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Speaker 1: Good looking Tuesday outside. And the good news is my

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Speaker 1: sources tell me that starting tomorrow, big warm up on

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Speaker 1: the way, big warm up on the way.

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Speaker 2: And this is the last day that like that.

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Speaker 1: You know that time of year where you get up

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Speaker 1: in the morning and you got to put on a

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Speaker 1: hoodie and a jacket, and then by the later in

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Speaker 1: the day you're like, whoa, it's burning up out here.

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Speaker 1: I actually have no idea whether or not tomorrow is

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Speaker 1: the start of a warm up, but my phone says

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Speaker 1: it's supposed to be warmer. Of course, I'm only going

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Speaker 1: to mention this every day between now and when it happens.

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Speaker 2: But a matter of fact, i'd like to know this now.

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Speaker 1: My cell phone number is three one seven five two

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Speaker 1: three ninety two eighty eight. Okay, three one seven five

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Speaker 1: two three ninety two eighty eight. I'm going to lean

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Speaker 1: on the listeners here to guide me in this direction.

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Speaker 1: Then I'm going to make my own decision.

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Speaker 3: Okay.

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Speaker 1: I think I'm probably in an audience of one on this,

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Speaker 1: but I mentioned and I know Stephen Holder we're going

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Speaker 1: to bring on here. As matter of fact, I'll bring

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Speaker 1: Stephen Holder on here to begin with this question and

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Speaker 1: I need you, folks, the listeners, to text me whether

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Speaker 1: or not I'm going to ask a question at the

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Speaker 1: end of this and I need listeners to send me

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Speaker 1: their answer. Now, Steven Holder, I'm going to let you

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Speaker 1: be the judge and jury here to begin with for

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Speaker 1: this question that I'm then going to ask to the

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Speaker 1: audience as well.

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Speaker 2: Are you ready?

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Speaker 3: It sounds like a big responsibility, but I am ready,

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Speaker 3: I think so.

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Speaker 1: I mentioned yesterday several times. Last year, when I was

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Speaker 1: at the IndyCar Race in Long Beach, I met Christopher Knight.

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Speaker 1: Completely serendipitously met Christopher Knight, who is the actor that

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Speaker 1: portrayed Peter Brady on The Brady Bunch. Okay, now, I

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Speaker 1: watched The Brady Bunch after like as a kid, all

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Speaker 1: the time. I even when I did a radio show

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Speaker 1: in high school, I did Possible Brady Bunch Trivia, which

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Speaker 1: the same three people shockingly were the only three that participated.

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Speaker 1: But so when I met Christopher Knight, he says to me,

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Speaker 1: oh man, next year on race weekend, hit me up

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Speaker 1: ahead of time, and I'll take you to the Brady

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Speaker 1: Bunch House that's now been renovated as an exact replica

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Speaker 1: of the radioch house. He's like, I'll take you by

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Speaker 1: the house where it was filmed and I'll show you

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Speaker 1: around and we'll do videos and have fun with it

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Speaker 1: and whatever else. And of course people say that and

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Speaker 1: they're being folksy, and of course I get his phone

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Speaker 1: number and follow up and then send him a thing

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Speaker 1: like all right, I'm coming back for the race.

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Speaker 2: Are we on? And he's like, yeah, actually we are.

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Speaker 2: Let's do it.

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Speaker 1: So we have this big grandio so plan where We're

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Speaker 1: going to go to the Brady Bunch house and I'm

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Speaker 1: going to be with the guy that played Peter Brady,

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Speaker 1: and he's going to take me through all the Brady

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Speaker 1: Bunch filming locations. And here's my question. I then said

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Speaker 1: to him, I need you on the radio show to

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Speaker 1: talk about the great adventures that we're about to get into,

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Speaker 1: and also to talk to you about as he and

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Speaker 1: I talked about the Brady Bunch connection to the Indianapolis

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Speaker 1: five hundred back in the early seventies. Now, my question

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Speaker 1: is that you know, we're talking about stuff from fifty

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Speaker 1: years ago.

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Speaker 2: Okay, So.

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Speaker 1: Is this should I have on Christopher Knight aka Peter Brady?

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Speaker 1: Should I bring him on for a segment on the

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Speaker 1: show to talk about the Brady Bunch and King's Island

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Speaker 1: and the Hawaiian episode and the Indianapolis five hundre connection

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Speaker 1: to the Brady Bunch, and to preview my.

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Speaker 2: Big trip through the House. Steven, hold, are your thoughts

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Speaker 2: yes or no?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think you're selling this pretty well. I

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Speaker 3: think I'm now curious. I now feel invested. I didn't

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Speaker 3: know any of this existed five minutes ago, but I

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Speaker 3: now feel invested. I think I want to know. I

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Speaker 3: mean now I am of a certain age too, so listen.

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Speaker 3: You know, my summer consisted of a lot of Brady

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Speaker 3: Bunch episodes when I was a kid. Okay, I'm with

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Speaker 3: you on that. I mean, I probably have seen every episode.

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Speaker 3: I'm not gonna lie. You know. I don't think I'm

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Speaker 3: quite the Brady Bunch fan that you are. But who

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Speaker 3: is right?

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Speaker 1: Yes, this is this is a revelation that was coming

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Speaker 1: out of the radio in the last few days.

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Speaker 2: Yes, that's correct.

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Speaker 3: You do seem to be like, you know, you're you're

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Speaker 3: a big fan. It seems like, and that's cool.

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Speaker 2: Honestly, groupy, Steven, you can say it, groupye. Talk about

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Speaker 2: the Colts Kicking.

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Speaker 3: Yeah right, I mean how many how many channels did

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Speaker 3: we have? Like in nine eighty four, that's right, Summer

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Speaker 3: was I know, we're getting way in the weeds here,

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Speaker 3: but summer was Brady Bunch, Gilligan's Island? What what else

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Speaker 3: I dream of? Genie?

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Speaker 1: There was nothing that irked me more than when they

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Speaker 1: would take either Gilligan's Island or The Brady Bunch and

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Speaker 1: occasionally drop them out of rotation for a season for

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Speaker 1: reruns of Green Acres or Hazel Like Hazel made Melas.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, both those shows made me.

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Speaker 3: Also. Also, the Beverly Hillbillies didn't need it.

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Speaker 1: No, yeah, I don't need I'm with you there, Okay,

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Speaker 1: give me the Brady Bunch. So here is my b

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Speaker 1: By the way, did you ever see the movie? Oh gosh,

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Speaker 1: what was the boxing movie? Stephen Eddie helped me out

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Speaker 1: boxing movie with Russell Crowe where he plays the underdog boxer.

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Speaker 3: This sounds familiar.

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Speaker 2: I think it was Russell.

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Speaker 1: Crowe, right, I can't believe that I just forgot the name.

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Speaker 1: But it's a true story. It's a true story, and

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Speaker 1: it's about you know. Max Bear was the heavyweight champion

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Speaker 1: that Cinderella Man. I think it was called Cinderella Man.

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Speaker 1: So it's it's it's a truth, okay. The true story

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Speaker 1: during the Depression era, true story of a guy that

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Speaker 1: goes into boxing during the Depression. He becomes the Cinderella

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Speaker 1: Heavyweight Champion of the world by knocking out Max Bear,

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Speaker 1: who was the absolute you know, the tyson of the era. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: Max Bear's son is the actor that portrays Jethrow on

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Speaker 1: the Leobillies.

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Speaker 2: So there's your sports tie in.

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Speaker 1: So my question for the listening audience at three one seven,

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Speaker 1: but go ahead, is this your first rodeo on this program, Stephen,

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Speaker 1: I need to know from the listening audience. Christopher Knight,

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Speaker 1: yes or no, he's I'm having him on. I can

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Speaker 1: tell you right now. But do I have like are

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Speaker 1: you would you as the listener? Are you interested in

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Speaker 1: me talking with Peter Brady about his time as Peter

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Speaker 1: Brady and then previewing the big trip that we're going

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Speaker 1: to take together. There's my question for the audience. Please

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Speaker 1: text me your answer. Okay, Steven. With that all said, let's.

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Speaker 3: I think based on your answer, I think you know

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Speaker 3: when you should actually air this interview, Like should you

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Speaker 3: do it like when the ratings get measured, or should

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Speaker 3: you do it like you know when listen.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to do it when the ratings get measured,

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Speaker 1: because that'll be an unfair tilt towards my advantage.

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Speaker 2: And then everybody will you know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: Uh?

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Speaker 1: And and by the way, I don't know if you

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Speaker 1: know this or not, but I never declared it. I

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Speaker 1: never declared it, Steven. But there are others that declared

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Speaker 1: the ratings war against me, like two years ago, and

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Speaker 1: ain't around in order to be able to take advantage

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Speaker 1: of anything that might happen with my Peter Brady thing,

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Speaker 1: because that war was one not the battle.

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Speaker 2: But I digress, so so sad, so sad. No.

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Speaker 1: Having said all of that, here's my question for you

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Speaker 1: regarding the Colts, the the Shaquille Leonard. We talked about

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Speaker 1: it a little bit yesterday as well, But the whole

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Speaker 1: situation with Shaquille, Shaquille Leonard, Darius Leonard, and Eric Ebron

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Speaker 1: you were was that of surprise to you that that

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Speaker 1: topic would come into play?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I guess anything. Is its possible when Eric

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Speaker 3: Ebron's involved in terms of, you know, the topic that

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Speaker 3: might get broached. But in terms of the accuracy, there

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Speaker 3: were some issues there, for sure. I, as you can imagine,

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Speaker 3: having covered that in depth, I know a lot about

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Speaker 3: the Andrew Luck situation and and a lot of details,

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Speaker 3: some of which have been reported, some of which you know,

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Speaker 3: we're told to me incompetence, and I am one hundred

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Speaker 3: percent sure that he is at minimum grossly exaggerating, if

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Speaker 3: not outright just telling a fabrication. Here's the bottom you're

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Speaker 3: I'm talking about. In reference to the Andrew Luck person

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Speaker 3: of the story, there was, uh, and maybe we can

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Speaker 3: touch on this if you wish. There was also Sequill

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Speaker 3: Leonard's version of his departure, and you know that I

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Speaker 3: think we can address as well. There's some there's some

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Speaker 3: details in there that you know, I maybe take issue with,

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Speaker 3: But as it relates to the Andrew Luck part of

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Speaker 3: that story, which essentially was that Chris Ballard and company

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Speaker 3: and or Jim Irsey pressured Andrew Luck to come back,

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Speaker 3: gave him an ultimatum as to as to when he

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Speaker 3: needed to get back, or they were quote moving on. Uh, listen,

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Speaker 3: let me tell you with absolute certainty not true. In fact,

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Speaker 3: I will just leave you with this there there were

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Speaker 3: instances well before Andrew Luck made his decision to retire,

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Speaker 3: where there were things that he said that highly suggested

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Speaker 3: in retrospect that he was maybe thinking about a different

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Speaker 3: career path.

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Speaker 1: So the okay, the thing about Shaq Leonard to me

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Speaker 1: that was eyebrow raising was the fact that he insinuated

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Speaker 1: that the Colts unfairly wrote off his playing career and

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Speaker 1: yet and that he could still play even though the

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Speaker 1: Colts thought he couldn't. But yet he went to another

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Speaker 1: franchise and then very shortly thereafter retired because he couldn't

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Speaker 1: play any And when I say he couldn't play anymore,

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Speaker 1: I mean physically speaking, his body didn't cooperate with him.

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Speaker 1: So the you know, the situation kind of defied what

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Speaker 1: it was that he was saying.

