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Speaker 1: Stephen Holder, who was at the Pacer game last night,

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Speaker 1: joining now on the Java House Peel and Poor guest line.

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Speaker 1: Java House dot com is the website. Jake twenty five

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Speaker 1: is the discount code for twenty five percent off. You

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Speaker 1: can always type in to the search bar the name

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Speaker 1: of this radio station the fan, and you will see

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Speaker 1: the bundle that includes Columbian House Coffee or Columbian Coffee,

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Speaker 1: I should say, from Java House, as well as Wrangler

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Speaker 1: Energy and their Liquid Science hydration beverage. But they've got

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Speaker 1: all kinds of the Peel and Poor beverages that are

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Speaker 1: awesome and instant at Java House dot com. Steven, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to begin before we get to colts with Miami

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Speaker 1: Indiana breakdown.

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Speaker 2: Is that fair? Yeah? Let's go.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So you are a graduate of the University of Miami.

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Speaker 1: You obviously know football as a football writer for ESPN

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Speaker 1: dot Com. I would assume that you actively follow the

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Speaker 1: Hurricanes probably each game this season.

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Speaker 2: Fair assessment, I have.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Okay, So for this particular matchup, let's begin with this.

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Speaker 1: Miami's strength or the thing that Miami does and in

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Speaker 1: particular in the playoffs better than other teams that has

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Speaker 1: put them to this point would be.

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Speaker 3: What So I think this showed up more than anything

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Speaker 3: in the Ohio State game. If anybody watched that game,

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Speaker 3: you will probably recall that Miami just they just dominated offensively,

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Speaker 3: in particular at the line of scrimmage. They have this

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Speaker 3: power run game that I think is their biggest potential

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Speaker 3: edge against Indiana because Indiana doesn't have weaknesses. And that's

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Speaker 3: the problem with playing them, right, how do you attack

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Speaker 3: this team that does everything so well or at least.

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Speaker 2: At a decent level.

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Speaker 3: You know, I don't know that they do anything poorly

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Speaker 3: where you would say, all right, well that's where we

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Speaker 3: got them. So but I do think Miami has, you know,

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Speaker 3: an extremely formidable off intive line. They have very physical

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Speaker 3: running backs, and they can play a game that no

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Speaker 3: one in college really plays anymore. You know, college football

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Speaker 3: is a spread offense, you know, playing above the rim

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Speaker 3: sort of game now. And they play a very or

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Speaker 3: a can at times play a very old school brand

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Speaker 3: of football offensively that has been very effective, and I

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Speaker 3: think that's their go to right here.

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Speaker 1: Do you in the time that you know Mario Cristobal,

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Speaker 1: the head coach at Miami, is is this style that

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Speaker 1: you're talking about from Miami aggression in the trenches, right,

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Speaker 1: like punch you in the mouth kind of play. Has

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Speaker 1: that been Crystal Ball's mo o? Or is he adjusting

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Speaker 1: to the personnel that he has been able to acquire.

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Speaker 2: So he likes this.

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Speaker 3: I really do think that he prefers to play this style.

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Speaker 3: In fact, it's interesting because I think they almost leaned

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Speaker 3: too much into it earlier in the season, and I

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Speaker 3: think it impacted them in those couple of losses they had,

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Speaker 3: at least the SMU game in particular, because I thought

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Speaker 3: they needed to open things up more offensively, right, and

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Speaker 3: to be more aggressive offensively because they do have makers

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Speaker 3: on the outside as well. You know, none more well

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Speaker 3: known than than Malachai Tony, the superb freshman wide receiver,

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Speaker 3: and I actually thought they needed to actually utilize that more,

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Speaker 3: and so down the stretch when you saw Miami scoring

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Speaker 3: thirty five to forty points in those games at the

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Speaker 3: end of the season, they were doing that. They were

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Speaker 3: throwing the ball down the field more, throwing it more

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Speaker 3: generally in general, and I thought that was good. But

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Speaker 3: I think when you get to the playoffs and depending

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Speaker 3: on your matchups and who you're playing and what your

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Speaker 3: strengths and weaknesses are. This has I'll come back full

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Speaker 3: circle and this plays right into Mario Crystal Ball's hands.

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Speaker 3: I mean he is he is a former offensive lineman.

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Speaker 3: He played with those teams back in the day, the

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Speaker 3: Jimmy Johnson teams that you know, while we might think

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Speaker 3: of Michael Irvin and quarterbacks and things like that, I mean,

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Speaker 3: they were a physical, physical football team, and that's his

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Speaker 3: brand of ball. So I love it. It's very old

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Speaker 3: school and I don't mind it at all.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Miami's area of susceptibility or vulnerability would be ware.

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Speaker 3: Playing stupid. They make a lot of mistakes, or at

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Speaker 3: least they they can. They they sometimes get out of character,

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Speaker 3: and they will they will just you know, do undisciplined things.

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Speaker 3: They will they will have you know, sort of late

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Speaker 3: hits or you know, just undisciplined stuff. And it's not

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Speaker 3: it's not an epidemic or anything. It's not the nineteen

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Speaker 3: nineties game. You know who did that, who did that repeatedly?

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Speaker 3: But they do have they do have to be on

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Speaker 3: guard for that because I just think Indiana is the

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Speaker 3: kind of team you do that and you're serving the

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Speaker 3: game up on a platter for them. So I just

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Speaker 3: think they have to be extremely disciplined, mistake free, and

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Speaker 3: you just got to play clean. You just got to

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Speaker 3: And this ties back into the first point, right of

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Speaker 3: that power football and power run games that they have.

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Speaker 3: I think the benefit of that, if they can find

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Speaker 3: success doing it, is that you keep the ball away

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Speaker 3: from freaking Mendoza because you don't want that guy with

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Speaker 3: the ball in his hands. And so that that also

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Speaker 3: ties into this other point of playing discipline and not

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Speaker 3: getting behind the sticks offensively long down the distance. If

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Speaker 3: you do that, which they did at times in the

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Speaker 3: old Miss game, they got in long down the distance

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Speaker 3: situations and then they can't necessarily rely on that big,

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Speaker 3: heavy run game. Then you have to sit back and

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Speaker 3: throw the ball and hold the ball in the pocket

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Speaker 3: to throw down the field, and you open yourself up

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Speaker 3: to that defense. So anyway, that's that's kind of where

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Speaker 3: I think I would look at Miami and say, like,

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Speaker 3: if they.

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Speaker 2: Do that, they lose.

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Speaker 1: Steven Holder is my guest ESPN dot com of course

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Speaker 1: where you read his work. He is on the Java

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Speaker 1: House Peel and P guest line. Steve and I I

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Speaker 1: know you had told me. You're going to the game, correct.

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Speaker 2: I am? I am? Sokay, I don't.

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Speaker 3: I don't put on my fan hat very often, but

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Speaker 3: this is one of those rare times.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Now, let me ask you this because because we're

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Speaker 1: gonna play a little game here, we're gonna I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: you like money, right, you're a fan of money.

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Speaker 3: It's it's it's okay, yeah, okay, mommy's money is a

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Speaker 3: good thing.

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Speaker 1: So I'm gonna make you some money here. Okay, you

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Speaker 1: have how you're going with how many buddies? How many people?

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Speaker 2: Uh? With two others?

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Speaker 1: So three of you total, and you're sitting in roughly

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Speaker 1: what the one levels? The three levels? Where are we

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Speaker 1: sitting here?

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Speaker 3: We are not in the chief seats. We're in the

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Speaker 3: good seats. We you know, it helps to know people.

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Speaker 3: I'll just leave it at that. We're in the I

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Speaker 3: think we're down there in the corner on the first level,

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Speaker 3: end zone, sort of in the corner there right by

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Speaker 3: the tunnels.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so I'm looking right here. Tickets right now

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Speaker 1: in that section. Okay, you could sell your tickets right now.

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Speaker 1: If you're in section one twenty nine, they're going for

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Speaker 1: fifty five hundred apiece. If you're in section one twenty

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Speaker 1: two on the other side of the tunnels, you're looking

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Speaker 1: at sixty four hundred. So based on that, you're looking

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Speaker 1: at nineteen two hundred bucks to sell your three tickets.

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Speaker 1: I mean, what the hell, why would you? Why not sell?

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Speaker 2: Sell it?

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Speaker 1: Stop at Denny's, get something to eat, drive home, and

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Speaker 1: then count your cash.

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Speaker 2: Buddy.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I mean, you're talking about paying the mortgage

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Speaker 3: for damn the other year, right right, That's that sounds

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Speaker 3: pretty appealing. Now when you put it that way, I

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Speaker 3: mean it's inspicated. I'll leave it at that way. It's

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Speaker 3: definitely definitely make you make good points. Points were definitely made.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I'll put it to you this way. Truth seerum

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Speaker 1: here you ready, you're walking in. This happened to Buddy

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Speaker 1: Mine in the NBA Finals in two thousand Pacers Lakers.

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Speaker 1: Buddy of Mine's walking in. This is twenty five years ago,

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Speaker 1: mind you. Okay, he and his dad are walking in.

