes, and you, but I have a question
Speaker 2: because because I'm not.
Speaker 6: Good at that, I'm better at asking questions than answering.
Speaker 6: It's it's very it's go ahead. I'm sorry, that's I'm
Speaker 6: not I'm just against all right?
Speaker 2: Zip it? Man? What you you? Literally? You and I
Speaker 2: have never had one conflict, not one. And in the
Speaker 2: in the radio industry, that's kind of a that's kind
Speaker 2: of a big deal when you're on air with somebody.
Speaker 2: Now we only do weekends together other and fill ins
Speaker 2: and stuff like that, but in three years we've never
Speaker 2: even had an argument across word or or anything like that. Sterling,
Speaker 2: what do you what do you attribute that to? Am
Speaker 2: I just like the nicest person to work with?
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, you know, just the most amazing, incredible, super
Speaker 6: talented start and all those things, and you know, and
Speaker 6: you shower for me and get put makeup on when
Speaker 6: you show up like that.
Speaker 4: What I heard you say earlier.
Speaker 2: Not tonight, I couldn't do it.
Speaker 4: I couldn't do it me either. Uh here here's I
Speaker 4: have a question for you though.
Speaker 6: Is it that unusual to work with someone in that
Speaker 6: because see, I'm not used to working with a partner,
Speaker 6: although the last couple of years we have and it
Speaker 6: doesn't seem irregular to not have a conflict. It seems okay,
Speaker 6: and we both seem to you know, if there's an
Speaker 6: idea that we have about a topic or a direction
Speaker 6: of the conversation, we seem to be a good match.
Speaker 6: I'll blame Rhino because he was like, I know who
Speaker 6: you need to work with, and he's a fan and this,
Speaker 6: that and the other, and then and it's the greatest
Speaker 6: thing ever. I don't want to I mean, so I
Speaker 6: don't know, are you just holding it in and waiting
Speaker 6: to like really like snap, like one of those people
Speaker 6: who just doesn't say anything.
Speaker 4: And then mindly it's like, it's true.
Speaker 1: It is true. That's true. Because couples that don't argue,
Speaker 1: and I'm calling you all a couple, a radio a
Speaker 1: work couple.
Speaker 2: It's my radio husband.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's fine. Couples that don't argue, they don't they
Speaker 1: don't fare very well, they don't do very well.
Speaker 2: But what if couples only see each other once or
Speaker 2: twice a week, because maybe Sterling, it is unusual for
Speaker 2: me because I would be.
Speaker 4: On working people you fought with regularly.
Speaker 2: Not regularly, but like fought with I mean like five
Speaker 2: days a week and then a four hour show and
Speaker 2: then you know, show prep before, show prep after. So
Speaker 2: I'm literally eight hours with this person five days a week,
Speaker 2: and then sometimes on the weekends for remotes and things
Speaker 2: like that. So so yeah, I would say it's unusual
Speaker 2: that we've gone three years, and I am applauding us
Speaker 2: even though doctor West is concerned. I am applauding us.
Speaker 4: I'm concerned that the good doctor is concerned.
Speaker 2: Maybe we need to get into a fight.
Speaker 1: And in fact, at.
Speaker 6: The holidays, I'm the clients in everybody.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and this place is packed, Sterling, let's totally get
Speaker 2: into a.
Speaker 4: Fight to do it Wednesday.
Speaker 2: I don't even know what I would argue with you about.
Speaker 2: That is the craziest thing. What would I argue with
Speaker 2: Sterling about he's.
Speaker 4: The nicest not wearing a blazer.
Speaker 2: Yes, that would that would would work if.
Speaker 6: You brought up numerous times from the last year, since
Speaker 6: last Christmas time, And the only reason I didn't have
Speaker 6: it was because I over rebar on the freeway in construction.
Speaker 6: I had other stuff to worry about, and swinging back
Speaker 6: by to get the cod.
Speaker 4: I'm like, I'm all right.
Speaker 1: Over here, Jack.
Speaker 2: He showed up. He showed up at the Christmas party,
Speaker 2: and he was so flustered because he got a flat
Speaker 2: tire on the way and I was like, what happened
Speaker 2: to your blazer? He was like, I can't.
Speaker 4: I don't even care. I'm just glad to be here.
Speaker 4: Where's a drink?
Speaker 2: Sterling? I love you.
Speaker 7: I mean that.
Speaker 2: And we've been together for so long, for three years.
Speaker 2: I'm not that I'm going anywhere, but I'm glad that
Speaker 2: you stayed up and called and and we get.
Speaker 4: To going somewhere.
Speaker 2: No, yeah, you're gonna go. You're gonna go to the
Speaker 2: Christmas party on Wednesday. That's why are you.
Speaker 4: Done with me?
Speaker 2: Now?
Speaker 6: It sounds like you're closing this up, doctor West. I mean,
Speaker 6: is this over now?
Speaker 4: Is that what you're saying about a fight? And this
Speaker 4: is ending?
Speaker 2: I've got my hand on the mouse.
Speaker 4: You got a Prematurelotte, click me off. I understand. I
Speaker 4: do it all the time.
Speaker 2: You do do it all the time, Sterling. I love you,
Speaker 2: love you, love you to death. Thank you for calling in.
Speaker 6: Well, Channing, I didn't even get to talk to Channing. Channing,
Speaker 6: let me just tell you you sound so smart and
Speaker 6: well put together and fully like functional and mentally like together,
Speaker 6: emotionally and fantactically. I could not have been on the
Speaker 6: radio talking the way you were talking. And I realized,
Speaker 6: Donna can make you very comfortable. Obviously, your pops is
Speaker 6: someone who's well educated and experienced and interpersonal stuff in therapy.
Speaker 6: But as a dad, I mean, how do you feel
Speaker 6: so comfortable in that environment doing what you did in
Speaker 6: the conversation I heard earlier.
Speaker 3: I have no idea. I think I've just it's just
Speaker 3: I just talked to a lot of people. So once
Speaker 3: I get comfortable with somebody, I'm just I'm there, Like, yeah.
Speaker 2: It is. It is a good question. And because we
Speaker 2: were just talking about this, there's a new study that
Speaker 2: preteen preteen girls specifically have high anxiety. They're there there.
Speaker 2: It's really based on phone usage and social media, and
Speaker 2: you were just talking about how it does affect you
Speaker 2: because when people are doing things and stuff and you
Speaker 2: see them all happy and you're not invited talk about that.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I catch myself getting down a lot on
Speaker 3: myself because I have always.
Speaker 2: Struggled with friends.
Speaker 3: I've always like, I've always felt really out of place
Speaker 3: wherever I'm at, and I've been trying to find like
Speaker 3: my friend group. So just scrolling on TikTok and seeing
Speaker 3: all my like other like friends or the people that
Speaker 3: I go to school with them having their friend groups,
Speaker 3: it just it really makes me feel down on myself
Speaker 3: because I'm like, am I falling behind? Like oh my gosh,
Speaker 3: my life is like not together, and it just it
Speaker 3: makes me feel super super down about myself. And I'm
Speaker 3: constantly comparing myself to other people like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 3: like her body, like I wish I had that, or
Speaker 3: like I wish I had this, and it's just it's it's.
Speaker 2: Really so when you say you catch yourself when you
Speaker 2: see yourself doing that and it doesn't feel good, like
Speaker 2: it feels terrible to do that, how do you pull
Speaker 2: yourself out of that? Talking to people?
