WEBVTT - Simon Mustoe with Tony McManus - Tue 10 Jun, 2025

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<v Speaker 1>Now this is astragior Urbanized with Tony McManus ga the

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<v Speaker 1>five o'clock. It's so nice to have you with right

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<v Speaker 1>through until the Breaking program gets underway with Ross and

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<v Speaker 1>Ross here on three at W. It's an interesting headline,

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<v Speaker 1>these things that come across the desk, and I looked

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<v Speaker 1>at it, and I reread it, and I reread it,

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<v Speaker 1>and then I thought about the question and how, in fact,

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<v Speaker 1>the power often lies in the question, not necessarily the answer.

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<v Speaker 1>And the question is how to survive the next one

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<v Speaker 1>hundred years? Question mark how to survive the next one

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<v Speaker 1>hundred years? So we're going to talk to this bloke,

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<v Speaker 1>Simon Musto is the author of how to Survive the

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<v Speaker 1>Next one under one hundred years. Now, we've only got

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<v Speaker 1>about ten minutes to talk Simon. Can we wrap it

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<v Speaker 1>up in ten minutes or not?

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<v Speaker 2>I reckon, Yeah, let's you're going to go?

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<v Speaker 1>Good Onion? Where would we start? Well?

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, well, okay, So it is that it's an ambitious title. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>of course the subtitle is Lessons from Nature. And the

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<v Speaker 2>reason why I think this story is important is because

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<v Speaker 2>we live in a society where people are increasingly exposed

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<v Speaker 2>to a lot of negative news, okay, and we don't

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<v Speaker 2>often hear the other side of the story, which is

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<v Speaker 2>the part where we have this supportive, supporting infrastructure of nature.

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<v Speaker 1>Right.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think particularly for communities, Australia has a history

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<v Speaker 2>obviously a very strong local community sense of belonging. We

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<v Speaker 2>get together and we deal with problems as their care

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<v Speaker 2>as a community. And if we learn to take lessons

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<v Speaker 2>from nature, we open up a whole new way of

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<v Speaker 2>thinking and it exposes us to a lot of fresh

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<v Speaker 2>answers about how we can survive and how we can

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<v Speaker 2>empower ourselves, particularly at a local community level.

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<v Speaker 1>So I mean you're right about the news cycle. We

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<v Speaker 1>see it. We've seen it recently, prolifically this year, more

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<v Speaker 1>recently perhaps with the flooding rains that we've seen in

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<v Speaker 1>Queensland and New South Wales. Conversely, here in Victoria we've

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<v Speaker 1>seen chronic drought areas in the southwest of Victoria and

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<v Speaker 1>into South Australia. It's a really tough time for many.

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<v Speaker 1>Is that the sort of thing that you're looking at

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<v Speaker 1>and the things that have to be considered and should

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<v Speaker 1>be considered.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, what I'd like people to start to do is

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<v Speaker 2>to think differently about their place within nature. I think

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<v Speaker 2>we have a history obviously of almost seeing environmentalism as

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<v Speaker 2>a separate and opposite construct to development and human progress.

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<v Speaker 2>Whereas what we're beginning to discover now is that a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of the support infrastructure that nature provided us in

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<v Speaker 2>the past, which we've perhaps fritted away, is able to

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<v Speaker 2>reintegrate through restoration and provide a significant amount of economic

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<v Speaker 2>value back into our local communities. We're talking, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>maybe seven to thirty times more value than we're currently

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<v Speaker 2>getting from our taxpayer dollar expenditure if we spend that

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<v Speaker 2>on processes that are positive. So to give you a

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<v Speaker 2>small example, this wonderful example of eastern barb bandicoots. So

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<v Speaker 2>the Rosvelt Sanctuary in the yu yangs in just west

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<v Speaker 2>of Melbourne, owned by the Odonata Foundation, was taken over

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<v Speaker 2>in two thousand and nine by a benefactor called Nigel Sharp,

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<v Speaker 2>and it acts as a laboratory to work out how

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<v Speaker 2>to restore balance with an ecosystems with native species. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>that animal used by bandicoot was considered extinct up until

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<v Speaker 2>quite recently. It was rediscovered in old abandoned cars in

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<v Speaker 2>a quarry in Hamilton, and the population is now thousands

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<v Speaker 2>of animals, and if it wasn't for that fur the

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<v Speaker 2>rest of our sanctuary, those animals would now be extinct.