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Speaker 3: Right, I think that's true. I mean, I remember he

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Speaker 3: went to the Eagles after his departure from the Colts,

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Speaker 3: and if you recall, you know, they had a ton

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Speaker 3: of defensive injuries in Philly at the time, and he

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Speaker 3: did play initially, and once they got healthy, he never

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Speaker 3: saw the field never, And I think it spoke more

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Speaker 3: to their their desperation because of their injury situation. Than

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Speaker 3: it did to you know, them wanting to have Jack

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Speaker 3: Lennard on their team. So you know he served a

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Speaker 3: purpose for them now for a very brief time, and

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Speaker 3: then once they got healthy. Remember that playoff game they

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Speaker 3: played that year in Tampa Bay where the Eagles.

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Speaker 5: Got absolutely demolished. He never saw the field and they

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Speaker 5: were getting molly wopped, okay, and he did not see

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Speaker 5: the field. So I think that kind of gives you

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Speaker 5: a good example of where his career was headed at

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Speaker 5: that point.

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Speaker 1: You know, I consider myself to have at times a

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Speaker 1: rather vast lexicon. But I don't believe I've heard that

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Speaker 1: word before. Did you say, can you spell that out?

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Speaker 1: Was it molly wopped or molly walked? How did that go?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's a big jay journalism word obviously, you know.

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Speaker 2: Can you spell that for me?

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Speaker 3: So it's so big, I don't think it's in the dictionary.

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Speaker 2: And is it wopped or walked?

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Speaker 3: Now that's a fair question and I don't know the answer.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 3: Uh, you know, I really thought through my use of

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Speaker 3: that term.

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Speaker 2: I like it though. I like it.

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Speaker 1: Steven, let me ask you when you when you first

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Speaker 1: got into journalism, your first job was at what you're

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Speaker 1: first like and I don't mean like in turning whatever us.

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Speaker 1: I mean your first big boy, I'm getting a paycheck

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Speaker 1: job was.

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Speaker 3: Where so I was very fortunate. My first opportunities came

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Speaker 3: at the Miami Herald. Okay, Miami Herald because I started

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Speaker 3: working there through college and facts.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so when you were at the Miami Herald and

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Speaker 1: you went into the Miami Herald, and I'm sure, and

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Speaker 1: there's a reason and a point I'm making here, and

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Speaker 1: anybody listening, no matter what line of work you're in,

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Speaker 1: whether you're a construc diduction worker, whether you're an architect,

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Speaker 1: a lawyer, you know, whatever it might be, I think

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Speaker 1: all people can relate to this. When you look back

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Speaker 1: on your first job, everything it was like the first

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Speaker 1: day of school. You didn't want anybody to know. You

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Speaker 1: were kind of terrified. You really didn't. Everything looked differently

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Speaker 1: than it did after a while because things were moving faster.

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Speaker 2: The room looked bigger, all of it. And there was.

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Speaker 1: Somebody in within that job. And I want to know

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Speaker 1: who it is for you, Stephen, there was somebody that

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Speaker 1: was an elder that you looked up to that kind

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Speaker 1: of took you under their wing, whether they even knew

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Speaker 1: it or not, because you just trusted them and felt

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Speaker 1: comfortable and knew that so long as you kind of

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Speaker 1: looked after them or stayed close to them, that you

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Speaker 1: could find your way and things just felt a little safer. Now,

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Speaker 1: Who was that person for you when you were at

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Speaker 1: the Miami Herald, Oh.

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Speaker 3: There's no question. It was my first editor, Bill Van Smith,

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Speaker 3: who was still with us. Thankfully he's getting up there.

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Speaker 3: But Bill Van Smith was a legendary high school reporter

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Speaker 3: at the Miami Herald. I think he started like in

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Speaker 3: the seventies, and he ran all the high school coverage,

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Speaker 3: high school sports coverage, and like it was his It

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Speaker 3: was like his personal like it was his baby. You know.

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Speaker 3: He treated he treated it like it was like it

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Speaker 3: was professional sports and it was the most important thing

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Speaker 3: to him. So he he taught me like the value

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Speaker 3: of like keeping the relationships with people and keeping people happy.

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Speaker 3: If the tennis coach from I don't know, Braddock High

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Speaker 3: School called and said, you know, we left their results

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Speaker 3: out on Thursday, well he's going to run it again

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Speaker 3: the next day just to make sure that everybody was content,

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Speaker 3: you know, And so Bill was, Yeah, he first, he

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Speaker 3: gave me my first opportunity and h and he kept

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Speaker 3: giving me opportunities even when I screwed up, which is

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Speaker 3: you know which is? I guess I don't know good

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Speaker 3: or bad, but I don't know if I earned him.

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Speaker 3: But I'm glad you did do that.

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Speaker 2: By the way, Braddock High School.

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Speaker 1: Funny you mentioned that James Braddock was the name of

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Speaker 1: the boxer that Russell Crowe played in Cinerella.

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Speaker 4: Man.

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Speaker 2: It just came me when you said that, not the name.

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Speaker 2: Here's why. Of course, that's what we do on the show.

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Speaker 2: So and believe me.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes it's about like this circle that goes around the

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Speaker 1: moon right now, for that group, it feels like it

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Speaker 1: takes ten days. But that's okay, Stephen. The reason I

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Speaker 1: mention it. So you're at the Miami Herald and Bill

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Speaker 1: Van Smith from the get go, you walk in and

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Speaker 1: at times you feel like you don't even belong, but

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Speaker 1: Bill Van Smith makes you feel comfortable and allows you

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Speaker 1: to navigate through and slow things down. Okay, ironic or

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Speaker 1: surprising because the relationship would be that of being the superior.

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Speaker 1: But is it possible that in the first year of

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Speaker 1: autonomy as an owner that carly Ers Gordon actually saw

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Speaker 1: Chris Ballard as her Bill van Smith that as she was,

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Speaker 1: And I don't mean that condescendiary towards her and anyway,

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Speaker 1: shape or form, But for the very first year now

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Speaker 1: with the loss of her father and familiarity and comfort

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Speaker 1: level of knowing that that guiding force was always there,

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Speaker 1: and now all of a sudden she's walking into the

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Speaker 1: building and things are different, and the role is different,

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Speaker 1: and it looks and feels different, but she finds comfort

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Speaker 1: in at least knowing that she has like a big

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Speaker 1: brother there that can guide her through and that stabilizing

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Speaker 1: force is Chris Ballard. Any chance, that's the dynamic.

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Speaker 3: So I think the question is a reasonable question. I

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Speaker 3: think where where might be true in this situation. In

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Speaker 3: a lot of places, I would say I maybe don't

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Speaker 3: know that it's the case as much here. And here's why.

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Speaker 3: I think most ownership situations you do not have someone

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Speaker 3: that is as intimately and deeply involved with running the

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Speaker 3: football team as carl Or Gordon. And I mean even

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Speaker 3: like legitimate you know, one hundred percent owners, they tend

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Speaker 3: to take a back seat to a great degree. They

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Speaker 3: certainly are not as present as she is she having

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Speaker 3: immersed herself in every aspect of the organization, you know,

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Speaker 3: whether it was her work in a ticket office when

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Speaker 3: she was like, you know, twenty years old or whatever.

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Speaker 3: She has learned the ropes. It doesn't mean that you

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Speaker 3: have a full understanding of everything. She will still often

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Speaker 3: defer to Chris Ballard on a lot of questions right

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Speaker 3: when we start talking about the roster and very specific things,

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Speaker 3: which she should probably do anyway, with whoever the GM is.

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Speaker 3: But in terms of having an understanding and having instincts

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Speaker 3: about how things should work, I think she's in a

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Speaker 3: pretty good place there. It does. It is a benefit

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Speaker 3: no matter how much you understand things and how well

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Speaker 3: versed you are, It is a benefit to have an

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Speaker 3: experienced general manager who knows the even if you think

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Speaker 3: that person has made some questionable decisions on the day

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Speaker 3: to day stuff, right, It is definitely a benefit to

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Speaker 3: have an experienced GM who has done it year after year.

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Speaker 3: So I have no doubt that his experience in the job,

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Speaker 3: and I'm talking about like the granular stuff of the job, right,

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Speaker 3: that helps carli Ersa Gordon and her sisters. There's no

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Speaker 3: question about that. Now, could they do it with a

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Speaker 3: different general manager at clean house and do it with

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Speaker 3: the general manager. Yes, I believe they could, and I

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Speaker 3: don't think they would miss much of a beat because

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Speaker 3: they have given themselves that education and from the ground

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Speaker 3: floor up. So that's a good thing if you're a

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Speaker 3: Colts fan. They get it.

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Speaker 2: Stephen.

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Speaker 6: I know Chris Ballard has said, hey, we've done this

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Speaker 6: before of not drafting in the first round, but this

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Speaker 6: is the first time since Ballard has taken over. And

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Speaker 6: I want to give Kevin Bowen a little credit here

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Speaker 6: because I know he's been really harping on this. If

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Speaker 6: you look at the draft class history for Chris Ballard,

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Speaker 6: in the years that they did not have a first

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Speaker 6: round pick, they at least had multi full seconds or

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Speaker 6: multiple thirds. This year that is simply not the case.

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Speaker 6: And I know Balot is already hinted at trading back.

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Speaker 6: Can they afford to trade back given the need at

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Speaker 6: at linebacker at edge rush, is that worth it in

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Speaker 6: their opinion, just to get an extra pick or two?

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Speaker 3: And a good question. I mean, I think back to

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Speaker 3: to to make your point or to to solidify your point,

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Speaker 3: I think back to the twenty twenty draft right where

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Speaker 3: they get I mean basically two first round talents and

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Speaker 3: Michael Pittman and Jonathan Taylor back to back in the

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Speaker 3: second round, and you know you can do that. Hey,

359
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,720
Speaker 3: because they had early first round picks, sorry, early second rounders,

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Speaker 3: that should say so that matters this year their first

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Speaker 3: pick not till forty seven there, I'm trying to remember.

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Speaker 3: I think they traded out or was that that might

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Speaker 3: have been the the Forrest Buckner year. It's all runny

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Speaker 3: to get it. The point is they had they had

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Speaker 3: more to work with there. I think here having that

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Speaker 3: single second rounder at number forty seven, it doesn't feel

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Speaker 3: like you have as many options. I think that is

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Speaker 3: going to be a debate for them. I think if

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Speaker 3: they feel like their their emphasis is more on getting

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Speaker 3: getting you know, numerous players that can help their depth,

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Speaker 3: or if their goal is to get a potential high

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Speaker 3: level player, then you or if they think one's available,

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Speaker 3: then you stay. If if you think maybe that player

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Speaker 3: is not available and you need to go the route

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Speaker 3: of getting value, then trading down then becomes a viable option.

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Speaker 3: And with Chris Ballad, it's always on the table. So

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Speaker 3: I know no one wants to hear that, but I

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Speaker 3: do think it's fair to talk about it because he

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Speaker 3: has a history of doing it and the situation may

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Speaker 3: suggest that it makes some sense this year, So we'll

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Speaker 3: have to see. It will really just depend on how

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Speaker 3: how that first day goes and how I think they

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00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:03,560
Speaker 3: two is playing out. But it's always on the table

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Speaker 3: at Chris Ballard and I would get the logic if

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Speaker 3: they did it.

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Speaker 6: Back in that Jonathan Taylor draft, they had an extra third,

387
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Speaker 6: that's why they were able to trade up into the

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Speaker 6: second round to go get Taylor and whatever that Behind

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Speaker 6: the scenes the Colts video that they did.

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Speaker 2: Jim Mersey was on the Zoom call.

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Speaker 6: He goes, you guys have not stopped talking about this

392
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Speaker 6: Jonathan Taylor guy. Go up and get him, Which brings

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Speaker 6: me to this next point. If there was a guy

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Speaker 6: that Chris Ballard absolutely loves, like last year was Justin Walling,

395
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Speaker 6: and he said he couldn't leave the draft without taking

396
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Speaker 6: Justin Walley. And they're on the board at forty seven

397
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Speaker 6: and they see him at forty two. Are they going

398
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Speaker 6: to be in a position to where they can afford

399
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Speaker 6: to trade up five spots and give up a pick

400
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Speaker 6: either this year or even next year to go get

401
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Speaker 6: a guy that they really really like.

