1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:00,320 Speaker 1: Casey. 2 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:01,560 Speaker 2: We discussed this yesterday. 3 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, we had a little love little seminar 4 00:00:04,880 --> 00:00:06,560 Speaker 1: on our insurance here at work. 5 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:09,000 Speaker 2: Because it's open enrollment season with health. 6 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:13,440 Speaker 1: Insurance and across the entire country. Well, it's a mess. Yeah, 7 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:14,960 Speaker 1: and there's a good chance it's going to cost you 8 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:16,480 Speaker 1: a lot more money than the Yeah. 9 00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 2: And just earlier this week, the Senate held a hearing 10 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,439 Speaker 2: and it was called making Healthcare Affordable Again, Healing a 11 00:00:22,440 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 2: broken System. And during that hearing, our senator, Indiana's Jim Banks, 12 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:32,120 Speaker 2: said that the five hospital systems controlled most of Indiana's hospitals, 13 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:36,479 Speaker 2: and he asked how that lack of competition is raising 14 00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 2: prices and causing higher health insurance premiums which we're experiencing. 15 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:45,800 Speaker 2: And the director of research from Civatas Institute, Michael Toath, 16 00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 2: he wrote an op ed and it was featured in 17 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 2: the Washington Times and he pretty much made the exact 18 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 2: same point. So let's get with Michael and ask him 19 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:59,080 Speaker 2: some questions. Michael, you said that if we don't fix 20 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 2: competition and within healthcare, especially within hospital markets, families and employers, 21 00:01:05,800 --> 00:01:08,440 Speaker 2: they're going to be paying more and Congress will keep 22 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:10,800 Speaker 2: fighting over the budget and that all could lead to 23 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:15,119 Speaker 2: more shutdowns like we experienced earlier a few months ago. 24 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:15,840 Speaker 2: Is that correct? 25 00:01:16,040 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 3: Yeah, Casey, good morning. Great to be with you guys, 26 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:19,839 Speaker 3: Great to be with your listener. I'll try to bring 27 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 3: like a little bit of good news to the conversation, 28 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:25,280 Speaker 3: because I know when the conversation gets to healthcare is 29 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 3: just like, oh my gosh, you know, one bad news 30 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:32,760 Speaker 3: cycle after the next. But if there's one silver lining 31 00:01:32,920 --> 00:01:35,840 Speaker 3: is the fact that we're having this conversation and you've 32 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:39,640 Speaker 3: got leaders like Jim Banks who are really driving this issue. 33 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 3: Because the fact of the matter is healthcare costs in 34 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:47,080 Speaker 3: the United States are outrageously high, and they're going up 35 00:01:47,120 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 3: into the right and we need an all hands on 36 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 3: deck moment to really fix the various parts of the 37 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 3: system that are driving these costs through the roof, for employees, 38 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 3: for employers, I mean, everybody across the border. And so yeah, 39 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:05,000 Speaker 3: my piece gets that one aspect of that Senator Banks 40 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:08,600 Speaker 3: was raising that issue we need more competition, we need 41 00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:10,880 Speaker 3: more consumer choice across the board. 42 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:13,519 Speaker 1: Well, yeah, here's the problem. Here's the the show I 43 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:15,800 Speaker 1: think people have though we've heard this from the Republicans 44 00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:18,680 Speaker 1: for fifteen years, right, they ran on the twenty ten 45 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,200 Speaker 1: minu terms that we're gonna fix obamac or the sphinx, 46 00:02:21,440 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: and they never do anything about it. Who is preventing 47 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:25,960 Speaker 1: them from doing something about it? 48 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:28,360 Speaker 3: It's a great question, you know, I think now's the time. 49 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 3: I mean, I think after multiple shutdowns, you know, this 50 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:34,800 Speaker 3: issue has become so problematic, and you're absolutely right. But 51 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 3: what I will say is, you know the issues on 52 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:40,960 Speaker 3: how to reform the system, because that's what we need. 53 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 3: And obviously Obamacare didn't do what it was promised. I 54 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 3: mean I went back and looked at it, and you know, 55 00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 3: then Senator Obama, running for president in two thousand and eight, 56 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:54,359 Speaker 3: talking about Obamacare, said it was going to lower premiums 57 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 3: by two five hundred dollars per family per year. The 58 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:01,480 Speaker 3: cost of insurance on the Obamacare exchanges has gone up 59 00:03:01,520 --> 00:03:06,239 Speaker 3: ten thousand dollars for a family for so we've gone 60 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:10,240 Speaker 3: in exactly the opposite direction. But what I think the 61 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 3: Republicans in Congress are starting to realize is that we 62 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:17,920 Speaker 3: need systematic reform. Right. It's not just a matter of 63 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 3: putting a band aid on a broken system. We've got 64 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:27,000 Speaker 3: to look holistically at how can we inject price transparency, competition, 65 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 3: and consumer choice all throughout the system, right, And so 66 