1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,280 Speaker 1: He joins us now from the Indian appse Star Zach 2 00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:07,360 Speaker 1: joining us Zach, I realized, well, I mean it's before 3 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:08,319 Speaker 1: the time of both of us. 4 00:00:08,360 --> 00:00:08,920 Speaker 2: I realized. 5 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:12,080 Speaker 1: But when you were a kid in syndication form, did 6 00:00:12,119 --> 00:00:14,120 Speaker 1: you watch any episodes of The Brady Bunch? 7 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 3: I feel like not a. 8 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,160 Speaker 4: Ton I feel like I was more of like a 9 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:23,480 Speaker 4: Mattlock kid. I mean, growing up in Atlanta, the TVs 10 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,400 Speaker 4: was had a lot more reach than Nick at Night. 11 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:28,160 Speaker 3: So I feel like I watched some Brady Bunches, but 12 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 3: I probably did. 13 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 4: More and more Mattlock, more Beverly Hillbillies, whatever came on 14 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 4: in like two hours before the Braves game on TVs. 15 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 3: Now. 16 00:00:38,080 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 1: In my and I'm a few years older than you, 17 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: but in my era, that would have been Starcade, which 18 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 1: was an arcade video game. 19 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:45,279 Speaker 5: Uh. 20 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:47,400 Speaker 1: And then probably Murder, she wrote, would have been in 21 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:48,200 Speaker 1: that mix as well. 22 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 2: You know what I mean? 23 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't. 24 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:52,440 Speaker 4: I probably wasn't allowed to watch Murder, she wrote, And 25 00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 4: I feel like it kind of I feel like it 26 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 4: probably flipped out of syndication just you know, matt Lock 27 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,760 Speaker 4: was a Matlock, was never quite so violent. Andy didn't 28 00:01:00,760 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 4: carry a gun. I always try to still with him. 29 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:06,960 Speaker 4: We did though. That was interesting, But yeah, that's that's 30 00:01:06,959 --> 00:01:12,800 Speaker 4: probably more my my like afternoon after school homesick childhood viewing. 31 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:17,920 Speaker 1: You have, Zach a fabulous column up right now for 32 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:22,480 Speaker 1: the Indianapolis Star in terms of this Final Four and 33 00:01:22,560 --> 00:01:26,520 Speaker 1: this championship game. Notably, if you were an Indiana fan, 34 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 1: would you see this game as being one of giving 35 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:35,960 Speaker 1: you reason for hope or rather one of reason for disappointment. 36 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 1: Take me through if you could, and for those that 37 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:41,520 Speaker 1: have not yet read it, exactly what it is that 38 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 1: you wrote about regarding Brayln Mullin's Dusty May and b 39 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 1: New Indiana, all of it in today's college basketball. 40 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 4: Yeah. Well, first of all, if I'm an Indiana fan, 41 00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 4: I probably still be celebrating what happened in Miami three 42 00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:57,680 Speaker 4: months ago. But I mean, the Braves won the World 43 00:01:57,720 --> 00:01:59,320 Speaker 4: Series five years ago, and I still pull up the 44 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:01,480 Speaker 4: highlights before it is hilarious. I'm ron about once League, 45 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:05,080 Speaker 4: so I'll be dining out on that until I can't 46 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:11,560 Speaker 4: remember my Christian name. But now that the piece just 47 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:13,960 Speaker 4: kind of tried to, I feel like, you know, I'm 48 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:15,320 Speaker 4: up there all week, and I'm gonna be up there 49 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 4: tonight and night, I feel like I had to write something, 50 00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 4: you know, from the perspective of my bead, acknowledging sort 51 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:22,680 Speaker 4: of some of these connections to Indiana Railyn Mullens to 52 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 4: a certain extent, although you know it, Dusty Mate probably 53 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 4: has a little bit of sort of a deeper connection 54 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:31,239 Speaker 4: there because he's he's been a part of the program, 55 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:34,559 Speaker 4: he's an IU alum as well as being from from Indiana, 56 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 4: and just kind of trying to wrap arms around just 57 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 4: sort of like what this should mean to Indiana fans. 58 00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:42,639 Speaker 4: And I think you make a good point, which I 59 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:47,079 Speaker 4: kind of didn't even necessarily maybe we for that as 60 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:50,359 Speaker 4: as much as I meant to, about the idea that 61 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:53,400 Speaker 4: you know, should just give Indiana fans hope. I think frankly, 62 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:56,440 Speaker 4: Indiana's own success in football should give Indiana fans hope, 63 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 4: because it shouldn't help Indiana fans recognize there's no history 64 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 4: any There is just what you are now and what 65 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 4: you can be in the future. And if Indiana can 66 00:03:04,320 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 4: get it right between obviously staffing and then resources scouting. 67 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:11,359 Speaker 3: You know, roster construction, et cetera, you. 68 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 4: Don't have to wait nearly as long the sort of 69 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:16,320 Speaker 4: you know, the the bottom up rebuild in the days 70 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 4: of Tom Green. That stuff is over because of the 71 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 4: portal and because teams can sort of grab their destiny 72 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 4: with both hands much more effectively than they used to 73 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:29,080 Speaker 4: be able to. But the point I tried to make 74 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 4: on that piece at the same time was, and you've 75 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 4: been around this program longer than I have, but I've 76 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 4: been around it long enough to note that Indiana, and. 77 00:03:39,400 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 3: This is not. 78 00:03:41,560 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 4: Unique to Indiana fans, but I write about Indiana, and ultimately, 79 00:03:46,680 --> 00:03:50,520 Speaker 4: you know, what kin touchy fans do doesn't take Indiana's problems. 80 00:03:50,520 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 4: What North Carolina fans do doesn't fix Indiana's problems. Indiana 81 00:03:54,840 --> 00:03:58,840 Speaker 4: has this, in my experience, increasing. 82 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 3: Sort of devotion to depot to the what if. 83 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:06,240 Speaker 4: The minute things start to go wrong, and to create 84 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 4: almost this sort of mythical utopian, their borderline utopian, sort 85 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 4: of alternate future if pad Mada had taken the job, 86 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:18,520 Speaker 4: or if Brad Stevens had taken the job, or you know, 87 00:04:18,960 --> 00:04:21,800 Speaker 4: Dustin may Is is kind of the latest, you know, 88 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:26,480 Speaker 4: unprovable and therefore inassailable hypothetical of if the job had 89 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 4: been opened, you know, a year earlier, and Indiana had 90 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:30,919 Speaker 4: gotten Dustiny May with the Indiana here right now and 91 00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 4: that listen, you can't prove that wrong, or you can't 92 00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:36,920 Speaker 4: prove that right between. You can't prove it wrong. And 93 00:04:37,000 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 4: so I can't sit here and tell you that Indiana 94 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:42,719 Speaker 4: wouldn't have had a lot of the same success Michigan's 95 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:45,839 Speaker 4: had if Indiana had tired Dustiny May instead. But I 96 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:48,920 Speaker 4: can't tell you that just constantly sort of finding over 97 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:51,839 Speaker 4: somebody else's future is hurting Indiana's presence. 98 00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 3: And in a time when your. 99 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 4: Point, there are examples across the spectrum, not least football 100 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 4: in Bloomington, proving that you can be whatever you are 101 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:07,960 Speaker 4: good enough to be with very few limitations anymore in 102 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 4: college sports, at least right now, at least as the 103 00:05:10,040 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 4: rules are today. You know, it would be a lot 104 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 4: more productive to focus on. 105 00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 3: What Indiana can do to improve itself. 