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S1: Hey, I'm Osman Farooqi and this is the drop a

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S1: culture show from the Sydney Morning Herald and The Age,

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S1: where we dive into the latest in the world of

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S1: pop culture and entertainment. I'm here with Thomas Mitchell and

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S1: Mel Kambouris. What's up team? How are you doing?

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S2: Pretty good. Yeah. Good week. Big week coming up. Lots

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S2: on the horizon in the pop culture world. Yeah.

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S3: Big, uh, one of our favorite weeks of the year,

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S3: I think.

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S1: Yeah, it's it's a big, big, big week. We're going

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S1: to be talking primarily on today's show about the Oscars,

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S1: which are on next Monday. But as you alluded to, Thomas,

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S1: it's been it's been a big one for cultural consumption

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S1: and and conversation. There's a lot happening and a lot

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S1: to talk about. So there's a few things I wanted

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S1: to run through with you guys before we get stuck

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S1: into our Oscars deep dive. Last month, it was Taylor

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S1: Swift causing a gigantic collective freakout in Australia. This time

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S1: it's the UK house musician Fred again. Dot dot dot uh.

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S1: He announced a pop up show at the Sydney Opera

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S1: House that sold, I think, thousands of tickets in like

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S1: 15 minutes. There was 200,000 people on the waiting list

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S1: at peak time. He went on to announce a run

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S1: of arena shows in Melbourne and Sydney. I hear from

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S1: insiders that nearly a million people tried to buy tickets

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S1: to his arena shows, so not quite the Taylor Swift

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S1: level of hype, but still an enormous amount of interest

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S1: in Fred. Again, I don't know if you've seen clips

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S1: from his shows at Rod Laver Arena the last couple

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S1: of nights.

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UU: Everyone is very into this young guy. Don't make some

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UU: fucking noise. Okay.

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S1: How do you guys feel about Fred again? Dot dot dot.

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S3: Look, I don't really get it. I don't really get

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S3: the interest, and I.

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S2: I have you been a big Fred head. I think

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S2: something could have been wrong with the cosmic universe.

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S3: Like, I know you guys think you're all kind of

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S3: cool and in on things, but I don't think he's

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S3: that cool. And I'm gonna quote Rob Moran here, who

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S3: has been on this pod and is one of the

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S3: best music writers in the country, who says he's just

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S3: the Ed Sheeran of dance music. And I think that's perfect.

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S3: I think that's a very apt description of what he is.

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S3: And there's a whole lot of excitement, which I think

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S3: is probably tied to kind of people feeling like they're

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S3: part of something to this musician that I don't really

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S3: think is warranted. Um, yeah. Thomas, I mean, you think

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S3: you're all indie. Is that why you like Fred again?

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S3: Thank you. Cool.

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S2: When you talk about being cool, it's like talking to

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S2: my mom. Honestly. No, I know you think you're a

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S2: pretty cool dude. Um, no, I think you're actually kind

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S2: of right. Like, I think his music is good, but

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S2: I think the hype around Fred again has become like

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S2: its own really funny beast to watch. Um, and especially,

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S2: you know, I think in what's really important these days

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S2: as well, is that he's a bit of a marketing genius,

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S2: like doing the surprise show at the Sydney Opera House

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S2: to like, you know, whip everyone up into a frenzy

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S2: was a really smart idea because then everyone who missed

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S2: out was like, well, I'm 100% buying tickets to the

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S2: six arena shows. I think he's just become he's slot

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S2: into this weird, like kind of trend, you know, like

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S2: almost like post triple J, but love dance music, but

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S2: still a bit accessible. And he's really captured a big

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S2: kind of aging millennial audience, um, that have just, like,

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S2: eaten his shit up big time. But I do think

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S2: his music is fun. He makes fun dance music. He's

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S2: a good producer. And, you know, I thought particularly and

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S2: I think you'll appreciate this, seeing some vision of him

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S2: at Revolver in Melbourne at like 9 a.m., like simultaneously

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S2: made me envious. And I had like, PTSD. Uh, so yeah,

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S2: it he's definitely made a mark in his short time here.

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S1: I'm glad you brought up the marketing element of it,

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S1: because to me, this is where the Taylor Swift comparison

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S1: is really interesting. Not just because they both are very

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S1: popular and selling a lot of tickets in Australia. I

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S1: think they both have found a very smart way to

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S1: create a, I guess, a mystique or an aura around

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S1: them that feels very relatable and very honest and very

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S1: earnest and very real when it is kind of anything but.

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S1: And by that I mean that both Taylor Swift and

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S1: Fred again have got, I would assume, giant marketing team

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S1: not even assume I know this giant marketing teams that

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S1: are working overtime to both do interesting things, like surprise

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S1: shows at revolver, keep a stadium show under wraps, post

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S1: in WhatsApp groups and discord chats like he's just a

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S1: regular person keeping you in the loop with his life.

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S1: It's a really interesting way to use a huge amount

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S1: of resources and a huge amount of buzz to feel

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S1: like just a regular person, and that certainly so much

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S1: of his aura. You mentioned elder millennials, Thomas. I think

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S1: there's a bit of that because I think maybe it

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S1: reminds people of a kind of electronic music that is

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S1: a little bit out of vogue or has been for

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S1: a while, but particularly younger people like Gen Z's in

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S1: the pandemic. Fred went ballistic on TikTok, making a kind

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S1: of music that I think that generation probably never really

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S1: heard commercially. And then when he came out of the

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S1: pandemic and started doing live shows for a lot of

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S1: people aged, I guess like 18 to 21, it was

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S1: probably the first live music they'd seen. And electronic music,

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S1: house music is so good for that collective, joyous experience

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S1: of dancing and partying. So they're like reasons why it

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S1: makes sense to me. But I think what I find

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S1: interesting about Fred again, and I think this is why

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S1: it's in conversation with Taylor, is being a good musician

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S1: is only, like I would say, not even 50%, maybe

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S1: like 20% of what it takes to succeed. The rest

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S1: of it is how do you market yourself? How do

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S1: you brand yourself, and how do you become part of

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S1: a cultural conversation? And I think he's done that in

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S1: a very interesting way, in a way that I think

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S1: overstates how good the music is. Like, I don't totally

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S1: love the music, I don't really hate it, but for

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S1: me it is more about how he's created a wave

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S1: around him. Then he's this like incredible musician that's never

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S1: done anything like this before, because ultimately, Mel, I got

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S1: to say, Rob's comp is spot on, like Ed Sheeran,

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S1: Tash Sultana like when Fred does these shows, he's in

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S1: the round, he's in the middle. He's like recreating the stuff,

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S1: using his MPC and loops. It's very like busking in

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S1: that Ed Sheeran way. Australians seem obsessed with that kind

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S1: of music in particular. It's a really funny little moment,

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S1: I think.

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S3: Yeah, and I agree, like there are good kind of

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S3: catchy songs that Billie song I quite like. What are

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S3: some of your other things? Well, Melanie, Melanie's doing the

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S3: part in brackets. There you go.

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S1: Um, Rumble is also a really good song. Like there's

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S1: a couple of great tracks.

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S3: Yeah, I think you're completely right that it's just. And

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S3: you say 20% talent, the rest marketing I think like

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S3: it's 5% talent, really. And the rest is marketing. And

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S3: I do think that he's managed to hit that sweet

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S3: spot where, you know, it's supply versus demand of who

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S3: can get to see the show, but then it becomes

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S3: just a tool of social currency. You know, I went

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S3: to the show and I'm going to the show and

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S3: I like. Again, like I'm in the know without realizing. Like,

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S3: I guess the bigger picture is that, you know, you're

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S3: just being played in a way. So I do think

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S3: it's just become like a tool of social currency to

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S3: be like, I'm attending this gig. In the same way

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S3: any exclusivity, you know, becomes a marker of your taste

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S3: and class and who you are, like a performance of

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S3: your own identity. So I yeah, I think you're spot

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S3: on us.

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S2: That being said, if the team is listening to this pod,

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S2: we would love six tickets to some of the shows.

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S1: I would happily miss, so I'm not that fussed, but

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S1: I hope you guys managed to get tickets to the show.

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S1: I think the other the other reason why I wanted

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S1: to talk to you guys about it, because to me,

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S1: it raises this other question of, okay, well, he makes

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S1: decent music and he's very smart at marketing where the

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S1: people around him are. Should that be a knock on him?

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S1: And I think the answer is obviously like, no, not necessarily.

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S1: But to me what it raises is who gets to

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S1: be Fred again and who gets to be Taylor Swift.

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S1: And I think we've talked about this over the last

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S1: couple of weeks, thinking about the Australian music industry, the

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S1: live music space in particular, crumbling around us. So many acts,

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S1: so many artists that I know was talking, uh, to

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S1: to a friend last night who I won't name the band,

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S1: but they're in like a very prominent Australian band that

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S1: that perform all over the country, all over the world.

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S1: And you would think that they would be like multi-millionaires

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S1: who own dozens of houses all over the country. And

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S1: probably in another era they would have been. But they're

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S1: like struggling financially because of the way the economics of

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S1: music works right now. And then, on the other hand,

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S1: you've got someone like Fred again who just comes in,

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S1: who've is up all this demand and is in is

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S1: going ballistic. And there is this conversation around Fred again.

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S1: You guys aware of his family background at all?

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S2: Yeah. Isn't he like a rich private school kid? I am.

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S3: I have to say, the opening paragraph on like Wikipedia.

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S3: When you look, look him up like we've got words

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S3: like aristocrat jukes, viscounts. Like, I've never seen someone with

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S3: such a background with so many kind of high class

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S3: words involved in its description.

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S1: I don't even know what half these words mean. It's

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S1: on his Wikipedia. It says, descended from the Huntingdonshire gentry

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S1: on his father's side through his mother's side. Fred's ancestry

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S1: comprises earls Marcus Jukes as well as many other peerage

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S1: and baronet families. That's like Thomas. He sort of understated

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S1: it by saying, private school rich kid, these guys like

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S1: a baron. That's crazy.

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S2: Play that shit, Fred.

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S1: And I think his godfather is by Brian Eno, the, the,

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S1: the very well known producer and and this is what

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S1: I think is so interesting and I think it's deliberate

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S1: part of why he's constructed this persona around himself. Because

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S1: you can't really lean into that too much. Like it's

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S1: okay to be a bit rich, but it's hard to

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S1: be the literal baron who was raised and taught everything

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S1: he knew by Brian Eno. And I think it seems

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S1: like he's working overtime to be. I'm just a normal person.

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S1: This guy got his start writing songs like shotgun with

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S1: George Ezra, solo by Clean Bandit, writing for Rita Ora,

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S1: writing for producing for Ed Sheeran. Like he's born into

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S1: music royalty, but it is interesting to see how he

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S1: counteracts that because he does these shows at Rev's. He's

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S1: been so supportive of Australian artists on this tour. He,

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S1: you know, he's done pop up shows with club Angel.

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S1: On Tuesday night at Rod Laver Arena, he brought out

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S1: Angie McMahon, a you know, young Australian artist who's got

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S1: an album and doing a tour right now and brought

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S1: her on stage to perform, made.

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S4: Some noise for Angie McMahon.

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S1: And that's one of the things we knocked Taylor Swift for,

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S1: was not engaging with the local music scene and not

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S1: boosting that. So on that front, like, kudos to him.

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S1: I think it's smart, but I also kind of think

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S1: you kind of have to do that stuff because it's

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S1: so easy to make fun of this guy as just

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S1: being like a nepo baby making electronic music. And I

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S1: guess that's that big a point of good on him

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S1: for giving back a bit. I'd still remain worried that

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00:10:55,190 --> 00:10:58,729
S1: it's literally just Taylor Swift and a Baron that can

223
00:10:58,730 --> 00:11:01,849
S1: make and perform live music in this, in this current

224
00:11:01,850 --> 00:11:02,780
S1: era of pop.

225
00:11:02,809 --> 00:11:04,580
S2: Yeah, I mean, it's definitely an issue. I wish my

226
00:11:04,580 --> 00:11:06,559
S2: biggest issue in life, though, was like trying to seem

227
00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:08,449
S2: more regular because I was so rich. Like, if that

228
00:11:08,450 --> 00:11:10,670
S2: was my only problem in life, I think I'd be

229
00:11:10,670 --> 00:11:13,370
S2: doing okay. But I mean, we talked about before, you know,

230
00:11:13,370 --> 00:11:16,520
S2: that the marketing is maybe like 80% of it and then,

231
00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:18,740
S2: you know, the talent or the good bit, it's only 20%.

232
00:11:18,740 --> 00:11:20,330
S2: But I mean, like, I know you're wanting to speak

233
00:11:20,330 --> 00:11:22,070
S2: about this, that just kind of reminds me of the

234
00:11:22,070 --> 00:11:26,750
S2: maths on June. Like the marketing tells you, it's so good.

235
00:11:26,750 --> 00:11:28,640
S2: And then you sit there for seven hours and you're

236
00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:30,410
S2: just like, this is a letdown.

237
00:11:30,530 --> 00:11:32,420
S1: All right. Well, I'm glad you brought up. Let's pivot

238
00:11:32,420 --> 00:11:35,240
S1: to that. Let's pivot to that. I, I watched this

239
00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:37,580
S1: movie again after we spoke about it last year.

240
00:11:37,910 --> 00:11:38,630
S3: Of course.

241
00:11:39,170 --> 00:11:41,870
S1: I had some time to reflect on on what I

242
00:11:41,870 --> 00:11:44,330
S1: said and what you guys said. And I've got to say,

243
00:11:44,330 --> 00:11:47,240
S1: you I mean, like Thomas in particular, you're so wrong

244
00:11:47,240 --> 00:11:49,489
S1: on this movie, man. Like, like, I feel like I

245
00:11:49,490 --> 00:11:51,500
S1: was made out to be some sort of, like, sci

246
00:11:51,500 --> 00:11:53,930
S1: fi freak who was like, this weird movie that no

247
00:11:53,929 --> 00:11:56,060
S1: one will like is pretty cool. And then Tommy still

248
00:11:56,059 --> 00:11:58,730
S1: sending me text messages from your friends who are like,

249
00:11:58,730 --> 00:12:00,680
S1: you know, I was just making this movie sound so dumb.

250
00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:02,870
S1: You're right, Thomas, you're a man of the people. This

251
00:12:02,870 --> 00:12:06,830
S1: movie is not only objectively very good, it has been

252
00:12:06,830 --> 00:12:10,730
S1: critically acclaimed. It has been watched by millions of people.

253
00:12:10,730 --> 00:12:14,750
S1: It's breaking box office records. It's genuinely very good. Interesting.

254
00:12:14,750 --> 00:12:16,849
S1: I just wanted to ask you guys whether you had

255
00:12:16,850 --> 00:12:19,970
S1: had time to reflect on your thoughts, and if you

256
00:12:19,970 --> 00:12:22,040
S1: had any other things you wanted to say about the

257
00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:24,050
S1: state of the discourse around June part two?

258
00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:26,600
S3: Yeah, I'll, I'll start off given the only one, I

259
00:12:26,600 --> 00:12:28,160
S3: am probably the only one out of the two of

260
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:33,350
S3: us that does reflect on their thoughts. Um, yeah. I was,

261
00:12:33,350 --> 00:12:35,959
S3: you know, I took a more middle ground approach, I

262
00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:37,760
S3: would probably say, but I was blown away by the

263
00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:40,400
S3: box office results over the weekend. And I really did

264
00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,940
S3: see that this film is incredibly popular, and the box

265
00:12:43,940 --> 00:12:47,210
S3: office results for part two have been well and truly outdone.

266
00:12:47,210 --> 00:12:49,580
S3: Part one as well. So not only has it kind

267
00:12:49,580 --> 00:12:51,740
S3: of got a lot of fans, it's got heaps of

268
00:12:51,740 --> 00:12:54,710
S3: new fans as well since the first one. So, um, yeah,

269
00:12:54,710 --> 00:12:58,190
S3: I'm sorry, Oz, that we made you seem like an obscure.

270
00:12:58,220 --> 00:12:59,240
S1: I have to apologize.

271
00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:01,010
S2: I don't apologize on my behalf.

272
00:13:01,910 --> 00:13:04,520
S3: But you are the man of the people.

273
00:13:05,660 --> 00:13:05,959
S5: The man.

274
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:07,699
S1: Of cinema. You could.

275
00:13:07,700 --> 00:13:08,480
S5: Say the man of the people.

276
00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:11,840
S2: Who's never flown economy. I did reflect on it, and

277
00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:14,030
S2: I reflected on it with friends. Allow me to share

278
00:13:14,030 --> 00:13:16,370
S2: some of my reflections. So this is a friend of

279
00:13:16,370 --> 00:13:18,980
S2: mine who texted me every moment Oseman talks about June

280
00:13:18,980 --> 00:13:20,900
S2: confirms more and more that I absolutely do not want

281
00:13:20,900 --> 00:13:24,390
S2: to see it. And this is a separate friend. June

282
00:13:24,390 --> 00:13:27,319
S2: 2nd sounds boring as fuck lol. What are you doing?

283
00:13:28,010 --> 00:13:29,030
S5: I mean these maybe.

284
00:13:29,030 --> 00:13:30,410
S3: Reflect more on you and your friendship.

285
00:13:30,410 --> 00:13:32,030
S5: I agree you have completely.

286
00:13:32,030 --> 00:13:34,250
S1: Moronic friends who are not interested. I do have.

287
00:13:34,250 --> 00:13:36,830
S2: Some some really moronic friends. Uh, one of them is

288
00:13:36,830 --> 00:13:38,929
S2: included in that group, but I just think, look, it's

289
00:13:38,929 --> 00:13:42,290
S2: important that we show both sides of the debate. And,

290
00:13:42,290 --> 00:13:44,990
S2: you know, as we've discussed at length this week, I mean,

291
00:13:44,990 --> 00:13:47,390
S2: some people see June as this masterpiece, and other people

292
00:13:47,390 --> 00:13:50,840
S2: see it as a 2.5 hour movie about worms. So

293
00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:52,370
S2: that's the world that we live in.

294
00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,309
S1: It is it is interesting, I think even and like Thomas,

295
00:13:55,309 --> 00:13:56,810
S1: even though you didn't love the movie, like you and

296
00:13:56,809 --> 00:13:59,809
S1: I were exchanging kind of Dune memes over the weekend

297
00:13:59,809 --> 00:14:02,900
S1: and stuff, it certainly you can acknowledge, has become like

298
00:14:02,900 --> 00:14:06,620
S1: a significant cultural moment. Probably not to the scale of Barbie,

299
00:14:06,620 --> 00:14:09,469
S1: but probably the next biggest in the last 12 months.

300
00:14:09,830 --> 00:14:13,250
S2: Yeah, 100%. And like it is funny because like we're

301
00:14:13,250 --> 00:14:16,010
S2: just saying it more and more now, like both before

302
00:14:16,010 --> 00:14:18,410
S2: and after a movie comes out. Just like the like

303
00:14:18,410 --> 00:14:21,140
S2: ecosystem of the internet around films is so crazy now.

304
00:14:21,140 --> 00:14:23,000
S2: Like we have joked about, you know, the June popcorn

305
00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:26,120
S2: bucket or whatever, but like, yeah, like I've had people

306
00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:28,310
S2: exchanging memes to me about June who I know haven't

307
00:14:28,310 --> 00:14:30,590
S2: actually even seen the movie yet. So yeah, it's really

308
00:14:30,590 --> 00:14:32,630
S2: weird that we live in this world now. That's a thing.

309
00:14:33,290 --> 00:14:36,080
S1: While we're talking about marketing, there is actually one bit

310
00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,470
S1: of the Dune Part two phenomenon that has left me

311
00:14:39,470 --> 00:14:42,109
S1: feeling like a little bit weird. I almost spent too

312
00:14:42,110 --> 00:14:43,790
S1: much time on this because I want to get to

313
00:14:43,790 --> 00:14:45,980
S1: the big stuff. The Oscars we're going to talk about today.

314
00:14:45,980 --> 00:14:51,140
S1: But the way that movie studios, distributors, marketing firms are

315
00:14:51,140 --> 00:14:55,010
S1: controlling the conversation about a movie in this day and

316
00:14:55,010 --> 00:14:58,040
S1: age is really fascinating to me and frankly, a little

317
00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:00,710
S1: bit depressing. So in the olden days, you know, the

318
00:15:00,710 --> 00:15:03,739
S1: first you generally hear about a movie and whether it

319
00:15:03,740 --> 00:15:05,330
S1: was good or bad, it was critics would go to

320
00:15:05,330 --> 00:15:07,910
S1: screenings early and they would write their reviews in the newspaper,

321
00:15:07,910 --> 00:15:10,640
S1: and great reviews would get you hyped. And you'd be like,

322
00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:12,200
S1: I guess that's the picture I want to go see

323
00:15:12,200 --> 00:15:14,330
S1: this weekend, and a bad review would like a movie

324
00:15:14,330 --> 00:15:16,790
S1: would be dead on arrival, right? So it's not surprising

325
00:15:16,790 --> 00:15:20,420
S1: that studios want to take some control back and set

326
00:15:20,420 --> 00:15:23,690
S1: the set the narrative on their terms. And so what

327
00:15:23,690 --> 00:15:28,520
S1: you've seen increasingly, is early screenings filled with influences more

328
00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:32,090
S1: than critics, even interview panels, which generally used to be

329
00:15:32,090 --> 00:15:36,580
S1: reserved for. Film journalists have now become about getting an influencer,

330
00:15:36,580 --> 00:15:39,729
S1: a TikToker, to ask someone involved in the movie what

331
00:15:39,730 --> 00:15:42,160
S1: their favorite like food is right to send that clip viral,

332
00:15:42,160 --> 00:15:45,130
S1: rather than an interesting conversation about what the movie is

333
00:15:45,130 --> 00:15:48,070
S1: about and what their process was. The new thing that

334
00:15:48,070 --> 00:15:49,840
S1: I've seen, and I think June Part two was, was

335
00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:53,140
S1: a really interesting example of this. You fill your early

336
00:15:53,140 --> 00:15:58,060
S1: release cinemas with fans of this franchise so that social media,

337
00:15:58,060 --> 00:16:03,310
S1: IMDb Letterboxd reviews are overwhelmingly positive because it's crazy spicy

338
00:16:03,310 --> 00:16:05,500
S1: to say it's great. That creates a narrative that this

339
00:16:05,500 --> 00:16:08,890
S1: movie is amazing, it's perfect, it's great, and no one

340
00:16:08,890 --> 00:16:10,840
S1: really wants to be the first person to say it

341
00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:13,870
S1: isn't quite that good. So everyone jumps on the hype train.

