1 00:00:00,520 --> 00:00:06,040 Speaker 1: It's Night's Eyes with Dan Ray Umbelling Easy Boston's news radio. 2 00:00:07,760 --> 00:00:12,760 Speaker 2: Well, this is an interesting night. It appeared, it appeared 3 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 2: around this time last night that Iran was going to 4 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:19,320 Speaker 2: be under attack by the United States for four hours. 5 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,960 Speaker 2: President Trump said that for four hours, we would hit 6 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 2: bridges and we would hit infrastructure. However, at about yes 7 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 2: six point thirty tonight, a little bit after six thirty, 8 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 2: word came that the US military has decided to pause 9 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:39,520 Speaker 2: the strikes in Iran. After President Trump announced he'd agreed 10 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:44,240 Speaker 2: to a two weeks ceasefire with Tehran. Under that agreement, 11 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:48,000 Speaker 2: which was negotiated apparently by the Prime Minister of Pakistan, 12 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 2: he proposed the ceasefire to allow for diplomatic negotiations between 13 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 2: US and Iran to continue for a couple of weeks. 14 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:00,200 Speaker 2: There's a lot to unpack here, there's no doubt about that. 15 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 2: And we are delighted to be joined tonight by Professor 16 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:08,399 Speaker 2: academic dean and Professor of International Politics at the Fletcher 17 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:14,839 Speaker 2: School at Tofts University, Professor Daniel Dresner. Professor Dresner, Welcome 18 00:01:14,840 --> 00:01:18,240 Speaker 2: to Night's Side. Thank you so much for joining us, Thanks. 19 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 3: For having me. I'm glad the topic of conversation. Isn't 20 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:22,880 Speaker 3: what we were fearing it was going to be. 21 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 2: Sure, Well, first of all, I'm curious to know how 22 00:01:27,240 --> 00:01:31,880 Speaker 2: surprised at you that this went this way tonight. I mean, 23 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:36,759 Speaker 2: it was it was brinksmanship up until the up until 24 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 2: about six thirty when the word actually was announced during 25 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:42,959 Speaker 2: the six thirty national newscasts. 26 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 3: I mean, I'm not terribly surprised. I'm a little surprised, 27 00:01:48,520 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 3: but you know, in the sense that the Iranians were 28 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 3: actually willing to consider a short term ceasefire. My understanding 29 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:59,160 Speaker 3: had been that they had communicated with the Trump ministration 30 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 3: that unless there was a permanent cessation of hostilities, they 31 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 3: were uninterested in any talks. But the fact that they 32 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,120 Speaker 3: were willing to go for two weeks, I suppose there's 33 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:12,480 Speaker 3: a promising sign. Although I'd have a whole bunch of 34 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:16,800 Speaker 3: questions about the details of this cease fire, the most 35 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 3: obvious of which is, you know, in the statements that 36 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 3: I've seen, the obvious question is how do ships get 37 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 3: out of the straight of horror moves? And do they 38 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:26,920 Speaker 3: need to pay the Iranians anything to get out? 39 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:29,640 Speaker 2: The Iranians have been talking about a million dollars a 40 00:02:29,680 --> 00:02:33,120 Speaker 2: ship or something like that. Well, here, let me just 41 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:37,440 Speaker 2: ask you this question, what leverage did the Iranians have here? 42 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:41,679 Speaker 2: I know that there's been a lot of misinformation back 43 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 2: and forth in the last five weeks, but it seemed 44 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 2: to me that they don't have much to deal with 45 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:51,519 Speaker 2: at this point other than the straight of Horn moves. 46 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:54,959 Speaker 3: I would say the Iranians had two sources of leverage, 47 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 3: the first being the straight of horror moves. And indeed, 48 00:02:57,520 --> 00:02:59,840 Speaker 3: the fact that you can argue that, you know, the 49 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 3: Iranian navy has been pretty much obliterated and there's been 50 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 3: severe damage to the Iranian military. The fact that the 51 00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:10,600 Speaker 3: Iranians were still able to essentially control that waterway, you know, 52 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:13,760 Speaker 3: suggested that it was we would have taken an overwhelming 53 00:03:13,800 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 3: amount of US force to change that. So that was 54 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:19,760 Speaker 3: one source of leverage. The other source of leverage is 55 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 3: all of Iran's remaining missiles. Intelligence reports that suggested that 56 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 3: Iranians were able to rebuild some of their missile industrial complex. 57 00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:31,640 Speaker 3: They also, you know, at least claimed the negotiations to 58 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 3: have an order of twenty five thousand missiles remaining. That 59 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,440 Speaker 3: is likely a lot of bomb bast but one of 60 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 3: the trends over the you know, in the war, had 61 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:44,640 Speaker 3: been that while the Defense Department had bragged about the 62 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:48,280 Speaker 3: reduced number of missiles that Iran had launched, what they 63 00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 3: failed to mention was that Iran's missile launchers were getting 64 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 3: more and more accurate. So what was happening was that 65 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 3: it was that Iran was still able to exact damage, 66 00:03:58,760 --> 00:04:02,440 Speaker 3: but in a much more efficient way. And so Iran 67 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 3: had no compunction whatsoever about attacking civilian areas both in 68 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:10,920 Speaker 3: the Persian Gulf and in Israel. And this obviously raised 69 00:04:10,920 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 3: the cost of the war for the US and its allies. 70 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 2: So so let me ask you a tough question, and 71 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 2: this is probably it's it's a fair question. We have 72 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:27,080 Speaker 2: we have two countries, the United States, with all our flaws, 73 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:31,160 Speaker 2: and it seems like that in many parts of the world, 74 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 2: including the the US capital of the on the democratic side, 75 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 2: we had depict it as the bad guy. Here. We 76 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 2: don't mow down thousands of people in the streets. We 77 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:53,360 Speaker 2: have not tried to develop nuclear weapons with the world 78 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 2: looking at us and saying that we don't. We don't 79 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 2: want you to develop nuclear weapons. We don't throw gay 80 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 2: people off buildings in America, there are crimes committed against 81 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 2: gay people, but not by the government, by individuals for certain. 82 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 2: How is it that we are in the minds of 83 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:13,320 Speaker 2: some people around the world, not just our enemies Russia 84 00:05:13,320 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 2: and China, but other parts of the other places in 85 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 2: the world. It's almost as if we're the bad guy 86 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 2: in the and the Iranian this theocratic dictatorship which imposes, encourages, 87 00:05:27,440 --> 00:05:31,480 Speaker 2: you know, women, all the things that they do. How 88 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 2: do we end up the bad guy in this situation? 