106 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 4: And I don't just mean fans. I do think like 107 00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 4: that's a I tried to paint that as a broad way. 108 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 4: I tried to paint with as broad of a brush 109 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 4: as possible, because I don't think it's just the fan 110 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 4: base that's been guilty of this at times in the 111 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:39,400 Speaker 4: last ten to fifteen years. The more Indiana focuses on itself, 112 00:05:39,440 --> 00:05:42,400 Speaker 4: the more I suspect Indiana might have success rather than 113 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:45,360 Speaker 4: sort of leering it something that's happening elsewhere. 114 00:05:45,880 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: Zach, let me let me run something past you, and 115 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:50,720 Speaker 1: you tell me if you agree with it. And it's 116 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: a harsh reality perhaps. And I'm one of them, of 117 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,120 Speaker 1: you know, for Indiana alumni and people who were the 118 00:05:57,160 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: fan base for a long time. Have you ever seen 119 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:06,599 Speaker 1: the theater version of a Christmas Carol with Ebenezer Scrooge 120 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:07,920 Speaker 1: and Jacob Marley? 121 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,320 Speaker 3: I mean not in theater, no, or maybe I have. 122 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:15,039 Speaker 1: If you see it in theater, at least in the 123 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 1: variation that I see every year at IRT. Jacob Marley, 124 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: when he is the ghost of Christmas Past, is trying 125 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:24,279 Speaker 1: to warn Ebenezer Scrooge, of course, of what is happening, 126 00:06:24,360 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 1: and then he kind of retreats away and sinks back 127 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:32,359 Speaker 1: into the stage, and Ebenezer Scrooge has this like dilemma 128 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:35,039 Speaker 1: of whether to continue to follow Marley, to continue asking 129 00:06:35,160 --> 00:06:37,520 Speaker 1: questions and get kind of sucked in with that, or 130 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 1: to move forward and finally keep that as the past 131 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 1: and learn from it. And I feel like that's Indiana 132 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:48,159 Speaker 1: Basketball's problem as a fan base is the ghost of 133 00:06:48,279 --> 00:06:52,120 Speaker 1: basketball past keeps coming up and tantalizing and torturing the 134 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 1: Indiana fan base, and instead of finally saying, we have 135 00:06:56,279 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: to learn from this and move forward and quit dealing 136 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:03,159 Speaker 1: with and relating to the past, We've got to move 137 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,320 Speaker 1: forward with it and quit comparing everything to it and 138 00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:08,839 Speaker 1: just say that was a wonderful period, but it is 139 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 1: now a picture frame on the mantle and nothing else, 140 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 1: and move forward with it. And it's become toxic for 141 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 1: the present members of Indiana basketball. Maybe not Darren Debreese's group, 142 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:23,920 Speaker 1: but I'm just saying that the now is continually hampered 143 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 1: by the past fact or fiction. 144 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 4: I think that's true to a certain extent. I think 145 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:32,080 Speaker 4: it's probably a lot less true now than it was 146 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 4: maybe five to seven years ago. And I think that's 147 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 4: some of that's the generational thing, you know, ultimately, and 148 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 4: I wrote this and something I wrote. 149 00:07:39,200 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 3: Near the end of the season, there is not a 150 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 3: twenty two. 151 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 4: Or younger I used student on campus that it was 152 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 4: even a live the last time Indiana was in. 153 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 3: A final four, much less won a national championship. 154 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 4: There is you know, when you when you wonder how 155 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 4: Indiana has embraced football so fully. A lot of times 156 00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 4: people will say to me, do you think it's because 157 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 4: football sort of replaces basketball and fans sort of mind 158 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 4: or in fans passion. I said, I think that was 159 00:08:04,840 --> 00:08:08,040 Speaker 4: already happening, because, frankly, if we're just talking about you know, 160 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 4: a generation is a shorter thing in college sports, and 161 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 4: if we're talking about a generation in college sports, probably 162 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 4: no more than ten years, maybe less. And in the 163 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:20,480 Speaker 4: previous generations, football, even before Kurt Signetti, had given Indiana 164 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:26,080 Speaker 4: fans more success and more happiness and more greatly fulfillments 165 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:28,560 Speaker 4: than basketball had, and that, I mean that has only 166 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 4: deepened in the last two or three years. So I 167 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:33,520 Speaker 4: think there's there's some of that that is just generational. 168 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 4: That is, as you know, as the fan base recycles 169 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:38,160 Speaker 4: and younger fans come up, they just what are the 170 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:40,560 Speaker 4: memories that they attached themselves to. There are fewer of 171 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:44,320 Speaker 4: them in basketball than the sort of the older fans 172 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:46,840 Speaker 4: that they are joining or in some cases, not to 173 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 4: be morbid about it, but replacing. I do think what 174 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 4: is true is that the to use your metaphor, the 175 00:08:56,440 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 4: ghost of basketball past is still the measure stick and Indiana, 176 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,560 Speaker 4: to be clear, still wants it to be the measuring stick, 177 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,760 Speaker 4: you know, administratively, institutionally, Indiana still wants to talk about 178 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 4: winning national championships, winning Big Ten championships, excellence on the 179 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 4: floor in basketball. And what happens is when that's not delivered. 180 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 4: And in full fairness to fans, to boosters, the season 181 00:09:22,040 --> 00:09:26,040 Speaker 4: ticket holders, they are asked, you know, annually to invest 182 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 4: with their time, with their money, with their emotion in 183 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 4: the idea that Indiana should be an elite or at 184 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:37,400 Speaker 4: least elite adjacent basketball program, and then that's not delivered. 185 00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 4: And so when that's the expectation and it's not met, 186 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 4: then it does kind of get married to what I 187 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 4: talk about in that piece about Dusty and Braylen Mullens, 188 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:53,319 Speaker 4: which is the sort of need to go find someone 189 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 4: who at least in sort of the the collective mind's eye, 190 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,680 Speaker 4: would meet that expectation and would have that success. But 191 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 4: the problem is that what happens is eventually you start 192 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 4: to mythologize that person by association, and you start to say, well, 193 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:13,320 Speaker 4: if that person was here, we'd win thirty games a year, 194 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:16,760 Speaker 4: We'd never missed a climb before, and all of the 195 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 4: all the failings of today, all the frustrations would would 196 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:24,199 Speaker 4: just evaporate the moment that person walked in the door. 197 00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 4: You know, Nick Napan lost to Louisiana Monroe his first 198 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 4: season at Alabama. It doesn't happen overnight. But I think 199 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:36,840 Speaker 4: your metaphor is apt in that a part of this is. 200 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:42,920 Speaker 3: Getting stuck on not just the person, but the expectation 201 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:43,319 Speaker 3: of what. 202 00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 4: The person would be without obviously the proof that that 203 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:52,800 Speaker 4: person could deliver. You know, what we're talking about is 204 00:10:52,840 --> 00:10:54,480 Speaker 4: if that because I've got to talk to myself into 205 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:55,640 Speaker 4: a corner there at the end, I. 206 00:10:55,559 --> 00:11:00,440 Speaker 1: Apologize, I talk myself into a corner, Zach, like three 207 00:11:00,440 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 1: hours a day, five days a week. 208 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 2: So you are forgiven. 