1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:03,560 Speaker 1: So last night, you know, I was watching that show 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:06,559 Speaker 1: I've been telling you about Eddie, that naked show that 3 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:11,039 Speaker 1: that British It's like a normal show on British television. 4 00:00:11,039 --> 00:00:12,960 Speaker 1: It's like the dating game, but everybody's naked. 5 00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:13,920 Speaker 2: Okay. 6 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:18,759 Speaker 1: Now, I watched an episode the other night and the 7 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,439 Speaker 1: contestants were all seventy plus. That was a bit of 8 00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:25,279 Speaker 1: what we say is a tough watch, right, Okay, I'm 9 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 1: just telling you. It's called Naked Attraction. It's so I'm 10 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:33,839 Speaker 1: watching the show, okay, And and as I'm watching it, 11 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: I'm also you know, I wasn't particularly interested in this, uh, 12 00:00:38,000 --> 00:00:40,120 Speaker 1: this group of nudity that was being brought up. So 13 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:42,480 Speaker 1: I'm scrolling through my phone and I happen to see, 14 00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:44,760 Speaker 1: you know, our friend Taylor Tannebaum, of course, formerly a 15 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:48,760 Speaker 1: WTHR that's now with the ACC Network in ESPN, and 16 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:53,240 Speaker 1: I see a post that she has mentioning that even 17 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 1: though she was calling the games at hinkle Fieldhouse, she 18 00:00:56,320 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 1: had never seen the movie Hoosiers. Okay, and so I 19 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 1: paused the naked I've told you about this Naked Attraction show. 20 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,320 Speaker 1: Now you can you can sit here and play dumb 21 00:01:07,319 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: if you'd like. But we won't tell anybody that you 22 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:11,399 Speaker 1: Actually last night at three thirty in the morning, sent 23 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,280 Speaker 1: me a text and said, Season four, show nine. Okay, 24 00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:20,520 Speaker 1: what's going on here? Just lying? I was asleep. I 25 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:23,119 Speaker 1: was asleep, So I texted Taylor to actually I called 26 00:01:23,120 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 1: her and I said, wait, you've never seen Hoosiers and 27 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:26,840 Speaker 1: so we had a lovely conversation and I said, well, 28 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 1: since you're going to be on the call for the 29 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:32,640 Speaker 1: NIT Championship, how about coming in the big program. I'm 30 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 1: sure appreciating this intro. Jake, Oh, she's aware of the program. 31 00:01:37,880 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 1: Our show. Huh, our show. No, nobody's aware of this show, 32 00:01:41,480 --> 00:01:44,959 Speaker 1: but she knows about the naked Brits, not Hoosiers. 33 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:47,200 Speaker 3: Though, I was not sure where this segue was going, 34 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:48,960 Speaker 3: but I'm happy at landed where it did. 35 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:54,040 Speaker 1: Okay, so you and me both hold on. It's a 36 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 1: it's a it's a very bizarre show because it was 37 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: a normal television in England, and that's what's weird it. 38 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 1: But Taylor, you you were aware of the show, right, 39 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:05,760 Speaker 1: I am. 40 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 3: I don't know where I've seen it before. But then 41 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 3: once you start, it's very hard to stop. So I 42 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:16,639 Speaker 3: can understand. It's extremely strange and then you just start 43 00:02:16,720 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 3: judging people. It's wild. It's a wild experience, that's it. 44 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:22,920 Speaker 1: And I honestly, and you and I talked about this, 45 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:24,520 Speaker 1: but I want to be clear here as to not 46 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:28,639 Speaker 1: make so that this doesn't sound uncomfortable flip and see aside. 47 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 1: It is far more an observation of just the human 48 00:02:33,680 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 1: element of yes, biologically speaking, and then as well, like 49 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 1: the emotional aspect that comes with people in these uncomfortable situations, 50 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:44,959 Speaker 1: and that's what makes the show fascinating, right. 51 00:02:45,560 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 3: No question. And I'm like, man, those those toes really 52 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:50,680 Speaker 3: did it for you. I was like, I can't agree 53 00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 3: with that, Like, it's just an interesting case study. 54 00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: It is because they will ask people, well, what attracted 55 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:57,800 Speaker 1: you about you know, John, and it's like, well, I 56 00:02:57,840 --> 00:03:00,240 Speaker 1: really like, you know, his his shoulder blade in the 57 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: symmetry of a pinky toe. You know what, It's totally 58 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 1: bizarre right in reality, I guess you know what I mean. Yeah, 59 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:12,080 Speaker 1: you're right, T. Now, so let's get to this before 60 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:13,919 Speaker 1: we get to the n I T And welcome back home. 61 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:15,680 Speaker 1: By the way, I realize you're a Floridian, but you 62 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:21,639 Speaker 1: are a user. You have or have not? Now did 63 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,240 Speaker 1: you did you in any way, shape or foot form, 64 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:26,639 Speaker 1: even dip your toe into the water of Hoosiers last night? 65 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:29,280 Speaker 3: So I fear last night after we hung up the 66 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,440 Speaker 3: phone and I fell asleep, it was a long day. 67 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,120 Speaker 3: But with that being said, I have an obligation and 68 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 3: duty and desire to watch it. So I will before 69 00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 3: the Championship of the n IT on Sunday, because I 70 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:43,040 Speaker 3: know I will inevitably get out about it on TV 71 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:45,840 Speaker 3: because I knew when I said that last night that 72 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 3: this wasn't going to go over well with the people. 73 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 3: Now let me say this. I have seen clips, I 74 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,120 Speaker 3: have seen pieces. I'll put it on in the background 75 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 3: because it's it's always on TV, but I've never really 76 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:55,760 Speaker 3: seen it yet. 77 00:03:55,920 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 1: Again, I get it, and I know. 78 00:03:58,240 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 3: I know that's really like, it's really damning, as like 79 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 3: an honorary Hoosier that I haven't seen the movie. 80 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:06,400 Speaker 1: So well, the funny thing is how long did you 81 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:11,120 Speaker 1: work at THHR Four years? So it's not as though 82 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 1: you don't have experience with hinkle Fieldhouse. I mean, I'm 83 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,599 Speaker 1: assuming you've been to hinkle field House fifty times, right. 