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Speaker 1: A guy stops him right there and goes and he

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Speaker 1: was from LA and says, I've got ten grand cash

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Speaker 1: right now, and I will pay you for your two

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Speaker 1: tickets right here. That's back when you have paper tickets

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Speaker 1: and everything else.

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Speaker 2: Oh okay, this is back in the ticket scalp for days. Correct.

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Speaker 1: So you're walking in and a guy stops you and

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Speaker 1: says you got three tickets and you go yeah, and

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Speaker 1: he says, listen, I got my ticket Master app right

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Speaker 1: here or whatever you know app, so you can transfer

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Speaker 1: me the tickets from your phone to my phone right now.

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Speaker 1: And I've got sitting right here eighteen in cash in

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Speaker 1: my pocket.

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Speaker 2: Meat, Do you do it?

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Speaker 3: I think I lean toward doing it. My friends would

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Speaker 3: have to make their own decision. I decide for my ticket,

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Speaker 3: would have to decide on theirs, since.

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Speaker 2: I'm you know, it's pretty tempting.

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Speaker 3: Dated tickets, so they'll have to they'll have to decide.

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Speaker 1: I mean it's like playing roulette, though, because if your

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Speaker 1: team wins and you're not there, you'd be like, oh man,

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Speaker 1: I would have been given anything to be in that stadium.

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Speaker 2: You know what I mean? Right?

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Speaker 4: Right?

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Speaker 2: No, I get it. It's funny because I know this

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Speaker 2: is awful to say, right, this is awful to say.

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Speaker 3: I I think when you do when you're in our

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Speaker 3: line of work, and you know this as well as

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Speaker 3: I do. Right when you're in our lineup work, and

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Speaker 3: we had this conversation I think at the Pacers game

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Speaker 3: last night, right, like we we so rarely get excited

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Speaker 3: about going to a game.

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Speaker 2: Don't get me wrong. I love my job, like I.

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Speaker 3: Really love my job, Okay, Like I am lucky as hell.

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Speaker 2: To do what I do.

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Speaker 3: However, when I roll up to Lucasol Stadium on Sunday,

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Speaker 3: I'm not like bouncing off the walls, like I can't

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Speaker 3: wait for this game because I'm going to work.

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Speaker 2: Man, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 3: Like, right, and I work hard and I and I

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Speaker 3: care about what I do and I and I'm glad

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Speaker 3: that the fans care a lot, because if they didn't care,

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Speaker 3: then what the hell the purpose do I serve?

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Speaker 2: Right? But it is a very interesting thing.

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Speaker 3: So, like I know I have friends who would be like,

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Speaker 3: you're crazy, are you on crack?

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Speaker 2: You would do that? And I'm like, whoa, hear me out?

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Speaker 3: And I just you know, I can't. I guess I

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Speaker 3: can't relate because I have been so divorced from the

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Speaker 3: emotions of caring about a game.

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Speaker 1: Well, which is why you know, Steven looks And it's

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Speaker 1: like I said last year when the Pacers went to

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Speaker 1: the finals. It has been so long, you know, we yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I and I say this with all respect to

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Speaker 1: the people listening to the show. You know, you do

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Speaker 1: get a little bit cynical. And I guess the better

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Speaker 1: way of saying it is that sports becomes a little

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Speaker 1: more antiseptic when you do it, for when you cover

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Speaker 1: it for a living, because it does, it does mute

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Speaker 1: your fandom. And so that's why I will always be

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Speaker 1: so grateful for that Pacers run, because it brought out

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Speaker 1: for me a euphoria of sport that I had not

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Speaker 1: allowed myself to enjoy for a long time. And it

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Speaker 1: was nice to go back to.

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Speaker 2: I love.

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Speaker 3: That's that's a great way of putting it. It does

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Speaker 3: become antiseptic. And I would say this the last couple,

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Speaker 3: the last couple of Miami games, I've watched them on TV.

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Speaker 3: Some of these same friends I'm going with, they actually

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Speaker 3: attended the last couple of rounds, the Cotton Bowl and

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Speaker 3: Fiesta Bowl, and I was I mean, I was invited,

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Speaker 3: but I you know, the Colts being the Colts, I

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Speaker 3: didn't know what was going to happen, and you know whatever,

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Speaker 3: oh you knew, I did know I actually did know.

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Speaker 3: I knew they weren't getting fired, but I also was like,

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Speaker 3: if there's a one percent chance and I'm not around,

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Speaker 3: that's gonna be my ass, right. So anyhow, I resisted

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Speaker 3: the urge and I didn't go, and I watched on

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Speaker 3: TV on the edge of my seat, and I hated

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Speaker 3: myself for not being there. You know, so I get

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Speaker 3: what you're saying. You know, this is kind of the

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Speaker 3: same feelings with the Pacers that you had, and I

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Speaker 3: am excited, like I'm really looking forward to it. And

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Speaker 3: there's also the element of like seeing your college friends

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Speaker 3: and college college. You know, your college team doing something

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Speaker 3: is different than your favorite pro team, you know what

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Speaker 3: I mean. And that's kind of how I see this.

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Speaker 3: Last thing I'd say is that, you know, I think

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Speaker 3: it was back in the two thousand and one they

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Speaker 3: win the championship. I didn't really enjoy that as a

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Speaker 3: fan because I was actually covering Miami in two thousand

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Speaker 3: and one. I was at the Rose Bowl and covered

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Speaker 3: that game as a reporter.

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Speaker 2: Half the fan.

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Speaker 3: Base hated me because you know, when you'd write a

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Speaker 3: negative story, you know you're not their favorite person in

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Speaker 3: the world. There was a message board back in the day.

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Speaker 3: This is hilarious. There was a back when college message

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Speaker 3: boards were a big thing. There was someone on a

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Speaker 3: Miami message board that started a rumor that I went

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Speaker 3: to Florida State, which only tells me that I was

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Speaker 3: really good at my job.

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Speaker 2: That was so good. Yeah, it's this team. Impartially, it's

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Speaker 2: they couldn't believe I went there.

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Speaker 1: It's like coaching a football team to such precision that

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Speaker 1: people think that you hacked into an iCloud right, kind

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Speaker 1: of the same thing.

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Speaker 2: I guess. Okay, so yeah, anywow.

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Speaker 1: Steven, let's switch gears to the NFL playoffs. Okay, the

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Speaker 1: games that we have seen, is there anything that we

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Speaker 1: can take away, because sometimes I think when like if

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Speaker 1: you're Chris Ballard or you're Shanstikeen and you're on the

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Speaker 1: sidelines and you're watching the games that are taking place,

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Speaker 1: is there anything that it kind of tipped the hand

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Speaker 1: to an area where you said, see that proves where

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Speaker 1: the Colts fell short, or that proves an area that

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Speaker 1: needs to be improved upon that perhaps even over the

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Speaker 1: course of the regular season, we didn't necessarily learn when

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Speaker 1: the style of play does turn up a wick a

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Speaker 1: bit in the playoffs. What is the area that was

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Speaker 1: exposed for Indianapolis that even more exemplifies it's need to

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Speaker 1: be addressed in the offseason.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean, I think it's on defense. I mean,

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Speaker 3: you got to get a stop when you need to

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Speaker 3: stop man. And you know, there's particularly when you get

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Speaker 3: into these these postseason games where you have elite quarterbacks

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Speaker 3: that you're dealing with all of that.

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Speaker 2: I just think, you know, when.

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Speaker 3: When you see you had the defensive breakdowns in these games,

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Speaker 3: they were very decisive. I mean I look at the

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Speaker 3: I don't know, maybe the Bears and Packers, for example,

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Speaker 3: the Packers, if they have Michael Parsons, I think they

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Speaker 3: win that game.

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Speaker 2: Right, I'm sorry, Yeah, I.

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Speaker 3: Think if the Packers have Michael Parsons, I think they

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Speaker 3: win that game. Because there was just in that fourth

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Speaker 3: quarter they just needed they just need like one stop,

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Speaker 3: you know what I mean, and they just couldn't get it.

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Speaker 3: They couldn't stop the bleeding.

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Speaker 5: Uh.

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Speaker 3: You've got to have a defense that can just get

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Speaker 3: off the field when all the chips are down. So

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Speaker 3: much has to happen offensively, you know, the quarter has

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Speaker 3: to be protected. You have to get just right the

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Speaker 3: just perfect connection with the receiver, the blocks, the blocking

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Speaker 3: scheme has to be perfect. I mean, so much has

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Speaker 3: to go right on offense for you to go down

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Speaker 3: and have a clutch winning touchdown drive or something. On defense,

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Speaker 3: sometimes you just got to make one play.

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Speaker 2: Man, you know, is that.

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Speaker 3: Can you make that third down or fourth down stop?

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Speaker 3: You do that, you win the game. It's over, you know,

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Speaker 3: in many of these cases. And I think if you

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Speaker 3: go back and look at the Colts down the stretch,

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Speaker 3: take a look at that that The Kansas City game

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Speaker 3: comes to mind. The Seattle game more than anything, I

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Speaker 3: think comes to mind those fourth quarters. All you needed

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Speaker 3: was one stop and you change your season. They're probably

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Speaker 3: in the playoffs that they get two stops, one in

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Speaker 3: the Kansas City game, one in the Seattle game. They're

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Speaker 3: in the freaking playoffs period. Now do they win in

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Speaker 3: the playoffs, I don't know, but I'm just saying, do

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Speaker 3: you see how that changes your outcomes?