209 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 1: I wanted to get to this real quick before we 210 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:10,439 Speaker 1: let you go. And that is the transfer portal. Indiana 211 00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 1: clearly now not only has money, but they have Ryan 212 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 1: Carr to help figure out how to utilize that money 213 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: along with Darren Derees. The big name right now would 214 00:11:18,840 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 1: be Harrelson out of Notre Dame. He had Indiana in 215 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:24,040 Speaker 1: his final three. I think Purdue was also a school 216 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:27,079 Speaker 1: of which he had initial interest. Do we read into 217 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:29,320 Speaker 1: what a kid was looking at when they're in high 218 00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 1: school or once they're in the portal? Is it basically 219 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:35,280 Speaker 1: it just depends on which program offers the most and 220 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:37,199 Speaker 1: where they decide to spend their money. 221 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 4: You know, I mean it's that's obviously a much bigger 222 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 4: part of it than he used to be. I think 223 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 4: it's less about maybe what a player was looking at 224 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:48,720 Speaker 4: when they were in high school and more about what 225 00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:52,960 Speaker 4: relationships they have. So you know, for example, if this 226 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 4: staff had recruited Jalen Harrelson, I think maybe there's a 227 00:11:57,160 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 4: world where and I'm not listening, I haven't heard anything 228 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:04,240 Speaker 4: one way or the other. My sense is that the 229 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 4: expectation is Harrelson is at least going to Indiana and 230 00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:10,440 Speaker 4: is at least going to sort of be involved to. 231 00:12:10,440 --> 00:12:11,439 Speaker 3: A certain extent there. 232 00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 4: But you do wonder if that would be, you know, 233 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:19,680 Speaker 4: it would be more intense or quicker or whatever if 234 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:21,679 Speaker 4: this was the staff that he had the relationship with. 235 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 4: And I think that's like, that's what coaches talk about 236 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 4: so much anymore with the portal is don't burn bridges 237 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 4: because you don't know when a guy might come back around. 238 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:30,760 Speaker 2: You don't know. 239 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 4: When maybe an initial opportunity won't work out, or you know, 240 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:37,760 Speaker 4: maybe you'll lind up somewhere else and then they'll come 241 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 4: available and the fit might make sense now where it 242 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 4: didn't before. Just keep those relationships, keep those options open. 243 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:49,600 Speaker 4: And I'm not saying Indiana won't get Jalen Harrelson, but 244 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:53,560 Speaker 4: in this case, obviously that doesn't necessarily apply. I also 245 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:56,199 Speaker 4: think he's not the only Notre dame transfer that Indiana's 246 00:12:56,200 --> 00:12:57,040 Speaker 4: gonna have some interest in. 247 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:58,439 Speaker 3: I would be very. 248 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:02,040 Speaker 4: Surprised if Indiana is not interested in and maybe as 249 00:13:02,040 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 4: involved as it can be with Marcus Burton, who is 250 00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:07,640 Speaker 4: a player that you know, if you rewind his recruitment 251 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:12,200 Speaker 4: did not really involve Indiana a Ton certainly not in 252 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 4: the business end of it, at least to my memory. 253 00:13:15,640 --> 00:13:17,480 Speaker 4: But it might be a different fit now. And I 254 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:19,360 Speaker 4: don't know if he has relationships to current staff or 255 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 4: if there's just maybe something you know, schematically that Indiana 256 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:25,440 Speaker 4: really likes about Burton as a player. But no, I 257 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 4: think it's it's less about maybe how a player viewed 258 00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 4: a program when he was in high school, and more 259 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 4: about one relationships at any he still got with that 260 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:35,960 Speaker 4: program when he goes into the portal. I'm not saying 261 00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 4: Harrelson won't wind up in Indiana. I'm just saying, in 262 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 4: my experience, that's more kind of where those wheels turn. 263 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:45,559 Speaker 1: It is my understanding, by the way, and this understanding 264 00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: could be inaccurate, but tonight is not only that I 265 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 1: Transfer portal officially opens at midnight, but also tonight it 266 00:13:52,480 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: is my understanding that the nineteen seventy six Indiana team 267 00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:58,240 Speaker 1: will be recognized by the NCAA as part of the 268 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:02,839 Speaker 1: fiftieth anniversary their undefeated season. Of course, Zach Osterman has 269 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:05,800 Speaker 1: all of it covered for you at The Indianapolis Star, 270 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:10,559 Speaker 1: not just about Indiana in general, but again this situation 271 00:14:10,760 --> 00:14:13,760 Speaker 1: in terms of tonight with the cross pollination in the 272 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:17,080 Speaker 1: National Championship game of how it relates to the Hoosiers, 273 00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:19,840 Speaker 1: because the article is up right now at the Indiestar 274 00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 1: dot com and that article talking about Braylan Mullin's Dusty 275 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 1: May and how part of Indiana's better future has got 276 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: to be at the end of reflexive coveting of somebody 277 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:32,600 Speaker 1: else's present. 278 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:34,320 Speaker 2: That article up from Zach. 279 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: Zach, appreciate the time as always, enjoy the game this evening. 280 00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 3: Absolutely thanks for having me. 281 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 1: Zach Ostman joining me on the program. We talked going 282 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:48,320 Speaker 1: into the weekend about all that goes into the Final 283 00:14:48,400 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 1: Four in terms of the preparation from the training standpoint 284 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:55,960 Speaker 1: and getting all of the medical personnel in place. Ralph 285 00:14:56,040 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: Rief joining us now on the program, And Ralph I 286 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:01,320 Speaker 1: didn't anticipate in this necessarily when we were talking to 287 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 1: you that we would that there would be Final Four 288 00:15:03,480 --> 00:15:07,400 Speaker 1: injuries for the Championship game to talk about, But in 289 00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: fact there are. And I'm going to begin with Michigan's 290 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 1: star player, outstanding talent and jax O Linnenborg, who essentially 291 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:19,720 Speaker 1: I believe it was an ankle that he rolled, kind 292 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,560 Speaker 1: of kind of rolled it when he was landing awkwardly. 293 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: You could see that he tried to walk off. I 294 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:29,680 Speaker 1: have always felt, at least for me, Ralph Reeve, the 295 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 1: thought is, when you have a sprained ankle, just got 296 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 1: to keep walking on it. Don't let it tighten up, 297 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:37,120 Speaker 1: keep walking on it. That's probably ill advised. I don't 298 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,080 Speaker 1: know what would you estimate, would it be, would be 299 00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 1: the treatment that he has undergone in the last you know, 300 00:15:42,960 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: thirty six hours. 