Speaker 3: Like sometimes I'll be text I'll text my mom and
Speaker 3: I'll be like, Mom, I'm like I'm having a moment
Speaker 3: where I'm just I'm feeling really down on myself and
Speaker 3: she'll talk me through it, which really helps me because
Speaker 3: it just she validates my emotions because she knows that
Speaker 3: I experience this, so it makes me feel better just
Speaker 3: communicating with other people because it doesn't feel good, and
Speaker 3: never I bottle stuff in.
Speaker 2: It really doesn't know. And you do get a lot
Speaker 2: of therapy from you know, a certain counselor that you're seeing,
Speaker 2: and certainly your dad is a big support as well.
Speaker 2: Because listen, these sterling we were talking about this earlier,
Speaker 2: how in our day we used to you know, be
Speaker 2: outside all the time. You talk about being a free
Speaker 2: range kid, and you used to have you know, friends
Speaker 2: and your free break latch key kid. You used to
Speaker 2: go and get yourself into all kinds of trouble, but
Speaker 2: we would.
Speaker 4: Play an adventure. I wouldn't say trouble.
Speaker 2: Adventures, right. But kids now they get off the bus,
Speaker 2: they go home, they lay on their bed in their
Speaker 2: four hours on social media and scrolling and all that other.
Speaker 2: Different homework isn't even way different homework isn't even done.
Speaker 2: It's it's it's now the the iPhone, the social media,
Speaker 2: and it gets depressing. And a lot of times you
Speaker 2: probably wouldn't even be depressed if you didn't doom scroll
Speaker 2: is what we all call it.
Speaker 6: Time to unplug a little bit, and that's got to
Speaker 6: be hard. I can't imagine coming up now the way
Speaker 6: you are chanting and others of your generation in that situation.
Speaker 4: But to just know that that.
Speaker 6: They may not necessarily be real, and it's good to
Speaker 6: have a close circle of friends and just I know
Speaker 6: time is shorter coming up on the tenth report, of course,
Speaker 6: I will say that it's situation where you are talking
Speaker 6: about friends and so forth. I moved around a lot
Speaker 6: through the first part of high school and stuff. I
Speaker 6: didn't fall into the same a good group of friends
Speaker 6: that was steady until I was probably fifteen sixteen, Yeah,
Speaker 6: and it was by happenstance, and the same group of
Speaker 6: friends a part of that. I am now in my
Speaker 6: mid fifties and it is like brotherhood. Yeah, and the
Speaker 6: guys that I've grown up with and non longer than
Speaker 6: we've not known each other in.
Speaker 2: Our lives and that's what.
Speaker 6: Yeah, And you may find that, So don't worry about it.
Speaker 6: In time, it'll do it. I mean, you just just
Speaker 6: be yourself and not worry about all the social media,
Speaker 6: which is easy for me to say because I'm going
Speaker 6: to hang up and you know, go along with my
Speaker 6: day and you're living it.
Speaker 2: All right, I'm gonna text. I'm going to text in
Speaker 2: a minute, Sterling, thank you so much. Coming up. Oh
Speaker 2: oh oh, he does it all the time too.
Speaker 1: How the turntable?
Speaker 2: How the turntables? Exactly? He does it all the time.
Speaker 2: Coming up. Uh, we're going to talk about something you
Speaker 2: used to value that you no longer value. It's the
Speaker 2: end of the year. We're gonna take sock. We're all
Speaker 2: gonna look at what and how this year has been.
Speaker 2: When we have Channing in doctor Wess in the studio
Speaker 2: with me. It's donn a d seven hundred WLW, Cincinnati.
Speaker 7: Listening to a woman shop in the produce section isn't funny?
Speaker 2: Yeah, a sail on cucumbers.
Speaker 7: Listening to a woman poot next to the Granny Smiths
Speaker 7: oops is funny. Eddie and Rocky are also funny. So
Speaker 7: when you think of an apple farterer oops, think of
Speaker 7: Eddie and Rocky, Eddie and Rocky.
Speaker 1: Monday afternoon at three.
Speaker 4: One seven hundred WLW.
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Speaker 2: Home to the Rachel Meadows Show. More nice because it's
Speaker 2: the holiday and we get snow flurries and just a
Speaker 2: beautiful night in Cincinnati. Boy, the Bengals game was so
Speaker 2: good Thursday, Joe Burrow's return and he killed it Ohio
Speaker 2: State one. We won't talk about ucsarr Sean Sean McMahon
Speaker 2: producing the show tonight. I am Donna Dee with doctor
Speaker 2: Wes crafton, licensed Marriage Family Therapist in from Nashville to
Speaker 2: do the show. We've also had your daughter on and Channing.
Speaker 2: You have been just an unbelievable sport giving us the
Speaker 2: insight to a fourteen year old girls that are you know,
Speaker 2: understanding some of the challenges that you face as a
Speaker 2: child and the bullying and the social media stuff overall.
Speaker 2: Because we're coming to a close of this year, how
Speaker 2: are you doing and how has twenty twenty five been
Speaker 2: for you?
Speaker 3: Twenty twenty five has been definitely a year of growth.
Speaker 3: I feel like I have learned so many new things.
Speaker 3: I've made good memories, I've made mistakes, but ultimately it's
Speaker 3: been a year of growth.
Speaker 2: Okay, So I love that and it's been a year
Speaker 2: of growth for me. And that's really all you can
Speaker 2: if you're if you're growing and you're becoming more loving
Speaker 2: to yourself and others, what else is there?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: What? That's really the key to living? But so what
Speaker 2: the question that I want to know, and I want
Speaker 2: to open up the phone lines too as well. What
Speaker 2: is something you used to value that you no longer value? Right?
Speaker 2: So five one three seven four nine seven thousand. We
Speaker 2: have had guests on the show tonight and not a
Speaker 2: lot of callers, so call in for this segment here.
Speaker 2: Five one three seven four nine seven thousand. What did
Speaker 2: you used to value that you no longer value? Doctor Wes.
Speaker 2: I'm going to start with you on this and it
Speaker 2: can be pretty personal. You do whatever you want to do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I'm going into next year with an
Speaker 1: intention of self love and so that means I'm going
Speaker 1: to be leaving behind so much of the opinions of others.
Speaker 2: Okay, so valuing the what you used to value.
Speaker 1: Would be the opinions of others and their approval.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so you're leaving that behind. I think that
Speaker 2: is a very courageous choice. And you know the quote
Speaker 2: that I love from Mikaela Catherine Jones, which is it's
Speaker 2: none of my business what other people think of me, right,
Speaker 2: And and that can be written on your arm if
Speaker 2: you want to, just as a reminder, because it really
Speaker 2: messes you up when you care about what other people
Speaker 2: think of you, and that is something we have all
Speaker 2: struggled with. It's like, did I make a fool of myself?
Speaker 2: Did I do something stupid? And now they're talking about me?
Speaker 2: But it really doesn't matter because everybody makes mistakes. Everybody does.
Speaker 2: So Channing, what would you say, what what is something
Speaker 2: that you value that you no longer value? Specific friendships? Okay? Yes, okay,
Speaker 2: So so friendships that you've had that you value that
Speaker 2: you no longer put in that pedestal of she's one
Speaker 2: of my bff. Okay, and how is that going for you?
Speaker 3: It's definitely been hard because a lot of these friendships
Speaker 3: that I don't value as much as I value like
Speaker 3: new connections that I've made.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely been.
Speaker 3: Hard because I mean, I've had such great memories with
Speaker 3: those specific friendships, but I just have just learning that
Speaker 3: those friendships might not be for me and it might
Speaker 3: not benefit me, you know, Like, Yeah.
