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Speaker 1: Joining us now by the way Jaba House peeling poor

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Speaker 1: guest line. He is from the Indianapolis Star. He is

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Speaker 1: our friend, Dustin. Thank you Eddie joining us.

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Speaker 2: Hi, Dustin, how are you you exact about yourself?

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Speaker 1: I've got it like an I my voice. But other

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Speaker 1: than that, I'm okay. I I'm not I'm Dustin. I'm

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Speaker 1: not even sick. I don't know what it is. I

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Speaker 1: just talk so much. I guess right, you.

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Speaker 3: Know, I mean, you would think that would get you

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Speaker 3: out over time, considering it is your job.

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Speaker 2: Here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: I think probably most people in Indianapolis are totally fine

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Speaker 1: with the fact that my voice might be waning a

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Speaker 1: little bit.

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Speaker 2: If you really would like to know the truth, Okay, Dustin,

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Speaker 2: we'll begin with this.

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Speaker 1: It's the NBA commissioner calls you, says we're going to

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Speaker 1: give you a franchise. You cannot put it in Seattle,

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Speaker 1: Las Vegas, Nashville is now off the board.

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Speaker 2: Where are you putting Dustin's team?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I would put it in Pittsburgh. But that's

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Speaker 3: just me. That's good now that that's not even me

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Speaker 3: saying it's going to work. That's just if I had

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Speaker 3: the kind of money to buy one. That's where I

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Speaker 3: would put it because that's where I'm from.

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Speaker 2: Are they going to be the Pipers? The Pittsburgh Pipers.

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Speaker 3: We bring it back, we bring it back. We go

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Speaker 3: with the A B A A B A stuff and

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Speaker 3: you know, you know, stick with that. I think the

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Speaker 3: last one they had, they had a CBA team that

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Speaker 3: was the Pittsburgh Puranas, actually been pretty good for a year,

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Speaker 3: if I recall correctly. But so like anything with the

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Speaker 3: p works, I think.

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Speaker 2: We go we got to be black and gold, right right?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, of course, I mean you have to stick with it.

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Speaker 3: That's that's how it has to operate. The entire city's

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Speaker 3: got to go under that coast.

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Speaker 2: What are you hearing? Trade deadline?

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Speaker 1: Let's begin with what you're hearing, and maybe even we'll

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Speaker 1: go outside. Benedict Mathern, Are there any other players on

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Speaker 1: the Pacers roster? Did you kind of raise an eyebrow

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Speaker 1: and say it wouldn't surprise me if their name percolates

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Speaker 1: a little bit here?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? I mean I think it all of the times,

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Speaker 3: how big they want to swing, like I only they're

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Speaker 3: trying to move anybody else. They're certainly not like it's

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Speaker 3: not you don't look at him and say, well, okay,

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Speaker 3: you know you've got to move off from that guy.

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Speaker 3: And Matthew's the only one to look at him say well,

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Speaker 3: you might you might have to make a move here,

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Speaker 3: because otherwise you might lose him for nothing. You know,

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Speaker 3: everybody else you have the opportunity to keep. You know,

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Speaker 3: Nev Harden's the other guy in that class, and he's

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Speaker 3: already signed to an extension. So I mean, I mean,

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Speaker 3: I could see you could I could still see Walker going,

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Speaker 3: I could still see in Isaiah Jackson going. But I

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Speaker 3: think in those cases it's more a case of you're

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Speaker 3: swinging big and you've got to put a package together

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Speaker 3: that works. I mean, I think I think they're thrilled

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Speaker 3: with the way Jaris Walker's playing. I mean, I think

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Speaker 3: Rick Carlo is over the moon with what he's got

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Speaker 3: out of in the last three weeks. Just the force

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Speaker 3: he's playing with. It's been what they've been waiting for

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Speaker 3: the entire time. I think, I'm really seriously when he

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Speaker 3: when he says this is what you know, I think

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Speaker 3: it's quote was just what we envisioned when we drafted him,

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Speaker 3: And I think that changes their view of him entirely,

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Speaker 3: and it happened in just a few weeks. I think

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Speaker 3: that was what they were waiting to see. But if

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Speaker 3: you want to go get a twenty million dollars center,

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Speaker 3: if you have the interest in that, Nick Klack or

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Speaker 3: somebody like that, you know, like you've got to include

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Speaker 3: some salaries and there, you've got to include some players

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Speaker 3: that are going to be enticing, and Walker would have

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Speaker 3: to be one of those guys. I think, if you know,

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Speaker 3: you have to. Also, I don't think he's playing so

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Speaker 3: well that you wouldn't think about shipping him off. If

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Speaker 3: you've got a big target, now you're not. You know,

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Speaker 3: you haven't seen their name pipe up with targets like

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Speaker 3: that in a while. I mean the last center you saw,

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Speaker 3: I think was Even's Missy, And like they actually have

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Speaker 3: to include something to get Mathrin. Basically they would have

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Speaker 3: to include somebody else, as the maths room makes about

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Speaker 3: nine million mas Mefie is like two or three somewhere

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Speaker 3: in that range. So they, like the Pelicans, would have

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Speaker 3: to put somebody else in there. And so Walker is

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Speaker 3: way out of you know, way out of scale there.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, I think you saw to day Jake Fisher

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Speaker 3: is reporting that there's sin some talks about Matha and

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Speaker 3: I you j Soon mode, but that was sort of

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Speaker 3: stuff he was seeing before what Chicago did yesterday bring

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Speaker 3: in uh Simon's and Jade and Ivy. So I'm not

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Speaker 3: sure if they still haven't understand a player like mather Into,

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Speaker 3: you know, or not, or if they just be okay

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Speaker 3: with value or that they'd be looking to move value

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Speaker 3: for something else. That's more they give them more sort

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Speaker 3: of positional balance. But yeah, no, I mean I think

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Speaker 3: anybody else that they would move, it wouldn't because they

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Speaker 3: want to get rid of moves because if you want,

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Speaker 3: if you need a swim big, you need to include

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Speaker 3: the salaries.

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Speaker 2: Do you believe Dustin.

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Speaker 1: That Ben Matherin is a player the Pacers could move

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Speaker 1: on from, because which would you say is the more

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Speaker 1: likely answer? A Indiana needs to get themselves a center

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Speaker 1: and Ben Mathern is the player that most facilitates for

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Speaker 1: that possibility via trade or b. They have seen enough

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Speaker 1: body of work from Ben Matheren to know while he

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Speaker 1: is a very good player, he is simply a player

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Speaker 1: that does not fit into the scheme they play, which

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Speaker 1: is the more likely reason he would be on deadline

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Speaker 1: potential trade.

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Speaker 3: I mean they're both. I mean, they're both really equal

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Speaker 3: to me. I mean, I guess it's b because it

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Speaker 3: just in the sense that you wouldn't move him if

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Speaker 3: you wouldn't even be thinking about it, if there wasn't

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Speaker 3: a fit issue, because he's been really you know, at

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Speaker 3: the end of the day, he's been productive. I mean, like,

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Speaker 3: I think he is the fourth leading scorer in terms

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Speaker 3: of average scoring in the class of twenty twenty two,

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Speaker 3: you know, and the other ones ahead of him are

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Speaker 3: like home Grew and Jalen Williams of Powell, you know,

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Speaker 3: So like he's he has been productive. And usually when

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Speaker 3: when a guy hits like that, you're not looking to

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Speaker 3: move him unless it's a fit issue, and so you're

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Speaker 3: only thinking about moving him for anything, even if it

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Speaker 3: is a center, if it's a finishes. That's the biggest reason.

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Speaker 3: But on the flip side of that, I don't think

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Speaker 3: that he's such a bad fit that they can't possibly,

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Speaker 3: you know, continue life with him.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 3: It's just I think you you have to imagine that

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Speaker 3: there's better offers for him out there, that there's a

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Speaker 3: better situation for him out there, that he would have

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Speaker 3: to consider, you know, in restricted even in restricted free agency,

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Speaker 3: and you know there are other roster concerns that you're

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Speaker 3: going to have. Like I don't think he doesn't serve

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Speaker 3: them any purpose. I think he was useful for them

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Speaker 3: even in the playoff run last year. Or I think

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Speaker 3: Rick Carlisle still like it in just the teacher pupil sense,

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Speaker 3: Like I think he still gets something out of working

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Speaker 3: with him. I mean I think even the other night

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Speaker 3: when he had twenty five points in that loss of

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Speaker 3: the Rockets, you know, he was like, man, he really

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Speaker 3: liked the reads he was making. He think he's come

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Speaker 3: so far with this, Like I don't think for as

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Speaker 3: much as some people think that, you know, Rick doesn't

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Speaker 3: like that or whatever. Like I think Rick feels like

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Speaker 3: he's made a lot of progress. It's just it's just

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Speaker 3: on the timeline that comes with contracts and it comes

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Speaker 3: with roster building, it doesn't necessarily fit. But I think

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Speaker 3: Rick Carlisle still sees a good player there. So I

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Speaker 3: don't think Rick would be upset if they still have

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Speaker 3: math and on the roster next year. I think he'd

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Speaker 3: find a way to get something out of him. But like,

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Speaker 3: I don't see a world where he starts over Nem

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Speaker 3: harden Andi Swez at the end of the day, when

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Speaker 3: you've got a roster with Haliburton on it, I think

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Speaker 3: those guys just too well fit the ball movement, you know,

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Speaker 3: the style of play. I just don't think Matthern ever

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Speaker 3: breaks past those guys. And he's just not as good

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Speaker 3: as a defender as they are. And so you know,

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Speaker 3: like he's there's still a role for him off the

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Speaker 3: bench going forward if he can't find another place to

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Speaker 3: go and they can't find a way to turn him

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Speaker 3: into a center. But you know, like if he gets stuck,

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Speaker 3: I think he can be useful on that team stuff.