301 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 6: Well, Jake, it's good to be with you. And I 302 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:53,120 Speaker 6: would say, well, I know treatment has been extensive and 303 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 6: as well, at the same time, you want to balance 304 00:15:57,320 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 6: it with not not overdoing it. So you know, he's 305 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 6: got talented medical personnel around him. He has an agent 306 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 6: that has people he is consulting with, I'm sure, So 307 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 6: there's no lack of advice that's funneling into the hands 308 00:16:18,520 --> 00:16:24,479 Speaker 6: on personnel with him. So probably some type of immobilization 309 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:27,720 Speaker 6: or at least reducing the number of reps of going 310 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:30,600 Speaker 6: to the hotel, back to the bus, down to the 311 00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:36,440 Speaker 6: dining rooms, et cetera. So keeping his reps minimum and yeah, 312 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:40,400 Speaker 6: being very active. Boy, the the MRIs have been spinning 313 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 6: here in Indianapolis this weekend. 314 00:16:42,840 --> 00:16:47,800 Speaker 1: Now, the the injury itself, you know, he hurt his knee, 315 00:16:48,040 --> 00:16:51,520 Speaker 1: and then also the you know, he has a sprained 316 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,560 Speaker 1: MCL on his left knee and an injured ankle. And 317 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:58,480 Speaker 1: now I would assume that perhaps sometimes one can kind 318 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:01,320 Speaker 1: of lend itself to the other. We've talked about that before, Ralph. 319 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:04,840 Speaker 1: But are these injuries and then I heard bone bruise 320 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:08,480 Speaker 1: also for him, and I'm talking about for Lindenborg, are 321 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:13,679 Speaker 1: these injuries that I'll take The knee is tricky, but 322 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 1: a sprained ankle, for example, if you do a course 323 00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:19,359 Speaker 1: like what is the treatment and can it worsen or 324 00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: is it simply a matter of how much can you tolerate? 325 00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:27,360 Speaker 6: Yeah, that's a loaded question and a very compressed window 326 00:17:27,400 --> 00:17:31,479 Speaker 6: of time and making a lot of speculation here. So 327 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:34,760 Speaker 6: let's go with the ankle. Let's let's let's address two injuries, 328 00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 6: his knee and his ankle. The ankle, I suspect, I 329 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:43,360 Speaker 6: know he has injured that ankle previously had some issues, 330 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:50,280 Speaker 6: small issues throughout the season. But when an ankle, when 331 00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:55,280 Speaker 6: you sprain the ankle and you twist it, what keeps 332 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:58,359 Speaker 6: it from twisting all the way around is that it 333 00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:01,760 Speaker 6: runs into another bone, so it's bone on bone. So 334 00:18:02,080 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 6: it's very common to get a bruise within the ankle joint. 335 00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 6: How severe is the issue, and so I would suspect 336 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:18,280 Speaker 6: that the opportunity to make it worse tonight, speaking purely 337 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:21,400 Speaker 6: of the ankle, would be really difficult to do. He's 338 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:25,480 Speaker 6: going to be well taped, braced, ready to go. From 339 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:28,520 Speaker 6: that standpoint of stability, stability is not going to be 340 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:32,480 Speaker 6: the issue. It goes back to our quarterback with the Colts. 341 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:38,920 Speaker 6: You know, stability or keeping the achilles in good position 342 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 6: wasn't the issue. It was all the repetitions of trying 343 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:47,280 Speaker 6: to be who you can be with that limitation. So 344 00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:50,479 Speaker 6: tonight's a pain management game for the medical staff and 345 00:18:50,520 --> 00:18:52,359 Speaker 6: for this athlete, it's going to be how do they 346 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:56,600 Speaker 6: manage his pain? And there's so many good ways of 347 00:18:56,640 --> 00:18:59,639 Speaker 6: doing that, whether it's things you can buy over the 348 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 6: shelf like voltaurin or other kinds of creams and gels, 349 00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:09,480 Speaker 6: to prescriptive medicines that's an anti inflammatory as well as 350 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:14,120 Speaker 6: a bit of a neurologic numbing agent that you can 351 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:18,240 Speaker 6: put on superficially. All of those things are things I've used, 352 00:19:19,119 --> 00:19:23,840 Speaker 6: and there's ways of administering that those medicines, so it 353 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:28,440 Speaker 6: gets sort of penetrated into the body using electrical currents 354 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:33,159 Speaker 6: and so forth, very very comfortable treatments, but there's lots 355 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:35,920 Speaker 6: of ways to administer pain reduction. 356 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,480 Speaker 1: Ralph Reef is my guest, of course, Ralphreef dot Com 357 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:44,280 Speaker 1: and Reef Executive Performance Solutions, long time athletic trainer, the 358 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:46,520 Speaker 1: best of the best when it comes to that area 359 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:50,119 Speaker 1: of expertise. Ralph on the other side of things, for Connecticut, 360 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: I mean, we're talking about in the case of solo ball, 361 00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 1: his foot has been his left foot in a walking boot, 362 00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:59,080 Speaker 1: essentially a tweak if you want to call it that. 363 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:03,000 Speaker 1: Where he said he got through it with adrenaline. Now, 364 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,640 Speaker 1: when you have the adrenaline you have an injury, adrenaline 365 00:20:06,640 --> 00:20:08,879 Speaker 1: carries you through, let's say, to the remainder of the 366 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:12,520 Speaker 1: game where you just you block it out. Can you 367 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,920 Speaker 1: recapture that adrenaline after a day when you go out 368 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:17,879 Speaker 1: and try to play on it again, or is that 369 00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: kind of a body's instant shock of defense mechanism that 370 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:23,720 Speaker 1: can't be recaptured. 371 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 6: Great question, Jake. And the advantage of when you're playing 372 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:34,200 Speaker 6: and have the injury and you continue to play due 373 00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:36,560 Speaker 6: to the so called adrenaline is that your body and 374 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,680 Speaker 6: all of your systems are at full tilt. You know, 375 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:43,359 Speaker 6: you're warm, you've activated, you've been up and down the floor, 376 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:47,280 Speaker 6: you've sort of acclimatized to the environment. Tonight, he's got 377 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:50,359 Speaker 6: to work into that and so you have to push 378 00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:55,280 Speaker 6: past the discomfort to get to that zone. And can 379 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 6: he get there? I suspect so with seventy thousand people 380 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 6: cheering and on that elevated floor and so forth. Again, 381 00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:06,480 Speaker 6: his issue is going to be managing pain and these 382 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:09,440 Speaker 6: are the kinds of things both these injuries that we're 383 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:13,560 Speaker 6: talking about. From an athletic trainer's perspective, you sort of 384 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:16,360 Speaker 6: live for these moments. I mean, you hate for injuries 385 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 6: to occur, but man, you talk about the opportunity to 386 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:25,040 Speaker 6: help somebody and help an entire institution with your skill 387 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:28,040 Speaker 6: set and so forth. I bet both athletic turners are 388 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 6: having the time of their life from a pride standpoint, 389 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:35,119 Speaker 6: and again having so many things to take care of. 390 00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:39,960 Speaker 6: Both these injuries are pain management, so how can they 391 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 6: manage the pain with that and take care of their 392 