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Speaker 3: That gets tough. It's a good question, it gets tough.

403
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Speaker 3: I think you have to decide how much do you

404
00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:58,120
Speaker 3: need those mid rounders. I think that would it wouldn't

405
00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:00,399
Speaker 3: be super expensive to do something like that, you know,

406
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,520
Speaker 3: to go up six or seven spots, that's very doable.

407
00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:07,639
Speaker 3: But you know, depending on who's still on the board.

408
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,600
Speaker 3: You know, teams may have multiple trade options, and if

409
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Speaker 3: they do, then it gets more expensive. Right, So I

410
00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 3: really think it's they don't have as much luxury this

411
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:20,439
Speaker 3: year as they as they prefer to have. There's no

412
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Speaker 3: question about that. So I mean they're hypotheticals. Who knows,

413
00:21:23,920 --> 00:21:28,080
Speaker 3: but I do think that scenario you painted it will

414
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Speaker 3: be more challenging than when you have a surplus of picks.

415
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Speaker 3: I always, I always lean toward Chris Ballard moving down

416
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Speaker 3: rather than moving up. Now, when he has traded up,

417
00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:42,840
Speaker 3: it's been in the second round in large part, so

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Speaker 3: that's certainly an option. But this year, just given the

419
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,680
Speaker 3: lack of resources they have, I lean toward trading down.

420
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Speaker 3: If he does that, if he makes them move at all.

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00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,320
Speaker 1: Steven, I'm going to incorporate one of my impossible Brady

422
00:21:56,359 --> 00:21:57,600
Speaker 1: bunch of trivia questions for you.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I actually I.

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Speaker 1: Think mentioned this on the air a couple of weeks ago,

425
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Speaker 1: so you know, and I know that you might be

426
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Speaker 1: behind on your you know, podcast listening, right, so maybe

427
00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:11,240
Speaker 1: you missed it. There is the episode where Greg Brady

428
00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:16,640
Speaker 1: realizes that Jerry Rodgers, the rat Fink quarterback from Fairview,

429
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Speaker 1: is flirting with Marcia in an attempt to get the

430
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,240
Speaker 1: playbook from the kitchen counter of the Brady Bunch House

431
00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:26,160
Speaker 1: because they're getting ready to play Westdale in the Big

432
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 1: Conference championship game. Okay, I don't know if you recall

433
00:22:29,800 --> 00:22:30,639
Speaker 1: this episode or not.

434
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,560
Speaker 3: I have only a vague recollection of this episode of

435
00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:38,240
Speaker 3: the House Familiar but so.

436
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Speaker 2: So thank you.

437
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,000
Speaker 1: So Jerry Rodgers ends up swiping the playbook, but of

438
00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:45,320
Speaker 1: course Bobby is Johnny on the scene and realizes this happens,

439
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,360
Speaker 1: so they know that, so they actually put out a

440
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:54,679
Speaker 1: fake playbook. Jerry Rodgers steals a fake playbook. Now, Mike Brady,

441
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:57,399
Speaker 1: being the scrupulous man that he is, you know, because

442
00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,680
Speaker 1: he's an architect in life as well as buildings, he

443
00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:02,520
Speaker 1: says to the guys, listen, you need to let Jerry

444
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 1: Rodgers know it's a fake playbook because you need to

445
00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,320
Speaker 1: win the game fair and square. So Greg calls Jerry

446
00:23:07,359 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 1: Rodgers at his house and says, look, the book's a phony.

447
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:14,400
Speaker 1: Then Jerry says, Greg, you're the phony. But it's nineteen

448
00:23:14,560 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 1: seventy one, I believe when that episode was done, And

449
00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:20,639
Speaker 1: Jerry Rogers in his bedroom has two NFL posters on

450
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,480
Speaker 1: the wall behind him, both of which franchises that no

451
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 1: longer are in the city that are on the posters

452
00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:31,240
Speaker 1: behind him. What two franchises does Jerry Rodgers have hanging

453
00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 1: in his bedroom in nineteen seventy one?

454
00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,640
Speaker 3: Wow? Which players?

455
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,639
Speaker 1: They're just generic posters of the team. They have the

456
00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,679
Speaker 1: helmet and then like generic illustrations of a football player.

457
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,480
Speaker 1: All right, very seventies, very seventies posters?

458
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:51,080
Speaker 3: Is one the Raiders?

459
00:23:51,760 --> 00:23:55,560
Speaker 1: The Raiders is indeed correct. Oakland Raiders is indeed correct.

460
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,680
Speaker 1: Now you're halfway there. What is the other franchise?

461
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 3: Ooh, Houston Oilers. Nah? I don't know if they were

462
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:05,399
Speaker 3: around back.

463
00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:06,879
Speaker 2: Then, great guests.

464
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:07,200
Speaker 4: Keep it.

465
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:11,440
Speaker 1: Keep in mind, keep in mind where Fairview and Westdale,

466
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,240
Speaker 1: what city they lived in. Keep in mind keep in

467
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,160
Speaker 1: mind where the Brady bunch of where the Brady's.

468
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:22,400
Speaker 3: Lived gotcha, uh, San Diego Chargers.

469
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,040
Speaker 1: Okay, another excellent guest. I was trying to throw you

470
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: down the wrong path. There the correct answer, by the way,

471
00:24:30,200 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 1: the Baltimore Colts, the Baltimore Colts. I was just trying

472
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:35,800
Speaker 1: to throw you off there. Baltimore Colts and Oakland.

473
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:36,600
Speaker 3: All right, I got you.

474
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:39,199
Speaker 1: I got Jerry Rodgers a fan of those two teams. Now,

475
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:41,320
Speaker 1: I will also let you know from a football standpoint,

476
00:24:41,520 --> 00:24:44,679
Speaker 1: there was the episode where Carroll had during homecoming for

477
00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:47,200
Speaker 1: the Big matter of fact, same episode for the Big Game,

478
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: same episode, Tank, the old football star from Westdale, comes

479
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 1: back to visit and recounts to Mike and Carroll his

480
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:58,800
Speaker 1: football heroics that the guy that played Tank actually was

481
00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 1: born in Bloomington. In his day, I was an athletic

482
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,959
Speaker 1: director and coach at Indiana University. There you go in

483
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:04,680
Speaker 1: real life.

484
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 3: Now, that is a hell of a lot of information.

485
00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 2: But I'm impressed, Steven, and I'll leave it with this.

486
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:15,879
Speaker 1: When you get done with these the dog and Pony

487
00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 1: show that is this program, do you ever actually then

488
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:20,960
Speaker 1: when you sit down for dinner at night, think to yourself,

489
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:22,879
Speaker 1: you know, I'm really lucky to be a part of

490
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 1: that roller coaster ride.

491
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:30,359
Speaker 3: I often, you know, yes, I do, actually, and you know,

492
00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:33,440
Speaker 3: I often have the same feeling that I did after

493
00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:36,600
Speaker 3: talking to the late great Jim Ersa. And what I

494
00:25:36,640 --> 00:25:39,639
Speaker 3: mean by that is he would drop these random facts

495
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,560
Speaker 3: on you, and you'd be like, there is no way

496
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,119
Speaker 3: that that is true, that that is absolutely false. And

497
00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:48,560
Speaker 3: I would find myself going to Google and being like,

498
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 3: all right, did this actually happened? And he'd be right

499
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:56,639
Speaker 3: to some degree most of the time, including the time

500
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:00,960
Speaker 3: he mentioned that the Baltimore Colts lost a game at

501
00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 3: Three Rivers Stadium in Pittsburgh and after the game, a

502
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:09,320
Speaker 3: Sessna crashed into the upper deck of the stadium, and

503
00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 3: I think it was Mike Wells and I or maybe

504
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:14,120
Speaker 3: Zach Keifer, and we looked at each other like, there's

505
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 3: no way that's true, absolutely true. So fun fact for

506
00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:21,520
Speaker 3: the day Assessna crashed into the upper deck of Three

507
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:25,359
Speaker 3: Rivers Stadium after a Colts game against the Christy.

508
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:27,080
Speaker 1: You know, there might be three to one odds that

509
00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 1: that Baltimore Colts poster that was in Jerry Rodgers' bedroom

510
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 1: on the Brady Bunch set is actually was part of

511
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,680
Speaker 1: the Erst collection and that's entirely possible.

512
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 3: By the way, it is possible. The the.

513
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 1: When you talk about like Jim or say, and the

514
00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,159
Speaker 1: things that he would recall if it came to the

515
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:49,400
Speaker 1: Colts and football itself. I don't think there's any question

516
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 1: that the guy was an almanac, right, I mean that

517
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,280
Speaker 1: is I think we can safely say that, right.

518
00:26:55,359 --> 00:27:00,199
Speaker 3: No. No, his his recollection and appreciation for like just

519
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:04,040
Speaker 3: random history is incredible, I mean incredible, and I think

520
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:07,199
Speaker 3: it's reflected in the collection. And also, just like I

521
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 3: said in conversation with him, I mean his ability. Listen,

522
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,360
Speaker 3: the guy was quirky and he had a lot going on,

523
00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:18,000
Speaker 3: and listen, he wasn't very he was not very mindful

524
00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 3: of his of his sensibilities, you know, because of his habits. Right,

525
00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 3: But I would say this, he he had an amazing recall.

526
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:32,440
Speaker 3: Amazing recall and his appreciation for like fun facts and

527
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:35,000
Speaker 3: things like that. I mean, I'm telling you, without fail,

528
00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 3: I would find myself walking out of the room and

529
00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:39,800
Speaker 3: being like, where's my phone? I got to google this?

530
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:44,320
Speaker 3: So I'm telling you really really intriguing. And I do

531
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 3: miss some of those conversations. They were funny.

532
00:27:46,640 --> 00:27:49,639
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like I said, my thought is, and my hope

533
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,080
Speaker 1: is that doing this show, like talking to the late

534
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:54,480
Speaker 1: great Jim Mersey, was like riding a roller coaster. Not

535
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,800
Speaker 1: to be confused, for example, with the racer that the

536
00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 1: Brady's raced at the end of the Brady Bunch episode

537
00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy three.

538
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:05,159
Speaker 2: Steven, appreciate the time as always.

539
00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:06,880
Speaker 3: I'll get that's right, we're talking to gym again.

540
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:10,320
Speaker 1: I guess NFL Draft April twenty third. We'll talk to

541
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,120
Speaker 1: Stephen between now and then. Appreciate the time as always, Stephen.

542
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 3: You got it.

543
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:20,280
Speaker 1: I'd Stephen Holder joining us on the guest line. Mike

544
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 1: de COURSEI covered the Final four last night and once

545
00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,359
Speaker 1: again Indianapolis hit it out of the park. Mike, I

546
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 1: had to laugh because at one point, and I didn't disagree.

547
00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 2: With you, you.

548
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:31,600
Speaker 1: Sit a post at one point in the game that

549
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:33,960
Speaker 1: said something like, this is the worst three minutes of

550
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,439
Speaker 1: basketball I've seen in a while. When there was just

551
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:38,720
Speaker 1: a stretch there was kind of ugly. It felt to

552
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 1: me like the Connecticut Butler Final from a decade and

553
00:28:43,320 --> 00:28:46,560
Speaker 1: a half ago, where maybe that's just what happens in

554
00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 1: the in the finals, right where players get tense and

555
00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 1: defense ramps up, and it just felt like last night

556
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 1: that was a game where nobody got truly into flow,

557
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:02,720
Speaker 1: but Michigan's depth simply paid off for them. But first off,

558
00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 1: thanks for joining the show. And you're overwhelming or your

559
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:07,720
Speaker 1: I guess your overriding thoughts from last evening.

