1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,400 S1: Hi, it's Samantha Selinger Morris here. And I'm the host 2 00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:06,880 S1: of the Morning Edition. We're bringing you the best episodes 3 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:11,360 S1: of 2025 before your Morning Edition team returns mid January. 4 00:00:11,960 --> 00:00:15,640 S1: Remember how there was a federal election? In this episode, 5 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:20,599 S1: we return to Anthony Albanese's astonishing landslide victory in May 6 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:25,120 S1: with former chief political correspondent David Crowe and senior economics 7 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:29,600 S1: correspondent Shane Wright. Crowe and Wright reflect on how history 8 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:32,959 S1: making the win was, and what Albanese will do with 9 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:37,920 S1: his mandate. So first of all, welcome David Crowe and 10 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:40,000 S1: Shane Wright. You both had very, very big nights and 11 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:41,400 S1: yet you're here with us. So we have to say 12 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:41,960 S1: thank you. 13 00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:44,400 S2: Thanks for having us, Sam. And I've got to say, 14 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:46,680 S2: it's just so good to be spending even more quality 15 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:49,240 S2: time with Shane here after all this election. 16 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:51,040 S3: And we've had to come all the way from Canberra 17 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:52,080 S3: to be in the same room. 18 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:53,320 S2: To finally be together. 19 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:56,200 S1: Exactly. Well I'm appreciative. I'm going to launch right in 20 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:58,240 S1: because you guys haven't had much sleep. So, Shane, right 21 00:00:58,240 --> 00:01:00,730 S1: before recording, you told me that what we saw on 22 00:01:00,730 --> 00:01:03,930 S1: Saturday was a political first in Australian history, where, of course, 23 00:01:03,930 --> 00:01:06,690 S1: we saw a first term government increase its vote share 24 00:01:06,690 --> 00:01:08,450 S1: or seat count at the end of its first term. 25 00:01:08,450 --> 00:01:10,970 S1: So were you surprised? Were you shocked. 26 00:01:11,410 --> 00:01:14,569 S3: If I saw a unicorn on on Saint George's Terrace 27 00:01:14,610 --> 00:01:17,690 S3: in Perth, that would be about the similarity of my surprise. 28 00:01:17,690 --> 00:01:20,130 S3: As seeing this result. I thought, wow, the number of 29 00:01:20,130 --> 00:01:23,050 S3: people trying to find people who said, oh yeah, I 30 00:01:23,050 --> 00:01:27,009 S3: think Anthony Albanese will increase his vote. He'll increase his 31 00:01:27,010 --> 00:01:31,090 S3: margin into the high 80s, if maybe not 90 seats. 32 00:01:31,330 --> 00:01:34,890 S3: He'll lift the Senate vote of the Labor Party. Peter 33 00:01:34,890 --> 00:01:38,410 S3: Dutton will lose his seat. There'll be more Nats in 34 00:01:38,810 --> 00:01:43,050 S3: seats in Victoria than there are Liberal MPs. At this stage, 35 00:01:44,050 --> 00:01:46,730 S3: I would have said, what color was the unicorn like? 36 00:01:46,970 --> 00:01:49,330 S3: That's how that's how surprising this is. 37 00:01:49,370 --> 00:01:55,050 S2: And we've all been cautious since 2019 about projecting too much. 38 00:01:55,050 --> 00:01:58,110 S2: And in a way, you've got to let the campaign 39 00:01:58,110 --> 00:02:01,110 S2: play out and not spend too much of the campaign 40 00:02:01,110 --> 00:02:04,670 S2: treating it like a race call. But our polling showed 41 00:02:04,670 --> 00:02:07,470 S2: that the labor primary was up, and that labor had 42 00:02:07,470 --> 00:02:10,790 S2: done really well during the campaign. And the Resolve Political 43 00:02:10,790 --> 00:02:12,950 S2: Monitor that we published had labor on a two party 44 00:02:12,950 --> 00:02:18,510 S2: preferred vote of 53.5. You'd have to say they exceeded expectations, 45 00:02:18,510 --> 00:02:22,309 S2: including their own expectations, because some of their own people 46 00:02:22,590 --> 00:02:24,790 S2: weren't expecting it to be this good. 47 00:02:25,350 --> 00:02:28,390 S1: Okay, so so we know this is absolutely astonishing. I 48 00:02:28,389 --> 00:02:32,230 S1: just heard this morning that Albanese's two party preferred vote 49 00:02:32,230 --> 00:02:34,829 S1: as of Sunday morning. You know, he's beaten the two 50 00:02:34,830 --> 00:02:39,150 S1: party preferred vote of Kevin Rudd, Bob Hawke, Whitlam Chifley 51 00:02:39,190 --> 00:02:41,990 S1: like beat them all. So absolutely unbelievable. 