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,200 Speaker 6: stability of the knee and the ankle and the foot. 393 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:49,120 Speaker 5: With Solo Ball Ralph, both. 394 00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 7: Of these guys, Jaxel Lindenborg and Solo Ball are probably 395 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 7: not wanting to come out of the game because once 396 00:21:54,760 --> 00:21:56,879 Speaker 7: they get going, they probably don't want to come off 397 00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 7: the floor and be They don't want to stiffen up 398 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,840 Speaker 7: a cause the major injury. So if they do come 399 00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:03,879 Speaker 7: off the floor tonight, how much time do you expect 400 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,920 Speaker 7: them to sit on the bench versus going over there, 401 00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:09,320 Speaker 7: sitting down for maybe a minute or two and getting 402 00:22:09,359 --> 00:22:12,040 Speaker 7: on that stationary bike just to keep the blood flowing 403 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:14,359 Speaker 7: so that it doesn't stiff enough and cause any more 404 00:22:14,640 --> 00:22:17,199 Speaker 7: you know issues moving forward throughout the later stages of 405 00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:17,560 Speaker 7: the game. 406 00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:20,320 Speaker 6: Yeah, it is just going to say, look at both 407 00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:24,960 Speaker 6: benches tonight. They'll have stationary bikes there for sure, and 408 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,160 Speaker 6: as well as maybe some hot packs to put over 409 00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:32,600 Speaker 6: the top of the shoe and in the case of Axel, 410 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:36,640 Speaker 6: putting on his knee, so you want to keep things 411 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:43,240 Speaker 6: warm as once you stay warm, and so again it's 412 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:46,439 Speaker 6: it's that's where the feedback from the player to the 413 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,399 Speaker 6: to the coach who makes the decision when they go 414 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:53,800 Speaker 6: in and out, it really becomes that conversation because your 415 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:57,200 Speaker 6: medical staff at that point has said green light, let's go, 416 00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:01,160 Speaker 6: and then it's up to your strategy and what's working 417 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:03,720 Speaker 6: well for you. So time on the bench is really 418 00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:07,320 Speaker 6: going to be dictated, like any game, what's the strategy, 419 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,880 Speaker 6: how's that player performing, what do we need in the moment. 420 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:15,600 Speaker 1: Ralph Lastly, I wanted to speak to the humanitarian aspect 421 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:21,479 Speaker 1: of it because scientifically speaking, you know, professionally speaking, when 422 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:26,159 Speaker 1: you're a trainer, you're looking at it from a biological standpoint. 423 00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:28,560 Speaker 1: I have a ligament here that needs this. I have 424 00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:31,480 Speaker 1: a bone here that needs that. But it is all 425 00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:35,320 Speaker 1: intertwined on the inside of an athlete who this is 426 00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 1: their one shining moment. In some cases, this is what 427 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:42,959 Speaker 1: they've worked for their whole life and suddenly now just 428 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: through fate to some extent, as a trainer, their fate 429 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:50,679 Speaker 1: somewhat rests in their mind, in your hands and in 430 00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:55,440 Speaker 1: your work. The responsibility of that, while I would assume 431 00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:59,560 Speaker 1: is a tremendous honor, and also I would think can 432 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:04,400 Speaker 1: be very emotionally conflicting. Was that a challenge in your career? 433 00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:06,879 Speaker 2: Never you. 434 00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:14,479 Speaker 6: An athletic trainer, you absolutely know where the lion is 435 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 6: and you absolutely know where the emotions are. You can 436 00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:24,080 Speaker 6: go back and look at volumes of Butler basketball videotape 437 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:29,439 Speaker 6: and watch the bench and watch me. Everybody's cheering, and 438 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,800 Speaker 6: I'm just sitting there watching, unemotional, in the moment of 439 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:38,159 Speaker 6: what might happen, what's going on, watching player movements, watching 440 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 6: what's going on. Now, everybody gets a little excited. I 441 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 6: have a friend at Duke. He sits on the end 442 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 6: of their bench. He gets a little excited, but he's 443 00:24:45,560 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 6: also laser focused on what needs to be done the 444 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:53,119 Speaker 6: athletic trainer at Duke, and so it does not become 445 00:24:53,119 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 6: a conflict, and the athletic trainer the team physician work 446 00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:04,200 Speaker 6: very closely as a group. You certainly get input from mom, dad, 447 00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:10,040 Speaker 6: agent and other people who might be in that inner circle, 448 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 6: but the medical decision does not get caught up in 449 00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:18,600 Speaker 6: the game that it is and so forth. In other words, 450 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,360 Speaker 6: you're not going to make any less of a medical 451 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,879 Speaker 6: decision the only thing that comes into it. And we 452 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:26,720 Speaker 6: talked about this all the time. I would go to 453 00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:30,760 Speaker 6: coaches and say, boy, we better limit minutes tonight. Now, 454 00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:35,080 Speaker 6: if this was game seven, we wouldn't limit minutes. And 455 00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:37,600 Speaker 6: so why do we say that. We say it because 456 00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,440 Speaker 6: tomorrow we don't have to get ready for another game. 457 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:42,640 Speaker 2: Right, You're guaranteed time off, Right. 458 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 6: We're guaranteed recovery time, absolutely, Jacob. And just think of 459 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:51,240 Speaker 6: already this month as players, as their seasons are ending, 460 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:56,640 Speaker 6: how many are lined up for elective surgeries and et cetera, 461 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,159 Speaker 6: et cetera. Because you were able to get to the 462 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:02,600 Speaker 6: end of the season, so tonight you're able to push 463 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,719 Speaker 6: the limits because that you don't have to prepare for 464 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:06,960 Speaker 6: tomorrow's game. 465 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,200 Speaker 1: Ralph, look forward to talking to you soon and catching 466 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:12,159 Speaker 1: up because I want to kind of get as we 467 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 1: get into the NBA postseason, in particular, you know the 468 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: story with Luca and going overseas in different things, and 469 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 1: then also just kind of keeping an eye on where 470 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 1: the Pacers may be as their season wraps up. It's 471 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:24,480 Speaker 1: always a good conversation. Would love to have you back 472 00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:25,159 Speaker 1: on for all of that. 473 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:27,880 Speaker 6: Okay, you guys take care of yourselves. 474 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 1: Appreciate it. Ralphree joining us on the program. How many 475 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:37,160 Speaker 1: people living in the Indianapolis metropolitan area do you think 476 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:39,639 Speaker 1: can say that they made it into one shining moment 477 00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:43,359 Speaker 1: currently living in India? I mean there have been IU 478 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,760 Speaker 1: players and Purdue players that have made the in Butler 479 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:49,160 Speaker 1: obviously players. I mean there's probably what fifteen total something 480 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,840 Speaker 1: like that. One of those joins us on the program now, 481 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:55,920 Speaker 1: of course he was a starter of seventy five games 482 00:26:55,920 --> 00:26:58,399 Speaker 1: for the Michigan Wolverines between two thousand and eight and 483 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: twenty twelve. 484 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:00,840 Speaker 2: Of Carmel. 