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Speaker 1: We saw what happened Dustin eventually with Miles Turner. Maybe

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Speaker 1: not on the floor, but you saw the end result

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Speaker 1: with Miles Turner. Clearly, Miles Turner routinely being mentioned in

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Speaker 1: trade talks and the DeAndre eight and offer a sheet

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Speaker 1: weighed on Miles Turner. Is there any possibility the Pacers

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Speaker 1: can enter that danger zone with Ben Matheren if he

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Speaker 1: is a player they decide that they want to run

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Speaker 1: with beyond this week.

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Speaker 3: I mean there is there is sort of I mean,

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Speaker 3: I think you know what you would look back and say,

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Speaker 3: there though, is it, Like, yes, it weighed on Miles Turner.

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Speaker 3: But when they brought Haliburton back, and you know, like

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Speaker 3: those the rumors, you know, for the most part, went away,

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Speaker 3: Like I mean, like you still saw it every year,

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Speaker 3: but like some of it wasn't as serious as was

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Speaker 3: in that first season where he and Haliberton really played together,

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Speaker 3: like going into twenty two, twenty two to twenty three.

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Speaker 3: When they did the extension later that year, you know,

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Speaker 3: like that took a whole lot of weight off, and

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Speaker 3: I think Turner played with that weight off of him

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Speaker 3: until they went another direction. I think really going into

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Speaker 3: free agency. I think he really thought he was going

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Speaker 3: to stay. At least that's how he's described it is.

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Speaker 3: You know, he he you know, bought in at that point,

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Speaker 3: really and you saw a better version of mouth Turner.

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Speaker 3: You know, you would have to I think you would

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Speaker 3: have to do something that indicates that you want to

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Speaker 3: have him around for a long term and you think

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Speaker 3: that he fits. So if you never give him the

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Speaker 3: indication otherwise, then yeah, you could run into that. But

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Speaker 3: I mean they did, you know, over the course of

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Speaker 3: that especially with that extension, say hey, we think you're

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Speaker 3: the center that fits this point guard. They would have

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Speaker 3: to indicate the matter and somehow, you know, we think

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Speaker 3: you fit a team with Tie on it. And there

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Speaker 3: have been a lot of indications that they helped so

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Speaker 3: that you could run into that more because they've I

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Speaker 3: think there's always been that idea out. They're like, you

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Speaker 3: have to be this other player if you're going to

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Speaker 3: play with Tie and you haven't proven it yet.

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Speaker 1: Do you think when you look at Jay Huff that

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Speaker 1: the Pacers say to themselves, you know what if that's

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Speaker 1: what we've got to go with in two years as

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Speaker 1: our starting center?

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Speaker 2: Cool, Yeah, we're cool with that.

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Speaker 1: Or are they thinking to themselves, nice piece, but we've

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Speaker 1: got to upgrade that in terms of a starter and

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Speaker 1: a long minute guy.

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Speaker 3: Yeah? The second I mean, I think they I think

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Speaker 3: they do see value there. And you know, I would

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Speaker 3: say the way that Jay Huff has changed the dynamic

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Speaker 3: is that they can see a world where they would

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Speaker 3: get a center who doesn't shoot threes and start him

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Speaker 3: and be able to bring Huff as a space is

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Speaker 3: a spacer, a stretch five off the bench. You know

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Speaker 3: that that I think is where he is. He has

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Speaker 3: shown value and changed the way they look at things.

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Speaker 3: You can block shots, he can shoot threes, you know,

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Speaker 3: run the floor reasonably well, and obviously the dunks are fun.

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Speaker 3: But you know, like I think they look at and say, okay, well,

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Speaker 3: if we need you know, we could get a lob guy,

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Speaker 3: rim protector, rebounder and put him at you know, have

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Speaker 3: him as the start, right. I think they do think

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Speaker 3: they have to upgrade that position. I think you know,

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Speaker 3: you saw him try to guard Seng doin the other

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Speaker 3: night and it was just brutal, you know, and and

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Speaker 3: I go backstay and Stay health is like the nicest guy,

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Speaker 3: and so like, I don't want to hit on him

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Speaker 3: too much just because he's a good dude, but like

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Speaker 3: he had I mean, he just could not well Dustin.

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Speaker 2: I feel like he has.

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Speaker 1: I mentioned this earlier, offensively speaking, he has skill set

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Speaker 1: that I think really does and could could really feed

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Speaker 1: well off Tyrese Haliburton. But at the same time, stamina

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Speaker 1: and strength seem to be a defensive liability.

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Speaker 2: Is that fair?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, it's just he's you know, when he's just

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Speaker 3: muscled up guys, not even muscled up guys, I mean

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Speaker 3: just a seng Gune does somebody a physical five man

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Speaker 3: is pushing him around, you know, on the block, you know,

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Speaker 3: just like on the glass and defensively just you know,

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Speaker 3: I mean, like Senggoon was just able to move him.

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Speaker 3: And he's not like quick enough to make up for

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Speaker 3: that either. It's not like, okay, well, what he lacks

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Speaker 3: in this bulk strength he makes up been in speed

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Speaker 3: and and sort of side to side, you know, lateral quickness. No,

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Speaker 3: he's just not staying in front of those guys you

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Speaker 3: know that are really driving at him and have really

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Speaker 3: good spin moves and stuff like that. Again, he's good

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Speaker 3: at getting to a rim protective state, I guess and

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Speaker 3: being able to block shots and that matters, and being

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Speaker 3: able to rim protect matters, but just you know, when

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Speaker 3: he's got to go man up with somebody, he just

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Speaker 3: doesn't have the muscle to hang in there. And you know,

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Speaker 3: like that's what they're gonna need against a guy like

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Speaker 3: a sing Gun or guy like you know, a Yah honest,

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Speaker 3: or anybody you know, like any any of the real

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Speaker 3: big guys he's going to have trouble with. And so

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Speaker 3: if you can't play him for ten minutes in those games,

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Speaker 3: you know, like I mean, like he can't be your

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Speaker 3: everyday starter here again, like there's there's use for him.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think there's a world where they can

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Speaker 3: keep Jackson and keep Huff and have a better starter

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Speaker 3: in that group, and all of those guys can have

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Speaker 3: a role. But I just I don't think if you

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Speaker 3: can't trust him to guard you know, the top five men,

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Speaker 3: you know, like, you clearly need an upgrade if you

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Speaker 3: want to win a championship. And that's the thing too,

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Speaker 3: like you you're you're not talking about this. Can you

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Speaker 3: run out five guys and play a basketball game?

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Speaker 5: You need?

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Speaker 3: You know, like if you need to hit the expectations

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Speaker 3: that are going to be there starting next year, you

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Speaker 3: have to have an upgrade.

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Speaker 6: Dustin Nypire the Star joins us, Java House Peel and

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Speaker 6: poor guest line. Dustin, I want to go back to

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Speaker 6: that report you discussed earlier with Jake Fisher. Why would

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Speaker 6: Indiana look into a guy like Io'd assuming when they

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Speaker 6: have Tyree Celiburn, they have TJ. McConnell, and they have

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Speaker 6: Andrenim Hard, why would they need another point guard?

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Speaker 3: I mean, I think you play Io off the ball,

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Speaker 3: you know, I mean, I think that's one thing. I

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Speaker 3: mean they like having two point guards, two potential ball

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Speaker 3: handlers on the floor. That's a big Rick Carlisle thing.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I mean you could play him as

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Speaker 3: a combo. I mean, like you can absolutely run him

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Speaker 3: as a two weeks big enough. You know, he can defend.

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Speaker 3: You know, he can slash and score and that kind

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Speaker 3: of stuff. Like I don't I don't think that's uh,

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Speaker 3: I don't. I don't think you're too redundant there basically,

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Speaker 3: and how you getting And I think I us got

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Speaker 3: some capabilities of doing some things that that McConnell doesn't happen.

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Speaker 3: I think you can put mccar Like, if you have

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Speaker 3: McConnell and I it was your second you know, your

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Speaker 3: your second unit backcourt, that's not a problem. I don't think,

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Speaker 3: you know, I don't think you can't play those two

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Speaker 3: guys together. So I mean, I don't think he's so

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Speaker 3: redundant that he caused you an issue. Like I don't

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Speaker 3: think he can on to flip that. Like I don't

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Speaker 3: think you can draft the Kingston Flemings out of Houston,

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Speaker 3: you know, to add to that group. Like I don't

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Speaker 3: think you want a pure point guard or smaller point guard.

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Speaker 3: But I think a guy who's a little bit bigger

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Speaker 3: than the combo. I like, I don't think you're run

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Speaker 3: him the same kind of problem.

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Speaker 2: There the.

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Speaker 1: The other thing that you have to factor in, Dustin,

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Speaker 1: and you tell me if this is me overthinking it,

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Speaker 1: which is a possibility. Sometimes trades happen and Bruce Brown

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Speaker 1: comes to mind, and I can't remember if they had

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Speaker 1: signed Bruce Brown or traded for Bruce Brown. But sometimes

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Speaker 1: acquisitions happen and they seem very peculiar. And what you

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Speaker 1: don't factor in is that that is the first of

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Speaker 1: a two step process.

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Speaker 2: Yes, that possible.

