1 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:10,440 Speaker 1: Lie from val Hartbiner and the Crossroads of America. 2 00:00:10,560 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 2: It's Tony Katz today. 3 00:00:12,640 --> 00:00:16,480 Speaker 1: It seems quite obvious that the vast majority of America 4 00:00:16,480 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: and Americans don't understand what it took to actually capture 5 00:00:20,640 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 1: Nicholas Maduro, the not elected leader of Venezuela. Tony Katz, 6 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:29,200 Speaker 1: Tony Katz today, Good to be here, Good to be 7 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:29,800 Speaker 1: with you. 8 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:31,319 Speaker 2: It took a lot. 9 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: The practice, the skill, the daring, or the military expertise 10 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 1: is a huge part of the story. But a larger 11 00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: part of the story, maybe a secondary part of the story, 12 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 1: is the idea of what it is we've actually done here. 13 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 1: How does this now not only engage legally as people 14 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:53,280 Speaker 1: question the constitutionality, which I think the president does have, 15 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:56,560 Speaker 1: but rather what is the story that is now told 16 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 1: militarily to the rest of the world. 17 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 2: Major Mike Lines joins me. 18 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:08,080 Speaker 1: Right now, we'retired United States Army West Point graduate military analysts. 19 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:11,360 Speaker 2: Let's start with the basics here. 20 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:14,560 Speaker 1: Talk to me about what you can as you've done 21 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:19,319 Speaker 1: your research regarding this operation and what it took to 22 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:24,120 Speaker 1: be able to get these helicopters landed, to get Maduro 23 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 1: apprehended and then be able to leave without quite well, 24 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:32,040 Speaker 1: basically a shot being fired at American troops. 25 00:01:32,600 --> 00:01:33,559 Speaker 3: Happy New Year, Tony. 26 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:37,959 Speaker 4: No question, this was likely one of the most sophisticated 27 00:01:38,000 --> 00:01:40,679 Speaker 4: and important military missions in the history of our country 28 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 4: in that without done without any councilors whatsoever. One hundred 29 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 4: and fifty aircraft. But let's take it even step back further. 30 00:01:49,080 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 4: You know, I've been talking for months about what we're 31 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 4: doing in the Caribbean, why are we bringing all these 32 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:56,120 Speaker 4: military assets there, and been talking to special operators about 33 00:01:56,120 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 4: what to do, and none of us, none of us 34 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 4: envisioned this kind of that was going to take place, 35 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 4: and it's because we just thought it would be too 36 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:05,800 Speaker 4: high a body count. We just didn't think that the 37 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 4: country would tolerate the kind of casualties that normally would 38 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:11,519 Speaker 4: go into this. The fact that there were no casualties 39 00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:15,000 Speaker 4: is just, you know, nothing short of miraculous. And so, 40 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:16,960 Speaker 4: you know, we thought, you know, the army wasn't there, 41 00:02:17,000 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 4: and so because the army wasn't there, that we weren't 42 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:21,040 Speaker 4: going to put twenty thousand troops on the beach someplace. 43 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 4: We weren't going to do a D Day type invasion here. 44 00:02:23,680 --> 00:02:26,400 Speaker 4: And so one hundred and fifty aircraft. First, take out 45 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 4: their air defense systems in layers. So if you've got 46 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 4: you know, Russian Essay three hundred systems. Now, once again 47 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:36,960 Speaker 4: the United States shows that they're no, don't match for 48 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:40,360 Speaker 4: anything that we've got. Then they turn the lights out 49 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,320 Speaker 4: in Caracas and turn the lights out in the place, 50 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:46,239 Speaker 4: go in, do a black Hawk down type xvill and 51 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 4: extraction there and again seventy fifth rangers involved on the ground. 52 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 4: We've we're seeing the Cuban government report thirty two of 53 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:58,000 Speaker 4: their security forces were killed. It's just the level of violence, security, 54 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:03,000 Speaker 4: the level of god, the level of surprise, all those 55 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:05,400 Speaker 4: things principles of war made it happen. 56 00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 3: Is the only country in the world that could have 57 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:07,800 Speaker 3: done a mission like that. 58 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:12,119 Speaker 1: You know, you mentioned the missile defense system, the Essay 59 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:15,680 Speaker 1: three hundred AD. There's the SUE four hundred. I think 60 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:18,080 Speaker 1: it's the SU three hundred and the STUE four hundred essay, 61 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 1: but SU and this is a missile defense system created 62 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 1: by the Russians, owned by a fair amount of countries, 63 00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 1: including some NATO nations like Turkey, and was meant to 64 00:03:27,760 --> 00:03:30,519 Speaker 1: be you know, the killer to r F thirty five 65 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 1: strike fighter. I want to get into that story in 66 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,320 Speaker 1: just a moment. But let's go back to nobody would 67 00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:42,840 Speaker 1: have envisioned this type of takedown of Maduro. 68 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 2: Talk to me about what it was. 69 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 4: Right, the fact that he had surrounded himself both with 70 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:54,200 Speaker 4: personnel in a fortress area, in a well inside the country, 71 00:03:55,520 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 4: in a military that had competency, and so it's possible 72 00:04:00,600 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 4: that the military was paid off. 73 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:04,000 Speaker 3: And they knew that this was coming. 74 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:07,560 Speaker 4: And from that perspective we see that the current vice 75 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:09,840 Speaker 4: president now is starting to cooperate there. 