560
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 4: Well, you know when you said players get tense and

561
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:16,240
Speaker 4: all that, but you left out officials let too much go. Yeah,

562
00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 4: this was not a well officiated final four. They went

563
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:24,960
Speaker 4: backward from where the game had been for the other

564
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 4: twenty weeks of the season. However long it lasts, it

565
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:32,760
Speaker 4: had been the most beautiful basketball season we had seen.

566
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 4: It the continued progression of freedom of movement. The late

567
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 4: John Adams, my friend John Adams, who had been the

568
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,640
Speaker 4: coordinator of officials, who tried to get that rock up

569
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 4: the mountain a little more than a decade ago and

570
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,080
Speaker 4: it kind of came backward, and then since has been

571
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 4: carried forward up that hill and they've gotten it to

572
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:55,720
Speaker 4: the top of the mountain. This season was beautiful and

573
00:29:55,800 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 4: the final four was not because they allowed I don't

574
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 4: know whether it'say they diff didn't want to listen to

575
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:05,440
Speaker 4: Dan Hurley or what, but they allowed Keeton Wogler to

576
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 4: get pounded, and they allowed last night's game to devolve

577
00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 4: into what it became. And they're not entirely to blame

578
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 4: for that, but their job is to call the game

579
00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 4: as it had been called all year long, and they

580
00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 4: chose to say, well, you know, we don't really want

581
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 4: to decide the game here, because when I look up

582
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:30,760
Speaker 4: at those two teams and there's maybe five minutes left

583
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:32,760
Speaker 4: in the first half or something like that, and I

584
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 4: look at their personal files team files and it's like

585
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:39,760
Speaker 4: three or four, I'm like, they're not watching the game

586
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 4: that I'm watching. And you know, ultimately Solo Ball gets

587
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 4: four and Silas Emery gets decuted. But it wasn't called

588
00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:52,400
Speaker 4: closely enough for the most.

589
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 7: Part, and that's a part of why we saw what

590
00:30:55,600 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 7: we saw and with that, But at the same time,

591
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 7: and I don't disagree with it that Mike especially, I mean,

592
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 7: Wogler had one play in the semi finals where I mean,

593
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 7: I was like, how do you not call that foul

594
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:09,200
Speaker 7: on a steal?

595
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:13,560
Speaker 1: But was it two laxed both ways? In other words,

596
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 1: it didn't seem stylistically maybe it favored somebody, but it

597
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,360
Speaker 1: wasn't like the whistle was swallowed on one end and

598
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 1: aggressive on the other.

599
00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 2: Correct.

600
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 4: Oh no, no, I'm not accusing that at all. No, no,

601
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:27,640
Speaker 4: I'm just talking about the tone. Yeah, it certainly probably

602
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:31,440
Speaker 4: favored Yukon to go that way, but Michigan can handle themselves.

603
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,720
Speaker 4: They're physically one of the most powerful teams we've seen

604
00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 4: in college basketball. So it wasn't about that. It was

605
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 4: about we want to watch the game at its best,

606
00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 4: and like, if you get the NBA playoffs, and we

607
00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:47,600
Speaker 4: saw this with the Pacers the last two years, it

608
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 4: gets much more physical. But the players are so good

609
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 4: that it that it almost needs to be that physical,

610
00:31:55,000 --> 00:31:57,560
Speaker 4: so it's not one seventy five to one seventy at

611
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 4: the end. And so I don't I don't have a

612
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:02,719
Speaker 4: problem with that at the NBA because the players are

613
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,440
Speaker 4: just so talented that they can overcome it. But at

614
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,640
Speaker 4: the college level they're not, and so I think it

615
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 4: impedes the ability of the game to proceed as the

616
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:19,120
Speaker 4: entertainment that it should be. When you have you had

617
00:32:19,320 --> 00:32:23,200
Speaker 4: great games all throughout this tournament that were really cleanly played,

618
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 4: and then you get to the final four, the Semis

619
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 4: in the final and they're already nervous and so they're

620
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 4: going to miss shots on that basis, and then you

621
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 4: add in the complication that they're being that the game

622
00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 4: is being played as if Bob Huggins were coaching against

623
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 4: tomas Um. That's a good way to put it, Mike.

624
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:45,880
Speaker 1: When you look at Mike's COURSI is my guest Sporting News,

625
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:47,720
Speaker 1: of course, where you can read Mike's work in a

626
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 1: column that I want to get to in a second

627
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 1: about a new coaching hiring college basketball that you wrote about.

628
00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 1: But when we look at last night's game Michigan and Connecticut,

629
00:32:57,160 --> 00:33:01,040
Speaker 1: and you know, sports sometimes can become where programs try

630
00:33:01,080 --> 00:33:05,320
Speaker 1: to replicate what is working somewhere. Connecticut, it goes without saying,

631
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:08,560
Speaker 1: I mean, everybody knows sensational freshmen and Brayla Mullins they had,

632
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: you know, in Caraban, a player that came to Connecticut

633
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:14,840
Speaker 1: when Connecticut was down really and was rewarded with the

634
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:18,680
Speaker 1: four great years there. Michigan, on the other hand, somewhat

635
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:23,640
Speaker 1: by necessity using the transfer portal and NIL to get

636
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 1: themselves a fresh starting five is the happy medium in

637
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:30,360
Speaker 1: terms of the way that you need to build a

638
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 1: program kind of between those two or is it going

639
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,840
Speaker 1: to be a variety that we see Mike moving forward.

640
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:40,680
Speaker 1: As to terms of how coaches decide to build their roster.

641
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 4: Well, I think you have to look at Michigan, as

642
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,560
Speaker 4: you mentioned that they brought in the starting five, and

643
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:51,479
Speaker 4: although Namari Burnett was a transfer, but he's been at

644
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,320
Speaker 4: Michigan for like four years. I mean, he played a

645
00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 4: lot of years because of injury in the COVID year.

646
00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:00,360
Speaker 4: I think he was in college basketball for six seasons,

647
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 4: but a lot of that time was spent at Michigan.

648
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:06,160
Speaker 4: And Will Cheddar spent all five of his years at Michigan.

649
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 4: And Will Cheddar was a really important part of Michigan

650
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 4: when when they don't I don't know if they showed

651
00:34:12,680 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 4: it on television, but at the end of the half,

652
00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:18,960
Speaker 4: the first half of Michigan didn't play great, but they

653
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:23,279
Speaker 4: are ahead. Will it's Will Cheddar who grabs everybody, all

654
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:27,920
Speaker 4: the players, reserve starters, everybody, and he's the one talking

655
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,880
Speaker 4: in the huddle about what the standard needs to be

656
00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:33,399
Speaker 4: for the second half. How you know, how they should

657
00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,080
Speaker 4: still be confident, how they should look at it like, Okay,

658
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 4: well did play the best, but but we played well

659
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 4: enough to be ahead so now let's go play the

660
00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:43,319
Speaker 4: best and all that sort of stuff it's coming from

661
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 4: will that you can't. I don't. I mean, maybe somebody's

662
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,560
Speaker 4: gonna someday bring in the you know, uh starting five

663
00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 4: that's equivalent of the Indiana seventy six starting five, and

664
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,040
Speaker 4: they're gonna go out and win every game or close

665
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:02,120
Speaker 4: to it. Maybe that's gonna happened. But I still believe

666
00:35:02,239 --> 00:35:05,719
Speaker 4: that if you had thrown Namari Burnett out because he

667
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:08,799
Speaker 4: wasn't a great player, and you threw wiltchaut Chatter out

668
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:12,520
Speaker 4: because he was, you know, an eighth man. Uh, if

669
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:14,680
Speaker 4: you had thrown L. J. Cason out because he wasn't

670
00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:16,920
Speaker 4: going to start for you because you were going to

671
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:19,600
Speaker 4: bring in Cado or whatever, if you would if you

672
00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:22,799
Speaker 4: do that, I don't think Michigan's holding the trophe no either.

673
00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:25,440
Speaker 4: I think that you have to have people in your

674
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:28,520
Speaker 4: program who are committed to the university, committed to the

675
00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:32,800
Speaker 4: culture of their program, and and and love that block

676
00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 4: Am in this case, or the Candy straight Pants in

677
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:39,279
Speaker 4: another case, or the you know, the paint crew in

678
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 4: another case. If you don't have those players, I just

679
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:45,439
Speaker 4: don't think you win the whole thing.

680
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:50,840
Speaker 1: It is still Mike. It is simply the best tournament

681
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:52,920
Speaker 1: in sport, is it not. I mean, there's just so

682
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:55,960
Speaker 1: even though we didn't have this year, and maybe for

683
00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:58,280
Speaker 1: the last two years, we have not seen the regularity

684
00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 1: of the Center. Everybody falls in love with its story,

685
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 1: the Loyola Marymount, the Northern Iowa. You know, you and

686
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:07,319
Speaker 1: I've talked about some of those great moments. This year

687
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:09,360
Speaker 1: might have been void of some of that to an extent,

688
00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:14,360
Speaker 1: but it still is. There's just a magic about March,

689
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 1: is there not?

690
00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 4: There is? And I think I think people in regards

691
00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 4: to Cinderella got spoiled during the era what I would

692
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:31,239
Speaker 4: call the rookie salary cap era, when so many players

693
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:35,920
Speaker 4: were leaving quickly because it didn't do them any favors

694
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,400
Speaker 4: to be the first pick or the tenth pick. Just

695
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,600
Speaker 4: being the thirtieth pick got them in the league and

696
00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:44,759
Speaker 4: got them paid, and they had to get paid because

697
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 4: they weren't getting paid where they were. They all understood

698
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:51,919
Speaker 4: their athletic careers were limited and you don't know when

699
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 4: your chance to get paid is, and so guys would

700
00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,160
Speaker 4: go so they could hope to be the thirtieth pick

701
00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:02,640
Speaker 4: and maybe the two and three year guys would go

702
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:05,879
Speaker 4: because they needed to make some money playing. Now all

703
00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 4: those players are not only staying in college basketball and

704
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:13,560
Speaker 4: elevating the level of competition at the major conference level,

705
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,680
Speaker 4: they're fighting to stay in They're going to court. I

706
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,759
Speaker 4: want to be a college player. We have to appreciate

707
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:23,320
Speaker 4: that and what and how that's made the high major

708
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 4: level better. Yeah, the mid major level in this Miami team,

709
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:32,560
Speaker 4: and if we had time traveled this one to twenty

710
00:37:33,440 --> 00:37:36,480
Speaker 4: to twenty fourteen or something, it probably could have made

711
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:40,000
Speaker 4: this Sweet sixteen. They were that good. But the high

712
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:43,759
Speaker 4: major level is better now. The transfer portal, yes, is

713
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:47,839
Speaker 4: taking a significant amount of talent away from the mid majors,

714
00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:51,080
Speaker 4: but they're still getting good players there, and some of

715
00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,400
Speaker 4: the players are coming back to them. I saw a

716
00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 4: player like a player at Akron who had played in

717
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:59,239
Speaker 4: the Big Ten, Evan Mahafey. He played in the Big

718
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,279
Speaker 4: Ten at both Penn's State and Ohio State, and he

719
00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:05,560
Speaker 4: went backward or leveled down or whatever you want to

720
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:08,640
Speaker 4: call it, to the mid major level and was part

721
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:12,120
Speaker 4: of a terrific Mid American Conference tournament champion and got

722
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,160
Speaker 4: to play in the Show. I'm not sure whether he

723
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 4: did it. The other two stuffs you might have I

724
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:18,280
Speaker 4: might have been at Penn State, but I'm not positive.

725
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:23,320
Speaker 4: So I'm not one to complain about the current circumstance,

726
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:26,680
Speaker 4: the idea that we have to have Cinderella. Look in

727
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:29,400
Speaker 4: nineteen eighty five, you didn't have a lot of Cinderella.

