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Speaker 1: So yes, it's a peace deal with Israel and Jamas.

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Speaker 1: Really it's the return of hostages. And after that. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what's going to happen. And I would tell

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Speaker 1: you that there are as many people who hope the

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Speaker 1: peace hold as there is people who say, you got

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Speaker 1: your people back. Great, Now go end Amos once and

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Speaker 1: for all. There is a call for that, without question.

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Speaker 1: Tony Katz, Tony Katz today, great to be with you,

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Speaker 1: but you can't engage today without the recognition that Trump

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Speaker 1: did good.

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Speaker 2: You like him, you don't like him.

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Speaker 1: That's inconsequential to the madness of the policy that gets

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Speaker 1: us here. Yet the former Secretary of State Anthony Blincoln,

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Speaker 1: the Secretary of State under Joe Biden, actually said that

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Speaker 1: it's good that President Trump and I'm quoting here adopted

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Speaker 1: and built on the plan the Biden administration developed after

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Speaker 1: months of this Scotia with Arab partners. Noah Rothman joins

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Speaker 1: me right now, senior writer at National Review.

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Speaker 2: Author of the Rise of the New Puritans, The Rise

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Speaker 2: of the New.

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Speaker 1: Puritans, fighting back against progressives, were on fun and unjust,

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Speaker 1: social justice, and the unmaking of America. You have the

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Speaker 1: column over there, No This is not Joe Biden's peace deal.

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Speaker 1: This is a maddening statement from Anthony Blincoln, and one

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Speaker 1: that not only shows a detachment from reality, but now

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Speaker 1: makes everyone question what kind of things were they pursuing

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Speaker 1: in those first four years if they think they were

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Speaker 1: laying a groundwork.

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Speaker 3: Your take, sir, Yeah, I mean, I guess you could

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Speaker 3: defend Anthony Blincoln's statement by saying that everything begets everything right,

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Speaker 3: I mean, just by virtue of the fact of our

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Speaker 3: existing in the year twenty twenty five. There's been a

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Speaker 3: series of precedents that got us here, and in that sense,

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Speaker 3: everything has you know, sort of cosmic consequence, sequence sequential,

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Speaker 3: Everything flows sequentially from that. But that doesn't make a

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Speaker 3: lot of sense if you actually know the terms that

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Speaker 3: they were negotiating. The September twenty twenty four peace agreement

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Speaker 3: is I think what they're referencing that was the quote

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Speaker 3: unquote take it or leave it deal that the Biden

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Speaker 3: administration put to Benjamin That yahoo, which is, you know,

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Speaker 3: kind of puts the lie to the notion that the

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Speaker 3: only reason why we have this agreement is because this

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Speaker 3: is something Progressives tell themselves that Donald Trump successfully muscled

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Speaker 3: Benjamin that Yahoo into it, cajoled, coerced use the kind

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Speaker 3: of strong arm tactics that Joe Biden was just he

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Speaker 3: was just too nice to apply that sort of thing

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Speaker 3: to the Israelis. That's just a revisionist history. But the

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Speaker 3: terms of that deal were nothing like the terms of

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Speaker 3: this deal. It would have compelled him us to release

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Speaker 3: only women, elderly, the ill, not fighting age men, which

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Speaker 3: is basically everybody who is in their captivity at that point,

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Speaker 3: with the exception of one of the hostages that were

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Speaker 3: seized and released by Israeli forces in Southern Agaza and

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Speaker 3: when the by the administration would not let them go

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Speaker 3: into Southern Gaza was hemming and hauling over it. And

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Speaker 3: then they say that you know this is it looks

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Speaker 3: a lot like either that deal or terms that were

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Speaker 3: implemented by Steve wood Cough and the Trump administration in

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Speaker 3: January of twenty twenty five. Is a short lived cease

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Speaker 3: fired deal then as well, but it was also again

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Speaker 3: phase one, did not release all the hostages, did not

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Speaker 3: release the bodies, and you know, sidesteps the best part

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Speaker 3: of this agreement that Donald Trump negotiated in the region,

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Speaker 3: which is this regional buy in from eight Muslim dominated governments,

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Speaker 3: including Pakistan and Turkey and Katar in Indonesia, all of

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Speaker 3: whom have signed on to the notion that Hamas cannot

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Speaker 3: govern the Strip, that the Palestinian authority needs to commit

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Speaker 3: to some unspecified reforms before it assumes leadership over the Strip,

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Speaker 3: and that the IDEF has a semi permanent presence in

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Speaker 3: the Gaza Strip, which is now legitimized and ratified. Arab

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Speaker 3: world is acknowledging Israel's permanent interests in the Palestinian territories.

