1 00:00:00,210 --> 00:00:01,860 S1: All right, let's go. Let's do it. 2 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:12,900 S2: Hey there. I'm Osman Farooqui and this is The Drop, 3 00:00:12,900 --> 00:00:15,870 S2: a culture show from the Sydney Morning Herald in The Age, 4 00:00:15,870 --> 00:00:18,150 S2: where we dive into the latest in the world of 5 00:00:18,150 --> 00:00:22,049 S2: pop culture and entertainment. I'm here with Thomas Mitchell and 6 00:00:22,050 --> 00:00:25,440 S2: Mel Kambouris. The three of us, unlike the industry we 7 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:28,710 S2: cover every week on this show, are not on strike. 8 00:00:28,710 --> 00:00:31,710 S2: In fact, quite the contrary. We're here with a very 9 00:00:31,710 --> 00:00:36,380 S2: special episode of The Drop to unpack the shutdown of Hollywood. 10 00:00:36,390 --> 00:00:39,960 S2: How are we feeling about this, guys? This historic moment 11 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:41,060 S2: we're all living through? 12 00:00:41,070 --> 00:00:43,979 S3: Well, before we get into that historic moment, maybe we 13 00:00:43,979 --> 00:00:47,280 S3: could talk about unpack the historic moment you're going through 14 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:49,800 S3: at the moment to which is your Barbie era. 15 00:00:50,130 --> 00:00:53,490 S2: I was I was shocked How many people because we 16 00:00:53,490 --> 00:00:55,500 S2: mentioned this, I think a couple of episodes ago that 17 00:00:55,500 --> 00:00:58,740 S2: I was thinking about going blonde for the Barbie premiere, 18 00:00:58,740 --> 00:01:00,540 S2: the amount of people I ran into just on the 19 00:01:00,540 --> 00:01:02,670 S2: street who are like, You're not blonde yet. I heard 20 00:01:02,670 --> 00:01:04,560 S2: you were going to go blonde. Like, Jeez, that was 21 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:08,399 S2: just a throwaway line on a podcast. Let a guy live. No, 22 00:01:08,400 --> 00:01:11,120 S2: but I did it. I bleached my hair on Friday. 23 00:01:11,130 --> 00:01:13,170 S4: I wish your barber had gone on strike. 24 00:01:14,490 --> 00:01:15,690 S2: You told me it looked great. 25 00:01:15,930 --> 00:01:18,600 S4: No, it looks good. I'm just having a very kind message. 26 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:21,030 S2: Yeah, I've gone the full kind of platinum blonde. I 27 00:01:21,030 --> 00:01:23,550 S2: think I look. I look like, you know, almost exactly 28 00:01:23,550 --> 00:01:26,070 S2: like Ryan Gosling in the Barbie film. 29 00:01:26,069 --> 00:01:28,650 S3: Now, you haven't done this before. Was it Barbie that 30 00:01:28,650 --> 00:01:29,850 S3: inspired you to do it again? 31 00:01:29,850 --> 00:01:32,460 S2: Yes, I done it before. How long? We're going to 32 00:01:32,459 --> 00:01:34,289 S2: talk about my hair. But I have I have. 33 00:01:34,650 --> 00:01:35,280 S4: Put aside 20. 34 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:38,400 S2: Minutes. I did spend I remember at least a year 35 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,880 S2: blonde previously. And then I don't know how much experience 36 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:44,400 S2: you guys have with with dyeing or bleaching your hair, 37 00:01:44,400 --> 00:01:48,030 S2: but your hair can get quite, you know, frizzy and 38 00:01:48,030 --> 00:01:49,920 S2: sort of dead after a while if you don't take 39 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:51,390 S2: care of it. So I thought, I'm just going to 40 00:01:51,390 --> 00:01:54,360 S2: let it grow out and just come back to its natural, 41 00:01:54,570 --> 00:01:57,840 S2: you know, healthy state. But then I thought, Oh, the 42 00:01:57,840 --> 00:01:59,910 S2: Bobby premiere is a great opportunity to do it again. 43 00:01:59,910 --> 00:02:01,440 S2: I always I always liked it. I thought it was 44 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,390 S2: fun and let's go. So I have. 45 00:02:03,570 --> 00:02:06,210 S4: No you do actually suited. I have been like threatening 46 00:02:06,210 --> 00:02:08,700 S4: this for a long time because I like the idea 47 00:02:08,700 --> 00:02:11,109 S4: of being someone that can like peroxide. Their hair would 48 00:02:11,130 --> 00:02:13,500 S4: look terrible. I did like I did blonde tips. We've 49 00:02:13,500 --> 00:02:15,390 S4: talked about this before. When I was in year eight. 50 00:02:15,389 --> 00:02:17,850 S4: Same time I was wearing a shell necklace. Very confusing 51 00:02:17,850 --> 00:02:21,450 S4: time for me. But yes, sadly, I cannot pull off 52 00:02:21,450 --> 00:02:22,320 S4: the peroxide blonde. 53 00:02:22,410 --> 00:02:24,870 S3: You should go for it. My. My thing about hair 54 00:02:24,870 --> 00:02:27,330 S3: is you can always change it. It will always grow back. 55 00:02:27,330 --> 00:02:29,220 S3: I think you should lean into your blonde era. And 56 00:02:29,220 --> 00:02:31,080 S3: then it would be quite fun having both of you 57 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:32,100 S3: blonde as well. 58 00:02:32,370 --> 00:02:33,960 S4: Blondes do have more fun, as they say. 59 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,740 S2: In my humble experience. That is. That is true. Even 60 00:02:37,860 --> 00:02:39,780 S2: over the last couple of days since I've been blonde, 61 00:02:40,020 --> 00:02:42,870 S2: that feels like the case. But let's put a pin 62 00:02:42,870 --> 00:02:45,000 S2: in the Bobby chat. Not because I don't want to 63 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,070 S2: talk about my hair for for much longer, but because 64 00:02:47,070 --> 00:02:50,850 S2: we will be back later this week, on Thursday. We 65 00:02:50,850 --> 00:02:52,110 S2: Is this a big day for us? Not only are 66 00:02:52,110 --> 00:02:54,990 S2: we doing the special strike pod, but tonight the three 67 00:02:54,990 --> 00:02:59,220 S2: of us are going to see Bobby at the Australian premiere. 68 00:02:59,250 --> 00:03:02,970 S2: Then on Tuesday night, we're going to see Oppenheimer at 69 00:03:02,970 --> 00:03:05,280 S2: the Australian premiere. It's big, big few days, so we're 70 00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:08,369 S2: going to be podcasting about those two big form releases 71 00:03:08,370 --> 00:03:12,600 S2: that'll be out on Thursday. But today we're here to 72 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:15,720 S2: break down the Hollywood strike, and there's a lot to 73 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:19,350 S2: delve into in terms of why it's happening, what's happening now, 74 00:03:19,350 --> 00:03:22,919 S2: what it means for the future of TV and film production, 75 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:25,650 S2: how long it could go on for and what exactly 76 00:03:25,650 --> 00:03:28,889 S2: the strike is over. But before we kind of unpack 77 00:03:28,889 --> 00:03:30,990 S2: each of those things one by one, I want to 78 00:03:30,990 --> 00:03:33,510 S2: ask you, Thomas and Mel, when when you guys you 79 00:03:33,510 --> 00:03:36,060 S2: cover this industry like I do every single day here 80 00:03:36,060 --> 00:03:38,010 S2: at the Herald and The Age, when did you realize 81 00:03:38,010 --> 00:03:41,730 S2: this was going to be an actual big deal that 82 00:03:41,730 --> 00:03:44,250 S2: changed the work that we do day to day? 83 00:03:44,490 --> 00:03:47,490 S4: I can give you like a pretty specific answer to 84 00:03:47,490 --> 00:03:53,280 S4: the minute. At about 3:37 a.m. on Friday morning. Not 85 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,350 S4: that I was awake at this time, but yeah, I 86 00:03:55,350 --> 00:03:59,280 S4: guess the 3:37 a.m. on Friday, I received an email 87 00:03:59,400 --> 00:04:03,240 S4: from the publicist of Jeremy Allen White from the Bet 88 00:04:03,780 --> 00:04:06,420 S4: who we had. I did a conversation with him last 89 00:04:06,420 --> 00:04:08,010 S4: year for the season one and I was trying to 90 00:04:08,010 --> 00:04:09,240 S4: chat to him for season two and we were kind 91 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:11,760 S4: of in the midst of setting that up. And then 92 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:15,120 S4: she emailed me and said, You know, unfortunately Jeremy can 93 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:19,860 S4: no longer do this because the strike means that promotional 94 00:04:19,860 --> 00:04:22,680 S4: activities fall under all the things they can't do. 95 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,380 S3: And we know how excited you were about you are 96 00:04:25,380 --> 00:04:27,870 S3: about the bear. So this must have been quite alarming 97 00:04:27,870 --> 00:04:28,680 S3: for you. Exactly. 98 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:31,310 S4: I wanted to kind of get into him stealing my look. No, 99 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:33,030 S4: but it was pretty crazy to wake up, see this 100 00:04:33,029 --> 00:04:34,469 S4: email and then be like, okay. 101 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:37,140 S2: This this is actually happening. This this is actually happening. 102 00:04:37,140 --> 00:04:39,960 S4: And I know that we've been like probably knowing it's coming. 103 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:41,820 S4: And the writers have been on strike for months, but 104 00:04:42,390 --> 00:04:44,130 S4: I mean, the actors I think has a much more 105 00:04:44,130 --> 00:04:47,339 S4: tangible impact and obviously like they're much more public facing. 106 00:04:47,339 --> 00:04:50,010 S4: But yeah, it was very strange to like literally wake 107 00:04:50,010 --> 00:04:51,600 S4: up to the news but then also wake up to 108 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:54,839 S4: this very firsthand experience of like, okay, this interview I 109 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:57,600 S4: was setting up cannot happen because this person can't work. 110 00:04:57,779 --> 00:05:00,330 S3: Yeah, I think it was when I saw that the 111 00:05:00,330 --> 00:05:04,080 S3: cast of Oppenheimer had left the screening, one of the 112 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:05,909 S3: biggest films of the year. They had been on the 113 00:05:05,910 --> 00:05:08,549 S3: red carpet. And then Christopher Nolan, the director, kind of 114 00:05:08,550 --> 00:05:10,729 S3: stood up in. And said, Oh, you might have noticed 115 00:05:10,730 --> 00:05:13,070 S3: the actors aren't here because they've gone home to go. 116 00:05:13,070 --> 00:05:15,320 S3: And right there, after they've got home to go and 117 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,229 S3: write their placards. I think that was a pretty big 118 00:05:18,230 --> 00:05:22,850 S3: moment when realized, Oh wow, this is happening. The symbolism 119 00:05:22,850 --> 00:05:25,730 S3: of that. And then shortly after saying with you, Thomas 120 00:05:26,690 --> 00:05:29,810 S3: worked with a lot of writers here who have interviews 121 00:05:29,810 --> 00:05:31,969 S3: lined up for the next few months with a lot 122 00:05:31,970 --> 00:05:35,060 S3: of actors for big films. And those interviews started dropping over. 123 00:05:35,060 --> 00:05:38,090 S3: And there something concern about, oh, about stories. 124 00:05:38,180 --> 00:05:40,640 S4: It's going to go in the paper. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 125 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:44,360 S2: I mean, like we are not the the key antagonists 126 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:46,700 S2: or the key focus of the strike as journalists, but 127 00:05:46,700 --> 00:05:49,730 S2: it is interesting to think about how quickly this went 128 00:05:49,730 --> 00:05:52,430 S2: from being like a news event that we all clock 129 00:05:52,430 --> 00:05:56,240 S2: to like, Oh, this actually tangibly impacts the work that 130 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:59,090 S2: we do every day. And Mel, you had a spectrum 131 00:05:59,089 --> 00:06:01,130 S2: and we've got a big interview coming up with with 132 00:06:01,130 --> 00:06:03,890 S2: Killian Murphy, who is the lead in Oppenheimer. That was 133 00:06:03,890 --> 00:06:06,710 S2: done before the strike, but kind of made me realize, 134 00:06:06,710 --> 00:06:08,990 S2: oh wow, like if these things just shifted by a 135 00:06:08,990 --> 00:06:11,120 S2: couple of weeks, you know, we wouldn't have had all 136 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:14,810 S2: that amazing Barbie hype that we saw because we'll talk 137 00:06:14,810 --> 00:06:17,330 S2: about this in a second. But the strike doesn't just 138 00:06:17,330 --> 00:06:20,239 S2: impact the production of films. It impacts, as you said, 139 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:23,480 S2: Thomas like promotional opportunities, interviews, all that sort of stuff. 