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Speaker 3: The Bruce Brown thing is the Bruce Brown thing is

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Speaker 3: perfect because I mean because it was an overpay and

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Speaker 3: they had and they one they had to overpay to

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Speaker 3: get to the floor.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: That's the other thing is that, like that's a big

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Speaker 3: reason why it worked out that it was the Pacers

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Speaker 3: in the first place, Like they didn't need backcourt help

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Speaker 3: that much, but you know, like I think they wanted

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Speaker 3: they did want an experienced guy. They did want a

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Speaker 3: little bit better defense on that. But you know the

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Speaker 3: reason that worked is you overpaid Bruce Brown. You've got

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Speaker 3: twenty two million that you could put in the trade

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Speaker 3: and they were able to hold out on that deal

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Speaker 3: until in Toronto was really ready to break it up.

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Speaker 3: And you know then having a guy that made twenty

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Speaker 3: two million went a whole long way and acquiring Siakam,

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Speaker 3: you know, just being able to do that in terms

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Speaker 3: of the money, and yeah, like that's that's absolutely a

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Speaker 3: thing that can happen, is that you might acquire somebody

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Speaker 3: and be able to move them for somebody else and

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Speaker 3: sort of change that piece, and you might not be

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Speaker 3: able to do it before you get that piece. So yeah, no,

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Speaker 3: Bruce Brown is the classic example of you know, there

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Speaker 3: was a little bit of okay, what are you doing?

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Speaker 3: Like why is he worth forty five million over two years?

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Speaker 3: It's like, well, you know they were able to move

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Speaker 3: off of him in half a season. Once you got

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Speaker 3: past the January fifteenth or I guess December fifteenth, you know,

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Speaker 3: signing them on, you could look to move that piece.

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Speaker 3: And you know, they didn't have really a package they

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Speaker 3: could have put together for Siakam that summer that would

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Speaker 3: have made sense. But with Brown, you know, especially once

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Speaker 3: Toronto was one step further in the we definitely got

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Speaker 3: to blow this up process.

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Speaker 1: At worked the Let me give you a question, Dustin.

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Speaker 1: Dustin del Pirek is our guest Joba House, Peeling Port

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Speaker 1: guest line. He's with the Indianapolis Star. Something I thought

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Speaker 1: about last night and has nothing to do with the

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Speaker 1: trade deadline. But when he has had to play more

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Speaker 1: often than not, Quentin Jackson is a very offensively competent player.

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Speaker 2: He's like instant buckets. He he can score quickly. He

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Speaker 2: can score. He doesn't need a lot of warm up

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Speaker 2: time to get going.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know the answer to this, And I

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Speaker 1: don't know if you have talked to Rick Carlisle or

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Speaker 1: Kevin Pritchard or any of them about this.

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Speaker 2: What is it that stops him?

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Speaker 3: What?

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Speaker 1: What is the What is what separates Quinton Jackson from

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Speaker 1: being a rotational player and still being a two way player?

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Speaker 1: What is the one thing of his game that needs

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Speaker 1: improvement for him to be regular rotation guy?

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Speaker 3: I mean he is still high risk in that. I

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Speaker 3: mean like he plays wild, you know, and that's sometimes

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Speaker 3: exactly what they need. But I mean he's he's good

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Speaker 3: for some less than you know, genius turnovers from time

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Speaker 3: to time. He's not a big guy, like that's another

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Speaker 3: thing too, Like he is skinny, and that's what's kind

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Speaker 3: of held him back his entire career. And you know,

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Speaker 3: he's a fascinating story. I'm kind of working on something

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Speaker 3: on Quinton now, and you know, like that's that's been

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Speaker 3: just the thing is like wait when they and he

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Speaker 3: came out at like, you know, from high school like

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Speaker 3: one hundred and fifty five pounds or something like that,

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Speaker 3: and he's still I mean, he's probably one seventy five,

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Speaker 3: you know, and so like there's there's guys that he's

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Speaker 3: going to have a hard time you know, staying with.

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Speaker 3: Like where like Ben Shephard, you have a little bit

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Speaker 3: bigger body. Where Shepherd's not nearly as explosed is you

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Speaker 3: know offensively in terms of his ability to get to

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Speaker 3: the rim is you know offensive explosion that kind of

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Speaker 3: thing is about to jump. But you know Shepherd gives

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Speaker 3: you a little bit more size, a little bit more laying.

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Speaker 3: But you know, Jackson's going to get down and really

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Speaker 3: really guard somebody. I mean I think it's you know,

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Speaker 3: the thing that he would have to improve at to

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Speaker 3: get on the floor more would be just you know

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Speaker 3: a little bit smarter decision making, a little bit less

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Speaker 3: turnovers a little bit more wild stuff, but like they

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Speaker 3: also don't want to get in it's way too much

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Speaker 3: because they like the juice that he brings. They like

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Speaker 3: the fact easier at takers. They like the fact that

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Speaker 3: he goes all out and like where he is, they

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Speaker 3: like that, you know, like I think to be something else,

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Speaker 3: he's got to be steadier and and it just would

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Speaker 3: have helped, you know, it would help that he was bigger,

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Speaker 3: and I think, I mean, like the size is probably

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Speaker 3: the biggest thing that holds him back from being a

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Speaker 3: rotation guy. But you know, they they love what they

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Speaker 3: get from off the bench. I mean, Rich a big,

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Speaker 3: big Quinton Jackson fan. And you know, I mean they've

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Speaker 3: started him, you know, I mean like when when they're

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Speaker 3: down enough guys, you know, like Rick elevates him over

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Speaker 3: other guys that that technically seem to be, you know,

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Speaker 3: higher up on the food chain. And I mean, if

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Speaker 3: they started Cam Jones last night, just because you know,

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Speaker 3: you want to give the rookie the opportunity. But Quenton

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Speaker 3: was by far the more effective player between the two,

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Speaker 3: and Jones wasn't bad. But I mean Jackson when he

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Speaker 3: was out there this plus fifteen you know, I mean

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Speaker 3: like he was like they might have won the game

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Speaker 3: if they played Quinton's for thirty five minutes.

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Speaker 4: Tustin, I know you don't cover this team, but do

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Speaker 4: you have any thoughts on where a good fit for

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Speaker 4: Gianna Santa Takopo is.

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Speaker 3: God, it's so hard because I mean, he's such a

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Speaker 3: big piece to move, you know, like, and I mean,

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Speaker 3: I guess Miami, because I'm I think Miami can at

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Speaker 3: least put together a package. I mean, I know they're

433
00:18:36,280 --> 00:18:39,560
Speaker 3: talking about Minnesota being aggressive, and man, that would be something,

434
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:42,040
Speaker 3: you know, with Edwards and if they were able to

435
00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:44,560
Speaker 3: put Edwards and Yannis together, I mean, that would be

436
00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:47,119
Speaker 3: a force and that would be fun stuff. And you

437
00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:48,960
Speaker 3: probably have to move I mean, I guess you have

438
00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:51,000
Speaker 3: to move Gobert. I'm trying to. I'm not, like, off

439
00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:52,280
Speaker 3: the top of my head, I don't know what Gobert

440
00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:55,240
Speaker 3: makes probably like thirty million, you know, and that that

441
00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:57,119
Speaker 3: push you in the range where you can get to

442
00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:59,440
Speaker 3: that fifty four. It gets just tough, you know, Like

443
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:01,760
Speaker 3: it's because of the way the NBA does things, and

444
00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:04,560
Speaker 3: it's good because of the competitive balance it creates that

445
00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:06,960
Speaker 3: like you got to find fifty four million, you know

446
00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:08,520
Speaker 3: what I mean. Like I was like, somebody you know,

447
00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:11,600
Speaker 3: send an email to Greg Doyle and that Greg releases

448
00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:13,159
Speaker 3: Calum with the day and he's like, well, you know

449
00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:15,280
Speaker 3: what if they traded the first you know that that

450
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:17,800
Speaker 3: top pick, Like, wouldn't that be interesting? And it would,

451
00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:19,960
Speaker 3: but it's like, you still have to find fifty four million,

452
00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:21,639
Speaker 3: like you you like, the Pacers would have to put

453
00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:23,560
Speaker 3: obi top and an entry them hard together unless they're

454
00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:26,320
Speaker 3: willing to move Siakam, So like they don't become really

455
00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:29,000
Speaker 3: a contender in that as much as you know, hey, like, yeah,

456
00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:31,200
Speaker 3: Halliburton Siakam thing would be fun and if you're the Bucks,

457
00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:34,560
Speaker 3: you'd love to have a top five pick, but you

458
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:37,919
Speaker 3: got to find the money. And so I think Miami

459
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:39,720
Speaker 3: and Minnesota I think are the ones that make the

460
00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:42,800
Speaker 3: most sense to me so far. And having some guys

461
00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:44,960
Speaker 3: that are a little bit you know, overpaid that they

462
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:48,480
Speaker 3: could they could you be willing to part with and

463
00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:50,680
Speaker 3: they would sit in those circumstances and it's it's a

464
00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:53,960
Speaker 3: good team if you imagine them together, you know. I

465
00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:56,320
Speaker 3: think those are two teams that stand out to me

466
00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:58,920
Speaker 3: that I could see it. But it's it's just hard

467
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:00,720
Speaker 3: to move a guy with that, you know, that makes

468
00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:03,159
Speaker 3: that kind of money. It's not an easy deal to make.

469
00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:05,879
Speaker 1: What did you think, by the way of Cam Jones'

470
00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:08,440
Speaker 1: performance last night? Really the first time, I think, you know,

471
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:10,760
Speaker 1: we're starting to see him get some minutes. Not saying

472
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:12,600
Speaker 1: that he's going to be a long term rotational piece

473
00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:14,840
Speaker 1: for them, but they did think highly of him when

474
00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:16,000
Speaker 1: they when they drafted him.

475
00:20:16,359 --> 00:20:18,040
Speaker 2: Your thoughts on what he was able to do.