89 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 3: Do you know what the price of gas is in 90 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:37,000 Speaker 3: New Zealand right now? 91 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:44,039 Speaker 2: Dan? The price of what gas? Death? I would say, 92 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 2: probably saying something that's critical of the government. That's what 93 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 2: that nineteen year old wrestler found out, right. 94 00:05:51,360 --> 00:05:53,720 Speaker 3: Sorry, my point is the price of gasoline? 95 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 2: Oh a gasoline. I'm sorry, I thought I misheard you. 96 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 2: I apologize. I thought you said the price of death. 97 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 3: No, no, note, okay, price of gasoline in New Zealand 98 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,800 Speaker 3: is approximately, when you add the exchange rate, thirteen dollars. 99 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:07,279 Speaker 4: A gallon right now? 100 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:07,720 Speaker 2: Okay. 101 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 3: One of the things that has been gone unnoticed is 102 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,960 Speaker 3: that while gas prices have risen in the United States, 103 00:06:14,440 --> 00:06:19,440 Speaker 3: they have risen dramatically more across most of the Asia Pacific, 104 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 3: not to mention Europe. Okay, And so you're wondering, why 105 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:26,920 Speaker 3: is the US, you know, seen as an instigator of this. 106 00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:28,880 Speaker 3: There's a couple of things going on. The first or 107 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 3: seen as a bad guy. First of all, you know, again, 108 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 3: it is the US that launched this round of attacks 109 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:38,120 Speaker 3: in concert with Israel on February twenty eighth, despite the 110 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 3: fact that negotiations were ongoing. Second, as a result of 111 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 3: all these attacks, everyone else's energy prices have shot through 112 00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:49,160 Speaker 3: the roof. You're seeing gas rationing, you know, across the 113 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:52,279 Speaker 3: Asia Pacific. And this is something that they don't have 114 00:06:52,279 --> 00:06:54,880 Speaker 3: any control over. And while yet it is a rom 115 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:57,960 Speaker 3: that is absolutely shut, the you know, has the stranglehold. 116 00:06:57,480 --> 00:06:59,480 Speaker 2: Over the straight up form moves exactly. 117 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:02,279 Speaker 3: The obvious perceptions. They have done that in response to 118 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,719 Speaker 3: you know, US attacks. And while you point out that 119 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 3: that it is true that the US does not mow 120 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:11,400 Speaker 3: down tens of thousands of people, the Trump administration has 121 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:15,400 Speaker 3: taken great delight in the devastation that it is wrought 122 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:19,120 Speaker 3: in Iran has refused to apologize for the you know, 123 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 3: school that had bombed accidentally that killed over one hundred 124 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 3: and twenty people, and you have tweets from you know, 125 00:07:26,440 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 3: the President of the United States promising the death of 126 00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:32,800 Speaker 3: a civilization, which is, just to be very clear about this, 127 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 3: a war crime if it was actually carried out. So, 128 00:07:35,920 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 3: while I in no way wanted to defend the Iranian regime, 129 00:07:40,960 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 3: you have a US administration that seems not just to 130 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:48,880 Speaker 3: be interested in the destruction of Iran, but also is 131 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 3: sort of exulting in disregarding the laws of armed conflict. 132 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 2: Well, there's a number of number of points and that 133 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:03,200 Speaker 2: I'd like to address. First of all, that school was 134 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 2: located next to an I r G headquarters uh. And 135 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:11,880 Speaker 2: I suspect that a lot of the locations, as we 136 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:15,760 Speaker 2: found out in Gaza were located. You know that that 137 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:22,400 Speaker 2: hamas had located there, uh, their underground tunnels under hospitals 138 00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 2: and schools. And I have I don't think for a 139 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:30,760 Speaker 2: moment that we would have hit a school with any intentionality, 140 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:32,000 Speaker 2: And I'm sure you don't. 141 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 3: No, No, You're absolutely right. I don't think we hit 142 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:37,520 Speaker 3: with any intentionality. Nonetheless, we hit it, yes, and you 143 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 3: had a president that claimed no, we think Iran did 144 00:08:40,280 --> 00:08:43,920 Speaker 3: it and has not acknowledged in some sense culpability, even 145 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:47,520 Speaker 3: though Defense Department finally determined that it was the United 146 00:08:47,559 --> 00:08:51,240 Speaker 3: States that in fact did it. But again you also 147 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:53,800 Speaker 3: have the rhetoric from the administration making it clear, and 148 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:55,640 Speaker 3: this has been you know, true for the last couple 149 00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:59,199 Speaker 3: of days now that as far as the trum administration 150 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 3: was concerned, attacks on civilian infrastructure were perfectly valid, which 151 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:06,880 Speaker 3: again is undeniably a violation of the laws of war, 152 00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 3: not just violations of international law, violations of US law. 153 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:18,880 Speaker 2: If if the institute installations that are under attack have 154 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 2: a duality of purpose, I suspect that an argument can 155 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 2: be made that they are hitting those locations, and I 156 00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 2: think you'd have to look at each one of them. 157 00:09:31,840 --> 00:09:35,679 Speaker 2: I don't see why bridges could not be hit. Is 158 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 2: that a violation of international law? 159 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, if it's a bridge that you know is primarily 160 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:45,719 Speaker 3: used for civilian traffic as opposed to military traffic, well 161 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,840 Speaker 3: then I guess hold on agreement it this way. Do 162 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 3: you think that Russia is violating the laws of war 163 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:56,679 Speaker 3: when they are bombing Ukrainian you know, the Ukrainian energy infrastructure? 164 00:09:56,760 --> 00:09:57,360 Speaker 2: Absolutely? 165 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 3: Okay, then how is what the US would be proposing 166 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:02,520 Speaker 3: to do in Iran any different. 167 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:05,360 Speaker 2: Well, because I think I think we have a tradition 168 00:10:06,120 --> 00:10:09,760 Speaker 2: and we have a track record. Putin will basically do 169 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 2: whatever he has to do. He will hit you know, 170 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:16,679 Speaker 2: civic centers, he will hit intentionally, hospitals, He'll he'll hit 171 00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:19,679 Speaker 2: schools intentionally. I mean, that is what Putin does, and 172 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:22,840 Speaker 2: that is what the Russians. Russians have done, and part 173 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:25,000 Speaker 2: of that is in the culture of Russian they have 174 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 2: always wanted to defend Mother Russia at all costs. I'm 175 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:32,480 Speaker 2: sure you you understand that mindset that they that they have. 176 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:35,960 Speaker 2: But I don't think there's any comparison between what the 177 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:39,120 Speaker 2: US would and wouldn't do with Iran. The goal in 178 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:42,079 Speaker 2: Iran is to is to take them off the nuclear 179 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:46,240 Speaker 2: stage as a as as someone who has nuclear weapons. 