140 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:25,100 S2: It was kind of why we wanted to do this episode, 141 00:06:25,100 --> 00:06:27,620 S2: I guess, to help people who maybe have been reading 142 00:06:27,620 --> 00:06:30,739 S2: some of the headlines understand exactly what's going on and 143 00:06:30,740 --> 00:06:33,020 S2: how long am I going for and why it will 144 00:06:33,020 --> 00:06:37,159 S2: change the way that we consume culture and journalism about 145 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,430 S2: culture for the foreseeable future. So I thought we could 146 00:06:40,430 --> 00:06:45,410 S2: start by trying to explain exactly how this process works 147 00:06:45,410 --> 00:06:47,470 S2: and how we got here. I'm going to I'm going 148 00:06:47,470 --> 00:06:49,130 S2: to give it a go. But you guys know this 149 00:06:49,130 --> 00:06:50,930 S2: stuff as well as I do, so feel free to 150 00:06:51,230 --> 00:06:53,929 S2: jump in or add any extra bits of detail you 151 00:06:53,930 --> 00:06:57,830 S2: think are relevant. There are essentially three main unions that 152 00:06:57,830 --> 00:07:00,710 S2: operate in Hollywood and represent all the key actors, but 153 00:07:00,710 --> 00:07:02,900 S2: that that was a really bad term because we're not 154 00:07:02,900 --> 00:07:06,109 S2: just talking about actors. There is the Actors Guild, the 155 00:07:06,110 --> 00:07:08,479 S2: Screen Actors Guild, which looks off to actors. There's the 156 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:11,240 S2: Writers Guild, which looks after writers, and there's the Directors Guild, 157 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:15,230 S2: the DGA. All three of those bodies individually negotiate with 158 00:07:15,230 --> 00:07:19,280 S2: this other group called the AMP, which is the Alliance 159 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:23,600 S2: of Motion Picture and Television Producers. That's essentially this umbrella 160 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:28,040 S2: org that represents the production companies. So everyone from Netflix 161 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:32,060 S2: to Amazon to Disney, NBC, all of those companies have 162 00:07:32,060 --> 00:07:36,140 S2: one big umbrella body that they negotiate under. And every 163 00:07:36,140 --> 00:07:40,310 S2: few years the AMP renegotiated the collective agreement that sets 164 00:07:40,310 --> 00:07:43,460 S2: things like minimum rates of pay and conditions for the actors, 165 00:07:43,460 --> 00:07:46,340 S2: writers and directors. Most of the time it's a bit 166 00:07:46,340 --> 00:07:48,920 S2: of a negotiation. They sign a deal and everyone's happy 167 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:51,530 S2: and we go and we get television and film. But 168 00:07:51,530 --> 00:07:55,550 S2: sometimes things break down. I don't know you guys. Probably 169 00:07:55,550 --> 00:07:58,490 S2: none of us were working in the industry in 2007, 170 00:07:58,490 --> 00:08:00,620 S2: but do you have any memories of that strike? That 171 00:08:00,620 --> 00:08:03,560 S2: was the last time a big chunk of Hollywood was 172 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:06,770 S2: shut down because of a failure of the negotiations? 173 00:08:07,370 --> 00:08:10,490 S3: No, but I, I do remember discussion around that time 174 00:08:10,490 --> 00:08:14,740 S3: about a Breaking Bad season that was cut short. And 175 00:08:14,740 --> 00:08:17,420 S3: it actually, I think, fundamentally changed the plot of that 176 00:08:17,420 --> 00:08:19,160 S3: show because they could only get, I think it was 177 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:21,980 S3: 7 or 8 episodes out and they couldn't end it 178 00:08:21,980 --> 00:08:24,260 S3: on a cliffhanger because the season wasn't finished. So it 179 00:08:24,260 --> 00:08:28,310 S3: ended on a kind of regular episode That was from 2007. 180 00:08:28,310 --> 00:08:29,960 S3: I think that's what I remember. 181 00:08:30,230 --> 00:08:32,090 S4: Yeah, I remember the Breaking Bad thing too. I just 182 00:08:32,090 --> 00:08:34,280 S4: remember like, I think the thing that always sticks in 183 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:36,439 S4: your mind is like the funny signs. But yeah, I 184 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:38,750 S4: remember it being like a big thing, but I don't 185 00:08:38,750 --> 00:08:39,740 S4: like kind of have specific. 186 00:08:39,740 --> 00:08:43,160 S2: Yeah, neither I, I saw some videos because the writers 187 00:08:43,340 --> 00:08:46,459 S2: actually have been on strike since May already. And so 188 00:08:46,460 --> 00:08:48,290 S2: there was a lot of talk about the last time 189 00:08:48,290 --> 00:08:50,719 S2: this happened in 2007. I was probably a bit too 190 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:52,400 S2: young to clock a lot of it all. But one 191 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:54,410 S2: of the viral clips that that came around a few 192 00:08:54,410 --> 00:08:56,449 S2: months ago that's really stuck with me was all those 193 00:08:56,450 --> 00:08:59,000 S2: late night talk shows, right? All the writers went on strike, 194 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,600 S2: but the hosts were still contractually obliged to go on 195 00:09:02,600 --> 00:09:04,790 S2: air and talk about stuff. It's really funny clip of 196 00:09:04,790 --> 00:09:07,760 S2: Conan O'Brien, who was literally just like spinning his wedding 197 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:09,710 S2: ring on his desk for like 20 minutes. 198 00:09:10,140 --> 00:09:12,530 S5: That was in Blazing Saddles. All right, here we go. Susie, 199 00:09:12,530 --> 00:09:14,990 S5: are you ready to time this? We're going for 41 seconds. 200 00:09:14,990 --> 00:09:17,410 S5: If we do it, this will be television history. Susie, 201 00:09:17,420 --> 00:09:20,930 S5: you ready to go? I'm ready. Okay. You excited, Susie? Yes. 202 00:09:20,929 --> 00:09:26,340 S5: Good luck. It's not a genuine bone in her body. 203 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:28,470 S5: Are we going to try and get a good spin? 204 00:09:28,470 --> 00:09:29,969 S5: If I don't? I'll start all over again. Band, I 205 00:09:29,970 --> 00:09:34,320 S5: hope you're ready. Here we go. And that's a good spin. 206 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:35,880 S5: That's a good spin. Oh, yeah. 207 00:09:39,460 --> 00:09:41,800 S2: And taking shots at like the studios for not signing 208 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:43,360 S2: a deal. So I don't have any writers. I can't 209 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:45,580 S2: make any gags and the audience is like cheering and 210 00:09:45,580 --> 00:09:48,010 S2: clapping him on as his wedding ring spins for like 211 00:09:48,010 --> 00:09:50,170 S2: 2 or 3 minutes at a time. So yeah, as 212 00:09:50,170 --> 00:09:52,240 S2: we said that the Writers Guild actually has been on 213 00:09:52,240 --> 00:09:55,750 S2: strike this year since May, and that had already halted 214 00:09:55,750 --> 00:09:58,809 S2: a bunch of TV and film productions. But then on Friday, 215 00:09:58,809 --> 00:10:01,270 S2: this is the big news. The Actors Guild decided to 216 00:10:01,270 --> 00:10:05,110 S2: walk out, and it's the first time since 1960 that 217 00:10:05,110 --> 00:10:08,280 S2: both the actors and writers have walked off the job. 218 00:10:08,290 --> 00:10:12,429 S2: Quick pop quiz. Who was the president of the Screen 219 00:10:12,429 --> 00:10:16,059 S2: Actors Guild in 1960 when the actors went on strike then? 220 00:10:16,300 --> 00:10:16,689 S4: Oh. 221 00:10:17,260 --> 00:10:18,340 S3: Thomas, over here. 222 00:10:18,340 --> 00:10:22,020 S4: Over here. I believe it was one Ronald Reagan. Wow. 223 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:23,950 S2: Thomas knows his union history. 224 00:10:23,950 --> 00:10:28,689 S4: Yes. Could I? Yeah. Should we do, like, a Shakespeare 225 00:10:28,690 --> 00:10:33,580 S4: quiz now or. Yeah. Yes. Ronald Reagan from, you know. 226 00:10:34,300 --> 00:10:35,050 S3: Oh, go on. 227 00:10:35,050 --> 00:10:36,730 S2: Well, Reagan From what? From what? Yeah. 228 00:10:36,730 --> 00:10:39,250 S3: Let's dig a little deeper here and see how far this. 229 00:10:39,250 --> 00:10:43,240 S4: Knowledge was going to say. He obviously he was an actor. 230 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:44,199 S4: He was like. 231 00:10:44,620 --> 00:10:45,400 S2: Well, it's an actor. 232 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:49,179 S4: Yes. And then he became president crazy. I think. 233 00:10:49,179 --> 00:10:51,370 S2: He was governor of California in between as well, I. 234 00:10:51,370 --> 00:10:54,190 S4: Believe. Really. But any actor that just put into governor 235 00:10:54,190 --> 00:10:55,030 S4: of California, didn't they? 236 00:10:55,390 --> 00:10:56,830 S2: Yeah. Arnie. 237 00:10:57,490 --> 00:10:57,970 S4: And that's it. 238 00:10:58,270 --> 00:11:05,470 S2: That's the two of them. So so first time since 1960, 239 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:07,930 S2: both the writers and actors are off the job. And 240 00:11:07,929 --> 00:11:10,660 S2: as a result, basically everything has shut down, not just 241 00:11:10,660 --> 00:11:14,290 S2: in Hollywood, but around the world and here in Australia 242 00:11:14,290 --> 00:11:17,350 S2: as well, because there are American actors working on Australian 243 00:11:17,350 --> 00:11:19,960 S2: based productions and because they can no longer work, those 244 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:24,130 S2: productions have essentially halted for the foreseeable future. Thomas You 245 00:11:24,130 --> 00:11:26,740 S2: did some reporting for us last week looking at which 246 00:11:26,740 --> 00:11:30,010 S2: shows in Australia were impacted. What did you find out? 247 00:11:30,010 --> 00:11:33,730 S4: Yeah, so the biggest one probably that was impacted immediately 248 00:11:33,730 --> 00:11:37,390 S4: was Apples Never Fall. So that's like a $79 million 249 00:11:37,420 --> 00:11:41,560 S4: Amazon Prime series. It's based on the bestselling Liane Moriarty book. 250 00:11:41,650 --> 00:11:43,959 S4: Know every book of hers just becomes a series. They're 251 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:45,790 S4: all slightly different versions of the same thing to me. 252 00:11:45,790 --> 00:11:46,300 S4: But anyway. 253 00:11:47,470 --> 00:11:48,460 S3: Wow, I didn't know. 254 00:11:48,460 --> 00:11:49,959 S4: We did the that's for my that's for my. 255 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:51,670 S2: Sorry. I had to go up and drive by shot. 256 00:11:52,210 --> 00:11:55,050 S4: To my Moriarty hate pod. Yeah, but so it's Sam 257 00:11:55,059 --> 00:11:58,540 S4: Neill and Annette Bening and Alison Brie obviously all very 258 00:11:58,540 --> 00:12:00,820 S4: famous actors, obviously all belong to SAG. That was meant 259 00:12:00,820 --> 00:12:06,040 S4: to wrap in September. And yeah, on Thursday we got 260 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:08,809 S4: word that Annette Bening had kind of done quite a 261 00:12:08,830 --> 00:12:12,430 S4: what we're told was like an impassioned speech, like, you know, 262 00:12:12,429 --> 00:12:15,280 S4: almost a, oh, captain, my captain style speech where she 263 00:12:15,309 --> 00:12:17,770 S4: spoke to the crew about what was happening and why 264 00:12:17,770 --> 00:12:19,660 S4: it was important for her to fly home. And she 265 00:12:19,660 --> 00:12:22,960 S4: flew out back to the States on Friday morning. And 266 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:25,240 S4: I believe Alison Brie has also since left. 267 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:26,920 S2: Well, do you know why they're flying back home? They're 268 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:28,809 S2: not just like sort of taking the opportunity to chill 269 00:12:28,809 --> 00:12:29,350 S2: out here. 270 00:12:29,350 --> 00:12:31,480 S4: Well, I guess I'm I reckon I mean, you can 271 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:33,849 S4: probably read a lot into that. Maybe they're like, well, 272 00:12:33,850 --> 00:12:36,760 S4: this is not going to end soon. Also, I guess 273 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:38,770 S4: if you're given the opportunity for a sudden break, maybe 274 00:12:38,770 --> 00:12:40,410 S4: you want to go home and see your family and stuff. True. 275 00:12:40,420 --> 00:12:42,490 S2: Maybe they want to join the picket lines outside. 276 00:12:42,850 --> 00:12:45,069 S4: Yeah, I know that because it's kind of like a 277 00:12:45,070 --> 00:12:47,559 S4: bad look optics wise. If you're like, Oh, I'll just 278 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:49,630 S4: hang out here because I'm assuming that. Well, go back 279 00:12:49,630 --> 00:12:50,380 S4: to work soon. 280 00:12:50,710 --> 00:12:53,230 S2: True, True. Alison Brie You know, Papped on strike at 281 00:12:53,230 --> 00:12:54,660 S2: the beach and Byron or something, maybe. 282 00:12:54,670 --> 00:12:56,860 S4: Yeah, Her and Dave Franco. Just like smashing bees at 283 00:12:56,860 --> 00:13:00,490 S4: cheeky Monkeys in bar. Yeah. So they they've all since 284 00:13:00,490 --> 00:13:03,189 S4: left and production halted on that. They finished shooting it. 285 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:05,530 S4: It was tools down at 5 p.m. on Friday which 286 00:13:05,530 --> 00:13:09,250 S4: was the cut off in LA and also similarly Mortal 287 00:13:09,250 --> 00:13:12,550 S4: Kombat two. That was like a big film that was 288 00:13:12,550 --> 00:13:15,099 S4: shooting on the go, both shooting in Queensland and that 289 00:13:15,250 --> 00:13:17,290 S4: was meant to wrap in August and it's since been 290 00:13:17,290 --> 00:13:19,630 S4: tools down on that. Pretty sure it stars Karl Urban 291 00:13:19,630 --> 00:13:22,840 S4: from Star Trek and amongst the other host of other Australians. 292 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:24,520 S4: And so yeah, they're two of the kind of biggest 293 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:27,250 S4: current productions. There's one other production we know that is 294 00:13:27,250 --> 00:13:30,910 S4: shooting with kind of an American cast. It's it's hasn't 295 00:13:30,910 --> 00:13:33,850 S4: been confirmed. It's under embargo, but that will also be halted. 296 00:13:33,850 --> 00:13:37,449 S4: So yeah, it's basically anything with SAG members has to 297 00:13:37,450 --> 00:13:40,330 S4: cease production immediately. But we do know stuff like the 298 00:13:40,330 --> 00:13:42,820 S4: Office Australia, which was a big deal. Everyone was kind 299 00:13:42,820 --> 00:13:45,340 S4: of across that the Australian spin off like that's all 300 00:13:45,340 --> 00:13:47,650 S4: Australian cast and crew. So that will be going ahead. 301 00:13:47,740 --> 00:13:49,990 S4: I think they're in pre-production now. So yeah, it was 302 00:13:49,990 --> 00:13:53,860 S4: again like, you know, obviously it's not about our industry 303 00:13:53,860 --> 00:13:55,660 S4: specifically or anything, but it's always easy to relate when 304 00:13:55,660 --> 00:13:58,840 S4: it affects you. And it was very interesting to hear it, 305 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,449 S4: you know, see these images of the actors on the 306 00:14:01,450 --> 00:14:03,940 S4: picket line in America and see Fran Drescher giving her 307 00:14:03,940 --> 00:14:06,670 S4: now famous speech and then also have these productions like 308 00:14:07,030 --> 00:14:08,560 S4: being impacted here straight away. Yeah. 309 00:14:08,559 --> 00:14:10,449 S3: And I guess for listeners who also want to know 310 00:14:10,450 --> 00:14:12,670 S3: what other shows are going to be affected through the 311 00:14:12,670 --> 00:14:15,670 S3: combination of the writers and actors strikes, there's some really 312 00:14:15,670 --> 00:14:18,939 S3: big shows that are going to be delayed. The White Lotus, 313 00:14:18,940 --> 00:14:22,270 S3: I know a favorite for us. Emily in Paris, Stranger Things. 