52 00:02:42,030 --> 00:02:46,470 S3: We are back to John Curtin's astounding victory in 1943. 53 00:02:46,510 --> 00:02:49,870 S3: So that was and that is still the high water 54 00:02:49,870 --> 00:02:54,510 S3: mark of the ALP. What happened in 1943? Yep. So yeah. 55 00:02:54,950 --> 00:02:56,280 S3: Unicorn sighting again. 56 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:58,520 S1: Unicorn setting again. Okay, so briefly, I just want to 57 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:00,360 S1: ask each of you before we look to what this 58 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:02,960 S1: all means for the future of labor, the future of 59 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,840 S1: the country. Why? Why have we seen this unicorn yet again? Chloe, 60 00:03:06,840 --> 00:03:07,720 S1: let's go to you first. 61 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:09,600 S2: Well, I don't think we should overlook the fact that 62 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:14,120 S2: Australian households have been really suffering over the cost of 63 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:19,320 S2: living and living standards for three years. Labor saw this, 64 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:21,560 S2: knew they had to do something about it, and prepared 65 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:24,959 S2: what they called the forward offer, which is let's not 66 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:27,200 S2: campaign about the last three years, because that's what Peter 67 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:30,000 S2: Dutton did. Let's talk to Australians about what we're going 68 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:33,240 S2: to do next. And that began at the beginning of 69 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,280 S2: this year. They ended last year knowing that this was 70 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:39,280 S2: going to be their plan. They invested in Medicare, in 71 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:42,920 S2: urgent care clinics. They had some school deals with the states, 72 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:46,160 S2: some hospital deals with the states. They did a tax 73 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:50,880 S2: cut in the budget. Um, step by step. They told households, 74 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,280 S2: this is what we're doing to help you. Energy bill relief, 75 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:56,740 S2: for example. And when you look at it now, you 76 00:03:56,740 --> 00:03:59,100 S2: can see clearly they caught the coalition napping because the 77 00:03:59,100 --> 00:04:02,380 S2: coalition matched some of this, then blocked the tax cuts, 78 00:04:02,380 --> 00:04:06,780 S2: which was strategically a big mistake. But Labour were moving 79 00:04:06,780 --> 00:04:10,700 S2: ahead of the coalition on addressing the problems of families. 80 00:04:11,220 --> 00:04:14,820 S2: They also offered big commitments on the quality of government 81 00:04:14,820 --> 00:04:18,660 S2: services and of course, a lot of external events. The cyclone, 82 00:04:18,660 --> 00:04:23,060 S2: to a certain extent, but mainly Donald Trump loomed over 83 00:04:23,060 --> 00:04:28,220 S2: the campaign, raised this question of global uncertainty, and Albanese 84 00:04:28,260 --> 00:04:32,060 S2: was presenting himself as a safe leader who could deliver 85 00:04:32,060 --> 00:04:36,020 S2: services that households needed, was acting on the cost of living, 86 00:04:36,020 --> 00:04:39,060 S2: and was the best answer in an incredibly volatile time. 87 00:04:39,180 --> 