485 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,719 Speaker 1: Stu Douglas joining us on the program. Stu, you fired up. 486 00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:05,200 Speaker 1: You paint in your face right now. 487 00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 8: Not quite in the face painting stage, but yeah, fired 488 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:09,600 Speaker 8: up to say. 489 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:12,520 Speaker 1: The least you have gone to and attended in the 490 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 1: last let's say three years, because I know some guys, 491 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:17,840 Speaker 1: some guys are like, hey, I enjoyed it. It was 492 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,280 Speaker 1: a great place to play basketball. I enjoyed the school. 493 00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 1: But you know, life, I'm doing other things. Other guys are. 494 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:26,639 Speaker 1: You know, they're there with pomp palms every weekend. How 495 00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,320 Speaker 1: much have you stayed in touch with and or followed 496 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 1: Michigan basketball the last few years? 497 00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:34,200 Speaker 5: I was, I mean the last few years went really 498 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:34,800 Speaker 5: picked up for me. 499 00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:36,720 Speaker 8: I was overseas for nine years, so I had to 500 00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,399 Speaker 8: miss the twenty thirteen final four run untils An eighteen 501 00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:41,400 Speaker 8: final four run, and I had to live vicariously through 502 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:44,720 Speaker 8: my teammates. So to actually be able to go to 503 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:46,320 Speaker 8: the Funnel four and let alone have it in my 504 00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:48,880 Speaker 8: backyard is extra special. 505 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 5: And there was some. 506 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:52,360 Speaker 8: Emotions and some words I won't say on the radio 507 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:54,320 Speaker 8: that will come out of me on Saturday and not expect. 508 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:56,600 Speaker 5: So it's been it's been really cool to participate in it. 509 00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,960 Speaker 2: Now you are going tonight, correct, Oh, of course? Okay. 510 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,919 Speaker 1: I'd like to know when you when you look at 511 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:07,520 Speaker 1: this game and you know and obviously Connecticut has been outstanding. 512 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:09,919 Speaker 1: I mean, it's the probably the premiere program in college 513 00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,240 Speaker 1: basketball right now. And it's weird to think that a 514 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:14,160 Speaker 1: team could be an underdog because they're a two seed. 515 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:16,720 Speaker 1: It's not like they're an eight seeds Cinderella here, right. 516 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:21,440 Speaker 1: But when you look at this game, what I'll start 517 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 1: it on this side? What area do you believe Connecticut 518 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:29,000 Speaker 1: could take advantage of at Michigan. What's an achilles heel 519 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: about Michigan that you look at and say that's where 520 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:32,680 Speaker 1: they may be susceptible. 521 00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:34,480 Speaker 5: Yeah, it's Yukon's movement. 522 00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:36,879 Speaker 8: It's been Michigan's Achilles the other the whole time. Like 523 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:39,760 Speaker 8: Nebraska almost had them at home without their big guy 524 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 8: because of their movement, and they are a three point 525 00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:44,840 Speaker 8: shooting ability. Now, you Kon's not been shooting it super 526 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,080 Speaker 8: great as of late, but Michigan likes to switch a 527 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 8: lot one through four and you kind of never stops 528 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,440 Speaker 8: running and can create some issues where like if you're 529 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 8: half steps slow on that switch, you can find a 530 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 8: man open and or you can create a mismatch with 531 00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:00,440 Speaker 8: tears down low. Maybe if a die have to come 532 00:29:00,440 --> 00:29:03,520 Speaker 8: out onto a perimeter player to close out so if 533 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:06,280 Speaker 8: they can stay attached and switch efficiently or come up 534 00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:10,320 Speaker 8: with similar tactics to stop their movement because ukn I 535 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,560 Speaker 8: was talking to somebody else earlier today, their practice must 536 00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 8: be intense, to say the least, because they're spacing and 537 00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:19,840 Speaker 8: timing is almost flawless, and that takes rep after rep 538 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:22,080 Speaker 8: after rep. And so they're going to do what they 539 00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 8: do really well, which is continue to move and they 540 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 8: never stop. And so Mischigan, if they can switch well, 541 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 8: they can defend really well and force them inside and 542 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 8: maybe force some tough twos and get some block shots. 543 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 5: But that's been their achilles h all year. 544 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:36,840 Speaker 1: You played for John Beeline, who obviously you know it 545 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 1: goes without saying he is clearly a brilliant basketball coach. 546 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:42,800 Speaker 1: What has jumped out at you from what you've been 547 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 1: able to observe about Dusty May and the preparation that 548 00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 1: he does for his team going into a game. 549 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:55,920 Speaker 8: Yeah, I think it's the flexibility in their preparation. We 550 00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:58,440 Speaker 8: what coach b was always good at is being an 551 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 8: able to like take the both team's best player, and 552 00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:03,000 Speaker 8: me and him had a lot of collaboration on that 553 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:04,520 Speaker 8: because a lot of perimeter players that I had to 554 00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 8: guard and said, all right, today, coach, let's trap these 555 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 8: screens or if he gives it up, we're cutting off 556 00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 8: the head of snake. 557 00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 5: We're just gonna deny it. 558 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:13,880 Speaker 8: I was a Taylor battle type strategy, like we're not 559 00:30:13,920 --> 00:30:14,880 Speaker 8: even to let him get it back. 560 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:17,480 Speaker 5: And I think Dusty. 561 00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:21,040 Speaker 8: Kind of has that flexibility there, Like it sticked out 562 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:23,920 Speaker 8: to me what he did with Elliott and throwing lobs 563 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:25,720 Speaker 8: against Arizona, and they're all right, I don't know if 564 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,479 Speaker 8: we're gonna be able to throw this lob exactly, but 565 00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:29,719 Speaker 8: I trust in you to throw off the backboard if 566 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:31,160 Speaker 8: you can get Rebus to help you throw off the 567 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:33,239 Speaker 8: backboard as a de facto lob, and a die will 568 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:34,560 Speaker 8: go get it. And that's exactly what they did on 569 00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 8: the first possession. So to have that trust in your 570 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:39,840 Speaker 8: player to execute something like that that they haven't done 571 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:43,640 Speaker 8: all year is I can't put into words how cool that. 572 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 2: Is, Stu. I have an inability or a weakness. I 573 00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:47,720 Speaker 2: should say. 574 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 1: One of the weaknesses that I have, probably as a 575 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 1: broadcaster really in general, is that when sometimes I hyper 576 00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: fixate on something right, I get an observation or an opinion, 577 00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:59,040 Speaker 1: and I hyper fixate on it, and this is one 578 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:00,640 Speaker 1: of those that I'm worried about. So I need you 579 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,520 Speaker 1: to calm me down and talk me off the ledge here. Perfect, 580 00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,320 Speaker 1: But there has been a lot of discussion on this, 581 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:09,320 Speaker 1: and that is for somebody who was a shooter like 582 00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:10,080 Speaker 1: you were a shooter. 583 00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:13,400 Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, I heard you talking about this earlier. 