314 00:14:22,270 --> 00:14:27,640 S3: Yellow Jackets, The Mandalorian, Deadpool Gladiator two, Mission Impossible. So 315 00:14:27,640 --> 00:14:29,200 S3: you won't be able to get to talk to Tom 316 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:30,280 S3: Cruise again. I'll probably. 317 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:31,090 S4: Say it at Tom's. 318 00:14:31,090 --> 00:14:35,050 S3: House. You need to ask him finally about that missing award. 319 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:40,510 S3: My favourite, Paddington. Paddington in Peru. Delayed. So some really. 320 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:41,750 S2: There's the new Paddington movie coming. 321 00:14:41,750 --> 00:14:42,859 S3: Yeah, in Peru. He's going. 322 00:14:42,860 --> 00:14:43,360 S4: To Peru? 323 00:14:43,370 --> 00:14:44,420 S2: Yeah, he's from Peru. 324 00:14:44,540 --> 00:14:46,670 S3: Who is he? Come on. You're not. 325 00:14:46,670 --> 00:14:49,070 S2: Across this. Paddington is a refugee from Peru. 326 00:14:49,070 --> 00:14:51,290 S4: Yeah, I did not know. I mean. 327 00:14:51,290 --> 00:14:53,150 S2: Yeah, and his. And his name is actually, I think 328 00:14:53,150 --> 00:14:55,910 S2: it's like post-WWII or something like that. And he's called 329 00:14:55,910 --> 00:14:58,190 S2: Paddington because when he rocks up as a refugee at 330 00:14:58,190 --> 00:15:02,479 S2: Paddington Station, the dumb English family can't say his name properly. 331 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:04,490 S2: They're like, Well, we'll just call you Paddington. 332 00:15:04,610 --> 00:15:06,560 S4: Oh, so this is like a classic English story where 333 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:07,880 S4: they like, we'll take him and we'll give him a 334 00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:09,230 S4: better life and we'll give him. 335 00:15:09,230 --> 00:15:11,390 S3: A Wellington and a marmalade sandwich. Yeah. 336 00:15:11,390 --> 00:15:13,880 S4: And he's probably like, fucking dreaming of. I don't know, 337 00:15:13,970 --> 00:15:14,190 S4: This is. 338 00:15:14,210 --> 00:15:16,400 S2: This is a problem because I don't know if you 339 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:18,860 S2: guys are following this, but the UK is kind of 340 00:15:18,860 --> 00:15:22,160 S2: embroiled in some pretty intense debate around immigration policy. A 341 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:24,410 S2: lot of kind of stopped the boats rhetoric. It feels 342 00:15:24,410 --> 00:15:28,100 S2: like a good time for a, you know, a narrative 343 00:15:28,100 --> 00:15:32,360 S2: about Paddington. The refugee of the UK needs this to 344 00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:34,160 S2: sort of reset its political debate. 345 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:36,380 S3: I agree. And although I would say that every time 346 00:15:36,380 --> 00:15:38,420 S3: is a good time for Paddington, I think you could 347 00:15:38,420 --> 00:15:40,880 S3: learn a lot from Paddington Bear. 348 00:15:40,910 --> 00:15:43,370 S2: The White Lotus one is interesting. I spoke to Mike 349 00:15:43,370 --> 00:15:46,010 S2: White about the writers strike a few weeks ago when 350 00:15:46,010 --> 00:15:48,860 S2: he was here in Sydney and he was pretty sanguine 351 00:15:48,860 --> 00:15:51,770 S2: about it because he he does know writing writers room 352 00:15:51,770 --> 00:15:53,690 S2: for that show. It's just kind of him. And he 353 00:15:53,690 --> 00:15:55,070 S2: was like, Well, obviously I'm going to obey the strike. 354 00:15:55,070 --> 00:15:56,990 S2: But he's like, Man, I'm really tired. Like I could 355 00:15:56,990 --> 00:15:59,360 S2: do with a couple of months just chilling in Thailand 356 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:02,300 S2: doing my development work. But yeah, that's a big list 357 00:16:02,300 --> 00:16:04,370 S2: of shows and films. And I think what is interesting 358 00:16:04,370 --> 00:16:07,970 S2: about all of these shutdowns is we've still got TV now, right? 359 00:16:07,970 --> 00:16:10,340 S2: Like this isn't sort of stopping stuff that has been 360 00:16:10,340 --> 00:16:13,010 S2: produced and signed off and is about to be distributed. 361 00:16:13,010 --> 00:16:16,670 S2: But in 3 to 4 months, like we could be 362 00:16:16,670 --> 00:16:20,570 S2: seeing very, very little stuff that isn't reality or documentary 363 00:16:20,570 --> 00:16:24,620 S2: because those are two production sort of categories that are 364 00:16:24,620 --> 00:16:27,270 S2: not impacted right. From from these kinds of strikes. And 365 00:16:27,290 --> 00:16:27,500 S2: it will. 366 00:16:27,500 --> 00:16:30,380 S3: Be interesting to see, too, because to be clear, these 367 00:16:30,380 --> 00:16:34,520 S3: are kind of American unions and the UK has its 368 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:37,490 S3: own union equity and we obviously have our own unions 369 00:16:37,490 --> 00:16:40,730 S3: here in Australia. But because of the way the global 370 00:16:40,730 --> 00:16:43,430 S3: nature of television and film it, it will be interesting 371 00:16:43,430 --> 00:16:46,130 S3: to see how it plays out. As in so far 372 00:16:46,130 --> 00:16:48,200 S3: I've read that House of Dragons is still being shot 373 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:51,260 S3: because the contract that's under is the UK Union. 374 00:16:51,260 --> 00:16:53,810 S2: Yeah, mainly a mainly British kind of crew. But there's 375 00:16:53,810 --> 00:16:56,900 S2: some speculation that that's like a little bit dodgy, like 376 00:16:56,900 --> 00:17:00,740 S2: the idea that there's not a single American SAG actor 377 00:17:00,740 --> 00:17:04,400 S2: or writer on that show doesn't totally make sense to me. 378 00:17:04,670 --> 00:17:06,649 S3: Yeah, that's what I mean. And so it'll be interesting 379 00:17:06,650 --> 00:17:09,590 S3: to see how those kind of cross country shows, which 380 00:17:09,590 --> 00:17:11,480 S3: are heaps of them play out. Like we have seen 381 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:13,550 S3: it already here in Australia with some of them. But 382 00:17:13,550 --> 00:17:16,250 S3: surely there'll be a stack more that are filming elsewhere 383 00:17:16,250 --> 00:17:17,600 S3: that are going to be pulled as well. 384 00:17:17,780 --> 00:17:21,980 S2: Thomas You mentioned Fran Drescher inspiring speech. I thought this 385 00:17:21,980 --> 00:17:24,470 S2: might be an opportunity to talk about her for a second. 386 00:17:24,470 --> 00:17:26,840 S2: So we mentioned Ronald Reagan was the president of the 387 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:29,810 S2: Screen Actors Guild in 1960. The current president of the 388 00:17:29,810 --> 00:17:33,139 S2: Screen Actors Guild is Fran Drescher, who most people know 389 00:17:33,140 --> 00:17:37,880 S2: from the 90s sitcom The Nanny. And her speech was 390 00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:39,670 S2: pretty extraordinary. I think all three of us were. I 391 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:42,170 S2: quite moved by it. Let's let's listen to a little 392 00:17:42,170 --> 00:17:42,500 S2: bit of it. 393 00:17:42,500 --> 00:17:47,359 S6: What we are saying, you cannot change the business model 394 00:17:47,690 --> 00:17:52,040 S6: as much as it has changed and not expect the 395 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:56,420 S6: contract to change, too. We're not going to keep doing 396 00:17:56,420 --> 00:18:01,399 S6: incremental changes on a contract that no longer honors what 397 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,670 S6: is happening right now with this business model that was 398 00:18:04,670 --> 00:18:09,230 S6: foisted upon us. What are we doing moving around furniture 399 00:18:09,230 --> 00:18:17,040 S6: on the Titanic? It's crazy. So the jig is up amp. 400 00:18:17,180 --> 00:18:21,500 S6: We stand tall. You have to wake up and smell 401 00:18:21,500 --> 00:18:22,429 S6: the coffee. 402 00:18:22,940 --> 00:18:26,120 S2: We are. Yeah. Pretty strong stuff. Did you like the 403 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:27,620 S2: Titanic reference? 404 00:18:27,619 --> 00:18:30,980 S4: I love that. I mean, I love a topical Titanic reference. 405 00:18:31,430 --> 00:18:34,429 S4: And also, I mean, given Ronald Reagan's trajectory, are we 406 00:18:34,430 --> 00:18:37,429 S4: looking at like a Fran 2040 run for the White House? 407 00:18:37,430 --> 00:18:39,800 S3: I think I've had you, but you have established. 408 00:18:39,830 --> 00:18:40,729 S4: I've noticed a pattern. 409 00:18:41,060 --> 00:18:43,850 S2: Funny you should bring that up. Right. Because a lot 410 00:18:43,850 --> 00:18:46,070 S2: of people who maybe don't follow the ins and outs 411 00:18:46,070 --> 00:18:51,619 S2: of Screen Actors Guild union bureaucracies, unlike me, were a 412 00:18:51,619 --> 00:18:53,960 S2: bit surprised to see the nanny like sort of lead 413 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:57,740 S2: the charge on this. But Fran Drescher in a number 414 00:18:57,740 --> 00:19:03,560 S2: of like different television and film stories has been like 415 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:07,909 S2: a very strong advocate for like, unionism. There's an episode 416 00:19:07,910 --> 00:19:13,010 S2: of the Nanny called The Strike where Fran refuses to 417 00:19:13,010 --> 00:19:16,189 S2: cross a picket line that Mr. Sheffield is like dragging 418 00:19:16,190 --> 00:19:18,380 S2: her through. And it's not like an actor strike. It's 419 00:19:18,380 --> 00:19:21,440 S2: busboys like waiters in this hotel that are going on strike. 420 00:19:21,790 --> 00:19:24,830 S7: Fine. You're embarrassing me. Now come along. I can't. 421 00:19:24,830 --> 00:19:27,950 S8: My hands. A blouse would roll over in her grave, 422 00:19:27,950 --> 00:19:29,660 S8: which was paid for by her union. 423 00:19:31,130 --> 00:19:33,140 S7: How would you please come in before this turns into 424 00:19:33,140 --> 00:19:36,530 S7: a spectacle? Would you go? 425 00:19:37,130 --> 00:19:44,260 UU: Why would you please. And she's like. 426 00:19:44,260 --> 00:19:46,780 S2: My mom told me to never, ever cross a picket line. 427 00:19:46,780 --> 00:19:49,389 S2: And then Mr. Sheffield tries to, like, drag her across 428 00:19:49,390 --> 00:19:51,790 S2: the picket line. She gets photographed. It's like in The 429 00:19:51,790 --> 00:19:54,550 S2: New York Times, it becomes this big scandal, and Mr. 430 00:19:54,550 --> 00:19:58,780 S2: Sheffield becomes, like, completely pilloried, cancelled, if you will, for 431 00:19:58,780 --> 00:20:02,110 S2: dragging his nanny across the picket line. And then, I 432 00:20:02,109 --> 00:20:04,690 S2: don't know, Have either of you guys seen 1997 Beautician 433 00:20:04,690 --> 00:20:05,500 S2: and the Beast? 434 00:20:05,740 --> 00:20:06,190 S3: I'm not. 435 00:20:06,190 --> 00:20:07,120 S4: No, no. 436 00:20:07,660 --> 00:20:09,480 S3: I had no idea you were such a friend, Drescher 437 00:20:09,490 --> 00:20:09,760 S3: I'm a. 438 00:20:09,910 --> 00:20:11,500 S2: I'm a friend. Drescher Ahead. Well, this is why she's 439 00:20:11,500 --> 00:20:14,199 S2: got great, great views on these things. So beautician and 440 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,619 S2: the beast, she plays a beautician, somehow gets confused for 441 00:20:17,619 --> 00:20:21,220 S2: being like, a teacher and gets sort of hired by 442 00:20:21,220 --> 00:20:25,390 S2: this dictator in this fake Eastern European country to, I think, 443 00:20:25,390 --> 00:20:27,669 S2: educate his kids seriously. 444 00:20:27,670 --> 00:20:30,250 S4: Anything goes. In the 90s plot was just like. 445 00:20:31,690 --> 00:20:34,900 S2: She ends up visiting like a steel mine and she 446 00:20:34,900 --> 00:20:37,780 S2: asks the workers like when they get to have their 447 00:20:37,780 --> 00:20:40,110 S2: break and they're like, what break? And she's like, What? 448 00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:41,980 S2: Talk to your union. And they're like, What's a union? 449 00:20:41,980 --> 00:20:45,310 S2: And then she ends up unionizing all of these steelworkers. 450 00:20:45,310 --> 00:20:49,869 S2: So very franchise has been smuggling all this wacky, pro-union stuff, 451 00:20:49,869 --> 00:20:52,270 S2: you know, for a long, long time. And you mentioned 452 00:20:52,270 --> 00:20:53,740 S2: whether she might be running for president. I had a 453 00:20:53,740 --> 00:20:55,869 S2: little back in the days of when I was very 454 00:20:55,869 --> 00:20:58,540 S2: involved in Twitter, had a bit of an interaction with 455 00:20:58,540 --> 00:21:01,570 S2: Fran on Twitter where she was posting some pretty bolshie stuff. 456 00:21:01,570 --> 00:21:07,240 S2: I think during the the Bernie Hillary primary campaign, 2015, 2016. 457 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:08,980 S2: And I said, Fran, you know, like, are we going 458 00:21:08,980 --> 00:21:11,590 S2: to see you maybe run for president one day? And 459 00:21:11,590 --> 00:21:14,890 S2: she said she said, watch this space. So there you go. 460 00:21:15,190 --> 00:21:18,280 S4: Really? Yeah. 2014 Osmond with the scoop. 461 00:21:18,310 --> 00:21:19,840 S3: You already had the scoop then. 462 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:21,850 S2: I was very happy with that and I'm glad to 463 00:21:21,850 --> 00:21:24,690 S2: be able to talk about it seven years later. Now, 464 00:21:24,690 --> 00:21:25,720 S2: with you guys, I'm. 465 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:28,090 S3: Really glad to see the nanny back in the limelight. 