00:04:42,780 S3: I think we've seen it that the reserve Bank cut 88 00:04:42,779 --> 00:04:47,219 S3: in interest rates in February is a sign that's important, 89 00:04:48,020 --> 00:04:50,580 S3: but I think I actually think the Liberal Party's one 90 00:04:50,580 --> 00:04:54,320 S3: of their problems was made last year and it's about 91 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:58,440 S3: Donald Trump. It's hard to avoid that aspect. And we 92 00:04:58,480 --> 00:05:00,760 S3: knew as soon as this is a president saying I'm 93 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:05,320 S3: going to increase tariffs. Yeah, he was absolutely clear about it. 94 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:09,760 S3: And you've tied yourself not economically, but you've tied yourself 95 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:13,800 S3: culturally to Donald Trump. And that is as our polling 96 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:16,720 S3: has been showing for Yonks, Donald Trump does not rate 97 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:19,360 S3: very particularly well. It was an own goal that they 98 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:23,080 S3: should have been able to think through further out that 99 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:24,400 S3: this was going to be a problem. 100 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:27,880 S1: And I really want to turn to the Labour Party now. 101 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:30,480 S1: So our colleague James Massola, he revealed the other day 102 00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:33,360 S1: that Anthony Albanese said he's already planning on how to 103 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:36,080 S1: win a third term, that he's already begun thinking about 104 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:40,240 S1: policies and strategies to secure that. So I'd love your opinion. 105 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,400 S1: What might this mean for what he plans for his 106 00:05:42,400 --> 00:05:45,120 S1: second term? Like, does this mean that he's likely to 107 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:48,320 S1: play it safe again with small, targeted achievements? Or could 108 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:50,330 S1: it be the opposite that, you know this is Labor's 109 00:05:50,330 --> 00:05:51,890 S1: time to to go bold. 110 00:05:52,490 --> 00:05:56,090 S2: I think it'll be about playing it safe and I 111 00:05:56,089 --> 00:05:58,250 S2: think there'll be some merit to that. I say this 112 00:05:58,250 --> 00:06:01,090 S2: as I drink a coffee from Bar Italia, and a 113 00:06:01,089 --> 00:06:04,849 S2: very strong coffee from the western inner west of Sydney, 114 00:06:04,850 --> 00:06:08,370 S2: where Anthony Albanese appeared on Sunday morning. 115 00:06:08,410 --> 00:06:09,690 S1: That's right. So you were with him while he was 116 00:06:09,690 --> 00:06:10,890 S1: doling out ice cream, I believe. 117 00:06:10,930 --> 00:06:13,450 S2: Yeah, because he did a he did a moment on 118 00:06:13,450 --> 00:06:16,490 S2: the Sunday morning after the election where he the cameras 119 00:06:16,490 --> 00:06:19,610 S2: were there. He was having a coffee with mates, served 120 00:06:19,610 --> 00:06:23,490 S2: some ice cream at the counter. Didn't give a lot away. 121 00:06:23,610 --> 00:06:27,770 S2: He didn't hold a doorstop where he waxed eloquently about 122 00:06:27,770 --> 00:06:29,409 S2: his agenda for the term ahead. 123 00:06:29,450 --> 00:06:30,490 S1: But did you think he would? 124 00:06:30,930 --> 00:06:33,930 S2: Ah, I think he's going to take it slowly. I 125 00:06:33,930 --> 00:06:36,890 S2: think there'll be some moments in Canberra in the week 126 00:06:36,890 --> 00:06:39,890 S2: ahead where he kind of talks about what he wants 127 00:06:39,890 --> 00:06:42,330 S2: to do, but I know from talking to the people 128 00:06:42,330 --> 00:06:47,210 S2: around him that it's not about taking any Australian voters 129 00:06:47,210 --> 00:06:51,020 S2: by surprise. Um, they have got drilled into them that 130 00:06:51,020 --> 00:06:53,140 S2: they are not going to do things that they didn't 131 00:06:53,180 --> 00:06:57,380 S2: take to the election. So when we talk about bold reform, 132 00:06:57,380 --> 00:07:00,620 S2: it can't mean