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Speaker 1: Eight oh five fifty five KRCD Talk Station, A very

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Speaker 1: happy Wednesday to I have been looking forward to this

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Speaker 1: moment in time since I got here in the morning

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Speaker 1: show to find out that Tom Clavin is on the rundown.

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Speaker 1: He's joined the program right now to talk about his

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Speaker 1: new book. By way of background, you probably already know him,

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Speaker 1: best selling author of twenty five let Me Underscore the

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Speaker 1: Word non fiction books on military history, sports and entertainment.

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Speaker 1: His writing career began in journalism as a rover reporter

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Speaker 1: for The New York Times fifteen years, as well as

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Speaker 1: contributed in multiple national magazines, awarded numerous prizes by the

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Speaker 1: Society of Professional Journalists National Newspaper Association. His books multiple

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Speaker 1: award winners, including six that made it to the New

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Speaker 1: York Times Bestseller He has written several screenplays, including a

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Speaker 1: couple of his books that are currently being developed as

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Speaker 1: screen projects. And I'm guessing, Tom Claven welcome that this

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Speaker 1: book we're talking about this morning is going to be

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Speaker 1: number three. I want to see a movie about this

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Speaker 1: running Deep Bravery survival and the true story of the

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Speaker 1: deadliest submarine in World War I to Tom, it's a

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Speaker 1: pleasure to have you on the program.

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Speaker 2: Well, thank you for having me back on the show.

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Speaker 2: And I agree it would make a terrific movie. Oh,

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Speaker 2: terrific story. So to begin with, it's insane.

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Speaker 1: And you know right now there is a man in

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Speaker 1: my listening audience, a dear friend of mine, a career submariner,

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Speaker 1: spent his entire career in the military and submarines. And

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Speaker 1: Mike is out there sitting on the edge of a seat.

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Speaker 1: You've already sold one book, I assure you, Tom, And

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Speaker 1: he knew about this boat. He knew about the Captain

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Speaker 1: Richard Okaine, which is featured in the book. So let's

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Speaker 1: dive on into it. You described this is the deadliest

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Speaker 1: submarine in World War Two.

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Speaker 3: So like.

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Speaker 1: Pilots get kills and they can become you know, certain

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Speaker 1: levels of pilots an ace. For example, this sub sunk

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Speaker 1: more vessels than any the other in the entire World

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Speaker 1: War two.

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Speaker 2: It did it did? It is the USS Tang and

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Speaker 2: it was the best attack submarine the US had in

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Speaker 2: the Pacific theater. And it sank thirty three Japanese ships

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Speaker 2: and what have sunk except that ran into it, you know,

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Speaker 2: ran into an entire convoy that was trying to take

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Speaker 2: out It proved to be a little too much. But

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Speaker 2: the Tang was was the most recognized. And I'm glad

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Speaker 2: you mentioned about your friend who knew knows about Richard o'caine,

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Speaker 2: because amongst some mariners there seems to be a recognition

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Speaker 2: of Ocaine and he's like the Navy equivalent of Audie Murphy. Yes,

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Speaker 2: but to the general public they don't. They've never heard

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Speaker 2: of the guy, which is which is a shame because

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Speaker 2: he was great Git, the heroic character in World War Two.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I wait to you here. We'll get a

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Speaker 1: brief little sliver of the excitement that these men were

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Speaker 1: involved with on the submarine. But Mike wanted you and

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Speaker 1: meet to know my listening audience is going to pass along.

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Speaker 1: There was a street named after the Tang in Groton,

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Speaker 1: Connecticut at the submarine base, and the CEO there Richard

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Speaker 1: Dick o'caine is also apparently they have a officers quarters

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Speaker 1: named after him on the sub bay. So everyone in

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Speaker 1: the Navy knows who this guy is. Let's talk about

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Speaker 1: some of the action they First off, what was life

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Speaker 1: like in a World War time submarine? I can't imagine

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Speaker 1: it was fun.

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Speaker 4: No, it wasn't.

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Speaker 2: And in fact, you can only volunteer for submarine duty.

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Speaker 2: You cannot be assigned to it because it was. It

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Speaker 2: was not only very cramped and very tight quarters. You're claustrophobic,

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Speaker 2: you were sunk, you can say, but it was dangerous.

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Speaker 5: It was.

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Speaker 2: You know, the mortality rate for a submarine sailor was

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Speaker 2: six times that of a surface ship sailor, so that

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Speaker 2: we lost fifty two boats was sunk during World War two,

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Speaker 2: and so there was a lot of a lot of

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Speaker 2: the Navy guys they said it was nothing to do

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Speaker 2: with submarines, but they turned out to be especially effective,

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Speaker 2: and the tang was was head and shoulders above the

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Speaker 2: other submarines and being able to hunt down and sink

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Speaker 2: Japanese shipping.

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Speaker 1: Well, you're right about psychological profile to serve on a submarine.

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Speaker 1: I personally would not pass that test. The idea of

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Speaker 1: it's less about claustrophobia, Tom, but the idea of depth

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Speaker 1: charges exploding around you in any moment in time you

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Speaker 1: I implode and sink to the bottom of the sea,

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Speaker 1: which we're going to talk about here in a minute.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you could be bonded, you'd be sailing on

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Speaker 2: the surface and as plane spots you, it could bother you.

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Speaker 2: You could be underwater and a depth charges like you said,

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Speaker 2: could come and get you. There could be a malfunction.

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Speaker 2: And the thing is when a submarine is in danger

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Speaker 2: of sinking and it goes under the water, there's no

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Speaker 2: way to go. I mean, one of the things about

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Speaker 2: if you're ont a destroyer or a battleship or an

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Speaker 2: aircraft carrier and it's damaged, you have the option of

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Speaker 2: getting into a lifeboat or if you need to jump

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Speaker 2: overboard and hold on to something. In a submarine, there's

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Speaker 2: no jumping overboard. There's no way out. So that's another

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Speaker 2: reason why it was especially risky and tension film the

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Speaker 2: way of serving the Navy.

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Speaker 1: Well, you go into great detail about this and then

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Speaker 1: let's fast forward and obviously I don't want a huge

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Speaker 1: reveal on this, but it's so exciting conceptually. This is

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Speaker 1: the book selling moment right here, at this moment in time,

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Speaker 1: Tom claven, Let's fast forward to October twenty fourth, nineteen

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Speaker 1: forty four.

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Speaker 2: Yes, eighty one years ago, this Friday, and the tang

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Speaker 2: is in the Foremosa Strait, which is off the coast

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Speaker 2: of China and it encounters an entire Japanese convoy. Now,

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Speaker 2: some submarines were operated in packs, were the one submarine,

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Speaker 2: but the tank was always a kind of a lone wolf.

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Speaker 2: It was by itself. I saw this convoy, it couldn't

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Speaker 2: let it pass pass through. So an attack that took

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Speaker 2: out an entire convoy. It was actually destroying it when

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Speaker 2: it fired its last torpedo, which boomerang came back and

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Speaker 2: struck the tang. It sank to one undred It came

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Speaker 2: to the rest of the bottom one hundred and eighty feet.

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Speaker 2: The captain and some of the crew members rightaged to survive.

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Speaker 2: It's a really exciting sequence to tell out of the boat.

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Speaker 1: Okay, there's a lot of process here. They were sunk

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Speaker 1: by their own torpedo. I didn't even know that was

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Speaker 1: a concept, Tom. I guess we're happy we have more

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Speaker 1: modern technology that can't happen anymore.

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Speaker 3: Well.

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Speaker 2: One of the reveals I think of Running Deep is

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Speaker 2: how inadequate a lot of our torpedoes were. I mean,

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Speaker 2: when you watch a movie about World War Two and

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Speaker 2: somebody fires the tort it always hits the target, but

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Speaker 2: a lot of times too often, and where we're to

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Speaker 2: the reality was that that torpedoes would explode too early,

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Speaker 2: they would be completely duds, and they can boomerang. They

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Speaker 2: could the gyroscope would go crazy and they would come

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Speaker 2: around as a case of the tank and strike the

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Speaker 2: tank in the stern. It sank stern first. A lot

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Speaker 2: of the guys and the boat were killed, but some

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Speaker 2: managed to escape and get to the surface where you know,

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Speaker 2: they went to the frying pans of the fire because

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Speaker 2: they were rescued by Japanese sailors who weren't too happy

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Speaker 2: about the submarine that I just destroyed a lot of

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Speaker 2: the shipping.

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Speaker 1: No, I imagine not so they sink one hundred and

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Speaker 1: eighty feet down. Eighty seven total crew men were on

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Speaker 1: this submarine, which again I'm trying to struggle with the

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Speaker 1: reality of the living conditions in this tightest space with

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Speaker 1: eighty seven but nine and managed to get to the surface.

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Speaker 1: Can I just say a screal briefly, how on the

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Speaker 1: hell do you get from one hundred and eighty feet

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Speaker 1: down in a sealed container to get to the surface.

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, there are two or three the captain

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Speaker 2: and the cup of guys were on the bridge when

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Speaker 2: the torpedo hits. They were thrown into the water, but

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Speaker 2: there were six others that down below that.

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Speaker 6: They had this.

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Speaker 2: Device called the bombson lung which was invented right before

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Speaker 2: the war, which you put it on and it's sort

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Speaker 2: of like it's not a scuba diving kind of thing,

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Speaker 2: and so that's just a little inflatable thing.

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Speaker 6: But the idea was.

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Speaker 2: They could give you enough oxygen to give you a

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Speaker 2: chance to get to the surface. And so that's what

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Speaker 2: these guys did. They put any bombs of lungs they

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Speaker 2: got into it the escape chamber, they would push down

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Speaker 2: into the water and they headed for the surface. Some

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Speaker 2: made it, some did not.

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Speaker 1: Now I have to ask you, are these like parachutes.

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Speaker 1: Every of the eight, every one of the eighty seven

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Speaker 1: crewmen had one of the us to use.

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Speaker 4: Well, they were on board, let's put it that way.

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Speaker 2: Life preservers. You didn't bother or even think about them

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Speaker 2: until you absolutely needed them and hope they would work.

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Speaker 2: It was like one was issued to every sailor, like

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Speaker 2: hopefully in the escape chamber you'd find them available.

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Speaker 1: All right, So when they make it to the top,

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Speaker 1: the remaining nine survivor and nine survivors. They were in

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Speaker 1: fact captured by the Japanese and placed in what you

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Speaker 1: described in the book as a torture camp.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, torture camp because they they were considered almost like

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Speaker 2: terrorists because they preyed on civilian shipping, which you know,

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Speaker 2: like the Japanese equivalent of the Virgin Marine, and so

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Speaker 2: they were in the brutal conditions very similar to what

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Speaker 2: the book Unbroken. In fact, Louis Zamparini, he was the

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Speaker 2: hero of the book Unbroken, was one of Captain o'caine's

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Speaker 2: fellow officers at this particular torture camp, and Ocane was

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Speaker 2: a particular target because once they found out he was

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Speaker 2: the captain of the submarine that had destroyed more shipping,

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Speaker 2: more of their boats than any ships than any of

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Speaker 2: the submarine, they really had it out for him and

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Speaker 2: he barely survived. But to the camp we.

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Speaker 1: Liberated home on, I bet he was a target of

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Speaker 1: some serious abuse, sir, I truly believe that. Oh yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: and he did, I guess ultimately earn the highest award

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Speaker 1: of the land, the Medal of Honor, as well as

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Speaker 1: other decorations. Was it for his service obviously on the

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Speaker 1: Tang but was because of this particular operation where they

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Speaker 1: sunk so many of this Japanese fleet. Is that the

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Speaker 1: basis for his receiving the Medal of Honor.

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Speaker 2: Well, I should point out that Richard O'Kane was like

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Speaker 2: the Audie Murphy of the US Navy. He was the

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Speaker 2: most decorated naval officer of World War Two. So he

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Speaker 2: had already been recognized for his service for operating, being

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Speaker 2: the captain of this terrific effective submarine. But I think

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Speaker 2: what got in the Medal of Honor is that during

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Speaker 2: his captivity in the torture camp, he endured, and he

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Speaker 2: got his men to endure, he got others to endure.

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Speaker 2: He was really an inspiration that he would Basically I

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Speaker 2: almost called this book Undefeated. He refused to be defeated

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Speaker 2: by no matter what the Japanese hold out to him,

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Speaker 2: and I think that helped other people survive terrific conditions.

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Speaker 2: So I think the Medal of Honor was different for

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Speaker 2: his survival and the survival of others. Wow, and a

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Speaker 2: great lesson to be learned for us who struggle with

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Speaker 2: you know, a fraction of the day to day challenges

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Speaker 2: that he struggled with, you know, inspiration can be derived

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Speaker 2: from a man who walked out of a torture camp

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Speaker 2: at ninety pounds after being subjected to that abuse. That's truly,

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Speaker 2: truly something be said, Tom Clayven, Let me ask you this,

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Speaker 2: did you have in doing your research for this? Did

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Speaker 2: you have access to diaries or personal accounts by the

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Speaker 2: people who served on the ship on the submarine. Where

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Speaker 2: did you come up with the information to understand these

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Speaker 2: day to day conditions and what they went through. Well,

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Speaker 2: I'm glad you mention that, because they they When the

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Speaker 2: survivors of the tank got back to the United States

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Speaker 2: and once they recovered enough physically from their various injuries,

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Speaker 2: they were all debriefed. And there's also all histories at

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Speaker 2: the World War Two Center Museum in New Orleans. Richard

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Speaker 2: o'caine years later, which is very interesting, he wrote a

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Speaker 2: book called Clear the Bridge about his experiences as the

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Speaker 2: tank captain, but he only devoted two pages to his

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Speaker 2: a year long incarceration in the torture camp. Like even

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Speaker 2: years later, he couldn't he couldn't bear to write about it.

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Speaker 2: There are other officers that kept diaries, so yes, there

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Speaker 2: was thankfully lucky for me a lot of archivro material

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Speaker 2: to draw from.

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Speaker 1: How did I'd never heard of the tank obviously didn't

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Speaker 1: serve in the military, most notably Navy on a submarine

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Speaker 1: like Mike did. But how did you learn personally of

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Speaker 1: the tang and Richard O'Kaine to write this book? Because

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Speaker 1: this is yet another, as far as I know, untold

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Speaker 1: story coming out of World War Two. It's twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 1: You'd think we'd have heard all of this by now, Tom.

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Speaker 2: Exactly how could there still be a story we don't

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Speaker 2: know about? But again, I was researching something else and

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Speaker 2: I stumbled upon I mentioned of Audio Murphy, comparing him

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Speaker 2: to Richard O'Kaine because of being the most decorated officers.

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Speaker 2: I said, I never heard of this guy. Most people

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Speaker 2: have heard of Audio Murphy because he went on to

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Speaker 2: become a Hollywood.

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Speaker 6: Star and made movies right like that.

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Speaker 2: But Richard O'Cain, who the heck is that?

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Speaker 6: You know?

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Speaker 2: A guy who born in New Hampshire and he became

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Speaker 2: one of the most decorated officer of the Navy. So

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Speaker 2: that's how I sort of stumbled upon it. And it

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Speaker 2: was one of those things where I just kept peeling

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Speaker 2: back layers and finding more information and more information found

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Speaker 2: out about the Tang. How con nobody noticed it about

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Speaker 2: the Tang and the most effective submarine in World War Two.

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Speaker 2: So the more I learned, the more I realized, this

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Speaker 2: is just an incredible story. And thankfully it's not been told,

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Speaker 2: you know, for a mainstream audience until Running Deep.

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Speaker 1: That's why we have you, Tom Claven doing it time

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Speaker 1: after time after time. Twenty five non fiction books. I

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Speaker 1: guess does this make it twenty six or is this

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Speaker 1: number twenty five?

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Speaker 2: You know, I'm like Jack Benny who never got past

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Speaker 2: age thirty nine. I had twenty five books. That's this

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Speaker 2: my story of sticking to it.

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Speaker 7: There you go.

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Speaker 1: Congratulations on the winning of the New York Times bestseller.

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Speaker 1: Another one. We're going to talk about six New York

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Speaker 1: Times bestsellers. Everyone's going to want to get a copy

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Speaker 1: of Running Deep, Bravery Survival and the True Story of

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Speaker 1: the deadliest submarine of World War Two. Tom, It's always

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Speaker 1: a pleasure talking with you. Keep up the great work.

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Speaker 1: And I know my listen is going to grab up

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Speaker 1: a copy of this. We've already got out on my

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Speaker 1: blog page of fifty five cars dot Com to make

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Speaker 1: it really easy for them to do that to be

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Speaker 1: able to get a copy of my next guest book,

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Speaker 1: The Broken Whistle, A Deep State running up My guess.

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Speaker 1: The author Pedro Israel or Tom Miami, born son of

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Speaker 1: Cuman immigrants who fled the tyranny of Fidel Castro's Communism.

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Speaker 1: He brings his eighteen years experience as a Central Intelligence

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Speaker 1: Agency veteran to his memoir, having served in the war

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Speaker 1: torn regions like Iraq, Afghanistan, and other undisclosed locations in

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Speaker 1: the Middle East, and at the Inspector General for the

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Speaker 1: intelligence community, working with on whistleblower cases is bravery and

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Speaker 1: exposing abuses of power led to retribution and termination. Despite

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Speaker 1: earning eight Exceptional Performance Awards for his contributions to the

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Speaker 1: US national security mostly encountered terrorism operations. Bachelor's degree in

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Speaker 1: political science from Florida University summa cum laude graduate and

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Speaker 1: master's degree in Security policy Studies in George Washington University,

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Speaker 1: specializing in defense policy, transnational security issues, and political psychology.

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Speaker 1: The book again, A Broken Whistle, A Deep stak running

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Speaker 1: buck Pedro Ortu, Welcome to the fifty five KC Morning Show.

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Speaker 1: It's a pleasure to have you on.

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Speaker 8: Good morning. Thank you so much for having it on

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Speaker 8: your show this morning.

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Speaker 1: And perfect time. I don't know if I know you

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Speaker 1: have seen Tucker Carlson's interview with Vladimir putin its reference

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Speaker 1: in the materials. His interview the other day with Mike

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Speaker 1: Banz from mid February censored the National Security State and

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Speaker 1: the inversion of democracy. It was a frightening account by

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Speaker 1: Mike Ben's of how our lettered agencies are all working

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Speaker 1: inwardly to control the narrative on social media, to the

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Speaker 1: exclusion of other alternative points of view, to the suppression

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Speaker 1: of factual information on narratives we get from our government.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this seems to be such a fundamental violation

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Speaker 1: of our freedoms, our liberties, and our constitutional rights. You

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Speaker 1: were kind of a victim of all this, and you

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Speaker 1: talk about it in the Broken Whistle.

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Speaker 8: In my case, it was from an internal perspective. By law,

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Speaker 8: if you see longdoing waste fraud views significant and specific

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Speaker 8: endangerment to public safety, as a federal civilian bureaucrat, you're

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Speaker 8: supposed to report it to your authorized officials through authorized channels,

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Speaker 8: basically superiors that all the way up to the head

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Speaker 8: of the agency and even the Inspector General. When you

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Speaker 8: do that, you're doing an act of blowing to whistle.

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Speaker 8: Most whistle blowers are accidental whistle blowers. I didn't even

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Speaker 8: know I was blowing to whistle, so I did it accidentally.

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Speaker 8: So once you do that, by law, they're not supposed

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Speaker 8: to take any personnel actions against you. They're supposed to

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Speaker 8: investigate and determine if indeed there's something going on and

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Speaker 8: fix it, which it's the way it's supposed to be done. Well,

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Speaker 8: in my case, the hammer came down against me and

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Speaker 8: they basically ran me out of CIA. I had to

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Speaker 8: take shelter in the Office of Inspector. Generally get don't's community.

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Speaker 8: It was a long process of just bureaucredit beating, bullying,

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Speaker 8: using every element of the agency. It was literally a

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Speaker 8: criminal conspiracy to cover up the violations of law I

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Speaker 8: had reported. So eventually what happens is they have to

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Speaker 8: investigate their reprisals. Well, they got into a criminal conspiracy

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Speaker 8: to investigate the reprisals. So it led to me blowing

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Speaker 8: the whistle a second time on the broken whistle on

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Speaker 8: these processes being broken. The second time, I went all

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Speaker 8: the way up the chain of command to the Director

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Speaker 8: of the CIA himself, the Director of National Intelligence, and

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Speaker 8: even Congress. But my disclosures to Congress apparently may have

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Speaker 8: never made it to Congress because the IG refused to

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Speaker 8: send the disclosures to Congress, the CIA refused to send

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Speaker 8: certain materials. So it was just a vast criminal conspiracy

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Speaker 8: to hide their wrongdoing and make sure that I would

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Speaker 8: be chased out. And since I refused to quit, then

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Speaker 8: they basically sent the Office of Security like a big

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Speaker 8: bad bully to threaten me that if I wouldn't shut up,

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Speaker 8: they would fire me. And since I didn't shut up,

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Speaker 8: that's exactly what they did. The point is, it's unaccountable

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Speaker 8: government power that violates the law because no one holds

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Speaker 8: them accountable. And what we're missing here is the congressional

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Speaker 8: element of oversight to make sure that the laws matter.

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Speaker 8: And if we get to the point where the laws

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Speaker 8: don't matter, we're running into basically lawlessness and tyranny and

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Speaker 8: consequently abuse us of power. And that's how we get

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Speaker 8: to what Tucker was talking about with Mike Bents. We

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Speaker 8: have got a bloated bureaucracy that is unaccountable and Unfortunately,

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Speaker 8: it has the power to violate the laws and not

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Speaker 8: be held accountable for it, and it leads us into

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Speaker 8: these vast abuses that even know it shuts down political dissent,

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Speaker 8: It targets political dissent like the Jay six ers.

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Speaker 4: It tries to shape the.

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Speaker 8: Narrative politically on every aspect of social media. And you

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Speaker 8: would have to do a historical deep dive on how

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Speaker 8: we got here too, because what has happened is although

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Speaker 8: we had the Church Committee with oversight in the nineteen

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Speaker 8: seven these mid seventies, once you start going up to

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Speaker 8: nine to eleven September eleventh, two thousand and one, vast

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Speaker 8: powers were given to the national security bureaucracy and those

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Speaker 8: powers allow them to turn the switch on and off

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Speaker 8: at will to target Americans through counterintelligence or counter terrorism prejudices.

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Speaker 8: And that's what has happened. And you look at Jay six.

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Speaker 8: They counted as an insurrection as a terrorism threat, so

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Speaker 8: they can flip that switch on and.

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Speaker 4: Target these people.

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Speaker 8: And unless we get Congress involved to do some oversight,

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Speaker 8: these abuses will continue.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I couldn't agree with you more on that, and

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Speaker 1: the FIZA abuses that we've learned about over the years

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Speaker 1: that they were going after Donald Trump like a rabid

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Speaker 1: dogs are to me just absolutely horrific violations of a

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Speaker 1: Fourth Amendment right to be free of unreasonable searches and caizars.

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Speaker 1: They are literally literally searching through our effects and papers

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Speaker 1: without any any belief that anyone out here in the

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Speaker 1: world has committed a crime, and that is a fundamental

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Speaker 1: violation of our constitutional rights. We don't have standing. This

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Speaker 1: is something I want to ask you about, Pedro, author

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Speaker 1: of Broken Whistle, Deep State Running Bok.

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Speaker 6: You have been.

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Speaker 1: Directly harmed by these violations. There is a whistleblower statue

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Speaker 1: you mentioned that you go in. Initially you're considered a whistleblower,

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Speaker 1: and then the pressure lorded down upon you is a

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Speaker 1: second abuse, which again you are you flagg don't you?

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Speaker 1: Have you ever consulted with counsel about maybe filing an

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Speaker 1: action based upon the violations of the law that the

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Speaker 1: CIA has engaged in or I'm just trying to wonder

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Speaker 1: if there's some recourse beyond congressional action, because Congress doesn't

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Speaker 1: seem to be able to do anything.

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Speaker 6: Well.

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Speaker 8: The problem is the law is so weak that it

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Speaker 8: that it is unenforceable, so I have no legality and

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Speaker 8: the law. The short answer to a very long answer

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Speaker 8: is Congress has created the situation with their lack of oversight.

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Speaker 8: The no legal remedy is based the way the law

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Speaker 8: is structured. The Inspector Generals have to do an investigation.

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Speaker 8: But what happens a lot of the times is they

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Speaker 8: do sham incomplete bias predetermined outcome investigations if they do one,

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Speaker 8: and they also don't adhere to the terms on the

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Speaker 8: time limits. So the further away you get from an

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Speaker 8: act of reprisal, the further or actually what happens is

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Speaker 8: the harder it is to substantiate a reprisal. So you

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Speaker 8: may have an IG that does a reprisal investigation five

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Speaker 8: seven years after the fact and they say, well, no,

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Speaker 8: we did not substantiate the reprisal. That does not mean

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Speaker 8: the reprisal did not happen. That means the IG didn't

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Speaker 8: find a reprisal. And you're right, I mean it's a

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Speaker 8: blatant violation of the law because on paper I have

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Speaker 8: law saying that I'm protected, but they don't enforce the laws.

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Speaker 1: Does the fox guarding a henhouse of reality?

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Speaker 8: Well, the inspector general system that's that's another topic that

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Speaker 8: can be discussed is inherently flawed and broken. They are

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Speaker 8: driven by two six months reports every year to Congress

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Speaker 8: through their agency head and basically that the report is

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Speaker 8: to find fraud, waste and abuse to save those agencies money.

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Speaker 8: And they're always looking for a way to spend the

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Speaker 8: narratives say we did X amount of cases, recovered x

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Speaker 8: amount of funds that you know, we investigated or actually

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Speaker 8: evaluate a certain aspect of operations and we determined that

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Speaker 8: they can tweak and do a couple of little changes,

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Speaker 8: and they think a little bit better. You know, we

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Speaker 8: did some audits and we determined that we're in compliance.

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Speaker 8: It's basically just paper, that's.

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Speaker 7: All it is.

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Speaker 8: It's just a report. So they're running like a hamster

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Speaker 8: on you know, the wheel, just going through the motion

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Speaker 8: of creating those reports twice a year. So they will

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Speaker 8: look for what we call low hanging fruit, like for example,

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Speaker 8: when the CIAIG was approached with an instance of candy

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Speaker 8: machine theft of about three thousand dollars that same day,

437
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:22,080
Speaker 8: they opened an investigation. Within sixty days, they had already

438
00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:26,480
Speaker 8: made referrals for prosecution to the attorneys in the local district,

439
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:29,879
Speaker 8: which declined prosecution and it became an internal matter. But

440
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:36,000
Speaker 8: when I reported the reprisal, it took them roughly one

441
00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:40,480
Speaker 8: hundred and eighty days to finally open an investigation. And

442
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:44,080
Speaker 8: after they opened an investigation, it took them an additional

443
00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:46,720
Speaker 8: I do remember if it was like five hundred days

444
00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:50,480
Speaker 8: to say they finished an investigation that was totally incomplete

445
00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:53,679
Speaker 8: and flawed because they failed to talk to witnesses. They

446
00:22:53,920 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 8: predetermined the outcome of the answers to the questions they

447
00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,320
Speaker 8: gave to witness, they didn't allow the witness to volunteer

448
00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:03,560
Speaker 8: extra infant I mean it was just shocking. That's all

449
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 8: I've got to.

450
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 9: Say about that.

451
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:08,200
Speaker 1: Wow, this is and I guess I have to answer

452
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:10,560
Speaker 1: you for we part company a fascinating account, Broken Whistle,

453
00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:13,960
Speaker 1: Deep State Running Back. Did you write this for Congress

454
00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 1: in a way? I mean, obviously you're enlightening the general public,

455
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,960
Speaker 1: and so we would encourage our elected officials to do

456
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:24,840
Speaker 1: something about these abuses. But I suppose you had maybe

457
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:27,000
Speaker 1: our elected officials in mind when you wrote the book.