180 00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 2: I see that as a wonderful goal. 181 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 3: Sure, that is a wonderful goal. But the laws of 182 00:10:51,160 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 3: war are not just about what the goals are. The 183 00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 3: laws of war also dictate how you fight the war. Yeah, 184 00:10:56,840 --> 00:11:00,640 Speaker 3: and if you're fighting the war by essentially weak mass 185 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:05,080 Speaker 3: carnage on civilians with a minimal or negligible effect on 186 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:07,959 Speaker 3: the military, then yeah, you're committing a war crime. 187 00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 2: I think that the numbers that I have seen in 188 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 2: terms of civilians that have been killed in Iran is 189 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 2: somewhere in the low one low hundreds, like two hundred 190 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 2: and fifty people they're claiming have been killed. I'm sure 191 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:26,160 Speaker 2: you have seen those similar figures. 192 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:27,480 Speaker 3: Right, And to be clear, by the way, what I'm 193 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:29,880 Speaker 3: referring to is the threats that the administration was making 194 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:33,280 Speaker 3: about what was going to happen tonight if there. 195 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:35,679 Speaker 2: No I understand, No, I do totally. I totally get that. 196 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 2: I think that he was trying to and again I'm 197 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,120 Speaker 2: not just for the record, I am not a fan 198 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 2: of Donald Trump per se, but I think he was 199 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 2: using that as an effort to force them to come 200 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:55,720 Speaker 2: to come to reality, and that is that that their 201 00:11:55,800 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 2: their navy is gone, their air force has gone. I 202 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 2: guess they do have some rpges as they utilized over 203 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:05,959 Speaker 2: the weekend on that one f fifteen, but that does 204 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 2: not a defense department make. Yeah. I have the numbers 205 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 2: here somewhere, and I think that there are some Israeli 206 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 2: casualties in the below one hundred. And I think that Iran, 207 00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 2: at least what I'm seeing at what I would consider 208 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 2: to be reputable news sources. The numbers are somewhere in 209 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:28,800 Speaker 2: like the two hundred and fifties, and that would include 210 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:32,000 Speaker 2: the number of girls that were sadly killed at that 211 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 2: strike on the school. Can we take a quick break 212 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:36,560 Speaker 2: and we'll come right back at just going to take 213 00:12:36,559 --> 00:12:39,360 Speaker 2: a commercial, And I'd like to ask you where we 214 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:43,000 Speaker 2: go from here? How optimistic are you that this two 215 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:49,040 Speaker 2: week ceasefire might actually result in what all of us 216 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:52,320 Speaker 2: would hope for, and that is the ultimate cessation of 217 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:58,080 Speaker 2: hostilities and the denuclearization of the government of Iran. Is 218 00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 2: that okay with you? Will be right back perfect. My 219 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 2: guest is Professor Daniel He's an academic dean and Professor 220 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,640 Speaker 2: Daniel Dresner, professor of International Politics at the Fletcher School 221 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 2: at Tufts University. Back on Nightside right after this. 222 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 1: It's Nightside with Boston's News Radio. 223 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:22,080 Speaker 2: My guest is Professor Daniel Dresner. He is a professor 224 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,320 Speaker 2: of international politics at the Fletcher School at Toughs University. 225 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:29,440 Speaker 2: I just wanted to update, so I'm correct, Professor, if 226 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 2: it's okay with you. According to al Jazira, who's using 227 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 2: statistics from the Iran Health Ministry as of I think 228 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,760 Speaker 2: earlier this week the number of those killed in Iran 229 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 2: is two thousand and seventy six killed, and I would 230 00:13:46,960 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 2: argue that in view of the amount of ordinance that 231 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:53,040 Speaker 2: we have dropped, we have been very careful. I would 232 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 2: suspect that the vast majority of those individuals are either 233 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 2: Iranian leadership or Iranian military. For the amount of ordinance 234 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 2: would drop, that's an incredibly I think small amount. There 235 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 2: have been fourteen hundred and ninety seven people killed in Lebanon, 236 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:12,120 Speaker 2: and that's mostly big ben the Israeli military. So I 237 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:18,560 Speaker 2: just think that we've been fairly, very careful, and we 238 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:22,360 Speaker 2: have hit military targets and obviously a lot of those 239 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 2: naval ships, I've had Iranian military personnel who were killed. 240 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:34,040 Speaker 2: I just think that we've been very careful in terms 241 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:36,280 Speaker 2: of what we have done here in terms of the 242 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 2: numbers who have died, and I'm happy about that, and 243 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 2: I'm sure you are as well. Where do we go 244 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,160 Speaker 2: from here? Where do you think this takes us two weeks? 245 00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:47,680 Speaker 2: Do we come back two weeks from now with another 246 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 2: situation like this? Or are you hopeful that maybe somehow, 247 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,040 Speaker 2: some way an agreement can be reached Where Iran would 248 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 2: agree that they will not pursue a nuclear bomb. 249 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 3: I'm not even sure the ceasefire is going to last 250 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 3: two weeks, to be honest. I mean, my understanding is 251 00:15:04,120 --> 00:15:06,920 Speaker 3: we've just received a report from the Associated Press which 252 00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 3: was that the Trump I think a Trump's spokesman. You know, obviously, 253 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:13,800 Speaker 3: if the US and Iran announced the ceasefire but Israel 254 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 3: continued to attack Iran, that doesn't really count as a ceasefire. 255 00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:21,320 Speaker 3: The Trump administration, I believe, said that Israel had agreed 256 00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:23,400 Speaker 3: to do this, but I've just seen an AP report 257 00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 3: suggesting that Israel is continuing to attack Irn. So and indeed, 258 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:31,120 Speaker 3: as this announcement of the ceasefire was going on, there 259 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,840 Speaker 3: have been reports of you know, missile attacks or attacks 260 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:37,160 Speaker 3: in the Gulf as well, So I. 261 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:40,200 Speaker 2: Believe I think, by the way, if what you're saying 262 00:15:40,240 --> 00:15:44,000 Speaker 2: is I think Ron after the ceasefire was announced, fired 263 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 2: one in on Israel because Israel, I guess, is not 264 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:51,120 Speaker 2: a participant at least as of now, to this ceasefire, 265 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 2: and Iran wanted to make that point, right. 