a tax white paper next month with 133 00:07:00,620 --> 00:07:05,740 S2: a tax reform, um, investigation that leads to recommendations. I 134 00:07:05,740 --> 00:07:08,340 S2: think there's a possibility where some of that happens and 135 00:07:08,380 --> 00:07:12,180 S2: is kind of canvassed during the term. But I think 136 00:07:12,180 --> 00:07:15,500 S2: that in the same way that some of the decisions 137 00:07:15,500 --> 00:07:19,580 S2: in the first term were contingent on the election, um, 138 00:07:20,500 --> 00:07:24,300 S2: the scenario for reform is to flesh out some ideas 139 00:07:24,300 --> 00:07:27,739 S2: during the term that's just about to start, and then 140 00:07:27,940 --> 00:07:31,380 S2: seek a mandate at the subsequent election. Um, but they 141 00:07:31,380 --> 00:07:34,300 S2: would be extremely cautious about what they're going to do, 142 00:07:34,460 --> 00:07:39,260 S2: because it's taking on iconic importance for Anthony Albanese that 143 00:07:39,260 --> 00:07:40,460 S2: he doesn't break faith. 144 00:07:40,740 --> 00:07:43,580 S3: We've seen what happens when a party comes out with 145 00:07:43,580 --> 00:07:48,160 S3: policy at the very last moment. Um, and the work 146 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:50,680 S3: from home policy, for example, from the Liberal Party, which 147 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,040 S3: came from nowhere for most people, the absolute dangers of 148 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:56,480 S3: trying to foist something on right at the last minute. 149 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:01,480 S2: For instance, just quickly, if the Productivity Commission or somebody 150 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:04,000 S2: else says, oh, and let's change negative gearing, that's something 151 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:06,520 S2: that needs to happen. Or capital gains tax on the 152 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,760 S2: family home or whatever. Well, that's a non-starter, right? So 153 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:12,320 S2: it's just not going to fly. His position on that 154 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:15,720 S2: is quite clear. He's made clear commitments in the election campaign. 155 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:20,200 S2: So there are there's a reform agenda. But there are 156 00:08:20,200 --> 00:08:22,120 S2: some things that are clearly not on. 157 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:25,440 S3: Which we saw with the personal income tax cuts, which 158 00:08:25,440 --> 00:08:27,679 S3: says we're not going to change them, but then they've 159 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:30,640 S3: come up with a way to keep them in spirit. 160 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:32,160 S3: Everyone got a tax cut. 161 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:34,959 S1: So do you think this is what Australians want now? 162 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:36,960 S1: Is this what they've signalled to the Labor Party? You 163 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:40,120 S1: know we don't want big social progress from you. We 164 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:42,760 S1: don't want that anymore. We want what you've offered us now. 165 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:44,770 S1: We want you in the middle. You know, they've cemented 166 00:08:44,770 --> 00:08:46,810 S1: the middle. This is what we think Albanese will do 167 00:08:46,809 --> 00:08:48,490 S1: in the next term and maybe even in the third. 168 00:08:48,490 --> 00:08:52,290 S2: And they want stability because this is the the huge 169 00:08:52,330 --> 00:08:56,530 S2: outcome here. We've had a series of one term prime ministers. 170 00:08:56,570 --> 00:09:00,130 S2: Scott Morrison came in and then served one term. Um, 171 00:09:00,450 --> 00:09:04,569 S2: these one term prime ministers haven't been able to cement reform. 172 00:09:04,570 --> 00:09:08,730 S2: Julia Gillard talked about, um, a price on carbon. She 173 00:09:08,730 --> 00:09:10,970 S2: was gone. And then the reform was swept away. And 174 00:09:10,970 --> 00:09:15,250 S2: Anthony Albanese has often said you've got to cement the reform. 