728
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 4: I mean, it didn't happen that much. It happened some,

729
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:38,319
Speaker 4: But I still remember showing up in ninety seven in Birmingham.

730
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 4: It's Arizona with Miles Simon and company and Michael Bibbie.

731
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:47,319
Speaker 4: It's It's Kansas with a team. I think that they

732
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 4: came in at like thirty seven and one with.

733
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:52,239
Speaker 2: Shot Rat with friends and Scott Pollard loaded.

734
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:55,560
Speaker 4: Right, yeah, Scott Pollard. I wanted to mention Scott because

735
00:38:56,200 --> 00:39:00,239
Speaker 4: you know, obviously his Indian Indiana connections and Providence which

736
00:39:00,239 --> 00:39:03,720
Speaker 4: had God Sham God and some and and another Austin Crozer,

737
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 4: another Pacer and and and Chattanooga was there. I mean,

738
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 4: come on, like I was supposed to get excited about Chattanooga.

739
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:13,839
Speaker 4: I wasn't excited about Chattanooga. I mean because I knew

740
00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:16,640
Speaker 4: they weren't gonna they weren't gonna win. Uh, And it

741
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:18,719
Speaker 4: was cool that they won the games that they won,

742
00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:21,960
Speaker 4: but they planted their flag around before they were They

743
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:24,240
Speaker 4: weren't gonna win in that quintet in that quarter.

744
00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:28,400
Speaker 2: There was no way, by the way, did that Chattanooga

745
00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:29,440
Speaker 2: team have to o on it.

746
00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:34,840
Speaker 4: I don't remember if they did. I think he was

747
00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:36,840
Speaker 4: in and I think by then he was in the NFL.

748
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 4: I I do think that I actually covered a game

749
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:43,200
Speaker 4: in which he played h when I was covering Memphis.

750
00:39:43,480 --> 00:39:45,680
Speaker 4: I had no idea at the time I was who

751
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:49,080
Speaker 4: I was watching, but I do believe I watched him play.

752
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:51,080
Speaker 4: But I think he had already That was ninety seven.

753
00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:52,799
Speaker 4: I think he was already in it. Oh, by then, I.

754
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:57,160
Speaker 1: Thought Johnny Taylor was there, right, he was in NBA.

755
00:39:57,239 --> 00:39:58,879
Speaker 1: Johnny Taylor had in the lake.

756
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:02,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know player yet.

757
00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 1: Mike, when you look Mike de course, he's my guest

758
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:06,160
Speaker 1: of course Sporting News where you can read him. He's

759
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:07,320
Speaker 1: also on the Big ten network.

760
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 2: Mike.

761
00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: I want to go back to a column that you

762
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 1: have right now as a matter of fact, which I

763
00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:14,920
Speaker 1: thought was a really interesting read. North Carolina hiring NBA

764
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:18,319
Speaker 1: champ Michael Malone is a surprising experiment for a blue

765
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:24,560
Speaker 1: blood program does North Carolina. And I don't mean this

766
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:28,000
Speaker 1: as a disrespect to Michael Malone at all, but at

767
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,439
Speaker 1: least on the surface, it would appear as though North

768
00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:32,640
Speaker 1: Carolina had to go a couple of different avenues before

769
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:37,560
Speaker 1: they found their guy. Does that North Carolina? I mean,

770
00:40:37,600 --> 00:40:42,040
Speaker 1: you know, Michael Jordan's North Carolina Dean Smith, Roy Williams,

771
00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:47,000
Speaker 1: the bluest of blue bloods. Does this create, if you will,

772
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:50,840
Speaker 1: kind of a warning shot to the rest of college

773
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:53,360
Speaker 1: basketball of be careful before you mad. And I'm not

774
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 1: saying Carolina made a knee jerk move, but be careful

775
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: before you enter that arena, because even the bluest of

776
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,319
Speaker 1: blue bloods, it's not that easy to just go out

777
00:41:01,360 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 1: and get somebody.

778
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think you have. I think like, let's use

779
00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:08,879
Speaker 4: Michigan as an example. I mean, eight and twenty four

780
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:12,399
Speaker 4: says you need to make a change, and so they did.

781
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 4: They removed Juwan Howard, and they are a powerful program

782
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:21,800
Speaker 4: and they and they get they wind up with Dusty

783
00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 4: May and they wind up with a title. I don't

784
00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:30,680
Speaker 4: think the problem for Carolina necessarily was was the fact

785
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 4: that they're not a blue blood anymore or anything like that.

786
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:37,360
Speaker 4: I think the problem for them was that they thought

787
00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 4: they needed to hire a resume. I don't think they

788
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 4: made a wise like, Okay, so the first resume they

789
00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:45,680
Speaker 4: look at is Tommy Lloydce. Well yeah, go ahead, yeah,

790
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:49,439
Speaker 4: but don't go. I mean, great resume and great coach,

791
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 4: great college coach, but he's not coming. Why you could

792
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 4: pick up the phone and say, we tried, but you know,

793
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:00,480
Speaker 4: Jennifer Anderson is I'm not looking for a that I'm

794
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 4: happily married. But like if I picked up the phone

795
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,359
Speaker 4: and called Jennifer Anson, she's not answering. You know, it's

796
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:06,240
Speaker 4: just not happening.

797
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, she might be a youtubes fan, Mike, you

798
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:11,319
Speaker 1: don't know that Jennifer Anson might be. She may be

799
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 1: saying to herself, usc, what are they going to do?

800
00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:13,960
Speaker 2: Mike. Of course he'd know.

801
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 1: She might answer not for the reason that you want,

802
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:23,680
Speaker 1: but she might answer I don't tell you herself short.

803
00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 4: But it was it was a waste of time. But

804
00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:28,280
Speaker 4: so they felt that they needed to hire a resume

805
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:31,080
Speaker 4: instead of hiring a coach. And I'm not saying they

806
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:32,640
Speaker 4: didn't hire a coach. They had a great coach, but

807
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:35,920
Speaker 4: they had a great NBA coach, and it's not the

808
00:42:35,960 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 4: same thing. Now, can it become gradually the same thing? Maybe? Sure,

809
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:43,360
Speaker 4: But he's not coached in college in twenty five years.

810
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:46,759
Speaker 4: He coached three different college programs for a total of

811
00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:50,319
Speaker 4: about seven eight years, so he's not totally unfamiliar with

812
00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:53,799
Speaker 4: the level. But he's not been in for twenty five years,

813
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:58,439
Speaker 4: and lots has changed. I just I think that when

814
00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,400
Speaker 4: I'm looking for like dust he May was a resume,

815
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 4: but first he was a coach. You know, if Dusty May,

816
00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:10,439
Speaker 4: I give you a scenario laid in the eight nine

817
00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:15,840
Speaker 4: game in twenty twenty three between Memphis and Florida Atlantic.

818
00:43:16,360 --> 00:43:18,440
Speaker 4: Memphis is winning the game. I think they're up a

819
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:23,320
Speaker 4: point and they and they create a steal when Florida

820
00:43:23,800 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 4: Atlantic is trying to attack for winning a winning shot

821
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:31,040
Speaker 4: or a lead shot and they and Memphis creates the steal,

822
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 4: gets down on the ground, loose ball on the ground.

823
00:43:33,080 --> 00:43:38,160
Speaker 4: Memphis player clearly has by himself, calls timeout. Wasn't granted,

824
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:42,160
Speaker 4: he gets tied up. It's called a health ball. Then

825
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,600
Speaker 4: time out. They go to. Dusty May comes over with

826
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 4: a great play. They get their guy to the rim,

827
00:43:47,880 --> 00:43:51,600
Speaker 4: he scores, they win. If that doesn't if that ball,

828
00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:55,120
Speaker 4: if that timeout is granted to Memphis, Dusty May never

829
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:58,840
Speaker 4: makes the Final four that year. Okay, because Memphis wins,

830
00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:04,560
Speaker 4: Dusty goes. But he's still a great coach. But people

831
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:09,280
Speaker 4: are too worried about hiring a resume, hire the coach

832
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:14,440
Speaker 4: and to do that, talk to people who know. It

833
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,279
Speaker 4: doesn't have to be me. But there are people out there,

834
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:23,480
Speaker 4: Rob Doster, Seth Davis Goodman. Those guys know, or talk

835
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:30,920
Speaker 4: to Billis or Fran those guys know too. But instead

836
00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:34,640
Speaker 4: it's all done at the level of agents and search

837
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:38,440
Speaker 4: firms and people just looking can we sell this? And

838
00:44:38,520 --> 00:44:40,680
Speaker 4: that's why you end up with coaches who fail.

839
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:44,480
Speaker 1: Mike, when you look at Dusty May, Mike de Coursi

840
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,919
Speaker 1: is my guest. When you look at Dusty May, does

841
00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:52,960
Speaker 1: his coaching ability to you more show itself in his

842
00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:57,360
Speaker 1: team's preparation and clearly his ability to break down the

843
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:01,840
Speaker 1: opponent or is it the innov of coming up with

844
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:05,560
Speaker 1: different ways to be effective and making adjustment throughout the

845
00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:06,320
Speaker 1: course of game.

846
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:10,919
Speaker 4: Well, I will say the number Both of those things

847
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,320
Speaker 4: are important, and he's great at them, But the number

848
00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 4: one thing, because we've seen two distinct different teams at

849
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,239
Speaker 4: Michigan in his two years, and you could add in

850
00:45:19,280 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 4: the Florida Atlantic team that we all watched in twenty three.

851
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:25,960
Speaker 4: His guys are connected, they could They are total Like

852
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:31,280
Speaker 4: the guys at FAU, Elijah Martin and Nick Boyd and

853
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:35,440
Speaker 4: those and that group Glad Golden, they were connected. Then

854
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:40,280
Speaker 4: you come to Michigan and it's Danny Wolf and Golden

855
00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:43,160
Speaker 4: again with playing with Danny Wolf's different style of play,

856
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:46,879
Speaker 4: and they're connected. And then those guys are gone and

857
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:49,239
Speaker 4: now you have a totally new group. You have some

858
00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:53,400
Speaker 4: continuity with Burnett and Cheddar like I mentioned, but the

859
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,479
Speaker 4: core guys, the guys that are going to do most

860
00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 4: of the basketballing, who shares it, who scores it? All

861
00:45:59,040 --> 00:46:05,600
Speaker 4: that they are connected. He does extraordinarily well in that department.

862
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:09,279
Speaker 4: And that's the most important thing in basketball. Can the

863
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:12,680
Speaker 4: players play next with each other. I will tell you

864
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:17,239
Speaker 4: that in twenty seventeen, was it in Houston? I went

865
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:21,440
Speaker 4: to write an article. It was twenty sixteen in Houston,

866
00:46:22,239 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 4: went to write an article about Sam Decker's rookie year

867
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:30,080
Speaker 4: with the Rockets, and I was in the Houston Rockets uniform.

868
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 4: That was when Dwight Howard was there. I think Harden

869
00:46:32,800 --> 00:46:35,080
Speaker 4: was on the team. I was in the Houston Rockets

870
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:38,640
Speaker 4: locker room before the game and after the game, and

871
00:46:38,760 --> 00:46:43,279
Speaker 4: that team so was disconnected that there were never in

872
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,400
Speaker 4: my period ten to fifteen, twenty minutes ahead of the game,

873
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:49,239
Speaker 4: half an hour after the game, whatever it was, there

874
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:51,200
Speaker 4: were never two players in the locker room at the

875
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:55,120
Speaker 4: same time. I swear to you never. There were never

876
00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 4: two players in the locker room at the same time.