584 00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:16,760 Speaker 1: Okay, my off base here of I'm fascinated by I 585 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:20,400 Speaker 1: And I don't know if this is I had heard this. 586 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 1: I don't know if this is if this is fact 587 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:26,600 Speaker 1: or embellishment. The Dusty may actually had Michigan shooting outdoors 588 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 1: in the Big House to acclimate to the depth perception 589 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: of a dome versus an arena. Is this am I 590 00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:37,080 Speaker 1: off base with my wild theory here or is there 591 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:37,920 Speaker 1: some truth to that? 592 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:40,680 Speaker 5: I think it's somewhere in between. 593 00:31:41,920 --> 00:31:44,120 Speaker 8: I think I heard people talk about the shooting percentages 594 00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:46,200 Speaker 8: go down the tournament. I also think that's just like 595 00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:50,800 Speaker 8: U typerer ends the tournament, right, Yeah, yeah, it's it's 596 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,080 Speaker 8: not easy to shoot with such high pressure on you 597 00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 8: at all times. 598 00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 5: But I don't know they would say that. 599 00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,200 Speaker 8: About pro arenas, and I never really had an issue 600 00:31:59,200 --> 00:31:59,880 Speaker 8: with pro arenas. 601 00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:02,080 Speaker 5: I think maybe just getting used to his space. 602 00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:04,520 Speaker 8: Maybe it's one of those things where it's like a 603 00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 8: placebo effect with like some people tell you it's an 604 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 8: issues and then you go in like, oh my god, 605 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,960 Speaker 8: am I going to go miss three threes in a row? 606 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:14,000 Speaker 8: So yeah, any practice always helps us to get acmitted 607 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,000 Speaker 8: to like a certain arena type. 608 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:17,040 Speaker 5: And I'll have to. 609 00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,240 Speaker 8: Defer to some former teammates who play on that two 610 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:21,240 Speaker 8: thirteen team, and they said it was a little weird, 611 00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 8: but it was also a guy who never shot threes 612 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 8: or anything past the team foot or Blane would have 613 00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:25,360 Speaker 8: taken them out. 614 00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:26,959 Speaker 5: So take that for what you will. But I think 615 00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 5: it's somewhere in between. 616 00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:28,320 Speaker 2: Yeah. 617 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 1: I guess the reality is to a shooter, you get 618 00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: a couple of shots in you and you get that, 619 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 1: you get the vision of it, and then you're kind 620 00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:35,440 Speaker 1: of in rhythm. 621 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 2: Right. 622 00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,800 Speaker 1: But yeah, but and it's probably no different than playing outdoors. 623 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:41,680 Speaker 1: And a lot of guys have played outdoors, right, And 624 00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 1: you play pick up ball, and you used to go 625 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:45,480 Speaker 1: to Lawrence North all the time play pick up ball, 626 00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:47,560 Speaker 1: and you're you know, you're shooting in the wide open. 627 00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,560 Speaker 1: Now I will tell you this, though, Stu. You get 628 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 1: me somewhere shooting where there's no net on the rim. 629 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:54,680 Speaker 1: That completely throws me off. I don't know, why do 630 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:55,800 Speaker 1: it weird? 631 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,680 Speaker 5: I'm with you, Yeah, I almost refuse. I'm a big 632 00:32:58,720 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 5: snob that way. 633 00:32:59,440 --> 00:32:59,680 Speaker 2: Yeah. 634 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:02,080 Speaker 1: Well, partially because you also never know where the ball's 635 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:04,120 Speaker 1: going through, and then you get like twenty people debating 636 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 1: about whether it actually did go through, right, yep, you know, 637 00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:12,400 Speaker 1: it becomes a whole thing. No, this particular, playing in 638 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: the tournament. Stu Douglas is my guest, former Michigan Wolverine. 639 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 1: Playing in the tournament itself, you know you went to 640 00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:20,720 Speaker 1: a sweet sixteen. I know you guys did that. I 641 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:22,720 Speaker 1: think it's an eight seed, so you kind of had 642 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 1: one of those runs. Are tournament games, just in terms 643 00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: of the juice itself, how many times down the floor 644 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:32,560 Speaker 1: do you take before everything where the game kind of 645 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 1: slows down for you? 646 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:36,240 Speaker 5: It's a great question. 647 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:41,200 Speaker 8: Never really does because with Beyond in particular, it was 648 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:42,320 Speaker 8: possession by possession. 649 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 5: I mean you had to move on the next possession. 650 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:45,320 Speaker 5: Like you made a mistake, you got to move. 651 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,800 Speaker 8: On and you cannot let it drag you down. So 652 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:50,520 Speaker 8: there really was no thinking, which was. 653 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,400 Speaker 5: Good in a way. You just had to worry about 654 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 5: whatever your. 655 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:57,200 Speaker 8: Game plan was offensively defensively, so to take it all 656 00:33:57,240 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 8: in not much. I mean, there was a couple of 657 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 8: moments there, maybe on the negative side, where like break 658 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:04,840 Speaker 8: Blake Griffin was dunking all over us my freshman year 659 00:34:04,840 --> 00:34:07,680 Speaker 8: and it was like, it's a little bit different of 660 00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:09,440 Speaker 8: a level for us. We have not quite seen this 661 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:11,240 Speaker 8: in the big And then I mean, that's Blake Griffin. 662 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:13,200 Speaker 8: No one else really saw another play like that in 663 00:34:13,239 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 8: the country. 664 00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:16,000 Speaker 5: So there's some moments like that that are surreal. 665 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 8: But you're so tuned in, and maybe I'm just that 666 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:21,920 Speaker 8: type of guy where like I would just try and 667 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:23,920 Speaker 8: say even keeled and tuned in and didn't really let 668 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,279 Speaker 8: myself like take in the crowd too much, which you know, 669 00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:28,000 Speaker 8: hindsight twenty twenty would have been a little more fun 670 00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:30,319 Speaker 8: to be that type of player, But you're you're so 671 00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:31,839 Speaker 8: locked in it it's hard to really do that. 672 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:34,600 Speaker 1: Who was the most locked in player you either played 673 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:35,440 Speaker 1: with or against? 674 00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,680 Speaker 2: Allegiately locked locked in? 675 00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,000 Speaker 8: There was a couple of dogs, as we like to 676 00:34:42,040 --> 00:34:44,360 Speaker 8: call them. Evan Turner was just absurd. I mean, to 677 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:48,000 Speaker 8: guard him at sixty six sixty seven point guard. He'd 678 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,759 Speaker 8: posts you up, he'd shoot over you, he'd cross you up, 679 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:53,880 Speaker 8: he'd get all boards on you, he'd throw dimes. You 680 00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:56,920 Speaker 8: couldn't trap him, you couldn't hedge him. It was he 681 00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 8: was ridiculous to guard against. I will forever say that 682 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,640 Speaker 8: those are how State teams. They should have achieved a 683 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:04,320 Speaker 8: lot more. To put it that way, not to talk trash. 