76 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 3: So they had the. 77 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:14,680 Speaker 4: CIA, and what they did to lay the groundwork for 78 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 4: this operation was pretty substantial as well, because it obviously 79 00:04:19,200 --> 00:04:21,839 Speaker 4: didn't leak inside, It didn't get to Maduro and he 80 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 4: was not able to you know, we saw the story 81 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 4: about him getting in to a safe room, but the 82 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 4: point was the channel that was created, the pathway that 83 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:34,039 Speaker 4: got the helicopters took to get to that spot, to 84 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 4: get there. Once there, how quickly they overwhelmed any of 85 00:04:37,680 --> 00:04:41,479 Speaker 4: the human security that was around him, knew exactly where 86 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:43,479 Speaker 4: the building was, knew exactly all his habits. 87 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:43,720 Speaker 5: You know. 88 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:47,200 Speaker 4: The level of detail of the CIA did to set 89 00:04:47,200 --> 00:04:49,040 Speaker 4: the table for this was also pretty amazing. 90 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:54,320 Speaker 1: Talking to Major Mike Lyons, retired United States Army Military Analysts, 91 00:04:54,560 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 1: West Point Graduate. You know, we talk about what it 92 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:03,560 Speaker 1: took to set this up. They rebuilt his lack of 93 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 1: a better word, fortress where he was spending his time 94 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: on this military base, and people forget that it was. 95 00:05:08,320 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 2: On a military base. 96 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 1: They were able to duplicate it, replicate it, and then 97 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,159 Speaker 1: they trained on it. 98 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:19,720 Speaker 2: It is the stuff of movies, is what they did here. 99 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:27,359 Speaker 1: The ability to keep this a secret. Right, First you 100 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: have the hit on the Iranian nuclear facilities, now you 101 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 1: have this. 102 00:05:32,200 --> 00:05:33,640 Speaker 2: I have heard all sorts of. 103 00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:38,200 Speaker 1: Things about Pete Hegseth as the Secretary of War. 104 00:05:38,640 --> 00:05:40,840 Speaker 2: I have heard about how the. 105 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 1: Non coms love him, maybe the officer corps sees things differently, 106 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:48,440 Speaker 1: certainly how the media is desperate to get him out 107 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:52,159 Speaker 1: and has been. And there are mistakes the chat on 108 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:56,480 Speaker 1: signal and some other moves made on a personnel level. 109 00:05:57,080 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 1: But this is the second time, Major, where we have 110 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: seen absolute perfection from our military in a way that 111 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 1: people didn't think, as you're describing it, did not think 112 00:06:08,080 --> 00:06:08,880 Speaker 1: could happen? 113 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 5: Right? 114 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 2: Accept that good? 115 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 1: Or is this the military actually now being allowed to 116 00:06:14,000 --> 00:06:14,520 Speaker 1: do what it. 117 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:17,159 Speaker 3: Does well, maybe a little bit of both. 118 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:20,239 Speaker 4: I think that they have good intent from the commander 119 00:06:20,279 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 4: in chief and from him they know what the mission is. 120 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:27,160 Speaker 4: I have been reinforcing that there's professionals up and down 121 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 4: the line here, the JASAT commanders, even when it comes 122 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:33,520 Speaker 4: to targeting those drug boats, right, I mean, they know 123 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 4: what they're doing, They are clear with their orders, they 124 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 4: recognize their legal That that whole kerfuffle about you know, 125 00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:45,359 Speaker 4: obeying in legal orders and the like, was just just 126 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:48,919 Speaker 4: more distraction that these professionals didn't need. The people that 127 00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:53,120 Speaker 4: are running our military are of the highest caliber, the 128 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:55,119 Speaker 4: highest commitment as to what they're doing. 129 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:58,240 Speaker 3: And again in this in this particular. 130 00:06:57,760 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 4: Case, I'm sure there was a couple of times even 131 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:02,720 Speaker 4: the Secretary felt that, boy, this is going to be 132 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 4: a real reach to try to do this, and the 133 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:07,039 Speaker 4: fact that we pulled it off was just amazing. You know, 134 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:10,040 Speaker 4: two things you heard General Kane talk about, you know, 135 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:13,000 Speaker 4: kind of basically planning to fail. That's the difference between 136 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 4: this mission now and you know, I still have the 137 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 4: scars of nineteen eighty and what happened in Iran and 138 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 4: that desert and that failure of that mission, and the 139 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:22,240 Speaker 4: fact that they didn't have you know, we don't have 140 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 4: on the same radio frequencies back then, the failures and 141 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 4: the silos that were created that without inter agency. We've 142 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:31,120 Speaker 4: come from that spot to now where we are today, 143 00:07:31,160 --> 00:07:34,480 Speaker 4: where you heard General Kane talk about the joint Force, 144 00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:36,560 Speaker 4: the joint force, and that's what this was all about, 145 00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 4: all about the joint force. The fact that everybody did 146 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 4: their role, brought their core competency to the table. Helicopters, planes, navy, everything, 147 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 4: everybody did their role in this and that that's the secret. 148 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:51,240 Speaker 3: Now, that's why the United States is the best military 149 00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 3: the world. 150 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 4: It's also why the Russians are wallowing in novacane in 151 00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 4: Ukraine because they just they fight still very siloed and 152 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 4: they can't break out. 153 00:07:57,600 --> 00:07:58,720 Speaker 3: Another separate issue. 