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Speaker 1: These Steelers' coaching searches in progress, joining me now to

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Speaker 1: talk about it. He covers the team for the Post Caazette.

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Speaker 1: Always a pleasure to talk to, Jerry Dulac. Jerry, how

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Speaker 1: long will this process take and how many interviews will

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Speaker 1: be conducted? If I'm conning correctly, there's been like eight

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Speaker 1: lined up.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know if the numbers reached that high.

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Speaker 2: It was, well, lets let me say it is.

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Speaker 3: Mark.

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Speaker 2: It reached five before I got started doing a number

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Speaker 2: of these radio hits and TV hits. But I'll go

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Speaker 2: with eight. But I will say this, they're a week

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Speaker 2: behind Mark because all the other firings occurred last week

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Speaker 2: by Tomlin was just two days ago when he stepped down,

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Speaker 2: So they're a week behind. Will they be able to

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Speaker 2: catch up? Well, yeah, they're going to have to, you know,

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Speaker 2: expedite the process. But I don't think that's going to effect.

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Speaker 2: They're not going to make a rash decision just to

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Speaker 2: hurry up to hire the person. You know, you look

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Speaker 2: at the past three hires, the latest one in the

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Speaker 2: calendar Chuck Noll, January twenty seventh. I don't think it's

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Speaker 2: going to be before then. But I think by the

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Speaker 2: first week of February. The one danger is you don't

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Speaker 2: want to miss out on a guy you know, and

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Speaker 2: if you're behind. I don't think that's going to happen.

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Speaker 2: I think one week you can catch up. But they

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Speaker 2: are a little bit behind the eight ball and they

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Speaker 2: will expedite. You know, the protocols are in place now,

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Speaker 2: market makes it. You know, there's a lot of boxes

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Speaker 2: to check before you even get down to the real interviews.

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Speaker 2: There's enough of them that slows the process a little bit.

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Speaker 2: But you know, I don't think it's going to be

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Speaker 2: a large deal that they started, you know, a week

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Speaker 2: later than most teams who.

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Speaker 1: Are the front runners. Give me a couple of names

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Speaker 1: you think have the most realistic shot.

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Speaker 2: In your eyes, Mark, I really can't, but let me

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Speaker 2: say this because I don't like to play that game,

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Speaker 2: because I don't know yet. It's way too early in

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Speaker 2: the process. But I will say this, I do not

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Speaker 2: believe that they will hire a former NFL head coach

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Speaker 2: and unemployed NFL NFL head coach to be their head coach. Now,

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Speaker 2: the hire one as a coordinator, I think is a

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Speaker 2: great move. You know, Mike McDaniel to be your offensive

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Speaker 2: for for example. I'm not saying that's going to happen.

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Speaker 2: I'm just using that as an example. I think, you know,

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Speaker 2: when you look at their tempo for the you know,

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Speaker 2: since Chuck No a young thirty ish, young thirty guy

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Speaker 2: who was defensive minded. Now I'm not going to tell

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Speaker 2: you that it's going to be a defensive minded guy.

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Speaker 2: Probably is probably a good chance it will be. But

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Speaker 2: one thing I learned from Dan Ruddy is they will

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Speaker 2: hire the right person. And you look at Chuck No.

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Speaker 2: Though I know it's a different animal now between social

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Speaker 2: media and all the talking heads on television these days,

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Speaker 2: and especially with the NFL, but you know, Chuck No

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Speaker 2: was hired. He was a secondary coach with the Baltimore

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Speaker 2: Colts that Don Shula highly recommended. Bill Kawer was. You know,

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Speaker 2: he was a known coordinator with the Kansas City Chiefs.

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't call him the hot commodity, wasn't Ben Johnson

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Speaker 2: and Mike Tomlin was only one year as the defensive coordinator.

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Speaker 2: And you know they had two candidates in Russ Grimm

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Speaker 2: and Ken Wizenhunt in their discussions, you know, guys who

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Speaker 2: were on the current staff. But yet Mike Tomlin came

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Speaker 2: in and just blew them away in the interview process.

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Speaker 2: And Dan Rooney always said he wanted to hire the

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Speaker 2: right person, and I think that's what they're looking for.

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Speaker 2: With who they are going to hire, I would imagine

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Speaker 2: it's probably going to be like the past. It's going

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Speaker 2: to be a young guy that they can build with.

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Speaker 2: That's what they want to do. That's been their history.

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Speaker 2: It's obviously worked very well, and I think I think

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Speaker 2: they'll follow the same process. Bringing in the former NFL

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Speaker 2: coach me does nothing for them.

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Speaker 1: Mark Okay, I agree with that, except for one guy

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Speaker 1: I'd talked to Stefanski.

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Speaker 4: He's forty three offensive.

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Speaker 1: Mind, it gets how the league is, had a great

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Speaker 1: defense in Cleveland too, knows the division. That would be

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Speaker 1: my one exception, and I think they're doing themselves a

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Speaker 1: disservice to not.

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Speaker 4: At least consider.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, I'm not going to tell you that they

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Speaker 2: are or not going to, but I don't think that's

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Speaker 2: in their cards. I don't think that's the direction they

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Speaker 2: want to go. But I don't dispute what you said.

