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Speaker 1: Joining us now on the show, and I'm sure thrilled

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Speaker 1: to be doing so. From ESPN dot com. Stephen Holder

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Speaker 1: is at the NFL owners meeting. Stephen, all I know

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Speaker 1: is this the meeting. It's the owner's meetings are in Arizona?

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Speaker 1: Is that correct?

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Speaker 2: That is correct? Okay?

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Speaker 1: Now where exactly the state? So where exactly in Arizona?

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Speaker 2: We are in Phoenix at the Arizona Biltmore, where I

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Speaker 2: am not staying because I don't have that big inexpense report.

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Speaker 2: But it's it's phenomenal, I will tell you. There are

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Speaker 2: I think four pools. It's pretty cool. They're all amazing.

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Speaker 2: It's waterslide too, apparently in the kids pool. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: you know, i'f're looking for some spring break fun and

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Speaker 2: you got twelve hundred bucks a night to spare. Come

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Speaker 2: on down.

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Speaker 1: How's how's putt putt at the Glendale Howard Johnson.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they don't give Mary out points over there, but

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Speaker 2: they do it the Renaissance, so so I'm making do there. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: they have a they have an executive lounge though for

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Speaker 2: preferred customers, and the croissants were okay, yeah.

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Speaker 1: I'm looking up right here. The Arizona built more hotel

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Speaker 1: and resort in Phoenix, Arizona. It does look like a

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Speaker 1: nice place. Do you think is this the kind of

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Speaker 1: place where they list the the rates on the web

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Speaker 1: or is it like a call if you're interested.

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Speaker 2: I think this probably depends on the room you're seeking.

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Speaker 2: I think if you want one of the many villas

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Speaker 2: that are available, you may have to call for the

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Speaker 2: special arrangements on those.

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Speaker 1: I'm looking right now in November. It doesn't look like

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Speaker 1: to And this is interesting. As soon as I put

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Speaker 1: it in, it says sorry, nothing available. Clearly they've got

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Speaker 1: some sort of a spyware on there. Okay, So Carli

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Speaker 1: orse Gordon has spoken, Chris Ballard has spoken, Shane Steichen

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Speaker 1: has spoken. If you could summarize if there was one thing,

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Speaker 1: Stephen that you would say was a theme or a

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Speaker 1: message that if there was one thing that you thought, wow,

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Speaker 1: they us have all gotten together at the Continental Breakfast

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Speaker 1: to make sure they were on the same page regarding

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Speaker 1: the messaging of something. What would it be?

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Speaker 2: Well, look, I mean I think I would just say

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Speaker 2: that they all suggest that they're very comfortable with where

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Speaker 2: things are at right now, because I think a lot

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Speaker 2: of fans seem underwhelmed by this off season. I asked

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Speaker 2: them about that in many different ways, and the reaction

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Speaker 2: from them was essentially, we think we checked our boxes

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Speaker 2: this offseason. They feel like they have accomplished what they

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Speaker 2: needed to do this offseason. I think the counter argument

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Speaker 2: is that, well, you just got back to like a

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Speaker 2: base level, and so I have you know, proceeded to

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Speaker 2: counter you know, is that enough? And you know, I

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Speaker 2: think the answers we'll see. I don't think they have

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Speaker 2: a great answer, particularly on defense. They don't have a

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Speaker 2: lot of great answers in terms of what they have

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Speaker 2: or haven't done. They've done what they've done, and they

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Speaker 2: are where they are and they seem confident or seem

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Speaker 2: comfortable with it. Whether that's or not, that's what they said.

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Speaker 1: I thought. Carl Er say, Gordon Stephen Holder is my

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Speaker 1: guest ESPN dot com. By the way, Steven, if you

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Speaker 1: want to go there in July, i'd take one hundred

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Speaker 1: and eighty degrees admittedly, but if you want to go

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Speaker 1: in July, you can stay at a resort room with

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Speaker 1: two queen beds for one hundred and seventy eight a night.

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Speaker 1: It's not terrible, right.

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Speaker 2: Oh, that's amazing actually, but it's also July.

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Speaker 1: Right, November three, November three sixty a night.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's also not the week the NFL owners

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Speaker 2: take over the place, so that's probably has something to

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Speaker 2: do with it.

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Speaker 1: You know that that checks out. Let me let me

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Speaker 1: see what it would cost if you did it right

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Speaker 1: now now. They're probably they're booked though right now.

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Speaker 2: Right presumably we also have the Women's Final Force coming

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Speaker 2: to town too, apparently. Let me see here what that

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Speaker 2: is adding to the demand here, Yeah, in town, all.

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Speaker 1: Right, I'm checking rooms right now to see what it

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Speaker 1: would be this weekend if we just decided, let me know.

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Speaker 2: Maybe maybe this was a missed opportunity by me miss

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Speaker 2: test eight nine four a night. Then you oh, okay,

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Speaker 2: not quite twelve hundred, but close. That's good.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's and I'm talking about what I just mentioned.

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Speaker 1: By the way, comes with a cot and then an

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Speaker 1: ice bucket. That's it. So yes, I would imagine a

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Speaker 1: legit room, probably two grant they Is there the possibility

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Speaker 1: that Chris Ballard even knew and I've I've broached this

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Speaker 1: subject before, but maybe now we have a little bit

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Speaker 1: more clarity. Is there the possibility that Chris Ballard knew

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Speaker 1: and Carli Ersa Gordon knew that with the unfortunate passing

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Speaker 1: of Jim, irsay that the first year that his daughters

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Speaker 1: would be in charge would literally be a year of

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Speaker 1: financial inventory and simply figuring out the taxes that are

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Speaker 1: going to be do, the the valuation of the franchise,

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Speaker 1: the numbers, all of it, all of the business operations.

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Speaker 1: Learning and tiptoeing through that for the first year would

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Speaker 1: prioritize then over. Okay, now that we understand the business

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Speaker 1: aspect of it, let's get down to the brass tacks

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Speaker 1: of the football standpoint, and that that gave some flexibility

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Speaker 1: even to Chris Ballard, of understanding and knowing that everything

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Speaker 1: was kind of set aside for a year or so to.

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Speaker 2: Speak, well, I would say, I would say probably not.

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Speaker 2: I don't know that I agree. And here's why, because

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Speaker 2: let's go back to last spring around this time. Now,

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Speaker 2: Jim Mercy was still with us at the time. But

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Speaker 2: you know, we don't know what his health was at

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Speaker 2: that time. It does not appear that it was great,

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Speaker 2: although I won't go further than that because I don't know,

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Speaker 2: but it does not appear he was in great health

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Speaker 2: at that point. So I say that to say curlier,

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Speaker 2: say Gordon was in a very influential position at that point,

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Speaker 2: and they had I thought that their most aggressive off

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Speaker 2: season in many, many years in terms of their free

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Speaker 2: agents spending. And then I fast forward to this offseason

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Speaker 2: where even though and Chris Ballard made this point yesterday

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Speaker 2: he said, look, we didn't go out and sign Mooney,

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Speaker 2: Ward or Cambinen or those types of guys this offseason,

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Speaker 2: but he said that might have had something to do

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Speaker 2: with us spending forty four million on the quarterback in

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Speaker 2: twenty eight million on a wide receiver, speaking of Daniel

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Speaker 2: Jones of course, and Alec Pierce. They're in house free agents.

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Speaker 2: I mean, that's a massive amount of money that they

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Speaker 2: had to dedicate to two players, so effectively, whether you're

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Speaker 2: spending it inside or outside of your building, you're spending

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Speaker 2: a ton of money. I would argue they're spending. Spending

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Speaker 2: is not their problem right now. Frankly, spending is not

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Speaker 2: their problem. I think I think their issue is they

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Speaker 2: have some holes in the roster that just have not

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Speaker 2: been have not been filled, or at least the appearance

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Speaker 2: right now, something outside looking in is that they have

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Speaker 2: not filled them. Time will tell.

