1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,439 Speaker 1: In the NATI brought to you by bell Terra Casino 2 00:00:04,559 --> 00:00:09,440 Speaker 1: and Belterra Park on ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home 3 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:10,920 Speaker 1: of the Cincinnati Bengals. 4 00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 2: Robert Windrob joins us Every Thursday. He writes some weekly 5 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,960 Speaker 2: Bengals column for Cincinnati Magazine. You can read this week's 6 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 2: right now at Cincinnati Magazine dot com. Robert was in 7 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:23,440 Speaker 2: town last week and he was at the Bengals game. 8 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 2: He was also at the Bearcats game, and they won 9 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:29,920 Speaker 2: and the Bengals lost, and so you know, we could 10 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:31,320 Speaker 2: talk about the Bearcats. 11 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:33,959 Speaker 3: Well, you know, it's funny. I feel like when I'm 12 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 3: watching the Bengals, I'm watching Big twelve football defense, easy 13 00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 3: scoring drive and a ton of points. So between the 14 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 3: Bengals and the Bearcats, there was no shortage of fireworks. Unfortunately, 15 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:49,120 Speaker 3: we came up just a little bit short in the 16 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 3: pro aspect of that particular combo. 17 00:00:52,320 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 2: Yes, yes we did. You wrote about Al Golden, so 18 00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:59,080 Speaker 2: I you know, amid all the different discussions about the 19 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 2: Bengals defense and how it might be fixed and what 20 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:05,800 Speaker 2: they should do moving forward and who to blame, I 21 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:10,120 Speaker 2: think the general consensus is, look, they asked Al to 22 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:11,840 Speaker 2: do a lot but they didn't give him much to 23 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 2: work with, and so we'll sort of absolve him. In 24 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 2: writing about the game last week, which you were at, 25 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:20,560 Speaker 2: you kind of point the finger at him a little bit, 26 00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:24,000 Speaker 2: and I want folks to read it, but walk me 27 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:27,880 Speaker 2: through is specifically as it relates to Sunday, how Al 28 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,039 Speaker 2: kind of got worked over by his counterpart on the 29 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 2: other team. 30 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I don't think Al Golden would absolve himself. 31 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:36,760 Speaker 3: Let me just say that person foremost, I think he 32 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:40,240 Speaker 3: pointed the finger right squarely in the mirror. But yeah, 33 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,600 Speaker 3: I mean, he's never called plays at the NFL before, 34 00:01:43,640 --> 00:01:46,679 Speaker 3: as much as we take as us or granted, you know, 35 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:50,280 Speaker 3: he obviously did it in college, but pro and college 36 00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 3: ball are not the same thing. He doesn't have the 37 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:55,000 Speaker 3: talent advantage obviously that he had a Notre Dame. And 38 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 3: I think you're seeing it a lot now, especially when 39 00:01:57,600 --> 00:01:59,440 Speaker 3: I was in the press box watching on Sunday, you 40 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:01,440 Speaker 3: see things little bit differently than to do on TV. 41 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 3: And you know, you could just see a lot of 42 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 3: times where the Jets were doing things that they had 43 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 3: done earlier in the game, and we're setting up sort 44 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 3: of zigging off of those zags. The Bengals stopped them early, 45 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:13,240 Speaker 3: you know, helped them to I think it was just 46 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:15,920 Speaker 3: eight yards rushing in the first quarter. By the fourth 47 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:17,800 Speaker 3: quarter it was over alle hundred yards just in the 48 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:20,160 Speaker 3: fifteen minutes. You know, if you could see it coming, 49 00:02:20,200 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 3: they were getting out flanked or they were throwing passes 50 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 3: that we're going to have guys having to pick their 51 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 3: way through, you know, through a messi of receivers and 52 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 3: then you know bunch formations and things like that. And 53 00:02:32,040 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 3: you know, so much of the chess game, if you will, 54 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 3: between coordinators is you know, kind of punch counter punch, 55 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:41,960 Speaker 3: zigging when you are expecting a zag and you know, 56 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,960 Speaker 3: being non rhythmic in a certain way. And you know, 57 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 3: al Going's a rookie at that too, unless as we 58 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 3: talk about the rookies who are playing for the Bengals 59 00:02:49,120 --> 00:02:51,639 Speaker 3: on the field, he's kind of learning on the job 60 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,639 Speaker 3: as he goes too, and he's going to make mistakes, 61 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:56,679 Speaker 3: and you know, there's certain times where you know it's 62 00:02:56,680 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 3: sort of almost too late. He probably sees it come 63 00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:00,560 Speaker 3: in too, if I can see it coming and I'm not, 64 00:03:00,919 --> 00:03:03,359 Speaker 3: you know, Amos Alonso's stag up in the booth there 65 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:06,679 Speaker 3: and I can see certain things happening, but I'm sure 66 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:08,800 Speaker 3: he does too. And it's just a little lady. You know, 67 00:03:08,880 --> 00:03:11,320 Speaker 3: he has to go with what he's called already. But 68 00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:14,280 Speaker 3: you know, the Jets have a first year play caller 69 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 