Speaker 2: It's one of the hardest things to do is let
Speaker 2: people go, definitely, and it's a very courageous thing to
Speaker 2: do because if a relationship is not serving you anymore,
Speaker 2: then you really do have to let go. One of
Speaker 2: the things that I used to value that I no
Speaker 2: longer value on another level. I thought I was over this,
Speaker 2: and then here comes another level of it that I
Speaker 2: have to learn from. And that happens to me all
Speaker 2: the time. But needing to feel right, I don't feel
Speaker 2: like I need to be right anymore. I just and
Speaker 2: and when I always felt like I need to be right,
Speaker 2: I made somebody else wrong and that doesn't feel good either,
Speaker 2: So that doesn't matter to me anymore. I'd rather take
Speaker 2: people for who they are, let them, let them Book
Speaker 2: by Mel Robbins is also a really big thing of like, okay,
Speaker 2: so he doesn't want to text you, It doesn't blah
Speaker 2: blah blah this and that, let them right. It's kind
Speaker 2: of of along those lines, and take people and have compassion,
Speaker 2: understand people make mistakes, and it's not about right or wrong.
Speaker 2: It's about appreciating for somebody for who they are. Maybe
Speaker 2: they're showing me that that's who they are. And then
Speaker 2: you have to make a choice like you are doing
Speaker 2: right now, Channing, and you have to let some of
Speaker 2: those friendships that have been close to you. You kind
Speaker 2: of let them go, and if they're real friendships, they
Speaker 2: come back, or real love affairs, they come back, but
Speaker 2: let them go, and that's kind of hard to do.
Speaker 1: Sure it is. Yeah, there's a quote that I love
Speaker 1: that I just hung up in my place and it says,
Speaker 1: in the end, only three things matter. You may know this, donna,
Speaker 1: how much you loved, how gently you lived, and how
Speaker 1: gracefully you let go of things not meant for you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because if you don't. I hadn't heard that, but
Speaker 2: I agree with it. If you don't let things go
Speaker 2: that are not working for you, how in the world
Speaker 2: are you going to open up to something that would
Speaker 2: be a thousand times more like you, or better for you,
Speaker 2: or more productive, or you know, to help you grow?
Speaker 2: How would you do that if you're hung up on yep,
Speaker 2: on something that's not working for you anymore? Five one, three, seven,
Speaker 2: four nine, seven thousand, one eight hundred The big one?
Speaker 2: What did you used to value that you no longer
Speaker 2: value anymore? You've grown out of hanging your hat on something, right,
Speaker 2: You've grown grown out of of dealing with with toxic
Speaker 2: people just because Wow, I've invested so much in this friendship.
Speaker 2: I've invested so much in this relationship, But every other
Speaker 2: sign is saying you need to run and you need to.
Speaker 2: Why is it that we hold on so much? Wess?
Speaker 2: Why why is it that we Why is letting go
Speaker 2: so hard?
Speaker 1: I mean, I hate to go back to the same
Speaker 1: old answer over and over again. But fear is so
Speaker 1: it's so powerful. Fear, far of what being alone, fear
Speaker 1: of being alone, fear of not knowing yourself. You've identified
Speaker 1: yourself with people, You've identified yourself with relationships.
Speaker 2: So who am I without this person? Exactly right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Who am I without them? How can I go on?
Speaker 1: What will my day to day life look like? Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's And it could be that you're an approval addict.
Speaker 1: I know I've certainly gotten caught up in that before,
Speaker 1: and I've I've been approved by this person, and so
Speaker 1: I have to have them in my life to feel
Speaker 1: that approval. And if they're not in my life, then
Speaker 1: I'm I'm not approved, right, I'm not okay, right?
Speaker 2: And so if if it's boy, that is a tough
Speaker 2: circle right there. It really is, because if you if
Speaker 2: you're looking for approval or the it's the same thing
Speaker 2: I could say about wanting to be liked, right, And
Speaker 2: and hopefully Channing will turn her head set up on this,
Speaker 2: because this is really important. It's not about being You're
Speaker 2: not gonna not everybody's gonna get you, right, Not everybody
Speaker 2: is gonna understand who Channing is and and and get
Speaker 2: every aspect of you. And then like you, there are
Speaker 2: gonna be some friends or some friends of friends that
Speaker 2: says something about her. I just don't mind when they're like,
Speaker 2: what did I do? I didn't, just myself. But the
Speaker 2: sooner you understand that not everything you do will everyone
Speaker 2: is going to get and you have to be okay
Speaker 2: with that too. Yeah, And because otherwise you're just gonna
Speaker 2: what happens on the flip side, you can form and
Speaker 2: then you're inauthentic, right, And that's the worst when you're
Speaker 2: when you don't mean what you say and say what
Speaker 2: you mean. And I talk about this all the time,
Speaker 2: how important authenticity is. It's it's it's what the definition
Speaker 2: of auth authenticity is. Being authentic is say what you
Speaker 2: mean and mean what you say. And if there's any
Speaker 2: kind of confusion that you're sending a message out to
Speaker 2: the universe. I want to date somebody, and somebody asks
Speaker 2: you and Lina, I'm happy being single, but you really
Speaker 2: want to date somebody. Then there's conflicting messages to the universe,
Speaker 2: and and you you don't get really what you intend,
Speaker 2: which is to date somebody or anything. I like this job,
Speaker 2: but you know, I don't know. I might want this promotion,
Speaker 2: but maybe not. Right, say what you mean, and mean
Speaker 2: what you say. If you want the promotion, go after it.
Speaker 2: You'll probably get it for the most part, right right.
Speaker 2: So when you're inauthentic, which means you're not going to
Speaker 2: be liked by everybody, you have to be okay with that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And a lot of people are terrified of taking
Speaker 1: that step. So what do they do?
Speaker 2: Look for approval from some other somebody else that's something,
Speaker 2: and they stay stuck in that cycle you're talking about,
Speaker 2: right right, is a terrible cycle. Okay, So we're going
Speaker 2: to talk about also. You know, the other thing I
Speaker 2: wanted to mention to was what do you want to
Speaker 2: have happened before the year ends?
Speaker 1: Too?
Speaker 2: My sister and I always take stock of how was
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five for you? A lot has happened to
Speaker 2: both of us. You know, I ended a relationship that
Speaker 2: I was in, so did she. She's in another one
Speaker 2: that is much more like her than the other one was, so,
Speaker 2: you know, there's there's things that that I have wanted
Speaker 2: to do in my career that I have done this year.
Speaker 2: There's there's things that I've done in terms of like
Speaker 2: giving service, fostering dogs. I've had three dogs that I've fostered,
Speaker 2: one currently with me. What is something that you want
Speaker 2: to do before you close out twenty twenty five? Is
Speaker 2: there something you want to do?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I need to let go of some things not
Speaker 1: meant for me, Like that quote says, yeah, yeah, there
Speaker 1: are certainly some things that I need to let go of,
Speaker 1: and I'm actively working to do that. Okay, but it
Speaker 1: is a daily choice for me, for all of us. Yeah, right,
Speaker 1: So letting go is one of the hardest things. And
Speaker 1: then when you realize, oh man, why did I hang
Speaker 1: on to that for so long, you realize I need
Speaker 1: to let go a little bit sooner I really do,
Speaker 1: so letting go Channing, Do you have one? What do
Speaker 1: you want to do before twenty twenty five?
Speaker 2: Ns?
Speaker 3: I could think of some funny things that I want
Speaker 3: to do, but letting go to just learning to let
Speaker 3: go of these friendships and work towards making new ones.