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Speaker 2: Right? You've got to have a defense that you count on.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I want to know of these quarterbacks. Speaking of

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Speaker 1: defenses that need to get a stop, I'm going to

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Speaker 1: list of quarterbacks that are remaining in the postseason and

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Speaker 1: I want you to tell me which one you least

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Speaker 1: trust if the game's on the line and they got

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Speaker 1: to take you down the field.

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Speaker 2: You ready, all right?

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Speaker 1: Caleb Williams, Drake May, Matt Stafford, Brock Purty, Sam Darnold,

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Speaker 1: c J Stroud, Josh Allen, I'm missing one.

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Speaker 2: Who am I'm missing? Eddie helped me out? Uh did

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Speaker 2: you say AFC AFC remaining? I think what's happening? Did

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Speaker 2: you say bow Nicks? Bo Nix? Thank you? I keep

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Speaker 2: forgetting Denver. Okay, so there's your list.

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Speaker 1: Which of those quarterbacks do you least trust or do

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Speaker 1: you have the biggest question mark about least trust?

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Speaker 2: Hmm, this is tricky. I like them all to some degree.

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Speaker 2: IJ Stroud is. I don't know what's going on there.

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Speaker 3: I'm not loving SINJ Stroud right now, but I think

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Speaker 3: he has more track record built up though than maybe

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Speaker 3: bo Nicks, even though I know how that sounds. Right.

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Speaker 3: There's the number one seed they had. I think, you know,

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Speaker 3: a pretty productive offense all year. I'm not saying they

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Speaker 3: have a bad offense. All I'm saying is have we

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Speaker 3: seen bow Knicks go down the field and have to

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Speaker 3: to win a playoff? Game, right, I mean, that's that's

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Speaker 3: a different ask, I guess, is what I'm getting at.

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Speaker 3: You know, So we'll see. I don't know, but but

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Speaker 3: I want to see if he can do it. This

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Speaker 3: is gonna be a big test for him, and I'm

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Speaker 3: I'm interested to see him in it. But the Texans offensively,

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: They've got to they got to figure some things out.

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Speaker 1: But listen, because the way that defense is playing, Steven,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I know that that defense is playing at

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Speaker 1: an exceptionally high level.

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Speaker 6: I mean, that is a nasty championship defense. It's a

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Speaker 6: championship defense. I don't disagree with you. It may not matter.

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Speaker 6: You're right, it may not matter if you if you're

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Speaker 6: just asking me about the quarterback, then maybe it's a

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Speaker 6: different answer. But when you ask that question in the

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Speaker 6: context of that Houston defense, that is a championship defense.

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Speaker 6: Aaron rodg They put Aaron Rodgers out the pasture last night.

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Speaker 2: I really feel that way.

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Speaker 1: Why is San Francisco able to overcome injury and continue

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Speaker 1: to produce even with injuries at key areas all across

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Speaker 1: the board and teams like Indianapolis or not.

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Speaker 2: Okay, this is a great question.

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Speaker 3: Because this is this has been talked about a lot,

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Speaker 3: and I think there's a lot to the two one here.

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Speaker 3: So the first thing is they did survive the brock

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Speaker 3: thirty injury, which was multiple weeks.

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Speaker 2: They did survive that.

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Speaker 3: The difference I think with them is they had a

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Speaker 3: very formidable number two quarterback in Mac Jones, who was

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Speaker 3: a first round pick who has one games in the NFL,

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Speaker 3: and you coupled him with with a lot of playmakers

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Speaker 3: on offense and an excellent offensive coach. And it makes

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Speaker 3: sense why that works, right, They still had a highly

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Speaker 3: productive offense with mac Jones in the lineup. The Colts,

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Speaker 3: obviously they were missing their top two quarterbacks. So I

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Speaker 3: think that's an important distinction. Is not an excuse. But

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Speaker 3: if we're asking what's the difference, well, that's a huge difference, right.

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Speaker 3: That's one thing. The other thing is I just think

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Speaker 3: the forty nine ers are the exception to the rule. Normally,

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Speaker 3: any team, not just the Colts, teams that have that

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Speaker 3: level of injury in a given season, they do not

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Speaker 3: do what the forty nine ers have done. It's more

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Speaker 3: credit to the forty nine ers than I think.

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Speaker 2: It is a.

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Speaker 3: Reflection of other teams that didn't overcome their injuries. Generally speaking,

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Speaker 3: teams that lose all their best players, they suck. The

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Speaker 3: forty nine ers keep overcoming it. I think they are

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Speaker 3: the exception, and they are one of the great franchises

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Speaker 3: in the league right now.

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Speaker 2: Look at their consistency.

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Speaker 3: They have been in the mix for the Super Bowl

395
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Speaker 3: for the most part in the last six years to

396
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Speaker 3: some degree with a couple exceptions, but they've been in

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Speaker 3: the mix for most of the past six years, and

398
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Speaker 3: that is that's remarkable. And that's what different quarterbacks. That is,

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Speaker 3: you know, with with a transition with their offensive line

400
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Speaker 3: is you know some a lot of their offensive lines

401
00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:29,200
Speaker 3: changed all that, you know, So, uh, there's just there's good,

402
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Speaker 3: good coaching happening for sure. Kyle Shanahan is the elite

403
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Speaker 3: of the elite. They have drafted very well and they

404
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Speaker 3: they have just gotten the most out of that roster.

405
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Speaker 3: I think it's a credit to them. That's that's the

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Speaker 3: best I can tell you. They just did a great,

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Speaker 3: great job.

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Speaker 1: By the way, In conclusion, Steven, last night, I believe

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Speaker 1: I asked you a trivia question as it relates to

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Speaker 1: the Pro Football Hall of Fame, and then we got distracted,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know that I ever gave you the

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Speaker 1: answer to the question.

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Speaker 2: What was it again? I can't remember. Was this the

414
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Speaker 2: one about.

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Speaker 1: The no tell me again the only the only member

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Speaker 1: question of the Pro Football Hall of Fame. When you

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Speaker 1: go into the Pro Football Hall of Fame in the

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Speaker 1: shrine room, you've been to the shrine room there right

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Speaker 1: in Canton. I have, yes, and you know I have

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Speaker 1: been also to the I think they call it the

421
00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:21,240
Speaker 1: gallery in Cooperstown where the plaques are. And yeah, the

422
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Speaker 1: Cooperstown plaques to me were very underwhelming. I don't know why,

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Speaker 1: but I anticipated them being much bigger per player, and

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Speaker 1: they're not. It was surprising to me. But nonetheless, the

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Speaker 1: shrine room in Canton really is fabulous. I mean, you

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Speaker 1: go in and it's it's pretty all. It's almost like

427
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Speaker 1: you want to be quiet when you're in there. It's

428
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Speaker 1: just that there's a.

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Speaker 3: I agree, I think the Football Hall of Fame, and

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Speaker 3: I haven't been to Cooperstown in like twenty years, so

431
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Speaker 3: I could be wrong about this, but my recollection is

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Speaker 3: that I was more struck by the Pro Football Hall

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Speaker 3: of Fame than I was at the Baseball Hall.

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Speaker 2: The basketball normandy of it felt that it felt bigger.

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Speaker 1: I've been to the basketball one also, and that more

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Speaker 1: just felt like a it was I mean, there's nothing

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Speaker 1: wrong with this, but it was more like an interactive

438
00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,199
Speaker 1: thing for kids about the game of basketball than it was.

439
00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:13,120
Speaker 1: But the shrine room is very impressive. So you go

440
00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:16,640
Speaker 1: in and it has different ways that you can look

441
00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,040
Speaker 1: up the enshrinees in the Pro Football Hall of Fame,

442
00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 1: including place of birth. And I was surprised to see

443
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,080
Speaker 1: that there is only one member of the Pro Football

444
00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:28,399
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame who was born in Indianapolis, Indiana. And

445
00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:29,959
Speaker 1: I don't think I ever gave you the answer.

446
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:30,639
Speaker 2: You did not.

447
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:32,560
Speaker 3: You did not, and I do not know the answer this,

448
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,480
Speaker 3: so I feel like I should, but I'm dying to know.

449
00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:37,600
Speaker 2: Well, here's what you're gonna have to do.

450
00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:40,600
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to turn on your radio because as

451
00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:42,280
Speaker 1: soon as we hang up, because I'm gonna tell everybody

452
00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:42,920
Speaker 1: on the other side.

453
00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:46,000
Speaker 2: How's that all right? Fair enough? It was very clever

454
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,639
Speaker 2: of you. I do what I can. Stephen, Uh, you

455
00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:52,480
Speaker 2: got kick those ratings up, baby? You know the drill?

456
00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:54,320
Speaker 2: All right? Steven, appreciate it.

457
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:56,760
Speaker 1: Enjoy going home to Miami and watching the game and

458
00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,359
Speaker 1: enjoy watching Indiana win their first national championship.

459
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 3: We'll see what happens, but it very well could be.

