Speaker 1: The Frames per Second Podcast.
Speaker 2: Welcome to another episode of the Frame Second Podcast. I'm
Speaker 2: helped with the evening of My name is Mike with me.
Speaker 2: I have Spike, What Up? Got Rod?
Speaker 3: What Up?
Speaker 1: Man?
Speaker 2: Got ken Ola? And we got Nick. Anytime we do
Speaker 2: some virtual shit, we try to drag Nick ass into
Speaker 2: these shits. So what's going on? Nick? I'm good, I'm good,
Speaker 2: glad to be here as always. Man. All right, so
Speaker 2: today we are talking about, Oh, this is actually a
Speaker 2: anniversary film, right, I forget how many years it was though,
Speaker 2: does anybody remember fifty years? Fifty years? We're covering Martin
Speaker 2: Taxi Driver. So I'm gonna go around the room, give
Speaker 2: a light and I mean light short, short opinion of
Speaker 2: if you like it or not, but also throwing there
Speaker 2: if this is your first time watching it. So I'm
Speaker 2: gonna let guests go first, even though he's not really
Speaker 2: a guest, but he's sort of Nick. You go ahead
Speaker 2: and go first. I'm gonna be honest, first time watching
Speaker 2: it interesting, even though I knew most about the movie.
Speaker 2: It's a note for me, dog. Oh it's a no
Speaker 2: for I'll go into it. But okay, all right, Rogers
Speaker 2: went away. So while while he's fixing his video. I'm
Speaker 2: gonna go ahead and go to Spike. Spike, was this
Speaker 2: your first time seeing it? And did you like it?
Speaker 2: First time watching it? And I did? I was not
Speaker 2: mad at this hit all. I understand the hype around
Speaker 2: it after watching it.
Speaker 4: I didn't believe it going into it, but after I
Speaker 4: watched it, I get while it was so popular when it.
Speaker 2: Was all right? And ken first time watching it? And
Speaker 2: did you like it?
Speaker 5: No, it's not my first time watching it. I've watched
Speaker 5: it before, and I do enjoy the movie.
Speaker 1: I did.
Speaker 2: I do like it, okay, and Rod is back Rod,
Speaker 2: first time watching it? And did you like it? Nah?
Speaker 2: This is?
Speaker 6: This isn't my first time watching it. Yeah, this movie is.
Speaker 6: This movie is great?
Speaker 2: All right, So this is definitely not my first time
Speaker 2: watching it. I've seen this movie many, many, many times.
Speaker 2: It's one of my favorite Scorsese films. I think Robert
Speaker 2: de Niro absolutely destroyed this role as one of the
Speaker 2: best acting performances of all time. And we're gonna go ahead,
Speaker 2: and we're gonna break down the movie. I tried to
Speaker 2: condense these notes, but you know we're not gonna let
Speaker 2: Rod keep us here all night, So let's go ahead
Speaker 2: and get started, all right. So we are in New
Speaker 2: York and we meet Travis Bickle played by Robert de Nier.
Speaker 2: He's a Vietnam vet who's applying for a job as
Speaker 2: a nighttime taxi driver. He lives alone, he keeps a
Speaker 2: diary about how disgusting he thinks the city is, and
Speaker 2: he visits porn theaters to occupy his mind. What are
Speaker 2: y'all's first thoughts about Travis. I want to start with you, Nick,
Speaker 2: since you didn't like this film. I like the way
Speaker 2: this film was shot and it has New York as
Speaker 2: a character, because I think that's me to me, one
Speaker 2: of the highlights of the film. But Travis as a
Speaker 2: character was boring to me. But I also know I'm
Speaker 2: looking at under the guys of twenty twenty six and
Speaker 2: not in nineteen seventy six, so I get to see
Speaker 2: like I see like the architect of this character in
Speaker 2: other films that I've watched. But as far as me
Speaker 2: watching this movie like as a newcomer, yeah, it took
Speaker 2: me literally to like the third act to really even
Speaker 2: get into the film.
Speaker 4: Spike, what about you to one of the next points
Speaker 4: I've seen this architect in other films. I just finished
Speaker 4: binging you, and this dude was like a nineteen seventy
Speaker 4: nine Joe Obert like they of course this was you
Speaker 4: as more today time, but it was the same premier,
Speaker 4: same like base was there. So that kind of shaped
Speaker 4: my mind for what I was about to get into,
Speaker 4: because I was like, Okay, this is interesting. I'm wondering
Speaker 4: how they're going to do this is in the seventies
Speaker 4: versus me watching the twenty twenty six version kind of
Speaker 4: this or twenty five or whenever that came out.
Speaker 1: So I was intrigued immediately.
Speaker 2: By the way, for anybody that has video, I just
Speaker 2: noticed spikes hat and I hate it. Nice but no,
Speaker 2: I didn't think it's a nice but I knew exactly
Speaker 2: what it meant what it said the second I saw it.
Speaker 2: I can't believe you're.
Speaker 1: Let's move on. I played golf, man, I.
Speaker 2: Know you did, But damn, Ken, what do you think
Speaker 2: of Travis Bickell?
Speaker 5: You know, I think they did a good job early
Speaker 5: on kind of giving you just enough background information on
Speaker 5: his past, you know, with the Vietnam War thing, its
Speaker 5: ability to not sleep and how just over time, you know,
Speaker 5: lack of sleep can really mess with you, and you
Speaker 5: combind that with you know, his his previous war experience.
Speaker 5: I don't know if he experienced combat or anything, but
Speaker 5: you know, things can go left pretty quickly.
Speaker 1: So he just seemed like he didn't fit in.
Speaker 5: And you can see that with his with his first interaction,
Speaker 5: you know, with the guy that was during the hiring,
Speaker 5: so it was clear that he was he was a
Speaker 5: loner and just trying to readapt to the world.
Speaker 2: Rod, did you get something different?
Speaker 6: Yeah, just pretty much the same as Ken. I did
Speaker 6: like how they had like the new art style, but
Speaker 6: just in like the seventies or whatever of him narrating
Speaker 6: and everything and just him just you know, experiencing insomnia.
Speaker 6: So that's why he, you know, took took the cab
Speaker 6: job just to begin with. So no, I mean I
Speaker 6: like how it started off with him, like the with
Speaker 6: with that character. I think they started off strong with him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree. I think Travis Bickle is a very
Speaker 2: interesting character. I do agree and understand Nick and Spike's
Speaker 2: point about you know, you've seen this character before, but
Speaker 2: it came after this obviously. But I think the most
Speaker 2: interesting thing about Travis is I assume he did see combat.
Speaker 2: I don't think it ever actually says, but we see
Speaker 2: those marks on his back later on, and judging by
Speaker 2: the way he's acting, I assume he's seen some kind
Speaker 2: of combat. But I like that he's just a walking
Speaker 2: contradiction because he's like, the city is disgusting, it's full
Speaker 2: of horrors and filth, but he constantly spends his nights
Speaker 2: at a porn theater like it's a regular ass movie theater,
Speaker 2: like dude has. Dude has no sense of what is
Speaker 2: quote unquote no more at this point, so I think
Speaker 2: the way they introduced him is very interesting. But Travis
Speaker 2: becomes infatuated with Betsy, who's played by Sybil Shepherd, who
Speaker 2: works for Senator Charles Pallantine, and after being a bit
Speaker 2: of a stalker, he goes into the office and asks
Speaker 2: her out on a date. What did y'all think about
Speaker 2: his first date? Anybody can take this this one.
Speaker 4: I knew he was crazy, like I thought it in
Speaker 4: the beginning, But then when he took her to the
Speaker 4: porn on the first day and thought it was that was.
Speaker 2: That wasn't the first day that second date walking in
Speaker 2: there and was talking to no, that was at the
Speaker 2: diner diner date.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, they had that weird talk. Well, i'll talk
Speaker 4: where y'all.
Speaker 1: Let y'all go.
Speaker 4: Then I ain't getting nothing from that other than the
Speaker 4: only thing I got from it is I didn't know
Speaker 4: Silver Shepherd used to be that bad for real.
Speaker 7: Hey.
Speaker 2: I had to look up all this because I like,
Speaker 2: these are a lot of famous people who had like great
Speaker 2: careers started. So of course I'm like, I'm looking at
Speaker 2: the who's who, and I'm like, hold on, that can't
Speaker 2: be the same. I've seen that motherfucker before. That's not hers.
Speaker 2: When I when I see that, I was like, okay,
Speaker 2: let me see how this goes. This confirmed that women
Speaker 2: like bad boys for generations and generations because she looked
Speaker 2: at that nigga knowing he crazy, but she was like,
Speaker 2: I just never seen that nobody like you before. You're
Speaker 2: just a walking contradiction. And he ain't know how to
Speaker 2: take that, but I knew it. But as long as
Speaker 2: she kept talking to him, he fucked with it. So
Speaker 2: that's all I took from that. He didn't know what
Speaker 2: contradiction meant.
Speaker 1: I didn't seem like.
Speaker 2: Anybody else.
Speaker 6: I didn't take him as a bad boy. Person and
Speaker 6: this I just he was just like kind of confident,
Speaker 6: like built up the confidence to come and talk to her,
Speaker 6: and just kind of just awkwardly confident. And I guess
Speaker 6: it's the best way to said. And yeah, she was
Speaker 6: intrigued by that. I get why she was intrigued. So, yeah,
Speaker 6: he didn't seem crazy to me in that moment. You know,
Speaker 6: he seemed like he was just really honest, you know
Speaker 6: how people that that kind of just talked straight, just no,
Speaker 6: just no filler, no nothing. That's just kind of how
Speaker 6: I took him to be. And I think she seemed
Speaker 6: like she respected that about.
Speaker 2: The breakdown he did of her co worker. Didn't sound
Speaker 2: crazy to you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well he just was. That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: Somebody straight shooters, straight suters that like you, I don't,
Speaker 2: I don't like it, but just him, I don't know. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so he's like, I bet he don't even know your
Speaker 2: What did he say?
Speaker 6: I bet he doesn't even know something? And she she agreed, like, yeah,
Speaker 6: he doesn't know that.
Speaker 2: He's like, yeah, you can just tell you the coworker, huh,
Speaker 2: he's a coworker who cares if he knows anything about her?
Speaker 2: And we see him protect her early on when she
Speaker 2: was when she noticed he was stalking her.
Speaker 5: He clearly likes her too, you know as well, and uh,
Speaker 5: he was he was definitely jealous of little boy, and
Speaker 5: you know, there was this edge to him that she
Speaker 5: liked because Nick, you you mentioned the stalking point. She
Speaker 5: saw him just staring at them earlier, and that in
Speaker 5: that time, probably any damn time honestly is scary. You know,
Speaker 5: you got somebody just after winning just looking at you.
Speaker 5: Then the guy walk out and he just peel off
Speaker 5: like that, like that's that's not that's not right. So
Speaker 5: then he comes up to you and then he.
Speaker 4: And I took it that was his first time. I
Speaker 4: just wanted to come in. What he said that that
Speaker 4: did it seem like his first time?
Speaker 2: You talked about you interrupted or I didn't.
Speaker 5: Uh, I didn't think about it till now about whether
Speaker 5: that was his first time or not. I always took
Speaker 5: it as as it was. But but if it wasn't,
Speaker 5: then that that adds more credics to, you know, that
Speaker 5: sort of bad boy edge. But him just coming in
Speaker 5: being as direct as he is, that does give that
Speaker 5: sort of like bad boy, you know, sort of thing
Speaker 5: because the other guy was clearly a good guy, but
Speaker 5: she didn't want him.
Speaker 2: Okay, Well, the main thing that I took from that
Speaker 2: conversation was what I just said a minute ago about
Speaker 2: the walking contradiction. She said how he seems like a
Speaker 2: prophet and a pusher and he seemed She said that
Speaker 2: he seems like he's part truth, part fiction. I do
Speaker 2: think that she saw a bad edge with this dude.
Speaker 2: There's there's no way she saw this motherfucker staring at
Speaker 2: her through a taxi window and was like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: he's normal. I think what it was is she had
Speaker 2: not experienced someone like him. She was used to these
Speaker 2: button up ties, you know, basically lames, and here comes
Speaker 2: this guy that's a little bit on the edge, and
Speaker 2: she's like, oh, I want to see what this is about.
Speaker 2: But yeah, So what did y'all think of the conversation
Speaker 2: that he had in in the taxi cab with Senator Palatine,
Speaker 2: which was immediately followed up by his interaction with a
Speaker 2: very young prostitute played by a very young Jodie Foster.
Speaker 2: So what did y'all think of this part? All? Right?
Speaker 2: That was I thought the taxi driver with the politician
Speaker 2: being close to New York. I understand what he meant
Speaker 2: by the filth. They still that's been a problem for
Speaker 2: I guess since for fifty years, because it is New
Speaker 2: York City is a city built on top of a
Speaker 2: trash can, essentially. But I was more curious. I was
Speaker 2: more curious to understand the politicians. But Mike and whoever else,
Speaker 2: you all are more fans of the film, like his
Speaker 2: understanding of what Travis was trying to say, or did
Speaker 2: he even get it? He got it, he got it.
Speaker 2: But I'll go laugh. I'll let y'all whoever wants to
Speaker 2: take that up.