Speaker 2: There's a really good book, and I think you got
Speaker 2: it because I read it by doctor David Hawkins called
Speaker 2: letting Go, and it talks about the science of actually
Speaker 2: letting go. And when I mean, obviously, and we just
Speaker 2: touched on this point too, is when you let go,
Speaker 2: you absolutely open up opportunities. So you close the door,
Speaker 2: slam it shut, and then a window opens and then
Speaker 2: there's wow, there's new air, there's new light, there's new energy,
Speaker 2: there's new passion, there's new fun. Right, So holding on
Speaker 2: seems a little a little I don't know, would you
Speaker 2: it's stifling because but it's so hard. It's so people
Speaker 2: have been in relationships for so long where I'm like, wow,
Speaker 2: they're still together? How they still together? How does that
Speaker 2: even work? They're still together. You've got to see this
Speaker 2: in your office all the time, too, where where there
Speaker 2: are relationships where you've said, all right, I don't think
Speaker 2: you guys should be together anymore.
Speaker 1: Now I tell people that the relationship's over. It's the
Speaker 1: recurrent relationship, as you know, it is over. So your choices,
Speaker 1: you're in my office, the choices. We either work on
Speaker 1: helping you all separate in a healthy way, or we
Speaker 1: start a new relationship. But that has to begin with friendship.
Speaker 2: Do you think the end of a year you have
Speaker 2: an opportunity to really figure out the things that you want.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a looking back, but we're starting a
Speaker 2: new year in twenty twenty six. There's a resurgence, there's
Speaker 2: a renewal, there's a set of intentions. You want to
Speaker 2: How important is it to have goals like that in
Speaker 2: the beginning of a year and let go of some
Speaker 2: of the things that didn't work in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 1: Well, I think that we are constructing our reality every
Speaker 1: day of our lives, and it's based on what we
Speaker 1: are the stories that we tell ourselves about our lives.
Speaker 1: So those in tensions are very important because that is
Speaker 1: exactly how your life will end up is based on
Speaker 1: the story you're telling yourself. And that's something that I
Speaker 1: oftentimes will challenge myself on what is the story I'm
Speaker 1: telling myself in this exact moment. And I tell my
Speaker 1: clients that if they have a dip in their depression
Speaker 1: or their anxiety, what were you just thinking right before
Speaker 1: you had that dip in your mood?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 2: I teach yoga on Saturday mornings, and one of the
Speaker 2: things I talked about is you know we have sixty
Speaker 2: to eighty thousand thoughts a day. Sixty to eighty thousand,
Speaker 2: and eighty to ninety percent of those thoughts are negative, repetitive,
Speaker 2: and useless. I mean, it is the same things we
Speaker 2: think about this morning that you think about tomorrow morning,
Speaker 2: and the same things. And so you literally have to
Speaker 2: alter and intentionally decide no, when I start going down
Speaker 2: that rabbit hole, don't feel good. So you literally have
Speaker 2: to control your mind. Just as if you were to say,
Speaker 2: if you were to scream your name in your head,
Speaker 2: doctor Wes, Right now you scream your name, and then
Speaker 2: you can say it's softly, whisper it, whisper your name
Speaker 2: in your head. Right, you have control of your talk,
Speaker 2: your mind, talk, your chatter. You have control over it.
Speaker 2: The key is to become aware of it and then
Speaker 2: to as Wayne Dyer used to say, doctor Wayne Dyer,
Speaker 2: change your thoughts, change your life. You get a whole buck.
Speaker 2: Yet about eighty of these books on changing your thoughts
Speaker 2: change your life, and it does work. Yeah, you have
Speaker 2: to become aware of it, and you have to be
Speaker 2: clear in what you want, right clear and what you
Speaker 2: want and what you're aware, and then that's where mantras
Speaker 2: come in and setting your intentions and things like that.
Speaker 2: You know, I can go down this road for hours
Speaker 2: an hour.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a great I think something for twenty twenty
Speaker 1: six would be daily mantras. Doc what you said?
Speaker 2: Yeah, like like things that you want, write it down
Speaker 2: and say it out loud as many times as you can.
Speaker 2: There's people that do these these chantings right before they
Speaker 2: go to bed, because you can get in a dream
Speaker 2: state and manifest it. So if you say things five times,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be the first millionaire in my family, I'm
Speaker 2: gonna I'm gonna make a million b time by the
Speaker 2: time I'm thirty years old. And you say these things
Speaker 2: over and over again right before you go to bed,
Speaker 2: and there's uh, there's that this has worked for people
Speaker 2: and how they have manifested it. It's pretty interesting. It's
Speaker 2: very interesting. All Right, we're up against clock. What's the
Speaker 2: scariest thing that can happen to you on a first date.
Speaker 2: We're going to get into yes, first date scenarios, worst, best,
Speaker 2: and everything in between. We are going there in the
Speaker 2: eleven o'clock hours. Don Indeed, doctor Wes and Channing tonight
Speaker 2: along for the Ride, Saturday Night, seven hundred WLW, Cincinnati.
Speaker 9: I'm Scottsloan here, and you don't need me to tell
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Speaker 9: You can always touch the podcast on the iHeartRadio app
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Speaker 9: you're on the toilet, or at a funeral, or when
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Speaker 9: hundred and twenty fifth season of Cincinnati men's basketball.
Speaker 4: Celebrate them.
Speaker 2: It's done a d Saturday Night along with me, Doctor West,
Speaker 2: licensed marriage family Therapists out of Tennessee. So we're talking
Speaker 2: about we're talking about things that you want to do
Speaker 2: for the new year and things you want to leave behind,
Speaker 2: like old relationships and that could lead to dating.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: I watched this comedian say what's the scariest thing that
Speaker 2: can happen to you on a first date? And she
Speaker 2: asked the men and the men said catfish.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 2: So basically, oh, she doesn't look like her photos, right,
Speaker 2: She usual looks a little off catfishing is a real thing.
Speaker 2: I get it. I'm not saying it. But then she
Speaker 2: asked the ladies, what's the scariest thing that can happen
Speaker 2: to you on the first date? And they all said murder? Right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: you see how men and women look at things so differently.
Speaker 1: You have to. Women have to in today's You just
Speaker 1: have to because of the risk of just the just
Speaker 1: the very differences between men and women. I mean, let's
Speaker 1: just talk about it, right.
Speaker 2: You've got a daughter. I've got a daughter, Yeah, fourteen,
Speaker 2: she's Fourteen's going to be dating at some point, that's right.
Speaker 2: So how do you look at it as a dad
Speaker 2: as as you have to girl? Dads have to look
Speaker 2: at things a little bit differently.
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely they do. I have to be thinking about
Speaker 1: teaching her about how to be smart when it comes
Speaker 1: to protecting you know, her, not giving out all of
Speaker 1: her information, not be sharing her location, all of those things,
Speaker 1: you know, even the devices that we have right now,
Speaker 1: things like that. That's something that I'm talking to her
Speaker 1: about all the time. And and people that are trying
Speaker 1: to purchase purchase gifts for people, you know, trying to
Speaker 1: groom them into these relationships. You got to be careful
Speaker 1: about that.
Speaker 2: So yeah, when once you are online and you have
Speaker 2: social media, and I say this to parents all the time,
Speaker 2: I don't know how you do it because it's so
Speaker 2: scary for the kids out there, right, it can be
Speaker 2: so scary. And I know, Channing, you're shaking your head.