175 00:09:15,490 --> 00:09:19,450 S2: That's the agenda here, not just to make announcements and 176 00:09:19,450 --> 00:09:22,170 S2: take people by surprise, but to cement reform in a 177 00:09:22,170 --> 00:09:26,650 S2: steady way. So Australians voted for stability after the, you know, 178 00:09:26,690 --> 00:09:29,330 S2: chopping and changing of the last 20 years. And that's 179 00:09:29,330 --> 00:09:34,089 S2: what they're I think going to get. Um, Anthony Albanese 180 00:09:34,530 --> 00:09:38,929 S2: gains great confidence out of this election result. He doesn't 181 00:09:38,929 --> 00:09:41,410 S2: have a mandate for a specific thing that he took 182 00:09:41,410 --> 00:09:43,870 S2: to the election in a dramatic way, like a GST 183 00:09:43,950 --> 00:09:47,390 S2: in 1998. But he's got this confidence. I think it'll 184 00:09:47,390 --> 00:09:50,910 S2: help on the international front with Donald Trump. Donald Trump 185 00:09:50,910 --> 00:09:55,589 S2: likes winners. Anthony Albanese is now a certified winner. And 186 00:09:55,590 --> 00:09:59,110 S2: so he goes into international relations and the domestic agenda. 187 00:09:59,110 --> 00:10:01,229 S2: With that sense of confidence. 188 00:10:01,230 --> 00:10:05,910 S3: I'm thinking the danger, of course, is hubris and of 189 00:10:06,230 --> 00:10:09,830 S3: because what he has done back to the unicorns. He's 190 00:10:09,830 --> 00:10:11,950 S3: got a paddock full of them. He's in terms of 191 00:10:11,950 --> 00:10:16,270 S3: what he's achieved and it's weather like. I think this 192 00:10:16,309 --> 00:10:19,230 S3: actually played into the the problem with the first term 193 00:10:19,230 --> 00:10:22,310 S3: and his speech on election night, which is the voice. 194 00:10:23,110 --> 00:10:24,510 S1: And he made that grand promise. 195 00:10:24,510 --> 00:10:25,110 S3: He made the grand. 196 00:10:25,110 --> 00:10:25,750 S1: He's now gone back. 197 00:10:25,750 --> 00:10:29,070 S3: On which and the voters said, no, Nick off. 198 00:10:29,230 --> 00:10:29,710 S1: They did. 199 00:10:29,750 --> 00:10:33,429 S3: They absolutely. And so that is always I keep thinking 200 00:10:33,429 --> 00:10:38,110 S3: of 93, the 93 election, which Keating won, and no 201 00:10:38,110 --> 00:10:41,720 S3: one thought that was going to happen. And that within 202 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:44,240 S3: within 3 or 4 weeks, the true believers were having 203 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:47,760 S3: a special dance in the Great Hall that went down 204 00:10:47,760 --> 00:10:51,520 S3: like a bucket of cold sick. And because the papers 205 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:54,559 S3: at the time were saying, oh, this election result, it 206 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:57,920 S3: gives Keating another, it gives him two terms. That's the 207 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:01,720 S3: absolute danger for every politician. John Howard would always talk 208 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:04,360 S3: about the dangers of being hubristic. 209 00:11:04,679 --> 00:11:06,679 S1: But I wanted to pick up something that you just 210 00:11:06,679 --> 00:11:09,040 S1: mentioned a bit earlier, which is you said that, you know, 211 00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:11,480 S1: the lesson Albanese would have learnt here is you are 212 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:14,360 S1: not going to spring anything new on the voters. But 213 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:17,800 S1: what about the long standing problems that we know that 214 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:20,960 S1: far and wide have been concerned about for Yonks, which 215 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:23,720 S1: of course, is, you know, the housing crisis, which is 216 00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:27,400 S1: decades in the making, not to mention this outstanding issue 217 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:30,600 S1: of indigenous representation. Might those be picked up at some point, 218 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:32,120 S1: or are they just going to be left in the 219 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:35,080 S1: dust and just, you know, continue for that frustration to 220 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:35,680 S1: be building? 