458
00:23:28,880 --> 00:23:31,560
Speaker 8: I certainly did, But more importantly, I wrote it for

459
00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:34,280
Speaker 8: the common day Americans, so they can see that I'm

460
00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,159
Speaker 8: a common day American. Yes, sir, born and raised in

461
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,240
Speaker 8: the United States of America. And look what happens to

462
00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:43,639
Speaker 8: somebody of their own current internally. If they do this

463
00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:47,120
Speaker 8: to somebody that's internally, imagine what they'll do to somebody.

464
00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:47,520
Speaker 6: On the outside.

465
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 4: Look at the Jay sixers. So I ended it with

466
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:52,360
Speaker 4: my epilogue, who will speak up for you when they.

467
00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:55,080
Speaker 8: Come looking for you? The American people need to wake

468
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:58,640
Speaker 8: up for their slomburgler LeFarge eet, their apathy and their complacency,

469
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,960
Speaker 8: and becoming the involved and active in any form, in

470
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:05,040
Speaker 8: any way that they can help our constitutional republic. Worlds,

471
00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:07,880
Speaker 8: we're going to lose our constitutional republic and go down

472
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:10,760
Speaker 8: this path of tyranny. So it's time to wake up

473
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:12,800
Speaker 8: and do something.

474
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,080
Speaker 1: And we will put that statement all caps in bold

475
00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:19,240
Speaker 1: and underscored. Pedro Israel or to get a copy of

476
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,560
Speaker 1: the Broken Whistle at Deep State Run Amuck Memoir of

477
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,840
Speaker 1: a CIA whistleblower at fifty five krs dot com. Pedro,

478
00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,600
Speaker 1: thank you so much for standing up and speaking truth

479
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 1: to power. It's a beautiful thing to behold. You're part

480
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 1: of the solution, my friend. Happy to welcome to the PI.

481
00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,000
Speaker 1: Give up hearsee Marty, someone you're probably already know. She

482
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,680
Speaker 1: is a best selling author Jane Healy, author of this

483
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:40,960
Speaker 1: book we're going to be talking about this morning, good

484
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 1: Night from Paris. Also author of The Secret Stealer, which

485
00:24:43,720 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 1: was wildly successful as well as Beantonge Girls, Washington Posts

486
00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:50,440
Speaker 1: and Amazon Charts bestseller. Graduate of the University Newmpshire in

487
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:54,680
Speaker 1: Northeastern University. I want to cut right to the chase

488
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:56,639
Speaker 1: chain and we'll have up to the eight fifteen. So

489
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 1: let's dive on into the book. Welcome to the program,

490
00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:02,400
Speaker 1: And this is a true story. I've interviewed a lot

491
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 1: of authors over the years about World War two stories,

492
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:09,480
Speaker 1: both works of historical fiction as well as nonfiction works,

493
00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 1: and I'm always amazed, as much as I heard about

494
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,520
Speaker 1: World War Two, there's always somebody else that emerges, a

495
00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:18,280
Speaker 1: story that nobody's ever heard about. And it's just mind

496
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:20,840
Speaker 1: blowing the stories that people haven't heard about because they

497
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:22,879
Speaker 1: it seems to me always to be some story that

498
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 1: you think everybody would know about. Welcome to the program, Jane,

499
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:27,320
Speaker 1: it's good to have you on.

500
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 10: Thank you so much for having me. Brian, and yes,

501
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 10: I completely agree. It just when you think that there's

502
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:36,679
Speaker 10: no more stories to tell about World War Two, another

503
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,880
Speaker 10: one comes along like this one. I wasn't really intending

504
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 10: to write another World War two historical fiction novel, but

505
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:47,600
Speaker 10: I discovered the story of this nineteen thirties actress. Her

506
00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 10: name was Drew Layton, and what she did during the

507
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:52,440
Speaker 10: war was really incredible.

508
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I always try to really force myself to

509
00:25:56,200 --> 00:26:00,800
Speaker 1: keep things in historical perspective. Nineteen thirty was not the

510
00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:03,960
Speaker 1: way it is in twenty twenty three. From the know

511
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:07,400
Speaker 1: how men and women relate and the nature of where

512
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:09,320
Speaker 1: they were in society. So when I read a story

513
00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:11,800
Speaker 1: and learn about a woman like Drew Layton, it just

514
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 1: it's really cool to see how much they were able

515
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,160
Speaker 1: to accomplish in really a male dominated world.

516
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,000
Speaker 10: Yes, absolutely, Yeah, So to give you some background, she

517
00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 10: was a Hollywood actress in the nineteen thirty She was

518
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 10: best known for the Charlie Chan film and she in

519
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,360
Speaker 10: nineteen thirty eight met the love of her life, Jacques Tartier,

520
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:34,720
Speaker 10: who was Frenchman, and she left it all behind and

521
00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:36,680
Speaker 10: moved to Paris. And then, of course, as we know,

522
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:40,320
Speaker 10: the war started in nineteen thirty nine and Jacques went

523
00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 10: off to war, and she didn't know what to do.

524
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 10: There wasn't a lot of acting jobs, obviously, but she

525
00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,560
Speaker 10: ended up getting a job as essentially the first voice

526
00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 10: of America on the radio, broadcasting news to America from

527
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 10: France on what was really happening on the continent of Europe.

528
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 10: And she did such a good job that the Nazis

529
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:04,760
Speaker 10: started announcing on German radio that when they occupied France,

530
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 10: they would execute your ladies.

531
00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,840
Speaker 1: Wow. And I was going to ask that I couldn't

532
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 1: recall what year the France got occupied, but she was

533
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:16,480
Speaker 1: broadcasting from Paris, France, this anti Nazi you know, I

534
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:18,639
Speaker 1: will say propaganda, but it was truth, speaking about what

535
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 1: the Nazis roll about. But she was in Paris doing that.

536
00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:25,960
Speaker 10: She was in Paris doing that before the occupation, and

537
00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 10: then Paris was occupied and she fled the city for

538
00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 10: a while but ended up coming back. Paris was occupied

539
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:35,400
Speaker 10: in June nineteen forty, so she ended up coming back.

540
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:38,400
Speaker 10: And you know, she she kind of lived a life

541
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 10: during the war, always looking over her shoulder. She used

542
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,959
Speaker 10: her marry name Tartier, so that they wouldn't they wouldn't

543
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,200
Speaker 10: track her down. But you know, she was a stunning

544
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 10: tall blonde actress, so it was she wasn't It wasn't

545
00:27:50,400 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 10: easy for her to hide and play in sight, but

546
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 10: somehow she managed to do that. And not only did

547
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:59,200
Speaker 10: she do that, but she eventually started being part of

548
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 10: the underground at work getting Allied flyers who were landing

549
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 10: in occupied territories out of the occupied territories to safety well.

550
00:28:08,320 --> 00:28:10,399
Speaker 1: And I understand in spite of the fact that they

551
00:28:10,480 --> 00:28:12,640
Speaker 1: promised to execute her for what she had said before

552
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,800
Speaker 1: the occupation, she did get arrested by the Nazis.

553
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:22,000
Speaker 10: She did, and they'd never They arrested her for being American,

554
00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:24,920
Speaker 10: but they never made the connection that Drew Tatier was

555
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:28,000
Speaker 10: Drew Layton, which is amazing. And this is another aspect

556
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 10: of the story that was so fascinated by. After Pearl Harbor,

557
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 10: the Nazis rounded up a number of American female expatriots

558
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 10: living in Paris and the surrounding area and they arrested them.

559
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,280
Speaker 10: There were several hundred of them. They arrested them, and

560
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 10: their first place for prison was a zoo outside Paris.

561
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 10: They arrested them and put them in the monkey house,

562
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,480
Speaker 10: and their friends and family had to pay five francs

563
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 10: to like yell over the fence to them, and you know,

564
00:28:57,560 --> 00:28:59,720
Speaker 10: and they'd be yelling back, like, you know, bring me

565
00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:02,680
Speaker 10: my socks and underwear, like you know. It was crazy.

566
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 10: And so that actually was one of the first stories

567
00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:09,080
Speaker 10: I learned about when I was researching the Secrets Sealers

568
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:11,520
Speaker 10: where Drew was mentioned, and I was like, how did

569
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,440
Speaker 10: I not know that a few hundred women were you know,

570
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:17,800
Speaker 10: American women were prison in prison in a zoo in

571
00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:22,320
Speaker 10: Paris in nineteen you know, after post Parl Harbor. It's crazy.

572
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 1: It is crazy. And again another fun fact you learned

573
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: so late in the game, so many years after the war,

574
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: but it did happen. I guess I'm wondering because after

575
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,120
Speaker 1: she she was helped able to escape from the prison camp.

576
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 1: I guess that's the interim story before she started working

577
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 1: and joining the resistance movement to help you know, fairy

578
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:41,479
Speaker 1: airmen who were down in and helped them escape to freedom.

579
00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:43,520
Speaker 1: But in the middle, though she got out of the

580
00:29:43,560 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 1: prison camp, how was she able to manage that? I

581
00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 1: don't want to do too many spoilers, but it's kind

582
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 1: of an interesting component of the story.

583
00:29:50,400 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 10: It's a very interesting component. So they were in the

584
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 10: in prison in the zoo for a few days, maybe

585
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 10: a week, and then they were put into another of

586
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 10: these women were then transferred to another camp in the

587
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,760
Speaker 10: mountains in France called Vittel. It was a Spa town.

588
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 10: There was a number of hotels and they turned the

589
00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:11,680
Speaker 10: hotel basically into prisons with a barbed wire all around it.

590
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,000
Speaker 10: But these were so American and American and British women

591
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,200
Speaker 10: were imprisoned in this in this camp, but it was

592
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 10: monitored by the Red Cross, so it was not as

593
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:24,240
Speaker 10: brutal in terms of conditions as as some of the

594
00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,040
Speaker 10: other camps that you know, we've read about in history.

595
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 10: And so she actually faked late stage cancer by you know,

596
00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 10: she she had one of the one of the doctors

597
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:37,680
Speaker 10: agreed to give her meds to make her look and

598
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:41,040
Speaker 10: appear very very sick. So she faced cancer to get

599
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:45,520
Speaker 10: released so she could go back and help help these

600
00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 10: Allied flyers through the underground network in in France.

601
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:52,800
Speaker 1: And she did that. It's kind of like an underground

602
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: railroad kind of thing. Or maybe you think about the

603
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,800
Speaker 1: diary in frank where she was being uh, you know,

604
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 1: hiding in the attic of a home. How was she

605
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,840
Speaker 1: able to do this, she said. I mean, it's reported

606
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 1: she helped forty two down airman escape by letting them

607
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 1: stay at her home. Everybody turned everybody into World War two.

608
00:31:11,640 --> 00:31:13,240
Speaker 1: It seemed like you had a neighbor that was, you know,

609
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 1: cotton to the Nazi regime. If they found out that

610
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 1: you had Jews or were harboring enemy airmen, then they

611
00:31:19,880 --> 00:31:21,719
Speaker 1: would turn you in. How was she able to fly

612
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 1: under the radar for so long and help so many

613
00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:25,600
Speaker 1: people without getting caught.

614
00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:30,360
Speaker 10: Yeah, it was amazing. There was a number of them

615
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:34,320
Speaker 10: that she had a home. After she got out of prison,

616
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:37,880
Speaker 10: she went to Barbazon, which was a little village about

617
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:40,320
Speaker 10: ninety minutes outside of Paris, so she had a home

618
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:42,959
Speaker 10: there where she was able to hide flyers. But then

619
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:46,400
Speaker 10: there was also a network of doctors and other people

620
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:50,600
Speaker 10: in Paris, you know, families, not a lot of money,

621
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:54,880
Speaker 10: but they also had agreed to hide these down to airmen,

622
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 10: and so Drew got involved. She got involved really at

623
00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 10: first because she spoke English, and you know, one of her,

624
00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 10: one of her, one of the villagers nearby, came to

625
00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 10: her door and said, you know, I have an airman

626
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:12,400
Speaker 10: in my apple tree. Don't speak English, and you do so,

627
00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:14,400
Speaker 10: can you tell me what to do with this man

628
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:16,720
Speaker 10: and talk to him? And so she you know, she

629
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,400
Speaker 10: was pulled into it because of her ability to speak English.

630
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 10: But then when she realized what was happening and how

631
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 10: she could help, she got very involved. She was a

632
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:29,440
Speaker 10: key figure and in this underground network of rescuing these flyers.

633
00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:31,959
Speaker 1: Well, you may have answered my next question, maybe our

634
00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 1: final question, since we're coming up on time. But Jane

635
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,959
Speaker 1: establishing trust. I always wondered how it was. I mean,

636
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:41,760
Speaker 1: you see in the movies you do get the down airmen.

637
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,040
Speaker 1: He happens upon a farmhouse. They happen to be sympathetic

638
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 1: and they put you in touch with the underground and

639
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:46,920
Speaker 1: the next thing you know, you're being ferried off to

640
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:50,120
Speaker 1: Switzerland or whatever. How how is it that she was

641
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:52,760
Speaker 1: able to establish the trust? Was it through her deed

642
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:55,280
Speaker 1: in that one action that they knew she was reliable

643
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:58,360
Speaker 1: and could help the allies? Or did did they do

644
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: a background check? I mean, how is it that the

645
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:04,200
Speaker 1: resistance people were able to trust newcomers? In other words?

646
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 10: Yeah, you know, I think that she was involved on

647
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,880
Speaker 10: a periphery level before Parl Horever, before she was imprisoned

648
00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 10: just by virtual of the fact that she was broadcasting

649
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,320
Speaker 10: and threatened. She was broadcasting through America and all these

650
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:22,520
Speaker 10: so she was already had some of those connections in place,

651
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 10: and then and then after she got out, she still

652
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 10: had those connections. And in fact, she was so sick

653
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 10: when she first got out of prison because she had

654
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:32,760
Speaker 10: almost overdone it and killed herself. With all these mens

655
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 10: she took, they started the resistance, Certain numbers of the

656
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:39,240
Speaker 10: resistance that she knew, started approaching her being like, can

657
00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 10: you help, can you help? And she's like, I have to.

658
00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:42,200
Speaker 11: I have to at least recover.

659
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 10: But then as the war went on, you know, these

660
00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:48,560
Speaker 10: these airmen were turning up in fields and and you know,

661
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 10: in barns, and she she really just couldn't not get involved.

662
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 12: Wow.

663
00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: Well, I guess she was compelled to join the cause.

664
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,840
Speaker 1: Her husband, I understand, got killed fighting in Syria along

665
00:33:59,880 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 1: with the Free French forces, so that might have been

666
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:04,480
Speaker 1: an impetus as well. But the fascinating book by my

667
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 1: guest Today best selling author Jane Heally the name of

668
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:09,959
Speaker 1: the book good Night from Paris, work of historical fiction,

669
00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:13,439
Speaker 1: this woman actually did exist, and Jane's written all about her, Jane.

670
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:15,480
Speaker 1: It's on my blog page fifty five cars dot com,

671
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:17,239
Speaker 1: so my listeners can easily get a copy of it,

672
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,400
Speaker 1: and I know they're going to really love it. Fantastic

673
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 1: works you've done previously, so we're going to enjoy this read.

674
00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 1: It's been a pleasure having you on the program, and

675
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,720
Speaker 1: thanks for keeping as centertain Jay. Everybody in my listening

676
00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: audience doesn't need an introduction when it comes to Bill O'Reilly.

677
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 1: Multiple Emmy winner. He has written multiple books, more than

678
00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:37,319
Speaker 1: twenty million books in print, and they are wonderful, every

679
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,279
Speaker 1: one of them. I've read about I think probably twenty

680
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 1: of Bill's books. The keys can't put them down, and

681
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:44,040
Speaker 1: that is the case with the new and welcome to

682
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:45,799
Speaker 1: the fifty five carssee Morning Show to talk about your

683
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: new book, Confronting Evil Assessing a worst of the Worst.

684
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,360
Speaker 1: Bill O'Reilly, it is fantastic to have you back on

685
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 1: the fifty five KRS Morning Show. Hey you been Brian,

686
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 1: I've been great. Took me a period of two days,

687
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:01,520
Speaker 1: basically about maybe three four hours read the whole thing

688
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:03,279
Speaker 1: cover to cover. Could barely put it down, and I

689
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:04,879
Speaker 1: didn't want to put it down. After the first day

690
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:07,520
Speaker 1: I love. The afterward is where I want to start,

691
00:35:07,560 --> 00:35:10,239
Speaker 1: if I may, here's my definition of evil, You right,

692
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:14,439
Speaker 1: harming a human being without remorse, vivid, concise, nothing more needed.

693
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:16,760
Speaker 1: Of course, self and family defense as well as righteous

694
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,360
Speaker 1: war situations are not part of the evil equation in

695
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:23,320
Speaker 1: this world. The primary drivers of wickedness are money, power

696
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 1: and zelotry, as you document in this book going through

697
00:35:27,239 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 1: some of the world's worst multi mass murders in history.

698
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:33,080
Speaker 1: You want to relate this, if I may be so bold,

699
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,680
Speaker 1: to what happened with Charlie Kirk and how we're working

700
00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:41,160
Speaker 1: through the issues that are unfolding with regard to that murder,

701
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:43,760
Speaker 1: which seems to be born of what you define as evil.

702
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's pretty eerie. I mean, the book was out

703
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:55,120
Speaker 3: last Tuesday, and then Wednesday, I wake up and Putin's

704
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:58,040
Speaker 3: lob and missiles into poland Putins on the cover of

705
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,320
Speaker 3: Confronting Evil, and then if you wurs later Charlie Kirk

706
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:06,640
Speaker 3: is assassinated. I'm sitting there on WHOA. Obviously, the Kirk

707
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:12,400
Speaker 3: murder is an evil act, and evil metastasizes so that

708
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,640
Speaker 3: his family, mister Kirk's family never be the same to

709
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,719
Speaker 3: little kids as widow, and then the family of the

710
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:27,200
Speaker 3: alleged shooter. They're destroyed across the board. So evil always

711
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 3: takes a lot of people with it. But there's no

712
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 3: question that the man who will be convicted in the

713
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:43,239
Speaker 3: murder of Charlie Kirk, you know, it's hard to say

714
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:47,920
Speaker 3: he's evil one hundred percent, but certainly he's got to

715
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 3: be put in that category at this point.

716
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 1: Well, certainly hasn't risen the level of Genghis Khan, who,

717
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,720
Speaker 1: as you point out, was responsible for killing around fifty

718
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 1: million people. Or you could pivot over to the worst

719
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:05,319
Speaker 1: mass murder in the world's history, eighty million dead under

720
00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 1: Mount se Dung. You know, it's kind of strange, Bill O'Reilly.

721
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:10,680
Speaker 1: You know, you read the book and you begin with Caliguila,

722
00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:14,239
Speaker 1: and there's the problem with leadership based on birthright or

723
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 1: family connections. That guy was off the charts insane, as

724
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 1: you well document, and he did indiscriminate violence, killed people

725
00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:23,279
Speaker 1: at will. No one even knew who he was going

726
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:24,919
Speaker 1: to kill the next day. You could be best friends

727
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:27,200
Speaker 1: with Coligial one day and the next day he's seeing

728
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 1: to it that you're executed, murdered by some twisted mechanism.

729
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:35,359
Speaker 1: But many times I kind of struggle with how these

730
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:38,239
Speaker 1: individuals were able to obtain the power and then gain

731
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 1: it in spite of the fact that they were so

732
00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 1: evil and so many people lived under the threat. That's

733
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,560
Speaker 1: the problem when you have a government that threatens its

734
00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:48,759
Speaker 1: own people with death if they don't follow the party line.

735
00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:51,080
Speaker 1: You get everybody turning each and everybody in Oh my

736
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:54,560
Speaker 1: next door neighbor uttered something against the administration, you find

737
00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:59,080
Speaker 1: that person's gone, disappeared, murdered. How is it that evil

738
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:01,600
Speaker 1: has been able over an over again, Bill a rally

739
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:04,759
Speaker 1: to I hate to use the word succeed.

740
00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:11,759
Speaker 3: Because people will turn away. Brian, all of fifteen men,

741
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:14,799
Speaker 3: I couldn't even find a woman to get up into

742
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 3: that evil category. You know, as far as comparing a

743
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:26,400
Speaker 3: female to what these males did, there one never existed

744
00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:29,600
Speaker 3: at that level. But if you look at all fifteen

745
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:33,960
Speaker 3: men that we profile, all of them have relevance today.

746
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:36,880
Speaker 3: So I eat colligular way back in the Roman Empire,

747
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 3: they oh, well, what does that have to do with America. Well,

748
00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:45,120
Speaker 3: Rome was the most powerful nation in the ancient world

749
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:48,840
Speaker 3: for centuries and a collapse, and a collapse because of

750
00:38:48,920 --> 00:38:56,359
Speaker 3: evil could that happen to America? Absolutely absolutely, And if

751
00:38:56,560 --> 00:39:00,760
Speaker 3: you don't learn the lessons of how evil metallic exercises,

752
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 3: how it takes root. I mean, look at the German people.

753
00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:10,400
Speaker 3: German Americans are the largest ethnic group in the country,

754
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 3: and I know you have a lot of German Americans

755
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 3: in Cincinnati.

756
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:14,880
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, And.

757
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:21,880
Speaker 3: In nineteen thirty four, the German people voted ninety percent

758
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:27,719
Speaker 3: to give Adolf Hitler dictatorial powers. Ninety percent and the

759
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:33,440
Speaker 3: police state wasn't even in full form, yet they did

760
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:38,399
Speaker 3: it because they wanted to do it. So evil comes

761
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:40,880
Speaker 3: in a lot of different ways and a lot of

762
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:45,799
Speaker 3: different disguises. But in the modern world in America today, many,

763
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 3: perhaps most Americans look away from it. And that's how

764
00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:55,320
Speaker 3: it takes root, and that's how it does its damage.

765
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 1: And the demand for expedience I think is largely behind that.

766
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:01,120
Speaker 1: You know, oh man, to deal with the Congress, they

767
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:02,800
Speaker 1: have to pass the law. We need somebody to just

768
00:40:02,920 --> 00:40:04,480
Speaker 1: can just get it done, go ahead and do it,

769
00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:06,240
Speaker 1: you know. And I can use this in the context

770
00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:09,640
Speaker 1: I find offensive that Donald Trump blew up people in

771
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:12,480
Speaker 1: about thousand miles plus away. Did they really represent an

772
00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 1: imminent threat? Can he just willingly declare someone a narco

773
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:18,600
Speaker 1: terrorist and then just kill them. And a lot of

774
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:21,359
Speaker 1: people are plotting that that's expedient. He got the job done.

775
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:23,520
Speaker 1: The drugs aren't coming to our country, period and the story.

776
00:40:23,560 --> 00:40:26,840
Speaker 1: But that's kind of like relinquishing the masses authority to

777
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:29,560
Speaker 1: control the direction of their lives by handing over complete

778
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 1: power to a crazy guy like Adolf Hitler.

779
00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 3: Well, I disagree there. I think that the evil that

780
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:41,279
Speaker 3: drugs are bringing into not only the United States but

781
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:45,239
Speaker 3: all over the world, killing millions of people. Millions of

782
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:49,960
Speaker 3: people die every year from drug overdosers, and those who

783
00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:55,680
Speaker 3: don't die are enslaved, their families are ruined in many cases.

784
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:58,600
Speaker 3: You have to stop the source of that evil. True,

785
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:03,040
Speaker 3: And I talked to President Trump about this on a

786
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:06,799
Speaker 3: number of occasions. I said, there's only one way, only

787
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:10,040
Speaker 3: one way on this kind of an evil, and that

788
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 3: is to declare it a national security problem, which it is,

789
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:19,920
Speaker 3: and then use the military to punish them. And if

790
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,480
Speaker 3: you do that, you'll cut it down fifty sixty percent.

791
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,239
Speaker 3: I mean, believe me. In the cartel world, and we

792
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,600
Speaker 3: profile two of them in confronting evil scary, so they're

793
00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:33,440
Speaker 3: not real happy today. Okay, they're looking up at the

794
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 3: sky because a drone can hit them at any time. No,

795
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:43,280
Speaker 3: And to me, that's fine. These people are as evil

796
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:47,000
Speaker 3: as they come. And it extends even to the sidewalks

797
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:50,520
Speaker 3: of Cincinnati where you have neighborhoods where the heroin dealers

798
00:41:50,600 --> 00:41:53,200
Speaker 3: and fentanyl dealers stand outside and hawk their wares.

799
00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:56,320
Speaker 1: Exactly, they let them do it. But you know, I

800
00:41:56,360 --> 00:41:59,280
Speaker 1: guess what are you doing? Maybe I'm a constitutional purist

801
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,399
Speaker 1: to a certain degree. We got due process. We also

802
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,400
Speaker 1: don't have the death penalty for drug dealing. Now if

803
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:06,680
Speaker 1: we did, maybe you could justify killing them. But even

804
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 1: if they were caught in US waters with a bunch

805
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,879
Speaker 1: of drugs, you couldn't execute them. You'd have to send

806
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 1: them to courts, prove that they were guilty, and then

807
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 1: throw them in jail for however period of time.

808
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:17,239
Speaker 11: I like it, but.

809
00:42:18,840 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 3: It's a different situation because we have a law that

810
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:27,839
Speaker 3: says if a president designates a group, and Trump has

811
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:34,360
Speaker 3: specified which groups to be terrorists, then the US military

812
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 3: can take them out. That's why I wrote killing the Killers, Yeah,

813
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:42,640
Speaker 3: because that's exactly what Obama and Trump did with isis

814
00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:46,920
Speaker 3: with Solomoni and the Iranian National Guard with al Qaeda,

815
00:42:47,600 --> 00:42:51,359
Speaker 3: with Osama bin Laden, it's exactly what they did. There

816
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:54,520
Speaker 3: was no due process for those people because they were

817
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,360
Speaker 3: deemed to be a threat to national security. It's a

818
00:42:57,400 --> 00:43:00,360
Speaker 3: different situation than a domestic crime.

819
00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:03,280
Speaker 1: Well, one of the more interesting elements, and it shows

820
00:43:03,440 --> 00:43:06,239
Speaker 1: the benefit of living in our society where we do

821
00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:08,600
Speaker 1: have the freedom to control the direction of where we go.

822
00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:13,279
Speaker 1: You highlight Franklin and Armfield, these slave traders. If they

823
00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 1: earned and built up a profit of two point three

824
00:43:16,640 --> 00:43:20,480
Speaker 1: billion dollars in today's net worth by selling humanity. Thankfully,

825
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 1: we're not that country anymore. We changed the dynamic. Guess

826
00:43:24,080 --> 00:43:25,960
Speaker 1: we had to go through a bloody revolution to do it,

827
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 1: but we no longer are a slave country. So this

828
00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:32,040
Speaker 1: illustrates the point of being in a democracy, a republic,

829
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,759
Speaker 1: versus this dictatorial reality where you're living with a mass

830
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:38,799
Speaker 1: murderer who can well basically decide your fate on a whim.

831
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 3: Well, there's no question that the United States is a

832
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 3: republic that grants most power to the people. The problem

833
00:43:51,320 --> 00:43:55,360
Speaker 3: now is a lot of the people don't care, excuse me,

834
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:59,440
Speaker 3: don't exercise their vote, don't pay attention, don't know anything.

835
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:04,439
Speaker 3: Public school education system has collapsed in many areas. People

836
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:07,640
Speaker 3: create bubble worlds based on social media. We've got a

837
00:44:07,680 --> 00:44:12,520
Speaker 3: lot of problems in the area of who's exercising power now.

838
00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:16,440
Speaker 3: The slavers who became the richest men in the world,

839
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 3: two of them. What they did was so heinous that

840
00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:24,000
Speaker 3: I had to put it on the page because people

841
00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:27,240
Speaker 3: don't understand exactly how that industry worked exactly.

842
00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:31,120
Speaker 1: That's the benefit of this book. I didn't know any

843
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:34,879
Speaker 1: day Vladimir Putin. He you know, honestly, you know, I've

844
00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:37,040
Speaker 1: been around along time, aboubly be sixty years old on Sunday,

845
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:39,400
Speaker 1: Bill O'Reilly, and I've read a lot about Vladimir Putin.