266 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 3: So the point is that if Israel continues to attack Iran, 267 00:15:57,440 --> 00:15:59,560 Speaker 3: and then Iran continues to attack Israel. I'm not sure 268 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 3: how much of his ceasefire this really is, except with 269 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:05,760 Speaker 3: respect to the Strait of Horn moves. And then, as 270 00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:10,000 Speaker 3: I said, with respect to that, there's also a question, 271 00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 3: I mean, and in a statement that I think even 272 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:16,320 Speaker 3: Trump retweeted from the Iranian foreign minister, the question is 273 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 3: just how much cooperation with the Iranian armed forces is 274 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 3: going to have to be necessary to get ships out. So, 275 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 3: first of all, it'll be interesting to see whether this 276 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 3: even last two weeks. I mean, bear in mind the 277 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:31,680 Speaker 3: number of times ceasefires were announced between Israel and Hamas 278 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 3: and the war in Gaza, and how many times you 279 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 3: nonetheless saw hostilities break out again. But let's be optimistic 280 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:41,880 Speaker 3: and say that roughly speaking, it holds, or that Israel 281 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 3: comes on. The question then, is is there a longer 282 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:49,880 Speaker 3: term agreement that would allow everyone to walk away thinking 283 00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 3: that they won. And this is where I'm not entirely 284 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 3: sure that's the case, in part because for the Trump 285 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 3: administration to declare victory, they would have to, you know, 286 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:05,479 Speaker 3: meet their initial goals, which were, you know, ensuring that 287 00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:10,600 Speaker 3: Iran never builds a nuclear weapon, you know, uh, destroying 288 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 3: or claiming that their missile capacity has been destroyed, and 289 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:16,399 Speaker 3: also making sure, by the way, that the Straight of 290 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:19,600 Speaker 3: Horn Moves, you know, remains an open waterway, because that 291 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 3: wasn't something they certainly wanted to start of this war. 292 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 3: It's not obvious to me that Iran is willing to 293 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:27,919 Speaker 3: is going to be willing to agree to those terms. 294 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 3: They might be able to say, you know, the missiles 295 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:36,040 Speaker 3: are are they can even claim that they'll they'll freeze that. 296 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:39,800 Speaker 3: They've been very consistent in saying we are not going 297 00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:42,760 Speaker 3: to give up the nuclear program because they argue that 298 00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:45,920 Speaker 3: it's a point of national pride. Maybe they could agree 299 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:48,879 Speaker 3: to a moratorium on it for something like, you know, 300 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:50,560 Speaker 3: for a couple of years, and that might be one 301 00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:53,960 Speaker 3: way that it would finesse it. And I don't know 302 00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:55,639 Speaker 3: what they're going to do about the Straight of Horn Moves. 303 00:17:56,200 --> 00:18:00,199 Speaker 3: For the Iranian regime, their ultimate goal here is not 304 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:05,360 Speaker 3: necessarily victory. Their goal is survival. And by the way, 305 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 3: that's another reason why you have to wonder whether the 306 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:10,720 Speaker 3: ceasefire will hold. Part of the reason the Iranians have 307 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:14,360 Speaker 3: persisted as they have is that after the June bombings 308 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:17,239 Speaker 3: of last year, the Iranians have basically sort of you know, 309 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:21,199 Speaker 3: prepared to decentralize their chain of command in case you 310 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:24,280 Speaker 3: had a decapitation strike like the one that happened at 311 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:26,280 Speaker 3: the very start of the war. So it's possible that 312 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:28,919 Speaker 3: even if the Iranian leadership thinks as a ceasefire, that 313 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 3: has to trickle down to the people that actually are 314 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:35,080 Speaker 3: able to fire the missiles. So I mean, in a 315 00:18:35,119 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 3: weird way, the decapitation strike, did you know, probably has 316 00:18:39,680 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 3: made more difficult for the Iranian regime to prosecute the war, 317 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:44,920 Speaker 3: but it will also make it more difficult for the 318 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:46,879 Speaker 3: Iranian regime to agree to a ceasefire. 319 00:18:47,480 --> 00:18:47,720 Speaker 5: Yeah. 320 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:51,000 Speaker 2: I have no idea who the US is able to 321 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:53,400 Speaker 2: deal with, or who Pakistan is able to deal with, 322 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:57,120 Speaker 2: and whether or not whoever they're dealing with actually can 323 00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 2: speak on behalf of the the Revolutionary Guard and or 324 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:07,480 Speaker 2: anyone in Iran, which is which is very difficult. There's 325 00:19:07,480 --> 00:19:09,640 Speaker 2: a there's a big piece in the New York Times 326 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 2: this afternoon. Yeah, I cleared about about six o'clock that 327 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,359 Speaker 2: when it cleared, and it was interesting that they said 328 00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:21,200 Speaker 2: that the one person in the administration who was opposed 329 00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:25,480 Speaker 2: to the action was the vice president and he may 330 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:30,040 Speaker 2: he may join the negotiations in Islamabad on Friday, according 331 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:31,280 Speaker 2: to some reports. 332 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,640 Speaker 3: Right, I mean I would when you read a long 333 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:36,320 Speaker 3: story like that, it's not that I want to say 334 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:39,680 Speaker 3: it's good accurate, but bear in mind which sources were 335 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:43,240 Speaker 3: talking to the reporters. In other words, I no doubt 336 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:46,200 Speaker 3: that JD. Vance was a source for that story, because 337 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 3: he came out of it looking reasonably good, uh, saying 338 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 3: with Marco Rubio. On the other hand, I'm also quite 339 00:19:51,359 --> 00:19:53,400 Speaker 3: certain Pete Hegseth didn't talk to The Times at all. 340 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say that, but the Times generally. Yeah, again, 341 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 2: if the Times it's not right what they're. 342 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,480 Speaker 3: Told, yes, absolutely, I'm not. I don't mean to imply 343 00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:07,320 Speaker 3: that the report is inaccurate. It's more sort of the slant, 344 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:09,880 Speaker 3: you know, the the shading on the margins in terms 345 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:13,639 Speaker 3: of this, And yeah, I mean, you know, it suggests that, 346 00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 3: among other things, that it was you know, Net and 347 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:20,119 Speaker 3: Yahoo that persuaded Trump that that a war in Iran 348 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 3: would would be quick and easy. Frankly, because it was 349 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 3: clear that Trump was told that one of the possible 350 00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:27,920 Speaker 3: Iranian responses was be to close the straight up Horn News. 351 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,879 Speaker 3: And I believe the report suggested that Trump thought that 352 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 3: the war wouldn't last that long and so it wouldn't 353 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:33,360 Speaker 3: be a problem. 