84 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:20,040 Speaker 3: Billion times for so many different things, And honestly, one 85 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:22,680 Speaker 3: of the last times I was there, you know, I 86 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:24,840 Speaker 3: was there obviously for Butler. But two, like I think 87 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 3: about the COVID Tournament and it was held at Hinkle 88 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 3: when Louisville or sorry it was was it Saint John's 89 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:34,880 Speaker 3: played Alabama or one of those games. I know Rick 90 00:04:34,920 --> 00:04:37,039 Speaker 3: Patino was coaching because this whole Louisville team was back 91 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,880 Speaker 3: washing him. So you know, it's it's definitely a cool 92 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 3: place and I've been a trillion times, but I just 93 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:43,480 Speaker 3: had never seen the movie. 94 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:47,840 Speaker 1: Well you obviously, you know, came back in this particular 95 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 1: situation because you're working the sidelines right for ESPN for 96 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:52,960 Speaker 1: these games in the n IT AM. 97 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:56,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, and what an honor not lost on me for sure. 98 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 1: It's very cool for certain. And one of the teams 99 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:03,040 Speaker 1: that is a storyline I think on Sunday is the 100 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:05,719 Speaker 1: fact that Auburn is one and we get this a 101 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 1: lot right where you get the team that there is 102 00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:10,480 Speaker 1: so much discussion about should they have made the tournament 103 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:12,880 Speaker 1: and they did not, and so they're in the NIT 104 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:14,640 Speaker 1: and here they are in the finals. I don't know 105 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 1: as much about Tulsa, to be honest with you. What 106 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 1: you know, what do we anticipate from this particular this particular. 107 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:26,599 Speaker 3: Matchup, so I would anticipate first and foremost, Auburn on 108 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:29,919 Speaker 3: paper is a superior team. They're the number one overall 109 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 3: seed in this tournament. They were one of the first 110 00:05:31,600 --> 00:05:34,280 Speaker 3: teams out. You know, there's so many scenarios. If one 111 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:36,520 Speaker 3: shot would have what in differently for the Tigers this season, 112 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 3: I would have seen they'd probably be in the Big Dance. 113 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:42,200 Speaker 3: And then maybe SMU hadn't said E J. Edwards was 114 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:45,120 Speaker 3: definitely going to be back, and he inevitably wasn't in 115 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 3: that first four, then maybe the Tigers would have been 116 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:49,560 Speaker 3: in over the Mustangs. I don't know. But with that 117 00:05:49,640 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 3: being said, you now have an Auburn team that they 118 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:53,839 Speaker 3: didn't come this far. To come this far, right, they'd 119 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 3: either probably bow out in the first round because they 120 00:05:55,880 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 3: didn't care, or you're going to get this far you 121 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 3: want to win a championship. They're talented top to bottom, 122 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 3: and it's too hot. Pettiford, you know, Keyshawn Hall, Kevin Overton, like, 123 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 3: these guys are ballers and they can play against the 124 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:16,280 Speaker 3: best of them. Gone through an SEC gauntlet, they have 125 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:18,839 Speaker 3: the third toughest schedule in the country. But then you know, 126 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 3: you have a Tulsa team that this is everything for them, 127 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 3: This is this is what they're playing for. And they're 128 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:25,839 Speaker 3: led by head coach Eric Conkle, who has a ton 129 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 3: of experience and you know, he's in this fourth season 130 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 3: at the Helm there and and they've really built this 131 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,920 Speaker 3: thing into a solid basketball program. And they have some 132 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:36,680 Speaker 3: dudes who can shoot the three, like they get hot 133 00:06:36,720 --> 00:06:40,679 Speaker 3: from three. Auburn's gonna have to combat that, which they can, 134 00:06:41,240 --> 00:06:42,680 Speaker 3: but you know, it's one game, and it's a one 135 00:06:42,720 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 3: game sample size, so we'll see if they can do it. 136 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:46,239 Speaker 3: I think that's what you can expect. It's an Auburn 137 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:48,359 Speaker 3: team that I think at this point does have a 138 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:50,839 Speaker 3: desire to win this championship to prove those people wrong 139 00:06:50,880 --> 00:06:53,159 Speaker 3: who thought they were going to lay an egg. Coach 140 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,359 Speaker 3: Stephen Pel will tell you that. And you have a 141 00:06:55,400 --> 00:06:58,479 Speaker 3: Tulsa team led by a veteran head coach and Eric 142 00:06:58,480 --> 00:07:01,600 Speaker 3: Conkle who know this is everything for them to win 143 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 3: a championship. So I think it's going to be a 144 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 3: fun battle, but I think ultimately Auburn is the better 145 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 3: team on the floor. 146 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:11,440 Speaker 1: Is it odd for you to be in Indie working 147 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 1: and staying in a hotel and not just living here. 148 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 3: Yes, very strange, and also because people ask me where 149 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 3: should I go? What should I do? First of all, 150 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 3: it's changed a lot since I left in twenty two 151 00:07:22,760 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 3: in a good way. Second of all, there's like parks 152 00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 3: that I just like because you live here, you just 153 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 3: like don't go to certain places. And I'm over on 154 00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:32,600 Speaker 3: like more monument circle side where I'm saying right now, 155 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 3: But I lived right off mass Apps, so I was like, 156 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 3: I didn't come except when I was working to like 157 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 3: this side as much, you know what I mean. It's 158 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 3: just so interesting. But it's nice to be back. But yeah, 159 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:44,440 Speaker 3: you know, I walked by my apartment today and I 160 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:47,080 Speaker 3: was like, kind of wish I still had had a 161 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 3: room there. 162 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: Did it make you sad? Be honest, did it make 163 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 1: you sad? 164 00:07:51,400 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 3: Yeah? A little bit, it does because I love this place. 165 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 3: This place meant a lot to me, and I wouldn't 166 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 3: be where I am without it, that's for darm sure. 167 00:07:57,960 --> 00:08:01,280 Speaker 3: But it was really cool yesterday just being back, and 168 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 3: you know, being at Butler, you see John Deadman and 169 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 3: you know the wonderful sid there and the athletic department 170 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:10,640 Speaker 3: and just just a ton of people and even ushers 171 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 3: and Chuck Lofton was there, you know, legendary meteorologists at THHR. 172 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 3: So it was just cool to see like those familiar 173 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 3: faces because it really does feel like home to me. 174 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:21,120 Speaker 3: So pretty cool and it's nice to. 175 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 4: Just walk around. 