846
00:44:39,440 --> 00:44:41,239
Speaker 1: And I hated the Soviet Union when they were there.

847
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:43,520
Speaker 1: I grew up in that Cold War era, you know,

848
00:44:43,640 --> 00:44:46,840
Speaker 1: the evil commies. I understand that. But you document Vladimir

849
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:50,960
Speaker 1: Putin's life. This guy is a hardcore murderer, torturer, criminal

850
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:53,480
Speaker 1: enterprise kind of guy, and.

851
00:44:53,640 --> 00:44:58,319
Speaker 3: A psychopath and is nuclear weapons. Yes, so, I mean,

852
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,560
Speaker 3: that's the most dangerous situation on the planet right now.

853
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:08,400
Speaker 3: Who But my job as a journalist slash historian is

854
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:14,480
Speaker 3: to inform and a year ago because me a year

855
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:17,800
Speaker 3: to write and research these books. I said to myself,

856
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:20,240
Speaker 3: you know, I'm seeing a lot of evil in America

857
00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:23,239
Speaker 3: and around the world. And then I look back and

858
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:26,360
Speaker 3: the only other time in our history, modern history was

859
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:29,200
Speaker 3: the nineteen thirties and after the Great Depression, when all

860
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:33,240
Speaker 3: of the tutalitarian regimes rose up in Europe and Japan

861
00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 3: and the result was one hundred million dead in World

862
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:39,600
Speaker 3: War Two. Now we're not at that level now, but

863
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:44,279
Speaker 3: the same mentality exists. Evil is not being confronted. In

864
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:49,160
Speaker 3: New York City where I am, the people may elect

865
00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:56,279
Speaker 3: a mayor who's a communist and who openly says I'm

866
00:45:56,320 --> 00:45:59,759
Speaker 3: not going to enforce the law. Well, what the deuce

867
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:01,520
Speaker 3: you think is going to happen with eight and a

868
00:46:01,520 --> 00:46:04,640
Speaker 3: half million people. I know, the bodies are just going

869
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:09,719
Speaker 3: to mount. It's going to be a catastrophe. And my say,

870
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 3: anybody who votes for this man, Donnie, is that's an

871
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:16,920
Speaker 3: evil act. You may not be evil, but giving this

872
00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:20,200
Speaker 3: man power, when he's looking you in the eye telling

873
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:25,840
Speaker 3: you that he's going to foster anarchy and allow violence

874
00:46:26,040 --> 00:46:29,560
Speaker 3: in the nation's largest city, what are you crazy? And

875
00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:32,560
Speaker 3: the answer is yeah, a lot of people in America,

876
00:46:33,120 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 3: for whatever reason, have lost their way.

877
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 1: Yes they have, and I think in your afterward you

878
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:41,680
Speaker 1: address some of the primary reasons for that decline, a

879
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:45,560
Speaker 1: theological belief, embrace of selfish behavior, and the high tech

880
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:48,920
Speaker 1: delivery system in the form of the Internet, which allows

881
00:46:48,960 --> 00:46:50,839
Speaker 1: people to sit in their basement in their mom's house

882
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:54,440
Speaker 1: and be subjected to all kinds of evil forces without

883
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:56,800
Speaker 1: a balancing message being presented.

884
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:59,359
Speaker 3: Bill O'Reilly, Yeah, that's having to happen to the guy

885
00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:04,400
Speaker 3: in Utah. That's exactly what happened to him. And you know,

886
00:47:04,520 --> 00:47:07,560
Speaker 3: again I wrote this book, I'm saying to myself, I'm

887
00:47:07,560 --> 00:47:12,520
Speaker 3: not nostra damas. You are right the you know, the

888
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:15,919
Speaker 3: guys said to me the release of your book last

889
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:20,320
Speaker 3: week was haunting base of all what's happened since. And

890
00:47:20,520 --> 00:47:21,919
Speaker 3: I think that's an accurate word.

891
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:22,800
Speaker 10: It is.

892
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:24,719
Speaker 1: And as soon as I heard about the murder and

893
00:47:24,719 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 1: the circumstances surrounding Charlie Kirk's assassination, your book is the

894
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:30,359
Speaker 1: first thing I thought of, and I thought, Man, isn't

895
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:32,640
Speaker 1: it amazing. I'll be talking to Bill O'Reilly about this

896
00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,240
Speaker 1: next week. Confronting evil, assessing the worst of the worst.

897
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:40,279
Speaker 1: My guest today, the incomparable Bill O'Reilly. I guarantee you

898
00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:43,359
Speaker 1: will love this book, like all of his books, get

899
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 1: a copy of it at fifty five krse dot com.

900
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,160
Speaker 1: Is a link there, Bill, so my listeners can easily

901
00:47:47,200 --> 00:47:49,680
Speaker 1: get a copy of this outstanding book. Thank you for

902
00:47:49,760 --> 00:47:51,480
Speaker 1: what you do. Thank you for coming on the Morning

903
00:47:51,560 --> 00:47:53,080
Speaker 1: show and talking about your book and the work that

904
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:55,240
Speaker 1: you do. And I'm waiting for the next one. Already,

905
00:47:55,280 --> 00:47:58,000
Speaker 1: Bill O'Reilly joining the program, Jaron Smith, and he's got

906
00:47:58,040 --> 00:47:59,160
Speaker 1: a book to talk about. We'll get to that in

907
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 1: just a second. He servant several roles at the White House,

908
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:04,240
Speaker 1: including Deputy Assistant to the President for Domestic Policy, Deputy

909
00:48:04,280 --> 00:48:07,080
Speaker 1: Director for Office of American Innovation, Director of Urban Affairs

910
00:48:07,120 --> 00:48:10,399
Speaker 1: and Revitalization for the White House Domestic Policy Council. Prior

911
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:12,200
Speaker 1: to serving in the White House, he worked for Senator

912
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 1: Tim Scott and served on the staff of House Committee

913
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 1: on Financial Services, the Republican Study Committee, House Republican Conference

914
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:22,880
Speaker 1: under then Representative Mike Pence in the office of Representative J. C. Watts.

915
00:48:22,960 --> 00:48:25,600
Speaker 1: Also former executive director of the Third Good Marshall Foundation

916
00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:30,120
Speaker 1: Center for Advancing Opportunity, currently partners at Denton Global Advisors

917
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:33,080
Speaker 1: and Senior Fellow Right on Crime. Holds a BBA from

918
00:48:33,120 --> 00:48:35,640
Speaker 1: Howard University, a Master of Divinity from Howard School Divinity,

919
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:38,759
Speaker 1: and is a member Proud Alpha Phi Alpha. Welcome jarn

920
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:42,160
Speaker 1: Smith to talk about your new book, Underserved, Harnessing the

921
00:48:42,239 --> 00:48:46,440
Speaker 1: principles of Lincoln's vision for reconstruction for today's forgotten communities.

922
00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:48,200
Speaker 1: Welcome to the fifty five Case Morning Show. It's a

923
00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:48,880
Speaker 1: pleasure to have you on.

924
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 4: Thanks for having me.

925
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:55,640
Speaker 1: Underserved Communities. Let's first identify that because what your book is,

926
00:48:55,719 --> 00:48:59,560
Speaker 1: at least I understand it is a blueprint for conservatives

927
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,480
Speaker 1: to engage in outreach and to address the needs of

928
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 1: underserved communities. I thought we fixed that with a Great

929
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:09,000
Speaker 1: Society program. Jeron Smith, what were supposed to have ended

930
00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:10,320
Speaker 1: poverty back in the sixties.

931
00:49:11,320 --> 00:49:13,480
Speaker 9: It was supposed to, but it looked like it's made

932
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:16,960
Speaker 9: things even worse. You know right now where we live

933
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:22,040
Speaker 9: in America, you know, if your parents grew up impoverish,

934
00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:26,200
Speaker 9: the likelihood that you can work yourself out of poverty,

935
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 9: that's become less likely, which is why we want to

936
00:49:30,600 --> 00:49:37,640
Speaker 9: create intentional uh infrastructure for opportunity, similar to what Lincoln's

937
00:49:37,680 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 9: vision was such long ago after reconstruction, an opportunity plan

938
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:48,320
Speaker 9: that's focused on economic empowerment. Lincoln knew the importance of

939
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:53,880
Speaker 9: economic opportunity, and we haven't had a president quite like

940
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:58,719
Speaker 9: President Trump that focused on that economic opportunity for underserved communities.

941
00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:01,040
Speaker 1: Well, it seems to be the problem is, you know,

942
00:50:01,080 --> 00:50:03,080
Speaker 1: there's an economic component to this, and you know, we

943
00:50:03,200 --> 00:50:06,640
Speaker 1: have this umbilical court of government which keeps people well

944
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 1: connected to government and keeping and continuing to vote for

945
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:12,359
Speaker 1: these same programs for fear that oh my god, I'm

946
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:13,640
Speaker 1: going to be left out in the cold and I

947
00:50:14,040 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 1: won't have any place to turn to get myself out

948
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:18,440
Speaker 1: of this situation. But you're not getting yourself out of

949
00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:20,800
Speaker 1: a situation by being hooked up to a government program.

950
00:50:21,280 --> 00:50:25,200
Speaker 1: But also this sort of social psychological thing that's going on,

951
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:29,840
Speaker 1: which is it's impossible no one in this racist, horrific,

952
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:32,920
Speaker 1: you know country that we live in can ever get

953
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:36,399
Speaker 1: themselves out of poverty. The systems stacked against you. That's

954
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:39,240
Speaker 1: a mindset that exists among too many people in this country.

955
00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:44,239
Speaker 9: Jurn No, I totally agree as a victim's mentality. Yeah,

956
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:48,800
Speaker 9: And what we're trying to speak is opportunity mentality that

957
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:52,840
Speaker 9: like the American Dream, could be available to anyone despite

958
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:56,920
Speaker 9: their background. But it all starts with civil society as

959
00:50:57,000 --> 00:51:00,560
Speaker 9: not something that's top down, you know, as community or oriented.

960
00:51:01,200 --> 00:51:06,440
Speaker 9: It's looking at things like family, historical institutions like our churches,

961
00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:11,120
Speaker 9: you know, and re imagining community and in the community.

962
00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:14,000
Speaker 9: We can figure out what's the best way to create

963
00:51:14,880 --> 00:51:19,600
Speaker 9: educational pipelines, we can figure out how to start businesses,

964
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:22,359
Speaker 9: we can figure out how to how to step into

965
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:25,400
Speaker 9: innovation and and all those things are going to have

966
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:28,840
Speaker 9: to be a ground up approach. And what we advocate

967
00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:33,240
Speaker 9: is looking at this very holistically, looking at everything from affordability,

968
00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:38,640
Speaker 9: you know, to economic development, to education, two jobs, and

969
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:41,960
Speaker 9: as well as kind of looking at you know, entrepreneurship

970
00:51:42,000 --> 00:51:44,560
Speaker 9: and how can we build wealth over time. All of

971
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:47,880
Speaker 9: these things aren't things that the government can provide, but

972
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:50,759
Speaker 9: we need to have an approach that allows for the

973
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:52,400
Speaker 9: private sector to get more involved.

974
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:54,880
Speaker 1: Getting the private sector involved. See I was going to

975
00:51:54,920 --> 00:52:00,640
Speaker 1: ask you, John Smith, how how a conservative ideological you know,

976
00:52:00,880 --> 00:52:04,120
Speaker 1: fix to the problems of these communities can even get

977
00:52:04,160 --> 00:52:06,960
Speaker 1: their foot in the door to have a conversation. I mean,

978
00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:09,440
Speaker 1: the you know, the the political mindset. It seems to

979
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:12,640
Speaker 1: be so warped and so rigid and fixed that oh

980
00:52:12,719 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: my god, this person is a conservative. This person's you know,

981
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:18,680
Speaker 1: advocating a free market approach to fixing our problems. I

982
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:22,040
Speaker 1: reject that out front before I even hear the message.

983
00:52:23,440 --> 00:52:27,279
Speaker 9: Well, I mean, look, the free market system has done

984
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:29,799
Speaker 9: more to lift impoverish.

985
00:52:29,280 --> 00:52:31,919
Speaker 4: Communities than any other system that we've ever seen.

986
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 9: The thing is is that part of it is getting

987
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:39,840
Speaker 9: the government out the way, you know, having a deregulatory regime,

988
00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:43,320
Speaker 9: you know, letting people keep more of their money and

989
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:48,480
Speaker 9: then allowing for parents, you know, institutions to be empowered

990
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:51,879
Speaker 9: is a key aspect of it. And so we want

991
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:54,960
Speaker 9: to create the right incentives, and we did things like

992
00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 9: created opportunity zones, which we're able to kind of mobilize,

993
00:52:58,680 --> 00:53:02,440
Speaker 9: mobilize over fix billion dollars in new capital and two

994
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:07,320
Speaker 9: three thousand different census tracks all across the country. And

995
00:53:07,400 --> 00:53:10,880
Speaker 9: then we worked with local mayors, you know, and county

996
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:14,160
Speaker 9: officials to figure out, you know, how do we create

997
00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:17,360
Speaker 9: safe communities, you know, how do we invest in police

998
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:21,640
Speaker 9: so that we can ensure that capital comes into those

999
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:24,279
Speaker 9: areas that need it most. Because you know, and I

1000
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:27,279
Speaker 9: know that, like, if you have an unsafe community, that's

1001
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:28,880
Speaker 9: going to be very hard to kind of get the

1002
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:31,840
Speaker 9: type of development in that community that's going to create

1003
00:53:31,920 --> 00:53:35,560
Speaker 9: the jobs, you know, allow for the revenues to create

1004
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:38,000
Speaker 9: the best schools, and so all of these things are interconnected,

1005
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:42,080
Speaker 9: and we're looking at it holistically, and we're recommending our

1006
00:53:42,200 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 9: leadership to take these new nuanced approaches that embrace the

1007
00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:49,640
Speaker 9: civil society, embraces the free markets, and we'll see the

1008
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:50,880
Speaker 9: progress that will.

1009
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:51,200
Speaker 4: Come from it.

1010
00:53:51,719 --> 00:53:54,719
Speaker 1: How much of the problems in these underserved communities do

1011
00:53:54,800 --> 00:53:57,400
Speaker 1: you trace back to the deterioration or I'm going to

1012
00:53:57,400 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 1: almost say the complete eradication of the nuclear family.

1013
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:04,239
Speaker 9: Oh. We we talk a lot about that in the

1014
00:54:04,320 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 9: book Underserved. You know, the incentives that were in many

1015
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:13,280
Speaker 9: of the Great Society programs made so many households choose

1016
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:19,000
Speaker 9: having a father or married household or or being able

1017
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:22,759
Speaker 9: to depend on the government instead then getting access to

1018
00:54:22,840 --> 00:54:26,160
Speaker 9: those resources. You know, I've heard stories, you know from

1019
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:30,600
Speaker 9: my parents that the government officials literally coming from house

1020
00:54:30,680 --> 00:54:33,640
Speaker 9: to house, you know, promoting that Like look, you know,

1021
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:35,759
Speaker 9: if you want to get help from the government, you know,

1022
00:54:35,880 --> 00:54:38,520
Speaker 9: don't get married you know, and then sign up for

1023
00:54:38,560 --> 00:54:42,360
Speaker 9: these benefits, and it's had a huge effect on households

1024
00:54:42,760 --> 00:54:47,320
Speaker 9: and also the mental health and viability of some of

1025
00:54:47,360 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 9: these communities. I mean, if you look at the statistics,

1026
00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:53,480
Speaker 9: you know, a single parent household, single mother household, they're

1027
00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:56,600
Speaker 9: almost like, uh, you know, like sixty percent less likely

1028
00:54:56,760 --> 00:54:59,879
Speaker 9: to you know, get out of poverty, and you're also

1029
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:02,560
Speaker 9: very more likely to kind of end up in the

1030
00:55:02,600 --> 00:55:05,600
Speaker 9: criminal justice system. I mean, you see almost like seventy

1031
00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:08,960
Speaker 9: percent of the individual individuals in the criminals system on

1032
00:55:09,080 --> 00:55:11,440
Speaker 9: grew up in single mother households. And so it's had

1033
00:55:11,440 --> 00:55:15,360
Speaker 9: a huge effect on underserved communities, and we want to

1034
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:19,480
Speaker 9: roll that back and bring back civil society and promote families.

1035
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:21,320
Speaker 1: And it seems to me that we should, you know,

1036
00:55:21,360 --> 00:55:23,120
Speaker 1: along the lines of, you know, if you're going to

1037
00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:25,680
Speaker 1: father a child and you're down all better re responsible

1038
00:55:25,719 --> 00:55:27,920
Speaker 1: for the financial component that goes along with it. That

1039
00:55:28,040 --> 00:55:30,799
Speaker 1: we should go after these deadbeat dads who just get

1040
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:34,240
Speaker 1: women pregnant and run off into the woods. It's therein

1041
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:37,279
Speaker 1: lies a real challenge and that one tiny slice of

1042
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:38,720
Speaker 1: the broader problem. Jeron.

1043
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:42,799
Speaker 9: Yeah, and it's a generational no issue. You know, we're

1044
00:55:42,840 --> 00:55:45,719
Speaker 9: looking at you know, a very generation of individuals who

1045
00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:47,920
Speaker 9: grew up in these single parent households, and so you

1046
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:50,720
Speaker 9: have young men that don't know how to be fathers,

1047
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:55,120
Speaker 9: you know, or young young women who aren't used to

1048
00:55:55,239 --> 00:55:57,439
Speaker 9: kind of working with the men, and so like. Look,

1049
00:55:57,520 --> 00:55:59,560
Speaker 9: we had to meet the problem where its at. You know,

1050
00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:02,480
Speaker 9: it's not going to happen overnight, but it starts with

1051
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:07,760
Speaker 9: individual communities. It starts with rebuilding civil society through our churches,

1052
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 9: you know, through through the things that's made America great historically.

1053
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:15,560
Speaker 9: And what we're trying to advocate for is a new

1054
00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:18,760
Speaker 9: infrastructure of opportunity that's not so dependent on the government,

1055
00:56:19,080 --> 00:56:22,160
Speaker 9: but that's dependent more on the community and the private sector,

1056
00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:23,920
Speaker 9: so it's more sustainable for everyone.

1057
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:26,920
Speaker 1: Well, hearing what you're saying, Jaron Smith, author of Underserved,

1058
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:29,640
Speaker 1: I bet you're a firm believer in the idea of

1059
00:56:29,680 --> 00:56:30,879
Speaker 1: school choice as well.

1060
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:32,600
Speaker 9: Oh, very much.

1061
00:56:32,640 --> 00:56:32,680
Speaker 13: So.

1062
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:36,000
Speaker 9: I think you have to let the decision lie with

1063
00:56:36,120 --> 00:56:39,520
Speaker 9: the parent, you know, so rather it's homeschooling the child,

1064
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:42,919
Speaker 9: send them to a charter school or even the best

1065
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:46,080
Speaker 9: public school that's in the community. You know, we shouldn't

1066
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:50,240
Speaker 9: put these parents in a situation where they're stuck sending

1067
00:56:50,280 --> 00:56:51,640
Speaker 9: their children to a poor school.

1068
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:53,960
Speaker 1: John Smith, get a copy of the book if we

1069
00:56:54,120 --> 00:56:56,120
Speaker 1: put on my blog page for you by Kerosey dot com.

1070
00:56:56,239 --> 00:56:59,600
Speaker 1: Underserved harnessing the principles of Lincoln's vision of reconstruction for

1071
00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:04,720
Speaker 1: today forgotten communities. I'm guessing you wrote it for politicians.

1072
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:09,120
Speaker 1: I meant, I know everybody should read it, and my

1073
00:57:09,239 --> 00:57:11,200
Speaker 1: listeners will certainly get a copy of it. But maybe

1074
00:57:11,239 --> 00:57:12,640
Speaker 1: we want to buy a copy and send it off

1075
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:13,840
Speaker 1: to our elected officials.

1076
00:57:15,120 --> 00:57:18,120
Speaker 9: Oh yeah, certainly. But I think that, like all power

1077
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:20,480
Speaker 9: goes to the people, and so we want to kind

1078
00:57:20,520 --> 00:57:23,720
Speaker 9: of know what type of leadership can help drive the

1079
00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:27,240
Speaker 9: country forward. This is a great thought piece to learn

1080
00:57:27,360 --> 00:57:29,600
Speaker 9: how we can get there and what you should be

1081
00:57:29,720 --> 00:57:30,920
Speaker 9: advocating for from.

1082
00:57:30,840 --> 00:57:33,600
Speaker 1: Your leadership, John Smith. I appreciate your care and concern

1083
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:36,480
Speaker 1: and the ideas articulated in your book Underserved. My listeners

1084
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:38,520
Speaker 1: can get a copy again at fifty five krec dot com.

1085
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:40,440
Speaker 1: Thanks for spending time with my listeners and me and

1086
00:57:41,120 --> 00:57:44,000
Speaker 1: addressing this very important subject. Jaron, It's been great talking

1087
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:46,400
Speaker 1: with you. Try to remain optimistic in spite of the

1088
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 1: fact that subject matter is a little bleak and dire.

1089
00:57:48,720 --> 00:57:51,160
Speaker 1: We started with Tech Friday's Dave Hatter, who talked about

1090
00:57:51,160 --> 00:57:54,240
Speaker 1: electric magnetic pulses earlier. We're going to elaborate on that

1091
00:57:54,360 --> 00:57:56,840
Speaker 1: and find out really just how genuinely bad things would

1092
00:57:56,840 --> 00:57:58,880
Speaker 1: be in the event we were hit with this. William

1093
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:02,200
Speaker 1: He's a New York Times best selling author and professor

1094
00:58:02,240 --> 00:58:05,400
Speaker 1: of history at Montree College in Montrea, North Carolina. He

1095
00:58:05,440 --> 00:58:08,080
Speaker 1: hold a doctoral degree from Purdue University with a specialization

1096
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:12,960
Speaker 1: of military history and technology. Author of more than fifty books,

1097
00:58:13,160 --> 00:58:16,600
Speaker 1: multiple best sellers, including the One Second After series, which

1098
00:58:16,680 --> 00:58:20,760
Speaker 1: details the realistic effects of an EMP strike. Noted expert,

1099
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:23,520
Speaker 1: he's been interviewed on all over news and a bunch

1100
00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:27,040
Speaker 1: of topics ranging from history, technology to cultural issues. Today,

1101
00:58:27,160 --> 00:58:29,080
Speaker 1: I welcome him to the fifty five Casee Morning Show

1102
00:58:29,120 --> 00:58:33,360
Speaker 1: to talk about his new book, Five Years After Doctor Forstin.

1103
00:58:33,440 --> 00:58:35,200
Speaker 1: Welcome to the fifty five Cassee Morning Show. It's a

1104
00:58:35,240 --> 00:58:37,040
Speaker 1: distinct pleasure to have you on my program today.

1105
00:58:37,840 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 5: Oh, good morning, pleasure to be with you. Given it

1106
00:58:40,640 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 5: early after me.

1107
00:58:42,680 --> 00:58:45,080
Speaker 1: I get up at three or two thirty to do

1108
00:58:45,240 --> 00:58:52,760
Speaker 1: this show. Yeah, crimea river ed at nine. Oh that's

1109
00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:55,680
Speaker 1: what I do. What I'm off work doctor. All right,

1110
00:58:55,760 --> 00:58:59,320
Speaker 1: so you're an expert in electro magnetic pulses, and you

1111
00:58:59,400 --> 00:59:02,640
Speaker 1: know we've all been through a power audage and it sucks,

1112
00:59:02,720 --> 00:59:06,800
Speaker 1: but it's not to the level that an EMP would

1113
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:10,400
Speaker 1: cause by way of damage to our electromagnet our electric grid.

1114
00:59:10,480 --> 00:59:12,480
Speaker 1: Let my listeners know, just briefly before we dive into

1115
00:59:12,480 --> 00:59:15,480
Speaker 1: the details of this new book five years after, what's

1116
00:59:15,560 --> 00:59:18,160
Speaker 1: the effect of an EMP, like, for example, a nuclear

1117
00:59:18,200 --> 00:59:23,200
Speaker 1: bomb exploding above in the atmosphere over the United States

1118
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:23,680
Speaker 1: of America.

1119
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:30,280
Speaker 5: You got it there, EMP short and electromagnetic pulse. It's

1120
00:59:30,560 --> 00:59:33,680
Speaker 5: created by detonating innis to the weapon forty to sixty

1121
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:37,400
Speaker 5: kilo ton about two hundred miles above the Earth's atmosphere.

1122
00:59:37,560 --> 00:59:41,720
Speaker 5: As a cascades down, it sets up an electrostatic discharge.

1123
00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:46,640
Speaker 5: It's the Earth's surface feeds into the antenna's wiring, which

1124
00:59:46,720 --> 00:59:52,240
Speaker 5: becomes antennas short circuits the system. The scary statistic there is,

1125
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:56,320
Speaker 5: if that ever was done to us and it's shorted

1126
00:59:56,360 --> 00:59:59,680
Speaker 5: at our grid, upwards ninety percent of all Americans with

1127
00:59:59,800 --> 01:00:01,200
Speaker 5: hair within a year or two.

1128
01:00:03,600 --> 01:00:06,720
Speaker 1: Of all Americans would perish within a year or two.

1129
01:00:07,680 --> 01:00:11,760
Speaker 5: Well, think about it. Electricity is the fundamental block building

1130
01:00:11,800 --> 01:00:14,840
Speaker 5: blocks of our society. Where did your water come from

1131
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:16,680
Speaker 5: this morning? I mean asking you.

1132
01:00:16,760 --> 01:00:19,800
Speaker 1: The question pumps that are run by electricity, Yes.

1133
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:26,000
Speaker 5: Exactly, everything is dependent on electricity. Your water supply is gone,

1134
01:00:26,680 --> 01:00:29,800
Speaker 5: food supply about twenty days is the average for most

1135
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:35,840
Speaker 5: towns and cities gone. Medication gone, command and control gone,

1136
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:40,840
Speaker 5: disease starts taking over, and then chaos. It's a very

1137
01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:45,360
Speaker 5: frightening scenario. Doctor Fortune. Let's put a real important statistic

1138
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:47,840
Speaker 5: on their real important emphasis point, because clearly what you

1139
01:00:47,960 --> 01:00:51,120
Speaker 5: said isn't enough to get people concerned about this. How

1140
01:00:51,160 --> 01:00:54,680
Speaker 5: about you won't be able to access TikTok anymore?

1141
01:00:57,640 --> 01:00:57,920
Speaker 11: Gone?

1142
01:00:58,200 --> 01:01:02,240
Speaker 1: Is the internet lately wiped out your ability to communicate

1143
01:01:02,280 --> 01:01:04,520
Speaker 1: with your friends and relatives. Phone systems don't work. Even

1144
01:01:04,520 --> 01:01:06,360
Speaker 1: if you had a landline, it would be fried out.

1145
01:01:06,600 --> 01:01:08,160
Speaker 1: And let me get the other is illustration. You have

1146
01:01:08,240 --> 01:01:11,040
Speaker 1: a car sitting in a driveway that is not covered

1147
01:01:11,080 --> 01:01:13,720
Speaker 1: by a Faraday cage. The electrical system in the car

1148
01:01:13,800 --> 01:01:15,640
Speaker 1: would also be fried out, would it not? In this

1149
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:16,520
Speaker 1: emp case?

1150
01:01:17,400 --> 01:01:19,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know you're stuffed. Yes, it's a Paraday cage.

1151
01:01:20,720 --> 01:01:23,320
Speaker 5: S smich ron anywhere from a low of ten percent

1152
01:01:23,480 --> 01:01:26,320
Speaker 5: to eighty or ninety percent of cars made after nineteen

1153
01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:27,400
Speaker 5: eighty gone.