342
00:16:13,870 --> 00:16:16,270
S1: They watch it. The box office numbers are big. You

343
00:16:16,270 --> 00:16:18,160
S1: have that effect that you're talking about with Fred again

344
00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:19,450
S1: when no one wants to miss that. So they go

345
00:16:19,450 --> 00:16:22,140
S1: and see it. I think that's really interesting. It's really

346
00:16:22,140 --> 00:16:25,230
S1: smart marketing. The only bit of that that really annoys

347
00:16:25,230 --> 00:16:29,010
S1: me is those opportunities and that space that used to

348
00:16:29,010 --> 00:16:33,720
S1: be about writing about movies or asking interesting questions about

349
00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:38,670
S1: the choices directors and actors and editors make, going to

350
00:16:38,670 --> 00:16:41,790
S1: the kinds of people who and like. Obviously there are smart,

351
00:16:41,790 --> 00:16:44,910
S1: interesting film TikTokers and YouTubers. I'm not knocking those, but

352
00:16:44,910 --> 00:16:46,500
S1: a lot of it now is just how do we

353
00:16:46,500 --> 00:16:48,660
S1: get the most engagements to get this in people's feeds,

354
00:16:48,660 --> 00:16:50,460
S1: to get people to watch the movie? And I think

355
00:16:50,460 --> 00:16:52,560
S1: that's a little bit sad if that's the way it goes.

356
00:16:52,590 --> 00:16:54,330
S1: Do you guys have any any thoughts about this? Am

357
00:16:54,330 --> 00:16:55,530
S1: I just being curmudgeonly?

358
00:16:55,830 --> 00:16:58,800
S3: You are being a bit curmudgeonly because I do think

359
00:16:58,800 --> 00:17:01,710
S3: that there is. I think what they're doing is trying

360
00:17:01,710 --> 00:17:06,600
S3: to appeal to a demographic that traditional critics aren't appealing

361
00:17:06,630 --> 00:17:10,320
S3: to or aren't reaching, and that's exactly what they're trying

362
00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:12,240
S3: to do. And I think there is room for both.

363
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:14,700
S3: I mean, I don't think at the June premiere, our

364
00:17:14,700 --> 00:17:19,800
S3: movie reviewers weren't invited because someone from an influencer was

365
00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:21,660
S3: invited to take photos in front of, like, a wall

366
00:17:21,660 --> 00:17:24,210
S3: of sand. Like, I think they both can exist. And

367
00:17:24,210 --> 00:17:28,590
S3: I think a more positive frame on it is to say, look,

368
00:17:28,590 --> 00:17:31,260
S3: if this is how we're getting a new generation into

369
00:17:31,260 --> 00:17:34,770
S3: cinema and into films like that's a really good thing.

370
00:17:34,770 --> 00:17:37,139
S3: Like if this is a lot of people's first introduction

371
00:17:37,140 --> 00:17:40,859
S3: to cinematic culture, like, that's wonderful, why wouldn't we celebrate

372
00:17:40,859 --> 00:17:43,379
S3: the fact that we're reaching a younger audience? And I

373
00:17:43,380 --> 00:17:45,900
S3: do understand what you're saying, like, obviously we don't want

374
00:17:45,900 --> 00:17:48,960
S3: a dumbing down of the critical industry that we have,

375
00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:51,209
S3: but I just I really do think it's a way

376
00:17:51,210 --> 00:17:54,119
S3: of getting people into cinema more than kind of trying

377
00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:57,240
S3: to remove the critical culture around it. And they can

378
00:17:57,240 --> 00:17:59,520
S3: both exist because there will always be. And we had

379
00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:01,770
S3: serious reviews of Dune at the same time as there

380
00:18:01,770 --> 00:18:05,790
S3: is this kind of separate world going on for younger people.

381
00:18:05,790 --> 00:18:07,620
S3: And I will say it's not every film like it's

382
00:18:07,619 --> 00:18:10,740
S3: not like an Oppenheimer, although obviously that because of its

383
00:18:10,740 --> 00:18:12,600
S3: release with Barbie, we did see kind of a lot

384
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:15,179
S3: of social stuff around it. But not every film is

385
00:18:15,180 --> 00:18:18,540
S3: treated the way Dune has been. Like Oppenheimer wasn't killers,

386
00:18:18,540 --> 00:18:20,970
S3: wasn't a lot of anatomy of a fall. These are

387
00:18:20,970 --> 00:18:25,080
S3: really big, critically glorious films, but they're not being treated

388
00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,420
S3: this way. So it is these kind of blockbuster films

389
00:18:27,420 --> 00:18:30,180
S3: that are getting this treatment particularly. Yeah.

390
00:18:30,180 --> 00:18:32,430
S2: And I think there will always be, um, a few

391
00:18:32,430 --> 00:18:34,889
S2: of us brave people who go on the pods and say,

392
00:18:34,890 --> 00:18:38,250
S2: June 2nd, June 2nd sucks. No, I think I think

393
00:18:38,250 --> 00:18:40,560
S2: it's a very valid argument. I think you guys, um,

394
00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:42,660
S2: kind of covered both sides. I do think, yeah, it

395
00:18:42,660 --> 00:18:44,580
S2: ultimately should be about the balance. Like, you know, I

396
00:18:44,580 --> 00:18:47,159
S2: remember when I went to the Saltburn screening and I

397
00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:48,840
S2: was like, oh, this is really weird. Like, this is

398
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,570
S2: it was such a like, almost like party like atmosphere

399
00:18:51,570 --> 00:18:53,100
S2: in the cinema. And this was like two weeks before

400
00:18:53,100 --> 00:18:56,580
S2: it came out. And then like when it was lights up, um,

401
00:18:56,580 --> 00:19:00,540
S2: I saw like several I would say like 60% of

402
00:19:00,540 --> 00:19:03,840
S2: the crowd was like influences who I knew and not recognized.

403
00:19:03,840 --> 00:19:05,940
S2: And then, like, would, you know, a day later saw

404
00:19:05,940 --> 00:19:08,970
S2: their content on online. And I guess it'll be about

405
00:19:08,970 --> 00:19:10,680
S2: the balance that you don't want to kind of like

406
00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:13,050
S2: flood it with that, you know, very I know it's

407
00:19:13,050 --> 00:19:15,300
S2: like so tempting for these movie companies to get the

408
00:19:15,300 --> 00:19:17,129
S2: influencers in to be like, oh, they'll, you know, you

409
00:19:17,130 --> 00:19:19,320
S2: do three posts to your 200,000 followers about how great

410
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:21,510
S2: Saltburn is and blah, blah, blah. But, um, I don't

411
00:19:21,510 --> 00:19:23,400
S2: ever think we'll see, you know, the full watering down

412
00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:25,830
S2: of the critical, you know, uh, culture.

413
00:19:25,830 --> 00:19:27,540
S1: Yeah, I hope, I hope so. And you guys are right.

414
00:19:27,540 --> 00:19:29,250
S1: I mean, we are very lucky to get great access

415
00:19:29,250 --> 00:19:31,200
S1: to these movies. We get to watch them earlier, as

416
00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:33,780
S1: do critics. And we often get great access to stars

417
00:19:33,780 --> 00:19:36,240
S1: and talent. So I'm not saying that this is the

418
00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:38,790
S1: end of good film criticism, but something about the way

419
00:19:38,790 --> 00:19:41,910
S1: that the Dune stuff operated, on one hand super smart

420
00:19:41,910 --> 00:19:44,250
S1: from the studio and is clearly paid off. But I

421
00:19:44,250 --> 00:19:47,580
S1: just can see like like Paul Atreides with his with his,

422
00:19:47,580 --> 00:19:50,790
S1: you know, spice vision, a darker path ahead if we

423
00:19:50,790 --> 00:19:52,830
S1: follow this one too far down the track, but one

424
00:19:52,830 --> 00:19:53,820
S1: to watch, I reckon.

425
00:19:53,820 --> 00:19:55,169
S3: I mean, I don't know what that metaphor means.

426
00:19:55,170 --> 00:19:58,649
S5: So something about talking about a worm, I think. Yeah.

427
00:19:59,100 --> 00:19:59,760
S3: Blue liquid.

428
00:20:00,150 --> 00:20:03,510
S1: Um, look, one other thing we wanted to, to touch on, um,

429
00:20:03,510 --> 00:20:06,390
S1: was a show that I mentioned in the Impress Your

430
00:20:06,390 --> 00:20:10,020
S1: Friends segment last week, uh, called Shogun. It's had a

431
00:20:10,020 --> 00:20:14,130
S1: pretty big response internationally, making a lot of comparisons to

432
00:20:14,130 --> 00:20:17,729
S1: Game of Thrones and even succession. The ringer called it

433
00:20:17,730 --> 00:20:21,060
S1: high stakes event TV at its finest. The Washington Post

434
00:20:21,060 --> 00:20:24,300
S1: says that Shogun is what thrillers or wish they were.

435
00:20:24,300 --> 00:20:26,400
S1: It's a show made by FX in the in the US.

436
00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,160
S1: It's the home of shows like Atlanta Legion, It's Always Sunny,

437
00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,010
S1: but this feels like that leveling up. It's one of

438
00:20:32,010 --> 00:20:36,270
S1: their most epic, intense shows yet, airing on Disney+ in Australia.

439
00:20:36,270 --> 00:20:38,160
S1: And if you didn't catch me talking about it last week,

440
00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:41,490
S1: very quick summary. It's set in Japan in the 1600s.

441
00:20:41,490 --> 00:20:44,490
S1: It follows an Englishman who ends up shipwrecked in the

442
00:20:44,490 --> 00:20:48,060
S1: country and quickly becomes ensnared in political intrigue as this

443
00:20:48,060 --> 00:20:51,119
S1: group of five Japanese regents who rule over the country

444
00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:55,230
S1: trying to politically outdo and backstab each other. Thomas, you've

445
00:20:55,230 --> 00:20:57,840
S1: since watched Shogun. What did you think?

446
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,050
S2: Yeah, I am really into it. Um, it feels, I guess,

447
00:21:01,050 --> 00:21:04,860
S2: like the closest thing we have to prestige TV right now. Um,

448
00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:06,449
S2: it just it just does such a good job of

449
00:21:06,450 --> 00:21:09,330
S2: setting up this world. It's not really like an easily

450
00:21:09,330 --> 00:21:12,930
S2: accessible world at, like, on paper, but you so quickly get, like,

451
00:21:12,930 --> 00:21:15,210
S2: drawn into the power struggles of these five different kind

452
00:21:15,210 --> 00:21:18,000
S2: of like families or regions. And, you know, it is

453
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:21,270
S2: those themes that we love consistently. From the shows that

454
00:21:21,270 --> 00:21:23,070
S2: we love. And, you know, we talked about comparisons to

455
00:21:23,070 --> 00:21:25,320
S2: succession and, you know, whether or not that's accurate, I

456
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:28,080
S2: don't know. But like this power vacuum that is suddenly,

457
00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:31,770
S2: you know, has this ripple effect is so intoxicating, I think.

458
00:21:31,770 --> 00:21:33,060
S2: And on top of that, I also think like the

459
00:21:33,060 --> 00:21:35,670
S2: way they do the era is really great. And yeah,

460
00:21:35,670 --> 00:21:39,150
S2: I the first two episodes are actually pretty dense as well.

461
00:21:39,150 --> 00:21:41,310
S2: Like in terms of trying to figure out exactly what's

462
00:21:41,310 --> 00:21:43,770
S2: going on. And there is so many different characters. But yeah, I,

463
00:21:43,770 --> 00:21:46,500
S2: I'm very into this. I'm on the Shogun train now.

464
00:21:46,530 --> 00:21:48,390
S3: Oh my gosh, it is so graphic too.

465
00:21:48,390 --> 00:21:51,930
S5: This is like video game level violence.

466
00:21:51,930 --> 00:21:54,180
S3: And it did remind me of our Murray Scorsese episode.

467
00:21:54,180 --> 00:21:57,210
S3: We talked about his film silence, which is also set

468
00:21:57,210 --> 00:22:00,180
S3: in a similar period. And if you liked that film,

469
00:22:00,270 --> 00:22:02,520
S3: you will love Shogun, because it actually picks up on

470
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,129
S3: a lot of those themes and the exact same kind

471
00:22:05,130 --> 00:22:08,100
S3: of rough and ready landscape, the kind of collapse and

472
00:22:08,100 --> 00:22:12,300
S3: building of civilizations. It's, uh, it's pretty gripping viewing.

473
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:14,610
S1: Yeah, I get I get the Game of Thrones comparisons,

474
00:22:14,609 --> 00:22:17,760
S1: particularly the violence, the unexpected violence, this sort of sex

475
00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,850
S1: and stuff. But the creators have said, look, we want

476
00:22:20,850 --> 00:22:24,030
S1: this to be considered along shows like succession and House

477
00:22:24,030 --> 00:22:26,220
S1: of cards as well. And I get that too, because

478
00:22:26,220 --> 00:22:28,859
S1: while there is, you know, there like some really great

479
00:22:28,859 --> 00:22:31,770
S1: action sequences, so much of it is like conversations and

480
00:22:31,770 --> 00:22:35,130
S1: rooms and this, this web that continues to grow of

481
00:22:35,130 --> 00:22:39,090
S1: double dealing and like Catholic missionaries playing both sides. There's

482
00:22:39,090 --> 00:22:42,810
S1: so much complexity and denseness to this story, but I

483
00:22:42,810 --> 00:22:45,390
S1: think it's done in a way that's more, uh, I guess,

484
00:22:45,390 --> 00:22:48,240
S1: welcoming to outsiders and something like June, like they really

485
00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:50,670
S1: explained things to you, which really helps, particularly the first

486
00:22:50,670 --> 00:22:53,280
S1: couple of episodes. I feel like I get this world

487
00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:56,670
S1: and the stakes and I'm really in, uh, I, I

488
00:22:56,670 --> 00:22:58,830
S1: also think the way it's shot is really interesting that

489
00:22:58,830 --> 00:23:01,860
S1: you said it's, you know, one of the few prestige

490
00:23:01,859 --> 00:23:04,260
S1: shows out right now. Thomas, I kind of agree, even

491
00:23:04,260 --> 00:23:06,630
S1: though there are like other hyped shows, you know, there's

492
00:23:06,630 --> 00:23:09,630
S1: the regime with Kate Winslet that's out on, um, out

493
00:23:09,630 --> 00:23:11,670
S1: on binge, the HBO show. But the way that this

494
00:23:11,670 --> 00:23:15,929
S1: show is filmed, the lighting, the directing, the sequences, the performances,

495
00:23:15,930 --> 00:23:20,040
S1: it feels like this last kind of we're making a

496
00:23:20,040 --> 00:23:23,189
S1: movie into a TV show over eight parts and come

497
00:23:23,190 --> 00:23:24,270
S1: along for the ride.

498
00:23:24,270 --> 00:23:26,760
S3: Yeah, you're like totally in that environment with them, with

499
00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,189
S3: the rough waters and the jungle and the kind of

500
00:23:29,190 --> 00:23:32,310
S3: you're they do such a good job at making you

501
00:23:32,310 --> 00:23:33,750
S3: feel like you're in that moment.

502
00:23:33,750 --> 00:23:36,000
S2: Yeah, it feels expensive. And also I, I've had like

503
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:39,090
S2: a lot of people, um, like texting me about it,

504
00:23:39,090 --> 00:23:41,100
S2: like I can the word of mouth on this show is, like,

505
00:23:41,100 --> 00:23:42,780
S2: really kicking off over the last couple of weeks. Like

506
00:23:42,780 --> 00:23:46,010
S2: it it feels like it could be in 5 or

507
00:23:46,010 --> 00:23:48,090
S2: 6 episodes. People are like, oh, fuck. Shogun. This is

508
00:23:48,090 --> 00:23:49,050
S2: like the show for the year.

509
00:23:49,050 --> 00:23:51,330
S3: So the esteemed friends you quoted before who didn't like.

510
00:23:51,330 --> 00:23:53,100
S5: June, are they into Shogun?

511
00:23:53,100 --> 00:23:55,050
S2: Correct? Yeah. They've given Shogun the tick of approval.

512
00:23:55,109 --> 00:23:55,919
S3: Interesting.

513
00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:57,390
S1: Well, let's keep an eye on it, because I do

514
00:23:57,390 --> 00:23:59,310
S1: think you're right. I think more people will jump on,

515
00:23:59,310 --> 00:24:01,320
S1: and it may be worth doing, like a deeper dive

516
00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:04,859
S1: and some character analyses and and that sort of fun thing.

517
00:24:04,859 --> 00:24:07,050
S1: So yeah, we're all going to send the Shogun train,

518
00:24:07,050 --> 00:24:18,990
S1: it sounds like. All right, folks, the 96th Academy Awards

519
00:24:18,990 --> 00:24:22,440
S1: are nearly here. They are airing during the day on Monday,

520
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,770
S1: the 11th Australian time. All three of us are fans

521
00:24:25,770 --> 00:24:28,800
S1: of the Oscars. We love cinema. We love award shows.

522
00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,740
S1: We love the celebration of film culture and everything to

523
00:24:31,740 --> 00:24:35,280
S1: do with the moving image with some sound attached to it.

524
00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,860
S1: We love it when the Oscars get it right. We

525
00:24:37,859 --> 00:24:39,149
S1: love it when they get it wrong. We love it

526
00:24:39,150 --> 00:24:40,770
S1: when they do both on the same night, which they

527
00:24:40,770 --> 00:24:44,310
S1: basically always do. Today we're going to do a deep

528
00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:47,129
S1: dive on this year's awards. We're going to take a

529
00:24:47,130 --> 00:24:49,619
S1: look at the state of the race, how the campaigns

530
00:24:49,619 --> 00:24:53,700
S1: for each film playing out, and we'll unpack exactly how

531
00:24:53,700 --> 00:24:57,450
S1: the awards work. And we'll also make some predictions that

532
00:24:57,450 --> 00:24:59,700
S1: you can hold us to next week when we do

533
00:24:59,700 --> 00:25:03,119
S1: a special Oscars reaction podcast, dropping in your feeds on

534
00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:06,990
S1: Monday evening. I actually thought, before we start talking about

535
00:25:06,990 --> 00:25:09,510
S1: this year's awards, it'd be fun to read out this

536
00:25:09,510 --> 00:25:13,679
S1: passage from a book. Mel Michael Shulman's Oscar was the

537
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:14,909
S1: one that you and I both enjoy.

538
00:25:14,910 --> 00:25:15,870
S5: Favorite book?

539
00:25:15,869 --> 00:25:18,330
S1: It's about the history of the Oscars, and early on

540
00:25:18,330 --> 00:25:20,760
S1: in the book he asks, like, what are the Academy

541
00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:25,320
S1: Awards anyway? And he says that the closest thing America

542
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:28,620
S1: has to royalty, they're the only thing forcing Hollywood to

543
00:25:28,619 --> 00:25:32,040
S1: factor art into commerce. They're a marketing ploy, propping up

544
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:35,760
S1: a multi-billion dollar business there, a method, however dubious, of

545
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,119
S1: organizing movies into canon. They're a game. They're a relic.

546
00:25:39,150 --> 00:25:42,000
S1: They're a fashion show. They're a horse race. They're an

547
00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:45,480
S1: orgy of self-congratulation by rich and famous people who think

548
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,690
S1: too highly of themselves. They're the gay Super Bowl. I

549
00:25:48,690 --> 00:25:51,390
S1: thought that is like, awesome, because all of those statements

550
00:25:51,390 --> 00:25:54,690
S1: are right. And I think they explain why these awards

551
00:25:54,690 --> 00:25:57,090
S1: are so fascinating to watch and to talk about, both

552
00:25:57,090 --> 00:26:00,630
S1: as a spectacle, but both as a statement on this

553
00:26:00,630 --> 00:26:02,910
S1: big question that we talk about every show, how culture

554
00:26:02,910 --> 00:26:05,070
S1: is made and received in the world right now.

555
00:26:06,230 --> 00:26:08,030
S3: Yeah, just hearing that made me excited.

556
00:26:08,030 --> 00:26:08,330
S5: Yeah.

557
00:26:09,050 --> 00:26:10,939
S1: So. So now we've got that kind of summary out

558
00:26:10,940 --> 00:26:12,800
S1: of the way. I thought it'd be fun if the

559
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:15,920
S1: three of us started with sharing some of our favorite

560
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,320
S1: Oscar moments from recent years. What are the bits that

561
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,690
S1: stand out that you still think about that make you think,

562
00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:23,359
S1: God damn, I love this insane group of people and

563
00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:25,310
S1: what they get up to? Mel. Jonah, do you want

564
00:26:25,310 --> 00:26:26,030
S1: to go first?

565
00:26:26,060 --> 00:26:28,040
S3: Well, I have to say one of them that I

566
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:31,580
S3: think still the influence still continues to loom large on

567
00:26:31,580 --> 00:26:36,859
S3: our culture was Ellen's selfie, which turns ten this year?

568
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,380
S1: Um, this week, I believe. Two days ago. Yeah.

569
00:26:39,410 --> 00:26:41,090
S3: Of course. Yeah. So, um.