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Speaker 1: Are there any topics of discussion or question marks or

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Speaker 1: holes that need to be addressed within the league itself

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Speaker 1: that have been discussed at these meetings that you did

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Speaker 1: not anticipate going in.

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Speaker 3: No.

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Speaker 2: I think there are some predictable things that did get discussed,

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Speaker 2: but I wouldn't say there were any surprises. I mean,

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Speaker 2: the thing I want to see here in a little

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Speaker 2: bit when we hear from Roger Goodell. The issue that's

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Speaker 2: simmering that we're probably not talking enough about is what's

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Speaker 2: going on with the officials. They are they're in a

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Speaker 2: potential lockout situation if they don't get a deal here

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Speaker 2: with the union that represents the game officials. And so

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Speaker 2: if that happens and they have a standoff and they

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Speaker 2: don't get a deal, you're looking at You're looking at

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Speaker 2: replacement referees, and they have already started the process of

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Speaker 2: hiring and vetting replacement referees. That's not good for anybody, okay,

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Speaker 2: and they should be feeling a lot of pressure about this,

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Speaker 2: but they seem willing to move forward with replacements if

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Speaker 2: need be, so I'm interested to see how that goes.

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Speaker 2: A fancy motorcycle is riding by me right now, so

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Speaker 2: it's gonna be a little while.

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Speaker 1: How fancy, like I'm staying there in July fancy or

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Speaker 1: staying there during the NFL owners meeting fancy because there

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Speaker 1: appears to be a significant difference.

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Speaker 2: A good question. I'm not a motorcycle guy. I know

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Speaker 2: it's not a very manly thing to say, but I'm

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Speaker 2: not a motorcycle guy. I don't know much about bikes.

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Speaker 2: I know cars, but not bikes.

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Speaker 1: I've always wondered this. I've asked this before. Why do

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Speaker 1: we say bicycle but motorcycle?

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Speaker 2: I work with words, but I don't have an answer

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Speaker 2: for this one.

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Speaker 1: I mean, all your changes the prefix, why are we

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Speaker 1: changing the pronunciation on the suffix.

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Speaker 2: That's a great question. I actually real quick. I just

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Speaker 2: thought about something you asked me, you know, about financial

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Speaker 2: flexibility and things of that nature. I did get into

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Speaker 2: a conversation with Carli Ersa Gordon the other day that

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Speaker 2: I do want to I do want to reference stuff.

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Speaker 2: I think it's relevant to your question. I asked her.

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Speaker 2: You may know, if you, if you follow the business

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Speaker 2: side of the NFL, you may know that they had

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Speaker 2: to vote to affirm the right to have private equity

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Speaker 2: investment in your team if you so choose as an owner,

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Speaker 2: which you know private equity is a controversial topic in

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Speaker 2: every industry.

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Speaker 1: Steven, let me let me stop you right there, and

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Speaker 1: I'm to put that in a more simple term. Basically,

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Speaker 1: what that means is the NFL owners are voting on the.

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Speaker 2: They've already voted. They did this this in a prior year.

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Speaker 1: But so they have cleared the way for if you

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Speaker 1: so choose to basically go out and find people off

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Speaker 1: the street to invest in your franchise. Is that essentially

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Speaker 1: what that means.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's like these Wall Street firms that basically go

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Speaker 2: out and invest in various industries or businesses and reach

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Speaker 2: the profits from it. And so it's it's not as

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Speaker 2: wide open as it sounds like that you have to

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Speaker 2: be an approved firm to do this. They vet you.

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Speaker 2: You know, there's only a handful that are even allowed in.

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Speaker 2: But it is allowed right and this and it hasn't

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Speaker 2: for a couple of years. There are three teams, one

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Speaker 2: of them being the Miami Dolphins, and a couple others

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Speaker 2: that absolutely have already taken advantage of this. So I

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Speaker 2: asked her said, you know, obviously it's a time of transition. Uh,

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Speaker 2: you know, do you have this this opportunity available to

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Speaker 2: you if need be or if you so choose, has

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Speaker 2: that Is that something you consider? She said that she

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Speaker 2: and her sisters discussed it, but they do not feel

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Speaker 2: the need to access that capital right now and they're

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Speaker 2: moving forward with full ownership of the team. So I

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Speaker 2: thought that was a way of her maybe signaling that, look,

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Speaker 2: we're here for the long haul and we're all in.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I think the thing to keep in mind,

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Speaker 2: she said this that Lucas Oil Stadium is reaching that

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Speaker 2: twenty year old mark now I think next year, and

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Speaker 2: as you get to that age, you're going to start

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Speaker 2: to need massive upgrades and that's going to cost probably

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Speaker 2: into the hundreds of millions of dollars. She said. They

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Speaker 2: will reevaluate at that point when they have to do

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Speaker 2: stadium renovations. They may or may not access private equity

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Speaker 2: at that point. Keep it. Last thing I'll say, if

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Speaker 2: you're a fan and you share that and you get

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Speaker 2: freaked out, I don't blame you, right because private equity

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Speaker 2: on Wall Street. You know, if you pay attention to

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Speaker 2: current events, a lot of times that ends poorly. The

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Speaker 2: key is the NFL only allows up to ten percent investment,

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Speaker 2: so that no one else in terms of the private

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Speaker 2: equity world, can own more than ten percent of the team.

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Speaker 1: Does that mean okay, and pardon my ignorance here, Steven, okay, sure?

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Speaker 1: Does that mean that no one person or no one firm,

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Speaker 1: no can buy more than ten percent or no more

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Speaker 1: than ten But hold on, does that mean that no

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Speaker 1: one that the maximum you can buy in is ten percent?

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Speaker 1: Or does that mean the maximum you can sell out

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Speaker 1: if you're the Colts is ten percent? Could they have

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Speaker 1: five different people that they sell ten percent each?

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Speaker 2: To My understanding is that that private equity in total,

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Speaker 2: private equity investment in total can be ten percent. That's

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Speaker 2: the way I understood it. And by the way, keep

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Speaker 2: in mind, you can, you could, you could sell, you

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Speaker 2: can have minority ownership, and that you can do whatever

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Speaker 2: you want theoretically. There.

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Speaker 1: Just to be clear, I will warn you, Stephen and

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Speaker 1: everyone else listening if at any point the Colts the city.

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Speaker 1: I guess the city more than the Colts. Here, If

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Speaker 1: at any point anybody comes to me for a single

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Speaker 1: dollar for Lucas Oil stadium renovations, I will absolutely scream

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Speaker 1: from the mountaintops to the point where probably it would

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Speaker 1: even like put me in jeopardy here because no, I agree. Now,

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Speaker 1: I am old enough to remember, like it was yesterday,

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Speaker 1: Like it was yesterday, I'm old enough to remember that

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Speaker 1: when the city of Indianapolis fleeced the taxpayers of this

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Speaker 1: town for seven hundred and twenty million dollars of like

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Speaker 1: one hundred ninety million I think of, which originally was

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Speaker 1: going to be the number, and it kept going up

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Speaker 1: on what we were going to pay. But the most

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Speaker 1: highly publicly subsidized sports building in the history of the

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Speaker 1: United States, one that has more tax dollars in it

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Speaker 1: come than Arizona, Dallas, and New York combined. Okay, And

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Speaker 1: at the time that we all agreed to bend over backwards,

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Speaker 1: reaching our wallet and hand it over to the city,

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Speaker 1: we all agreed on it because we were told this

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Speaker 1: is a one time deal, You're not going to have

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Speaker 1: to do it again. This is a stadium that is

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Speaker 1: going to then the bonds are going to pay for itself.