476
00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:20,920
Speaker 3: Or not do, Yeah, decent. I mean, I think you know,

477
00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:23,639
Speaker 3: it's it's still I mean, he could be you know,

478
00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:25,600
Speaker 3: he could be useful on term. They've certainly turned second

479
00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:27,720
Speaker 3: round picks in the in the useful players Percy and

480
00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:30,840
Speaker 3: obviously Mamhard, So you know, like he had the chance,

481
00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:34,080
Speaker 3: and I think it's it's just been, as Ricarlos pointing out,

482
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:35,480
Speaker 3: it's just been a really tough break for the kid.

483
00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:37,560
Speaker 3: I mean, like, you know, he didn't he didn't have

484
00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:40,200
Speaker 3: a preseason camp because he has that lower back thing,

485
00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:42,240
Speaker 3: you know. I mean like I mean like he was

486
00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:44,920
Speaker 3: a brace for a minute, and so like he doesn't

487
00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:46,680
Speaker 3: get out on the floor until like I mean, he

488
00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:48,359
Speaker 3: didn't even really start doing something in December, and I

489
00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:50,240
Speaker 3: remember just like watching him at the end of practices,

490
00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:53,200
Speaker 3: you know, right around that NBA Cup break, and I

491
00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:55,800
Speaker 3: mean me and Tony Ustil watches like, man, he's far off,

492
00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,040
Speaker 3: Like he don't look like he has any you know,

493
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,199
Speaker 3: like like his body don't look right at all all

494
00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:02,960
Speaker 3: right now, and he's come such a long way a lot.

495
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:03,159
Speaker 2: You know.

496
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:04,879
Speaker 3: I mean, he just looks so much smoother and like

497
00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:07,800
Speaker 3: shot looks pretty good. I mean, I think you're reminded

498
00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:09,800
Speaker 3: of some stuff he did at Marquette, Like he's got

499
00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:12,520
Speaker 3: a really good at playing off at two feet, you know,

500
00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,000
Speaker 3: ability to really score it all three levels, really good

501
00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:17,399
Speaker 3: touch around the rim, you know, ability to kind of

502
00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:20,399
Speaker 3: have different kinds of finishes that you really like is

503
00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:23,159
Speaker 3: you know, willing past or you know, pretty good you

504
00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:25,240
Speaker 3: know again, ability to create off the bounce, to create

505
00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:27,840
Speaker 3: for other people off the bounce. It was all all

506
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:30,520
Speaker 3: pretty good stuff. And you know, not the best defender,

507
00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:32,840
Speaker 3: but but you know, they kind of think he didn't

508
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:34,960
Speaker 3: really do anyth good on defense. I've reminded that that

509
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:36,800
Speaker 3: stood out to me last night. That wasn't too great.

510
00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:39,000
Speaker 3: But you know, offensively, he gives you a lot of

511
00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:42,560
Speaker 3: potential weapons and you can see him being you know,

512
00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:44,720
Speaker 3: a depth point guard in the long term, and like

513
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:47,040
Speaker 3: there there will be a time when you start to

514
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,080
Speaker 3: see TJ to slow down it. You know, like as

515
00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:52,480
Speaker 3: good as he is, it's fighting father time off and

516
00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:54,760
Speaker 3: he's excellent at it. You know, there will be a

517
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:56,560
Speaker 3: time where they need there needs to be a third

518
00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 3: guy in this group. In additionance, you could see Ken

519
00:21:59,160 --> 00:21:59,880
Speaker 3: Jones maybe being.

520
00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:03,280
Speaker 4: That After the game Monday night, you and Benedict Matheren

521
00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:05,640
Speaker 4: had a pretty fun little interaction there, you two kind

522
00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,879
Speaker 4: of flirting with each other and smiling back unfortunately with

523
00:22:09,040 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 4: one another. It is eleven PM around that time in

524
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:16,200
Speaker 4: Milwaukee when you are in the media room and you're

525
00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:19,800
Speaker 4: waiting on a player uh to smile at and is

526
00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:22,520
Speaker 4: Benig Matherin walking through that door and you smile and

527
00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:24,520
Speaker 4: you're smiling at him at eleven pm Friday night.

528
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:28,879
Speaker 3: You're killed me? You killed me? Coin flip Yeah, man,

529
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,000
Speaker 3: I mean I think it's fifty fifty. Obviously, they've they've

530
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,520
Speaker 3: got to explore all options here, and you know, like

531
00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:37,960
Speaker 3: like I just be they It does not seem like

532
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:40,440
Speaker 3: they want to swing and give him a real big extension.

533
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 3: If if you're keeping around. You're doing it on the

534
00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:44,960
Speaker 3: possibility that you think there's just not enough of a

535
00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,000
Speaker 3: market for him for somebody to take him off your hands,

536
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:51,159
Speaker 3: you know, in terms of free agency. So I mean, like,

537
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:54,160
Speaker 3: does some think Ben I think Ben has a look

538
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,200
Speaker 3: to him that says, I'm okay with moving on?

539
00:22:56,480 --> 00:22:57,520
Speaker 2: Could they get more?

540
00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,080
Speaker 1: Could they get more for him if they wait and

541
00:23:00,200 --> 00:23:01,800
Speaker 1: do it as a sign in trade, so that a

542
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:05,960
Speaker 1: team has stability of knowing how long they're getting the

543
00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:07,640
Speaker 1: guy under under a contract.

544
00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,640
Speaker 2: Could that maybe could that get more paid back? Yeah?

545
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:13,840
Speaker 3: Maybe? Like I don't know, And I think that's not

546
00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 3: like if you're you know, like if you're Kevin Pusher

547
00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:19,680
Speaker 3: and Chad Buchan, and that's what you need to know

548
00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:22,680
Speaker 3: right now, you know, that's that's the that's the question

549
00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:24,359
Speaker 3: you have to have asked. I would think if you're

550
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:26,720
Speaker 3: calling and talking to these teams as far as trade

551
00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,600
Speaker 3: partners are concerned, that's what you would want to find out,

552
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 3: you know, and say like okay, like do you want

553
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,400
Speaker 3: this guy signed for a longer time? Like how much

554
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:37,080
Speaker 3: do you want him? What's he mean to you? And

555
00:23:37,600 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 3: you know, like I certainly, however they do this probably

556
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:42,440
Speaker 3: tells you what the answer is to that question, like

557
00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:46,520
Speaker 3: I don't know, but if you're you know, like that's

558
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:49,480
Speaker 3: you know, I don't know, Like I mean, it's hard

559
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:51,960
Speaker 3: to say. I think it's a question of it does

560
00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:53,879
Speaker 3: go back? I think to Jake something you've said a

561
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:57,000
Speaker 3: few times as is he the twenty five twenty guy

562
00:23:57,080 --> 00:23:58,919
Speaker 3: or is the twenty twenty five let me.

563
00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:03,040
Speaker 1: Tell you something doesn't okay? Just you remember that you

564
00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:08,360
Speaker 1: have no idea? Do you watch Seinfeld by chance from

565
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:08,960
Speaker 1: time to time?

566
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:12,359
Speaker 3: I'm not like a devoted voted at.

567
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 1: The risk of offending listeners and or in case kids

568
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 1: are listening, there's a there's an episode where George Costanza

569
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,960
Speaker 1: goes and gets a massage and it happens to be

570
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:24,480
Speaker 1: a male masseuse, and he makes mention of a concern

571
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 1: he had of just in terms of his biological reaction

572
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:31,159
Speaker 1: to that. That's similar to how I feel knowing that

573
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:34,119
Speaker 1: you reference the twenty twenty five guy. The fact that

574
00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:39,560
Speaker 1: you an esteemed established NBA beat writer with credentials and

575
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: you know, an accolade, and you're willing to go to

576
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 1: this dog and Pony show and pick up on twenty

577
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,359
Speaker 1: twenty five guy, which is a guy destined to score

578
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,960
Speaker 1: twenty a game on a twenty five win team for

579
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:52,240
Speaker 1: the totality of his career.

580
00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:54,159
Speaker 2: You have no idea what that means for me.

581
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:58,080
Speaker 3: I mean you have mentioned it's gonna be probably three

582
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:00,439
Speaker 3: or four times, so it did stick. I think you're right.

583
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:04,080
Speaker 3: But it is a useful it's useful terminology. It is.

584
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:07,280
Speaker 3: It is a very good concept. Jack. I'm not going

585
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:09,680
Speaker 3: to get into the visuals that came from that Seinfeld story,

586
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 3: so I would just say it is a good concept.

587
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,639
Speaker 3: It is a good concept, and it is one that

588
00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:17,719
Speaker 3: you just keep out there because there is there are

589
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:19,800
Speaker 3: guys like that that's like, okay, like that guy can

590
00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:22,840
Speaker 3: score anywhere, but does he help you win? And you know,

591
00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 3: I am interested. I do wonder if other teams look

592
00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:27,159
Speaker 3: at him and say, well, that guy can get you

593
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 3: twenty five a night, but what's that twenty five the

594
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,200
Speaker 3: night getting yet? Like if he's just you know, going

595
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:33,440
Speaker 3: one on one and and all that kind of stuff

596
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:36,240
Speaker 3: and just just worried about how much he scores, you know,

597
00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,000
Speaker 3: how much does that make a difference? Right again, I

598
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:40,280
Speaker 3: think he's made a lot of progress, and you know,

599
00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:44,000
Speaker 3: that's that's honestly, why you keep seeing me like get

600
00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 3: caught smiling at massiveness because every time I ask a

601
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 3: question about passing or something he had, he flashes that,

602
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,600
Speaker 3: and I'm like, okay, like I need to need to know,

603
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,119
Speaker 3: like I'm not insulting you, you know, and like I

604
00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:59,400
Speaker 3: do think he's made rope progress as far as that's concerned,

605
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 3: and that he has become a much better team oriented player.

