Speaker 1: Alex Hillman is with the Ostralations Center for Corporate Responsibility.
Speaker 1: What does this decision mean for Woodside? Get a Alex
Speaker 1: good to talk to.
Speaker 2: You, Hice something good to be on the station.
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you. We're running a yes no poll today,
Speaker 1: Is it over for the Woodside processes? The yes are
Speaker 1: five and the nose are twenty And I think you
Speaker 1: would agree with that this this could really exacerbate and
Speaker 1: inflame the hardline activists.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's obviously a number of aspects to this. You know,
Speaker 2: the environmental aspects are pretty clear. You're talking a lot
Speaker 2: about the Yeah, the protests that that Woodsid's receiving. You know,
Speaker 2: we spend a lot of time thinking about investor perspectives
Speaker 2: and speaking to investors as well. Woodside doesn't have a
Speaker 2: strong record of generating strong shareholder returns. It's invested in
Speaker 2: a number of projects that we think have lost money,
Speaker 2: and we're actually concerned that's that's just going to happen
Speaker 2: again if it proceeds with brows.
Speaker 1: That So that's the next bad, isn't it. That's the
Speaker 1: next part of the puzzle. We suspect the browse basis.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think so. So, you know, this can
Speaker 2: do small approval. We haven't seen what the conditions are,
Speaker 2: but that's to operate craft the gas plant or the
Speaker 2: Northwest Shelf which can process gas. But that's running out
Speaker 2: of gas. So you know, if this approval is granted,
Speaker 2: then you know Woodside is going to be looking for
Speaker 2: other gas sources and you know, probably the most prominent
Speaker 2: is Brows.
Speaker 1: So you know, I had a little phone around yesterday
Speaker 1: and talked to people who are on the protest activism
Speaker 1: side of it, Alex and they I think they're a
Speaker 1: little rattled. They weren't expecting the decisions to be so
Speaker 1: quick and so clear and so brutal. Conditions notwithstanding if
Speaker 1: I can ask you about that part of it, the
Speaker 1: social license part of I guess for Woodside and their
Speaker 1: corporate responsibility thereof you mentioned that there hasn't always been
Speaker 1: a great investor return. People like me seduced by the
Speaker 1: fact that they sponsored the Nippers, they had a nice,
Speaker 1: big building in the city, they sponsored the Frio Dockers.
Speaker 1: People like me seduced that by their community image.
Speaker 2: I can't talk to what suggests you, you know.
Speaker 1: What, thank you, but yeah, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: they've got to I think they've got a good rep
Speaker 1: in a brand in the community, haven't they, which which
Speaker 1: goes to corporate responsibility.
Speaker 2: I think they act like they need to protect their brands.
Speaker 2: You know that they do face a lot of Cruiz's criticism.
Speaker 2: I think, you know, maybe counter and trial intuitively to
Speaker 2: some of your listeners. They actually don't generate strong returns.
Speaker 2: So over the last fifteen years they've actually generated less
Speaker 2: shareholder return they haven't generated enough shareholder returns to keep
Speaker 2: up with inflation. They've generated point seven percent per year.
Speaker 2: So they've got they've got a weak brand that they
Speaker 2: feel they need to protect, and they've got a business
Speaker 2: model which which doesn't generate strong returns for investors.
Speaker 1: Seen as a w A company too, aren't they? And
Speaker 1: they are based here, they're employee about four thousand people aregain.
Speaker 1: That's that goes to branding, I suppose, doesn't it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, they are w based. They're increasingly focused on Houston,
Speaker 2: so you that currency Meg is US based. Their last
Speaker 2: major investment was US based, So I think they like
Speaker 2: to play up the fact that they're a West Australian company. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and they still are headquartered here. But you know, I
Speaker 2: think that there is a gradual pivot towards them being
Speaker 2: increasingly Americanized.
Speaker 1: This is Alex Hillman from the Australasian Center for Corporate Responsibility.
Speaker 1: If I were to ask you as a citizen, Alex,
Speaker 1: or even is an edgy in doing your day job
Speaker 1: as you are now? Yes?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 1: Is it over for the Woodside protests? Are you yes?
Speaker 1: Or are you and no? No?
Speaker 2: So I think climate change climate science is getting more certain,
Speaker 2: the impacts are getting more real. You know, we're seeing
Speaker 2: massive floods in New South Wales at the moment. We're
Speaker 2: seeing massive droughts in South Australia at the moment. You know,
Speaker 2: the Australian government is both sides of government have a
Speaker 2: net zero policy. So the energy transition is happening. Woodside
Speaker 2: doesn't seem to accept this. They're still developing new fossil
Speaker 2: fuels against what we would say is their shareholder interests.
Speaker 2: And again it's the accelerating energy transition that the world's
Speaker 2: going through.
Speaker 1: PM mentioned firming capacity this week. Alex. He seems to
Speaker 1: think or hint that we still we're going to need
Speaker 1: gas for a while.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. So you know that the energy transition
Speaker 2: is happening. The vast bulk of energy or increase energy
Speaker 2: supply each year and is now coming from renewables. And
Speaker 2: what we're seeing in Australia and the East Coast and
Speaker 2: the West Coast in Japan, in China and Europe, what
Speaker 2: we're seeing is that renewables are backing out coal and
Speaker 2: then as that happens, we're seeing less less demand for gas.
Speaker 2: So although we need some gas to you know, while
Speaker 2: we transition to a fully renewable grid, the amount of
Speaker 2: gas we need is decreasing over time and we already
Speaker 2: have enough developed So the International Energy Agency says that
Speaker 2: we have enough developed gas reserves that we don't need
Speaker 2: to develop anymore on our way through the energy transition.
Speaker 1: Thanks for the chat today, Alex. Very good tacnical move.
Speaker 1: Not to comment on the seduction stuff, but thanks for
Speaker 1: thank you.
Speaker 2: Great to thank you.
Speaker 1: Thanks cheers, my Alex Hillman