570
00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:41,780
S5: Remind us.

571
00:26:41,780 --> 00:26:42,470
S1: Of the selfie.

572
00:26:42,470 --> 00:26:45,050
S3: No, I mean, it's a bit. Ellen. Probably. Now, we

573
00:26:45,050 --> 00:26:47,750
S3: know she probably bullied everyone into doing it and smiled

574
00:26:47,750 --> 00:26:50,780
S3: the whole way. So it's kind of a bit tinged now, but, um,

575
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:55,100
S3: Ellen just happened to take that, you know, seemingly random selfie.

576
00:26:55,100 --> 00:26:58,220
S3: Probably ten years ago. We were all just discovering selfies, right?

577
00:26:58,490 --> 00:27:00,590
S3: And it had the who's who of Hollywood in it.

578
00:27:00,590 --> 00:27:03,860
S3: Everyone from Meryl Streep to Bradley Cooper, Jennifer Lawrence was

579
00:27:03,859 --> 00:27:06,500
S3: in it, Brad Pitt all like in a kind of

580
00:27:06,500 --> 00:27:10,340
S3: Renaissance style, scattered composition. And it was just kind of

581
00:27:10,340 --> 00:27:14,120
S3: captured a moment in time in Hollywood so perfectly. And

582
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:17,600
S3: since then it's obviously been ripped off multiple times. Everyone's

583
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:19,580
S3: kind of done their own version of the Ellen self,

584
00:27:19,580 --> 00:27:22,040
S3: and it became a trend at other events as well.

585
00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:24,020
S1: It's so funny that selfie, because you're right, it had

586
00:27:24,020 --> 00:27:26,389
S1: this chokehold on the on the world. But now you

587
00:27:26,390 --> 00:27:29,240
S1: look back, you're like that is so cringe. Like who cares?

588
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:33,920
S1: The photo looks like depressing Kevin Spacey. There's a few

589
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:36,139
S1: people there that have not aged well, but now it's

590
00:27:36,140 --> 00:27:38,720
S1: like you just couldn't see that going ballistic the way

591
00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:39,619
S1: that that did.

592
00:27:39,619 --> 00:27:41,660
S3: No, I feel like if you saw it, you'd probably

593
00:27:41,660 --> 00:27:44,840
S3: mock them and criticize them for the ostentatious ness of

594
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:47,630
S3: it all. Um, of course, at the moment that I

595
00:27:47,630 --> 00:27:50,960
S3: think we'll never get past from the Oscars is the slap. Um,

596
00:27:50,960 --> 00:27:53,480
S3: not the Crystal talkers book, though we can talk about

597
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:58,850
S3: that later. The 2022, um, Will Smith, Chris Rock, I'm

598
00:27:58,850 --> 00:27:59,450
S3: out here.

599
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:07,699
UU: Oh, Richard. Oh, wow. Wow.

600
00:28:09,619 --> 00:28:11,600
S6: Will Smith just smack the shit out of me.

601
00:28:14,900 --> 00:28:17,210
UU: Name out your mouth.

602
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:22,460
S6: Wow, dude. Yes, it was a G.I. Joe.

603
00:28:22,970 --> 00:28:26,090
S3: My wife's name. I remember we were all in the office,

604
00:28:26,090 --> 00:28:29,060
S3: I think, when it happened. And it was. The response was.

605
00:28:29,060 --> 00:28:31,310
S3: So no one really understood what was going on.

606
00:28:31,310 --> 00:28:33,439
S1: I was famously not in the office. I'd been helping

607
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:35,210
S1: live blog at all day and went to get a

608
00:28:35,210 --> 00:28:36,470
S1: sandwich and was like.

609
00:28:37,220 --> 00:28:37,520
S5: What could.

610
00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:39,410
S1: Happen here? And I got my phone starts blowing up.

611
00:28:39,410 --> 00:28:41,690
S1: It's like, you know, Will Smith just slap Chris Rock.

612
00:28:41,690 --> 00:28:43,610
S1: I'm like, ah, I was like George Clooney at the

613
00:28:43,610 --> 00:28:45,800
S1: opening of Ocean's 12. And Julia Roberts calls and he

614
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:48,979
S1: throws the flowers away and just gets back, runs back in.

615
00:28:48,980 --> 00:28:52,130
S2: It was like a BLT. Yeah, yeah, just enjoying himself.

616
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:54,590
S1: It was so funny. You mentioned Crystal Soakers because I

617
00:28:54,590 --> 00:28:56,270
S1: can remember who it was. Someone in our team had

618
00:28:56,270 --> 00:28:59,870
S1: an idea to message Crystal and see if he would

619
00:28:59,870 --> 00:29:03,620
S1: comment on the slap, and and I did. He decided

620
00:29:03,620 --> 00:29:04,820
S1: to not buy it. Actually.

621
00:29:05,480 --> 00:29:07,550
S3: That is such a good idea and I think we

622
00:29:07,550 --> 00:29:08,870
S3: should ask him again.

623
00:29:08,870 --> 00:29:11,150
S1: I actually, I actually just found the message. He said,

624
00:29:11,150 --> 00:29:13,460
S1: Hi Osman, I think the wisest thing for me to

625
00:29:13,460 --> 00:29:16,160
S1: do is let the memes take care of themselves. Hope

626
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,850
S1: that's okay. Don't hesitate to ask me anything. My best Christmas.

627
00:29:20,900 --> 00:29:21,710
S5: That's a great message.

628
00:29:22,070 --> 00:29:24,110
S3: Speaking of the time, I asked Helen Garner to write

629
00:29:24,110 --> 00:29:25,700
S3: about the Kardashians and.

630
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:27,500
S5: Which I still.

631
00:29:27,500 --> 00:29:29,060
S3: Believe would have been a remarkable.

632
00:29:29,060 --> 00:29:30,590
S5: Can you bring this up often?

633
00:29:30,590 --> 00:29:35,210
S3: She just replied one line. No, not for me. Um, yeah,

634
00:29:35,210 --> 00:29:36,710
S3: but do you remember? We were all very confused about

635
00:29:36,710 --> 00:29:38,990
S3: whether it was a joke at first or like whether

636
00:29:38,990 --> 00:29:41,330
S3: it was staged. There was at least a kind of

637
00:29:41,330 --> 00:29:43,940
S3: a few minutes where everyone was kind of confused about

638
00:29:43,940 --> 00:29:46,010
S3: whether it was set up, one of those kind of interactive.

639
00:29:46,010 --> 00:29:47,510
S5: Yeah. It just seemed so outrageous that.

640
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:48,590
S1: It actually happened.

641
00:29:48,590 --> 00:29:50,900
S2: I remember shortly after that Osbourne was like, you have

642
00:29:50,900 --> 00:29:53,060
S2: to write this anatomy of the slap piece, where I

643
00:29:53,060 --> 00:29:54,920
S2: broke it down into like, it was like, you know,

644
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:56,990
S2: it was like a replay of a of a football

645
00:29:56,990 --> 00:29:59,030
S2: game or something and like, broke it down piece by piece.

646
00:29:59,030 --> 00:30:00,890
S2: And we got like vision made up. And that was

647
00:30:00,890 --> 00:30:02,930
S2: another one of those times where I'm like, I used

648
00:30:02,930 --> 00:30:04,850
S2: to be somebody. And now here's one of those.

649
00:30:04,850 --> 00:30:06,590
S1: Times where you said, oh, do I have to? And

650
00:30:06,590 --> 00:30:09,170
S1: then it became one of the most beautiful and best read.

651
00:30:09,500 --> 00:30:11,450
S5: It actually did absolutely pop up. What would have been like,

652
00:30:11,450 --> 00:30:11,720
S5: is this.

653
00:30:11,720 --> 00:30:12,620
S3: Even a story?

654
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:14,090
S5: Um, funnily.

655
00:30:14,090 --> 00:30:16,880
S2: Enough, my Oscars moment comes from the same year I

656
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,880
S2: present to you two words. Ladies and gentlemen, Adele.

657
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:25,640
S7: Naseem, please welcome the wickedly talented one and only a dozen.

658
00:30:26,450 --> 00:30:28,880
S2: Aside from the fact I love Travolta, I also love

659
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:32,210
S2: late era Travolta because he's just, like, fucking careening out

660
00:30:32,210 --> 00:30:34,459
S2: of control. He's a pilot whose face doesn't move. Um,

661
00:30:34,460 --> 00:30:37,730
S2: everything he does is hilarious. But the fact that, you know,

662
00:30:37,730 --> 00:30:40,430
S2: we can still have something like the Oscars, which is

663
00:30:40,430 --> 00:30:44,390
S2: the most heavily coordinated, one of the most watched black

664
00:30:44,570 --> 00:30:47,150
S2: cultural events in the world, and you can still have

665
00:30:47,150 --> 00:30:49,580
S2: these hilarious slip ups. It's very funny. Obviously, it was

666
00:30:49,580 --> 00:30:53,270
S2: when John Travolta went up on stage to introduce, um,

667
00:30:53,270 --> 00:30:55,910
S2: actor and songstress Idina menzel. Um, who was going to,

668
00:30:55,940 --> 00:30:58,760
S2: you know, perform Let It Go from frozen. And he

669
00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:02,810
S2: obviously he's I guess his logic is that he misread

670
00:31:02,810 --> 00:31:04,910
S2: the phonetic spelling of her name on the teleprompter, and

671
00:31:04,910 --> 00:31:09,950
S2: he said, Adele, dizzy. And I was just like, what

672
00:31:09,950 --> 00:31:13,250
S2: the fuck, Travolta? Um, and, you know, funnily enough, it was. Yeah,

673
00:31:13,460 --> 00:31:16,190
S2: it was ten years ago. Two days ago, I think. Um,

674
00:31:16,190 --> 00:31:18,950
S2: so Idina menzel went on Instagram to wish Adele regime

675
00:31:18,950 --> 00:31:19,400
S2: a happy.

676
00:31:19,700 --> 00:31:21,740
S5: Happy 10th birthday, which was very funny.

677
00:31:21,830 --> 00:31:24,020
S2: Um, so yeah, that's my one that stands out.

678
00:31:24,020 --> 00:31:25,880
S1: It's funny that all of ours are kind of fuckups,

679
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,700
S1: like no moments, just like, wow, the first so-and-so to

680
00:31:28,700 --> 00:31:31,220
S1: win an Oscar because mine is my favorite moment of

681
00:31:31,220 --> 00:31:36,080
S1: all time. The 2017 Moonlight La La Land clusterfuck, which which,

682
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:39,050
S1: if you don't remember, Faye Dunaway and Warren Beatty were

683
00:31:39,050 --> 00:31:41,900
S1: announcing the winner of Best Picture. Everyone knew it was

684
00:31:41,900 --> 00:31:44,810
S1: down to La La Land and Moonlight. That was like

685
00:31:44,810 --> 00:31:48,530
S1: shades of the 2009 VMAs. It's kind of like clash

686
00:31:48,530 --> 00:31:51,980
S1: of of race and culture and films and what stories matters,

687
00:31:51,980 --> 00:31:57,260
S1: this beautiful, queer black story that just looked stunning compared

688
00:31:57,260 --> 00:32:00,080
S1: to this movie about Hollywood. You know, I'm not a

689
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,780
S1: big La La Land guy, you guys know that. And

690
00:32:02,780 --> 00:32:05,989
S1: then they announced that it's La La Land. All the

691
00:32:05,990 --> 00:32:10,580
S1: producers jump up, everyone's celebrating. It's pretty exciting. Then Jordan Horowitz,

692
00:32:10,580 --> 00:32:13,310
S1: the producer, looks at the envelope and says, there's been

693
00:32:13,310 --> 00:32:16,190
S1: a mistake. Moonlight, you guys won Best Picture.

694
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:18,050
S8: We lost, by the way. But, you know.

695
00:32:18,740 --> 00:32:22,460
S9: I'm sorry. No, there's a mistake. There's a mistake. Moonlight.

696
00:32:22,460 --> 00:32:24,950
S9: You guys won best picture. Moonlight won.

697
00:32:26,420 --> 00:32:28,700
S10: This is not a joke. This is not a joke.

698
00:32:28,700 --> 00:32:31,040
S10: I'm afraid they read the wrong thing. This is.

699
00:32:31,970 --> 00:32:34,730
S9: This is not a joke. Moonlight has won Best picture.

700
00:32:37,120 --> 00:32:39,160
S9: Moonlight Best Picture.

701
00:32:45,740 --> 00:32:48,350
S1: I watched that clip multiple times a week. It gives

702
00:32:48,350 --> 00:32:51,140
S1: me chills. No one knows what's going on. It is insane.

703
00:32:51,140 --> 00:32:53,900
S1: How do they get it wrong? I was liveblogging those

704
00:32:53,900 --> 00:32:55,880
S1: awards for a different company I was working for at

705
00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,940
S1: the time. I did the same thing I made you do, Thomas.

706
00:32:58,940 --> 00:33:01,910
S1: I did like an anatomy of it screenshots, time frames,

707
00:33:01,910 --> 00:33:04,700
S1: where it all went wrong. It was just so good

708
00:33:04,700 --> 00:33:07,610
S1: and I love that it lives on in Oscars history.

709
00:33:07,610 --> 00:33:09,980
S2: And again, it's just like, how does this happen? Not

710
00:33:09,980 --> 00:33:12,380
S2: since the winner of Australia's Next Top model has.

711
00:33:12,380 --> 00:33:15,170
S5: Such a disaster, but like, yeah.

712
00:33:15,590 --> 00:33:18,980
S2: I mean, it just was like that heart in the

713
00:33:18,980 --> 00:33:22,370
S2: mouth moment. Similar, I guess, to to the Will Smith thing.

714
00:33:22,370 --> 00:33:26,450
S2: Like everything in our world really is often so like

715
00:33:26,450 --> 00:33:28,940
S2: scripted and expected and there's not much room for chaos.

716
00:33:28,940 --> 00:33:31,520
S2: And so when stuff like that happens, especially at these

717
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:33,980
S2: moments where, you know, like much of the world is watching,

718
00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:35,870
S2: it's just it's kind of beautiful.

719
00:33:35,870 --> 00:33:36,350
S5: Yeah.

720
00:33:36,350 --> 00:33:38,660
S3: I like the, you know, there's no chaos until there

721
00:33:38,660 --> 00:33:41,000
S3: is chaos and then it's absolute chaos.

722
00:33:41,420 --> 00:33:44,090
S1: And because this involves like people who make the best

723
00:33:44,090 --> 00:33:47,630
S1: films in the world, you think they can get a broadcast, right?

724
00:33:47,630 --> 00:33:50,090
S1: They can produce a ceremony. So I think you're spot on.

725
00:33:50,090 --> 00:33:52,430
S1: I think that element of chaos is why we love

726
00:33:52,430 --> 00:33:55,670
S1: the alive award ceremony as much as, like, who actually

727
00:33:55,670 --> 00:33:56,690
S1: wins and loses.

728
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:58,400
S3: Yeah. Gosh, it would be good to have a like

729
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:00,770
S3: a kind of documentary of what went on behind the

730
00:34:00,770 --> 00:34:02,540
S3: scenes after that kind of is.

731
00:34:02,540 --> 00:34:03,290
S5: It Warren Beatty is that.

732
00:34:03,290 --> 00:34:04,040
S2: Really old and can't.

733
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:05,930
S5: Fucking say anything anymore? Yeah, yeah it is.

734
00:34:05,930 --> 00:34:07,970
S1: He did, I think I think from memory, like he

735
00:34:07,970 --> 00:34:11,930
S1: took the wrong envelope. He took it Emma Stone's envelope

736
00:34:11,930 --> 00:34:16,279
S1: for Best Actress, and he was confused and it had

737
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:17,810
S1: La La Land on it. And he's like, well, I

738
00:34:17,810 --> 00:34:20,720
S1: guess that's the best picture. And so that's what happened.

739
00:34:20,810 --> 00:34:21,260
S5: If I.

740
00:34:21,260 --> 00:34:22,280
S3: Say it with confidence.

741
00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:23,480
S5: They'll believe me.

742
00:34:24,260 --> 00:34:26,719
S1: Now. Warren Beatty rules like good on him. And it

743
00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:29,540
S1: led to a very funny moment. So very happy for

744
00:34:29,540 --> 00:34:32,900
S1: everyone involved. Except, anyway, moonlight got the award. That's what matters.

745
00:34:33,230 --> 00:34:33,440
S5: Um.

746
00:34:34,190 --> 00:34:37,880
S1: Speaking of awards, I thought it'd be interesting to do

747
00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:42,080
S1: a bit of a reflection on last year's awards. Uh,

748
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:45,320
S1: I think they're actually an interesting case study into how

749
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,819
S1: the Oscars work and why some movies and actors and

750
00:34:49,820 --> 00:34:54,140
S1: directors win, when it might not necessarily seem super obvious.

751
00:34:54,140 --> 00:34:56,660
S1: It's a good way to kind of ground ourselves before

752
00:34:56,660 --> 00:35:00,230
S1: we talk about what could happen this year on Monday.

753
00:35:00,230 --> 00:35:05,779
S1: So last year, 2023 was basically a sweep for everything everywhere,

754
00:35:05,780 --> 00:35:08,960
S1: all at once. It won Best Picture, Best Director for

755
00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:12,950
S1: the two, Daniels, Best Original Screenplay for the Daniels Best Editing,

756
00:35:12,950 --> 00:35:16,610
S1: Best Actress for Michelle Yeoh, Best Supporting Actor for Kwan,

757
00:35:16,610 --> 00:35:20,300
S1: and Best Supporting Actress for Jamie Lee Curtis. It was

758
00:35:20,300 --> 00:35:23,300
S1: ultimately just one shy of what we call in the

759
00:35:23,300 --> 00:35:26,390
S1: business the Big five. When a film wins Best Picture,

760
00:35:26,390 --> 00:35:30,290
S1: best director, best screenplay, actor and actress, that's only happened

761
00:35:30,290 --> 00:35:33,230
S1: three times in history. Uh, it happened One Night, One

762
00:35:33,230 --> 00:35:35,870
S1: Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, and The Silence of the lambs.

763
00:35:35,870 --> 00:35:39,379
S1: Last one was 1991. So I watched this movie again,

764
00:35:39,380 --> 00:35:42,560
S1: like late last year after all the awards. And honestly,

765
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:44,480
S1: I found it like a bit harder to sit through

766
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:46,640
S1: than the first time I remember thinking the first one.

767
00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:49,520
S1: This is pretty wacky and fun. It's kind of interesting,

768
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:52,730
S1: but do you guys think a year on that? It

769
00:35:52,730 --> 00:35:55,490
S1: kind of stacks up that this movie won so many

770
00:35:55,489 --> 00:35:56,509
S1: Academy Awards?

771
00:35:56,690 --> 00:35:59,330
S3: I haven't gone back and watched it, and I have

772
00:35:59,330 --> 00:36:00,859
S3: to say I enjoyed it at the time and same

773
00:36:00,860 --> 00:36:02,840
S3: as you. I found it kooky and different, and it

774
00:36:02,840 --> 00:36:04,820
S3: wasn't like anything else that was out at that time

775
00:36:04,820 --> 00:36:07,280
S3: of the year, and it had an interesting cast. Um,

776
00:36:07,430 --> 00:36:10,700
S3: but it really did seem that that year it was

777
00:36:10,700 --> 00:36:12,920
S3: kind of just on point. And I think we do

778
00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:15,740
S3: see this with the Oscars often. One film kind of

779
00:36:15,739 --> 00:36:17,930
S3: steals a lot of the oxygen, and it gets all

780
00:36:17,930 --> 00:36:20,450
S3: the hype in the build up to the Oscars campaign

781
00:36:20,450 --> 00:36:23,060
S3: and the kind of vibe is on its side, and

782
00:36:23,060 --> 00:36:25,910
S3: then it sweeps a lot of them. And then, you know,

783
00:36:25,910 --> 00:36:28,760
S3: it doesn't particularly always age well. I still think this

784
00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:30,740
S3: film is really good. Do I think it would have

785
00:36:30,739 --> 00:36:33,799
S3: won all those Oscars this year? Probably not, because I

786
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,200
S3: think the mood is different that we're in right now,

787
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:38,930
S3: and I think its success was a direct reflection of

788
00:36:38,930 --> 00:36:41,900
S3: kind of the world that was voting for it and

789
00:36:41,900 --> 00:36:44,030
S3: created it at the time. So no, I think it

790
00:36:44,030 --> 00:36:46,490
S3: was like pretty limited to that year. And that moment

791
00:36:46,489 --> 00:36:49,910
S3: and wouldn't necessarily have the same success at another time.

792
00:36:49,910 --> 00:36:50,750
S3: What do you think, Thomas?

793
00:36:50,750 --> 00:36:52,730
S2: I think Top Gun Maverick was robbed, which I think

794
00:36:52,730 --> 00:36:56,510
S2: was like obvious. No, like I yeah, I don't really

795
00:36:56,510 --> 00:36:58,850
S2: love everything everywhere all at once. Like, not as much

796
00:36:58,850 --> 00:37:02,029
S2: as everyone else seems to. I do like in my

797
00:37:02,030 --> 00:37:04,129
S2: most cynical part, I think, oh God, was the Oscars.

798
00:37:04,130 --> 00:37:06,200
S2: Just like, did they see a big opportunity to, like,

799
00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:09,260
S2: write some maybe historical wrongs and just kind of like

800
00:37:09,260 --> 00:37:12,500
S2: hand out, you know, in this one year, like, make

801
00:37:12,500 --> 00:37:15,469
S2: themselves feel better about their checkered history. I do think

802
00:37:15,469 --> 00:37:17,780
S2: there were better films. Um, and I especially think Jamie

803
00:37:17,780 --> 00:37:19,250
S2: Lee Curtis, which I know will get on to. But

804
00:37:19,250 --> 00:37:20,989
S2: that was like a fucking stitch up of a win.