606
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 3: But one he has a long you know, still has

607
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:06,440
Speaker 3: a long way to go in two mem Hard and

608
00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:08,480
Speaker 3: the Smiths are just way more natural at it. That's

609
00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 3: just how they play, and Mesine has to go a

610
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:12,840
Speaker 3: long way. But I am you know, I am interested

611
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 3: in if other execs look at him sokay, that's just

612
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:17,719
Speaker 3: that that's an empty calories guy. I know he can

613
00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:18,159
Speaker 3: score out one.

614
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,440
Speaker 1: Well, hold on, hold on, hold the phone. Can you

615
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 1: hit the breaking news sounder, if you could, please, Eddie

616
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:28,680
Speaker 1: hit the breaking Dustin just used the term. I kid

617
00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 1: you not that I was about to say the other

618
00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:32,920
Speaker 1: one that I coined. Now, I don't know, Dustin. Maybe

619
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,159
Speaker 1: it's the bate of mind help phenomenon. I thought I

620
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 1: coined empty calories guy, and the fact that you just

621
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,680
Speaker 1: used it there means once again I've crept into your

622
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,879
Speaker 1: subconscious there maybe maybe maybe I subconsciously got it from you.

623
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:49,440
Speaker 1: But empty calories, guy, also a beautiful term, and I'm

624
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:53,360
Speaker 1: gonna rip credit for that if I can go ahead. Yes,

625
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:56,760
Speaker 1: empty calories guy, Eddie, you've heard me mention it, right,

626
00:26:56,840 --> 00:26:58,520
Speaker 1: that's the next one that I'm all on the train.

627
00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,399
Speaker 1: We're retiring twenty twenty five, guy, all in on empty

628
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,360
Speaker 1: calories guys, right, and Dustin's going to use all of them.

629
00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:06,280
Speaker 2: Dustin, I appreciate the time.

630
00:27:06,160 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 3: As always, man, absolutely thanks for having me.

631
00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:12,200
Speaker 1: Dustin appirak from the Indianapolis Star, the Indiana Pacers beat

632
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:16,560
Speaker 1: writer Job alse Peel and poor guests. I'm I'm going

633
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,760
Speaker 1: to bring Zach Osterman into this equation now, Zach, of course,

634
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 1: with the Indianapolis Star, Java House Peel and poor guest

635
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:25,640
Speaker 1: line and Zach, you thought you were coming on here

636
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 1: to talk about Indiana and USC last night. But I'm

637
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,840
Speaker 1: going to begin with because you're probably still a little

638
00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:34,159
Speaker 1: bit in football mode, I'm going to.

639
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 2: Begin with for you a football question. Are you prepared? Yeah?

640
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:44,040
Speaker 1: Of course, Okay, it's an NFL question, though not a

641
00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 1: college football question. I'd like for you to tell me

642
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 1: if you agree or disagree with the following statement. And

643
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:55,000
Speaker 1: I because I think there might be some bias here

644
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,639
Speaker 1: on my behalf because of the market where I'm working.

645
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: But you grew up in Atlanta. You're a Falcons fan.

646
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:05,440
Speaker 1: They've had runs where they've been pretty competitive. They don't

647
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:10,000
Speaker 1: necessarily have The Falcons don't have a natural rival, per

648
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 1: se in the two teams that are participating to hold

649
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:18,159
Speaker 1: on amongst the two teams that are participating, Albeit the

650
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:20,119
Speaker 1: twenty eight to three still really hurts.

651
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:22,240
Speaker 2: I get that, but.

652
00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 1: It seems to me that this Super Bowl leading up

653
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:34,040
Speaker 1: to it has a lot less national cultural juice versus

654
00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:38,480
Speaker 1: other years. I have heard a lesser amount about Media

655
00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 1: Day and big storylines going into it, and buzz and

656
00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,960
Speaker 1: hype and people getting fired up for it, and what

657
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,480
Speaker 1: commercials are going to be out there other than the

658
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 1: halftime show. I've heard very little buzz and anticipation and

659
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 1: excitement on the street about the Super Bowl. But maybe

660
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 1: that's because I'm doing a radio show and a market

661
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 1: that is very far from Seattle and hates New England.

662
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:07,960
Speaker 2: What say you, I don't think that's unfair. I think.

663
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,920
Speaker 5: I mean I'm looking at this, well, we're talking here,

664
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 5: and somebody probably could have this more immediately at hand

665
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 5: than me. You know, when it was the last time

666
00:29:22,560 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 5: that we had a Super Bowl that did not include

667
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 5: like an established superstar.

668
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:31,960
Speaker 2: Quarterback, right, or or an established like.

669
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 5: A tea or even just a head coach, you know,

670
00:29:36,200 --> 00:29:40,440
Speaker 5: like a like an Andy Reid type figure, or you know,

671
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 5: I mean, Mike Rabel's obviously been around a while.

672
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 3: But it's not like either the you know, it's not like.

673
00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:46,960
Speaker 5: Dick Vermeal chasing his first super Bowl with the Rams

674
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 5: like it. I don't know if this is gonna be

675
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,160
Speaker 5: a changing of the guards season or if this is

676
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:54,520
Speaker 5: just kind of one of those years obviously Kansas City

677
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 5: was down. You know, we can probably have a conversation

678
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,240
Speaker 5: about maybe some of the shifting dynamics in court, about

679
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:05,720
Speaker 5: playing general in the league. But I do think, you know,

680
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 5: maybe we look at this as an outlier. Maybe this

681
00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 5: is just, you know, the beginning of something, whether it's

682
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 5: like the beginning of a run for the Seahawks or

683
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:17,840
Speaker 5: it's the beginning of you know, three super Bowl championships

684
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 5: for Drake May. I don't know, but it's just you know,

685
00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 5: if you if you think back to these last several

686
00:30:23,920 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 5: Super Bowls. You've got Pat Mahomes, You've got you know,

687
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 5: Sean McVay versus Joe Burrow. You've got obviously, you know,

688
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:34,600
Speaker 5: all the stuff that, especially in the moment, wound up

689
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 5: being compelling. With the Eagles and their Super Bowls. You've

690
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,680
Speaker 5: got Tom Brady and Bill Belichick. You've got you know,

691
00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:43,720
Speaker 5: Tom Brady in Tampa Bay. You've got the Kyle Shanahan

692
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,400
Speaker 5: of it all when when he's been in in the

693
00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:48,200
Speaker 5: Super Bowl. And we obviously don't need to bring up

694
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 5: too much about twenty seventeen, but it just feels like

695
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 5: a year where, for whatever reason, and an abnormal number

696
00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 5: of storylines to reset themselves at once. And then you

697
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 5: couple that to the fact that in the West Coast

698
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:06,440
Speaker 5: Super Bowl it's you know, it's it's in San Francisco,

699
00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:08,360
Speaker 5: which is someone who's covered a Bowl game out there,

700
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 5: that's it's kind of an awkward place because everything's gonna

701
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:14,239
Speaker 5: be in San Francisco, and Levi Stadium is nowhere near

702
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:18,320
Speaker 5: San Francisco. It does feel oddly to disconnected.

703
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 2: I agree with you.

704
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,600
Speaker 1: Do you think part of it also is the fact

705
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:26,080
Speaker 1: that we are in Indianapolis. And while people here are

706
00:31:26,160 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 1: passionate about the Colts, there's an element of almost like

707
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:33,520
Speaker 1: a fomo of like, you know what that here are

708
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:37,800
Speaker 1: two franchises that, you know, when when Andrew Luck retired,

709
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:42,400
Speaker 1: the Seahawks like didn't even Sam Darnold was nowhere near

710
00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 1: their radar. And when Andrew Luck retired that you know,

711
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,080
Speaker 1: Drake May was like probably in late middle school, and

712
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 1: Mike Vrabel was you know, nowhere in the in the

713
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 1: conscious of New England. And yet these are two franchises

714
00:31:55,560 --> 00:31:57,800
Speaker 1: that god aggressive, did what they had to do and

715
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 1: got back there, and the Colts are still sitting around

716
00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,719
Speaker 1: with the same storyline and the same narrative of did

717
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,520
Speaker 1: you know Ander Luck retired? And that has just caused

718
00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:10,480
Speaker 1: people to become like a loof about it. Am I

719
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:11,480
Speaker 1: being too cynical?

720
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 5: No, I don't think that's that's totally unfair.

721
00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:15,520
Speaker 3: And I mean, listen, you know.

722
00:32:15,760 --> 00:32:17,719
Speaker 5: It didn't feel that way for a lot of this season, right,

723
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:19,920
Speaker 5: And I'm not a cold fan, but you know, I

724
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,800
Speaker 5: worked for the Star, I live in the the indie market.

725
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,640
Speaker 5: Like there was a point where we thought live bit

726
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:27,680
Speaker 5: of this way. I know, Sam Donald, you know, didn't

727
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:29,680
Speaker 5: come out of nowhere this year. But there was a

728
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:31,800
Speaker 5: point where we all wondered if Daniel Jones was was

729
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:35,400
Speaker 5: maybe doing something that's fair. It's similar to to what

730
00:32:35,760 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 5: Sam Darnald did, what like last year, just this year

731
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 5: in Indianapolis. And then the injuries happened, and you know,

732
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:43,880
Speaker 5: maybe that's a little bit of a reminder of just

733
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 5: like the fragility of life in the NFL, that all

734
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 5: it takes is a little bit of quarterback uncertainty and

735
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 5: the whole thing gets beat six And I think, again,

736
00:32:51,400 --> 00:32:54,680
Speaker 5: we can you know, maybe it's really easy to start

737
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 5: looking at the at the past through roast colored glasses

738
00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:59,560
Speaker 5: that say, geez, weren't things great ten years ago? But

739
00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:04,440
Speaker 5: it does like maybe in general, like quarterback play has

740
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 5: started to turn a little bit. And I think again,

741
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 5: I mean, I just got done covering a Heisman Trophy

742
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:12,480
Speaker 5: season where I think we had some of these similar

743
00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 5: conversations about how coverage has changed, you know, defensive coverages

744
00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:20,760
Speaker 5: have changed, quarterback stats, clock rules have changed, quarterback stats,

745
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 5: all these different kinds of things.