154 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:01,720 Speaker 1: Though, talking to Major Mike is retired United States Army 155 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:08,360 Speaker 1: military analysts, let's get into how it's not a siloed 156 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 1: The Russians, the Chinese, the Iranians are all affected by this. 157 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: But I take it to the piece you wrote over 158 00:08:17,720 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: it real clear policy or one of the real clear places, 159 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 1: which was about the Trump his doctrine of visible leverage 160 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: and how that plays into President Trump and basically this 161 00:08:32,960 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 1: rethink and this remodel of the Monroe doctrine James Monroe 162 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:41,200 Speaker 1: President James Monroe saying we must thwart European influence in 163 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:45,319 Speaker 1: the Western hemisphere. Well, you take a look at Venezuela 164 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:48,840 Speaker 1: and their connections to the Iranians, the Chinese, and the Russians. 165 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:50,320 Speaker 2: Is is this? 166 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 1: It is this the proof and the message to the 167 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:56,439 Speaker 1: world that the Monroe doctrine is well in effect and 168 00:08:56,679 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 1: simply this hemisphere is ours and you can go find 169 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 1: someplace else to play. 170 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 5: Yeah. 171 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 4: Absolutely, So I'm glad you brought that up, because that's 172 00:09:05,520 --> 00:09:09,240 Speaker 4: exactly what ends up happening here is Trump now gains 173 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 4: the leverage of control of Venezuelan oil. 174 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:13,400 Speaker 3: And I don't see anything wrong with that. 175 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 4: Okay, we we we we took Maduro out under the 176 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 4: guise of the drug cartel and that that that's that uh, 177 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:21,000 Speaker 4: that that. 178 00:09:21,040 --> 00:09:22,240 Speaker 3: Excuse soda, so to speak. 179 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:26,479 Speaker 4: But the bottom line is now u US controlling Venezuela 180 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 4: and controlling the energy in the oil there is is 181 00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 4: the leverage that Trump needs against China. It's the leverage 182 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:34,880 Speaker 4: that needs he needs against Canada, I mean, of all things. 183 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:38,200 Speaker 4: And it's clearly what he what he was after, which 184 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:40,280 Speaker 4: which again I don't see if you're an American what 185 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:43,400 Speaker 4: is wrong with that. And it's in our hemisphere, and 186 00:09:43,440 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 4: it's not that the Venezuelan people are going to be 187 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,079 Speaker 4: pour over it when they're not going to be destitute 188 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 4: of it. But we're going to use it as leverage 189 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 4: against the Cubans. We're going to use it as leverage 190 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:55,720 Speaker 4: to restore democracy to We're going to use his leverage 191 00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 4: to bring to bring, you know, lift all the boats 192 00:09:58,080 --> 00:09:59,000 Speaker 4: within our hemisphere. 193 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 3: So we've ignored South America for a long time. 194 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:05,679 Speaker 4: I think it's it's pretty interesting that that people are 195 00:10:05,720 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 4: concerned about, you know, all of a sudden that that 196 00:10:08,040 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 4: were the mean people taking three hundred you know, three 197 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 4: hundred billion pairs of oil from the Venezuelans. 198 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:14,960 Speaker 3: We're not doing that, but we are controlling it. 199 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,880 Speaker 4: The Chinese are no longer getting it, the Russians won't 200 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 4: be able to sell military equipment to Venezuela anymore, and 201 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:22,160 Speaker 4: the Uranians are gonna have to close down the drone 202 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:24,839 Speaker 4: factory that they had set up in Venezuela. 203 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 3: Uh So, again all good. I wouldn't go as far 204 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 3: as calling it the Don Road doctor, and I wouldn't 205 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 3: go there with it. 206 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 4: But but this is this is a long time coming, 207 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 4: and I'm glad to see our country. 208 00:10:34,640 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 1: The president, President Trump and that presser on Saturday morning 209 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:41,960 Speaker 1: referred to it as the Don Road doctrine. But to 210 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 1: the larger point, this is about sending the signal. This 211 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:51,200 Speaker 1: certain there's no way to look at what happened and say, well, 212 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:55,360 Speaker 1: this was a peaceful move. This was an austrageously strong 213 00:10:55,480 --> 00:10:59,480 Speaker 1: move that was meant to send the message. I I 214 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: have theory on what that message truly is, but how 215 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 1: do you see and others within the military analyst world, 216 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 1: how does that message received? 217 00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:13,319 Speaker 2: And what was that message to the rest of the world. 218 00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:17,200 Speaker 4: Oh, the message to first of all the Chinese and 219 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 4: is that We're not going to let you take any 220 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 4: foothold at all within our hemisphere. That's number one. So 221 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 4: that first and foremost most support, I mean, the Chinese 222 00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 4: delegation was there the day before. Now again you talk about, 223 00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,600 Speaker 4: as we tell the fact that the Chinese didn't know 224 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 4: that the mission was going on, because if they did 225 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:38,080 Speaker 4: know something this happened, they surely wouldn't have put their 226 00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:41,319 Speaker 4: people at risk of being anywhere near that place when 227 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 4: this took place. So again the level of secrecy, surprise, 228 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 4: only the United States going to have pulled this off. 229 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 4: You know, we're somewhat concerned about the Chinese military, obviously 230 00:11:51,160 --> 00:11:53,120 Speaker 4: because of what they've built, But at the end of 231 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 4: the day, they haven't fought in a war since nineteen 232 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:58,800 Speaker 4: seventy nine. They didn't do well then, and who knows 233 00:11:58,800 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 4: what's going to happen once if the bullets start flying. 