354 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:36,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, he's still within his four to six weeks here, 355 00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 2: but I think it I think if it does resume, 356 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 2: it's gonna it's going to go longer than that. Hopefully 357 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:48,120 Speaker 2: this can be resolved. I still think, and I don't 358 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:50,439 Speaker 2: know if you would join me in this, that it 359 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:56,080 Speaker 2: is really important to the world that this theocratic dictatorship 360 00:20:56,800 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 2: UH not ever have the opportunity to secure and use 361 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:04,720 Speaker 2: nuclear weapons. And that is why I think it is 362 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:08,919 Speaker 2: such an important moment in history. And I hope you 363 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:11,280 Speaker 2: joined me in that. We might disagree with the margins, 364 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,480 Speaker 2: but I hope you would agree with me that that 365 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:17,520 Speaker 2: that goal is one that that is laudable. 366 00:21:18,560 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 3: I certainly think it's a laudable goal. I am questioned 367 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:26,439 Speaker 3: the price that is being paid to even potentially achieve 368 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:28,159 Speaker 3: that goal. And by the way, it's not clear to 369 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 3: me now that that goal has been is any closer 370 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,680 Speaker 3: to completion than it was at the start of this war. 371 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:42,800 Speaker 2: Well, I think that I'll disagree with you that's that one. 372 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 3: I mean, unless there is a secret strike that I'm 373 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 3: aware of, in which the US recovered all of Iran's 374 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,800 Speaker 3: facile material, or you have evidence that Iran's you know, 375 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,879 Speaker 3: nuclear machinery has been further destroyed. The fact is Iran 376 00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:01,240 Speaker 3: still has uranium that is highly enriched and they bragged 377 00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,080 Speaker 3: about it. Yeah, and presumably still as the technical know 378 00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 3: how that if they want to convert those into weapons, 379 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 3: it is possible, and they obviously have the missile technology 380 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:11,600 Speaker 3: to be able to deliver it where they'd want to. 381 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:15,959 Speaker 3: So it's far from obvious to me that Iran's nuclear 382 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,920 Speaker 3: capabilities have been any way set back by the current war. 383 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:23,119 Speaker 3: To be sure, that June bombing certainly did that to 384 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:26,119 Speaker 3: some extent. But by doing that in the June bombing 385 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,959 Speaker 3: is you've locked into a strategy where you have to 386 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 3: repeatedly bomb the Iranians in order to try to set 387 00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:36,200 Speaker 3: back any further developments they have in this area. Just 388 00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:38,040 Speaker 3: as I'm not sure that's the productive strategy. 389 00:22:38,119 --> 00:22:41,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, just as I think the February twenty eighth March 390 00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:45,919 Speaker 2: first bombing and taking out their leadership, although it sounded 391 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:50,200 Speaker 2: great at the time, maybe prevented us figuring out who 392 00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:53,720 Speaker 2: to deal with. I think that what happened in June, 393 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:59,080 Speaker 2: that that physible material all, you know, one thousand pounds 394 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,919 Speaker 2: of it, four hundred and four kilograms buried deep inside 395 00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 2: on that mountain. And I don't know if that would 396 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 2: be accessible for us, all of the IR audience, but 397 00:23:09,560 --> 00:23:12,320 Speaker 2: we'll see, we'll see. Professor. I really enjoyed the conversation. 398 00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:15,240 Speaker 2: It was fun and I'd love to get you to 399 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 2: come back. Thank you very much for joining us tonight. 400 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:22,439 Speaker 2: You were at a great school at Tufts, and the 401 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:26,199 Speaker 2: Fletcher School has such a great reputation. I checked you 402 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 2: out tonight and you're a Williams College guy as an 403 00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:31,440 Speaker 2: undergraduate and a Stanford guy for you doctorate. So it's 404 00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:34,640 Speaker 2: always great to have someone from Williams on the program. 405 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:35,440 Speaker 2: Thank you so much. 406 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:36,800 Speaker 3: Oh, thank you very much. 407 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 2: Goeyes Absolutely all right, thanks again, Professor, Professor Daniel Dresner, 408 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,360 Speaker 2: Academic Dean and Professor of International Politics at the Fletcher 409 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 2: School at Tufts University. Okay, you've heard what the professor 410 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:56,159 Speaker 2: had to say. You know that what many people feared 411 00:23:56,160 --> 00:24:00,440 Speaker 2: would be going on at this very hour has been down, 412 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,399 Speaker 2: which I think is a good thing. Donald Trump is 413 00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 2: going to be Donald Trump. There's no question about that. 414 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:12,400 Speaker 2: There were people today who were calling for his impeachment. 415 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:17,119 Speaker 2: I don't know why. At least it doesn't appear to 416 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 2: me that that call is a serious call. Others calling 417 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,680 Speaker 2: for the twenty fifth Amendment, I don't know if those 418 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:27,800 Speaker 2: people understand how the twenty fifth Amendment works, because you 419 00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:32,080 Speaker 2: need the Cabinet of the president to basically go to 420 00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 2: the vice president say we got to pull the string 421 00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:39,240 Speaker 2: on this guy again. I think it's I think the 422 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,040 Speaker 2: average American doesn't understand the twenty fifth Amendment, and a 423 00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:44,119 Speaker 2: lot of the Democrats who are talking about the twenty 424 00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:47,600 Speaker 2: fifth Amendment are counting on that. I want to open 425 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 2: up the phone lines. I think that this ceasefire is 426 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 2: probably a good thing because they now know, the Iranians 427 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:03,560 Speaker 2: now know that President Trump was close to doing what 428 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:09,160 Speaker 2: he said he would do. I have strong feelings on this. 429 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 2: My strong feelings on this are based in large part 430 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,399 Speaker 2: on the fact that Iran should never have a nuclear weapon. 