877
00:46:56,719 --> 00:46:58,680
Speaker 4: Because they didn't want to be around each other. They

878
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:03,360
Speaker 4: found somewhere else to go, right that, So that can happen,

879
00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:06,920
Speaker 4: and that's what That's what Dusty May so far has

880
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:11,080
Speaker 4: shown himself to be expert at getting them to like

881
00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:16,000
Speaker 4: each other, or finding players who are going to connect

882
00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:19,440
Speaker 4: with one another, making sure that you don't recruit players

883
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:24,360
Speaker 4: who are me guys, the EXCELLENTI boorg. I wish I

884
00:47:24,480 --> 00:47:26,680
Speaker 4: was on the Michigan beat this year. I have not.

885
00:47:27,520 --> 00:47:31,720
Speaker 4: I cannot remember. Maybe since Ronald Noried. Can I remember

886
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:35,799
Speaker 4: a player who I enjoyed being around on the way

887
00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:37,839
Speaker 4: through the tournament at the Big ten tournament in his

888
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:40,680
Speaker 4: case as well as here at the Final four. Enjoyed

889
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:44,319
Speaker 4: being around him so much he was so delightful and

890
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:49,759
Speaker 4: so cooperative and so pleasant because he understands like he's

891
00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:52,240
Speaker 4: in an unbelievable position. He's going to have a great

892
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 4: life if he's smart with his money, and so he

893
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:58,399
Speaker 4: chooses happiness. That's a guy I take on my team

894
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 4: every day of the week. And I'm telling you right now,

895
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:04,200
Speaker 4: somebody in the NBA, maybe a lot of somebody's, are

896
00:48:04,239 --> 00:48:06,239
Speaker 4: going to screw up by not taking him because he's

897
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:09,160
Speaker 4: twenty four years old. Listen, want that guy on your team.

898
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: I loved it at the halftime interview and you were

899
00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:13,600
Speaker 1: probably at the game so you didn't see the television interview,

900
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 1: but he's coming off and Tracy Wolfson says, you know,

901
00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:17,960
Speaker 1: how are you feeling? And he says, I feel terrible.

902
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:22,400
Speaker 1: My foot hurts and I can't hit anything. They're like, well,

903
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:25,839
Speaker 1: how sad? For honest, He's like, it's awful, you know.

904
00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:28,719
Speaker 1: But hey, Mike, before I let you go, I wanted

905
00:48:28,760 --> 00:48:31,200
Speaker 1: to ask you about this. I mean, the NCAA tournament.

906
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:33,280
Speaker 1: We talked about how great it is. Sixty eight teams

907
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,600
Speaker 1: looks like it's going to be seventy six. Now, just

908
00:48:38,080 --> 00:48:41,239
Speaker 1: I'll put the table at your feet here tournament expansion.

909
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:46,799
Speaker 4: Go. I am trying to decide whether the dumbest move

910
00:48:46,880 --> 00:48:51,160
Speaker 4: in sports is the MLS going to a winter schedule

911
00:48:51,719 --> 00:48:55,439
Speaker 4: or taking March Madness as seventy six teams. And I'm

912
00:48:55,440 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 4: coming down on the side of March Madness being stupider

913
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 4: because MLS this is filidly searching for something to a degree,

914
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:05,359
Speaker 4: I think they're searching for a goal they can never reach.

915
00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 4: They want to be the best legal It's not going

916
00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:12,560
Speaker 4: to happen. Probably not in three of my lifetimes will

917
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 4: that happen. But as you mentioned, the NCAA tournament is perfect.

918
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:22,959
Speaker 4: It is perfect as it is. Even more to that

919
00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:28,040
Speaker 4: is how going to seventy six will impact the regular

920
00:49:28,120 --> 00:49:31,319
Speaker 4: season by the end of this season. I mean, I

921
00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:34,080
Speaker 4: don't think I'm being unfair when I say this. There

922
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:36,440
Speaker 4: were not a lot of Indiana fans who were like

923
00:49:37,480 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 4: thinking they should be in the tournament. And they were

924
00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:42,680
Speaker 4: not a lot of Indiana fans that I was around

925
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:45,919
Speaker 4: who were like thinking that they were dying to see

926
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:49,400
Speaker 4: that team play more. I mean they spent the entire

927
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:55,000
Speaker 4: stretch run saying, don't pick us, we're good enough, we

928
00:49:55,080 --> 00:49:59,319
Speaker 4: don't have it. And if you had seventy six, they

929
00:49:59,360 --> 00:50:03,360
Speaker 4: would have been a probably on February twenty.

930
00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:07,120
Speaker 1: My thing is this, I did the math earlier, and

931
00:50:07,160 --> 00:50:08,719
Speaker 1: I know that when I say this, you're gonna think

932
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:10,239
Speaker 1: I'm one of the biggest ten foil hat ever.

933
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:11,560
Speaker 2: And I'm a critical overthinker.

934
00:50:11,600 --> 00:50:12,160
Speaker 3: I know that.

935
00:50:12,800 --> 00:50:15,759
Speaker 1: But the ACC Big twelve, Big ten SEC add those

936
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:20,720
Speaker 1: teams up sixty eight total teams. To me, when people

937
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 1: hear the expansion to seventy six and they think this

938
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:26,000
Speaker 1: is great because now Miami is definitely going to get in,

939
00:50:26,120 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 1: and this means that the mobile can get three in

940
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:32,560
Speaker 1: and et cetera. This is designed, in my opinion, and

941
00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:34,279
Speaker 1: I want you to tell me if I'm wrong. This

942
00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:37,520
Speaker 1: is designed to allow them to continue to get in

943
00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:41,080
Speaker 1: as many out of those four as they can out

944
00:50:41,080 --> 00:50:44,160
Speaker 1: of fear of those four leagues somehow revolting against the

945
00:50:44,280 --> 00:50:47,960
Speaker 1: NCAA thoughts, well, I.

946
00:50:48,600 --> 00:50:51,480
Speaker 4: Think that's probably true, and and but what bothers me

947
00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:54,680
Speaker 4: about that? I know I don't think that's probably true.

948
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:56,640
Speaker 4: I think it's definitely true. I think they are. I

949
00:50:56,680 --> 00:50:59,760
Speaker 4: think those leagues are using leverage, that sort of leverage,

950
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:02,440
Speaker 4: so I think that leverage is hollow at this point

951
00:51:02,719 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 4: because of the House settlement. They dragged the mid Majors

952
00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:11,720
Speaker 4: and low majors into the house settlement of basically using

953
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:16,360
Speaker 4: their NCUBA Tournament funds to pay their share of the

954
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:20,839
Speaker 4: House settlement and so, and that payout is basically amortized

955
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 4: to ten years. So if I don't see how you

956
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:27,520
Speaker 4: force those schools to pay the rest of that settlement

957
00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:30,439
Speaker 4: if you book in two years, I just don't see

958
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:33,480
Speaker 4: how that's plausible. If I were them, I would just say, no,

959
00:51:33,480 --> 00:51:36,200
Speaker 4: we're not going to pay. Why would we. You took

960
00:51:36,239 --> 00:51:39,640
Speaker 4: away the entity through which we were supposed to pay that.

961
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,680
Speaker 4: We don't have that money. We only have it if

962
00:51:42,719 --> 00:51:45,440
Speaker 4: we have that entity. So I don't know whether they

963
00:51:45,520 --> 00:51:48,719
Speaker 4: really have that leverage or not. But I think that

964
00:51:48,880 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 4: the ncuble A Charlie Baker, is choosing not to fight

965
00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:57,520
Speaker 4: it and just acquiescing. But I also think that the

966
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:01,080
Speaker 4: people like Brett Yormark, Jim Phillips who have advocated for this,

967
00:52:01,160 --> 00:52:04,760
Speaker 4: and and the most of all Greg Shaheen. Uh those

968
00:52:04,800 --> 00:52:09,480
Speaker 4: guys not Greg Shin. I'm sorry, why did his name

969
00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:12,080
Speaker 4: pop in my mind? The commissioner of the sec uh.

970
00:52:13,080 --> 00:52:16,000
Speaker 1: Well, Greg was formerly the commissioner of the tournament itself, correct,

971
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:17,359
Speaker 1: or the director of the tournament.

972
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:21,120
Speaker 4: Correct, the commissioner of the SEC who Greg's name popped

973
00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:24,440
Speaker 4: into my head instead of uh, the commission of the

974
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:29,600
Speaker 4: SEC who has been advocating for this longer than Greg.

975
00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:31,759
Speaker 4: Thankye see, there you go. That's what It's been a

976
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:35,600
Speaker 4: long month. Greg Sankie was the first to advocate for

977
00:52:35,640 --> 00:52:39,560
Speaker 4: this and used the absurdity of comparing it to the

978
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:41,759
Speaker 4: College World Series and saying, well, the last team men

979
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:44,160
Speaker 4: won it the College World Series, so clearly that could

980
00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:48,360
Speaker 4: happen in basketball as well. Please, Uh, It's never happened

981
00:52:48,360 --> 00:52:53,280
Speaker 4: and never will. But that's they They are already getting

982
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:57,680
Speaker 4: the lion's share of the NCAA Tournament and they deserve it.

983
00:52:58,360 --> 00:53:00,920
Speaker 4: The very few mid majors get out large bids now,

984
00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:04,240
Speaker 4: and that's as it should be, because, as I've always said,

985
00:53:04,600 --> 00:53:07,719
Speaker 4: the high majors have the most good players, the most

986
00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 4: good coaches, and the most good teams, and so they

987
00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:13,920
Speaker 4: should get the almost all of those bids. It's a

988
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:17,160
Speaker 4: rare breakthrough when like Miami this year, when they don't

989
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:21,840
Speaker 4: have every single one, but it doesn't make anything better,

990
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:24,520
Speaker 4: and it's bad business. That's the worst part. These people

991
00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:28,120
Speaker 4: are supposed to be good business people. It's bad business

992
00:53:28,400 --> 00:53:33,040
Speaker 4: to water down the NCAA tournament, to ruin the bracket concept,

993
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:36,799
Speaker 4: the one page bracket that's so essential to the viewership

994
00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:40,359
Speaker 4: that accrues to the NCUBA Tournament. I say this, if

995
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,719
Speaker 4: you don't understand how important the one page bracket is

996
00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:47,560
Speaker 4: to the popularity of the NCUBA Tournament, then you should

997
00:53:47,640 --> 00:53:51,279
Speaker 4: not be in a decision making position in college athletics

998
00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 4: because it's a very simple concept. It's very obvious. It's

999
00:53:55,200 --> 00:53:59,040
Speaker 4: influence and you should know that. And still they move

1000
00:53:59,080 --> 00:54:00,080
Speaker 4: forward in this direction.

1001
00:54:00,680 --> 00:54:04,080
Speaker 1: Mike's thoughts on the North Carolina higher as well as

1002
00:54:04,239 --> 00:54:07,000
Speaker 1: about the depth of Michigan and most importantly the college

1003
00:54:07,040 --> 00:54:10,640
Speaker 1: basketball rankings the way too early top twenty five for

1004
00:54:10,719 --> 00:54:14,480
Speaker 1: next season, which includes a taste from the state of Indiana,

1005
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:17,960
Speaker 1: all at the Sportingnews dot Com for the dean of

1006
00:54:17,960 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 1: college basketball writers, Mike de Corsi, Mike, appreciate the time

1007
00:54:21,160 --> 00:54:24,640
Speaker 1: as always, and congratulations again on a fabulous year of

1008
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:25,960
Speaker 1: coverage in college basketball.

1009
00:54:26,920 --> 00:54:28,719
Speaker 4: Thanks so much, Shake, you have a great day.

1010
00:54:28,760 --> 00:54:31,040
Speaker 2: Appreciate it, Mike to Corsi joining us on the program.