Speaker 2: There's uh, there's one there. It's not just the scary
Speaker 2: aspect of dating, because there's there's that, but it's also
Speaker 2: like sometimes very uncomfortable too, because when you're dating it
Speaker 2: could feel like a job interview. It feels like you
Speaker 2: try and ask questions and you try and get to
Speaker 2: know somebody, but it's not always like I don't always
Speaker 2: feel like people are being one hundred percent honest. Like
Speaker 2: if you're an outdoors person and you say that you're
Speaker 2: an outdoor person, great, you go skiing and you know,
Speaker 2: play hoops with your friends on the weekends, whatever, that's great.
Speaker 2: But if you're not, just say you're not. If you're
Speaker 2: a couch potato would like to watch football all day
Speaker 2: on Saturday and all day on Sunday, then just be
Speaker 2: honest about it. How important is it to be honest
Speaker 2: on the first date so that you can figure out
Speaker 2: whether you're a match because if you're saying you're outdoors
Speaker 2: and you're really not, maybe somebody that that would love
Speaker 2: a couch potato that stays home and watches sports all weekend,
Speaker 2: there would be your perfect match. I wouldn't love that,
Speaker 2: you know, all weekend to stay home on the couch
Speaker 2: and watch sports. But you know sometimes on Sunday watch
Speaker 2: them bangles of course.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 1: No, it's like layers of an onion for me. And
Speaker 1: for what I mean by that is you want to
Speaker 1: start with the just the basic small talk, but then
Speaker 1: you do I think need to just I think you
Speaker 1: need to in that second layer, be honest about who
Speaker 1: you are as a person, what your identity is as
Speaker 1: a person, and what you like and what you don't like.
Speaker 1: And so it's very important, I mean, But unfortunately, I
Speaker 1: think dating right now is a lot of It's like Donna,
Speaker 1: you and I have talked about it. It's like shopping
Speaker 1: almost online. This online dating is like shopping, and people
Speaker 1: are putting out like the ad campaigns on themselves, Like
Speaker 1: there's certain pictures that they're putting off that aren't really
Speaker 1: who they are, and so they're trying to advertise themselves
Speaker 1: in such a way.
Speaker 2: It's not a whole new world. It's right, it's not
Speaker 2: who they really are, that is the first. That is
Speaker 2: the thing I did in twenty twenty five that I
Speaker 2: never thought I was going to do is get on
Speaker 2: a dating app. And it's been interesting and I've met
Speaker 2: some very nice people. I think dating apps are great.
Speaker 2: I know so many people that have found matches on
Speaker 2: Bumble and the like that that are truly like in love,
Speaker 2: in life partners. I mean, I have three people around
Speaker 2: me in my you know, in my close circle, that
Speaker 2: have found people on Bumble and and and it's been
Speaker 2: or or another dating app. And it's been a really
Speaker 2: good experience for some it's been terrible for others. And
Speaker 2: what makes it and I Doctor West, tell me if
Speaker 2: I'm wrong here, please, but I think what makes your
Speaker 2: experience on something that's uncomfortable, like a dating app or
Speaker 2: whatever that could be uncomfortable, is your perspect perspective about it. Right,
Speaker 2: So if you say, listen, this is fun, I'm having
Speaker 2: I'm having fun. I like dating. I'm I'm I'm not
Speaker 2: ready to settle down yet. I'd like to meet somebody
Speaker 2: that I match with, but I'm okay with just dating
Speaker 2: for a while, and because I see some people put
Speaker 2: on like I can't wait to get off this app.
Speaker 2: I think it's terrible. Blah blah blah blah blah. How
Speaker 2: are you going to have a good experience?
Speaker 1: If you're like that, you're not going to eat. But
Speaker 1: you can't be attached to an outcome. I think that's key.
Speaker 1: You cannot be attached to an outcome because if you're
Speaker 1: attached an outcome, you become imprisoned by that outcome.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I completely agree. But even your perspective, perspective is
Speaker 2: everything it is. It's if it's a cold, snowy Cincinnati
Speaker 2: mourning and you got to go walk the dog. It
Speaker 2: can be fresh and beautiful and bundle up and cozy,
Speaker 2: you know all that's it just depends on how you
Speaker 2: look at things. And I really do feel like dating
Speaker 2: and dating apps are really important to pay attention to
Speaker 2: your perspective on it, as if it's not going to
Speaker 2: be good. I have people that are on there and
Speaker 2: says it's the worst I can stand it. And then
Speaker 2: like I said, people that have found great people matches.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the people that are on there, they're saying I
Speaker 1: getting on this app was the most horrible thing I've
Speaker 1: ever done. That they're not going to attract anyone. That's
Speaker 1: just negative energy. Yeah, who wants to date someone with
Speaker 1: negative energy? So no, that's not going to work. You know,
Speaker 1: you want to be able to be honest but also
Speaker 1: have a little bit of a positive attitude about it.
Speaker 2: I think it's important. It is really important. Five three
Speaker 2: seven four ninety seven thousand. Everybody's been so quiet tonight.
Speaker 2: We've had a really good discussion. Tell me about this though.
Speaker 2: How do you feel about dating apps?
Speaker 1: How do I feel about dating apps?
Speaker 2: I'm asking the our asking our listeners. How do you
Speaker 2: feel about dating apps? How? How has it been for you?
Speaker 2: Have you found a match? This is how we all
Speaker 2: live now. Everybody is on dating apps. Channing, you're fourteen. Now,
Speaker 2: I'm not going to ask if you're dating. You're not
Speaker 2: dating anyone, right, Your dad is right here.
Speaker 1: She's not dating anyone until she's late late twenties and
Speaker 1: then they have to put in the application to meet.
Speaker 2: But you meet kids at school still, right? Is that
Speaker 2: how you do it? Now? You're fourteen, so you know
Speaker 2: I would suggest you going at least you know, three
Speaker 2: or four more years before you start. I mean that
Speaker 2: I am not exaggerating. Seventeen eighteen. Maybe that's when you
Speaker 2: start looking to like meet somebody and get your first
Speaker 2: experience of like actually having a love of your life
Speaker 2: kind of a thing.
Speaker 7: Is that?
Speaker 2: Have you experienced any kind of a minimal crush or
Speaker 2: something like that?
Speaker 3: Yes, obviously crushes, I've experienced many throughout school. As far
Speaker 3: as like long term like relationships, I have not.
Speaker 2: I have not yet. Well, you're fourteen. I literally said,
Speaker 2: I'm hoping.
Speaker 3: To experience one, but I'm kind of just letting it
Speaker 3: happen how it's supposed to happen.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's good.
Speaker 3: Crushes Obviously, crush on somebody back in the day.
Speaker 2: This is so embarrassing. But I used to have a
Speaker 2: crush on Andy Gibb and Very Manilow. How crazy is that?
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. Do you have crushes like for rock
Speaker 2: stars and stuff? Oh? Yes, do you? I just saw
Speaker 2: you saw Bruno Mars out in the hallway. Guys, I
Speaker 2: really like Joe Jonas.
Speaker 3: Okay, but he could be my father, so I it's
Speaker 3: the But yes, I have.
Speaker 2: Crushes on random rock stars. So I've won three seven
Speaker 2: for ninety seven thousand. How do you feel about dating apps?
Speaker 2: Is it the worst thing in the world or are
Speaker 2: you having some success in it? The thing about understanding
Speaker 2: how how to date, because if you haven't been out there,
Speaker 2: I haven't I was in a relationship for a while,
Speaker 2: you as well. You really have to practice it like
Speaker 2: anything else. And if you if you're thin skinned in
Speaker 2: the dating world right now, that's going to be a
Speaker 2: pro that's going to be hard. What advice doctor Wes
Speaker 2: would you give in terms of of of of being
Speaker 2: honest about yourself and authentic about who you are, but
Speaker 2: also like not getting offended and being thicker skinned if
Speaker 2: somebody because you you, somebody can unmatch you in a
Speaker 2: second on on you know, the dating apps or somebody
Speaker 2: can you know, decide after a first date that hey,
Speaker 2: this isn't a match. How do you not take that?