431 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:23,879 Speaker 2: At least this leadership of Iran, this theocratic, autocratic dictatorship, 432 00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:27,760 Speaker 2: should never have a nuclear weapon because if they ever 433 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 2: secured a nuclear weapon, they would pop one in on 434 00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,560 Speaker 2: their neighbor and not think two seconds about it. Going 435 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:36,840 Speaker 2: to take a break, I'm going to open up the 436 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 2: phone lines six one, seven, two, five, four ten thirty, 437 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:42,960 Speaker 2: six one seven, nine, three one ten thirty. Are you 438 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,840 Speaker 2: surprised it's a ceasefire tonight? Are you happy it's a 439 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:48,800 Speaker 2: ceasefire tonight? Do you think it is a smart move 440 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,639 Speaker 2: for the United States to agree to a cease fire tonight? 441 00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:55,359 Speaker 2: I'll answer all of those questions as a yes, yes, 442 00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 2: and yes. I'm surprised, I'm happy, and I think it 443 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 2: was a good move. That doesn't mean that it can't 444 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 2: can't be if Iron doesn't follow through on this, the 445 00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 2: hostilities can be resumed. Six one, seven, two, five, four, 446 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,840 Speaker 2: ten thirty, six one seven, nine three thirty. I would 447 00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:16,520 Speaker 2: love to hear from some new callers tonight. You just 448 00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 2: heard a fairly i think lively exchange with Professor Daniel Dresner. 449 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 2: I think he made his position very clear, and I 450 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:27,800 Speaker 2: think I made my position clear. Now it's up to 451 00:26:27,840 --> 00:26:30,520 Speaker 2: you to make your position clear. Coming back on Nightside, 452 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:32,880 Speaker 2: We're going to talk about this, probably all the way 453 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 2: to midnight. I'd love to talk with you coming back 454 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 2: on nightside. 455 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:41,639 Speaker 1: You're on Nightside with Dan Ray on w z Boston's 456 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:42,320 Speaker 1: news radio. 457 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 2: One factor that I want you to be aware of 458 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:51,680 Speaker 2: is that the stock market, the futures market, which indicates 459 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:54,000 Speaker 2: where the market is likely to open in the morning, 460 00:26:55,440 --> 00:27:00,400 Speaker 2: likes the ceasefire. The NOW futures is up over nine 461 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,200 Speaker 2: hundred points, that's nearly two percent. The S and P 462 00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:05,920 Speaker 2: futures are up one hundred and forty four points that's 463 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 2: over two percent, and the Nasdaq futures are up seven 464 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:12,320 Speaker 2: hundred and one points, that is close to three percent. 465 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 2: If those numbers hold, and I suspect they will, the 466 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:23,440 Speaker 2: stock market likes the ceasefire. First up tonight, Steve and Cambridge. Steve, welcome, 467 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:24,920 Speaker 2: Thanks very much for checking in. 468 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:26,080 Speaker 5: Dan. 469 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:28,359 Speaker 4: That was a very interesting conversation you had. 470 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:30,919 Speaker 2: Yes it was. It was a little lively, but I 471 00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:31,960 Speaker 2: liked it. I really did. 472 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:33,760 Speaker 5: Dan. 473 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,720 Speaker 4: There's a couple I have three points or questions. I 474 00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 4: guess the first one is I think when Iran moved 475 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:49,439 Speaker 4: a lot of civilians around power stations, and from what 476 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:55,560 Speaker 4: I understand, they moved them around bridges, I think that 477 00:27:56,400 --> 00:28:03,119 Speaker 4: kind of ended Trump's option of bombing those locations. 478 00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:06,639 Speaker 2: Yeah, by the way, mostly women and children. It looked 479 00:28:06,640 --> 00:28:09,120 Speaker 2: like the men. There was a there were a few 480 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:14,000 Speaker 2: men who were watching and they were directing the women 481 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:19,720 Speaker 2: who were dressed in full garb from head to toe, right. Uh. 482 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:24,320 Speaker 4: And whether or not it's despicable or not. The question 483 00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:27,879 Speaker 4: is I think that removed Trump's option from doing that, 484 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:30,920 Speaker 4: from bombing those locations. 485 00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, that that's a move that they that that the 486 00:28:34,040 --> 00:28:42,720 Speaker 2: Iranian government made, But they still apparently have agreed with 487 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:47,840 Speaker 2: you know, the Pakistani Prime minister that they will open 488 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,920 Speaker 2: up the Strait of Hormus. So I mean the seeing 489 00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 2: seeing is believing trust, but verify, right. 490 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 4: You mean the fact that they're supposedly opening up the 491 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 4: Strait of her Moos. Yes, Oh okay, I mean I 492 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 4: think that's great. I think that's wonderful. 493 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:06,400 Speaker 2: Well, that's what that's what the stock market, I think 494 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:09,160 Speaker 2: is responding to. I mean, I hope that there's I 495 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,960 Speaker 2: hope that the people that the Trump administration is dealing 496 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 2: with actually represent the people of Iran, and and and 497 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:23,880 Speaker 2: you know, and and have are somewhat rational. I why 498 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 2: why would they Why would they want their infrastructure and 499 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 2: their bridges to be taken out? They that would put 500 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:34,920 Speaker 2: them back one hundred years, As the President said last night. 501 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:36,440 Speaker 4: Well, I mean, I you know, I think if you 502 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:39,800 Speaker 4: move your civilian population. As despicable as that may be 503 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:46,400 Speaker 4: around these infrastructure, that kind of cancels Trump's option. He 504 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 4: cannot kill that many civilians. 505 00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:51,920 Speaker 2: Right, and nor do I think it's his intention. As 506 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 2: I said, according to El Jazeera, and according they're using 507 00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 2: as their source, I'm not using an American source here. 508 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:03,520 Speaker 2: Al Jazeera is quoting the Iranian Health Agency is saying 509 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 2: two thousand and seventy six Iranians have lost their lives. 