234 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 4: I still, you know, the Chinese couldn't possibly get into 235 00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,640 Speaker 4: Taiwan and take their leader like we did and make 236 00:12:08,679 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 4: that situation there any different, make it less kinetic. So 237 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:14,319 Speaker 4: so again messages were sent to the Chinese, to the 238 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,840 Speaker 4: Russians about their equipment they're gone, and surely to the Uranians. 239 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:20,560 Speaker 4: The Uranians wanted this oil as well. The Chinese wanted 240 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:23,000 Speaker 4: this oil. The Chinese were looking for the Venezuelan oil. 241 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:24,880 Speaker 4: So now all these tankers are going to be seized 242 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 4: and the world energy markets are totally different. 243 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:33,080 Speaker 1: Talking to major Michaelons, retired United States Army military analysts, 244 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 1: let me stay on the topic and hit it from 245 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 1: another direction. The Chinese were in Venezuela. They were meeting 246 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:44,280 Speaker 1: with Maduro, so were the Russians, and they were there 247 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: on the day in that twenty four hour period where 248 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:51,560 Speaker 1: Maduro was taken. So your point of they clearly weren't 249 00:12:51,559 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 1: aware because they would have been nowhere near the place 250 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 1: and therefore tipping off Maduro that maybe something was an issue, 251 00:12:58,360 --> 00:12:59,400 Speaker 1: that is very true. 252 00:12:59,400 --> 00:12:59,559 Speaker 5: Now. 253 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:01,679 Speaker 1: The other we said is they knew exactly what the 254 00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:03,559 Speaker 1: United States was going to do and didn't tip their 255 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: hands that they knew what the United States was gonna 256 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 1: do because it didn't affect them. So we do have 257 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,560 Speaker 1: to ask ourselves what is it that the Chinese are 258 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:12,959 Speaker 1: aware of? But you brought up something that I have 259 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,200 Speaker 1: been saying, others have discussed. I believe Gordon Chang is 260 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:19,880 Speaker 1: one of these people and others the question of whether 261 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:22,880 Speaker 1: or not the Chinese are indeed a paper tiger, whether 262 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: or not they can actually sustain a punch to the nose. 263 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,319 Speaker 2: Is this a basically a. 264 00:13:29,360 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: Taking away of affront in their desire for Belton Road 265 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:38,839 Speaker 1: in trade, their desire for conquest and hegemony not only 266 00:13:38,880 --> 00:13:41,520 Speaker 1: in the Pacific grim but they've been working on spending 267 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:44,079 Speaker 1: billions of dollars to have conquests in South America and 268 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:47,440 Speaker 1: Central America, like they have in African nations. How much 269 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: does this thwart their plans and how would we be 270 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 1: able to see it militarily that it has. 271 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:57,480 Speaker 4: Oh, it totally thwarts their plans. Again, it gets back 272 00:13:57,520 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 4: to energy. They're not going to have the energy capability 273 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 4: to project the kind of power that they want to 274 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:04,400 Speaker 4: project throughout the world. 275 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:07,839 Speaker 3: This is the name of the game since the Second 276 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 3: World War. 277 00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 4: I mean the Japanese failing to knock out the United 278 00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:17,160 Speaker 4: States energy reserves and gasoline and petroleum reserves when they 279 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 4: came into Pearl Harbor was one of the strategic mistakes 280 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:22,480 Speaker 4: that they ended up making tactically first, but then obviously 281 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:24,920 Speaker 4: it impacted them because it allowed the United States to 282 00:14:24,920 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 4: continue to continue. 283 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 3: The war there. 284 00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 4: The Chinese have really have got to go back to 285 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:33,880 Speaker 4: the basics now and go back to focusing on their 286 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 4: backyard and knowing that this president, like you heard Mark 287 00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 4: Rubio say, he's going to say you know, he says 288 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 4: what he means, He's going to do what he says 289 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:41,600 Speaker 4: he's going to do. 290 00:14:41,880 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 3: There's no more playing around about that. The leverage now 291 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 3: we have over. 292 00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:50,040 Speaker 4: China with this oil that it's not unlikely that Trump 293 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 4: does a deal with China that eventually allows Venezuela and 294 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 4: oil to flow back to China. 295 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,320 Speaker 3: But we're going to get something for it. There's something's 296 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:57,080 Speaker 3: going to happen for it. 297 00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 4: So again it gets back to the leverage and the 298 00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 4: leverage that he created and gets it very clearly. 299 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 3: Anybody could see it. This is what's going on. 300 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 1: I've got more with Major Mike Lyons coming up in 301 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 1: just a little bit, because there's a lot of moving 302 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:17,120 Speaker 1: parts regarding this takedown of Maduro and what it means 303 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:17,920 Speaker 1: the world over. 304 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:20,760 Speaker 2: Keep it here. I'm Tony Katz. This is Tony Katz today. 305 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: I don't think there's anything wrong with saying that the 306 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 1: taking of Maduro was about the oil. I don't know 307 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: why that's so frightening to people or angering to people. Well, 308 00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 1: it's not angering to people. It is angering to children 309 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:39,560 Speaker 1: who parade on the leftist side. Tony Katz, Tony Katz today. 