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Speaker 3: This is all historic and it can't be undone. That's

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Speaker 3: the sort of thing that you can't just like take back.

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Speaker 3: So it's not Joe Biden's peace deal. It doesn't really

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Speaker 3: even resemble Joe Biden's peace deal. And even to talk

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Speaker 3: about it like it's Joe Biden's peace deal ignores the

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Speaker 3: things that the Biden administration either couldn't do or didn't

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Speaker 3: even have the imagination to envision. So it's it is

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Speaker 3: a kind of a defunct talking point. But I get

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Speaker 3: that they need to solve their wounds today because they

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Speaker 3: look uniquely inept when compared to the president's first eight

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Speaker 3: months in office night.

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Speaker 1: Often, and I do wonder how this plays out on a.

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Speaker 2: On an election.

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Speaker 1: Stage talking to Noah Rothman of National Review. But you

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Speaker 1: bring up the Kataris and this deal these Muslim nations,

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Speaker 1: and I want you to get a little bit more

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Speaker 1: into that. But first things first, the Kataris have Hamas

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Speaker 1: living in their worlds and spending the A billions. The

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Speaker 1: Kataris are investing and putting money into universities and trying

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Speaker 1: to gain influence all across.

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Speaker 2: The United States.

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Speaker 1: You've got the Trump administration signing deals saying that we'll

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Speaker 1: protect the Kataris via executive order. There's conversations about land

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Speaker 1: investments and military investments here in the United States. Are

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Speaker 1: you worried about the Kataris and them playing a Chinese

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Speaker 1: esque influence game in the US?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? I am, and they are. You know, the line

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Speaker 3: in Washington is the play both sides. What are you

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Speaker 3: going to do about it? You got to live with

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Speaker 3: the world as it is. They're not savory actors, but

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Speaker 3: sometimes they're on our side, and sometimes they are on

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Speaker 3: our side. In this case, they're on our side. You

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Speaker 3: could say the same thing with Turkey. It doesn't it's

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Speaker 3: not engagement as far as I know, an influence operation

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Speaker 3: in the United States like the Kataris are, but they're

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Speaker 3: an unreliable ally. The question is do you want them

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Speaker 3: inside the tent or outside of it? And the prevailing

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Speaker 3: you is in Washington and elsewhere that you want the

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Speaker 3: Kataris in the tent, not outside of it, not you know,

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Speaker 3: cast out of the international order, made a pariah state,

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Speaker 3: suffering with sanctions, what have you, because you'll only get

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Speaker 3: more of this sort of thing. I'm of two minds

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Speaker 3: on that. I can see the realist case for working

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Speaker 3: with the Katari with the government of Guitar as it is,

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Speaker 3: but it's certainly not a model exemplar in the region,

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Speaker 3: and it's not much of a partner either when it

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Speaker 3: comes to it's the strategic benefits that it provides the

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Speaker 3: United States, But just by virtue of the existence of

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Speaker 3: this air base and US sent compositions inside the country,

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Speaker 3: it's more of a gift to the Kataris, and it's

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Speaker 3: designed to keep them from folding into the Iranian orbit,

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Speaker 3: and I see the value of that. And this is

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Speaker 3: these are not easy, the decisions that are put before

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Speaker 3: Western leaders, to say nothing of the American president. But

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Speaker 3: it's you know, it's it's one of those things where

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Speaker 3: you have to take them where they're doing good, then

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Speaker 3: take them when they're doing good, and would not then

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Speaker 3: you make an issue. But it's a case by case basis. Unfortunately.

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Speaker 1: So my two notes were one about the Qataris and

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Speaker 1: then I wrote, why agree you talk about these nations agreeing?

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Speaker 2: Is this about Iranian hegemony?

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Speaker 1: Is everything built into Hey, we're going to build up

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Speaker 1: our power and diminish their power.

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Speaker 2: We really hate those people.