805
00:37:20,989 --> 00:37:24,410
S2: I think that was them playing catch up. Uh, and

806
00:37:24,410 --> 00:37:27,470
S2: also I think similarly, Cate Blanchett sadly, was the best

807
00:37:27,469 --> 00:37:30,080
S2: actress that year and she was robbed. So that's my

808
00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:32,000
S2: thoughts on it. But this is this is a problem

809
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:34,910
S2: that the Oscars faces. It's a vicious cycle they're stuck in.

810
00:37:34,910 --> 00:37:39,590
S2: And and yeah, I mean time will tell if Oppenheimer

811
00:37:39,590 --> 00:37:41,630
S2: basically does the same thing this year, I think it

812
00:37:41,630 --> 00:37:45,589
S2: will go even further. Um. Yeah, it's a funny thing.

813
00:37:45,590 --> 00:37:47,750
S2: And I think what you said is right, Mel, sometimes

814
00:37:47,750 --> 00:37:50,330
S2: we go into this season and the way, you know,

815
00:37:50,330 --> 00:37:52,700
S2: the major kind of critic awards go and the Globes

816
00:37:52,700 --> 00:37:54,589
S2: and stuff, and by the time we get to Oscars,

817
00:37:54,590 --> 00:37:57,319
S2: it's like, well, this is the way that everyone like,

818
00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:58,670
S2: this is the way the wind is blowing. So it's

819
00:37:58,670 --> 00:37:59,660
S2: like an inevitable.

820
00:37:59,690 --> 00:38:02,150
S1: Yeah. I'm glad you brought up those kind of make

821
00:38:02,150 --> 00:38:04,670
S1: good Oscars, as I call them, where someone gets rewarded

822
00:38:04,670 --> 00:38:08,450
S1: because the Oscars want to rectify a historical either injustice

823
00:38:08,450 --> 00:38:11,060
S1: or someone's turn. Right. They've been this big part of

824
00:38:11,060 --> 00:38:12,830
S1: Hollywood for so long, they haven't gotten an Oscar, and

825
00:38:12,830 --> 00:38:14,390
S1: so they give it to them. But what that really

826
00:38:14,390 --> 00:38:16,970
S1: does is it then creates another example of someone who

827
00:38:16,969 --> 00:38:19,310
S1: probably deserved it, didn't get it, that they have to, like,

828
00:38:19,310 --> 00:38:21,529
S1: make good down the track. And I think there were

829
00:38:21,530 --> 00:38:24,320
S1: a few of those examples with with everything everywhere. I

830
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:27,650
S1: thought like the acting categories is so interesting because they

831
00:38:27,650 --> 00:38:30,680
S1: give you a bit of a snapshot of how different

832
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,560
S1: narratives can can lead to a performance that you might

833
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:36,080
S1: not think as being the best performance. Winning Michelle Yeoh

834
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:40,490
S1: is an interesting example. Was she better than Cate Blanchett

835
00:38:40,489 --> 00:38:43,100
S1: in Tar like? I don't think so. I think Tarr

836
00:38:43,100 --> 00:38:45,800
S1: was an astonishing movie, and I thought Cate Blanchett did

837
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:49,460
S1: an extraordinary job. But the Oscars aren't just like a

838
00:38:49,460 --> 00:38:51,710
S1: liberal who was the best in a movie. There's all

839
00:38:51,710 --> 00:38:56,989
S1: these questions and and conversations and in historical threads, like Blanchett,

840
00:38:56,989 --> 00:39:00,470
S1: for example, has an Oscar, Michelle Yeoh hasn't won an Oscar,

841
00:39:00,469 --> 00:39:02,660
S1: and if she was to win, which she did, she

842
00:39:02,660 --> 00:39:05,660
S1: would have become and did become the first East Asian

843
00:39:05,660 --> 00:39:08,299
S1: woman to do so. Right. So that's like a big

844
00:39:08,600 --> 00:39:11,060
S1: a big factor in that. And I think everything everywhere

845
00:39:11,060 --> 00:39:13,940
S1: was was really wrapped up with the identity politics of

846
00:39:13,940 --> 00:39:16,940
S1: that movie and the story it told. Then. Kwan, who

847
00:39:16,940 --> 00:39:19,580
S1: won Best Supporting Actor, it was sort of similar, like

848
00:39:19,580 --> 00:39:22,820
S1: you could argue, and I probably would, that both Barry

849
00:39:22,820 --> 00:39:26,689
S1: Kuhn and Brendan Gleeson gave more compelling performances in Banshees

850
00:39:26,690 --> 00:39:29,990
S1: of Inisherin like Kwan was fine, but he had this

851
00:39:29,989 --> 00:39:32,570
S1: amazing comeback narrative, right? He was basically written out of

852
00:39:32,570 --> 00:39:36,440
S1: Hollywood because of racism for decades and decades. He gave

853
00:39:36,440 --> 00:39:39,530
S1: powerful speeches when he won at other awards, and it

854
00:39:39,530 --> 00:39:42,470
S1: just became a story of like, we've got to rectify

855
00:39:42,469 --> 00:39:46,160
S1: the injustice we did to win. Sorry, Barry and Brendan,

856
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,680
S1: and you mentioned Jamie Lee Curtis Thomas like that feels

857
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:51,770
S1: like a total just like Jamie Lee Curtis. Thank you

858
00:39:51,770 --> 00:39:54,200
S1: for everything you've done for Hollywood. Take this award because

859
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:57,350
S1: she's like, that role is fine. I don't think she

860
00:39:57,350 --> 00:39:59,090
S1: thought when she was doing it she was going to

861
00:39:59,090 --> 00:40:00,200
S1: be up for an Oscar, right?

862
00:40:00,890 --> 00:40:01,730
S2: Definitely not.

863
00:40:01,730 --> 00:40:03,560
S3: Yeah. But I do think we have to be careful

864
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:06,260
S3: in a way, because you're speaking about like the Oscars

865
00:40:06,260 --> 00:40:09,739
S3: decided and it is like a member voted award. You know.

866
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:10,850
S1: We'll get into all of that.

867
00:40:11,060 --> 00:40:12,590
S5: Yeah. All right. Yeah.

868
00:40:12,860 --> 00:40:16,490
S3: Because I think that that yeah. It's not like the

869
00:40:16,489 --> 00:40:20,359
S3: an institution is necessarily being like, you deserve this. It's

870
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,570
S3: like people voting. Not that there can't be campaigns and

871
00:40:23,570 --> 00:40:26,600
S3: there's not like kind of groupthink in that, but maybe we'll, uh,

872
00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:28,310
S3: I can maybe we'll pin that. I feel like there's

873
00:40:28,310 --> 00:40:29,180
S3: more to be said.

874
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:31,490
S2: I just for the second time, this podcast wanted to

875
00:40:31,489 --> 00:40:33,890
S2: quote the ever wise Rob Moran because he wrote about

876
00:40:33,890 --> 00:40:37,100
S2: this recently about award ceremonies playing catch up. And he said,

877
00:40:37,100 --> 00:40:39,859
S2: call it the who are effect the West. Sorry, Mr. Pacino,

878
00:40:39,860 --> 00:40:42,110
S2: we didn't watch Dog Day afternoon in the 70s because

879
00:40:42,110 --> 00:40:44,660
S2: of cocaine. Here, take this for scent of a woman.

880
00:40:44,900 --> 00:40:47,870
S5: And it's very true. And yeah, and, you.

881
00:40:47,870 --> 00:40:51,259
S2: Know, it's funny, I was watching DiCaprio's acceptance speech for

882
00:40:51,260 --> 00:40:53,569
S2: winning for The Revenant, which is not his best film.

883
00:40:53,570 --> 00:40:55,610
S2: He was a six time nominee. He probably should have

884
00:40:55,610 --> 00:40:58,400
S2: won for The Departed. And, you know, he got the

885
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:01,100
S2: the Oscar for The Revenant. Same thing with Scorsese winning

886
00:41:01,100 --> 00:41:05,750
S2: for The Departed instead of Goodfellas. Like, the list is endless. Uh, and,

887
00:41:05,750 --> 00:41:08,480
S2: you know, again, I'll quote Rob here, who actually recalled

888
00:41:08,480 --> 00:41:11,089
S2: the very recent and very wise words of Jay-Z, who

889
00:41:11,090 --> 00:41:14,600
S2: said these organizations at least have to get it close to. Right.

890
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:17,660
S1: Yeah, yeah. And I think it's good to have that history.

891
00:41:17,660 --> 00:41:19,730
S1: And I think that's why Michael Shulman's book is so interesting,

892
00:41:19,730 --> 00:41:22,310
S1: because for people who have just like, jumped on the

893
00:41:22,310 --> 00:41:24,710
S1: Oscars train and are really excited about what it says,

894
00:41:24,710 --> 00:41:27,770
S1: they always do weird things like, do not look to

895
00:41:27,770 --> 00:41:31,790
S1: them to be an objective, you know, decider of what

896
00:41:31,790 --> 00:41:34,250
S1: the best film or the best performance are, that they're

897
00:41:34,250 --> 00:41:36,920
S1: a political organization in the sense that. And you're right, Mel,

898
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:39,020
S1: we're about to get into how they're deciding things. But

899
00:41:39,020 --> 00:41:41,839
S1: everyone in the academy, the near 10,000 members, have their

900
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,570
S1: own personal views and biases. A lot of them don't

901
00:41:44,570 --> 00:41:47,090
S1: watch every movie. And yes, there are campaigns and narratives

902
00:41:47,090 --> 00:41:50,029
S1: that push people in certain directions, but they're very fallible.

903
00:41:50,030 --> 00:41:53,060
S1: They'll be the first to admit that they've made outrageous.

904
00:41:53,060 --> 00:41:56,630
S1: Troy Green Book won an Oscar, Driving Miss Daisy beat

905
00:41:56,630 --> 00:41:58,940
S1: Do the Right Thing, and it's almost because they get

906
00:41:58,940 --> 00:42:00,980
S1: things wrong a lot that I think it's so interesting

907
00:42:01,010 --> 00:42:03,020
S1: to talk about, because it'd be kind of boring if

908
00:42:03,020 --> 00:42:04,250
S1: they just nailed it all the time.

909
00:42:04,250 --> 00:42:07,250
S3: I do think, too, that, like, really good stuff is

910
00:42:07,250 --> 00:42:10,040
S3: often not appreciated in its time, which speaks to some

911
00:42:10,040 --> 00:42:13,190
S3: of what we're saying about people being recognized well after

912
00:42:13,190 --> 00:42:16,610
S3: the moment of their art. Like great art, doesn't necessarily

913
00:42:16,610 --> 00:42:19,940
S3: shine in the moment. What's the kind of the marry

914
00:42:19,940 --> 00:42:22,370
S3: the age widow in the next, which I always talk about, like,

915
00:42:22,370 --> 00:42:26,600
S3: you know, if you're so on point as an artist,

916
00:42:26,600 --> 00:42:29,810
S3: I don't know, sometimes you don't necessarily last the test

917
00:42:29,810 --> 00:42:32,720
S3: of time. And I guess some of these historical revisions

918
00:42:32,719 --> 00:42:35,960
S3: are people being recognized later on for the influence and

919
00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:38,870
S3: significance they had then, but it wasn't appreciated.

920
00:42:39,580 --> 00:42:41,230
S1: Yeah, I think that's a really good point. All right,

921
00:42:41,230 --> 00:42:44,770
S1: let's let's, um, let's break down how these awards are

922
00:42:44,770 --> 00:42:47,740
S1: actually decided. What do you guys know about how the

923
00:42:47,739 --> 00:42:51,910
S1: Academy decides who is nominated and who wins?

924
00:42:52,690 --> 00:42:54,340
S2: They don't just ask Warren Beatty.

925
00:42:56,110 --> 00:43:01,060
S3: And I know the very respectable PricewaterhouseCoopers is doing the auditing.

926
00:43:01,060 --> 00:43:02,950
S5: So that's are not always to be found.

927
00:43:03,100 --> 00:43:05,170
S2: I don't have I don't know if I know I

928
00:43:05,170 --> 00:43:07,570
S2: don't like I'm sure when you inevitably tell me in

929
00:43:07,570 --> 00:43:09,220
S2: about two minutes I'll be like, oh yeah, I did

930
00:43:09,219 --> 00:43:10,990
S2: know that, but I don't think I know exactly how

931
00:43:10,989 --> 00:43:11,290
S2: it works.

932
00:43:11,770 --> 00:43:14,140
S3: I do know, but it's very complicated. So I'm going

933
00:43:14,140 --> 00:43:16,600
S3: to hand over to Osmond. He's read this book called

934
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:17,380
S3: Oscar Wars.

935
00:43:17,500 --> 00:43:17,980
S5: I might.

936
00:43:17,980 --> 00:43:19,360
S3: Be able to, uh, he might be able to.

937
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:20,230
S5: Shine. Let me tell you.

938
00:43:20,230 --> 00:43:21,970
S1: I've gone super deep. And even if you go in

939
00:43:21,969 --> 00:43:24,879
S1: the Academy's website when they explain voting and stuff, it's

940
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:29,050
S1: very superficial. And me being like a kind of, I guess,

941
00:43:29,050 --> 00:43:32,290
S1: election numbers nerd as well, was really fascinated in the

942
00:43:32,290 --> 00:43:34,359
S1: specific mechanics of all of this. So. So I've gone

943
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:37,660
S1: pretty deep and it turns out it is super fascinating. Uh,

944
00:43:37,660 --> 00:43:39,550
S1: believe it or not. But I think the first thing

945
00:43:39,550 --> 00:43:41,049
S1: we should say and this this is to your point,

946
00:43:41,110 --> 00:43:43,960
S1: all these awards are like are not judged. They are

947
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:46,030
S1: voted on. And by that I mean no one gets

948
00:43:46,030 --> 00:43:48,279
S1: together and says, okay, so we've all watched these movies.

949
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:49,600
S1: Now let's sit down in a room for a couple

950
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:52,810
S1: of hours and debate what deserves a nomination. And and

951
00:43:52,810 --> 00:43:55,540
S1: a win like this is an anonymous ballot. Obviously, people

952
00:43:55,540 --> 00:43:57,670
S1: talk to each other about what they think is good,

953
00:43:57,670 --> 00:44:00,730
S1: and we'll get into campaigning later on. But the nominations

954
00:44:00,730 --> 00:44:03,160
S1: and the winners are the result of like thousands of

955
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:05,950
S1: discreet votes. It's more like an election than like a

956
00:44:05,950 --> 00:44:09,520
S1: literary awards judging panel where you just debate and decide

957
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:12,609
S1: these things. And so who, who, who votes? The Academy

958
00:44:12,610 --> 00:44:16,060
S1: is made up of just under 10,000 people from all

959
00:44:16,060 --> 00:44:19,210
S1: around the world. It's actually a 60% increase from around

960
00:44:19,210 --> 00:44:22,180
S1: a decade ago. And that big increase happened because the

961
00:44:22,180 --> 00:44:25,270
S1: academy was trying to diversify its membership in terms of gender,

962
00:44:25,270 --> 00:44:29,200
S1: race and nationality. Each of those members is divided into

963
00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:32,739
S1: different branches. It's like actors and the acting branch directors

964
00:44:32,739 --> 00:44:36,070
S1: are in the directing branch, etc. and when you get

965
00:44:36,070 --> 00:44:39,250
S1: to voting, this is where it gets really interesting. There

966
00:44:39,250 --> 00:44:41,770
S1: are two rounds of voting. First is deciding who the

967
00:44:41,770 --> 00:44:45,880
S1: nominees are. Each branch gets to vote on the eligible

968
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:48,969
S1: movies to decide who's nominated, and every category has got

969
00:44:48,969 --> 00:44:51,850
S1: five nominees except for Best Picture, which is ten, and

970
00:44:51,850 --> 00:44:54,130
S1: everyone gets to vote on that. So basically, if you're

971
00:44:54,130 --> 00:44:56,710
S1: a director, you get to decide who the nominees for

972
00:44:56,710 --> 00:45:00,460
S1: Best Director are. If you're a writer, you decide on

973
00:45:00,460 --> 00:45:05,260
S1: Best screenplay. The method used this is where, like Nerdy

974
00:45:05,260 --> 00:45:09,730
S1: Brain is. And if you're an Australian political science fan,

975
00:45:09,730 --> 00:45:11,440
S1: you're definitely going to want to turn the volume up

976
00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:14,620
S1: on this one. The method used to vote and decide

977
00:45:14,620 --> 00:45:19,660
S1: on the nominees is a system called proportional preferential voting.

978
00:45:19,750 --> 00:45:21,850
S1: Where have you heard that before, Thomas?

979
00:45:22,690 --> 00:45:27,880
S2: Succession? No. Like when we vote in the federal election.

980
00:45:28,060 --> 00:45:31,330
S1: Yes. That is the system used to elect the Senate

981
00:45:31,330 --> 00:45:32,290
S1: in Australia.

982
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:34,840
S3: You're going to Canberra. You always wanted to go. You're going.

983
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:36,100
S2: It was always my next posting.

984
00:45:36,100 --> 00:45:39,160
S1: Every federal election, we elect six senators from every state

985
00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:43,150
S1: using proportional preferential voting. And that is the same system

986
00:45:43,150 --> 00:45:46,600
S1: the Academy uses to decide the nominees. How cool is that?

987
00:45:47,310 --> 00:45:48,420
S2: Pretty cool.

988
00:45:49,110 --> 00:45:50,910
S5: I think it's really cool. I think it's really cool

989
00:45:50,940 --> 00:45:52,620
S5: because Australia is it's.

990
00:45:52,620 --> 00:45:55,650
S1: Really Senate electoral system is like kind of. It's pretty

991
00:45:55,650 --> 00:45:59,549
S1: rare in the Anglosphere and America doesn't use it famously

992
00:45:59,550 --> 00:46:01,740
S1: for its federal elections. And I think it's kind of

993
00:46:01,739 --> 00:46:04,200
S1: wacky that the Oscars are like, cool, let's use the

994
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:06,960
S1: insane Senate system to decide our nominees. So that's a

995
00:46:06,960 --> 00:46:07,530
S1: fun one.

996
00:46:07,530 --> 00:46:08,250
S2: That is a fun one.

997
00:46:09,540 --> 00:46:12,509
S1: Thank you for encouraging me on this. Um, okay. So

998
00:46:12,510 --> 00:46:14,730
S1: then when you have your nominees, it's time for the

999
00:46:14,730 --> 00:46:16,799
S1: second round of voting. And I think a lot of

1000
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:18,930
S1: people don't know that the second round where you decide

1001
00:46:18,930 --> 00:46:21,540
S1: who actually wins takes place in late February, and it

1002
00:46:21,540 --> 00:46:24,000
S1: only goes for like about a week. People lodged their

1003
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:27,239
S1: ballots online. And this time everyone is allowed to vote

1004
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,520
S1: in every category. So doesn't matter if you're an actor,

1005
00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:31,830
S1: director and editor or writer, you can vote on every

1006
00:46:31,830 --> 00:46:35,520
S1: single award. The voting system this time is much more straightforward.

1007
00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:38,370
S1: It's just first past the post, which is the system

1008
00:46:38,370 --> 00:46:40,950
S1: they use in the US presidential election. Whoever gets the

1009
00:46:40,950 --> 00:46:44,370
S1: most votes wins, even if they don't get over 50%.

1010
00:46:44,489 --> 00:46:48,420
S1: You're following me on that one? Yep, yep. The exception, however,

1011
00:46:48,420 --> 00:46:51,870
S1: is Best Picture, where they use preferential voting so you

1012
00:46:51,870 --> 00:46:54,509
S1: can number your ballots from 1 to 10, which is

1013
00:46:54,510 --> 00:46:58,529
S1: just like the system we use for the House of Representatives.

1014
00:46:58,530 --> 00:47:02,840
S1: So basically the Oscar system. Is pretty akin to the

1015
00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:04,969
S1: system we use to elect Australian Parliament.

1016
00:47:04,969 --> 00:47:08,420
S3: And what do you take? What is.

1017
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:10,399
S5: So meaningful.

1018
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:11,150
S3: To you?

1019
00:47:11,660 --> 00:47:13,760
S1: What isn't it cool like? I mean, maybe it's not cool.

1020
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:15,920
S1: Maybe I'm the only person the Venn diagram of the

1021
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:19,040
S1: Oscars and the Australian political system. But I just found

1022
00:47:19,040 --> 00:47:21,110
S1: that out, like in the last few weeks, that specifics

1023
00:47:21,110 --> 00:47:23,180
S1: of how the voting works and the fact that it

1024
00:47:23,180 --> 00:47:25,730
S1: mirrors something that we are so familiar with, but most

1025
00:47:25,730 --> 00:47:28,730
S1: Americans have no idea about is really interesting. And when

1026
00:47:28,730 --> 00:47:32,150
S1: you when you hear Academy like employees talk about this,

1027
00:47:32,150 --> 00:47:34,430
S1: they're like, most voters have no idea how any of

1028
00:47:34,430 --> 00:47:37,069
S1: this works that's so unfamiliar, even though they can put

1029
00:47:37,070 --> 00:47:40,310
S1: preferences down. They don't, because I just don't understand how

1030
00:47:40,310 --> 00:47:43,250
S1: preferences work. But why? Why, I guess it's relevant is

1031
00:47:43,430 --> 00:47:45,680
S1: up until a few years ago, the Academy only had

1032
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:49,280
S1: five Best Picture nominees, and when they expanded it to ten,

1033
00:47:49,310 --> 00:47:52,700
S1: they realized they had to include preferences because you could

1034
00:47:52,700 --> 00:47:55,400
S1: end up with a situation where one film gets 12%

1035
00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:58,820
S1: of the vote and becomes Best picture, even though 88%

1036
00:47:58,820 --> 00:48:00,860
S1: of people didn't think it was the best one. So

1037
00:48:00,860 --> 00:48:03,800
S1: they had to change the mechanism to make sure that

1038
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:09,560
S1: the actual best picture is reflective of what most people

1039
00:48:09,560 --> 00:48:11,150
S1: think is the best picture, if that makes sense.