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Speaker 2: I think Kevin Stefanski is a good coach. He's had

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Speaker 2: to deal with that dysfunction in Cleveland. Yet despite having

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Speaker 2: the deal with that dysfunction, which is the Browns and

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Speaker 2: the Jets are right at the top of the league

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Speaker 2: when it comes to dysfunction, he still wasn't able to

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Speaker 2: overcome it enough. I know who he was in a

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Speaker 2: division with the Steelers and the Ravens and even the

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Speaker 2: Bengals with Joe Burrow. But I don't think that's the

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Speaker 2: direction they want to go.

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Speaker 1: We're talking to Jerry Dulac from the because that brought

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Speaker 1: to us by bud Light, easy to drink in, easy

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Speaker 1: to enjoy. Now, Art said, competing is the intent and

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Speaker 1: no wasted years. I get it, that's always been their focus.

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Speaker 1: But boy, Jerry, I can't help but think they could

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Speaker 1: do with the six and ten year or six and

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Speaker 1: eleven now, because that's how they got Ben.

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Speaker 2: You know Mark, Yeah, when he's you know, when he

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Speaker 2: said that, it made it sound as though he would

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Speaker 2: rather be content competitive and have a shot than advance

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Speaker 2: in the playoffs, and of course that's not the case.

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Speaker 2: But his point is they were always competitive under Mike

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Speaker 2: Tommin They you know, eight division titles, you know, you

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Speaker 2: know the whole story, one hundred and ninety three wins,

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Speaker 2: and he would take that being competitive and to use

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Speaker 2: his words, have a shot rather than have six and ten,

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Speaker 2: six and eleven in the case, maybe five and twelve

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Speaker 2: or whenever the bottom falls out. And so that's his point.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I get it. The problem is, you know,

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Speaker 2: nine years without a playoff win, seven losses in a row,

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Speaker 2: nine to one and done. That's what's frustrated a lot

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Speaker 2: of the fan base. I mean, there's not even one

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Speaker 2: win in there, which is what they were hoping to

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Speaker 2: accomplish this year by bringing in Aaron Rodgers and it

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Speaker 2: didn't happen, and so that that's you know, that's where

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Speaker 2: the frustration lies with the people who wanted to see

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Speaker 2: a change. And I don't blame them. I don't blame them.

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Speaker 1: A lot of players specifically loved playing for Tomlin, wanted

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Speaker 1: to play for tom win. That's why Rogers came here.

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Speaker 1: How will Tomlin's departure affect the roster makeup? I'm sure

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Speaker 1: Rogers won't be back.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Aaron Rodgers won't be back. Mark And even if

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Speaker 2: Mike Tomlin stayed, I think the loss to the Texas

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Speaker 2: stealed that deal. He came in for one year. They

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Speaker 2: brought him in to hopefully win a playoff game and

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Speaker 2: maybe start to get something going in the postseason, and

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Speaker 2: when that didn't happen, they were just you know, they

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Speaker 2: were going up on the plan B. So I expect

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Speaker 2: them back after that loss anyhow. But Mike Tomlin being gone,

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Speaker 2: he's the person who wanted him. He's the reason why

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Speaker 2: Aaron Rodgers came. And with him not here, that's it's

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Speaker 2: a foregone conclusion. He won't be back. They're gonna make

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Speaker 2: some changes, Mark. I don't think they're going to overhaul.

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Speaker 2: They just don't do that. But if you look at

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Speaker 2: the last two years, how active they been in free

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Speaker 2: agency and with trades. That roster has turned over a

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Speaker 2: lot in the last two years, and I expect it

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Speaker 2: to happen again. And you have some decisions with some

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Speaker 2: older players. You know, it's you get to the point

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Speaker 2: where you say, okay, we can finish last with them,

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Speaker 2: or we can find not that they finished last, but okay,

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Speaker 2: we cannot win a playoff game with them. We cannot

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Speaker 2: win a playoff game without them. So you know, it

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Speaker 2: gets to that point. You don't, though, have to make

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Speaker 2: a decision on Cam Hayward despite the fact that he

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Speaker 2: had an outstanding year. You know, are you going to

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Speaker 2: keep Jalen Ramsey, John new Smith, guys you brought in

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Speaker 2: to cost a lot of money. Are you going to

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Speaker 2: stick with them when what you are doing isn't working now?

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Speaker 2: Mike Tomlin fell on the sword if you will. You

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Speaker 2: know when he told the players in the meeting, Look,

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Speaker 2: I haven't gotten the best out of you. I haven't

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Speaker 2: been able to get you guys over the hump. Give

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Speaker 2: them credit for the unselfish self analysis. But you know

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Speaker 2: that that's the truth. And so it's it's is it?

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Speaker 2: The coach is the common denominator. But you have to

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Speaker 2: look at the roster and I think you'll see I

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Speaker 2: think you'll see some overhaul, not not a blow up.

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Speaker 2: They don't believe in that. They've been in the playoffs

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Speaker 2: five the last six years, so they're not more abund

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Speaker 2: But I think you'll see them continue to make changes

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Speaker 2: because they're not going to sit there and say we're

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Speaker 2: satisfied with our roster.