Speaker 6: No, I was just saying that I thought that Jodie
Speaker 6: Foster thing was crazy. I think she was actually twelve
Speaker 6: in this film. I think she's playing a prostitute. She's
Speaker 6: between twelve and fourteen. Yeah, yeah, yeah, So I thought
Speaker 6: that was crazy, and you could you can just kind
Speaker 6: of tell so that. That's always been kind of weird
Speaker 6: to me seeing her in that in that role.
Speaker 3: Playing that as as an actual young girl. Sports the
Speaker 3: politician stuff.
Speaker 2: The politician stuff is always.
Speaker 3: Kind of.
Speaker 6: Confused me because on one hand, it seems like palatine.
Speaker 2: Is it palatine? Yeah, Valentine, Palatine or whatever.
Speaker 6: Seems like he had the same mission as Travis, but
Speaker 6: for whatever reason, at some point he didn't see it
Speaker 6: that way, he.
Speaker 2: Being Travis or he being the Senator didn't.
Speaker 3: Travis didn't see it that way.
Speaker 2: Oh well, we'll we'll definitely get to that. But right, right, right,
Speaker 2: kenn Er Spike, did you take anything that you can
Speaker 2: throw at Nick to make him understand what the senator
Speaker 2: was doing?
Speaker 5: Well, I think he was bullshit, and I think, you know,
Speaker 5: he was confronted with a potential voter, and Travis was
Speaker 5: sitting there kind of you know, uh, speaking glowingly to him.
Speaker 1: I was I do have a question.
Speaker 5: Who said that they didn't want to take the cab.
Speaker 5: I kept trying to identify the voices.
Speaker 2: That's the assistant Palentine. Palatine wanted to take the cab.
Speaker 2: Because Palatine is a very typical democrat pretending to be
Speaker 2: one of the people. I'm taking cabs around and if
Speaker 2: you notice the second guy of the cab who was
Speaker 2: there photo op that's all it was about. He wanted
Speaker 2: to be able to get out of the cab and
Speaker 2: have people taking pictures like he's one of the you know,
Speaker 2: political just like us kind of thing. So I'm with Ken.
Speaker 2: I definitely think Time was bullshitting. He was listening. He
Speaker 2: didn't disagree with Travis. But I think what we're supposed
Speaker 2: to take from that is this is more of Travis
Speaker 2: being delusional about thinking he knows what's best for the
Speaker 2: city he's at there's filth and there's scum. But then
Speaker 2: when he's confronted with the filth and the scum, with
Speaker 2: the pimp trying to drag this fucking preteen prostitute out
Speaker 2: of the truck or out of his cap, he does nothing,
Speaker 2: nothing at all. So I've always found that to be interesting.
Speaker 2: But I'm gonna start with you, Spike. Uh oh, you
Speaker 2: got a face.
Speaker 4: No, I don't come up to later, but I do
Speaker 4: want to remember that you said that later.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm gonna start with you because you already kind
Speaker 2: of alluded to this the second date. This retakes it
Speaker 2: to a point theater, What did you think of this?
Speaker 4: It was weird, and I think they did a good
Speaker 4: job of framing it in the sense of where his
Speaker 4: mental space was and what reality was. As you mentioned
Speaker 4: in in the beginning, Mike, because he thought this was normal,
Speaker 4: Like he couldn't believe that she wanted to get up
Speaker 4: and walk out of this. He thought this was just
Speaker 4: like a regular everyday experience, So the fact that he
Speaker 4: was surprised by her reaction.
Speaker 1: May be more interesting in where this was going.
Speaker 2: What about you, Nick?
Speaker 8: I thought that these scenes was hilarious when he was
Speaker 8: in the theater, especially when he first when we see
Speaker 8: him going the first time, where he buying popcorn and candy,
Speaker 8: but he's trying to holler at the stewardess.
Speaker 2: She was like, do I need to get my manager?
Speaker 2: He was like, nah, you ain't got to do all that.
Speaker 1: Ye give me.
Speaker 2: She was like, we got what we got. I thought
Speaker 2: that was funny, but also, uh, the date itself, I'm
Speaker 2: surprised she even allowed she even allowed herself to go inside,
Speaker 2: knowing what she already knew about the place, and to
Speaker 2: the point where I was confident that he knew what
Speaker 2: he was talking about, because he made it seem like, oh, no,
Speaker 2: it's just some sex in there, but it's actually a film.
Speaker 2: So I'm watching this ship and I see the like
Speaker 2: these motherfuckers is just fucking So I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: he's crazy, he's insane. That she just figured out so
Speaker 2: she had to. I was like, girl, I wouldn't even
Speaker 2: sat down. She sat down and everything. I'm like, Nigga,
Speaker 2: this that's probably the most comfield theater and and and
Speaker 2: and Travis, like you mentioned talking about all that film
Speaker 2: that Nigga was lounging around like it was his living
Speaker 2: room in that damn theater. So I was like that
Speaker 2: that those scenes were like hilarious. The fact that he
Speaker 2: was just so out of it to even understand that
Speaker 2: that's not a good first date or official first date.
Speaker 3: Mm hmm, yeah, that's that's super wild.
Speaker 2: I really.
Speaker 6: Come with you on, Like I don't even know to
Speaker 6: understand like why she sheknew. I mean, once you get
Speaker 6: in front of the theater, you know where you're going.
Speaker 6: At this point, I don't understand, like why she even
Speaker 6: sat down in this moment, you know what this is.
Speaker 6: But she did get up very quickly once she would
Speaker 6: on the first clashes hit or whatever. But I did
Speaker 6: like how she didn't back down out of it. I
Speaker 6: thought she was just gonna kind of give him another chance.
Speaker 6: But now she was out of there, she was she
Speaker 6: was just like, nah, your ass is off, So I
Speaker 6: ain't right she wasn't trying to.
Speaker 4: I thought the only reason she gave him a chance
Speaker 4: because she was intrigued by him, like y'all were saying,
Speaker 4: And then he explained to her like Nick said, well wait,
Speaker 4: it ain't just that. But then when she's seen it,
Speaker 4: she was like, oh, hell nah, yeah, that's.
Speaker 2: How I've I was taken too. That she she gave
Speaker 2: him a shot because she was trying to see if, Okay,
Speaker 2: maybe he's telling the truth, maybe this is a regular movie.
Speaker 2: But when she saw I mean, and I do y'all
Speaker 2: gonna think I'm crazy. I do think it was a
Speaker 2: quote regular movie with a bunch of sex, because that's
Speaker 2: that's how a lot of those weirdo foreign films are.
Speaker 2: It's not just fucking like there is some weird ass
Speaker 2: artsy story there. But she was just like, this feels awkward.
Speaker 2: Then I'm on a second date with this dude and
Speaker 2: he took me to a movie where it's a bunch
Speaker 2: of sex. That's why when she gets outside, she's like, like,
Speaker 2: this is about as subtle as you just saying let's fuck.
Speaker 2: Because to your point, Mike, I saw the subtitles, I
Speaker 2: heard the narration in the background, I'm like, is this
Speaker 2: so weak? Or is this like like I couldn't I
Speaker 2: didn't know what to call it. All I know is
Speaker 2: that some white woman was in a goddamn gang bang
Speaker 2: and it was nothing but niggas in the theater. You
Speaker 2: said nothing again, went to a theater like this? Was it? Like?
Speaker 2: Was it weird?
Speaker 1: Like you? I can't remember, it's been a minute. They
Speaker 1: still have those around.
Speaker 2: Unfortunately, I don't think they do. Man, I've only been
Speaker 2: to one of those once. You have to experience it, man,
Speaker 2: you have to is it in the south. Was it
Speaker 2: in the south, or like you and Cali or we
Speaker 2: were on tour. We were on tour and.
Speaker 1: They definitely still got though. They got some here.
Speaker 2: See there he goes. He looks like I didn't know that,
Speaker 2: rubbing his faith too, Like I, I can recommend you
Speaker 2: a couple of.
Speaker 1: I take you when we get done.
Speaker 2: What them called nice put exactly.
Speaker 1: He got this.
Speaker 2: He always got a hold in one and.
Speaker 1: Three holes in one.
Speaker 2: Oh Jesus, Oh, that's one of the films.
Speaker 1: She was hot though. Man. She didn't even want the records.
Speaker 1: She don't want ship. She was like, all right, now
Speaker 1: I got two copies.
Speaker 2: She was like, can you please take my good She's
Speaker 2: like already got it at home.
Speaker 3: She was not trying to hear bro I.
Speaker 2: Don't blame her. I don't blame her, you know. I
Speaker 2: think this is like one of y'all said, this is
Speaker 2: a beautiful woman wanting a little bit of a bad boy,
Speaker 2: but she has standards at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: and Travis completely bypass those standards by taking her to
Speaker 2: a place like that.
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Speaker 2: You also have to remember she works for the senator
Speaker 2: who is I think he's trying to run for president.
Speaker 2: Say that's what he says, Like, yeah, because he was Yeah, so,
Speaker 2: I mean that's not a place that she can be
Speaker 2: seen at. So there's so many there's so many layers
Speaker 2: to why she was mad. But she completely stops talking
Speaker 2: to Travis. She's like, fuck this dude, even though he's
Speaker 2: calling her over and over again. So it's one of
Speaker 2: my favorite scenes of the whole movie. So he storms
Speaker 2: into the office where he's confronted by her coworker. So
Speaker 2: I'm gonna start with you, Ken, what did you think
Speaker 2: of what happens when he.
Speaker 1: Goes in there.
Speaker 5: It was very bold and bratch of him, and I
Speaker 5: thought she was going to be like terrified of him
Speaker 5: walking in there cursing everybody out like that, et cetera,
Speaker 5: et cetera. And it was definitely the beginning of his
Speaker 5: mental decline because every single approach, everything he's tried wasn't
Speaker 5: being returned. And you know, he realized the eraror of
Speaker 5: his ways, and he apologized over and over again, but
Speaker 5: she wasn't trying to hear it. But he was in
Speaker 5: the cussing everybody out, and and old Boy tried to
Speaker 5: come over and talk ship like bro.
Speaker 2: Ready for this, hey A, I was saying what to
Speaker 2: do when I nigga hit that come to action. Every
Speaker 2: time I see that ship cracks me up. He's, hey,
Speaker 2: that ship was funny, bro, and he I don't know,
Speaker 2: this is like one of the first like quotes that
Speaker 2: I was here. But it's always like, you know how
Speaker 2: the white man to be like, goddamn man. He kept
Speaker 2: saying that too, bro, oh man. The funniest part I
Speaker 2: hate to laugh at this, but the funniest part, and
Speaker 2: I don't even know if y'all caught it, but when
Speaker 2: he when he finally walks out the door, there's a
Speaker 2: woman that's on the door and.
Speaker 7: She just.
Speaker 2: And I don't know if that was like a mistake,
Speaker 2: like if that really accidentally happened.
Speaker 1: But that was me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I see that every time too. Like that.
Speaker 6: That absolutely. I don't think that was in the script.
Speaker 6: It couldn't have been. It was just too real, exactly
Speaker 6: what you're talking about.
Speaker 3: She was too real.
Speaker 2: I know I should have laughed in this either, but
Speaker 2: kidd when he was cussing her out afterwards, he was like,
Speaker 2: who the fuck don't call back after somebody? You go
Speaker 2: to hell and everybody crazy.
Speaker 4: If she didn't think he was crazy before, then she
Speaker 4: know you crazy?
Speaker 2: Exactly exactly. Yeah, But the the the narration before that
Speaker 2: is really interesting because he's talking and he says that
Speaker 2: he thinks he has stomach cancer, which is completely random.
Speaker 2: So it's just showing this like increased paranoia that Travis gets.
Speaker 2: And when he goes in there and he tells her,
Speaker 2: he's like, you're just like the rest of him. You know,
Speaker 2: you're in a hell and you're gonna die, just like
Speaker 2: everybody else. It's like, God, damn. It goes from that,
Speaker 2: and I'm sure the movie wasn't trying to make this funny.
Speaker 2: God damn, fuck.
Speaker 10: What the hell you got to walk up behind your chair,
Speaker 10: Lovie having Lovie having stomach issues?
Speaker 2: God, let's move on ship, all right? So this part
Speaker 2: I remember the very few times. For the very first
Speaker 2: few times I watched this movie. This scene didn't really
Speaker 2: hit until I got much older and saw why it
Speaker 2: was important. But he gives a ride to a guy
Speaker 2: who's spying on his cheating wife. Does anybody know who
Speaker 2: that guy was? Played by Scorsese? There you go, so
Speaker 2: he's played by Scorsese himself. So Nick sins, you're already talking,
Speaker 2: what did you think about this scene? I was like Damn.
Speaker 2: Scorsese was young as hell in this movie, and I
Speaker 2: knew as soon as he said it's some he gotta
Speaker 2: be upset to the black man especial I do that.
Speaker 2: And but like you said, Mike, I didn't really know
Speaker 2: how to take that scene. I don't know if this
Speaker 2: was more of like Travis getting justification for how he
Speaker 2: feels and what he will eventually do and later on
Speaker 2: in the movie, or this is just more of an
Speaker 2: example of what Travis keeps talking about as far as
Speaker 2: the filth uh in this city. But either way, I
Speaker 2: thought that scene was just very much like I don't know,
Speaker 2: I guess to me, it was like answering some question
Speaker 2: that I don't know if I knew exactly what it
Speaker 2: was yet.