746
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 2: But it does. I mean, I guess I'm.

747
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,240
Speaker 5: Sitting here and saying I'm prepared to see a lot

748
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 5: of this as an outlier, and maybe even you know,

749
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:33,720
Speaker 5: specific to the cults, almost kind of Hey, they made

750
00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,400
Speaker 5: actually a decent fifth of it this year until their

751
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 5: quarterback got hurt, which is just one of those things

752
00:33:38,720 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 5: you can't really always control for. But I don't know,

753
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:44,920
Speaker 5: maybe five years from now we're still having the same

754
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 5: conversation around Indy. Maybe five years from now we've had

755
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 5: the same conversation around you know, three of the last

756
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 5: five Super Bowls. I don't know, it's I mean, listen,

757
00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:56,520
Speaker 5: the money suggests that the NFL is not losing juice,

758
00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:00,240
Speaker 5: but I agree that it does. And it's someone who,

759
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,560
Speaker 5: you know, frankly, grew up in a market that is

760
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:08,080
Speaker 5: probably stuck in a not totally dissimilar place to Indianapolis

761
00:34:08,200 --> 00:34:11,239
Speaker 5: right now, good enough not to tank and just start

762
00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:14,479
Speaker 5: all over, but bad enough not to feel like there's

763
00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:19,160
Speaker 5: a lot of energy or forward facing optimism.

764
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 3: It is kind of an odd place to be, Zach.

765
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:26,960
Speaker 1: Let's talk about what happened last night in LA between

766
00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 1: Indiana and USC and I want to begin with Nick Dorn.

767
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:32,640
Speaker 2: Did you know Nick Dorn was shooting the ball really well.

768
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:36,239
Speaker 1: He became suddenly this secondary scoring option for Indiana as

769
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:40,520
Speaker 1: Tuckertavereeze continues to struggle, and Lamar Wilkerson is a volume score,

770
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:44,239
Speaker 1: no doubt about that. But did we become intrigued by

771
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:47,879
Speaker 1: the anomaly and last night Nick Dorn, who was two

772
00:34:47,920 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 1: of twelve.

773
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:49,359
Speaker 2: Came back to Earth?

774
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:53,400
Speaker 1: Or is Nick Dorn in fact that player that we

775
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,520
Speaker 1: were hoping he was turning into and last night was

776
00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:58,280
Speaker 1: the anomaly just based on fatigue?

777
00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:01,480
Speaker 5: I think it'd be a bit of both. You know,

778
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 5: there were moments, I mean, and I watched the game

779
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:06,920
Speaker 5: from home. Mike knives look made the trip out to

780
00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:10,440
Speaker 5: La you know he I mean, he attended twelve three,

781
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:13,879
Speaker 5: He's all twelve. His field goal attempts came from behind

782
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 5: the arc. And I'm not gonna act like I went

783
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:18,160
Speaker 5: back and charted them all today, But in real time

784
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:20,880
Speaker 5: I felt like I had I saw a help he

785
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 5: slit between. That's a good shot that didn't go in.

786
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,520
Speaker 5: And maybe that's an example of a player who suddenly

787
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 5: got to learn how to grapple with a little bit

788
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:33,800
Speaker 5: more defensive attention, if you know what I'm saying. You know,

789
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:35,839
Speaker 5: USC right now is kind of a team that's trying

790
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,760
Speaker 5: to defend its way through its problems. You know, Rodney

791
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:42,440
Speaker 5: Rice is out, Chad Bickramazar obviously missed a healthy amount

792
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 5: of last night after he rolled his ankle. I thought

793
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:46,880
Speaker 5: Dorin had some good moments. I thought he had some moments.

794
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:50,320
Speaker 5: He's kind of an unconventional shooter to begin with, Like

795
00:35:50,400 --> 00:35:53,719
Speaker 5: he's not afraid to pull from distance. He's not necessarily

796
00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 5: all shooters are better when they're squared up, but he's

797
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,160
Speaker 5: not necessarily somebody that has to be perfectly square to get.

798
00:35:59,080 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 3: His shot off.

799
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:01,960
Speaker 5: So every once in a while, miss SHOT's going to

800
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:05,400
Speaker 5: look a little bit, I don't know, mechanically netsier, I

801
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:07,960
Speaker 5: think than what you would expect, and is still going

802
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:10,880
Speaker 5: to go in of course. You know, everyone sort of

803
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,000
Speaker 5: said last night, it's not an excuse. We've got to

804
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:14,920
Speaker 5: be better. You know, everybody's got to go through these

805
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:17,759
Speaker 5: West Coast road trips. That doesn't change the fact that,

806
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:21,040
Speaker 5: you know, it is still a long time on the road,

807
00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 5: and for what it's worthd I'm I'm not totally sure

808
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:26,200
Speaker 5: Indiana wasn't dealing with that. I mean, I don't think

809
00:36:26,239 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 5: dar In de Very's brought up illness or anything like that,

810
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 5: but I'm not totally sure Indiana wasn't dealing with something

811
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 5: like that, which, again, it's kind of one of those

812
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:34,400
Speaker 5: things that you talk to a college basketball coach, they

813
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:36,000
Speaker 5: will tell you that they just have to factor it

814
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:37,960
Speaker 5: into their season once or twice a year, that their

815
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,080
Speaker 5: team is just going to get sick for a week

816
00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:43,520
Speaker 5: in an inopportune time. I have no idea if that

817
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 5: affected dorn shooting night, but I feel like it was

818
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 5: probably at least to what I saw a little bit of,

819
00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:52,880
Speaker 5: you know, hey, forty eight minutes, three nights earlier on

820
00:36:53,040 --> 00:36:56,360
Speaker 5: the road for a whole weekend on the West Coast, tired,

821
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:59,440
Speaker 5: worn down, and a little bit of hey, if you're

822
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,799
Speaker 5: going to score twenty points to night, eighteen points a night,

823
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:03,759
Speaker 5: you've got to be prepared to work a little bit

824
00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 5: harder because you're going to get that little bit more

825
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:07,799
Speaker 5: effort from the opponent's game plan.

826
00:37:08,280 --> 00:37:10,880
Speaker 2: Is Talker Tobrees one hundred percent healthy?

827
00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:15,759
Speaker 5: I don't know, if I guess the question would be

828
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,040
Speaker 5: like probably that, The question more to ask him would be,

829
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 5: is he one hundred percent where he was before his

830
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:26,560
Speaker 5: previous injuries? Because he talked about in the offseason, the preseason,

831
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 5: you know how he's dealt with I think multiple shoulder

832
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:31,800
Speaker 5: injuries at this point. Obviously, this is a player who's

833
00:37:32,239 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 5: played one hundred and thirty one career games in college,

834
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:36,799
Speaker 5: so there's plenty of miles on the clock. I don't

835
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,839
Speaker 5: know if he's necessarily injured right now today. I think

836
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:41,919
Speaker 5: the question maybe, and I don't want to put words

837
00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:44,560
Speaker 5: in anyone's mouth. I want to be careful. Maybe would

838
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:46,640
Speaker 5: be a little bit more of you know, where does

839
00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:48,640
Speaker 5: he feel like he is compared to where he was

840
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 5: like two years ago, because sometimes that stuff can have

841
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:55,840
Speaker 5: a compounding effect where you do look at you know,

842
00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 5: the quickness in a shot release or the reaction times

843
00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:02,759
Speaker 5: you know with the ball, the ability to put it

844
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 5: on the floor and get out ahead of somebody. I mean,

845
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 5: one of the biggest numbers, you know, for me this

846
00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 5: season from degrees is I mean, he was consistently one

847
00:38:10,840 --> 00:38:12,960
Speaker 5: of the best players on his team at drawing fouls.

848
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:16,000
Speaker 5: You know, he was top five in the valley his

849
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 5: last two years in fouls drawn for forty minutes. He's

850
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 5: drawn two point one fouls per forty minutes. A big

851
00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:23,719
Speaker 5: ten play right now, and you would expect some of

852
00:38:23,719 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 5: those numbers go down, of course, but that tells you

853
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:28,320
Speaker 5: that's that's somebody who's just not moving with maybe the

854
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,200
Speaker 5: same quickness and the same purpose and the same you know,

855
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 5: just sort of sharpness that maybe they once had.

856
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:34,959
Speaker 3: Now I think he deserves credit.

857
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 5: He is certainly sort of shored up some of Indiana's

858
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 5: issues elsewhere, rebounding the ball, passing the ball, his turnover

859
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 5: rate is excellent. But I think, you know, the question

860
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:47,200
Speaker 5: I maybe would would frame that, or the way I

861
00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:47,800
Speaker 5: would ram.

862
00:38:47,680 --> 00:38:48,640
Speaker 3: That question would be less.

863
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,279
Speaker 5: You know, is it a health now issue or is

864
00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:56,200
Speaker 5: it more of a again, a compounding of just the

865
00:38:56,280 --> 00:38:57,880
Speaker 5: wear and tear of a career issue.