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Speaker 1: And that's really where maybe the Obama Biden administration cabal

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Speaker 1: has its biggest issue, because they were convinced that they

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Speaker 1: could work with Iran, they could deal with the Ran,

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Speaker 1: they could appease Iran, and these other nations were clearly

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Speaker 1: saying you can't.

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Speaker 2: You're out of your mind.

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Speaker 1: How much of what we're seeing in this agreement is

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Speaker 1: because of the desire to diminish Iran's hegemonic.

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Speaker 2: Power a lot of it.

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Speaker 3: And I don't think you would have gotten I mean

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Speaker 3: again back to the sequence of events for everything to

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Speaker 3: get to everything. I don't think you would have gotten

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Speaker 3: Abraham Accords without the Iran nuclear deal with JCPOA because

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Speaker 3: The logic of the Abraham Accords was twofold. First, it's

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Speaker 3: presented to the Sunni Arab states in the region a

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Speaker 3: real existential conundrum because they opposed the Iran and I

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Speaker 3: have strategic and tactical differences with Iran, and Iran poses

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Speaker 3: a threat to their securities. So the Abraham Accords said, listen,

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Speaker 3: this is the big threat. Let's deal with this first.

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Speaker 3: And then the second part of that was, let's put

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Speaker 3: the Palestinian issue on the back burner. It's not forgotten,

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Speaker 3: it's not over, but we're not going to get to

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Speaker 3: peace that way first, we do that last. And the

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Speaker 3: logic of that was very compelling, and the effects of

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Speaker 3: it are self evidently gratifying if you actually do seek

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Speaker 3: something like a durable peace in the Middle East, because

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Speaker 3: this begat security ties, military and intelligence sharing between these

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Speaker 3: countries at a culvert level, and then it's subsequently flowered

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Speaker 3: into diplomatic relations and commercial ties, and that's the sort

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Speaker 3: of thing that eventually yields normalization in the sense that

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Speaker 3: we mean the word normalization, normal relations between these between

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Speaker 3: the Arab States and Israel. And there's the Biden administration

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Speaker 3: went to work trying to undermine that, and initially the

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Speaker 3: Trump administration set about undermining that when President in his

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Speaker 3: second term, the first couple of weeks of the second term,

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Speaker 3: the President started talking about the Palestinian conflict like it

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Speaker 3: was the root of cause of violence in the Middle East,

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Speaker 3: of disunion and war in the Middle East. And then

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Speaker 3: you started talking about displacing Palestinians and making you know,

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Speaker 3: Gaza into a seaside resort. And this is the sort

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Speaker 3: of thing that made the Palestinian issue once again front

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Speaker 3: of mind for the Arab world, which is not what

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Speaker 3: you want. You want it to be back of mind.

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Speaker 3: You want it to be the last thing that gets done.

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Speaker 3: And I think now that the President's sort of abandoned

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Speaker 3: that approach, and I think it was smart to do so.

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Speaker 3: And now that we have a real legitimate strategic victory

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Speaker 3: on all fronts, mostly on all fronts by Israel, I

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Speaker 3: think you're going to see the peace process for zoom

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Speaker 3: and quickly and in ways that just indicate that this

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Speaker 3: operation was really just a bump in the road, and

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Speaker 3: in fact, it demonstrates that Israel is once again the

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Speaker 3: all but unquestioned military hedgemon in the region. And that's

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Speaker 3: going to get more countries that want to align with

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Speaker 3: the strong horse, putting aside their grievances with Israel and

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Speaker 3: the Palestinian issue, which is still very important to them.

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Speaker 3: They'll say in statements, but they're going to move forward

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Speaker 3: with a normalization process, especially now that Iran has been

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Speaker 3: not neutralized, but the Iranian nuclear program is set back

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Speaker 3: significantly and a precedent has been established that I think

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Speaker 3: future presidents will observe that we will not sit by

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Speaker 3: and allow Iran to nuclearize. I don't think a future

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Speaker 3: Democratic president would say, Okay, well, you know, we struck

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Speaker 3: them once, but we're not going to do that again.