Speaker 1: Anybody else, No, I don't.
Speaker 5: I don't really have an idea about it outside of
Speaker 5: him just being upset that his girls with some nigger. Yeah,
Speaker 5: but yeah that Yeah, I haven't really thought about it
Speaker 5: on that much.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 5: It just seemed like it definitely felt like it was
Speaker 5: oddly placed. But yeah, I don't know, I think that
Speaker 5: was I'll go ahead.
Speaker 4: I seen something afterwards that made him make more sense
Speaker 4: as I watched the recap of the movie than they
Speaker 4: were talking about.
Speaker 1: How said cheating I asked something. I didn't think anything.
Speaker 4: I didn't think anything about it when I seen it,
Speaker 4: which is why I want to go look and see
Speaker 4: what it meant.
Speaker 1: That's like, why is this random man? Shit didn't here?
Speaker 1: But I won't spoil it since you don't want to know.
Speaker 2: Well, I haven't seen this YouTube. We'll go to you last,
Speaker 2: because I want to see if they say something similar
Speaker 2: to what I say or what about what Rod is
Speaker 2: about to say.
Speaker 6: Y'all are still broken up on my end, so I'm sorry.
Speaker 6: It's like, like really it's hard. It's hard to hear y'all.
Speaker 6: But but yeah, so yeah, I just think it was
Speaker 6: it was just like a trigger for him to kind
Speaker 6: of like set him off. He was already spiraling and
Speaker 6: already thinking about like like harming people, and I think
Speaker 6: when he saw that it was something that may make
Speaker 6: him feel like, you know, maybe he could do something,
Speaker 6: uh for the greater good or something like that, because
Speaker 6: he felt like he was justified and what he gonna do.
Speaker 6: So that's what I always felt like that scene played
Speaker 6: a part on his mental breakdown.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so the way I the way I've always seen this,
Speaker 2: and not always, but since I've been a little bit
Speaker 2: older is when I was. When I was younger watching
Speaker 2: the film, I never really got the impression that that
Speaker 2: Travis was racist. But Travis is fucking racist. And the
Speaker 2: way you realize this is the way he sees people.
Speaker 2: So we're seeing the movie through Travis's eyes. And if
Speaker 2: you watch the way the movie is is pointing out
Speaker 2: black people. They're always doing something fucking weird. Even the
Speaker 2: guy that he works with that he's cool with, he's
Speaker 2: like pointing the gun bow what you can assume he's
Speaker 2: not really doing that because that's just fucking weird. Who
Speaker 2: sits around like doing the gun fingers over and over again.
Speaker 2: It's bizarre. There's a scene where he's walking down the
Speaker 2: street camera if it was before or after this part,
Speaker 2: but he sees this black after after the guy's walking
Speaker 2: down the street and he's just bugging out, and the
Speaker 2: way the camera is like shaking when he's walking, it's
Speaker 2: giving you this impression that this is how Travis sees
Speaker 2: black people. And we can definitely get to it, and
Speaker 2: y'all know what see I'm talking about later on when
Speaker 2: he gets to the convenience store. But what I got
Speaker 2: from this scene is pretty much what Rod just alluded to,
Speaker 2: which is this is the turning point for Travis where
Speaker 2: he sees he's not crazy because this guy in the
Speaker 2: back seat is like, my wife's up there cheating with
Speaker 2: his nigger. I got this gun. I'm gonna fucking kill her.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna kill her. I'm gonna put the gun to
Speaker 2: her face. I'm aa blow her face off. I'm gonna
Speaker 2: put it in her pussy. I'm a blow her pussy up.
Speaker 2: And he says to Travis, do you think I'm sick?
Speaker 2: And then the camera shows Travis's face and Travis is like,
Speaker 2: not really, bro, Nah, I don't really think you're sick.
Speaker 2: This is Travis getting that confirmation that I'm I'm not
Speaker 2: the only one that thinks this way. He already got
Speaker 2: it from Senator Palatine, because Palatine was like, yeah, I
Speaker 2: kind of feel you. Thank you for your opinion. Now
Speaker 2: we as the audience see that Palatine is fucking bullshitting him.
Speaker 2: But to Travis, Palatine is the real deal, which is
Speaker 2: why he becomes so obsessed with him putting his fucking
Speaker 2: uh his political posters in his house. But what we
Speaker 2: also get is this is the moment that Travis realizes that,
Speaker 2: you know what, I need to be a vigilanti because
Speaker 2: I need to save this city. So that's what I've
Speaker 2: always found interesting about this scene. So as you're saying that, Mike,
Speaker 2: I was gonna ask, like, why the fuck is the
Speaker 2: representation in this film as far as the black actors
Speaker 2: or the black characters, like so stupid? Like it was
Speaker 2: it was like I was, like Martins says, he like
Speaker 2: it was he intentional with that, because it came off
Speaker 2: very offensive and for no reason because like a lot
Speaker 2: of interactions aren't with black people, right, They're all around
Speaker 2: the city because it's New York City, so there is
Speaker 2: representation of New York City and the diversity of it,
Speaker 2: but like they're the way they're portrayed and how they're acting,
Speaker 2: which is weird. So I'm glad you touched on that.
Speaker 2: And I didn't think he but I didn't think he
Speaker 2: was racist because until you mentioned it, because when he
Speaker 2: talked about like early in the movie when he's getting
Speaker 2: the cab and stuff and he said the boss whatever
Speaker 2: says where do you want to go? Like, what's what
Speaker 2: areas do you want to deal with? He was like,
Speaker 2: I'll go anywhere, it don't matter. And then even in
Speaker 2: his narration he talks about I go to Harlem, I
Speaker 2: go this. I'm like, oh, okay. So he was like, I
Speaker 2: even pick up what do you call him?
Speaker 3: Movie?
Speaker 2: I think spooks. Yeah, So I was like, okay, So, yeah,
Speaker 2: he's using horrible terminology, but it is the seventies. But
Speaker 2: at the same time, he's willing to pick up anybody,
Speaker 2: That's what I'm saying. So I was like, what is
Speaker 2: this dude. I'm like, I can't really figure out his
Speaker 2: character this yet. So you got to think about if
Speaker 2: the reason Travis takes his job is because his mind
Speaker 2: won't stop wandering at night for him to sleep, So
Speaker 2: he wants to be able to go and be out
Speaker 2: driving and working in all hours of the night. You're
Speaker 2: not gonna go to like the nicer parts of New
Speaker 2: York and get someone to pick up at two o'clock
Speaker 2: in the morning. You are gonna get that in the
Speaker 2: more dangerous parts of town. So I think that, and
Speaker 2: also Travis, whether or not he wants to admit it,
Speaker 2: he's attracted to the filthy parts of the city. Because
Speaker 2: he is this walking contradiction. If you look at his house,
Speaker 2: he lives in a fucking pig style. His house is disgusting.
Speaker 2: But remember in that first day, he brings up that
Speaker 2: whole thing about the sign that says I want to organized,
Speaker 2: and he thinks it's like a joke or whatever, and
Speaker 2: he even has that sign in his house. But his
Speaker 2: house is a fucking mess. Travis is, he's completely mixed
Speaker 2: up in the brain. And the reason I don't think
Speaker 2: that the movie necessarily showed black people in a bad
Speaker 2: light is because you do get diversity. You get the
Speaker 2: guy that he works with, who's an honest guy. He's
Speaker 2: an honest guy that's just working to make a living,
Speaker 2: but Travis sees him weird. It doesn't seem like he's
Speaker 2: acting weird towards anybody else, but Travis sees it. And
Speaker 2: he even borrows money from the guy. So it's like
Speaker 2: this weird version of racism that Travis has where he's like,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm surrounded by these type of people, but
Speaker 2: there's like maybe one or two good ones. But then
Speaker 2: he goes to the bad parts of town and you
Speaker 2: see pimps, pushers, drug addicts, drug dealers, So Travis is
Speaker 2: looking at these people like these are scum. That makes
Speaker 2: sense because there was that scene with the woman and
Speaker 2: the little kid on the street, she was chasing him
Speaker 2: or something like that. I was like, what the fuck
Speaker 2: is going on with this shit?
Speaker 5: But okay, yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, I think it's
Speaker 5: definitely a reflection of the neighborhoods and certain neighborhoods of
Speaker 5: New York. So I think it was being honest in that.
Speaker 5: And you know, it wasn't a lot of black people,
Speaker 5: but I don't.
Speaker 1: Know if it.
Speaker 5: I didn't feel the offensive part of it the way
Speaker 5: you did, Nick, and because there weren't a lot in there,
Speaker 5: and I think because they were in certain areas.
Speaker 1: I just kind of took it for what it was.
Speaker 5: And then you and You've also see like white people
Speaker 5: doing the similar things as well. The thing about the
Speaker 5: him point of the gun, Mike, I just always took
Speaker 5: that as like foreshadowing when he called him a killer,
Speaker 5: And I also took that as him kind of poking
Speaker 5: fun at him or knowing that he was in the
Speaker 5: military in Vietnam. And I think that's why I always he
Speaker 5: was just kind of referring to that and just kind
Speaker 5: of poking at him, you know, poking fun out of him.
Speaker 11: For that sort of thing, and then foreshadow of what
Speaker 11: was to come and the offense I took. And I know,
Speaker 11: LOUI got you want to speak on this too. Defence
Speaker 11: I saw was like the way the black people were trade.
Speaker 2: Like even the cab colleague he had, it seemed like
Speaker 2: he was black and lazy at his job because he
Speaker 2: didn't really say shit. He was just like sitting around.
Speaker 5: He's sitting around with the other white guys that were there,
Speaker 5: but he was it just he just gave off for
Speaker 5: like a like a a.
Speaker 2: Non compromary aloofness about him and his job. The obviously,
Speaker 2: like you mentioned the pushers and the drug dealers, but
Speaker 2: like that's those are what you would see in the streets.
Speaker 2: But then when we get to the scene later on,
Speaker 2: it's like the thievery of the criminal the gangs, Like
Speaker 2: it felt like it was just like showing stuff that
Speaker 2: white people would assume that's how black people were in
Speaker 2: the seventies or like out and about in the streets.
Speaker 2: So we'll definitely tackle that. But if you also look
Speaker 2: at the fact that that guy was a thief, sure
Speaker 2: he tried to rob a convenience store with the gun. Sure,
Speaker 2: but what is the worst crime of this movie the
Speaker 2: fact that somebody is pimping out a fucking twelve thirteen
Speaker 2: year old girl. And who's that being done by white people?
Speaker 2: So this is this is I feel like what Tarantino
Speaker 2: wishes he could do is capture the racism without being
Speaker 2: racist himself. I think scor Sesse actually does it well
Speaker 2: because he's like, look, this is how white people in
Speaker 2: this time saw black people. But when you really dig
Speaker 2: into shit, the people fucking committing the worst atrocities are
Speaker 2: white people. You know, even when you look at the
Speaker 2: dude that's that's that's in the back of the car
Speaker 2: talking about his wife cheating. She's cheating with a black guy.
Speaker 2: But what's this guy talking about doing. He's talking about
Speaker 2: killing her, putting a gun in her vagina and shooting her. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that was nuts. So scor Sesse is so fucking good
Speaker 2: at this where he's like, look, these motherfuckers are racist.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna show you that that these people do exist.
Speaker 2: But the worst motherfucker in this movie the white people.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: But you got lou.
Speaker 4: Oh god, the pimp, the pimp was originally cast as
Speaker 4: a black man in a production house.
Speaker 1: Oh, he was written in the script as a black man.
Speaker 4: The production house made them change it, and he was
Speaker 4: written as a racist as well, Travis, And they made
Speaker 4: them change it because they didn't want to riot outside.
Speaker 4: So that that that helped me understand that scene in
Speaker 4: him being a racist.
Speaker 2: You know, I've never heard that. I don't know who
Speaker 2: the YouTuber is that you saw.
Speaker 4: I seen it in two places, not a ship, not
Speaker 4: seeing in two places. The pimp was Originally they got
Speaker 4: the famous dude who played the pimp. Now they got
Speaker 4: him blasted out because they thought it would be too
Speaker 4: controversial for the pimp to be black.
Speaker 1: Mmmm.
Speaker 2: But everybody else a rich white.
Speaker 4: No, they had they changed that in the script too,
Speaker 4: But you said, we'll get to that later. So everybody
Speaker 4: was black. I'm a lot the villains, all the villains,
Speaker 4: that's what you say. Everybody are you talking about, like
Speaker 4: the pimp, not the guy, not the guy that you're
Speaker 4: talking about, but the pimp, and then everybody associated with
Speaker 4: him was black in the original script.
Speaker 2: That's interesting because when you've listened to SCORSESEI talk about
Speaker 2: this film, that's not the impression that he gave at all. Huh. Interesting, Well,
Speaker 2: last point before you move on, I will say, kid,
Speaker 2: I don't know if you laughed at the cabbies and
Speaker 2: their stories about the customers.
Speaker 7: What got on the midgets like, yeah, they like to
Speaker 7: they always like to feel taller us, like to pick
Speaker 7: him up or something.