460
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:04,119
Speaker 3: I will say, Hey, fun fact, by the way, the

461
00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:06,760
Speaker 3: last time I walked through that shrine room, this is

462
00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 3: this is why my job is cool. The last time

463
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:10,720
Speaker 3: I walked through that shrine room.

464
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:15,280
Speaker 2: With Tony Dungeye, that's pretty cool. Pretty cool. Yeah, that's

465
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:16,800
Speaker 2: pretty cool. That's very cool.

466
00:23:17,320 --> 00:23:19,640
Speaker 1: All Right, I appreciate it, Steven. We'll talk to you soon.

467
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:23,840
Speaker 1: All right, Steven Holder joining us here on the Java House.

468
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:25,720
Speaker 1: Peel and poor guest line.

469
00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:28,679
Speaker 2: Eddie. You have or have not been to the Pro

470
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,800
Speaker 2: Football Hall of Fame. I have not. It really is

471
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:32,680
Speaker 2: worth driving over for.

472
00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:36,240
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's funny because when you go into it,

473
00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:40,960
Speaker 1: you walk in and you as soon as you walk

474
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:44,760
Speaker 1: into the facility, the first room that you go into

475
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:48,680
Speaker 1: is the shrine room, and it's dimly lit with spotlights

476
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,560
Speaker 1: on the busts of all of the Hall of famers

477
00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 1: and they have like touch screens where you can look

478
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:57,640
Speaker 1: up the bios, and I mean it's very impressive. Now

479
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:04,280
Speaker 1: the rest of it is somewhat almost like dilapidated like

480
00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:07,119
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of and it is not just

481
00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:09,359
Speaker 1: the NFL Hall of Fame, it's the Pro Football Hall

482
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:11,720
Speaker 1: of Fame. So it has things in there talking about

483
00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 1: the Canadian League and you know, all kinds of different things.

484
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,880
Speaker 1: But it has a fabulous goes without saying gift shop,

485
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,680
Speaker 1: I mean you could go. It's worth the drive over

486
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:22,000
Speaker 1: just to go to the gift shop because you could

487
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 1: buy it. Literally, you know what I mean. You want

488
00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:29,479
Speaker 1: to buy a thimble with the Chiefs logo on it,

489
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 1: They got it. I mean, they have everything there. But

490
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,520
Speaker 1: when you go through, the one thing that you see

491
00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 1: among the busts the following player. He spent the majority

492
00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:43,760
Speaker 1: of his career with the Minnesota Vikings and also played

493
00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,360
Speaker 1: for the Atlanta Falcons and the San Francisco forty nine Ers.

494
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:49,280
Speaker 1: An eight time Pro Bowl selection, three time first team

495
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:52,639
Speaker 1: All Pro, recording one hundred and fifty and a half career,

496
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,160
Speaker 1: Sacks a member of the Pro Football Hall of Fame

497
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:59,000
Speaker 1: in the class of two thousand and two. He passed

498
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:02,600
Speaker 1: away in twenty twenty at the age of fifty eight.

499
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:06,360
Speaker 1: In Duluth, Georgia. Went to high school in York Pennsylvania

500
00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:09,400
Speaker 1: College at the University of Pittsburgh, the fourth overall pick

501
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,960
Speaker 1: in the eighty five draft, but born on October the sixteenth,

502
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:17,160
Speaker 1: nineteen sixty one, in Indianapolis, Indiana, Chris Dolman of the Vikings,

503
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:21,919
Speaker 1: primarily of the Vikings, Chris Dolman when I entered it

504
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 1: in at least at the time that I was there,

505
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:29,440
Speaker 1: the only member of the Hall of Fame born in Indianapolis.

506
00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:34,520
Speaker 1: He had brain surgery in twenty eighteen, later diagnosed with

507
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:39,080
Speaker 1: giablastoma and passed away at the age of fifty eight.

508
00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,399
Speaker 1: Honored prior to the kickoff at the Super Bowl, the

509
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:45,439
Speaker 1: Super Bowl five days later. So there you go, Chris Dolman,

510
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 1: the late great Chris Dolman, born in Indianapolis. Okay, Eddie,

511
00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 1: you were saying your question about Indiana if they were

512
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:52,800
Speaker 1: to win come Monday night.

513
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 7: Obviously it would be great for the local rooting interest

514
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,399
Speaker 7: here in the state of Indiana and fellow who's just

515
00:25:57,480 --> 00:25:59,639
Speaker 7: across the country, just because of the fact that this

516
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:02,520
Speaker 7: is that, you know, nobody ever thought they would say

517
00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 7: that Indiana is not only playing in the college football

518
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,639
Speaker 7: playoff Chapionship game, that they are the champions and they

519
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 7: were the best team in college football. You know, this

520
00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 7: season in the first undefeated team in the history of

521
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 7: college football in this new format, and on the year

522
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,360
Speaker 7: is fifty years of the celebration of as you've highlighted

523
00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:21,960
Speaker 7: of basketball. Going undefeated. Got me thinking if it would

524
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,439
Speaker 7: actually be bad for college football if a team like

525
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,120
Speaker 7: Indiana won it and not in the aspect of it's

526
00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:30,360
Speaker 7: Indiana winning and the aspect in the aspect of how

527
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 7: they've done it, Like it's been two years for Kurt

528
00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:35,760
Speaker 7: Signetty to do this, and you're and if you're a

529
00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,800
Speaker 7: team that's like Florida, for example, You've got a large

530
00:26:38,800 --> 00:26:41,800
Speaker 7: fan base, you have a large alumni association with a

531
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,600
Speaker 7: lot of you know, history in the football program itself.

532
00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:47,280
Speaker 7: You look at Alabama in the history that they have

533
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,439
Speaker 7: had in their football program, especially recently under Nick Saban,

534
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:54,880
Speaker 7: and like, is it going to start creating unrealistic expectations

535
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,920
Speaker 7: for some of these schools that have the big in

536
00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:01,680
Speaker 7: ale budget, that have the history of football and being

537
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,359
Speaker 7: really good and competitive among one of the best in

538
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 7: the country, that they can't get it right in the

539
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 7: nature and as quick as Indiana did with a guy

540
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:14,359
Speaker 7: who is from James Madison. The answer is, I think

541
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:17,000
Speaker 7: to an extent, yes, and we're going to see constant

542
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,160
Speaker 7: change almost every two to three years, and these coaches

543
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 7: aren't going to get a chance to build up anything.

544
00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,320
Speaker 1: Here is what I think is going to be the

545
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:34,960
Speaker 1: biggest question mark. And you're correct. It works two ways, Eddie.

546
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:36,600
Speaker 1: I think there are a lot of schools that are

547
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:39,160
Speaker 1: going to look at it and say, wait a minute.

548
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:43,280
Speaker 2: You know, we are the Ohio State University.

549
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:49,600
Speaker 1: We are Clemson, we are Texas, we are Michigan, we

550
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:54,160
Speaker 1: are usc we are football schools. We are football schools

551
00:27:54,560 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 1: that invest in football, believe in football, live and die

552
00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:06,040
Speaker 1: by football. So how in the world, How in the

553
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 1: world did Plucky feel sorry for them? Indiana come swooping in. Well,

554
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:19,360
Speaker 1: then they diagnose it and you do the autopsy, you say, okay,

555
00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:23,960
Speaker 1: several things had to come into play here. Number one,

556
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:28,160
Speaker 1: very good strategy by their athletic director and their president

557
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:31,520
Speaker 1: to say and you know what, kudos to Tom Allen

558
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:36,040
Speaker 1: for saying even though I think towards the end it

559
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:40,320
Speaker 1: was this wasn't the main culprit, but Tom Allen was

560
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 1: very open to anybody that would listen to it about

561
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,680
Speaker 1: his critique that Indiana did not financially invest in football

562
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 1: the way that other teams did. And you heard when

563
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:54,240
Speaker 1: we had Dave Rebson on and he talked about the

564
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:59,520
Speaker 1: story of Jerry DeNardo piping in crowd noise with speakers

565
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 1: before they went to Oregon some twenty years ago and

566
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 1: won by the way, and the university then saying, well,

567
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 1: who's going to pay for the speakers? You know, those

568
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: sorts of things. Indiana finally said, was Scott Dolson and

569
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,640
Speaker 1: Pam Witten like football. They figured out football is the breadwinner.

570
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:18,440
Speaker 1: It's great to be a basketball school, but that doesn't

571
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 1: pay the bills. Football does. So they went out and

572
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:24,959
Speaker 1: did it. What Indiana did, as I've mentioned many many times,

573
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: is they got out in front of it and anticipated.

574
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:31,680
Speaker 1: I remember having a conversation with somebody at Indiana before

575
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:34,960
Speaker 1: the NIL thing got full clearance, and it was like, look,

576
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:36,000
Speaker 1: Indiana's ready to go.

577
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 2: They got a war chest ready to.

578
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:42,440
Speaker 1: Go, and they're going to be able to figure out

579
00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:44,200
Speaker 1: how to navigate this new system.

580
00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 2: And I'm sure Signetti was a big part of that.