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Speaker 3: Why we're not. I think they would, and I think

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Speaker 3: they would just maintain that balance because a nuclear rian

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Speaker 3: is not a popular proposition in the United States. So

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Speaker 3: if you want to stay on the right side of

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Speaker 3: the American people, you would make sure to tend the grass,

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Speaker 3: as it were, and ensure that Baran never develops a

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Speaker 3: nuclear program again. All this stuff is apocle, huge shifts

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Speaker 3: in the course of events, and it has everything to

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Speaker 3: do with this force of arms and fighting a war

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Speaker 3: to win it that changed circumstances on the ground in

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Speaker 3: ways that the endless diplomatic peace process never could right.

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Speaker 1: The attack from Hamas change things, But it was Israel

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Speaker 1: unrelenting in its response that really kind of set a

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Speaker 1: stage for opportunity. Talking to Noah Roffan of National Review,

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Speaker 1: let me go back again to something you said, which

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Speaker 1: is these nations working with Israel, how will the college

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Speaker 1: campus anti Semite, the Palestinian flag waiving program.

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Speaker 2: Program, how will they be.

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Speaker 1: Able to square the circle that Islamic nations are engaged

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Speaker 1: in normalized relations with the Zionists while they're out there

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Speaker 1: flag waving and hoping to engage some toppling of society.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. I imagine they'll still be quite violent

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Speaker 3: and quite disruptive. What attracted a lot of these people

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Speaker 3: to the cause of freeing Palestine, freeing Gaza, as they say,

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Speaker 3: the genocide, the famine there never was is that it's

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Speaker 3: anti Western. There are fans of that which is hostile

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Speaker 3: to Western dominance, and Israel is coded as Western and

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Speaker 3: it's because it is Western aligned and the Palestinian cause

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Speaker 3: is not. And I think that really is the basis

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Speaker 3: of it. In part because you know a lot of

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Speaker 3: these people were violent before October seventh violent radical. They

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Speaker 3: didn't have a unifying cause, and now they do. But

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Speaker 3: I think that cause will fade into the background if

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Speaker 3: we no longer have Israel at the top of the

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Speaker 3: headlines every day, and they'll glom onto some other cause

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Speaker 3: to be disrupt about what happens to them. I think

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Speaker 3: they're probably going to continue their campaign of anti Western

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Speaker 3: agitation in some other guys, some other form. But do

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Speaker 3: they reconcile what they're seeing with the facts on the ground, No,

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Speaker 3: they do not. They inhabit a very strange universe. It's

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Speaker 3: a it's a universe in which normalization deals aren't peace deals,

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Speaker 3: and that the regional threat environment is as bad or

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Speaker 3: worse as it was on October sixth, twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 3: that Benjamin Netanyahu had to be strong armed into accepting

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Speaker 3: this agreement which ratifies just about every Israeli proposition and

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Speaker 3: then has a regional buy in like this, this is

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Speaker 3: what they tell themselves. They're talking as though, and this

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Speaker 3: is not just on the left, this is also folks

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Speaker 3: on the far right, the influencer side of the far right,

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Speaker 3: which is very skeptical of, if not hostile towards Israel,

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Speaker 3: saying the same things that you're hearing from the American left.

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Speaker 3: That Ah, you know Benjamin Theniel, who was such a

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Speaker 3: recalcitran party, he was such a violent actor that there's

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Speaker 3: no way he would have accepted this peace deal. It's

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Speaker 3: not sense.

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Speaker 2: It's laughable.

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Speaker 3: And they tell themselves now that it gets Israel supporters

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Speaker 3: are just disconsolate today and all the hostages are home

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Speaker 3: for the first time in almost seven hundred and fifty days.

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Speaker 3: It's just it's insane. They live in a strange world

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Speaker 3: that does not reflect our own world, and they will

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Speaker 3: continue to inhabit it and do a lot of things

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Speaker 3: that make very little sense to us because they're not

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Speaker 3: consuming our shared reality. They're contemptuous of our shared reality.

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Speaker 1: Noah Rothman, By the way, that's a whole conversation that

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Speaker 1: we should get into one day. But that's going to

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Speaker 1: involve Bourbon and the land of make believe versus real life.

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Speaker 2: The land of make believe.

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Speaker 1: By the way, that should be your next book, because

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Speaker 1: if I would write books, that would be my next book.

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Speaker 2: But that I'm giving you that one right there. You

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Speaker 2: take that, you run. No roth I think that was.

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Speaker 3: A I think I was a kids show. That was

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Speaker 3: on when Eye.