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 3: we've got to look at the rules that are driving 67 00:03:34,760 --> 00:03:37,400 Speaker 3: prices up into the right. And so I think there's 68 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 3: conversations that are happy now that weren't really happening in 69 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 3: twenty seventeen. Weren't really happening in twenty ten, you know. 70 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 3: And you've got leaders like Brian Blaize from Paragon Health 71 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 3: Institute Orick Roy Senator Banks on the consolidation issues that 72 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,000 Speaker 3: we need to address. So I feel like we're getting 73 00:03:56,120 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 3: the critical mass of folks. But you know, nothing in 74 00:03:58,800 --> 00:04:00,800 Speaker 3: Washington is a given. So you know, let's keep the 75 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:01,320 Speaker 3: pressure on. 76 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 2: Michael Toth is joining us from the Civitas Institute. He's 77 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:08,040 Speaker 2: the research director there. So Rob and I were curious 78 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:11,560 Speaker 2: you mentioned giving consumers more choice. What would that look 79 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:13,880 Speaker 2: like in a real world example. 80 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:16,159 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think I think it's got to 81 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:18,599 Speaker 3: look you know, it's got there's got to be consumer 82 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:20,560 Speaker 3: choice at various parts of the system. So I'll just 83 00:04:20,640 --> 00:04:24,520 Speaker 3: mention a few things. First of all, you know, more hsas, right, 84 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 3: So if we look at HSA's you're putting you're putting 85 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:31,240 Speaker 3: healthcare choice in the pocketbook of the consumer, right, So 86 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 3: that's one aspect of it. Another aspect of it, And 87 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 3: this gets to the shutdown is you know we were 88 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:39,919 Speaker 3: giving one hundred cents on the dollar to insurance companies, 89 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:43,840 Speaker 3: you know, for these Obamacare premiums. You know, that's not 90 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 3: priss competition. If somebody is getting one hundred cents on 91 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,279 Speaker 3: the dollar, they have no incentive to bring those costs down. 92 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 3: So I know folks on Capitol Hill, on both sides 93 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,720 Speaker 3: of the aisle, are looking at addressing that issue. Another 94 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 3: issue on choice is making sure that there's choice in 95 00:04:59,320 --> 00:05:01,359 Speaker 3: the marketplace, and that's part of what my op ed 96 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:03,919 Speaker 3: got into in the Washington Times. That's what Senative Banks 97 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:06,560 Speaker 3: got into. When we look at a major driver of 98 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 3: healthcare costs, it's the hospitals, over a trillion dollars of 99 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:13,400 Speaker 3: spending and we're seeing more and more consolidation. We need 100 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 3: more competition in the marketplace. Competition on the private side 101 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:19,719 Speaker 3: is what bring cost down. So I think we need 102 00:05:19,760 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 3: to basically stack choice on top of choice, choice and competition, 103 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:27,360 Speaker 3: and that force is going to do what it's done 104 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 3: across other markets, which is bring cost down. One last 105 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:34,400 Speaker 3: thing case here health care is not completely broken. There 106 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 3: are parts of the healthcare industry where costs are going down. 107 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,039 Speaker 3: It's things like LASiS where people are spending their own 108 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 3: money on services. There's lots of competitions bring the cost down. 109 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 3: So we can do this. We just have to reform 110 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 3: the system. 111 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,960 Speaker 2: How long do you think consumers would see any savings 112 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:54,839 Speaker 2: if any of these proposed reforms actually were put into place. 113 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 3: You know, these things do take some time to turn around. 114 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:01,360 Speaker 3: But I know with what's going on in Washington now, 115 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 3: there's conversations that are happening right now. And let's be 116 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:07,800 Speaker 3: honest too. I mean, we've seen prices move quickly in 117 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 3: the opposite direction. So these rules, these regulations, they do 118 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 3: make a difference. I mean year one of Obamacare, the 119 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:18,000 Speaker 3: premiums went up forty seven percent. Okay, I mean that 120 00:06:18,160 --> 00:06:22,560 Speaker 3: just goes to show what changes can do to people's pocketbooks, right, 121 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 3: And so I think, you know, consumers are smart. People 122 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:29,839 Speaker 3: know that the system is broken, and once our leaders 123 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 3: in Washington sort to get the right points in place 124 00:06:31,960 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 3: and fix it, I think consumers will respond like they 125 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 3: always do and make the decisions that make the most 126 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:38,160 Speaker 3: sense for them and their families. 127 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,919 Speaker 2: Well, we appreciate your time. You can find that article 128 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:47,440 Speaker 2: in the Washington Times, and it's making healthcare more affordable again. 129 00:06:47,520 --> 00:06:49,480 Speaker 2: Thank you, Michael for your consideration. 130 00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:51,559 Speaker 3: They see my pleasure. Let's do it again. 131 00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 2: It is Kindily Casey. It's ninety three WIBC.