1154
01:01:28,520 --> 01:01:31,800
Speaker 1: Well, that makes a good argument for a carburetor. Now

1155
01:01:32,440 --> 01:01:34,479
Speaker 1: in your in your newest book, now you talk about

1156
01:01:34,560 --> 01:01:37,240
Speaker 1: all of this. These are works of fiction, but these

1157
01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:41,160
Speaker 1: are all based upon fact, reality, what the real life

1158
01:01:41,240 --> 01:01:45,160
Speaker 1: scenario would be as as the situation unfolds. Moving fast

1159
01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:48,440
Speaker 1: forward from your first book on this topic to your

1160
01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:51,160
Speaker 1: newest book five years after. What's this focus on this

1161
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:52,120
Speaker 1: most recent book.

1162
01:01:53,120 --> 01:01:56,640
Speaker 5: Well, I was a title implied. It's five years after,

1163
01:01:57,240 --> 01:02:00,840
Speaker 5: and it's amps to society to rebuild itself for five years,

1164
01:02:01,520 --> 01:02:05,000
Speaker 5: and it's basically crawling back from the abyss. But there

1165
01:02:05,040 --> 01:02:09,440
Speaker 5: are still things out there supposed disease like okay, COVID

1166
01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:12,520
Speaker 5: hits but ten times worse. That's what it's about.

1167
01:02:14,440 --> 01:02:18,120
Speaker 1: Okay, does that have a happy ending? I'm just kidding.

1168
01:02:19,560 --> 01:02:24,200
Speaker 1: I'm kidding. Dealing with the practical solutions, I threw out

1169
01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:26,320
Speaker 1: that real quickly, the Faraday cage. But you know, for

1170
01:02:26,360 --> 01:02:29,920
Speaker 1: people who don't know, fair day cage dissipates that electromagnetic pulse.

1171
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:32,520
Speaker 1: So whatever is surrounded by like I could go out

1172
01:02:32,520 --> 01:02:34,760
Speaker 1: and buy a cell phone bag that is a Faraday cage.

1173
01:02:34,840 --> 01:02:37,600
Speaker 1: My cell phone would survive. Now the grid upon which

1174
01:02:37,640 --> 01:02:39,480
Speaker 1: it works would be wiped out, but at my cell

1175
01:02:39,520 --> 01:02:41,880
Speaker 1: phone as a device would still operate at some future

1176
01:02:41,960 --> 01:02:45,919
Speaker 1: dat if it ever got fixed. But we can't. Can

1177
01:02:46,080 --> 01:02:51,360
Speaker 1: we strengthen our grid or otherwise protect our grid? Can we?

1178
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:52,080
Speaker 4: Doctor?

1179
01:02:53,320 --> 01:02:56,600
Speaker 5: That's my anger and frustration. That's why I'm doing a

1180
01:02:56,680 --> 01:03:00,200
Speaker 5: lot of interviews again. We're spending to trillion dollars on

1181
01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:03,560
Speaker 5: so called green energy. Sure, you know, I actually do

1182
01:03:03,760 --> 01:03:07,000
Speaker 5: kind of support wind mills in solar. But on the

1183
01:03:07,080 --> 01:03:10,480
Speaker 5: other hand, the average component in our electrical grid is

1184
01:03:10,560 --> 01:03:14,800
Speaker 5: over forty years old. We are pumping our electricity in

1185
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:18,960
Speaker 5: a grid basically from the nineteen seventies nineteen eighties. Why

1186
01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:23,120
Speaker 5: are we not spending more money on infrastructure, security, more

1187
01:03:23,760 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 5: spare parts, upgraded systems. We're not doing it. We're naked,

1188
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:29,760
Speaker 5: We rarely are.

1189
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:34,480
Speaker 1: Okay, and recognizing that our grids as old as they are,

1190
01:03:34,680 --> 01:03:37,360
Speaker 1: and the numerous problems we've already faced, and the rush

1191
01:03:37,480 --> 01:03:40,560
Speaker 1: to add even more components to it in the name

1192
01:03:40,600 --> 01:03:42,680
Speaker 1: of being green, all the evs in the world and

1193
01:03:42,720 --> 01:03:49,480
Speaker 1: everything else, we can't manage the projections for the load

1194
01:03:49,600 --> 01:03:52,240
Speaker 1: on the grid right now. And what you're saying, is

1195
01:03:52,320 --> 01:03:55,040
Speaker 1: it's way beyond just that. It's protecting us from this

1196
01:03:55,200 --> 01:03:57,760
Speaker 1: kind of scenario, and a scenario that doesn't necessarily require

1197
01:03:57,800 --> 01:04:00,560
Speaker 1: the Chinese Communist Party to launch. It learned early in

1198
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:02,680
Speaker 1: the program, and as you know, we could get electromagnetic

1199
01:04:02,760 --> 01:04:03,720
Speaker 1: pulse from the sun.

1200
01:04:05,040 --> 01:04:07,920
Speaker 5: Right exactly. It's called to seem the gronal mass ejection.

1201
01:04:08,320 --> 01:04:11,560
Speaker 5: Another thing to worry about. But the problem with the

1202
01:04:11,640 --> 01:04:15,600
Speaker 5: grid now is it's like December seventh, nineteen forty one.

1203
01:04:16,200 --> 01:04:19,000
Speaker 5: President meets with his staff and they got mister President,

1204
01:04:19,440 --> 01:04:22,240
Speaker 5: we've got a problem. All our aircraft carriers are made

1205
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:26,600
Speaker 5: in Japan, our planes are made in Germany. Where are

1206
01:04:26,840 --> 01:04:32,560
Speaker 5: all our major components being made today China? Yes, that

1207
01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:33,840
Speaker 5: is what worries me.

1208
01:04:34,840 --> 01:04:38,600
Speaker 1: But the practical solution, assuming we don't have budget problems

1209
01:04:38,640 --> 01:04:41,280
Speaker 1: and we have sane people that are actually forward thinking

1210
01:04:41,400 --> 01:04:45,160
Speaker 1: and think and worried about this, your wonderful scenario with

1211
01:04:45,480 --> 01:04:49,880
Speaker 1: December seventh, nineteen forty one is great, But going back

1212
01:04:49,920 --> 01:04:54,360
Speaker 1: to the fundamental question, can it be protected enough that

1213
01:04:54,560 --> 01:04:57,840
Speaker 1: this catastrophic scenario you're talking about with ninety percent of

1214
01:04:57,880 --> 01:05:00,600
Speaker 1: the population being dead by one year, to be protected

1215
01:05:00,640 --> 01:05:04,240
Speaker 1: to the extent where we wouldn't have that level of catastrophe. Yeah,

1216
01:05:04,840 --> 01:05:06,280
Speaker 1: of course that was a quick guest.

1217
01:05:07,320 --> 01:05:10,040
Speaker 5: Yes, it means, you know, I'm going to be optimistic

1218
01:05:10,160 --> 01:05:14,760
Speaker 5: on this, that we have to upgrade, harden, hardening the system,

1219
01:05:14,880 --> 01:05:20,360
Speaker 5: better circuit breakings, better status which are microcomputers, things like

1220
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:23,920
Speaker 5: that we could be doing it. And also we have

1221
01:05:24,080 --> 01:05:27,120
Speaker 5: to start using the nineteen forty one scenario. We got

1222
01:05:27,200 --> 01:05:30,920
Speaker 5: to learn to start re manufacturing things like transformers here

1223
01:05:30,960 --> 01:05:34,800
Speaker 5: in the United States. Yes, not shut overseas because we

1224
01:05:34,920 --> 01:05:37,400
Speaker 5: need quick replacement of parts in such a time.

1225
01:05:38,680 --> 01:05:42,480
Speaker 1: So, uh, a Faraday cage around my pad, my neighborhood's

1226
01:05:42,520 --> 01:05:44,800
Speaker 1: pad mounted transformers, would that help?

1227
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:46,000
Speaker 6: Oh?

1228
01:05:46,080 --> 01:05:46,280
Speaker 13: Yeah?

1229
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:48,000
Speaker 5: Expensive?

1230
01:05:48,480 --> 01:05:51,880
Speaker 1: It fair enough? Well, that's easy. Where the problem is,

1231
01:05:51,960 --> 01:05:54,400
Speaker 1: it's just really expensive. So rather than you know, deal

1232
01:05:54,440 --> 01:05:56,560
Speaker 1: with the realities of the expense and be forward thinking

1233
01:05:56,600 --> 01:05:58,720
Speaker 1: that it's like, well, it's too expensive to do it,

1234
01:05:58,840 --> 01:06:01,360
Speaker 1: so just let's keep pushing forward with incentives to buy

1235
01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:03,480
Speaker 1: electric vehicles and not worry about the problem.

1236
01:06:04,080 --> 01:06:08,920
Speaker 5: Well the name book, Yeah, it's it's called expectation of normalacy.

1237
01:06:09,080 --> 01:06:11,000
Speaker 5: We expect things to continue as they are.

1238
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:15,000
Speaker 1: M well, like ostriches with this ahead in the sand.

1239
01:06:15,080 --> 01:06:17,560
Speaker 1: This is the emp reality we're facing and I appreciate

1240
01:06:17,680 --> 01:06:21,360
Speaker 1: Doctor Fortune giving us the information and regularly doing so.

1241
01:06:21,480 --> 01:06:24,160
Speaker 1: In these wonderful, wonderful books. You can get them on

1242
01:06:24,200 --> 01:06:27,160
Speaker 1: my blog page fifty five CARC dot com. Doctor, we

1243
01:06:27,280 --> 01:06:29,439
Speaker 1: have your book linked there so my listeners can easily

1244
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:31,560
Speaker 1: get a copy of it. And congratulations on all your

1245
01:06:31,600 --> 01:06:34,480
Speaker 1: best selling works. Fabulous reads, all of them. And I

1246
01:06:34,640 --> 01:06:36,400
Speaker 1: know my listeners will enjoy not just this one, but

1247
01:06:36,520 --> 01:06:38,400
Speaker 1: your other works, and I'll encourage them to check them out,

1248
01:06:38,800 --> 01:06:41,240
Speaker 1: Doctor Fortune, keep up the great work. I enjoyed our

1249
01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:43,560
Speaker 1: conversation today and certainly appreciate the time you spent with

1250
01:06:43,600 --> 01:06:47,640
Speaker 1: my listeners in me heyto two here a fifty five

1251
01:06:47,680 --> 01:06:49,920
Speaker 1: car CUD talk station, and a very happy Wednesday to you.

1252
01:06:50,040 --> 01:06:51,840
Speaker 1: Coming up bottom of the hour every Wednesday here in

1253
01:06:51,840 --> 01:06:53,960
Speaker 1: the fifty five CARC Morning Show, Judge Inn and Apolatana

1254
01:06:54,040 --> 01:06:56,320
Speaker 1: to talk about the freedom of speech, which is a

1255
01:06:56,440 --> 01:06:58,880
Speaker 1: topic that is addressed in the book I'm talking about

1256
01:06:58,880 --> 01:07:01,280
Speaker 1: with my next guest, Greg. You may know him former

1257
01:07:01,400 --> 01:07:04,840
Speaker 1: trial attorney as opposed to what I was, a litigation attorney.

1258
01:07:04,880 --> 01:07:07,680
Speaker 1: Big difference. Aaron Greg knows the difference. New York Times

1259
01:07:07,800 --> 01:07:10,200
Speaker 1: best selling author of the Russian hoax and witch hunts.

1260
01:07:10,240 --> 01:07:12,640
Speaker 1: A legal and political analyst for Fox News, where he

1261
01:07:12,680 --> 01:07:14,680
Speaker 1: was an anchor for fifteen years. Prior to Fox, he

1262
01:07:14,720 --> 01:07:17,200
Speaker 1: was an anchor and correspondent for MSNBC and an anchor

1263
01:07:17,240 --> 01:07:21,440
Speaker 1: at Court TV. He has compiled and written commentary as

1264
01:07:21,480 --> 01:07:23,840
Speaker 1: well as an introduction on the book we're talking about today,

1265
01:07:24,280 --> 01:07:27,360
Speaker 1: the Constitution of the United States and other patriotic documents.

1266
01:07:27,400 --> 01:07:29,480
Speaker 1: Welcome to the program, Greg Jarrett, it's a real pleasure

1267
01:07:29,480 --> 01:07:30,200
Speaker 1: to have you on today.

1268
01:07:30,720 --> 01:07:33,480
Speaker 12: Well, Brian, my pleasure to be with you, Thanks so much.

1269
01:07:33,840 --> 01:07:35,920
Speaker 1: And yeah, Judging, I mean for the materials that are

1270
01:07:35,960 --> 01:07:38,960
Speaker 1: in the book, and you have a wealth of important

1271
01:07:39,560 --> 01:07:43,959
Speaker 1: documents in this book. Constitution, Declaration of Independence, Bill of Wright,

1272
01:07:44,080 --> 01:07:48,040
Speaker 1: certain federalist papers, selections, articles or confederations, writings from Frederick

1273
01:07:48,080 --> 01:07:52,840
Speaker 1: Douglass writing, Ronald Reagan, writings and speeches Albert Einstein. This

1274
01:07:53,440 --> 01:07:56,960
Speaker 1: is fascinating. How is it that you selected these particular

1275
01:07:57,120 --> 01:08:00,560
Speaker 1: documents which people can read in full along with your commentary.

1276
01:08:00,600 --> 01:08:04,840
Speaker 1: What was the motivation behind this, Greg, Well.

1277
01:08:04,760 --> 01:08:07,960
Speaker 12: There was no other book like it. There are some

1278
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:11,960
Speaker 12: other books that print in part the Constitution and then

1279
01:08:12,120 --> 01:08:17,280
Speaker 12: follow it up with speeches by Hillary Clinton and you know,

1280
01:08:17,479 --> 01:08:24,200
Speaker 12: sort of this deconstruction of our American history and the

1281
01:08:24,360 --> 01:08:27,400
Speaker 12: very negative. I couldn't find what I wanted, so I

1282
01:08:27,520 --> 01:08:31,160
Speaker 12: decided to write it myself. This is a tribute to

1283
01:08:31,280 --> 01:08:35,160
Speaker 12: the many patriots who made America great. We are a

1284
01:08:35,400 --> 01:08:40,720
Speaker 12: luminous beacon for liberty, prosperity, and justice. And in the

1285
01:08:40,760 --> 01:08:45,599
Speaker 12: book you can read our nation's most important documents, speeches, letters.

1286
01:08:45,680 --> 01:08:48,360
Speaker 12: You mentioned a few of them, but these are things

1287
01:08:48,439 --> 01:08:53,840
Speaker 12: that changed the course of history, inspiring words and galvanizing

1288
01:08:54,000 --> 01:08:59,440
Speaker 12: ideas that shaped America our virtues, our aspirations, our ideals.

1289
01:08:59,520 --> 01:09:05,520
Speaker 12: And sadly, you know, public education they don't really emphasize

1290
01:09:05,680 --> 01:09:09,720
Speaker 12: or teach government and civics. And I've found that out

1291
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:14,479
Speaker 12: through my own young daughters at the time. And you know,

1292
01:09:14,880 --> 01:09:17,840
Speaker 12: that was the really germination.

1293
01:09:17,760 --> 01:09:18,479
Speaker 14: Of this book.

1294
01:09:18,920 --> 01:09:21,720
Speaker 1: Yea, it's the benefit of having concerned parents, you know,

1295
01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:24,240
Speaker 1: you can get the blanks filled in at home. That

1296
01:09:24,360 --> 01:09:25,040
Speaker 1: was my situation.

1297
01:09:25,200 --> 01:09:25,479
Speaker 6: At home.

1298
01:09:25,560 --> 01:09:29,000
Speaker 1: We had regular family dinner discussions and my dad was

1299
01:09:29,120 --> 01:09:31,519
Speaker 1: very politically motivated and active. That's how I got involved

1300
01:09:31,560 --> 01:09:34,160
Speaker 1: in politics at a young young age. But got all

1301
01:09:34,240 --> 01:09:37,519
Speaker 1: this sort of important foundational information around the dining room

1302
01:09:37,560 --> 01:09:40,640
Speaker 1: table because it isn't in schools anymore. And Greg, you

1303
01:09:40,720 --> 01:09:44,080
Speaker 1: know you've I think you've done a wonderful job of illustrating,

1304
01:09:44,640 --> 01:09:49,440
Speaker 1: sadly illustrating the loss of eloquence in modern political discourse.

1305
01:09:49,920 --> 01:09:53,240
Speaker 1: These were in many cases, this preceded the Internet and

1306
01:09:53,320 --> 01:09:56,880
Speaker 1: preceded radio. Folks had to communicate their ideas and thoughts

1307
01:09:57,240 --> 01:10:00,240
Speaker 1: in a profound way so they could change the arts

1308
01:10:00,280 --> 01:10:03,920
Speaker 1: and minds of people. And do offer their arguments and

1309
01:10:03,960 --> 01:10:06,120
Speaker 1: their opinions in an effort to change the hearts and

1310
01:10:06,160 --> 01:10:08,800
Speaker 1: minds of people. This is great work here.

1311
01:10:09,840 --> 01:10:12,559
Speaker 12: Thank you very much, Brian. You know how lucky are

1312
01:10:12,680 --> 01:10:18,000
Speaker 12: we to live in the greatest nation in history. And

1313
01:10:18,280 --> 01:10:23,479
Speaker 12: fortunately the eloquence of the written word and the spoken

1314
01:10:23,600 --> 01:10:28,760
Speaker 12: word have been honored and preserved for our national heritage.

1315
01:10:28,920 --> 01:10:32,519
Speaker 12: And it's all contained in my book. It came out

1316
01:10:32,760 --> 01:10:35,920
Speaker 12: yesterday nationwide. It can be ordered online. You'll find it

1317
01:10:36,040 --> 01:10:37,440
Speaker 12: in bookstores everywhere.

1318
01:10:37,560 --> 01:10:38,679
Speaker 6: And we were.

1319
01:10:38,840 --> 01:10:44,840
Speaker 12: Blessed with extraordinary leaders. They stealed our resolve for independence

1320
01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:48,679
Speaker 12: and self determination. They invented this new form of government

1321
01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:52,759
Speaker 12: by the people and for the people, and those leaders

1322
01:10:52,800 --> 01:10:57,519
Speaker 12: who followed for more than two centuries ably guided us

1323
01:10:57,760 --> 01:11:02,040
Speaker 12: through these grave threats and treacher risk challenges, and you know,

1324
01:11:02,160 --> 01:11:06,240
Speaker 12: so this is a unique collector's edition of all of

1325
01:11:06,439 --> 01:11:07,679
Speaker 12: those wise words.

1326
01:11:08,240 --> 01:11:12,479
Speaker 1: And your commentary, you know, you contrasted what this book

1327
01:11:12,680 --> 01:11:16,680
Speaker 1: includes and contrasted with you Hillary Clinton going on in

1328
01:11:16,760 --> 01:11:20,640
Speaker 1: deconstructing the Constitution. She's making a political argument, obviously a

1329
01:11:20,840 --> 01:11:24,200
Speaker 1: left leaning political argument, but that's not what you were

1330
01:11:24,240 --> 01:11:27,080
Speaker 1: trying to do here. You're not trying to accomplish some

1331
01:11:27,200 --> 01:11:32,800
Speaker 1: sort of uh, you know, modern US versus them debate here.

1332
01:11:34,280 --> 01:11:39,280
Speaker 12: Yeah, you're you're right. As I had looked across publications,

1333
01:11:39,439 --> 01:11:45,040
Speaker 12: across Amazon, other retailers, I was really amazed to realize

1334
01:11:45,120 --> 01:11:48,480
Speaker 12: that I couldn't find what I was looking for, a patriotic,

1335
01:11:48,560 --> 01:11:54,679
Speaker 12: complete American made selection of our greatest documents. So I resolved,

1336
01:11:54,720 --> 01:11:59,640
Speaker 12: I'm going to do it. And this doesn't promote an agenda.

1337
01:12:00,240 --> 01:12:05,080
Speaker 12: It has the full Constitution. It contains essential conservative documents

1338
01:12:05,120 --> 01:12:09,600
Speaker 12: as well as liberal ones, everything from Booker T. Washington,

1339
01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:15,360
Speaker 12: Frederick Douglas through Teddy Roosevelt, Dwight Eisenhower, and among my

1340
01:12:15,560 --> 01:12:23,800
Speaker 12: favorites truly is Ronald Reagan. So this book is philosophically patriotic.

1341
01:12:23,960 --> 01:12:25,240
Speaker 12: It is not partisan.

1342
01:12:25,960 --> 01:12:30,080
Speaker 1: Well and liberal conservative. One of my favorite liberals, Thomas Jefferson,

1343
01:12:30,120 --> 01:12:34,439
Speaker 1: a true liberal in the traditional sense of liberalism, you know,

1344
01:12:34,560 --> 01:12:38,000
Speaker 1: obviously believed in freedoms and liberties, and what an unbelievably

1345
01:12:38,040 --> 01:12:40,479
Speaker 1: important person shaping the direction of our country.

1346
01:12:41,600 --> 01:12:46,840
Speaker 12: Oh he really was quite a brilliant man. And he

1347
01:12:47,080 --> 01:12:53,320
Speaker 12: was so well educated. Oh yeah, and really a magician wordsmith.

1348
01:12:53,479 --> 01:12:58,200
Speaker 12: But you've also got John Adams who was warning that

1349
01:12:58,439 --> 01:13:03,200
Speaker 12: unscrupulous men in power, if left unchecked, would become ravenous

1350
01:13:03,400 --> 01:13:07,280
Speaker 12: beasts of prey, destroying our government. And he was right

1351
01:13:07,400 --> 01:13:12,600
Speaker 12: about that. We have seen that recently with the weaponization

1352
01:13:13,760 --> 01:13:19,120
Speaker 12: of authority by the FBI, the Department of Justice, intelligence agencies,

1353
01:13:19,160 --> 01:13:26,040
Speaker 12: and George Washington warned away from political parties. He said,

1354
01:13:26,080 --> 01:13:31,240
Speaker 12: these will become potent engines of unprincipled men. Political parties

1355
01:13:31,360 --> 01:13:36,680
Speaker 12: will undermine our freedom. We should not abide by them. Unfortunately,

1356
01:13:37,360 --> 01:13:38,240
Speaker 12: no one listened.

1357
01:13:39,960 --> 01:13:42,400
Speaker 1: Yes, isn't that the truth? And those who do not

1358
01:13:42,479 --> 01:13:44,720
Speaker 1: study mistakes of the past are destined to repeat them.

1359
01:13:44,760 --> 01:13:46,760
Speaker 1: We seem to be on our on a timeline on

1360
01:13:46,840 --> 01:13:49,240
Speaker 1: that ins far as our monetary system is concerned. You know,

1361
01:13:49,360 --> 01:13:51,479
Speaker 1: we should look at Venezuela when we're talking about something

1362
01:13:51,560 --> 01:13:52,840
Speaker 1: like that, but I don't want to go down that road.

1363
01:13:53,240 --> 01:13:55,040
Speaker 1: He also include and I thought this was a rather

1364
01:13:55,120 --> 01:13:59,719
Speaker 1: interesting contribution, Albert Einstein's warning to President Franklin Delan Rosebult

1365
01:13:59,720 --> 01:14:00,719
Speaker 1: about the atomic bomb.

1366
01:14:02,240 --> 01:14:05,360
Speaker 12: Yeah, I mean it was so amazing. Of course, the

1367
01:14:05,479 --> 01:14:11,519
Speaker 12: renowned theoretical physicist, world renowned, he sent this secret letter

1368
01:14:11,840 --> 01:14:15,599
Speaker 12: to Franklin Roosevelt, and he had been tracking the use

1369
01:14:16,320 --> 01:14:21,520
Speaker 12: of uranium abroad, and he sends this letter to Roosevelt

1370
01:14:21,640 --> 01:14:25,560
Speaker 12: warning him that he thinks the Nazis are attempting to

1371
01:14:25,720 --> 01:14:31,479
Speaker 12: develop this new and frightening a powerful weapon, an atomic bomb.

1372
01:14:31,800 --> 01:14:36,839
Speaker 12: And you know, he raised the alarm, and that triggered

1373
01:14:37,560 --> 01:14:42,240
Speaker 12: the US British covert operation to build our own weapon

1374
01:14:42,920 --> 01:14:47,320
Speaker 12: in the highly classified Manhattan Project. I think great. Many

1375
01:14:47,360 --> 01:14:53,000
Speaker 12: Americans don't know that, they don't appreciate that. And of

1376
01:14:53,080 --> 01:14:57,680
Speaker 12: course Harry Truman ordered the use of the atomic bombs.

1377
01:14:58,320 --> 01:15:02,920
Speaker 12: You'll read his famous statement, the force from which the

1378
01:15:03,040 --> 01:15:06,080
Speaker 12: Sun draws its power has been loosened against those who

1379
01:15:06,200 --> 01:15:09,760
Speaker 12: brought war to the Far East. And then he was

1380
01:15:09,880 --> 01:15:14,960
Speaker 12: followed by Dwight Eisenhower. You can read his efforts to

1381
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:20,600
Speaker 12: seek peace through strength, to halt nuclear proliferation. All of

1382
01:15:20,680 --> 01:15:25,639
Speaker 12: these are important documents and addresses and speeches and letters

1383
01:15:25,760 --> 01:15:29,360
Speaker 12: that you know, I think Americans need to revisit to

1384
01:15:29,479 --> 01:15:32,400
Speaker 12: rekindle the American spirit.

1385
01:15:33,280 --> 01:15:37,080
Speaker 1: Well, and another truly impactful person. I think that doesn't

1386
01:15:37,080 --> 01:15:41,519
Speaker 1: get enough, you know, press or people don't go back

1387
01:15:41,560 --> 01:15:44,839
Speaker 1: and reread his important writings Frederick Douglas.

1388
01:15:45,720 --> 01:15:49,040
Speaker 12: Yeah, you know, you just took the words out of

1389
01:15:49,080 --> 01:15:53,280
Speaker 12: my mouth. Truly one of the highlights of my book.

1390
01:15:53,320 --> 01:15:58,400
Speaker 12: And understand who Frederick Douglas was, an escape slave who

1391
01:15:58,560 --> 01:16:04,000
Speaker 12: became an at aist icon and a confident of Abraham Lincoln.

1392
01:16:04,040 --> 01:16:07,960
Speaker 12: At one point, you know, black people were not traditionally

1393
01:16:08,040 --> 01:16:10,680
Speaker 12: allowed in the White House. Lincoln changed all of that,

1394
01:16:10,960 --> 01:16:13,840
Speaker 12: and in one encounter in a room full of people

1395
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:18,200
Speaker 12: in the White House in moocks, Frederick Douglass all eyes

1396
01:16:18,360 --> 01:16:22,479
Speaker 12: turned to him, and Lincoln steps forward and says, here

1397
01:16:22,840 --> 01:16:27,040
Speaker 12: is the man whose judgment I trust more than any

1398
01:16:27,120 --> 01:16:32,799
Speaker 12: other human being. And after Lincoln was assassinated, Frederick Douglas

1399
01:16:33,920 --> 01:16:38,720
Speaker 12: printed one of the greatest eulogies to the man who, probably,

1400
01:16:38,880 --> 01:16:42,240
Speaker 12: at least in my judgment, was the greatest president in

1401
01:16:42,360 --> 01:16:44,360
Speaker 12: American history, Abraham Lincoln.

1402
01:16:44,720 --> 01:16:47,600
Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln and some people view him as very controversial

1403
01:16:47,680 --> 01:16:50,760
Speaker 1: for wanting to maintain the Republic and not allow the

1404
01:16:50,880 --> 01:16:53,680
Speaker 1: Southern States to break away. Some argue that is well

1405
01:16:53,720 --> 01:16:57,640
Speaker 1: within the constitution. When the powers that be are, you know,

1406
01:16:57,840 --> 01:16:59,439
Speaker 1: serving the will of the people, then you have a

1407
01:16:59,520 --> 01:17:01,479
Speaker 1: right to be against some sort of basis of our

1408
01:17:01,560 --> 01:17:04,800
Speaker 1: country's foundation. Is there any common right in there on that?