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Speaker 1: This is a stadium that is going to bring all

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Speaker 1: kinds of bookoo bucks in and all kinds of events

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Speaker 1: that are going to come here and is one size

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Speaker 1: fits all. This is a one size fits all stadium

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Speaker 1: that's going to do everything and answer every question. And

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Speaker 1: I know it's a big sacrifice, but you're only going

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Speaker 1: to have to make it once, and I'm going to

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Speaker 1: hold them to it. I'll see you said, and I

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Speaker 1: think you're right to do that. I think you're right

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Speaker 1: to do that. Listen.

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Speaker 2: Since that time, I think in the last two decades,

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Speaker 2: attitudes toward public financing of stadiums has I think certainly

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Speaker 2: gone the other direction, on the other direction, and a

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Speaker 2: lot of teams now they don't even go there, you know,

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Speaker 2: because they know it's a it's a non starter. It

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Speaker 2: depends in your market. There still are teams obviously doing it,

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Speaker 2: you know. I don't know what's going on, like for example,

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Speaker 2: the Chicago Bears. I don't know if they're looking for

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Speaker 2: public financing, but uh, but they certainly are in a

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Speaker 2: in a strange situation with their stadium. But my point

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Speaker 2: is there are a lot of teams now that they

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Speaker 2: just they literally do not go there because it's such

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Speaker 2: a toxic subject for the fan base that even even

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Speaker 2: fan bases that are you know, certainly deeply invested in

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Speaker 2: their teams. They still don't want to hear it, you know,

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Speaker 2: and so I get it. I'm with you. I I

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Speaker 2: think just as a just as a as a citizen,

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Speaker 2: as a voter, I am. I am staunchly against that concept.

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Speaker 2: And I will say you've seen it now, like for example,

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Speaker 2: the Miami Dolphins, if you've been to hard Rock Stadium,

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Speaker 2: that stadiums come a long way, well, that was pay

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Speaker 2: for out of Steve Ross's pockets, their owner, like a

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Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty million dollar renovation, and the culture

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Speaker 2: are probably gonna end up having to do the same

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Speaker 2: thing when the time comes at Lucas.

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Speaker 1: Oil, Steven Holder down in Arizona, NFL owners meeting all

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Speaker 1: the coverage ESPN and ESPN dot com as well. Go

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Speaker 1: get on your fancy motorcycle and ride yourself back to

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Speaker 1: the hojo.

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Speaker 2: All right, brother, I'll see you.

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Speaker 1: I appreciate Steven Holder joining us on the program. I

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Speaker 1: love everything about the Final Four. I've always loved the

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Speaker 1: Final Four. I love the the trivia of it, I

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Speaker 1: love the history of it. I love the random nature

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Speaker 1: of an LSU in eighty six, or South Carolina a

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Speaker 1: few years ago, or George Mason, you know, just the

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Speaker 1: the fact that there's always a Cinderella story in the

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Speaker 1: Final four. Maybe not so much this year, but stars

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Speaker 1: can emerge in the Final four. I've just always loved

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Speaker 1: everything about it, the fact that it's the turn of spring,

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Speaker 1: and as an Indianapolis native, it is surreal. Two things

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Speaker 1: about the Final Four to me are surreal. One of

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Speaker 1: them is that Indianapolis has become one of the regular

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Speaker 1: rotation homes of the event, because I remember just what

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Speaker 1: an absolute thrill and honor and it was to think

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Speaker 1: in ninety one that for the second time Indianapolis was

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Speaker 1: hosting one and the world was looking at us the

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Speaker 1: other thing, to be honest, and I'm not just saying

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Speaker 1: this because he's our next guest on the program, but

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Speaker 1: you know, in reading about and learning about and just

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Speaker 1: always anticipating the Final Four, I really don't think. I

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Speaker 1: guess two people that come to mind. John Feinstein always

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Speaker 1: came to mind to me, just because of a season

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Speaker 1: on the brink and then seeing him at Final Fours.

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Speaker 1: But Mike DECURSI I think, from the standpoint of writing

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Speaker 1: about it, has done as much to champion and celebrate

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Speaker 1: and grow and spread the enthusiasm of this event, I

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Speaker 1: think as much as anybody that you can find, certainly

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Speaker 1: in the written word, but in the word in general

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Speaker 1: about the Final Four. And to know that he's become

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Speaker 1: a regular guest on the program to me is also

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Speaker 1: again surreal. But I loved reading recently that Mike just

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Speaker 1: wrote about his favorite Final Four memories, and Mike, that's

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Speaker 1: because an illustrious career and covering the event that You've

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Speaker 1: decided for the Sporting News that this one is the

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Speaker 1: curtain call in terms of your Final Four coverage. Is

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Speaker 1: that correct?

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Speaker 3: Well, particlarly, maybe not Final four coverage, but the rest

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Speaker 3: of the year coverage is going to kind of be

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Speaker 3: really scaled back a lot. I'm going to retire from

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Speaker 3: the full time employment situation with the Sporting News, and

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Speaker 3: I still intend to do, hopefully a lot of the

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Speaker 3: broadcasting work that I've been doing over the last couple decades,

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Speaker 3: and I'll still maintain some presence at Sporting News, including

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Speaker 3: we are one of the four components of the consensus

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Speaker 3: All America team, and I take great pride in that,

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Speaker 3: and I assemble a group of esteemed veteran basketball journalists

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Speaker 3: from across the country to put together our team, and

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Speaker 3: I will continue to administer that at minimum, and so

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Speaker 3: it's possible I'll still be doing some NCAA tournament coverage

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Speaker 3: as well. We'll see about that. Exactly what form it's

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Speaker 3: going to take, we haven't really decided upon. But getting

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Speaker 3: up in the morning and going straight to my desk

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Speaker 3: every day, it's time for that for there to be

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Speaker 3: some alternate to that routine.

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Speaker 1: How much of that also is Mike and I think

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Speaker 1: that we've all been like bracing for this, and I

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Speaker 1: don't think it's bad. I think it's been actually, in

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Speaker 1: some ways maybe even more refreshing than I anticipated. But

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Speaker 1: how much is college basketball different than even say, five

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Speaker 1: years ago, and the way that it may look for

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Speaker 1: five years from now, Well it.

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Speaker 3: Looks a lot different, but in a lot of ways

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Speaker 3: that aren't appreciated, it looks better. It's a better game now,

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Speaker 3: first of all, in the way the rules are administered,

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Speaker 3: the elimination of I never take credit for this term.

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Speaker 3: I love it, I can't take credit for it. Brandon Prunty,

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Speaker 3: former sports writer now pr executive in New Jersey, used

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Speaker 3: to work for New York Star Ledger and cover the

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Speaker 3: Rutgers and Seaton Hall and those guys, and he came

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Speaker 3: up with the term charbage, which is an amalgamation of

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Speaker 3: garbage charges. And that ruled basketball for the better part

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Speaker 3: of two decades, and it made the game stagnant and

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Speaker 3: less interesting than it should be, and it rewarded bad defense,

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Speaker 3: and we fought for years to get rid of it.

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Speaker 3: And the late great John Adams, who was such a

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Speaker 3: good friend and did so much for my family that

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Speaker 3: a lot of people don't know about. He ten years

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Speaker 3: ago tried to get that rock up the hill and

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Speaker 3: it didn't happen, but the force of that launch eventually

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Speaker 3: took place. And now you see, I mean, how much

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Speaker 3: different a player would y Exel Lendeborg be if you

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Speaker 3: could I don't know that anybody would want to, but

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Speaker 3: if you could just jump in front of him anytime

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Speaker 3: he got going and fall down and get a call,

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Speaker 3: Yax is going to be on the bench half the game.