1040
00:48:11,150 --> 00:48:11,989
S3: Yeah. That does.

1041
00:48:11,989 --> 00:48:13,820
S2: That actually is surprisingly interesting.

1042
00:48:14,270 --> 00:48:16,040
S1: I'm so glad you said so. I was worried I

1043
00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:19,190
S1: was losing you guys, but I think understanding these things

1044
00:48:19,190 --> 00:48:22,550
S1: helps you understand why sometimes you get divergences right between

1045
00:48:22,550 --> 00:48:25,250
S1: best picture and actors and actresses, and also makes me

1046
00:48:25,250 --> 00:48:28,190
S1: really fascinated to look at what I would love them

1047
00:48:28,190 --> 00:48:30,799
S1: if they somehow someday decided to release the raw votes

1048
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:33,140
S1: for these movies. Like how many votes did a certain

1049
00:48:33,140 --> 00:48:36,650
S1: movie a certain actress get to get the award? It's

1050
00:48:36,650 --> 00:48:37,700
S1: super interesting.

1051
00:48:37,969 --> 00:48:41,149
S2: The podcast is just increasingly becoming like Osborne's fringe interest

1052
00:48:41,150 --> 00:48:41,719
S2: each week.

1053
00:48:44,270 --> 00:48:45,980
S5: I feel like we, both you and the awards.

1054
00:48:45,980 --> 00:48:47,240
S1: Are not a fringe interest, my.

1055
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:48,560
S2: Friend. No, no no no.

1056
00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:50,690
S1: But frankly, that's what it's always been. So yeah.

1057
00:48:51,110 --> 00:48:51,529
S5: Yeah, yeah.

1058
00:48:51,530 --> 00:48:53,810
S3: Because you didn't do history and I'm at uni. Right.

1059
00:48:53,810 --> 00:48:54,770
S3: So now we're kind.

1060
00:48:54,770 --> 00:48:55,280
S5: Of yeah.

1061
00:48:55,700 --> 00:48:56,570
S3: We're up to date.

1062
00:48:56,780 --> 00:48:58,640
S1: Okay. So that's like the system. That's how it works.

1063
00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:02,930
S1: But in reality the actual process or I guess the campaigning,

1064
00:49:02,930 --> 00:49:05,330
S1: the way that this plays out behind the scenes and

1065
00:49:05,330 --> 00:49:07,580
S1: in front of the screens is way more interesting than

1066
00:49:07,580 --> 00:49:11,150
S1: just like how votes are tabulated by PricewaterhouseCoopers. I want

1067
00:49:11,150 --> 00:49:15,080
S1: to ask you guys about campaigning. Like we see this happen.

1068
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:17,480
S1: We are kind of sometimes part of it, right? Where

1069
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:20,300
S1: you get a PR person saying, hey, can you do

1070
00:49:20,300 --> 00:49:23,930
S1: an interview with this actor or actress or director? They

1071
00:49:23,930 --> 00:49:26,299
S1: want that person part of the narrative. They want that

1072
00:49:26,300 --> 00:49:29,450
S1: person talking about all the specific things they did to

1073
00:49:29,450 --> 00:49:33,110
S1: make this movie so good. Because Oscar voters and there

1074
00:49:33,110 --> 00:49:36,140
S1: are lots of Australian Oscar voters in the Academy might

1075
00:49:36,140 --> 00:49:38,960
S1: be swayed by that and might vote for that person.

1076
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:43,069
S1: How do you guys feel about campaigning more generally? And also,

1077
00:49:43,070 --> 00:49:46,670
S1: any interesting highlights from the campaign for this year's Oscars

1078
00:49:46,670 --> 00:49:47,750
S1: that are stood out to you?

1079
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:50,690
S3: Yeah, I do think it's a little less for the

1080
00:49:50,690 --> 00:49:53,029
S3: Oscars than it has been previously for the Golden Globes,

1081
00:49:53,030 --> 00:49:54,410
S3: because for the Golden Globes, you have to be a

1082
00:49:54,410 --> 00:49:57,770
S3: member of the Hollywood Foreign Press Association. And then they

1083
00:49:57,770 --> 00:50:02,660
S3: really do sometimes only give access to actors, to people

1084
00:50:02,660 --> 00:50:05,989
S3: who are part of that association, um, knowing that they

1085
00:50:05,989 --> 00:50:08,509
S3: will be voting. So the Oscars is slightly different just

1086
00:50:08,510 --> 00:50:11,180
S3: because of the sheer number of people who can vote.

1087
00:50:11,180 --> 00:50:13,819
S3: But I mean, yeah, you do see the momentum and

1088
00:50:13,820 --> 00:50:18,170
S3: the push that develops behind these films, and none of

1089
00:50:18,170 --> 00:50:20,960
S3: it just kind of rarely does it grow authentically, as

1090
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:23,870
S3: we were obviously talking about earlier in the pod. So

1091
00:50:23,870 --> 00:50:26,900
S3: like I would say, like in some ways Saltburn isn't

1092
00:50:26,900 --> 00:50:29,720
S3: on the list for, um, nominated for best films, but

1093
00:50:29,719 --> 00:50:32,210
S3: I reckon that was kind of quite a momentous push

1094
00:50:32,210 --> 00:50:33,980
S3: to try to get that to be part of the

1095
00:50:33,980 --> 00:50:37,160
S3: Oscar conversation, the way that that films kind of suddenly

1096
00:50:37,160 --> 00:50:39,620
S3: took off at the box office speaks to like, a

1097
00:50:39,620 --> 00:50:42,410
S3: marketing campaign that was rolled out and kind of capitalised

1098
00:50:42,410 --> 00:50:44,000
S3: on what was going on in the conversation to push

1099
00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:46,880
S3: it back to the forefront. So I do feel I

1100
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:48,739
S3: do think you see some of those smaller films and

1101
00:50:48,739 --> 00:50:52,340
S3: then in the bigger films like, you know, with Scorsese,

1102
00:50:52,370 --> 00:50:56,750
S3: Christopher Nolan, Yorgos Lanthimos, you know, the huge stars are

1103
00:50:56,750 --> 00:50:59,930
S3: everywhere in the lead up to the releases of these films. Um,

1104
00:50:59,930 --> 00:51:02,089
S3: the releases are kind of tied to the start of

1105
00:51:02,090 --> 00:51:04,460
S3: the Oscar voting. Often, though, in Australia we get them

1106
00:51:04,460 --> 00:51:06,920
S3: at a different time. Um, so yeah, I mean, I

1107
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:09,650
S3: think you can see that the campaigns do push certain

1108
00:51:09,650 --> 00:51:11,930
S3: films to the forefront of public discussion, and then they're

1109
00:51:11,930 --> 00:51:14,600
S3: often the films that are then reflected in the Oscars.

1110
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,450
S2: Yeah, I think it's funny. Like I remember last year, um,

1111
00:51:17,450 --> 00:51:20,030
S2: our colleague Meg, who is currently on maternity leave, but

1112
00:51:20,030 --> 00:51:22,069
S2: like just a week before the Oscars, they just, like,

1113
00:51:22,070 --> 00:51:24,110
S2: made Austin Butler available to her. Do you remember that

1114
00:51:24,110 --> 00:51:25,759
S2: she did a really long sit down with Austin Butler

1115
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:27,560
S2: like he was? He was in the middle of a

1116
00:51:27,560 --> 00:51:31,009
S2: very intense campaign, uh, to win Best actor for Elvis.

1117
00:51:31,010 --> 00:51:33,230
S2: He was probably the best shot that film had at

1118
00:51:33,230 --> 00:51:36,290
S2: a big award. And yeah, like I remember even saying

1119
00:51:36,290 --> 00:51:38,450
S2: to yours, like, it's so weird that Austin Butler is just, like,

1120
00:51:38,450 --> 00:51:40,640
S2: got like 45 minutes the week before the Oscars because

1121
00:51:40,760 --> 00:51:43,520
S2: they were just, like, really putting him out there to like,

1122
00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:46,190
S2: push hard. And, you know, he kind of was it

1123
00:51:46,190 --> 00:51:47,299
S2: was a great interview. You should go back and check

1124
00:51:47,300 --> 00:51:50,270
S2: it out. But yeah, it is interesting that, you know,

1125
00:51:50,270 --> 00:51:52,010
S2: even though we kind of look at these awards and

1126
00:51:52,010 --> 00:51:54,380
S2: think everything's maybe like preordained or it all feels so

1127
00:51:54,380 --> 00:51:56,930
S2: far away, like it is still such a big campaigning

1128
00:51:56,930 --> 00:52:00,380
S2: thing and you've ever spent time in especially like in the.

1129
00:52:00,830 --> 00:52:03,469
S2: Around any kind of, like, awards season. Like, we don't

1130
00:52:03,469 --> 00:52:05,150
S2: get it as much over here because we're not like,

1131
00:52:05,150 --> 00:52:09,380
S2: obviously in the ecosystem, but like over there, it's like

1132
00:52:09,380 --> 00:52:11,660
S2: the full billboards, like for your consideration. And, you know,

1133
00:52:11,660 --> 00:52:14,420
S2: on TV the ads are like relentless, like it's the,

1134
00:52:14,420 --> 00:52:17,359
S2: the constant pushing down your throat of the message of

1135
00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:20,810
S2: like vote and like it's just like pushing the awareness.

1136
00:52:20,810 --> 00:52:22,250
S2: And we don't really get it here as much. It's

1137
00:52:22,250 --> 00:52:23,690
S2: a very strange thing to say.

1138
00:52:24,110 --> 00:52:27,200
S1: Yeah. And, and all these studios have got big budgets

1139
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,110
S1: for not just marketing movies, but for the Oscars specifically.

1140
00:52:30,110 --> 00:52:32,899
S1: Like for those ads, they also more often in the

1141
00:52:32,900 --> 00:52:35,330
S1: States than elsewhere, but also elsewhere, particularly as the Academy

1142
00:52:35,330 --> 00:52:38,060
S1: has become more internationalized. We'll host events and they'll get

1143
00:52:38,060 --> 00:52:41,000
S1: the actors and the directors there, and they'll it's like

1144
00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:43,940
S1: a political campaign. There are rules around campaign finance, like

1145
00:52:43,940 --> 00:52:46,070
S1: what you can and can't spend money on, and people

1146
00:52:46,070 --> 00:52:49,430
S1: will shake hands. There was, uh, someone telling a story

1147
00:52:49,430 --> 00:52:50,989
S1: on a podcast I was listening to where they're like,

1148
00:52:50,989 --> 00:52:53,930
S1: I'm voting for. I think it was Robert De Niro. No,

1149
00:52:53,930 --> 00:52:56,210
S1: it was Robert Downey Jr, because he just came up

1150
00:52:56,210 --> 00:52:57,980
S1: to me and said, hey, I'm Robert Downey Jr. How's

1151
00:52:57,980 --> 00:53:00,080
S1: your day going? He's like, great, I'm voting for him.

1152
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:02,720
S1: So I think this goes to the point of like,

1153
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:06,020
S1: it is just like 10,000 weird film nerds or people

1154
00:53:06,020 --> 00:53:08,540
S1: that used to make films, in some cases, voting on

1155
00:53:08,540 --> 00:53:10,730
S1: these things based on sometimes what they think is good,

1156
00:53:10,730 --> 00:53:13,940
S1: sometimes like an interview that they read that really compelled them,

1157
00:53:13,940 --> 00:53:16,759
S1: and sometimes who was nice to them, like a la,

1158
00:53:16,790 --> 00:53:20,150
S1: you know, luncheon event. That is a really interesting campaign

1159
00:53:20,150 --> 00:53:23,690
S1: move by, I think, neon, who distributed anatomy of a fall.

1160
00:53:23,690 --> 00:53:25,310
S1: And I don't want to give too much away, but

1161
00:53:25,310 --> 00:53:29,060
S1: the dog in that movie plays a few crucial roles. Uh,

1162
00:53:29,060 --> 00:53:31,910
S1: the dog's real name is messy. They brought that dog

1163
00:53:31,910 --> 00:53:34,760
S1: to the Oscars luncheon, and so every actor wanted to

1164
00:53:34,760 --> 00:53:37,100
S1: take a selfie with it. All the media, like, took

1165
00:53:37,100 --> 00:53:39,200
S1: photos of it. And so all of a sudden, for

1166
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:41,930
S1: a week in the key voting period, everyone is talking

1167
00:53:41,930 --> 00:53:44,420
S1: about anatomy of a fall, like those kinds of tricks

1168
00:53:44,420 --> 00:53:46,969
S1: are used just to get your film in front of people.

1169
00:53:46,969 --> 00:53:49,069
S3: And it would be interesting to see actually, how many

1170
00:53:49,070 --> 00:53:53,450
S3: voting Australians we have in in the Oscars, because it

1171
00:53:53,450 --> 00:53:56,990
S3: could speak to how much access we get to these people,

1172
00:53:56,989 --> 00:53:59,779
S3: and also to the release dates of films here. Because

1173
00:53:59,780 --> 00:54:02,450
S3: if they're looking at Australia as a smaller or larger

1174
00:54:02,450 --> 00:54:05,390
S3: voting bloc, I think it would kind of determine how

1175
00:54:05,390 --> 00:54:07,400
S3: films are rolled out here. I don't I don't think

1176
00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:09,350
S3: we do have those numbers, but it would be fascinating.

1177
00:54:09,350 --> 00:54:11,300
S1: I would love to have the more data on this stuff,

1178
00:54:11,300 --> 00:54:13,340
S1: the better. And I, you know, maybe I will start

1179
00:54:13,340 --> 00:54:16,580
S1: a consultancy on the slide just helping rally votes for

1180
00:54:16,580 --> 00:54:19,969
S1: different movies. Um, the other part to this, I guess

1181
00:54:19,969 --> 00:54:23,509
S1: story is, is what we call the precursor awards. And Thomas,

1182
00:54:23,510 --> 00:54:25,430
S1: you were you were talking about these before. Like you

1183
00:54:25,430 --> 00:54:28,730
S1: can sort of basically start to predict what happens at

1184
00:54:28,730 --> 00:54:31,339
S1: the Oscars by looking at things like the Golden Globes,

1185
00:54:31,340 --> 00:54:33,800
S1: the Critics Choice, the Directors Guild, the SAG Awards. You

1186
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:34,850
S1: want to talk a bit about that?

1187
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:38,450
S2: Yeah. Like the there's. It's funny, certain awards seem to

1188
00:54:38,450 --> 00:54:41,330
S2: carry more weight. Um, but like awards season generally you

1189
00:54:41,330 --> 00:54:43,700
S2: start to get an idea of like which films are

1190
00:54:43,700 --> 00:54:45,410
S2: the ones that seem to be leading the way and

1191
00:54:45,500 --> 00:54:48,049
S2: specifically in like, you know, like best actor and actress

1192
00:54:48,050 --> 00:54:50,630
S2: and supporting actor and actress. You really get a sense

1193
00:54:50,630 --> 00:54:53,299
S2: of like, who the voters are going with. Or if

1194
00:54:53,300 --> 00:54:55,819
S2: it's a two horse race, we can start to see like, okay.

1195
00:54:55,820 --> 00:54:59,090
S2: But like critically, you know, the Critics Choice are going with, uh,

1196
00:54:59,090 --> 00:55:02,210
S2: you know, let's say Cillian Murphy and Oppenheimer, whereas SAG

1197
00:55:02,210 --> 00:55:04,790
S2: has gone with Paul Giamatti and The Holdovers. And and

1198
00:55:04,790 --> 00:55:07,009
S2: it's really funny because we talked about it last week

1199
00:55:07,010 --> 00:55:09,980
S2: in a story SAG especially, which is one of the

1200
00:55:09,980 --> 00:55:12,950
S2: last awards of the season. Very like the overlap with

1201
00:55:12,950 --> 00:55:15,620
S2: the Oscars winners is like almost like for like, um,

1202
00:55:15,620 --> 00:55:17,720
S2: so that's often a big one. But yeah, we have

1203
00:55:17,719 --> 00:55:20,810
S2: this full awards season now that by the end of it, um,

1204
00:55:20,810 --> 00:55:22,609
S2: you know, the Oscars is kind of the cherry on top,

1205
00:55:22,610 --> 00:55:25,460
S2: but it almost robs us of, of, of the mystery

1206
00:55:25,460 --> 00:55:27,860
S2: because it's like, well, really it's going to come down

1207
00:55:27,860 --> 00:55:31,100
S2: to like, you know, 1 or 2 films and there's

1208
00:55:31,100 --> 00:55:33,049
S2: going to be 1 or 2 categories where we maybe

1209
00:55:33,050 --> 00:55:36,110
S2: don't know, but we're pretty sure, like, you know, it's

1210
00:55:36,110 --> 00:55:39,530
S2: created this system whereby the mystery is gone a little bit. But, uh, yeah,

1211
00:55:39,650 --> 00:55:43,460
S2: basically come March, um, the whole industry has an idea

1212
00:55:43,460 --> 00:55:44,690
S2: of like, you know, if you're just turning up as

1213
00:55:44,690 --> 00:55:46,279
S2: a nominee and you know, you're not like, there's not

1214
00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:47,210
S2: a chance you're winning.

1215
00:55:47,510 --> 00:55:49,280
S3: Yeah. And if you look at like the kind of

1216
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:52,220
S3: the what the, the odds that the betting companies are

1217
00:55:52,219 --> 00:55:55,940
S3: putting on it like everyone. Well, the, the gamblers are

1218
00:55:55,940 --> 00:55:58,670
S3: pretty sure that they know who is winning every single

1219
00:55:58,670 --> 00:56:01,070
S3: category at this point when it comes to the Oscars.

1220
00:56:01,070 --> 00:56:04,760
S2: Yeah, the bookies odds for this year's like pretty depressing.

1221
00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:05,779
S2: If you go and look at it like it doesn't

1222
00:56:05,780 --> 00:56:07,880
S2: it doesn't doesn't like make you want to watch the

1223
00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:09,500
S2: Oscars a bunch because it's like, well, they know who's

1224
00:56:09,500 --> 00:56:10,040
S2: going to win.

1225
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:13,040
S1: Well, I think that very neatly brings us to this

1226
00:56:13,040 --> 00:56:18,350
S1: year's awards. Let's start by listing the ten nominees for

1227
00:56:18,350 --> 00:56:22,520
S1: Best Picture. Uh, they are, in no particular order, American fiction.

1228
00:56:22,520 --> 00:56:24,320
S1: And actually, I lied. They are in alphabetical order. I

1229
00:56:24,320 --> 00:56:24,589
S1: was about.

1230
00:56:24,590 --> 00:56:26,180
S5: To say that's quite clearly alphabetical.

1231
00:56:29,030 --> 00:56:33,260
S1: Uh, American fiction. Anatomy of a fall. Barbie. The holdovers.

1232
00:56:33,260 --> 00:56:37,790
S1: Killers of the Flower Moon. Maestro. Up and Huma, Past Lives,

1233
00:56:37,790 --> 00:56:41,210
S1: Poor Things, and The Zone of Interest. And how do

1234
00:56:41,210 --> 00:56:42,770
S1: we feel about that list? It's so interesting, because I

1235
00:56:42,770 --> 00:56:44,750
S1: feel like there are a couple of movies where at

1236
00:56:44,750 --> 00:56:46,879
S1: certain moments, I was like, that's probably going to win.

1237
00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:48,500
S1: Like when killers of the Flower Moon came out, it

1238
00:56:48,500 --> 00:56:51,170
S1: felt like cool, this big epic Scorsese thing that he

1239
00:56:51,170 --> 00:56:55,460
S1: really pulled off. But then Oppenheimer drops, you know, the

1240
00:56:55,460 --> 00:56:58,160
S1: zone of interest drops. Things start to shift a little bit.

1241
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:00,440
S1: What are your thoughts on on the list of nominees,

1242
00:57:00,440 --> 00:57:02,660
S1: and do you think anything's missing from it?

1243
00:57:02,780 --> 00:57:05,149
S3: I'm pretty happy with that list. I think that does

1244
00:57:05,150 --> 00:57:07,100
S3: hit the big ones. There are two that, and I

1245
00:57:07,100 --> 00:57:09,770
S3: don't necessarily believe that they should be on that list,

1246
00:57:09,770 --> 00:57:12,739
S3: but it is interesting that they haven't got a look

1247
00:57:12,739 --> 00:57:13,550
S3: in and one.

1248
00:57:13,550 --> 00:57:16,340
S5: Bit you think, yeah.

1249
00:57:16,820 --> 00:57:19,670
S3: Best actress for sure. Um, Napoleon.

1250
00:57:19,970 --> 00:57:24,710
S5: Huge. You're obsessed. Are you talking in. Oh, that's so rogue.

1251
00:57:24,710 --> 00:57:24,920
S1: Mel.

1252
00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:25,520
S5: That's not great.

1253
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:27,110
S3: No it's not. No, no, I don't think it's a

1254
00:57:27,110 --> 00:57:29,660
S3: great film. But I do think like, it's complete lack

1255
00:57:29,660 --> 00:57:32,930
S3: of kind of relevance. You know, there was a huge

1256
00:57:32,930 --> 00:57:35,240
S3: buildup to that film and it's such a big name,

1257
00:57:35,240 --> 00:57:36,530
S3: a big filmmaker. Are you going to like.

1258
00:57:36,530 --> 00:57:37,310
S5: Producing it.

1259
00:57:37,310 --> 00:57:38,150
S2: On Napoleon and.

1260
00:57:38,270 --> 00:57:39,770
S5: Like, getting money in the back end? Yeah, yeah.