Speaker 1: Personally, you have to love yourself. You gotta love yourself
Speaker 1: first and foremost. You have to know that you are
Speaker 1: a catch yourself and write down the reasons why you're
Speaker 1: a catch. I think you have to put those front
Speaker 1: and center in your mind because if you are seeking
Speaker 1: that external validation from the apps, you're going to get disappointed,
Speaker 1: right so, and.
Speaker 2: It's kind of like what we talked about earlier in
Speaker 2: terms of not getting validated by other people. Better if
Speaker 2: you could actually if I don't think it's a match,
Speaker 2: but I didn't get to say it before he did,
Speaker 2: and he you know, it would be like I already
Speaker 2: feel like it's not a match too, so by right,
Speaker 2: it could be one of those things. Or it could
Speaker 2: be like why didn't he like me? Because even though
Speaker 2: you didn't feel like it was, it was a good
Speaker 2: match too, you might feel like, oh, abandoned by it?
Speaker 2: Or what would be the technical term of that.
Speaker 1: No, abandoned would be a good term for that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you would feel abandoned, You would feel invalidated, you would
Speaker 1: feel rejected.
Speaker 2: Rejected is the word that I was looking for. Rejected
Speaker 2: would be rejecting me before I could reject, which is
Speaker 2: always a bummer you. I will always want to reject
Speaker 2: somebody before they can reject me. But really everybody nowadays,
Speaker 2: it's kind of it is kind of like shopping online
Speaker 2: shopping and you're like trying to pick pick the one
Speaker 2: that you think would like a nice par of jeans, right,
Speaker 2: like a nice comfy para jeans. You're like, man, these
Speaker 2: don't fit that well, they looked better on the hangar, right,
Speaker 2: and then it doesn't fit very well. But it's something
Speaker 2: that we're all getting used to in society online dating.
Speaker 1: We are, we are, and it is very much there's
Speaker 1: got to you gotta, I think, go into it with
Speaker 1: a beginner's mind, without having a lot of expectations. But
Speaker 1: also I think you've got to be careful to not
Speaker 1: get hurt. So you got to put you got to
Speaker 1: put a lot of parameters up around not giving out,
Speaker 1: not giving out too much information too soon.
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, I can't believe you just said it,
Speaker 2: because that's kind of how people get violated. So I
Speaker 2: don't need to know that you didn't get along with
Speaker 2: your on the first date. I don't need to know
Speaker 2: that you didn't get along with your wife, right, and
Speaker 2: that your family is now disgruntled and they don't get
Speaker 2: along with her and the kids are I don't need
Speaker 2: to know all that on the first date right now,
Speaker 2: and why you broke up and why. I mean, I
Speaker 2: think it's important to understand, but like just what books
Speaker 2: have you read late lately? I mean, that's kind of
Speaker 2: where the first date should be.
Speaker 1: That's a sign of somebody that needs to go to therapy.
Speaker 1: If they're telling you all that on a first date,
Speaker 1: they should go to therapy.
Speaker 2: Because they have to get it out. That's what they're doing.
Speaker 1: Right, But they're just moving from one relationship to the next,
Speaker 1: to the next to the next.
Speaker 2: I actually said, and I really like this guy, and
Speaker 2: I thought thought he was super nice, and he got
Speaker 2: a little bit into that and I said, you're you're
Speaker 2: telling me too much stuff. And I realize not everybody
Speaker 2: has a twin sister like I do and talk for
Speaker 2: two hours and get everything out. But it is, it is.
Speaker 2: It can be too much for the listener and too much,
Speaker 2: certainly for somebody. That's Sharon. Let's go to Brian and Amelia. Brian,
Speaker 2: I don't know what you're you're married for thirty seven years.
Speaker 2: Tell me about the dating life that you no longer
Speaker 2: have to deal with.
Speaker 10: Well, I work for a company where there are a
Speaker 10: lot of women and I don't even pay attention to them.
Speaker 10: I treat them like they're toxic because there's too much.
Speaker 4: Trouble these days.
Speaker 10: You can get into. But my point being is when
Speaker 10: my wife and I met each other, we were engaged
Speaker 10: for a year.
Speaker 4: We dated for a year.
Speaker 10: We were engaged for a year and then we got married,
Speaker 10: and in that time we talked about all the things
Speaker 10: that we wanted to achieve, how many children, where we
Speaker 10: wanted to live. We're both Catholic. That was a good
Speaker 10: point that she wanted from me, and things have worked out.
Speaker 10: We've got four boys who are all Eagle Scouts in
Speaker 10: their contributing members of society and none of them have
Speaker 10: been in jail.
Speaker 2: Well, that is about That is definitely a positive thing.
Speaker 2: So you've been married for thirty seven years, Brian, Yes, okay?
Speaker 2: Are you still are you still.
Speaker 10: Eighty eight?
Speaker 2: Okay? Do you still have good communication with your wife? Yes?
Speaker 10: Things have gotten better. Unfortunately issues out of work and
Speaker 10: I get to see her more often and our relationship
Speaker 10: has gotten a lot better. We only have one of
Speaker 10: the four boys left at home and he's about about
Speaker 10: do I believe get married and move out so we
Speaker 10: will be empty nesters?
Speaker 2: And what do you? Because I again this is perspective
Speaker 2: because I have friends that are going through empty nest
Speaker 2: empty nesters right now, and they they're re establishing, many
Speaker 2: of them, they're reestablishing the deeper connection by being alone.
Speaker 2: What do you? How do you see that, Wes, doctor Wes.
Speaker 2: Some people grow apart in some people, Yeah, some people
Speaker 2: grow apart. But but Brian, you and your wife, it
Speaker 2: sounds like you all. I'm wondering what intentional steps you
Speaker 2: all took throughout your marriage to stay connected, because what
Speaker 2: can often happen is is that couples grow apart because
Speaker 2: of all because of all the parenting and all the
Speaker 2: different roles, and they when they become empty nesters, they
Speaker 2: end up separating or divorcing. So you all have done
Speaker 2: something different.
Speaker 10: It sounds like, well, we've had we've had our rocky
Speaker 10: times in the marriage. I won't I won't lie to
Speaker 10: you that we've not seen an eye on a few things.
Speaker 10: But the communication is what counts. Okay, if you truly
Speaker 10: love someone, you will look past a lot of things
Speaker 10: because you want that person for who they are, not
Speaker 10: for that certain belief, for that that little.
Speaker 1: Quirk that they have.
Speaker 2: No. I honestly agree with Brian one hundred it's important.
Speaker 2: People oftentimes feel like the grass is always greener on
Speaker 2: the other side, and Brian, that's not always the case.
Speaker 2: And when you know, and when you yeah.
Speaker 10: I can't give up all we've worked together to build
Speaker 10: that would be stepping too far back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, And if you have two people in a
Speaker 2: relationship that understand that, that's where the that's that's step one.
Speaker 2: And then learning how to communicate and understand each other's idiosyncrasies.
Speaker 2: Like they're not always gonna you're not always going to
Speaker 2: agree with them. There's always going to be some tough times. Brian,
Speaker 2: thank you so much for the call. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 10: You're awake, We're welcome. Don I have a good night
Speaker 10: you too.