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Speaker 1: What do I do with Watt is average annel Value's

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Speaker 1: forty one million, one hundred eight million was guaranteed upon signing.

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Speaker 1: He's clearly and obviously in decline, I knew that contract

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Speaker 1: was a mistake and he said he only wants to

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Speaker 1: play for Tom. When now he's got a contract, it's

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Speaker 1: not really his choice, you know who he plays for.

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Speaker 1: And on that Tom was left. But what's gonna happen

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Speaker 1: with him? Will he be back?

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Speaker 4: For sure?

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Speaker 2: Well, Mark, they kind of the ship kind of sailed

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Speaker 2: last year. They missed not to use the same analogy.

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Speaker 2: They missed the boat last year when they could have

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Speaker 2: dealt him, and I will tell you that was that

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Speaker 2: was something they that they had thought about. But instead

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Speaker 2: they gave him the big deal because you know, well,

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Speaker 2: because he's t J Watt and what he's been, what

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Speaker 2: he had done, and you know they didn't believe he

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Speaker 2: was finished. But you saw again this year that that

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Speaker 2: turns out to be not a smart business decision, which

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Speaker 2: they were aware of committing that kind of money for

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Speaker 2: five years to a guy who was going to be

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Speaker 2: thirty one. So at this point, you know you're going

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Speaker 2: to trade him. You won't get for him this year

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Speaker 2: what you would have gotten for him last year, meaning

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Speaker 2: probably a number one draft pick, but you won't get

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Speaker 2: that now. I don't think so his value is not

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Speaker 2: you know, this isn't Micah Parsons. So if you could

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Speaker 2: get that, you know, and get somewhat, you know, off

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Speaker 2: the hook to a degree with his contract.

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Speaker 1: Jared, I think you'd have trouble trading him for anything.

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Speaker 1: I think his performance in that contract makes him untradable.

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Speaker 2: Now, well, the contract is what makes him untradable. But

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Speaker 2: I'm just saying last year, before the contract, you could

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Speaker 2: have gotten away with that, and you probably could have

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Speaker 2: gotten a top pick for him. But that's why I

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Speaker 2: say that ship has sailed and I don't see that happening.

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Speaker 2: So now what do you do? Either way, you got

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Speaker 2: to bite the bullet and they'll keep them because they're

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Speaker 2: on the hope for that amount of money. So if

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Speaker 2: that's the case, I mean, it's not like he's thirty nine.

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Speaker 2: You know, they'll keep them and hope they get you know,

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Speaker 2: the old production out of him. Next year, you know,

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Speaker 2: at age thirty two, who's.

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Speaker 4: Going to be the quarterback? What direction do they go

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Speaker 4: in then?

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Speaker 1: Because clearly they got to draft the long term guy,

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Speaker 1: but I'm not sure sure that presents itself in this

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Speaker 1: year's draft.

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Speaker 2: Well, Mark, and that's what's going to play out here.

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Speaker 2: That's their intention, That doesn't mean that's what's going to happen,

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Speaker 2: and so then you know they'll take a look at

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Speaker 2: Will Howard. The last thing they want to do is

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Speaker 2: bring in a six different quarterback for.

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Speaker 3: The in the past six years.

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Speaker 2: That is not on their radar at all. They know

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Speaker 2: they have to get started with a with the next

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Speaker 2: quote franchise quarterback, and so they're hoping to accomplish that

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Speaker 2: this year. I don't know if they can. That's but

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Speaker 2: that's what we're going to find out.

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Speaker 1: See, Jerry, I would just go if you can't draft

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Speaker 1: the guy, I just go with with Rudolph and Howard

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Speaker 1: and Thrus stuff at the wall and see what sticks

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Speaker 1: in the interim.

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Speaker 2: Well, I think the the option there would be they

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Speaker 2: would take the look at Will Howard first to see

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Speaker 2: if whatever they thought they had in him. And the

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Speaker 2: understand mark is, you know, he's a six round pick,

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Speaker 2: so it's not exactly like they thought they were drafting

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Speaker 2: a franchise quarterback, but they do like them, and so

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Speaker 2: you know what, take a look. You know, that was

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Speaker 2: the problem of not seeing him in a preseason where

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Speaker 2: they can at least make some evaluation in a game,

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Speaker 2: not in practice in a game, and he didn't even

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Speaker 2: have a lot of practice with them for a long

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Speaker 2: time as well. So that's where they are behind on

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Speaker 2: evaluating Will Howard. But he will be part of taking

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Speaker 2: a look at him, and I would imagine they'll bring

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Speaker 2: Mason Rudolph back. But yeah, that's curious to see how

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Speaker 2: that's going to play out. But I know what their

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Speaker 2: intention is, Mark, but it doesn't mean that's going to

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Speaker 2: be the case.

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Speaker 4: Finally, Jerry, and I think I know the answer. Bit.

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Speaker 1: Was Art Rooney really surprised when Tomlin quit? And was

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Speaker 1: there any acrimony at all between the two?