466 00:21:28,119 --> 00:21:30,220 S3: I thought her speech was very rousing. I really liked 467 00:21:30,220 --> 00:21:33,159 S3: when she evoked the French Revolution. You know, the people 468 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,590 S3: break down the gates of a sigh and then it's over. 469 00:21:35,590 --> 00:21:37,900 S3: I thought that was great. Also, I really enjoyed I 470 00:21:37,900 --> 00:21:40,180 S3: don't know if you saw, but before she gave this speech, 471 00:21:40,180 --> 00:21:43,210 S3: she'd been criticized because she had been off in Italy 472 00:21:43,210 --> 00:21:46,240 S3: at a Dolce and Gabbana show, and she was photographed 473 00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:49,210 S3: with Kim Kardashian and people were criticizing her for being 474 00:21:49,210 --> 00:21:52,119 S3: offered a fashion show when she should have been, you know, 475 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,699 S3: when it was thought she should have been negotiating the deal. 476 00:21:54,700 --> 00:21:56,800 S3: And she came back with some great lines about that, too, 477 00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:58,869 S3: about how she didn't want to be running around on 478 00:21:58,869 --> 00:22:01,420 S3: the cobblestones in high heels, how it was all work, 479 00:22:01,420 --> 00:22:04,840 S3: how it wasn't a selfie. Yeah. So, Fran, friends having 480 00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:05,050 S3: a moment? 481 00:22:05,050 --> 00:22:09,340 S4: It's pretty fun. I thought that I thought that that moment, like, 482 00:22:09,340 --> 00:22:11,350 S4: I think that really rammed it home for a lot 483 00:22:11,350 --> 00:22:12,639 S4: of people. And like you said, it was and I 484 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,670 S4: don't think many people knew that she. Fran Drescher like 485 00:22:15,670 --> 00:22:17,859 S4: who obviously we all know from the nanny is involved. 486 00:22:17,859 --> 00:22:20,830 S4: But it was like this incredible speech. And, you know, 487 00:22:20,830 --> 00:22:23,979 S4: the way we consume culture, the Internet, just like packaged 488 00:22:23,980 --> 00:22:25,689 S4: it up and repurposed it and like smashed it out 489 00:22:25,690 --> 00:22:28,030 S4: there so everyone saw it. And yeah, so I think 490 00:22:28,030 --> 00:22:29,830 S4: like everyone that I've spoken to, that's kind of not 491 00:22:29,830 --> 00:22:33,220 S4: as like in to the business has been like, Oh yeah, 492 00:22:33,220 --> 00:22:34,900 S4: like the Fran thing was pretty cool. So that seems 493 00:22:34,900 --> 00:22:36,369 S4: to be this like kind of flashpoint. 494 00:22:36,369 --> 00:22:38,800 S3: Yeah, I feel like campaigns like this need a moment. 495 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:41,139 S3: And that was the momentum. That was the moment to 496 00:22:41,140 --> 00:22:42,160 S3: launch the momentum. 497 00:22:52,230 --> 00:22:55,139 S2: It's the most fascinating thing about like a labor dispute 498 00:22:55,140 --> 00:22:57,840 S2: is by its nature, not the most exciting kind of 499 00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:00,450 S2: topic of choice. And, you know, if it was another 500 00:23:00,450 --> 00:23:03,480 S2: category of workers in another country that went on strike, 501 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,700 S2: I don't know if it would have gripped global attention 502 00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:08,160 S2: the way this has. But we're talking about the biggest 503 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:11,880 S2: names in the world. We're talking about people who literally 504 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:14,129 S2: act and hold our attention for a living. And we're 505 00:23:14,130 --> 00:23:17,040 S2: talking about a character and an actress as iconic as 506 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:21,900 S2: Fran Drescher giving this kind of speech. It I was 507 00:23:21,900 --> 00:23:24,600 S2: a bit surprised to see it across like all my 508 00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:26,910 S2: feeds from all sorts of like regular people who don't 509 00:23:26,910 --> 00:23:29,699 S2: work in the industry. And I think because we'll get 510 00:23:29,700 --> 00:23:31,050 S2: into this when we talk about some of the issues 511 00:23:31,050 --> 00:23:36,780 S2: but like. Friends speech went beyond acting and writing like 512 00:23:36,780 --> 00:23:39,450 S2: she was very explicit in being like the world doesn't 513 00:23:39,450 --> 00:23:42,030 S2: feel right at the moment. Like Wall Street's making a 514 00:23:42,030 --> 00:23:44,400 S2: lot of money and lots of regular people are having 515 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:47,970 S2: their jobs and livelihoods threatened by technology and all this 516 00:23:47,970 --> 00:23:50,100 S2: kind of really intense change. And this is a moment 517 00:23:50,100 --> 00:23:53,280 S2: for us to all pay attention. So let's talk about 518 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:57,030 S2: some of those key issues because. I feel like understanding 519 00:23:57,030 --> 00:23:59,640 S2: the sticking points is important to understanding what is really 520 00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:02,760 S2: happening in Hollywood right now. I feel like what's really 521 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:05,280 S2: interesting is that the last couple of times there's been 522 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:09,990 S2: an actor's strike. It's revolved around technology and essentially the 523 00:24:09,990 --> 00:24:13,950 S2: industry going through technological change and how actors are fighting 524 00:24:13,950 --> 00:24:17,430 S2: to be properly compensated for that. In that 1960 strike 525 00:24:17,430 --> 00:24:19,650 S2: that we've mentioned a couple of times, the key sticking 526 00:24:19,650 --> 00:24:22,440 S2: point was actually TV. TV had been around at that 527 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,080 S2: stage for like a decade. And actors were saying, Well, 528 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:28,409 S2: when my show gets aired on television and the network 529 00:24:28,410 --> 00:24:30,240 S2: makes a bunch of money on it from selling ads, 530 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,179 S2: I should get a portion of that money. And they 531 00:24:33,180 --> 00:24:36,660 S2: do now. And it's like a bedrock of how the 532 00:24:36,660 --> 00:24:39,330 S2: television and acting industries work. When the actors went on 533 00:24:39,330 --> 00:24:43,109 S2: strike in the 1980s, it was about VHS tapes which 534 00:24:43,109 --> 00:24:45,000 S2: had just started to become a thing. And they're like, Well, 535 00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,300 S2: when they sell my tape for $25, I should get 536 00:24:48,300 --> 00:24:52,080 S2: a cut of that money. And they do in 2007. 537 00:24:52,290 --> 00:24:55,020 S2: This is so interesting because the Writers Guild, you read 538 00:24:55,020 --> 00:24:57,719 S2: like kind of the the sticking points then and you 539 00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,750 S2: read the marketing and the kind of propaganda from both sides. 540 00:25:00,750 --> 00:25:03,210 S2: And they're talking about like the Internet, but they're talking 541 00:25:03,210 --> 00:25:04,800 S2: about it in this way that they're not quite sure. 542 00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,830 S2: They're like, our writers are being asked to write shows 543 00:25:07,830 --> 00:25:10,500 S2: for websites. And like The Office was this one where 544 00:25:10,500 --> 00:25:14,850 S2: the Office did this series of like off season online 545 00:25:14,850 --> 00:25:18,030 S2: shorts and the writers weren't getting paid proper rates for it. 546 00:25:18,030 --> 00:25:20,129 S2: And they're like, You know what? Maybe like down the 547 00:25:20,130 --> 00:25:21,960 S2: track we might be doing a fair bit of like 548 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:25,020 S2: writing for the Internet. Maybe we should get proper payment 549 00:25:25,020 --> 00:25:27,000 S2: for that. And that's what the strike was about. And 550 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,540 S2: they won essentially. And now that's when 99% of us 551 00:25:30,540 --> 00:25:34,020 S2: watch things is on streaming platforms. Now, the two big 552 00:25:34,020 --> 00:25:37,260 S2: issues are around AI, which which is a complicated one 553 00:25:37,260 --> 00:25:41,250 S2: that will delve into and residuals from streaming. Let's start 554 00:25:41,250 --> 00:25:43,290 S2: with this streaming thing, because I think that's the most, 555 00:25:43,380 --> 00:25:45,810 S2: I guess like in line with these other issues that 556 00:25:45,810 --> 00:25:48,629 S2: feels like the evolution of how the industry is going. 557 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,750 S2: Thomas One of the key issues has been the lack 558 00:25:51,750 --> 00:25:55,890 S2: of transparency around like what is being watched and therefore 559 00:25:55,890 --> 00:25:59,460 S2: what writers and actors should get compensated for. Can you 560 00:25:59,460 --> 00:26:01,980 S2: talk us through a bit like about those problems in 561 00:26:01,980 --> 00:26:04,320 S2: what the actors are fighting for right now? 562 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:06,810 S4: Yeah. So this is like you said, it kind of 563 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:09,510 S4: is one of the main, I guess, bones of contention. It's, 564 00:26:09,510 --> 00:26:14,369 S4: it's basically a viewership based residual. So everyone gets a 565 00:26:14,369 --> 00:26:17,460 S4: residual like as baked into your contract when you're on 566 00:26:17,460 --> 00:26:20,220 S4: a show. But the actors are arguing that they should. 567 00:26:20,220 --> 00:26:23,100 S4: Should the show be a success on streaming? There should 568 00:26:23,100 --> 00:26:27,300 S4: be a further residual that is paid to reflect that success. Unfortunately, 569 00:26:27,300 --> 00:26:29,280 S4: as has always been the way with streaming platforms, they 570 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,060 S4: refuse to share data. They don't ever say, You know, 571 00:26:33,060 --> 00:26:35,310 S4: how many people are watching, how many hours are being watched. 572 00:26:35,310 --> 00:26:37,260 S4: It's like they're very, very private when it comes to 573 00:26:37,260 --> 00:26:39,479 S4: the success of a show. Obviously, that doesn't mean we 574 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,629 S4: don't know what successful because we do. And so essentially 575 00:26:42,630 --> 00:26:46,950 S4: what the Sag-aftra members have proposed is that they they 576 00:26:46,950 --> 00:26:49,439 S4: have proposed using data from Parrot Analytics, which is a 577 00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:52,260 S4: company that kind of like aggregates a bunch of data 578 00:26:52,260 --> 00:26:56,010 S4: pools in, you know, search queries, fan sites, social media 579 00:26:56,010 --> 00:26:58,800 S4: engagement downloads, and can kind of paint a picture of 580 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:00,270 S4: how popular a show is. 581 00:27:00,270 --> 00:27:02,490 S2: Sort of the next best thing to having the actual 582 00:27:02,490 --> 00:27:04,139 S2: ratings from the companies themselves. 583 00:27:04,140 --> 00:27:08,130 S4: Exactly. Exactly. And they've basically gone to the studios and said, look, 584 00:27:08,130 --> 00:27:10,710 S4: we'll use parrot analytics. We know how popular shows are 585 00:27:10,710 --> 00:27:13,560 S4: and we can figure out the viewership based residuals off that. 586 00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:17,310 S4: The studios have said absolutely no to parrot analytics, of course, 587 00:27:17,340 --> 00:27:20,010 S4: like the Sag-aftra saying that we're happy to do it 588 00:27:20,010 --> 00:27:22,950 S4: off your data, should you share it, but they refuse to. 589 00:27:22,980 --> 00:27:26,699 S4: So basically, like that's kind of this real main sticking 590 00:27:26,700 --> 00:27:28,710 S4: point because you've got you know, there's so many examples. 591 00:27:28,710 --> 00:27:31,050 S4: I know that the creator of Squid Game comes out 592 00:27:31,050 --> 00:27:32,760 S4: and talks about all the time like he had one 593 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,820 S4: of the most popular shows over the last decade, and 594 00:27:35,820 --> 00:27:38,939 S4: he made no extra money despite creating a phenomenon for 595 00:27:38,940 --> 00:27:41,460 S4: Netflix who have made so much money off squid game 596 00:27:41,460 --> 00:27:43,980 S4: and squid game merchandise and the IP of squid game. 597 00:27:43,980 --> 00:27:47,610 S4: So yeah, it really is this, you know, it's I'm 598 00:27:47,609 --> 00:27:49,620 S4: not surprised. They're kind of like sticking to their guns 599 00:27:49,619 --> 00:27:52,030 S4: on this one because it's insane that that you know 600 00:27:52,050 --> 00:27:53,850 S4: you can make the same for a squid game as 601 00:27:53,850 --> 00:27:56,429 S4: you might make for something that does nowhere near as 602 00:27:56,430 --> 00:27:56,850 S4: well And. 603 00:27:56,850 --> 00:27:58,800 S3: Obviously back in the day it would have been based 604 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:00,990 S3: on TV ratings because you often hear about in the 605 00:28:00,990 --> 00:28:03,090 S3: case of friends, by the end of that series, they 606 00:28:03,090 --> 00:28:04,290 S3: were getting $1 million in. 607 00:28:04,290 --> 00:28:07,320 S2: Episode. Yeah, they could negotiate every year. They were like, Oh, okay, 608 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,510 S2: these are published every day. We see how many people 609 00:28:09,510 --> 00:28:11,010 S2: watch it. And that gave them leverage. 610 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:14,760 S4: Exactly. So yeah, that, that I think will be a really, 611 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:18,210 S4: really big one. And it'll be interesting because, you know, 612 00:28:18,210 --> 00:28:19,949 S4: there are lots of rumors and I know we've all 613 00:28:19,950 --> 00:28:22,650 S4: been kind of engaging in the content around this strike 614 00:28:22,650 --> 00:28:25,770 S4: since it happened, but it seems like there were the 615 00:28:25,770 --> 00:28:28,710 S4: commonly accepted narrative is that most of the major studios 616 00:28:28,710 --> 00:28:30,570 S4: were kind of willing to bend. And it may be 617 00:28:30,570 --> 00:28:33,210 S4: there were two of the big kind of platforms that 618 00:28:33,210 --> 00:28:36,450 S4: were absolutely refusing to share their data. I mean, I 619 00:28:36,450 --> 00:28:38,250 S4: think if you were to read between the lines, it 620 00:28:38,250 --> 00:28:40,680 S4: might be easy to figure out who that could be. 621 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,110 S4: But yeah, I it looks like this is one that 622 00:28:43,110 --> 00:28:45,280 S4: neither side will want to bend on. So it'll be 623 00:28:45,460 --> 00:28:46,170 S4: to see what happens. 