1261
00:57:39,770 --> 00:57:42,890
S3: I train the horse. Um, and the other one that

1262
00:57:42,890 --> 00:57:46,220
S3: maybe I could see being on best Film. Priscilla I

1263
00:57:46,220 --> 00:57:50,510
S3: liked that film. Um, Sofia Coppola's Priscilla. Um, I could

1264
00:57:50,510 --> 00:57:52,820
S3: see it sitting on there, like, as comfortably as some

1265
00:57:52,820 --> 00:57:54,620
S3: of the others on that list. So I thought they

1266
00:57:54,620 --> 00:57:57,740
S3: were too kind of notable absences. Um, not that I

1267
00:57:57,740 --> 00:58:00,560
S3: think they deserve to win. Um, but yeah, I could

1268
00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:01,940
S3: have seen them on that list.

1269
00:58:02,240 --> 00:58:03,230
S1: What about you, Thomas?

1270
00:58:03,470 --> 00:58:05,210
S2: Uh, yeah. I've been banging this drum for a while.

1271
00:58:05,210 --> 00:58:06,500
S2: You guys are going to both laugh at me. I

1272
00:58:06,500 --> 00:58:08,570
S2: reckon fair play. Should have got a nomination for Best Picture.

1273
00:58:08,600 --> 00:58:09,500
S5: I'm obsessed with that film.

1274
00:58:09,500 --> 00:58:10,670
S3: You're always talking about it.

1275
00:58:10,670 --> 00:58:13,190
S2: Well, I actually am, but it was. It was a

1276
00:58:13,190 --> 00:58:17,210
S2: good film, and it suffered from, like, being a Netflix release. Um,

1277
00:58:17,450 --> 00:58:20,750
S2: and I think it could have easily slotted in there. Um,

1278
00:58:20,750 --> 00:58:24,020
S2: Chloe directed and I thought the two leads were great,

1279
00:58:24,020 --> 00:58:26,180
S2: and I just thought it was a really interesting, like,

1280
00:58:26,180 --> 00:58:29,240
S2: film for our time. And it kind of just like,

1281
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:31,970
S2: didn't get the credit it deserves. Uh, but yeah, that

1282
00:58:31,970 --> 00:58:33,050
S2: would have been my audition.

1283
00:58:33,470 --> 00:58:37,640
S1: Yeah. Mine one is the Iron Claw. The, um, Zac Efron, uh,

1284
00:58:37,820 --> 00:58:41,630
S1: Jeremy Allen White wrestling movie. Um, I thought that movie

1285
00:58:41,630 --> 00:58:44,840
S1: was astonishing. I think the reason for it not getting

1286
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:47,300
S1: nominated or not really having much of a campaign, it's

1287
00:58:47,300 --> 00:58:50,690
S1: an A24 movie like Past Lives and A24 put all

1288
00:58:50,690 --> 00:58:52,520
S1: their chips on past life. This, this. You see this

1289
00:58:52,520 --> 00:58:55,790
S1: happen with small but also big studios like Netflix and,

1290
00:58:55,790 --> 00:58:57,620
S1: you know, and Apple and whatever they'll be like, this

1291
00:58:57,620 --> 00:59:00,080
S1: is the movie we're going for, and past Lives is great,

1292
00:59:00,080 --> 00:59:02,930
S1: and I'm glad it's nominated and I'm glad it's getting love.

1293
00:59:02,930 --> 00:59:07,100
S1: But the ankle just felt like a really obvious absence

1294
00:59:07,100 --> 00:59:10,190
S1: in the Oscars conversation to me. Yeah.

1295
00:59:10,580 --> 00:59:12,230
S2: Yeah. And I feel like lots of people are saying

1296
00:59:12,230 --> 00:59:14,990
S2: that post Iron Claw being released. I still haven't seen it. Um,

1297
00:59:14,990 --> 00:59:17,960
S2: but yeah, like one of the biggest things I've heard

1298
00:59:17,960 --> 00:59:19,669
S2: people say is that I'm like really shocked it didn't

1299
00:59:19,670 --> 00:59:22,520
S2: get nominated for Best Picture. So yeah, it's curious that

1300
00:59:22,520 --> 00:59:23,690
S2: that's been overlooked.

1301
00:59:24,140 --> 00:59:27,950
S1: I think it's probably time to talk about the, the, uh,

1302
00:59:27,950 --> 00:59:31,700
S1: atomic bomb sized elephant in in the room. And this

1303
00:59:31,700 --> 00:59:34,130
S1: is what you're alluding to, Thomas, with the betting odds

1304
00:59:34,130 --> 00:59:39,420
S1: looking pretty. Pretty grim. Oppenheimer is just like expected, both

1305
00:59:39,420 --> 00:59:42,900
S1: through what the bookies are saying and the precursor awards

1306
00:59:42,900 --> 00:59:46,710
S1: that you were talking about, to sweep basically everything. How

1307
00:59:46,710 --> 00:59:47,670
S1: do we feel about that?

1308
00:59:49,030 --> 00:59:52,480
S2: Ah, I feel like I've got Oppenheimer fatigue a little bit,

1309
00:59:52,480 --> 00:59:56,350
S2: to be honest. It's the the cultural juggernaut that was

1310
00:59:56,350 --> 00:59:59,200
S2: Barb and Heimer, um, was amazing to be a part of,

1311
00:59:59,200 --> 01:00:01,900
S2: and we all really enjoyed it. I mean, Osmond openly

1312
01:00:01,900 --> 01:00:05,590
S2: wept at the end of, um. Osmond wept openly at

1313
01:00:05,590 --> 01:00:07,240
S2: the end of Oppenheimer and then saw it again the

1314
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:07,840
S2: next day.

1315
01:00:07,840 --> 01:00:08,980
S5: It was it was.

1316
01:00:08,980 --> 01:00:10,390
S3: June, the original June.

1317
01:00:10,570 --> 01:00:11,140
S5: Yeah, it's been.

1318
01:00:11,140 --> 01:00:13,450
S1: A big I ended up seeing Oppenheimer at Imax three times,

1319
01:00:13,450 --> 01:00:14,290
S1: I believe in a week.

1320
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:14,800
S5: Yeah.

1321
01:00:15,070 --> 01:00:17,320
S2: But yeah, like it was it was a really cool

1322
01:00:17,320 --> 01:00:19,000
S2: thing to be a part of. And, you know, maybe

1323
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:21,340
S2: just it's just the passing of time. Unfortunately, it's been

1324
01:00:21,340 --> 01:00:24,070
S2: a while and it feels like Oppenheimer hasn't gone away.

1325
01:00:24,070 --> 01:00:27,310
S2: And it's a great movie, but I think I find

1326
01:00:27,310 --> 01:00:30,850
S2: it very like depressing to go into Oscar season and

1327
01:00:30,850 --> 01:00:32,590
S2: knowing that this film is just going to sweep. And

1328
01:00:32,590 --> 01:00:34,720
S2: I do have some major issues with some of the

1329
01:00:34,720 --> 01:00:36,790
S2: categories that it is predicted to sweep in.

1330
01:00:37,120 --> 01:00:40,300
S3: I think Oppenheimer is a stunning film, and I've watched

1331
01:00:40,300 --> 01:00:43,180
S3: it multiple times since, and I think it's incredible work

1332
01:00:43,180 --> 01:00:46,840
S3: by all the actors, um, and, and the filmmaker. And,

1333
01:00:47,230 --> 01:00:49,450
S3: but I do think it is maybe one of the

1334
01:00:49,450 --> 01:00:54,250
S3: safer films on that list. And often safer films do

1335
01:00:54,250 --> 01:00:57,040
S3: win awards because the more polarizing films.

1336
01:00:57,040 --> 01:00:58,810
S1: What do you mean, what do you mean by safe?

1337
01:00:59,080 --> 01:01:01,360
S3: I think it's a more traditional film. I think the

1338
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:05,440
S3: way Christopher Nolan tells stories. I mean, it's a biopic

1339
01:01:05,440 --> 01:01:09,670
S3: of an American figure who is his genius kind of

1340
01:01:09,670 --> 01:01:13,390
S3: is hard to control, who has to reckon with guilt

1341
01:01:13,390 --> 01:01:15,220
S3: and right and wrong like it is kind of. You're

1342
01:01:15,220 --> 01:01:16,000
S3: talking about, maestro.

1343
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:16,360
S2: Yeah.

1344
01:01:17,050 --> 01:01:19,450
S3: I mean, I yeah, that's kind of a similar genre

1345
01:01:19,450 --> 01:01:22,720
S3: of film, right? Obviously Christopher Nolan's film is way better. Um,

1346
01:01:22,720 --> 01:01:25,090
S3: and Cillian Murphy is way better in it. But I

1347
01:01:25,090 --> 01:01:29,620
S3: do think it's a film we recognize, particularly Hollywood recognizes

1348
01:01:29,620 --> 01:01:32,140
S3: it's tried and true and tested. And I'm not saying

1349
01:01:32,140 --> 01:01:34,630
S3: that to take away from how powerful it is, but

1350
01:01:34,630 --> 01:01:38,530
S3: I think the format is kind of one that universally

1351
01:01:38,530 --> 01:01:41,530
S3: people agree on. And when people universally agree on something

1352
01:01:41,530 --> 01:01:43,780
S3: that's kind of going to win, where is more like,

1353
01:01:43,780 --> 01:01:46,450
S3: you know, something like poor things is way more divisive,

1354
01:01:46,450 --> 01:01:48,820
S3: which is probably why we won't see it win. Best film.

1355
01:01:48,820 --> 01:01:49,450
S3: But this is where.

1356
01:01:49,450 --> 01:01:51,850
S2: Again, that catch up cycle comes into play because they're like, oh,

1357
01:01:51,940 --> 01:01:53,740
S2: we did the weird one last year. Like, we gave

1358
01:01:53,740 --> 01:01:55,540
S2: you everything everywhere all at once. Like that was you

1359
01:01:55,540 --> 01:01:57,670
S2: got the crazy A24 one. So this year we'll go

1360
01:01:57,670 --> 01:02:00,070
S2: back to more something more traditional. I agree with you.

1361
01:02:00,070 --> 01:02:03,220
S2: I think that, um, it, you know, Oscar bait is

1362
01:02:03,220 --> 01:02:04,930
S2: a term that gets thrown around a lot lately. But

1363
01:02:04,930 --> 01:02:07,540
S2: fuck me, Oppenheimer is Oscar bait to a T.

1364
01:02:07,540 --> 01:02:10,060
S1: Yeah, I, I see what you're saying. And I think

1365
01:02:10,060 --> 01:02:13,000
S1: in terms of the great man and and all that

1366
01:02:13,000 --> 01:02:15,040
S1: sort of stuff, it is traditional. But I also think

1367
01:02:15,040 --> 01:02:18,070
S1: Nolan and Killian and they did they did so many

1368
01:02:18,070 --> 01:02:20,470
S1: interesting things in that movie that made it a little

1369
01:02:20,470 --> 01:02:23,890
S1: bit more interesting than like other previous biopics out of one.

1370
01:02:23,890 --> 01:02:25,690
S1: But I think you're right. I mean, like, I think

1371
01:02:25,690 --> 01:02:28,270
S1: something like killers of the Flower Moon was told in

1372
01:02:28,270 --> 01:02:31,240
S1: such an interesting way, in such an interesting story that

1373
01:02:31,480 --> 01:02:33,640
S1: I would have loved to say that have more of

1374
01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:37,000
S1: a chance against something like Oppenheimer if Oppenheimer wasn't in

1375
01:02:37,000 --> 01:02:39,910
S1: this race. Do you guys think there's another obvious film

1376
01:02:39,910 --> 01:02:42,490
S1: that would be sweeping the way Oppenheimer is, or do

1377
01:02:42,490 --> 01:02:45,130
S1: you think things would be a little bit more disjointed,

1378
01:02:45,130 --> 01:02:47,230
S1: like Best Picture could go that way. Best Actor could

1379
01:02:47,230 --> 01:02:48,670
S1: go in a different way.

1380
01:02:49,320 --> 01:02:51,360
S2: I think things would be way more fractured if Oppenheimer

1381
01:02:51,360 --> 01:02:53,340
S2: wasn't in. I don't reckon there would be another obvious

1382
01:02:53,340 --> 01:02:56,220
S2: like sweep film, I think. You then say like the

1383
01:02:56,220 --> 01:02:59,190
S2: big five awards go to, like possibly five different films

1384
01:02:59,190 --> 01:03:01,290
S2: or these, you know, fractured.

1385
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:04,950
S3: Yeah, I think I think maybe killers might have had

1386
01:03:04,950 --> 01:03:07,440
S3: more of a shoo in for Best Picture. I do

1387
01:03:07,440 --> 01:03:11,790
S3: think on Oppenheimer two, it's the narrative. Like if Hollywood

1388
01:03:11,790 --> 01:03:15,600
S3: is largely voting for this, an American institution, the story

1389
01:03:15,600 --> 01:03:18,660
S3: of the atomic bomb is something that really speaks deeply

1390
01:03:18,660 --> 01:03:21,690
S3: to the US, say, psyche and kind of their reckoning

1391
01:03:21,690 --> 01:03:25,980
S3: of their history and role in the global kind of community,

1392
01:03:25,980 --> 01:03:27,660
S3: I think. I don't know, I do think it speaks

1393
01:03:27,660 --> 01:03:31,380
S3: to that audience very differently as well to the Australian audience,

1394
01:03:31,380 --> 01:03:33,840
S3: which might be why we're seeing it kind of dominates

1395
01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:34,830
S3: so strongly.

1396
01:03:35,220 --> 01:03:39,090
S1: And also the Academy, the Academy loves movies that are like, oh, wow,

1397
01:03:39,090 --> 01:03:41,580
S1: like we persecuted communists in the 50s. And that was

1398
01:03:41,580 --> 01:03:44,550
S1: pretty bad. And war's pretty bad. Like, the Academy does

1399
01:03:44,550 --> 01:03:50,010
S1: have that small liberal sensitivity that makes Oppenheimer pretty appealing. Film. Mhm. Totally.

1400
01:03:50,130 --> 01:03:52,230
S1: I thought as a way, it's a little bit more

1401
01:03:52,230 --> 01:03:54,480
S1: fun to talk about the other categories, rather than just

1402
01:03:54,480 --> 01:03:57,000
S1: listing who's nominated and debating it. We could play a

1403
01:03:57,000 --> 01:04:01,290
S1: little game. So for Best Picture, Best Director, Best actress,

1404
01:04:01,290 --> 01:04:05,370
S1: Best Actor and the two screenplay categories adapted and original,

1405
01:04:05,370 --> 01:04:09,350
S1: we could share who we think. We want to win

1406
01:04:09,350 --> 01:04:11,690
S1: and who we think will win. I have a bit

1407
01:04:11,690 --> 01:04:13,460
S1: of a chat about those, and then when we do

1408
01:04:13,460 --> 01:04:17,300
S1: our Oscars kind of review show on Monday, we can.

1409
01:04:18,070 --> 01:04:20,440
S1: To hold ourselves accountable and see who actually won. How

1410
01:04:20,440 --> 01:04:21,580
S1: do you guys feel about that?

1411
01:04:21,640 --> 01:04:22,990
S3: I'm keen. Love a game.

1412
01:04:23,410 --> 01:04:26,500
S1: Well, let's start with Best Picture. I'll go first because

1413
01:04:26,500 --> 01:04:28,750
S1: I'm probably the most boring on this one. I do

1414
01:04:28,750 --> 01:04:30,880
S1: like I think I said I like killers of the

1415
01:04:30,880 --> 01:04:33,520
S1: Flower Moon a lot, but I think Oppenheimer is a

1416
01:04:33,520 --> 01:04:36,130
S1: great movie. I think it's like, you know, probably my

1417
01:04:36,130 --> 01:04:38,770
S1: favorite movie of the last year, and I think it

1418
01:04:38,770 --> 01:04:42,130
S1: deserves to win. I also think it will win. Uh,

1419
01:04:42,130 --> 01:04:45,760
S1: so happy to just get my boring best picture take

1420
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:46,480
S1: out of the way.

1421
01:04:46,600 --> 01:04:48,250
S3: Yeah, you need to be in the academy.

1422
01:04:48,580 --> 01:04:48,910
S5: Um.

1423
01:04:49,600 --> 01:04:52,540
S3: For my what? I want to win. I'm just going

1424
01:04:52,540 --> 01:04:54,610
S3: purely subjective for all of them. Okay? Like, I'm not

1425
01:04:54,610 --> 01:04:56,320
S3: even going based on, like, what I think is a

1426
01:04:56,320 --> 01:04:58,540
S3: good film. It's the film that I liked the best.

1427
01:04:58,540 --> 01:05:00,400
S5: Completely uncritically. Yeah.

1428
01:05:00,400 --> 01:05:01,150
S1: That's why you're here.

1429
01:05:01,840 --> 01:05:05,500
S3: What I think was the actual best film was anatomy

1430
01:05:05,500 --> 01:05:09,940
S3: of a fall. I think that film was incredible, unlike

1431
01:05:09,940 --> 01:05:14,620
S3: anything I've probably seen in a while. Interesting concept, interestingly shot, um,

1432
01:05:14,620 --> 01:05:17,290
S3: very moving and will stick with me for a while.

1433
01:05:17,290 --> 01:05:18,370
S3: What I think will win.

1434
01:05:18,370 --> 01:05:20,140
S1: A bit a bit anti man though, right.

1435
01:05:20,140 --> 01:05:25,660
S5: Well yeah yeah yeah this is Oppenheimer. Very all about

1436
01:05:25,810 --> 01:05:26,380
S5: the man.

1437
01:05:26,620 --> 01:05:29,380
S3: So yes I think because we are also as a

1438
01:05:29,380 --> 01:05:32,440
S3: society all about a man. Oppenheimer will win as we've

1439
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:33,880
S3: just full flagged.

1440
01:05:34,420 --> 01:05:38,470
S2: Yes. Uh well look I, I think sadly Oppenheimer will win.

1441
01:05:38,470 --> 01:05:40,180
S2: It is a great film. And I loved Oppenheimer, but

1442
01:05:40,180 --> 01:05:42,130
S2: I don't think it's the best film. Um, this won't

1443
01:05:42,130 --> 01:05:44,920
S2: shock you, because I am obviously famous for my emotional intelligence.

1444
01:05:44,920 --> 01:05:47,980
S2: The film that deserves it most is Past Lives. Uh,

1445
01:05:47,980 --> 01:05:51,010
S2: that film, you know, you guys were very, very early

1446
01:05:51,010 --> 01:05:52,570
S2: on it, and you saw it both before me, and

1447
01:05:52,570 --> 01:05:54,430
S2: you both spoke about how great it was, and I

1448
01:05:54,430 --> 01:05:56,440
S2: watched it, and it really it really broke me. I

1449
01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:59,740
S2: thought it was a beautiful movie, um, in every aspect

1450
01:05:59,740 --> 01:06:03,280
S2: of filmmaking. And I just think, unfortunately, coming after a

1451
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:05,560
S2: year where A24 did so well, I think it suffered

1452
01:06:05,560 --> 01:06:08,200
S2: from that. Um, but that's who should win. But obviously

1453
01:06:08,200 --> 01:06:09,100
S2: Oppenheimer will win.

1454
01:06:09,340 --> 01:06:11,410
S1: Yeah, I think that's a really good chat. It is

1455
01:06:11,410 --> 01:06:12,820
S1: a great movie. I think the other thing is the

1456
01:06:12,820 --> 01:06:16,930
S1: Oscars just generally don't reward debut filmmakers. It's like, good

1457
01:06:16,930 --> 01:06:20,080
S1: on you. You got your nomination now. Like do your time.

1458
01:06:20,080 --> 01:06:22,900
S1: One of the exceptions that was Emerald Fennell, who, as

1459
01:06:22,900 --> 01:06:26,229
S1: we've spoken about before, just bizarrely won Best screenplay for

1460
01:06:26,230 --> 01:06:29,380
S1: Promising Young Woman, uh, her debut feature. Um. All right,

1461
01:06:29,380 --> 01:06:32,740
S1: onto Best Director. Yeah. This is the one I thought

1462
01:06:32,740 --> 01:06:37,750
S1: long and hard about. I, I do think Scorsese deserves

1463
01:06:37,750 --> 01:06:41,620
S1: it for killers because of the way he both adapted

1464
01:06:41,620 --> 01:06:45,430
S1: that movie from the source text, the way he filmed it,

1465
01:06:45,430 --> 01:06:48,130
S1: the way he opened it and closed it. He just, like,

1466
01:06:48,130 --> 01:06:51,130
S1: did so many interesting things and pulled off a movie

1467
01:06:51,130 --> 01:06:55,630
S1: that was both entertaining and gripping. And as far as

1468
01:06:55,630 --> 01:06:58,930
S1: movies about American history go, we we kind of maybe

1469
01:06:58,930 --> 01:07:00,790
S1: didn't know all the details about Oppenheimer. We knew the

1470
01:07:00,790 --> 01:07:03,430
S1: big picture stuff. I think most people accept that they

1471
01:07:03,430 --> 01:07:06,970
S1: had no knowledge of what was going on in Oklahoma, uh,

1472
01:07:06,970 --> 01:07:10,390
S1: in that period of time. So I, I would put

1473
01:07:10,390 --> 01:07:13,360
S1: in a vote for Scorsese. But I do think Nolan

1474
01:07:13,360 --> 01:07:16,870
S1: will win just with the Oppenheimer train, uh, trundling on

1475
01:07:16,870 --> 01:07:17,950
S1: the way that it is.

1476
01:07:17,950 --> 01:07:20,710
S3: Oh, you have totally talked me into Scorsese. Like, I

1477
01:07:20,710 --> 01:07:23,560
S3: remember remembering now the feelings of killers. And I think

1478
01:07:23,560 --> 01:07:24,820
S3: I would also like to see him when I head

1479
01:07:24,820 --> 01:07:28,420
S3: down Yorgos Lanthimos, though, for Poor Things. Only because I

1480
01:07:28,420 --> 01:07:30,190
S3: think when you talk about director, when you look at

1481
01:07:30,190 --> 01:07:32,290
S3: who took the most risks, who was working with the

1482
01:07:32,290 --> 01:07:37,240
S3: most kind of interesting source material, who pushed actors and actresses,

1483
01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:40,450
S3: that furthers the kind of whole aesthetic of that film.