581
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,360
Speaker 1: When Signetti came in and said everything year has to

582
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 1: change everything. We have to literally turn this thing upside down,

583
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 1: and the first thing we got to do is bring in,

584
00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:00,400
Speaker 1: go out and get players that are used to that

585
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:02,120
Speaker 1: are you know, veterans whatever else.

586
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:05,720
Speaker 7: Okay, And the other part to what they've done so well, Jake,

587
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 7: is they're not typically going after guys that have the

588
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,719
Speaker 7: high talent with the star recruit whatever. They're looking for

589
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 7: players that fit what they want to do.

590
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:16,240
Speaker 2: Correct. That's correct.

591
00:30:16,320 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 7: So it's more of a NFL roster build type, correct

592
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 7: versus I want to go get the best player to

593
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 7: come play for me.

594
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 1: Now here is where Eddie, this gets interesting because you're

595
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 1: correct in that, right does Indiana There are two sides

596
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 1: of this question mark moving forward? The first is this

597
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:47,680
Speaker 1: Indiana's blueprint? How does it change? Now Indiana can say

598
00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:49,960
Speaker 1: all they want that they've never wanted five stars. Guess

599
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:55,280
Speaker 1: what it's because five stars never wanted Indiana, right, I

600
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 1: Mean that's just the reality of it.

601
00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 2: Like it's not like.

602
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 1: You know, the the under Armor All American Game that

603
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 1: it wasn't like two years ago, people like he'll be

604
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: choosing between Indiana, Miami, Alabama, and USC.

605
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:10,720
Speaker 5: No.

606
00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: So the now that Indiana has elevated its profile and

607
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 1: it is perhaps on the radar or in play for

608
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:22,959
Speaker 1: elite blue chip high school talent. Does that change Indiana's

609
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:26,200
Speaker 1: tune about those players? Now, you would say likely not.

610
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,120
Speaker 1: You use them as a situation, but you don't lean

611
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 1: on those players. But at the same time, it's a

612
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:35,840
Speaker 1: balancing act because if you are getting a five star

613
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:40,880
Speaker 1: kid out of Stone Mountain, Georgia, or Dasal High School

614
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: in Coronado, California.

615
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,760
Speaker 7: Or even locally, Manchin Sales at Lawrence North. He has

616
00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:45,760
Speaker 7: a five star recruit.

617
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 1: So if he's coming in and you're saying, Okay, we

618
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 1: have that kid, but we also have a twenty three

619
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,760
Speaker 1: year old transfer from Kansas State that had nine hundred

620
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,720
Speaker 1: yards receiving last year, you may only have a year

621
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,480
Speaker 1: to get minutes out of that five star before he says,

622
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:02,080
Speaker 1: you know what I got, Kansas State offer me a

623
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 1: million and a half for next year, or whatever it

624
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:07,520
Speaker 1: may be. I think the more fascinating thing is going

625
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:10,920
Speaker 1: to be this, and I'm going to sound like an

626
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: old man yelling at clouds.

627
00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 2: I realize.

628
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:19,920
Speaker 1: Mark Cuban has essentially endless money. Fifteen million bucks to

629
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: Mark Cuban is literally a pop, a bag of combos,

630
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:30,480
Speaker 1: and a powerball ticket at the gas station. But even

631
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 1: people with that kind of wealth, or even people that

632
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: are boosters of Michigan or Alabama. But let's even go

633
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:45,880
Speaker 1: a step further and say the Minnesota's, the Mississippi States,

634
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:50,840
Speaker 1: the San Jose states of the world. How many times

635
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:53,720
Speaker 1: can you go to the same car dealer and say, hey,

636
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:56,120
Speaker 1: I know, last year we asked you for eighty grand

637
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:58,000
Speaker 1: because there was a quarterback we really wanted. It was

638
00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 1: a transfer from you know, you see Santa Barbara because

639
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:04,120
Speaker 1: they phased out their program, and he was really good

640
00:33:04,160 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 1: for us, and we went seven and six and that

641
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:09,720
Speaker 1: was cool and hopefully you and you enjoyed your your

642
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 1: stop at the you know, the Hawaiian Punch Bowl.

643
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 2: But we need one hundred grand this year because we

644
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:15,920
Speaker 2: got a guy.

645
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:17,479
Speaker 1: Now last year, that guy was good, but we got

646
00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:19,320
Speaker 1: a guy this year that's coming from UTEP and they

647
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:21,960
Speaker 1: actually played in the Little Caesars Bowl, and so we

648
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 1: need one hundred grand this year. And then that kid

649
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:25,760
Speaker 1: trains serves after a year, and then you go back

650
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:27,720
Speaker 1: to that guy and you go, it's now going to

651
00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: be one hundred and fifty. I mean eventually, Eddie, because

652
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,600
Speaker 1: and I know, television money is a huge revenue source okay,

653
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:38,520
Speaker 1: but television money also through Title nine, is helping to

654
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 1: pay the scholarships for the cross country runners and the

655
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 1: volleyball team and the girls swimming team and everything else

656
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 1: the NIL collectives. As long as you are going to

657
00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:54,040
Speaker 1: bowl games, in championship games and making these runs, theoretically,

658
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,160
Speaker 1: people are going to continue to pay into that hopper.

659
00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: But even even success eventually get look at Alabama, Alabama.

660
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:06,280
Speaker 1: Why were there no Alabama fans at the Rose Bowl

661
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:09,319
Speaker 1: Because they've been there one hundred times. I mean it's

662
00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:11,719
Speaker 1: far for them to travel, but not much further than Indiana,

663
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:14,839
Speaker 1: but they've been there a hundred times. And Alabama fans like, yeah,

664
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:16,040
Speaker 1: i mean, wake me up when we get to the

665
00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 1: final four, you know.

666
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 2: And same reason why.

667
00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:23,080
Speaker 1: I mean, Indiana travels really well for the NCAA tournament,

668
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:28,120
Speaker 1: but for years there, you know, certain schools they didn't

669
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:29,920
Speaker 1: have a huge turnout in the opening round of the

670
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,000
Speaker 1: NCAA tournament because they're like, yeah, I'm gonna go to

671
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:33,480
Speaker 1: the final four. I'm gonna save my money for that.

672
00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,960
Speaker 1: And the same is true of when you start getting

673
00:34:37,040 --> 00:34:41,319
Speaker 1: regular success within the NIL era, Eventually people are going

674
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:43,600
Speaker 1: to be like, yeah, I'm accustomed to this man like

675
00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:46,040
Speaker 1: the thrill and the excitement and the chasing of the

676
00:34:46,160 --> 00:34:48,759
Speaker 1: high of can we get to the next level. I

677
00:34:48,840 --> 00:34:52,480
Speaker 1: keep writing checks for you. That's what's going to be interesting.

678
00:34:52,560 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 1: I do think that Indiana has broken the mold a

679
00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: little bit on how you build a program, Eddie to

680
00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:00,799
Speaker 1: your point of when you say, is it going to

681
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:02,320
Speaker 1: be bad for college football?

682
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:05,040
Speaker 2: I don't know that it's going to be.

683
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,279
Speaker 1: Bad for college football, but I do think there's a

684
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:08,839
Speaker 1: group of people it's going to be bad for if

685
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:13,400
Speaker 1: Indiana wins. If you're thinking to yourself, Jacket's gonna take

686
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:15,160
Speaker 1: a lot of energy to watch those games, no problem,

687
00:35:15,239 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 1: get yourself a wrangular energy. From Java House java house

688
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,319
Speaker 1: dot com Heeling Poor guest line is where we find

689
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:24,040
Speaker 1: Scott Agnes from Fieldhouse Files Pacers last night winners over

690
00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:30,320
Speaker 1: the Boston Celtics who had their city gold gold standard uniforms. Scott,

691
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:34,239
Speaker 1: I thought again, oddly, and you know, it's almost like

692
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 1: this kind of band of misfits to borrow a Fernanda

693
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:39,920
Speaker 1: Mendoza term for the Pacers is starting to kind of

694
00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: figure out some.

695
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:42,560
Speaker 2: Cohesiveness amongst themselves.

696
00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:44,840
Speaker 1: Is is it that or is it the fact that

697
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 1: they're playing teams like Boston with no Jaylen Brown.

698
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:49,839
Speaker 5: I think first of all, I start out as they've

699
00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:52,560
Speaker 5: gotten many of their guys back, meaning the Pacers right,

700
00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 5: Nie Smith being out there, significant, nim Hard when he's

701
00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:59,800
Speaker 5: healthy significant. Then then I would go to the second

702
00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:02,680
Speaker 5: part point, whereas, look, you're facing the Celtics who are

703
00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:06,279
Speaker 5: without Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown, and they've done a

704
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:08,160
Speaker 5: great job after the first month of the season of

705
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:10,760
Speaker 5: putting it together, although they've now lost three of four.

706
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 5: But I think you just find a Pacers team that's

707
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:17,320
Speaker 5: finally being able to establish something because they're not dealing

708
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:20,040
Speaker 5: with all these ten day contracts or you know, those

709
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 5: type of guys that are coming in and out, and

710
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:24,680
Speaker 5: they're leaning more heavily on the players we expected entering

711
00:36:24,680 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 5: this season.