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Speaker 2: No, not at all, Mark, I've never got any indication

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Speaker 2: there was. As you heard Art Rooney say he was

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Speaker 2: tending to talk to him about twenty twenty six, and

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Speaker 2: you know, and it never got to that conversation because

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Speaker 2: Tomlin delivered that bombshell. And in retrospect, Mark I would

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Speaker 2: have been I wouldn't have been as surprised if the

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Speaker 2: Steelers cut ways and part of ways with Mike Tomlin

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Speaker 2: rather than Mike Tomlin stepping down when I look at it,

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Speaker 2: think about it in retrospect, when I know the type

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Speaker 2: of coach and the type of guy Mike Tomlin is.

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Speaker 2: You know, Mark, this guy, he's a football junkie. He

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Speaker 2: watches If there's a coach in the National Football League

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Speaker 2: who watches more film than him, I want to meet him.

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Speaker 2: This is a guy, My god, He loves OTAs. He

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Speaker 2: talks all the time about embracing challenges. He tells his

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Speaker 2: players all the time, you run to the fire and

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Speaker 2: not away from it. And so I'm not saying I

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Speaker 2: can't believe that he's stepping away for any other reason.

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Speaker 2: I don't think he has any diabetical plan in his mind, like, hey, look,

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Speaker 2: I'll take a powder this year. I'm walking away from

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Speaker 2: sixteen or seventeen million, but I'll be a free agent

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Speaker 2: after the twenty twenty sixth season and I could go

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Speaker 2: get a John Harbaugh contract that averages twenty million dollars

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Speaker 2: a year, which he would. I don't think that's what

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Speaker 2: was his plan at all. But that's but all what

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Speaker 2: I said is why I expect him to be on

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Speaker 2: an NFL sideline. Again, I don't know that, but knowing him,

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Speaker 2: if I had to guess, that's what we'll see.

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Speaker 4: Jerry.

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Speaker 1: Great stuff is always good work at the PG. We'll

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Speaker 1: talk again soon.

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Speaker 2: Thanks Mark, good chat with you, my friend.

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Speaker 4: That's Jerry Do.

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Speaker 1: I brought us by Bud White segment before brought to

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Speaker 1: us by Danny's peach and hogies on route a day

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Speaker 1: to Bethel Park, and that actually strikes me as a

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Speaker 1: rather good combination. We got all kinds of guests today,

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Speaker 1: Yoe talking hockey at the bottom of the hour. At

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Speaker 1: four o'clock the return of the King of Old School,

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Speaker 1: John Steigerwald will be in studio, and at four point

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Speaker 1: thirty former Penguins coach Michelle Terrion.

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Speaker 4: They say they care. I know they don't. What oh

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Speaker 4: five ninety X, here's your.

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Speaker 2: Big fan, Mark, And after the gallon at like the

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Speaker 2: Mark Madden, what do you want?

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Speaker 4: What do you want?

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Speaker 5: Damn it?

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Speaker 2: The X at one oh five nine, I.

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Speaker 4: Forgot to plug.

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Speaker 1: It's time for calls on the fifteen styal aight three

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Speaker 1: three four one two wxdx eight three three four one

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Speaker 1: two w xdx. We got Josh Joey talking Penguins in

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Speaker 1: just a few moments. I was down at the River's

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Speaker 1: Casino last night, won thirty bucks playing blackjack, only played

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Speaker 1: for about twenty minutes. I had dinner, watched the first

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Speaker 1: period of the Flyers game. They lost a Buffalo four

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Speaker 1: to one. Flyers with a four game losing streak, which

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Speaker 1: is how I like it. Coming into tonight's visit the

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Speaker 1: Pittsburgh we got the Hockey Night Show talking about that

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Speaker 1: at five thirty, got Yowei talking about that at three thirty.

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking about playing poker again. I played poker for

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Speaker 1: number of years, not very well. I might start playing

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Speaker 1: a little bit at the River's poker room. Although the

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Speaker 1: problem with poker is it really frustrates me because I

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Speaker 1: should be great at it because it requires intelligence, but

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Speaker 1: I'm not very good at it.

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Speaker 4: You know an idea I had.

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Speaker 1: Everybody wants to give people stuff for free, feed the poor, etc.

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Speaker 1: I was walking through the wheelhouse at the Rivers last night,

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Speaker 1: had a steak there and keeping with the awaken one

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Speaker 1: to eighty parameters, and I saw people leaving a lot

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Speaker 1: of food on their plates, like waffle fries and buffalo

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Speaker 1: chicken dip. Why not bring bums in off the street

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Speaker 1: and just let them eat off the plates. Once people

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Speaker 1: are done enough left the table. It wouldn't be real

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Speaker 1: good optics, but I've seen bums eat ravelly all out

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Speaker 1: of a can on the sidewalk on the south side. Really,

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Speaker 1: how different would this be? Not very Let's go to

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Speaker 1: Nick in the truck. Nick, you're on with double.

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Speaker 2: M hey Mark.

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Speaker 5: So Jerry sang his praise as an earlier Proshuido did

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Speaker 5: on DVE about Mike Tomlin. How no one is a

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Speaker 5: student of the game like he was.

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Speaker 3: With the amount of film he washed and prepared.

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Speaker 5: It reminds me of like a kid who is a

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Speaker 5: terrible baseball player and takes all of his time to

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Speaker 5: practice practice to eventually meet his peak at average at best.

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Speaker 5: So he watched a lot of film and prepared.