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Speaker 3: And that's not the way it should be. The game

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Speaker 3: is supposed to be dynamic, and it is again. And

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Speaker 3: so that's the first part of what makes it better.

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Speaker 3: And then the other element of what makes it better

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Speaker 3: is the number of players who now are actually I'm

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Speaker 3: not in favor of the fighting part, but the idea

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Speaker 3: that they want to fight to stay in college. Whereas

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Speaker 3: even six or seven years ago, or maybe even five

391
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Speaker 3: years ago, players who really would prefer to have stayed

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Speaker 3: in college because they knew they weren't necessarily ready for

393
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Speaker 3: the NBA or ready to pack up and go to

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Speaker 3: play in Europe, just had to make some money playing

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Speaker 3: the game. They just couldn't. They just couldn't keep not

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Speaker 3: making six grand a year on cost of attendance and

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Speaker 3: all of that, when their skills were worth more than that, clearly,

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Speaker 3: and there probably would be somebody that would pay them,

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Speaker 3: if not in the NBA. And so those players are

400
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Speaker 3: staying in college now, so you have better players playing

401
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Speaker 3: the sport. And if you want to add in the

402
00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:27,119
Speaker 3: Illinois circumstance, players who before would say, okay, like if

403
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Speaker 3: I go over there and play, when can I enter

404
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Speaker 3: the draft? And how well, yeah, and I have to

405
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Speaker 3: give up what money I am making and all the

406
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Speaker 3: rest of that, they would they would stay in Europe

407
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Speaker 3: and then they file for the draft and then maybe

408
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Speaker 3: the team would take them at stash them in Europe.

409
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Speaker 3: They and we don't really need you now, and now

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Speaker 3: they come here and they make better money in some

411
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Speaker 3: cases than they would have made with their clubs in

412
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Speaker 3: the in the in Europe, and they get themselves better trained.

413
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Speaker 3: I don't care what anybody says. The best training in

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Speaker 3: the world for the NBA is college basketball. Okay so

415
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Speaker 3: Yan and a few others, Jokic, those guys went through

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Speaker 3: Europe the system.

417
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Speaker 2: But MJ.

418
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Speaker 3: Magic. You look at Paul Pierce, the best players in

419
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Speaker 3: the history of the game went through college. Larry Bird,

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Speaker 3: of course I should have certainly mentioned.

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Speaker 1: That, Chamberlin Russell, on and on right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean they went and you continue to have

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Speaker 3: this incredible resource of Tom Izzo and Bill Self and

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Speaker 3: John Calipari and Rick Patino, who are unbelievable teachers of

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Speaker 3: the game. And you can get that, and now you

426
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Speaker 3: can get paid to do that, and you can get

427
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Speaker 3: yourself ready for the highest league in the world. There's

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Speaker 3: no better place to develop NBA talent than there isn't

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Speaker 3: in American colleges.

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Speaker 1: Mike, when you look at Mike de COURSI is my guest,

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Speaker 1: of course, Sporting News, Big ten Network as well. When

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Speaker 1: you look at this final four, you know I was

433
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Speaker 1: looking this up yesterday. Everybody amongst these four teams, they

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Speaker 1: all shoot the three pointer in terms of shooting percentage

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Speaker 1: at a pretty even clip. It's pretty even amongst the four. However,

436
00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,360
Speaker 1: the volume is different. Illinois obviously shoots nearly double over

437
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,840
Speaker 1: the course of the year than did Arizona. Whenever you

438
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,639
Speaker 1: get into a Lucas Oil stadium. And I know this

439
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,320
Speaker 1: sounds crazy and it doesn't mean for the totality of

440
00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,639
Speaker 1: the game, but sometimes early in the game it takes

441
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:31,560
Speaker 1: shooters a minute, and I know they have walked throughs

442
00:23:31,560 --> 00:23:34,480
Speaker 1: and practices, but the depth perception is just a little

443
00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:39,480
Speaker 1: bit different. Okay, Is this a Final Four that can

444
00:23:39,560 --> 00:23:43,080
Speaker 1: be won by an Illinois, for example, by simply out

445
00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,040
Speaker 1: three point shooting everyone, so to speak? Will the three

446
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:49,400
Speaker 1: be a prevalent part of the storyline within this Final four?

447
00:23:50,080 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 3: Jake, I've written multiple times over the years, and more

448
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 3: so even than me, there have been statistans. I believe

449
00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:00,840
Speaker 3: Ken Palmroy has done this. It's actually not as much

450
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:04,800
Speaker 3: impact on the performances as people think there are. And

451
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:08,119
Speaker 3: one of the back when they used to put the

452
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:11,600
Speaker 3: regionals on occasion, what they would often do is use

453
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:14,680
Speaker 3: the regionals as a trial run for the following year's

454
00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:16,440
Speaker 3: Final Four. If the Final Four was coming to Indy

455
00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 3: one year, let's say, let's say it was come in

456
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:22,119
Speaker 3: twenty ten, they would put it in the in the

457
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 3: in Lucas Oil in two thousand and nine.

458
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,200
Speaker 1: Well, the regionals, we're here last year, right at Lucas Oil.

459
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 3: They don't. They no longer feel compelled to do that,

460
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:34,160
Speaker 3: but I believe that they did that a year ago

461
00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:36,959
Speaker 3: in a lot of cases. But anyway, back when they

462
00:24:37,040 --> 00:24:40,359
Speaker 3: used to do that, we would have games in like

463
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:44,359
Speaker 3: traditional domes like the Alamo Dome, which they've now retrofitted

464
00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:46,000
Speaker 3: in a way that they can use the Final four

465
00:24:46,040 --> 00:24:47,879
Speaker 3: set up. But back when they used to stick the

466
00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,600
Speaker 3: court in the corner and then block off half, and

467
00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,800
Speaker 3: then we had the basketball arenas like say FedEx down

468
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:56,280
Speaker 3: in Memphis, and then you would have the real the

469
00:24:56,320 --> 00:24:58,760
Speaker 3: stadium looked that they would use, like at Lucas Oil,

470
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,639
Speaker 3: that like they'll use this weekend. And so you could say, Okay,

471
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,960
Speaker 3: what were the shot numbers here, there and there? And

472
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 3: I was able to look at that, and there really

473
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:08,119
Speaker 3: wasn't any difference as a matter of fact, in the

474
00:25:08,200 --> 00:25:10,040
Speaker 3: year that I checked, and it probably had something to

475
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 3: do with the teams, but I think it said something.

476
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 3: The year that I checked, I believe was two thousand

477
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:19,520
Speaker 3: and nine, the worst shooting performances were in FedEx in Memphis,

478
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,560
Speaker 3: not in the domes. So it's I think what you're

479
00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:28,600
Speaker 3: seeing in those early parts really is they're nervous, right, Yeah,

480
00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,680
Speaker 3: it's that simple. They it's the final four man. It's

481
00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:33,360
Speaker 3: as big.

482
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 2: As it gets.

483
00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:36,800
Speaker 3: And yeah, okay, so the seventy five thousand people thing

484
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:41,560
Speaker 3: probably makes a difference more so than the shooting background.

485
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:46,240
Speaker 3: Kids grow up even now, playing on playgrounds where the

486
00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 3: with metal rimstal, metal nets and metal backboards and on

487
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:55,440
Speaker 3: occasion maybe not even a net. Remember those days where

488
00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:57,240
Speaker 3: you'd hoop and you wouldn't have met the ball.