712
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:31,400
Speaker 1: The Okay, last night in the game against Boston, I

713
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 1: thought they got good play in good contribution from a

714
00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 1: couple of plays. You know, nim Hard showed the ability

715
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:41,360
Speaker 1: Scott to hit shots when they needed it. But I

716
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: thought last night he was a better facilitator than he

717
00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:48,320
Speaker 1: was scorer. Are they better when Andro Nimhard is serving

718
00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 1: that role as opposed to the shoot first guy, does

719
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: that make sense?

720
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 5: It does, and I think so because that's how this

721
00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:58,360
Speaker 5: system is built, That's how Tyrese runs it as the

722
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:02,840
Speaker 5: primary facilitator. And then what we normally have seen previously

723
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 5: with this group, right talking about Haliburton and Company, is

724
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:08,320
Speaker 5: when they need it in the third or fourth quarter,

725
00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:10,600
Speaker 5: then he turns it on. So he might go from

726
00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:13,760
Speaker 5: eight points to twenty five because of a big fourth quarter.

727
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:15,880
Speaker 5: And so yeah, I think the key thing is for

728
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:20,279
Speaker 5: Nimhart to be that facilitator, the organizer, especially with the

729
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:22,840
Speaker 5: way in which this team is set up and organized.

730
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:25,759
Speaker 5: The challenge is you need somebody to be nim Hard,

731
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 5: and nobody has been really able to accomplish that.

732
00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 4: Scott who has most taken advantage of opportunity this year?

733
00:37:35,600 --> 00:37:39,480
Speaker 5: First name that came to mind was Jay Huff. Second

734
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:40,880
Speaker 5: is probably Johnny Furfey.

735
00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:42,440
Speaker 2: To me, okay, that's fair.

736
00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:48,960
Speaker 1: I would put Jeris Walker at a even in other words,

737
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 1: he unfortunately, you know, somebody asked me last night. It

738
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:54,960
Speaker 1: was a good way of saying it. I'm watching the

739
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,720
Speaker 1: game and I get a text and it just says,

740
00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 1: when is the fog going to lift off?

741
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:01,120
Speaker 2: Of Jeris Walker?

742
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:02,880
Speaker 1: And I thought that was a very good way of

743
00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:06,680
Speaker 1: saying it, because when when the fog does clear, from

744
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,720
Speaker 1: time to time, he has shown flashes where you go okay,

745
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 1: like he's ready to take that next step, and then

746
00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:15,520
Speaker 1: he kind of goes back to just being a guy.

747
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:19,280
Speaker 1: And I think I've come to the conclusion that Jeris

748
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,440
Speaker 1: Walker may be a part of the future, but just

749
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:24,799
Speaker 1: as a guy just a minute. You know, a guy

750
00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:28,080
Speaker 1: that goes out and gives you decent minutes but doesn't

751
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:31,839
Speaker 1: lift and or hurt you. But then there are other

752
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:35,719
Speaker 1: players that I feel like have not that have probably regressed.

753
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 1: Ben Shephard is one of them in that category. Now,

754
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 1: I too harshened saying that, and that Ben Shephard seemingly

755
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:46,400
Speaker 1: as there was more opportunity for him this year has struggled.

756
00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:47,880
Speaker 1: Am I being too critical?

757
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:48,319
Speaker 2: No?

758
00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:50,439
Speaker 5: I think that was true early on, But I think

759
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:52,680
Speaker 5: since the injury, since coming back a couple of weeks

760
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:55,959
Speaker 5: ago from that calf spring, we've started to see more

761
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:58,440
Speaker 5: of his old self, and he's getting more minutes and

762
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 5: he's knocking down shots. I think he's shooting better than

763
00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:04,399
Speaker 5: sixty percent since coming back in the last two weeks

764
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:06,719
Speaker 5: from three point range. Sam I would say is true

765
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 5: from Jeris Walker. He went through an awful shooting slump

766
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:12,520
Speaker 5: Jay Huff two and to me, it's probably no coincidence

767
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:15,359
Speaker 5: that these guys are hitting more shots now that things

768
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 5: are more back to normal in terms of personnel, and

769
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,440
Speaker 5: because one of the big challenges is you're not just

770
00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:24,360
Speaker 5: during that injury, not to beat this dead horse. But

771
00:39:24,400 --> 00:39:26,719
Speaker 5: part of the issue is when these players are out,

772
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 5: yes you're losing them, but then other guys have to

773
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,360
Speaker 5: be forced into playing different roles or playing outside themselves,

774
00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:36,560
Speaker 5: including Shepard who was starting quite a bit for a

775
00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 5: while rather than playing his fourteen to twenty minutes off

776
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 5: the bench, And so I think in that role, yes,

777
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:45,360
Speaker 5: being the starter, he struggled. Now coming off the bench

778
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 5: playing with the reserve unit, I think we're seeing more

779
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:49,640
Speaker 5: of what we expected from him.

780
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:53,280
Speaker 1: And I realize it's going to be in a very

781
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 1: back end role if he were to stay. In other words,

782
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:01,560
Speaker 1: bottom of the depth chart area here. But has Micah

783
00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:06,800
Speaker 1: Potter played himself into Scott a role moving forward beyond

784
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:07,239
Speaker 1: this year?

785
00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:11,960
Speaker 5: I think absolutely all all spots are open from that

786
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 5: center spot, and with him specifically, it is certainly the

787
00:40:15,520 --> 00:40:18,200
Speaker 5: second or third big I think right now, from what

788
00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 5: I would gather, it feels like Jay Huff would be

789
00:40:20,640 --> 00:40:23,280
Speaker 5: your perfect backup center and Michael could be your third string,

790
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:25,399
Speaker 5: and you're still missing that number one.

791
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 1: Okay, now the question is, and I do believe Scott

792
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:32,880
Speaker 1: I said earlier, if you were to close your eyes,

793
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:37,440
Speaker 1: Let's say next year, for the sake of my little

794
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:41,839
Speaker 1: experiment here, let's say the Pacers have a Christmas Day

795
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,279
Speaker 1: game next year. Okay, the Pacers are going to play

796
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:47,279
Speaker 1: in New York on Christmas Day next year. So you

797
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:49,319
Speaker 1: get done opening the gifts and you're sitting there and

798
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:51,920
Speaker 1: you got your PJS on, and you're drinking your eggnog

799
00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:52,799
Speaker 1: and you turn it on.

800
00:40:53,200 --> 00:41:02,400
Speaker 2: WHOA did you feel that, Jake? Did you feel like breeze? Yeah?

801
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:05,879
Speaker 2: It's our friend Robin Jennie. That is correct. I heard

802
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:08,279
Speaker 2: the eggnog and they had to come into the room. Oh,

803
00:41:08,560 --> 00:41:10,160
Speaker 2: Genie's like eggnog. I don't know if you knew that

804
00:41:10,239 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 2: or not.

805
00:41:10,880 --> 00:41:14,040
Speaker 4: Eddy, like I mentioned, I heard you talking about your

806
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:15,400
Speaker 4: Christmas Day scenarios.

807
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 2: I have a question for Scott Aggies. Okay, Scott, you

808
00:41:18,800 --> 00:41:20,560
Speaker 2: up for taking a question from Robin and Jennie. He

809
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 2: doesn't pay on his bets. I do to please wait.

810
00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:24,920
Speaker 5: Hew it, Robin, I'm ready for.

811
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:28,359
Speaker 4: Okay, here's my question for you, Scott, as you are

812
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:30,080
Speaker 4: getting ready to watch the game on.

813
00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 2: Christmas Day next year, if the Pacers.

814
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 4: Were playing, when they do the starting lineups for one

815
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,920
Speaker 4: million dollars, you have to answer, now, is the starting

816
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 4: center in that scenario next year currently on the Pacer roster.

817
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,600
Speaker 5: I don't see it, Robert, No, I don't think so.

818
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,600
Speaker 5: I think that upgrade will will have to comb from

819
00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:51,320
Speaker 5: the outside.

820
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 4: You may have noticed in the Deal or No Deal

821
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:56,319
Speaker 4: at Pacer games they have a new feature known as

822
00:41:56,360 --> 00:41:59,120
Speaker 4: the double or nothing. I will give you double and

823
00:41:59,160 --> 00:42:01,719
Speaker 4: anything by saying this, would you like to tell me

824
00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:04,279
Speaker 4: what center do you believe it.

825
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 2: May be that is starting for the Pacers next season?

826
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:12,560
Speaker 5: You should, I'll come on. I'd like Robin to tell me.

827
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 5: He should know that one.

828
00:42:15,080 --> 00:42:18,040
Speaker 2: I do not actually make predictions. I simply pay for others.

829
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:23,319
Speaker 1: Okay, fair enough, I think now I will tell you this.

830
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,240
Speaker 1: I will take the place of Robin here. Okay, Scott,

831
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:28,640
Speaker 1: I believe that it would be And I'm just gonna

832
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:31,920
Speaker 1: throw a name I keep hearing about, like you know,

833
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:34,920
Speaker 1: Zubac's name keeps coming up, right, that price tag seems

834
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 1: to be a lot A guy that I loved coming

835
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:42,680
Speaker 1: out of college, and I have no idea how accessible

836
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:46,000
Speaker 1: he would be. But I loved Mark Williams.