176 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 3: It's actually warm out, guys, crazy. 177 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 1: No, I'm just hoping it doesn't rain, but you know, 178 00:08:26,120 --> 00:08:29,640 Speaker 1: concerts and everything else going on. Taylor Tannebaum is our guests. 179 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:32,080 Speaker 1: Should we be on the call for Tulsa and Auburn 180 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 1: n IT Championship gamebridge Field House Sunday ESPN. You also, Taylor, 181 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 1: work with the ACC Network primarily, so allow me to 182 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 1: ask this if the Pacers, you know, obviously you know 183 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 1: the scenario, Indiana is trying to make sure that they 184 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 1: stay within one of those top four picks if they 185 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:54,440 Speaker 1: were to not be in the top two. Because I 186 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 1: do think we don't know this, but let's just say 187 00:08:57,520 --> 00:08:59,679 Speaker 1: for the sake of the discussion that Devonsa and Peterson 188 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 1: in some form are one and two, and the Pacers 189 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:05,560 Speaker 1: have a situation where it's Caleb Wilson or it is 190 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:07,960 Speaker 1: Cam Boozer that would be and you know a cup 191 00:09:08,000 --> 00:09:09,480 Speaker 1: may be in the discussion as well. But from the 192 00:09:09,520 --> 00:09:14,640 Speaker 1: acc standpoint of those two, Boozer Wilson, which one do 193 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 1: you think is more intriguing as an NBA prospect? 194 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:21,079 Speaker 3: That's interesting. I think you know a lot more about 195 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:23,280 Speaker 3: Cam Booser at this point. He's definitely going to have to, 196 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 3: you know, elevate his game, and he knows that. And 197 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:27,440 Speaker 3: he's as good as it get, like he can do 198 00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:30,199 Speaker 3: it all. And he's grown up in an incredible household 199 00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:33,319 Speaker 3: with it wonderful mom and CC and of course Dad Carlos, 200 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 3: So he has every tool in his toolbox to be 201 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:38,439 Speaker 3: the ultimate NBA player and he's going to play for 202 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:41,439 Speaker 3: a long time. Caleb Wilson is a little bit rougher 203 00:09:41,480 --> 00:09:43,559 Speaker 3: around the edges, right, and we didn't get to see 204 00:09:43,640 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 3: him on the back end of the season, but man, 205 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 3: he is impossible to take your eyes off of when 206 00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 3: he's out there. He's an energizer, bunny. He's a great 207 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 3: teammate and truthfully, the ultimate competitor, like he saves every 208 00:09:57,440 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 3: receipt anyone who's ever doubted him. And to be honest, 209 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,199 Speaker 3: I don't think he got talked about enough this season 210 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 3: because this freshman class was so star studded you can't 211 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 3: go wrong with either of them. I think people would 212 00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 3: be thrilled with Cam Boozer because you know a lot 213 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:12,800 Speaker 3: more about him than what he can bring to the table. 214 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 3: You know, the name Caleb Wilson, You're going to be 215 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 3: sat in a seat at Gamebridge if he's on the floor. 216 00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 1: Is he is? And I'm talking about Wilson. Is Caleb 217 00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 1: Wilson a more of like the finesse wing defender guy 218 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,080 Speaker 1: or is he more the holy cow he just took 219 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 1: off from the block and Sean Kemp forced guy. 220 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:38,320 Speaker 3: Honestly both honestly both He can do a little bit 221 00:10:38,320 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 3: of everything. And again, I think his ceiling is high. 222 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:45,360 Speaker 3: I don't think he's even reached that potential. And I think, 223 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 3: you know, you put a couple pounds of muscle on him, 224 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 3: get him in the weight room a little more. I 225 00:10:50,640 --> 00:10:52,840 Speaker 3: think he's the ultimate prospect and there's just like so 226 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:55,160 Speaker 3: much the left to be desired. Like I think there's 227 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:56,920 Speaker 3: just so much less on the table that he can 228 00:10:56,960 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 3: add to his game. And it's really for me, it's 229 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:02,439 Speaker 3: it's the intangible. But yeah, he can, he can defend, 230 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:05,679 Speaker 3: but it's you know, he's at some point before he 231 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:07,520 Speaker 3: got hurt led the country in dunks like this is 232 00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:11,040 Speaker 3: a guy who can do everything, and he led Carolina 233 00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:12,960 Speaker 3: to where they were this season, and they were a 234 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 3: different team without him, unfortunately. 235 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 1: Well, Taylor, I hope you get a little slice of 236 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 1: home while you're here. And again, I know it's not home, 237 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:22,200 Speaker 1: but to those of us that live here, we consider 238 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 1: it to be part of your home because you made 239 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:26,040 Speaker 1: it home here for a while and you were certainly 240 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 1: a part of the fabric of all of it. And 241 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 1: I appreciate you squeezing in a little time and enjoy 242 00:11:31,120 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 1: enjoy on Sunday being on that call at Gambridge Field House. 243 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:36,440 Speaker 3: It'll be awesome if anyone's here, it's going to be 244 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 3: a great game. So I hope some people come out. 245 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:39,640 Speaker 3: And I do want to know it. I already had 246 00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:42,800 Speaker 3: my cluster trunck. Oh, appreciate that. 247 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 1: There you go. 248 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 3: Did we ordered it to We ordered it to Hankle, 249 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 3: so everyone got a nice taste. It was great. And somehow, 250 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:53,800 Speaker 3: you guys, I just snuck into the NABC convention. I 251 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,720 Speaker 3: got a pass. And also I'm currently an assistant coach somewhere. 252 00:11:57,480 --> 00:11:58,959 Speaker 2: No, he needs to know wear them all. 253 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 1: You got to do Taylor. Just so you know two things. First, Off, Eddie, 254 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 1: she can get a discount that cluster truck by using 255 00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:04,600 Speaker 1: what coach. 256 00:12:04,640 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 2: Code, big fan five dollars off twenty five for. 257 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:09,360 Speaker 1: More uh and Taylor, amazing, I will be doing that 258 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:12,439 Speaker 1: if you are at the NABC that's the National Association 259 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:15,319 Speaker 1: of Basketball Coaches. If I'm not mistaken, right, you, you've 260 00:12:15,320 --> 00:12:18,120 Speaker 1: got to walk around in a sweatsuit that has nineteen logos, 261 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:20,000 Speaker 1: and all you've got to do you walk past anybody. 262 00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 1: You go, hey, coach, you good coach? You good? Yeah, good, 263 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:24,079 Speaker 1: good coach. Good seeing your coach, and then you keep walking. 