489
00:25:57,400 --> 00:26:00,280
Speaker 1: Comply would throw you off too. It was like and

490
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 1: it was like watching Trey Kaufman Wren's put back. You're

491
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 1: like waiting, did that go in or not? And then

492
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,159
Speaker 1: you know, oh, my gosh.

493
00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:07,440
Speaker 3: I thought I thought that ball, I thought he missed.

494
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:08,360
Speaker 1: I thought it was a spare ball.

495
00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 3: It went so clean through the hoop. I didn't think

496
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:12,880
Speaker 3: it went in. That was the most amazing thing.

497
00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:16,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I listen back in the day and now we

498
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:18,280
Speaker 1: sound like, you know, the two old guys at the

499
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 1: end of the Muppets, But the two biggest like discussions

500
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 1: that would take place on the court. One was whether

501
00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:26,520
Speaker 1: or not you could actually technically call a foul right

502
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 1: when you shoot a ball and come ouside a foul.

503
00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,200
Speaker 1: And then the other would be that like it, did

504
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:30,879
Speaker 1: it go in or not?

505
00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:31,240
Speaker 2: Right?

506
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 1: I'm telling you went through this particular final four, Mike,

507
00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:40,399
Speaker 1: what's your favorite storyline maybe that you know obviously we

508
00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 1: know the big storylines, but is there anything that jumped

509
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 1: out at you where you thought to yourself, if more

510
00:26:44,520 --> 00:26:46,440
Speaker 1: people knew the story of that kid, or that coach

511
00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:48,879
Speaker 1: or that team, they would fall in love with it.

512
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 3: Well, one of the things that I really fell in

513
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:53,199
Speaker 3: love with through the Sweet Sixteen. I mean, I have

514
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,080
Speaker 3: no bradder Underwood for twenty years since he was an

515
00:26:56,119 --> 00:26:59,399
Speaker 3: assistant for Bob Huggins at K State. That's where I

516
00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 3: met him. He came up from the Juco's, Hugs hired

517
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:04,399
Speaker 3: him there and then he went on, you know, he

518
00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:08,159
Speaker 3: coached with Frank Martin at K State after Huggs went

519
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:12,560
Speaker 3: back to West Virginia, and he eventually winds up at

520
00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,240
Speaker 3: Steven F. Austin doing a phenomenal job there, gets to

521
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 3: oak State for a year, and then he gets at

522
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 3: the shot at Illinois, and I knew he would take

523
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,199
Speaker 3: that shot if he got it, and I knew he

524
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,960
Speaker 3: would succeed, but I didn't know he would succeed like this.

525
00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 3: I have a good friend in Indy, Jim Watson, who

526
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,240
Speaker 3: is a lot ILLINOI alum, and when they hired him,

527
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 3: I said, I said, I think you're getting a really

528
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 3: good one. And then I was nervous because I promised

529
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 3: him he was getting a good coach. Well, I think

530
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 3: Coach Underwood has backed up my promise. But what I

531
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 3: loved about what I heard from him was when he

532
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:51,639
Speaker 3: was being questioned about being the Illinois fighting a LINEI

533
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,639
Speaker 3: playing against Houston Cougar's in Houston, two miles from the

534
00:27:55,760 --> 00:28:00,040
Speaker 3: UH campus, and his response to that was, look, and

535
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:02,919
Speaker 3: it's been like twenty twenty five years since I was

536
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:07,200
Speaker 3: driving a van from Kansas with a bunch of junior

537
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:09,800
Speaker 3: college guys to go play a game in Mesa, Arizona.

538
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 3: I don't care where you put the Sweet sixteen, I'm

539
00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 3: going if I'm in it. And it was just such

540
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:19,919
Speaker 3: a beautiful appreciation of how far he's come, and I

541
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,200
Speaker 3: think any of us who've had some success can do

542
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:27,040
Speaker 3: the same. And in my case, I started off Jake

543
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:32,160
Speaker 3: making seven dollars a story. It was seven dollars plus mileage.

544
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:34,480
Speaker 3: I don't know how many cents a mile, but it

545
00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 3: wasn't many. Seven dollars seven dollars a story for the

546
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 3: Mononga Hailey Daily Herald, which was Joe Montana's hometown, and

547
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 3: I covered high school sports for them for two and

548
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,480
Speaker 3: a half three years. And that's where it starts. And

549
00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:50,880
Speaker 3: the best part of that story is it was seven

550
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:54,440
Speaker 3: dollars a story plus mileage, and then like about halfway through,

551
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 3: they took away the mileage. I was cought them too much.

552
00:28:59,840 --> 00:29:01,800
Speaker 1: You were hoping at that point you were just writing

553
00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,120
Speaker 1: stories that were two miles from the campus, right, because

554
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 1: you weren't getting the mileage anyway. Right.

555
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:06,520
Speaker 2: Yeah.

556
00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 3: I was just happy to be able to learn how

557
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,160
Speaker 3: to do what I did, and I was so blessed

558
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,160
Speaker 3: to get that opportunity. A high school friend of mine

559
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:19,600
Speaker 3: asked me if what I was doing to try to

560
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 3: get ready, and she said, you know, you should go

561
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 3: down there. And I drove down to the Daily Herald office,

562
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 3: and I walked up to the front desk and asked

563
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 3: to speak to the sports editor and he came over

564
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,000
Speaker 3: and he said okay and gave me a shot on

565
00:29:32,040 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 3: the spot, and that was it. I worked for them

566
00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 3: for the next two and a half years writing high

567
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 3: school articles.

568
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:40,880
Speaker 1: How many of those seven dollars stories did you have

569
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 1: to write before you could properly spell Monongahey within the

570
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 1: Mononga Hala within the byline?

571
00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 3: Hey, when you grow up on the Yaka Ganiney River.

572
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:56,800
Speaker 4: Monaga hal is a walk in the park, right, Yes, absolutely.

573
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 1: Hey, Mike, your favorite memories of and you had a

574
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 1: great column and just you posted it yesterday is when

575
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:03,600
Speaker 1: I read it. But your favorite memories of the Final Four.

576
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: I loved the fact that you included. And I'm saying

577
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 1: this just for the younger audience or for those that

578
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:10,480
Speaker 1: might not have lived here in India at the time.

579
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:16,800
Speaker 1: You know, it's difficult to illustrate to people just how

580
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,239
Speaker 1: incredible and at the same time how surreal it was

581
00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 1: to have fifteen years removed from Bob Knight's last undefeated team,

582
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:27,360
Speaker 1: to have Vegas come here here with a chance to

583
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:31,080
Speaker 1: cap off a perfect season, and that shock of Duke

584
00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 1: upsetting UNLV and that ninety one final four. I love

585
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:38,360
Speaker 1: that you included that within some of your great memories.

586
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:39,959
Speaker 1: But man, there have been a ton of great memories,

587
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 1: haven't there.

588
00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 3: Absolutely? I mean, that was number one for me. I

589
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:46,080
Speaker 3: think that would have been my first Indie Final four,

590
00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:51,320
Speaker 3: and there have been several since, including the challenging one

591
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:56,160
Speaker 3: with COVID in twenty one, and that certainly is a

592
00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:59,880
Speaker 3: distinct memory. But it was great that the NCAA told

593
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 3: that off and we got to crown a champion that

594
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 3: year after the crushing disappointment of a year before. But

595
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:11,280
Speaker 3: I'll say this, and I will always say this, and

596
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 3: I know that it's probably a tougher thing for the

597
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:18,480
Speaker 3: NCAA to pull off now because one, so many people

598
00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:20,960
Speaker 3: are building stadiums with dome so that they can get

599
00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,719
Speaker 3: the Final four, and also the fact that once they

600
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:28,000
Speaker 3: moved there they're headquarters to Indy, they were kind of biased,

601
00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 3: so to speak. But I've always believed that every Final

602
00:31:31,160 --> 00:31:34,239
Speaker 3: four should be in Indianapolis. Maybe we'd get tired of it,

603
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 3: but I don't think so. Because Indianapolis I wrote this,

604
00:31:38,800 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 3: I got one of the wonderful pleasures of my last

605
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:46,440
Speaker 3: year on the job was when the Pacers made the

606
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:49,640
Speaker 3: Championship series last year and the finals were coming back

607
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:52,479
Speaker 3: to Indianapolis for the first time in twenty five years.