310 00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:41,240 Speaker 1: Good to be here, Good to be with you. 311 00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:43,000 Speaker 2: Mike Lions joins us right now. 312 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 1: Major Mike Lyons, retired United States Army military analysts, and 313 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,280 Speaker 1: we've been having this conversation about the capture of Maduro, 314 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:55,360 Speaker 1: and certainly the conversation that this is about oil is 315 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 1: a huge part of the story, just not how the 316 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 1: political left is engaged. And that's because they want to 317 00:16:01,360 --> 00:16:04,240 Speaker 1: go out there and engage protests and no war for oil, 318 00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:07,320 Speaker 1: because they're never so happy as when they're protesting, because 319 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 1: that's the only place where they feel like. I don't know, 320 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 1: they have some purpose or some usefulness, but I'll leave 321 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: my politics aside just for a moment. I want to 322 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 1: get before we get into the oil conversation, back to 323 00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:24,040 Speaker 1: something you said about the defense systems, because this taking 324 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:26,240 Speaker 1: of Maduro has now shown that you have thirty two 325 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:33,120 Speaker 1: dead Cubans, which means Cuba was providing protection for Maduro, 326 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 1: which is a very strange. 327 00:16:34,520 --> 00:16:35,920 Speaker 2: Thing to hear. 328 00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:38,880 Speaker 1: Why would anybody think that the Cubans could actually do this? 329 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:42,080 Speaker 1: And when you see how easily we were able to 330 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 1: get Blackhawks in and out, I believe it was black 331 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 1: Hawk helicopters, the SU three hundred, the SU four hundred, 332 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:52,320 Speaker 1: this missile defense system that it's supposed to be from 333 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,120 Speaker 1: the Russians be able to take down patriots and take 334 00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:57,880 Speaker 1: down the F thirty five Strike Fighter from the US. 335 00:16:57,920 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 2: It was supposed to be the F thirty. 336 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 1: Five Killer Turkey, which was instrumental in creating the F 337 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,879 Speaker 1: thirty five was actually a purchaser of the SQU four hundred. 338 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: I mean, it was infuriated the United States at the time. 339 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:14,760 Speaker 1: And now we're saying that the Russian missile defense system 340 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:17,280 Speaker 1: that the Turks purchased and was supposed to be able 341 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:20,359 Speaker 1: to take out the F thirty five can't detect and 342 00:17:20,440 --> 00:17:24,440 Speaker 1: take down a helicopter. I mean, that's that is one 343 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:29,440 Speaker 1: hell of an exposing and talk about weakening the Russians 344 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:30,200 Speaker 1: to what extent? 345 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:31,040 Speaker 2: Is that accurate? 346 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:33,200 Speaker 3: No, it's one hundred percent accurate. 347 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:36,640 Speaker 4: And it's not only they can't take them out from 348 00:17:36,800 --> 00:17:39,280 Speaker 4: the strategic level with that with that system, but they 349 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:41,119 Speaker 4: couldn't even take it out from the tactical level. There 350 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:44,440 Speaker 4: was no air defense systems that were around that fortress. 351 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:47,400 Speaker 4: For example, I mean Blackhawk Down was taken down by 352 00:17:47,640 --> 00:17:51,359 Speaker 4: you know, a very low grade system, you know, handheld 353 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:54,280 Speaker 4: a system that was able to hit the tail rod 354 00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:55,200 Speaker 4: of a helicopter. 355 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:56,959 Speaker 3: That created chaos for the United States. 356 00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 4: The same thing could have happened here in say seven 357 00:17:59,720 --> 00:18:01,080 Speaker 4: or something like that is what it was, or an 358 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,240 Speaker 4: RPG I guess is what what took that down? 359 00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:04,439 Speaker 3: But they didn't even have that. 360 00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:07,600 Speaker 4: You know, we were able to get helicopters literally inside 361 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 4: the wire into the fortress. And then you know, geta 362 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:13,600 Speaker 4: asked the question about you know, if if Venezuela thinks 363 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 4: that were they're being attacked, you know, they they have targets, 364 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:20,000 Speaker 4: they could they could have hit the navy that was offshore, 365 00:18:20,119 --> 00:18:22,840 Speaker 4: like what would have happened? Then once they we attacked 366 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:26,120 Speaker 4: multiple military sites there, it just again goes to show 367 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:28,120 Speaker 4: they didn't scramble jets, they didn't do anything. 368 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:31,119 Speaker 3: They didn't response to this whatsoever. Maybe they thought they 369 00:18:31,119 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 3: were gonna. 370 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:33,639 Speaker 4: Have to respond asymmetrically if troops are going to ever 371 00:18:33,640 --> 00:18:37,159 Speaker 4: show up, but there was again no response was a 372 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:40,639 Speaker 4: really interesting sign. Maybe maybe they were paid off, but 373 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 4: they also showed no capability. 374 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:43,680 Speaker 2: Is it your. 375 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 1: Contention as you take a look at Venezuelan military, which 376 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:52,680 Speaker 1: is not small by any any any stretch. Under the 377 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 1: the vice president, who is a Moduro loyalist, Delsey Rodriguez. 378 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 1: The claim now is that she she wants to desperately 379 00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:03,000 Speaker 1: work with the United States. But this isn't technocrat. This 380 00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 1: is somebody in the Maduro mold, and certainly is not 381 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:08,440 Speaker 1: somebody who would still seem as legitimate, would not be 382 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:13,200 Speaker 1: seen as legitimate by the Venezuelan people considering two stolen elections. Right, 383 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 1: does the Venezuelan military have any capability to respond? Is 384 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 1: it even possible that they would try to respond against 385 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:25,880 Speaker 1: our fifteen eleven warships in the Caribbean fifteen thousand troops there. 