510 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 2: I think that's an incredibly small number for the amount 511 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 2: of ordnance. That's glad to. 512 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:13,400 Speaker 4: Hear that it's as low as that. Yes, I am 513 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 4: definitely glad. 514 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 2: To hear it, and I think the vast majority of 515 00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 2: them would be Iranian military. Are you're talking about what 516 00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 2: it's I think the number they said it was one 517 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:26,560 Speaker 2: hundred and fifty ships naval vessels that have been sunk, 518 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:30,520 Speaker 2: so I would hope, and in military there have been 519 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,560 Speaker 2: military bases that have been hit. I would hope. It 520 00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 2: would be wonderful to think that there are no civilians. Obviously, 521 00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:40,240 Speaker 2: that girls' school that was hit, which I believe was 522 00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:48,280 Speaker 2: close to an IRG headquarters, is tragic, But you know, 523 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:55,560 Speaker 2: did we break the rules of war by bombing Dresden 524 00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 2: at the end of World War Two. 525 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,560 Speaker 4: Well, I don't know. Those are all questions that I 526 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:04,840 Speaker 4: think are interesting, but I don't know how. I don't 527 00:31:04,880 --> 00:31:08,880 Speaker 4: really understand a lot about the so called rules of 528 00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:13,160 Speaker 4: war and so called international law. But Dan, one other 529 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:17,200 Speaker 4: problem I think with this whole effort on the part 530 00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 4: of Trump, which I think is very good, I mean, 531 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 4: I support Trump in many ways, I certainly don't support 532 00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:30,240 Speaker 4: his I've never supported the way he expresses himself. He 533 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 4: does his country and himself a real disservice by this 534 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:40,239 Speaker 4: hyperbolic and crude and what was the other you know, 535 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:45,920 Speaker 4: these way he expresses himself towards his opponents, towards everything. 536 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,120 Speaker 4: But that aside, Dan, One problem I have here, and 537 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:50,760 Speaker 4: this is a serious problem I think, and I like 538 00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 4: your opinion on this. How can we ever really be 539 00:31:55,560 --> 00:32:00,600 Speaker 4: sure that Iran doesn't develop a nuclear weapon unless we 540 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:01,800 Speaker 4: occupy the country? 541 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:05,280 Speaker 2: I think the only way that we're not going to 542 00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:10,160 Speaker 2: occupy the country, that's that's unrealistic. I know you realize that. 543 00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 2: I think that if there is a change in leadership, 544 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:17,480 Speaker 2: you can call it regime change and call it a 545 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:21,200 Speaker 2: change of leadership, And we say to them, look, you know, 546 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:23,040 Speaker 2: we want you to be honest with us. I mean, 547 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:27,640 Speaker 2: they were negotiations between Iran and other administrations, including the 548 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:32,280 Speaker 2: Obama administration. They thought that Iran had stopped doing what 549 00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 2: we didn't want them to do, and yet they didn't 550 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,920 Speaker 2: allow international inspectors in there. We have to make them 551 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:42,560 Speaker 2: guarantee that they will give it up. I hope that 552 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 2: they will surrender the physical materials that they have. I 553 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:50,000 Speaker 2: think it's four hundred and forty kilograms. That's about one 554 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:54,440 Speaker 2: thousand pounds of enriched uranium, sixty percent enriched uranium, which 555 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 2: could produce eleven bombs. I think we have to have 556 00:32:59,600 --> 00:33:05,000 Speaker 2: you know, international monitors in there on a regular basis, 557 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 2: and if they. 558 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:10,520 Speaker 4: Certainly hope it can be achieved. But I also know 559 00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:17,000 Speaker 4: that I also believe that if we get that somehow, 560 00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:19,800 Speaker 4: we've got to give something to Iran. You know, they 561 00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 4: have to be able to say. It seems to me 562 00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:28,440 Speaker 4: that to have this be at all permanent, and I 563 00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:29,600 Speaker 4: don't know what that would be. 564 00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:33,000 Speaker 2: But we could we could talk to them. We could 565 00:33:33,040 --> 00:33:38,440 Speaker 2: talk to them about having you know, US companies going 566 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:42,080 Speaker 2: in there and working with them, trying to rebuild some structure, 567 00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:45,640 Speaker 2: almost like a Marshall plan, but maybe not as generous 568 00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:48,720 Speaker 2: as we were to our European allies. We've done that 569 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 2: before with other countries. That's one possibility if they're rational, 570 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:54,920 Speaker 2: I mean, if that would be you know, if they 571 00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 2: want to try to get back on their feet, that 572 00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:58,800 Speaker 2: would be one thing that we could we could perhaps 573 00:33:58,840 --> 00:34:03,560 Speaker 2: help them with. But you know, it comes down to 574 00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:04,880 Speaker 2: can we trust them? 575 00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:05,400 Speaker 5: You know? 576 00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:10,680 Speaker 4: Well, I mean, Dan, in international in the international order, 577 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:11,800 Speaker 4: whom can you trust? 578 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:13,920 Speaker 2: I trust Israel? 579 00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:16,359 Speaker 5: Uh? 580 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:19,560 Speaker 4: Well, I don't know a lot of people don't. I 581 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:21,799 Speaker 4: don't know how much I trust her and don't trust them. 582 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:25,440 Speaker 4: But I am in favor of this, and I'm also 583 00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:31,440 Speaker 4: very very very thankful that this ceasefire, as fragile as 584 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,799 Speaker 4: it may be, according to the professor, at least we 585 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:37,320 Speaker 4: don't have any kind of armageddon here tonight. 586 00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:39,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. No, And none of us want that. None of 587 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:40,239 Speaker 2: us want that. 588 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:43,920 Speaker 4: None of us want that, nobody in Iran and nobody here. 589 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,319 Speaker 4: Thank you, Dan, Thank you very much. 590 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,920 Speaker 2: I appreciate it. Will take a break, We'll be right 591 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:50,320 Speaker 2: back on Nightside. 592 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:54,960 Speaker 1: You're on night Side with Dan Ray on wz Boston's 593 00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:55,640 Speaker 1: news radio. 594 00:34:56,320 --> 00:34:57,640 Speaker 2: Back to the cause, and we go to Larry in 595 00:34:57,680 --> 00:34:59,160 Speaker 2: New York. Larry next on Nightside. 596 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:02,759 Speaker 5: Welcome, good evening, Dan, Good to hear your voice, and 597 00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:06,000 Speaker 5: good to talk to you. That was an excellent conversation 598 00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,399 Speaker 5: that you had with the professor and just a quick 599 00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 5: plug hearing. One of the great things about Nightside and 600 00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,680 Speaker 5: the thing you've always brought to it is you have conversations, 601 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:17,759 Speaker 5: unlike a lot of other talk masters who pontificate. 