837
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:49,720
Speaker 2: That's that's the first name that came to mind too, totally.

838
00:42:49,320 --> 00:42:51,200
Speaker 1: That style, and I have no idea what kind of

839
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:55,400
Speaker 1: shooter he is, but he's uber athletic, right, that's.

840
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:58,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, for sure, But there's there's some health concerns if

841
00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:01,040
Speaker 5: you consider what the Lakers did, and that was take

842
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 5: back the trade and decline it due to health there, that's.

843
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 2: Right, And I can't remember what was it? Do you

844
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:06,880
Speaker 2: remember me?

845
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:11,960
Speaker 5: It was lower back, something with his back if I think, yeah.

846
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:13,359
Speaker 1: I mean, I just but but you know that kind

847
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:16,040
Speaker 1: of in other words, a very athletic gazelle type.

848
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:18,479
Speaker 2: Big. I mean, that's that's the game plan.

849
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,120
Speaker 1: But so I see that, and then I see Huff

850
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:25,520
Speaker 1: as the fifteen to twenty minute really nice rotational piece.

851
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 1: I mean, I think Huff has shown that he's got

852
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 1: some skill set there. Then the question becomes, Okay, if

853
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:35,880
Speaker 1: you go with like Potter, for example, at your three,

854
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:39,520
Speaker 1: does that mean that Isaiah Jackson becomes a power forward

855
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:41,400
Speaker 1: or is he out?

856
00:43:41,760 --> 00:43:43,600
Speaker 5: That would suggest to me he would be out.

857
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 2: I would agree with that. He's a guy.

858
00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:49,920
Speaker 5: Let's go back to what I think your second question was,

859
00:43:50,440 --> 00:43:54,200
Speaker 5: and I treat it with some comfort or not comfort,

860
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:58,080
Speaker 5: with some understanding given his injury, and that is I

861
00:43:58,080 --> 00:44:00,320
Speaker 5: will never say that's an easy injury to come off.

862
00:44:00,520 --> 00:44:02,319
Speaker 5: But he's a guy I want to and need to

863
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:03,480
Speaker 5: see more from.

864
00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:05,320
Speaker 1: By the way, Eddie, do you happen to have the

865
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:07,680
Speaker 1: breaking news sounder? My apology, Scott, hang on your set.

866
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:14,920
Speaker 1: Mike Tomlin is out in Pittsburgh, the Pittsburgh Steelers announcing

867
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 1: I believe a mutual departure. I don't know, uh, you

868
00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 1: know when we will get a list or excuse me

869
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:23,640
Speaker 1: clarification on that Eddie is at correct.

870
00:44:23,760 --> 00:44:26,800
Speaker 7: This is from Ian Rappaport Jake. Steelers coach Mike Tomlin

871
00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:28,799
Speaker 7: has informed the team that he plans to step away

872
00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:33,960
Speaker 7: from coaching, and Rapp also adds that he informed the

873
00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:36,440
Speaker 7: team in a meeting. There has been a lot of

874
00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:39,680
Speaker 7: you know steam lately, and I believe Pro Football Talk

875
00:44:39,800 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 7: had this either a week or two ago, that there

876
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:45,640
Speaker 7: was a lot of interest between Mike Tomlin and moving

877
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:48,479
Speaker 7: to television, so that could be in the works as well.

878
00:44:48,520 --> 00:44:50,319
Speaker 1: Now, keep in mind, one of the things that the

879
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:54,560
Speaker 1: Steelers have always prided themselves on, preached a little bit

880
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:59,080
Speaker 1: is the fact of stability and solidarity within their coaching

881
00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:02,480
Speaker 1: position or their front He is just the third person

882
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:06,880
Speaker 1: to coach the Steelers since the Nixon administration, so you know,

883
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:09,480
Speaker 1: Chuck Noell, obviously Bill Kawer, and now Mike Tomlin. But

884
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:12,960
Speaker 1: that's a big one and we'll see what happens with that.

885
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 1: We'll get more into that later. Scott back into the conversation. Yeah,

886
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:21,400
Speaker 1: Jackson for me, and I feel bad because and the

887
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:25,160
Speaker 1: one thing that worries me as well is even and

888
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:28,440
Speaker 1: I know Jackson is hurt currently Isaiah Jackson for the Pacers.

889
00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:28,200
Speaker 2: But.

890
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 1: Different skill set of where it's needed perhaps, but considering

891
00:45:35,560 --> 00:45:38,319
Speaker 1: that he is coming off of the same injury that

892
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:43,880
Speaker 1: Tyrese Halliburton is right now wading through, Jackson to me,

893
00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:47,720
Speaker 1: seemed to have lost some of his burst or athleticism

894
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:50,480
Speaker 1: at least to this point, and that worries me a

895
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:51,719
Speaker 1: little bit about Halliburton.

896
00:45:51,960 --> 00:45:53,840
Speaker 2: But is that apples to oranges?

897
00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:56,800
Speaker 5: I think it's a little bit of apples to oranges.

898
00:45:56,840 --> 00:45:59,359
Speaker 5: I haven't seen as much as a decrease in him

899
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:02,359
Speaker 5: unable to be himself as much as just lack of productivity.

900
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:06,880
Speaker 5: And for a guy that's in year five, Jake, the

901
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:09,960
Speaker 5: foul issues is still a thing I've realized in my

902
00:46:10,040 --> 00:46:13,319
Speaker 5: years covering this league. Biggs are slower to develop than

903
00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:14,960
Speaker 5: any other player. You have to give them two or

904
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:17,719
Speaker 5: three years. But you're now in year five. You don't

905
00:46:17,719 --> 00:46:20,320
Speaker 5: want to be dealing and still having these issues where

906
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,279
Speaker 5: your starting center has two fouls in the first two

907
00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:26,000
Speaker 5: minutes and fifteen seconds. And so it's those little things

908
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:28,719
Speaker 5: that bother me much more than a lack of burst

909
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:30,480
Speaker 5: or anything like that. I don't see that as much

910
00:46:30,520 --> 00:46:33,040
Speaker 5: as just the productivity is not there for a guy

911
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:34,560
Speaker 5: who knows this system in this team.

912
00:46:35,160 --> 00:46:39,879
Speaker 1: Okay, and Scott, I apologize for asking Scott agres my guests,

913
00:46:40,160 --> 00:46:42,239
Speaker 1: Java House Peel and Port guest line. He's with field

914
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:46,720
Speaker 1: House files, Scott Win is the trade deadline?

915
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 5: You have about less than a week or excuse me,

916
00:46:49,160 --> 00:46:50,759
Speaker 5: less than a month here coming up?

917
00:46:52,560 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 2: So what is the Is it before or after Valentine's Day?

918
00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:57,520
Speaker 2: Let me ask you that.

919
00:46:59,400 --> 00:47:03,560
Speaker 5: It's well before. It's a week before February sixth. Okay,

920
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:07,080
Speaker 5: February fifth, I'm sorry, February fifth at three pm Eastern.

921
00:47:08,120 --> 00:47:13,799
Speaker 1: So let's just say hypothetically that on Valentine's Day, you

922
00:47:13,880 --> 00:47:17,319
Speaker 1: decide to go out for dinner and you walk in

923
00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:20,400
Speaker 1: and you see a Pacer player who's enjoying a Valentine's Day.

924
00:47:20,280 --> 00:47:21,840
Speaker 2: Dinner and you're like, well, that's wonderful.

925
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:26,080
Speaker 1: I'm assuming they're not playing on Valentine's Day night, and

926
00:47:26,120 --> 00:47:28,360
Speaker 1: that player has been Matheren. Would you be stunned to

927
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:30,000
Speaker 1: see him in Indianapolis at that time?

928
00:47:31,239 --> 00:47:35,560
Speaker 5: I would not know, just because the Pacers have options

929
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:39,160
Speaker 5: and also former lottery pick, a guy that is productive

930
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:42,359
Speaker 5: that you don't just trade for for anything out there.

931
00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:44,240
Speaker 5: But it's definitely something to watch.

932
00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:47,040
Speaker 1: Okay, because I think Scott and I keep saying this,

933
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:49,480
Speaker 1: you tell me if you sounds like you might disagree

934
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 1: to me. Matherin is the piece they will use to

935
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:53,920
Speaker 1: try to get themselves the center.

936
00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:56,719
Speaker 5: It might have to be if you're trying to do

937
00:47:56,760 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 5: it via trade, absolutely, but you also have the advance

938
00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:02,560
Speaker 5: of time here in that. Look, this is not a

939
00:48:02,640 --> 00:48:05,320
Speaker 5: championship or even maybe even a playoff team this season,

940
00:48:05,360 --> 00:48:08,080
Speaker 5: so it doesn't necessarily have to be done at the

941
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 5: trade deadline. Matherin will be a restricted free agent, which

942
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:14,160
Speaker 5: gives the team more control potentially than usual, and an

943
00:48:14,200 --> 00:48:18,120
Speaker 5: unrestricted this summer. But yes, that would be that he'd

944
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:20,880
Speaker 5: be the player I think that would that would be

945
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 5: available that they could get the most four uh, you know,

946
00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:28,280
Speaker 5: if they could reach a deal. And you mentioned Zubac earlier.