608
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 3: I got a chance to write about what I learned

609
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:58,560
Speaker 3: in my decade in India as a resident of the

610
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:04,520
Speaker 3: suburbs out there and Fishers and talk about how Indianapolis

611
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:07,280
Speaker 3: and the state of Indiana get basketball better than any

612
00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:10,200
Speaker 3: other place. I mean I lived after I left Pittsburgh,

613
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:12,720
Speaker 3: my hometown where I fell in love with the game,

614
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,400
Speaker 3: and almost no one else did, and almost all of

615
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:18,400
Speaker 3: those who did ended up leaving to become successful, like

616
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 3: Sean Miller, Herb Syndek, at Santa Clara, the late great

617
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 3: Skip Prosser. We all left to search for basketball, so

618
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:30,239
Speaker 3: to speak. And I went to Memphis, which was an

619
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:34,600
Speaker 3: incredible basketball city from the grassroots up, and Cincinnati, which

620
00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,080
Speaker 3: in the time I was there, was absolutely the best

621
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 3: college basketball city because they had Xavier and Cincinnati rocking

622
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 3: at a top twenty five level and the rivalry was unbelievable.

623
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 3: And then I moved to Indy, which is It's just

624
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:51,160
Speaker 3: basketball Heaven. I love the slogan we grow basketball here

625
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 3: because it absolutely captures the state, and I got to

626
00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 3: write that article about what basketball means to Indye and

627
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 3: to Indiana when they made the finals last year, and

628
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,120
Speaker 3: talked to a bunch of people around the state. Jason

629
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:09,360
Speaker 3: Gardner who grew up there, Michael Lewis who grew up

630
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 3: in Indiana, and Indianapolis should have the Final four because

631
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 3: they appreciate it. They put it on better than anybody

632
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 3: else by far, but also they appreciate it more than.

633
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 1: Anyone Arizona's loan championship came here in the final four

634
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,600
Speaker 1: in ninety seven. Of course, under lude Olsen Jason Gardner

635
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 1: took them to a final four, but they were not

636
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 1: able to win it. Illinois obviously is still in search

637
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 1: of their first national championship. Michigan won THEIRS in eighty nine,

638
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:41,320
Speaker 1: that was in Seattle, and then Connecticut obviously has you know,

639
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:44,400
Speaker 1: we know what Connecticut has done lately. Is there any

640
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 1: of these four that you would consider to be an

641
00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: upset if they were to win it?

642
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, Ukhn for sure, Illinois would be a like if

643
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:55,840
Speaker 3: you look at the odds. I was just on a

644
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:58,920
Speaker 3: call with someone else and he gave me the odds

645
00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 3: per team, and it's slightly above even money for Michigan,

646
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 3: a little bit more than that for Arizona, then around

647
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:11,880
Speaker 3: four to one for Illinois, and I think six or

648
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 3: seven to one for Yukon, something like that. And I think,

649
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 3: if you look at Yukon, their team right now is

650
00:34:22,080 --> 00:34:23,880
Speaker 3: very fortunate to be here now. Of course, they had

651
00:34:23,880 --> 00:34:25,680
Speaker 3: to make their own luck, and Braylan had to make

652
00:34:25,719 --> 00:34:30,760
Speaker 3: the amazing shot, But the things that I thought needed

653
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 3: to happen for them to get here didn't happen all

654
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 3: season long. Braylan Mullins is a great talent and he's

655
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:40,319
Speaker 3: going to He's going to get a chance to be

656
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,960
Speaker 3: an NBA first round pick, I hope in twenty twenty seven, honestly,

657
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:47,360
Speaker 3: because I don't think that his game has fully matured

658
00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 3: so that it's ready for the league. But he's a

659
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:53,320
Speaker 3: great talent, and they know it, and everybody on a

660
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 3: team knows it, and all the coaches know it, and

661
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,000
Speaker 3: they know that in order to win the biggest games,

662
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 3: Braylin's going to have to be who he is at

663
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:04,320
Speaker 3: his best. But it didn't happen in the first four rounds.

664
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,800
Speaker 3: It really didn't happen until there were six seconds left

665
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:10,799
Speaker 3: in the in the Duke ging, So that to me,

666
00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 3: if they're able to win it, I mean, obviously Braylin

667
00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:16,799
Speaker 3: will have to be special, and it won't be an

668
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,239
Speaker 3: upset if he is, but it'll be it'll have been

669
00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:20,239
Speaker 3: a long journey back.

670
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:24,520
Speaker 1: I think, Mike that the Danny Hurley gets a lot

671
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:26,719
Speaker 1: of credit for two things. I mean for a lot

672
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 1: of things. One of them is and I want you

673
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 1: to to tell me if this is an off base observation,

674
00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 1: but I look at Danny Hurley and I say, here's

675
00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:39,960
Speaker 1: a guy that theoretically, during the game itself, at times

676
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,960
Speaker 1: loses all self control. I mean, maybe he's within control,

677
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:45,120
Speaker 1: but I mean he's he's all over the place, right,

678
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:47,560
Speaker 1: he's he's right running up and you know, we get that.

679
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,319
Speaker 1: But at the end of that game against Duke, his

680
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 1: team was in total control, and they they made, you know,

681
00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:58,920
Speaker 1: the pass back to Mullins, the presence of mind of

682
00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: Mullins to get that to pass, to then get lined

683
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 1: up for the shot, to know there's only four seconds left,

684
00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 1: to know that he's got to let it go. All

685
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:09,719
Speaker 1: of those things coming into play there, I thought it

686
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,920
Speaker 1: was symbolic of good coaching because they looked prepared for

687
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:15,600
Speaker 1: the moment. In addition to that, I give Hurley a

688
00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:19,120
Speaker 1: lot of credit because shooter's got to shoot, and if

689
00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 1: a shooter is not getting the ball, I've always said,

690
00:36:21,719 --> 00:36:24,399
Speaker 1: if you're playing horse with somebody and a guy that's

691
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:26,560
Speaker 1: a good shooter is not hitting anything, and then eventually

692
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 1: he goes and forfeits one of his reps by getting

693
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:31,120
Speaker 1: to the free throw line, you don't want him hitting

694
00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:34,760
Speaker 1: that free throw because then suddenly the field comes back.

695
00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: But you got to have shooters to continue to shoot.

696
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:39,880
Speaker 1: And Danny Hurley has allowed Mullins to do that and

697
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 1: eventually it paid off for him. I thought there were

698
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:44,480
Speaker 1: two examples there of really good coaching.

699
00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 3: Oh absolutely, the presence of mind to look back. The

700
00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:51,320
Speaker 3: presence of mind of Brailin to get into the play

701
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:54,960
Speaker 3: after he retrieves the ball. If you look at the play.