624 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:49,020 S2: Yeah, it feels like what is really going on here 625 00:28:49,020 --> 00:28:53,640 S2: is like the reckoning of the modern entertainment industry. Like 626 00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:58,460 S2: these big old school. Companies like Warner Brothers, NBC, they 627 00:28:58,460 --> 00:29:01,250 S2: you know, obviously they always like fought for the right 628 00:29:01,250 --> 00:29:03,530 S2: to make as much profit as possible, but they had 629 00:29:03,530 --> 00:29:07,280 S2: a pretty well understood distribution model. They worked with actors 630 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:10,850 S2: in movies for decades and decades ahead, relationships, the negotiated 631 00:29:10,850 --> 00:29:13,040 S2: fees they played by the rules. Then they had TV 632 00:29:13,100 --> 00:29:14,720 S2: arms and they played by the rules when it came 633 00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:17,720 S2: to ratings, Then the rise of things like Netflix and 634 00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:22,070 S2: Amazon and Disney completely upended that entire landscape, not just 635 00:29:22,070 --> 00:29:26,150 S2: in terms of how you made and watched television, but also, 636 00:29:26,150 --> 00:29:30,770 S2: I guess, things like keeping viewer statistics secret so you 637 00:29:30,770 --> 00:29:32,930 S2: have all the power, you know, you know, there are 638 00:29:32,930 --> 00:29:35,959 S2: all these stories that writers and actors tell you when 639 00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,180 S2: they go to pitch to a streaming platform. And there's 640 00:29:38,180 --> 00:29:41,510 S2: these references to the amorphous algorithm, right? And it's not 641 00:29:41,510 --> 00:29:44,450 S2: just like how many people watched a show. It's like, 642 00:29:44,450 --> 00:29:46,250 S2: how long do they watch a show for? Do they 643 00:29:46,250 --> 00:29:48,860 S2: watch many episodes of that show? All these really opaque 644 00:29:48,860 --> 00:29:52,970 S2: things that give these huge companies all of the control 645 00:29:52,970 --> 00:29:57,080 S2: and reduce writers and actors to kind of competing while 646 00:29:57,080 --> 00:29:59,600 S2: they're blindfolded with one arm tied around their back. And 647 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:02,960 S2: I think for a long time, everyone was okay to 648 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,120 S2: live with that because there was so much money like 649 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:08,030 S2: like the money was being thrown around. Huge showrunners were 650 00:30:08,030 --> 00:30:12,870 S2: being signed to like 200, $300 million. Overall deals. But 651 00:30:12,870 --> 00:30:14,910 S2: we've seen in the last kind of 12 months that 652 00:30:14,910 --> 00:30:19,260 S2: start to fall apart, like there's a bit of a 653 00:30:19,260 --> 00:30:23,120 S2: bust in this previous kind of what was a streaming boom. 654 00:30:23,130 --> 00:30:25,320 S2: The bubbles popped a little bit and the money is 655 00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:28,530 S2: drying up. And so actors and writers are saying, okay, 656 00:30:28,530 --> 00:30:31,230 S2: we have to get what we can now. The other issue, 657 00:30:31,230 --> 00:30:33,510 S2: the other side to this thing and we should say 658 00:30:33,510 --> 00:30:35,310 S2: there's a bunch of different issues to do with minimum 659 00:30:35,310 --> 00:30:37,650 S2: rates to pay and other things. But the technology side 660 00:30:37,650 --> 00:30:39,360 S2: of it is the big one. The other one is 661 00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:42,890 S2: a AI that came up with the Writers Guild as well. Mel, 662 00:30:42,930 --> 00:30:44,760 S2: But it seems to be a big part of what 663 00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:48,150 S2: the actors are fighting for. What's the what's the key 664 00:30:48,150 --> 00:30:50,850 S2: fault line when it comes to artificial intelligence? 665 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:52,920 S3: Yeah. So as you were saying before, when we were 666 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:54,870 S3: looking at the other strikes, actors have been quite forward 667 00:30:54,870 --> 00:30:57,600 S3: looking when it comes to protecting their rights into the future. 668 00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:03,000 S3: So they want more protections and safeguards about how AI 669 00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:05,250 S3: is used. And it is important to say the AI 670 00:31:05,250 --> 00:31:09,570 S3: is already used in films. Harrison Ford in Indiana Jones 671 00:31:09,570 --> 00:31:14,310 S3: being De-aged synthesize voices, visual effects. But obviously as AI 672 00:31:14,340 --> 00:31:18,690 S3: gets more advanced and more available, it's being increasingly used 673 00:31:18,690 --> 00:31:21,570 S3: and we're seeing this pop up already. Sarah Silverman had 674 00:31:21,570 --> 00:31:25,320 S3: a copyright infringement lawsuit that she filed against OpenAI and 675 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:27,960 S3: Meta saying that they were kind of breaching her copyright 676 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,200 S3: by training their systems, using their firms. And other actors 677 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:35,070 S3: are already writing clauses about AI into their contracts. Keanu 678 00:31:35,070 --> 00:31:39,090 S3: Reeves has one that bans studios from digitally editing him. 679 00:31:39,090 --> 00:31:41,640 S3: So it's already a pressing issue, but obviously it's going 680 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,640 S3: to become an increasingly relevant one. And I think the 681 00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,700 S3: contracts that these unions are signing a three years, so 682 00:31:47,700 --> 00:31:49,080 S3: they kind of need to do it now or they're 683 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:50,400 S3: going to miss the opportunity. 684 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:52,890 S4: So obviously, like because the thing I found interesting about 685 00:31:52,890 --> 00:31:55,770 S4: this is like, obviously if you're a Keanu Reeves, you're 686 00:31:55,770 --> 00:31:57,870 S4: going to have like, I mean, you're Keanu Reeves, you've 687 00:31:57,870 --> 00:32:00,120 S4: got the best management team. Like no studio is going 688 00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:01,800 S4: to whatever you put in your contract. They'll probably just 689 00:32:01,800 --> 00:32:04,230 S4: go along with like, you're going to be fine. But 690 00:32:04,230 --> 00:32:06,200 S4: it is like obviously and this is the whole like 691 00:32:06,210 --> 00:32:09,540 S4: wider problem with the strike. Like it's obviously about not 692 00:32:09,540 --> 00:32:12,900 S4: the top 2%, but like the other 98% or 90% 693 00:32:12,900 --> 00:32:16,440 S4: or whatever. And like especially for the background actors and stuff, 694 00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:18,960 S4: like I think they talk about it, it's like, you know, 695 00:32:19,170 --> 00:32:22,050 S4: a day rate for a background actor in Hollywood typically 696 00:32:22,050 --> 00:32:28,020 S4: is like $135 American a day. And, you know, essentially 697 00:32:28,020 --> 00:32:30,120 S4: they could now pay you that. Once you sign the contract, 698 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:32,520 S4: you've got zero leverage to be able to be like, oh, well, 699 00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:34,260 S4: wait a minute, I don't want that to be part 700 00:32:34,260 --> 00:32:36,450 S4: of my deal. And then instead of what could be 701 00:32:36,450 --> 00:32:39,180 S4: potentially ten days work as an extra, you've just had 702 00:32:39,180 --> 00:32:41,520 S4: one and you'll never get another day again because they 703 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,340 S4: can just continually use your likeness in perpetuity. 704 00:32:44,940 --> 00:32:48,480 S3: Yeah, that's it. And I think Duncan Crab Tree Island, 705 00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:50,240 S3: who is the chief negotiator for SAG. 706 00:32:50,250 --> 00:32:52,910 S2: Right name, by the way. I know, I know Derek. 707 00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:55,469 S4: I feel like maybe the middle name was like a 708 00:32:55,470 --> 00:32:56,730 S4: bit of a glow up when he got to Hollywood. 709 00:32:56,730 --> 00:32:57,780 S4: He's like, I need something. 710 00:32:58,380 --> 00:33:02,970 S3: It feels like a last name I might generate. Yeah, 711 00:33:02,970 --> 00:33:05,310 S3: he did come out and say that. And again, this 712 00:33:05,310 --> 00:33:08,100 S3: is obviously only one side of the negotiation that the 713 00:33:08,100 --> 00:33:11,880 S3: studios had proposed that background actors could be able to 714 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,870 S3: get scanned and then their company, the companies they're working for, 715 00:33:15,870 --> 00:33:19,350 S3: could just continue to to reuse that likeness of them 716 00:33:19,350 --> 00:33:21,930 S3: over and over and over again. And it sounds a 717 00:33:21,930 --> 00:33:23,640 S3: bit kind of far fetched, the idea that you would 718 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:27,540 S3: always have the same background actors in every single show 719 00:33:27,540 --> 00:33:28,500 S3: you watch. But yeah, I mean. 720 00:33:28,650 --> 00:33:30,090 S2: I think this is the this is the this is 721 00:33:30,090 --> 00:33:33,620 S2: the thing that like. Everything that we're talking about sort 722 00:33:33,620 --> 00:33:36,860 S2: of sounds a little bit surreal, right? Like Hollywood, big 723 00:33:36,860 --> 00:33:40,970 S2: studios want to use AI to capture background actors to 724 00:33:40,970 --> 00:33:43,550 S2: then just like never have to practice again. But I 725 00:33:43,550 --> 00:33:45,860 S2: guarantee you, like you said, Mel, this is already being 726 00:33:45,860 --> 00:33:48,709 S2: used in other capacities now. And it almost makes it's 727 00:33:48,710 --> 00:33:51,710 S2: almost completely irrational. Like just leave aside personal views on 728 00:33:51,710 --> 00:33:54,140 S2: like who's on the right side in this debate. Of course, 729 00:33:54,140 --> 00:33:56,000 S2: a giant company is going to try and minimize its 730 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:58,700 S2: costs and it's going to harness the latest technology to 731 00:33:58,700 --> 00:34:01,760 S2: try to do that. Like that is a completely rational 732 00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:04,400 S2: thing for them to try and do. And similarly, it 733 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:06,440 S2: makes total sense for the union to say, hang on 734 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,980 S2: a second, like AI is coming and we want to 735 00:34:09,980 --> 00:34:12,830 S2: work with you on it, but can we at least 736 00:34:12,830 --> 00:34:15,800 S2: talk about how we're probably compensated for it? And I 737 00:34:15,800 --> 00:34:18,140 S2: think the fact that from what the union has said, 738 00:34:18,260 --> 00:34:21,890 S2: that the AMP has just been like, no, this is 739 00:34:21,890 --> 00:34:25,940 S2: a red line issue, suggests that they think while the 740 00:34:25,940 --> 00:34:28,010 S2: rest of us are just like playing around on ChatGPT 741 00:34:28,010 --> 00:34:30,890 S2: and making jokes, the big companies are like, we are 742 00:34:30,890 --> 00:34:33,230 S2: going to make so much money from this technology. This 743 00:34:33,230 --> 00:34:34,640 S2: is a key issue for us. 744 00:34:34,640 --> 00:34:36,890 S4: Yeah, the fact that they were so staunch on it 745 00:34:36,890 --> 00:34:39,340 S4: makes you like they've obviously can see the dollar signs. 746 00:34:39,340 --> 00:34:42,049 S4: And like with this one, we absolutely will not negotiate on. 747 00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:45,230 S4: I mean, everyone that I know uses ChatGPT to write 748 00:34:45,230 --> 00:34:48,440 S4: like funny poems in the style of like certain people, whatever. 749 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:51,380 S4: But this is like proper issue. But then also, like, 750 00:34:51,380 --> 00:34:54,680 S4: I guess it becomes a concern of with the bigger stars, 751 00:34:54,680 --> 00:34:56,990 S4: like you basically give your likeness over and they can 752 00:34:56,989 --> 00:34:59,180 S4: use you for like promotional materials, stuff you would normally 753 00:34:59,180 --> 00:35:01,790 S4: be paid for. But also then like you become this 754 00:35:01,790 --> 00:35:05,180 S4: kind of weird instrument for the studio and you kind 755 00:35:05,180 --> 00:35:08,540 S4: of don't have any say over what they use it for. 756 00:35:08,540 --> 00:35:11,570 S3: And it does feel like that first episode in Black Mirror. Yeah, yeah. 757 00:35:12,670 --> 00:35:16,430 S4: Yeah. Joan is awful. I know. It really is. Like, yeah, 758 00:35:16,430 --> 00:35:17,419 S4: it's pretty terrifying. 759 00:35:17,420 --> 00:35:19,430 S3: And for the writers, so the actors are particularly concerned 760 00:35:19,430 --> 00:35:22,280 S3: about their likeness and their representation being used, but the 761 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:25,609 S3: writers as well, they're worried about how I could be 762 00:35:25,610 --> 00:35:29,210 S3: used to write and finish scripts, craft outlines do dialogue, 763 00:35:29,210 --> 00:35:32,300 S3: so essentially that I would ingest their work and then 764 00:35:32,300 --> 00:35:35,029 S3: be able to parrot it, which I think is a 765 00:35:35,090 --> 00:35:37,370 S3: is a reasonable fear. And we know we know from 766 00:35:37,370 --> 00:35:41,060 S3: our own organization and industry that media companies are looking 767 00:35:41,060 --> 00:35:43,940 S3: into how I could be used to do certain jobs. 768 00:35:43,940 --> 00:35:45,980 S2: That's one of the bits of this I find so interesting. 