Speaker 2: Like these motherfuckers pieces of ship. They ain't me talking
Speaker 2: about anything. Well, you know, midges didn't have rights back then,
Speaker 2: so for little people, sorry, didn't have rights back then. Oh,
Speaker 2: Spike left to go watch some more of his little
Speaker 2: YouTube video. He'll try to drop dollargs on you by
Speaker 2: me if what Spike is saying is true, and that's
Speaker 2: really interesting to me, Actually it is. That's again, that's
Speaker 2: the feeling that I got. I was like, bro, like
Speaker 2: what you were saying, Lou as far as like the
Speaker 2: portrayal of black people to fail if they were if
Speaker 2: they would have went with that original script, obviously, I'm like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is like too heavy handed.
Speaker 1: But you asked him to change it.
Speaker 2: If that is true, I still don't know that it
Speaker 2: all the way changes the point of it changes my
Speaker 2: point that I said a few minutes ago. But I
Speaker 2: don't know that necessarily changes the point about SCORSESEI and
Speaker 2: the way he casted or the way he wrote Travis
Speaker 2: as being or depicted Travis as being racist. But I
Speaker 2: would actually be interested to see how this would have
Speaker 2: hit if the pimp and everyone surrounding him was black.
Speaker 2: I assumed they still had Jodi Foster, so his horse
Speaker 2: were still white. So I'm sure Travis would have seen
Speaker 2: that as the ultimate in the issue, You're a black
Speaker 2: pimp pimping out young white women. That probably would have
Speaker 2: been a bit too heavy. Yeah, so I'm glad they
Speaker 2: changed that. But so after this, Travis meets up with
Speaker 2: easy Andy and buys a gun. Then he goes back
Speaker 2: and he builds all kinds of contraptions to assist with
Speaker 2: like quick drawing the guns, and he also starts a
Speaker 2: really rigorous workout routine and diet. So what's going on
Speaker 2: with him in this in this scene, this is not
Speaker 2: the one y'all want to get to, but just the
Speaker 2: whole workout and diet thing. What's going on with him here?
Speaker 3: You just think about an arsenal.
Speaker 2: Did you say gun as a singular? Well, he goes
Speaker 2: to him to buy a gun, But now I think
Speaker 2: he was.
Speaker 12: Just like, well, shit, I'll take all these motherfuckers about
Speaker 12: the start a war.
Speaker 6: No, this was I always liked like these these scenes
Speaker 6: or whatever, just him you know, building a contraption and
Speaker 6: you just really see how I mean, at this point,
Speaker 6: tapping into like his you know, war experience and things
Speaker 6: like that, and he's about to Okay, he's about to
Speaker 6: be like a vigilante at this point. So uh, I
Speaker 6: think we get some dialogue and him narrating at this
Speaker 6: point as well.
Speaker 2: So yeah, and then after that, that's when he starts to.
Speaker 6: Go try to uh surveil, do surveillance on the on
Speaker 6: the security detail for the politician, right, mm hmm.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I'm always interested in like arms dealers and the people
Speaker 2: that they deal with. So I feel like this is
Speaker 2: kind of like a side story of like the customers
Speaker 2: of the motherfuckers who always armed the streets and you know,
Speaker 2: somehow these guns end up, you know, on the streets,
Speaker 2: and this is the guy who actually does it. So
Speaker 2: the way he talks about these guns and how he
Speaker 2: tries to connect with his cliss, like he was trying
Speaker 2: to connect with Travis a little bit too as well.
Speaker 2: Like I always find those things interesting, So like this
Speaker 2: was very like a standout scene for me as far
Speaker 2: as like seeing Travis like light up when he sees
Speaker 2: all these guns and all this ship, and like his
Speaker 2: imagination goes crazy as far as what he has to
Speaker 2: do next.
Speaker 5: M hm, Well, and you know he's a Vietnam vet,
Speaker 5: so he's he definitely would know how to use it all.
Speaker 5: One of the things that I found interesting was that,
Speaker 5: you know, the guy was white, you know, you know,
Speaker 5: and he's selling all these guns and to these people
Speaker 5: so always because I think he's in sales or something
Speaker 5: like that. So I was like, here this guy walking
Speaker 5: in too you know, you would look at him and
Speaker 5: be just unassuming, just another white guy walking through the
Speaker 5: city of New York, you know, getting out of the
Speaker 5: cab and he's packed with fucking weapons.
Speaker 1: Bro in a fucking bake about.
Speaker 5: To sell him to a guy who has intentions to
Speaker 5: do horrible things with.
Speaker 1: Him, and he's just gonna go bout his day.
Speaker 5: And then after that, the other part that I always
Speaker 5: thought was interesting was he was like.
Speaker 1: Ship when he bought all of them, Like, well, Ship,
Speaker 1: what you want drugs? I got everything you need? Bro got.
Speaker 5: Okay, a fall, I got, I got I got syrup
Speaker 5: and that, like said she for a while out you
Speaker 5: might as well party.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you too.
Speaker 3: I was just about to mention that King.
Speaker 4: I was wondering what this was, preparing him buying all
Speaker 4: them guns with preparing us. I was wondering what the
Speaker 4: payoff for that was gonna be. That's what that sam anything.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I think what's what's going on with him
Speaker 2: here is that he's actually preparing to be a vigilante.
Speaker 2: He's you know, he changes his diet because if y'all
Speaker 2: remember before this, he was eating fucking cereal and he
Speaker 2: was pouring like liquor on it and then a bunch
Speaker 2: of syrup, I mean syrup sugar. He was, he was.
Speaker 2: He was living like a black crackhead in the fucking
Speaker 2: because I ain't never seen white people pour fucking alcohol
Speaker 2: on corn flakes. I've seen some brothers do that, unfortunately,
Speaker 2: So no way in real life, in real life, unfortunately. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I kind of wanted to taste it, but I didn't.
Speaker 2: They had the milk, and they're all wild to me.
Speaker 2: They had the milk and they're already and then they
Speaker 2: put jim beam over it, and I was like, what
Speaker 2: on already? Corn flakes. Honestly, getting drunk while eating cereal
Speaker 2: does sound interesting because it's like, you know, I mean,
Speaker 2: because how much you don't look at me like that?
Speaker 2: Because it ain't that much different when people put jim
Speaker 2: bean in coffee.
Speaker 4: It's just a lot different. Sometimes. Who mixes alcohol with dairy?
Speaker 4: It's breadth insane everybody. That's that's a white Russian, that's
Speaker 4: a you know, kolua bro. Like what you're talking about, y'all, we're.
Speaker 6: Talking about a child's breakfast of Christ.
Speaker 2: I don't want hear nothing from you. You motherfuckers over
Speaker 2: there creaking blood and ship in church make fun of
Speaker 2: me for putting little liquor on my call flights. The
Speaker 2: thing that was agreed with Mike was the sugar, because
Speaker 2: that bot a personal sized box of sugar and sprinkling
Speaker 2: all like it was like, I don't know. That seemed
Speaker 2: reminds me of that part in the fucking house party
Speaker 2: when they were making the kool aid. Look at all
Speaker 2: that sugar, like, girl's good, That's what I was thinking.
Speaker 2: He was pouring all that sugar, but watching watching the
Speaker 2: soul train. Man Travers didn't talk with black people, but
Speaker 2: he fucked with black people.
Speaker 1: Did so.
Speaker 2: After this we get the scene where he's kind of
Speaker 2: talking to the Secret Service guard at the Senator Palatine rally.
Speaker 2: But following this, when he goes back home, we have
Speaker 2: the most famous scene of the entire film.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 2: This is where he is practicing of what he's going
Speaker 2: to do to a nigger in the mirror. Bro He's like,
Speaker 2: I wish a nigger would What you'll think of the scene, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I kind of, man, you're talking to me, talking to
Speaker 2: I don't see nobody else in here. It's just so hard.
Speaker 13: And then when he was just doing this ship that
Speaker 13: was that was the funniest thing to me, right, And.
Speaker 14: I like how he acted like he was like, okay,
Speaker 14: I let this. I'm like this stick of DUTs.
Speaker 1: Did he jump on the bed and do that ship?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 5: Yeah, he was practicing how he was going to get
Speaker 5: the knife and the gun out and ship on the
Speaker 5: bed and ship like that.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Hey, he was good though he made that little contraption
Speaker 1: in his arm. I don't know what ye man.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I feel like I too. Like we started like
Speaker 6: gradually cutting his hair off. I feel like that's a
Speaker 6: military thing too, where his hair was getting lower and
Speaker 6: to the point where he just did a full mohawk.
Speaker 2: And I'm sure it was crazy.
Speaker 6: White boys back in the military that had them fucking hairstyles.
Speaker 6: So I think he was reverting back to like a
Speaker 6: time when he was in that state.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and you know, I don't know this, but I was.
Speaker 1: Was that ad lib? Did he just make all that
Speaker 1: ship up?
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 4: Research that's a good question.
Speaker 1: I'm actually gonna looked that up.
Speaker 2: He probably did. I mean, they were probably it was
Speaker 2: probably a little bit, but then de Niro just kind
Speaker 2: of went off the rails with it. But this is
Speaker 2: the go ahead.
Speaker 6: Well her scor sa she don't doesn't do a lot
Speaker 6: of improv stuff. He likes to stick straight to his scripts.
Speaker 6: He don't like people doing improv. So it probably was
Speaker 6: written that way. Man, what I've heard about scor Sacy.
Speaker 6: I don't know if he was always like that, but
Speaker 6: I know later on scor Sacy he he like, do
Speaker 6: not mess up my script, even like the biggest like.
Speaker 2: Especially with the party. The party he got heard.
Speaker 6: I think, uh, Leonardo was talking about it and Matt
Speaker 6: Damon and they were talking about, Yeah, he doesn't.
Speaker 3: Like you to straight away from his script.
Speaker 4: Jack Nicholas part was sumprovised and that was its famously
Speaker 4: known that he improvised the whole thing.
Speaker 2: But the yeah, yeah, I was I was gonna let
Speaker 2: you finish, but you spiked on d like that.
Speaker 1: Rober I didn't say nothing. Nick.
Speaker 2: They got both of us love don't do that. But
Speaker 2: that dialedold scene with with Jack Nicholson when he was
Speaker 2: I forgot who he was talking to his girl or
Speaker 2: something like that. Somebody they said, that's not that wasn't
Speaker 2: in the script at all. But but Rod's not crazy.
Speaker 2: I've heard that too, that Scorsese does not like people
Speaker 2: to kind of venture off. But I'm sure he made
Speaker 2: an exception because it's fucking Jack Nicholson. But this is
Speaker 2: one of his first films. This is like his third
Speaker 2: fourth film, so he probably and he didn't write it.
Speaker 2: Somebody else wrote the script, so he probably was just like,
Speaker 2: I don't really care that much. And and I'm sure
Speaker 2: it also had to do with the fact that this
Speaker 2: scene was so good it seemed incredibly natural, Like when
Speaker 2: I watched this scene, this really does feel like some
Speaker 2: crazy ass white man that they he's gonna go take
Speaker 2: over New York. So I don't know, I will say
Speaker 2: before you move on, Mike, the scene with the Secret
Speaker 2: Service agent, what's hilarious. He was like, you, if you
Speaker 2: want to sign up, to give me your address and
Speaker 2: I'll say the information. I was like, okay. I was like,
Speaker 2: I don't know how crazy we're gonna see all that,
Speaker 2: but if you give him his real name and ship,
Speaker 2: he's a dumb ass. But he yeah, he didn't.
Speaker 1: But I think the okay, so you guys think the Secret.
Speaker 5: Service agent was was just taking notes and aware to
Speaker 5: look out for him later.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think he was completely bullshit and he
Speaker 2: was not gonna get that man a job. He thought
Speaker 2: he was fucking weird. So he was like, oh yeah, man, yeah, sure,
Speaker 2: what's yours? Okay cool? And he's probably like, okay, I'm
Speaker 2: gonna have somebody investigate this motherfucker. And he gave me
Speaker 2: the right.
Speaker 5: Address, and when he got the wrong one, he definitely
Speaker 5: probably put him on how alert, you know, the lookout
Speaker 5: for him.
Speaker 2: So the next scene is a very controversial scene, and
Speaker 2: this is the scene at the convenience store. I'll start
Speaker 2: with you, Rob, what did you what did you think
Speaker 2: of this scene?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 3: This scene, so I didn't like I didn't necessarily like
Speaker 3: this scene.
Speaker 6: I understand why it was controversial, and it just kind
Speaker 6: of lends to Spike saying that about you know, the
Speaker 6: pimps being black. I like looking at that, I could, man,
Speaker 6: it does make sense that they had to probably change
Speaker 6: it up to where it wasn't so much violence against
Speaker 6: black people, but it's still because it was written a
Speaker 6: certain way, you still kind of felt it.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I.
Speaker 6: Always hated this, and then then the convenience store got
Speaker 6: kicking him or beating him, like get him afterwards he's
Speaker 6: clearly clearly dead.
Speaker 3: So yeah, that that always like rubbed me the wrong way.
Speaker 2: But you know, yeah, yeah, I never I never liked
Speaker 2: that scene. Spike, what you think.
Speaker 4: I thought they were gonna start hitting down towards him
Speaker 4: being violent against black people, similar to Rods thing.
Speaker 1: I was like, I did, did sto have to be black?
Speaker 4: And then you beat the shit out of him too
Speaker 4: after you clearly shot him and didn't even have them
Speaker 4: rob in the store. Just it goes to what Nick
Speaker 4: said earlier and what Rodgers said of how they were
Speaker 4: portraying black people in this film. This is when I
Speaker 4: really started to notice it, and that's what made me
Speaker 4: look it up.