264 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:26,840 Speaker 3: Coach always coach, always flies. 265 00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 1: You good coach. That's right. You just say, are you 266 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:31,920 Speaker 1: good coach? And every coach is good? Yeah, now yep 267 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:34,280 Speaker 1: we're good. Yeah, just got fired. But good, everything's good. Okay, 268 00:12:34,280 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 1: good coach, good senior coach. All right, Taylor, we'll let 269 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,120 Speaker 1: you get back to the to the coaches. 270 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:41,839 Speaker 3: There, right, Thanks, guys, and I hope to see you 271 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 3: while I'm here. 272 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:44,679 Speaker 1: Look out for Eddie White. I guarantee he's walking around. 273 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:48,080 Speaker 1: Good coaching people, glad handed all right, Taylor will see. 274 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 1: I appreciate it, Taylor, you see right there in the background, 275 00:12:51,880 --> 00:12:53,439 Speaker 1: and you hear, you can hear somebody good coach, You 276 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:58,560 Speaker 1: good coach. I'm good coach. Two o'clock hour in Indianapolis, 277 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:00,720 Speaker 1: for that matter, it's the two o'clock hour everywhere in 278 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:03,959 Speaker 1: the Eastern time zone. My name is Jake Querry Eddie Garrison. 279 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,079 Speaker 1: The other voice you hear in this program. We call 280 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:08,160 Speaker 1: it Querry and Company. They had a marketing firm that 281 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: sat for months coming up with that name. And of 282 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 1: course it is Final four week here in Indianapolis and 283 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 1: joining us now on the program, he has just completed 284 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:19,640 Speaker 1: his third season as the head coach at Notre Dame, 285 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 1: after two at Penn State and of course a number 286 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 1: of different programs throughout the state of Indiana. Michael Shrewsbury 287 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:28,560 Speaker 1: joining us on the program. We just said that during 288 00:13:28,600 --> 00:13:30,800 Speaker 1: Final four week, whenever you see a coach, you walk 289 00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:32,840 Speaker 1: past and you go, hey, coach, you good coach. Everything 290 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:35,120 Speaker 1: good coach. So therefore that's how I'm going to greet 291 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:35,840 Speaker 1: you. You good coach. 292 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:38,560 Speaker 2: I am good. 293 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. 294 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:42,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a I'm sitting in the convention center now, 295 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:45,959 Speaker 4: so you can imagine the amount of greetings like that 296 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 4: that are happening. Yeah, at this moment currently, even with 297 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:49,960 Speaker 4: me on the phone. 298 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 1: Every coach wearing a sweatsuit with three different emblems of 299 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:55,480 Speaker 1: the school and then carrying a cup of coffee and 300 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:57,719 Speaker 1: then saying hey coach, you good coach. That's how it works, right, 301 00:13:59,160 --> 00:14:01,480 Speaker 1: So that's yea, you know, there's a lot that and 302 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:03,560 Speaker 1: I appreciate your time, man, and I want to get 303 00:14:03,600 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 1: to this to begin, and that is, you know, the 304 00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:10,560 Speaker 1: opportunity in this weekend. I have always kind of considered 305 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:14,839 Speaker 1: this like a coaching convention where probably you're you're maybe 306 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:17,439 Speaker 1: picking the brains of some guys or you know, I 307 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 1: don't know that you're in the situation of staff and 308 00:14:20,240 --> 00:14:23,440 Speaker 1: that kind of thing. But there are important things that 309 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 1: can take place this weekend. What is from a coaching perspective, 310 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 1: the overall I guess significance of being here and the 311 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:33,480 Speaker 1: things that can come out of this weekend if you 312 00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:36,080 Speaker 1: are not coaching in it, yeah. 313 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 4: I think you know, for us, this is our coach's convention, right, 314 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 4: So a lot of personal development happens. But you also, 315 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:48,720 Speaker 4: as at different levels you'd grow to as a coach, 316 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:53,000 Speaker 4: there's different involvement in each thing. So you know, as 317 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 4: a young coach. Yeah, you're getting here for the first time. 318 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 4: Maybe you're doing some of the clinics or watching some 319 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:02,080 Speaker 4: of the coaches present. Maybe you're you know, trying to 320 00:15:02,120 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 4: see who's got a GA job and you're tracking down 321 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:07,880 Speaker 4: a head coach to talk to him. But as you 322 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 4: get a little older, now, like you know, this is 323 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,400 Speaker 4: my like you said, fifty year now as a head coach, 324 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:18,000 Speaker 4: I'm on the NABC board. So sitting in meetings yesterday, 325 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 4: going through meetings today with the NCAA and Ethics Coalition 326 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 4: and head coaches meetings, We're talking about a lot of 327 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:30,160 Speaker 4: issues that are affecting our game and how can we 328 00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 4: as coaches do what we need to do to help 329 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:33,960 Speaker 4: change those. 330 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 1: Okay, you just walked right in perfectly, coach, and I 331 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 1: appreciate it to one of the things that I thought 332 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: you would be an excellent resource to discuss, and that 333 00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 1: is just and I don't think it's necessarily always a 334 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 1: bad thing, but the reality is that there are these 335 00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 1: wins of change that are sweeping through college basketball. Between 336 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:57,040 Speaker 1: the portal and when the portal should open, the NIL money, 337 00:15:57,160 --> 00:15:59,280 Speaker 1: you know, whether or not that should be governed or capped, 338 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:01,920 Speaker 1: I mean all kinds of things that are going on. 339 00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:05,720 Speaker 1: From your perspective, what would you say is the biggest 340 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,000 Speaker 1: challenge facing college basketball today? 341 00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:14,160 Speaker 4: I think the biggest challenge that we have is and 342 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:19,080 Speaker 4: this has been not just today but throughout college basketball. 343 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 4: There's a there's a lot of bad actors that are 344 00:16:22,720 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 4: still involved in it that are driving a lot of 345 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 4: the issues, right, maybe driving a lot of the transfers 346 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,920 Speaker 4: or driving a lot of the nil issues that we're 347 00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:38,880 Speaker 4: trying to eliminate. But it's probably never going to happen 348 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 4: because it you know, before all this happened, these guys 349 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:42,640 Speaker 4: were still involved. 