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Speaker 4: No, no, I don't care.

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Speaker 1: But Jerry is certainly entitled to his opinion as his

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Speaker 1: pursuit of But I've always said on this program that

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Speaker 1: the most overrated thing in the world is efforts. You

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Speaker 1: can try hard all you want, but at some point

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Speaker 1: you're gonna have the talent. Now, if effort enables you

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Speaker 1: to maximize your talent, that's a good thing. But I've

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Speaker 1: known athletes and people in any walk of life who

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Speaker 1: work minimally but have so much talent they're just destined

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Speaker 1: to success coming out of the womb and I trust

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Speaker 1: that guy before I trust a guy that isn't talented.

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Speaker 4: But works hard to reach.

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Speaker 1: Like you said, mediocrity, Mike Tonwin didn't win a playoff

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Speaker 1: game in nine years. He got double figured in his

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Speaker 1: last five playoff games. I don't think he's anything close

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Speaker 1: Bah Hall of Famer. In fact, that goes so far

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Speaker 1: as to say, as I have said, that he's an

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Speaker 1: absolute fraud. But like kiss albums, everybody has one and

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Speaker 1: they're mostly stupid. Why'd I say kiss? I like kiss up?

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Speaker 4: Next, talk to Joe one oh five nine.

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Speaker 1: Hey, find yourself needing a little post holiday cash infusion.

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Speaker 4: Say no more the eggs as you're shot at extra cash. Oh, Mark,

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Speaker 4: Madden beat can eat you off.

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Speaker 5: Time, Mark, I have to have a porn question for you.

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Speaker 1: That right there, my friends, that's asking for trumpets.

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Speaker 4: The ex at one.

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Speaker 1: Penguin's hosting The Hated Flyers tonight, joining me now to

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Speaker 1: talk about it. He covers the team for the Athletic

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Speaker 1: It is Josh, Joey Josh. One thing I like about

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Speaker 1: the Flyers these days, which is to say something that

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Speaker 1: I enjoy hating. Trevor Zegris is Philly's best player. It's

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Speaker 1: his first year there, and he's become a panamime villain

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Speaker 1: for the Penguins. He's like a chicken scratch, cheap shot guy,

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Speaker 1: and it makes the rivalry more fun.

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Speaker 3: It certainly does, Mark, and I think for the last

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Speaker 3: few years the peng One's Flyers rivalry has not had

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Speaker 3: the same sizzle, not even close in fact. And maybe

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Speaker 3: that's because neither team has been particularly good. I don't know,

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Speaker 3: but I think the fact that they're both in a

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Speaker 3: fight for a playoff spot right now, and then you

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Speaker 3: throw in the Zegres factor, who the Penguins absolutely cannot stand.

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Speaker 3: I mean even to the point where like players in

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Speaker 3: the locker room like Connor Clifton are actually not afraid

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Speaker 3: to say in the press that they don't like him,

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Speaker 3: Like the Penguins don't ever do that. So he's clearly

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Speaker 3: gotten under their skin. And yeah, I think that adds

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Speaker 3: to the intensity of what already is a very important game.

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Speaker 4: Now Zegres is playing well.

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Speaker 1: On the other hand, talking can't get Mitchkov going the

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Speaker 1: mercurial Russian. He's a talent, but obviously a pain in

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Speaker 1: the backside.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, he's got to be. And you know, I know,

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Speaker 3: there's a lot of fans in Philly who are very

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Speaker 3: critical of Talking for not playing him more and for

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Speaker 3: being too hard on him. You know, Talk's kind of

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Speaker 3: an old school guy, but Talks also no dummy, and

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Speaker 3: he has played with some of the great players of

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Speaker 3: all times. So Talk, while he might be, you know,

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Speaker 3: a tough guy from Canada as a hockey player, he

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Speaker 3: certainly appreciates skill on how important it is in today's game.

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Speaker 3: So if he's benching the guy a lot and not

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Speaker 3: always playing him, I think that tells you he's a

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Speaker 3: pain in the ass and that he has to grow up.

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Speaker 3: But Philly's never going to get anywhere without him. He

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Speaker 3: is their most gifted hockey player. But Mark, I've seen

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Speaker 3: him play in person numerous times, and there are some

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Speaker 3: games I don't even notice him literally, and that's a

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Speaker 3: real problem given the talent that that really has.

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Speaker 1: Why did the Penguins stop scoring Josh two goals in

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Speaker 1: three games and all were losses.

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Speaker 3: You know, I think goaltending has something to do with it.

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Speaker 3: They were playing maybe the best goalie in the world

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Speaker 3: the other night. He was pretty darn good. I think

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Speaker 3: Sidney Crosby hasn't been very good in the last week,

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Speaker 3: and he still obviously carries the offense to a large

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Speaker 3: extent for the Penguins more than anything else, though, I

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Speaker 3: think Dan Muses has really made some mistakes with his

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Speaker 3: line configurations. I just don't like taking Malkoln away from

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Speaker 3: Braso and Mantha. I think those three work. I think

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Speaker 3: there's something of a proven commodity at this point. I

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Speaker 3: would leave them together, and I think there's a trickle

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Speaker 3: down effect that's really, you know, impacted the first and

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Speaker 3: third lines really because he's just not playing those three

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Speaker 3: guys together, which I don't understand. And there's also this

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Speaker 3: mark I've Ben Kendall, who's been wonderful all season. He's

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Speaker 3: done fourteen games without a goal, and he's not hurting

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Speaker 3: the Penguins because he's so darn good defensively, but they

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Speaker 3: still could use some production from him, no question.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I want to stay with Kendall for a second.