769 00:35:45,980 --> 00:35:49,040 S2: Like Fran in her speech, again, she said, we're all 770 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,680 S2: going to be in jeopardy of being replaced by machines, 771 00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:54,650 S2: which so sort of sounds like a line from the Terminator. 772 00:35:54,650 --> 00:35:56,810 S2: But I think but I think what like this is 773 00:35:56,810 --> 00:35:58,790 S2: almost like the canary in the coal mine. Like like 774 00:35:58,790 --> 00:36:02,270 S2: the actors are blowing up these huge issues around AI 775 00:36:02,270 --> 00:36:06,290 S2: and like just technology and transparency. But this is kind 776 00:36:06,290 --> 00:36:10,100 S2: of coming across society and I think it's slowly dawning 777 00:36:10,100 --> 00:36:13,460 S2: on people that this is worth talking about. Those are 778 00:36:13,460 --> 00:36:15,950 S2: really great. New York Times, like in a little Critics 779 00:36:15,950 --> 00:36:19,310 S2: note section that compared every worker in the world to 780 00:36:19,310 --> 00:36:22,190 S2: a background actor. Essentially, they said all of us faced 781 00:36:22,190 --> 00:36:25,130 S2: the same risk. Every time that there's a technological or 782 00:36:25,130 --> 00:36:28,100 S2: cultural shift that happens, companies will rewrite the terms of 783 00:36:28,100 --> 00:36:31,730 S2: employment to their advantage, citing financial pressures while paying their 784 00:36:31,730 --> 00:36:33,910 S2: top executives tens and hundreds of millions of dollars. Like 785 00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,680 S2: this is not just something that is happening in Hollywood, 786 00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:38,630 S2: but as we said a couple of times, we're all 787 00:36:38,630 --> 00:36:42,410 S2: paying attention because it's Margot Robbie and, you know, and 788 00:36:42,410 --> 00:36:44,810 S2: big name stars who are who are talking about it. 789 00:36:44,810 --> 00:36:49,010 S2: So basically a bunch of issues, the key ones coming 790 00:36:49,010 --> 00:36:53,150 S2: down to AI and the lack of data transparency in 791 00:36:53,150 --> 00:36:56,569 S2: what people are viewing. The agreement that currently exists was 792 00:36:56,570 --> 00:36:59,120 S2: due to expire on July 1st. They managed to get 793 00:36:59,120 --> 00:37:01,910 S2: a couple of weeks extra to try and negotiate. Nothing 794 00:37:01,910 --> 00:37:05,960 S2: seemingly was done in that time except Bobby. The Bobby 795 00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:08,780 S2: marketing machine kind of fell between the window of July 796 00:37:08,780 --> 00:37:11,150 S2: 1st and July 12th. I don't know whether or not 797 00:37:11,150 --> 00:37:13,070 S2: that was like a sweetheart deal. We've just got to 798 00:37:13,070 --> 00:37:15,410 S2: get this movie out. This movie is going to save Hollywood. 799 00:37:15,410 --> 00:37:17,390 S2: Let's get it out and then we can go on strike. 800 00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:19,730 S2: So they kind of agree and then they do go 801 00:37:19,730 --> 00:37:21,680 S2: on strike. And the response, like Mel, you said that 802 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:24,800 S2: when you realized that it was at the Oppenheimer red carpet, 803 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,410 S2: that was so fascinating because I was in London and 804 00:37:27,410 --> 00:37:28,580 S2: they were all in the red carpet and they all 805 00:37:28,580 --> 00:37:31,549 S2: left the red cop. It's like Matt Damon, Cillian Murphy, 806 00:37:31,550 --> 00:37:35,719 S2: Emily Blunt, really fascinating. Margot Robbie was asked about it 807 00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:39,350 S2: on the red carpet. She gave a pretty sharp statement, 808 00:37:39,350 --> 00:37:42,230 S2: you know, supporting the union, supporting the strike. 809 00:37:42,710 --> 00:37:44,660 S9: That might be a strike tonight. Are you in support 810 00:37:44,660 --> 00:37:47,480 S9: of the strike and absolutely do be prepared to strike 811 00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:47,870 S9: as well. 812 00:37:47,870 --> 00:37:50,840 S10: Yeah, absolutely. No, I very much in support of all 813 00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,150 S10: the unions and I'm a part of SAG, so I 814 00:37:53,150 --> 00:37:53,810 S10: would absolutely. 815 00:37:53,810 --> 00:37:57,420 S2: Stand by that. This is like. It's really big. Like 816 00:37:57,420 --> 00:38:00,660 S2: we're talking about over 100,000 actors, but not all of 817 00:38:00,660 --> 00:38:03,839 S2: those are like Margot Robbie and and Killian Murphy, which 818 00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:06,419 S2: is also another interesting dynamic to this. Like, did those 819 00:38:06,420 --> 00:38:09,030 S2: guys get the attention? But 99% of the people in 820 00:38:09,030 --> 00:38:10,680 S2: the picket lines are people we probably have never seen 821 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:11,630 S2: of a heard of. 822 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:13,290 S4: Yeah. And I think that I think that's probably the 823 00:38:14,010 --> 00:38:16,650 S4: biggest problem this strike faces like again even talking to 824 00:38:16,650 --> 00:38:19,230 S4: people over the weekend I think the knee jerk response 825 00:38:19,230 --> 00:38:23,250 S4: because they see these very famous, very rich people on 826 00:38:23,250 --> 00:38:25,649 S4: the picket lines and they're the face of it. People 827 00:38:25,650 --> 00:38:27,930 S4: like struggle to empathize. They're like, oh, what is like, 828 00:38:27,930 --> 00:38:29,780 S4: you know, like Keanu Reeves going to be okay? What 829 00:38:29,790 --> 00:38:31,530 S4: do we need to do a fucking Kickstarter for Margot? 830 00:38:31,530 --> 00:38:34,950 S4: Robbie Like, obviously not. But like, you know, Matt Damon 831 00:38:34,950 --> 00:38:36,870 S4: put it really well on the Oppenheimer red carpet right 832 00:38:36,870 --> 00:38:38,880 S4: before they walked. He was like, Obviously, this is not 833 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,340 S4: about me is unbelievably important. 834 00:38:41,340 --> 00:38:43,049 S11: We got to protect the people who are kind of 835 00:38:43,050 --> 00:38:46,500 S11: on the margins. And 26,000 bucks a year is what 836 00:38:46,500 --> 00:38:48,780 S11: you have to make to get your health insurance. And 837 00:38:48,780 --> 00:38:51,900 S11: and there are a lot of people who residual payments 838 00:38:51,900 --> 00:38:55,050 S11: or what carry them across that threshold. And and if 839 00:38:55,050 --> 00:38:57,840 S11: if those residual payments dry up, so does their health care. 840 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:00,540 S11: And that's absolutely unacceptable. 841 00:39:01,020 --> 00:39:03,000 S4: And obviously, the cost of living crisis is happening all 842 00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:04,710 S4: over the world. Like, you know, it is about these 843 00:39:04,710 --> 00:39:08,310 S4: people who are like struggling to pay their bills and 844 00:39:08,460 --> 00:39:11,189 S4: all of these things impact. And especially, you know, like 845 00:39:11,190 --> 00:39:13,560 S4: if you are a jobbing actor on an okay show 846 00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:15,690 S4: like you, you live off residuals. Like that's how you 847 00:39:15,690 --> 00:39:17,940 S4: make your money, that's how you pay your rent. So 848 00:39:17,940 --> 00:39:19,990 S4: I do think that that is your guy. 849 00:39:20,010 --> 00:39:23,520 S2: Your guy, Glen Powell from Top Gun basically said that, right? 850 00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,260 S4: Yeah. Well, that's the thing. Like, he's a real interesting one. 851 00:39:25,260 --> 00:39:27,330 S4: He tweeted about it. You know, he's super famous now. 852 00:39:27,330 --> 00:39:30,089 S4: We all know him. He knows my friend Sydney. But 853 00:39:30,090 --> 00:39:31,950 S4: then he goes on this. 854 00:39:31,950 --> 00:39:34,050 S2: Filmed before the strike, by the way. Very, very glad. 855 00:39:34,140 --> 00:39:35,910 S4: Thank God. I know. But he was on this show. 856 00:39:35,910 --> 00:39:37,890 S4: This is like a Ryan Murphy show, Scream Queens. It 857 00:39:37,890 --> 00:39:39,810 S4: was like pretty popular. And like, he cites that as 858 00:39:39,810 --> 00:39:41,580 S4: like that show in the residuals he made that like, 859 00:39:41,580 --> 00:39:44,009 S4: kept him afloat. And then lo and behold, he's actually 860 00:39:44,010 --> 00:39:46,530 S4: a really good actor. And then now he's famous. But like, 861 00:39:46,530 --> 00:39:48,719 S4: that's how the system works. And you need to be 862 00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:51,569 S4: able to have this ecosystem that supports people while they're 863 00:39:51,570 --> 00:39:54,210 S4: still figuring themselves out because that's who are going to 864 00:39:54,210 --> 00:39:55,560 S4: be the stars, be the next Margot. 865 00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:58,379 S3: Robbie Yeah, and I think when you look at the 866 00:39:58,380 --> 00:40:01,589 S3: attention that some of these stars, Margot and Cillian Murphy, 867 00:40:01,590 --> 00:40:04,380 S3: are bringing to the strike, if you compare it to 868 00:40:04,380 --> 00:40:07,169 S3: the writers strike, which has been going on since May, 869 00:40:07,170 --> 00:40:09,660 S3: and I don't really think that made huge news over 870 00:40:09,660 --> 00:40:12,960 S3: here and definitely didn't garner the global attention that the 871 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:15,900 S3: actor's strike has garnered. It's because they have these very 872 00:40:15,900 --> 00:40:20,009 S3: recognizable faces. So I think, you know them speaking out, 873 00:40:20,010 --> 00:40:23,070 S3: even though they obviously have their own teams negotiating their 874 00:40:23,070 --> 00:40:25,530 S3: contracts for them and they have all the power in 875 00:40:25,530 --> 00:40:28,890 S3: many of those situations, they are necessary, I think, to 876 00:40:28,890 --> 00:40:30,930 S3: keep the momentum going for the strike. 877 00:40:30,930 --> 00:40:32,970 S4: Yeah. And I guess the good the good thing, if 878 00:40:32,969 --> 00:40:35,790 S4: anyone's worried at least about the optics of like actors, 879 00:40:35,790 --> 00:40:39,600 S4: high profile actors complaining or crying poor, nothing can be 880 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:42,480 S4: worse than the optics of Bob Iger. Melanie's close personal. 881 00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:46,020 S2: Friends at Sun Valley, Idaho. Right. With all the billionaires? Yes. 882 00:40:46,260 --> 00:40:49,859 S4: He was commenting on the strike from a billionaires retreat 883 00:40:49,860 --> 00:40:52,080 S4: with Tim Cook and the rest of like the very 884 00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:54,930 S4: rich few and basically saying like, this is the worst 885 00:40:54,930 --> 00:40:57,840 S4: time for this to happen. And, you know, it's very disruptive. 886 00:40:57,930 --> 00:41:00,839 S4: I'm trying to get a fucking jaw massage back here. 887 00:41:01,410 --> 00:41:04,710 S4: And yeah. And you know, I've heard interviews across the 888 00:41:04,710 --> 00:41:07,710 S4: weekend from the SAG team and Duncan Crabtree Island saying like, 889 00:41:07,710 --> 00:41:10,530 S4: we would have loved Bob to have come to the negotiations. 890 00:41:10,530 --> 00:41:13,110 S4: Like he sent some of the lower downs at Disney. 891 00:41:13,110 --> 00:41:15,310 S4: He wasn't even there. And then to come out to 892 00:41:15,330 --> 00:41:17,010 S4: take a five minutes out of his billionaire retreat to 893 00:41:17,010 --> 00:41:19,680 S4: comment on it was just terrible. Terrible for the studios. 894 00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,200 S3: Yeah. I feel like the rhetoric that is coming out 895 00:41:22,200 --> 00:41:25,650 S3: of the studios is very strong handed. Deadline Had they 896 00:41:25,650 --> 00:41:28,740 S3: were quoting an executive as saying something essentially like. 897 00:41:28,739 --> 00:41:30,300 S4: Let them die on the vine. Yeah, we'll let them 898 00:41:30,300 --> 00:41:31,050 S4: lose their houses. 899 00:41:31,050 --> 00:41:33,150 S3: Lose their houses, we'll outlast them. 900 00:41:33,150 --> 00:41:35,760 S2: I feel like the timing of that story was particularly bad. 901 00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:38,340 S2: It was like these anonymous quotes from executives, you know, saying, 902 00:41:38,340 --> 00:41:40,680 S2: we're going to starve them out. Like we're going to 903 00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:43,770 S2: watch them strike until they can't pay their mortgages and like, 904 00:41:43,770 --> 00:41:46,890 S2: they're made homeless. And that came out like three days 905 00:41:46,890 --> 00:41:49,920 S2: before the Screen Actors Guild was deciding whether to go 906 00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:52,109 S2: on strike or not. And maybe they thought the execs 907 00:41:52,110 --> 00:41:53,940 S2: that that would scare people. But I think all it 908 00:41:53,940 --> 00:41:56,549 S2: did was like galvanize the industry. And people said, you 909 00:41:56,550 --> 00:41:59,250 S2: guys are crooks. Ron Perlman, who, you know, actor of 910 00:41:59,250 --> 00:42:01,410 S2: Sons of Anarchy and, you know, a few different movies 911 00:42:01,410 --> 00:42:04,050 S2: and things have been around for a while. He he 912 00:42:04,050 --> 00:42:05,520 S2: I don't know if you saw his video where he 913 00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:08,130 S2: went on like he went on Instagram or Twitter and 914 00:42:08,130 --> 00:42:11,279 S2: he was like, there's many ways people can lose their homes. 915 00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:14,190 S2: They can lose their homes when they strike or they 916 00:42:14,190 --> 00:42:16,529 S2: can lose their homes because we will find out who 917 00:42:16,530 --> 00:42:19,530 S2: these executives are and we'll find out where they live. 918 00:42:19,530 --> 00:42:21,270 S2: And we will, like kick them out of their homes 919 00:42:21,270 --> 00:42:22,140 S2: and burn them down. 920 00:42:23,430 --> 00:42:26,040 S12: There's a lot of ways to lose your house. You 921 00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:30,870 S12: wish that on people. You wish that families starve while 922 00:42:30,870 --> 00:42:35,040 S12: you're making 27 fucking million dollars a year for creating nothing. 