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Speaker 2: That was part of mister Rogers. I'll walk you through it.

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Speaker 1: Right, Yah, yeah, yeah, No Rothman, appreciative National Review.

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Speaker 2: I appreciate you taking the time. More coming up, I'm

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Speaker 2: Tony Katz line from Baal Hartland and the Crossroads of America.

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Speaker 2: It's Tony Katz today.

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Speaker 1: So we are now in day nine hundred trillion of

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Speaker 1: the shutdown, and I'm telling you no one still cares.

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Speaker 1: But we've clearly seen that this is a political prom

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Speaker 1: because I saw CNN announced that they were gonna have

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Speaker 1: a town hall with Bernie Sanders and representative of Cassio Cortez.

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Speaker 1: Clearly they're testing out the twenty twenty eight ticket. Oh

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Speaker 1: you think anyone cares that he's three hundred and forty

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Speaker 1: two years old, stop.

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Speaker 2: It, No one, No one on the left is going

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Speaker 2: to care. Iday he's the nominee.

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Speaker 1: They're gonna say, finally, right, dang that Hillary for stealing

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Speaker 1: it from him in twenty sixteen when the Democratic Party

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Speaker 1: stole it from Bernie Sanders. And of course the Costio

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Speaker 1: Cortez is the future for some. But they're gonna have

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Speaker 1: a town hall about the shutdown. They were announcing this

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Speaker 1: on Friday. They knew the shutdown was gonna take that long.

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Speaker 1: It's proof, in my view that they are believers in

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Speaker 1: exact as much pain as possible to get their political

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Speaker 1: objectives accomplished, which is how do you make Trump look bad?

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Speaker 2: And how I think this works.

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Speaker 1: Is trying to take credit for the continuation of Obamacare subsidies,

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Speaker 1: the subsidies that were supposed to sunset with the end

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Speaker 1: of twenty twenty five, because they know that if they

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Speaker 1: agree to a negotiation, Trump's going to extend them anyway,

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Speaker 1: because his populace bona fides are going to absolutely go

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Speaker 1: in that direction, and then he's going to take credit

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Speaker 1: for it, and they don't want to lose credit for it.

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Speaker 2: I think there's a lot of lot of layers to

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Speaker 2: the thing.

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Speaker 1: Let me bring back Noah Rothlan from National Review dot Com,

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Speaker 1: because Noah, you have this piece the GOP is letting

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Speaker 1: the Democrats win the shutdown, And I'm telling you, Noah,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what you're talking about, in what world,

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Speaker 1: in what thought process, how do you come to the

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Speaker 1: place where where Republicans are letting Democrats win the shutdown?

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Speaker 3: When I published that piece on October ninth, the morning

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Speaker 3: of October ninth, nothing that had been advertised that was

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Speaker 3: going to punish Democrats for seeking and shutting down the

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Speaker 3: government had happened, not one thing. I don't know how

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Speaker 3: any Republican could have been comfortable at that point with

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Speaker 3: the lack of squirming that Democrats were engaged inaged having

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Speaker 3: shut down the government with a convoluted theory of the

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Speaker 3: case that they could argue about Obamacare subsidies that they

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Speaker 3: themselves implemented this shutdown there rather, this phase out process

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Speaker 3: was implemented because they couldn't get Joe Mansion on board

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Speaker 3: for the Inflation Reduction Act. As part of the Inflation

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Speaker 3: Reduction Act, This is all they're doing, all they're making

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Speaker 3: and Republicans did what they promised at the outset of

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Speaker 3: the shutdown massive layoffs, there were none. They promised to

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Speaker 3: impose costs on Democrats politically about Obamacare. They weren't even

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Speaker 3: talking about Obamacare. Indeed, are reporters like cracked. The National

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Speaker 3: Review reporter Audrey Folberg reported well in advance of much

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Speaker 3: of the media that the Republicans in Congress were thinking

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Speaker 3: about caving to these demands put in some few more

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Speaker 3: subsidies COVID era subsidies. And by the way, this is

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Speaker 3: about six million people we're taking advantage of this stuff

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Speaker 3: in twenty fourteen, and today it's like twenty three million.

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Speaker 3: It just grows and grows and grows. In the interim.