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Speaker 4: Is he hit a wall?

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Speaker 1: And if so, that wouldn't you alarm me because he's

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Speaker 1: an eighteen year old rookie and I think he's still

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00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,800
Speaker 1: playing good. But like you said, the production's not there,

434
00:21:48,840 --> 00:21:52,959
Speaker 1: and really the good moments they're there, but they're more sporadic.

435
00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:56,240
Speaker 3: I think he is hitting a wall if I had

436
00:21:56,240 --> 00:22:00,639
Speaker 3: to guess, and he's such of an intelligent Cereb player

437
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:03,440
Speaker 3: that yeah, he'll get away with it. Like I said,

438
00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 3: he's not going to hurt you. But I was talking

439
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:08,040
Speaker 3: to him the other day. I asked how his body

440
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:11,680
Speaker 3: was holding up, and he said, eh, okay. He wasn't

441
00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:14,760
Speaker 3: real convincing the way he said it, And I said,

442
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:16,560
Speaker 3: are you looking forward to the Olympic break? And his

443
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,639
Speaker 3: eyes got kind of big. He said, oh yeah, that

444
00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:20,920
Speaker 3: just tells me he's a kid who needs a bit

445
00:22:20,960 --> 00:22:23,000
Speaker 3: of a rest. And listen, he's eighteen. He's not a

446
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 3: big kid to begin with. It's his first year of

447
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:28,600
Speaker 3: life in the National Hockey League. I think that Olympic

448
00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:30,159
Speaker 3: break is actually going to be really good for the

449
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:32,920
Speaker 3: Penguins in general and for Kendall specifically.

450
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:36,760
Speaker 1: Now getting back to Sid, I think he's played pretty

451
00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:39,680
Speaker 1: good even without the production these last three games.

452
00:22:39,720 --> 00:22:42,480
Speaker 4: But I think he's passing up good shots.

453
00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:45,320
Speaker 1: It's it's tough to question Sid in his method, but

454
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,239
Speaker 1: like the other night against Tampa, Josh, he passed up

455
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:50,680
Speaker 1: a great chance to try to set up Ryan Shay

456
00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:51,320
Speaker 1: back door.

457
00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:54,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, you and I were very alarmed by that in

458
00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 3: the press box, and we see this with Sid every season.

459
00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:02,040
Speaker 3: I always say this, Mark, he's one of the greatest

460
00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 3: players in the history of the sport, but in some

461
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:08,679
Speaker 3: ways he's human and for whatever reason, his confidence with

462
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,920
Speaker 3: his goal scoring with his shot isn't there right now.

463
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:12,880
Speaker 3: And we see this every year from him. He goes

464
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:14,920
Speaker 3: through a little slide. Well, he'll go six or seven

465
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:18,119
Speaker 3: games without a goal and he's passing up shots. You

466
00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:21,160
Speaker 3: don't really understand why he's forcing passes. I think it's

467
00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,439
Speaker 3: just a confidence thing and he doesn't feel great with

468
00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:25,680
Speaker 3: his shot right now. It will come back. I'm sure

469
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:28,320
Speaker 3: he's not playing bad hockey by any stretch. In fact,

470
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:30,720
Speaker 3: he made one of the greatest passes I've ever seen

471
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,200
Speaker 3: in my life in overtime to Brian Russ and I

472
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 3: set him up for a breakaway's I got backhand passed

473
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 3: from one hundred and twenty feet unbelievable. So he'll be fine, Mark,

474
00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:42,600
Speaker 3: And if ever there was a time for him to

475
00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:45,520
Speaker 3: break out of it. We know how he feels about

476
00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:49,000
Speaker 3: the Flyers and how he plays against them. Historically, he's

477
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 3: gone three games without a point. I would not bet

478
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:51,880
Speaker 3: on it going to four.

479
00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:56,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, he says he doesn't necessarily hate the Flyers, but

480
00:23:56,600 --> 00:24:00,640
Speaker 1: the numbers in his extra drive of that as possible

481
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 1: with sid when he plays Philadelphia indicates otherwise.

482
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:06,480
Speaker 4: The odd thing about this scoring slump, though, well, it's

483
00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:06,960
Speaker 4: not odd.

484
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:11,879
Speaker 1: Defensively, they've been outstanding while they stopped scoring. But that's

485
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:15,160
Speaker 1: what kind of not very good teams do. They can't

486
00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 1: put everything together on many nights.