Speaker 1: At the end, I was like, this kind of kind
Speaker 1: of racist. This feels kind of racist, but I can't
Speaker 1: really put my finger on it. So interesting, Uh, Nick, Yeah.
Speaker 2: I mean he just shoots him without any hesitation. I
Speaker 2: think this is the first kill that we see him
Speaker 2: doing the old film. And of course it's against black people.
Speaker 2: And then as an audience member, if I wasn't black,
Speaker 2: people will say that's justified because he was robbing the
Speaker 2: convenience store. And not only was he robbing a convenience store,
Speaker 2: he's robbing his friend because de Niro comes in and says, hey,
Speaker 2: how you doing. Even you know, the guy greets them
Speaker 2: and everything, so you seem like they're familiar with each other.
Speaker 2: So this is like a local store, so it seems
Speaker 2: like again de Niro is doing the right thing, you know.
Speaker 2: And then but then like the beating at the end,
Speaker 2: it was just like not only the beating at the end,
Speaker 2: but the convenience store owner letting him go and say
Speaker 2: like just get out of here. You did your job,
Speaker 2: you did a good thing. I'm gonna protect you. You
Speaker 2: know what I'm saying. It's just it was it was
Speaker 2: just like all right, what like I got to see
Speaker 2: how this film ends, because at this point, I'm like,
Speaker 2: I don't know what the fuck I'm like, I don't
Speaker 2: feel like I'm I'm feeling things I shouldn't feel because
Speaker 2: this is such a classic film, wondering why people look
Speaker 2: at it in high regard because this is a piece
Speaker 2: of shit scene.
Speaker 5: I would love to know what black people thought, those
Speaker 5: that watched it back back in the seventies. You know,
Speaker 5: we're you know, times have changed a lot now and
Speaker 5: we kind of look at things differently.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I didn't take it as a racist or anything like that.
Speaker 5: You know, I think when you're in a bad neighborhood
Speaker 5: in that way, there are reasons why they're there because
Speaker 5: of you know, systemic racism and all the other stuff
Speaker 5: that you can add on. So there could be a
Speaker 5: larger conversation that we had that we have about that.
Speaker 5: But for me, you know, this was the first act
Speaker 5: of violence that I saw towards a black person, and
Speaker 5: the reaction by the owner was violent in that way
Speaker 5: because he mentioned that this was the fourth or fifth
Speaker 5: time it happened that that month or that year or
Speaker 5: something like that, So over the top, yes, but he
Speaker 5: validated it with the reasons why he was frustrated, and
Speaker 5: him killing for me was a sign of him finally
Speaker 5: getting getting a chance to act out in violence in
Speaker 5: a way in his mind that was justified, and probably setting.
Speaker 1: Up like.
Speaker 5: This weird sort of test run to get to the
Speaker 5: palatine that he was gonna kill because he was gonna
Speaker 5: kill a white guy, you know, later on that was
Speaker 5: his main objective, was to kill a white guy who
Speaker 5: was running for president or whatever.
Speaker 1: So that's why I never.
Speaker 5: Really looked at the racist elements of it, you know
Speaker 5: when I when I watched it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this this scene is definitely a hard one to swallow.
Speaker 2: I don't think the movie itself is racist. For this scene,
Speaker 2: I definitely think that Travis is supposed to be It's
Speaker 2: supposed to be implied that he is racist because he
Speaker 2: sees the guy robbing the store. He could have easily
Speaker 2: just been like, all right, man, put your gun down whatever,
Speaker 2: whatever he was dying to kill somebody. Travis could not
Speaker 2: wait to kill someone face the second he saw the dude.
Speaker 2: When the dude turned around, bow immediately immediately. Is it
Speaker 2: racist that the shop owner then hit him with a
Speaker 2: fucking a bat after he was dead. I don't know
Speaker 2: if that's racist. If a motherfucker came in my store
Speaker 2: pulled a gun onto me, I might fucking whip his
Speaker 2: ass a little bit after he was dead too. I
Speaker 2: don't go that's right. I want you to go to
Speaker 2: hell remembering what happened in my motherfucking store. God damn it,
Speaker 2: the scene just looked weird to me. The way the
Speaker 2: dude was just like slumped over, and the fact that
Speaker 2: he like propped him up and set him up against
Speaker 2: the counter before hitting him, and he's just it's such
Speaker 2: a weirdly filmed scene that it always just makes me
Speaker 2: uncomfortable from like a racist standpoint, because it feels like
Speaker 2: the fucking store owner that felt like he enjoyed hitting
Speaker 2: that black man while he was dead and on the
Speaker 2: ground like that. So I give it that it felt real.
Speaker 2: It definitely felt real shot to me. What made damn.
Speaker 4: No, I just agree And the way it shot it
Speaker 4: looked like a documentary. Mike, you just stopped in the
Speaker 4: MIDI sentence.
Speaker 2: I heard you, I heard you start talking, and I
Speaker 2: want you to get it out. I'm the host man,
Speaker 2: so y'all are more important than me, So just get
Speaker 2: it out.
Speaker 4: Now I'm just agreeing with you and Rod did it
Speaker 4: felt like a documentary that scene, that shot, That's.
Speaker 1: What it looked real.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna mute myself.
Speaker 2: You know what, I don't mine.
Speaker 5: I do agree with you, Mike that he was he
Speaker 5: was definitely itching to kill someone, and you know, this
Speaker 5: guy just happened to give him an opportunity because at
Speaker 5: this point, he's he's already gone. He got a briefcase
Speaker 5: full of weapons, and he's ready to go kill the president,
Speaker 5: and he's he's a former Vietnam vet. I would assume
Speaker 5: that he's struggling to sleep because he PTSD or whatever
Speaker 5: and just having dreams and nightmares and stuff like that.
Speaker 5: So he's an insomniac and he's probably still not sleeping
Speaker 5: anymore his girlfriend who left him, so he is absolute gone.
Speaker 1: And hickme.
Speaker 5: This guy who's acting in this volid weight with a
Speaker 5: gun robbing his place, he was like, I finally got
Speaker 5: my shot.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 5: I didn't mean that in that way, but yeah, I
Speaker 5: finally got a chance, you know, to kill somebody, and.
Speaker 2: He took it. But I also look at it like, again,
Speaker 2: I tried a lot to not have a twenty twenty
Speaker 2: six gays and go back to seventy six, and I'm thinking, like,
Speaker 2: at that time, in this specific part of the country,
Speaker 2: was this U needed thing to push the for the
Speaker 2: and maybe not the again. And I'm black, so of
Speaker 2: course I'm biased, but like hesing a black person in
Speaker 2: that that way to justify not only murder, but justify
Speaker 2: the crime that goes on in the that city is
Speaker 2: just kind of like, all right, that's kind of very
Speaker 2: low hanging fruit and against I'm sure black people at
Speaker 2: that time, like you said, Mike still had an issue
Speaker 2: with it, you know, just like black people today would
Speaker 2: probably have an issue with that. Seemed like that, That's
Speaker 2: what I was thinking. I was just like, Okay, what
Speaker 2: is the overall purpose in the story with this movie forward?
Speaker 2: Of course we're seeing a man become more violent as
Speaker 2: the movie goes along, but I'm like, damn, like you
Speaker 2: just killing like again And going back to Louse with
Speaker 2: his point of like the original script, there was supposed
Speaker 2: to be a lot of black death because no white
Speaker 2: man got killed in this man or in the original script.
Speaker 1: But he was going to kill a white man.
Speaker 2: He was going to, but he didn't because that's him.
Speaker 2: But I know what I'm saying, but but but because
Speaker 2: he couldn't do that, he kills a lot of black people.
Speaker 2: That's my thing in the original script. Now obviously in
Speaker 2: the movie it's different. But based off of lou was saying,
Speaker 2: if I'm going off for that as fact, then that's like, okay,
Speaker 2: that makes the movie come off different. I do think
Speaker 2: that there's a difference between making a movie that's racist
Speaker 2: and making a racist character. I do think that Travis
Speaker 2: Bickle is supposed to be racist. He just I think
Speaker 2: that the subtlety of the whole thing is that, you know,
Speaker 2: if you know how racism works, you can tell he's
Speaker 2: racist by the way he's looking at black people. But
Speaker 2: I never really got the impression that the filmmakers themselves
Speaker 2: were being racist in the way that they portrayed black people.
Speaker 2: Travis is clearly going to a certain part of town,
Speaker 2: and in that certain part of town these things happen.
Speaker 2: So him going to this part of town, going to
Speaker 2: this type of store, and eventually having a black person robit,
Speaker 2: I think that kind of makes sense. It's still uncomfortable
Speaker 2: as fuck to watch, and it's still makes my stomach
Speaker 2: hurt every time I see it, but I also kind
Speaker 2: of think that that might be the point. We're supposed
Speaker 2: to feel uncomfortable in a way that Travis doesn't. Travis
Speaker 2: doesn't feel uncomfortable about what he did. He just doesn't
Speaker 2: want the cops to come get him.
Speaker 5: Because he has another He still wants to kill the
Speaker 5: other guy. And Nick, you said earlier, the city of
Speaker 5: New York is a character too. So that's why I
Speaker 5: never really applied like this whole sort of racial outlook
Speaker 5: on it, because I just looked at it as just
Speaker 5: part of the city that's that way by everything else,
Speaker 5: by just racist America, right.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: And I'm not arguing that the film is like the
Speaker 2: filmmakers are racist. What I'm saying is that, just like
Speaker 2: you know, Rod, I always try to shout you out with,
Speaker 2: I have a thought about this, and like when certain
Speaker 2: black characters go through those black tropes or those black
Speaker 2: you know, situations that are stereotypical, it's just I'm like,
Speaker 2: was that necessary? Could this been another ethnicity, could have
Speaker 2: been another character portrayal instead of using black people to
Speaker 2: me as low hanging fruit. That's all I'm saying is
Speaker 2: that based off of what I watched and some of
Speaker 2: the commentary Lou made about what he watched from others
Speaker 2: recap it was just kind of like, Okay, I can
Speaker 2: see I'm glad they went in this direction because it
Speaker 2: was already tough going through that scene, especially during that
Speaker 2: time period. If they weren't even heavy handed on it,
Speaker 2: then I can see why other people will be like, Okay,
Speaker 2: this is a racist film.
Speaker 4: I don't think this filmmaking in it was racist. I
Speaker 4: think that the person who wrote the script was writing
Speaker 4: it racist. I think Swiss Says did a good job
Speaker 4: in taking that out of it and making it a
Speaker 4: more classic palatable film, though I.
Speaker 2: Don't even I feel you, Spike, I don't even know
Speaker 2: if I would agree that the person who wrote the
Speaker 2: script would have been viewed as racist because Travis, in
Speaker 2: my opinion, Travis was intentionally going to these parts of town.
Speaker 2: Would be like why I can't and give I can't
Speaker 2: even give like a comparison, because it's exactly what it is.
Speaker 2: Travis was going to these parts of town where it
Speaker 2: was predominantly black people, poor black people, and he immediately
Speaker 2: was like, this is scum, this is filth, et cetera,
Speaker 2: et cetera, and it's that point.
Speaker 4: To that point he's calling we hear his mind, his
Speaker 4: commentary being that he's specifically in black neighborhoods and referring
Speaker 4: to New York this way. I think that makes it
Speaker 4: even more kind of like racist Travis.
Speaker 2: Though I don't think that makes the person that wrote it,
Speaker 2: because in my opinion, it's not like they made Travis
Speaker 2: seem like a good guy. I don't think you're supposed
Speaker 2: to watch this but even though some weird white boys do,
Speaker 2: I don't think you're supposed to watch this film and
Speaker 2: look at Travis like he's a sympathetic character or hero.
Speaker 4: I bet it's some insils did, Dude one hundred, I
Speaker 4: wouldn't million, but this is what I thought when I
Speaker 4: watched this, Like, I bet this some white boys out
Speaker 4: here love this fun.
Speaker 2: With this ending, I could easily see how like some
Speaker 2: people can say, he's like the what we now know
Speaker 2: as like the anti hero. Yes, yes he's Bruce Wayne,
Speaker 2: he's Batman, but it's like, no, I don't think that
Speaker 2: the filmmakers meant for it to be portrayed that way.
Speaker 2: Travis throughout this film is supposed to be fucked up,
Speaker 2: a fucked up character. He's not supposed to be a
Speaker 2: good guy. He hates women, he hates black people, he
Speaker 2: hates poor people, he hates dirty people. The most interesting
Speaker 2: thing about Travis is he hates what He is, a filthy, dirty, nasty,
Speaker 2: scummy person.
Speaker 4: He sounded like a twenty twenty six intill one hundred
Speaker 4: percent spike with exactly what he sounded like.
Speaker 2: And to your point, Mike, if I was to write
Speaker 2: a slave Master, I'm going to write the way that
Speaker 2: he's saying these things and having these thoughts. And we
Speaker 2: were like, that's here. But you got this interesting nick
Speaker 2: is that they take this this angle of racism, and
Speaker 2: even for nineteen seventy six, they make it more subtle.
Speaker 2: They could have made Travis just running around calling everybody nigger,
Speaker 2: aka what Tarantino would do. But instead they're just like, look,
Speaker 2: he's a subtle racist. He's he doesn't like black people,
Speaker 2: but he's not doing it in a traditional way. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Rob got something to say to defend his king.