3: two and I just thought that their guy, Tanner egg 70 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:20,120 Speaker 3: Engstrand is his name, Not that anybody would know who 71 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:23,799 Speaker 3: who he is, necessarily, but he's a rookie offensive coordinator 72 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 3: and he was just seemed like he was getting a 73 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 3: step ahead, especially in the second half of Golden And 74 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 3: you know, it's it's just the kind of thing he's 75 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:33,600 Speaker 3: gonna have to work through and get more comfortable with 76 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:36,880 Speaker 3: this sort of cut and thrust of the way plays 77 00:03:36,880 --> 00:03:39,320 Speaker 3: are called and what teams want to do and want 78 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 3: to make you think they're doing, you know, And I 79 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:44,560 Speaker 3: just think he's a step behind right now. And you know, 80 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 3: like the rookies who are playing on the field, that 81 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:48,400 Speaker 3: can only get better with the reps. And I'm sure 82 00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 3: he will too. 83 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:52,320 Speaker 2: Robert Appeal appeal appealing to the younger generation with the 84 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 2: Amos Alonso Stag reference. There you go, Robert. 85 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:58,720 Speaker 3: Him or Walter Camp I wasn't sure which one to 86 00:03:58,800 --> 00:03:59,000 Speaker 3: go with. 87 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,680 Speaker 2: Are very good. They draft players on defense, and the 88 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:07,440 Speaker 2: idea is they make an immediate impact that is not 89 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 2: happening with Shamar Stewart or Dimitrius Knight or Barrett Carter. 90 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 2: Should I start to lose hope when it comes to 91 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:19,520 Speaker 2: these rookies or should should I give them time? Should 92 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:21,040 Speaker 2: I give them time to make an impact? 93 00:04:22,400 --> 00:04:24,120 Speaker 3: Well? I mean, if you're going to take the rookie 94 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 3: class as a hole, the guards or the guys we 95 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 3: thought would be the problem, right, and they've actually both 96 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,239 Speaker 3: played fairly well. Certainly on Sunday they played really well, 97 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:35,080 Speaker 3: and they're getting thrown into the fire. I mean, you know, 98 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 3: you look around the league and there's plenty of rookies 99 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 3: who are making more instant impacts than the guys we have. 100 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:44,680 Speaker 3: Over in Baltimore. Teddy Buchanan, a fourth round the rookie 101 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:47,080 Speaker 3: linebacker named Rookie of the Month for October. So he's 102 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:51,040 Speaker 3: doing something right. I mean, you certainly don't give up hope. 103 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 3: Al Golden himself made the point, like, you know, if 104 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:56,160 Speaker 3: you looked at the guys he worked with back in 105 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:58,360 Speaker 3: the early twenties when they were on their Super Bowl 106 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 3: runs and Logan Wilson and Jermaine Pratt when they were youngsters, 107 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 3: young pups. They made plenty of mistakes too, and they 108 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 3: turned into key elements of the defense. So you know, 109 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 3: you certainly don't write them off. And you know, for 110 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 3: better or worse. I mean, think about how many rookie 111 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:14,280 Speaker 3: classes the Bengals have had where the guys never even 112 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 3: saw the field, you know, and whether that was because 113 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:19,960 Speaker 3: of injury or because they were you know, behind veterans, 114 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 3: or just weren't any good. And then you get to 115 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:24,120 Speaker 3: the year three and you're like, well, now it's time 116 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:26,320 Speaker 3: to see what we have in ex player. But then 117 00:05:26,320 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 3: it's almost too late. Nobody could be saying that about 118 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:31,719 Speaker 3: Barrett Cutter or Demetrius Knight or even Jalen Rivers. You know, 119 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 3: it's like, by year three, we'll know one way or 120 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:36,920 Speaker 3: the other what we have in them and whether it's 121 00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 3: you know, time to move on or whether they're players 122 00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 3: you can build around. So you know, in that sense, 123 00:05:41,360 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 3: it's good that they're getting a lot of reps, but 124 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:47,479 Speaker 3: not so good that they haven't performed anywhere close to 125 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:50,040 Speaker 3: their capabilities as yet. And you know, it's not just 126 00:05:50,080 --> 00:05:53,279 Speaker 3: because they can't play. It's a variety of factors and 127 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,400 Speaker 3: it's almost compounding on itself every week. They have to 128 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 3: just pull out of this kind of nose that that 129 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:00,120 Speaker 3: they're in and get things stab up off before they 130 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:01,200 Speaker 3: can really start to play well. 131 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:05,480 Speaker 2: Robert Wan Trob with a Cincinnatimagazine dot Com Rita's weekly 132 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 2: Bengals column. In your opinion, since that Super Bowl year, 133 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 2: which is feeling like it was decades ago, what is 134 00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 2: the single biggest front office misstep since? 