Speaker 2: So I really do feel like that that was such
Speaker 2: a good call because it shows that even though you
Speaker 2: have rough times, you can still work it out. Obviously,
Speaker 2: we're gonna we're going to talk about this and when
Speaker 2: you should leave a relationship, because there are times. We're
Speaker 2: going to finish out the segment when we come back,
Speaker 2: Doctor West is going to talk about when you should
Speaker 2: give up on a relationship, when those things, when those
Speaker 2: signs happen. So coming back donner d with Doctor West
Speaker 2: Saturday night. It's seven hundred WLW Cincinnati when or Winter
Speaker 2: Weather Advisor, if I can say that it's called out.
Speaker 2: It feels like twenty five it's going to be snowing, tomorrow.
Speaker 2: It's done a d on a Saturday night here with
Speaker 2: my buddy doctor Wes seven hundred WLWS Doctor Wes. We've
Speaker 2: been talking about this, you know, finding love in today's world,
Speaker 2: and oftentimes it's on dating sites. You know, it's you know,
Speaker 2: it's the way that we meet people now, and sometimes
Speaker 2: it works and sometimes it doesn't. I have friends that
Speaker 2: are in long term relationships from meeting on a dating app.
Speaker 2: And you know, if you're in a long term relationship
Speaker 2: and things are going great and then after a year
Speaker 2: or two, thoughts are coming in, maybe this isn't my
Speaker 2: person right, Maybe he isn't what I thought he was.
Speaker 2: We haven't been getting along. Why are we not getting long?
Speaker 2: So the question I have for you when should you
Speaker 2: give up on a relationship? I was watching this video
Speaker 2: of this cute young guy, right, he's so cute and
Speaker 2: he's talking to this therapist and he's struggling to figure
Speaker 2: out his relationship. And he asked her when should I
Speaker 2: give up on a relationship? And her response was when
Speaker 2: they're not interested in you? And he said, but what
Speaker 2: if they say they're interested in me and that they
Speaker 2: love me but don't show it, then they're not interested
Speaker 2: in you, and they don't love you, she said, because
Speaker 2: you can't believe what people say, you have to believe
Speaker 2: how they act. So behavior is a language. It is
Speaker 2: really when is it, and I know we talk about
Speaker 2: the four horsemen a lot, When is it time where
Speaker 2: you can feel like I've done everything I can and
Speaker 2: this person is just not for me. I need to
Speaker 2: let go of this person.
Speaker 1: It's usually when there's a total lack of reciprocity, so
Speaker 1: there's no emotional engagement at all. You can literally be
Speaker 1: vulnerable with this person and they will just they'll just
Speaker 1: totally disengage with you. They won't even really acknowledge your
Speaker 1: emotional like you're saying to them, you're reaching out to them,
Speaker 1: you're pursuing them, and they're they're just totally stonewalling you.
Speaker 1: We've talked about the four horsemen of the apocalypse for relationships. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so there's criticism contempt. Contempt is when you just generally
Speaker 1: look down upon your partner and you think you're better
Speaker 1: than them, and you are rolling your eyes at them,
Speaker 1: or you're just constantly just thinking about the worst in them.
Speaker 1: So there's criticism, there's contempt, there's defensiveness, where you're just
Speaker 1: constantly defensive. No matter what is said in the relationship,
Speaker 1: you're constantly defensive. And then there's stonewalling. Stonewalling is the
Speaker 1: ultimately the end of a relationships.
Speaker 2: So stonewalling is when you get no response, no response
Speaker 2: at all. You walk in and you see, you know,
Speaker 2: your husband on the phone and you say, sweetheart, we
Speaker 2: you know I did this today, I did that today,
Speaker 2: and he doesn't look up from his.
Speaker 1: Phone, doesn't look up.
Speaker 2: And that's not even like in an argument, it's just
Speaker 2: kind of his basic way of being.
Speaker 1: And he's not mad either. He's got no emotional response
Speaker 1: at all. He just doesn't look up.
Speaker 2: Okay, So if you have one or more of the
Speaker 2: four horsemen, chances are it's going to be a tough road. Yeah,
Speaker 2: to heal.
Speaker 1: Contempt is the biggest predictor of separation and divorce.
Speaker 2: And what's contempt.
Speaker 1: Contempt is really looking down upon your partner, thinking that
Speaker 1: you're better than your partner, holding them just in a
Speaker 1: in a in a belief that you're better than them,
Speaker 1: and your feelings matter more than them, and and all
Speaker 1: of that, you know they're beneath you in some way.
Speaker 2: Would contempt be and you said better than them, and
Speaker 2: oh my gosh, I'm I'm just hearing the words that
Speaker 2: you were just saying. You think you're better than your partner? Yeah,
Speaker 2: how do people get that mindset? How do how does
Speaker 2: that happen? Because if if if you're better than he,
Speaker 2: let's say, I feel like I'm better than you and
Speaker 2: we're in a relationship, how is that ever going to work?
Speaker 1: It's not. It can't. It can't because there's never a
Speaker 1: because if if one person's better than the other one,
Speaker 1: then their their needs matter more and their feelings matter more.
Speaker 1: They're they should be getting what that there's like a
Speaker 1: hierarchy in the relationship. You know, one's higher than the other.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And isn't that the eye rolling thing? Contempt
Speaker 2: is like eye rolling? So can't could it possibly be
Speaker 2: that they take turns with inferior and superior in in
Speaker 2: in in in daily life? Could he feel superior at
Speaker 2: some point and she feel inferior?
Speaker 1: Sure?
Speaker 2: Can that that can gr out?
Speaker 1: It can, but it's still contempt on both sides.
Speaker 2: Okay, so so, so contempt could be on both sides
Speaker 2: and the inferior superior show up in both sides. Yes, Okay,
Speaker 2: that is that hard to recover? That's hard to be, that's.
Speaker 1: Hard to recover from?
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, so.
Speaker 1: That would be if a couple's in my office and
Speaker 1: I'm seeing that, that is a very strong predictor that
Speaker 1: it might be time to Is.
Speaker 2: It usually one person though, that has the contempt for
Speaker 2: the other.
Speaker 1: Especially if there's been an affair or there's been some
Speaker 1: type of an attachment injury or attachment wound. Yeah, yes,
Speaker 1: Or one person's been pursuing for so long that they
Speaker 1: have finally just given up. Then then they can Oftentimes
Speaker 1: I see them stone walling and and being in contempt.
Speaker 2: And why would they be in your office in counseling.
Speaker 1: You know, some people do it just to just.
Speaker 2: To say we've tried everything.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean there could be some hope. Sometimes
Speaker 1: the other partner begs them to go just please, let's
Speaker 1: go to therapy, and then I have the very difficult
Speaker 1: job of in that case saying to them, this isn't
Speaker 1: going to work and it's current state, the relationship is over.
Speaker 1: We're going to have to recreate a new relationship, and
Speaker 1: do you all want to do that or not? And
Speaker 1: I've had it, even most recently within the past week.
Speaker 1: Both of them couldn't give me an answer right, So.
Speaker 2: So neither one of them could say we want.
Speaker 1: To work on it, right, And they're so they're in
Speaker 1: my office and I think they just need permission to
Speaker 1: say that maybe this is over.
Speaker 2: Well, we talked about how hard it is to let go. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's hard to let gown when you know that this
Speaker 2: relationship isn't working, and you know that you have put
Speaker 2: a bid in for connection and that that has fallen
Speaker 2: flat and you and you can't connect with someone because
Speaker 2: they're so defensive. They can't listen, or they're criticizing you
Speaker 2: and you can't you can't toller rate that. How can
Speaker 2: you have a connection with someone if you're constantly criticized, right,
Speaker 2: that's right. Or there's stonewalling and they're not listening or
Speaker 2: caring what you say and they're not responding to anything
Speaker 2: that you say, or they have contempt for you, right,
Speaker 2: any one of those would be hard to overcome. It
Speaker 2: would be are you seeing relationships that have all four?
