Speaker 1: Live from ball Heartbyer and the Crossroads of America.
Speaker 2: It's Tony Katz today.
Speaker 1: I'm not quite sure there's anything left to say about
Speaker 1: the WNBA.
Speaker 2: I mean, I've got the.
Speaker 1: Telegraph talking about Sophie Cunningham as basketball's new anti trans
Speaker 1: maga poster girl. What when did she say she was
Speaker 1: anti trans? Girls should be in girls sports, Girls sports
Speaker 1: are for girls. That's anti trans. No, no, no it's not.
Speaker 2: And who's still fighting this fight? And why?
Speaker 1: You know what we said here from the beginning was
Speaker 1: was that Sophie Cunningham of the Indiana a Fever has
Speaker 1: done absolutely nothing wrong.
Speaker 2: She has said absolutely nothing wrong. She said that.
Speaker 1: Girl sports should be for girls and that children is normal.
Speaker 1: It's the rational course, Tony Katz, Tony Katz today, so
Speaker 1: good to be with you. Find everything I do with
Speaker 1: Tony kats dot com. It was a story from the Guardian.
Speaker 1: Sophie Cunningham isn't rejecting politics, She's cashing in on them.
Speaker 1: This whole article ends in the following manner. Sophie Cunningham
Speaker 1: has been.
Speaker 2: In the league eight years.
Speaker 1: She'll be thirty later this month, five and a half
Speaker 1: years older than Clark, and for the large majority of
Speaker 1: those years, she's been a serviceable, unremarkable player who was
Speaker 1: a top notch three point shooter. She wasn't even who
Speaker 1: the marketers picked to sell sex to the boys. The
Speaker 1: role of the glambed up blonde beauty baller belonged to
Speaker 1: six or four inch Cameron Brink. Cunningham needed the war
Speaker 1: to get on the map, needing it as much as
Speaker 1: it needed her, and all it took was a silly
Speaker 1: fingerpoint and being in opposition as someone black to the
Speaker 1: aggrieved whites standing up to someone black men standing up
Speaker 1: for them. Add transphobia to her portfolio, and the result
Speaker 1: is a star, the latest participant in an old game
Speaker 1: no more complicated than checkers, but far less interesting. The
Speaker 1: author of this piece of the guy the name of
Speaker 1: Howard Bryant. Now that paragraph tells the story of part
Speaker 1: of the WNBA story, which is the media that covers
Speaker 1: the WNBA is desperate for that league to stay black
Speaker 1: and gay. Now I could get in a whole bunch
Speaker 1: of trouble for saying that. I could have people coming
Speaker 1: after me for saying that. I just quoted the author
Speaker 1: who said that's what we do here and put it
Speaker 1: in the context of.
Speaker 2: White people are just so angry.
Speaker 1: No, white people aren't a group, like black people aren't
Speaker 1: a group, like gay people.
Speaker 2: Are in a group.
Speaker 1: They have their own minds and their own thoughts, maybe
Speaker 1: mister Bryan's or anybody else. If they could just stop
Speaker 1: being bigots for five minutes, we could have ourselves a
Speaker 1: better conversation. The issue here is that Caitlin Clark is
Speaker 1: a star. We know the story here. She's simply better
Speaker 1: than the rest. And even if she isn't actually better
Speaker 1: than the rest, she has captured the imagination.
Speaker 2: And that's the way it goes.
Speaker 1: You think Taylor Swift is really a super great songwriter
Speaker 1: and a super great voice, No part of that is true.
Speaker 1: She has captured the imagination, and that's why it's stadium
Speaker 1: tour after stadium tour after stadium tour.
Speaker 2: That's what she was able to do. Cook has sold
Speaker 2: out stadiums.
Speaker 1: Don't ask me captured the imagination For just a moment,
Speaker 1: I'll give you the most unpopular opinion in the history
Speaker 1: of mankind, Andrew Dice Clay was never that funny, but
Speaker 1: it was a really good routine. Captured the imagination, and
Speaker 1: you wanted to be a part of it. The attitude
Speaker 1: was fun. Stadium tours, Comics in stadiums. Man, that's the goal.
Speaker 1: Because every comic wishes they were a rock and roll guy,
Speaker 1: wishes that they were a rock star.
Speaker 2: We know this to be true.
Speaker 1: Rock Stars want to be actors. Actors want to be comics.
Speaker 1: Comics want to be rock stars. As I believe that
Speaker 1: is the circle of life. The WNBA has every opportunity
Speaker 1: to be better off because of Caitlin Clark. She captured
Speaker 1: the imagination. She brought people to the sport. She brought
Speaker 1: the players from commercial flights to flights. She brought them
Speaker 1: better hotels, she brought them better contracts, she brought them
Speaker 1: more money.
Speaker 2: She did it.
Speaker 1: It's a lot to put on a twenty four to
Speaker 1: twenty five year old, but she did it. That's the end.
Speaker 1: Sophie Cunningham didn't come along to be a star because
Speaker 1: of Caitlyn Clark. She came along to be a star
Speaker 1: because the WNBA had no interest in having a star
Speaker 1: like Caitlyn Clark because she was too white and too straight.