866
00:38:58,360 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 2: Zach.

867
00:38:58,600 --> 00:39:01,520
Speaker 1: When I look at Zachsterman's my guest Jaba house Peel

868
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: and poor guest line he's with the Indianapolis Star, the

869
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:07,439
Speaker 1: Indiana Athletics beat writer. When I look at this team,

870
00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:12,880
Speaker 1: and I'll be honest, they have I think they've gotten

871
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:15,440
Speaker 1: better as the year has gone on. And you know,

872
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:19,120
Speaker 1: we don't know a lot about Darren Devrees, but it's

873
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:21,399
Speaker 1: a roster that he had to put together rather late.

874
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:25,440
Speaker 1: They probably were wearing name tags for the first two

875
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 1: months they were around one another. Yes, I know they

876
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:29,759
Speaker 1: took a preseason trip together and that kind of thing.

877
00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 1: But when you look at the fact that they are

878
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:36,400
Speaker 1: putting themselves in position now to enter into the NCAA

879
00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:41,480
Speaker 1: tournament conversation last night, notwithstanding they they've seemed to have

880
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:43,440
Speaker 1: hit kind of a stride here in the way they're playing.

881
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:48,680
Speaker 1: Does that speak more to Darren Devrees' ability even late

882
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 1: to character assess and build a roster of players that

883
00:39:54,560 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 1: are going to be able to buy in or does

884
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:01,360
Speaker 1: it speak more to simply the x's and o's of

885
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:05,280
Speaker 1: him schematically coming up with things that favor the pieces

886
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:06,319
Speaker 1: with which he had to deal.

887
00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:11,200
Speaker 5: You know, if we're talking about like this season, I

888
00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:15,640
Speaker 5: would lean more towards the former because there was that stretch.

889
00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:17,600
Speaker 5: And I understand it's an experienced team, and I know

890
00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,759
Speaker 5: people will say, listen, these guys are making red share

891
00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:22,640
Speaker 5: in NIL, they should be playing hard. I appreciate all that,

892
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 5: and there's an extent to which I agree with it.

893
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:26,640
Speaker 5: But any team that loses four games in a row

894
00:40:26,719 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 5: in the middle of January and loses them frankly the

895
00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:30,520
Speaker 5: way Indiana lost some of those games, in the Michigan

896
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:33,400
Speaker 5: State game, the Isle game, and so forth, you know

897
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,440
Speaker 5: that there is an intangibility about kind of pulling yourself

898
00:40:36,520 --> 00:40:39,879
Speaker 5: back up from a stretch like that to win three

899
00:40:39,920 --> 00:40:41,640
Speaker 5: in a row, and even that, you know, even last night,

900
00:40:41,680 --> 00:40:44,280
Speaker 5: I know they lose, but it's a quad one loss.

901
00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:46,880
Speaker 5: It was it was a game in the final thirty seconds,

902
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:48,400
Speaker 5: like you know it was. Again, it was the end

903
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:51,359
Speaker 5: of a pretty lengthy road trip. You can you can

904
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 5: live with that as long as you respond to with

905
00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 5: the right way. And I think Indiana's sort of two

906
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:58,040
Speaker 5: game home stand up coming is really really important for

907
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:00,480
Speaker 5: this team's sort of turn an outlook.

908
00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 3: And we could talk about that if you want, but I.

909
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:06,719
Speaker 5: Think if we're talking about this season specifically, I think

910
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:11,000
Speaker 5: you look at the way Indiana responded to that dip

911
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:14,520
Speaker 5: between Nebraska and Michigan, and you give Degrees and his

912
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:16,279
Speaker 5: roster a lot of credit for the way they held

913
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 5: some things together intangibly. I think if you look at

914
00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:23,080
Speaker 5: both just the pure x's and o's of the stuff

915
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:26,400
Speaker 5: that Indiana runs, the shots they create, where they go

916
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:30,600
Speaker 5: for their offense, who's doing the scoring, you know, how

917
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 5: the shots are distributed. And then I think if you

918
00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 5: also look at and I watched you know, Degrees often

919
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 5: on especially back in Drake, those last two or three

920
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:41,600
Speaker 5: years just for different reasons. I found myself watching a

921
00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:45,480
Speaker 5: decent amount of Drake basketball. I think you see a

922
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 5: lot of natural follow on philosophically from what he learned

923
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 5: from Dana Altman, what he learned from Greg McDermott, who

924
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:54,799
Speaker 5: coaches obviously this season are not necessarily having a ton

925
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,560
Speaker 5: of success, but have been. You know, I would I

926
00:41:57,560 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 5: don't think it's unfair to say, you know, relative models

927
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 5: of consistency over the last ten to fifteen years in

928
00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:07,400
Speaker 5: college basketball, especially in their ability to recruit and develop

929
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:10,520
Speaker 5: and build really, really good offensive teams.

930
00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:12,239
Speaker 2: So I think it's a bit of both.

931
00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:15,480
Speaker 5: Now, listen, you know, we can have that conversation and

932
00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:17,719
Speaker 5: we can also say, but there's gonna be a lot

933
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 5: to replace off this roster when the time comes. You know,

934
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,680
Speaker 5: there's a player there and Lamar Wilkerson that is doing

935
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 5: a ton of heavy lifting. Wilkerson as second in the

936
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:29,120
Speaker 5: conference right now in Big Ten play in percentage of

937
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:32,640
Speaker 5: shots taken like he is. He is handling as much

938
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:34,800
Speaker 5: workload as anybody in the Big Ten right now. So

939
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:36,759
Speaker 5: you can also look at it and say some of

940
00:42:36,800 --> 00:42:39,560
Speaker 5: this is let's give credit to the individual talent of

941
00:42:39,680 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 5: some of these players. But I would probably split my

942
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:44,919
Speaker 5: answer down the middle in terms of what I see

943
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 5: out of this team intangibly this season, and then also

944
00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:52,640
Speaker 5: what I think and time will tell, will be able

945
00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 5: to sort of transition as you know, moving forward, as

946
00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 5: Debris maybe gets a little bit more of that roster

947
00:42:58,239 --> 00:42:59,200
Speaker 5: balance that he'd like to have.

948
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:00,439
Speaker 2: Did not see.

949
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:04,320
Speaker 1: And you know what, I can't recall Zach if he

950
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:07,200
Speaker 1: came back into the game or stayed out for the game.

951
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:09,880
Speaker 1: But late in the game last night, sam Alexis was

952
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:13,000
Speaker 1: very slow to get up. I couldn't tell if it

953
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 1: was a knee Well, you know, I was doing other things,

954
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:18,319
Speaker 1: truth be told. Do we know whether or not there

955
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:20,520
Speaker 1: was a legit injury there or whether or not that

956
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 1: is something where he could miss time?

957
00:43:23,080 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 2: Well, I think he.

958
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 5: I think he fouled out, So I think that was

959
00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 5: I think that was what eventually kind of kept him

960
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:29,640
Speaker 5: out of the game. Was he filed out with like

961
00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:33,439
Speaker 5: two minutes left, So I mean he was he wasn't

962
00:43:33,680 --> 00:43:35,839
Speaker 5: you know necessarily I think to your point, I don't

963
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 5: think he was, you know, springing all over the floor.

964
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:39,160
Speaker 5: He did play more minutes, so.

965
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:40,920
Speaker 1: Was he do you know what I'm talking about though,

966
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 1: when he went down and looked hurt or was it

967
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 1: that he was in dismay because that was his sixth

968
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:45,640
Speaker 1: or his fifth foul.

969
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:50,000
Speaker 5: I think I thought it was more the reaction to

970
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:51,400
Speaker 5: the call, But I'm not positing.

971
00:43:51,680 --> 00:43:53,799
Speaker 1: Admittedly, I didn't have the audio on that that maybe

972
00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:56,440
Speaker 1: I should have Probably maybe it would have behooved me, right.

973
00:43:56,560 --> 00:43:58,640
Speaker 1: I just he was down for a while and it

974
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:00,920
Speaker 1: looked at me like he was grabbed onto something I

975
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,279
Speaker 1: didn't know, so apparently not right.

976
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:06,799
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean again, I'm not sure because I wasn't

977
00:44:06,840 --> 00:44:09,320
Speaker 5: in the gym either, But my impression was more just

978
00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:12,640
Speaker 5: than it was the act of fouling out and just

979
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 5: the frustration, you know, that was that was the stretch

980
00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:17,360
Speaker 5: it which it sort of got away from Indiana in

981
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 5: a way. They couldn't quite pull back, you know, they

982
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:21,839
Speaker 5: got it down to what like three there at the end,

983
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 5: but but it was it was that sort of that

984
00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:28,480
Speaker 5: rubber band from about five minutes to two minutes where

985
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 5: the game sort of stretched out and they gave themselves too.

986
00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:31,520
Speaker 3: Much to do.

987
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:34,560
Speaker 1: Okay, Lastly, it seems as though, and you tell me

988
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 1: if you agree with this, Zach, Yeah, I think there

989
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:39,560
Speaker 1: were a lot of Indiana fans.

990
00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:41,480
Speaker 2: I thought it was funny last night somebody had a.

991
00:44:41,560 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 1: Sign that said something like, sorry to arrive late, been

992
00:44:45,800 --> 00:44:48,880
Speaker 1: consumed with college football lately, and it was an Indiana fan, right,

993
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:51,680
Speaker 1: And I do think that there is you know, this

994
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:55,879
Speaker 1: is new territory for Indiana fans, Like wow, like still

995
00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:58,480
Speaker 1: basking in a football season? Then, oh, yes, that's right.