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Speaker 3: In the days since, we've seen Republicans put a little

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Speaker 3: bit of muscle to their Democratic colleagues. The firings that

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Speaker 3: Russ fought advertised are happening, and they're going to go

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Speaker 3: to court and say Darris to you know, we don't

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Speaker 3: want to hire these people back. What are you going

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Speaker 3: to do about it? We've seen Speaker Johnson now actually

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Speaker 3: making the case against Obamacare for the first time in

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Speaker 3: a long time. Lo and behold that the Speaker of

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Speaker 3: the House is saying that this is an unsustainable entitlement

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Speaker 3: program that was designed to fail at all. It is

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Speaker 3: is just this gaping maw into which we shovel taxpayer

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Speaker 3: dollars that go nowhere and do nothing for you. That's

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Speaker 3: what I wanted to see, and we're finally beginning to

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Speaker 3: see it. So it's not my universe that I don't

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Speaker 3: quite understand. I don't understand how Republicans and of any

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Speaker 3: stripe were comfortable with the degree to which they were

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Speaker 3: letting Democrats retail narratives that are false and flawed and

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Speaker 3: shutting down the government to pursue a negotiating tactic that

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Speaker 3: they just came up with after the fact, and that

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Speaker 3: we all know has only anything to do with Chuck

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Speaker 3: Schumer's deteriorating position among progressive voters.

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Speaker 2: Which is true or.

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Speaker 3: More tolerant of that. We're tolerant of that.

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Speaker 1: We're in all sorts of agreement that Schumer has lost

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Speaker 1: the plot. He can't lead, he is not a wartime conciliary,

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Speaker 1: and his day as leader is done.

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Speaker 3: We agree with this, Yeah, I would imagine. So, I mean,

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Speaker 3: I'm not sure, but I wouldn't be surprised at all

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Speaker 3: if he didn't run for reelection, seeing a causey of

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Speaker 3: Quartez coming up in his rear.

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Speaker 1: Talking to Noah Rowthin of National Review, your point is now,

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Speaker 1: as I understand it, is very well taken because you're

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Speaker 1: making the argument, and it's interesting to hear it from you.

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Speaker 1: All right, I consider you one of the more astute minds.

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Speaker 1: Don't always agree, but I am convinced that there's real

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Speaker 1: thought and caring going into your positions based on your

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Speaker 1: big history brain and your understanding of conservatism.

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Speaker 2: But it's it's sometimes really nice.

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Speaker 1: To hear you say, Man, these Republicans are a bunch

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Speaker 1: of pansies.

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Speaker 2: What the hell is this? Where money?

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Speaker 3: Honey?

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Speaker 2: But that's your argument. I love it.

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Speaker 3: I have this earned reputation among the activist class on

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Speaker 3: the American rights for being kind of squishy, But it

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Speaker 3: has nothing to do with It has everything to do

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Speaker 3: with tactics and not about strategy. The people who want

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Speaker 3: to fight every time for every hill at all times,

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Speaker 3: without any consideration for the consequences or strategic positioning get

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Speaker 3: really annoyed when I say, now, this is not the

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Speaker 3: great time to fight. That's their problem. It's always been

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Speaker 3: their problem. And then all of a sudden we have

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Speaker 3: a situation where, yeah, now's the time to fight. You're

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Speaker 3: loaded for bear, you have a good tactical and strategic position,

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Speaker 3: and you're observing forbearance. Why because, and the only reason why,

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Speaker 3: in my view, is you're getting a lot of pushbacks

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Speaker 3: to the extent you're getting any pushback anymore, because it's

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Speaker 3: just really not the case. But when I wrote that piece,

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Speaker 3: getting some pushback from say the comments section is because

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Speaker 3: it was critical of the Republicans, critical of Donald Trump,

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Speaker 3: and that's the difference. I'm yeah, you can be critical

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Speaker 3: of Donald Trump and still have a tactical and strategic

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Speaker 3: differences with conservatives and still maintain conservative discipline and be

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Speaker 3: a political actor that's effective. But if you're fighting it

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Speaker 3: all all the time, in all ways, in every direction,

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Speaker 3: then you're not going to be effective. Likewise, if you're

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Speaker 3: just giving up for the sake of giving up for

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Speaker 3: the sake of a political narrative, which would look like

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Speaker 3: for a while, as you say, you still anticipate Donald

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Speaker 3: Trump to fold when it comes to these voluncare subsidies.