602 00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:20,160 Speaker 2: But well, I am appreciated that it and obviously he 603 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:22,840 Speaker 2: and I disagreed, agreed a little bit, and he was 604 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 2: a gentleman, and I tried to treat him well and 605 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:26,000 Speaker 2: I'd love to have him back. 606 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:30,480 Speaker 5: No, you both did. This is probably one of the 607 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,400 Speaker 5: three times in his entire two administrations where I've agreed 608 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:38,000 Speaker 5: with Donald Trump in terms of getting rid of the regime. Uh, exactly, 609 00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:40,080 Speaker 5: it was. It's been necessary. You know, you and I 610 00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:43,799 Speaker 5: are old enough to remember when the when Colmini first 611 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,800 Speaker 5: took over and the craziness in Iran, and it should 612 00:35:46,840 --> 00:35:49,560 Speaker 5: have been gotten rid of with all the other presidencies 613 00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:53,759 Speaker 5: that haven't been said. The problem with this is that 614 00:35:54,520 --> 00:35:58,040 Speaker 5: the idea was good, the battle was good. The war 615 00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:02,120 Speaker 5: planning has been horrific because there is no plan for 616 00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 5: the future. And one of the reasons is I think 617 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:08,400 Speaker 5: there's a very important lack of understanding about what is 618 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,040 Speaker 5: really going on here, and that is this is not 619 00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:15,280 Speaker 5: a political war. This is a holy war the regime. 620 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 5: We keep hearing about change in regime. The problem is 621 00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:22,799 Speaker 5: you have a religious regime, and religious regimes, as you know, 622 00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:25,680 Speaker 5: go back through the Crusades and history and everything else, 623 00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:29,960 Speaker 5: they don't change the way other regimes do. And the 624 00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:32,480 Speaker 5: notion that well, if we kill all these iatolas off, 625 00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:34,799 Speaker 5: well we'll get a change in regime. You may get 626 00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:38,120 Speaker 5: something that's a little milder, but the bottom line is 627 00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:42,080 Speaker 5: is that there has to be negotiations along with the 628 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:48,200 Speaker 5: power and strength. But you know, we're talking about bombing 629 00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:51,640 Speaker 5: the railroad trestles and you know they're putting people out. Yeah, 630 00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:55,160 Speaker 5: that's right, because that's what religious crusaders do. 631 00:36:57,680 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 2: Well, we're not religious crusaders. 632 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,480 Speaker 5: No, No, I'm not talking about us, I'm talking about them. 633 00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:05,880 Speaker 5: And we don't fully understand the fact that, yes, they 634 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:09,520 Speaker 5: will sacrifice down the road, they will sacrifice as many 635 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:11,560 Speaker 5: of their citizens as they have to. 636 00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:14,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, they've already killed They killed tens of thousands of 637 00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:16,879 Speaker 2: their citizens. We are absolutely right. 638 00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 5: That's right, and you know I'm saying you notice that 639 00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:22,279 Speaker 5: they still have not been poppled over. That government is 640 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:23,320 Speaker 5: still running the country. 641 00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:26,719 Speaker 2: It is, but that government is the government that has 642 00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:34,480 Speaker 2: the military and has the weaponry. I look, there have 643 00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:37,640 Speaker 2: been thousands of courageous rounding people who have taken to 644 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:40,839 Speaker 2: the streets, and there may come a time in the 645 00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 2: next few weeks or in the next few months where 646 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 2: maybe maybe they will take over that government. There was 647 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:49,000 Speaker 2: a point in time, you know, the Ayatola flew there 648 00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:53,440 Speaker 2: from Paris, and his arrival, the Shah left town. I 649 00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,280 Speaker 2: mean it was a peaceful takeover. 650 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:58,280 Speaker 5: Well the shaw fled, he didn't leave town. 651 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,240 Speaker 2: No, but yes, yeah, no, I I've used that little 652 00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:04,520 Speaker 2: tongue in cheek there. Okay, there wasn't a shot fired, 653 00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:08,240 Speaker 2: to the best of my recollection. When when Homiani arrived 654 00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:11,000 Speaker 2: there from Paris, he had been in exile. And that 655 00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,520 Speaker 2: apparently is what the majority of the Iranian people want. 656 00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:16,760 Speaker 2: But I don't think young Iranian people want the world 657 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:18,920 Speaker 2: in which they have grown up in these last forty 658 00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 2: seven years. And I think that there has to be 659 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:24,479 Speaker 2: hope that look at what has happened in the Middle East. 660 00:38:24,480 --> 00:38:26,879 Speaker 2: Look at all of these countries that are unattacked. They 661 00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:30,680 Speaker 2: are now aligned with Israel. The Abraham Accords, which were 662 00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:34,440 Speaker 2: part of the first administration, that was a that was 663 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:36,680 Speaker 2: a wonderful development for the Middle East. 664 00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:40,680 Speaker 5: Absolutely, but those governments were political, even though they were 665 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:46,000 Speaker 5: Muslim governments, they were political governments. They were not religious governments. 666 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,200 Speaker 5: Are I'm just saying, if you look at the core 667 00:38:49,280 --> 00:38:52,439 Speaker 5: of the Iranian government, they don't. They just don't see 668 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:54,319 Speaker 5: it the way the rest of the world does. I'm 669 00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 5: just saying that is a cautionary. 670 00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:00,879 Speaker 2: Want to I want to be cautious, but I also 671 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:04,640 Speaker 2: want to be hopeful, and I do really hope that somehow, 672 00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:07,640 Speaker 2: some way, the Iranian people will rise up and take 673 00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:10,560 Speaker 2: control of their their their country and take it away 674 00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:14,440 Speaker 2: from these religious autocrats dictators. 675 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:17,040 Speaker 5: Absolutely, and the one way that that's going to happen 676 00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:19,799 Speaker 5: is that all of the other Arab countries have to 677 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,920 Speaker 5: get full on in on making that change. And now 678 00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:24,840 Speaker 5: we haven't seen yet. 679 00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:27,480 Speaker 2: Really well, we haven't seen it yet, but I'm I 680 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,560 Speaker 2: still am hopeful about that. Larry, I'm up on my break. 681 00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,879 Speaker 2: Thanks so much for listening. I wish you'd call more 682 00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:34,799 Speaker 2: often because you're a great caller. Thank you so much. 683 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:36,919 Speaker 5: Absolutely, talk soon, Dan, take care, talk to you soon. 684 00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:40,200 Speaker 2: We'll be back one line at six one seven, two, 685 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:42,799 Speaker 2: five four ten thirty one and six one seven nine 686 00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:44,759 Speaker 2: three one ten thirty. Let's light them up. We're going 687 00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:47,279 Speaker 2: to talk about this till midnight. It is a good 688 00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:49,360 Speaker 2: night for the world.