386 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:27,840 Speaker 3: No, they couldn't. 387 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:29,880 Speaker 4: The only way they could is if we had made 388 00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:32,439 Speaker 4: the mistake by doing the D Day type invasion that 389 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 4: I was talking about before, and we put twenty thousand 390 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 4: troops there and we actually did an invasion, and then 391 00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:39,639 Speaker 4: you create the asymmetrical warfare where they would have an 392 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 4: advantage over And now we have a rock that's your 393 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 4: rock analogy, But everyone projecting it right now is way 394 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,240 Speaker 4: off base because it wasn't an invasion and it wasn't 395 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:51,440 Speaker 4: regime change. We took the leader out, and they've got 396 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,879 Speaker 4: a person that's running their country, didn't We didn't take 397 00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:59,200 Speaker 4: out the henchmen. You saw that comment that they wanted 398 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:00,919 Speaker 4: to know why we didn't take more people out. We 399 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:03,159 Speaker 4: took the right guy out that that was indicted by 400 00:20:03,320 --> 00:20:06,399 Speaker 4: US Corde law and brought him to justice. So again 401 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 4: without having troops on the ground there, we would be 402 00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:12,159 Speaker 4: it would be a very bad move for us to 403 00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 4: action and invade Venezuela and bring ourselves into this close 404 00:20:16,600 --> 00:20:19,919 Speaker 4: battle where that then then perhaps they would have some 405 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,959 Speaker 4: way to combat against them. 406 00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:23,960 Speaker 2: I have that clip if you want to hear it. 407 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 2: I have Margaret Brennan on cn NON CNN, on CBS. 408 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:35,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, with one of the more peculiar arguments here it is. 409 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 2: This is her. 410 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:39,560 Speaker 1: She's speaking to the Secretary of State Marco Rubio and 411 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:42,640 Speaker 1: trying to make the argument of well, you had Maduro 412 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 1: on the most wanted list, right, Biden and Harris offering 413 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,040 Speaker 1: up twenty five million dollars, but you had all these 414 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: other people, why didn't you take them as well? This 415 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,800 Speaker 1: is Brennan asking the question, and then Rubio answering, here 416 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:54,360 Speaker 1: is why. 417 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:58,359 Speaker 6: The Trump administration decided to leave it intact and only 418 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 6: arrest Nicholas Maduro and his wife. The person who controls 419 00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:06,720 Speaker 6: the police, the chief thug ds di Cabeo. He's the 420 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:09,520 Speaker 6: Interior minister. He's been indicted by the United States. He 421 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:13,720 Speaker 6: was in that indictment the administration released. He's a narco terrorist. 422 00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:16,160 Speaker 6: There's a twenty five million dollar price on his head. 423 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:19,720 Speaker 6: He's still in place. The defense minister who is deep 424 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 6: ties to Russia, fifteen million dollar price on his head, 425 00:21:23,119 --> 00:21:27,159 Speaker 6: he is still in place. I'm confused. Are they still 426 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:30,600 Speaker 6: wanted by the United States? Why didn't you arrest them? 427 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:34,120 Speaker 6: If you are taking out the narco terrorist regime. 428 00:21:34,280 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 5: You're confused. I don't know why that's confusing. 429 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:37,960 Speaker 2: They're still in. 430 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 5: We're not going to go in and they wrap up. 431 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:42,440 Speaker 7: You're going to but yeah, but you can't go You're 432 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:44,880 Speaker 7: going to go in and suck up five people. They're 433 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:48,159 Speaker 7: already complaining about this one operation. Imagine the howls we 434 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 7: would have from everybody else that we actually had to 435 00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:53,119 Speaker 7: go and stay there four days to capture four other people. 436 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:54,639 Speaker 5: We got the top priority. 437 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 7: The number one person on the list was the guy 438 00:21:57,840 --> 00:21:59,680 Speaker 7: who claimed to be the president of the country that 439 00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 7: he was not, and he was arrested along with his. 440 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:03,280 Speaker 5: Wife, who was also indicted. 441 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,680 Speaker 7: And that was a pretty sophisticated and frankly complicated operation. 442 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:09,879 Speaker 7: It is not easy to land helicopters in the middle 443 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 7: of the largest military base in the country. The guy 444 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:15,719 Speaker 7: lived on a military base, land within three minutes, kick 445 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:17,879 Speaker 7: down his door, grab him, put him in handcuffs, read 446 00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 7: him his rights, put him in a helicopter, and leave 447 00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:23,320 Speaker 7: the country without losing any American or any American assets. 448 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:24,600 Speaker 5: That's not an easy mission. 449 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:26,199 Speaker 7: And you're asking me why didn't we do that in 450 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:27,800 Speaker 7: five other places at the same time. 451 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:29,399 Speaker 5: I mean, that's absurd. 452 00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:33,560 Speaker 2: You forget how good he is. Yeah, and he is 453 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:35,920 Speaker 2: very very good. 454 00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:39,280 Speaker 1: There is Marco Rubio, the Secretary of State, talking to 455 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:42,080 Speaker 1: Major Mike clons also very good, retired the United States 456 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:46,800 Speaker 1: Army military analyst. The oil and you see the screaming 457 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:50,040 Speaker 1: of no war for oil. This isn't about whether or 458 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,240 Speaker 1: not the US is going to profit off the oil, which, 459 00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 1: knowing President Trump, of course we will. This is about, 460 00:22:56,560 --> 00:23:00,199 Speaker 1: you know, to this is the economist Frederick Bostiat, than 461 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,240 Speaker 1: the unseen, it's that the oil is not going to 462 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:06,640 Speaker 1: end up in the hands of the Russians or the Chinese. 