1011
00:54:33,320 --> 00:54:36,120
Speaker 1: The Iowa Wolves, by the way, the G League team

1012
00:54:36,120 --> 00:54:39,600
Speaker 1: for Minnesota. They play in the Caseys Center, which has

1013
00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:46,959
Speaker 1: fabulous pizza inside the arena and among their roster. Remember

1014
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:51,480
Speaker 1: no Jell Eastern that played at Purdue. He's an Iowa Wolf.

1015
00:54:51,560 --> 00:54:54,279
Speaker 1: So to two former pacers? Do we have Scott, by

1016
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:57,880
Speaker 1: the way on the program, we Scott agneson Fieldhouse Files.

1017
00:54:57,920 --> 00:54:59,560
Speaker 1: Joins us Scott, I'm going to put you on the

1018
00:54:59,600 --> 00:55:02,360
Speaker 1: spot for a trivia question that I would be highly

1019
00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:05,400
Speaker 1: impressed if you know the answer, So therefore there is

1020
00:55:05,480 --> 00:55:08,359
Speaker 1: no shame if you don't. Are you prepared for this

1021
00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:09,240
Speaker 1: trivia question?

1022
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:10,799
Speaker 8: Yes, let's do it.

1023
00:55:11,600 --> 00:55:14,400
Speaker 1: Can you tell me one of the two former pacers

1024
00:55:14,520 --> 00:55:17,480
Speaker 1: currently listed on the website as being members of the

1025
00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:24,960
Speaker 1: Iowa Wolves the Timberwolves G League team, Alise Johnson. That's

1026
00:55:25,000 --> 00:55:28,520
Speaker 1: an excellent, excellent guest. I do not see him listed.

1027
00:55:28,960 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 8: Okay, he was there at some time. If he's not,

1028
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:34,000
Speaker 8: he might be back overseas, but I thought he was there.

1029
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:41,200
Speaker 2: Tristan Newton No, also really good guests not listed.

1030
00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:43,279
Speaker 8: All of those guys have been there, so it's just

1031
00:55:43,320 --> 00:55:45,160
Speaker 8: a matter of if they're there.

1032
00:55:45,400 --> 00:55:47,759
Speaker 1: And admittedly, in your defense, these could be guys for

1033
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:49,200
Speaker 1: all I know that signed up.

1034
00:55:49,640 --> 00:55:52,040
Speaker 2: You know a two way ten days ago. I have

1035
00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:54,319
Speaker 2: no idea, right, sure, here we go.

1036
00:55:55,120 --> 00:55:58,480
Speaker 1: I think this guy was a pacer Terry Taylor. Wasn't

1037
00:55:58,520 --> 00:55:59,040
Speaker 1: he a piacer?

1038
00:55:59,040 --> 00:55:59,560
Speaker 8: Absolutely?

1039
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: And not unlike Terry Taylor because known for his rebounding

1040
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:04,880
Speaker 1: prowess Enrique Freeman.

1041
00:56:05,719 --> 00:56:07,840
Speaker 8: Ah, yep, absolutely, that was over the summer.

1042
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:10,759
Speaker 1: Okay, So let's talk about tonight just in terms of

1043
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:12,960
Speaker 1: what we're gonna see because probably a lot of guys

1044
00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:17,120
Speaker 1: like that right in terms of Indiana kind of ending

1045
00:56:17,160 --> 00:56:21,239
Speaker 1: out the season here understandably, so by going into the

1046
00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:23,880
Speaker 1: depth chart, so to speak, one of those that is

1047
00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:29,880
Speaker 1: I think of note and I believe did we already

1048
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:35,320
Speaker 1: pass the number of games that if Cam Jones appears

1049
00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:38,440
Speaker 1: that his contract becomes guaranteed, are we already assured now

1050
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:39,960
Speaker 1: that he cannot meet that requirement?

1051
00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:41,600
Speaker 3: Yes?

1052
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:44,400
Speaker 8: That's right, So only half of his contract for this

1053
00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:46,160
Speaker 8: upcoming season is fully guaranteed.

1054
00:56:46,239 --> 00:56:46,960
Speaker 2: Okay, gotcha.

1055
00:56:47,800 --> 00:56:51,480
Speaker 1: But that said, let's look at where they are now, Scott.

1056
00:56:51,520 --> 00:56:54,480
Speaker 1: They can still the Pacers with what four games left,

1057
00:56:55,400 --> 00:56:57,960
Speaker 1: they can still afford to win? Is it two of them?

1058
00:56:58,120 --> 00:57:01,600
Speaker 1: And they will not necessarily jepper themselves or hurt their

1059
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,239
Speaker 1: statistical odds of holding under their draft pick.

1060
00:57:04,680 --> 00:57:07,160
Speaker 8: Yeah, that figures to be about right, even though I

1061
00:57:07,239 --> 00:57:09,720
Speaker 8: don't expect them at all to win two more games

1062
00:57:09,719 --> 00:57:11,719
Speaker 8: the rest of the way. But they're currently with the

1063
00:57:11,840 --> 00:57:15,719
Speaker 8: second worst percentage, only ahead of the Washington Wizards. Brooklyn's

1064
00:57:15,760 --> 00:57:18,000
Speaker 8: right above them. And then there's two teams out west

1065
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:21,920
Speaker 8: Sacramento in Utah who both have two more wins than

1066
00:57:21,920 --> 00:57:24,720
Speaker 8: the Pacers with or excuse me, three more with twenty

1067
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:25,560
Speaker 8: one wins.

1068
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:29,600
Speaker 1: What do you This is gonna sound like an elementary question,

1069
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:33,400
Speaker 1: but based on that, like, for example, I'll be there

1070
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:38,560
Speaker 1: tonight and I'm Scott. I have been amazed, impressed and

1071
00:57:38,640 --> 00:57:43,960
Speaker 1: amazed at the crowds. Still everyone knows the scenario, but

1072
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:46,920
Speaker 1: yet when I go down there, there are still Now

1073
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:48,720
Speaker 1: maybe it won't be the case tonight because we're coming

1074
00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:50,840
Speaker 1: off the Final four and it's Tuesday night and you know,

1075
00:57:50,880 --> 00:57:53,840
Speaker 1: you know, Anthony Edwards isn't playing. But even with all

1076
00:57:53,840 --> 00:57:56,280
Speaker 1: of that, there have been really good crowds down there.

1077
00:57:57,320 --> 00:57:59,360
Speaker 8: Yeah, and that's great to hear. I mean the fact

1078
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:01,840
Speaker 8: that we all knew going into the season what it

1079
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:04,080
Speaker 8: was and it actually turned out way worse. Right, Like

1080
00:58:04,120 --> 00:58:06,760
Speaker 8: we thought this would be a forty win team. We

1081
00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:10,240
Speaker 8: thought it would probably be a fringe playoff team, maybe

1082
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:13,240
Speaker 8: play play in worthy. No, this has been one of

1083
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:16,280
Speaker 8: the worst seasons in franchise history, as nothing seemingly has

1084
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:18,760
Speaker 8: gone right for the team, where they've had twenty plus

1085
00:58:18,800 --> 00:58:22,520
Speaker 8: transactions in the first month of the season, and so

1086
00:58:22,840 --> 00:58:26,800
Speaker 8: I think if anything, most fans, while they support the guys,

1087
00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:30,120
Speaker 8: they're very much paying attention to that may tenth date

1088
00:58:30,520 --> 00:58:33,080
Speaker 8: with the draft a lot, or it's remarkable that there's

1089
00:58:33,240 --> 00:58:35,640
Speaker 8: just four games left. One of the things I was

1090
00:58:35,680 --> 00:58:39,880
Speaker 8: watching Jake was Pascal Siakam because he's at sixty two games.

1091
00:58:40,240 --> 00:58:42,480
Speaker 8: I don't think it's a lock by any means that

1092
00:58:42,560 --> 00:58:45,280
Speaker 8: he would be an All NBA player, But I think

1093
00:58:45,280 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 8: that's some wrestling that probably he and the franchise.

1094
00:58:47,640 --> 00:58:48,280
Speaker 2: Had to deal with.

1095
00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:51,720
Speaker 8: Is is it worthwhile getting that at sixty five games

1096
00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:53,800
Speaker 8: or we want to continue to hold you out and

1097
00:58:54,120 --> 00:58:57,720
Speaker 8: just finish the season here without you. But that can't

1098
00:58:57,720 --> 00:58:59,240
Speaker 8: be easy on the player whatsoever.

1099
00:58:59,440 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, and with the Siakam situation, there have been other

1100
00:59:03,760 --> 00:59:07,520
Speaker 1: players already that just now. Anthony Edwards I think is

1101
00:59:07,560 --> 00:59:10,160
Speaker 1: one of those, right, isn't he now denied the possibility

1102
00:59:10,280 --> 00:59:13,960
Speaker 1: of some bonus or some accolade that can come his

1103
00:59:14,000 --> 00:59:15,600
Speaker 1: way because of a number of games he's missed.

1104
00:59:16,320 --> 00:59:18,840
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's the end of season awards and he's only

1105
00:59:18,840 --> 00:59:21,439
Speaker 8: played sixty games to this point. As you said, he's

1106
00:59:21,440 --> 00:59:24,080
Speaker 8: not playing tonight in Indy. There's no way he's getting

1107
00:59:24,120 --> 00:59:26,600
Speaker 8: to that sixty five game threshold that the league added

1108
00:59:27,040 --> 00:59:30,240
Speaker 8: several years ago to try to get rid of these

1109
00:59:30,280 --> 00:59:33,360
Speaker 8: teams that were holding players out, and so at least

1110
00:59:33,400 --> 00:59:35,720
Speaker 8: a can you play eighty percent of the season sixty

1111
00:59:35,720 --> 00:59:38,160
Speaker 8: five of the eighty two games to be eligible for

1112
00:59:38,240 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 8: postseason awards. Now, some players that are coming off their

1113
00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:46,120
Speaker 8: contract rookie contract and looking to sign a new contract

1114
00:59:46,400 --> 00:59:49,800
Speaker 8: that can also often trigger a bonus for a supermax

1115
00:59:49,960 --> 00:59:52,480
Speaker 8: type contract. Now, Anthony Edwards, I don't believe that's the

1116
00:59:52,520 --> 00:59:55,320
Speaker 8: case at all, But for him, he was somewhat in

1117
00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:58,080
Speaker 8: the MVP conversation he's been up there. Certainly would it

1118
00:59:58,120 --> 01:00:00,360
Speaker 8: be an all NBA player. The other one jac it

1119
01:00:00,360 --> 01:00:03,960
Speaker 8: applies to, among many is Wimby and then Luka Donchez.

1120
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:07,000
Speaker 8: But there's a chance Dunchets will apply for an exception

1121
01:00:07,120 --> 01:00:09,080
Speaker 8: given the fact that he missed a couple of games

1122
01:00:09,440 --> 01:00:12,040
Speaker 8: due to the birth of his kid, and could that

1123
01:00:12,160 --> 01:00:18,120
Speaker 8: be a scenario there where it's the exception is applied.

1124
01:00:18,200 --> 01:00:21,200
Speaker 8: It should, but I think what we've realized is it

1125
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:25,800
Speaker 8: was great in theory, but having this artificial number isn't

1126
01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:28,560
Speaker 8: good because you look back now ten years at later,

1127
01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:31,640
Speaker 8: you know, twenty thirty five, we'll look back at these

1128
01:00:31,680 --> 01:00:33,480
Speaker 8: seasons and be like, who are the best players? You'll

1129
01:00:33,480 --> 01:00:35,840
Speaker 8: look at the All NBA list and it's a guy

1130
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:38,320
Speaker 8: that maybe wasn't an All Star or the guy that

1131
01:00:38,440 --> 01:00:40,840
Speaker 8: certainly wasn't a top fifteen guy, and so that needs

1132
01:00:40,840 --> 01:00:41,560
Speaker 8: to be rethro.

1133
01:00:41,480 --> 01:00:44,400
Speaker 2: It's like being a quarterback and he won the Pro Bowl. Congraduations,

1134
01:00:44,400 --> 01:00:45,600
Speaker 2: You're the ninth guy, right.