702
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:58,160
Speaker 3: And this is what really just continues to baffle me,

703
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:01,920
Speaker 3: is that when the play happens, Cayden Boozer made a

704
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,840
Speaker 3: poor decision to try to force the ball over Braylan

705
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 3: and memory from Yukon it was a poor decision. The

706
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:12,960
Speaker 3: best decision there is to hold the ball. A lot

707
00:37:13,000 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 3: of people said throw the ball toward the ceiling, et cetera,

708
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:16,920
Speaker 3: et cetera. And you could do those things and they

709
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:21,320
Speaker 3: could have worked. But the basketball decision that everyone makes

710
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 3: hold the ball, let them follow, you go make some

711
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:25,480
Speaker 3: free throws in the games over and he made an

712
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 3: awful decision to attempt to throw the pass and have

713
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:33,319
Speaker 3: it deflected by memory. But I honestly think that if

714
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 3: on a scale of what makes literal no sense, is

715
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:42,200
Speaker 3: that the second decision that Caden Boozer made was even poorer.

716
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 3: And that was when Braylan went into the forecourt, the

717
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 3: Duke forecourt to get the ball and retrieve it. Instead

718
00:37:51,480 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 3: of going toward him and defending him, Boozer went all

719
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:01,520
Speaker 3: the way back to the lane twenty feet away from Mullens.

720
00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 3: When he takes the shot, he went back to guard nobody.

721
00:38:06,040 --> 00:38:08,360
Speaker 3: And if he stays in the play, here's what happened.

722
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 3: The ball goes to Alice Caravan on the right wing.

723
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,759
Speaker 3: Cameron Booser has come into the play so that he

724
00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:15,839
Speaker 3: doesn't have a good shot. Now he could take it,

725
00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:18,040
Speaker 3: but he'd be challenged, it would be off balanced, it

726
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:20,520
Speaker 3: wouldn't be in rhythm. He would have to try to

727
00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 3: dribble to kit some space and probably wouldn't have gotten

728
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 3: off a good shot, but he saw that Braylan was

729
00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:28,799
Speaker 3: uncovered coming across the mid court line and threw it

730
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 3: back to him. And if camera, if Kayden Boozer had

731
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:34,800
Speaker 3: been in the play, that wouldn't.

732
00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 2: Have been available.

733
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:37,959
Speaker 1: That passing lanes closed, right, Yeah, I mean.

734
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:41,280
Speaker 3: He could still probably get it to him, because because

735
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:43,600
Speaker 3: Cayden's not going to reach out and try to deflect

736
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 3: that it would have to be an awful pass for

737
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,520
Speaker 3: him to get. But he's there and so at that point,

738
00:38:48,800 --> 00:38:52,040
Speaker 3: the rhythm and the and the eyesight and all of

739
00:38:52,080 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 3: that that was available for the shot would have been gone.

740
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:00,319
Speaker 3: So that play probably just becomes the heat. And that's

741
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:03,440
Speaker 3: what really blows me away. It was the second decision, honestly,

742
00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:06,280
Speaker 3: that I'm even more vexed by than the first.

743
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:08,680
Speaker 1: Okay, Mike, I'm going to end with this. I'm going

744
00:39:08,719 --> 00:39:10,480
Speaker 1: to give you the same trivia question I gave to

745
00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:14,239
Speaker 1: Eddie earlier. Okay, Okay. I looked up today in the

746
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:18,160
Speaker 1: US News and World Report academic rankings the final four schools.

747
00:39:18,520 --> 00:39:21,200
Speaker 1: I want you to rank to me what you would guessed.

748
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:25,920
Speaker 1: Don't look, don't don't look, but non ranking the final

749
00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 1: four schools of what you would assume them to be

750
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:31,600
Speaker 1: from from highest ranking to lowest ranking of the final

751
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:35,799
Speaker 1: four schools as it stands right now academically speaking, go.

752
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 3: Ahead, probably Michigan, Illinois, Yukon, Arizona.

753
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:45,360
Speaker 1: I'm writing down your guests. We'll reveal it later in

754
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 1: the program.

755
00:39:46,680 --> 00:39:50,400
Speaker 3: Mike, I want to know what's at I said, you're

756
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:51,880
Speaker 3: gonna have to text me because I want to know.

757
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:54,240
Speaker 1: I will text you the answer.

758
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 2: How's that?

759
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:55,840
Speaker 1: I will text you the answer?

760
00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 2: Great, Mike.

761
00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:57,440
Speaker 1: I appreciate it.

762
00:39:57,480 --> 00:39:57,600
Speaker 4: Man.

763
00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 1: I know it's a really busy time and certain I

764
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:02,600
Speaker 1: hope you're able to soak in all the joy, the

765
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:04,480
Speaker 1: fun and the atmosphere of the final four.

766
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:06,799
Speaker 3: Thank you, Jake. I'll look forward to seeing it.

767
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:10,839
Speaker 1: I appreciate it. Mike's Coursey joining us on the program. Yes,

768
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:15,160
Speaker 1: Scott Agnes joins us now for field House Files, Pacers

769
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:20,320
Speaker 1: and Action Tomorrow Night taking on the Bulls and Scott,

770
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 1: I'll begin with I guess when it comes to this

771
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:24,000
Speaker 1: game Tomorrow night, kind of the elephant in the room,

772
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 1: and that is the story of Jade and Ivy. I

773
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,319
Speaker 1: got into it earlier. I went fairly in depth on it,

774
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:33,840
Speaker 1: but Jade and Ivy being waived by the Bulls. I

775
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 1: guess your overall reaction. Clearly, he is out for the

776
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 1: rest of the year with injury. But you know, how

777
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:42,480
Speaker 1: did you interpret that news.

778
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:45,640
Speaker 4: I took it as the Chicago Bulls, who are not

779
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 4: doing well, are looking, you know, or one of those

780
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:51,360
Speaker 4: bottom tier teams in the league are trying to remove

781
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:54,160
Speaker 4: a distraction here for the final couple weeks of the season.

782
00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 4: He was a guy that was acquired at the trade deadline,

783
00:40:56,880 --> 00:40:59,920
Speaker 4: has been mostly hurt. I think early on maybe he

784
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 4: wanted to play and they didn't want him, and then

785
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:06,120
Speaker 4: he was ruled out for the season, and all along,

786
00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 4: even since the trade, I didn't expect for them to

787
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:10,680
Speaker 4: bring it bring him back next year, and so I

788
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 4: think it was a matter of, you know, be who

789
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,280
Speaker 4: you can afford to be, and in this case, Jaden

790
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:18,719
Speaker 4: was a guy that was unavailable and injured, and so

791
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 4: let's remove him from the equation.

792
00:41:21,080 --> 00:41:25,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think that's as I had said earlier, Scott,

793
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:28,840
Speaker 1: the one thing that bothered is the wrong word. But

794
00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:32,720
Speaker 1: I think to just say the Bulls have waived Jaden

795
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:36,800
Speaker 1: Ivy because of particular comments to me, I'm like, look,

796
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:40,799
Speaker 1: I don't think that's accurate because there's a lot more

797
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 1: that goes into it. And if Jaden Ivy was averaging

798
00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 1: seventeen points in twenty nine minutes a game, there's no

799
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:46,840
Speaker 1: way that that happens.

800
00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 5: Right, Oh, one hundred percent, exactly right.

801
00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:51,960
Speaker 4: It was one of those cases where he's not contributing

802
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:53,759
Speaker 4: on the courts. So the last thing you want is

803
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:56,239
Speaker 4: for that guy to speak up elsewhere. Now what he's

804
00:41:56,239 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 4: getting into and some of that, Like you know, there's

805
00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:02,279
Speaker 4: been a lot of arguments about that and should he

806
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:05,160
Speaker 4: have free speech from that respect, right, But what it

807
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:08,440
Speaker 4: comes down to is he's not playing. Therefore the Bulls

808
00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:11,160
Speaker 4: him being in a contract year, just like Benedict Mathern

809
00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:13,800
Speaker 4: is same draft class. This is the direction the Bulls

810
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:14,919
Speaker 4: felt more comfortable going.