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Speaker 3: That would be a terrible disaster GOP.

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Speaker 2: Oh, do you want to place bets? Noah, put your

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Speaker 2: money down.

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Speaker 3: I don't think you're wrong. I don't think you're wrong.

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Speaker 3: I think it would be a terrible disaster for the GOP.

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Speaker 3: It's coming, I mean, notify, legitimize, and to just shovel

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Speaker 3: money into it and take ownership of that program when

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Speaker 3: it is in secret. Doounson is right? Destined to implode'll

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Speaker 3: be very bad for the Republic. I've got the popular

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Speaker 3: I don't think you're wrong, but it's but it's terrible

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Speaker 3: and it should be opposed.

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Speaker 2: Talking to Noah Rothman of National Review.

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Speaker 1: Be sure to check out his columns over there, and

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Speaker 1: be sure to check out his books, including the Rise

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Speaker 1: of the New Puritans, Fighting Back against Progressives, War on Fun,

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Speaker 1: available at Amazon dot com wherever fine books are sold.

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Speaker 1: I've got the populist Marjorie Taylor Green sounding like a Democrat.

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Speaker 1: I've got the popular Center Josh Hawley sounding like a democrat.

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Speaker 2: There's a real freaking problem going on here.

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Speaker 3: What this is not the first time, No, not the

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Speaker 3: first time. Populist Republicans sound like democrats because they embraced

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Speaker 3: democratic policies. Yes, yes, that's why, and they always have.

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Speaker 3: You don't need two parties in this country of the

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Speaker 3: same mind on whether the government spends too much money

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Speaker 3: or not enough money.

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Speaker 2: Rather not enough money.

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Speaker 1: Right, there's I'm hearing Josh Holly discuss the fact that

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Speaker 1: we need to be pushing back.

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Speaker 2: On Amazon because they're not unionized.

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Speaker 1: And so, of course Trump is going to do it

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Speaker 1: because it's going to make him look good. Look what

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Speaker 1: I'm doing extending your subsidies. And yes, you've got populous

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Speaker 1: Republicans who are going to absolutely fall in line because

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Speaker 1: they see some kind of weird value system here.

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Speaker 3: They do. They see a political argument. The Americans like

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Speaker 3: unions a lot in abstract, they don't want to join them,

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Speaker 3: which is killing. It tells you something about ten percent

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Speaker 3: of the private workforce is unionizing this country. You would

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Speaker 3: thank for the amount of time that politicians talk about

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Speaker 3: unions that half the country belong to organized labor. They don't.

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Speaker 3: One of the Republican Party's biggest victories of the twenty

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Speaker 3: tens was not just policy oriented, but paradigmatic right to

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Speaker 3: work laws, which allowed individuals to join whatever shop they

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Speaker 3: want to and work at whatever shop they want to

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Speaker 3: without being forced to join a union or without being

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Speaker 3: forced to contribute wages to an organization they might not

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Speaker 3: even belong to. That was a stumongous victory for the GOP,

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Speaker 3: and it has been eroded in part because Republicans turned

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Speaker 3: against it and don't celebrate it anymore. They don't even

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Speaker 3: seem to notice that these laws are being repealed in

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Speaker 3: places like Michigan. It's a travesty for the Republican Party.

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Speaker 3: They're just giving up a victory that took them a

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Speaker 3: generation to secure, and all in the pursuit of this

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00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 3: convoluted idea of what the electorate is or what it

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00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,320
Speaker 3: looks like in this the noble working man theory of

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Speaker 3: the case that Donald Trump and his accolytes seemed to

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00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,880
Speaker 3: believe delivered him the White House. It wasn't union members

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Speaker 3: that delivered him the White House. They contributed because he

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Speaker 3: had a giant coalition of voters. The giant coalition of

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Speaker 3: voters is what got you into the White House. And

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Speaker 3: preserving that and making life better for them on the whole,

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Speaker 3: on the aggregate, is what's going to keep the Republican

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Speaker 3: Party in power. Abandoning them will not.

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Speaker 2: No Rothman National Review, Noah C. Rothman.

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Speaker 1: That's the letter C Noahs C. Rothman on X follow

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Speaker 1: him there. I appreciate it, man, very very much. This

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Speaker 1: is Tony Katz today,