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<v Speaker 2>More recently, what's happened is they've reintroduced them to a

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<v Speaker 2>working sheep farm in western Victoria near Hamilton, and in

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<v Speaker 2>just three years they have restored soil and soil water processes.

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<v Speaker 2>So the things you were talking about a moment ago

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<v Speaker 2>flooding for example, So we've gone through some of the

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<v Speaker 2>worst floods in the last few years that that area

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<v Speaker 2>has seen, but the fence infrastructure has remained solid, so

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<v Speaker 2>they're no longer having to spend money on fencing. Because

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<v Speaker 2>of the surface water that longo runs away, the organic

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<v Speaker 2>layer in the soil has increased, the potentile strength of

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<v Speaker 2>water is increased, meaning they're getting more profit from the farm.

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<v Speaker 2>All of that achieved simply by reintroducing a single animal

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<v Speaker 2>back into the environment.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so much comes out of that. Are you based

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<v Speaker 1>on the work that you've been doing for many, many

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<v Speaker 1>years in writing? Are you completely devoted to the idea

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<v Speaker 1>that young people have got this? Young people have got

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<v Speaker 1>this even like old facts like me and many people

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<v Speaker 1>in this audience, and go don't worry about it. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>it's cyclical. The environment as we know it has been

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<v Speaker 1>going on like this for millions of years. Nothing's really changed.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it's I think it's a chaotic situation. So

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<v Speaker 2>my understanding of how econsistents function, you've got difference between

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<v Speaker 2>balance and chaos effectively, and I think so we've got

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<v Speaker 2>a diversification of views and young people obviously they suffer

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<v Speaker 2>from a probably more negative news input or exposure to

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<v Speaker 2>algorithms than we do. They some of them have ignored that,

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<v Speaker 2>and I see in my own children a sense of community.

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<v Speaker 2>They spend more time chanting to their friend and getting

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<v Speaker 2>involved in things. Now I think other kids suffer differently.

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<v Speaker 2>What I am urging is to, I guess, step aside

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<v Speaker 2>from that and start looking, just start spending some time

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<v Speaker 2>in nature, Tony. Honestly, the start of this is just

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<v Speaker 2>to immerse yourself back into the environment around you and

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<v Speaker 2>actually look at it and think about what's going on.

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<v Speaker 2>And this is not going to solve all the problems

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<v Speaker 2>of the world without our assistance, but there is a

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<v Speaker 2>heck of a lot you can learn about to do

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<v Speaker 2>yourself which can make the world a difference. If that's

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<v Speaker 2>scaled up and I often use the phrase rewilding your mind. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>by reconnecting in that way, it actually brings a new

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<v Speaker 2>way of thinking, and it's very very cathartic. It's been

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<v Speaker 2>very cathartic for me at.

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<v Speaker 1>Least, oh bit it has. How did your heart and

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<v Speaker 1>soul head into this direction some years ago, Simon, Oh.

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<v Speaker 2>I've always been like this ever since I was a child.

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<v Speaker 2>I use I grew up in the UK. You can

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<v Speaker 2>probably tell from my accent. I was actually born in Adelaide,

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<v Speaker 2>but my parents went back to the UK when I

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<v Speaker 2>was very young, and I just used to wander the

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<v Speaker 2>fields of the United Kingdom countryside and the Cotswolds night

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<v Speaker 2>and day, every working every waking hour effectively, and I

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<v Speaker 2>try to do that as much as I can these

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<v Speaker 2>days as well. Today I tend to wander under the

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<v Speaker 2>water and in the water of portfol At Bay, which

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<v Speaker 2>is a remarkably exciting place to be.