1409
01:17:05,880 --> 01:17:11,160
Speaker 12: Well, you know, you are arguably correct if you take

1410
01:17:11,240 --> 01:17:15,960
Speaker 12: the meaning literally. You know, we've come to think of,

1411
01:17:18,040 --> 01:17:23,200
Speaker 12: you know, the Civil War as an effort to abolish

1412
01:17:23,320 --> 01:17:29,439
Speaker 12: slavery and human bondage. That certainly became the principal purpose,

1413
01:17:30,120 --> 01:17:32,439
Speaker 12: but at the beginning it was told to hold the

1414
01:17:32,600 --> 01:17:38,479
Speaker 12: Union together. And you know, Abraham Lincoln was left to

1415
01:17:38,680 --> 01:17:44,920
Speaker 12: deal with the faustian bargain that our founders had created.

1416
01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:50,800
Speaker 12: They wanted the Constitution to be approved so much that

1417
01:17:50,960 --> 01:17:54,040
Speaker 12: they kicked the can down the road on slavery, which,

1418
01:17:54,640 --> 01:17:58,880
Speaker 12: and as I describe in my introduction, was shameful, a

1419
01:17:58,960 --> 01:18:03,840
Speaker 12: shameful bargain. And you can criticize so many of our

1420
01:18:03,920 --> 01:18:08,839
Speaker 12: founders for being slaveholders themselves, with the exception of John Adams,

1421
01:18:09,200 --> 01:18:14,479
Speaker 12: who was virulently against slavery. And so if I have

1422
01:18:14,600 --> 01:18:21,160
Speaker 12: one regret, by the way, it is. Abigail Adams. Her beautiful, brilliant,

1423
01:18:21,479 --> 01:18:25,120
Speaker 12: intelligent letters are not included in the book.

1424
01:18:25,600 --> 01:18:26,200
Speaker 8: You know, we did.

1425
01:18:26,479 --> 01:18:30,160
Speaker 12: We had to draw some lines. But these were great

1426
01:18:30,240 --> 01:18:34,479
Speaker 12: people in American history, and they're memorialized in this book

1427
01:18:34,560 --> 01:18:38,280
Speaker 12: so that you can read their thoughts, their ideas and

1428
01:18:38,479 --> 01:18:39,400
Speaker 12: their words.

1429
01:18:39,800 --> 01:18:43,160
Speaker 1: Well, it suggests those comments that you just made. Greg Jared,

1430
01:18:43,200 --> 01:18:45,439
Speaker 1: Author or collector of the United States and the Constitution,

1431
01:18:45,560 --> 01:18:48,559
Speaker 1: United States and the Patriotic Documents, Volume two. I am

1432
01:18:48,640 --> 01:18:50,920
Speaker 1: certain that there is a wealth of additional documents you

1433
01:18:51,040 --> 01:18:53,200
Speaker 1: could come up with a follow up volume.

1434
01:18:54,080 --> 01:18:59,120
Speaker 12: There are you should see my pile of documents on

1435
01:18:59,320 --> 01:19:03,559
Speaker 12: my dad and Abigail's at the top. I so much

1436
01:19:04,160 --> 01:19:07,080
Speaker 12: wanted to include her, and so yeah, maybe there's a

1437
01:19:07,360 --> 01:19:09,439
Speaker 12: volume two come. That's a great idea, or.

1438
01:19:09,400 --> 01:19:11,640
Speaker 1: At least a supplement, an updated edition to include the

1439
01:19:11,680 --> 01:19:14,200
Speaker 1: other chapters that you left out. Greg Jared, this is

1440
01:19:14,320 --> 01:19:16,160
Speaker 1: great and I know my listener is going to love it.

1441
01:19:16,240 --> 01:19:18,320
Speaker 1: My audience eats this stuff up. And these are in

1442
01:19:18,479 --> 01:19:22,400
Speaker 1: documents that every household should have sort of your own.

1443
01:19:22,680 --> 01:19:25,320
Speaker 1: If you're a political person, you probably have independently collected

1444
01:19:25,439 --> 01:19:27,160
Speaker 1: so many of the works that are included in here.

1445
01:19:27,200 --> 01:19:30,120
Speaker 1: But here you are one volume hard copy. Greg Jared

1446
01:19:30,160 --> 01:19:32,519
Speaker 1: has done a wonderful job collecting him and offering his commentary.

1447
01:19:32,600 --> 01:19:37,000
Speaker 1: One other one, I guess the original A women's suffrage fighter.

1448
01:19:37,320 --> 01:19:40,080
Speaker 1: Susan B. Anthony's Proclamation on women's right to Vote is

1449
01:19:40,080 --> 01:19:40,799
Speaker 1: also included.

1450
01:19:41,640 --> 01:19:47,800
Speaker 12: Oh, it is as well as Victoria Woodhall, who argue

1451
01:19:47,840 --> 01:19:51,240
Speaker 12: the Constitution makes no distinction of sex and women are

1452
01:19:51,400 --> 01:19:54,720
Speaker 12: the equals of men. I think she was wrong. I

1453
01:19:54,760 --> 01:19:58,240
Speaker 12: think women, at least in my family are far superior.

1454
01:19:58,479 --> 01:19:59,240
Speaker 12: Yes to the men.

1455
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:01,720
Speaker 1: Sounds like thank you married out of your element, Greg,

1456
01:20:01,880 --> 01:20:02,439
Speaker 1: Like I did.

1457
01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:07,280
Speaker 12: Yes, Oh yeah, totally married, And I'm so grateful.

1458
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:10,080
Speaker 1: Smart men do that, so you and I get props

1459
01:20:10,120 --> 01:20:11,680
Speaker 1: for doing the right thing. It's so far as our

1460
01:20:11,760 --> 01:20:14,920
Speaker 1: partners are concerned. The whole idea is to rekindle the

1461
01:20:15,080 --> 01:20:17,880
Speaker 1: American spirit. You can do that very easily. Read the

1462
01:20:18,040 --> 01:20:21,920
Speaker 1: eloquence of these unbelievably famous folks and all the reasons

1463
01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:24,439
Speaker 1: they are unbelievably famous. And if they're not famous in

1464
01:20:24,520 --> 01:20:26,679
Speaker 1: your mind, then you need the book more than anybody.

1465
01:20:26,720 --> 01:20:29,040
Speaker 1: The Constitution of the United States and the Patriotic Documents.

1466
01:20:29,280 --> 01:20:32,200
Speaker 1: Greg Jarrett, Thanks on behalf of all my listeners and

1467
01:20:32,360 --> 01:20:35,560
Speaker 1: me for putting these all together and collecting them and

1468
01:20:35,920 --> 01:20:39,160
Speaker 1: showing the importance of reading and going back and studying

1469
01:20:39,720 --> 01:20:42,559
Speaker 1: where how we got here from there. Greg, It's been

1470
01:20:42,560 --> 01:20:43,960
Speaker 1: a real pleasure having you on the program.

1471
01:20:44,080 --> 01:20:47,000
Speaker 12: Thanks again, find my pleasure and thanks so much. I

1472
01:20:47,120 --> 01:20:49,519
Speaker 12: really appreciate your kind words about the book.

1473
01:20:49,880 --> 01:20:52,560
Speaker 1: Joining the fifty five Caresey Morning Show. Frank Abrams a

1474
01:20:52,640 --> 01:20:56,160
Speaker 1: criminal defense attorney in North Carolina as well as Florida's

1475
01:20:56,160 --> 01:20:59,960
Speaker 1: practicing federal state criminal law for thirty eight plus years.

1476
01:21:00,520 --> 01:21:02,760
Speaker 1: He's been on public radio and court TV, and he

1477
01:21:02,960 --> 01:21:05,800
Speaker 1: is an author and today we're welcoming to the fifty

1478
01:21:05,840 --> 01:21:08,280
Speaker 1: five Carse Morning Show to talk about his book, The

1479
01:21:08,400 --> 01:21:10,840
Speaker 1: Cock Fight. And I observe Frank, and it's a pleasure

1480
01:21:10,840 --> 01:21:12,719
Speaker 1: to have you on the program. It's been long stated

1481
01:21:12,720 --> 01:21:15,000
Speaker 1: the law holds it as better the ten guilty persons

1482
01:21:15,160 --> 01:21:18,720
Speaker 1: escape than one innocent sufferer. I'm a firm believer in that,

1483
01:21:18,800 --> 01:21:20,240
Speaker 1: and there was a time in my life, Frank, that

1484
01:21:20,320 --> 01:21:23,000
Speaker 1: I believed in the death penalty. But as I've gotten,

1485
01:21:23,360 --> 01:21:27,479
Speaker 1: coming older and wiser and having practiced litigation for sixteen years,

1486
01:21:27,600 --> 01:21:29,840
Speaker 1: I am painfully aware of the fact that quite often,

1487
01:21:30,200 --> 01:21:34,440
Speaker 1: well maybe not often, but sometimes innocent people are convicted,

1488
01:21:34,520 --> 01:21:36,200
Speaker 1: and if the state has the ability to take your

1489
01:21:36,280 --> 01:21:39,639
Speaker 1: life from you, that's a scary proposition. Welcome Frank, Sorry

1490
01:21:39,680 --> 01:21:40,599
Speaker 1: for being long winded.

1491
01:21:41,840 --> 01:21:44,240
Speaker 4: Oh no, it's an honor and a pleasure, and you

1492
01:21:44,600 --> 01:21:46,519
Speaker 4: are one hundred percent on point.

1493
01:21:46,800 --> 01:21:47,080
Speaker 9: Ryan.

1494
01:21:47,760 --> 01:21:50,040
Speaker 4: So can I tell you a little bit about how

1495
01:21:50,240 --> 01:21:51,240
Speaker 4: this book came about?

1496
01:21:51,439 --> 01:21:54,920
Speaker 1: Absolutely, Plus explain the title for my listeners so they

1497
01:21:55,000 --> 01:21:56,160
Speaker 1: understand the relationship.

1498
01:21:57,400 --> 01:22:01,160
Speaker 4: Okay, the title of the book is The cock Fight.

1499
01:22:02,000 --> 01:22:05,000
Speaker 4: So one day I'm sitting at federal court. This is

1500
01:22:05,120 --> 01:22:08,559
Speaker 4: a few years back, and it comes to my attention

1501
01:22:08,760 --> 01:22:12,160
Speaker 4: and the attention that's some other attorneys that there's a

1502
01:22:12,360 --> 01:22:19,320
Speaker 4: Kentucky crime lab that has been mishandling DNA. So, Brian,

1503
01:22:19,640 --> 01:22:24,519
Speaker 4: I thought to myself, what could go wrong there? So

1504
01:22:24,680 --> 01:22:28,200
Speaker 4: that's when I started. Yeah, that's when I started writing

1505
01:22:28,560 --> 01:22:32,280
Speaker 4: the book. It gets even better, but I started writing

1506
01:22:32,360 --> 01:22:34,800
Speaker 4: the book. The main character of my book is a

1507
01:22:35,040 --> 01:22:40,280
Speaker 4: teacher of the year who's falsely accused of a relationship

1508
01:22:40,760 --> 01:22:43,240
Speaker 4: with a student, loses everything he has and is living

1509
01:22:43,760 --> 01:22:49,439
Speaker 4: under a bridge with homeless people. Now why is it

1510
01:22:49,680 --> 01:22:54,320
Speaker 4: called the cock Fight? The answer is because every third

1511
01:22:54,400 --> 01:22:57,320
Speaker 4: Friday of the month under this bridge, they have cock fights.

1512
01:22:57,880 --> 01:23:02,679
Speaker 4: Why because the basis of the book is they treat

1513
01:23:03,200 --> 01:23:06,840
Speaker 4: animals the same way fighting roosters the same way they

1514
01:23:06,920 --> 01:23:11,479
Speaker 4: treat people. They make them mean and angry towards each other,

1515
01:23:11,880 --> 01:23:16,400
Speaker 4: and then they make money in the whole unholy process.

1516
01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:19,280
Speaker 1: I'm glad you pointed out the money thing, because I

1517
01:23:19,400 --> 01:23:22,400
Speaker 1: had that line in the notes circled for this reason

1518
01:23:22,520 --> 01:23:26,080
Speaker 1: because as you know from my comments introducing you having

1519
01:23:26,160 --> 01:23:29,559
Speaker 1: practice litigation and eight years in Chicago and eight years

1520
01:23:29,600 --> 01:23:33,160
Speaker 1: in house with a healthcare company, I know how expensive

1521
01:23:33,600 --> 01:23:37,639
Speaker 1: retaining a lawyer is. I mean outrageous amounts of money.

1522
01:23:37,680 --> 01:23:42,040
Speaker 1: You're talking several hundred at minimum dollars an hour. And

1523
01:23:42,120 --> 01:23:44,320
Speaker 1: if you get falsely accused of crime or accused of crime,

1524
01:23:44,400 --> 01:23:46,479
Speaker 1: generally speaking, you have to get a defense attorney unless

1525
01:23:46,520 --> 01:23:49,439
Speaker 1: you rely on the public defender. And I will welcome

1526
01:23:49,479 --> 01:23:53,160
Speaker 1: your observations about the competency of the public Defender's office,

1527
01:23:53,200 --> 01:23:55,760
Speaker 1: but they tend to be overwhelmed with a number of

1528
01:23:55,840 --> 01:23:59,040
Speaker 1: cases they had, So to get competent counsel, it's coming

1529
01:23:59,080 --> 01:24:01,760
Speaker 1: out of your pocket. And for those the monments that

1530
01:24:01,840 --> 01:24:04,240
Speaker 1: don't have a lot of money, it's an impossible chore.

1531
01:24:06,240 --> 01:24:14,680
Speaker 4: Abbsosolutely public. Defender's offices across the country are utterly overwhelmed.

1532
01:24:14,720 --> 01:24:18,520
Speaker 4: They don't have the time, they don't have the resources.

1533
01:24:19,040 --> 01:24:25,040
Speaker 4: But this even gets better because yesterday in the news

1534
01:24:25,360 --> 01:24:31,200
Speaker 4: came out a story that a crime lab analyst altered

1535
01:24:31,680 --> 01:24:38,800
Speaker 4: DNA evidence in hundreds of cases in Colorado. Yesterday's news,

1536
01:24:39,080 --> 01:24:41,479
Speaker 4: it's like they knew, Brian, that I was going to

1537
01:24:41,520 --> 01:24:45,280
Speaker 4: be interviewed by you today. It's like they knew why.

1538
01:24:45,720 --> 01:24:51,160
Speaker 1: And no, the timing is excellent, Frankfort, Why would they

1539
01:24:51,320 --> 01:24:51,680
Speaker 1: do that?

1540
01:24:53,479 --> 01:24:56,640
Speaker 4: Well, here's the thing I wrote. I wrote in my

1541
01:24:56,680 --> 01:24:59,960
Speaker 4: book of the story of this teacher's fight to clear

1542
01:25:00,320 --> 01:25:03,040
Speaker 4: his name and all that he has to go through.

1543
01:25:03,640 --> 01:25:06,760
Speaker 4: And in it, I have a hearing and a trial,

1544
01:25:06,800 --> 01:25:10,640
Speaker 4: and there's eight potential eight reasons, eight things more than

1545
01:25:10,680 --> 01:25:14,320
Speaker 4: eight actually that can go wrong, and a lot of

1546
01:25:14,400 --> 01:25:19,480
Speaker 4: it has to do with time elements. These lab analysts

1547
01:25:19,520 --> 01:25:22,439
Speaker 4: are told, we want these results, we want them now.

1548
01:25:22,560 --> 01:25:27,080
Speaker 4: There's hundreds and hundreds of cases. They'll fudge results. There's

1549
01:25:27,200 --> 01:25:32,040
Speaker 4: evidence in that particular case she was indicted for over

1550
01:25:32,479 --> 01:25:37,360
Speaker 4: a hundred plus cases that she dealt with. You know,

1551
01:25:37,720 --> 01:25:40,040
Speaker 4: I can't say why people do things. But I know

1552
01:25:40,240 --> 01:25:44,959
Speaker 4: this that it happens, and when the system, when someone's

1553
01:25:45,080 --> 01:25:51,200
Speaker 4: life and someone's freedom is at stake, there has to

1554
01:25:51,280 --> 01:25:55,800
Speaker 4: be more than just oh, well, we have this test

1555
01:25:55,920 --> 01:25:59,479
Speaker 4: and we're gonna absolutely rely on the results of this test.

1556
01:26:00,240 --> 01:26:03,000
Speaker 1: Point Frank, I think there's a sort of perhaps it's

1557
01:26:03,040 --> 01:26:06,320
Speaker 1: a you know, presumably a government employee or some lab

1558
01:26:06,360 --> 01:26:08,679
Speaker 1: They don't have any relationship to defend it. Maybe there's

1559
01:26:08,680 --> 01:26:11,760
Speaker 1: a presumption of guilt because they've been charged, so they

1560
01:26:11,880 --> 01:26:14,920
Speaker 1: have a lack of care and concern that they should

1561
01:26:14,960 --> 01:26:16,800
Speaker 1: sort of put themselves in the position of the person

1562
01:26:16,840 --> 01:26:20,120
Speaker 1: who's a defendant and do the job correctly and be

1563
01:26:20,160 --> 01:26:23,000
Speaker 1: able to testify on the stand that everything every eye

1564
01:26:23,120 --> 01:26:26,680
Speaker 1: was dotted and t was crossed because lives are at

1565
01:26:26,760 --> 01:26:29,680
Speaker 1: stake here. But it's like taxpayer dollars. You know, the

1566
01:26:29,720 --> 01:26:31,760
Speaker 1: government doesn't care where the dollars come from. They don't

1567
01:26:31,760 --> 01:26:34,439
Speaker 1: have any incentive to be, you know, mindful of where

1568
01:26:34,520 --> 01:26:37,280
Speaker 1: the money's going because they have this open spigot, and

1569
01:26:37,400 --> 01:26:40,880
Speaker 1: that creates well, lack of care and concern. Same kind

1570
01:26:40,920 --> 01:26:44,519
Speaker 1: of parallel, boy, boy, Brian, or have you hit it

1571
01:26:44,720 --> 01:26:46,080
Speaker 1: and let me tell you that, Let me say this

1572
01:26:46,240 --> 01:26:48,120
Speaker 1: you want to talk about, you know, they talk about

1573
01:26:48,200 --> 01:26:53,360
Speaker 1: weaponizing the Justice Department against you know people. If you

1574
01:26:53,479 --> 01:26:56,000
Speaker 1: want to see the weaponization of the justice.

1575
01:26:55,800 --> 01:26:58,120
Speaker 4: Point, you ought to see how it's been weaponized against

1576
01:26:58,200 --> 01:27:03,320
Speaker 4: regular people and people who just can't afford to pay

1577
01:27:03,680 --> 01:27:08,960
Speaker 4: for expensive attorneys, and people who just don't have the resources.

1578
01:27:09,360 --> 01:27:13,640
Speaker 4: And now, of course we're in days of budgetary restraint,

1579
01:27:13,760 --> 01:27:17,240
Speaker 4: as we always have, so you know, good luck getting

1580
01:27:17,360 --> 01:27:21,040
Speaker 4: the court to approve money and say things like, well,

1581
01:27:21,439 --> 01:27:23,760
Speaker 4: you know, we're going to go ahead and do another test,

1582
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:26,719
Speaker 4: even though you've already had a test and your results

1583
01:27:26,760 --> 01:27:31,320
Speaker 4: have been tested in my book, the individual asks for

1584
01:27:31,680 --> 01:27:37,120
Speaker 4: another test, but it's rejected. It's rejected, and in federal

1585
01:27:37,200 --> 01:27:41,000
Speaker 4: courts they have something across the country called rocket dockets,

1586
01:27:41,360 --> 01:27:46,400
Speaker 4: and so it's like this, well, guess what, we don't

1587
01:27:46,439 --> 01:27:49,479
Speaker 4: have time to do another test. There's not going to

1588
01:27:49,560 --> 01:27:52,080
Speaker 4: be the money given to do another test, and guess what,

1589
01:27:52,160 --> 01:27:54,920
Speaker 4: you're gonna be in trial on Monday.

1590
01:27:55,680 --> 01:27:59,519
Speaker 5: So you see, yeah, yeah, yeah, see.

1591
01:27:59,400 --> 01:28:00,400
Speaker 6: How well I.

1592
01:28:03,320 --> 01:28:07,599
Speaker 1: Didn't practice I didn't practice criminal law. And I understand

1593
01:28:07,600 --> 01:28:10,320
Speaker 1: where you're coming from, though, because you know, when you're

1594
01:28:10,360 --> 01:28:14,120
Speaker 1: preparing for a trial, you have a lot of work

1595
01:28:14,200 --> 01:28:16,639
Speaker 1: on your plate and when and you're a criminal defendant,

1596
01:28:16,880 --> 01:28:19,840
Speaker 1: a criminal defense attorney, you know again your client's life

1597
01:28:20,000 --> 01:28:22,400
Speaker 1: is in your hands. I dealt with money matters, and

1598
01:28:22,520 --> 01:28:24,720
Speaker 1: of course that really is significant to your client, but

1599
01:28:25,320 --> 01:28:27,760
Speaker 1: lives aren't at stake, and so I feel for you, Frank,

1600
01:28:28,240 --> 01:28:31,280
Speaker 1: I really do. In the book It's the Cock Fight,

1601
01:28:31,400 --> 01:28:33,599
Speaker 1: It's on my blog page fifty five carse dot com.

1602
01:28:33,680 --> 01:28:36,559
Speaker 1: I'm my guest today, Frank Abrams. I appreciate your passion

1603
01:28:36,640 --> 01:28:39,280
Speaker 1: on this subject. It's something near and dear to my heart. Frank,

1604
01:28:39,360 --> 01:28:41,559
Speaker 1: it's been great having you on the program. I appreciate

1605
01:28:41,600 --> 01:28:44,519
Speaker 1: your sharing your time and with our listeners and documenting this.

1606
01:28:44,640 --> 01:28:46,880
Speaker 1: And it is a work of fiction, but Frank will

1607
01:28:46,880 --> 01:28:48,560
Speaker 1: tell you all day long, this is all based on

1608
01:28:48,680 --> 01:28:50,920
Speaker 1: reality and real quick Frank, in terms of being a

1609
01:28:50,960 --> 01:28:54,760
Speaker 1: defense attorney, if I wanted a separate DNA test because

1610
01:28:54,760 --> 01:28:57,160
Speaker 1: I had suspicions about the one that was presented by

1611
01:28:57,200 --> 01:29:00,200
Speaker 1: the prosecuting attorney, how much would it cost me as

1612
01:29:00,200 --> 01:29:02,360
Speaker 1: an a separate line item on the legal bill.

1613
01:29:03,800 --> 01:29:06,439
Speaker 4: Well, first of all, typically they take it takes quite

1614
01:29:06,439 --> 01:29:09,360
Speaker 4: a long time to do, but it would be in

1615
01:29:09,479 --> 01:29:13,599
Speaker 4: the many thousands of dollars at least three or four

1616
01:29:13,720 --> 01:29:16,920
Speaker 4: thousand dollars, and you're going to have to go ahead,

1617
01:29:16,960 --> 01:29:22,600
Speaker 4: basically and also retain an expert regarding that all to

1618
01:29:22,800 --> 01:29:27,160
Speaker 4: show that the first test had flaws. So take a

1619
01:29:27,240 --> 01:29:28,320
Speaker 4: guess what that's gone A.

1620
01:29:28,360 --> 01:29:30,400
Speaker 1: Put eight hundred plus dollars an hour.

1621
01:29:31,760 --> 01:29:35,599
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, eight hundred plus. You know what an honored

1622
01:29:35,680 --> 01:29:38,240
Speaker 4: has been to talk to you. It has just been

1623
01:29:38,320 --> 01:29:42,840
Speaker 4: such an honor to be interviewed. And this book I

1624
01:29:42,960 --> 01:29:44,519
Speaker 4: wrote came from my heart.

1625
01:29:44,680 --> 01:29:45,120
Speaker 1: I know it did.

1626
01:29:45,320 --> 01:29:49,519
Speaker 4: And people seem to like this because this is a

1627
01:29:49,560 --> 01:29:50,760
Speaker 4: book that tells it like.

1628
01:29:50,840 --> 01:29:53,479
Speaker 1: It is well and again you're outlining in this work

1629
01:29:53,520 --> 01:29:57,000
Speaker 1: of fiction real parallels to real life and again supporting

1630
01:29:57,120 --> 01:30:01,400
Speaker 1: my argument that there should be no death from the state. Frank,

1631
01:30:01,720 --> 01:30:03,640
Speaker 1: keep up the great work. Thanks for joining me on

1632
01:30:03,680 --> 01:30:05,400
Speaker 1: the morning show, and I'll recomend my listeners. Go to

1633
01:30:05,439 --> 01:30:07,080
Speaker 1: fifty five carsy dot com and get a copy of

1634
01:30:07,120 --> 01:30:09,400
Speaker 1: your book, The Cockfight. Welcome to the fifty five Cars

1635
01:30:09,600 --> 01:30:15,000
Speaker 1: Morning Show. Lee Borden's Lee is with Classical Conversations, but

1636
01:30:15,040 --> 01:30:18,320
Speaker 1: you can find all on Classical Conversations dot com. We're

1637
01:30:18,360 --> 01:30:23,080
Speaker 1: talking about homeschooling along a classical and faith based way

1638
01:30:23,240 --> 01:30:26,320
Speaker 1: and a wildly successful operation. It's been welcome to the program, Lee,

1639
01:30:26,360 --> 01:30:27,960
Speaker 1: it's a real pleasure to have you on today.

1640
01:30:29,040 --> 01:30:30,880
Speaker 11: Well, thanks for having me. I'm glad to be here.

1641
01:30:31,120 --> 01:30:33,720
Speaker 1: Well, I am obvious, well maybe not obvious to you.

1642
01:30:33,760 --> 01:30:35,640
Speaker 1: It's first time to speak. But I am very, very

1643
01:30:35,720 --> 01:30:39,679
Speaker 1: disappointed the state of Americans education, failing grades, passing students

1644
01:30:39,720 --> 01:30:41,560
Speaker 1: that don't have the skill sets to move on to

1645
01:30:41,600 --> 01:30:47,240
Speaker 1: the next grade, woke ideology, CRT teaching, gender pronouns that

1646
01:30:47,280 --> 01:30:48,880
Speaker 1: might fly in the face of, you know, a lot

1647
01:30:48,920 --> 01:30:51,080
Speaker 1: of people's belief systems, or just simply the notion that

1648
01:30:51,360 --> 01:30:54,040
Speaker 1: in order to just have these conversations which they're having

1649
01:30:54,160 --> 01:30:57,800
Speaker 1: with very young children, it necessarily involves a discussion of

1650
01:30:57,960 --> 01:31:01,960
Speaker 1: sex and sexuality, which I've offensive there are ways out

1651
01:31:02,040 --> 01:31:04,080
Speaker 1: of it. And I talk about homeschooling all the time

1652
01:31:04,120 --> 01:31:06,080
Speaker 1: in the program. Not that I did it, but we

1653
01:31:06,160 --> 01:31:08,280
Speaker 1: have a wonderful woman named Ta Shuemak who joins a

1654
01:31:08,320 --> 01:31:11,120
Speaker 1: program and she's got all the resources. She homeschooled. She

1655
01:31:11,280 --> 01:31:15,080
Speaker 1: encourages others to do it. Your organization does the same thing.

1656
01:31:15,200 --> 01:31:17,720
Speaker 1: Tell my listeners about classical conversations.