221 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,840 S2: I guess they have to act on housing and they've 222 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:42,740 S2: got to deliver. They actually put forward some really interesting 223 00:11:42,740 --> 00:11:49,740 S2: ideas on housing supply. A $10 billion loan and grants program, 224 00:11:49,780 --> 00:11:53,140 S2: mainly for the states, but also for private developers to 225 00:11:53,179 --> 00:11:55,900 S2: add housing for first home buyers. Now, when I talked 226 00:11:55,900 --> 00:12:00,740 S2: to some housing experts, these are nonaligned academics. They said 227 00:12:00,740 --> 00:12:05,780 S2: that on balance, the labor programs on housing supply were better. 228 00:12:05,980 --> 00:12:09,620 S2: I'm not saying that it's the magic solution on every front, 229 00:12:09,900 --> 00:12:14,900 S2: but they've actually got some agendas here where it's all 230 00:12:14,900 --> 00:12:17,980 S2: about delivery. Now it's about proving that they can add 231 00:12:17,980 --> 00:12:22,860 S2: 1.2 million homes to housing supply, as they've promised, doing 232 00:12:22,860 --> 00:12:26,100 S2: everything they possibly can to do that, which also means 233 00:12:26,100 --> 00:12:29,260 S2: reducing the cost of building materials and increasing the supply 234 00:12:29,620 --> 00:12:33,460 S2: of building workers. So it's about execution. We don't need 235 00:12:33,500 --> 00:12:36,860 S2: a whole bunch of committees reviewing things. They just have 236 00:12:36,860 --> 00:12:38,830 S2: to act on what they've said they're going to do. 237 00:12:38,870 --> 00:12:39,190 S1: Right? 238 00:12:39,230 --> 00:12:42,510 S3: And I reckon you'll see, because we know there's about 239 00:12:42,510 --> 00:12:46,270 S3: 28,000 of their social homes that are under construction or 240 00:12:46,309 --> 00:12:49,590 S3: in planning. I think I'll put money on it. Now. 241 00:12:49,630 --> 00:12:52,870 S3: Crow that anyone covering the Prime Minister over the next 242 00:12:52,870 --> 00:12:54,589 S3: three years is going to spend a lot of time 243 00:12:54,990 --> 00:13:00,790 S3: at new housing sites when they're opened to reinforce that point, saying, 244 00:13:00,790 --> 00:13:03,110 S3: right here are the homes they are being built. 245 00:13:03,190 --> 00:13:04,670 S1: We're going to see you in a high viz vest, 246 00:13:04,670 --> 00:13:06,230 S1: is what I'm seeing. We're going to see this. 247 00:13:06,270 --> 00:13:08,429 S3: And a hard hat. Yeah, I can see that coming. 248 00:13:08,470 --> 00:13:09,950 S1: Okay. And oh. Sorry. 249 00:13:10,710 --> 00:13:13,310 S2: Mate. You know, he made a point in his election 250 00:13:13,309 --> 00:13:16,309 S2: night speech of doing a couple of really simple things 251 00:13:16,309 --> 00:13:19,230 S2: that I think are important and effective. He thanked voters. 252 00:13:19,470 --> 00:13:22,190 S2: You know, he just said a simple thank you. He said, 253 00:13:22,350 --> 00:13:26,750 S2: I won't take this for granted. Um, I'll, uh, you know, 254 00:13:26,830 --> 00:13:29,790 S2: you've put your trust in, in us and I give 255 00:13:29,790 --> 00:13:34,790 S2: you this solemn pledge to to act on that. So 256 00:13:34,830 --> 00:13:38,130 S2: it's about the execution at this point. I think they've 257 00:13:38,130 --> 00:13:41,929 S2: got an issue with spending because they've promised a lot 258 00:13:41,970 --> 00:13:46,650 S2: in the campaign. And as we've all reported on in 259 00:13:46,690 --> 00:13:50,770 S2: the budget on March 25th, they didn't really, you know, 260 00:13:50,809 --> 00:13:54,610 S2: allow any major savings. There was some redirection of funding, 261 00:13:54,610 --> 00:13:58,770 S2: but they didn't they didn't do enough work, in my view, 262 00:13:58,770 --> 00:14:01,570 S2: to really save money and produce a better budget. Bottom line. 263 00:14:02,530 --> 00:14:05,410 S2: They've announced a lot in the campaign that puts money 264 00:14:05,410 --> 00:14:09,690 S2: out the door. That then does mean that the agenda 265 00:14:09,690 --> 00:14:11,890 S2: in this term has got to be about being really 266 00:14:11,890 --> 00:14:16,050 S2: careful with that. They might get lucky on the commodities 267 00:14:16,090 --> 00:14:18,850 S2: side and on the revenue side and the budget bottom line, 268 00:14:19,010 --> 00:14:22,090 S2: and the outlook may improve over time, but there's going 269 00:14:22,130 --> 00:14:24,330 S2: to have to be, I think, a hard look at 270 00:14:24,330 --> 00:14:28,690 S2: the spending side of the budget now that they've got 271 00:14:28,690 --> 00:14:31,410 S2: so much on the table, which hasn't been rolled out yet. 272 00:14:31,450 --> 00:14:33,050 S2: You know, it's yet to yet to be rolled out. 273 00:14:33,090 --> 00:14:37,660 S2: For instance, on Medicare. Um, and then, um, find some 274 00:14:37,660 --> 00:14:40,220 S2: savings to help improve things over the next three years. 