1135
01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:48,880
Speaker 1: Scott Agnes our guest Fieldhouse Files where you can read

1136
01:00:48,880 --> 01:00:51,760
Speaker 1: his work. Scott, one of the things that you have

1137
01:00:51,880 --> 01:00:55,560
Speaker 1: always stayed at top of, probably more than anybody is

1138
01:00:55,640 --> 01:00:58,480
Speaker 1: knowing just kind of the business and the media aspect

1139
01:00:59,080 --> 01:01:01,120
Speaker 1: of the NBA. And the reason I asked it. I

1140
01:01:01,160 --> 01:01:06,680
Speaker 1: saw the headline last week maybe that the television network

1141
01:01:06,720 --> 01:01:09,880
Speaker 1: for the Pacers itself, not the Pacers, but the network

1142
01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:13,360
Speaker 1: that is airing them currently is going away. So what

1143
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:17,720
Speaker 1: does that mean for next season in terms of television coverage?

1144
01:01:17,720 --> 01:01:18,720
Speaker 2: For Pacer games.

1145
01:01:19,200 --> 01:01:22,160
Speaker 8: Yeah, so the company used to be Diamonds Sports Group.

1146
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:25,720
Speaker 8: Now it's called main Street and the main Street Sports

1147
01:01:25,760 --> 01:01:28,920
Speaker 8: Groups the group that runs FanDuel Sports Network that everybody's

1148
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:32,919
Speaker 8: become familiar with. But this spin off that they there's

1149
01:01:32,960 --> 01:01:37,200
Speaker 8: all these selloffs of rights several years ago, I think

1150
01:01:37,240 --> 01:01:41,240
Speaker 8: originally from Fox. But long story short is they're in bankruptcy,

1151
01:01:41,240 --> 01:01:43,320
Speaker 8: and they came out of bankruptcy looked like they were

1152
01:01:43,560 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 8: getting their head above water. There was a chance maybe

1153
01:01:46,600 --> 01:01:49,240
Speaker 8: they were going to sell or bring in additional partners

1154
01:01:49,360 --> 01:01:54,360
Speaker 8: like Amazon Prime Video, like Desonne, maybe some others, but no,

1155
01:01:54,840 --> 01:01:58,280
Speaker 8: they've signaled now here in the last week through regulatory

1156
01:01:58,680 --> 01:02:03,760
Speaker 8: filing and such and lane off individuals that they're winding

1157
01:02:03,760 --> 01:02:07,000
Speaker 8: down operations. So for the Pacers, it means they're without

1158
01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:09,160
Speaker 8: a TV partner for next season. And I think they

1159
01:02:09,160 --> 01:02:12,040
Speaker 8: were going to be a free agent anyway, but now

1160
01:02:12,080 --> 01:02:15,920
Speaker 8: it opens up many options. And the thing that leagues

1161
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:18,240
Speaker 8: like the NBA are trying to figure out is what's

1162
01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:21,200
Speaker 8: the best way to position this moving forward because the

1163
01:02:21,360 --> 01:02:24,920
Speaker 8: local model, the regional sports model, isn't what it was.

1164
01:02:25,080 --> 01:02:28,480
Speaker 8: It was highly lucrative. Jake, I think I forget off

1165
01:02:28,520 --> 01:02:30,440
Speaker 8: the top of my head, but I think my understanding

1166
01:02:30,640 --> 01:02:34,680
Speaker 8: was the Pacers were making about fifteen million per year

1167
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:37,120
Speaker 8: off this a franchise like the Lakers, I think was

1168
01:02:37,160 --> 01:02:39,960
Speaker 8: well over one hundred million, so quite a disparity there,

1169
01:02:40,000 --> 01:02:43,080
Speaker 8: but that was one of the biggest, if not the biggest,

1170
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:48,560
Speaker 8: local revenue generators that each of these teams were able

1171
01:02:48,560 --> 01:02:52,280
Speaker 8: to enjoy. So what it could be is NBA, along

1172
01:02:52,320 --> 01:02:54,320
Speaker 8: with one of their partners, Let's say a Prime Video

1173
01:02:55,000 --> 01:02:58,240
Speaker 8: distributes it like that. So if you're familiar with Thursday

1174
01:02:58,280 --> 01:03:01,000
Speaker 8: night football and logging on for Prime Video, maybe that's

1175
01:03:01,000 --> 01:03:03,120
Speaker 8: how you'd watch Pacer games and many have done that

1176
01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:06,040
Speaker 8: with the FanDuel app, or I could see them partnering

1177
01:03:06,120 --> 01:03:10,520
Speaker 8: it or also in addition to that, maybe they bring in.

1178
01:03:10,440 --> 01:03:11,240
Speaker 2: A local partner.

1179
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:14,440
Speaker 8: They've worked with WTHR Channel thirteen the last couple of years.

1180
01:03:14,440 --> 01:03:17,600
Speaker 8: That's also the Fever broadcasting partner. There's a couple other

1181
01:03:17,640 --> 01:03:20,360
Speaker 8: stations that now become intriguing a little bit to me

1182
01:03:20,440 --> 01:03:23,320
Speaker 8: as well. But for the first time in quite a while,

1183
01:03:24,520 --> 01:03:27,720
Speaker 8: a real opportunity here for Pacer Sports and Entertainment to

1184
01:03:27,840 --> 01:03:31,920
Speaker 8: rethink their media distribution models.

1185
01:03:32,200 --> 01:03:34,040
Speaker 1: Scott, have we gotten to the point and I don't know,

1186
01:03:34,080 --> 01:03:38,200
Speaker 1: I'm asking this rhetorically, and maybe I'm going to sound

1187
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:41,320
Speaker 1: like an old man yelling at clouds here, But is

1188
01:03:41,360 --> 01:03:45,760
Speaker 1: the one disadvantage to this happening right now? Have we

1189
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:48,240
Speaker 1: gotten to the point now where even though it's become

1190
01:03:48,320 --> 01:03:52,960
Speaker 1: more normalized and accepted to the consumer of the pay

1191
01:03:53,000 --> 01:03:57,760
Speaker 1: for access television app that now maybe we're far enough

1192
01:03:57,760 --> 01:04:00,160
Speaker 1: into the game that familiarity is there. Yes, and so

1193
01:04:00,160 --> 01:04:02,280
Speaker 1: it doesn't sound foreign to somebody when you say like, hey,

1194
01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:05,520
Speaker 1: you got to pay for But people now have got

1195
01:04:05,520 --> 01:04:08,080
Speaker 1: to the point where they've become oversaturated in the apps

1196
01:04:08,080 --> 01:04:11,000
Speaker 1: they're paying for and therefore are reluctant to continue to

1197
01:04:11,040 --> 01:04:13,240
Speaker 1: do so because now people are like, yeah, I'm starting

1198
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:16,920
Speaker 1: to scale back on the monthly subscriptions to these apps.

1199
01:04:17,640 --> 01:04:20,600
Speaker 8: Yes, totally agreeing. It's been something I've been harping on

1200
01:04:20,640 --> 01:04:23,520
Speaker 8: the last half dozen years at least, is especially in

1201
01:04:23,600 --> 01:04:26,640
Speaker 8: those down years right when things weren't going well after

1202
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:29,320
Speaker 8: Paul George's injury. I'm sitting there thinking like, there's a

1203
01:04:29,360 --> 01:04:32,200
Speaker 8: lot of fans that are growing up and not watching

1204
01:04:32,240 --> 01:04:34,760
Speaker 8: Pacery games and not watching other NBA games. They're consuming

1205
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:38,320
Speaker 8: on YouTube and they're watching ten minute highlight clips and

1206
01:04:38,920 --> 01:04:42,160
Speaker 8: it's much like the ims and the local blackout there.

1207
01:04:42,320 --> 01:04:47,080
Speaker 8: I truly believe that if you make it less successible,

1208
01:04:47,200 --> 01:04:49,760
Speaker 8: it starts telling everybody it doesn't matter, it's not as

1209
01:04:49,840 --> 01:04:52,600
Speaker 8: big a deal. So I would add a line item

1210
01:04:52,680 --> 01:04:55,640
Speaker 8: to marketing. If you take a loss or lose some

1211
01:04:55,720 --> 01:04:58,360
Speaker 8: money here by taking a local platform, which I would

1212
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:01,680
Speaker 8: love to see personally, chalk that up to marketing and

1213
01:05:01,720 --> 01:05:04,160
Speaker 8: more merchandise sales and all those things that you can

1214
01:05:04,200 --> 01:05:08,240
Speaker 8: capitalize off of because of the increased availability, just like

1215
01:05:08,280 --> 01:05:08,840
Speaker 8: it used to be.

1216
01:05:09,240 --> 01:05:12,040
Speaker 2: What's the latest you're working on at Fieldhouse Files? Yeah,

1217
01:05:12,160 --> 01:05:12,680
Speaker 2: wrapping up.

1218
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:15,200
Speaker 8: I was at the final four weekend the last five days,

1219
01:05:15,240 --> 01:05:18,360
Speaker 8: so I was bouncing around covering different things there, including

1220
01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:21,000
Speaker 8: a one on one with Chris paul A couple days ago,

1221
01:05:21,080 --> 01:05:24,520
Speaker 8: shamik A Holst call Mark fu talking about the Nimhard Brothers.

1222
01:05:24,560 --> 01:05:27,360
Speaker 8: So kind of a notebook that I'll be wrapping up there.

1223
01:05:27,400 --> 01:05:31,080
Speaker 8: Plus a little fever news about qualifying offers that were

1224
01:05:31,080 --> 01:05:35,680
Speaker 8: sent out yesterday. No surprise, but it's going according to

1225
01:05:35,680 --> 01:05:37,160
Speaker 8: plan thus far for Indiana.

1226
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:40,080
Speaker 6: Free agency is officially underway for the Wright Scott, I

1227
01:05:40,160 --> 01:05:41,600
Speaker 6: know what kind of flying by the seat of our

1228
01:05:41,640 --> 01:05:44,280
Speaker 6: pants here with the WNBA, with how they're just kind

1229
01:05:44,280 --> 01:05:45,880
Speaker 6: of accelerating everything right now.

1230
01:05:46,240 --> 01:05:48,280
Speaker 8: Yeah, and it doesn't help that, you know, less than

1231
01:05:48,320 --> 01:05:51,640
Speaker 8: twenty four hours before free agency began on Monday, we

1232
01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:54,560
Speaker 8: find out at ten o'clock at night the plan for

1233
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:57,840
Speaker 8: the week, and so right now those qualifying offers can

1234
01:05:57,880 --> 01:06:01,680
Speaker 8: be issued yesterday in today, there can start to be

1235
01:06:01,760 --> 01:06:04,400
Speaker 8: some negotiations with other free agents. I'm thinking like a

1236
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:08,360
Speaker 8: Sophie Cunningham over the next several days after today, and

1237
01:06:08,400 --> 01:06:11,280
Speaker 8: then signings can begin as soon as April eleventh, and

1238
01:06:11,320 --> 01:06:13,720
Speaker 8: then the drafts two days later. So it's a quick

1239
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:17,080
Speaker 8: wind up to training camp, which begins on the nineteenth.

1240
01:06:17,240 --> 01:06:19,320
Speaker 1: All right, Scott, we'll be looking at field House files

1241
01:06:19,320 --> 01:06:20,240
Speaker 1: for all the coverage.

1242
01:06:20,280 --> 01:06:21,680
Speaker 2: Appreciate the time as always

1243
01:06:21,920 --> 01:06:24,560
Speaker 1: You bet, Thanks, Jake, Scott Agnes joining US again Pacers

1244
01:06:24,560 --> 01:06:27,200
Speaker 1: and Action tonight taking on Minnesota at the field House.