1657
01:31:19,000 --> 01:31:23,400
Speaker 11: Well, thank you so Classical Conversations is a support organization

1658
01:31:23,680 --> 01:31:28,200
Speaker 11: for families that are homeschooling. We enroll children in programs,

1659
01:31:28,280 --> 01:31:31,400
Speaker 11: but the parents attend because the parents are trying to

1660
01:31:31,479 --> 01:31:36,680
Speaker 11: figure out how to homeschool classically as Christians and in

1661
01:31:36,920 --> 01:31:41,759
Speaker 11: community when all of us were raised in secular, modern education,

1662
01:31:42,360 --> 01:31:44,680
Speaker 11: and so the parents need a friend, We need to

1663
01:31:44,760 --> 01:31:47,920
Speaker 11: help one another. So we have over twenty seven hundred

1664
01:31:47,960 --> 01:31:52,919
Speaker 11: communities across the United States where five to fifty students

1665
01:31:52,960 --> 01:31:56,320
Speaker 11: and their parents get together one day a week for

1666
01:31:56,439 --> 01:32:00,280
Speaker 11: half the year and they practice together teaching class school

1667
01:32:00,360 --> 01:32:04,720
Speaker 11: Christian education. We have a curated curriculum everybody's using, and

1668
01:32:04,800 --> 01:32:06,960
Speaker 11: then they go home and the parent now is better

1669
01:32:07,040 --> 01:32:10,200
Speaker 11: equipped to help their students through the assignments. And then

1670
01:32:10,200 --> 01:32:13,280
Speaker 11: they come back the next week and the students work

1671
01:32:13,400 --> 01:32:15,960
Speaker 11: on what we call the dialectic and rhetoric. There's a

1672
01:32:16,040 --> 01:32:20,800
Speaker 11: whole lot of interaction and peer activities. You know, you

1673
01:32:20,840 --> 01:32:22,760
Speaker 11: can see at home and be quiet and think and

1674
01:32:23,280 --> 01:32:25,840
Speaker 11: write your papers and do your math problems. So when

1675
01:32:25,880 --> 01:32:28,200
Speaker 11: we get together that one day week, the whole purpose

1676
01:32:28,320 --> 01:32:31,160
Speaker 11: is to have a lot of conversations around the material

1677
01:32:31,600 --> 01:32:34,560
Speaker 11: and it's all original source documents.

1678
01:32:34,960 --> 01:32:38,679
Speaker 1: I love that well, I just I'm saying out loud

1679
01:32:38,760 --> 01:32:41,479
Speaker 1: what I'm thinking, because one of the reservation reservations rather

1680
01:32:41,560 --> 01:32:45,080
Speaker 1: the people have often or the the retort to, well,

1681
01:32:45,120 --> 01:32:46,920
Speaker 1: I'm going to educate my child at home, is that

1682
01:32:47,160 --> 01:32:49,800
Speaker 1: they're going to lack this social interaction and that you know,

1683
01:32:49,880 --> 01:32:52,240
Speaker 1: it's important for kids to be around other kids and

1684
01:32:52,280 --> 01:32:54,800
Speaker 1: not just their siblings and mom and dad. So this

1685
01:32:55,160 --> 01:32:59,040
Speaker 1: provides that sort of quote unquote whole in homeschooling that

1686
01:32:59,200 --> 01:33:00,360
Speaker 1: some perceive to exist.

1687
01:33:01,760 --> 01:33:04,759
Speaker 11: Yeah, and so you know, I can read Shakespeare plays

1688
01:33:04,840 --> 01:33:06,839
Speaker 11: with my kids, and we can go over the Declaration

1689
01:33:06,920 --> 01:33:09,280
Speaker 11: of Independence. But it's a lot more fun when you

1690
01:33:09,360 --> 01:33:11,160
Speaker 11: do it one day a week with your friends who

1691
01:33:11,200 --> 01:33:13,600
Speaker 11: are doing the same thing. And besides being fun, it

1692
01:33:13,720 --> 01:33:15,880
Speaker 11: also makes us so that when it doesn't many seem

1693
01:33:15,960 --> 01:33:18,680
Speaker 11: important to one kid and they see another kid get

1694
01:33:18,720 --> 01:33:22,240
Speaker 11: all excited. There's you know, this enthusiasm that can be

1695
01:33:23,080 --> 01:33:26,720
Speaker 11: part of the socialization, you know, and academics and so.

1696
01:33:26,880 --> 01:33:28,880
Speaker 11: But you don't need to be doing it all day long,

1697
01:33:29,040 --> 01:33:29,680
Speaker 11: five days a.

1698
01:33:29,680 --> 01:33:30,960
Speaker 10: Week for most of the year.

1699
01:33:31,160 --> 01:33:34,560
Speaker 11: It's just not necessary. And so as in scores a

1700
01:33:34,600 --> 01:33:37,360
Speaker 11: lot of us, I wanted half the year to do

1701
01:33:37,479 --> 01:33:39,280
Speaker 11: what I want to do with my children, and you

1702
01:33:39,320 --> 01:33:41,920
Speaker 11: know that's also the time to do delight directive education

1703
01:33:42,160 --> 01:33:44,519
Speaker 11: as well as maybe you have a child that's ready

1704
01:33:44,560 --> 01:33:47,479
Speaker 11: to have intensive phonics, or an older student that needs

1705
01:33:47,600 --> 01:33:50,040
Speaker 11: more algebra help, or you have someone with special needs.

1706
01:33:50,520 --> 01:33:52,560
Speaker 11: So by meeting half the year together, we have this

1707
01:33:52,680 --> 01:33:55,479
Speaker 11: community based education and then the other half the year

1708
01:33:55,560 --> 01:33:58,400
Speaker 11: you can focus specifically on your children as individuals.

1709
01:33:59,320 --> 01:34:03,040
Speaker 1: Lee Morton. She's with and founded Classical Conversations, which you

1710
01:34:03,080 --> 01:34:07,360
Speaker 1: can check out online at classical conversations dot com. Homeschooling

1711
01:34:07,520 --> 01:34:12,400
Speaker 1: with a Christian faith based sort of approach to the

1712
01:34:12,439 --> 01:34:14,000
Speaker 1: whole thing, and that's why I wanted to hold you

1713
01:34:14,080 --> 01:34:19,519
Speaker 1: over to talk about the surrounding the children with faith

1714
01:34:19,560 --> 01:34:23,600
Speaker 1: elements and belief in Christianity. I trying to draw a

1715
01:34:23,680 --> 01:34:26,600
Speaker 1: parallel here in my mind. When I think of homeschooling,

1716
01:34:26,760 --> 01:34:29,320
Speaker 1: I think of the struggles that I, Brian Thomas, might

1717
01:34:29,400 --> 01:34:34,280
Speaker 1: face teaching my children something like physics. Okay, I don't

1718
01:34:34,360 --> 01:34:37,000
Speaker 1: remember anything about physics. It's been too long. I've forgotten

1719
01:34:37,040 --> 01:34:39,360
Speaker 1: what I knew about the science is given that I

1720
01:34:39,400 --> 01:34:42,880
Speaker 1: didn't need it in my entire practicing law background up

1721
01:34:42,920 --> 01:34:45,920
Speaker 1: and through my now seventeen years in radio, so I

1722
01:34:46,000 --> 01:34:46,840
Speaker 1: don't know where to turn.

1723
01:34:46,920 --> 01:34:47,000
Speaker 12: Now.

1724
01:34:47,040 --> 01:34:49,120
Speaker 1: There are resources, of course you have them. That's one

1725
01:34:49,120 --> 01:34:52,599
Speaker 1: of the reasons you have classical conversations. But pivoting over

1726
01:34:52,720 --> 01:35:01,559
Speaker 1: to the Christian philosophy that is classical conversations theologians. I'm

1727
01:35:01,640 --> 01:35:03,960
Speaker 1: not a theologian either, And while you can have a

1728
01:35:04,400 --> 01:35:06,920
Speaker 1: deeply held belief in Christ, you may not be in

1729
01:35:06,960 --> 01:35:09,600
Speaker 1: a position to sort of share the message on a

1730
01:35:09,720 --> 01:35:12,879
Speaker 1: theological level. Is that part of the service that you provide.

1731
01:35:14,479 --> 01:35:16,559
Speaker 11: Yes, So the scriptures tell us we want to raise

1732
01:35:16,600 --> 01:35:19,840
Speaker 11: our children to have fat souls, because the child who

1733
01:35:19,840 --> 01:35:23,040
Speaker 11: has filled these things from eternity is able to grow

1734
01:35:23,080 --> 01:35:26,280
Speaker 11: into an adult that can have delayed gratification. And there's

1735
01:35:26,360 --> 01:35:29,439
Speaker 11: the world's not all about themselves. And of course what

1736
01:35:29,600 --> 01:35:32,439
Speaker 11: are we seeing right now is the absence of fat souls,

1737
01:35:32,560 --> 01:35:36,919
Speaker 11: and so therefore we have fat bodies and indulgence spirits instead.

1738
01:35:37,920 --> 01:35:38,960
Speaker 10: So you know, when a.

1739
01:35:39,040 --> 01:35:41,640
Speaker 7: Child knows that they are just a little lower than

1740
01:35:41,680 --> 01:35:44,280
Speaker 7: the angels, rather than being taught they're a little better

1741
01:35:44,360 --> 01:35:46,760
Speaker 7: than apes, or if they're taught that they are a

1742
01:35:48,040 --> 01:35:51,000
Speaker 7: spirit with a body rather than a body with a spirit,

1743
01:35:51,560 --> 01:35:51,880
Speaker 7: it just.

1744
01:35:52,080 --> 01:35:55,200
Speaker 11: Makes for a totally different psyche and the human being,

1745
01:35:55,720 --> 01:35:58,080
Speaker 11: and that's what we're about. We're trying to teach them

1746
01:35:58,120 --> 01:36:00,599
Speaker 11: that the timeless should affect the timely.

1747
01:36:01,640 --> 01:36:04,599
Speaker 1: Okay, I get that, and the success has been amazing

1748
01:36:04,680 --> 01:36:07,040
Speaker 1: for you. Tell my listeners this was you go back

1749
01:36:07,080 --> 01:36:10,559
Speaker 1: to nineteen ninety seven. My understanding is that you had

1750
01:36:10,640 --> 01:36:14,160
Speaker 1: your in your home. Eleven teenage boys were you took

1751
01:36:14,240 --> 01:36:17,760
Speaker 1: on to classically educate? Is that the basis of this

1752
01:36:17,920 --> 01:36:20,160
Speaker 1: and we're all those teenage boys yours? I don't see

1753
01:36:20,200 --> 01:36:21,080
Speaker 1: that that's possible.

1754
01:36:22,760 --> 01:36:24,760
Speaker 7: No, there were girls there too.

1755
01:36:24,880 --> 01:36:27,400
Speaker 11: What was this three or four families we got together

1756
01:36:27,479 --> 01:36:31,200
Speaker 11: and said, let's do this rhetorical level of classical education

1757
01:36:31,320 --> 01:36:35,120
Speaker 11: together because it kind of requires it. And so there

1758
01:36:35,200 --> 01:36:37,519
Speaker 11: was three moms that hung out. That says, not drop

1759
01:36:37,560 --> 01:36:40,599
Speaker 11: off problem, I mean program. We're all there, working together,

1760
01:36:41,439 --> 01:36:43,920
Speaker 11: and within three years we had three hundred students on

1761
01:36:43,960 --> 01:36:46,320
Speaker 11: the waiting list, and my husband quit work in order

1762
01:36:46,400 --> 01:36:50,280
Speaker 11: to make it a viable company, and he's been with

1763
01:36:50,439 --> 01:36:53,360
Speaker 11: us ever since, and at this point we have over

1764
01:36:53,400 --> 01:36:56,160
Speaker 11: one hundred and thirty thousand students just in the United

1765
01:36:56,240 --> 01:36:59,800
Speaker 11: States enrolled, which the influence of homeschooling. People just don't

1766
01:36:59,800 --> 01:37:03,960
Speaker 11: really understand so if you consolidated my organization, we would

1767
01:37:03,960 --> 01:37:07,040
Speaker 11: be the twentiest largest school district in the United States.

1768
01:37:07,880 --> 01:37:11,400
Speaker 11: These parents care and they are powerful because they love

1769
01:37:11,439 --> 01:37:14,000
Speaker 11: their children so much. And so now the whole world

1770
01:37:14,120 --> 01:37:17,720
Speaker 11: is clamoring to understand what is classical education and what

1771
01:37:17,800 --> 01:37:19,880
Speaker 11: I would just like your listeners and though is you're

1772
01:37:19,920 --> 01:37:23,799
Speaker 11: not going to ever separate classical education from faith and family.

1773
01:37:24,120 --> 01:37:25,679
Speaker 11: It's not a secular task.

1774
01:37:26,960 --> 01:37:31,040
Speaker 1: Interesting, now you know one of the things, it's you're proselytizing,

1775
01:37:31,080 --> 01:37:33,840
Speaker 1: which is a good thing. I atheist Pendulette, I think

1776
01:37:33,920 --> 01:37:36,560
Speaker 1: made the best argument for proselytizing. If you are a

1777
01:37:36,600 --> 01:37:39,280
Speaker 1: true believer, and you truly believe that your neighbor who

1778
01:37:39,439 --> 01:37:42,320
Speaker 1: maybe isn't a Christian is going to be suffering eternal

1779
01:37:42,400 --> 01:37:45,240
Speaker 1: damnation for their failure to be Christian, you owe it

1780
01:37:45,400 --> 01:37:49,400
Speaker 1: to them to explain to them why you're worried about them.

1781
01:37:49,920 --> 01:37:54,519
Speaker 1: This element of and I appreciate that that public schools

1782
01:37:54,560 --> 01:37:57,400
Speaker 1: aren't teaching religion and not a fan of it necessarily

1783
01:37:57,479 --> 01:38:00,719
Speaker 1: because what type of theologian you get they have in class?

1784
01:38:00,800 --> 01:38:05,080
Speaker 1: Are they teaching your version of the of the scripture

1785
01:38:05,240 --> 01:38:07,400
Speaker 1: or someone else's? So I got a problem with that.

1786
01:38:07,479 --> 01:38:10,120
Speaker 1: But if you're in control of the curriculum and your

1787
01:38:10,160 --> 01:38:13,479
Speaker 1: faith based, you get get to control the narrative. Just

1788
01:38:13,800 --> 01:38:16,960
Speaker 1: that seems to me like a very big missing component

1789
01:38:17,040 --> 01:38:19,639
Speaker 1: that public schools can never fill.

1790
01:38:21,160 --> 01:38:23,559
Speaker 11: Yeah, and that's why, like I'm not for public education

1791
01:38:23,720 --> 01:38:27,720
Speaker 11: at all. Public education is inherently publicly funded. That's what

1792
01:38:27,840 --> 01:38:31,080
Speaker 11: makes it public. Therefore it is inherently socialists. And of

1793
01:38:31,160 --> 01:38:35,240
Speaker 11: course we shouldn't be surprised after six generations of having

1794
01:38:35,520 --> 01:38:39,240
Speaker 11: compulsory education we have all these Marxists. It's the natural result.

1795
01:38:39,360 --> 01:38:42,240
Speaker 11: Public school is finally successful at what it was designed

1796
01:38:42,280 --> 01:38:46,519
Speaker 11: to do. Get your kids out. Now we can see what.

1797
01:38:46,600 --> 01:38:47,519
Speaker 13: It was really all about.

1798
01:38:47,880 --> 01:38:53,439
Speaker 1: Well, wildly successful organization yours, forty five thousand families serving

1799
01:38:53,640 --> 01:38:57,400
Speaker 1: now enrolled in programs spread over fifty countries globally. This

1800
01:38:57,560 --> 01:38:59,640
Speaker 1: is a worldwide success that you've created here.

1801
01:39:00,840 --> 01:39:04,000
Speaker 11: Yeah, there's we just crossed the ten thousand marks and

1802
01:39:04,240 --> 01:39:07,320
Speaker 11: the other countries that are in and recognize a lot

1803
01:39:07,360 --> 01:39:10,040
Speaker 11: of rentalmen's actually fifty countries, and a lot of the

1804
01:39:10,080 --> 01:39:13,280
Speaker 11: countries are in it's illegal to homeschool. It's illegally even

1805
01:39:13,320 --> 01:39:15,560
Speaker 11: be a Christian in some of them. So they're underground,

1806
01:39:15,960 --> 01:39:18,679
Speaker 11: and we're just super happy that we can be helpful

1807
01:39:18,760 --> 01:39:19,040
Speaker 11: to them.

1808
01:39:19,520 --> 01:39:23,000
Speaker 1: I love that. I love that underground element, and I

1809
01:39:23,080 --> 01:39:25,040
Speaker 1: causu I'd be living in a country where you're not

1810
01:39:25,120 --> 01:39:27,800
Speaker 1: free to pursue your own religion. You're not free to

1811
01:39:27,880 --> 01:39:30,920
Speaker 1: teach your children. They must go into the public and

1812
01:39:30,960 --> 01:39:33,280
Speaker 1: doctrination camps. That's one of the things that I think

1813
01:39:33,320 --> 01:39:36,880
Speaker 1: people are so shortsighted about in America these days, that

1814
01:39:37,240 --> 01:39:40,080
Speaker 1: the freedoms that we get to enjoy that just don't

1815
01:39:40,120 --> 01:39:42,640
Speaker 1: exist outside of our borders. I'll tell you what, Lee,

1816
01:39:42,760 --> 01:39:44,400
Speaker 1: I can't thank you enough on behalf of all my

1817
01:39:44,479 --> 01:39:46,240
Speaker 1: listeners who are going to be looking into this and

1818
01:39:46,320 --> 01:39:51,120
Speaker 1: perhaps training their children classically in education Classical conversations dot com.

1819
01:39:51,760 --> 01:39:54,040
Speaker 1: I guess the founder of the organization, Lee Borton's Lee,

1820
01:39:54,080 --> 01:39:56,559
Speaker 1: it's been a real pleasure and uplifting conversation and very

1821
01:39:56,600 --> 01:40:00,799
Speaker 1: inspirational as well. I wish you continued success. Liz Wheeler,

1822
01:40:01,120 --> 01:40:02,360
Speaker 1: author of the book We're going to be talking about

1823
01:40:02,360 --> 01:40:05,439
Speaker 1: today that everybody needs to get hide your children, exposing

1824
01:40:05,520 --> 01:40:09,160
Speaker 1: the Marxists behind the attack on America's kids. Liz Wheeler

1825
01:40:09,400 --> 01:40:11,200
Speaker 1: you probably have already heard about her. She is a

1826
01:40:11,400 --> 01:40:14,880
Speaker 1: very prominent conservative hosts the podcast The Liz Wheeler Show,

1827
01:40:14,920 --> 01:40:16,880
Speaker 1: author of Tipping Points. How the Top of the Left's

1828
01:40:16,920 --> 01:40:19,719
Speaker 1: House of Cards, named a top ten thirty under thirty

1829
01:40:19,760 --> 01:40:22,519
Speaker 1: conservative rising star in twenty ten by Red Alert Politics

1830
01:40:22,560 --> 01:40:25,920
Speaker 1: and profiled by Political Magazine of All Places in twenty eighteen,

1831
01:40:26,040 --> 01:40:29,639
Speaker 1: is a titan of conservative media. Welcome to the Morning show, Liz.

1832
01:40:29,680 --> 01:40:31,240
Speaker 1: It is indeed a pleasure to have you on to

1833
01:40:31,320 --> 01:40:32,880
Speaker 1: talk about your book, Hide Your Children.

1834
01:40:33,960 --> 01:40:35,800
Speaker 14: Hi, Brian, thanks so much for having me. I appreciate it.

1835
01:40:36,200 --> 01:40:37,760
Speaker 1: I'm glad I ended up going to law school because

1836
01:40:37,760 --> 01:40:39,360
Speaker 1: I don't know what I would have done with political

1837
01:40:39,439 --> 01:40:42,320
Speaker 1: science degree. But having gotten a political science degree undergrad,

1838
01:40:42,360 --> 01:40:45,360
Speaker 1: I did read Marx, and I'm familiar with Marx's writings

1839
01:40:45,720 --> 01:40:48,439
Speaker 1: and the teachings. I guess I'm wondering, as you document

1840
01:40:48,520 --> 01:40:51,720
Speaker 1: an outline in your book, everybody seems to be in

1841
01:40:52,000 --> 01:40:57,479
Speaker 1: on Marxism, teachers' union, school counselors, planned parenthood, critical race theory,

1842
01:40:58,120 --> 01:41:02,920
Speaker 1: the CDC, American to me, and pediatrics. How is it

1843
01:41:03,080 --> 01:41:05,880
Speaker 1: that a theory of politics that has been an epic

1844
01:41:06,120 --> 01:41:10,000
Speaker 1: global failure in every single institution that has endeavored to

1845
01:41:10,120 --> 01:41:13,120
Speaker 1: embrace it. How does that even have legs in what

1846
01:41:13,320 --> 01:41:18,080
Speaker 1: is demonstrably the proven winner in terms of political structure,

1847
01:41:18,160 --> 01:41:19,560
Speaker 1: the United States of America.

1848
01:41:20,840 --> 01:41:23,679
Speaker 15: Well, listen, I'm impressed that you read Karl Marx in college.

1849
01:41:23,760 --> 01:41:26,000
Speaker 15: Unless they were teaching it as something that was wonderful

1850
01:41:26,040 --> 01:41:27,000
Speaker 15: and we should aspire to.

1851
01:41:27,760 --> 01:41:29,400
Speaker 14: You wouldn't see that in the political guide in the

1852
01:41:29,479 --> 01:41:30,240
Speaker 14: program anymore.

1853
01:41:30,960 --> 01:41:33,040
Speaker 1: With the type of cost to say, they wouldn't have

1854
01:41:33,120 --> 01:41:34,880
Speaker 1: you read Marx. They would just talk about it in

1855
01:41:35,000 --> 01:41:36,360
Speaker 1: generalized terms.

1856
01:41:37,320 --> 01:41:40,360
Speaker 14: Exactly and call for us to be on that side

1857
01:41:40,400 --> 01:41:41,000
Speaker 14: of history.

1858
01:41:41,600 --> 01:41:44,160
Speaker 15: Listen, the type of Marxism that we're seeing in this country,

1859
01:41:44,280 --> 01:41:47,000
Speaker 15: it is the same as Carl Marx's Marxism in the

1860
01:41:47,080 --> 01:41:49,760
Speaker 15: sense that the ultimate goal is the same. These people

1861
01:41:49,840 --> 01:41:52,920
Speaker 15: still want to abolish capitalism, they still want a revolution,

1862
01:41:53,040 --> 01:41:56,000
Speaker 15: they still want to topple our government, but the way

1863
01:41:56,040 --> 01:41:58,880
Speaker 15: that they're going about it has changed. Because when Karl

1864
01:41:58,960 --> 01:42:01,080
Speaker 15: Marx wrote The Communist Matters, so as I'm sure you remember,

1865
01:42:01,160 --> 01:42:04,639
Speaker 15: he envisioned a global Marxist revolution that didn't really happen.

1866
01:42:04,920 --> 01:42:08,439
Speaker 15: There were some Marxist revolutions, but the global revolution never occurred.

1867
01:42:08,800 --> 01:42:11,719
Speaker 15: So Marxism went out of fashion politically for a little while.

1868
01:42:11,960 --> 01:42:15,040
Speaker 15: And it was revived in the twentieth century by an

1869
01:42:15,120 --> 01:42:17,920
Speaker 15: Italian Marxist, actually by the name of Antonio Gramsi. He

1870
01:42:18,040 --> 01:42:20,640
Speaker 15: was the co founder of the Italian Communist Party, and

1871
01:42:21,040 --> 01:42:23,280
Speaker 15: he was put in prison by Mussolini, and he was

1872
01:42:23,320 --> 01:42:26,280
Speaker 15: studying Marxism while he was in prison, and he recognized

1873
01:42:26,320 --> 01:42:30,640
Speaker 15: that when Marxist revolutions were actually successful, they weren't predicated

1874
01:42:30,800 --> 01:42:33,640
Speaker 15: on economic discontent. It wasn't the working class that was

1875
01:42:33,680 --> 01:42:37,840
Speaker 15: overthrowing the ruling class. It was first predicated by the

1876
01:42:37,960 --> 01:42:42,920
Speaker 15: government or activist organizations working on behalf of government figures,

1877
01:42:43,439 --> 01:42:48,439
Speaker 15: demolishing or capturing cultural institutions first. And he named these

1878
01:42:48,760 --> 01:42:52,880
Speaker 15: cultural institutions on which the working class rely as the media,

1879
01:42:53,479 --> 01:42:58,240
Speaker 15: the education system, religious institutions, the law of the nuclear family,

1880
01:42:58,600 --> 01:43:01,799
Speaker 15: which of course is exactly what we're seeing happen today

1881
01:43:02,200 --> 01:43:04,680
Speaker 15: here in the United States. These organizations, I argue in

1882
01:43:04,760 --> 01:43:06,360
Speaker 15: my book that four of the five of them have

1883
01:43:06,520 --> 01:43:10,360
Speaker 15: already been captured, and the fifth, the Nuclear family, is

1884
01:43:10,479 --> 01:43:13,160
Speaker 15: under assault right now, which is why they're targeting our children.

1885
01:43:13,600 --> 01:43:16,560
Speaker 15: But these different organizations that we see popping up the

1886
01:43:16,600 --> 01:43:18,599
Speaker 15: last couple of years around the country, whether it's Black

1887
01:43:18,640 --> 01:43:22,320
Speaker 15: Lives Matter, whether it's the president of the American Library Association.

1888
01:43:22,840 --> 01:43:26,559
Speaker 15: These people admit that they hold Marxist ideology. They call

1889
01:43:26,640 --> 01:43:30,360
Speaker 15: themselves Marxists. Whether it's the Black Lives Matter leaders saying

1890
01:43:30,439 --> 01:43:34,080
Speaker 15: we are trained Marxists, whether it's Emily Drabinski, the president

1891
01:43:34,200 --> 01:43:37,920
Speaker 15: of the American Library Association, calling herself a lesbian Marxist.

1892
01:43:38,240 --> 01:43:40,520
Speaker 14: These people are open about their ideology.

1893
01:43:40,560 --> 01:43:43,280
Speaker 15: It's just a matter of whether we as conservatives, we're

1894
01:43:43,320 --> 01:43:46,040
Speaker 15: so used to dismissing what they say because they often

1895
01:43:46,160 --> 01:43:49,479
Speaker 15: lie and propagate fake news. At the same time they articulate,

1896
01:43:49,560 --> 01:43:51,200
Speaker 15: they verbalize what they're going to do and why.

1897
01:43:51,840 --> 01:43:54,760
Speaker 1: Well, and as you've illustrated, the history demonstrates that those

1898
01:43:54,800 --> 01:43:59,400
Speaker 1: who have instituted well what they call Marxist regimes are

1899
01:43:59,479 --> 01:44:02,000
Speaker 1: not truly Marxist, and that it is an overthrow of

1900
01:44:02,120 --> 01:44:07,000
Speaker 1: the proletariat or by the workers of the ruling class.

1901
01:44:07,520 --> 01:44:11,720
Speaker 1: It is a top down thing which always translates into well,

1902
01:44:12,120 --> 01:44:17,040
Speaker 1: the rulers end up living glorious, grand capitalist type lives

1903
01:44:17,080 --> 01:44:19,320
Speaker 1: while the rest of us all suffer equally. I mean,

1904
01:44:19,360 --> 01:44:22,720
Speaker 1: it's equal suffering, and they always live the lavish life

1905
01:44:22,920 --> 01:44:26,240
Speaker 1: they're not sharing. In the Marxist theoretical burden.

1906
01:44:27,680 --> 01:44:30,120
Speaker 15: That's exactly right, and that's why you can see the

1907
01:44:30,200 --> 01:44:32,599
Speaker 15: leaders of many of these organizations, whether it's the leaders

1908
01:44:32,600 --> 01:44:35,080
Speaker 15: of the teachers' unions or the or Black Lives Matter,

1909
01:44:35,360 --> 01:44:38,720
Speaker 15: or you know, those who are trying to assault homeschooling

1910
01:44:39,120 --> 01:44:40,160
Speaker 15: or whatever it may be.

1911
01:44:40,240 --> 01:44:41,920
Speaker 14: Wherever these assaults on our kids are coming from.

1912
01:44:42,200 --> 01:44:44,600
Speaker 15: Why they're not concerned with the history of communism and

1913
01:44:44,640 --> 01:44:47,760
Speaker 15: Marxism because they understand that the role that they play

1914
01:44:48,000 --> 01:44:51,600
Speaker 15: in their communist vision is that of the elite, and

1915
01:44:51,680 --> 01:44:55,960
Speaker 15: the elite are the ones who escape the inevitable starvation, oppression,

1916
01:44:56,040 --> 01:44:58,600
Speaker 15: and death. You can look at the Bolshevik Revolution in

1917
01:44:58,680 --> 01:45:01,599
Speaker 15: Russia as a perfect example of this of both things.