Speaker 1: Yes? Yes, I do see those and and usually those
Speaker 1: relationships have been in that place for years.
Speaker 2: So is it that they're staying for the kids? Is it?
Speaker 2: Is it you know, financial is it.
Speaker 1: Both of those reasons come.
Speaker 2: Up religious because there's there's a religious thing that you know,
Speaker 2: once you marry somebody, you're not supposed to get divorced.
Speaker 2: There's there's still that happening, even though there's a high
Speaker 2: rate of divorce and society. So when you come across
Speaker 2: couples that have these issues and you can see them
Speaker 2: clearly and neither one of them want to really do
Speaker 2: the work to be able to fix it, which would
Speaker 2: take a lot of self reflection and looking in it,
Speaker 2: do you say, you guys need to go your own way.
Speaker 1: I will tell them that I will be there to
Speaker 1: help them whatever way they wanted, whichever way they want
Speaker 1: to go, but that the relationship in its current format,
Speaker 1: its current form with the four Horsemen, yeah, will not
Speaker 1: statistically won't survive.
Speaker 2: Do you ask them, would you like separate counseling? Yeah,
Speaker 2: Because we had a caller here one time on this
Speaker 2: show and he said, when we got into separate count
Speaker 2: because they got into an argument. Do you remember that
Speaker 2: they were they were on their way home and they
Speaker 2: did their first couples therapy together, and he said she
Speaker 2: was upset because she felt like the therapist was siding
Speaker 2: with him, and he was upset because she spilled out
Speaker 2: some of the things that he felt like she was
Speaker 2: tattling on him and he was embarrassed. So they decided
Speaker 2: that they would go to counseling, but separately, and they
Speaker 2: said they both had maybe four counseling sessions and they
Speaker 2: were great. They needed to get it out separately. So
Speaker 2: is that something you suggest as well?
Speaker 1: I will suggest that in collaboration with couples with a
Speaker 1: different therapist, So yes, I will suggest that they each
Speaker 1: go get their own individual therapists. They work on individual issues,
Speaker 1: and then we do couples therapy. As they're learning and
Speaker 1: growing and increasing in self awareness and self reflection, then
Speaker 1: they can come back to couples.
Speaker 2: How important is it? How important is it to maintain
Speaker 2: a level of interest in your partner?
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 2: So if you're curious and you're interested and you care,
Speaker 2: why you know, why wouldn't you show it? Because if
Speaker 2: somebody turns their back on me in a relationship, which
Speaker 2: has happened before, and I've had to deal with that,
Speaker 2: I'm like, I've tried to talk to you, I've tried
Speaker 2: to work things out, and it's not getting better. What
Speaker 2: are we doing here? Why are we? Why are we
Speaker 2: in this? And it seems like they could care, They
Speaker 2: could care less, otherwise they would work on it, couldn't
Speaker 2: Isn't it easy to just say, you know, I get it.
Speaker 2: I've been a total you know, mean whatever in the
Speaker 2: last week, and I don't know what's wrong with me.
Speaker 2: It's my fault. Let me let me get a little
Speaker 2: bit of space around what I've done and why I'm
Speaker 2: doing it, and then let's connect.
Speaker 1: That would be wonderful. I couldn't say that, But.
Speaker 2: It's easier said. Then it's easier done than said. It's
Speaker 2: not that hard to take responsibility and understand that, hey,
Speaker 2: it's me, not you. Right, Sometimes it doesn't seem like
Speaker 2: it's easy because you're admitting guilt and you think somebody
Speaker 2: might hold it against you or whatever. But just own
Speaker 2: your bad behavior and say I'm going to work on it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and what can I do better? I've already seen that
Speaker 2: I can do this, this and this. But what do
Speaker 2: you need from me that we can come back and
Speaker 2: connect a little bit.
Speaker 1: If you were in my office and you said that
Speaker 1: to your partner, we would be onto something big time. Okay,
Speaker 1: we really would be yeah, but the problem is people
Speaker 1: are so.
Speaker 2: Dug into their side.
Speaker 1: Yes.
Speaker 2: See. This goes back to why I used to value
Speaker 2: being right, and I don't value that at all anymore.
Speaker 2: I'd rather work on communication and get and because we
Speaker 2: both know Esther Pirell, the quality of your life is
Speaker 2: determined by the quality or relationships. If you're with somebody
Speaker 2: that you don't, don't love, don't even like sometimes in
Speaker 2: the house, if you're with them, you're doing something wrong.
Speaker 2: If you're just saying, oh, they're this, there's that, there's
Speaker 2: you know, that's my wife. I mean I I went
Speaker 2: to a dinner where all these guys were talking so
Speaker 2: badly about their wives, and I'm like, they have to
Speaker 2: go home and sleep in the same bed with them,
Speaker 2: Like what are they doing right? Why why are they
Speaker 2: talking so badly about their wives? And and and and
Speaker 2: then what are the wives saying about their husbands? How
Speaker 2: do you? How do you? How do you manage that?
Speaker 2: How how do you how do you stay in a lot,
Speaker 2: in a in a long term relationship and not even.
Speaker 1: Like the person not very well? I think that's what
Speaker 1: a lot of people are doing that and it's a
Speaker 1: transactional relationship and I do think it's based upon finances,
Speaker 1: it's based upon child rearing, it's based upon religious reasons.
Speaker 1: It's not based upon authentic true love anymore. And it's
Speaker 1: really sad. That's why we have the level of divorce
Speaker 1: in our country.
Speaker 2: But it can be fixed it well, if you reach
Speaker 2: out and say you mean something to me. Sometimes that's
Speaker 2: all people care about. That's right, is that, yes, you
Speaker 2: mean something to me. We've had a rocky patch. Even Brian,
Speaker 2: who's been married for thirty seven years, will say, we
Speaker 2: went through some hard times. And it's whether you're going
Speaker 2: to dig in and get and stay in that boat
Speaker 2: with that somebody that you love. You've had four kids
Speaker 2: with and they're worth it. If you just said you're
Speaker 2: worth it to me, yeah.
Speaker 1: And that's a bid for connection. I think Brian and
Speaker 1: his wife developed bids for connection, yeah, and consistently reached
Speaker 1: out yes, and that is what That's what made the
Speaker 1: difference in that relationship.
Speaker 2: I can't agree more. While we are at a time
Speaker 2: another Saturday night, Wow, it's gone by so fast, doctor Wes,
Speaker 2: thank you for being in you. You know, we have
Speaker 2: had a very surprise guest here and she has been
Speaker 2: absolutely amazing. I didn't understand how great this little girl
Speaker 2: is and how how what a deep soul she is
Speaker 2: at the age of fourteen. But you know, you have
Speaker 2: been so amazing and you should be very proud of
Speaker 2: your daughter.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me. I have so
Speaker 3: much fun.
Speaker 2: Well, we'll have you back again. We're back next Saturday.
Speaker 2: So we're going to you know, kick off December and
Speaker 2: and go through some more of this relationship stuff. We're
Speaker 2: deep diving in to figure out how we can make
Speaker 2: our own lives better through the quality of our relationships.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much. Thank you Sean McMahon for producing
Speaker 2: the show tonight. We'll be back next Saturday and have
Speaker 2: a wonderful, wonderful Sunday, everybody. Thanks again.