487
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:22,479
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would suggest the Penguins are just a highly

488
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:24,919
Speaker 3: average hockey team. I'm not knocking them. They're better than

489
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:28,400
Speaker 3: I thought they'd be, but average teams when they cheat

490
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 3: a little bit to score, they're going to give up

491
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,639
Speaker 3: four goals tonight. And when they pack it in defensively

492
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 3: the way they did against Tampa, like I thought, they

493
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:38,439
Speaker 3: played a really smart game against Tampa. I can't remember

494
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 3: one odd man rush they allowed all game until overtime,

495
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,320
Speaker 3: so that they played smart hockey. But I just don't

496
00:24:45,359 --> 00:24:48,040
Speaker 3: know that they're good enough to produce offense regularly when

497
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,399
Speaker 3: they play it that way, and that's their problem. So

498
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,679
Speaker 3: they're not playing poorly. I actually like their game the

499
00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:57,679
Speaker 3: other night without Carlson, especially too. It's just it's so

500
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:01,200
Speaker 3: much harder to generate offense without this version of Carlson

501
00:25:01,240 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 3: in the lineup. And I thought Crystal Tang played one

502
00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:05,119
Speaker 3: of his best games of the season against Tampa, and

503
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,240
Speaker 3: that's really encouraging. They need him to be really, really

504
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 3: good if Carlson's out three weeks or whatever it's.

505
00:25:11,119 --> 00:25:11,480
Speaker 1: Going to be.

506
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 3: They need him to play the way he did the

507
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:15,320
Speaker 3: other night. But they're going to have to win a

508
00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:17,920
Speaker 3: lot of close games. They're not going to dominate many

509
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:19,200
Speaker 3: people with how there are Carlson.

510
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:22,400
Speaker 1: Well, the problem with Carlson's absence is the trickle down

511
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:24,600
Speaker 1: as much as anything. Obviously, Josh, you want to have

512
00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:27,080
Speaker 1: Carlson out there the way he's played this year, in

513
00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:29,800
Speaker 1: particular for the Penguins, but Lok Tank can only play

514
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:32,520
Speaker 1: so many minutes, saying Ivan, he had a great game,

515
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 1: But I mean, I don't think you're going to associate

516
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:37,439
Speaker 1: the word great with him on too many nights. And

517
00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:41,840
Speaker 1: Connor Clifton, I mean, a dumb penalty be not that good?

518
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:45,480
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, I mean, I am reminded of a conversation

519
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,840
Speaker 3: I had with Ben Lovejoy about ten years ago. He

520
00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:51,280
Speaker 3: was talking about minutes that defenseman play. He said, have

521
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 3: you ever noticed like Tanger is even better when he

522
00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,159
Speaker 3: plays thirty minutes a night. I said, yes, I have.

523
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 3: He said, well, I'm not like that, and most defensemen aren't.

524
00:25:58,280 --> 00:25:59,880
Speaker 3: He said, I'm a pretty good player. If I got

525
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 3: fourteen minutes a night, you give me like eighteen to twenty,

526
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 3: you're probably gonna have a problem. That's just the way

527
00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,119
Speaker 3: it is. And I think the Penguins have a lot

528
00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:09,480
Speaker 3: of defensemen that are in that cluss. I like Shane

529
00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:11,359
Speaker 3: San and Ivany is a pairing. I really do when

530
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 3: they're together. I think they're both good third pairing defensemen.

531
00:26:14,680 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 3: You don't want them playing twenty two minutes. Eventually they're

532
00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 3: going to run into problems. So the faster Carlson gets back,

533
00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,960
Speaker 3: the better. And they just need Chris to turn back

534
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 3: the clock a little bit here the next couple of

535
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 3: weeks in it. Listen, he was good the other night.

536
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 3: He's been better lately in general with Kulak. They need

537
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:32,680
Speaker 3: this version of Crystal Tang badly.

538
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,520
Speaker 1: Skinner's and goal tonight, I think the goaltending has been

539
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 1: real good, you know, while they've not been scoring even

540
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:41,600
Speaker 1: shilloffs the other night, except he let in the one

541
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,560
Speaker 1: bad goal when he dropped the puck in his feet,

542
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 1: and then he sucked in the shootout, as he always

543
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:48,640
Speaker 1: does one in five and shootouts.

544
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:52,359
Speaker 4: Eleven goals on sixteen shots. That's a lot of points lost.

545
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,920
Speaker 1: But as you heard me ask news after the game,

546
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:56,400
Speaker 1: would you sub him out?

547
00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:59,600
Speaker 4: And mus said no? And I just don't get it.

548
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 1: I get it because I mean, respect is everything in

549
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:06,200
Speaker 1: that dressing room, every hockey dressing room, and they don't

550
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:08,920
Speaker 1: want to take it away from showoffs. But again, that's

551
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,320
Speaker 1: a lot of points lost. It is.

552
00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 3: On the bright side, Skinner has been really good since

553
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 3: the new year. He has played four games since the

554
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 3: holiday break and he's given up four goals and exactly

555
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 3: one in each of those appearances. He's the best goaltender

556
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,720
Speaker 3: right now. And if I were the Penguins, I would

557
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,159
Speaker 3: start to ride him a little more. They're doing the

558
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 3: whole fifty to fifty thing that they did at the

559
00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:35,119
Speaker 3: beginning of the season, but she loves and Jari. It

560
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,840
Speaker 3: worked for a while, but Jari was clearly the better goalie,

561
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:39,560
Speaker 3: so they had to start playing him more and the

562
00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:42,760
Speaker 3: Penguins started winning more games when they did. I would

563
00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:45,399
Speaker 3: recommend the same thing from Skinner if we keep seeing

564
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 3: this version of him she loves has been better. I

565
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,240
Speaker 3: think he's an okay backup, quite honestly, but I think

566
00:27:51,280 --> 00:27:53,760
Speaker 3: Skinner's the better goaltender, and he's not going to kill

567
00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:56,359
Speaker 3: you in shootouts. He might actually give you a chance.