1918
01:45:01,680 --> 01:45:03,919
Speaker 14: Actually of the elite being.

1919
01:45:05,640 --> 01:45:09,120
Speaker 15: The ones who were enriched both in power and in money,

1920
01:45:09,160 --> 01:45:12,440
Speaker 15: but also in the different cultural institutions that were decimated,

1921
01:45:12,479 --> 01:45:15,360
Speaker 15: whether it was the church, whether the education system, whether

1922
01:45:15,400 --> 01:45:18,519
Speaker 15: it was freedom of speech, whether it was all of

1923
01:45:18,560 --> 01:45:21,200
Speaker 15: these freedom of the press, all of these different institutions

1924
01:45:21,280 --> 01:45:24,360
Speaker 15: were torn down in that first year of the revolution,

1925
01:45:24,479 --> 01:45:28,560
Speaker 15: which allowed the communist regime or the socialist regime in

1926
01:45:28,600 --> 01:45:31,800
Speaker 15: Bolshevik Russia to be successful. And when I say successful,

1927
01:45:31,840 --> 01:45:36,120
Speaker 15: I mean to actually exact Marxism, not not to cause prosperity.

1928
01:45:36,200 --> 01:45:38,320
Speaker 1: Of course, my guess day, Liz Wheel, author of Hide

1929
01:45:38,360 --> 01:45:40,920
Speaker 1: Your Children, Exposing the marxis behind the attack on America's kids.

1930
01:45:40,920 --> 01:45:43,559
Speaker 1: Focusing on children what always worries me, and it happened

1931
01:45:43,600 --> 01:45:45,760
Speaker 1: here in the city of Cincinnati some years ago. The

1932
01:45:45,840 --> 01:45:49,080
Speaker 1: idea of pre k education sold to people as a

1933
01:45:49,160 --> 01:45:51,320
Speaker 1: means of allowing oh so women can work well. That

1934
01:45:51,400 --> 01:45:53,600
Speaker 1: destroys the nuclear family. Women go out to work that

1935
01:45:53,720 --> 01:45:57,240
Speaker 1: children are then run and raised by the state. There's

1936
01:45:57,320 --> 01:46:00,960
Speaker 1: no opportunity for what my parents would do when over

1937
01:46:01,040 --> 01:46:04,439
Speaker 1: the dinner table, deprogramming you from the leftism that goes

1938
01:46:04,520 --> 01:46:07,000
Speaker 1: on in a classroom. I guess we have COVID to

1939
01:46:07,080 --> 01:46:09,120
Speaker 1: thank for the great awakening that's going on in this

1940
01:46:09,160 --> 01:46:13,000
Speaker 1: country against public education. Without COVID, we'd still be blindly

1941
01:46:13,040 --> 01:46:15,160
Speaker 1: sending our kids to school and not having any idea

1942
01:46:15,200 --> 01:46:16,000
Speaker 1: what's being taught.

1943
01:46:17,640 --> 01:46:19,840
Speaker 15: It's one of the reasons that I feel encouraged even

1944
01:46:19,880 --> 01:46:22,080
Speaker 15: as we live in this cultural insanity where boys are

1945
01:46:22,160 --> 01:46:24,200
Speaker 15: told they can be girls, and girls are told they

1946
01:46:24,240 --> 01:46:26,000
Speaker 15: can be boys, and white children are told they're racist

1947
01:46:26,040 --> 01:46:27,760
Speaker 15: and black children are told they' oppressed. I mean, this

1948
01:46:27,840 --> 01:46:30,120
Speaker 15: is pretty This is madness that we're living in right now.

1949
01:46:30,439 --> 01:46:33,880
Speaker 15: But I feel encouraged because for the first time, people,

1950
01:46:34,200 --> 01:46:37,320
Speaker 15: including parents, but it's not just parents, have their eyes open.

1951
01:46:37,400 --> 01:46:39,519
Speaker 15: We see the reality of the political enemy that's in

1952
01:46:39,560 --> 01:46:42,439
Speaker 15: front of us, and that's never happened before. These attacks

1953
01:46:42,479 --> 01:46:45,519
Speaker 15: on our children, especially in the education system, aren't new.

1954
01:46:45,920 --> 01:46:48,479
Speaker 15: We just noticed them, and they might be escalating, but

1955
01:46:48,520 --> 01:46:50,920
Speaker 15: they've actually the seeds for these attacks have been planted

1956
01:46:50,960 --> 01:46:54,479
Speaker 15: in our institutions for decades upon decades, and Republicans were

1957
01:46:54,600 --> 01:46:56,920
Speaker 15: just lively unaware. We had our heads in the sand,

1958
01:46:57,000 --> 01:47:00,880
Speaker 15: which allowed the capture of these institutions to be success. Well,

1959
01:47:00,920 --> 01:47:04,240
Speaker 15: now parents actually realize what we're up against and it's

1960
01:47:04,320 --> 01:47:06,320
Speaker 15: not going to We're not going to let the other

1961
01:47:06,360 --> 01:47:08,679
Speaker 15: side get away with it, which of course is also

1962
01:47:08,720 --> 01:47:10,120
Speaker 15: why I say at the beginning of my book, we

1963
01:47:10,640 --> 01:47:14,120
Speaker 15: need to expect escalation because the other side recognizes that

1964
01:47:14,160 --> 01:47:17,040
Speaker 15: they're time to impose this sort of Marxism on our

1965
01:47:17,080 --> 01:47:20,280
Speaker 15: society through the formation of our children's minds in the

1966
01:47:20,439 --> 01:47:21,200
Speaker 15: education system.

1967
01:47:21,680 --> 01:47:24,639
Speaker 14: They understand that it's now or never. Because we understand

1968
01:47:24,680 --> 01:47:25,280
Speaker 14: what we are up.

1969
01:47:25,240 --> 01:47:28,120
Speaker 1: Against, Well, would you say, and I think I'm going

1970
01:47:28,160 --> 01:47:31,600
Speaker 1: to anticipate, yes, that this whole green energy revolution, in

1971
01:47:31,680 --> 01:47:36,000
Speaker 1: this carbon crap is designed to kneecappus economically and make

1972
01:47:36,040 --> 01:47:39,879
Speaker 1: a force capitulation by the American well, our system of government.

1973
01:47:39,920 --> 01:47:43,160
Speaker 1: I mean, what they can accomplish through political activism and

1974
01:47:43,200 --> 01:47:46,960
Speaker 1: through elections, they're going to accomplish through regulation and wealth

1975
01:47:47,040 --> 01:47:48,760
Speaker 1: redistribution via the tax code.

1976
01:47:49,960 --> 01:47:50,880
Speaker 14: Yeah, that's exactly right.

1977
01:47:50,880 --> 01:47:53,360
Speaker 15: And there's an additional factor too that makes it worse,

1978
01:47:53,439 --> 01:47:57,360
Speaker 15: and that's the ESG score, the Environmental, Social and Governance metrics.

1979
01:47:57,400 --> 01:47:58,960
Speaker 15: I talk about this a little bit in my book,

1980
01:47:59,040 --> 01:48:01,519
Speaker 15: which some people ask why because they're like, what does

1981
01:48:01,600 --> 01:48:03,040
Speaker 15: this have to do with a tax on children?

1982
01:48:03,360 --> 01:48:03,920
Speaker 11: Well, I'll tell you.

1983
01:48:04,040 --> 01:48:07,080
Speaker 15: These ESG scores are essentially the same as the Chinese

1984
01:48:07,200 --> 01:48:10,160
Speaker 15: Social credit score system, where you are ranked based on

1985
01:48:10,240 --> 01:48:13,720
Speaker 15: your adherents to a communist ideology. In China, it's on

1986
01:48:13,800 --> 01:48:16,200
Speaker 15: an individual basis as well as corporations. Here in the

1987
01:48:16,320 --> 01:48:18,920
Speaker 15: United States, it hasn't quite trickled down to individuals yet,

1988
01:48:19,280 --> 01:48:21,680
Speaker 15: although they intend to. Right now, it just ranks businesses.

1989
01:48:22,160 --> 01:48:24,680
Speaker 15: But these businesses, if they want access to capital, if

1990
01:48:24,680 --> 01:48:27,760
Speaker 15: they want access to loans, if they want access to

1991
01:48:27,800 --> 01:48:32,280
Speaker 15: the marketplace, Essentially they have to propagate leftist ideologies and

1992
01:48:32,360 --> 01:48:34,919
Speaker 15: leftist agenda items, whether this is paying for their employees

1993
01:48:34,960 --> 01:48:37,160
Speaker 15: to travel out of state for abortions, whether this is

1994
01:48:37,240 --> 01:48:41,519
Speaker 15: DEI offices, whatever it might be, these very leftist causes,

1995
01:48:41,560 --> 01:48:45,719
Speaker 15: whether it's commitment to going fossil fuel free, curbon neutral,

1996
01:48:45,800 --> 01:48:48,400
Speaker 15: that kind of nonsense which we know is unrealistic and harmful.

1997
01:48:48,960 --> 01:48:52,640
Speaker 15: They're locked into propagating these agendas because they have to

1998
01:48:52,680 --> 01:48:55,560
Speaker 15: pursue their ESG score if they want to participate in

1999
01:48:55,640 --> 01:48:58,719
Speaker 15: the marketplace. And the way that this impacts our children,

2000
01:48:58,760 --> 01:49:01,120
Speaker 15: the way that this harms our children, and is you know,

2001
01:49:01,240 --> 01:49:04,400
Speaker 15: look at bud light, look at target these different places

2002
01:49:04,439 --> 01:49:07,360
Speaker 15: that we're targeting target especially with targeting our children.

2003
01:49:07,400 --> 01:49:10,240
Speaker 14: With queer theory, are small children.

2004
01:49:10,560 --> 01:49:14,000
Speaker 15: And even amidst the backlash from consumers and the boycott

2005
01:49:14,120 --> 01:49:17,240
Speaker 15: that is continuing to ensue very successfully, I might add,

2006
01:49:17,600 --> 01:49:20,120
Speaker 15: they are not going to change their course, not because

2007
01:49:20,120 --> 01:49:21,840
Speaker 15: the people at the top of you know, in New

2008
01:49:21,880 --> 01:49:25,519
Speaker 15: York executive boardroom are committed Marxists, but because they can't.

2009
01:49:26,000 --> 01:49:28,960
Speaker 15: If they do reverse course, if they do recant this,

2010
01:49:29,479 --> 01:49:31,920
Speaker 15: they will have their esg's or a doct and it

2011
01:49:31,960 --> 01:49:34,960
Speaker 15: will hurt them in the marketplace. So until we add

2012
01:49:35,080 --> 01:49:36,760
Speaker 15: a society this can be done at the state level

2013
01:49:36,840 --> 01:49:39,799
Speaker 15: or the federal level, use the just authority of government

2014
01:49:39,920 --> 01:49:43,400
Speaker 15: to ban ESG. Then we're not going to be able

2015
01:49:43,439 --> 01:49:45,599
Speaker 15: to stop the corporate wocus and that's targeting our children.

2016
01:49:46,320 --> 01:49:50,080
Speaker 1: So from where do the ESG scores come? Who is

2017
01:49:50,160 --> 01:49:53,280
Speaker 1: the lord and master over assigning an ESG score? And

2018
01:49:53,360 --> 01:49:56,360
Speaker 1: I suppose the banks have a tremendous amount to do

2019
01:49:56,520 --> 01:49:58,919
Speaker 1: with this, given that that's the lending in the financial

2020
01:49:59,000 --> 01:50:02,639
Speaker 1: connection that you're saying, Well, the reason corporations are even

2021
01:50:02,760 --> 01:50:05,519
Speaker 1: bothering with ESG you're paying attention to their score might be,

2022
01:50:05,600 --> 01:50:08,439
Speaker 1: is because they're being denied access to capital. Well, denying

2023
01:50:08,520 --> 01:50:11,560
Speaker 1: access to capital to otherwise successful businesses is not in

2024
01:50:11,680 --> 01:50:14,960
Speaker 1: a bank's best interest either, So how is it that

2025
01:50:15,080 --> 01:50:18,520
Speaker 1: there's been so much business capitulation when this is harmful

2026
01:50:18,840 --> 01:50:21,839
Speaker 1: to the whole idea of commerce?

2027
01:50:23,680 --> 01:50:27,880
Speaker 15: Well, as you rightly note, the enforcers of ESG are

2028
01:50:27,880 --> 01:50:30,599
Speaker 15: the biggest banking institutions in our country. So two examples

2029
01:50:30,640 --> 01:50:33,880
Speaker 15: would be Black Rock and Bank of America. These institutions

2030
01:50:33,960 --> 01:50:36,800
Speaker 15: control much of the capital in the marketplace when it

2031
01:50:36,880 --> 01:50:40,200
Speaker 15: comes to loans or entering the marketplace.

2032
01:50:39,960 --> 01:50:41,920
Speaker 14: And they are committed to these ESG scores.

2033
01:50:42,000 --> 01:50:45,759
Speaker 15: They are part of, you know, that annual World Economic

2034
01:50:45,840 --> 01:50:48,880
Speaker 15: Forum gathering where many of these ideas come from. The

2035
01:50:48,920 --> 01:50:53,720
Speaker 15: World Economic Forum actively calls for a redefinition of capitalism.

2036
01:50:53,800 --> 01:50:57,680
Speaker 15: They of course want to transform our capitalist system. They

2037
01:50:57,760 --> 01:51:00,680
Speaker 15: call it shareholder capitalism, which there's just another term for

2038
01:51:00,760 --> 01:51:05,479
Speaker 15: free market capitalism. They want to transform it into stakeholder capitalism. Now,

2039
01:51:05,720 --> 01:51:08,800
Speaker 15: stakeholder capitalism isn't capitalism. They're just trying to retain the

2040
01:51:08,840 --> 01:51:12,160
Speaker 15: words so that people are confused. But stakeholder capitalism is

2041
01:51:12,280 --> 01:51:16,880
Speaker 15: this authoritarian system where sure there are elements of the

2042
01:51:16,920 --> 01:51:19,479
Speaker 15: free market that are allowed to reign just enough so

2043
01:51:19,600 --> 01:51:22,320
Speaker 15: that businesses can be kind of successful like they are

2044
01:51:22,400 --> 01:51:25,200
Speaker 15: in China, But at the end of the day, these businesses,

2045
01:51:25,280 --> 01:51:28,439
Speaker 15: while not technically owned by the government, are controlled by

2046
01:51:28,520 --> 01:51:32,519
Speaker 15: government ideology. That's essentially what the role that these big

2047
01:51:32,600 --> 01:51:36,760
Speaker 15: banks are serving in ESG. But the people behind the ESG,

2048
01:51:36,880 --> 01:51:39,679
Speaker 15: the people whose idea it was, are people like klau

2049
01:51:39,760 --> 01:51:43,200
Speaker 15: Schwab in the World Economic Forum, people like organizations like

2050
01:51:43,240 --> 01:51:46,599
Speaker 15: the United Nations, who don't believe in free countries, don't

2051
01:51:46,640 --> 01:51:49,960
Speaker 15: believe in a capitalist society, they too pursue, just like

2052
01:51:50,040 --> 01:51:53,439
Speaker 15: the original Markist, the abolition of communism and the imposition

2053
01:51:53,600 --> 01:51:56,599
Speaker 15: of a communist economy, knowing of course that they will

2054
01:51:56,600 --> 01:51:58,760
Speaker 15: hold the power and the money and not suffer any

2055
01:51:58,840 --> 01:52:00,320
Speaker 15: of the devastation or death.

2056
01:52:00,880 --> 01:52:03,120
Speaker 1: Le's Wheeler author Hid Your Children, exposing the Marxist behind

2057
01:52:03,120 --> 01:52:04,760
Speaker 1: the attack on America's kids and in turning before we

2058
01:52:04,800 --> 01:52:07,400
Speaker 1: part company today and this has been just an amazing conversation,

2059
01:52:07,600 --> 01:52:11,440
Speaker 1: an amazing book, Liz Wheeler. It seems though that another

2060
01:52:11,520 --> 01:52:14,800
Speaker 1: component of this COVID revelation is the idea that I

2061
01:52:14,840 --> 01:52:17,000
Speaker 1: think everybody of any political strike, with the exception of

2062
01:52:17,040 --> 01:52:20,320
Speaker 1: people who are die hard Unions or Marxists, everybody wants

2063
01:52:20,320 --> 01:52:22,439
Speaker 1: the opportunity to send their children a better school. The

2064
01:52:22,680 --> 01:52:24,960
Speaker 1: public schools. I mean, look at Baltimore. They can't find

2065
01:52:25,160 --> 01:52:28,040
Speaker 1: a kid who can read at grade level. They are

2066
01:52:28,200 --> 01:52:30,800
Speaker 1: dumbing down our children to the point where they they're

2067
01:52:30,880 --> 01:52:33,600
Speaker 1: just going to become what reliant on government because they

2068
01:52:33,600 --> 01:52:36,760
Speaker 1: won't able to feed themselves. They won't question this ideology

2069
01:52:36,800 --> 01:52:39,880
Speaker 1: because they don't they lack critical thinking skills. That seems

2070
01:52:39,880 --> 01:52:41,800
Speaker 1: to be a goal of the public education system is

2071
01:52:41,880 --> 01:52:44,120
Speaker 1: to produce a bunch of idiots that will be useful

2072
01:52:44,200 --> 01:52:44,759
Speaker 1: to the cause.

2073
01:52:46,080 --> 01:52:46,920
Speaker 14: That's exactly right.

2074
01:52:47,000 --> 01:52:49,439
Speaker 15: I mean, I have a fairly based viewpoint on the

2075
01:52:49,479 --> 01:52:51,240
Speaker 15: public school system in this day and age. I'm not

2076
01:52:51,280 --> 01:52:54,200
Speaker 15: sure why one would send a child to the public

2077
01:52:54,240 --> 01:52:56,599
Speaker 15: school system. I understand why some people feel that they

2078
01:52:56,600 --> 01:53:00,679
Speaker 15: don't have a choice, but it's producing academically the fish students,

2079
01:53:00,840 --> 01:53:04,160
Speaker 15: socially stunted students. Half of schools aren't even safe for

2080
01:53:04,360 --> 01:53:08,960
Speaker 15: either bullying, gang related activities, or school shooters. Ideologically, they

2081
01:53:09,000 --> 01:53:11,920
Speaker 15: are assaulted at every turn with Marxist ideology. There's no

2082
01:53:12,120 --> 01:53:16,000
Speaker 15: reason that we should be sending our children collectively.

2083
01:53:15,760 --> 01:53:16,920
Speaker 14: To the public school system.

2084
01:53:16,960 --> 01:53:18,840
Speaker 15: And this is actually one of the most interesting pieces

2085
01:53:18,840 --> 01:53:20,919
Speaker 15: of information I came across in the course of researching

2086
01:53:21,000 --> 01:53:24,400
Speaker 15: my book. The public school system in America didn't become

2087
01:53:24,479 --> 01:53:27,559
Speaker 15: mandatory until eighteen fifty two. Massachusetts was the first state

2088
01:53:27,640 --> 01:53:30,519
Speaker 15: to make it compulsory, and the reason they did was

2089
01:53:30,560 --> 01:53:32,800
Speaker 15: because there was an influx of immigrants coming to our

2090
01:53:32,840 --> 01:53:36,240
Speaker 15: country at the time, particularly Catholic immigrants, and the Protestant

2091
01:53:36,320 --> 01:53:39,960
Speaker 15: politicians in charge of Massachusetts wanted to indoctrinate the immigrant

2092
01:53:40,080 --> 01:53:42,880
Speaker 15: children in American values so that they would be loyal

2093
01:53:42,920 --> 01:53:45,680
Speaker 15: to America first versus the country of their birth, and

2094
01:53:45,880 --> 01:53:48,759
Speaker 15: in Protestant values because of the centuries old battles between

2095
01:53:48,840 --> 01:53:53,759
Speaker 15: Protestants and Catholics, and I realized our education system actually

2096
01:53:53,920 --> 01:53:55,639
Speaker 15: is supposed to be an indoctrination center.

2097
01:53:55,680 --> 01:53:58,960
Speaker 14: That's what it's supposed to do. We oftentimes associate.

2098
01:53:58,560 --> 01:54:02,160
Speaker 15: In doctrination negatively because of what the Democrats are indoctriating

2099
01:54:02,160 --> 01:54:04,880
Speaker 15: our children with. But I challenge conservatives to think of

2100
01:54:04,920 --> 01:54:08,680
Speaker 15: indoctrination as morally neutral, to take back this institution and

2101
01:54:08,800 --> 01:54:13,719
Speaker 15: actually start teaching children not just this neutral idea of reading, writing,

2102
01:54:13,800 --> 01:54:16,680
Speaker 15: and arithmetic, but to understand that there's really no such

2103
01:54:16,760 --> 01:54:19,240
Speaker 15: thing as neutrality. Either the Democrats are going to be

2104
01:54:19,320 --> 01:54:23,000
Speaker 15: teaching their ideologies to our children, or we Republicans are

2105
01:54:23,040 --> 01:54:25,759
Speaker 15: going to be imparting American values in Judeo Christian morals.

2106
01:54:26,000 --> 01:54:28,920
Speaker 15: And if we don't reorient our thinking away from neutrality

2107
01:54:29,000 --> 01:54:33,040
Speaker 15: and understand that was the purpose of our public school

2108
01:54:33,480 --> 01:54:36,360
Speaker 15: as an institution to actually train children and what's right

2109
01:54:36,480 --> 01:54:38,560
Speaker 15: and what's wrong, then we're going to continue to lose

2110
01:54:38,640 --> 01:54:39,320
Speaker 15: this fight.

2111
01:54:40,200 --> 01:54:43,600
Speaker 1: Loz Wheeler just been fantastic Kevin in the program, all

2112
01:54:43,680 --> 01:54:45,480
Speaker 1: the emails and texts are coming in. They love what

2113
01:54:45,520 --> 01:54:47,080
Speaker 1: you're saying. They're going to get a copy of your book.

2114
01:54:47,200 --> 01:54:49,280
Speaker 1: Hide your children, which they can easily do. Liz, write

2115
01:54:49,280 --> 01:54:50,760
Speaker 1: on my blog page, but if you have caresy dot

2116
01:54:50,840 --> 01:54:53,240
Speaker 1: com to be a link there, please buy it, forward

2117
01:54:53,280 --> 01:54:54,800
Speaker 1: it to your friends, let them or you to get

2118
01:54:54,800 --> 01:54:56,960
Speaker 1: your kids out of public education until we can write

2119
01:54:57,000 --> 01:54:59,480
Speaker 1: this ship and turn it back to what it used

2120
01:54:59,480 --> 01:55:01,200
Speaker 1: to be. Liz, thank you for your time, and thank

2121
01:55:01,240 --> 01:55:03,360
Speaker 1: you for what you're doing for America and writing this book.

2122
01:55:04,280 --> 01:55:07,920
Speaker 1: Retired United States Marine Corps Colonel Eric Bure by way

2123
01:55:07,960 --> 01:55:10,360
Speaker 1: of background, native California. We won't hold that again to

2124
01:55:10,600 --> 01:55:13,240
Speaker 1: Eric spent his formative years in rural New England before

2125
01:55:13,280 --> 01:55:16,360
Speaker 1: graduating from Ohio Wesleyan University with a degree in economics.

2126
01:55:16,400 --> 01:55:19,240
Speaker 1: He then accepted a commission from the Marine Corps, trained

2127
01:55:19,480 --> 01:55:22,920
Speaker 1: to fly attack helicopters, which we'll be talking about here

2128
01:55:22,960 --> 01:55:27,320
Speaker 1: in a moment. His deployments took it to the Persian Gulf, Samalia, Bosnia, Iraq, Afghanistan.

2129
01:55:27,720 --> 01:55:29,520
Speaker 1: Later served on the staff of the Chairman of the

2130
01:55:29,600 --> 01:55:33,600
Speaker 1: Joints Chiefs, as Professor of National Security Strategy and Policy

2131
01:55:33,680 --> 01:55:36,600
Speaker 1: at the National War College, and as an Air Group

2132
01:55:36,640 --> 01:55:40,280
Speaker 1: Commanding Officer, currently Senior executive for Aviation and Training Company.

2133
01:55:40,320 --> 01:55:42,640
Speaker 1: Also a consultant public speaker in areas of military and

2134
01:55:42,640 --> 01:55:46,280
Speaker 1: commercial aviation and global conflict. Welcome to the program, and

2135
01:55:46,360 --> 01:55:48,720
Speaker 1: God bless you for your service to our country. Colonel

2136
01:55:48,840 --> 01:55:50,480
Speaker 1: Eric Buwer. It's great to have you on today.

2137
01:55:52,200 --> 01:55:53,640
Speaker 6: Good morning, Hey, great to be here.

2138
01:55:53,720 --> 01:55:57,160
Speaker 1: Appreciate that and the reason you're here. Ghosts of Baghdad

2139
01:55:57,280 --> 01:56:00,720
Speaker 1: Marine Corps gunships. On the opening days of the Iraq War,

2140
01:56:01,880 --> 01:56:05,520
Speaker 1: you flew a Cobra attack helicopter. Is that the name

2141
01:56:05,560 --> 01:56:07,000
Speaker 1: of the helicopter you flew?

2142
01:56:08,440 --> 01:56:12,600
Speaker 16: That's correct, Yeah, Bell h Ones so them for a

2143
01:56:12,640 --> 01:56:14,880
Speaker 16: goody plus years now.

2144
01:56:16,080 --> 01:56:17,920
Speaker 1: The helicopter, I remember the one that was just chock

2145
01:56:18,000 --> 01:56:20,120
Speaker 1: full of all kinds of armaments and armaments and everything.

2146
01:56:20,160 --> 01:56:22,800
Speaker 1: That that's the Blackhawk. Is what's the difference between a

2147
01:56:22,840 --> 01:56:24,640
Speaker 1: Cobra and a black Hawk before we dive into what

2148
01:56:24,800 --> 01:56:25,600
Speaker 1: you have been through.

2149
01:56:26,800 --> 01:56:33,400
Speaker 6: Sure, so, a Cobra's an attack helicopter. You'll see, it's cannon, missiles, rockets,

2150
01:56:33,560 --> 01:56:34,680
Speaker 6: all the things you'd expect.

2151
01:56:35,480 --> 01:56:39,520
Speaker 16: It's it's closely associated with the Armies Apache, which is

2152
01:56:39,560 --> 01:56:40,680
Speaker 16: also an attack helicopter.

2153
01:56:41,760 --> 01:56:44,320
Speaker 1: All right, Now, the first question I've got to ask you,

2154
01:56:44,480 --> 01:56:47,160
Speaker 1: because I've seen a lot of war movies in my time.

2155
01:56:47,200 --> 01:56:48,880
Speaker 1: I did not serve our country, so I do not

2156
01:56:49,080 --> 01:56:51,800
Speaker 1: know what the what combat is like. And I'm just

2157
01:56:51,920 --> 01:56:55,640
Speaker 1: thoroughly impressed anybody who's been through that. But how in

2158
01:56:55,680 --> 01:56:59,800
Speaker 1: the hell do you manage to fly into these unbelievably

2159
01:57:00,080 --> 01:57:03,920
Speaker 1: hence the fields of battle and not get shot down?

2160
01:57:04,120 --> 01:57:07,000
Speaker 1: Think with modern armaments these days, drones and rockets and

2161
01:57:07,440 --> 01:57:10,400
Speaker 1: you know, shoulder launched missiles, how is it you avoid

2162
01:57:10,480 --> 01:57:12,240
Speaker 1: getting shot down? It seems like it will be such

2163
01:57:12,240 --> 01:57:13,360
Speaker 1: an easy target to hit.