275 00:14:40,220 --> 00:14:41,540 S1: So do you reckon this is going to be a 276 00:14:41,540 --> 00:14:45,540 S1: very brief honeymoon period before reality hits them in the face? 277 00:14:45,860 --> 00:14:46,460 S3: Yes. 278 00:14:46,780 --> 00:14:49,820 S2: Yeah. It could be because Anthony Albanese actually had quite 279 00:14:49,860 --> 00:14:53,260 S2: a long honeymoon in the polls after the 2022 election. 280 00:14:53,660 --> 00:14:59,500 S2: Then the Voice started, then the tough living standards really 281 00:14:59,500 --> 00:15:02,340 S2: started to bite and then it evaporated. 282 00:15:02,620 --> 00:15:05,260 S1: I know we've spoken a little bit about, you know, 283 00:15:05,300 --> 00:15:07,460 S1: they've got to be very careful. Albanese has to be 284 00:15:07,460 --> 00:15:10,180 S1: very careful not to exhibit hubris in this moment like 285 00:15:10,180 --> 00:15:12,540 S1: we've seen with previous winners. And I wanted to ask you, 286 00:15:12,580 --> 00:15:16,100 S1: I guess, whether we actually might be finding that we're 287 00:15:16,100 --> 00:15:18,420 S1: in a period of greater kindness or an emphasis on 288 00:15:18,460 --> 00:15:21,740 S1: that in our political sphere, because we heard, I think, 289 00:15:21,740 --> 00:15:23,940 S1: a lot of humility over the last couple of days. 290 00:15:23,980 --> 00:15:26,180 S1: You know, we heard it from Jim Chalmers on election night. 291 00:15:26,180 --> 00:15:27,540 S1: It was looking like they were going to win, and 292 00:15:27,540 --> 00:15:29,580 S1: he was very cautious about that. And then, of course, 293 00:15:29,580 --> 00:15:33,120 S1: in Anthony Albanese's acceptance speech, he made a marked point 294 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:35,960 S1: of shushing his own supporters when they were booing Peter Dutton. 295 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:39,280 S2: And then an interesting moment. Those personal moments are really interesting, 296 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:39,680 S2: aren't they? 297 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:41,720 S1: And then on Sunday morning, we've seen Albanese come out 298 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:44,800 S1: and I think he said, I feel for Peter. So 299 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:47,160 S1: I'm just wondering, do you think that we might see 300 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:48,640 S1: greater kindness? You know. 301 00:15:48,680 --> 00:15:51,240 S2: I think it's part of his brand or something that 302 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:54,640 S2: they want to continue to be part of his message. 303 00:15:54,680 --> 00:16:00,360 S2: I talked to one of the cabinet ministers who made 304 00:16:00,360 --> 00:16:05,320 S2: a point about Anthony Albanese, in her view, actually being 305 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:09,120 S2: a kind person. Now, I know that one of the 306 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:13,400 S2: quotes in the nine debate that stood out because three 307 00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:17,880 S2: women mentioned it to me, unprompted, mentioned this quote, kindness 308 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,960 S2: is not weakness. That was Anthony Albanese's quote in the 309 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:25,160 S2: channel nine debate against Peter Dutton. And that sank in, 310 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:27,640 S2: I think, with voters. And so I think that's going 311 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:30,090 S2: to be part of who he is as prime minister. Now, 312 00:16:30,130 --> 00:16:33,970 S2: whether that is maintained is another question. Can he be 313 00:16:33,970 --> 00:16:36,890 S2: the person who turns the boats around, while also being 314 00:16:36,890 --> 00:16:40,250 S2: the prime minister, who says kindness is not weakness? Lots 315 00:16:40,250 --> 00:16:44,170 S2: of contradictions because it's not an easy job. However, um, 316 00:16:44,290 --> 00:16:46,690 S2: that is something that I think will see more of. 317 00:16:47,210 --> 00:16:49,970 S3: I'm not expecting anyone getting out of guitar, sitting around 318 00:16:49,970 --> 00:16:52,450 S3: a fire and singing Kumbaya anytime. That is not the 319 00:16:52,450 --> 00:16:57,609 S3: story of Australian politics. Menzies was hard. Holt was hard. 320 00:16:57,770 --> 00:17:02,290 S3: Whitlam was hard. Hawke played hard. Keating, Howard like he 321 00:17:02,490 --> 00:17:05,210 S3: he gave across that air. But he was tough. Tough 322 00:17:05,210 --> 00:17:06,210 S3: as nails. 323 00:17:06,250 --> 00:17:09,090 S2: And Albanese settle scores inside the labor movement because the 324 00:17:09,090 --> 00:17:11,250 S2: labor movement is a tough, tough place. 325 00:17:11,250 --> 00:17:12,169 S3: It is so. 326 00:17:12,210 --> 00:17:15,290 S2: And when he was asked what to name a song 327 00:17:15,290 --> 00:17:17,330 S2: and have a song played on radio. Sorry, Shane, I'm 328 00:17:17,330 --> 00:17:18,770 S2: talking over the top of you. But when he was 329 00:17:18,770 --> 00:17:21,930 S2: asked this in the recent days, he nominated the angels. 330 00:17:21,930 --> 00:17:24,369 S2: Am I ever going to see your face again? Which 331 00:17:24,369 --> 00:17:27,330 S2: has a famous refrain with a chant from the crowd 332 00:17:27,330 --> 00:17:30,710 S2: with a couple of F bombs, and it was pretty 333 00:17:30,710 --> 00:17:34,149 S2: clear he was aiming that at Peter Dutton. So there's a, 334 00:17:34,190 --> 00:17:36,710 S2: you know, a mix of a bit of sympathy, but 335 00:17:36,710 --> 00:17:37,830 S2: a real hard line as well. 336 00:17:37,869 --> 00:17:40,790 S3: More sympathy for the devil, to quote the Rolling Stones. Yeah. 337 00:17:40,790 --> 00:17:45,070 S3: But yeah, that's why no, I, I love that you 338 00:17:45,109 --> 00:17:47,630 S3: you you believe in this, Sam. And I was just 339 00:17:47,630 --> 00:17:50,030 S3: wondering a bit of kindness in the air, you know, 340 00:17:50,590 --> 00:17:54,350 S3: but once he get like he as he said on 341 00:17:54,350 --> 00:17:57,710 S3: Saturday night, you know, we're back to work. That's back 342 00:17:57,710 --> 00:18:00,590 S3: to work. Like he is going to continue to fight 343 00:18:00,869 --> 00:18:04,310 S3: what he believes in. And yeah, he he may dress 344 00:18:04,310 --> 00:18:06,590 S3: it up as kindly, but it's not. 345 00:18:06,630 --> 00:18:09,870 S2: Mind you, if he fights and he reverts to sort 346 00:18:09,869 --> 00:18:13,229 S2: of fighting only on Labour terms, to Labour people, to 347 00:18:13,270 --> 00:18:15,350 S2: the Labour base. He'll be making the same mistake that 348 00:18:15,350 --> 00:18:19,950 S2: Peter Dutton made. And, um, I think given the election outcome, 349 00:18:19,990 --> 00:18:22,909 S2: he doesn't seem inclined to make Peter Dutton's mistakes. 350 00:18:22,950 --> 00:18:23,390 S3: Yes. 351 00:18:25,950 --> 00:18:29,770 S1: Well, gentlemen, an absolutely fascinating election. And so lucky to 352 00:18:29,770 --> 00:18:32,129 S1: have both of your viewpoints on this. So thank you 353 00:18:32,130 --> 00:18:34,450 S1: so much, Shane and David, for your time. 354 00:18:34,450 --> 00:18:35,530 S3: Thank you Samantha. 355 00:18:35,530 --> 00:18:37,330 S2: Thank you. Great to talk again. 356 00:18:40,810 --> 00:18:44,369 S1: Today's episode of The Morning Edition was produced by myself, 357 00:18:44,530 --> 00:18:48,210 S1: Josh Towers and Tammy Mills. Tom McKendrick is our head 358 00:18:48,210 --> 00:18:51,090 S1: of audio. To listen to our episodes as soon as 359 00:18:51,090 --> 00:18:54,930 S1: they drop, follow the Morning Edition on Apple, Spotify, or 360 00:18:54,930 --> 00:18:59,570 S1: wherever you listen to podcasts. Our newsrooms are powered by subscriptions, 361 00:18:59,570 --> 00:19:05,770 S1: so to support independent journalism, visit the page or smh.com.au. Subscribe. 362 00:19:06,410 --> 00:19:08,250 S1: And to stay up to date, sign up to our 363 00:19:08,250 --> 00:19:10,810 S1: Morning Edition newsletter to receive a summary of the day's 364 00:19:10,810 --> 00:19:15,050 S1: most important news in your inbox every morning. Links are 365 00:19:15,050 --> 00:19:19,409 S1: in the show. Notes. I'm Samantha Selinger. Morris, thanks for listening.