Speaker 1: Where do you think this went wrong? Why did this
Speaker 1: Air India Flight AI one seven one? Why did it
Speaker 1: come down?
Speaker 2: Do you think, Well, we're still trying to work that out.
Speaker 2: There's a little bit of information available and more come.
Speaker 2: We can tell that the aircraft wasn't able to stain flight,
Speaker 2: and that could be because the engines weren't producing enough thrust,
Speaker 2: or the lift devices might not have been producing enough lift,
Speaker 2: or the extra drag of the landing gear may have
Speaker 2: overcome both. There's a complex set of circumstances we're still
Speaker 2: waiting to find out.
Speaker 1: Malcolm Gladwell and his book talks about when you have
Speaker 1: aviation disasters, it's not one thing, it's up to seven
Speaker 1: things that may have caused this. Does that seem to
Speaker 1: work in this case?
Speaker 2: I think there'll be a lot of different circumstances it
Speaker 2: contributed to whatever's happened. There'll be some pretty obvious direct
Speaker 2: causal factors, and there'll be lots of other things in
Speaker 2: the background that may have caused or contributed to that situation.
Speaker 2: So that, yeah, there's a lot to find out. We're
Speaker 2: looking forward to finding out some more information.
Speaker 1: So what's your theory. Do you think that it's something
Speaker 1: to do with the plane's wing flaps and the landing gear.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm ridding so many different things here.
Speaker 2: There are a lot of theories, for sure, and it
Speaker 2: m'd be pretty hesitant to speculate. Of course, we do
Speaker 2: know that the aircraft wasn't able to sustain flight, and
Speaker 2: that's most likely because it didn't have enough thrust to
Speaker 2: overcome whatever other influences the aircraft had on it. And
Speaker 2: we don't know why that is, but we'll find that
Speaker 2: out soon.
Speaker 1: If you could talk me through this based on what
Speaker 1: you know, how did it manage to get up in
Speaker 1: the air in the first place.
Speaker 2: Well, that's the interesting concern. It had enough power to
Speaker 2: get as fast as it needed to ground, enough lift
Speaker 2: to get off the runway, and then for some reason
Speaker 2: it wasn't able to continue flight. And there'll be something
Speaker 2: that occurred or a set of factors that occurred to
Speaker 2: result in that outcome, and we just don't know at
Speaker 2: this stage.
Speaker 1: There's been a lot of talk about how the flight
Speaker 1: beforehand on that plane, the air conditioning wasn't working. In flight,
Speaker 1: TV wasn't working, and that's been directly attributed to that
Speaker 1: particular plane, and I think the flight going into India,
Speaker 1: wouldn't that have been a warning sign for people on
Speaker 1: the ground.
Speaker 2: Well, like it could have been. That may well indicate
Speaker 2: something to do with the electrical systems on the aircraft
Speaker 2: may not have been working as well as they could
Speaker 2: have been, But they could just be isolated incidents that
Speaker 2: are not directly related at all. And we know that
Speaker 2: aircraft from time to time have different parts of systems
Speaker 2: not working, and sometimes it's okay to fly with them
Speaker 2: and sometimes it's not. They're very strictly defined in operating
Speaker 2: procedures that are approved by the regulators, and we expect
Speaker 2: that their India would have met its obligations there of course,
Speaker 2: so we just don't know at this stage.
Speaker 1: And I understand it's not your position to speculate, but
Speaker 1: from an aviator's point of view, for us that are layman,
Speaker 1: would there have been anything on the instrument panel that
Speaker 1: would have said something's wrong here?
Speaker 2: Depending on which which part of the flight, whether it's
Speaker 2: at the start of the takeoff or after the aircraft
Speaker 2: became airborne, almost certainly there would have been warning signs.
Speaker 2: What they were specifically in relationship of the aircraft systems,
Speaker 2: It's hard to know, but the aircraft will almost certainly
Speaker 2: have been telling the pilots some things about what was
Speaker 2: going on that they could interpret.
Speaker 1: So one, are the pilots at that stage in the
Speaker 1: flight when you've got issues and he's putting out a
Speaker 1: may day? Could that have helped?
Speaker 2: In that circumstance? The may day was probably a last
Speaker 2: ditch resort to tell people that something was terribly wrong
Speaker 2: and that they were facing imminent danger. It doesn't directly
Speaker 2: help solve the problem, but it lets everybody else know
Speaker 2: that there's a problem and for them to be aware
Speaker 2: and to enable the aircraft to do whatever it wants
Speaker 2: to try and save itself.
Speaker 1: From And how much information can they get out of
Speaker 1: the black box? Does that wudle it down to the
Speaker 1: ins degree? Will it give you an exact idea of
Speaker 1: what might have happened here?
Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a couple of different recorders. There's the flight
Speaker 2: data recorder, and that records information about all the aircraft
Speaker 2: systems and the configuration and some of the environmental conditions
Speaker 2: that the aircraft was flying in. And that'll certainly help
Speaker 2: understand whether certain systems are working, what was selected or
Speaker 2: dialed or switched at the time, and how much thrust
Speaker 2: the engines were producing, what selections were made, and whether
Speaker 2: those selections were achieved. And then a copy voice recorder,
Speaker 2: which apparently has been found as well now will tell
Speaker 2: us what the pilots were saying and hearing, and that
Speaker 2: will be very helpful as well.
Speaker 1: And there's been a lot of talk about the miracle
Speaker 1: survivor in seat eleven A, and I've read since this
Speaker 1: occasion everybody now is trying to book their seat on
Speaker 1: seat eleven A, which is interesting because I always was
Speaker 1: led to believe the safest place to be was down
Speaker 1: the back of the plane. And I did notice that
Speaker 1: when I saw the incredible pictures that the rear of
Speaker 1: the plane, which was sticking out of a building, was,
Speaker 1: apart from you know, obvious scorch marks and dents, seemed
Speaker 1: to be pretty intact. Is that true that the back
Speaker 1: of the plane is always safer than somewhere like ELEBNA
Speaker 1: and this was just an anomaly.
Speaker 2: I think it was ahenomenally And we don't know whether
Speaker 2: ELEVENA is the ex seat for every flight. It would
Speaker 2: definitely depend on the circumstances of the accident as to
Speaker 2: whether you want to be in the tail or up
Speaker 2: the front. That's probably a personal opinion of course on that,
Speaker 2: and this is purely just conjecture. But how do you
Speaker 2: think he managed to survive? Is that right near a door?
Speaker 2: Could that door of popped open? Yeah, he said he
Speaker 2: was seated near an emergency exit, and what I read
Speaker 2: from what he said, he's kind of thought he was dead.
Speaker 1: He woke up and.
Speaker 2: Walked out of the aeroplane. So yeah, it was quite miraculous,
Speaker 2: Like you said that, who was able to survive that situation.
Speaker 1: But now people obviously whenever there's an a crash like this,
Speaker 1: people immediately get really concerned about aviation safety. But is
Speaker 1: it still fair to say that aviation safety is among
Speaker 1: the safest of any kind of transport. Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2: The data and the facts represent well that aviation is
Speaker 2: a safe way of traveling, and we'd certainly pause to
Speaker 2: consider which airlines you'd fly with from time to time,
Speaker 2: and more often than not, you're going to be safe
Speaker 2: as any other type of transport.
Speaker 1: Mate, good to talk to you. Tell us a little
Speaker 1: bit about your company aviation projects.
Speaker 2: In my company, we provide trusted advice about airport planning,
Speaker 2: development and operations. Aviation safety and airspace and fight procedure, design,