350 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:45,520 Speaker 1: So you mean like intermediaries, right, like mercenaries that. 351 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:46,520 Speaker 2: Are in their mediais. 352 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:51,600 Speaker 4: Yes, yes, so they've always been there, but now they're 353 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:56,240 Speaker 4: they're wearing different name tags in what they're doing. So 354 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 4: how do we we help to do what we need 355 00:16:59,920 --> 00:17:02,080 Speaker 4: to do to take care of these guys and keep 356 00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:05,600 Speaker 4: the focus on the game, right, Like we changed the 357 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:09,520 Speaker 4: date of the transfer portal, and like, you know, I 358 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:13,000 Speaker 4: love the freedom that these guys have, But how about 359 00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:17,639 Speaker 4: celebrating the season that college basketball has had. This is 360 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:20,200 Speaker 4: gonna be one of the most one of the best 361 00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:23,560 Speaker 4: seasons from start to finish. That we've had in a 362 00:17:23,600 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 4: long time, a tremendous final four, four great teams, and 363 00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:30,439 Speaker 4: that championship is going to end on Monday, and all. 364 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 2: The talk is going to go to the chaos. 365 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 4: It's going to start on Tuesday instead of us celebrating 366 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:36,520 Speaker 4: what great season we just had. 367 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 1: Which of these four teams do you feel has the 368 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:40,000 Speaker 1: fewest flaws? 369 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 2: Wow? 370 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think, you know, and a lot of people 371 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 4: will probably say this. I think Yukon and Illinois are 372 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 4: really good, and I think that's going to be an 373 00:17:50,600 --> 00:17:55,159 Speaker 4: unbelievable game. I think the Michigan Arizona game is going 374 00:17:55,240 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 4: to be points galore because of the way they're going 375 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,120 Speaker 4: to attack each other, attack them, get to the free 376 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:06,680 Speaker 4: throw line. I just think with you know, Michigan size 377 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:12,200 Speaker 4: and depth, the teamwork that they play with, you know, 378 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 4: I think they are the team that probably has the 379 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:16,439 Speaker 4: few as flaws. 380 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: The you know, in looking at and obviously coaching through 381 00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:23,760 Speaker 1: in the league you're in, you see you know you 382 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: didn't see, And I don't recall if you saw any 383 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: of these four directly you obviously, I'm assuming so Duke 384 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: and Carolina both over the course of the year. Carolina 385 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:33,600 Speaker 1: didn't get in. But the reason I asked, did you 386 00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 1: see and I should be looking at the schedule right now, 387 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:38,400 Speaker 1: did you have or did you see Caleb Wilson before 388 00:18:38,440 --> 00:18:38,920 Speaker 1: he was hurt? 389 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 2: We did, yes, yes, no, we played him. Uh. 390 00:18:44,040 --> 00:18:46,880 Speaker 4: He was tremendous, had an unbelievable year, had a great 391 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 4: game against US. And it was actually noteworthy because you know, 392 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:55,600 Speaker 4: I was on the staff of the the USA Basketball 393 00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 4: in the summer and he was one of the guys 394 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:01,920 Speaker 4: that had gotten cut. And after the game he shook 395 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 4: my hand and said, coach, thanks for motivating me. I 396 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 4: was like, hey, I don't think you needed that motivation. 397 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:11,119 Speaker 1: Is he a we were? The reason I asked, Micah 398 00:19:11,280 --> 00:19:14,160 Speaker 1: is just on a side note, you know, obviously, assuming 399 00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 1: that he goes in to the draft, we don't know 400 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 1: that yet, but he and Cam boose are both are 401 00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:22,240 Speaker 1: players that would be in the mix for Indiana should 402 00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:24,119 Speaker 1: hold onto one of its top four picks. And I 403 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:25,920 Speaker 1: think we have a pretty good idea of what kind 404 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 1: of player Cam Boozer is. There seems to be more 405 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,399 Speaker 1: enigma around Caleb Wilson because of the injury. Is he 406 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 1: a down low force player or a more of a wing, 407 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: you know, kind of the three D guard guy. Which 408 00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 1: way do you see him? 409 00:19:40,119 --> 00:19:42,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, he's a little mix of both. 410 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:48,320 Speaker 4: You know, didn't shoot a lot of threes, didn't didn't 411 00:19:48,320 --> 00:19:51,040 Speaker 4: shoot a ton of threes. You know, made some, but 412 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:54,040 Speaker 4: wasn't a high volume guy. Didn't shoot a great percentage. 413 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:58,919 Speaker 4: Kind of happened some with freshmen. But he faces the 414 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:02,400 Speaker 4: basket a lot, so you know, whether that was through 415 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 4: a post up near the block, off the block, out 416 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,959 Speaker 4: near the three point line. He handles the ball. He's 417 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:13,600 Speaker 4: very fast and electric with his athleticism, you know, finishing 418 00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 4: way above the rim. But he can score with his 419 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 4: back to the basket. He's a good passer. He and 420 00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 4: Henry Vassar played a lot of high low together. So 421 00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,080 Speaker 4: I think the NBA game is going to sue him 422 00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 4: because of his speed, his ability to handle the ball 423 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:31,440 Speaker 4: and pass. He'll have more space to play with as 424 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 4: well at the next level. 425 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:35,400 Speaker 1: Michael Shrewsbury is my guest, the head basketball coach at 426 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: Notre Dame. Coach. Obviously, I know this year and you 427 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,640 Speaker 1: had injury, there's no doubt about that, and the year 428 00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:44,480 Speaker 1: probably did not go as you are hoping or anticipated. 429 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:48,120 Speaker 1: Now that you've been through three seasons, at Notre Dame. 430 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 1: How do you assess just the way this year went 431 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: and where your program kind of goes from here. 432 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, obviously we were disappointed in how we 433 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:02,080 Speaker 4: finished this season. So we're looking forward to getting back 434 00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:04,720 Speaker 4: and getting going again. And you know, injuries were a 435 00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:07,679 Speaker 4: huge part of it. You know that that's part of 436 00:21:08,359 --> 00:21:12,160 Speaker 4: college basketball right now is being able to build depth. 