811
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:17,520
Speaker 1: Speaking of that, do you think Benedict Matherin? I realized

812
00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,239
Speaker 1: that since he's in Los Angeles now and playing for

813
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 1: the Clippers, that you know that's you don't cover the Clippers,

814
00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:27,200
Speaker 1: But just from what you've been able to see, Reid follow,

815
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 1: do you believe that Benedict Matherin could possibly factor into

816
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 1: the Clippers' plans beyond this year? I do?

817
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 4: I do just the level of scoring he's played with.

818
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,800
Speaker 4: He seems to be pairing nicely with Kawhi, and with Kawhi, obviously,

819
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 4: you never know where his health has been. When he's great,

820
00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:47,440
Speaker 4: he's still playing at a near MVP caliber level. And

821
00:42:47,640 --> 00:42:50,280
Speaker 4: at the same time, though Jake, we've known for several

822
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:54,360
Speaker 4: years now, this Clippers team has shaped up their salaries

823
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:57,720
Speaker 4: to have a lot of money for this upcoming summer

824
00:42:58,200 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 4: of twenty twenty six and to be able to then

825
00:43:00,600 --> 00:43:03,600
Speaker 4: and such, and ultimately I think will come down to

826
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 4: who has the best offer. I think with Mattherin, with

827
00:43:06,120 --> 00:43:08,520
Speaker 4: this first big contract, I think he'll go for the

828
00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:10,719
Speaker 4: best offer on the table. It could be the Clippers,

829
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:13,520
Speaker 4: they'll have his rights. But the grand scheme of it,

830
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,440
Speaker 4: honestly is there hasn't been much of a market for

831
00:43:17,560 --> 00:43:21,160
Speaker 4: restricted free agents, which means teams can match any offer

832
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 4: out there, and so we've seen other players get into it.

833
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:28,239
Speaker 4: Jonathan kaminga previously with Golden State, so that is more

834
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:31,320
Speaker 4: favorable for the teams. But I think Mathern's proven his

835
00:43:31,800 --> 00:43:33,840
Speaker 4: worth and you got to and I go back to

836
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:35,520
Speaker 4: the fact that he's still dealing with a turf toe

837
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 4: injury he suffered in like game two of the season,

838
00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:40,280
Speaker 4: and so he should be better off after a healthy

839
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:41,759
Speaker 4: and RESTful offseason as well.

840
00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: Scott Agnus is my guest field House Files, where you

841
00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:46,760
Speaker 1: could read his work Scott heading down the home stretch.

842
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:50,080
Speaker 1: Here we figured it out basically for the Pacers seven

843
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 1: games remaining, they want to stay in that bottom three

844
00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:58,040
Speaker 1: I guess to mathematically give themselves the best chance at

845
00:43:58,080 --> 00:44:04,120
Speaker 1: a top four pick. As it stands right now, nineteen

846
00:44:04,280 --> 00:44:10,240
Speaker 1: wins if everybody just lost out, nineteen would be that benchmark. Realistically,

847
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: do you when you look at it, do you think

848
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:15,040
Speaker 1: they do have kind of a number in mind where

849
00:44:15,040 --> 00:44:16,960
Speaker 1: they say, let's make sure we don't exceed that. I

850
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:20,040
Speaker 1: know that we're not talking overtly tanking quote end quote,

851
00:44:20,920 --> 00:44:22,800
Speaker 1: but it has to be in the mind, right.

852
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:25,560
Speaker 5: Yeah, I would assume. So we don't know that.

853
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 4: But they got several analytics guys over there, and at

854
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 4: this point you are so far into it, right, Jake

855
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 4: lay totally like they'd be schoolish to mess.

856
00:44:35,000 --> 00:44:36,839
Speaker 5: Up your odds. But you're right.

857
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:39,400
Speaker 4: Top three give you a fourteen percent chance at the

858
00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 4: number one overall pick. But again the most important thing

859
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:45,279
Speaker 4: is to just be in top four. Therefore, you're able

860
00:44:45,320 --> 00:44:48,320
Speaker 4: to keep that pick. But they've split their last four games.

861
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:51,920
Speaker 4: There's clearly at least a couple more winnable games among

862
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:54,239
Speaker 4: their final seven with four on the road, or yeah,

863
00:44:54,280 --> 00:44:57,440
Speaker 4: four on the road including this road trip that is

864
00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:00,319
Speaker 4: their last one that begins coming up in Chicago. And

865
00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 4: so yeah, anytime there's a player out there that has

866
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 4: any concern whatsoever, like we saw Jerris Walker's hard fall,

867
00:45:09,360 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 4: you're gonna lean as always on that side of safety,

868
00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 4: and from his standpoint, you hold him out. And I

869
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:17,600
Speaker 4: think that will be the case here for another game

870
00:45:17,680 --> 00:45:18,320
Speaker 4: or two at least.

871
00:45:18,360 --> 00:45:21,759
Speaker 1: Has Kobe Brown played his way into possible discussion for

872
00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:24,240
Speaker 1: next year or is he simply getting empty calories?

873
00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:25,359
Speaker 3: Yeah?

874
00:45:25,400 --> 00:45:26,600
Speaker 5: I think so, I do.

875
00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 4: I mean he's shooting I think forty four percent from

876
00:45:29,600 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 4: three point range. He's he's a bigger frame than they have,

877
00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:35,600
Speaker 4: a little bit taller, I think than most people realize.

878
00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:38,160
Speaker 4: And for a guy, you know, I could see him

879
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:42,520
Speaker 4: becoming the twelfth or thirteenth guy potentially on the team.

880
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:45,440
Speaker 4: I don't necessarily see him as a rotation guy right away.

881
00:45:45,680 --> 00:45:48,920
Speaker 4: Assuming full health for the Spacers team next season, including

882
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:51,319
Speaker 4: a draft pick that I'm factoring in and all this,

883
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 4: but just outside the rotation and certainly a guy you

884
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:56,440
Speaker 4: lean on with injuries and all that stuff.

885
00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:58,799
Speaker 5: I think early on the thought was he's just a

886
00:45:58,880 --> 00:45:59,200
Speaker 5: throw in.

887
00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:03,440
Speaker 4: But this via case here where the right opportunity, an

888
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 4: opportunity with playing time leads to a potential future for

889
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:12,400
Speaker 4: him here contractually, Scott with Kobe Brown, it's like Jalen

890
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 4: Smith of a few years ago, where they can only

891
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:16,320
Speaker 4: offer him X amount of dollars.

892
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:16,840
Speaker 1: Correct.

893
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:22,359
Speaker 4: Yes, that's my understanding with that, because they declined his

894
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:26,920
Speaker 4: fourth year option, clearly suggesting Clippers weren't interested in moving forward.

895
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:29,200
Speaker 4: You don't see it a ton, but that does have

896
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,520
Speaker 4: limitations on what the Pacers can get to in terms

897
00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:33,440
Speaker 4: of a salary number.

898
00:46:33,680 --> 00:46:37,360
Speaker 1: PACER's Bulls Tomorrow night, eight o'clock tip up in Chicago,

899
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:39,480
Speaker 1: pregame at seven thirty can be heard on the station,

900
00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:41,320
Speaker 1: and then of course you can read all about it

901
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,320
Speaker 1: before and after at Fieldhouse Files with Scott Agnes. Scott

902
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:45,520
Speaker 1: appreciated as always.

903
00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 5: You gotta thank Jake Scott Agnes joining

904
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:48,400
Speaker 1: Us on the programs