923 00:42:36,150 --> 00:42:38,730 S12: Be careful, motherfucker. Be really careful. 924 00:42:39,660 --> 00:42:42,569 S2: Like, to your point, Thomas, of whose side are people 925 00:42:42,570 --> 00:42:47,190 S2: on the optics of, like, Matt Damon versus a regular actor? 926 00:42:47,190 --> 00:42:50,609 S2: Most people, I think, like, have more of an affinity 927 00:42:50,610 --> 00:42:52,830 S2: for the Hollywood actors they like than they do for 928 00:42:52,830 --> 00:42:56,300 S2: faceless CEOs who run like Jeff. But he's also like 929 00:42:56,300 --> 00:42:59,029 S2: no normal person, I think is like, I really like 930 00:42:59,030 --> 00:43:01,340 S2: Matt Damon's movies, but I think Jeff Bezos has a 931 00:43:01,340 --> 00:43:02,870 S2: point that no. 932 00:43:02,870 --> 00:43:05,719 S4: I literally no one I know except Mel loves Bob Iger. 933 00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:08,989 S3: So he just helps me resolve my tech issues. 934 00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:12,560 S4: But, you know, yes, you're right. No, no one empathizes 935 00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:15,290 S4: with the studio heads. And I mean, I think it 936 00:43:15,290 --> 00:43:17,210 S4: was kind of perfect that he was at this kind 937 00:43:17,210 --> 00:43:20,960 S4: of weird, I don't know, orgy for the ultra wealthy. Yeah. 938 00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:23,390 S2: So I guess this is the challenge with with any 939 00:43:23,390 --> 00:43:27,200 S2: kind of strike, right? Because you're right that the top 940 00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:30,170 S2: tier A-list Hollywood actors, they're not the ones who have 941 00:43:30,170 --> 00:43:32,360 S2: the most to benefit from the strike. They're doing it 942 00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:35,390 S2: for the rest of the industry. But they also kind 943 00:43:35,390 --> 00:43:38,330 S2: of have the least to lose because they can live 944 00:43:38,330 --> 00:43:40,820 S2: in their mansions even if they don't work for a 945 00:43:40,820 --> 00:43:42,680 S2: few months or a year. But there's a lot of 946 00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:44,780 S2: people who are losing a lot of money in this strike. 947 00:43:44,780 --> 00:43:47,450 S2: Like even in Australia, there's now hundreds if not thousands 948 00:43:47,450 --> 00:43:50,509 S2: of crew who haven't made the decision to go on strike, 949 00:43:50,510 --> 00:43:52,970 S2: but have essentially been stood down because 1 or 2 950 00:43:52,969 --> 00:43:56,360 S2: Hollywood actors are off. There's also the fact, as you 951 00:43:56,360 --> 00:43:58,640 S2: mentioned at the start of this chat, Thomas, like actors 952 00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:03,200 S2: can't promote shows, so there's no interviews happening. Red carpets 953 00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:06,470 S2: are being impacted, film festivals, which employ lots of people. 954 00:44:06,469 --> 00:44:08,660 S2: Toronto Film Festival might not go ahead because they might 955 00:44:08,660 --> 00:44:11,870 S2: not be stars. That award shows like the Emmys could 956 00:44:11,870 --> 00:44:14,720 S2: be postponed and cancelled. This is going to have a 957 00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:18,049 S2: significant impact, not just in the sense that we can't 958 00:44:18,050 --> 00:44:20,989 S2: watch things, but in terms of economic impact, in terms 959 00:44:20,989 --> 00:44:23,270 S2: of people not having jobs, that sort of thing. How 960 00:44:23,270 --> 00:44:26,360 S2: long do you think this can go on and do 961 00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:29,030 S2: you think the longer it goes on, it shifts the 962 00:44:29,030 --> 00:44:31,340 S2: dynamic of like what side people are on? 963 00:44:31,550 --> 00:44:34,910 S3: Yeah, I think when you look at it historically, they 964 00:44:34,910 --> 00:44:38,720 S3: do go out for a very long time, like 1960 965 00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:42,440 S3: when your friend, my boy Ron taught us was in charge. 966 00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:45,380 S2: What are your thoughts on his policies? Thomas Ronald Reagan 967 00:44:45,530 --> 00:44:45,950 S2: I'm actually. 968 00:44:45,950 --> 00:44:48,140 S4: Just about to do a part on that tomorrow. 969 00:44:48,140 --> 00:44:50,000 S3: So he's he's like hurriedly. 970 00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:52,040 S4: But let me just say, I don't know if you 971 00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:53,600 S4: guys are familiar with Reaganomics. 972 00:44:55,580 --> 00:44:57,680 S2: What can you can you hear the question? Can you 973 00:44:57,680 --> 00:44:58,610 S2: break it down for us? 974 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:00,750 S4: Uh, dance. 975 00:45:00,770 --> 00:45:01,140 S2: This man. 976 00:45:02,330 --> 00:45:04,010 S4: This is worse than when you call me Jonah Hill. 977 00:45:04,100 --> 00:45:07,910 S3: I'm, like, squirming watching you, though, actually, now. Well, while 978 00:45:07,910 --> 00:45:10,819 S3: we've been waylaid onto another subject, I wanted to ask 979 00:45:10,820 --> 00:45:14,210 S3: if you were getting residuals for your starring role because 980 00:45:14,210 --> 00:45:16,040 S3: you were in a short film, right? 981 00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,890 S4: I was, yeah. I mean, it was all Australian crew. 982 00:45:18,890 --> 00:45:22,160 S4: So we can we can chuck it up on on 983 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:22,940 S4: the socials. 984 00:45:23,030 --> 00:45:26,000 S2: Just before we move on from Reagan. Are you pro 985 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:28,190 S2: anti Reagan? Can you just give us like that take. 986 00:45:28,190 --> 00:45:29,090 S4: I'm anti Reagan. 987 00:45:29,210 --> 00:45:30,020 S2: Y'all right? 988 00:45:30,980 --> 00:45:34,370 S4: I don't want to say Mel. 989 00:45:34,370 --> 00:45:38,000 S2: I did I did completely waylay you as you were discussing. 990 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:39,380 S2: You know, you guys bullied me. 991 00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:42,320 S3: I was happy for the distraction. 992 00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:43,940 S4: Yeah. This is your favorite thing. 993 00:45:43,940 --> 00:45:46,540 S2: How how long how long was this strike? In 1960. 994 00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:50,330 S3: It went for 21. The writers were off for 21 995 00:45:50,330 --> 00:45:53,569 S3: weeks and the actors were for six. But for everything 996 00:45:53,570 --> 00:45:56,270 S3: I've read around this, they're saying like they probably won't 997 00:45:56,270 --> 00:45:58,130 S3: be back till September at the earliest. 998 00:45:58,130 --> 00:46:00,020 S2: Yeah. Our guy Brian Cox from Succession was like, it 999 00:46:00,020 --> 00:46:01,850 S2: could go on to the end of the year. It's 1000 00:46:01,850 --> 00:46:02,330 S2: a big deal. 1001 00:46:02,330 --> 00:46:04,820 S3: Oh, I loved that interview where he appeared. It was 1002 00:46:04,820 --> 00:46:08,120 S3: I kind of felt like, Oh, you're back. It was 1003 00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:11,060 S3: so nice. But yeah, I think it will be interesting 1004 00:46:11,060 --> 00:46:13,339 S3: to see because obviously there's heaps of attention and hype 1005 00:46:13,340 --> 00:46:15,950 S3: around it at the moment and a lot of media coverage. 1006 00:46:15,950 --> 00:46:19,040 S3: But I wonder if four weeks down the track if 1007 00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:20,930 S3: we're still going to be talking about it. And that's 1008 00:46:20,930 --> 00:46:24,379 S3: when I guess those actors and writers who who don't 1009 00:46:24,380 --> 00:46:27,110 S3: have a lot of money are really going to be suffering. 1010 00:46:27,110 --> 00:46:28,820 S3: And it's going to be hard, I think, to keep 1011 00:46:28,820 --> 00:46:31,310 S3: up the momentum once it kind of fades out of 1012 00:46:31,310 --> 00:46:32,870 S3: public interest if it does. 1013 00:46:33,500 --> 00:46:36,950 S4: Yeah, it'd be interesting. I spoke to some crew members 1014 00:46:36,950 --> 00:46:40,700 S4: over the weekend that were employed on both Mortal Kombat 1015 00:46:40,700 --> 00:46:43,940 S4: to and Apple's Never before, and they all had the 1016 00:46:43,940 --> 00:46:47,990 S4: same quite funny response, which was pretty much at 5 p.m. 1017 00:46:47,989 --> 00:46:50,299 S4: on Friday, they started texting everyone they know that works 1018 00:46:50,300 --> 00:46:54,589 S4: in reality TV for work. So that's pretty grim. Yeah, 1019 00:46:54,590 --> 00:46:56,359 S4: but I mean, that could be a reality. And they 1020 00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:58,489 S4: seem to think that like all of their contacts in 1021 00:46:58,550 --> 00:47:00,950 S4: LA were like, not even a chance. It's over before 1022 00:47:00,950 --> 00:47:04,490 S4: the end of September. Wow. So, you know, they're preparing 1023 00:47:04,489 --> 00:47:07,339 S4: for like a couple of months at least. I mean, 1024 00:47:07,340 --> 00:47:10,490 S4: I really don't know. It very much seems like neither 1025 00:47:10,489 --> 00:47:12,290 S4: side is going to blink first. And they seem very 1026 00:47:12,290 --> 00:47:15,799 S4: far away on very core issues to both sides. So, 1027 00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:19,940 S4: you know, Carol Lombardi, who's the head of the AMP, 1028 00:47:20,090 --> 00:47:23,540 S4: she was quite forthright in saying that like they won't 1029 00:47:23,540 --> 00:47:26,600 S4: talk with SAG while they're on strike, which I don't 1030 00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:29,120 S4: really understand how that's supposed to work because. 1031 00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:30,440 S2: You're never going to end it. I mean, business has 1032 00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:32,540 S2: always said that they're always like, while they're on strike, 1033 00:47:32,540 --> 00:47:34,790 S2: they're being obstinate and then just hope that they blink. 1034 00:47:34,790 --> 00:47:37,819 S2: But obviously there will be a conversation at some point, right? 1035 00:47:37,820 --> 00:47:40,250 S2: Even if it's like behind closed doors. I want to 1036 00:47:40,250 --> 00:47:43,640 S2: ask you guys about like how this could be different 1037 00:47:43,640 --> 00:47:46,790 S2: to 2007. Obviously, we didn't have streaming then. We had 1038 00:47:46,790 --> 00:47:49,069 S2: a handful of networks that made TV. When you shut 1039 00:47:49,070 --> 00:47:51,799 S2: that down, you shut down television and you just don't 1040 00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:54,560 S2: have movies and TV for a while, and that starts 1041 00:47:54,560 --> 00:47:57,390 S2: to cost. Works money because they need content to sell 1042 00:47:57,390 --> 00:48:00,239 S2: ads against. But in the current ecosystem where there is 1043 00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:03,510 S2: so much in the pipeline, there's already too much for 1044 00:48:03,510 --> 00:48:05,879 S2: us to watch. And on top of that, you've got 1045 00:48:05,880 --> 00:48:09,960 S2: an increasingly globalized industry. You've got Netflix that could weather 1046 00:48:09,960 --> 00:48:13,170 S2: this storm by just running like 100 K dramas, right? 1047 00:48:13,170 --> 00:48:16,980 S2: Or like doing a million Bridgerton series or the Crown 1048 00:48:16,980 --> 00:48:19,770 S2: season 55 or whatever. It seems like there's a real 1049 00:48:19,770 --> 00:48:22,260 S2: challenge here, like the Hollywood actors can can go on strike. 1050 00:48:22,260 --> 00:48:25,799 S2: But could the streamers just whether it end up breaking 1051 00:48:25,800 --> 00:48:26,850 S2: the union that way? 1052 00:48:27,630 --> 00:48:30,450 S3: Yeah, I think they could. I think there is that 1053 00:48:30,450 --> 00:48:33,750 S3: risk there because the streamers do have a global network 1054 00:48:33,750 --> 00:48:36,870 S3: to draw upon. So there's no shortage of content. And 1055 00:48:36,870 --> 00:48:39,810 S3: also we have named some of the big shows that 1056 00:48:39,810 --> 00:48:41,670 S3: are coming up, but there's a heat that will be 1057 00:48:41,670 --> 00:48:44,130 S3: in post-production that is still going to hit our screens 1058 00:48:44,130 --> 00:48:46,380 S3: over the next few months. So I think it is 1059 00:48:46,380 --> 00:48:48,570 S3: a risk for the actors, whereas back in the back 1060 00:48:48,570 --> 00:48:51,239 S3: in the day when you could kind of, you know, 1061 00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:53,940 S3: we were all watching TV, it would be way more 1062 00:48:53,940 --> 00:48:57,030 S3: noticeable when those shows were dropping out of the schedule. 1063 00:48:57,030 --> 00:48:58,799 S3: But now I kind of think the streams are just 1064 00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:01,230 S3: going to keep refreshing their home pages and we might 1065 00:49:01,230 --> 00:49:03,450 S3: not notice it. I was going to ask, though, I wonder, 1066 00:49:03,450 --> 00:49:05,640 S3: do you think that the streamers will invest more in 1067 00:49:05,640 --> 00:49:09,420 S3: local production, i.e. will see more Australian productions being made 1068 00:49:09,420 --> 00:49:11,850 S3: in the next kind of or commissioned for the next year? 1069 00:49:11,969 --> 00:49:14,730 S2: Our colleague Callum Jasmine, who's the media writer here at 1070 00:49:14,730 --> 00:49:16,290 S2: the Herald and The Age, had had an interesting story 1071 00:49:16,290 --> 00:49:19,200 S2: about this today. He was speaking to a few different 1072 00:49:19,200 --> 00:49:22,410 S2: producers and streamers and they were saying it's a little 1073 00:49:22,410 --> 00:49:24,719 S2: bit too early, like to tell whether that will happen. 1074 00:49:24,719 --> 00:49:28,680 S2: But reading between the lines, like I think streamers like Netflix, 1075 00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:32,400 S2: like Amazon, like Disney Plus have been building up production teams. 1076 00:49:32,400 --> 00:49:36,569 S2: Kia and I think they've got the infrastructure to do that. 1077 00:49:36,570 --> 00:49:39,900 S2: So depending on how long this goes, I think it 1078 00:49:39,900 --> 00:49:42,750 S2: would make sense for them to look to other markets. 