437 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:15,840 Speaker 4: I think some of the seams that you see that 438 00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 4: are able to use either transfer port or nil to 439 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:23,120 Speaker 4: a certain level, it's to build their depth to withstand 440 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 4: some of those injuries that they have because they have 441 00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:30,679 Speaker 4: a lot of power behind it still. So, uh, you know, 442 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 4: you've got to have good fortunes. You've got to be 443 00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:34,919 Speaker 4: able to continue. 444 00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 2: To play the game the right way. 445 00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:39,359 Speaker 4: So that's something for us as we continue to move forward. 446 00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:42,119 Speaker 4: You know, we're chomping at the bit to be better 447 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:44,800 Speaker 4: and get better and that's something that you know, the 448 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:49,440 Speaker 4: Notre Dame fans deserve, and that's something that every single day, 449 00:21:49,520 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 4: that's what I'm pushing towards. And you know, we're hoping 450 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:54,600 Speaker 4: that next year is going to be our best year yet. 451 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:58,560 Speaker 1: Were you surprised or could you kind of illuminate us 452 00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 1: on the process of Jalen Harrold is excuse me, Jalen 453 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:05,919 Speaker 1: Harrelson going into the transfer portal and just maybe the 454 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 1: conversations that did or did not take place with that 455 00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 1: or what your anticipation is with it. 456 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:14,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think at this time in college basketball, you're 457 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:19,480 Speaker 4: not really surprised with anybody that makes a decision to 458 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:23,919 Speaker 4: stay or go, and especially go or like like going, 459 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:29,160 Speaker 4: leaving is in vogue right now. If you know, you look, 460 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:31,480 Speaker 4: you know, we get we get the tweets every. 461 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,720 Speaker 2: Day, so you're almost immune to it. 462 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:39,160 Speaker 4: Of you know that someone is leaving, it's not a surprise, 463 00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:42,200 Speaker 4: and you know you see great players across the country 464 00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 4: that are going to enter you know into that like 465 00:22:45,160 --> 00:22:47,520 Speaker 4: you know, for for as a coach, you know it's 466 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 4: it's disappointing because you put the time into it and 467 00:22:50,560 --> 00:22:51,879 Speaker 4: you want to see it through and you want to 468 00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 4: keep developing these kids. But you know, you want what's 469 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:56,679 Speaker 4: best for them at the end of the day, and 470 00:22:56,720 --> 00:23:00,440 Speaker 4: if that's what they feel is best for them, then 471 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 4: you let them move forward and keep going towards their 472 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,640 Speaker 4: career and then you pivot to what's next in your 473 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:09,480 Speaker 4: program and wish them all the best, and you know, 474 00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:12,960 Speaker 4: I love coaching it. Jalen was a great kid, somebody 475 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,480 Speaker 4: that we enjoyed being around. I think he's got a 476 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 4: bright future, and I thought he had a really great 477 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:19,639 Speaker 4: year for us. I thought he was gonna have an 478 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:23,520 Speaker 4: even better year next year, but unfortunately it just won't 479 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:24,399 Speaker 4: be here for us. 480 00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:26,879 Speaker 1: So you think definitively that means because there are some 481 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: coaches that I don't know if you have this line 482 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:30,480 Speaker 1: of it of hey, if you throw your name in 483 00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:33,360 Speaker 1: the portal, I understand it, but there's no coming back 484 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:35,520 Speaker 1: from that. Is that a fair statement. 485 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:39,639 Speaker 4: For the most part, with everybody right that that's usually 486 00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:42,399 Speaker 4: how it is because nobody's really testing, right. It's not 487 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:47,360 Speaker 4: the not the NBA draft, where you know people might 488 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 4: put it in their statement of you know, I'm open 489 00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:54,600 Speaker 4: to coming back, but that pretty rarely happens. Once these 490 00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,879 Speaker 4: kids go into the portal, they pretty much know, you know, 491 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:00,960 Speaker 4: that they're not coming back. Some times they may even 492 00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:04,159 Speaker 4: know where that next destination is before the portal was 493 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:09,320 Speaker 4: even open. So you know that that stances is pretty 494 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,760 Speaker 4: well known on both sides that you know once you 495 00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:16,600 Speaker 4: go that usually a decision has been made. 496 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 1: Did you have discussion with them or was it one 497 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 1: of those where you got the Twitter alert like the 498 00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:21,120 Speaker 1: rest of us. 499 00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 4: No, No, these these conversations that happened, you know, between 500 00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:34,440 Speaker 4: you know us, our staff, Jalen, his family, our general manager, whatever. 501 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:37,440 Speaker 2: So, uh, we had discussions about it. We had talked 502 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:37,879 Speaker 2: about it. 503 00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:41,000 Speaker 4: I think every coach gets a chance, you know, at 504 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,600 Speaker 4: the end of the year to you know, kind of 505 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,959 Speaker 4: say their piece and talk about it and people make decisions. 506 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 2: So it wasn't a surprise. 507 00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,280 Speaker 4: That that, you know, when I saw it on Twitter yesterday, 508 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:53,879 Speaker 4: it was it was not a new development. 509 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,960 Speaker 1: You know. I'm curious of this. Michael Shrewsbury's my guest, 510 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,120 Speaker 1: and I appreciate the time and the candor coach. I 511 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 1: from a coach from an outside perspective, what fascinates me 512 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 1: is where we are headed in terms of do you 513 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 1: build a roster by going portal players first and then 514 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,360 Speaker 1: complimenting it with freshman Do you build a roster by 515 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 1: trying to get as many homegrown guys that you're maintaining 516 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,400 Speaker 1: from year to the next and accentuating it with portal 517 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:26,119 Speaker 1: or are we entering a world where it literally is 518 00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:28,800 Speaker 1: going to be roster rebuild every single year for every 519 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:31,919 Speaker 1: program and just the finding the balance of that, what 520 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:33,479 Speaker 1: is your approach to that? 521 00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 4: You know is as you go through it now and 522 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,880 Speaker 4: the more years you get into it, I think it's 523 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:44,560 Speaker 4: pretty much going to look like a portal first thing 524 00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:49,600 Speaker 4: for everybody. Very rare is the days of the you 525 00:25:49,680 --> 00:25:51,760 Speaker 4: know that we just saw with the Braden Smith, the 526 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:56,200 Speaker 4: Fletcher Lawyer, the Trey Kaufman Wren, the Alex Caravan, those 527 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:58,080 Speaker 4: guys that have stayed at one. 528 00:25:57,920 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 2: Place for four years. 