Speaker 3: What's up, man, It's just funny with y'all pick and choose.
Speaker 2: I knew it's what he was thinking.
Speaker 6: A shot a black man in a face mm hmm
Speaker 6: in this film.
Speaker 2: And if he called him, if he said nigger one
Speaker 2: hundred and eighty times before that, there will be a
Speaker 2: Tarantino film. If Tarantino did every single black person would
Speaker 2: be would be go ahead, rather fifty times shot him.
Speaker 2: And that is the problem with.
Speaker 1: But Tarantino was doing both make.
Speaker 2: Exactly exactly ding ding ding. Black man got shot in
Speaker 2: the fucking dick. What is the main thing that white
Speaker 2: people talk about with black people, big old dick? They
Speaker 2: shoot him in the fucking dick, Rod, and you were like, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I love this guy. Oh what this my man? That
Speaker 2: ship he has? Watch? Oh, we're not about to talk
Speaker 2: about again.
Speaker 12: You do just try, you just tried. I'm moving on, Rod.
Speaker 2: What was going on with Travis at Senator Palatine's rally?
Speaker 2: What was he thinking there?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 2: Ship? I sorry, sorry, Rod, I'm sorry. I skipped apart
Speaker 2: And I know you're gonna call me out on it,
Speaker 2: so hold on. He keeps having these runnings with the
Speaker 2: underage prostitute named Iris, Yeah again, played by Jodie Foster.
Speaker 2: What did you think of the meetup that he has
Speaker 2: with her? And do you think that this is where
Speaker 2: Drake got his whole stees from stripper and underage women
Speaker 2: at the same time, was Travis Bickle, the original Drake Jesus.
Speaker 2: I'm asking a question, Spike, and I'm asking I just
Speaker 2: want to know, man, what you think he was trying
Speaker 2: to save her? Man, he was just trying to save her.
Speaker 6: He wasn't He didn't have any ill intention, and we
Speaker 6: saw that at the end of the movie. I think
Speaker 6: that is the the bright spot about him is that,
Speaker 6: you know, he he saw he saw basically like a
Speaker 6: damsel in the stress.
Speaker 2: Even though she was adamant about the fact that she
Speaker 2: was fine, he was just like, look, you're you're you're young,
Speaker 2: you don't know, You're.
Speaker 6: Not trust me or whatnot. So I did think that
Speaker 6: was actually a bright spot. As much as he was
Speaker 6: trying to to advance on him, she you know, he
Speaker 6: continued to deny, deny or not uh to the point
Speaker 6: where he killed folks for it. So so yeah, I
Speaker 6: do like that about the Travis character, that he was
Speaker 6: adamant about getting her uh to safety.
Speaker 2: Mmm.
Speaker 4: I didn't think he had good intentions, really think he
Speaker 4: you know, I did not take that that way at all.
Speaker 4: I thought, he, ain't you you putting in this much
Speaker 4: work to get this little girl who's already out prostituting. Like,
Speaker 4: I didn't think that he was going to be Captain
Speaker 4: save a whole and like take her to her family
Speaker 4: and friends and be like you're okay.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 4: He don't even strike me as that type of person,
Speaker 4: Like I know he's a vigilante, but he just seems
Speaker 4: more violent, sinister, and dark to me in his character.
Speaker 1: I don't.
Speaker 4: I think that she was her senses as a woman
Speaker 4: kicked in were not a woman but a girl kicked in.
Speaker 1: It's get away from you're weird.
Speaker 5: So I think his intentions were sincere, but I think
Speaker 5: they were for different reasons. I think it was because
Speaker 5: it maybe was his way of making up for what
Speaker 5: happened with Betsy.
Speaker 1: That's how I looked at it.
Speaker 5: And the ship was so fucked over her, it was like, oh, well,
Speaker 5: I can try to make a miss, you know, with
Speaker 5: this character.
Speaker 1: With a iris.
Speaker 2: Okay, that's an interesting take, Nick, did you get something different?
Speaker 2: I thought that because, like you mentioned earlier, that we
Speaker 2: see the interaction between him and her and the cab
Speaker 2: earlier on. I didn't know how he was able to
Speaker 2: track her down or how he was able to follow
Speaker 2: up with her. But I thought that to somewhat of
Speaker 2: Ken's point, that he was trying to redeem himself somehow,
Speaker 2: some way, because this is after he failed to uh
Speaker 2: oh no, no, this is before that. But like I
Speaker 2: just felt like he was just trying to redeem himself
Speaker 2: and be like, Okay, at least did this. I at
Speaker 2: least took this person out of a bad predicament and
Speaker 2: brought justice. But it did kind of I also feel like,
Speaker 2: to lose point, there was something weird about that interaction still,
Speaker 2: like it wasn't as innocent like we watched Mayor of Kingston.
Speaker 2: This remind me of Iris, like between Mike and Iris,
Speaker 2: like a character who is an anti hero, but he
Speaker 2: has a good heart and he actually goes out of
Speaker 2: his way to help people, at least innocent people. This
Speaker 2: just felt like he wanted to have an excuse to
Speaker 2: kill someone and this is the best reason for like
Speaker 2: anybody who does something to a child, that's like the
Speaker 2: number one thing. Like pedophiles are always hated, no matter
Speaker 2: even if you're in jail. So I think this is
Speaker 2: just more of a universal sin that he could justify killing.
Speaker 2: So I think all of these are interesting takes. Some
Speaker 2: of them are takes that I never thought of. But
Speaker 2: what I've always gotten from this is I just had
Speaker 2: to look it up and see what it was called.
Speaker 2: But there's this thing about the Madonna horror dichotomy that
Speaker 2: men still have. But men see women in two ways,
Speaker 2: either as a madonna meaning not like a singer, but
Speaker 2: like the actual madonna, like a pure, perfect woman, and
Speaker 2: a whore. A lot of men don't see a gray area.
Speaker 2: So he sees Iris as you know, she's obviously the whore,
Speaker 2: but he wants to turn her into the madonna aka Betsy, right.
Speaker 2: He sees Betsy as this perfect, angelic woman. So I
Speaker 2: do agree with Ken about he's sort of trying to
Speaker 2: make up because he wasn't able to save Betsy. I
Speaker 2: do agree with Rob, though I do think his motives
Speaker 2: are sincere. I do think that he was going to
Speaker 2: save her and take her back to her house, because
Speaker 2: he tells her earlier when they're having that conversation, He's like,
Speaker 2: you need to go home, need to go back to
Speaker 2: your parents. I think the interesting thing about this is
Speaker 2: Travis has no real say over what's going on with
Speaker 2: his life. He's crazy. He has to do these odd
Speaker 2: nighttime jobs. Because he can't sleep, he can't calm his
Speaker 2: brain down. If you look at the Iris character and
Speaker 2: the Betsy character, both of them are being controlled by men.
Speaker 2: He looks at it like Iris is being controlled by
Speaker 2: the pimp aka Sport and Betsy is being controlled by
Speaker 2: Senator Palpatine, not Palpatine Palatine. So he he looks at
Speaker 2: this and he's trying to save them. That takes us
Speaker 2: into the next scene. I know, you gotta run, Spike.
Speaker 2: I'm trying to get through this. You can go to
Speaker 2: seven five. Okay, we'll definitely be done by We'll definitely
Speaker 2: be done by men. This goes into the next scene
Speaker 2: Rod where Travis goes to Senator Palatine's rally. So what
Speaker 2: was going on there?
Speaker 6: Yeah, so this is what I'll sayd In the beginning,
Speaker 6: this part has always confused me because I thought, but
Speaker 6: I guess y'all kind of explaining it earlier on where
Speaker 6: he's like a fake politician and he's not living up
Speaker 6: to his words or whatever. So I always was wondering, like,
Speaker 6: why is he trying to kill the man that said
Speaker 6: he's trying to click clean up the streets if they
Speaker 6: both are trying to clean up the streets, so that
Speaker 6: I always was confused by in the movie. But I mean,
Speaker 6: I think after y'all was talking about it earlier on
Speaker 6: in this review, I kind of understand it now that
Speaker 6: he also saw him as part of the problem, part
Speaker 6: of the problem as far as, like, you know, saying
Speaker 6: one thing and not being a man of your word
Speaker 6: and cleaning.
Speaker 3: Up the streets.
Speaker 6: So yeah, I'm just having a revelation on that, and
Speaker 6: I'm not even sure that's still the case, to be
Speaker 6: quite honest, Nick, what you.
Speaker 2: Got, Yeah, his I find it because again I've seen
Speaker 2: movies after this film that I understand the justification of
Speaker 2: somebody that you highlight and idolize as far as this
Speaker 2: crazy person, how you could easily switch and flip on
Speaker 2: them based off of something that it could be something small,
Speaker 2: or could be a conversation, or could be just like
Speaker 2: how you change your own mind throughout the as we
Speaker 2: see him progressing the movie. So him trying to kill
Speaker 2: him wasn't necessarily that off putting or like that confusing
Speaker 2: to me. It was just like I was expecting, based
Speaker 2: off the legacy of this movie, that he actually got
Speaker 2: the job done'n get close.
Speaker 7: So that's so pissed me, y'all felt I was like, wait,
Speaker 7: hold on, this niggase just ended up in the parking.
Speaker 2: Lot like and then getting chased off, and it was
Speaker 2: just like, Okay, so you did all that for what
Speaker 2: you know? That's what it wasn't no payoff for me
Speaker 2: for like him working out, him getting the gun, him
Speaker 2: doing all this training, the whole who are you talking
Speaker 2: to me type shit. It just seemed like That's why.
Speaker 2: I harken back to the scene where he killed the
Speaker 2: black guy. I was like, so you did all that
Speaker 2: just to not even commit the dude the number one
Speaker 2: thing you wanted to do or that you were practicing
Speaker 2: to do. It was just kind of like, Okay, that's it.
Speaker 3: Anybody.
Speaker 6: I honestly don't even know if it was about the
Speaker 6: politician itself. I think he met It might have had
Speaker 6: something to do with Betsy and bet hit him having
Speaker 6: just being jealous of that whole situation, So maybe it
Speaker 6: had more. Maybe that overtook the policy stuff. Like I said,
Speaker 6: I just met that. That part I've never kind of
Speaker 6: grasped as to why he would try to risk killing
Speaker 6: the politician.
Speaker 1: That's That's what I've always taken as right.
Speaker 4: I said, I agree with Nick. I was let down.
Speaker 4: I thought that this was the payoff of the movie.
Speaker 4: I thought that it is something was going to happen here,
Speaker 4: whether him shooting especially. It's like you said, Nick, as
Speaker 4: popular as this feel me, I'm thinking that he gonna
Speaker 4: shoot the dude to get shot or kill here. I
Speaker 4: didn't know that there was another payoff coming.
Speaker 2: And then he also, like he wrote the letter to Iris,
Speaker 2: put some money in the mail. He was like, listen
Speaker 2: by how you read it, I'm gone. So I'm like,
Speaker 2: all right, he about to go cash out, like he'll say,
Speaker 2: go crazy with it.
Speaker 5: So I always took it as this was him just
Speaker 5: trying to get back at Betsy, and this was one
Speaker 5: of the ways he knew how. I don't think that
Speaker 5: Travis was even interested in Palatine at all. He just
Speaker 5: happened to get in his cab and he had just
Speaker 5: happened to mess with me be dating Betsy, and he
Speaker 5: was just starting to just kind of put on airs
Speaker 5: and was like, oh, you're the guy, and just trying
Speaker 5: to do what he can to win her affection, and
Speaker 5: she just happened to work for him, so he was like,
Speaker 5: oh my god, you're in't here, And that's why I
Speaker 5: think he gave such a crazy, sort of weird answer
Speaker 5: about what he can do to help clean up the city.
Speaker 5: And once he lost Betsy, it was like, all right,
Speaker 5: well you still work for when I'm going to take
Speaker 5: you out because that's the one way that I can her,
Speaker 5: because I can't hurt her any other way. And but
Speaker 5: what I do love about this the scene was of
Speaker 5: course to reveal of the mohawk, like that shit is
Speaker 5: always dope to me, Like you just see like his
Speaker 5: midsection and it just stayed there for a minute, and
Speaker 5: then it poomed me, like, oh, this motherfucker is gone.
Speaker 1: At this point, it's a rap.
Speaker 5: It's over, he's deteriorated, he's and that's a rap. And
Speaker 5: I think that his his the evolved the way his
Speaker 5: character evolved over time. But you're also having evidence of
Speaker 5: this being present all the time. But he's there are
Speaker 5: things that he's holding on to that keeps him attached
Speaker 5: to reality, and when you move remove those things, it
Speaker 5: could send somebody spirally in a way that they never intended.
Speaker 5: And we see that stuff depicted in this movie, and
Speaker 5: up to the point where he completely transformed his image,
Speaker 5: you know, and and you know there have been many
Speaker 5: conversations article discussion of when people start shaving their hair
Speaker 5: and stuff like that. It's all, it's all, it's all
Speaker 5: present in this movie.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've always took it as him taking out Palatine
Speaker 2: was always about Betsy. It was never really about Palatine.