1079 00:49:42,750 --> 00:49:46,590 S2: And I think something like Australia, like you've got Korean drama, 1080 00:49:46,590 --> 00:49:48,839 S2: you've got like Netflix and India, you've got all these things, 1081 00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:51,780 S2: but a market like Australia where there's already a lot 1082 00:49:51,780 --> 00:49:54,359 S2: of overlap, right? And it's English language and these sorts 1083 00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:56,790 S2: of things. I think it does make sense. I think 1084 00:49:56,790 --> 00:49:58,290 S2: this goes on for a while. I think a bunch 1085 00:49:58,290 --> 00:50:02,160 S2: of stuff might get greenlit here that previously wouldn't have 1086 00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:04,950 S2: or what they might do is just buy up Australian 1087 00:50:04,950 --> 00:50:08,790 S2: stuff for the states. Like maybe the Office Australia becomes 1088 00:50:08,790 --> 00:50:11,939 S2: like Amazon's key thing that comes. 1089 00:50:11,940 --> 00:50:14,280 S4: Out or like Netflix suddenly is like, Oh, we're going 1090 00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:17,370 S4: to go, you know, like, let's really get cracking on 1091 00:50:17,370 --> 00:50:18,990 S4: the next season of Heartbreak High because it was such 1092 00:50:18,989 --> 00:50:21,810 S4: a big global hit and you know, we've got nothing 1093 00:50:21,810 --> 00:50:24,390 S4: else coming. So yeah, maybe this is a good time 1094 00:50:24,510 --> 00:50:26,070 S4: to get my Reagan show greenlit. 1095 00:50:26,489 --> 00:50:28,560 S2: You you mentioned reality TV, Thomas. I mean, that was 1096 00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:30,960 S2: one of the big consequences of the writers strike. I 1097 00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:34,890 S2: don't think people necessarily are aware of how much of 1098 00:50:34,890 --> 00:50:38,040 S2: reality TV exists because nothing else could be made. And 1099 00:50:38,040 --> 00:50:40,830 S2: that has changed everything. It's cheaper to make. You can 1100 00:50:40,830 --> 00:50:43,650 S2: make it without, you know, unions, all that sort of stuff. 1101 00:50:43,650 --> 00:50:45,210 S2: We're probably going to get so much more of it 1102 00:50:45,210 --> 00:50:46,110 S2: now as well, aren't we? 1103 00:50:46,469 --> 00:50:48,810 S4: Well, for sure. And you know, people often like cite 1104 00:50:48,810 --> 00:50:51,510 S4: reality TV as the end of days and oh, my God. 1105 00:50:51,510 --> 00:50:54,580 S4: But like, yeah, prepare for more of that because it's yeah, 1106 00:50:54,630 --> 00:50:57,180 S4: it is easy to make. It requires little to no 1107 00:50:57,180 --> 00:51:00,210 S4: talent under different agreements and they can just pump it 1108 00:51:00,210 --> 00:51:03,840 S4: out often just in a studio or wherever. So yeah. 1109 00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:06,719 S4: And now you have a whole like the trickle down 1110 00:51:06,719 --> 00:51:09,419 S4: effect of everyone in the industry desperate for work, like 1111 00:51:09,420 --> 00:51:13,710 S4: hair and makeup and crew and production and everything. So yeah, 1112 00:51:13,710 --> 00:51:17,969 S4: you'll have this ready made kind of like ecosystem ready 1113 00:51:17,969 --> 00:51:20,700 S4: to work. And no doubt the studios and streamers will 1114 00:51:20,700 --> 00:51:22,890 S4: begin to pump out more of that and they can 1115 00:51:22,890 --> 00:51:24,390 S4: turn shows around so quickly, though. 1116 00:51:24,390 --> 00:51:25,860 S3: I hope it shows because I do think that the 1117 00:51:25,860 --> 00:51:30,270 S3: appetite for reality shows has fallen off quite substantially. Definitely 1118 00:51:30,270 --> 00:51:32,490 S3: in Australia. When we look at the ratings of reality 1119 00:51:32,489 --> 00:51:33,420 S3: shows over. 1120 00:51:33,420 --> 00:51:36,090 S2: Here, yeah, things like The Bachelor just don't hit anymore. 1121 00:51:36,090 --> 00:51:38,189 S4: Yeah, Married at First Sight is really great. 1122 00:51:38,370 --> 00:51:39,930 S3: Oh, always the company man. 1123 00:51:40,260 --> 00:51:41,130 S2: I mean, it is. It's a good. 1124 00:51:41,130 --> 00:51:44,670 S4: Show. It actually is good. My favorite show. No, but 1125 00:51:44,670 --> 00:51:46,440 S4: the one thing the one thing I would say in 1126 00:51:46,440 --> 00:51:47,850 S4: the flip side to all this, like it is a 1127 00:51:47,850 --> 00:51:50,520 S4: very different time. And I think, you know, 15 years 1128 00:51:50,520 --> 00:51:53,520 S4: ago or whatever, the strike was much more impactful in 1129 00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:56,100 S4: our day to day. But on the flip side, the 1130 00:51:56,100 --> 00:51:58,830 S4: rise of social media and everything means like the the 1131 00:51:58,830 --> 00:52:02,550 S4: amount of like pressure that these stars can put on 1132 00:52:02,550 --> 00:52:06,120 S4: and keep it in the news feed constantly is a 1133 00:52:06,120 --> 00:52:07,230 S4: massive bonus. 1134 00:52:07,230 --> 00:52:08,760 S2: I think that's a really good point, Thomas. I mean, 1135 00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,760 S2: even like we sent each other the clip of Margot Robbie, 1136 00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:14,580 S2: you know, at some Barbie event, like Margot Robbie is 1137 00:52:14,580 --> 00:52:16,259 S2: one of the biggest stars in the world right now 1138 00:52:16,260 --> 00:52:19,380 S2: because of all the hype around Barbie. She is like, 1139 00:52:19,380 --> 00:52:22,470 S2: you know, very photogenic. She looks great. She's very exciting 1140 00:52:22,469 --> 00:52:25,890 S2: and bubbly. And she gets asked about stuff and she says, 1141 00:52:25,890 --> 00:52:28,710 S2: I support labor. I support unions, I support the strike. 1142 00:52:28,710 --> 00:52:31,650 S2: And that goes viral on Instagram. And people have been 1143 00:52:31,650 --> 00:52:34,400 S2: there's a clip of her from, I think like 10 1144 00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:37,410 S2: or 15 years ago when she was on Neighbours and 1145 00:52:37,410 --> 00:52:40,590 S2: she was part of Al Union, the MEAA Media Entertainment 1146 00:52:40,590 --> 00:52:41,370 S2: Arts Alliance. 1147 00:52:41,580 --> 00:52:47,279 S13: Sometimes issues come up with our payslips and stuff and 1148 00:52:47,280 --> 00:52:50,910 S13: over time there's just technical things that for someone who's 1149 00:52:50,910 --> 00:52:54,360 S13: new to acting, you don't know what what it's about 1150 00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:57,780 S13: or what you're. Actually entitled to and and being a 1151 00:52:57,780 --> 00:53:00,060 S13: part of the union, I can then go to our 1152 00:53:00,060 --> 00:53:03,270 S13: union representative who was Alan Fletcher at work. Dr. Carl 1153 00:53:03,270 --> 00:53:05,969 S13: and just make sure that I'm not being ripped off. 1154 00:53:05,969 --> 00:53:08,940 S13: And it's good to know that there are things they 1155 00:53:08,940 --> 00:53:11,820 S13: should be abiding by and stuff we are entitled to 1156 00:53:11,820 --> 00:53:15,360 S13: to make sure we get correct pay or breaks or overtime. 1157 00:53:15,540 --> 00:53:18,029 S2: There's a clip where people have mashed that up with 1158 00:53:18,030 --> 00:53:20,489 S2: her most recent comments. And it's like this Barbie is 1159 00:53:20,489 --> 00:53:23,190 S2: a union Barbie and it's getting millions, like tens of 1160 00:53:23,190 --> 00:53:26,969 S2: millions of views. And I think that is something that 1161 00:53:26,969 --> 00:53:29,669 S2: has never happened before. And I'm really interested to see 1162 00:53:29,670 --> 00:53:32,580 S2: not just the impact of that in terms of public 1163 00:53:32,580 --> 00:53:36,719 S2: opinion on the Hollywood strike, but how many, like regular 1164 00:53:36,719 --> 00:53:39,660 S2: people have maybe never thought about like labor issues or 1165 00:53:39,660 --> 00:53:42,480 S2: unions or strikes are like, whoa, Margot Robbie, who's like 1166 00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:44,610 S2: the hot chick from The Wolf of Wall Street, is 1167 00:53:44,610 --> 00:53:47,370 S2: like telling me to go on strike to protect myself 1168 00:53:47,370 --> 00:53:51,000 S2: against AI and evil Wall Street companies. It's pretty fascinating 1169 00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:51,810 S2: moment in history. 1170 00:53:51,810 --> 00:53:53,969 S4: It's like the Big Short all over again. Just like. 1171 00:53:53,969 --> 00:53:55,560 S2: Yeah, exactly. In the bathtub. 1172 00:53:55,560 --> 00:53:56,430 S14: Yeah, yeah, yeah. 1173 00:53:56,610 --> 00:53:59,279 S4: But I think and that's the important thing. Like there's 1174 00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:01,410 S4: a famous quote when you can't make them see the light, 1175 00:54:01,410 --> 00:54:05,380 S4: make them feel the heat. That's President Ronald Reagan said that. 1176 00:54:07,840 --> 00:54:09,759 S3: Sorry. Where did you. Are you. Hang on. I'm looking. 1177 00:54:09,760 --> 00:54:10,089 S3: I'm on. 1178 00:54:10,180 --> 00:54:15,160 S4: Brainy quote. It's actually a really appropriate quote. 1179 00:54:15,160 --> 00:54:17,350 S2: That is fitting. It's a great quote for this month. 1180 00:54:17,380 --> 00:54:21,969 S4: Yes. Thank you. But yeah, that's you will see these 1181 00:54:21,969 --> 00:54:24,489 S4: A-listers start to galvanize now. And it will be interesting, 1182 00:54:24,489 --> 00:54:27,190 S4: like especially for this stuff coming up, like we're in 1183 00:54:27,190 --> 00:54:29,830 S4: an Emmy voting season now. Normally there's like so much 1184 00:54:29,830 --> 00:54:32,589 S4: like for your consideration, like they can't use social media. 1185 00:54:32,590 --> 00:54:34,810 S4: We're just gonna have this full blackout. It's going to 1186 00:54:34,810 --> 00:54:37,390 S4: be very, very strange. And I think I still think, 1187 00:54:37,390 --> 00:54:41,529 S4: you know, the regular civilians out there probably don't really 1188 00:54:41,530 --> 00:54:43,750 S4: appreciate how big a deal it is. It even took 1189 00:54:43,750 --> 00:54:45,190 S4: all of us a little while to be like, oh, actually, 1190 00:54:45,190 --> 00:54:48,310 S4: like as you start to like, realize the layers to it. 1191 00:54:48,580 --> 00:54:50,830 S4: Give it two weeks, we'll give it a month. And 1192 00:54:50,830 --> 00:54:53,080 S4: I think everyone will really start to, you know, they'll 1193 00:54:53,080 --> 00:54:55,060 S4: be like, it just looks like blackout. I mean, nothing 1194 00:54:55,060 --> 00:54:56,919 S4: to talk about. No news. Yeah. 1195 00:54:56,920 --> 00:54:59,680 S2: When Bobby finally comes out and people realize Margot, Robbie 1196 00:54:59,680 --> 00:55:02,799 S2: cannot talk about it, she can't talk about the reaction 1197 00:55:02,890 --> 00:55:05,650 S2: to Bobby. That will be quite a significant moment, I think. 1198 00:55:05,650 --> 00:55:08,109 S2: I think that'll be the next big check point for 1199 00:55:08,110 --> 00:55:09,100 S2: all of this stuff. Yeah. 1200 00:55:09,100 --> 00:55:11,770 S3: Or even just thinking about the Bobby campaign, what it 1201 00:55:11,770 --> 00:55:14,800 S3: would have been like if you minus all of that 1202 00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:18,190 S3: cast and crew talking about it, you know, their global tour. 1203 00:55:18,190 --> 00:55:20,799 S3: So many of the stories about Bobby were about the 1204 00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:23,410 S3: off screen and off set kind of antics, and you 1205 00:55:23,410 --> 00:55:25,750 S3: just would have had none of that, though I do 1206 00:55:25,750 --> 00:55:28,930 S3: feel sad because I really enjoy that the writers haven't 1207 00:55:28,930 --> 00:55:31,989 S3: got as much attention because they do have very good placards. 1208 00:55:32,260 --> 00:55:34,120 S3: But there was one I saw on the picket line 1209 00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:36,790 S3: that was like, without writers you get dot, dot, dot 1210 00:55:36,790 --> 00:55:37,520 S3: the idle. 1211 00:55:37,570 --> 00:55:38,469 S4: Yeah, that was great. 1212 00:55:40,030 --> 00:55:42,069 S3: So I do think they do have very good, good 1213 00:55:42,070 --> 00:55:44,920 S3: placards but just haven't been able to come through as much. 1214 00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:47,860 S2: Well, I reckon that's a good place to leave it. 1215 00:55:47,860 --> 00:55:50,109 S2: I feel like we did a pretty decent job of 1216 00:55:50,110 --> 00:55:52,300 S2: covering the ins and outs. I, I doubt that it'll 1217 00:55:52,330 --> 00:55:54,850 S2: be the last time we talk about this. It will 1218 00:55:54,850 --> 00:55:58,090 S2: certainly impact the show in a way like we had 1219 00:55:58,090 --> 00:56:01,060 S2: Jeremy Allen White hopefully lined up to do it. You know, 1220 00:56:01,060 --> 00:56:04,660 S2: we interview high profile actors here, pretty regularly and you 1221 00:56:04,660 --> 00:56:08,980 S2: probably won't hear that for a while. But as mentioned 1222 00:56:08,980 --> 00:56:11,200 S2: at the top of the show, we're very excited to 1223 00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:15,940 S2: be back this Thursday with our Bobby and Oppenheimer Breakdown 1224 00:56:15,940 --> 00:56:19,810 S2: and maybe any kind of union updates that occur. But Thomas, 1225 00:56:19,810 --> 00:56:21,580 S2: thank you. Mel, thank you. 1226 00:56:22,210 --> 00:56:24,370 S3: Tell me, did you have more fun as a blonde? 1227 00:56:24,850 --> 00:56:28,750 S2: I'm in the funnest era of my life right now. 1228 00:56:31,150 --> 00:56:33,820 S4: Well, I'm off to just brush up on my Reaganomics. 1229 00:56:34,030 --> 00:56:34,840 S4: I'll be your biggest. 1230 00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:35,590 S3: Hit next week. 1231 00:56:35,590 --> 00:56:37,660 S2: The wealth trickles down, Thomas. Just remember that. 1232 00:56:38,469 --> 00:56:41,380 S4: Something slowing the growth of government spending. 1233 00:56:46,310 --> 00:56:49,609 S2: This episode of The Drop was produced by Chai Wong. 1234 00:56:49,880 --> 00:56:52,460 S2: If you enjoyed listening to today's episode of The Drop, 1235 00:56:52,460 --> 00:56:55,050 S2: make sure to follow us in your favorite podcast app. 1236 00:56:55,070 --> 00:56:57,740 S2: Leave us a review or better yet, share it with 1237 00:56:57,739 --> 00:57:00,950 S2: a friend. I'm Osman Farooqui. See you next week.