568
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 3: He might be the worst goalie I've ever seen in shootouts.

569
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 3: Markets not just how many goals he allows, it's how

570
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:04,399
Speaker 3: easy he makes it look for the opposition. It's like

571
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:06,920
Speaker 3: they're shooting into an open net. He's not even coming

572
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 3: close to making this age. I've never seen anything quite

573
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:10,960
Speaker 3: like it at the NHL level.

574
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,480
Speaker 1: Josh, we've got breaking news mainson Heinsch was going to

575
00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: stay at pitt They say he's locked in and JJ

576
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:20,359
Speaker 1: Watt didn't like the Mike de Febo story because he

577
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:23,720
Speaker 1: felt like that could have stayed in the dressing room.

578
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 3: Oh god, wow, I thought.

579
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 4: It was the perfect response. I thought it was a

580
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 4: brilliant story, no question. It made the dressing room come

581
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 4: to life.

582
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: But you see, Josh, that's the problem we're headed for

583
00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 1: in our business. Pretty soon, it's going to be all

584
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 1: athletes with every microphone, and they'll keep stuff like that

585
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:45,240
Speaker 1: secret because they just don't think it's the public's business.

586
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 3: That's right. And I've always viewed my job as you know,

587
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 3: I'm supposed to be the bridge from the public to

588
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 3: the locker room and vice versa. And unfortunately, you're right,

589
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,080
Speaker 3: there's so many ex jocks who are more interested in

590
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 3: protecting the brotherhood. And I think that's an incredibly dangerous

591
00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 3: thing for the world of sports journalism, if it even

592
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:07,760
Speaker 3: still exists, and even more so for fans who sometimes

593
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 3: I don't want to see it that way, but I

594
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 3: think sometimes you need to know the truth as a

595
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 3: sports fan.

596
00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, JJ tweet. It feels like this moment could have

597
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,360
Speaker 1: stayed in the dressing room. If I could speak to

598
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:23,760
Speaker 1: JJ personally, I'd say, you tell him, Frank. Now, the

599
00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 1: Penguins need to win tonight, don't they. I mean, you know,

600
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 1: they've lost three in a row. The Flyers have lost

601
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: four in a row. Flyers played last night Penguins where

602
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,680
Speaker 1: idle Flyers lose to Buffalo, and the Flyers are a

603
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 1: team that are competing with the Penguins for playoffs, but

604
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 1: right now the same amount of points. I mean, never

605
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:45,040
Speaker 1: mind the usual rivalry, never mind Trevor Ziegris, this is

606
00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:47,160
Speaker 1: a chance to kind of push the Flyers just a

607
00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 1: little bit over the edge. I think.

608
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:52,680
Speaker 3: It's the biggest game of the season for the Penguins,

609
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 3: and I'm not saying that because of the rivalry. I'm

610
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 3: saying that because of the standings, Like we're like what

611
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 3: thirty seven games left. The Penguins are a couple of

612
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 3: points out of a playoff spot, and one of the

613
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:04,560
Speaker 3: teams they're battling with that got them in their backyard tonight.

614
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 3: That alone makes it the biggest game of the year.

615
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,000
Speaker 3: The fact that it's the Flyers add some sizzle. But

616
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 3: you're right, Philly played last night lost in Buffalo. Yeah, Frankly,

617
00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 3: it's a game the Penguins should win. And I know

618
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 3: they're playing without Carlson, but you know, every team's banged

619
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,200
Speaker 3: up right now, is playing without players. The Penguins have

620
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,440
Speaker 3: their top goalie going tonight there at home. They you know, Yeah,

621
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,120
Speaker 3: it's an absolutely massive game for the Penguins. I don't

622
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 3: think there's any other way to look at it. And

623
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 3: the schedule right now for them is fairly soft up

624
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:37,480
Speaker 3: until the Olympic break and then it gets absolutely outrageously

625
00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:40,280
Speaker 3: difficult in March. They got to make up some ground,

626
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:41,880
Speaker 3: right now, in the next two weeks, I'm telling you

627
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 3: that the only game that like looks like a loss

628
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:46,360
Speaker 3: on their schedule right now for sure, is at Edmonton

629
00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:48,640
Speaker 3: next week. Other than that, the schedule is pretty soft

630
00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:49,760
Speaker 3: the next couple of weeks.

631
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 4: Gosh, there's always great stuff we'll see at the rink.

632
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:55,200
Speaker 3: An honor to be on a show with this many

633
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 3: distinguished guests, Mark, thank you.

634
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:00,440
Speaker 4: That's right, Frank. Five nine.

635
00:31:01,720 --> 00:31:04,160
Speaker 3: It's The Woody Show weekday mornings at six.

636
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:05,640
Speaker 2: One of five ninety x