Speaker 2: If he takes out Palentine, he gets Betsy back. That's
Speaker 2: what his brain is telling him, because Betsy is being
Speaker 2: controlled by Palatine. Now where I disagree with with with
Speaker 2: Nick and Spike is it would have been wholly unrealistic
Speaker 2: for him to show up at that rally and be
Speaker 2: able to just kill the senator slash presidential candidate, because
Speaker 2: we see that he has secret service there. I think
Speaker 2: because the thing about it is he wasn't practicing all
Speaker 2: of that you're looking at me shit for Palatine, because
Speaker 2: that wouldn't even really make any sense, Like why would
Speaker 2: he be saying to Palatine, you're looking at me, you're
Speaker 2: looking at me. No, he was practiced seeing for what
Speaker 2: happens later at the convenience store, he was looking to
Speaker 2: shoot someone, not necessarily Palatine at the moment, but just
Speaker 2: some poor person, some poor person he knew he get
Speaker 2: away with in this moment, he thought if he could
Speaker 2: kill Palatine, he would get Betsy back. That's what That's
Speaker 2: how I've always taken it. But after the failed assassination
Speaker 2: attempt on Senator Palatine, Travis goes back to the brothel
Speaker 2: where Iris works. He kills Sport Sport played by Harvey Tytel.
Speaker 1: Real quick, what did.
Speaker 2: Y'all think of this scene? I thought Harvey Kytel did
Speaker 2: a great job of this movie. Uh, once he flicked
Speaker 2: his cigarette on him, I was like this, Dad, I
Speaker 2: was waiting for his Assai says that, but yeah, I've
Speaker 2: fucked with with his portrayal of a not fucking like likely.
Speaker 2: But it's just like I thought, he gave a real
Speaker 2: honest take about like what it's like to be in
Speaker 2: that work at that time, and even going back to
Speaker 2: his weird scene with Iris when he got that one
Speaker 2: fingernail that was catered and ship like that, but he
Speaker 2: over here like uh being intimate her, which was nasty
Speaker 2: as hell, Like it was like this is guy's is
Speaker 2: like a crazy creeping itself. But yeah, this scene was hilarious, Mike.
Speaker 7: Seeing us uphlarious, especially when the fat motherfucker who he
Speaker 7: gave the money to.
Speaker 2: The first time he was with Iris, he shot his hand.
Speaker 2: He was just screaming up.
Speaker 14: My man.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying this whole scene was just it was
Speaker 2: just like it was. This is where like I get Oh,
Speaker 2: Scorsese has always done this in movies where he just
Speaker 2: does the exaggerated scene like death didn't shootouts and ship
Speaker 2: like that. So I funk with this.
Speaker 4: Spike same here, like when he flicked the cigarette on him,
Speaker 4: like Nick's house, so he could have kill him. I want,
Speaker 4: is he gonna kill everybody else in here?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 4: How extreme?
Speaker 1: Is this gonna be?
Speaker 4: Right?
Speaker 2: No?
Speaker 3: That's yeah.
Speaker 2: So it's a well executed scene. Damn y'all.
Speaker 5: Ken you're asking about the shootout, the first shoot up.
Speaker 1: I want to go.
Speaker 2: I want y'all to get your ship off. I'm just
Speaker 2: the host you w thirty one minutes?
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think for me, what I what what I've
Speaker 5: always liked about the pimp, and you guys have gave
Speaker 5: me new information I didn't know. I always loved the
Speaker 5: idea that the guy was white, you know, and it
Speaker 5: really felt good to see that, you know, instead of
Speaker 5: it being your stereotypical black person.
Speaker 1: So I'm glad they did did they did change that?
Speaker 5: So that's always been you know, I thought that I've
Speaker 5: had about it, you know, just seeing that guy Harvey
Speaker 5: coumetell in white.
Speaker 2: So I'm the only one that was really impressed by
Speaker 2: the acting performance here by by by Robert de Niro
Speaker 2: after he shoots him, the fact that he goes over
Speaker 2: and he like he panics immediately. He goes over and
Speaker 2: he sits down, and then he immediately gets back up
Speaker 2: and he's just like looking around. Then he goes inside.
Speaker 2: Like I've always thought that this part was fucking brilliant
Speaker 2: because if he just shot him and then just walked
Speaker 2: away cool, like no big deal again, it would feel unrealistic.
Speaker 2: But the fact that he shoots him and then he's like,
Speaker 2: oh shit, I really just did that, and then he
Speaker 2: goes and he sits on the fucking stairs right by
Speaker 2: him for like a few seconds, and he gets up
Speaker 2: and he's just like I can't stay here, and then
Speaker 2: he's like, well fuck, I'm mass just gonna kill everybody,
Speaker 2: and then he goes inside. That's what I was getting
Speaker 2: at Rod I said, it was a well executed scene. Man,
Speaker 2: all right, we're gonna speed this up so always, and
Speaker 2: he shoots the bodyguard and then he ends up getting
Speaker 2: shot in the neck. He kills Sport, then he kills
Speaker 2: the John that's upstairs with Iris, right in front of Iris.
Speaker 2: Why do y'all think he tried to kill himself afterwards?
Speaker 2: Anybody can take this. Not everybody has to go, but
Speaker 2: anybody can throw this out if they have an answer.
Speaker 2: I thought that was the original plan from trying to
Speaker 2: shoot I want to say POWERPA team, but valentime plentie.
Speaker 2: I thought that was just like he knew he was
Speaker 2: gonna die. This was just like like send off or
Speaker 2: whatever for him to be remembered as this whatever. So
Speaker 2: I thought he always had like a like a suicide
Speaker 2: kind of mindset.
Speaker 1: Same here.
Speaker 4: I thought that he knew that he had missed up,
Speaker 4: that he knew that he couldn't handle the consequences of
Speaker 4: what he had just done, kind of speaking to what
Speaker 4: you said about him being like a miss. As soon
Speaker 4: as he shot the pimp and then he thinks, okay,
Speaker 4: well I might as well go all out, and then
Speaker 4: you do it. He's like, I can't deal with the
Speaker 4: consequences of this and kills himself tried to kill this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, this was one scene I never really really fully got.
Speaker 2: I just always assume he wanted to go out like
Speaker 2: a martyr, but I never really got why he was.
Speaker 2: He did all this, and he was immediately just like, Okay,
Speaker 2: well I'm gonna kill myself. Like did he Maybe he
Speaker 2: thought his job was done because he did save Iris.
Speaker 2: I don't know, But I what did y'all take from
Speaker 2: the scene right after this, when the cops come and
Speaker 2: they're all holding the gun on him and then he
Speaker 2: does this with his bloody finger on his temple. What
Speaker 2: did y'all take them that.
Speaker 1: He wanted to die?
Speaker 2: I've never liked that either.
Speaker 1: Yeah I thought he wanted to die. Yeah, yeah, either.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I've always taken like he just he was done at
Speaker 2: that point. Yeah, he wanted to die, But I've never
Speaker 2: really gotten a full answer as to why he wanted
Speaker 2: to die.
Speaker 5: You know what, the black guy did the whole finger
Speaker 5: pointed thing at him earlier.
Speaker 2: And that's why I've never believed that that actually happened.
Speaker 2: I think that that's just what Travis saw because it
Speaker 2: doesn't make any sense. I mean, I know they call
Speaker 2: him killer or whatever, but the fact that he's just
Speaker 2: doing over and over. It's just like, why is this,
Speaker 2: Why is this black dude being so weird? That doesn't
Speaker 2: make any sense. Why A you're acting like that. But
Speaker 2: I don't think that that really happened. I think that's
Speaker 2: just what Travis saw.
Speaker 6: You shake your head, I said, I think the same.
Speaker 6: I mean, because it doesn't. He obviously clearly let him
Speaker 6: borrow money and everything, so he was cordial with him.
Speaker 3: It makes sense. That doesn't make any sense.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he was cordial with him, but Travis still saw
Speaker 2: danger in black man. That's all right. Oh, go ahead.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say last day again, last funny moment
Speaker 2: when the dude he shot was they was fighting like
Speaker 2: toddlers at the ground. I was like, shoot him.
Speaker 1: I never understood that.
Speaker 2: He took all for him to die, But I mean, somebody,
Speaker 2: shoot haf your hand off. You're gonna try to kill him.
Speaker 1: But he was mad. He was the hand Mike.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he chased him upstairs though, Mike, I'm thinking, like,
Speaker 2: all right, this guy's crazy, let me get a fucker
Speaker 2: out of here. He chased his ass upstairs, tackling him.
Speaker 2: I'm talking about, so I'm gonna kill you, I'm gonna
Speaker 2: kill you just swinging on him like like this, like
Speaker 2: I'm like football, but he's also a bodyguard. And no,
Speaker 2: I bet you no one has fucked with him like that,
Speaker 2: like they think about he shot his half his hand
Speaker 2: off and he shot him in the side or whatever,
Speaker 2: and the dude still had the power to run upstairs
Speaker 2: and fight and he stabbed him in the hand too.
Speaker 2: There he shut hand too. Oh man, This motherfucker was crazy.
Speaker 2: So last scene, Travis goes into a coma during UH
Speaker 2: due to his wounds, and he receives a letter from
Speaker 2: Iris's parents, who tell him that she's doing much better
Speaker 2: and she's back in school. But the movie basically ends
Speaker 2: with Travis going back to work. He gets Betsy as
Speaker 2: a ride, who tells him that she's kept up with
Speaker 2: a situation and he drops her off. The refuses to
Speaker 2: take any of her money, and he drives away with
Speaker 2: a smirk. What did y'all take from the ending? I
Speaker 2: can't believe him.
Speaker 5: She went all the way back when his image has
Speaker 5: been repaired and she realized she messed up, that maybe
Speaker 5: he wasn't so bad after all, and she she just
Speaker 5: tried to get back into good Grace, but he was like, nah,
Speaker 5: you know you messed up.
Speaker 1: He said, you had your shot and it's over. And
Speaker 1: I think the other.
Speaker 5: Thing I was thinking about, Nick, you know how you
Speaker 5: always say white man. Look, only a white man can
Speaker 5: fail like killing a person and then turn out to
Speaker 5: be a hero. Bro.
Speaker 2: Ruh. Those newspaper clippings pissed me. This editing movie them
Speaker 2: there pissed me off. But I will agree with your
Speaker 2: first point. Ken At Louis Rod, you know what I'm
Speaker 2: talking about. This reminded me of Mike Jones.
Speaker 1: Back then. They didn't want me.
Speaker 2: Now I'm hot. He felt like a million bucks when
Speaker 2: she got in that cabin. He let her walk away
Speaker 2: like I don't even need Joe ass no more go
Speaker 2: home like but going back to the point of the
Speaker 2: fact that he was a hero, like the parents of
Speaker 2: the girl was like, listen, we only can afford to
Speaker 2: go back to New York wants to pick her up.
Speaker 2: We wish you'd come back more to even thank you, like,
Speaker 2: and the whole city is going behind them and everything.
Speaker 2: He grew his hair out again like Samson, I'm just like, man,
Speaker 2: it's some bullshit.
Speaker 4: Yeah, his ending I didn't believe it. I couldn't believe
Speaker 4: that that's how they would end a movie like this.
Speaker 4: I don't think that, like, oh, everything's wrapped up nicely
Speaker 4: and he gets the girl and he gets to drive
Speaker 4: off after being a fucking psychle path for an hour
Speaker 4: and a half. Like, No, it didn't make any sense
Speaker 4: to me. And then I've seen the theory behind it,
Speaker 4: so it made more sense.
Speaker 2: Did everybody go, Rod, did you say your piece?
Speaker 6: I didn't say my piece, But like I can agree
Speaker 6: with Nick here, it is it is.
Speaker 2: In real life, it's it's it's really messed up.
Speaker 6: But I think in the in the idea of the movie,
Speaker 6: I liked it at the time. Yeah, I definitely wasn't
Speaker 6: expecting me. I wanted to expected him to live off
Speaker 6: a next shot. I think you shot in the necker.
Speaker 2: I went through his.
Speaker 1: He just.
Speaker 4: A scar, then didn't he died? The theory is that
Speaker 4: was in his head because we see this obscure view
Speaker 4: of reality that he always had. Like you said, Mike,
Speaker 4: this is how he would have wanted it to end.
Speaker 4: But in actuality, he died in that brothel.
Speaker 1: So he created a scar on his neck and his
Speaker 1: in his that was fake car. That was fake.
Speaker 2: It was.
Speaker 12: That think about it.
Speaker 1: I don't have to think about it.
Speaker 2: He's laying there dying.
Speaker 4: If he's laying there dying and he's dreaming about, oh
Speaker 4: I make it through this. I survived this. His neck
Speaker 4: still gonna have the scar on it, because it's in
Speaker 4: his head. He actually got shot. He just didn't leave.
Speaker 2: But they said he was in a calm coma that
Speaker 2: was in his head. No, it was in a paper,
Speaker 2: wasn't it. He's saying everything, everything dreamed all of it once.