Speaker 2: Now that's a very rude thing to say, but I'm
Speaker 2: not the one saying it.
Speaker 1: I notice that they say it constantly and consistently, over
Speaker 1: and over and over and over again, overshadowing this one
Speaker 1: and overshadowing that one.
Speaker 2: The only reason.
Speaker 1: People like hers because she's white in this and then
Speaker 1: the media needs a straight white woman as a post.
Speaker 2: She brought the excitement, ride the wave. Call a penalty
Speaker 2: on her when it's her penalty.
Speaker 1: Call a penalty on Sophie Cunningham when it's Sophie Cunningham's penalty.
Speaker 1: But because Sophie Cunningham has decided to be protective of
Speaker 1: Caitlyn Clark, because Sophie Cunningham isn't afraid of a fight,
Speaker 1: because she's able to utilize social media can make a
Speaker 1: moment like the meme of the point right, all the pointing,
Speaker 1: she gets attacked and vilified, and when playing the Minnesota Lynks,
Speaker 1: she gets elbowed in the face and she gets called
Speaker 1: for the penalty. Let me say it again for the
Speaker 1: people in cheap seats. She got elbowed in the face
Speaker 1: and she got called for the penalty. She didn't have
Speaker 1: the ball. The player with the ball elbowed her in
Speaker 1: the face, and Sophie Cunningham got called for the penalty.
Speaker 1: And then she had the audacity, the audacity to say
Speaker 1: that girls sports should be for girls, and that was it,
Speaker 1: That was it, game over. She is a bigot, and
Speaker 1: she is terrible, and she's maga and all the rest
Speaker 1: of the nonsense.
Speaker 2: The hate machine went full throttle.
Speaker 1: By the way, not only did I believe the Guardian
Speaker 1: referred to her as anti trans, they referred to her
Speaker 1: as anti black. The media that covers the NBA is
Speaker 1: amongst the most bigoted and the most terrible out there.
Speaker 2: They really are awful, positively awful. But what is worse.
Speaker 1: Possibly are the coaches, the coaches who have put them
Speaker 1: in a position of being in favor of men in
Speaker 1: their sport.
Speaker 2: Now, a lot of people have.
Speaker 1: Been discussing what happens when the WNBA allows this, When
Speaker 1: the WNBA allows men in because they identify as this,
Speaker 1: that or the other, that's going to be the end.
Speaker 1: That's going to be the end of the WNBA. By
Speaker 1: the way, did I call it a penalty and not
Speaker 1: a foul, my mistake. I apologize for that. I was
Speaker 1: looking that the US men's soccer team did just sign
Speaker 1: Pochettino to a long term contract through twenty thirty, and
Speaker 1: maybe that's why I was doing it.
Speaker 2: It just came up foul, not penalty. My apologies.
Speaker 1: Now, coach after coach after coach got asked what they
Speaker 1: think about Sophie Cunningham standing up for girls in girl sports,
Speaker 1: which is a normal position.
Speaker 2: She didn't say a single thing that's political.
Speaker 1: The people who say she says something political are the
Speaker 1: people who are broken. They are fools, and they are
Speaker 1: a danger to themselves and others. Why do I say
Speaker 1: such a thing, Because if you can believe that girls
Speaker 1: sports are not for girls, you'll believe anything. If girls
Speaker 1: sports are not for girls, there are no girls sports.
Speaker 2: The end.
Speaker 1: It is such a factual statement, such a clear statement,
Speaker 1: such an understandable statement. It can't be denied. Only the
Speaker 1: irrational can deny it. And those people are irrational, and
Speaker 1: they should be mocked. People who are going through this
Speaker 1: mental illness, I think should be shown respect and love
Speaker 1: people who want to push mental illness on others or
Speaker 1: get you to buy into that somebody else is meant
Speaker 1: to own.
Speaker 2: This means you have to change the way you live.
Speaker 1: Yeah, those people, those people, they need to be pushed aside,
Speaker 1: mocked them, ridicule to s Fine, So we get back
Speaker 1: to the coaches, because one by one they're asked, what
Speaker 1: do you think about what Sophie Cunningham said?
Speaker 2: They can't figure out how to be rational.
Speaker 1: I have got the coach of the Minnesota Links, quite literally,
Speaker 1: wearing a she's got a shirt on, and what does
Speaker 1: the shirt say? The shirt says trans kids belong?
Speaker 2: What does that even mean?
Speaker 1: What possibly could that mean? Trans kids belong belong? What
Speaker 1: girls belong in girls' sports? Boys who say they're girls
Speaker 1: do not your shirt? Trans kids belong is nothing more
Speaker 1: than some kind of irrational sloganeering. It's virtue signaling. Look
Speaker 1: at me, I'm nice, Look at me I care. You
Speaker 1: don't care. You sure as hell don't care about kids.
Speaker 1: You don't care about girls. And that's the story time
Speaker 1: and again into the WNBA and what has come.