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<v Speaker 1>There's been a lot of exposure and no doubt you

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<v Speaker 1>would have seen it over the weekend with the great

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<v Speaker 1>new documentaries coming over the future King of Australia and

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<v Speaker 1>is sitting down there with Sir David and Sir David,

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<v Speaker 1>who's coming up to his one hundredth birthday. I think

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<v Speaker 1>from memory and in the future King looking at what's

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<v Speaker 1>happening underneath our oceans. Have you had time to have

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<v Speaker 1>a look at that and understand how important the points

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<v Speaker 1>that Sir David has been making in that area alone.

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<v Speaker 2>Personally, I haven't seen the film yet and I'm a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit hesitant. I probably shouldn't say this, but I

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<v Speaker 2>mean I tend towards looking and immersing myself into positive

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<v Speaker 2>actions that I can take. We're running the project at

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<v Speaker 2>the moment called Restore the Bay in Melbourne, which is

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<v Speaker 2>something that I think encapsulates everything I've just talked about,

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<v Speaker 2>a way for people to take part in something where

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<v Speaker 2>they can be part of co designing outcomes for our

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<v Speaker 2>own neighborhood. And again, I prefer my preference is to

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<v Speaker 2>jump in the sea and actually see it for myself,

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<v Speaker 2>and I think those we come to the same conclusions, right.

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<v Speaker 2>But the thing people really want to know is what

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<v Speaker 2>action can I take?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah? What action can I take? Hits the book How

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<v Speaker 1>to Survive the Next one hundred Years. As you speak,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm getting lots of tickes. What in particular talks about say,

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<v Speaker 1>keeping bees and those sorts of little things. Have you

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<v Speaker 1>looked at that are they? I mean, I've said on

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<v Speaker 1>this program before how important bees. We have no bees,

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<v Speaker 1>We're all kangaroo edwards pretty much. But do you look

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<v Speaker 1>at those sorts of things and have young people recognize

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<v Speaker 1>how special that is for our survival? Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>Possibly, I certainly mention regularly enough. The odds thing I

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<v Speaker 2>think is that ten years ago not many people had

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<v Speaker 2>veggie patches in the garden. No, they did not, whereas today,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know Tony, your friends and colleagues, but everyone's

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<v Speaker 2>got a veggie patch today, right, it seems or something.

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<v Speaker 2>They've grown something in their garden. And I don't find

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<v Speaker 2>that quite remarkable because it wasn't. It didn't come about

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<v Speaker 2>through any kind of law, or change has come about

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<v Speaker 2>because of something else. And I think that's that kind

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<v Speaker 2>of mysterious underlying thing that nature does and connects with

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<v Speaker 2>our brains in ways we really don't understand. But you

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<v Speaker 2>see a change like that happening and you go, well,

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<v Speaker 2>how about when did that figure?

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<v Speaker 1>But you could say that about to Simon how important

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<v Speaker 1>it is for people to get at and just enjoy

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<v Speaker 1>nature in its most basic form, I guess is just

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<v Speaker 1>having a guard and spending time and connecting with garden.

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<v Speaker 2>That's right, and anything and everything we do to look

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<v Speaker 2>after the place we live immediately around our feet and

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<v Speaker 2>around our minds, I think is where our focus should be.

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<v Speaker 1>More and more, Simon, I hope we talk again. It's

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<v Speaker 1>simply called how to Survive. I love the title how

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<v Speaker 1>to Survive the next one hundred years, and that's even

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<v Speaker 1>before we have children and grandchildren. How to Survive the

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<v Speaker 1>next one hundred years Lessons from Nature. Simon must thank

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<v Speaker 1>you for joining us nice and early on a Tuesday morning.

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<v Speaker 2>Simon, Thanks Tony, it's been my pleasure.

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<v Speaker 1>Good On. Yeah, what a book, how to Survive the

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<v Speaker 1>Next one hundred years. There's a big thesis just there.

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<v Speaker 1>You would have thought, have a look at it. It's

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<v Speaker 1>available from all great bookshops. Of course, it was nice

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<v Speaker 1>to having live of course, part of Australia Evernight