Speaker 4: Yeah, everything post everything, post the brothel is him dreaming
Speaker 4: how the perfect way it would have ended, but he
Speaker 4: actually died there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a that's definitely a theory because if you
Speaker 2: if you watch through to the very very end, if
Speaker 2: you're not paying attention, you'll miss it. But when he
Speaker 2: drives off, it makes it seem like, oh, happily ever after,
Speaker 2: and he looks up and he adjusts the mirror, and
Speaker 2: then the movie ends. So there's this piece where it's
Speaker 2: telling you, yeah, you think everything is sweet and it
Speaker 2: ended in this happily ever after way, but no, Travis
Speaker 2: is still crazy. So I've had the same theory that
Speaker 2: Spike just throughout, which is either he died in that
Speaker 2: brothel or he's still in a coma. But that ending
Speaker 2: did not fucking happen, where Betsy just shows up where
Speaker 2: he is and gets in his taxi. That didn't happen.
Speaker 2: It doesn't even make any sense that she would say
Speaker 2: the thing that she was saying in the taxi that
Speaker 2: and I just I watched what you did, and you know, no, man,
Speaker 2: no fucking way even after what Like, I'm sure she
Speaker 2: knew by that point that a crazy motherfucker where god
Speaker 2: damn mohawks showed up and tried to kill Palatine, And
Speaker 2: I'm sure she could put two and two together and say, oh,
Speaker 2: that was him. So there's no way she would go
Speaker 2: back to his taxi getting his fucking car. I'm like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: I heard what you did. You the shit bro should
Speaker 2: hang out later. No, this is Travis making up what
Speaker 2: he thinks the perfect scenario for an ending to this
Speaker 2: story is and Rod. Imagine if the story went with
Speaker 2: the original script like Lou said, and it was all
Speaker 2: black people that he killed, and.
Speaker 4: He was the ship they said, the studio man that
Speaker 4: they said, the struty was scared that it would be
Speaker 4: like riots, like real rights if they played it out
Speaker 4: that way for real, so that's why they recast everybody
Speaker 4: and brothel.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 5: I think it was real, and I think what I
Speaker 5: do agree with you though, Mike, is when he looked
Speaker 5: in the mirror at that startling thing, I think that
Speaker 5: that was showing that, yes, this is real.
Speaker 1: But this motherfucker is still he still got that dog game.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and he's gonna he's gonna snap back at some
Speaker 5: point to get rid of the so called filth again
Speaker 5: and all is not well with him, but for right now,
Speaker 5: he stay yeah.
Speaker 2: Always. I felt that scene with her in the backseat
Speaker 2: and her talking, granted, like some of the dialogue I
Speaker 2: felt like earlier in this movie was kind of they
Speaker 2: didn't really have that much chemistry, but I guess they
Speaker 2: shouldn't because he's crazy, But it just felt awkward. I
Speaker 2: was like, why the fuck would she say this? Why
Speaker 2: the fuck? Like you said, like, why would she come
Speaker 2: all the way one point eighty from thinking he's a
Speaker 2: creep to like, oh, I'm now back in love with
Speaker 2: him or I find interest in them? And how she
Speaker 2: knows what taxi is his because she just walked up
Speaker 2: and got in the car and the dude was like, oh,
Speaker 2: you got somebody in your car? How would she know
Speaker 2: what taxi is? His? Like, the movie's not written poorly
Speaker 2: to where we could be like, oh yeah, it's just
Speaker 2: bad writing, and it just carried on through the end.
Speaker 2: No way, no way, the movie the ending. If this
Speaker 2: was all real, the ending would be one of the
Speaker 2: most poorly written endings for a for a good movie
Speaker 2: ever done, because it doesn't make sense. She would just
Speaker 2: walk up, like, Oh, this must be Travis's taxi? What
Speaker 2: how did she get there? She walked to where his
Speaker 2: job was or where the diner was and just knew
Speaker 2: he was there. None of it makes any sense, but
Speaker 2: it does make sense if you're looking at this from
Speaker 2: the unreliable narrator that Travis has been throughout this entire film. So, huh,
Speaker 2: I said, I'm with Ken. I think it was real.
Speaker 2: I don't care what you no. You know what I
Speaker 2: would Rod, I would not argue with you or Ken,
Speaker 2: because there's not enough here for me to say that.
Speaker 2: My theory is is really you know, uh, super sound.
Speaker 2: So I wouldn't even argue with y'all. It could be real,
Speaker 2: but to me, it just wouldn't make a lot of sense,
Speaker 2: but it could be real.
Speaker 1: But if it's real, it's not as good as me.
Speaker 4: It's good to me, Yeah, to me, Yeah, he can't
Speaker 4: be like that in a film for an hour and
Speaker 4: then walk away with like, oh yeah, old happy Day.
Speaker 1: Like nah, I get out of here.
Speaker 4: I agree hundred people. Yeah, but this movie was different.
Speaker 4: That's what made this good. That's like, that's what made
Speaker 4: it better to me. Like I probably would have had
Speaker 4: a different opinion on it had I not looked at
Speaker 4: the stuff that broke it down and was like, no,
Speaker 4: this is what actually happened.
Speaker 1: Because as I was.
Speaker 4: Looking at that and he's driving away, I'm like, ain't
Speaker 4: no fucking way that they did that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree the last thing I'll say. I definitely
Speaker 2: agree with what Spike just said. This movie is very different.
Speaker 2: It's not written in that white people are heroes kind
Speaker 2: of way. Again, if this was if Lena Waite wrote it,
Speaker 2: I might be with y'all. I don't think it was
Speaker 2: written to imply that white people just get away with everything,
Speaker 2: So I would not believe that he was able to
Speaker 2: go up in there shoot all of those people. Then
Speaker 2: the cops just be like, yeah, let him go. Nah, nah,
Speaker 2: I think they were all criminal. Criminals. Though they were
Speaker 2: all criminals.
Speaker 12: You still can't just go up shooting if it was like,
Speaker 12: that's right, that's right, that's right.
Speaker 2: As a lawyer, Mike, he was a bad guy, right,
Speaker 2: you're a bad guy.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: He wanted to save a child. He was going to
Speaker 2: save a child. That was the first few times I
Speaker 2: watched it.
Speaker 5: But then I was just like, nah, and and they
Speaker 5: she was real quick.
Speaker 1: I know we're closing out.
Speaker 5: But Jodie Foster, she was twelve, but her sister played
Speaker 5: the double in those you know, provocative scenes.
Speaker 3: Okay, cool, that's good.
Speaker 2: So now you don't feel bad about looking at him
Speaker 2: being like.
Speaker 1: Damn, well, his sister was only eighteen.
Speaker 2: But you know, I'm just wondering why that information was
Speaker 2: needed because it was gross. Either way, he was trying you,
Speaker 2: trying me money, y'all feel better. First of all, Jodie
Speaker 2: Foster ain't never do it for me, let alone.
Speaker 1: A twelve year old, right, I ain't never seen that
Speaker 1: damn as a child, right, right.
Speaker 2: That's one of the most uncomfortable things about this film.
Speaker 2: But anyway, anybody got well, Spike, you want to go
Speaker 2: ahead and give any any any final thoughts you can
Speaker 2: jump out of here. I'm glad.
Speaker 1: I'm glad we reviewed this. I had never seen it.
Speaker 4: I always heard about the Narro's performance, and I was
Speaker 4: skeptical in the beginning, but as it got into it,
Speaker 4: I understood the complexity of the movie. I like, like
Speaker 4: Nick said, how New York was a character in the movie.
Speaker 4: So I got it once I watched it. I may
Speaker 4: not as hold it in high regard as people do
Speaker 4: the call of the classic, but I totally understand the sentiment.
Speaker 2: Okay, I think y'all ruined this movie for me. Wait,
Speaker 2: hold on, jump jump, But anybody else want to give
Speaker 2: their final thoughts?
Speaker 6: I was saying, yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry. I think I
Speaker 6: think us reviewing this has ruined this movie for me.
Speaker 6: I don't know if I feel I don't know if
Speaker 6: I like it as much anymore after this.
Speaker 2: Why what could we have said that ruined it for you?
Speaker 2: I never like because thinking.
Speaker 6: About the the things that they probably had the change
Speaker 6: and now looking back, like, yeah, that was weird with
Speaker 6: the black folks in this, like and they just I
Speaker 6: don't know, I feel like they made a pivot to
Speaker 6: to satisfy the audience, so looking back at some of
Speaker 6: the stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I like it as much as
Speaker 2: leave it to a Tarantino fan to be mad that
Speaker 2: they made the movie less racist. H Like, I think
Speaker 2: he just didn't have his coofy hat on what he
Speaker 2: was like, hold on this actually fucked up. I appreciate
Speaker 2: them making the movie less fucked up for black people,
Speaker 2: and actually I appreciate them taking to taking into account
Speaker 2: that black folk would have gotten really upset if they
Speaker 2: made everybody black. Yeah, but it's just it's just the idea.
Speaker 2: I think it's just already I.
Speaker 4: Guess you're saying the fact that they even had to
Speaker 4: change it is a problem for what he's saying.
Speaker 2: And ain't what he's saying nout alright, all right. I
Speaker 2: was actually surprised, Mike that, when watching this movie and
Speaker 2: watching the opening credits, that Martin Scort says he didn't
Speaker 2: write this movie, that he just drafted it. So like
Speaker 2: so that changed my mindset a little bit as far
Speaker 2: as like, Okay, how much can I put on the
Speaker 2: script and the story on him versus me just like separating,
Speaker 2: Like just look at the direction, how he the characters
Speaker 2: are portrayed like he did a great job, especially for
Speaker 2: the late seventies. Again, the grit and feel of the
Speaker 2: movie is amazing, but again, like the story is does
Speaker 2: and live up to the hype to me, That's why
Speaker 2: I said it's a note for me not say this
Speaker 2: is a horrible film, but it's just like, to me,
Speaker 2: it's just not as good as what I thought it
Speaker 2: would be. The Only thing that I really will take
Speaker 2: from is that the bones of this movie, the structure,
Speaker 2: the foundation of it has been used so many times
Speaker 2: by so many different directors, so many different films that
Speaker 2: you have to give it credit as something that is
Speaker 2: a classic. But yeah, it's it's just outside of that,
Speaker 2: Like rewatching this, I don't even know who I would
Speaker 2: let watch this if I was at the grip.
Speaker 5: All right, Yeah, I don't think it changes my perception
Speaker 5: of the movie, you know, with being potentially racist or
Speaker 5: the portrayal of.
Speaker 1: Black people. It's funny because I watched.
Speaker 5: Robert de niro is in another movie by Brian de
Speaker 5: Palmer Greetings that I watched after this, because I was
Speaker 5: just kind of looking at Robert de Niro's like what
Speaker 5: he did before that, I watched that and you watched
Speaker 5: that movie?
Speaker 2: Is that the one where he's is that the one
Speaker 2: where he's like, there's like gay prostitute or whatever, and
Speaker 2: a am I thinking of a different movie?
Speaker 5: He was trying it's a comedy, but he wasn't trying
Speaker 5: to go to war. They were trying to get out
Speaker 5: of war. Yeah, it's a really weird movie. But in
Speaker 5: that one, like their portrayal of all the things that
Speaker 5: are typically viewed as negative nowadays is present in the
Speaker 5: beginning because they talk about, you know.
Speaker 1: Gay people and black people.
Speaker 5: They used the N word a couple of times in
Speaker 5: the beginning, like the guy went to start a fight
Speaker 5: so we wouldn't go with black people so he can
Speaker 5: get out of.
Speaker 1: Going to war.
Speaker 5: And then there's all kind of weird things happening in
Speaker 5: that movie around that time. And and this was like
Speaker 5: a couple of years before this, so you know, it
Speaker 5: seems in line with it, but there wasn't an overabundance
Speaker 5: of the word that was being used, and it was
Speaker 5: in a specific context of the movie, and the kind
Speaker 5: of walked away from it. Same thing with this one,
Speaker 5: like we're that word. We mainly heard the word spooks
Speaker 5: and the N word. We once or twice at that
Speaker 5: in a movie with a lot of black people around
Speaker 5: and a seemingly racist you know, so I think it
Speaker 5: did a good job, you know, if that's the case
Speaker 5: of even being racist, portraying that in a way that
Speaker 5: isn't too over the top.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean reviewing it, but y'all definitely didn't
Speaker 2: change my opinion on this film. I think it's an
Speaker 2: incredible film. I am curious to read the stuff that
Speaker 2: Spike found about the original cast being black. I don't
Speaker 2: think I ever knew that, so that's really interesting. But
Speaker 2: I appreciate that they thought twice about how fucked up
Speaker 2: that would look, even if they did have the right
Speaker 2: mindset in place of look, Travis is racist, because Spike
Speaker 2: said he also saw that they said that Travis was
Speaker 2: going to be more overtly racist. I just don't think
Speaker 2: that that would have made the movie as good. In
Speaker 2: my opinion, if Travis was just running around I hate
Speaker 2: Niggers and killing black people, he'd been like, all right, bro,
Speaker 2: I'm good on this, it would it probably wouldn't have
Speaker 2: been a classic. But the way that they wrote Travis,
Speaker 2: the way that they wrote the characters around him, his
Speaker 2: weird motivations, and just the really interesting way that they
Speaker 2: shot this film. I think it was great. I think
Speaker 2: this movie is absolutely great. So so yeah, so that's
Speaker 2: gonna do it for us. Let us know what y'all
Speaker 2: thought about this review. And shit, this shit was an
Speaker 2: hour and forty something minutes, y'all. Motherfucker's better talk about
Speaker 2: this motherfucker all right, So we will see y'all next
Speaker 2: time we out.
Speaker 1: Peace pe