463 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 2: Right explain that. 464 00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:13,760 Speaker 1: It's that's geopolitical, that military strategic importance of keeping the 465 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:18,440 Speaker 1: oil away from them as a pretext to this capture. 466 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's that simple. And how people don't think you 467 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:23,240 Speaker 3: know that? 468 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 4: I guess the MAGA crowd is saying, you know, for 469 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:30,080 Speaker 4: some reason, the America first doesn't stop at the end 470 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 4: of our shorelines and and and stop at the oceans. 471 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:36,359 Speaker 4: America first means we act in the best interests of 472 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 4: our country. And it's not in our interests of our 473 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:42,320 Speaker 4: country to have Russia, China and Iran have access to 474 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 4: three hundred billion barrels of reserve crude oil. It's just 475 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:47,960 Speaker 4: not it's it's in our best interest to have control 476 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:49,800 Speaker 4: over that. So and if you don't see that, I 477 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 4: don't know what to tell you. So that's part of 478 00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 4: this process. And sure, we're not stealing it. We're not 479 00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,040 Speaker 4: going to make Venezuela destitute over it. It's going to 480 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 4: get more ship it's going to be used as leverage 481 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,160 Speaker 4: to fix situations like in Cuba. It's going to make 482 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,000 Speaker 4: Mexico pay attention. Everyone is now, I guess I go 483 00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 4: back to Canada. Canada thought they were going to do 484 00:24:09,760 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 4: a deal with Trump on oil. Those days are over 485 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:14,600 Speaker 4: now because Venezuela pumps the same kind of oil that 486 00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:16,919 Speaker 4: the Canada does. And if we decide to build an 487 00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,920 Speaker 4: infrastructure down there, then we don't necessarily need Canadian crude oil. 488 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:22,439 Speaker 3: Now there, they'll maybe do a deal with China then 489 00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:22,920 Speaker 3: who knows. 490 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:24,679 Speaker 4: But but again the leverage that's been gained by this, 491 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 4: but oil energy has always been a strategic atchet in 492 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:31,399 Speaker 4: our lifetimes, Tony, in our lifetimes, it will always be. 493 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 4: As much as everybody wants to go green and go 494 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 4: through other locations not happening. It's we're going to stay, 495 00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:42,240 Speaker 4: you know, addicted to this product for a very long 496 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:44,439 Speaker 4: time as a society, whether we like it or not. 497 00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:48,680 Speaker 1: We could say addicted, and people can downplay it all 498 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:50,400 Speaker 1: they want. We live in the real world and oil 499 00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 1: runs of the real world. And the real world also 500 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,800 Speaker 1: involves keeping others at pay. And that's why this oil conversation, 501 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: as you mentioned, it goes back. 502 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:02,440 Speaker 2: To this Monroe doctrine conversation. 503 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 1: And one of the things this shows is and it exposes, 504 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:11,959 Speaker 1: is the capability of America's military might as opposed to 505 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: the Barack Obama years, as opposed to the Joe Biden years. 506 00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,919 Speaker 1: Although he at least had some moves, there has been 507 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 1: a real desire not to show our strength and our capability. 508 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,840 Speaker 1: Now I'm not a guy who is a fan of 509 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,360 Speaker 1: military parades, but I am absolutely a fan of being 510 00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:30,119 Speaker 1: able to utilize our skill set in a way that 511 00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 1: makes the world say, oh. 512 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:34,239 Speaker 2: Dang, I didn't know they could do that. 513 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:38,200 Speaker 1: So now that the world knows we can do that 514 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:42,280 Speaker 1: twice twice, we've been able to do this in less 515 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 1: than a year. Is there a change that you see 516 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:52,960 Speaker 1: to strategy globally? We have discussed whether or not the 517 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:59,320 Speaker 1: threat is coming from Russia's invasion of Ukraine, conversations in 518 00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,680 Speaker 1: the Middle least in Iran, or is the threat UH 519 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,399 Speaker 1: China and only China and that should be our only focus. 520 00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:10,119 Speaker 1: Has this been able to the utilization of this UH 521 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,399 Speaker 1: skill set of ours? Has this been able to help 522 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:16,960 Speaker 1: the Trump administration decide here's where our focus has to 523 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 1: be in Wine. 524 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:20,120 Speaker 3: I think I think it's always good. 525 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 4: We're projecting power and creating that the turns that we've 526 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:26,320 Speaker 4: long lost under. We had nothing under the Biden administration, 527 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:30,080 Speaker 4: and Obama picked and chewt you know, chose when when 528 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:33,520 Speaker 4: he decided to flex his muscle there. I think that 529 00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 4: the first Trump administration was just so scattered that they 530 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 4: weren't really sure. And him taking the four years off 531 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,720 Speaker 4: and assembling the team he has has put put put 532 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 4: us in place. 533 00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:46,440 Speaker 3: Now for you know, real missions. 