1484
01:07:40,450 --> 01:07:44,260
S3: I think in terms of interesting filmmaking, Yorgos Lanthimos takes

1485
01:07:44,260 --> 01:07:46,990
S3: the takes the prize, but I tend to agree that

1486
01:07:46,990 --> 01:07:50,290
S3: Christopher Nolan also will probably get the nod from the Academy.

1487
01:07:50,290 --> 01:07:53,080
S2: Yeah, I agree, I'm in line with Mel on this one.

1488
01:07:53,080 --> 01:07:56,530
S2: I think Nolan will win. Um, but I also think, uh,

1489
01:07:56,530 --> 01:08:00,340
S2: Yorgos deserves it. And not only because the movie is great,

1490
01:08:00,340 --> 01:08:03,370
S2: but because he is Greek. And let me tell you,

1491
01:08:03,370 --> 01:08:06,520
S2: the last director to win an Academy Award who is,

1492
01:08:06,520 --> 01:08:09,310
S2: you know, even like second generation Greek was Elia Kazan

1493
01:08:09,310 --> 01:08:11,470
S2: in 1954 for On the Waterfront. It's one of the

1494
01:08:11,470 --> 01:08:14,680
S2: great injustices in cinema. Uh, and, you know.

1495
01:08:14,680 --> 01:08:17,920
S1: Obviously, Eli Cezanne was also a rat who betrayed former

1496
01:08:17,920 --> 01:08:20,560
S1: members of the Communist Party to the House. Uh, Committee

1497
01:08:20,560 --> 01:08:22,960
S1: on UN activity. Yeah. American activities. What do you.

1498
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:23,770
S3: Have to say about that?

1499
01:08:23,770 --> 01:08:25,059
S2: I just say we take the wins where we can

1500
01:08:25,060 --> 01:08:25,450
S2: get them.

1501
01:08:25,450 --> 01:08:26,890
S1: And obviously.

1502
01:08:26,890 --> 01:08:29,590
S2: Yorgos was nominated in 2018, our very own George Miller

1503
01:08:29,590 --> 01:08:32,439
S2: nominated in 2015. But because of systemic racism, we've been

1504
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:34,419
S2: overlooked since the 50s. And so.

1505
01:08:37,900 --> 01:08:41,229
S1: Uh, both of us outdoing each other on our insane takes.

1506
01:08:42,550 --> 01:08:45,160
S1: That's great. Okay. Best actor. This is interesting because I

1507
01:08:45,160 --> 01:08:47,980
S1: don't think this category is that stacked really. Like, I

1508
01:08:47,979 --> 01:08:50,140
S1: think when I think about some of the best performances

1509
01:08:50,140 --> 01:08:53,710
S1: of the year outside of Oppenheimer, I'm thinking about anatomy

1510
01:08:53,710 --> 01:08:56,019
S1: of a fall. I'm thinking about past lives. I'm thinking about,

1511
01:08:56,020 --> 01:08:59,410
S1: like a lot more performances from actresses. I thought, yeah, Killian,

1512
01:08:59,410 --> 01:09:02,110
S1: I think just really went for it in, in this.

1513
01:09:02,110 --> 01:09:04,540
S1: I think he should win and I think he will win.

1514
01:09:04,540 --> 01:09:06,880
S1: But interesting. You guys have a different take.

1515
01:09:06,880 --> 01:09:09,700
S3: Yeah, I completely, completely agree. Looking at the list, um,

1516
01:09:09,700 --> 01:09:13,600
S3: who's up for that? Bradley Cooper, Colman Domingo, Paul Giamatti,

1517
01:09:13,600 --> 01:09:16,780
S3: Jeffrey Wright and Cillian Murphy. Like, I feel like he is.

1518
01:09:17,060 --> 01:09:18,799
S3: Serving of that for sure.

1519
01:09:18,920 --> 01:09:20,990
S2: Do you think Kilian deserves that? This is probably like

1520
01:09:20,990 --> 01:09:23,510
S2: a should and will, although I will say, and we've

1521
01:09:23,510 --> 01:09:24,680
S2: had a bit of a chat about this in the office.

1522
01:09:24,680 --> 01:09:28,040
S2: And I know you fucking hate Maestro and Bradley Cooper.

1523
01:09:28,310 --> 01:09:29,780
S2: I feel bad for him.

1524
01:09:29,780 --> 01:09:32,030
S1: He is. I really do not like that movie and

1525
01:09:32,030 --> 01:09:33,410
S1: he is annoying me a lot.

1526
01:09:33,410 --> 01:09:37,850
S2: Okay, like I quite liked maestro, but also he like,

1527
01:09:37,850 --> 01:09:40,550
S2: he wants this. He is like, obsessed with winning an

1528
01:09:40,550 --> 01:09:43,820
S2: Oscar and, you know, like, let him have one.

1529
01:09:44,030 --> 01:09:44,750
S5: Yeah, but sometimes.

1530
01:09:44,750 --> 01:09:46,100
S3: You want things and you just don't.

1531
01:09:46,100 --> 01:09:48,740
S5: Get that. How the world works. Good on you. Do

1532
01:09:48,740 --> 01:09:49,880
S5: we feel a bit bad.

1533
01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:52,490
S2: For Bradley Cooper now? Like he is just he like,

1534
01:09:52,790 --> 01:09:55,700
S2: no one's working harder for that Oscar than Bradley Cooper.

1535
01:09:55,700 --> 01:09:58,490
S3: I think he's been overrated his entire career. And it's

1536
01:09:58,490 --> 01:10:00,950
S3: time for him to understand his place.

1537
01:10:01,910 --> 01:10:03,350
S5: He'll he'll get one now. He will.

1538
01:10:03,500 --> 01:10:05,120
S2: He'll do like the hangover 4 in 5 years. And

1539
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:05,810
S2: they'll give it to him for that.

1540
01:10:05,810 --> 01:10:07,640
S3: I also don't think, like, I didn't mind that film

1541
01:10:07,640 --> 01:10:09,860
S3: as much as other people seem to, but, um, I

1542
01:10:09,860 --> 01:10:13,040
S3: don't think his role in it was that impressive, particularly

1543
01:10:13,040 --> 01:10:15,800
S3: not compared to Killian Murphy's. And I think the best

1544
01:10:15,800 --> 01:10:18,320
S3: parts of that movie were Carey Mulligan and him in

1545
01:10:18,320 --> 01:10:21,260
S3: dialogue and conflict with her, like, alone. He did not

1546
01:10:21,260 --> 01:10:22,280
S3: carry that film.

1547
01:10:22,280 --> 01:10:24,530
S2: Yeah, true. But anyway, it's all a moot point because

1548
01:10:24,530 --> 01:10:25,309
S2: Killian will win.

1549
01:10:26,360 --> 01:10:27,860
S1: Well, let's go to Best Actress. And this is one

1550
01:10:27,860 --> 01:10:31,160
S1: that I changed my mind on, like recently. Um, for

1551
01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:34,370
S1: a really interesting reason. Sandra Bullock, who is the lead

1552
01:10:34,370 --> 01:10:38,600
S1: in anatomy of a fall, but is also a really

1553
01:10:38,600 --> 01:10:41,270
S1: big part of the Zone of Interest, another movie nominated

1554
01:10:41,270 --> 01:10:44,450
S1: for Best Picture. And I know that people are nominated

1555
01:10:44,450 --> 01:10:47,600
S1: for like, individual movies, but the fact that she was like,

1556
01:10:47,600 --> 01:10:51,620
S1: astonishing and too pretty fascinating and interesting and very well

1557
01:10:51,620 --> 01:10:54,410
S1: made movies, uh, like hats Off to her in the

1558
01:10:54,410 --> 01:10:57,620
S1: same year. And I thought she really killed it in both.

1559
01:10:57,620 --> 01:11:01,009
S1: So I would love to see her win. Uh, I

1560
01:11:01,010 --> 01:11:03,110
S1: do think, and I'm not upset about this at all.

1561
01:11:03,110 --> 01:11:05,450
S1: I do think Lily Gladstone will win for killers of

1562
01:11:05,450 --> 01:11:07,400
S1: the Flower Moon. I know there's like a a lily

1563
01:11:07,400 --> 01:11:09,410
S1: versus Emma Stone thing going on. I think it's probably

1564
01:11:09,410 --> 01:11:12,320
S1: the most interesting category where we're not totally sure what's

1565
01:11:12,320 --> 01:11:14,240
S1: going to happen. Yeah, and I think Lily will win.

1566
01:11:14,240 --> 01:11:16,880
S1: She's won those awards. Thomas, that you mentioned tend to

1567
01:11:16,880 --> 01:11:19,400
S1: overlap the most with the Oscars. It seems like the

1568
01:11:19,400 --> 01:11:20,570
S1: most likely result.

1569
01:11:21,080 --> 01:11:24,680
S3: Yeah, I would really like to see Lily win. I

1570
01:11:24,680 --> 01:11:27,080
S3: think that what she did with that role, the kind

1571
01:11:27,080 --> 01:11:30,979
S3: of quiet power of the character she played is, was

1572
01:11:30,979 --> 01:11:34,040
S3: remarkable and very moving. And I think Emma Stone was

1573
01:11:34,040 --> 01:11:36,050
S3: fantastic in poor things and like really had to put

1574
01:11:36,050 --> 01:11:38,600
S3: herself out there as an actress. But it is in

1575
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:43,130
S3: many ways a larger than life role versus what Lily

1576
01:11:43,130 --> 01:11:45,860
S3: Gladstone had to do with holding back, but still managing

1577
01:11:45,860 --> 01:11:49,280
S3: to convey so much. And I think in terms of acting,

1578
01:11:49,280 --> 01:11:52,189
S3: I was more impressed by Lily than than Emma. Um,

1579
01:11:52,189 --> 01:11:54,320
S3: so yeah, I think she should win. And I reckon

1580
01:11:54,320 --> 01:11:55,280
S3: she probably will too.

1581
01:11:55,970 --> 01:11:59,210
S2: Uh, yeah. I'm pretty sure that Legatum is going to

1582
01:11:59,210 --> 01:12:01,250
S2: win this category. I know that Emma Stone has kind

1583
01:12:01,250 --> 01:12:04,340
S2: of been tipped to win it, although just recently the

1584
01:12:04,340 --> 01:12:08,390
S2: bookies have like seen Lily move in front. That's interesting. Um,

1585
01:12:08,390 --> 01:12:10,490
S2: but I also think like it's one of those things where,

1586
01:12:10,850 --> 01:12:14,210
S2: you know, and like, I think lots of viewers often

1587
01:12:14,210 --> 01:12:16,820
S2: assume this like the Academy looks at what's happening and

1588
01:12:16,820 --> 01:12:18,470
S2: then it's like, well, just give out one here to

1589
01:12:18,470 --> 01:12:20,780
S2: make sure that, like, that film gets its big award

1590
01:12:20,780 --> 01:12:23,570
S2: and not that, you know, Lily's performance doesn't warrant the

1591
01:12:23,570 --> 01:12:26,090
S2: award anyway, but this feels like the category where if

1592
01:12:26,090 --> 01:12:29,000
S2: killers will, like, get it's just desserts. And and she

1593
01:12:29,000 --> 01:12:31,310
S2: was amazing in that movie. Emma Stone's already got an Oscar.

1594
01:12:31,310 --> 01:12:33,230
S2: Like it all just seems to add up that like,

1595
01:12:33,229 --> 01:12:35,450
S2: I think Lily Gladstone should and will win this category.

1596
01:12:36,140 --> 01:12:38,570
S1: So yeah, out of all of those, we basically all

1597
01:12:38,570 --> 01:12:41,090
S1: agree on who we think will win. Which is interesting

1598
01:12:41,090 --> 01:12:43,880
S1: because it means that we can't say we're better than

1599
01:12:43,880 --> 01:12:45,950
S1: the other on Monday. That is annoying. But also, I

1600
01:12:45,950 --> 01:12:48,830
S1: think speaks to how locked up the race is. A

1601
01:12:48,830 --> 01:12:50,900
S1: couple more categories to to whip through, which I thought

1602
01:12:50,900 --> 01:12:53,540
S1: would just add a little bit more uncertainty to the equation.

1603
01:12:53,540 --> 01:12:56,660
S1: Original and adapted screenplay. So original screenplay is where I

1604
01:12:56,660 --> 01:12:58,940
S1: think past lives could get a nod. It deserves to

1605
01:12:58,939 --> 01:13:01,969
S1: get a nod. It's a great screenplay, like it's we've

1606
01:13:01,970 --> 01:13:03,620
S1: talked about the movie before, don't need to go into

1607
01:13:03,620 --> 01:13:08,570
S1: it again. Just beautiful. Simple. Moving like just affected almost

1608
01:13:08,570 --> 01:13:12,320
S1: everyone I know who saw it. I think the holdovers

1609
01:13:12,320 --> 01:13:16,370
S1: will probably win just because GMT is like is is

1610
01:13:16,370 --> 01:13:18,170
S1: is part of this narrative. You know, after he won

1611
01:13:18,170 --> 01:13:22,009
S1: the Globes, he's being considered as a pretty close second

1612
01:13:22,010 --> 01:13:24,889
S1: to Killian in Best Actor category. So this could be

1613
01:13:24,890 --> 01:13:28,580
S1: where The Holdovers manages to to just get to get something.

1614
01:13:28,580 --> 01:13:30,769
S1: What do you guys thoughts on Original Screenplay?

1615
01:13:30,770 --> 01:13:33,469
S3: I would like to see anatomy of a Fall Win.

1616
01:13:33,470 --> 01:13:36,469
S3: I think that film is told in a really interesting wow.

1617
01:13:36,470 --> 01:13:37,220
S5: You really, really had a.

1618
01:13:37,220 --> 01:13:37,970
S1: Big impact on you.

1619
01:13:37,970 --> 01:13:40,099
S3: I thought it was pretty incredible. Like, did.

1620
01:13:40,100 --> 01:13:40,850
S2: You meet the dog?

1621
01:13:41,030 --> 01:13:42,290
S5: Yeah, I would.

1622
01:13:42,290 --> 01:13:43,160
S3: Love to. I would yeah.

1623
01:13:43,160 --> 01:13:44,450
S5: The dog is great though, isn't how good.

1624
01:13:44,540 --> 01:13:46,130
S3: Yeah, what a role I was the whole time. I

1625
01:13:46,130 --> 01:13:48,830
S3: was like, how did they get it to do that? Yeah. Um,

1626
01:13:49,189 --> 01:13:52,760
S3: I just think that how that story unfolded, like the

1627
01:13:52,760 --> 01:13:55,580
S3: kind of slow release of information at the same time

1628
01:13:55,580 --> 01:13:58,880
S3: as you're slowly starting to doubt people more and more like,

1629
01:13:58,880 --> 01:14:00,470
S3: I just think, I always think when you watch a

1630
01:14:00,470 --> 01:14:02,299
S3: film and you can't really see the joints of it

1631
01:14:02,300 --> 01:14:05,300
S3: like that is when I'm like wondering, how did they

1632
01:14:05,300 --> 01:14:07,580
S3: do that? How is it working? Like, that's a really

1633
01:14:07,580 --> 01:14:10,550
S3: good film. Um, so I think I would like to

1634
01:14:10,550 --> 01:14:14,299
S3: see that win. I actually think past lives will win. Interesting. Yeah.

1635
01:14:14,300 --> 01:14:17,150
S3: I think it's a way to acknowledge that. Movie which

1636
01:14:17,150 --> 01:14:20,780
S3: deserves to be acknowledged, um, to commend and encourage a

1637
01:14:20,780 --> 01:14:23,420
S3: first time filmmaker. Um, and that could be where it

1638
01:14:23,420 --> 01:14:25,670
S3: gets its nod, and it is well deserved to.

1639
01:14:25,820 --> 01:14:28,460
S1: If there was an award for best use of a

1640
01:14:28,460 --> 01:14:33,260
S1: steel band cover of $0.50 per amp, I think anatomy

1641
01:14:33,260 --> 01:14:35,720
S1: of a full should and would win that category.

1642
01:14:35,750 --> 01:14:36,740
S3: Yeah, it was in my head.

1643
01:14:36,860 --> 01:14:38,269
S5: So like for so.

1644
01:14:38,270 --> 01:14:38,780
S3: Long after the.

1645
01:14:38,780 --> 01:14:39,710
S5: Film, we could.

1646
01:14:39,710 --> 01:14:42,470
S2: Also do some like quite a fun, you know, best

1647
01:14:42,470 --> 01:14:44,360
S2: dog in a movie.

1648
01:14:45,150 --> 01:14:45,839
S5: Yeah.

1649
01:14:46,080 --> 01:14:46,920
S3: Do you have one at the.

1650
01:14:46,920 --> 01:14:47,970
S5: Top of your head? We'll do it next year.

1651
01:14:48,210 --> 01:14:51,479
S2: Anyway, I think Anatomy Before will win Best original Screenplay.

1652
01:14:52,380 --> 01:14:52,950
S1: Do you think it should?

1653
01:14:53,100 --> 01:14:54,870
S2: I think it should. Yeah. I think it should. Um,

1654
01:14:54,870 --> 01:14:57,840
S2: but I definitely think it's it's more curious to talk

1655
01:14:57,840 --> 01:15:00,030
S2: about best adapted. Um, which obviously we'll move on to

1656
01:15:00,030 --> 01:15:02,670
S2: now because of, you know, I mean, we've discussed this previously.

1657
01:15:02,670 --> 01:15:03,870
S2: The Barbie element.

1658
01:15:04,260 --> 01:15:06,900
S1: Yeah. Well, talk us through that. So Bobby ended up

1659
01:15:06,900 --> 01:15:10,500
S1: being put into that category because I guess the argument

1660
01:15:10,500 --> 01:15:13,830
S1: is that Barbie the doll is a source material that

1661
01:15:13,830 --> 01:15:14,969
S1: is being adapted.

1662
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:17,160
S2: Yeah. So I think I believe it was originally submitted

1663
01:15:17,160 --> 01:15:20,040
S2: for Best Original because obviously, you know, the world and

1664
01:15:20,040 --> 01:15:23,310
S2: the story was completely created by, um, you know, Greta

1665
01:15:23,310 --> 01:15:26,280
S2: Gerwig and Margot Robbie and the entire team and Noah Baumbach,

1666
01:15:26,790 --> 01:15:29,280
S2: Gerwig's husband, who also co-wrote the movie. But then it

1667
01:15:29,280 --> 01:15:31,410
S2: was pushed into Best Adapted because they made the argument

1668
01:15:31,410 --> 01:15:35,220
S2: that there was original source material for Barbie. But, I mean,

1669
01:15:35,220 --> 01:15:38,340
S2: I don't know, it's now up against American fiction, Oppenheimer,

1670
01:15:38,340 --> 01:15:41,550
S2: Poor Things, and The Zone of Interest. Uh, pretty stacked field,

1671
01:15:41,640 --> 01:15:44,970
S2: but luckily, uh, both my should and will line up. Uh,

1672
01:15:44,970 --> 01:15:46,769
S2: it's a film that we all enjoy, the film that

1673
01:15:46,770 --> 01:15:49,680
S2: we discussed at length recently, and that is American fiction.

1674
01:15:50,310 --> 01:15:52,800
S3: Yeah. I would like to see American fiction when and

1675
01:15:52,800 --> 01:15:55,410
S3: particularly when you know that the book, Percival Everett's book

1676
01:15:55,410 --> 01:15:58,530
S3: is kind of written in a book within a book.

1677
01:15:58,530 --> 01:16:02,100
S3: I think the job of translating that to screen is

1678
01:16:02,100 --> 01:16:05,280
S3: pretty impressive. And the balancing of the satire with the

1679
01:16:05,280 --> 01:16:08,340
S3: familial relations, um, was really well done. So I'd like

1680
01:16:08,340 --> 01:16:10,860
S3: to see that when I reckon Barbie might win this,

1681
01:16:10,860 --> 01:16:13,680
S3: it will be controversial. Maybe it'll be the controversial moment

1682
01:16:13,680 --> 01:16:16,349
S3: of the Oscars, but I do think they might want

1683
01:16:16,350 --> 01:16:18,360
S3: to give Barbie a bit of a nod, and people

1684
01:16:18,360 --> 01:16:20,910
S3: might see this category as a way to celebrate that

1685
01:16:20,910 --> 01:16:23,940
S3: film and Greta Gerwig in her role in it.

1686
01:16:24,689 --> 01:16:27,150
S1: If, um, if killers was nominated, I would put in

1687
01:16:27,150 --> 01:16:29,280
S1: a plug for that. It's bizarrely not, even though I

1688
01:16:29,280 --> 01:16:32,910
S1: think it's maybe the best adapted screenplay this year, I,

1689
01:16:32,910 --> 01:16:34,620
S1: I think without that, I agree with you guys on

1690
01:16:34,620 --> 01:16:37,740
S1: American fiction. Don't be shocked if the zone of interest

1691
01:16:37,740 --> 01:16:40,620
S1: picks up here. Like, that movie is having a bit

1692
01:16:40,620 --> 01:16:43,110
S1: of a run at the moment. You know, picked up

1693
01:16:43,110 --> 01:16:45,810
S1: a bunch of awards at the BAFTAs. It's really landing

1694
01:16:45,810 --> 01:16:48,689
S1: with a lot of people, movies that that sort of

1695
01:16:48,689 --> 01:16:52,589
S1: discuss with or engage with the Holocaust have, have generally

1696
01:16:52,590 --> 01:16:56,490
S1: been pretty, you know, well received. Seems like a weird

1697
01:16:56,490 --> 01:16:59,250
S1: term to use. But the Oscars has acknowledged those movies

1698
01:16:59,250 --> 01:17:01,830
S1: generally in the past. Spielberg came out and said a

1699
01:17:01,830 --> 01:17:04,200
S1: very weird thing, that this is like the best Holocaust

1700
01:17:04,200 --> 01:17:06,960
S1: movie since Schindler's List, which sounds great until you remember

1701
01:17:06,960 --> 01:17:09,330
S1: that he made Schindler's List and was like, this is

1702
01:17:09,330 --> 01:17:11,040
S1: the best movie about this topic since the one that

1703
01:17:11,040 --> 01:17:13,590
S1: I did, so I think that could be an interesting

1704
01:17:13,590 --> 01:17:16,410
S1: one to watch as well. Are there any other categories

1705
01:17:16,410 --> 01:17:18,809
S1: you guys wanted to to mention any, any races or

1706
01:17:18,810 --> 01:17:21,300
S1: any particular films that we haven't touched on that, uh,

1707
01:17:21,300 --> 01:17:23,580
S1: deserve a little bit of conversation?