2164
01:57:15,840 --> 01:57:20,920
Speaker 16: You know, we're trying to think about that too. No,

2165
01:57:21,080 --> 01:57:23,200
Speaker 16: it's uh, you know, we do our best, and we

2166
01:57:23,280 --> 01:57:26,320
Speaker 16: have great training. Uh, there's great air crews, there's great

2167
01:57:26,400 --> 01:57:30,360
Speaker 16: maintenance crews. On this deployment, the vast majority of our

2168
01:57:30,360 --> 01:57:35,560
Speaker 16: aircraft were hit by enemy fire. It's it's it's a

2169
01:57:35,760 --> 01:57:37,720
Speaker 16: it's a real good study of the enemy and what

2170
01:57:37,760 --> 01:57:40,480
Speaker 16: they're doing, how they're doing. Uh, and then our tactics

2171
01:57:40,680 --> 01:57:42,400
Speaker 16: that try to keep us out of the most likely

2172
01:57:42,520 --> 01:57:45,400
Speaker 16: scenarios where we could be, you know, really heavily engaged

2173
01:57:46,440 --> 01:57:47,160
Speaker 16: by the enemies.

2174
01:57:47,200 --> 01:57:49,240
Speaker 6: So and then, by the grace of God, right, and

2175
01:57:49,480 --> 01:57:52,520
Speaker 6: you just you find a way that you find a

2176
01:57:52,560 --> 01:57:52,760
Speaker 6: way to.

2177
01:57:52,840 --> 01:57:54,840
Speaker 16: Learn lessons each day, each night, and then you put

2178
01:57:54,880 --> 01:57:57,200
Speaker 16: those lessons to practice the next day, and you hope

2179
01:57:57,200 --> 01:57:58,839
Speaker 16: you're a little smarter, you hope you a little.

2180
01:57:58,640 --> 01:58:01,600
Speaker 6: Better and uh, and then roll the dice for Quartane.

2181
01:58:02,120 --> 01:58:04,280
Speaker 1: Now is a helicopter? I mean, I think about D

2182
01:58:04,480 --> 01:58:07,680
Speaker 1: Day and what the landscape might have been completely different

2183
01:58:07,680 --> 01:58:11,160
Speaker 1: if we had helicopters supporting those arriving on the on

2184
01:58:11,280 --> 01:58:15,600
Speaker 1: the beaches of Normandy. But in terms of your the

2185
01:58:15,800 --> 01:58:18,400
Speaker 1: military's practice of the helicopter, is it is it an

2186
01:58:18,440 --> 01:58:20,960
Speaker 1: advanced thing that the helicopters would go in? Is it

2187
01:58:21,080 --> 01:58:23,640
Speaker 1: used this follow up support after ground troops have moved in?

2188
01:58:23,720 --> 01:58:25,760
Speaker 1: Is a combination the above depending upon the mission and

2189
01:58:26,200 --> 01:58:28,960
Speaker 1: what what kind of role does the helicopter play in

2190
01:58:29,040 --> 01:58:30,040
Speaker 1: any given combat?

2191
01:58:32,360 --> 01:58:35,160
Speaker 6: Great question, So the role of the cobra, We'll do

2192
01:58:35,200 --> 01:58:35,880
Speaker 6: a little bit of both.

2193
01:58:36,440 --> 01:58:40,880
Speaker 16: So in a scenario similar to D Day, you would

2194
01:58:40,920 --> 01:58:43,360
Speaker 16: send in in the day there they send an aircraft

2195
01:58:43,440 --> 01:58:46,240
Speaker 16: and they send in your mustangs or thunderbolts.

2196
01:58:46,000 --> 01:58:48,080
Speaker 6: To attack, you know, targets on the beach.

2197
01:58:48,480 --> 01:58:51,760
Speaker 16: They'd use artillery from ships to again attack targets on

2198
01:58:51,800 --> 01:58:54,480
Speaker 16: the beach, we would be that artillery.

2199
01:58:54,520 --> 01:58:57,160
Speaker 6: We would be those thunderbolts and mustangs. So we go in.

2200
01:58:57,240 --> 01:59:00,160
Speaker 16: Some we go in prior uh to work on what

2201
01:59:00,400 --> 01:59:04,760
Speaker 16: we call the pre plant targets. And as marines, most importantly,

2202
01:59:04,800 --> 01:59:07,560
Speaker 16: as marines go in, we are right there with them.

2203
01:59:07,600 --> 01:59:10,600
Speaker 16: So we're close air support and wherever those marines go,

2204
01:59:10,760 --> 01:59:14,040
Speaker 16: we go with them. That our primary mission.

2205
01:59:14,520 --> 01:59:19,080
Speaker 1: Well, given the theaters of of action, you saw Persian

2206
01:59:19,120 --> 01:59:21,760
Speaker 1: golf smelling of Bosnia, Iraq, Afghanistan, all of them very

2207
01:59:21,840 --> 01:59:25,280
Speaker 1: very dangerous. How many missions did you fly, sir, during

2208
01:59:25,320 --> 01:59:27,600
Speaker 1: your service to our country While you're behind the stick,

2209
01:59:27,640 --> 01:59:33,040
Speaker 1: if I may use that term, I don't know he's

2210
01:59:33,160 --> 01:59:33,960
Speaker 1: lost track.

2211
01:59:35,720 --> 01:59:38,880
Speaker 6: No, it wasn't lost track. You just at some point

2212
01:59:38,960 --> 01:59:39,320
Speaker 6: you care.

2213
01:59:39,400 --> 01:59:42,880
Speaker 16: At some point it just doesn't matter anymore because what

2214
01:59:43,000 --> 01:59:46,160
Speaker 16: you're doing is so important. It's so important really for

2215
01:59:46,240 --> 01:59:50,240
Speaker 16: those marines and sailors in particularly we support. So yeah,

2216
01:59:50,360 --> 01:59:53,600
Speaker 16: really long long, long, stopping about me or about us

2217
01:59:53,720 --> 01:59:56,240
Speaker 16: in aviation. It really it really is always about those

2218
01:59:56,320 --> 01:59:57,320
Speaker 16: marines that were supporting.

2219
01:59:57,600 --> 01:59:59,000
Speaker 1: Well, the name of the book goes to bag Dag

2220
01:59:59,080 --> 02:00:01,720
Speaker 1: Marine Corps gunship on the opening days of the Iraq War,

2221
02:00:01,760 --> 02:00:04,000
Speaker 1: and you notice I emphasize opening days. Why did you

2222
02:00:04,080 --> 02:00:07,040
Speaker 1: focus on the opening days? Because clearly, with your years

2223
02:00:07,080 --> 02:00:09,560
Speaker 1: of service, I imagine there's like four or five books

2224
02:00:09,600 --> 02:00:11,520
Speaker 1: worth of material you could pass along.

2225
02:00:13,680 --> 02:00:16,200
Speaker 6: So the opening days it really what I wanted to

2226
02:00:16,280 --> 02:00:20,040
Speaker 6: do in this book in particular, was it was It's

2227
02:00:20,080 --> 02:00:22,440
Speaker 6: been in my brain for a while. Is it's just

2228
02:00:22,600 --> 02:00:26,640
Speaker 6: capture Really what is the first twenty five plus days

2229
02:00:27,800 --> 02:00:28,600
Speaker 6: of the Warner Rocks.

2230
02:00:28,640 --> 02:00:31,040
Speaker 16: So it begins the opening night, and it really lets

2231
02:00:31,080 --> 02:00:35,480
Speaker 16: the reader and lets step into the cockpit, close the

2232
02:00:35,520 --> 02:00:38,400
Speaker 16: campig unless I walked through a door that was otherwise closed.

2233
02:00:38,440 --> 02:00:42,120
Speaker 16: And whether you like me or not, you've got to

2234
02:00:42,120 --> 02:00:45,320
Speaker 16: spend twenty five plus days with my cock in my cockpit,

2235
02:00:45,480 --> 02:00:48,600
Speaker 16: and you see the world through my lens. But the

2236
02:00:48,640 --> 02:00:51,800
Speaker 16: book is not about me, You'll quickly realize. It's about everybody.

2237
02:00:52,200 --> 02:00:55,040
Speaker 16: It's about my copilot, it's about my wingment, it's about

2238
02:00:55,080 --> 02:00:59,400
Speaker 16: squadron mates, it's about rains on the grounds. It's really

2239
02:01:00,200 --> 02:01:03,160
Speaker 16: my opportunity to tell a story, an untold story. So

2240
02:01:03,400 --> 02:01:06,600
Speaker 16: I feel pretty pretty blessed, pretty privileged for the opportunity

2241
02:01:06,640 --> 02:01:06,920
Speaker 16: to do it.

2242
02:01:07,080 --> 02:01:08,800
Speaker 1: Well, I'm blessed and privilege for the opportunity to talk

2243
02:01:08,800 --> 02:01:10,880
Speaker 1: to you about the book, and my producer has already

2244
02:01:10,920 --> 02:01:12,720
Speaker 1: added your book to my blog page if you have

2245
02:01:12,840 --> 02:01:14,680
Speaker 1: cares dot com, so they can easily get a copy

2246
02:01:14,680 --> 02:01:16,120
Speaker 1: of that. I've got a lot of folks in my

2247
02:01:16,240 --> 02:01:19,800
Speaker 1: listening audience who are either served in the military, veterans,

2248
02:01:19,800 --> 02:01:22,560
Speaker 1: they have members that are currently serving or have served,

2249
02:01:22,600 --> 02:01:25,960
Speaker 1: And of course my show is dedicated and committed anything

2250
02:01:26,000 --> 02:01:28,360
Speaker 1: I can do to help America's military. You mentioned the

2251
02:01:28,400 --> 02:01:31,280
Speaker 1: Marines on the ground. How much did you rely on

2252
02:01:32,040 --> 02:01:36,800
Speaker 1: ground support information data fed to you real time while

2253
02:01:36,800 --> 02:01:38,480
Speaker 1: you're in the helicopter or is this sort of just

2254
02:01:38,680 --> 02:01:40,640
Speaker 1: deal with it as you approach it kind of thing.

2255
02:01:40,760 --> 02:01:44,000
Speaker 1: Perhaps a combination of both. Again, having never been been

2256
02:01:44,040 --> 02:01:45,520
Speaker 1: there and done that, I'm kind of curious about that.

2257
02:01:48,000 --> 02:01:50,760
Speaker 6: So it is a combination both.

2258
02:01:50,840 --> 02:01:52,920
Speaker 16: So the folks from the ground have a great idea

2259
02:01:53,160 --> 02:01:55,080
Speaker 16: that they know exactly what's happening, they know the type

2260
02:01:55,080 --> 02:01:58,480
Speaker 16: of enemy they're dealing with, and in our case, at

2261
02:01:58,520 --> 02:02:02,480
Speaker 16: a very tactical level, every marine, every marine unit from

2262
02:02:02,520 --> 02:02:04,600
Speaker 16: the company size up as it has a will be

2263
02:02:04,680 --> 02:02:07,600
Speaker 16: on a ground controller and they're passion this information. You know,

2264
02:02:07,680 --> 02:02:11,160
Speaker 16: minute by minute what they're seeing simultaneously, we're painting the

2265
02:02:11,200 --> 02:02:14,200
Speaker 16: picture for them on the ground what we see, and

2266
02:02:14,320 --> 02:02:17,400
Speaker 16: then together that builds, that builds a little bit of

2267
02:02:17,560 --> 02:02:20,360
Speaker 16: an insight for us, a little a little bit of awareness.

2268
02:02:20,160 --> 02:02:23,280
Speaker 6: And hopefully allows us to do a better jobs for you.

2269
02:02:23,360 --> 02:02:25,520
Speaker 4: Then things happened so quickly.

2270
02:02:26,480 --> 02:02:30,000
Speaker 6: There is no perfect intelligence, there's no intelligence. What's happening

2271
02:02:30,080 --> 02:02:33,920
Speaker 6: to block away two blocks away. It's us that are

2272
02:02:34,040 --> 02:02:34,440
Speaker 6: cheaping that.

2273
02:02:34,840 --> 02:02:37,720
Speaker 16: It's us to understand it best, and then we're trusted

2274
02:02:37,720 --> 02:02:38,880
Speaker 16: to make the best decisions we.

2275
02:02:38,920 --> 02:02:43,000
Speaker 1: Can well demonstrable badassery. I can't thank you enough for

2276
02:02:43,000 --> 02:02:46,200
Speaker 1: your service for our country. USMC Retired Colonel Eric Viewer

2277
02:02:46,240 --> 02:02:49,160
Speaker 1: of the book Ghosts of Bagdad Marine Corps Gunships on

2278
02:02:49,160 --> 02:02:50,640
Speaker 1: the opening as of Rock War get a copy of

2279
02:02:50,720 --> 02:02:53,400
Speaker 1: fifty five carsy dot com. Thanks again for your service, Colonel.

2280
02:02:53,440 --> 02:02:55,240
Speaker 1: It has been a real pleasure talking with you, and

2281
02:02:55,440 --> 02:02:57,520
Speaker 1: I know everybody's going to enjoy the book. I'm happy

2282
02:02:57,560 --> 02:03:00,320
Speaker 1: to welcome with the FT five Cares Morning Show. Ilo

2283
02:03:00,600 --> 02:03:03,280
Speaker 1: Creed Days an American author. He's written under a multiple

2284
02:03:03,320 --> 02:03:07,520
Speaker 1: pen names. He has sold over one point four million books.

2285
02:03:07,520 --> 02:03:10,080
Speaker 1: He's received multiple Gold medals for novels and been a

2286
02:03:10,160 --> 02:03:13,760
Speaker 1: Best selling many times over author. Today, we're gonna be

2287
02:03:13,800 --> 02:03:17,480
Speaker 1: talking about the book Plunged the Three Worlds. It's book

2288
02:03:17,560 --> 02:03:22,360
Speaker 1: one Three Worlds described as Christian sci fi series. Shiloh,

2289
02:03:22,880 --> 02:03:25,080
Speaker 1: Welcome to the fifty five KRSEE Morning Show. Thanks for

2290
02:03:25,160 --> 02:03:25,560
Speaker 1: showing up.

2291
02:03:26,720 --> 02:03:28,120
Speaker 13: Hey, thank you so much for having me.

2292
02:03:28,560 --> 02:03:31,760
Speaker 1: Now, I'm confused Christian sci fi series. That's sort of

2293
02:03:31,800 --> 02:03:37,240
Speaker 1: an interesting melding of mediums, I guess. Or I'm just

2294
02:03:37,280 --> 02:03:40,440
Speaker 1: trying to figure out how Christianity and science fiction go

2295
02:03:40,560 --> 02:03:43,000
Speaker 1: hand in hand. Obviously that's what the book is all about.

2296
02:03:43,080 --> 02:03:45,720
Speaker 1: But how did you get the inspiration for this particular

2297
02:03:45,800 --> 02:03:48,920
Speaker 1: book and the idea of merging sci fi and christian theme.

2298
02:03:50,640 --> 02:03:53,920
Speaker 13: Well, it's been a long journey. I've written thirty eight novels,

2299
02:03:54,200 --> 02:03:56,840
Speaker 13: but this one has been over ten years in the making,

2300
02:03:57,080 --> 02:04:00,480
Speaker 13: so I've had a lot of revisions and it's been

2301
02:04:00,880 --> 02:04:04,000
Speaker 13: quite a journey. But you know, have you ever heard

2302
02:04:04,040 --> 02:04:05,440
Speaker 13: of the Philadelphia Project?

2303
02:04:06,520 --> 02:04:06,720
Speaker 8: Yeah?

2304
02:04:07,040 --> 02:04:11,160
Speaker 13: Yeah, yeah, yeah, so we go there too. So a

2305
02:04:11,240 --> 02:04:13,560
Speaker 13: big part of the book is kind of based on

2306
02:04:14,120 --> 02:04:17,520
Speaker 13: the Philadelphia Project, which is considered a conspiracy theory, I

2307
02:04:17,560 --> 02:04:21,520
Speaker 13: guess now, So yeah, we've got conspiracy theories, sci fi

2308
02:04:21,720 --> 02:04:26,400
Speaker 13: and spiritual thriller all wrapped up into one. So Plunge

2309
02:04:26,520 --> 02:04:29,680
Speaker 13: is the story of Jacob Carter who is forced into

2310
02:04:29,720 --> 02:04:33,360
Speaker 13: a military experiment which causes him to jump into the

2311
02:04:33,400 --> 02:04:37,160
Speaker 13: spiritual side of our world, where instead of seeing the physical,

2312
02:04:37,240 --> 02:04:41,120
Speaker 13: he's actually experiencing spiritual things. So it's his journey of

2313
02:04:41,880 --> 02:04:45,360
Speaker 13: discovering who he really is as a navy feel he's

2314
02:04:45,720 --> 02:04:48,400
Speaker 13: very strong, capable and smart, but in the spirit he

2315
02:04:48,520 --> 02:04:51,960
Speaker 13: discovers his true self is not all he wants it

2316
02:04:52,040 --> 02:04:54,720
Speaker 13: to be. So it's a super fun journey.

2317
02:04:55,120 --> 02:04:58,040
Speaker 1: So this spiritual realm that he finds himself in, I

2318
02:04:58,080 --> 02:05:01,320
Speaker 1: guess my understanding is that there's a a cloaking device

2319
02:05:01,440 --> 02:05:05,080
Speaker 1: that puts him into this spiritual realm. Now is this

2320
02:05:05,280 --> 02:05:06,480
Speaker 1: a spiritual realm?

2321
02:05:06,560 --> 02:05:06,680
Speaker 9: Is it?

2322
02:05:06,800 --> 02:05:07,440
Speaker 1: Is it evil?

2323
02:05:07,720 --> 02:05:07,840
Speaker 5: Uh?

2324
02:05:08,040 --> 02:05:10,480
Speaker 1: I means he is? He is he attacked? I mean,

2325
02:05:10,480 --> 02:05:14,280
Speaker 1: because if it's spiritual, there's no physical nature going on.

2326
02:05:14,440 --> 02:05:16,320
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, like, you couldn't get into a gunfight in

2327
02:05:16,360 --> 02:05:18,120
Speaker 1: the spiritual world. I mean, does he come under some

2328
02:05:18,280 --> 02:05:20,560
Speaker 1: threat or and how is his spirituality tested?

2329
02:05:22,160 --> 02:05:22,560
Speaker 11: For sure?

2330
02:05:22,680 --> 02:05:26,200
Speaker 13: Yeah, a lot of threats. There's definitely an action adventure book,

2331
02:05:26,800 --> 02:05:29,200
Speaker 13: so there's a fight scenes throughout, but in the spirit

2332
02:05:29,800 --> 02:05:33,920
Speaker 13: the enemy is a lion, and he is being hunted.

2333
02:05:34,000 --> 02:05:36,800
Speaker 13: Jacob is being hunted throughout the whole book, and it's

2334
02:05:36,840 --> 02:05:40,840
Speaker 13: his journey to figure out, you know what biblically does

2335
02:05:41,000 --> 02:05:44,160
Speaker 13: he have? What what can he do to protect himself

2336
02:05:44,200 --> 02:05:48,280
Speaker 13: and to change things and to keep himself from you know,

2337
02:05:48,920 --> 02:05:53,840
Speaker 13: from the enemy there. So, yeah, plunge is definitely man.

2338
02:05:53,920 --> 02:05:55,320
Speaker 13: I tell people when to pick it up. I say,

2339
02:05:55,400 --> 02:05:58,600
Speaker 13: brace yourself because in the physical world, when he jumps

2340
02:05:58,640 --> 02:06:03,000
Speaker 13: back into the physical he is facing super soldiers. They're

2341
02:06:03,000 --> 02:06:05,240
Speaker 13: putting him against super soldiers to see if they can

2342
02:06:06,080 --> 02:06:08,200
Speaker 13: the government can use the knowledge that he gained in

2343
02:06:08,280 --> 02:06:10,720
Speaker 13: the spirit. So yeah, fights in both worlds.

2344
02:06:10,760 --> 02:06:14,320
Speaker 1: I guess is the lion a metaphor or is it

2345
02:06:14,640 --> 02:06:16,640
Speaker 1: a true lion? I'm thinking like the Lion, the Witch

2346
02:06:16,680 --> 02:06:18,960
Speaker 1: and the Wardrobe, which many point two is maybe a

2347
02:06:19,040 --> 02:06:21,560
Speaker 1: dominant Christian theme if you read those series of books.

2348
02:06:21,600 --> 02:06:23,720
Speaker 1: But in this particular book, is that is that sort

2349
02:06:23,760 --> 02:06:25,960
Speaker 1: of a Is that like an homage to the lion

2350
02:06:26,040 --> 02:06:27,680
Speaker 1: the witch in the War about Wardrobe in some way?

2351
02:06:29,240 --> 02:06:32,080
Speaker 13: No, maybe more to scripture. You know, the Bible says

2352
02:06:32,160 --> 02:06:35,360
Speaker 13: that the enemy goes about like a roaring lion, so

2353
02:06:35,960 --> 02:06:39,440
Speaker 13: it is I fund definitely has a lot of allegorical content.

2354
02:06:40,240 --> 02:06:42,560
Speaker 13: So you know, the more that you get into it,

2355
02:06:42,600 --> 02:06:44,440
Speaker 13: the more I think things that will pop out to

2356
02:06:44,480 --> 02:06:46,160
Speaker 13: you as you read the book.

2357
02:06:47,400 --> 02:06:49,880
Speaker 1: There was a book designed to test people's faith or

2358
02:06:50,040 --> 02:06:52,560
Speaker 1: to you know, affirm it in some way.

2359
02:06:53,880 --> 02:06:56,480
Speaker 13: Oh, definitely to a ferment. When I was thirty two,

2360
02:06:57,280 --> 02:07:01,080
Speaker 13: I had major heart trouble, and this book was really

2361
02:07:01,200 --> 02:07:06,240
Speaker 13: born out of my struggle to find faith and to

2362
02:07:06,360 --> 02:07:09,560
Speaker 13: find divine healing, which thank God I have received here.

2363
02:07:09,640 --> 02:07:14,000
Speaker 13: I am so yeah. Plunge is definitely a spiritual journey,

2364
02:07:14,040 --> 02:07:17,000
Speaker 13: and its purpose is to strengthen, encourage, and kind of

2365
02:07:17,080 --> 02:07:21,280
Speaker 13: wake up the church and people who are maybe seeking

2366
02:07:21,360 --> 02:07:24,840
Speaker 13: God but haven't seen any of his power. They haven't

2367
02:07:24,880 --> 02:07:28,880
Speaker 13: seen the life that they expected to see from that relationship.

2368
02:07:29,360 --> 02:07:31,840
Speaker 1: How about that? So I think you've already answered the question,

2369
02:07:31,960 --> 02:07:33,760
Speaker 1: But who did you write this book for? I can

2370
02:07:33,840 --> 02:07:37,320
Speaker 1: certainly understand that now. I guess you went through this

2371
02:07:37,440 --> 02:07:40,000
Speaker 1: challenge yourself. Was it one of those moments when you

2372
02:07:40,080 --> 02:07:41,960
Speaker 1: felt like God had kind of given up on you

2373
02:07:42,320 --> 02:07:44,360
Speaker 1: or turned his back on you in some way, shape

2374
02:07:44,440 --> 02:07:46,080
Speaker 1: or form. Because I know a lot of people struggle

2375
02:07:46,120 --> 02:07:48,680
Speaker 1: with that sort of harsh reality of the world when

2376
02:07:48,720 --> 02:07:52,640
Speaker 1: they experience times of trouble or maybe in your case,

2377
02:07:53,960 --> 02:07:57,200
Speaker 1: health problems crop up like a cancer diagnosis or something.

2378
02:08:00,200 --> 02:08:04,840
Speaker 13: Definitely a dark time, but it was also a time

2379
02:08:04,880 --> 02:08:08,800
Speaker 13: of hope because I had made the complete decision for

2380
02:08:08,880 --> 02:08:13,360
Speaker 13: myself to trust God's words. So I didn't see any doctors,

2381
02:08:13,400 --> 02:08:15,560
Speaker 13: I didn't do anything else. I I just went to

2382
02:08:15,600 --> 02:08:19,360
Speaker 13: the Lord. And so although it was difficult, I think

2383
02:08:19,440 --> 02:08:21,760
Speaker 13: the biggest thing that I had to do was unlearned

2384
02:08:22,720 --> 02:08:25,560
Speaker 13: things that I thought about God. And I had to

2385
02:08:25,640 --> 02:08:29,520
Speaker 13: go to the Bible and discover what did God actually

2386
02:08:29,600 --> 02:08:31,880
Speaker 13: say about himself? And then I had to believe that

2387
02:08:32,200 --> 02:08:34,720
Speaker 13: instead of all of the things that I had spent

2388
02:08:34,800 --> 02:08:36,720
Speaker 13: my life believing before.

2389
02:08:37,400 --> 02:08:39,560
Speaker 1: Fair enough, Now, this is the first book and what

2390
02:08:39,760 --> 02:08:42,600
Speaker 1: is called the Three Worlds Christian sci fi series? King

2391
02:08:42,920 --> 02:08:45,440
Speaker 1: real quick, I guess, have the other books been written

2392
02:08:45,480 --> 02:08:47,400
Speaker 1: already and we're just waiting to release them after this

2393
02:08:47,520 --> 02:08:50,360
Speaker 1: one's gone out, or are you still working on them?

2394
02:08:50,440 --> 02:08:54,160
Speaker 1: And what also is the Three Worlds? What does initial

2395
02:08:54,240 --> 02:08:55,920
Speaker 1: cap three worlds Christian refer to.

2396
02:08:57,680 --> 02:09:01,160
Speaker 13: Sure three worlds refers to heaven or and Hell. So

2397
02:09:01,560 --> 02:09:04,920
Speaker 13: the book kind of spans all three realms, and the

2398
02:09:05,000 --> 02:09:07,760
Speaker 13: series definitely does. I'm actually sitting here in front of

2399
02:09:07,800 --> 02:09:11,440
Speaker 13: my computer editing Book two. It is scheduled to release,

2400
02:09:11,480 --> 02:09:13,560
Speaker 13: I believe in July, and it is up on pre

2401
02:09:13,720 --> 02:09:14,320
Speaker 13: order right now.

2402
02:09:15,480 --> 02:09:15,680
Speaker 2: Yeah.

2403
02:09:15,800 --> 02:09:20,000
Speaker 13: So as the series progresses, we definitely get into end

2404
02:09:20,080 --> 02:09:25,480
Speaker 13: Times themes. There starts in book two and in book

2405
02:09:25,560 --> 02:09:29,960
Speaker 13: three is full on end time revelation type stuff.

2406
02:09:30,520 --> 02:09:30,720
Speaker 6: Wow.

2407
02:09:30,720 --> 02:09:32,600
Speaker 13: That's extremely fun series.

2408
02:09:33,520 --> 02:09:36,560
Speaker 1: That sounds very interesting to say the least. And I

2409
02:09:36,640 --> 02:09:38,600
Speaker 1: know my listeners will be very interested in getting copy

2410
02:09:38,640 --> 02:09:41,080
Speaker 1: of your book. So what we've done is, Shiloh, put

2411
02:09:41,120 --> 02:09:42,960
Speaker 1: your book up on my blog page fifty five care

2412
02:09:43,040 --> 02:09:45,680
Speaker 1: se dot com with a link to purchase a copy,

2413
02:09:45,760 --> 02:09:49,040
Speaker 1: and I'll encourage my listeners to check that out. Sounds fascinating. Shiloh,

2414
02:09:49,560 --> 02:09:51,840
Speaker 1: create a real pleasure having on the program this morning,

2415
02:09:51,880 --> 02:09:53,960
Speaker 1: and keep up the great work. Obviously, you are an

2416
02:09:54,040 --> 02:09:56,520
Speaker 1: inspired writer with thirty one books under your belt. I

2417
02:09:56,640 --> 02:09:57,600
Speaker 1: just can't imagine.

2418
02:09:59,240 --> 02:10:00,720
Speaker 13: Oh, thank you so so much for having me.

2419
02:10:00,880 --> 02:10:01,880
Speaker 11: I appreciate it been.

2420
02:10:01,800 --> 02:10:04,520
Speaker 1: A real pleasure. Take care seven thirty eight fifty five

2421
02:10:04,680 --> 02:10:06,280
Speaker 1: k RC The Talk Station