529 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,440 Speaker 4: Those guys are going to be few and far between, 530 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 4: and I think you know, who you can keep is 531 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,240 Speaker 4: really important, and there are going to be some guys 532 00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:12,439 Speaker 4: like that that can continue to push your culture forward 533 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 4: of what you want your program to be. But this 534 00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:20,000 Speaker 4: day and age of college and the fans getting a 535 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:23,760 Speaker 4: chance to know these guys and know who you know, 536 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:25,920 Speaker 4: see this guy come in and now you're going to 537 00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:29,320 Speaker 4: see him at senior Day. Now, senior Day is gonna 538 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:32,040 Speaker 4: be probably a one year proposition with a lot of 539 00:26:32,080 --> 00:26:35,919 Speaker 4: these kids, which is which is sad, and it's it's 540 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:39,119 Speaker 4: it's different from a lot of us coaches. You know 541 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 4: where we started, But you also have to adapt to 542 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:46,720 Speaker 4: what's happening, and this is the way of college right now, 543 00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 4: so you have to adapt and move with it. 544 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,000 Speaker 1: What's a realistic number on what it would cost? And 545 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 1: that sounds so bizarre to say, right, but what it 546 00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: would cost a field a team for a year in 547 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 1: I own money? What's a realistic number if you if 548 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:04,480 Speaker 1: you looked at it. And I'm not even gonna say 549 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:06,040 Speaker 1: for Notre Dame, right, I'm not going to put you 550 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 1: in that position. But if you were under the got 551 00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:12,240 Speaker 1: the assumption and a power for conference to be a 552 00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,200 Speaker 1: competitive team at realistically you would like to have how 553 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:16,880 Speaker 1: much to spend in nil? 554 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:18,640 Speaker 2: Yeah? 555 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:21,720 Speaker 4: And you know this is going to go a couple 556 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:25,720 Speaker 4: different ways. But I was I was talking to a reporter, 557 00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:31,159 Speaker 4: you know, last week, and he talked about the you know, 558 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,639 Speaker 4: when this house settlement came through and there was a 559 00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:39,000 Speaker 4: twenty point five million dollar rev share or that the 560 00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,879 Speaker 4: schools were able to do. And a couple of years ago, 561 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,520 Speaker 4: Ohio State won the football championship and everybody said they 562 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 4: had a twenty two million dollar roster. You know, if 563 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 4: Hoio State had a twenty two million dollar roster next year, 564 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,359 Speaker 4: they could be one of the last teams in the 565 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 4: big pit. So you see how quickly that's changed, that 566 00:28:00,000 --> 00:28:04,640 Speaker 4: bsketball is is getting there and catching up really quickly. 567 00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:05,760 Speaker 2: With those numbers. 568 00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:09,560 Speaker 4: And I saw something that somebody put out the other 569 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:13,240 Speaker 4: day and and all of these are yeah, some coaches 570 00:28:13,280 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 4: say stuff and it's not exactly true. Yeah, estimates, But 571 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,600 Speaker 4: you know, somebody was saying, if you don't have a 572 00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 4: ten to twelve million dollar roster, you know you're you're 573 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 4: going to be behind. 574 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:28,600 Speaker 2: And I think Mick Cronin said it best. 575 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,920 Speaker 4: It's about the haves and the have nots right now, 576 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:34,840 Speaker 4: and if you're one of the haves, you're in a 577 00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:37,679 Speaker 4: pretty good position. If you're one of the have nots 578 00:28:37,760 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 4: right now, you're a feeder program for the people that 579 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:42,880 Speaker 4: do have the resources. 580 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:47,080 Speaker 1: Which one do you feel you are currently? 581 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:52,080 Speaker 4: Yep, uh, you know what, we we have a great situation. 582 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:54,120 Speaker 4: I love no her name, and we're going to be 583 00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 4: the best that we can be. But uh, I believe 584 00:28:57,120 --> 00:28:57,800 Speaker 4: we're one of the have. 585 00:28:57,920 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 2: Nots, right. 586 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 4: But it's that that goes in a long way. There's 587 00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,640 Speaker 4: some really good programs that are in the top twenty 588 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,720 Speaker 4: five that are also in that way. I think it's 589 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:12,239 Speaker 4: you know, it's moving to a model where there's you know, 590 00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:18,160 Speaker 4: ten to twelve to fifteen schools that you know are 591 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 4: doing everything they need to do. Now, part of that 592 00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 4: is you still have You still have to coach your team, right, 593 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:25,720 Speaker 4: you still have. 594 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,440 Speaker 2: To have luck. You still have to build a roster 595 00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 2: the right way. 596 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,400 Speaker 1: You got to stay healthy too, right, you. 597 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:32,240 Speaker 2: Got to stay healthy. 598 00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:32,480 Speaker 1: Right. 599 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 2: All these things give you a better advantage. 600 00:29:34,560 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 4: But it doesn't mean you're going to win the national championship, right, 601 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 4: And it doesn't mean you're going to finish last in 602 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:40,680 Speaker 4: your conference. 603 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 2: It just gives you a better chance to be one 604 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:44,240 Speaker 2: or the other. 