684 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:06,200 Speaker 8: I thought, that's that's how good they were. 685 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:07,120 Speaker 6: Uh. 686 00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:09,280 Speaker 2: The guy that did talk to most trash was who. 687 00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:12,359 Speaker 5: You know. It's funny I always tell that as well. 688 00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:14,600 Speaker 8: Everyone always says that, even my buddies, we'd recollect on this, 689 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:16,080 Speaker 8: and guys that I know played IU and Purdue, like 690 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,520 Speaker 8: Draymond talked a lot of trash and he was always confident. 691 00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:20,920 Speaker 8: And Michigan State players are always ones we heard the 692 00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 8: most because they're always those quotes are always cuote. They were, 693 00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 8: you know, forty five minutes down the road of Eat Lansing, 694 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:27,240 Speaker 8: so we heard those quotes the most. 695 00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 5: But the big tens kind of I wouldn't say oppressed 696 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:34,000 Speaker 5: or suppressed, but not a. 697 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:36,160 Speaker 8: Lot of trash talkers. But I'd say Mischigan State was 698 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:37,319 Speaker 8: definitely the tops. 699 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,640 Speaker 1: You after you were playing at Michigan Stu Douglas's my guest. 700 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:44,320 Speaker 1: You played professionally predominantly in Israel, But if I'm not mistaken, 701 00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:45,160 Speaker 1: did you play in. 702 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:48,279 Speaker 2: Pomplona, Spain? I did, yeah, And. 703 00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:51,680 Speaker 1: I know that this is kind of become more of 704 00:35:51,719 --> 00:35:54,759 Speaker 1: a pass thing in certain regions of Spain, but Pomplona 705 00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:56,640 Speaker 1: would not be won where this is the case. 706 00:35:56,680 --> 00:35:57,960 Speaker 2: Did you do the running of the bulls? 707 00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:00,400 Speaker 1: I've heard that a bullfight is actually like pretty disturbing 708 00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:01,759 Speaker 1: to watch, But did you ever do the running of 709 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:02,320 Speaker 1: the bulls? 710 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:02,920 Speaker 3: No? 711 00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:03,360 Speaker 2: I never do. 712 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:04,640 Speaker 5: Think it's in the summer. 713 00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:06,040 Speaker 8: I don't think I was there yet, and then I 714 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:07,919 Speaker 8: had left by the time it would have rolled around 715 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:08,640 Speaker 8: the next summer. 716 00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:12,000 Speaker 5: So no, and there really wasn't too many remnants of it. 717 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:13,840 Speaker 8: You're walking to like you do it here, like in 718 00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,240 Speaker 8: the city, they're like yeah, and then like nothing looks 719 00:36:16,840 --> 00:36:18,120 Speaker 8: set up for it, like what do you do with 720 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 8: the windows? 721 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:20,640 Speaker 5: And so yeah, it was it was odd to. 722 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:21,880 Speaker 8: Walk to the city and be like, yep, this is 723 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,560 Speaker 8: where you do it, but never got to experience Zon. 724 00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:24,960 Speaker 2: So it is. 725 00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:28,360 Speaker 1: Is the bullfighting culture still prevalent in that area or 726 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:30,240 Speaker 1: is that like the one area where it's like well, 727 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,120 Speaker 1: traditionally speaking one week in the year, yes, but the 728 00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:34,399 Speaker 1: rest of the year it's not a big deal. 729 00:36:34,880 --> 00:36:36,440 Speaker 5: I feel like it was in certain areas. I don't 730 00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:36,960 Speaker 5: think it was there. 731 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:39,280 Speaker 8: And I remember even at like the bus stops seeing 732 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:44,000 Speaker 8: anti bullfighting ads up and so I think it was 733 00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:45,759 Speaker 8: dying down from what they had told me. 734 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 5: But it definitely was not talked about so that way. 735 00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:49,200 Speaker 2: Uh Okay. 736 00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:51,480 Speaker 1: Lastly, when you play for a program that gets to 737 00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:54,319 Speaker 1: the Final four, and in particular in your hometown, uh 738 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:57,520 Speaker 1: one would assume because you were, like I said, you 739 00:36:57,560 --> 00:37:00,680 Speaker 1: started seventy five games for Michigan, you played for four years, 740 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,600 Speaker 1: one would assume that means that you basically just call 741 00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:05,640 Speaker 1: and say, let me know where I need to pick 742 00:37:05,719 --> 00:37:08,239 Speaker 1: up my tickets. But a lot of people have played 743 00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:10,480 Speaker 1: basketball at Michigan or for whatever scoop it may be. 744 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:13,080 Speaker 2: What is the protocol? How does it work? Yeah? 745 00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:14,839 Speaker 5: I don't know when I can and cannot say. 746 00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:16,480 Speaker 8: I know, we put in our ticket request in the 747 00:37:16,560 --> 00:37:19,560 Speaker 8: open and then from what I understand, Dusty has done. 748 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:21,919 Speaker 5: A very good job of taking care of basketball lot. 749 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,360 Speaker 1: So the school does get a certain allotment, right, yes, yeah. 750 00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:28,480 Speaker 8: Yes, And then in terms of where we get them, 751 00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:31,399 Speaker 8: I guess you know, is up to some people. And yeah, 752 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:33,640 Speaker 8: all I can say is Dusty has done an incredible 753 00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,920 Speaker 8: job of joining the generations together and making sure is 754 00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 8: a big focus. I mean, he gets a time when 755 00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:41,279 Speaker 8: he can, but when he can he does things like 756 00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 8: this where we make sure our guys can show up 757 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:46,120 Speaker 8: with good seeds. So, yeah, we're forever grateful. I was 758 00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:49,160 Speaker 8: already forever grateful before that, but it's cool to have that. 759 00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:52,200 Speaker 1: If Tim Hardaway Junior was put in charge of distributing 760 00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:53,759 Speaker 1: the tickets, would that be the first time that he 761 00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:55,399 Speaker 1: actually passed things to everybody else? 762 00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:58,480 Speaker 8: Very good point, Chris, Yeah, that would be. 763 00:37:58,520 --> 00:37:59,440 Speaker 2: He wouldn't know what to do with it. 764 00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:01,719 Speaker 5: He need to go then go past it. 765 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:02,279 Speaker 2: That's right. 766 00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:05,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, make sure to relegate that to somebody else. All right, 767 00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:08,880 Speaker 1: So what time does the pregaming begin for the Michigan alumni. 768 00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:12,720 Speaker 5: Yeah, I think like five o'clock. 769 00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 8: I know there's a lot of people down there right 770 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:15,640 Speaker 8: now in India, but it's a long day. 771 00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:17,160 Speaker 5: I would not last. I'm not getting down at till 772 00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:17,640 Speaker 5: about five. 773 00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:18,279 Speaker 2: Let's go. 774 00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:20,560 Speaker 1: Well, that's still you got three hours and fifty minutes 775 00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:23,440 Speaker 1: to get braced up, and then as the former Michigan 776 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,279 Speaker 1: man said, to get looped up before the game, like 777 00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:28,400 Speaker 1: Tom Brady said. And then eight p fifty tip at 778 00:38:28,480 --> 00:38:31,880 Speaker 1: least tentatively, and then we will see if mister Brightside 779 00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,399 Speaker 1: is ringing through the streets of Indianapolis from Lucas Oil 780 00:38:34,400 --> 00:38:37,680 Speaker 1: Stadium later tonight, Stu, enjoy it, appreciate the time tonight 781 00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:38,640 Speaker 1: and certainly enjoy. 782 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:38,839 Speaker 2: It all right. 783 00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:40,399 Speaker 5: Thanks, thanks, appreciate it. 784 00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:42,280 Speaker 2: Stu Douglas joining us on the program.