135 00:06:16,880 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 3: Well, let me say this first. I mean, listen, I 136 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 3: know Duke Tobin is beginning a lot of bullets this week, 137 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 3: and I fired a few too, And you know he's 138 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:27,840 Speaker 3: the face. He's there to take that, to take the heat. 139 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 3: So you no, I'm not making any excuses or anything 140 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:33,279 Speaker 3: for him. I don't have any sympathy, but you know, 141 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:35,919 Speaker 3: I think we've also memory hold the idea that it 142 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 3: was only three weeks ago where he sort of saved 143 00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:40,760 Speaker 3: the season by getting Joe fleckowing. I mean, the team 144 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 3: would be completely off a cliff if if we didn't 145 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:46,160 Speaker 3: have the offense going. I mean, you know, think about 146 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:48,760 Speaker 3: not just how they were losing games, but we're totally 147 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:51,440 Speaker 3: unwatchable from the quarterback position, and that's where all the 148 00:06:51,440 --> 00:06:53,240 Speaker 3: money is on the offensive side of the Paul. So 149 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 3: at least they're on track thanks to Joe in that sense, 150 00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 3: and give Toven credit for bringing them in here and 151 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:00,359 Speaker 3: getting him for basically nothing. But to get back to 152 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:03,560 Speaker 3: your point, I mean, there's been a lot of obviously 153 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 3: issues over the last several draft class since that Super Bowl, 154 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 3: But to me, the biggest thing it's not just one misstep, 155 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,280 Speaker 3: it's the failure as a whole to get another pass 156 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:15,680 Speaker 3: rusher in here to go along with Trey Hendrickson. You know, 157 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 3: I think Sam Hubbard at six six and a half 158 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 3: sacks back in twenty two, that's still the most sacks 159 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:24,360 Speaker 3: any player not wearing number ninety one his hat in 160 00:07:24,400 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 3: the last years, three years since the Super Bowl. And 161 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:28,400 Speaker 3: it's not going to get any better this year either. 162 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:31,640 Speaker 3: So you know, you can't as much as we just 163 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 3: talked about Al Golden and the rookies and everything else, 164 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 3: you're playing defense with one hand tied behind your back 165 00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:39,960 Speaker 3: if you can't get any pass rush at all, and 166 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 3: they just can't do it when Hendrickson's not the guy 167 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 3: making it happen single handedly and he just can't go forward, 168 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:49,480 Speaker 3: it's just hard, almost impossible to sustain any kind of 169 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:53,080 Speaker 3: you know, defensive momentum or win you know, consistently in 170 00:07:53,120 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 3: this league without any kind of regular pass rush for 171 00:07:56,200 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 3: multiple angles. So it's been that you know, they've tried obviously, 172 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 3: they drafted Miles Murphy, they drafted Stewart, but they haven't 173 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 3: tried hard enough, and uh, you know they It's almost 174 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 3: like you got to go all out at this point 175 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 3: to get somebody and with Hendrickson's and Penn departure at 176 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 3: some point, whether it's in a couple of weeks, I 177 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 3: don't think so, but possible, or you know, next year 178 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 3: or even the year after, you got to get somebody 179 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:22,960 Speaker 3: else in here to rush the pastor it's just it's 180 00:08:23,000 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 3: beyond a joke at this point. 181 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 2: No question about it. Thank you as always. Well we'll 182 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 2: talk next week, thanks so much. 183 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 3: Okay, hopefully off a win this time, we'll do it. 184 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:33,520 Speaker 2: Give me like what next week, Give me like a 185 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 2: like a like a sid Gilman or a web U 186 00:08:35,920 --> 00:08:37,839 Speaker 2: Bank like GI mean, I just I cannot. You got 187 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,520 Speaker 2: to drop one one of those in once per week now, Okay. 188 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 3: It's Bears week, so it'll be George's house. 189 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:46,280 Speaker 2: That's right, Yes, that's right there you go, Robert win Troup, 190 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:50,240 Speaker 2: Cincinnati Magazine dot com. We're gonna get a Breeders Cup preview. 191 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:58,480 Speaker 4: Next, you've been listening to football in the Nattie on 192 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 4: ESPN's fifteen, the official home of the Cincinnati Bengals. Cincinnati's 193 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:09,840 Speaker 4: ESPN fifteen thirty. 194 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 5: Traffic from the UC Health Traffic Center with a stroke 195 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:17,719 Speaker 5: Every second counts, and so does your team. Home to 196 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 5: rapid life saving treatment and clinical trials. You see Health 197 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,319 Speaker 5: is the clear choice for strokecare. Learn more at u 198 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 5: seehealth dot com. River Road blocked off completely in both 199 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 5: directions from fallen power cables between Fort Thomas Avenue and 200 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:37,280 Speaker 5: Mary Ingles Highway northbound seventy five. It is an accident 201 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 5: over at Western Avenue. Traffic backed up from Freeman Avenue. 202 00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 5: I at Ezelic with traffic. 203 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:44,240 Speaker 3: This report is