996
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 1: We have a basketball season to to pay attention to. Right,

997
00:45:01,840 --> 00:45:04,520
Speaker 1: And I mean that flippantly, but you get what I'm saying.

998
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:09,480
Speaker 1: But it seems like from the basketball standpoint that Indiana

999
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:11,799
Speaker 1: might have kind of weathered the storm here because they

1000
00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 1: get they come back. You got Wisconsin, then you got Oregon,

1001
00:45:15,120 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: who's way down. Then you got a two step on

1002
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 1: the road that's really tough, but a chance after that

1003
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,960
Speaker 1: to close out pretty strong. And they put themselves now

1004
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,200
Speaker 1: into the conversation, have they even moved at this point

1005
00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:30,920
Speaker 1: off of the bubble, Zach? Is it too early to

1006
00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:34,800
Speaker 1: look that way? And have they indeed kind of taken

1007
00:45:34,920 --> 00:45:38,480
Speaker 1: on the first gauntlet here real challenge for them scheduleized.

1008
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:44,600
Speaker 5: I think to your first question, first, they're on the bubble,

1009
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:45,960
Speaker 5: but I think they're on the right side of it.

1010
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:51,960
Speaker 5: And I am a self avowed rejector of all bracketology

1011
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,640
Speaker 5: projections until Valentine's Day, But the one tool I do

1012
00:45:56,040 --> 00:45:59,280
Speaker 5: lean on starting around this time of year is bracket Matrix,

1013
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:01,080
Speaker 5: which is people I know a lot of people probably do.

1014
00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:05,200
Speaker 5: But it's a website that basically just scrubs the Internet

1015
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:09,359
Speaker 5: for like literally dozens of different bracket projections and then

1016
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:11,880
Speaker 5: creates you know what it would you imagine, which is

1017
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:17,480
Speaker 5: an overall aggregation of those projections. Going into this weekend,

1018
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:21,040
Speaker 5: Indiana was I think in something like twenty of one

1019
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 5: hundred and ten brackets or something.

1020
00:46:23,920 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 2: Along those lines.

1021
00:46:25,320 --> 00:46:28,080
Speaker 5: Now, this hasn't been updated since yesterday. This won't have

1022
00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 5: reflected Indiana's loss against USC, But yesterday's update on bracket

1023
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:36,000
Speaker 5: Matrix at Indiana and ninety eight out of one hundred

1024
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:40,440
Speaker 5: and four brackets, one spot in the aggregate ahead of USC,

1025
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:42,040
Speaker 5: which was in one hundred and one out of one

1026
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,200
Speaker 5: hundred and four brackets. Again, you understand these numbers are imperfect,

1027
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,760
Speaker 5: but that gives you an idea, especially, and I've welcomed

1028
00:46:48,840 --> 00:46:50,359
Speaker 5: people to do this for the last week or two.

1029
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:51,600
Speaker 2: Go look at the bubble.

1030
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 5: The mid major side of the bubble is carved out

1031
00:46:53,960 --> 00:46:56,200
Speaker 5: to almost nothing this year, like the bubble is going

1032
00:46:56,280 --> 00:46:59,320
Speaker 5: to be almost nothing but high major teams. And that's

1033
00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:04,040
Speaker 5: obviously a philosophical discussion for another day, but the bubble

1034
00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 5: is going to be heavily, heavily weighed toward high majors

1035
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:11,120
Speaker 5: this year. And Indiana certainly has done itself favors with

1036
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:13,640
Speaker 5: the CADU win, with the UCLA win. Even you know,

1037
00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:17,759
Speaker 5: someone had a friend texts me, that's late last night

1038
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:21,279
Speaker 5: and I was fading out, but they said, you know

1039
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 5: that even that USC game, especially the way it started

1040
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:24,880
Speaker 5: to go in the second half, was one that you

1041
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:26,560
Speaker 5: feel like Indiana might have found a way to lose

1042
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:29,560
Speaker 5: by twenty a year or two ago. To lose it

1043
00:47:29,680 --> 00:47:32,719
Speaker 5: only by six still rescues you something because it still

1044
00:47:32,760 --> 00:47:36,000
Speaker 5: helps your metrics, It still helps your analytics, It still

1045
00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:38,279
Speaker 5: keeps the floor a little bit more firmly under your

1046
00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:41,280
Speaker 5: feet for the next opportunity, which is, of course Wisconsin

1047
00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 5: on Saturday. Indiana by no means comfortably in the field.

1048
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 5: And I think that that's where you do look at

1049
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:51,840
Speaker 5: first of all these next two and you say you

1050
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:54,920
Speaker 5: have to hold serve probably just the rest of the way.

1051
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:56,160
Speaker 3: At home to feel comfortable.

1052
00:47:56,200 --> 00:47:57,239
Speaker 2: You got five of.

1053
00:47:57,320 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 3: Eight to finish. Now at home, there's a couple.

1054
00:48:00,239 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 5: I think there's maybe one fad to one opportunity, maybe

1055
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:06,000
Speaker 5: two depending on what Wisconsin does some games and there

1056
00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 5: you really can't afford to lose, like Oregon and Minnesota

1057
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:11,600
Speaker 5: and Northwestern, and then you got the three road games

1058
00:48:11,680 --> 00:48:14,359
Speaker 5: that all in various ways represent opportunity. But I think

1059
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 5: Indiana has at least put itself in a position for

1060
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:19,480
Speaker 5: a team that was pretty clearly trending away from the

1061
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:23,239
Speaker 5: field after that Michigan loss on January twentieth. Indiana has

1062
00:48:23,520 --> 00:48:26,800
Speaker 5: both with the way it has the results that is

1063
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 5: added to its resume, and also just the way it

1064
00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:32,240
Speaker 5: has stabilized itself a little bit. From a bracket perspective,

1065
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:35,320
Speaker 5: Indiana has put itself in a much better position to

1066
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:37,520
Speaker 5: at least as we get into the thicke of February

1067
00:48:37,560 --> 00:48:39,880
Speaker 5: here be in control of its own destiny from a

1068
00:48:39,920 --> 00:48:40,800
Speaker 5: tournament perspective.

1069
00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:43,919
Speaker 1: Okay, lastly, Zach football side of things, Kurt Signetti found

1070
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:46,719
Speaker 1: out that one of his staff members in CHANDL.

1071
00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:47,160
Speaker 2: Whitmer.

1072
00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 1: And this happens when you win, right, guys start to

1073
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:53,960
Speaker 1: get plucked away, they lose Whitmer, but they go back

1074
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:57,960
Speaker 1: to a familiar spot in replacing him, so continuity remains

1075
00:48:58,000 --> 00:48:58,920
Speaker 1: with Indiana football.

1076
00:48:58,960 --> 00:49:03,160
Speaker 5: Correct, Yeah, so Whimmer obviously, I mean a lot of

1077
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 5: Whitmer's and he's he's a young coach, so you don't

1078
00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:07,680
Speaker 5: want to overstate it. But a lot of his experience,

1079
00:49:07,719 --> 00:49:10,000
Speaker 5: for a got to Indiana had been at the NFL level,

1080
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:13,759
Speaker 5: He'd been with Atlanta, he'd been with San Diego. I

1081
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:17,319
Speaker 5: don't think anyone, necessarily in Bloomingson was shocked to see

1082
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:21,080
Speaker 5: his name linked with a return to the NFL. You know,

1083
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:23,880
Speaker 5: one year, of course, a very very successful season, so

1084
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:28,480
Speaker 5: it winds up turning around pretty quickly. But to your point,

1085
00:49:28,520 --> 00:49:32,280
Speaker 5: bringing Tino sincere back, Tino Sinceri, who was with Signetti

1086
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:36,200
Speaker 5: for several years between James Madison and Indiana, left last

1087
00:49:36,280 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 5: year to go call plays at UCLA. Of course that

1088
00:49:38,200 --> 00:49:41,160
Speaker 5: didn't work out now coming back worth pointing out Tino

1089
00:49:41,320 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 5: is is not only close with with Signetti because way

1090
00:49:45,200 --> 00:49:48,120
Speaker 5: way back with Mike Shanahan, Indiana's offensive coordinator. Those two

1091
00:49:48,800 --> 00:49:52,680
Speaker 5: are particularly you know, sort of complimentary of one another

1092
00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:55,319
Speaker 5: in like the way they collaborate, in the way they

1093
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:57,360
Speaker 5: build game plans, and the way they developed the quarterback

1094
00:49:57,360 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 5: position and then.

1095
00:49:57,920 --> 00:49:59,080
Speaker 3: Build the offense around it.

1096
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,200
Speaker 5: And so you know, if you're Indiana, to your point,

1097
00:50:02,239 --> 00:50:03,960
Speaker 5: you don't want to lose good people, but if you win,

1098
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:06,759
Speaker 5: you're going to And I don't think it was a

1099
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:11,279
Speaker 5: surprise to anyone here that when that job came open again,

1100
00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:14,360
Speaker 5: Indiana went for someone who has a proven track record

1101
00:50:14,400 --> 00:50:17,800
Speaker 5: of success with this head coach, this offensive coordinator and

1102
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 5: the process behind what is obviously yielded Indiana Kurtzignety and

1103
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:24,080
Speaker 5: Indiana success.

1104
00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 1: Zach appreciate the time as always, and after a late

1105
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:29,920
Speaker 1: night last night, we'll let you get a nap, all right.

1106
00:50:29,960 --> 00:50:33,719
Speaker 2: This is what happens when you're over thirty. Sound good.

1107
00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:34,920
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me, Joe.

1108
00:50:35,160 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 1: That's our friend from the Indianapolis Star, Zach As joining

1109
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:39,520
Speaker 1: the program.