Speaker 2: Out of this. It isn't about Caitly Clark. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: It isn't about Sophie Cunningham or Caitlyn Clark.
Speaker 1: It's about the media that covers the WNBA and the
Speaker 1: coaches within the WNBA who.
Speaker 2: Don't care about women. They are bigots and they are
Speaker 2: proud of it.
Speaker 1: And they are desperate to see women be demoralized and
Speaker 1: moved out.
Speaker 2: This is the coach of the Golden State Valkyries.
Speaker 1: Her name is Natalie Nikoss, and she is asked a
Speaker 1: basic question.
Speaker 3: Ever again in the regular season, but coming out of
Speaker 3: the break, one of the big news stories has been
Speaker 3: Sophie Cunningham and the protest for her and protests against her.
Speaker 3: And you know, they had a national televised game today
Speaker 3: and Cheryl, you know, wore a shirt and it's just
Speaker 3: a conversation. I'm wondering, just what do you think about it?
Speaker 3: Do you do you think that's good for the league?
Speaker 3: Does it does it detract from the basketball?
Speaker 2: Is it? Is it just noise?
Speaker 3: I'm just wondering what your opinion is.
Speaker 4: I think thank you for that question.
Speaker 2: I think just in terms of.
Speaker 4: How I'm seeing it is if I could answer it
Speaker 4: was like for me, sports, sports is about belonging.
Speaker 2: It's about inclusivity.
Speaker 4: It's about allowing everyone to be their authentic self. You know,
Speaker 4: I'm big on that, just because I have been criticized
Speaker 4: for my for my ethnicity. I've been in those you
Speaker 4: shouldn't belong here many times, and for me, I don't
Speaker 4: want that space, especially Golden State, to ever feel like that.
Speaker 1: And that is a broken league and a broken coach.
Speaker 1: I would tell her directly what an absolutely surreal argument
Speaker 1: sports is about belonging. I didn't say that somebody who
Speaker 1: thought they were a woman couldn't play basketball. Go play basketball.
Speaker 1: You just can't play organize against other women. If you
Speaker 1: want to play in a league that does that, go
Speaker 1: do that. But if you want to tell women they
Speaker 1: have to take a back seat to men, first of all,
Speaker 1: I don't know what kind of feminism that is.
Speaker 2: Secondly, my gosh, that's bigoted. That's ugly.
Speaker 1: Since your ideology comes before your humanity, you lost all
Speaker 1: sense of rationality.
Speaker 2: You can't even stand up for you. Look at me.
Speaker 1: They came after me because of my ethnicity. I don't
Speaker 1: even know what that's supposed to me. And I wasn't
Speaker 1: tall enough, this and that. And now you're saying that
Speaker 1: other girls should have to sit down because well they're girls.
Speaker 1: You're saying to me, Tony, this conversation isn't making sense.
Speaker 1: And I'll say to you, trying to make sense of
Speaker 1: the left's argument is madness. Let me give you the
Speaker 1: baseline of all of their arguments. They were told that
Speaker 1: if they don't accept the fact that men can be women,
Speaker 1: they will be excommunicated, and they simply can't get excommunicated,
Speaker 1: so they have no way of explaining how it is
Speaker 1: they really feel. They just simply do what they are
Speaker 1: told so they get to stay in the fold.
Speaker 2: The WNBA is telling you on every level, we are
Speaker 2: a league for.
Speaker 1: Black women and gay women, and that's it, and that
Speaker 1: if anything should come around questioning that, we will go
Speaker 1: to further and further extremes to prove it, and we
Speaker 1: will give every nonsense answer, literally no sense, to try
Speaker 1: and get out of the conversation. Sports is about belonging. Well,
Speaker 1: sometimes the guy who isn't good enough doesn't make the team.
Speaker 1: He wants to belong but he doesn't make the team.
Speaker 1: I thought it was about winning, so I thought a
Speaker 1: lot of it was about Sophie Cunningham said absolutely nothing wrong.
Speaker 1: But the WNBA's response is outrageously wrong.
Speaker 2: Maybe this is what we need, Maybe this is what
Speaker 2: we need. Maybe what we need.
Speaker 1: Is for them to be able to out themselves completely
Speaker 1: so we know what it is we're dealing with.
Speaker 2: Now, what does it mean for the WNBA. I don't know,
Speaker 2: because it doesn't look to me like the NBA is
Speaker 2: ever going to change the league.
Speaker 1: It doesn't look like they're going to do anything except
Speaker 1: continue this welfare project. Our job, I think, is to
Speaker 1: ask ourselves what this is talking to or doing to
Speaker 1: us via culture, and how do we make changes from there,
Speaker 1: Because right now they're a little girls saying thank you,
Speaker 1: Sophie Cunningham for standing up for us, and then they
Speaker 1: are the coaches saying, how dare you stand up for girls?
Speaker 2: I have a couple of theories of where this can go.
Speaker 2: I'll get into those in the days ahead. Keep it here.
Speaker 2: I'm Tony Katz, and this is Tony Katz today.