947
00:48:28,280 --> 00:48:29,960
Speaker 5: I don't think his contract's too bad at all. I

948
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,799
Speaker 5: think it's about twenty million. That's below the going rate

949
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:35,719
Speaker 5: for a starting center right now. And Mark Williams will

950
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:37,640
Speaker 5: need a new contract. I look that up, and so

951
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:39,600
Speaker 5: that's something to consider in that front.

952
00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:41,960
Speaker 7: Scott, I kind of pushed back on the notion of

953
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:45,720
Speaker 7: they need to they could wait with trading Mathering because

954
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 7: you mentioned the he's a restricted free agent. Look at

955
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:52,879
Speaker 7: how that played out for Jonathan Kaminga and the Golden

956
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:56,280
Speaker 7: State Warriors. Look how it played out for DeAndre Ayton

957
00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,839
Speaker 7: and the Phoenix Suns. Like it just hasn't worked out

958
00:49:00,080 --> 00:49:03,319
Speaker 7: league wide between players and that team. So I just

959
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:05,800
Speaker 7: feel like, you know, it's better off for the Pacers

960
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 7: to trade Mathering now because I think the value of Mathering,

961
00:49:09,239 --> 00:49:11,840
Speaker 7: even though he is injured, is probably going to be

962
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:13,960
Speaker 7: higher right now than it would be if you let

963
00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:16,920
Speaker 7: him get to you know, that restricted free agency, because

964
00:49:17,440 --> 00:49:19,480
Speaker 7: there could be a team out there that signs him

965
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,160
Speaker 7: to an offer that the Pacers may not be willing

966
00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:23,759
Speaker 7: to make, and either they're going to let him walk

967
00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:26,359
Speaker 7: for nothing, or they're kind of going to get their

968
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:28,520
Speaker 7: hands caught behind their back a little bit and tied

969
00:49:28,600 --> 00:49:31,080
Speaker 7: and forced to sign into a contract they don't want

970
00:49:31,080 --> 00:49:33,480
Speaker 7: to sign him to, and then you're kind of stuck

971
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:36,320
Speaker 7: with that awful contract potentially, and you may not be

972
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:38,839
Speaker 7: able to get then what you could now.

973
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:41,919
Speaker 5: Yeah, there's several things to that. First of all, since

974
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:46,480
Speaker 5: the new Collective Bargaining Agreement several years ago, restricted free agency,

975
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:50,440
Speaker 5: what we have seen has heavily favored the teams and

976
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:53,719
Speaker 5: so in terms of other teams not really having cap

977
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 5: space like we saw this past summer, which is why

978
00:49:55,960 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 5: there was not much of a market for kaminga. So

979
00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:01,920
Speaker 5: that would be advantage ages to sign matherin at a

980
00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:05,680
Speaker 5: lower number than maybe you would expect or he would like.

981
00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:08,600
Speaker 5: I Yet, at the same time another thing you could

982
00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:10,719
Speaker 5: consider as a sign and trade. The Pacers did that

983
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:14,000
Speaker 5: with Malcolm Brogden receiving him from the Bucks and sent

984
00:50:14,480 --> 00:50:16,920
Speaker 5: a couple of picks to the Bucks who wanted to

985
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:20,200
Speaker 5: move on from Brogden anyway. But that said, I think

986
00:50:20,200 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 5: there's also a lot to say in terms of if

987
00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:27,520
Speaker 5: you don't have plans for a player moving forward, then

988
00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:31,399
Speaker 5: you don't want to keep around it unhappy player, which

989
00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:33,440
Speaker 5: is I think the primary thing you're getting at. And

990
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 5: that's not to say, by the way, Matherin's unhappy or not.

991
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:39,120
Speaker 5: I don't think so either way. But I did take note,

992
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:41,920
Speaker 5: like many probably that his Instagram photo is now black,

993
00:50:42,600 --> 00:50:44,640
Speaker 5: that he has nothing in his profile. I don't know

994
00:50:44,680 --> 00:50:48,000
Speaker 5: what that means, if anything, but it's something of note

995
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:51,360
Speaker 5: with him as he currently sits out with multiple injuries,

996
00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:54,440
Speaker 5: and I think that was probably the right move for him. Ultimately,

997
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:57,440
Speaker 5: here is not have to He's in a contract year,

998
00:50:57,480 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 5: so he feels the need and the desire to play.

999
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:03,719
Speaker 5: But turf Toe's awful right sprain has definitely impacted his

1000
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:06,400
Speaker 5: thumb in his shooting hand, and so it's good right

1001
00:51:06,440 --> 00:51:08,719
Speaker 5: now that he's also sitting out for himself and for

1002
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:09,200
Speaker 5: the team.

1003
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:11,640
Speaker 1: Scott, can you briefly and I'm going to throw you

1004
00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:14,720
Speaker 1: a curveball here, and I apologize Scott agersonfield House files.

1005
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:19,080
Speaker 1: But I know that there is an ongoing labor negotiation

1006
00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:22,560
Speaker 1: discussion within the WNBA that has hit like a couple

1007
00:51:22,560 --> 00:51:26,000
Speaker 1: of temporary stalls and then seems to progress and then

1008
00:51:26,040 --> 00:51:28,320
Speaker 1: step back. Where do things stand in thirty seconds or

1009
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 1: less of a synopsis there?

1010
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, so right now there has been no progress toward

1011
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 5: an agreement between the WNBA Players Association and the league.

1012
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:41,960
Speaker 5: They've renewed, if you will, for a short term situation,

1013
00:51:42,280 --> 00:51:45,960
Speaker 5: the collective Bargaining Agreement a couple different times. That last

1014
00:51:46,000 --> 00:51:49,279
Speaker 5: one expired January ninth. In the meantime since then, they

1015
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 5: decided not to continue it on the league and the

1016
00:51:53,239 --> 00:51:56,120
Speaker 5: players have agreed to a moratorium where no other deals

1017
00:51:56,120 --> 00:51:58,800
Speaker 5: can be signed because there was some fears some players

1018
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:01,520
Speaker 5: might sign deals but those would be covered in the

1019
00:52:01,520 --> 00:52:05,200
Speaker 5: old collective Bargaining agreement that would be favored. So right

1020
00:52:05,239 --> 00:52:08,439
Speaker 5: now this is all stalled out and there's no real

1021
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 5: clarity on when this might get done.

1022
00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:13,520
Speaker 2: You going to Miami, I am, Yes, you were in.

1023
00:52:14,160 --> 00:52:17,319
Speaker 2: Were you in the Peach Bowl? Yes, as well as

1024
00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:17,879
Speaker 2: the Rose Bowl?

1025
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 1: Okay, so between the Rose Bull and the Peach Bowl,

1026
00:52:20,520 --> 00:52:23,280
Speaker 1: which one had the larger percentage of Indiana.

1027
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:27,400
Speaker 2: Fans easily the Peach Bowl, Okay, and.

1028
00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:31,880
Speaker 1: You anticipate that percentage to be what for the National

1029
00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:34,800
Speaker 1: Championship game, m fifty to fifty?

1030
00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:38,440
Speaker 5: Yeah, No, I don't think so. I think it'll be

1031
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:42,880
Speaker 5: slightly more Indiana fans just because the newness of this

1032
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 5: and how everybody is bought in to this situation. And

1033
00:52:47,280 --> 00:52:49,040
Speaker 5: I think you're gonna have some Miami fans that get

1034
00:52:49,040 --> 00:52:50,920
Speaker 5: tickets and go, hey, look, I'll just watch it from home.

1035
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:53,080
Speaker 5: I can do the tailgating and then I'll go home

1036
00:52:53,120 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 5: and pay for my mortgage for four months.

1037
00:52:56,000 --> 00:52:58,399
Speaker 2: That's fair. That's fair. Do they win?

1038
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:02,640
Speaker 5: I think so. Everything we've seen from this group, the thing,

1039
00:53:02,719 --> 00:53:04,680
Speaker 5: Jake that's been most impressive to me is not even

1040
00:53:04,719 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 5: the on field results. It's the new characteristics. It's the standard,

1041
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:10,759
Speaker 5: it's the discipline, it's the although it was not the

1042
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:13,200
Speaker 5: case this last game. It's the lack of penalties and

1043
00:53:13,239 --> 00:53:15,680
Speaker 5: in the bonehead plays that we have seen in the past,

1044
00:53:15,719 --> 00:53:19,680
Speaker 5: and that stuff has mostly gone away since Signetti got here.

1045
00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:23,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, bonehead plays was the motto of Indiana football for

1046
00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:28,439
Speaker 1: like one hundred years, right, all right, Well, Scott, cheer

1047
00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:31,200
Speaker 1: them on it'll be it's gonna be exciting, obviously Monday.

1048
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:33,520
Speaker 1: We'll probably talk to you before then, but I certainly

1049
00:53:33,520 --> 00:53:37,360
Speaker 1: appreciate the time. Pacers and action again tomorrow night raptors

1050
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:39,120
Speaker 1: that will be here at the field. I appreciate it.

1051
00:53:39,120 --> 00:53:41,759
Speaker 2: Scott, you've got thanks Jake. It's gott Agnes joining us.