1708
01:17:23,580 --> 01:17:27,510
S2: Yes, I, I mean, it's no conversation about the Oscars

1709
01:17:27,510 --> 01:17:30,660
S2: is complete without getting a little bit parochial and talking

1710
01:17:30,660 --> 01:17:34,650
S2: about the Australians nominated, uh, obviously Margot was, uh, famously

1711
01:17:34,650 --> 01:17:36,510
S2: and controversially shut out, even though I think we all

1712
01:17:36,510 --> 01:17:39,360
S2: agreed that she probably didn't deserve a nomination. Uh, but yes,

1713
01:17:39,360 --> 01:17:42,179
S2: there are two Australians nominated in one category, which is

1714
01:17:42,180 --> 01:17:46,019
S2: live action short. So Niki Bentham, a producer of the after,

1715
01:17:46,020 --> 01:17:49,530
S2: which is on Netflix, and Sara MacFarlane, uh, red, white

1716
01:17:49,530 --> 01:17:52,320
S2: and blue. So they're both, uh, two Australian producers up

1717
01:17:52,320 --> 01:17:55,020
S2: against each other in best live action short. Uh, and

1718
01:17:55,020 --> 01:17:57,390
S2: actually I haven't seen either of those, but the after

1719
01:17:57,390 --> 01:17:59,010
S2: is kind of a hot favourite now, and we always

1720
01:17:59,010 --> 01:18:01,320
S2: love to see Australians do well. So that's Nicki Bentham

1721
01:18:01,410 --> 01:18:04,020
S2: up against Sara macfarlane in live action short.

1722
01:18:04,880 --> 01:18:05,630
S1: Great shout.

1723
01:18:05,810 --> 01:18:07,730
S3: We do. And we often the Australians we do really

1724
01:18:07,729 --> 01:18:11,180
S3: well in cinematography, historically has been where we often shine

1725
01:18:11,180 --> 01:18:15,439
S3: at the Oscars. Look I for music original song I

1726
01:18:15,439 --> 01:18:19,400
S3: wouldn't mind seeing. I'm just can get a nod. But

1727
01:18:19,400 --> 01:18:21,800
S3: particularly I'd like to get a nod over the Billie

1728
01:18:21,800 --> 01:18:22,880
S3: Eilish song.

1729
01:18:23,060 --> 01:18:24,589
S5: Was seriously enough.

1730
01:18:24,590 --> 01:18:25,790
S1: With the Billie Eilish thing.

1731
01:18:25,790 --> 01:18:27,470
S3: If one is going to get it from Bobby, I

1732
01:18:27,470 --> 01:18:28,670
S3: want it to be I'm just can.

1733
01:18:28,670 --> 01:18:31,310
S2: Yeah, I find the Billie Eilish song so like drab

1734
01:18:31,310 --> 01:18:34,220
S2: and yeah, I'm just getting way more fun.

1735
01:18:34,220 --> 01:18:36,200
S3: And I know the only other category I'm kind of

1736
01:18:36,200 --> 01:18:38,120
S3: interested in, only because I think a lot of the

1737
01:18:38,120 --> 01:18:41,420
S3: films we're talking about are so visually stunning is costume design,

1738
01:18:41,420 --> 01:18:44,630
S3: which we as Australians have also won in the past

1739
01:18:44,630 --> 01:18:47,090
S3: with Catherine Martin. Like when you look at the list

1740
01:18:47,090 --> 01:18:53,330
S3: for that Barbie, Poor Things, Killers and Napoleon and then Oppenheimer,

1741
01:18:53,330 --> 01:18:55,309
S3: which I would say probably isn't quite the same, though

1742
01:18:55,310 --> 01:18:57,860
S3: it does have stunning outfits like, yeah, who would you

1743
01:18:57,860 --> 01:19:01,130
S3: pick for that? They're all such remarkable acts of world

1744
01:19:01,130 --> 01:19:02,720
S3: building in their costuming.

1745
01:19:03,050 --> 01:19:05,780
S1: Totally, totally pull things. Or Barbie winning that would be

1746
01:19:05,780 --> 01:19:06,950
S1: would be pretty great. All right.

1747
01:19:06,950 --> 01:19:07,340
S5: Yeah.

1748
01:19:07,640 --> 01:19:09,320
S2: So it's so sad though, when we have a year where,

1749
01:19:09,320 --> 01:19:12,200
S2: like Mandy Walker or Catherine Martin aren't involved in a film,

1750
01:19:12,200 --> 01:19:13,460
S2: we're just like, not going to win any Oscars.

1751
01:19:15,560 --> 01:19:18,860
S1: Well, Greg Frazier will probably be nominated for cinematography for

1752
01:19:18,860 --> 01:19:20,179
S1: June part two next year.

1753
01:19:20,180 --> 01:19:21,200
S2: Oh my God.

1754
01:19:22,160 --> 01:19:22,760
S5: People get to.

1755
01:19:22,760 --> 01:19:24,050
S3: Relive it all over again.

1756
01:19:24,650 --> 01:19:26,300
S2: I was like, I saw it for the 800th time

1757
01:19:26,300 --> 01:19:26,810
S2: last week.

1758
01:19:26,810 --> 01:19:29,330
S1: And the only other thing that I wanted to mention,

1759
01:19:29,330 --> 01:19:31,730
S1: I won't go in deep on this one, is Best

1760
01:19:31,729 --> 01:19:35,780
S1: International Feature Film. I. I love this category, not just because,

1761
01:19:35,780 --> 01:19:38,990
S1: you know, it's also a category where Australians can sometimes compete,

1762
01:19:38,990 --> 01:19:41,780
S1: but the politics of it are the most fascinating. So

1763
01:19:41,780 --> 01:19:44,270
S1: the way this works, unlike the other categories that I

1764
01:19:44,270 --> 01:19:48,290
S1: ran through before, each country actually has a system whereby

1765
01:19:48,290 --> 01:19:53,090
S1: they nominate what the one movie from that country should

1766
01:19:53,090 --> 01:19:56,300
S1: be in terms of contention for Best International Feature Film.

1767
01:19:56,300 --> 01:19:59,570
S1: And in Australia, like it's Screen Australia, the government funded

1768
01:19:59,570 --> 01:20:02,750
S1: screen body that decides other countries have like the ministries

1769
01:20:02,750 --> 01:20:05,479
S1: of culture. So like the government picks the movie or

1770
01:20:05,479 --> 01:20:08,480
S1: they have like industry bodies and panels, it's a pretty

1771
01:20:08,479 --> 01:20:11,330
S1: interesting screen. Australia not a great track record. I think

1772
01:20:11,330 --> 01:20:15,020
S1: we've had one movie nominated since this category was introduced

1773
01:20:15,020 --> 01:20:17,660
S1: in the 90s, but there's actually a bit of drama

1774
01:20:17,660 --> 01:20:21,080
S1: around the French nominee, which this year was the taste

1775
01:20:21,080 --> 01:20:23,480
S1: of things, and a lot of people were upset that

1776
01:20:23,479 --> 01:20:26,450
S1: it wasn't anatomy of a fall because they thought it's

1777
01:20:26,450 --> 01:20:29,960
S1: nominated for Best Picture, it's nominated for Best Director. Why

1778
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:33,590
S1: is Justine Tree's pretty good movie not in Best International Feature?

1779
01:20:33,590 --> 01:20:36,290
S1: And essentially there was like a lot of political bullshit

1780
01:20:36,290 --> 01:20:38,660
S1: that went down at the French body. There was a vote.

1781
01:20:38,660 --> 01:20:41,600
S1: It was 4 to 3 in favor of the taste

1782
01:20:41,600 --> 01:20:43,849
S1: of things instead of anatomy of a fall. One of

1783
01:20:43,850 --> 01:20:46,430
S1: the voters said, can I change my vote? I didn't

1784
01:20:46,430 --> 01:20:48,500
S1: realize I was going to be the swing vote. And

1785
01:20:48,500 --> 01:20:51,380
S1: they're like, no, you fucked up. I'm sorry. And seemingly

1786
01:20:51,380 --> 01:20:53,030
S1: the reason for it is, like the French film body

1787
01:20:53,030 --> 01:20:56,180
S1: has more conservative elements within it. And Justine Trier, when

1788
01:20:56,180 --> 01:20:58,880
S1: she won the Palme d'Or at Cannes since then gave

1789
01:20:58,880 --> 01:21:02,240
S1: a lot of speeches decrying the French government, accused them

1790
01:21:02,240 --> 01:21:05,900
S1: of being neo liberal stooges like basically has taken a

1791
01:21:05,900 --> 01:21:08,450
S1: very strong stance on a number of key issues which

1792
01:21:08,450 --> 01:21:11,990
S1: potentially alienated her from the French film body and probably

1793
01:21:11,990 --> 01:21:14,990
S1: cost France the best international feature Oscar. Because I think

1794
01:21:14,990 --> 01:21:18,200
S1: if anatomy was in, it would 100% have won this award.

1795
01:21:18,590 --> 01:21:19,790
S2: Yeah. That's crazy.

1796
01:21:19,970 --> 01:21:20,390
S5: Yeah.

1797
01:21:20,660 --> 01:21:24,710
S1: Geopolitics, man. This award rules the Oscars are the best.

1798
01:21:24,710 --> 01:21:26,900
S2: Oh, now I'm just like in 2000. Why did Screen

1799
01:21:26,900 --> 01:21:28,849
S2: Australia not put Wog Boys forward.

1800
01:21:29,120 --> 01:21:30,020
S5: That's like it.

1801
01:21:30,620 --> 01:21:32,450
S2: But seriously that was like the one time Nick Jonas

1802
01:21:32,450 --> 01:21:35,780
S2: got funding from Screen Australia is a good movie anyway.

1803
01:21:36,020 --> 01:21:38,420
S1: And on that note, we could have wrap up our

1804
01:21:38,450 --> 01:21:42,290
S1: 2024 Oscars deep dive. So we'll be back on Monday

1805
01:21:42,290 --> 01:21:44,990
S1: evening with a review and a wrap of the show

1806
01:21:44,990 --> 01:21:48,290
S1: and discussions of what worked, what went right and what

1807
01:21:48,290 --> 01:21:51,679
S1: went wrong, and hopefully some upsets to to chew on.

1808
01:21:51,680 --> 01:21:55,370
S1: But before we sign off, we're we've got our regular

1809
01:21:55,370 --> 01:21:59,180
S1: Impress Your Friends segment, something we watched read, listened to

1810
01:21:59,180 --> 01:22:01,939
S1: from the past week that we want to shout out, Thomas,

1811
01:22:01,939 --> 01:22:03,229
S1: why don't you go first this time?

1812
01:22:03,740 --> 01:22:06,530
S2: Yes, this is a Netflix show that's out today. It

1813
01:22:06,530 --> 01:22:08,840
S2: is the gentleman. This one's been coming for a little while.

1814
01:22:08,840 --> 01:22:11,270
S2: It's a spin off of the Guy Ritchie film. Um,

1815
01:22:11,270 --> 01:22:13,070
S2: and firstly, it's got a few things that I think

1816
01:22:13,070 --> 01:22:15,320
S2: make it really fun. Uh, it's firstly, it's got just

1817
01:22:15,320 --> 01:22:18,050
S2: a guy Ritchie's DNA all over it. Um, it's like

1818
01:22:18,050 --> 01:22:22,849
S2: proper gangsters, uh, you know, in London. The soundtrack is amazing. Uh,

1819
01:22:22,850 --> 01:22:24,980
S2: and the lead actor is Theo James, who, of course,

1820
01:22:24,979 --> 01:22:27,080
S2: we all know and love from The White Lotus. He's

1821
01:22:27,080 --> 01:22:29,450
S2: being very charming. He plays a guy named Eddie who

1822
01:22:29,450 --> 01:22:32,840
S2: basically his father dies. He he inherits, um, you know,

1823
01:22:32,840 --> 01:22:36,260
S2: a very impressive farm and house and also a, you know,

1824
01:22:36,260 --> 01:22:38,840
S2: becomes a duke. Uh, and then, as it turns out,

1825
01:22:38,840 --> 01:22:41,870
S2: the father had been basically leasing his land out to

1826
01:22:41,870 --> 01:22:44,090
S2: a nearby drug lord, and things kind of start to

1827
01:22:44,090 --> 01:22:46,010
S2: unravel from there. But, yeah, like I said, it's if

1828
01:22:46,010 --> 01:22:48,800
S2: you even have a passing interest in Guy Ritchie, you know,

1829
01:22:48,800 --> 01:22:51,530
S2: style and aesthetic and tone, this will be right up

1830
01:22:51,530 --> 01:22:54,349
S2: your alley. But aside from that, it's also just quite fun.

1831
01:22:54,350 --> 01:22:56,330
S2: Guy Ritchie can be a lot, but this is like

1832
01:22:56,330 --> 01:22:58,939
S2: him kind of honed and distilled at his very best. Uh,

1833
01:22:58,939 --> 01:23:00,379
S2: and that's on Netflix today.

1834
01:23:00,890 --> 01:23:03,920
S3: I am going this week with Abbey Morgan's. This is

1835
01:23:03,920 --> 01:23:07,060
S3: not a. Pity memoir, which is what it says. It

1836
01:23:07,060 --> 01:23:09,010
S3: is not. It is not a pity memoir. It's a

1837
01:23:09,010 --> 01:23:11,830
S3: great memoir. Abby Morgan, you might know she's a screamer.

1838
01:23:11,860 --> 01:23:12,519
S5: Is this a book?

1839
01:23:12,939 --> 01:23:13,780
S3: It is a.

1840
01:23:13,780 --> 01:23:16,660
S5: Book, don't you? Don't even say it anymore. No, no.

1841
01:23:16,660 --> 01:23:18,550
S1: No, I'm not, I'm not. I'm just checking. You didn't

1842
01:23:18,550 --> 01:23:21,160
S1: tell me what medium this this item came in. True.

1843
01:23:21,280 --> 01:23:22,000
S1: It's not a kitty.

1844
01:23:22,030 --> 01:23:22,480
S5: When I said.

1845
01:23:22,720 --> 01:23:27,640
S3: Memoir twice, maybe. But that also I've stitched up because

1846
01:23:27,640 --> 01:23:30,310
S3: Thomas doesn't read. It's like I'm doing TV. It's like, well,

1847
01:23:30,310 --> 01:23:33,700
S3: what's left? Um, you might know her. She's a screenwriter.

1848
01:23:33,700 --> 01:23:37,300
S3: She did like the Iron Lady suffragette. Shame. The hour,

1849
01:23:37,300 --> 01:23:40,900
S3: that TV show. Um, so it's a pretty remarkable tale.

1850
01:23:40,900 --> 01:23:44,740
S3: It's very funny the way it's told. Her husband has M.S.,

1851
01:23:44,740 --> 01:23:49,150
S3: and he goes on an experiment tree, um, drug trial

1852
01:23:49,150 --> 01:23:51,339
S3: that puts him into a coma. And when he wakes up,

1853
01:23:51,340 --> 01:23:54,070
S3: he does not realize who she is. He does not

1854
01:23:54,070 --> 01:23:58,479
S3: remember her. He is convinced that she is an imposter

1855
01:23:58,479 --> 01:24:02,020
S3: in the body of his partner. And it's just a

1856
01:24:02,020 --> 01:24:06,370
S3: fascinating story, but really. Well told and like, kind of heartbreaking,

1857
01:24:06,370 --> 01:24:09,850
S3: but humorous as well. Um, it's been a very buzzy book. Um,

1858
01:24:09,850 --> 01:24:12,070
S3: so I think, well, well worth the read.

1859
01:24:12,310 --> 01:24:15,400
S1: We low key. We're giving the best book recommendations on

1860
01:24:15,400 --> 01:24:18,340
S1: this show every week. Thanks to you, Mel. Like booktok.

1861
01:24:18,370 --> 01:24:20,889
S1: Eat your heart out. This podcast should be going ballistic

1862
01:24:20,890 --> 01:24:23,470
S1: amongst book lovers. These these recs are great. Like I'm

1863
01:24:23,470 --> 01:24:24,610
S1: not going to get around to reading it, but it's

1864
01:24:24,610 --> 01:24:25,150
S1: good for people.

1865
01:24:25,450 --> 01:24:25,960
S5: Yeah, yeah, you.

1866
01:24:25,960 --> 01:24:27,519
S3: Might need to sit in your guilt for a bit.

1867
01:24:29,320 --> 01:24:33,010
S1: Um, mine is a mine's a memoir, uh, Mel. Adapted

1868
01:24:33,010 --> 01:24:35,200
S1: into a TV show. So, you know, it's important to clarify.

1869
01:24:35,200 --> 01:24:36,280
S2: Yeah. Best of both worlds.

1870
01:24:37,660 --> 01:24:39,790
S1: Um, so this, uh, show first came out a couple

1871
01:24:39,790 --> 01:24:44,559
S1: of years ago. It's Tokyo Vice, uh, to brilliant, brilliant memoir, uh,

1872
01:24:44,560 --> 01:24:49,330
S1: by a American journalist called Jake Adelstein, uh, who moved

1873
01:24:49,330 --> 01:24:51,880
S1: to Japan when he was quite young and became the

1874
01:24:51,880 --> 01:24:55,389
S1: first Westerner to work at this big Tokyo newspaper and

1875
01:24:55,390 --> 01:24:58,780
S1: was a crime reporter embedded with the cops and investigated

1876
01:24:58,780 --> 01:25:02,620
S1: the Yakuza. Uh, he's played by Ansel Elgort. This show

1877
01:25:02,620 --> 01:25:07,330
S1: also stars Ken Watanabe. He's amazing. Japanese actor. The second season, uh,

1878
01:25:07,330 --> 01:25:11,019
S1: has just been released. I didn't watch the first season

1879
01:25:11,020 --> 01:25:13,030
S1: when it came out, and I'm kind of rewatching it

1880
01:25:13,030 --> 01:25:15,700
S1: to catch up. It's really good. Like Michael Mann was

1881
01:25:15,700 --> 01:25:17,950
S1: originally attached to this. I think he did direct the

1882
01:25:17,950 --> 01:25:21,280
S1: first episode, but then wandered off the project and it

1883
01:25:21,280 --> 01:25:25,479
S1: is shot beautifully. It looks great. Japan is an amazing

1884
01:25:25,479 --> 01:25:30,070
S1: location to to set a sort of gritty police journalist

1885
01:25:30,070 --> 01:25:33,009
S1: noir sort of story. I would strongly recommend this one.

1886
01:25:33,400 --> 01:25:34,900
S3: Yeah, I love that I watched the first season. I

1887
01:25:34,900 --> 01:25:37,420
S3: thought it was fantastic. The book is really good. The book.

1888
01:25:37,420 --> 01:25:40,300
S5: Is. I've read that book and I loved it.

1889
01:25:40,300 --> 01:25:42,490
S3: After you're done in Canberra, straight to the, uh, the

1890
01:25:42,490 --> 01:25:45,550
S3: foreign crime beat, correct? Um, but yes, I'm very much

1891
01:25:45,550 --> 01:25:47,410
S3: looking forward to the second season of that.

1892
01:25:47,770 --> 01:25:51,670
S1: Awesome. Well, we we really covered a lot on this episode.

1893
01:25:51,670 --> 01:25:55,150
S1: And thank you so much for indulging me. My Oscars, uh,

1894
01:25:55,150 --> 01:25:59,410
S1: electoral nerdery hopefully people found it interesting and the pubs

1895
01:25:59,410 --> 01:26:01,180
S1: and the clubs will be a chatter with people saying,

1896
01:26:01,180 --> 01:26:04,060
S1: did you know, did you know how the Oscars. It's

1897
01:26:04,060 --> 01:26:06,130
S1: the same way we vote for the Senate. Isn't that crazy?

1898
01:26:06,160 --> 01:26:09,729
S1: That's my contribution to discourse this this week in Australia.

1899
01:26:09,729 --> 01:26:10,510
S5: I'm just happy to get.

1900
01:26:10,510 --> 01:26:13,719
S2: My mandated one mention per product.

1901
01:26:15,189 --> 01:26:17,860
S1: Thanks, guys. Looking forward to debriefing on Monday night.

1902
01:26:17,979 --> 01:26:18,759
S3: See you Monday.

1903
01:26:20,650 --> 01:26:23,800
S1: This episode of The Drop was produced by Qi Wang.

1904
01:26:23,950 --> 01:26:26,320
S1: If you enjoyed listening to today's episode of The Drop,

1905
01:26:26,320 --> 01:26:29,290
S1: make sure to follow us in your favorite podcast app.

1906
01:26:29,290 --> 01:26:32,230
S1: Leave us a review or better yet, share the episode

1907
01:26:32,229 --> 01:26:35,320
S1: with a friend. I'm Usman Farooqui. See you next week!