605 00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:47,000 Speaker 1: I think coach would be donor fatigue. Also. I mean, 606 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 1: it's great if you want to go out and spend 607 00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: twelve million and get that money, but if you're going 608 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 1: back to the same people over and over saying, hey, 609 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,000 Speaker 1: you know what the last point guard, I know he left, 610 00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 1: but this guy though, now we really got you know, eventually, 611 00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 1: it's it's going to be cyclical, right, where people go 612 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:02,680 Speaker 1: in waves of when they're able to do it, except 613 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 1: for those that have like the big pocket guys. In 614 00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:08,080 Speaker 1: my opinion, yeah. 615 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:12,360 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think it's driven by excitement, right, Like if 616 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,479 Speaker 4: you are showing that excitement if they have something. If 617 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:18,560 Speaker 4: you're one of the four teams that are playing here 618 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:21,720 Speaker 4: today because we're all pushing to do this. 619 00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 2: If you're one of the four teams that. 620 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:26,320 Speaker 4: Has that, you have that excitement and those fans and 621 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:31,240 Speaker 4: that those big donor bases, they wanted to continue to 622 00:30:31,280 --> 00:30:34,200 Speaker 4: come here. They want to continue to help get you there. 623 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:40,080 Speaker 4: But if there's no excitement there, it's hard, and you 624 00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 4: know where does it end eventually for some of these 625 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,000 Speaker 4: people that are, you know, writing big checks to help you. 626 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:49,760 Speaker 1: What are your stops along the way? Coach? I believe 627 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:52,080 Speaker 1: you you had Ronald Norid as a player. I believe 628 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:54,560 Speaker 1: when you were assistant at Butler, but certainly you're familiar 629 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,040 Speaker 1: with that program. Your overall thoughts on the hire of 630 00:30:57,120 --> 00:30:59,840 Speaker 1: Ronald Norid now to lead the Butler program? 631 00:31:00,520 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 4: You know, he Ronald's one of my favorite guys that 632 00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 4: I've ever coached, and I'm so happy for he and 633 00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:12,720 Speaker 4: Butler and Grant that he's gonna be the head coach 634 00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:15,560 Speaker 4: there and he's gonna do a great job. Ron ron 635 00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 4: has such a big personality that the fans are gonna 636 00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:21,760 Speaker 4: love him, His players are going to love him, and 637 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:26,000 Speaker 4: you know, his teams are gonna play really tough, gritty, 638 00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:30,760 Speaker 4: solid team basketball. And you know, he's a fundamental guy. 639 00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 4: He's played for great coaches, He's worked for great coaches. 640 00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 4: He's gonna play a modern system, you know his time 641 00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:41,160 Speaker 4: in the NBA with the Pacers, with the Atlanta Hawks. 642 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,240 Speaker 4: He's going to play a system that kids are gonna 643 00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 4: love and want to play in. So I'm excited for 644 00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:48,600 Speaker 4: him and I'm excited to see what he. 645 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:49,760 Speaker 2: Can do with the Butler program. 646 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:51,280 Speaker 1: Did you inquire about that job? 647 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:56,720 Speaker 4: You know, no, I'd love everything about this place, man, 648 00:31:57,240 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 4: But I also love the challenge that. You know, things 649 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 4: haven't gone great for us here at Notre Dame in 650 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 4: the last three years, but you know, I haven't given up. 651 00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 2: I'm fired up. 652 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 4: Like I said to let's keep going, let's keep building, 653 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,320 Speaker 4: let's keep growing because I want year four to be 654 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:18,480 Speaker 4: the best one we've had and then build from there. 655 00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:22,040 Speaker 1: So lastly, you got committee meetings and things like that, 656 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: and it's very obvious why you would be on committee's 657 00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:26,360 Speaker 1: coach and why you would you know, because you represent 658 00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 1: what's right about college basketball and the vision of it. 659 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,280 Speaker 1: What does the weekend look like for you or for 660 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:33,880 Speaker 1: most coaches when you come in here, other than walking 661 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: around and just to you know, saying you good coach. 662 00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:38,840 Speaker 1: What what all goes into the week? Yeah? 663 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,440 Speaker 4: Once, you know, once we're kind of finished with these like, 664 00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,320 Speaker 4: you know, I've kind of completed my duties. Now it's 665 00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:49,440 Speaker 4: about getting a chance to uh see some guys, right, 666 00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:51,240 Speaker 4: see some some former players. 667 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 2: There's a lot of players, Like. 668 00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 4: We talked about the Butler program and you know, I 669 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,640 Speaker 4: just stood here a few minutes before we got on 670 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,840 Speaker 4: the phone with Matthew Graves, Willie Veasley, On van Zant, 671 00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:05,160 Speaker 4: Mike Green that are all coaching college basketball. Guys like 672 00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,800 Speaker 4: DJ Bird or you know, guys like that that that 673 00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 4: coach at Purdue. 674 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 2: So guys you don't get a chance to see. 675 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,560 Speaker 4: Throughout the year, we're all busy with their own programs. Uh, 676 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:19,440 Speaker 4: really connecting with these guys. Spending time with Coach Painter 677 00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:22,320 Speaker 4: last night, spending time with some of the guys from 678 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:22,800 Speaker 4: you know. 679 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:24,000 Speaker 2: Our Penn State staff. 680 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 4: So reconnecting with guys, talking about different things, you know, 681 00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:32,520 Speaker 4: gaining as much information as you can on players that 682 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:37,280 Speaker 4: you could be recruiting next week, so that socialization, being 683 00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:40,440 Speaker 4: able to see guys, talk to guys spend time with 684 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 4: the meat dinner, and then everybody kind of get together 685 00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:47,040 Speaker 4: and watch the games, and you know, the greatest host 686 00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:48,280 Speaker 4: city that we have. 687 00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:49,880 Speaker 2: For the final four. 688 00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 1: Coach, I appreciate the time as always and certainly wish 689 00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:56,120 Speaker 1: you the best of luck up at Notre Dame and 690 00:33:56,160 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 1: also just enjoying everything that comes with this particular Weekendreciate 691 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 1: having you back on in your hometown here. Yeah, thank you, guys, 692 00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:07,320 Speaker 1: appreciate it. Michael Shrewsbury joining us from Notre Dame. Really 693 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:09,880 Speaker 1: really interesting stuff, especially about the NIL and the portal 694 00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:13,400 Speaker 1: and Harrelson and all of it. Really really good conversation. 695 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:14,279 Speaker 1: Much appreciated.