534 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:49,199 Speaker 4: But I'll bring up the thing about partners because now 535 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:50,640 Speaker 4: it's going to be a good time to be a. 536 00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:51,240 Speaker 3: Partner of us. 537 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,280 Speaker 4: And and what you know, watching you know the Europeans, 538 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 4: you know, the Germans and the French thinking that they're 539 00:26:58,720 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 4: gonna all of a sudden get together and stop the 540 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,199 Speaker 4: Russians there. Everyone is delusional and they know it. And 541 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:05,000 Speaker 4: so so now it's going to be a good time 542 00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,200 Speaker 4: to be to be a good partner of the United States. 543 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,359 Speaker 4: And imagine if we turn a country like Venezuela and 544 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 4: make that a good partner. I mean, obviously we're going 545 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,680 Speaker 4: to go after you know, some of the bad people 546 00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:16,439 Speaker 4: there are look to hold an election at some point, 547 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:22,399 Speaker 4: but this Trump administration has the real possibility of projecting 548 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:25,680 Speaker 4: power in such a way that gets democracy. I've always 549 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,280 Speaker 4: felt that the United States, when we did a rock 550 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 4: we try to import democracy and we should have imported 551 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,320 Speaker 4: capitalism and that, and that if we'd done that then 552 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,520 Speaker 4: then we might not have seen the insurgenty that took place. 553 00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 3: Well, that's going to happen here. 554 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 4: We're going to likely improve the economic value of Venezuela first, 555 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:47,280 Speaker 4: We're going to get that up and running, and then 556 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:49,879 Speaker 4: we'll bring democracy second. I think that's the way to 557 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:51,840 Speaker 4: go here and when you have the military that we 558 00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:54,560 Speaker 4: have to do it now projects the power that gives 559 00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 4: you the right to do it in that direction. 560 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:58,800 Speaker 1: Before I let you go, Major Mike Lyons, retired United 561 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:04,000 Speaker 1: States Army Military anam. In this conversation of oil, and 562 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:08,280 Speaker 1: in this conversation of who has really got to rethink 563 00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 1: now they're positioning, you have to bring up the Iranians 564 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 1: where the Iotola is losing control. There are massive protests 565 00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,120 Speaker 1: going on in Iran that the media is not covering. 566 00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:21,879 Speaker 1: Iran has executor over nineteen hundred people in twenty twenty 567 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,040 Speaker 1: five alone that has been up. The sanctions are having 568 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:27,440 Speaker 1: a real effect and people have had enough. They are 569 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:31,440 Speaker 1: fighting back. And Venezuela was a place where the Iotola 570 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:33,600 Speaker 1: man thought he could have escaped to. The word on 571 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:35,640 Speaker 1: the street is that he's trying to talk to Moscow 572 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 1: about being able to escape there, as if somehow Moscow 573 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 1: would actually want him. But the story here is with 574 00:28:42,760 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 1: this move and with this control of oil, it also 575 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 1: allows for a flood of oil, further decreasing the purchasing 576 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:52,360 Speaker 1: power and capabilities of the Russians and the Iranians. So 577 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:57,120 Speaker 1: if the Iatola is watching this, what is that strategic 578 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:58,400 Speaker 1: thinking in Iran right now? 579 00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:02,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, that reports about him looking to go to Moscow. 580 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:08,000 Speaker 4: This again unthinkable on some level. Iran greatest foreign policy 581 00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:09,600 Speaker 4: failure our country post World War Two. 582 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:10,400 Speaker 5: We've talked about that. 583 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 4: Before, and the fact that he's just going to tap 584 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:16,400 Speaker 4: out just is incredible to me. That the Republican guards 585 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 4: and the security forces are collapsing around him as well. 586 00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,920 Speaker 4: And I guess at some point human nature takes over 587 00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:25,680 Speaker 4: and survivability comes to the forefront, and people look at 588 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,840 Speaker 4: that first. We have to watch Iran see what happens, 589 00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 4: because again, that's another tremendously resourceful, intelligent country underneath this 590 00:29:36,000 --> 00:29:40,600 Speaker 4: cloud of Islam that it's not been allowed to project 591 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 4: positively in the international community. I get, you know, Obama 592 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,040 Speaker 4: tried to get them part of the international community, but 593 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 4: giving them four billion dollars of cash, you know, all 594 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 4: I did was fund Hamas and fund terrorist organizations. If 595 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 4: you could turn if you could turn Iran away from 596 00:29:56,360 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 4: that access of China, Russia in North Korea, that would 597 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 4: be nothing short than spectacular, and maybe three years from now, 598 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 4: that's what we're talking about. But Iran, there's a tipping 599 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 4: point taking place in Iran. Right now, we've also put 600 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 4: C seventeens in London and in England. It looks like 601 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,400 Speaker 4: that the Trump administration is saying that if you, if 602 00:30:14,440 --> 00:30:17,120 Speaker 4: you harm those protesters, we're going to do something. And 603 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 4: we've got that capability now, so we'll see what happens. 604 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 1: Major Mike Lyons, retired United States Army military analyst, on 605 00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,640 Speaker 1: the Twitter X m Aj. Mike Lyons l y o 606 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:30,160 Speaker 1: NS be sure to follow him there. I appreciate taking 607 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 1: the time to be with us and more we got 608 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 1: to I'm Tony Katz. 609 00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:34,160 Speaker 2: This is Tony Katz today